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REWIND: Top 33 Players of All-Time · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

0:00
SPEAKER_01: Hey everybody, Tim here.
0:02
SPEAKER_01: This week's rewind takes you back to our three part series where we ranked the hundred greatest players in Pittsburgh sports history.
0:09
SPEAKER_01: Rather than re-releasing all three episodes, we're bringing you the finale, which was the top thirty-three.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: If you want the full list, you can still find the earlier episodes on our back catalog, but for now, here's the best of the best.
0:39
SPEAKER_01: Hi everybody, welcome to the Pittsburgh Sports Memories Podcast.
0:43
SPEAKER_01: If you've been with us the last couple of weeks, you know that we are counting down the 100th greatest players in the history of Pittsburgh Sports.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: Uh the this list uh was compiled by Steve and I.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: We we ranked everybody independently, then we averaged everybody together.
0:58
SPEAKER_01: We had some criteria.
1:00
SPEAKER_01: People had to be players, uh, they had to have played for a Pittsburgh team, and it was only pro in college, no high school level.
1:06
SPEAKER_01: And we came up with a list of what we think is the hundred greatest players.
1:10
SPEAKER_01: We we did part one two weeks ago, part two last week, and this week we are going to wrap it up with our top players of all time.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: Who do you think is number one?
1:19
SPEAKER_01: You'll have to stay tuned to find out.
1:22
SPEAKER_01: Number 33 is TJ Watt.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Steelers from 2017 to at least the time of this recording.
1:31
SPEAKER_01: Uh he is the team's all-time leader in sacks.
1:34
SPEAKER_01: He was the 2021 defensive player of the year.
1:37
SPEAKER_01: Uh just an absolute dominant force.
1:39
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you watch him, he's just dominant.
1:42
SPEAKER_01: And and the Steelers, I don't have it here in front of me.
1:45
SPEAKER_01: Their record's really bad with Alan.
1:47
SPEAKER_01: Their record, yeah.
1:48
SPEAKER_01: Let's just say that.
1:48
SPEAKER_01: Their record is bad when TJ Watt is not playing.
1:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:53
SPEAKER_02: It's a shame.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: Now there's a guy like I think is kind of clutch, and I mean he does seem, but he hasn't they he hasn't won a playoff game yet, so but I don't think uh I I kind of like have the exact opposite.
2:07
SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't think he's a stats guy.
2:08
SPEAKER_02: I think he's a football player and he wants to win games.
2:11
SPEAKER_02: It just, you know, they haven't had a very good football team around him.
2:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that's fair.
2:17
SPEAKER_02: He doesn't have the linebackers on the inside that Joey Porter or you know, LC Greenwood or Dwight White had, or not Dwight White, he wasn't the mental lineman.
2:28
SPEAKER_01: Well, he came, he came the year, his rookie year was the year that they lost Brian Chazir.
2:32
SPEAKER_01: And I feel like it's taken them six or seven years to rebuild from that injury.
2:38
SPEAKER_02: Well, then I I don't I don't think they have.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: I I mean I don't think they've got a lot of people.
2:42
SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, time will tell, I guess, right?
2:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can't say that they've definitely definitively rebuilt.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: They've definitely had some moments in there, but there's still holes in that defense.
2:50
SPEAKER_01: But he's definitely not one of them.
2:51
SPEAKER_01: I think we can all agree on that.
2:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
2:55
SPEAKER_01: Number 32 is Hugh Green, played for the Pit Panther football team between 1977 and 1980.
3:02
SPEAKER_01: Uh he was a um just to just to give you an idea how dominant Hugh Green was on the defensive side of the football, in 1980 he won the Walter Camp Award, Maxwell Award, the Lombardi Award, and he was the Sporting News Player of the Year, the UPI Player of the Year, and he finished second in the Highland balloting, which is a big deal because the Heisman Trophy is not a defensive player award.
3:27
SPEAKER_01: It's really a quarterback award, sometimes a running back award is not an award to get the defensive lineman.
3:35
SPEAKER_01: Uh Charles Woodson is the only other guy in the history of college football to have finished higher.
3:41
SPEAKER_01: He actually won the Heisman for a defensive player.
3:45
SPEAKER_01: And I think he also returned kicks and stuff.
3:47
SPEAKER_01: Otherwise, I don't think he probably wins it, Steve.
3:49
SPEAKER_01: Charles Woodson.
3:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, yeah.
3:51
SPEAKER_02: That's that famous punt return against Ohio State where he does the Heisman pose at the end.
3:56
SPEAKER_01: So so yeah, Hugh Green was just an absolute dominant force at Pitt.
4:02
SPEAKER_01: Uh there's a site called CollegeFootball News.com.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: They actually named him the fifth greatest college football player of all time.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: Not defender, not defensive lineman player of all time.
4:14
SPEAKER_01: So that just tells you a little something about how good Hugh Green was.
4:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, another guy I never saw play, but I've heard the stories.
4:21
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, he had an amazing career at Pitt.
4:24
SPEAKER_02: And uh part of that is dominant late 70s pit teams.
4:28
SPEAKER_02: So apparently he's the baddest cat in the game, too.
4:36
SPEAKER_01: He was on the cover of Sports Illustrated with that with that title.
4:39
SPEAKER_01: Yep, baddest cat.
4:40
SPEAKER_02: And what looks like a Jaguar, not a Panther, behind it.
4:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, folks folks listening can't see what we're looking at, but there is a go look up the Sports Illustrated cover with Hugh Green and you'll see what we're what we're talking about.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: It's very it's very appropriate for the era.
4:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:55
SPEAKER_02: He's the baddest cat.
4:56
SPEAKER_02: He's the baddest cat out there, man.
4:59
SPEAKER_02: Don't mess with Hugh Green.
5:02
SPEAKER_02: Ruin your quarterback's day.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: Uh number 31 on the list, Chuck Cooper, played basketball at Duquesne between 1946 and 1950.
5:14
SPEAKER_01: Still holds the school record uh 50, well, what, 73 years later of 990 points.
5:23
SPEAKER_01: Uh, we we told the story once on the podcast before, but the University of Tennessee, Tennessee actually forfeits a game in Pittsburgh because uh they wanted Chuck so Chuck Cooper was a was an African American player, and the University of Tennessee uh wanted Duquesne to to sit him on the bench because they're not gonna they're they want to play against only white players, and Duquesne players and administration refused.
5:48
SPEAKER_01: Tennessee had to forfeit he becomes the first black player selected in the NBA draft.
5:55
SPEAKER_01: Uh and and he plays for the Boston Celtics.
5:58
SPEAKER_01: The owner of the Boston Celtics is a guy named Walter Brown.
6:00
SPEAKER_01: He says, quote, he could be striped, plaid, or polka dot.
6:03
SPEAKER_01: All you know is this kid can play basketball, and we want him on the Boston Celtics.
6:08
SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, really a a a revolutionary, not only a great player, but I mean that that's that's when that racism goes away when you when you say who who cares what he looks like, who cares what color his skin is, he's a great player.
6:22
SPEAKER_01: And he was he was the first guy in the it's hard to believe, right, in the NBA, you know, having a bunch of white guys, but that's the way it was until Chuck Cooper came along.
6:32
SPEAKER_02: Well, when Halba Halbalchek stole the ball.
6:35
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
6:35
SPEAKER_02: I think it was later.
6:37
SPEAKER_01: Well, that was later, but but you you know, you had Bill Russell and guys like that, at least by that point.
