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Feminist Movie Friday: Summer of Soul · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome stuff. One
0:07
Speaker 1: Never Told You, Protection of Buy Heart Radio, and today
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Speaker 1: for feminist movie Friday, we're talking about the twenty twenty
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Speaker 1: one documentary Summer of Love or When the Revolution Could
0:26
Speaker 1: Not Be Televised, directed by Amir Questlov Thompson, who is
0:30
Speaker 1: a coworker.
0:32
Speaker 2: He's on our network network, so we know friends of
0:36
Speaker 2: friends and friends.
0:37
Speaker 1: We're definitely like two degrees away from him.
0:40
Speaker 2: We two are one.
0:42
Speaker 1: Well one, I think you're right.
0:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, one, I think we're one. Like we're so close
0:47
Speaker 2: to sitting next to him one day in a random work.
0:52
Speaker 1: Activity, random work activity. Yeah. I think we actually did
0:57
Speaker 1: go to an event at a conference where he was
1:00
Speaker 1: the DJ. Oh, I don't know. I don't know. I
1:03
Speaker 1: think we're there. I don't know if we were there
1:06
Speaker 1: when he was the DJ, but eventually I think we
1:09
Speaker 1: left before that happened, which is very on brand for us, right, yes,
1:16
Speaker 1: but yes, So this documentary delves into the nineteen sixty
1:20
Speaker 1: nine Harlem Cultural Festival and the lack of media coverage
1:24
Speaker 1: on it, other civil rights movements and social change that
1:27
Speaker 1: was happening at the same time. It won so many awards,
1:31
Speaker 1: including the Academy Award for Best Documentary Feature, Just so Many.
1:37
Speaker 1: One of the reasons it caught so much attention was
1:40
Speaker 1: the restoration of the footage, which is amazing. It looks amazing.
1:46
Speaker 2: Well, the sound was so good too, like the sounds
1:49
Speaker 2: so clear.
1:50
Speaker 1: Yes, would. I was shocked at how good it looked,
1:53
Speaker 1: not because just because it's from the seventies, like the
1:56
Speaker 1: late sixties, early seventies. It looks amazing. The second part
2:01
Speaker 1: of the title comes from poet and musician Gil Scott
2:05
Speaker 1: Heron's nineteen seventy poem and song The Revolution Will Not
2:09
Speaker 1: Be Televised, And it's a mix of concert footage from
2:14
Speaker 1: this event and interviews with people who attended or performed
2:19
Speaker 1: that really tells the story of what was going on
2:21
Speaker 1: at the time, why it mattered, how it's relevant now.
2:25
Speaker 1: The music is so stunning, it's just amazing, and people
2:29
Speaker 1: are so moved when they're talking about it and when
2:31
Speaker 1: they're remembering it amazing. You can see our past episodes
2:38
Speaker 1: on women, black Women in Blues, Black Women in Hip Hop,
2:43
Speaker 1: Massage Noir less directly related but related. Yes, yes, all right,
2:49
Speaker 1: So I wrote plot question Mark because it's kind of
2:56
Speaker 1: a less of a plot and more of a breakdown
2:58
Speaker 1: of what this is and how it yeah happens, As
3:01
Speaker 1: we said. The film documents the Harlem Cultural Festival, which
3:05
Speaker 1: took place in Harlem over six weekends from June twenty
3:08
Speaker 1: ninth to August twenty fourth, where black performers took the
3:12
Speaker 1: stage and the list of performers was wide ranging and
3:16
Speaker 1: really impressive. Stevie Wonder, Nina Simone, Mahalia Jackson, Gladys Knight
3:21
Speaker 1: and the Pips, B. B. King, Sly and the Family Stone,
3:24
Speaker 1: the Chambers Brothers, the Fifth Dimension and Mavis Staples, among
3:29
Speaker 1: so many others. It was sponsored by Maxwell House, the
3:32
Speaker 1: coffee brand.
3:35
Speaker 2: Can we talk about the ad in there too.
3:39
Speaker 1: It's a very time cheek ad tongue in cheek in
3:44
Speaker 1: the fact that they showed this ad Maxwell House did
3:46
Speaker 1: that was not the most so kind of appropriate. They're like, oh,
3:54
Speaker 1: coffee beads from Africa.
3:56
Speaker 2: Africa, the lens of Africa. The whole thing was like, oh.
4:01
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, but they were the sponsor. It was produced
4:06
Speaker 1: and directed by Tony Lawrence and it was supported by
4:08
Speaker 1: New York City's Liberal Republican mayor John Lindsay. The Black
4:13
Speaker 1: Panthers provided security because the NYPD refused at first. A
4:17
Speaker 1: later came in, but at first they were like no,
4:19
Speaker 1: no know. About three hundred thousand people attended, It was free,
4:23
Speaker 1: and it was this huge, huge event. While the festival
4:28
Speaker 1: had these powerhouse performances and professional cameras covering the whole thing, Woodstock,
4:35
Speaker 1: which was happening about one hundred miles away, completely overshadowed
4:39
Speaker 1: this in mainstream media coverage. Over forty hours were filmed,
4:45
Speaker 1: all of which was condensed down into two one hour
4:48
Speaker 1: specials that I think were shown on ABC and CBS.
