Latest / UK Column Radio / A Thousand Words – Katy-Jo Murfin (Part 1)

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A Thousand Words – Katy-Jo Murfin (Part 1) · UK Column Radio

0:00
Oh my gosh, it's happening. This is really happening now.
0:03
It's like I'm compelled to do this.
0:06
I, I don't even know what's come over me.
0:09
How can you look at hope and think we're far right?
0:11
I just don't, you know, you look at all of our social media, you
0:15
look at the website, you look at our ethos, our, our values.
0:19
It's it's just. A ruse.
0:21
Katie, Joe. Whereas I never ever was afraid.
0:25
Ever. KJ.
0:45
Yes. Welcome to my garden, The
0:48
secret. Garden.
0:48
Beautiful. I've never been here before.
0:50
Yeah. No, you haven't, have you?
0:51
No. But it did to this area.
0:52
I've never been and. You had a bit of synchronicity
0:54
on the way as well. I did it's it's.
0:56
Just why you were late. It's there's a few reasons.
1:02
Because I got. Lost.
1:02
I always get lost. It's fine.
1:04
I'm used to it. I just go everything.
1:06
I, I, I arrive when I'm meant to arrive.
1:09
And actually, if I hadn't got lost and, you know, taking the
1:13
journey I took, I would never have bumped into Katie Ann.
1:15
And that's just the universe telling me that I'm I'm, I'm on
1:20
the right path. Yeah, are you?
1:22
Do you believe in fight? I believe that we have to just
1:28
surrender sometimes to yeah, to the universe basically just
1:35
guiding you and supporting you and synchronicities will happen
1:42
along the way. Yeah.
1:44
And they and as you, as they happen, it kind of it's, it's,
1:47
it's more sort of confirmation that you're on the right path.
1:50
So let's well, I was going to say, have you found that with
1:52
hope, with hope, the whole hope project?
1:54
Have you found that synchronicities have of help,
1:57
help too long on that path? But before, before you answer
2:00
that, really for those who we should talk a little bit about
2:03
hope, because I guess that's it's what you're known yes, for
2:08
and it's and it is a big passion of yours.
2:10
So tell everyone a little bit about hope.
2:12
It's A and then we'll get back into the synchronicity.
2:14
I suppose it, it is my life to a certain extent because it, it
2:24
means so much to me and to my family.
2:28
You know, it's, we're, we're all involved in hope, but especially
2:33
Tommy, you know, if I didn't have hope, I don't know what
2:38
Tommy's life would be like, right?
2:40
It would be very, very different.
2:42
So for those who don't know that much about Hope, there might be
2:46
one or two people out there who don't, so give a little.
2:50
I know, I'm just presuming everybody.
2:52
Knows about it well, because it's so much a part of our
2:53
lives, isn't it? And yeah.
2:56
It is weird, isn't it? When you have something like
2:58
that that's, you know, it's, it's just like the norm and then
3:01
people don't know about it and you're like, what?
3:03
Yeah, so there'll, there'll definitely be people watching
3:05
who either won't know what hope is or won't know much about
3:08
hope. So give people a little overview
3:12
of of how it started, what? It is, yeah.
3:14
So I suppose we need to go right back to 2000 and 19 really, and
3:22
the announcement of the lockdowns.
3:24
And you know, previously to that, you know, the, the, the
3:28
even the talk of a lockdown happening was just something
3:32
that sent me, my mum, my sister, my auntie, all of us that were
3:37
aware of the agenda, shall we say, just spiralling into, Oh my
3:43
gosh, it's happening. This is really happening now in
3:46
our lifetime, in our lifetime, which is just was just a really
3:49
weird thing because I'd heard David Icke speaking about it for
3:52
years and years and years. And obviously had been down many
3:54
rabbit holes myself already down, you know, the big pharma
3:58
rabbit hole, vaccination rabbit hole, 911 rabbit hole, the
4:03
chemotherapy, chemotherapy rabbit hole, just so many things
4:07
that I've been researching and knew about already.
4:10
So we just all immediately said, right, OK, we've got to do
4:15
something. It was just like I had to, you
4:18
know, I felt like I had to be proactive.
4:20
I couldn't just sit back and just watch things happening.
4:24
So my mum and myself and a couple of friends decided that
4:27
we would start a cooperative. Before that, actually, I'd
4:32
started a Facebook page with a friend called Hastings.
4:36
Stop and think where we were just, you know, encouraging
4:40
people to question things and, you know, a nice.
4:43
A nice name actually. Hastings, stop stopping the
4:46
thing. Because it's, it's quite gentle,
4:49
isn't it? It's quite feminine.
4:51
Like the, you know, if that was a bloke setting up a Facebook
4:54
page, it'd be like, you know, Armageddon approaches call to
5:00
arms. Also not the you know, the shits
5:03
hit the fan. Yeah, the shits hit the fan.
5:05
Yeah. So that's that's nice.
5:07
But we had, we had a really nasty character join the page
5:11
and start, you know, antagonising people and it just
5:14
all got horrible as social media does.
5:17
So I decided to put, just put messages out and said if you're
5:20
really serious about, you know, making a change and doing
5:24
something then and building community, then meet me on the
5:27
beach. So I started meeting people
5:30
illegally on the beach and in at the back of downstairs of a cafe
5:36
in the centre of Hastings. That's where I met amazing
5:39
people like Chris Coverdale, who, Oh yeah, I absolutely adore
5:44
and. Yeah, I've not met him, but he
5:47
always comes across. You should definitely paint
5:49
Chris. You know what?
