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How to fix the Cubs bullpen · North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast

0:05
Speaker 1: Welcome into North Side Territory, Foul Territory Networks Cubs Podcast.
0:09
Speaker 1: I'm Sahadev Sharma with my partner Patrick Mooney. We are
0:12
Speaker 1: your Cubs be writers over we are Uh, Patrick, Uh,
0:22
Speaker 1: this is going to be a bullpen centric episode. Uh.
0:25
Speaker 1: Bullpens are such a fickle unit in baseball, and they
0:29
Speaker 1: are often you know, uh, where the criticism goes. One
0:34
Speaker 1: bad game and and it will lead to a ton
0:36
Speaker 1: of criticism. But it's not just one bad game. There's
0:39
Speaker 1: there's been moments and plenty of reason for consternation among
0:42
Speaker 1: the fan base. Uh. I think it's it's starting to
0:46
Speaker 1: look better. We could we can discuss all these different aspects.
0:50
Speaker 1: I think the reality is the Cubs are continue continually
0:54
Speaker 1: trying to find the right mix. They keep making moves.
0:58
Speaker 1: The latest is the transaction wire says that Jordan Wicks
1:01
Speaker 1: has been sent down and and we know that the
1:06
Speaker 1: Cubs have traded for Drew Pomeranz. We'll see when he's
1:09
Speaker 1: up with the team. But the Cubs are continuing to
1:12
Speaker 1: cycle through bullpen arms. This isn't They're not you know,
1:15
Speaker 1: standing still right now.
1:18
Speaker 2: Sense of urgency was the theme of our last show,
1:22
Speaker 2: and I think you continue to see it here from
1:26
Speaker 2: Luke Little being a one and done out of this
1:29
Speaker 2: bullpen Jordan Wicks, I mean not getting the job done
1:35
Speaker 2: and getting sent back to Iowa and Pomerans. It's a
1:40
Speaker 2: long shot, right, I mean, the guy hasn't pitched in
1:42
Speaker 2: the Major since twenty twenty one, but he was awesome
1:48
Speaker 2: when Craig Counsel had him for the Brewers, and that
1:50
Speaker 2: was in you know, a trade deadline move that was
1:54
Speaker 2: not like, you know, earth shattering. He was not pitching
1:58
Speaker 2: well as a starter at that time, and once again
2:03
Speaker 2: the Brewers found a way to like do more with
2:06
Speaker 2: less and extract something out of a pitcher who you know,
2:11
Speaker 2: sort of looked, you know, a little washed up at
2:14
Speaker 2: that point. And I mean, he pitches so well for
2:17
Speaker 2: the Brewers, he gets this huge contract with the Padres,
2:22
Speaker 2: does not stay healthy for most of it, but when
2:24
Speaker 2: he does pitch, he's awesome, And like, I don't know,
2:29
Speaker 2: it's not crazy to think they could catch lightning in
2:31
Speaker 2: a bottle again with with Drew Pomerantz here, just giving
2:35
Speaker 2: their history, the way they kind of cycle through those
2:39
Speaker 2: you know, middle inning relievers and you kind of see
2:42
Speaker 2: what happens. I think we're expecting Pomerants to be at
2:45
Speaker 2: really feeld at some point this week.
2:49
Speaker 3: We'll kind of see how that goes.
2:52
Speaker 2: But I think you see Jed Hoyer's front office, Craig
2:56
Speaker 2: Council's coaching staff just being aggressive and showing their patience
3:01
Speaker 2: is not unlimited.
3:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, And you know, I think what you're talking about
3:07
Speaker 1: with lightning in a bottle like that's that happens so
3:09
Speaker 1: frequently with with relievers. And this is just the reality
3:14
Speaker 1: of bullpens.
3:15
Speaker 4: Uh.
3:16
Speaker 1: We saw it last year with Tyson Miller. He was
3:19
Speaker 1: dfade and and you Adam Yeah by the Mariners. Uh,
3:25
Speaker 1: they the Cubs traded made a small trade for him.