4:52
Speaker 1: After that, the tapes were shelved and pretty much forgotten,
4:56
Speaker 1: though some tried to bring them back to light a
4:58
Speaker 1: couple of times, and footage of Nina Simone's performance was
5:01
Speaker 1: used in a couple of documentaries about her. The producer
5:05
Speaker 1: of these forty hours, how Tuccin, was one of the
5:08
Speaker 1: key people trying to get these tapes out to the public.
5:11
Speaker 1: He tried to sell the footage, but to paraphrase him,
5:14
Speaker 1: nobody cared. A film archivist named Joe Laura reached out
5:20
Speaker 1: to Tuccin and digitized and cataloged the tapes. There were
5:23
Speaker 1: a couple of relationships and deals that didn't work out,
5:26
Speaker 1: and in twenty sixteen, a couple of producers came together
5:29
Speaker 1: to make this film and they approached Questlov about the project.
5:34
Speaker 1: He was initially shocked he'd never heard of it, and
5:36
Speaker 1: decided he wanted to make sure that others did. He said, quote,
5:41
Speaker 1: the fact that forty hours of footage was kept from
5:43
Speaker 1: the public is living proof that revigionous history exists. It
5:46
Speaker 1: was incredibly important for me to get that history right.
5:50
Speaker 1: And he also he has a lot of great interviews
5:51
Speaker 1: about this, but he was talking about how at first
5:53
Speaker 1: he was questioning whether he could do this, but then
5:58
Speaker 1: just was like, yes, this is something I can do
6:03
Speaker 1: and needs to be done and needs to be done correctly.
6:06
Speaker 1: And I really love how it opens and closes with
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Speaker 1: attendee Musa Jackson, who's a kid when he went and
6:13
Speaker 1: to see his reaction that actually that wasn't what they
6:16
Speaker 1: were intending. I think they wanted to end with Mahalia
6:20
Speaker 1: Jackson in Mavis doing that really emotional thing emotional performance
6:25
Speaker 1: sets in the middle. But seeing his reaction it was
6:28
Speaker 1: just such a good book end of remembering this experience, right.
6:35
Speaker 2: I mean the fact that he also had to go
6:36
Speaker 2: back and be validating and like, no, I remember this happening.
6:40
Speaker 2: I thought I was people thought I was crazy. I
6:42
Speaker 2: thought I was crazy, but I'm not.
6:43
Speaker 1: It happened.
6:43
Speaker 2: It really happened.
6:44
Speaker 1: Like I love that.
6:45
Speaker 2: That was that level of like the erasure and then
6:48
Speaker 2: the validation.
6:50
Speaker 1: Essentially, Yeah, it's good. And he was so clearly moved
6:55
Speaker 1: and at seeing this, that this footage that had been
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Speaker 1: pretty much hidden way and a race for all this time.
7:02
Speaker 1: So it's really lovely. The music's great, The footage is amazing.
7:07
Speaker 1: I highly recommend. But yes, obviously one of the big
7:10
Speaker 1: themes is the music. There is a lot of talk
7:15
Speaker 1: in there about how music can commemorate or recognize these
7:21
Speaker 1: huge and often painful cultural events or moments or just existences.
7:29
Speaker 1: So the one I mentioned earlier, Mahalia Jackson singing Martin
7:33
Speaker 1: Luther King Junior's favorite hymn with Mavis was a really emotional,
7:38
Speaker 1: powerful moment.
7:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, and just for context, I think you mentioned but
7:44
Speaker 2: the fact that MLK had just been it's not too
7:46
Speaker 2: long before, as well as the founder of the Black
7:50
Speaker 2: pant Panther, Malcolm X. So so many people have been
7:54
Speaker 2: especially during this time in this conversation of civil rights activism.
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Speaker 2: This was so close to that that it was very
8:02
Speaker 2: significant in what was being performed, in what was being
8:05
Speaker 2: relayed through this specific festival.
8:08
Speaker 1: Yes, and I do have a quote about that from
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Speaker 1: an NPR article. After a violent winter, the Summer of
8:14
Speaker 1: Soul was a musical moment of healing by Carol Cooper quote.
8:18
Speaker 1: Unlike Woodstock, these concerts were no syperitic celeration of hippie counterculture,
8:23
Speaker 1: but a direct response to the profound losses and violence
8:26
Speaker 1: endured by black activists and progressives that preceded that summer.