6:42
SPEAKER_01: But Chuck Cooper was a pioneer.
6:44
SPEAKER_01: If you go down and watch the Duquesne game on campus, the arena actually bears his name.
6:49
SPEAKER_02: And a great great pair of shoes, too.
6:52
SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, Chuck Cooper, uh a guy that, again, none of us saw play, but you gotta give him his dupe.
7:00
SPEAKER_01: Number 30 on the list is Chris Letang.
7:02
SPEAKER_01: Ooh.
7:04
SPEAKER_01: Controversial.
7:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this one will definitely be a controversial one.
7:08
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Penguins between 2006 and the present.
7:11
SPEAKER_01: Six-time All-Star, three time Stanley Cup champion.
7:15
SPEAKER_01: Steve, is he the greatest defenseman in Penguins history?
7:18
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
7:19
SPEAKER_02: He's definitely played the long.
7:20
SPEAKER_02: I guess if you go to longevity, I think Larry Murphy's better.
7:24
SPEAKER_02: I like Brooke Zorpik better.
7:26
SPEAKER_02: He's a good player and he's good at what he does, but he just turns it over so much.
7:33
SPEAKER_02: Just off, please.
7:35
SPEAKER_02: Plus, he's he has had some health problems he's overcome, so it's a good story, too.
7:40
SPEAKER_02: But he's not a bad player.
7:42
SPEAKER_02: I mean, you can't you probably can't go wrong with him or Gonchar or Murphy on your point.
7:47
SPEAKER_02: I mean, like I said, all-time penguins power play.
7:50
SPEAKER_02: I think we know who's, you know, on the low part of that, the two people down there.
7:55
unknown: Yeah.
7:56
SPEAKER_02: The point people you could probably debate till the cows come home.
8:00
SPEAKER_01: I I think it's probably, if you're gonna have that argument, uh it's got to me it's gotta be between Latine and Larry Murphy.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: I think those are the two.
8:07
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you you you could put Gontar up there, you could put uh uh Zubov or or or Brooks Orpick or, you know, uh even uh oh gosh, even even Randy Carlisle, who won an Ores trophy with the Penguins way back when.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: But I I I think I I I won't argue with anybody that says Letang is is the greatest.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: And obviously we consensus we have him higher on the list than Larry Murphy, so I guess we're saying that too.
8:34
SPEAKER_01: Alright, number 29 is Darrell Reevas, was a cornerback for the Pitt Panthers football team between 2004 and 2006, has eight career interceptions at Pitt, but even eight interceptions is pretty impressive given that no one ever threw on his side.
8:49
SPEAKER_01: There's another guy that you can't you just can't measure with stats, right?
8:53
SPEAKER_01: And Steve and I had season tickets back then, we watched him play a ton.
8:57
SPEAKER_01: And it it just literally a whole half of the field was just missing for whoever the opposing offense was.
9:04
SPEAKER_01: You just couldn't throw to that side of the field.
9:06
SPEAKER_01: It was ridiculous.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: He was very dominant.
9:09
SPEAKER_01: It it it it reminds me of a SR player we're gonna have on this list, a little higher, that was also a cornerback, where he you just when he was on the field, uh he was just he was just dominant.
9:20
SPEAKER_01: He was also a pretty good kick returner, has uh a famous highlight rail punt return against West Virginia at Heinz Field.
9:27
SPEAKER_01: Uh, but really, you know, the Revis Island thing that that became in vogue when he played for the New York Jets, that was for sure a thing.
9:35
SPEAKER_01: They just didn't call it that at the time.
9:39
SPEAKER_02: Uh I I since I've been watching pit football like since like the late 80s, and there haven't been a lot of freshmen that have started.
9:48
SPEAKER_02: Now it's becoming more and more common because I think people are leaving earlier.
9:54
SPEAKER_02: But the the guys I can really the impactful freshmen, I mean let's see, Darrell Revis, Larry Fitzgerald, Curtis Martin, LaShawn McCoy was kind of a a freshman.
10:10
SPEAKER_02: He was like one year removed, so I guess so was Larry Fitzgerald.
10:14
SPEAKER_02: So I mean, that's like a seriously who's who of like probably four, like most of those guys are gonna be in the Hall of Fame if they aren't already.
10:22
SPEAKER_02: Right.
10:23
SPEAKER_02: So it's very hard to start anywhere in college football as a freshman, never mind.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: You know, in a major school.
10:30
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
10:31
SPEAKER_02: There's only been a few guys that have done it, and there's only been a few guys that have done it really well.
10:35
SPEAKER_02: And Dorel Rebus is in that category with those other people I mentioned.
10:39
SPEAKER_02: For sure.
10:40
SPEAKER_01: That's why we have him 29.
10:42
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
10:43
SPEAKER_01: 28 is another guy that was he was okay at Pitt, I guess.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I it's so weird because he just came out of nowhere a senior year.
10:53
SPEAKER_02: He really had a kind of a very middling career for his first three years.
10:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's the guy we're talking about is Aaron Donald.
11:01
SPEAKER_01: Played for Pitt from 2010 to 2013, was the ACC defensive player of the year.
11:07
SPEAKER_01: Go ahead, Steve.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, the highlight of his Pitt career is winning the Pizza Bowl.
11:11
SPEAKER_02: I mean they won the little Caesars Pizza Bowl, him and I think they had him, Connor, and uh they had I think Chad Voytek was the quarter.
11:21
SPEAKER_02: Was that the Savage?
11:22
SPEAKER_02: That was the Yeah, because Tom Savage got concussed like he did every time.
11:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, Chad Voytek.
11:28
SPEAKER_02: Well, that's a good memory.
11:29
SPEAKER_02: And uh I I think what's his name?
11:31
SPEAKER_02: Um, the guy from the Bengals might have been the wide receiver, too.
11:36
SPEAKER_02: Tyler Boyd.
11:37
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
11:38
SPEAKER_02: And yet Pitt could the best they could do was the little Caesars Pizza Bowl in Detroit, Michigan against Bowling Green.
11:46
SPEAKER_02: That's unreal.
11:47
SPEAKER_01: Because so Aaron Donald had the misfortune of playing for Pitt probably during the worst four-year stretch of the last, at least of this century.
11:56
SPEAKER_02: And maybe the best thing that happened was Pat Narduzzi, because Pat Narduzzi, they seemed to like really turn the corner with defensive linemen.
12:02
SPEAKER_02: This is like when things started to like they just started to churn out defensive linemen like nobody's business.
12:08
SPEAKER_01: So so what had happened to Pitt was that he got Aaron Donald was recruited by Dave Wansted.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: And then uh at the end of his freshman year, Dave Wanstead was fired.
12:19
SPEAKER_01: They hired, they had an interim coach, uh, coached the bowl game.
12:24
SPEAKER_01: Then they hired this guy, I don't even remember his name, but he got arrested.
12:28
SPEAKER_01: Michael Haywood.
12:29
SPEAKER_01: Michael Haywood got arrested for beating his wife, I think.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: His girlfriend, something like that.
12:33
SPEAKER_01: Girlfriend.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, so he got fired after two weeks after he got hired.
12:37
SPEAKER_01: Then they hired this guy that uh named Todd Graham that that you know that he didn't have a soul.
12:44
SPEAKER_01: And and then he quits uh before that his season's over, and they have another interim coach, then they hire Paul Christ.
12:50
SPEAKER_01: He's there for a couple years and he goes to Wisconsin.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: So it it was just a time of utter and complete turmoil.