3:28
Speaker 1: It seemed like a nothing move and it really stabilized
3:31
Speaker 1: the bullpen for a period of time. Right, Like the
3:34
Speaker 1: bullpen was not a strength last year, it was much
3:37
Speaker 1: better for portions of the season. Ultimately, for how long
3:43
Speaker 1: it struggled and and the key pieces that did struggle
3:47
Speaker 1: kind of sunk their season right along with the slumping
3:50
Speaker 1: of the offense. But yeah, like this is you're not
3:54
Speaker 1: going to this is at this point in time, You're
3:56
Speaker 1: not going to get this massive upgrade unless you have
4:00
Speaker 1: that massive upgrade, like in the minors or something, right,
4:04
Speaker 1: So you have to kind of hope that you can
4:06
Speaker 1: catch lightning in a bottle if you need, if you
4:10
Speaker 1: need like a significant upgrade, right. And I think right
4:13
Speaker 1: now what I'm seeing is they are starting to kind
4:18
Speaker 1: of find pieces, right, Like guys are settling to different roles,
4:24
Speaker 1: guys are stepping up. I think what you need that.
4:30
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Friday, right because Friday. First of all,
4:34
Speaker 1: that was one of those Yeah, it's one of those
4:37
Speaker 1: games that you cover and you're like, what what is
4:40
Speaker 1: happening right now? Right? And not even like a like
4:43
Speaker 1: there was a David Bodie game where that one like
4:46
Speaker 1: sends your heart racing because it was just like, wow,
4:49
Speaker 1: that was amazing. This was just more like, come on,
4:52
Speaker 1: like is this really happening right now? This is this
4:55
Speaker 1: is a little silly. It was absolutely fun to cover,
4:58
Speaker 1: and it's easier to go in clubhouse when uh when
5:02
Speaker 1: the team when when you're covering the team that won
5:05
Speaker 1: that sort of game, Uh that you know, it's it's
5:08
Speaker 1: a fun atmosphere and all that, but it's really an
5:10
Speaker 1: odd game and it's hard to take away too much
5:13
Speaker 1: from it. Here's one thing I will take away from it.
5:18
Speaker 1: When you have a seven to one lead, I don't
5:20
Speaker 1: care who you have warming up in the bullpen. Uh. Like,
5:23
Speaker 1: once you get that seven to one lead, you bring
5:25
Speaker 1: in a lesser reliever, right if that lesser When I
5:29
Speaker 1: say lesser reliever, that's not an indictment on Jordan Wicks.
5:32
Speaker 1: It's his where he is in the pecking order right now. Right. Uh,
5:37
Speaker 1: he's probably the last guy in a bullpen, as indicated
5:40
Speaker 1: by the fact that he was just sent down right
5:45
Speaker 1: and he couldn't get the job done. Like that's that's
5:49
Speaker 1: not that that doesn't instill a lot of confidence in
5:52
Speaker 1: the guy. Listen, that's a really tough offense. Still, you
5:56
Speaker 1: got to get a couple outs there. You got to
5:58
Speaker 1: avoid using Porter Hodge, like the the idea in that
6:01
Speaker 1: situation is you're trying to get two innings out of
6:05
Speaker 1: Jordan Wicks, save your in theory Hodge and Pressley or
6:09
Speaker 1: your setup guy and your closer, right and and keep
6:12
Speaker 1: them fresh for Saturday or Sunday, right whatever it may be.
6:18
Speaker 1: And and Wicks was completely unable to do that. Uh
6:22
Speaker 1: it turned so quickly. Uh. I don't think like, I
6:26
Speaker 1: don't think there's any reason to bring Hodge in that
6:28
Speaker 1: game when it's seven to one, but once the bases
6:30
Speaker 1: are loaded, no outs, Yeah, kind of have to your
6:35
Speaker 1: hand is forced, right, And and I also don't think
6:38
Speaker 1: that's not a game where I look in and say, like, oh,
6:41
Speaker 1: the bullpen is a disaster that was set up by wicks.
6:44
Speaker 1: Hodge is allowed to have a bad game. He picked
6:47
Speaker 1: the absolute worst time right like to hang a meet
6:50
Speaker 1: called I mean like it was he's But unless that
6:54
Speaker 1: becomes a trend, which we haven't seen. We hadn't seen
6:57
Speaker 1: it before he had a five pitch quick, one two
6:59
Speaker 1: three outing on Sunday, I'm not concerned about Porter Hodge.
7:04
Speaker 1: So is Friday a reason for concern for the bullpen?
7:09
Speaker 4: Not?
7:09
Speaker 1: In my mind, it really isn't. There are plenty of
7:13
Speaker 1: other reasons that built up concern. But I think you need,
7:18
Speaker 1: like when you have a big lead, if you can't, like,
7:21
Speaker 1: you need guys that can come in and just clean
7:24
Speaker 1: those up because those type of outings save the bullpen.