5:50
I hadn't even thought of Chris, but that would be brilliant.
5:52
Yeah. He's lovely.
5:53
Yeah. So, yeah, so that, and then the
5:56
meetings just grew and grew and grew.
5:58
And throughout that time, it was very exciting, shall I say, to,
6:03
to, to meet whilst, you know, having to hide your cars and,
6:07
you know, pull the blinds down. And it was just, it was just
6:10
such a crazy time. It was really, really bonkers,
6:14
you know, with that. And then, you know, all of the
6:16
protests and the marches. But getting, getting back to
6:20
hope, we, I met Matt and Sadie and they're four gorgeous
6:24
children on the beach. And our friendship just grew
6:29
from there. We started to educate the
6:30
children together, you know, go for lovely walks in the woods.
6:36
We had a friend's apple farm, Martin's Apple farm that we used
6:39
to go to and and do forest school with the children there.
6:42
We had the police called on us and we had to play hide and seek
6:45
with the children. Mad times for being outside so.
6:53
Some children really suffered with that, but some really
6:55
thrived, didn't they? Yes.
6:58
You know, I think some children really, really relished that
7:02
excitement. But I know that a lot of
7:04
children didn't. They didn't like it.
7:07
I think it, I think it depends on what sort of environment
7:11
they're in. So if, if, if your parents are
7:14
panicking and being very, you know, afraid and fearful, then
7:18
they're going to pick up on that.
7:19
Whereas I never ever was afraid ever.
7:22
And I know that sounds really, I don't know, I'm not trying to
7:27
sound big headed or anything, but I just, I never had a fear
7:30
at that at that time. I never, I never do have any
7:33
fear of, of, of, of them and what, what they want to try and,
7:38
you know, force us into. It's just not something that's
7:41
ever crossed my mind. So, yeah.
7:44
So we, so we started educating at Sadie's house, you know,
7:49
other parents houses, smuggling the children in and it was
7:54
fairly exciting really. Then the Co-op fell apart.
8:00
Really. It's it's, it's one of those
8:02
things that with a cooperative, everybody gets a say and, and I
8:07
know that sounds like true democracy and I suppose.
8:11
It is. It's democracy.
8:13
But that's a big question, isn't it?
8:14
That's a big question. You know, if you have a room
8:16
full of 100 people and you're talking about one topic, let's
8:20
say, should we allow vaccinated people into the Co-op or should
8:24
we not allow vaccinated people into the Co-op, for example?
8:28
Every single person has to have their say and naturally, you
8:33
know, even though the point has been made by someone else,
8:36
everyone will want their, you know, their their moment to
8:39
speak. And, and so meetings would go on
8:41
and on for hours and hours and hours with the same people going
8:46
away and doing the doing all the work.
8:48
Yeah, you know, it's it's. And a lot of hot air.
8:51
And a lot of hot air and a lot of going round and round in
8:53
circles and never really achieving anything.
8:55
So for me, when, when the Co-op was, was shut down, I, I, I, I
9:00
didn't want to go back to that model.
9:02
I knew it wasn't really going to help.
9:04
So we went for the CIC model instead, which is a community
9:09
interest company. Oh, OK.
9:11
So we can we, you know, myself and Sadie, we are the directors,
9:16
but we have a core team, as you know, that really are at the
9:22
centre of making decisions. And we always ask if they're big
9:26
decisions. We always ask for, you know,
9:28
people's opinions. But ultimately the buck lies
9:32
with me and Sadie and it has to be like that for for us to get
9:35
anything done, for us to achieve anything, you know?
9:39
I think that's the case with, well, with a lot of freedom
9:42
people. They have this sort of utopian
9:44
idea that if we're all aligned, we can all come together and
9:49
create these communities. But actually, I think like any
9:52
good business, it's usually one or two people's idea and they
9:58
have the vision and then they find people who want to support
10:02
that vision and then it just becomes a solid thing.
10:05
Whereas if you have just like you're saying, if you have so
10:08
many different voices all saying, well, it should be like
10:10
this. It should be like nothing ever
10:11
gets done. No business ever succeeded like
10:12
that. And I'm not saying business is
10:14
the be all and end all, but it's the it's the mark of, you know,
10:18
if you're profit driven and you know, you want to succeed at
10:22
something, that's the model that you it's usually one at the most
10:25
two really. Isn't it like a partnership?
10:27
Yes, yes, I mean. Matt, Matt's definitely there as
10:31
well. You know, I, I he's like a.
10:33
But then he's in a relationship with Sadie, so there's a whole.
10:36
So they're they're they come as a pair really, you know, but
10:40
it's a it's a, it's a, it's a really weird thing.
10:44
You mentioned profit there, but both, both of us are really bad
10:47
at business. We're terrible at business and
10:50
it's not obviously what has driven us to create hope.
10:55
And I think that has its advantages and disadvantages.
10:59
Its advantages is that it's it's coming totally from heart.
11:03
There's no, there's never been off.
11:05
We do this, we can make loads of money.
11:06
It's that's just never, ever ended our minds.
11:08
We can vouch for that and I know how the how it works.
11:12
But it's but, yeah, but I'm sure we've made plenty of silly
11:16
mistakes along the way as well. You know, we're learning as we
11:20
go along. Nobody's given.
11:23
Nobody's given us a handbook and gone.
11:25
This is how you build community, especially in these times when
11:30
community is pretty alien to people.