12:57
SPEAKER_01: They had like 48 coaches during Aaron T Aaron Donald's four years at Pitt, and yet he was still you know, he was still a great player.
13:06
SPEAKER_01: And and another guy where stats won't do him justice, just go on YouTube and look up Aaron Donald Pitt Highlights, find the game of Duke.
13:14
SPEAKER_02: Duke, yeah, where he tackles the quarter.
13:16
SPEAKER_02: It's Daniel Jones, too.
13:17
SPEAKER_02: Tackle the quarterback and the running back on like a running play.
13:20
SPEAKER_02: It's like, yeah, I'll just tackle both of you.
13:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm not sure if this is play action or not, so I'll just tackle them both.
13:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: I mean, he was so good.
13:28
SPEAKER_01: And I remember, again, when he came into the NFL, I've said this before, I'm like, he was so good, so good, but maybe, you know, sometimes guys look so good in college and and against NFL offensive linemen, he's not going to be as dominant as he was at Pitt.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: And sure enough, he's one of the greatest NFL defensive players of all time.
13:46
SPEAKER_01: Like, literally, he's won three defensive player of the year awards.
13:48
SPEAKER_02: Outside of Reggie White, I've never seen a defensive player single-handedly win a Super Bowl for a team.
13:53
SPEAKER_02: And he did that for the Rams.
13:54
SPEAKER_02: Like, he literally sacked Joe Burrow on the play on that, yeah, at the end of that game.
13:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:00
SPEAKER_01: I I don't think it's I don't think it's an exaggeration to say he'll he will go down like at that Reggie White Lawrence Taylor tier of defensive players, Joe Green.
14:09
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't think that that's an exaggeration.
14:12
SPEAKER_01: And he was he was really, really good at pit two, which is why we have him at number 28.
14:18
SPEAKER_01: Number 27 is the flower.
14:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
14:21
SPEAKER_01: This one will not be controversial.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: Marc-Andre Fleury, unless people think we put him too low, played for the Penguins between 2003 and 2017.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: He's the Penguins' all-time leader in pretty much every major goaltender category, wins, shutouts, goals against, saves.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: Uh, obviously made the the save that I think Steve you were alluding to earlier against Nicholas Lidstrom that that clinches the 2009 Stanley Cup.
14:46
SPEAKER_01: Just a legend and an all-time favorite in Pittsburgh.
14:50
SPEAKER_01: I think this guy could come here and run for mayor and he would run by a landslide.
14:55
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's like I bet you you compare like he never won a Vesna.
15:00
SPEAKER_02: I don't think he was even in the conversation.
15:02
SPEAKER_02: But it's just like he played for a penguins team that didn't play the greatest of defense and got hung out the dry a lot, but and he gave up some goals.
15:11
SPEAKER_02: But you know what?
15:12
SPEAKER_02: He made the saves when he needed to make he made so many times in the third period.
15:16
SPEAKER_02: It's like the he's the opposite of the guy they never have now, Jarrett Jari, where he seems to fall apart in the third period.
15:23
SPEAKER_02: Like Flurry just seems to rise to the occasion, and just you just need that one or two saves late under two minutes to go in the third period, and he would just come up with it and you would walk out of the building with the win.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: So another thing about Flurry that I think people may remember, but they may not.
15:41
SPEAKER_01: There was a there was a period there around 2013 or 14 where he kind of went the Steve Blass route, right?
15:48
SPEAKER_01: That we talked about earlier, where he he really struggled.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: And I think the one playoff year where they they made it all the way to the conference finals, he got benched for Vokoon.
15:57
SPEAKER_01: Was that the call?
15:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was Vokoon.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: Vokoon was like a solid, kind of steady goalie.
16:02
SPEAKER_01: He was a veteran.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: He was he was like the diamond dozen veteran that you could just you could count on at least.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: And Flurry at the time wasn't that guy, and he they had hired a like a sports psychologist, and he really got his career back on track after that.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: I don't think that's something that a lot of people remember.
16:18
SPEAKER_01: There was a time when people wanted Flurry out and traded and everything else, and then he came back and had a really good uh end of his penguins career.
16:28
SPEAKER_01: Obviously, he lost his job to Matt Murray through no fault of his own.
16:31
SPEAKER_01: Uh, but like I said, we'll I think we'll always be beloved in this town.
16:35
SPEAKER_02: Oh, for sure.
16:36
SPEAKER_02: Deservedly so.
16:37
SPEAKER_02: Good person, too.
16:38
SPEAKER_02: Good person.
16:39
SPEAKER_02: The opposite of Antonio Brown.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: Or Tom Barrasso before him.
16:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
16:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: All right, number 26 is Ernie Stoutner.
16:49
SPEAKER_02: It's tough to it's tough to rank this guy.
16:52
SPEAKER_02: It really is.
16:53
SPEAKER_02: Because he he played in a different era and on a crappy team.
16:56
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
16:57
SPEAKER_01: So Ernie Stoutner was a defensive end for the Steelers between 1950 and 1963.
17:02
SPEAKER_01: Pro Football Hall of Fame, nine-time pro bowler, arguably the best defensive player of his era, but like Steve said, terrible teams where the defense was probably out on the field a lot, right?
17:14
SPEAKER_01: I I Steelers didn't have a lot of good offense back then, so I'm guessing the defense was probably out on the field a lot, and he's still one of the best players of the era.
17:21
SPEAKER_01: And there's only three Steelers in the history of the team that have had their number retired by the franchise.
17:26
SPEAKER_01: Ernie Stoutner's one of them.
17:28
SPEAKER_01: I I think we have to put him high on this list just because, again, the the the the the the Steelers, the Rooneys obviously have owned the team the entire history, and and they have intentionally framed this guy as one of their all-time greatest players.
17:46
SPEAKER_01: One of the few guys that they've retired their number.
17:48
SPEAKER_01: So I I think that he has to be high on this list because of that.
17:52
SPEAKER_02: And they retired his number before the uh golden year, before like the null years, I think, too.
17:59
SPEAKER_02: So it isn't like they just retired it or even retired it when they started having success.
18:04
SPEAKER_02: So he was a tough guy.
18:06
SPEAKER_02: That was tough guy football back then.
18:08
SPEAKER_02: Like there, you know, they said something about him like breaking his jaw or biting through his lip, and he just like put dirt on it and kept playing.
18:17
SPEAKER_02: Or no, he broke his arm, that's right, and just wrapped his arm up.
18:20
SPEAKER_02: It's like he's nuts.
18:21
SPEAKER_02: I mean, he'd like you know, that was different.
18:24
SPEAKER_02: They were a different breed back then.
18:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was the the men were men.
18:29
SPEAKER_02: Uh we could use a few of those dudes around now.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: I I hurt my wrist opening a jar of peanut butter the other day and was almost out of commission for the whole day.
18:40
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, Ernie Startner would have broken open the jar named the shards glass.
18:46
SPEAKER_01: Yes, he would have.
18:50
SPEAKER_01: Number 25 on the list uh is Mike Webster, Steeler Center between 1974 and 1988, Hall of Famer, member of both the 19.
18:59
SPEAKER_01: This is this is pretty impressive, Steve.
19:01
SPEAKER_01: The 1970s NFL All Decade team and the 1980s NFL All Decade team.
19:06
SPEAKER_02: So that's a trick.
19:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that says a lot about his like how dominant he was for a long period of time.
19:13
SPEAKER_01: Also made the NFL's 100th anniversary team.