8:30
Speaker 1: Nonviolent and legislative attempts to dismantle and institutionalized racism had
8:35
Speaker 1: led to a devastating series of political assassinations during the
8:38
Speaker 1: nineteen sixties, most attributed to arcane conspiracy theories. Having lost
8:43
Speaker 1: Medgar Evers in nineteen sixty three, Malcolm X in nineteen
8:47
Speaker 1: sixty five, then both the Reverend doctor Martin Luther King
8:50
Speaker 1: Junior and Robert F. Kennedy in nineteen sixty eight, ordinary
8:54
Speaker 1: Black citizens were tired of counting martyrs. The nineteen sixty
8:59
Speaker 1: nine edition of the f was a carefully coordinated reaction
9:02
Speaker 1: to these cumulative losses. Black America's acute sense of being
9:07
Speaker 1: forcibly denied. Both altruistic leadership and hope made the Harlem
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Speaker 1: Cultural Festival about more than mere music. So yeah, it
9:15
Speaker 1: was a It was a lot of uh, these really
9:21
Speaker 1: traumatic events had happened, a lot of loss of leadership,
9:25
Speaker 1: And through the interviews with attendees and musicians, you hear
9:31
Speaker 1: about these ideas of both using music as something for
9:36
Speaker 1: progress and for activism, but also using music as therapy
9:41
Speaker 1: or as a way to come together and let some
9:44
Speaker 1: of these emotions out or share some of these emotions
9:47
Speaker 1: with a community. Right.
9:49
Speaker 2: And I think when we talk about music in general,
9:51
Speaker 2: when we talk about gospel music, when we talk about
9:53
Speaker 2: folk music, when we talk about hip hop, we know
9:56
Speaker 2: the origination. And when we often talk about we cant
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Speaker 2: to contribute beginning or the creation or the invention of something,
10:02
Speaker 2: it's usually to the black community. The black people music
10:05
Speaker 2: would be at the top of that list. And I
10:07
Speaker 2: think that's something that we have to consistently remember. And
10:10
Speaker 2: the fact that we see two big events would stock
10:12
Speaker 2: and this event happening back to back, and only one
10:15
Speaker 2: got the attention and one was appealing to all kind
10:18
Speaker 2: of you know, that whole hippie lifestyle like just love
10:21
Speaker 2: each other man, We just want to be together unity,
10:23
Speaker 2: which is a great ideal, while this festival was talking
10:26
Speaker 2: about survival essentially and being strong and strengthening each other
10:31
Speaker 2: and building each other up as humans. So I think
10:34
Speaker 2: it's such a giant conversation in that and then knowing
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Speaker 2: which one was erased once again and which one wasn't
10:40
Speaker 2: and lives in like infamy, like one of we know
10:43
Speaker 2: when it comes to Woodstock, everybody knows what that is
10:46
Speaker 2: without knowing what that is, as where we talk about
10:49
Speaker 2: the Harlem Cultural Festival in that conversation of like we
10:53
Speaker 2: knew kind of vaguely because of Nina's amone. I think
10:56
Speaker 2: if you know anything about activism and music and you
11:00
Speaker 2: know about her, you know a little bit in its context,
11:04
Speaker 2: but not the full array of what it was. And
11:08
Speaker 2: just in conversation when we're talking about music in general,
11:12
Speaker 2: we have to understand that music really did come from
11:16
Speaker 2: the black community. And when we see Travesty's in this
11:20
Speaker 2: conversation where they're no longer part of that conversation, I
11:23
Speaker 2: know that was a kind of a chopped up centis
11:25
Speaker 2: but that's when we know that injustice is very, very
11:28
Speaker 2: very real. Erasure is very, very, very real because these
11:32
Speaker 2: were all things that they have been doing that this
11:34
Speaker 2: has been their therapy, their conversations, their stories that so
11:41
Speaker 2: many people would try to hide.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the reasons I would really recommend this
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Speaker 1: documentary is that you get to see all kinds of
12:00
Speaker 1: styles of music, all types of genres, and and hearing
12:06
Speaker 1: the musicians talk about it, or even just the attendees
12:09
Speaker 1: talk about, oh, I'd never heard this type, or I'd
12:11
Speaker 1: never heard this type, or I've never done this or
12:14
Speaker 1: something like that. It was really really interesting.
12:18
Speaker 2: And comedians. I love thatians coming through.
12:23
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, yeah they did. They did. And
12:29
Speaker 1: another thing we're going to talk about later is that,
12:31
Speaker 1: you know, this is all very dire what we're talking about.
12:33
Speaker 1: It was very dire, but it's a very joyous, like
12:37
Speaker 1: this experience. A lot of the crowd is so joyous
12:41
Speaker 1: and you can see just like all ages of people.
12:45
Speaker 2: Also, it was free.
12:46
Speaker 1: It's free my mind. These are like huge names. It
12:51
Speaker 1: was like hit after hit after hit.
12:54
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Stevie Wonder is on there. Of course, Nina
12:56
Speaker 2: Simone once again, but Mahalia Jackson was huge too, Like
13:00
Speaker 2: like huge names, you're like wait.
13:01
Speaker 1: What, Yeah, yeah it was. It was amazing. Yeah, it
13:07
Speaker 1: was just really cool to see. And one of the
13:09
Speaker 1: things going back to kind of the the therapy thing,
13:13
Speaker 1: it just it stuck out to me because it was
13:15
Speaker 1: about UGA.