11:33
You know, we're not, we're not used to that.
11:34
We're not even used to really existing in big families
11:39
anymore. So it's, it's a whole new way of
11:41
learning to live and cooperate with people and yeah, be, be
11:48
understanding and compassionate. And especially at these trying,
11:54
in these trying times. Everyone's going through it big
11:56
time. There's everyone's struggling at
11:59
the moment. I think it's tough.
12:02
So, but it was, it was a, it was a when I never forget my husband
12:08
when I was when I was meeting people on the beach, he said,
12:11
said to you, it's like, it's like you think, Jesus, it's
12:16
like, no, no, it's not that at all.
12:19
I can't I it's like I'm compelled to do this.
12:22
I, I don't even know what's come over me.
12:25
I'm literally just half to do it.
12:27
And it was such a stressful time.
12:30
Actually in our house. It was a really stressful time
12:32
because that's all I could put my energy into was, was, was,
12:38
yeah, it was. That was building community,
12:39
making a change, doing something.
12:41
Yeah. So is that something that you
12:43
took my focus? Lastly, you still, because I
12:46
know you're very driven and for example, when we asked if you'd
12:51
like to join the band, you know, it's a big consideration because
12:55
you do so much, you know, you had to consider did you have the
12:59
time to do it? Well, luckily, luckily for us
13:02
that you thought you had. But is that an ongoing concern
13:06
juggling? I know you've got a very
13:07
supportive family. I've got a star.
13:09
My family's amazing, absolutely amazing.
13:12
I, you know, I couldn't do they deserve all the credit really,
13:17
because there's just no way I could achieve anything I've
13:20
achieved without them. So they do deserve all of the
13:23
credit. But I, oh, I, I, it was straight
13:28
away I was like, yes, I want to be in Victorious.
13:30
Absolutely love Victorious. And it's been so lovely already
13:33
that we've, you know, I've sung, you know, guest songs with you.
13:37
So it felt like, you know, something that would be a
13:42
natural progression. Yeah.
13:46
So yeah, going back to Hope, how did the vision form of actually
13:50
a place for home education because we haven't actually said
13:54
that to people. So what let, let, OK, what is
13:56
hope in its current form? What is it?
13:59
Hope is Sussex, Hope Sussex Community is literally that.
14:04
So I would say the site operates as a community centre and we
14:08
have our home educators, home educating families that come and
14:15
use the facility. They, they have, we have classes
14:21
there with independent tutors, amazing independent tutors who
14:25
are all really happy to be out of the education system.
14:31
And so they, they're, they're taking classes and also just
14:37
socialising the children. It's also, it's also about the
14:40
adults being able to chat with like minded people and, and
14:44
again, feel like you're putting into something, you're making a
14:46
difference. You know, you're, you're, you're
14:48
leaving a legacy behind. Is, is how I feel.
14:52
And we have the best people there.
14:55
We do, we really do. And that's and you know, and,
14:58
and there are obviously people that come that weekly.
15:01
We have a health clinic PHA, which again is so important for
15:07
people to be able to get low cost treatments.
15:10
So really, really grateful to all of those practitioners that
15:14
are part of the PHA that'd. Be where you'd get your latest
15:17
shot, is it? Is that right?
15:18
Yeah, yeah. Get your latest shot of glowed
15:21
or silver or what else is there. There's hydroxychloroquine, the
15:28
natural stuff, I think so. Yeah.
15:30
So there's there's the PHA. And again, I'd just love to
15:33
expand every single branch really.
15:34
Our allotment is another one. The food side of things is
15:39
really important, but that's run by a real dedicated core group.
15:44
And you know, they work their butts off.
15:48
They really do. And it's looking amazing down
15:51
there. So we're, we're looking like
15:52
we're going to have a really fruitful year harvest this year.
15:57
So there's that and there's, there's the event side, which
15:59
really, I mean, I absolutely adore the event side, but it is
16:05
a constant juggle for myself and Sadie because the, the running
16:09
of the homemade side and then the running of the events side
16:12
are both really, really demanding.
16:15
And we're constantly going, OK, we have to run the events to
16:17
bring the money in. The homemade side is what's is
16:22
at the core really. It's the reason we started Hope
16:25
Sussex. So for us, we, it, it is, it's,
16:29
it's big, it's a lot, it's a lot of work, it's a lot of work, but
16:34
it's, it's, there's, there's I can't, there's, I can't think of
16:37
doing anything else. There's, there's no, there's no
16:39
other option really, if you like.
16:41
And the rewards are massive. The rewards are huge.
16:44
When you see the children having a wonderful time at Hope,
16:48
playing, being free, you know, that's, that's, that's just, you
16:54
know. Well, it it.
16:55
It's makes my heart just swell. It's just the best thing.
16:59
And that's what it's all about. And especially my Tommy, when I
17:02
see him, I hope, you know, having having the best time and
17:05
being accepted for who he is. So for Tommy, if, if, if we
17:10
didn't have hope, his options would be mainstream.
17:12
And I mean, Jake, Can you imagine Tommy in mainstream
17:15
school? He's 13.
17:16
He's 14 this year. That means he would be, you
17:20
know, nearly at the end of first year in secondary school that it
17:24
would just kill him. I know it would.
17:25
It would be he would be bullied, he would, he wouldn't cope with
17:29
it. He just wouldn't be able to.
17:30
So the other option is a special needs school.
17:33
And he's he's not stupid. He's not, you know, I think that
17:39
would. Just wouldn't be.