19:16
SPEAKER_01: There was only four centers on that team.
19:18
SPEAKER_01: So in 100 years of NFL football, the NFL determined that he's one of the four best centers to ever play the game of football.
19:26
SPEAKER_01: Pretty high honor, uh, huge on the Super Bowl teams, consistent, led that, you know, led that running game.
19:33
SPEAKER_01: Um I don't know, I don't know what else you can say about Mike Webster.
19:37
SPEAKER_01: Obviously, had some some issues later in life, whether that was CT related or not, but during his playing career, he was great.
19:45
SPEAKER_02: And they said he was pretty humble too, like a humble guy, very hardworking.
19:50
SPEAKER_02: In a small, he was not a big one of these big mammoth offensive linemen.
19:54
SPEAKER_02: You know, he was a smaller guy that would pull and kind of you know cut and stuff trap plays and stuff.
20:01
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, he's definitely a different, different type.
20:04
SPEAKER_02: And um hey, they wouldn't have four Super Bowls definitely without Mike Webster.
20:10
SPEAKER_01: Uh Tunch Yoken always credited him with turning Tunch's life around.
20:15
SPEAKER_01: Uh, Tunch was talked about how he was you know into kind of like the lifestyle of of being a big-time NFL player, and Mike Webster kind of pulled him aside and shared his faith with them.
20:24
SPEAKER_01: And Tunch always credited Mike Webster for being one of those people that really uh changed his the trajectory of his life.
20:32
SPEAKER_01: So I I agree with you about the good person.
20:35
SPEAKER_01: That's amazing.
20:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that.
20:37
SPEAKER_01: That's that's great.
20:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:40
SPEAKER_01: Number 24 on the list, Jerome Bettis played for the Steelers between 1996 and 2005.
20:47
SPEAKER_01: He's a pro football hall of famer.
20:49
SPEAKER_01: He's still in the top 10 all-time in the NFL of roughing yards, uh, even though he's been retired for almost 20 years now, which is hard to believe.
20:58
SPEAKER_02: Um he still looks good.
21:01
SPEAKER_02: Like his his kid is getting recruited by Notre Dame.
21:04
SPEAKER_02: That's how I didn't realize Jerome Bettis is that old.
21:06
SPEAKER_02: His son has got to go to well, of course he's gonna well, he's getting recruited by Notre Dame.
21:11
SPEAKER_02: Of course he's gonna go to Notre Dame.
21:14
SPEAKER_02: Jerome ain't gonna his daughter already goes there.
21:16
SPEAKER_02: Jerome ain't gonna let him go anywhere else.
21:20
SPEAKER_01: It's it's literally almost two decades ago now that he won Super Bowl 40 in his final game and retired.
21:26
SPEAKER_01: So it's it's been a while.
21:28
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't feel like that long ago.
21:29
SPEAKER_02: Uh but I think he lives in Atlanta, but he comes into Pittsburgh during the football season to record.
21:34
SPEAKER_02: Like he does at Jerome Bettis show.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, he's he's like Flurry.
21:38
SPEAKER_01: He's another guy that just people will love in this town.
21:40
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
21:40
SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, if he if him and Flurry ran for any political position, they like one could be county executive, the other could be mayor, and he would be upset, upset.
21:51
SPEAKER_01: Yep, that's that's absolutely accurate.
21:53
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, what I'm all aboard the Flurry Bettis ticket for you know, whatever.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and and yeah, we did that episode recently.
22:03
SPEAKER_01: Well, we did that episode a while ago.
22:04
SPEAKER_01: We re republished it recently about the uh the year that Bill Cower uh they had that really bad stretch in the late nineties, early two thousands and and and I think people just remember, you know, Bettis was here for ten years and he was just the bus for ten years.
22:18
SPEAKER_01: He was dominant.
22:20
SPEAKER_01: He at one point in the middle of that, it looked like he was completely washed up and he was done.
22:24
SPEAKER_01: And then he had like two different resurgences.
22:26
SPEAKER_01: He had a big resurgence in 2001, the year that they um made the AFC Championship game.
22:32
SPEAKER_01: And then even after that, he kind of got replaced by Amos Airway, and then he had another resurgence when Ben came along, Ben's rookie year.
22:39
SPEAKER_01: Uh and they had good they had they had uh yeah, they they kept trying to get guys to replace him, and then he kept being the guy.
22:46
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, Jerome Bettison, all time great.
22:49
SPEAKER_02: He got hit, I forget, I think it was a guy from Cleveland, a safety hit him, and when he uh messed up his hip, he that was kind of and that was towards the end.
22:57
SPEAKER_02: Like he could give you a couple games, but not a whole season, and that that's what kind of happened to like Jerome Bettis at the end of his career.
23:05
SPEAKER_01: And and that last season, he Bully Parker was the Steelers featured back for sure.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: But but Bettis had a lot of great plays, you know, things people will never remember, like like Super Bowl 40 when Heinz Ward scores that touchdown and the Steelers have a two-score lead, but they ran a ton of clock in the fourth quarter.
23:23
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, with Bettis.
23:24
SPEAKER_01: With Bettis.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: But again, people might not remember that.
23:27
SPEAKER_01: And then certainly earlier that season, they're playing a game in Heinz Field against the Bears.
23:32
SPEAKER_01: And again, Bettis at the very last couple of games of his career steamrolls Brian Urlacher, who was the defensive player of the year that year, and at the absolute height of his powers, Brian Urlacher is an all-time great uh NFL player, and he steamrolls Brian Urlacher for a touchdown.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: So even at the very end, he was still very valuable.
23:54
SPEAKER_01: Number 23 is another stealer.
23:56
SPEAKER_01: It's Jack Lambert, Stealer from 1974 to 1984, Hall of Famer, nine-time Pro Bowler, 1976 defensive player of the year, also elected to that 100th anniversary all-time NFL team, which was again pretty select.
24:12
SPEAKER_01: Uh tough as nails guy, just man, another guy fans just fell in love with.
24:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
24:20
SPEAKER_01: Because he just he just didn't suffer foals at all.
24:23
SPEAKER_01: He always played tough.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: Uh the the the moment in the Super Bowl with um was that Cliff Harris, Steve.
24:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, or was it yeah, it was Cliff Cliff Harris or Cliff Jarrett?
24:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Cliff Harris, he throws him down to the ground.
24:35
SPEAKER_02: He throws the kicker, yeah, Roy Jarella.
24:37
SPEAKER_02: No, he well, Roy Jarella misses a field goal and he's like, oh, good kick, like real sarcastically, and Jack Lambert's like, nope.
24:44
SPEAKER_02: And the Steelers like said that that got them going because like they're like, hey, we're not gonna, that's America's team, and we're supposed to win.
24:51
SPEAKER_02: Like they weren't intimidated after that.
24:53
SPEAKER_02: So yep.
24:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, he has the stats, nine Pro Bowls, defensive player of the year, but another guy where you can really argue the intangibles probably were more important than kind of like Killy Porter, right?
25:05
SPEAKER_01: What an idiot Cliff Harris is, too.
25:07
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah.
25:09
SPEAKER_02: Because I think they were winning too at that point.
25:11
SPEAKER_01: They were, yeah.
25:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah, that's that's really stupid.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: Very similar to like Daniel Carcello for the Flyers when he picked a fight with Tal, but it's like you had all the momentum, you had no reason to do that.
25:23
SPEAKER_01: Just control yourself.
25:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:25
SPEAKER_01: And Cliff Harris couldn't, and and Dallas lost.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: Sucks to be them.