7:27
Speaker 1: That's what keeps your bullpen healthy, that's what keeps them fresh.
7:30
Speaker 1: And not and not getting that, not getting a seven
7:33
Speaker 1: to one victory or whatever it may have been in
7:36
Speaker 1: the end, a blow not getting a blowout victory and
7:38
Speaker 1: having to use your best arms again, that's that hurts,
7:43
Speaker 1: and that I think that's how you look at that game.
7:46
Speaker 1: It's an awesome win, fun win, fun game to cover.
7:49
Speaker 1: We'll probably be looking back at that as like, you
7:53
Speaker 1: know what, you could be looking back at that if
7:55
Speaker 1: they had lost it as one of those games where
7:57
Speaker 1: it's like September you look back, remember that game. They
8:01
Speaker 1: should have won that game, and they knew it right
8:03
Speaker 1: and now they're a game out or they lost the
8:05
Speaker 1: tiebreaker with Arizona or whatever it may be. Right now
8:08
Speaker 1: they have the tiebreaker with Arizona. Now they look like
8:11
Speaker 1: one of the better teams in the National League, and
8:14
Speaker 1: the kind of the narrative around them has shifted because
8:16
Speaker 1: of that game.
8:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's either look at this explosive offense and the
8:23
Speaker 2: team's resiliency to come back, or is it going to
8:26
Speaker 2: be kind of this red flag about a bullpen that
8:32
Speaker 2: you know right now is near the bottom of the
8:36
Speaker 2: majors and the Cubs have covered up some of those issues.
8:40
Speaker 2: And I believe you spoke with Craig Counsel about this.
8:43
Speaker 2: If Presley Hodge and Julie and Merriwether are doing well
8:51
Speaker 2: and if Ethan Roberts looks, you know, somewhat trustworthy, like,
9:00
Speaker 2: where's this bullpen right now?
9:01
Speaker 3: What is you know?
9:02
Speaker 2: Craig Counsel is never one to show many emotions or
9:07
Speaker 2: any emotions, But how does I know you spoke with
9:10
Speaker 2: him at Wrigley Field of the weekend. How is he
9:12
Speaker 2: kind of looking at the group as a whole right now?
9:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's talk about that in a moment. Let's take
9:18
Speaker 1: a quick break and then we can come back and
9:19
Speaker 1: talk about the overall health of the bullpen.
9:21
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10:24
Speaker 1: Well, Patrick, I mean, like, think about last year, right,
10:27
Speaker 1: think about who was struggling. Al Zalai was a mess
10:31
Speaker 1: and then was hurt. Hector Narris just never really settled in,
10:35
Speaker 1: never found his best self pretty much. That looks like
10:39
Speaker 1: it may have been the end of his run in
10:42
Speaker 1: the majors as a truly effective reliever. Julie Merriweather was
10:46
Speaker 1: never healthy, never looked like himself. Mark Leider Junior was
10:51
Speaker 1: really up and down. I felt like maybe he probably
10:54
Speaker 1: was the one of that group that had some bad luck,
10:57
Speaker 1: but the numbers were not there. On a consistent basis
10:59
Speaker 1: for him. Uh So, I mean those coming into the season,
11:03
Speaker 1: those were like expected to be your best relievers, and
11:07
Speaker 1: for the vast majority of the season they were either
11:09
Speaker 1: hurt or ineffective. Uh, that's not the case right now.
11:14
Speaker 1: Borter Hodge outside of Friday, has been awesome, right, Julian
11:18
Speaker 1: Meriwether looks like he's actually getting better with each outing,
11:22
Speaker 1: I feel like, and then obviously Ryan Presley a mess
11:27
Speaker 1: at the beginning of the year. Never really I don't
11:31
Speaker 1: think he cost them a game if I'm remembering, there
11:33
Speaker 1: was one game that he was out there right with
11:35
Speaker 1: the error. There was the error. Yeah, that was the
11:40
Speaker 1: only one where he where he blew the game right,
11:44
Speaker 1: quote unquote. But so it's almost like he settled into it,
11:49
Speaker 1: and now he looks so much better. He looks like
11:52
Speaker 1: a pretty effective reliever, veteran closer. And and whether he's
11:56
Speaker 1: the closer the rest of the season or not, that
11:58
Speaker 1: I think he's showing that he can be pretty effective. Right.