17:40
Right, either that just wouldn't work for him either.
17:42
I think he just needs to be accepted for who he is in a
17:45
loving environment and to be able to learn at his own pace,
17:49
which he cannot hope. So it's, it's the biggest
17:55
blessing for, for us as a family.
17:57
Yeah, it's a very, it's a very natural way of of community,
18:03
isn't it? Hope it's it's very relaxing in
18:06
some ways, although there are structured, you know, the tutors
18:09
come in. But in a way, I mean, I can say
18:11
for Mackie as well that it's all the stuff around it really,
18:17
which is just so nourishing for everyone, adults and children,
18:22
in a way that, you know, we've put off coming for a long time.
18:25
Rachel was you must come to hope.
18:27
And it's too far away, yes. It is far, I know.
18:33
But you know, the rewards have just been incredible and on so
18:39
many different levels, it does feel that, you know, when you
18:42
set something up, it just it just has its own momentum and
18:47
people just come who are right. And I can imagine Netherfield
18:52
becoming this hub of. The locals, yeah.
18:56
I know, I know there's challenges with the locals.
18:58
I've heard some things and you know, people get in the wrong
19:02
end of the stick and and listening to the media too much
19:05
and you know. We've all experienced that,
19:08
haven't we? I think we've got things.
19:09
Unfortunately, those people probably won't be listening to
19:14
this and and getting the the true picture.
19:17
That's the problem, isn't it? People get stuck in their
19:20
perceptions. I mean, you can't.
19:24
I don't know how you can blame parents for wanting to protect
19:27
their children from what's happening.
19:30
At the end of the day, that's all we're doing as parents is
19:32
going. I want to be the best parent I
19:35
can be, you know? And I know that something is
19:38
deeply wrong with society and the way society is going, I know
19:42
something's deeply wrong with the education system.
19:45
I don't want my child to be subjected to any of that.
19:47
I want to protect them. That's surely a natural instinct
19:50
for a parent so. But most people wouldn't
19:52
wouldn't see, no, sorry, not most people, those who have been
19:58
indoctrinated into the, you know, by the the press and
20:01
you've had some hit pieces done about hope and all that kind of
20:04
stuff. But the people who?
20:06
Fall for that they they're not seeing it from that perspective,
20:10
are they, though? They're seeing a bunch of far
20:13
right. How can you look at hope and
20:15
think we're far right? I just don't, you know, you look
20:18
at all of our social media, you look at the website, you look at
20:22
our ethos, our values. It's just.
20:25
A ruse. Katie Joe, It's just stories.
20:28
I love your slogan. What's that so far?
20:31
Right, right so far. Oh, yeah.
20:32
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Brilliant.
20:34
Yeah. T-shirts.
20:35
T-shirts available on the website.
20:36
Get yours now, right? So far, yeah.
20:39
So it's, yeah, it's just another, it's just like being
20:42
called a conspiracy theorist. Like it's like being called a
20:46
homophobic, transphobic person. I mean, I just, it's, it's just
20:51
another, it's just another, you know, name.
20:55
They're just trying to put us in that box really, aren't they?
20:58
And the only badge I will wear is that is the anti Vaxxer.
21:04
Badge. You know, I'm the same actually.
21:07
I'm really not ashamed to speak out and say I'm an anti vaxxer.
21:10
I'm not either, you know, I don't, I wouldn't necessarily
21:12
describe myself as anti anything.
21:15
It's, you know, it just has connotations of negativity, but
21:19
essentially. See, I, I, I don't feel that
21:23
because I've researched vaccines so deeply with every child.
21:29
I mean, obviously my, my background is that my mum's
21:33
brother, three years old, developed a leukemia after the
21:37
measles vaccine and died. Oh right, I didn't know that.
21:39
Yeah, so it goes right back in my family, the questioning of
21:43
vaccinations. And I used to.
21:47
I've always grown up seeing a homeopath and my homeopath when
21:49
I fell pregnant with Molly, she said to me, you really need to
21:53
research vaccines. She didn't say to me, don't,
21:55
don't, don't vaccinate research vaccines.
21:58
So she gave me loads of books and I'm sorry, but if you do
22:02
your research, there's just no way you'd let them, you know,
22:06
vaccinate your child. So I, I, well, I did that with
22:09
every single 1. I did that with Poppy and I did
22:11
that with Tommy. I just went back to the to the
22:14
same books, you know, and the informed parent is a fantastic
22:18
website. I don't know if they do any
22:20
talks anymore, but they went to a couple of their their their
22:23
talks. Oh.
22:23
Is that what's her name? Is that English?
22:27
Is that an English organization? Yeah.
22:28
Yeah, I. Think she, I think there was the
22:30
one who's promoted a lot in the Aneka groups who used.
22:33
To probably. It's pretty clear cut, really.
22:37
Yeah. When I say anti I, it's just the
22:39
word anti. But yeah, no, absolutely 100% I,
22:43
you know, vaccines are they're. Not safe, they're ineffective,
22:50
they're not effective, you know, and and it's again, all about
22:56
profit for big pharma and keeping us.
22:59
I'll, you know, so I'm, I'll wear that badge with pride with
23:04
Molly. She got whooping cough.
23:06
Oh, yeah. And it wasn't very nice.
23:07
But she's so, you know, it's it, it did the world of good really
23:11
in the end, because she never gets coughs.
23:13
And, you know, it's like a, it's like an immunity.