25:33
SPEAKER_01: Number 22 is Yevgeny Malkin.
25:37
SPEAKER_02: I guess.
25:38
SPEAKER_02: I don't know what the I don't know what to do with him either.
25:40
SPEAKER_02: Like he's such an I don't know.
25:43
SPEAKER_01: Well, we we averaged him out at number 22.
25:45
SPEAKER_02: 22, yeah.
25:46
SPEAKER_01: He uh played for the Penguins between 2006 and uh as of the time of this recording, current present day, he's a three-time Stanley Cup champion.
25:55
SPEAKER_01: He's won the Art Ross Trophy twice, that's leading league in scoring.
25:58
SPEAKER_01: He won the Calder Trophy for Rookie of the Year in 2007, he won the Conn Smythe Trophy for playoff MVP in 2009, and the Hart Trophy is league MVP in 2012.
26:07
SPEAKER_01: So he's got quite the resume.
26:09
SPEAKER_02: Um I I I think it's just it's it's like, is he good because he plays with the other people that I'm sure will be higher on his list?
26:16
SPEAKER_02: Or is he just I mean, I don't know.
26:20
SPEAKER_02: They always seem to go deeper into playoffs when he's on his game than just the other people.
26:26
SPEAKER_02: When he's on his game, he can be absolutely unstoppable.
26:30
SPEAKER_01: I I I I think you know, his career's obviously not over, but to me the highlight is always going to be that 2009 playoff run.
26:38
SPEAKER_01: Because he was just so good.
26:39
SPEAKER_01: That goal he scored against Carolina.
26:43
SPEAKER_01: You know, the the the conference finals, Carolina came into that conference finals really on a tear.
26:48
SPEAKER_01: And the Penguins swept them in four games because it wasn't even close.
26:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they had no answer for Malkin yet.
26:54
SPEAKER_01: They had no answer for Malkin.
26:55
SPEAKER_01: That was that was literally, yeah, it wasn't even a series because Malkin just single-handedly destroyed them.
27:01
SPEAKER_01: And and then he was very good against Detroit as well.
27:05
SPEAKER_02: So good defensive center, too.
27:07
SPEAKER_02: People forget that.
27:08
SPEAKER_02: Like he's a very good defensive center.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: And and you you you just like you said about Latin.
27:14
SPEAKER_02: But he does like stupid stuff like penalties in the offensive center, right?
27:19
SPEAKER_02: Especially against Philadelphia.
27:21
SPEAKER_02: Like, for some reason, Philadelphia brings it out of them.
27:24
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
27:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that that's that's the most frustrating thing ever when like, okay, we we're we're really pressing, we're jumping in down low, let's see if we can get a good shot here, and then the whistle blows.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: And you think anytime a whistle blows in that moment, you're thinking, oh, good, a power play, but it's on us.
27:38
SPEAKER_01: And it's 71.
27:39
SPEAKER_01: He's the Penguins all-time leader in penalty minutes.
27:44
SPEAKER_01: Surprising.
27:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, it it you you get the good, you take the bad with the good.
27:49
SPEAKER_01: But uh yeah, I think.
27:52
SPEAKER_02: You have Guinea mouth, and there you go.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: I think his place in Pittsburgh sports history is pretty secure.
27:57
SPEAKER_01: It it is kind of a weird one, like you said, Steve, because I I don't know that you have anybody else that is paired with another guy the way he is.
28:04
SPEAKER_01: Really paired with two other guys the way he is.
28:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:07
SPEAKER_01: Uh but I mean he's he's an all-time great, and uh, I don't know.
28:12
SPEAKER_01: H his story's not done yet either.
28:13
SPEAKER_01: So number 21 is another all-time great penguin.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: It's Ron Francis.
28:18
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Penguins between 1991 and 1998.
28:22
SPEAKER_01: He's a hockey hall of famer.
28:24
SPEAKER_01: He is top five all-time in the NATO in points.
28:27
SPEAKER_01: Obviously, not all of those were worth the Penguins, but it's worth mentioning that like literally, if you look at the top five all-time scoring leaders in NATO history, Ron Francis is one of them.
28:36
SPEAKER_02: Uh doesn't Malkin play point on the power play too?
28:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
28:41
SPEAKER_02: So, okay, you figure out the ultimate penguins power play.
28:44
SPEAKER_02: You you tell me.
28:45
SPEAKER_02: You tell me who you're leaving on the bench.
28:48
SPEAKER_02: They could put out they could put out a second team power play that would be probably just as an all-time there, too.
28:56
SPEAKER_01: That's a good point.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: It's a really good point.
28:58
SPEAKER_01: Uh Ron Francis, though, I mean, he was they they got him in that famous trade with Hartford, which to this day still still baffles the imagination that they were able to get him.
29:10
SPEAKER_01: Ronnie franchise, all-time great.
29:12
SPEAKER_01: Uh that that really gave I mean the Penguins had Mario Lemieux for six or seven seasons by that point and hadn't won anything.
29:19
SPEAKER_01: Because that was their own, they had one line.
29:21
SPEAKER_01: And then when they got Francis, now they had a second line that was that was deadly.
29:25
SPEAKER_02: And then they had Tradier on the third.
29:28
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and so they they had three competent lines, yeah.
29:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so Ron Ron Francis again, another guy whose place I think in in Penguin's history is very secure as an all-time great.
29:40
SPEAKER_01: Number 20 is Debo.
29:41
SPEAKER_01: It's James Harrison.
29:43
SPEAKER_01: Uh three different stints with the Steelers, 2002, 2004 to 12, and then 2014 to 2017.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: Uh was the team's all-time sack leader until very recently.
29:54
SPEAKER_01: Uh, was the 2008 Defensive Player of the Year, and uh that year that he won Defensive Player of the Year, made a uh, I don't know, a semi-important play in that Super Bowl.
30:02
SPEAKER_02: A pass that Kurt Warner wish he wouldn't have ever thrown.
30:05
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
30:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:07
SPEAKER_01: So I mean uh kind of similar to what we said about TJ Watt, just a guy that's just so dominant in his prime.
30:14
SPEAKER_01: And then even when he came back, he had retired.
30:16
SPEAKER_01: Remember, he actually retired and then came back and had some games where he, like especially against the Ravens.
30:22
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what it was about the Ravens, I think because they had cut him early in his career.
30:25
SPEAKER_01: But even when he was older, he had some great games.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, definitely a a little bit of a surly kind of personality at times.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: Uh, but man, uh just that Super Bowl interception alone, right?
30:40
SPEAKER_01: That that that should be a statue somewhere of him just running back a hundred yards against the Cardinals offense with Larry Fitzgerald chasing him from behind.
30:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:49
unknown: Yeah.
30:51
SPEAKER_02: It's one of the greatest plays in Super Bowl history, too.
30:54
SPEAKER_02: So I mean it's yeah.
30:56
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
30:57
SPEAKER_01: So I don't I don't feel bad about putting James Harrison in the top 20.
31:00
SPEAKER_01: I think I think it's fair to put him that high.
31:04
SPEAKER_01: Number 19 is Dan Marino, was the pit quarterback between 1979 and 1982, set numerous passing records at Pitt.
31:13
SPEAKER_01: Uh Joe Paterno, who coached against a lot of people over his career, said, quote, Dan Marino is the best quarterback I've ever coached against at the collegiate level.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: So that's pretty high praise coming from Joe Paterno.