13:16
Speaker 2: But that's conversation we have to come back to. Who
13:20
Speaker 2: goes all like, but that is my Alma monter, Like,
13:22
Speaker 2: that's what I went to school, And I'm like, oh
13:25
Speaker 2: it was.
13:26
Speaker 1: It was a reporter that was being interviewed. She was
13:29
Speaker 1: talking about the power of music is therapy and finding
13:32
Speaker 1: this and she was one of the first black people
13:38
Speaker 1: who was allowed to attend UGA and got a lot
13:44
Speaker 1: of backlash, experienced a lot of racist attacks because of it.
13:47
Speaker 1: And she would have these people like banging because they
13:52
Speaker 1: knew what room was hers, so they would be banging
13:54
Speaker 1: around to disturb her, and she would just turn on
13:57
Speaker 1: Nina Simone and listen to it, like, no, I can.
14:03
Speaker 2: I would love to know who that woman was, the
14:05
Speaker 2: white woman that interviewed. She was like, they can't be here,
14:08
Speaker 2: they can't they can be here. I don't like it,
14:11
Speaker 2: but they better not be in our dorm rooms. Essentially,
14:14
Speaker 2: I know. I'm like, I hope this haunts you. I
14:17
Speaker 2: hope your grandkids see this and are at least embarrassed.
14:21
Speaker 2: They might not be horrified because I probably already know
14:23
Speaker 2: who you are, but at least I hope generationally y'all
14:27
Speaker 2: are embarrassed.
14:28
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, But she had a really interesting story too
14:34
Speaker 1: about working as a black woman in editorial and writing
14:37
Speaker 1: and journalism. Very fascinating. Also something I wanted to touch
14:42
Speaker 1: on because I thought it was cool. I know this
14:44
Speaker 1: about Questlove because I've seen some interviews with him. He's
14:47
Speaker 1: a very technical person, like he like likes knowing the
14:52
Speaker 1: technology and stuff of how did they record this? What
14:56
Speaker 1: was the technology then? Like we said, this documentary looks amazing,
15:05
Speaker 1: And I feel like a lot of times when we
15:07
Speaker 1: do female first with eaves or something, we always come
15:10
Speaker 1: back to we have to thank the researchers who did
15:15
Speaker 1: this work. Are the people who were constantly like, no,
15:18
Speaker 1: we need to we can't let this die, or we
15:20
Speaker 1: can't forget this, and the people who did the restoration,
15:27
Speaker 1: who were behind the reclamation of this that it just
15:32
Speaker 1: looks amazing, it sounds amazing. It's it's such a great
15:38
Speaker 1: snapshot of the time, but it's also such a it's
15:43
Speaker 1: so well contextualized with the history and all the things
15:47
Speaker 1: that were happening, but it also is like it comes
15:50
Speaker 1: back to what's happening in our current day and just
15:56
Speaker 1: the work of people doing that of all the like
15:58
Speaker 1: technical aspects and storytelling us specs and making sure that
16:02
Speaker 1: this was done well historically.
16:05
Speaker 2: They were able to show us what needs to be
16:07
Speaker 2: done when it comes to history repeating itself, like the
16:11
Speaker 2: level of work that they've already gone through. Also, I
16:14
Speaker 2: was very sad. I'm not gonna lie, I think I'm
16:16
Speaker 2: in a mood. I'm in a mood any when it
16:18
Speaker 2: comes to just everything happening and I think today is
16:21
Speaker 2: one of my bad days. Yeah, just gonna put that
16:24
Speaker 2: a little out there. But it made me sad because
16:28
Speaker 2: these people who I'm so glad we were they were
16:31
Speaker 2: able to talk to and interview and bring back to
16:35
Speaker 2: see their reactions and their joy and their like all
16:38
Speaker 2: of the things that they had felt and being able
16:40
Speaker 2: to really relate that to the audience at the same
16:44
Speaker 2: time feeling like we're back here again, and realizing how
16:49
Speaker 2: much that community who was working during the civil rights
16:54
Speaker 2: movement and civil rights movement and time, how much they
16:58
Speaker 2: had to go through and what kind of work and
17:01
Speaker 2: sacrifice that they had to go through, but to only
17:04
Speaker 2: be here again, I'm not gonna lie. I had a moment, yeah,
17:09
Speaker 2: because I was like, son of a why they did
17:13
Speaker 2: so much and they made so much progress?
17:16
Speaker 1: Oh my god. Yeah, now I had that moment too.