12:02
Speaker 1: You have Brad Keller stepping up, you have Ethan Roberts
12:05
Speaker 1: stepping up. I think Daniel Palencia, like, I don't want
12:10
Speaker 1: to take too much away from it just yet, he's
12:12
Speaker 1: got to keep doing it because we've seen flashes. But
12:15
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what we haven't seen. We haven't seen
12:17
Speaker 1: him go like back to back games like he did
12:19
Speaker 1: and hold the stuff. We haven't seen him go two
12:22
Speaker 1: innings and hold the stuff. He looks like a different
12:24
Speaker 1: pitcher right now. Let's see how long that lasts. But
12:28
Speaker 1: that him with Roberts like that, that creates some depth,
12:31
Speaker 1: right brag Keyler looks like, I don't know, man, I'm
12:34
Speaker 1: watching him and I'm just every single time I see him,
12:37
Speaker 1: I'm like, this guy's kind of awesome. Like the stuff
12:40
Speaker 1: is nasty. He's hitting one hundred miles per hour. He
12:45
Speaker 1: looks like a damn good reliever. That's a lot of
12:48
Speaker 1: relievers that are are good to great right now, including
12:54
Speaker 1: who you came into the season with expecting to be
12:57
Speaker 1: your best relievers, and they are, Like that's huge right now.
13:00
Speaker 1: What we're talking about is the last or the final
13:04
Speaker 1: couple spots in the bullpen. Right if Palancia is legit
13:08
Speaker 1: or even close to okay, Right if he can handle
13:12
Speaker 1: coming into a game when it's five to one Cubs
13:15
Speaker 1: and keep it to you know, keep it to a
13:18
Speaker 1: foe and lead or keep it or only allow a
13:20
Speaker 1: run over two innings, even that would be acceptable.
13:23
Speaker 3: Right.
13:24
Speaker 1: You need these, You need guys that can just keep
13:27
Speaker 1: games in check. Or if you're down three to two
13:30
Speaker 1: and Polancy comes in and keeps it that way, right exactly,
13:33
Speaker 1: that's those are the things you're looking for from your
13:37
Speaker 1: fifth sixth reliever. Right, So we'll see who kind of
13:42
Speaker 1: steps up, you know, if it's Drew Promerance, if it's
13:45
Speaker 1: cost Grove, the lefty that they picked up. Field Bar
13:50
Speaker 1: is starting to look a little bit better too, right
13:52
Speaker 1: Like if I don't know, like I don't fully I'm
13:55
Speaker 1: not there yet, just because the command seems to just
13:57
Speaker 1: disappear at times for him. So I feel like this
14:02
Speaker 1: bullpen is coming together. Listen. I'm not going to like
14:08
Speaker 1: criticize fans who are on edge about it. I think
14:12
Speaker 1: fans have been burned too much by bullpens. All fans, listen,
14:18
Speaker 1: Fans are just always uneasy about bullpens. Very rarely do
14:21
Speaker 1: you feel great about a bullpen. Maybe if you're a
14:23
Speaker 1: Padres fan right now, you feel great about your bullpen.
14:25
Speaker 1: But it's just I think as like, fans see this
14:29
Speaker 1: a lot and they hold on to the negative it's
14:31
Speaker 1: so easy to do that right pitching, like relief pictures.
14:35
Speaker 1: It's like one inning, one bad inning can really sink,
14:39
Speaker 1: like that stays with you. I think as a as
14:43
Speaker 1: a fan, as an observers, as media, I think media
14:46
Speaker 1: can can do it too. It's not just fans. So
14:49
Speaker 1: it's it's really easy to to just like it's hard,
14:55
Speaker 1: I should say, to shake that negative feeling of a bullpen.
14:58
Speaker 1: So they have to continue to prove themselves. But I
15:01
Speaker 1: think they're I think they're headed in the right direction.
15:05
Speaker 1: I'm not saying all as well and all is perfect,
15:08
Speaker 1: but like there's a lot of names that you should
15:10
Speaker 1: feel encouraged about, right.
15:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's kind of a pass fail job
15:16
Speaker 2: if if you're Presley or some of those other guys.