31:26
SPEAKER_01: Uh Dan Marino, I think, we we talked about this in a previous episode.
31:30
SPEAKER_01: Greatest player at the most important position in pit history.
31:34
SPEAKER_01: So uh to me, that's why he's got to be this high, Steve.
31:38
SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, yeah, there might be one other person in pit history that outranks him a little bit just because they have some hardware that fair Dan doesn't have.
31:47
SPEAKER_02: But um and he had a bad senior year, so that kind of holds him back a little bit, but you can't go wrong with Dan Marino, a quarterback.
31:57
SPEAKER_02: And Pitt hasn't had like a terrible amount of really great quarterbacks.
32:01
SPEAKER_02: He's I mean, I don't even the drop-off from number one to number two all time in pit quarterbacks is pretty significant.
32:10
SPEAKER_02: I mean who'd be number two, Alex Van Pelt, I don't know.
32:14
SPEAKER_02: I mean Rod Rutherford.
32:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean you could put you could even hit Tyler Palco, I don't know.
32:20
SPEAKER_01: You could argue Kenny Pickett up there too, but like you said, regardless of regardless of which of those guys you pick, it's a it's a m massive it's very similar to like Terry Bradshaw before Ben came along.
32:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:30
SPEAKER_01: Or he or even Bradshaw and Ben, like the two guys like after that, like who would you go as to like Bobby Lane, I guess, but that was so long ago.
32:37
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:37
SPEAKER_01: It's it's like a huge drop-off.
32:40
SPEAKER_01: So I that's a really good way to frame it, Steve.
32:43
SPEAKER_01: And and like you said, he didn't win a championship, and that he'd be a lot higher.
32:47
SPEAKER_01: If Pitt wins a championship, which they should have, because it had such a good team, uh, he'd be way higher than 19.
32:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:56
SPEAKER_01: Number 18 uh is a guy named Barry Lamar Bonds.
33:01
SPEAKER_01: This is a fair I think this is a fair ranking.
33:04
SPEAKER_01: I think this is a fair ranking.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Pirates between 1986 and 1992, won two National League MVPs during that time.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: Uh I don't think you can say that there was a better five-tool player in the history of the Pirates than Barry Bonds.
33:17
SPEAKER_01: And if he plays a little longer, if he plays maybe just one on one more contract with the Pirates, he's probably in the top five in this list.
33:26
SPEAKER_01: Like he's just he's so good.
33:28
SPEAKER_01: He's so good.
33:29
SPEAKER_01: I know, I know we all hate him, and he took steroids and all that stuff.
33:33
SPEAKER_01: So I I'm not gonna pretend like you know, that never happened, but he just was so good.
33:38
SPEAKER_02: But Tim steroids wasn't cheating.
33:41
SPEAKER_02: I mean, there was no rule banning steroids.
33:44
SPEAKER_02: So I mean, it's like throwing the spitball or Albert Pools.
33:49
SPEAKER_02: You realize Albert Pool Holes used an illegal bat for half his career?
33:53
SPEAKER_02: Nobody talks about that.
33:55
SPEAKER_02: The only re because the and and then Major League Baseball said, Oh, we'll grandfather you in.
34:00
SPEAKER_02: So and Albert Pool Hells has 600 home runs.
34:03
SPEAKER_02: Is he gonna get held out of the Hall of Fame because he used an illegal bat for half his career?
34:07
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I I yeah, whatever.
34:10
SPEAKER_02: So I I I don't know.
34:12
SPEAKER_02: That's the make I mean the argument I always make when people say, well, Barry shouldn't be in the hall of fame because of steroids.
34:17
SPEAKER_02: It wasn't against the rules when he did it.
34:20
SPEAKER_02: And number two, there's a bunch of other people that have broken rules that have since been made illegal that are in gonna be in the Hall of Fame, are in the Hall of Fame.
34:29
SPEAKER_02: But I mean it's just what holds him back is kind of like once again, we go back to Tyrell Owens we had talked about earlier.
34:36
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
34:36
SPEAKER_02: And it's just Tyrell Owens is just I mean, it when you're like, I think it's sometimes like people give you the benefit of the doubt when oh, he's a nice guy, let's you know, bring him in, or they think of you fondly, but when you kind of have a chip on your shoulder and you know a lot of attitude like Barry Bonds did, then it uh people hold that against you, and that that's what's kind of going on with Barry Bonds.
35:00
SPEAKER_02: I find myself doing that with Dion Sanders.
35:03
SPEAKER_02: I I just I shouldn't dislike the guy, but because he's such a such a just a cocky jerk, you can't like him.
35:09
SPEAKER_02: It makes himself unlikable.
35:11
SPEAKER_02: And that's what Barry Bonds kind of did too.
35:13
SPEAKER_02: It's just like you just make yourself unlikable.
35:17
SPEAKER_01: It it definitely taints your opinion.
35:19
SPEAKER_01: You it's it makes it harder to be objective, right, about their accomplishments.
35:23
SPEAKER_01: Now, the one thing that if again, if we're being completely objective, we and we already alluded to this, Barry Bonds did not produce in the postseason for the Pirates.
35:31
SPEAKER_01: I mean, he was he was that stretch where they won three National League East championships in a row, he was the best player in baseball.
35:39
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't even close.
35:40
SPEAKER_01: He was the best player in baseball during the regular season, and he couldn't he was terrible in the in the NLCS all three of those years.
35:48
SPEAKER_01: And if he would have just been even like 70% of what he was in the regular season, the Pirates make it to at least one World Series, if not three.
35:58
SPEAKER_01: So that that is for sure a fair knock against him, but it's still a great all-time player for the Pirates.
36:08
SPEAKER_01: Number 17 is a great all-time player for the Steelers.
36:11
SPEAKER_01: Mel Blunt played for the Steelers between 1970 and 1983, Hall of Famer, 1975 Defensive Player of the Year, also on the 100th anniversary NFL team, 57 career interceptions, and I think again, stats, accolades, awards, anniversary teams.
36:29
SPEAKER_01: To me, the Mel Blunt's greatness is defined by the fact that they literally had to change the roles of NFL football because Mel Blunt was too dominant.
36:40
SPEAKER_02: That was Don Shula, just way, way, way.
36:43
SPEAKER_01: It was, but but that was why.
36:45
SPEAKER_01: Because the the teams weren't scoring points.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: The NFL knows that, you know, the the NFL smartly is something that the NHL for 40 years has yet to figure out that you know, people want to see scoring and high flying action.
36:58
SPEAKER_01: They don't want to see, you know, nine to six football games.
37:02
SPEAKER_01: So Mel Blunt was was too good.
37:04
SPEAKER_01: He would chuck people off the line of scrimmage.
37:05
SPEAKER_01: They said you can't do that anymore.
37:07
SPEAKER_01: Uh uh well, beyond the five yards.
37:09
SPEAKER_01: He would, you know, so they they literally changed the rules because of Mel Blunt.
37:13
SPEAKER_01: And that's why uh again, throw away the stats for a minute.
37:17
SPEAKER_01: To me, that's why he was he's an all-time legend.
37:20
SPEAKER_02: He still looks like he can play, man.
37:22
SPEAKER_02: Have you seen him really?
37:23
SPEAKER_02: He wears that cowboy hat.
37:24
SPEAKER_02: He's like in great shape.
37:26
SPEAKER_02: I mean, he wears that cowboy hat.
37:28
SPEAKER_02: I would call him Mr.
37:29
SPEAKER_02: Blunt if I saw him in person.