17:20
Speaker 1: I had that moment too. And I mean, that's one
17:22
Speaker 1: of the things I think is great about it though,
17:23
Speaker 1: is that it doesn't shy away from that, but it
17:25
Speaker 1: also does show the joy of this event particularly and
17:32
Speaker 1: why it was so important. And another thing they touch
17:35
Speaker 1: on is why it's so important that the movie exists
17:40
Speaker 1: because not everyone could go to Woodstock, but there was
17:44
Speaker 1: a movie, there was footage they could see, like they
17:46
Speaker 1: could if you couldn't go to this event that was
17:51
Speaker 1: like so powerful and you know, like the whole crowd
17:56
Speaker 1: is almost completely black people. Like it was a very
18:00
Speaker 1: powerful event. And if you couldn't go and you never
18:04
Speaker 1: heard of this, you missed that whole scene. And so
18:08
Speaker 1: the power of having this footage and being able to
18:11
Speaker 1: watch it and at least experience it in some way
18:16
Speaker 1: is really important because not all of us can go
18:19
Speaker 1: to these events, you know, for whatever reason. Maybe you're
18:22
Speaker 1: just not New York, maybe you can't afford it to
18:23
Speaker 1: New York, whatever it is, and so having this is
18:27
Speaker 1: really important.
18:28
Speaker 2: I will say the founder did say that at the
18:30
Speaker 2: very beginning, he said, welcome to this history making event,
18:34
Speaker 2: Like he really had that in there, and it was like, yeah,
18:37
Speaker 2: it really was. Obviously, had we not seen this documentary,
18:42
Speaker 2: not many people would have known how much history was made.
18:44
Speaker 2: But to see that and how significant that was, Wow,
18:48
Speaker 2: Like it we really did get to be a witness
18:50
Speaker 2: to a historical time yeah event.
18:54
Speaker 1: Yeah, And like we said, you would just see people
18:57
Speaker 1: get so caught up in the memories, like they would
18:59
Speaker 1: be watching it just like not answering the question because
19:02
Speaker 1: they were just so caught up in it and being
19:05
Speaker 1: so open about the experience. So I did want to
19:09
Speaker 1: touch on that of just like the power of having
19:11
Speaker 1: things like this. And then of course identity was a
19:15
Speaker 1: huge theme in here. As we said, it was a
19:17
Speaker 1: huge time of shift. Actually, when we were writing our book,
19:22
Speaker 1: we kind of had to have this discussion of like,
19:25
Speaker 1: why are so many events we're focusing on from like
19:28
Speaker 1: this specific time period. But it was a time of
19:31
Speaker 1: huge shift culturally, societally, politically, and there were a couple
19:36
Speaker 1: of things that stood out to me that people brought up.
19:40
Speaker 1: One was the conversation of the Fifth Dimension, I believe,
19:44
Speaker 1: where they said they felt like they weren't black enough. Yes,
19:48
Speaker 1: and they were talking about how much that hurt them
19:50
Speaker 1: and how they were like, you know, how do you
19:53
Speaker 1: color a sound? But music being very segregated at that time,
19:57
Speaker 1: and why it was so important to them that they
19:59
Speaker 1: performed at this event that was about celebrating black culture
20:03
Speaker 1: and black music and black people and it was an
20:07
Speaker 1: excellent performance.
20:09
Speaker 2: It was such a great performance.
20:11
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, and.
20:13
Speaker 2: I have this church moment. I love that.
20:15
Speaker 1: I love how the person that we talked about, Muster Jackson,
20:19
Speaker 1: who opens and closes it, he's like interspersed throughout. And
20:22
Speaker 1: he was like, I just remember they were wearing the
20:24
Speaker 1: Creamsickle outfits, like he remembered it. He was so young,
20:29
Speaker 1: but he remembered it.
20:30
Speaker 2: Remember that there were so many kids in that audience.
20:32
Speaker 2: It was fun to watch them really get into that
20:35
Speaker 2: type of music. I will say that, Yeah, that group
20:38
Speaker 2: was so interesting because they talked about how they became
20:41
Speaker 2: hits in like the whole like interaction with the hair, production,
20:45
Speaker 2: actual play, and how they came up with their one
20:49
Speaker 2: of their number one songs. But I think it does
20:52
Speaker 2: lead to a huge conversation about, like, culturally, what does
20:55
Speaker 2: music look like? And honestly, it was before the conversation
20:59
Speaker 2: of no, but the black community are the ones who
21:02
Speaker 2: created this type of sound to begin with. It just
21:04
Speaker 2: got co opted and because of that, the black community
21:09
Speaker 2: created a different type of context because they wanted like
21:11
Speaker 2: they were good at creating different types of music in
21:14
Speaker 2: that level, and then that conversation of like where do
21:17
Speaker 2: we belong if this is the type of sound we have,
21:22
Speaker 2: and then also going into but we belong everywhere? And
21:26
Speaker 2: that should be the point as well as when these
21:29
Speaker 2: get co opted, there comes a conversation about ownership, and
21:33
Speaker 2: we know when it comes to ownership it often gets
21:35
Speaker 2: handed to those who have the most power. And why
21:37
Speaker 2: supremacy has most power? You know, I'm going right way
21:42
Speaker 2: deep into that thought process, but it is interesting to
21:44
Speaker 2: see because we also have to be mindful in these
21:50
Speaker 2: conversations about like who why people do gatekeep specific music
21:56
Speaker 2: and sounds or anything in general versus why pple abuse
22:01
Speaker 2: and and and take control of something for monetary gain r.