23:15
Yeah, there is a theory that with every infection, let's just
23:20
call it an infection, the the body goes through a kind of a
23:25
real growth spurt intellectually and it that that the challenge
23:29
of the infection pushes a child to develop.
23:32
And people like children have I. Agree with that.
23:36
And if you suppress the infection, then maybe they they
23:38
don't get that chance to. I I would say that's, that's
23:41
definitely true. I've I've witnessed that as well
23:43
with, with my children after they've maybe had a fever.
23:47
Yeah, they have like a growth spurt.
23:49
OK. So that's the, I would say I've
23:52
actually witnessed that, right. OK, so that is definitely true.
23:57
But it was the doctor. Oh my gosh.
23:59
Because I, I didn't, she didn't have any antibiotics or
24:01
anything. I used homeopathy to, to, to,
24:03
you know, to help her and just let it run its course.
24:07
But the, oh, the doctor, yeah. Oh, I bet you wish you'd had her
24:10
vaccinated now. No, actually no.
24:15
But they oh gosh, went obviously spent a lot of time in hospital
24:19
and that's that's a challenge when you have a child like
24:22
Tommy, who's who's born and straight into special care and
24:25
has, you know, you're in that allopathic environment and then
24:30
you're trying to treat them as holistically as possible.
24:34
And never forget the pharmacists going crazy at me because I'd
24:37
gave him, I'd given him some Monica and he went, you're going
24:39
to give him a heart attack. I was like, no, I don't think I
24:46
will. I think he'll be absolutely
24:48
fine. Thanks.
24:49
I've. Been What was his reasoning with
24:51
that? Oh, he just, he just didn't want
24:52
me to use any, anything apart from pharmaceuticals.
24:55
He didn't really give a reason. He just said that it was
24:58
dangerous, which is quite amusing, really, when you think
25:03
of the side effects from yeah, from pharmaceuticals.
25:09
It's just. But that's OK, That's all right.
25:12
Because they've got they've got the side effects documented and
25:15
they can say that these are, you know, so it's, it's all right
25:19
If, if you get ill from pharmaceutical drugs.
25:22
Yeah. It's, it's bonkers.
25:23
It's such a bonkers world we live in.
25:24
It really is, isn't it? The invert, the inversion
25:27
everywhere. It just, it drives you mad.
25:30
Your head just starts going, you can't cope with this anymore.
25:34
I mean, a clown world, as Trevor John says, that song is perfect.
25:39
It is a clown world. How was that when Tommy was born
25:43
then? Did you feeling then that you
25:45
had to be drawn into this system that you was very wary of?
25:50
I believe, yeah, I, I can see, I look back at my life now and I
25:54
look at big challenges and I think they've prepared me for
25:59
what I'm doing now. They've been, they've been a
26:02
preparation 100%. So that was obviously probably,
26:09
I would say the biggest challenge of my whole life was,
26:13
was trying to, I mean, if it wasn't for me and my mum, my
26:23
husband, I don't think Tommy would be here.
26:27
I really don't think he'd be here, you know, So I've when I
26:33
felt pregnant with Tommy, he was a surprise.
26:37
And when I found out, I instantly knew something wasn't
26:40
right. It was really bizarre.
26:42
Yeah, I knew in my gut I was like, this isn't right.
26:44
I don't feel the same way. And it wasn't that it was a
26:48
surprise because I love children.
26:49
I just keep having kids. I could just knock them out,
26:53
have loads of kids, but it there was something.
26:56
And. And so then and, and with the
26:58
girls, I didn't have any scans, didn't have any scans at all
27:02
with the girls, but with Tommy, something in my gut said I
27:06
needed to have one. And so that's when we found out
27:09
he had pulmonary stenosis on his heart, on his heart.
27:12
And, and then the second scan, they realised I had
27:20
polyhydramnius, which is this medical condition where we know
27:24
now he wasn't swallowing the amniotic fluid.
27:27
So I was getting bigger. I literally looked like I was
27:29
had about 10 babies and I was so tiny as well.
27:34
I was like Mr. Greedy from the back.
27:36
I didn't look pregnant for a turn around huge.
27:39
I was massive and I was really poorly towards the end.
27:43
But yeah, no. And, and when he was born, he
27:45
had to, he went straight to special care, couldn't feed, he
27:52
wouldn't feed. So he had to have Ng tube, which
27:56
is the nasal gastric tube. And then after 10 days they
28:01
said, OK, we've got to transfer him to Brighton.
28:03
And that was just kind of like the journey.
28:05
We were Brighton to Evelina, to Great Ormond St. to so many
28:09
different hospitals. Found out that he had De George
28:11
syndrome, which is actually the second most common syndrome
28:17
after Downs. Say that again, What's it
28:19
called? De George.
28:21
De George. De George.
28:23
De George Yeah. And I've never heard of it.
28:25
No, I've not heard of it and some people don't know they've
28:28
got it. It can be very, very mild,
28:30
depends on the deletion. So Down's syndrome is a
28:33
duplication and did George syndrome is a deletion on the
28:36
chromosome 22. So.
28:40
So it was just a journey then of finding out.
28:43
So he had to have his biggest operation at three months old
28:47
was his fund duplication. Where what's this?
28:50
What? It's it's called a
28:51
thunderplication. So the top of his stomach, his
28:54
he had low muscle tone all the way down his centre of his body.
28:58
And so the top of his stomach hadn't formed properly.
29:01
So it's wide open. Oh.
29:03
OK. So for a, for a while before the
29:06
operation, he had to have a tube into his stomach that would take
29:11
the contents out so that he didn't aspirate.