37:32
SPEAKER_02: It's sir and yes, sir, with that dude.
37:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he was a force of nature for sure.
37:40
SPEAKER_01: Number 16 on the list is Josh Gibson.
37:43
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Homestead Greys in Pittsburgh Crawford between 1930 and 1946.
37:48
SPEAKER_01: Twelve-time All-Star, two-time triple crown winner, hit over 800 home runs.
37:54
SPEAKER_01: That's unofficial because the Negro Leagues did not keep complete stats.
37:58
SPEAKER_01: But that's a that's a lot of historians and stuff have done some studies and they think he hit literally hit over 800 home runs.
38:05
SPEAKER_01: Uh and Steve kind of you said this earlier.
38:07
SPEAKER_01: You made this this uh remark earlier, but like literally that's what they called him back in the day.
38:12
SPEAKER_01: They called Babe Ruth the white Josh Gibson.
38:15
SPEAKER_02: There's stories about him hitting home runs halfway across to Oakland when they were in Forbes field.
38:20
SPEAKER_02: So I the the he was a catcher by trade, um, didn't get a lot of credit until recently, but um one of the greatest ball players of all time, you know, no matter what league.
38:32
SPEAKER_02: You put him in the major league baseball, he gives Babe Ruth a run for his money.
38:36
SPEAKER_02: He he's up, he's at least in the conversation, I would guess.
38:39
SPEAKER_02: You know?
38:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
38:40
SPEAKER_01: And another guy who uh just came along a little too early, and when the color barrier got broken, he was not included in that mix.
38:48
SPEAKER_01: He was at the end of his career at that point, unfortunately.
38:54
SPEAKER_01: Number 15 is Jack Ham.
38:56
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Steelers between 1971-1982, eight-time Pro Bower, hundredth anniversary team guy as well.
39:02
SPEAKER_01: Uh Tony Dungey, who of course is an all-time great coach, but was also a player on that Steelers 70s defense, says, quote, I've never seen anyone play the outside linebacker position better than Jack Ham.
39:15
SPEAKER_01: And and just like Joe Petarno, Tony Dungey has decades and decades of experience uh in pro football, so pretty high accolade coming from that guy.
39:25
SPEAKER_02: Kind of like the exact opposite of Jack Lambert.
39:28
SPEAKER_02: He's like Jack Lambert was a tough guy, frothing at the mouth, running around.
39:33
SPEAKER_02: Jack Ham was always more of the uh thinking man's linebacker.
39:37
SPEAKER_02: You know.
39:39
SPEAKER_02: So I mean, you know, he is from Penn State.
39:42
SPEAKER_02: He did Penn State, he did call her for Penn State for the longest time, which was just always great to listen to if Pitt was beating them, because then you could listen to him and the other guy cry about it.
39:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I which is which in their defense didn't happen too often.
39:58
SPEAKER_01: So that's that's true.
39:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's pretty rare.
40:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
40:01
SPEAKER_01: I like your comparison there between him and Lambert.
40:03
SPEAKER_01: I think it's almost the same comparison we were making between Swan and Stalworth.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: Like Lambert was the Lambert was the swan.
40:09
SPEAKER_01: He was like the flashy, you know, attention attention uh he just stuck out.
40:15
SPEAKER_02: He had no teeth, he's like flying around, hitting people, playing reckless abandon, where Ham was more, you know, he still played tough, but he more played the position maybe.
40:25
SPEAKER_02: More of a tactician.
40:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
40:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
40:28
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
40:28
SPEAKER_02: The Thinking Man's linebacker.
40:30
SPEAKER_02: The Thinking Man's linebacker.
40:31
SPEAKER_02: I like it.
40:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
40:33
SPEAKER_01: Number 14 is a teammate of Dak Ham's.
40:36
SPEAKER_01: It's the late Franco Harris.
40:38
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Steelers between 1972 and 1984.
40:42
SPEAKER_02: Another guy that could have ran for mayor and probably won easily.
40:46
SPEAKER_02: Good person.
40:47
SPEAKER_02: I did not realize I remember that.
40:50
SPEAKER_02: I remember I remember in the 90s.
40:53
SPEAKER_02: I think I I don't know if I spoke about this on another podcast where the um KKK wanted to come to Pittsburgh.
40:59
SPEAKER_02: And I remember this in the late 90s, and they had they the court ruled they had to let them because of freedom of speech, even though, you know, whatever, they're a bunch of idiots.
41:07
SPEAKER_02: And so Franco went down and had a sit-in at the city council because he was he was felt that and that's the type of person Franco was.
41:17
SPEAKER_02: And they literally had to send Dan Rooney down to like talk among he was going to sit there individual and try and like way-lay, you know, the the that group from coming in, which they eventually were allowed to.
41:29
SPEAKER_02: But then he eventually, I think what they ended up doing was they talked Franco and some other members of the community to have like a counter protest over Point State Park.
41:40
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, I didn't remember that until his death.
41:42
SPEAKER_02: And that though, what what a what an interesting person, besides obviously catching the biggest, the most famous play outside of Bill Masarovsky in Spitzburg sports history.
41:51
SPEAKER_02: But they literally had to bring down the guy who was the uh the head of media relations from the Steelers because he wouldn't leave.
41:57
SPEAKER_02: He brought a book with him and was literally, you know, you ever been down to like the city Grant Street, like where that little like overhang is and the pillars are where they put the Christmas tree.
42:07
SPEAKER_02: He was sitting like right there, and he wasn't going to walk out.
42:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:11
SPEAKER_02: He brought like a book and a blanket and some food, I guess.
42:14
SPEAKER_02: It was like, good for him, good for him, good dude.
42:17
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
42:18
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, yeah.
42:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:20
SPEAKER_01: And and like you, like you said, Steve, so that's cool.
42:23
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that story.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: And and like you said, obviously.
42:26
SPEAKER_02: They had to bring Dan Rooney, like he wouldn't leave.
42:28
SPEAKER_02: Like they had to bring Dan Rooney, who obviously the players love and respect, right?
42:33
SPEAKER_02: You know, to kind of talk him out of it, like, hey, we'll have a counter protest somewhere else.
42:37
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:39
SPEAKER_02: We meet we miss we miss leaders.
42:40
SPEAKER_02: I the the day the Dan Rooneys of the world are long gone, and I know I miss their leadership, and Franco's too.
42:47
SPEAKER_02: I mean, we we need more Dan Rooneys than Franco Harris is in our leadership right now, and less idiots like we have now.
42:56
SPEAKER_01: Yep, totally agree.
42:58
SPEAKER_01: And and Franco, of course, always will be remembered for the Immaculate Reception, but also as a Steelers all-time leading rusher, also as a Super Bowl nine MVP and a Hall of Famer.
43:09
SPEAKER_01: So uh Franco Harris, again, another guy whose place in Pittsburgh Sports Lore is I I think will be secure long after the generation that got to see him play.
43:19
SPEAKER_02: I wish I know he's gotten a lot of ballyhoo and he gets a lot of credit for a lot of stuff, but and he takes a little bit of heat for supporting Joe Peterto through all that scandal, but I don't know.
43:31
SPEAKER_02: I I'm willing to over when nobody's perfect, and I'm willing to forgive him even though he is a Penn State guy.
43:36
SPEAKER_02: But no, he he really he really is a hard guy to not like and just respectable on and off the field.
43:42
SPEAKER_02: And good good dude.
43:44
SPEAKER_02: Good good dude.