15:19
Speaker 2: And the Cubs enter Tuesday fourteen and ten in first place,
15:25
Speaker 2: while playing the most difficult opening schedule in baseball, like
15:29
Speaker 2: they must be doing something right. I think whatever the
15:33
Speaker 2: bullpen looks like now, it's gonna look different maybe by
15:37
Speaker 2: the you know, by Wednesday, by the.
15:40
Speaker 3: Weekend series against the Phillies.
15:41
Speaker 2: Certainly there's gonna be a lot of turnover in May
15:44
Speaker 2: and June and the gold Jed Hoyer said, is to
15:47
Speaker 2: get all eight relievers pitching well at the same time.
15:51
Speaker 3: Very hard to do.
15:52
Speaker 2: But you need those guys, even our head guys as
15:57
Speaker 2: Joe mattuscol to just put it away when you have
15:59
Speaker 2: the lead and just bank those wins.
16:01
Speaker 3: And you need the.
16:02
Speaker 2: Kind of guys lower on the pegging order who can
16:05
Speaker 2: give what looks like a very good offense a chance
16:10
Speaker 2: to come back. And so they're going to constantly be
16:14
Speaker 2: cycling these guys out, Like, yes, Luke Little was the disappointment,
16:18
Speaker 2: but it's not just him. And yes, Jordan Wicks has
16:22
Speaker 2: a nice pedigree as a first round guy and who
16:25
Speaker 2: actually really impressed in twenty twenty three. I gotta say,
16:28
Speaker 2: like coming up towards the end of that season, he
16:30
Speaker 2: looked really good as a rookie thrown in there. Hasn't
16:34
Speaker 2: gotten back to that place yet. But it's not just them.
16:39
Speaker 2: It's just the organization's mindset right now. It is they
16:42
Speaker 2: have to make the playoffs this year. That is their
16:45
Speaker 2: absolute goal, and they're not going to defer as much
16:50
Speaker 2: to development.
16:50
Speaker 3: They're not going to be quite as patient. And you know.
16:57
Speaker 2: Colin Ray has been starting recently, but he's a nice
17:01
Speaker 2: piece to kind of connect the pitching staff the way
17:04
Speaker 2: you just describe sid of that, if they keep getting
17:06
Speaker 2: good starting pitching, if Tommy Hottevey and the coaching staff
17:12
Speaker 2: can keep kind of game planning, and Craig Counsel can
17:18
Speaker 2: keep the big picture in mind.
17:20
Speaker 3: You know, I think that's something that players really are.
17:23
Speaker 2: Relievers in particular, appreciate about Counsel that he either knows
17:27
Speaker 2: how to lose or he knows how to play the
17:29
Speaker 2: odds and the percentages to kind of keep guys healthy
17:33
Speaker 2: over the long term. And look, we already every contending
17:37
Speaker 2: team of our looks for bullpen help, but the trade deadline, right,
17:40
Speaker 2: So that's that's got to be the Cub's focus here.
17:43
Speaker 2: And you know, there are some interesting names at Iowa.
17:47
Speaker 2: There is at least, you know, a certain amount of
17:50
Speaker 2: depth that you know, I don't think there's like a
17:53
Speaker 2: huge drop off from say the eighth guy in the
17:56
Speaker 2: bullpen to you know, maybe your nine tenth and ten, ninth,
18:00
Speaker 2: tenth and eleventh guys on the Eyewashers are obviously forty
18:04
Speaker 2: man considerations and contractual issues to work through as well.
18:08
Speaker 2: But you know, if the Cubs were maybe ten and
18:13
Speaker 2: fourteen at the moment, I think you could be screaming
18:16
Speaker 2: about the bullpen. I think it's just hard at the
18:20
Speaker 2: start of the season. There's a lot of kind of
18:23
Speaker 2: trial and error going on right here, and the Cubs
18:27
Speaker 2: are more than kind of passing the eye test right now.
18:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think I think what you're saying there, like, listen,
18:37
Speaker 1: you don't want what happened last year where it'sly costing
18:41
Speaker 1: you games and then you look back and say, yeah,
18:44
Speaker 1: we fix this or we stabilized it, or we got
18:46
Speaker 1: it to a good place. But look at the these
18:49
Speaker 1: eight games that cost us or whatever half dozen games
18:53
Speaker 1: that it cost us. That you don't want the Cubs
18:55
Speaker 1: to be saying that at the end of the season,
18:57
Speaker 1: and and so far they really have its call. Has
19:00
Speaker 1: the bullpen cost them a couple of games? Sure, you
19:03
Speaker 1: could say that their offenses has stolen them a couple
19:07
Speaker 1: of games, right, and beat up on other teams bullpens
19:10
Speaker 1: and whatever it may be, right and and taken some games.