29:15
And then he had a tube into his Jedinam which would feed him.
29:19
So, and all this time I was trying to express because I
29:22
wanted him to have breast milk. And I did that.
29:24
I literally, probably for the first 3-4 months, I think I was
29:30
every two hours, day and night, expressing wherever we were just
29:34
trying to, yeah, try to feed him.
29:36
And then he had the, the surgery, which was a huge
29:40
success. Fantastic surgeon at Brighton,
29:47
but this whole time we're constantly suctioning him.
29:50
So, you know, like a, a a suction machine that you get in
29:54
the dentist, that's what you would constantly have to suction
29:57
him and for they didn't. They didn't constantly.
30:01
Do you mean like literally? Yeah, yeah, constantly
30:06
otherwise. You could someone need to be.
30:08
He couldn't swallow. With him like.
30:10
He yeah, all the time, Yeah. He had the worst case of
30:12
dysphasia they've seen in the ebolina.
30:16
So he was suctioned constantly, but but even Even so, it was.
30:21
So I look back now and the speech and language therapist
30:24
was still trying to get me get him to feed.
30:27
And it's, I look back now and I, I cannot believe you didn't see
30:30
that He couldn't swallow. So it's just really weird.
30:34
So he has the fundification. He, he's, he's had, he had his,
30:43
one of his hernia operations. We get home and I've got this
30:46
baby that I'm trying to feed all these different formulas.
30:51
Actually before we even got him home, he had necrotizing
30:54
entrecolitis. I don't know if you've heard of
30:55
that. That's where some of the bowel
30:57
dies. And that's because they wanted
31:00
him to have this really, really high fat milk because he wasn't
31:03
putting weight on. And I said I was really worried
31:06
about him getting that. And they, they said no, no, no,
31:09
he'll be fine. I'll eat my hat if he gets that.
31:11
She went and then two days on the milk and he's profusely
31:15
bleeding. Yeah, it was.
31:17
It was awful. So yeah, it was.
31:19
It was just like there were plenty of times where I just
31:22
wanted to run away. Yeah, I bet.
31:26
But when I got him home, this was, this was I think was the
31:29
biggest turning point for Tommy was when he he would, he would
31:34
choke constantly. So therefore whatever we put
31:36
into his stomach, he would vomit.
31:39
So he's not putting any weight on.
31:41
So, yeah, and the, and the formulas were awful.
31:44
I knew that, you know, but I couldn't, I couldn't express
31:47
anymore. I had nothing left.
31:49
So I made it my mission to make my own formula milk.
31:52
Oh, OK. And I tried everything I, you
31:55
know, hemp milk and cows it literally every kind of milk.
32:00
And I would put, I studied the composition of, of formula milk
32:05
and I added molasses and olive oil and ghee and just coconut
32:10
oil and everything I could. But he was still being fed
32:13
through his nose. So there's a really tiny, tiny
32:15
tube. So it had to be really thin
32:17
still. He would still constantly vomit
32:20
all the time. So I, I researched raw goats,
32:24
OK. And that saved his life because
32:27
I, I can't, you know, I, I don't see how we would have got any,
32:31
you know, past that constant vomiting if it hadn't been for
32:35
the raw goats, because it turns to curds and whey pretty much as
32:39
soon as it hits the stomach. So it became a solid solid.
32:43
And that, that gradually helped him to start to gain weight.
32:50
So, and they abut, Oh my gosh, I'll never forget going for an
32:55
appointment with the dietitian and the surgeon who'd done his
32:59
surgery and I told them this and how brilliant it was going.
33:03
Oh my God, you'd have thought they were going to take him off
33:05
of me phone social services. It was it.
33:08
I suddenly just went right. Not never ever coming back here
33:12
again. Ever.
33:13
So was that part of your awakening process seeing first
33:18
hand some of the difficulties within, you know, or the, the.
33:22
I within the system. I thank God that that didn't
33:27
happen during COVID. I, you know, we, we were lucky
33:34
enough that it was a time where we could all be in the room with
33:37
Tommy, you know, and, and I could, I could sleep next to him
33:42
every night. And if I, you know, it was hard.
33:45
We had two other children. So I would, you know, every now
33:49
and again go home and see them And my husband would, we'd swap
33:52
all, my mum would stay with Tommy and Tom's mum was amazing.
33:57
And obviously the granddads as well have been so such a support
34:00
in, in supporting us and the, and the girls.
34:04
But I just, Oh my gosh, if I, if I think about what that would
34:09
have been like during COVID and the restrictions of having
34:12
people in there and, and the testing and the mask wearing, I,
34:17
I just, yeah, it was tough enough as it was.
34:19
So my heart goes out to anybody who was in, in the, you know, in
34:24
the hospitals in the system at that time.
34:27
It must have been horrendous. They, you know, I can't, I can't
34:30
knock most of the nurses and, and doctors, but it, but you had
34:34
to be there. You had to be there for
34:36
handover. You had to be there because
34:38
things would get missed. You know, there's, there were
34:41
times where he was going to be given the wrong medicine and
34:44
you'd be like, no, that's not the drugs he's on.
34:46
He's on this or, you know, or I don't remember one, one night
34:51
going to see him. This was when he was in the
34:53
special care unit. So he was really, really young,
34:56
probably two months old. And I'd just popped to see him.
35:01
It was about 11:00 at night. And there was a, a doctor doing
35:07
an A scan on his heart. And I was like, this wasn't
35:11
scheduled in. What are you doing?