22:07
Speaker 1: There is so much. There is so much, But it
22:10
Speaker 1: was really like seeing them talk about it and they
22:15
Speaker 1: having those like oh, I remember when we did this,
22:18
Speaker 1: or I remember, yeah, it was really it was really nice.
22:24
Speaker 1: There was also a discussion of gender parody in there,
22:28
Speaker 1: especially amongst women attendees, and I think it was in
22:33
Speaker 1: the family Stone they were talking about like I've never
22:36
Speaker 1: seen a woman play the trumpet before and seeing before
22:40
Speaker 1: and how how impactful that was for them, So that
22:44
Speaker 1: was really cool. Of course, Harlem was a big theme,
22:48
Speaker 1: just Harlem in itself and the the history of Harlem
22:52
Speaker 1: and the culture of Harlem, the food, the music, that fashion.
22:57
Speaker 1: It was like a you can't remove it from the
23:01
Speaker 1: whole real festival.
23:03
Speaker 2: Well, Harlem is a culture, like in itself, we know
23:06
Speaker 2: what Harlem represents and what it became for many who
23:09
Speaker 2: had been ousted of other areas, many especially in the
23:13
Speaker 2: black community, outsted of like the South and where they
23:16
Speaker 2: would end up, and Harlem in itself became a time period,
23:21
Speaker 2: like it became a focus, like it became a main character,
23:25
Speaker 2: and so many conversations when it comes to music and art. Again,
23:32
Speaker 2: that realm though is so often co opted because we
23:36
Speaker 2: only know Harlem and some big players, but the influence
23:41
Speaker 2: it had trickles into so many things today that people
23:44
Speaker 2: don't recognize it for.
23:46
Speaker 1: What it was, you know, yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely. There
23:53
Speaker 1: was so much to be said about Harlem in this
23:55
Speaker 1: in this documentary, and they also talked about Spanish Harlem,
23:59
Speaker 1: and they talked about how at this festival they had
24:05
Speaker 1: Puerto Rican performers as well and why that was so important.
24:10
Speaker 1: It's just great again, they did such a fantastic job
24:12
Speaker 1: of contextualizing the whole thing, right, what was going on?
24:18
Speaker 2: It was interesting. Manuel well and his father, right, yeah,
24:24
Speaker 2: we're both featured on there in the conversation and his father, Louise.
24:29
Speaker 2: Manuel was specific because he remembers those eras talking about
24:33
Speaker 2: how significant that type of community was and how the
24:37
Speaker 2: black and Latino community really had to come together during
24:41
Speaker 2: that time. And there was one feature when they were
24:44
Speaker 2: specifically focusing on the Black Panthers and the Black Panthers
24:47
Speaker 2: coming in being security because the cops refused to help
24:51
Speaker 2: in this festival. So the Black Panthers are like, we
24:53
Speaker 2: got you. We make sure that everything is up and up.
24:58
Speaker 2: But in that conversation, the Black Panther members are also
25:00
Speaker 2: talking about how they are there to protect and ensure
25:05
Speaker 2: the rights of the black, the brown, the Asian, like
25:08
Speaker 2: the the I think he said Puerto Ricans specifically, because
25:12
Speaker 2: I know there's a lot of Puerto Ricans in that
25:14
Speaker 2: area New York.
25:15
Speaker 1: Creacan. They had a turn I never heard before.
25:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, but in that like very specific culture because they
25:23
Speaker 2: need you to understand that if you're not white, you're
25:26
Speaker 2: a part of the marginalized. And as much as you
25:29
Speaker 2: want to pretend to be a part of that supremacy,
25:33
Speaker 2: you'll never be. You'll always be an underling to white supremacy.
25:38
Speaker 2: And what the Black Panthers really put into conversation was
25:42
Speaker 2: the intersectionality of what was needed even before intersectionality was
25:47
Speaker 2: a conversation. Yeah, and when I'm saying intersectionality just at
25:51
Speaker 2: the levels of like, yeah, you might not be completely oppressed,
25:54
Speaker 2: but you're somewhat oppressed.
25:56
Speaker 1: You know, like the levels may be.
25:58
Speaker 2: Different for you, but is there.
26:00
Speaker 1: We talked about them in our Ada the Accessibility episode,
26:06
Speaker 1: and they were there for that as well.
26:09
Speaker 2: They were a part of the conversation with the Flave
26:11
Speaker 2: before That's a whole different thing, but like it was
26:14
Speaker 2: really interesting to see. But again, like that focal point
26:18
Speaker 2: within Harlem, that that era really just drive it home
26:23
Speaker 2: into what they were looking at. It was bigger than
26:25
Speaker 2: just a festival. It was.
26:39
Speaker 1: Something else they touched on. And here is religion, and
26:42
Speaker 1: it was really interesting conversation kind of talking about Christianity
26:51
Speaker 1: coming in and co opting again like African religions, but
26:56
Speaker 1: the importance of music in religion. And they have a
27:00
Speaker 1: whole great conversation about gospel music in there and the
27:06
Speaker 1: power of that. And then yes, they obviously big theme
27:13
Speaker 1: who gets televised, who gets erased, So they do have
27:19
Speaker 1: a bunch of clips from they were interviewing people at
27:22
Speaker 1: this festival and the moon landing had just happened, and
27:27
Speaker 1: so many of the people like, no, this is more
27:29
Speaker 1: important to me. You're just wasting my tax payer money.