19:15
Speaker 1: So like those those things tend to even out. You
19:18
Speaker 1: just don't want it to happen like every other day,
19:21
Speaker 1: or you don't want you don't want, So what happened
19:26
Speaker 1: on Friday right. You don't want that to continually happen,
19:29
Speaker 1: because what happens then is you're using your guys over
19:32
Speaker 1: and over again, and then come August and September, Porter
19:36
Speaker 1: Hodge isn't as good as he is now because he's
19:38
Speaker 1: exhausted because he's at whatever, you know, seventy innings at
19:42
Speaker 1: the beginning of September instead of at the end of September, Right,
19:46
Speaker 1: or whatever it may be. You just don't want these
19:48
Speaker 1: guys completely gas. You don't want Ryan Presley overused, You
19:52
Speaker 1: don't want you just don't want any of that, right.
19:55
Speaker 1: You need to find ways to get these guys breaks.
19:57
Speaker 1: And that's that's why, like Friday just cannot be like, yeah,
20:02
Speaker 1: it was a fun thirteen to eleven. Cubs offense is
20:06
Speaker 1: awesome and looks like it can win them a lot
20:08
Speaker 1: of games. Great, rest your bullpen arms, make sure they're
20:11
Speaker 1: healthy for the stretch run. I think that's really important. Patrick.
20:17
Speaker 1: What something I kind of want to touch on that
20:19
Speaker 1: I think is, you know, I don't want to rehash
20:23
Speaker 1: everything that happened in the winter, right, but the Cubs
20:26
Speaker 1: are playing the Dodgers for the final time this week, right,
20:30
Speaker 1: incredibly tough schedule They've done really well. I'm impressed. I'm
20:34
Speaker 1: coming away, you know, impressed. So far. They have five
20:38
Speaker 1: more games before the brutal stretch engine ends. I think
20:41
Speaker 1: there's a couple more actually, after they play Pittsburgh and
20:44
Speaker 1: then they have a couple more tough games. It's like
20:46
Speaker 1: Milwaukee and San Francisco, which is turning out to be
20:50
Speaker 1: will be tough ish. So but still like this was
20:53
Speaker 1: what we kind of circled is get through this and
20:56
Speaker 1: we'll see where they are. So far, so good. But
21:00
Speaker 1: with the Dodgers coming into town, you know, Tanner Scott, Kirby, Yates,
21:06
Speaker 1: guys that the Cubs would have liked to have on
21:10
Speaker 1: their roster, and the Dodgers just out muscle them financially,
21:16
Speaker 1: you know, the Cubs. I don't think Jed loves to
21:19
Speaker 1: spend big. I mean we know that, I don't. I
21:21
Speaker 1: don't say I don't. I don't think we know Jed
21:23
Speaker 1: doesn't love to spend big on the pen, right, But
21:27
Speaker 1: that he was willing to be aggressive for Tanner Scott
21:30
Speaker 1: and get out of what we believed was his comfort
21:32
Speaker 1: zone with the reliever is certainly interesting. And they never
21:38
Speaker 1: they couldn't close that deal. But It's interesting to see
21:41
Speaker 1: them like try and be aggressive and not still not
21:45
Speaker 1: be able to get the guy. That's I think that's
21:48
Speaker 1: telling in two different ways. It's telling that Jed, you know,
21:50
Speaker 1: they loved, they loved Tanner Scott, they love what he
21:53
Speaker 1: can do. Jed also sees, you know, it's what we
21:56
Speaker 1: talked about last episode, that this is going to be
21:58
Speaker 1: an aggressive season, that they're under fire, that they need
22:01
Speaker 1: to get the job done, and they see that they
22:04
Speaker 1: saw Tanner Scott as a guy that kind of could
22:06
Speaker 1: have been a huge piece. Imagine. I don't know if
22:10
Speaker 1: they signed Tanner Scott, if they still get Ryan Presley right, No.
22:14
Speaker 3: They wouldn't.
22:14
Speaker 6: I think they would not have gone after right same
22:18
Speaker 6: same So so I think maybe it doesn't completely change.