35:13
Oh, yeah, just just just checking.
35:15
And I was thinking, you know, there's so much intervention for
35:18
these for, for when you're in hospital, you know, and these
35:21
little children, they, they have to have, you know, moments where
35:24
they're they're left alone. And it turned out he was just a
35:27
student just using Tommy, you know.
35:31
And so you, if you're not there, things will happen for sure.
35:38
You've got to be there and on your guard, which is a shame.
35:43
And I and I, I do believe hearing now that things have
35:46
probably have deteriorated quite a lot in hospitals.
35:50
All the children that hope benefit from that.
35:56
It's a very loving atmosphere. And some, you know, someone like
36:00
Tommy, like you said, if they're at mainstream school, they'd,
36:04
you know, maybe be bullied or, you know, left out, ostracized.
36:08
Way guarantee he was. He was in when he, when he first
36:12
went up to special care, when he was born.
36:16
Three days later a little baby came in called Tilly and
36:22
adorable little thing. Then we lost contact and Tommy
36:26
did go to mainstream school for a bit and they ended up being in
36:30
the same year together. And her story is different.
36:34
She did go to mainstream school and it's not, it's not been
36:39
good, not been good at all. And I know it would have been
36:42
the same for him. You know, he's, he's different,
36:47
not wrong, different, just different.
36:49
And you know, if you don't fit in and that's, that's the
36:52
pressure that all children have, isn't it, at school to fit in?
36:57
And that's what I saw with Molly, my eldest.
37:01
So she went through primary school.
37:03
I didn't even think about home educating, didn't even cross my
37:05
mind. Lovely village school guestling
37:08
really lovely small and she was very happy went to secondary
37:13
school and I just started to see that yeah, she was just quite
37:20
becoming quieter and not herself very quiet, unhappy and I and I
37:27
just thought OK, all the girls in school have got phones, you
37:31
haven't got a phone. They're all doing TikTok,
37:33
they're all doing selfies, they're all concerned about what
37:36
they look like. And although Molly is loves her
37:38
makeup now and she's, you know, that's, she's found herself now.
37:42
But then she, she just wanted to climb trees and she wanted to be
37:47
in the fields, you know, rescuing sheep out of the canal
37:50
and, and, and being a being a child still, she wasn't ready
37:54
for that. And I just, my gut instinct was
37:56
get her out. And I didn't, I didn't know
37:58
anything about home Ed, didn't know anyone who home educated.
38:01
I just went with my gut. And that was, yeah, that was the
38:05
right thing to do for sure. So with Poppy, it was, it was a
38:08
natural thing. I just said, OK, you're not
38:11
going to secondary school. That's not happening.
38:14
I'm not going anywhere near it. And I was going to do the same
38:16
for Tommy. But then lockdown happened.
38:18
And as soon as it happened, I took him straight out.
38:22
I just thought you are not being told you can't cuddle Pete.
38:25
He's such a cuddly, cuddly. I mean, go up and cuddle
38:28
anybody, won't he? And well, tickle anybody.
38:32
So, you know, the thought of him being told that he's, he's, you
38:37
know, he's, he's, he's got germs and he can't do that and he's
38:40
going to make people ill and all of that nonsense.
38:43
And, and, and I think it's, it would have had such a
38:47
detrimental effect on his mental health.
38:50
The, the, the constant hand washing they were told to do.
38:52
And I just know it would have. Affected him.
38:57
Negatively hundreds. Of thousands of children who are
39:01
traumatised by that whole episode, don't even realise it.
39:05
It's sort of a hidden, hidden disaster really in a way.
39:10
I think probably kids, social development and confidence and
39:15
OCD. It did self harming went through
39:18
the roof, suicide went through the roof.
39:21
The age of of suicide dropped, I think down to something like 10
39:26
or I mean, you know, it's pure evil what they're doing and what
39:33
what what they did. It really, really is.
39:35
There's no other word for it. It's interesting, when we
39:38
chatted with Andrew Bridgen a couple of weeks ago, there's one
39:42
moment he just paused because he, he was talking about
39:46
Leicestershire and his constituency and he was just
39:53
talking about the suicide rate, you know, and Cathay really
39:57
affected him. You know, I think these things,
39:59
the people are still in denial about what what they, what they
40:03
went through, you know? Collectively, what we went
40:06
through. Yeah, I think we're still, we're
40:09
trying to process it, aren't we? It's it.
40:12
But that's the weird thing, isn't it?
40:13
About when you look back on life, it's just the weirdest
40:17
thing because it's it's it feels like it was yesterday and yet it
40:21
feels like it. It happened in another world, in
40:25
a dream. Yeah.
40:26
It's just bizarre, isn't it? This whole existence is bizarre.
40:30
You know it is. What else can you say?
40:32
It's it's it's, it's crazy, Yeah.
40:36
Trying to work out what it's all about.
40:38
I sometimes think there's just no point even trying try.
40:42
Just be in the moment, really. Yeah.
40:44
And do you find that in a way with the whole the rabbit holes
40:48
that you can go down and. I don't go down.
40:51
Yeah, it almost feels like. I did it.
40:53
I did it to death. That's right, yeah.
40:55
There's a point where you just say I don't need to know
40:57
anymore. Really.
40:58
Yeah. I mean, there's still obviously
41:00
times where you'll hear something and it'll affect you
41:04
deeply, you know, there's still times where I'll hear something
41:07
and I'll, I'll really cry, you know, or I'll, I'll think about
41:11
things and it'll, it'll really get to me.