27:33
Speaker 1: You should put that in. Harlow like, why are you, oh,
27:38
Speaker 1: why are you sending it there when we have all
27:41
Speaker 1: of these people who need it here. But so, yeah,
27:44
Speaker 1: this was like this hugely important event for a lot
27:48
Speaker 1: of people. Woodstock had gotten all this coverage. Now the
27:52
Speaker 1: moon landing was getting all this coverage, but it wasn't
27:54
Speaker 1: getting any any coverage really, So Stevie Won says in there,
28:00
Speaker 1: the so called powers that are were didn't find it
28:03
Speaker 1: significant enough to keep it as part of history. And yeah,
28:08
Speaker 1: I mean even Queslov has a lot of quotes about it.
28:11
Speaker 1: He's like, I can't believe I was denied this. This
28:15
Speaker 1: would have meant so much to me. It would have
28:18
Speaker 1: maybe changed my whole musical understanding. But instead it just
28:23
Speaker 1: sat and gathered dust for all these years.
28:29
Speaker 2: You know, and I know we're going to talk about
28:30
Speaker 2: it in just a second, but I think it really
28:32
Speaker 2: comes close to what people, what many people have said,
28:37
Speaker 2: whether they're a queer community, whether they're disabled, or whether
28:41
Speaker 2: they are a part of the people of color, if
28:43
Speaker 2: it's not tragic or traumatic or violent, they don't want
28:48
Speaker 2: to know this.
28:48
Speaker 1: They don't care.
28:49
Speaker 2: They don't want to spread Yeah, they don't want to
28:52
Speaker 2: spread joy because they were having joy and unity and
28:55
Speaker 2: so that was too good. They looked too happy. They
28:58
Speaker 2: looked too Christine, this is influential in a positive manner,
29:04
Speaker 2: So to show that is not as good. They want
29:06
Speaker 2: to show anything that looks if if something volatile had happened,
29:10
Speaker 2: absolutely it would have been the number one headline story
29:15
Speaker 2: of whatever violence or issue or riot or whatever they
29:19
Speaker 2: could think of could have happened. But because it wasn't
29:22
Speaker 2: because it was a celebration, because people loved it, and
29:25
Speaker 2: then probably we would want more of it.
29:29
Speaker 1: They did not.
29:30
Speaker 2: It was not catchy enough because it was too much joy.
29:33
Speaker 2: And I think about that all the time, like the
29:34
Speaker 2: bad news that we see that we don't see enough
29:37
Speaker 2: of the joy, but a collective joy for a giant
29:40
Speaker 2: group of people in an area that's still being gentrified
29:44
Speaker 2: at that point or hadn't been quite gentrified at that point.
29:48
Speaker 2: To have that as a published part, of course, I'm
29:51
Speaker 2: not going to show that. Of course they would try
29:52
Speaker 2: to erase that because that's too much in giving up
29:55
Speaker 2: love and humanity.
29:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and they did. They certainly did try to
30:04
Speaker 1: keep it under wraps for a very long time. But yeah,
30:08
Speaker 1: I did want to end on that note of joy.
30:11
Speaker 1: It does look, like I said, when you're looking out
30:14
Speaker 1: into the crowd, it looks incredibly joyful. When you're listening
30:18
Speaker 1: to the interviews, people are moved, but in joyous way.
30:23
Speaker 1: I think the last line is Russa Jackson. He says,
30:26
Speaker 1: and how beautiful it was, and he's just like visually
30:31
Speaker 1: tearing up but happy. It's a very like we said.
30:37
Speaker 1: It tackles these dark, dark things, but it's very joyous
30:41
Speaker 1: in the music. And here's a quote from questlov nineteen
30:45
Speaker 1: sixty nine was the year we planted the seeds of
30:48
Speaker 1: what we call black joy, the idea of seeing ourselves
30:51
Speaker 1: in a beautiful light, learning to love ourselves, because previously
30:54
Speaker 1: all indications pointed to the self hate we've been going
30:57
Speaker 1: through since the days of slavery and Jim Crow. That
31:00
Speaker 1: year we embraced our blackness and coined the phrase black
31:03
Speaker 1: is beautiful.
31:04
Speaker 2: And that's another conversation. That's also the same year that
31:07
Speaker 2: they coined the term black like instead of calling people
31:10
Speaker 2: a derogatory term that we know now, that they began
31:12
Speaker 2: using the term, you know, black community, black people in
31:15
Speaker 2: a way in order to reverse some of the trauma
31:19
Speaker 2: that has been imposed due to the labeling in itself.