22:25
Speaker 1: The the way the bullpen looks, right because in theory
22:28
Speaker 1: adding Presley just you still have that bottom of the
22:31
Speaker 1: bullpen issue. But also maybe you don't have the hiccups
22:35
Speaker 1: early in the year. I don't know, you don't have
22:38
Speaker 1: questions about having a lefty. All these things right different
22:41
Speaker 1: you have different issues steel bars the second lefty instead
22:43
Speaker 1: of the primary lefty. I don't know if Tanner Scott's
22:45
Speaker 1: closing maybe Porter Hodge is closing. I don't know what
22:48
Speaker 1: they do. I don't know what the Cubs would do
22:50
Speaker 1: in that situation, but ultimately the Cubs are you know,
22:55
Speaker 1: you can look at how the Dodgers built their bullpen
22:58
Speaker 1: and how the Cubs built built their bull pen, and
23:00
Speaker 1: it's you know it. I think Cubs fans just look
23:03
Speaker 1: at that with envy and say, man, that that team
23:08
Speaker 1: doesn't have to stress out about every every close game,
23:12
Speaker 1: right uh. And again, I think eventually Cubs fans will
23:15
Speaker 1: come to believe in this bullpen. But right now there's
23:20
Speaker 1: you know, they're still they're still on edge, and and
23:22
Speaker 1: the fact that they don't outspend the competition to get
23:25
Speaker 1: the job done is going to remain a frustration I
23:28
Speaker 1: think with a certain with certain fans. And I think
23:31
Speaker 1: that's fair understandably.
23:34
Speaker 3: So like, has Jed learned his lesson with a bullpen? I?
23:40
Speaker 3: I think so. I think he definitely.
23:42
Speaker 2: I mean offering Tanner Scott four years and sixty six
23:45
Speaker 2: million dollars, Uh, I would think he'd be the closer
23:50
Speaker 2: in that scenario over a second year reliever and Porter
23:54
Speaker 2: Hot But you're right, like, I don't think that would
23:59
Speaker 2: have led like three more big bullpen moves or you know,
24:04
Speaker 2: And I think the frustration is, you know, look, Presley's
24:07
Speaker 2: a good, good pitcher, like hard to top his resume
24:13
Speaker 2: in the postseason.
24:15
Speaker 3: It's the.
24:17
Speaker 2: Why not David Robertson Now the baseball industry as a whole,
24:20
Speaker 2: and David Robertson do not see ey eye on value clearly,
24:24
Speaker 2: Otherwise I'd assume he'd be pitching somewhere. But it was
24:27
Speaker 2: just kind of the you know, why not add a
24:33
Speaker 2: little more? Why so far below the CBT threshold? And look,
24:41
Speaker 2: these got these relievers are so little. I believe Blake
24:43
Speaker 2: Trinon just went down with an injury and he was
24:45
Speaker 2: part of that Dodger.
24:48
Speaker 3: You know, rush to just totally rebuildable. But like Ryan
24:54
Speaker 3: Brazier was a good picture.
24:55
Speaker 2: Now, maybe he obviously hasn't done much for the Cubs
24:59
Speaker 2: and he's not very close to coming back from his injury,
25:02
Speaker 2: but like I do think we've seen a little bit
25:06
Speaker 2: of an evolution of how people look at bullpens. Like
25:11
Speaker 2: I know, the Dodgers have more money seemingly than anyone.
25:15
Speaker 2: Maybe the Mets have more, but if they're willing to
25:18
Speaker 2: spend that much money on their bullpen. It's probably a
25:22
Speaker 2: good way to go about it, right, Like, the Dodgers
25:24
Speaker 2: don't make dumb decisions by and large, so if they're
25:26
Speaker 2: willing to pour that much money into their bullpen and
25:29
Speaker 2: spend on older relievers, it probably tells you something about,
25:37
Speaker 2: you know, the efficiency and the usefulness of how to
25:45
Speaker 2: kind of go about it. And obviously they leaned hard
25:47
Speaker 2: on their bullpen last October, and you know, I think
25:51
Speaker 2: this is something we'll probably get into later this summer
25:57
Speaker 2: of like it's nice to have, you know, pieces you
26:02
Speaker 2: kind of trust in May against the pirates, But do
26:06
Speaker 2: the Cubs have like the put away dominant relievers to
26:11
Speaker 2: win in October? And that for the Cubs would be
26:14
Speaker 2: a nice conversation to have, knowing that they made the playoffs.
26:20
Speaker 3: But I think that's the time.