41:15
But generally, overall, I feel like I don't need to do that.
41:20
I feel like it's more important that I keep my vibration as high
41:23
as possible and I put my time and energy into something
41:27
positive and something that's meaningful.
41:31
And yeah, that's going to be better.
41:34
But that's not an avoidance thing.
41:37
No. I mean, I know that's not an
41:38
avoidance thing with you. I I, it can be with some people,
41:41
yeah. You know, But I think there's
41:43
that it's like a healthy trajectory where you, you you're
41:48
open to what's going on. You explore what's going on.
41:51
You see, there's an agenda, You see that there's deception.
41:57
And then and then you just you go, OK, I don't need to spend X
42:06
amount of hours a day indulging in, you know, the details of
42:12
this thing. I just.
42:13
I just need to. I need to get.
42:14
On my mind, where's the benefit for me?
42:16
Where's the benefit in that? You know, you're, you're going
42:20
to end up bringing yourself down, you know, and I do I, I
42:24
really truly believe that vibration is, is the key to
42:27
everything, you know, and we, I think most people that are awake
42:32
are on that page, You know, we're all vibration and we know
42:38
that the lower vibrations feed the machine, the elite, the, you
42:43
know, the dark side, it, it feeds them.
42:45
So, you know, as much as we can, we need to be love and above.
42:51
That's not always easy, but you know, but it's, I think
42:55
authenticity is, is important as well.
42:57
Authenticity is the most important, but it and and also,
42:59
you know, you, it's not saying we can't have those emotions,
43:03
but it's not allowing them to govern us and allowing them to,
43:06
you know, remain so. It's it's acknowledging them and
43:11
and being able to move on, trying not to get drawn in to
43:15
things as much. I like the observe not absorb
43:21
thing. Observe, not absorb.
43:24
Yeah, Yeah, that makes sense. We had this chat with Sandy and
43:31
she was almost questioning, saying, well, should I, you
43:34
know, should I just leave it all behind and go off and do
43:38
painting or something, you know, and, but I think we do need,
43:44
it's a, it's a, it's a, we do need people to be Trail Blazers,
43:49
you know, and if, if they have skills and they have the armour
43:54
to face this and, and, and investigate it and, and be a
44:00
spokesperson. Those kind of people I find
44:03
amazing. We've all needed them perhaps
44:08
more towards the start of our journey.
44:10
And so I said to Sunday, what people like you do is just
44:15
something that a lot of people can't do because it's just too,
44:18
you must be really grounded basically to be able to face
44:20
that and talk about it and go into it.
44:23
I just don't think I can't really they.
44:27
Are incredible. You know, so it's not.
44:31
But that's that's that's where we all have a part to play.
44:33
A different role as. Well, and that's and it's that
44:37
should you know, that's community as well, isn't it?
44:40
You know, we've all got a skill, we've all got something to bring
44:45
to the table, and everyone's just as important as everybody
44:49
else. Yeah.
44:51
Transcending the ego. I know we need ego to a certain
44:54
extent, but it's important not to allow it to, to, to rule over
44:59
you and to really, yeah, we've got to keep a lid on it.
45:05
I think for us to be able to move forwards, You know, it's
45:10
still, people are still falling out and it's 9 times out of 10
45:14
the ego really. Yeah, I agree that's getting in
45:17
the way. I agree.
45:19
It's not discussing things that's the problem.
45:22
It's been attached to ideas that's the problem.
45:24
So, you know, I talk about stuff and I annoy people because I
45:27
have my opinions on certain things.
45:29
But what could that? Yeah, I'm not going to say I've
45:32
been told not to keep banging on about it.
45:34
But what I like is learning to discuss without being attached.
45:40
So let's talk about this stuff that we might disagree on and
45:45
let's do it with love in our hearts.
45:47
You know, it's just, it's not a big deal.
45:49
But can we learn to just not? Healthy debate.
45:52
Healthy debate and just, and not even, you know, it doesn't even
45:55
have to be a debate, just a discussion.
45:57
You know, like I said, I, I've stopped looking at stuff in
46:01
detail really largely, but I'm more interested in how we
46:05
progress psychologically as a, as a group of people who's
46:08
looking for truth, you know, because ultimately I think the
46:12
external is really just a reflection of the internal.
46:15
So unless we're dealing with our crap.
46:17
Oh, yes, we're just. But don't you feel like that's
46:20
at the moment everybody's craps being bought out of them?
46:24
Yeah, it does feel energetically like you can't hide anything at
46:29
the moment, you know, and people are, you know, on the edge at
46:35
the moment because if you've got any trauma that you've not dealt
46:40
with, it's coming to the surface, which I believe we've
46:47
we've that's that's for a reason.
46:49
So that we can move on and, and, and move up.
46:55
It's baggage. Get rid of it, you know?
46:59
Yeah, Make yourself lighter. You know, it was a massive
47:06
learning curve for me was was trying to unlearn that time
47:12
isn't linear. Yeah, the sun could still be a
47:15
portal, but we could still be on a globe.
47:18
The gay pride movement, which was just about equality and just
47:21
about allowing people to be who they want to be.
47:23
Now we've got these horrendous marches which children should
47:28
not be subjected to each other. And I was whizzing almost like
47:31
through space, I suppose because it was pitch black.
47:33
And there was like a bit like Star Warsy.
47:36
But it I know it wasn't a dream because I felt it.