31:22
Speaker 2: And yeah, I loved that too, with Nina Simone's poems
31:26
Speaker 2: of like empowering blackness is a gorgeous thing. And also
31:30
Speaker 2: this is I think something we could have said at
31:33
Speaker 2: the top, because neither Annie and I are from the
31:36
Speaker 2: black community obviously. How However, with that conversation is like,
31:42
Speaker 2: we have the opportunity to witness something beautiful that wasn't
31:46
Speaker 2: for us. This is not for us in that manner
31:49
Speaker 2: of that. We should be inspired by their work, We
31:54
Speaker 2: should be inspired by that community, We should be inspired
31:57
Speaker 2: by the beauty that happened there and to be able
31:59
Speaker 2: to acknowledge how beautiful this festival was. But it's not
32:04
Speaker 2: about us.
32:05
Speaker 1: It's not for us.
32:06
Speaker 2: And that's that understanding that we should actually absolutely elevate
32:10
Speaker 2: these voices, but an understanding and try to pretend like, yeah,
32:14
Speaker 2: and I did this for them. Nah. No, this is
32:17
Speaker 2: an amazing documentary that shows so much beauty and joy
32:21
Speaker 2: and we should be frustrated that we have not been
32:24
Speaker 2: able to witness this before.
32:26
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely absolutely, because it's I mean, I can't recommend
32:32
Speaker 1: it enough. It's it's so good, the music, all of it.
32:36
Speaker 2: Mahalia Jackson, Mahalia Jackson, I apologize. So I watched. I
32:39
Speaker 2: think I've talked about this before when we were talking
32:41
Speaker 2: about gospel music and soul music. Watching a play based
32:45
Speaker 2: on her when I was working as a missionary in
32:47
Speaker 2: small town, Oklahoma, which I was trying to think back
32:50
Speaker 2: on who got this tickets? They're like, we need to
32:52
Speaker 2: go see this play. The people I went with were
32:55
Speaker 2: not black. I'll tell you that so I don't know
32:57
Speaker 2: who we were, like, we need to go see this
32:59
Speaker 2: because that was so outside the realm of what I
33:01
Speaker 2: would have expected because I was there with the Southern
33:04
Speaker 2: Baptist Convention, y'all. This was before I knew better.
33:07
Speaker 1: Okay, So don't judge me, but this memory, well you
33:10
Speaker 1: can judge me.
33:11
Speaker 2: Actually you should judge me, but this memory specifically of
33:14
Speaker 2: going to because I remember that play was so good
33:17
Speaker 2: and the lead actress that I can't remember, I am
33:19
Speaker 2: so sorry. In Oklahoma. It was glorious. Everything about that
33:23
Speaker 2: play was good. The music was good, the actors were good,
33:26
Speaker 2: the tailing of the story was good. And it was
33:28
Speaker 2: also joyous celebrating her life and to see her perform
33:33
Speaker 2: live like for that was amazing. It's truly mind blowing
33:38
Speaker 2: to see that type of performance actually on stage, and
33:42
Speaker 2: that it was in a secular setting because she did
33:44
Speaker 2: often did perform everywhere, but she was also a specifically
33:47
Speaker 2: gospel singer. So gorgeous. It was so gorgeous. But the
33:51
Speaker 2: entirety of that with her and Mavis was so beautiful. Yes,
33:56
Speaker 2: like heart stoppingly like h and I'm not even religious,
33:59
Speaker 2: but it was gorge.
34:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it was really nice because you know, it
34:03
Speaker 1: was a sad moment in a lot of ways that
34:06
Speaker 1: Mahelia Jackson was like, maybe this I don't feel well
34:09
Speaker 1: like she shared this. Yeah, that's because she remember it.
34:15
Speaker 2: Not only that's one of the best starts. Sorry, it's
34:18
Speaker 2: like Mayva was saying, like, I remember her coming up
34:20
Speaker 2: to me, and then they show it on the clip
34:22
Speaker 2: of her going up through that. I told Stilwell, and
34:24
Speaker 2: he's just seeing girls.
34:25
Speaker 1: Like a they have it on film.
34:27
Speaker 2: They have it on film. That's phenomenal.
34:29
Speaker 1: And the camera angles were amazing.
34:31
Speaker 2: I was like, oh whoa Like he and the original
34:34
Speaker 2: guy who came in on a very low budget with
34:38
Speaker 2: his own idea with the sponsorship still but like he
34:42
Speaker 2: had very minimal mal equipment, but he did amazing job
34:46
Speaker 2: with this work. Like he came in knowing that it
34:49
Speaker 2: could be so good.
34:51
Speaker 1: Yes, and it really was, and he was understandably frustrated
34:57
Speaker 1: that they just shelved it, as we all are and
34:59
Speaker 1: should be.
35:00
Speaker 2: Yeah.
35:01
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I highly recommend loved it. Loved it yes
35:10
Speaker 1: well listeners. If you have any suggestions for movies we
35:16
Speaker 1: should talk about or music love music suggestions all the time,
35:21
Speaker 1: you can email us at Hello at Stuffwenever Told You
35:24
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Speaker 1: one Never Told You. We're also on YouTube, we have
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35:35
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35:40
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