26:20
Speaker 2: When you kind of get greedy and you know start
26:24
Speaker 2: you know, you're do your A relievers match up against
26:29
Speaker 2: the Dodgers A relievers or the Padres A relievers?
26:32
Speaker 3: Like can they put away some of the.
26:35
Speaker 2: Best lineups in the game, and thus far, I think
26:39
Speaker 2: they've done a pretty good job. Like I think it's
26:42
Speaker 2: you have to kind of credit them for getting those results,
26:47
Speaker 2: and you know, we'll see whether they can sustain it.
26:51
Speaker 2: And that's where aside of I think your point is
26:53
Speaker 2: very well taken of. You know, how counsel manages this
26:56
Speaker 2: group with the long term in mind, with a big
26:59
Speaker 2: picture mind, is really important and I think should show up.
27:04
Speaker 2: We saw it with the Brewers, how they finished and
27:07
Speaker 2: closed so well in those septembers year after year.
27:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, ultimately for me, and I think if I think
27:17
Speaker 1: I'm remembering how I was reacting early on in the season,
27:20
Speaker 1: my concern was always Presley, Yeah, if he like I
27:24
Speaker 1: just like I needed to see more from him. And
27:27
Speaker 1: I'm starting to see that now and I believe now
27:29
Speaker 1: that that is is now that I feel a little
27:32
Speaker 1: bit more confident with him, it really settles the bullpen
27:35
Speaker 1: and it makes me more confident that the bullpen can
27:37
Speaker 1: be good going forward. It was my point earlier in
27:40
Speaker 1: the show that you have your best relievers pitching, well,
27:45
Speaker 1: you can figure out that bottom half. You can figure
27:48
Speaker 1: it out. It's not that it's not impossible. Right. It
27:52
Speaker 1: should also mention that Tyson Miller, I believe, is supposed
27:55
Speaker 1: to pitch in back to back games either Tuesday Wednesday
27:58
Speaker 1: or Wednesday Thursday. I can't remember. Console said, in fact
28:01
Speaker 1: from a remembering council, wasn't even one hundred percent sure.
28:03
Speaker 1: But he's pitching him back to back soon, and that
28:08
Speaker 1: that tells me. You know, I don't want to speak
28:10
Speaker 1: out of turn, but I think he may be close
28:11
Speaker 1: to coming back then if it's got me to pitch, yeah, Jack, right, Yeah,
28:17
Speaker 1: so I mean that helps things too, right, that that
28:20
Speaker 1: should help you figure out some things. If he's healthy
28:23
Speaker 1: and effective, now you have one more trusted arm. That's
28:26
Speaker 1: pretty big, right. He doesn't need to become the seventh
28:28
Speaker 1: inning guy. If he's just a guy that pitches when
28:31
Speaker 1: the team is down a couple of rounds or whatever,
28:34
Speaker 1: trying to hold a big lead or keep a deficit close,
28:38
Speaker 1: one of those things. You'll take that, right. If that's
28:40
Speaker 1: what Tyson Miller is, I think that's a big deal.
28:43
Speaker 1: And then we'll see Asad is supposed to pitch Tuesday,
28:46
Speaker 1: we'll see when he when he comes back. So you
28:50
Speaker 1: know they're getting healthy too. You mentioned Brazier. I don't
28:53
Speaker 1: think he's close so yeah.
28:56
Speaker 3: So ways off.
28:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they're starting to get a little healthier there,
29:02
Speaker 1: even though they've lost some guys like Eli Morgan, but yeah,
29:06
Speaker 1: I think it's headed in a better direction and they're
29:09
Speaker 1: trying to create depth by making moves like true promerence.
29:12
Speaker 1: So we'll see where this ends up. I think it's
29:15
Speaker 1: always it's going to continue to evolve. We'll see what
29:17
Speaker 1: guys emerge from the miners, whatever it may be. Bullpen's
29:20
Speaker 1: just going to be a topic of conversation. It always is,
29:23
Speaker 1: and I think that's with a good reason. All right, everyone,
29:28
Speaker 1: thanks so much for listening. This is Northside Territory Foul
29:30
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29:35
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29:46
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29:48
Speaker 1: things Cubs for the rest of the season and into
29:50
Speaker 1: the winter. Thanks so much for listening to everyone. Take
29:52
Speaker 1: care you don't name anything the name
30:07
Speaker 6: Do they