43:45
SPEAKER_02: Hard to find a bad story about him.
43:47
SPEAKER_01: Yes, for sure.
43:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
43:50
SPEAKER_01: Speaking of good dudes.
43:52
SPEAKER_01: Another good yeah, yeah.
43:53
SPEAKER_01: Number thirteen is Larry Fitzgerald.
43:56
SPEAKER_01: Played from Pitt uh two thousand two.
43:59
SPEAKER_01: Two seasons.
44:00
SPEAKER_02: Can you believe it he only played for seasons?
44:02
SPEAKER_01: It's hard to believe, isn't it?
44:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
44:04
SPEAKER_01: Was the Walter Camp Player of the Year, the first sophomore to win that award, won the Bolitnikoff Award, should have won the Heisman.
44:10
SPEAKER_01: We won't go into that tragedy again.
44:13
SPEAKER_01: But uh just one of the most unstoppable athletes in Pittsburgh sports history, Steve.
44:18
SPEAKER_01: Like it was it was a guy that you knew he was getting the ball, you knew they had nowhere else to go, and people just couldn't stop him.
44:25
SPEAKER_02: He was Rod Rutherford's best.
44:27
SPEAKER_02: They would be inside the five.
44:29
SPEAKER_02: You could literally like it's a fade, and nobody could stop it.
44:33
SPEAKER_02: Nobody could stop it.
44:35
SPEAKER_02: He would just throw it up and let Larry go get it, and he's gonna go get it, and you're just gonna be out of luck.
44:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:42
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
44:42
SPEAKER_01: Nearly single-handedly cost the Stewart's a Super Bowl kind of bell career.
44:46
SPEAKER_01: Did everything possible to win that game.
44:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:49
SPEAKER_01: You know, I just an all-time great.
44:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what else you can say about Larry Legend.
44:54
SPEAKER_01: Again, I think one of these days I really want to do just an episode about him, Steve.
44:58
SPEAKER_02: Oh, that'll be fun.
44:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that'll be a fun one.
45:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, him running down uh almost running down James Harrison.
45:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
45:05
SPEAKER_02: Um I mean, just all he's a good person off the field.
45:09
SPEAKER_02: You know, they came back.
45:10
SPEAKER_02: I think they retired his number, I do believe just this season.
45:13
SPEAKER_02: They finally I think they finally did.
45:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so um, yeah.
45:18
SPEAKER_01: He um yeah, he he he was kind of the antithesis too of like you we mentioned Terrell Owens and guys like that.
45:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, he's the exact opposite.
45:28
SPEAKER_02: And he he never left the Cardinals, never played for another team that suffered out there in the desert for years and years and years until they finally got Kurt Werner and a decent coach for 15 minutes.
45:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
45:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, literally.
45:42
SPEAKER_02: How many other wide receivers would have put up with that?
45:45
SPEAKER_01: I mean Right, right, and and how many D.Va wide receivers are there that dance and celebrate he would always hand the ball to the official.
45:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
45:52
SPEAKER_01: Just yeah.
45:52
SPEAKER_01: I I I yeah, I'm glad Larry Fitzgerald made it this high because he he's well deserving, even though his time in Pittsburgh was short.
46:02
SPEAKER_01: A guy whose time in Pittsburgh was not short was Willie Starjil played for the Pirates for 21 seasons, 1962 to 1982, seven-time All-Star, National League MVP, all-time leader in home runs, Hall of Famer.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: They have a statue outside PNC Park of Willie Stargil, and of course, he was also clutch in big games, especially in that 79 World Series.
46:25
SPEAKER_02: Always forget that he doesn't have 500.
46:27
SPEAKER_02: He only has 475 home runs.
46:30
SPEAKER_02: And uh fun story, I was at Willie Starjil's retirement game, he his last game.
46:36
SPEAKER_02: I was I attended Willie Starjil's last game in Three River Stadium.
46:40
SPEAKER_02: Was that the game where people threw batteries at Dave Parker?
46:43
SPEAKER_02: No, that was like in the 80s.
46:44
SPEAKER_02: That was like 82 or 88.
46:46
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that would have been Starjil played until 82.
46:48
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, no, there was nobody throwing anything at everybody's just happy to see Willie Stargil play one last time.
46:56
SPEAKER_02: And I remember I had a hat.
46:58
SPEAKER_02: Remember the hat, and you used to have the Stargil stars on the and my mom gave me a hat and it had like this the little she put a couple stars on there for me.
47:06
SPEAKER_02: Nice.
47:07
SPEAKER_02: Here's a question, Tim.
47:08
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so P and C Park.
47:09
SPEAKER_02: Let's say you know we can bring back Willie Stargil in his prime to P and C Park.
47:15
SPEAKER_02: Can you now you remember the home runs, right, that he hit in the upper deck of Three River Stadium?
47:20
SPEAKER_02: You remember the numbers?
47:21
SPEAKER_02: Would one of those home runs have made it across the river?
47:25
SPEAKER_02: Across the river?
47:26
SPEAKER_02: I think you hit I think he hits Duke Fort Duquesne Boulevard.
47:30
SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's a great question.
47:32
SPEAKER_01: I thought you were gonna say in the river, and I was gonna say for sure, but across the river.
47:36
SPEAKER_02: Across the river.
47:37
SPEAKER_02: Because think about that.
47:38
SPEAKER_02: That was 600 level.
47:41
SPEAKER_02: To the 600 level in what was that, right?
47:44
SPEAKER_02: Because he was a left-hander in right field.
47:46
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
47:46
SPEAKER_02: One was in the seats, too, like 10 rows up.
47:49
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
47:50
SPEAKER_01: Well, they used to have a marker.
47:52
SPEAKER_01: Like there was a seat you could sit in up there that had a few years.
47:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was painted.
47:55
SPEAKER_02: It was painted, yeah.
47:56
SPEAKER_02: So I would maybe somebody with a computer, if a computer person could take a simulation and we could simulate, you know, stat cast those uh those and see if any how far they would have gone in the river.
48:07
SPEAKER_02: I I know they're making the river, it's just how far across the river are they getting.
48:11
SPEAKER_02: That's a great that's a great question.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: That's a great one.
48:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:17
SPEAKER_01: Number 11 on the list is Rod Woodson, Steeler cornerback between 1987 and 1996, uh in the Pro Football Hall of Fame, on the 100th anniversary team, uh defensive player of the year in 93, third all-time in the NF in NFL history in interceptions, which, you know, I I don't know that people would remember that that he's third, he's in the top three.
48:38
SPEAKER_02: More interceptions than a coach from Colorado.
48:41
SPEAKER_02: That's true.
48:43
SPEAKER_01: Uh so again, all the stats are there and all the accolades are there for Rod Woodson.
48:48
SPEAKER_01: But the reason that Steve and I probably have him so high is because I I've never seen a defensive player single-handedly win games the way that Rod Woodson did.
49:01
SPEAKER_01: I I I think you could probably find guys that have.
49:04
SPEAKER_01: We talked about like Aaron Donald in that Super Bowl and people like that.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: But he did that consistently.
49:09
SPEAKER_01: There were games where literally the Steelers don't win if not for Rod Woodson, make you know, making some kind of turnover.
49:15
SPEAKER_01: There was a there was a Monday night football game against Buffalo in '94.
49:19
SPEAKER_01: This was when Buffalo was the four-time defending AFC champion.
49:23
SPEAKER_01: And the Steelers scored two touchdowns in that game.
49:26
SPEAKER_01: And they're both Rod Woodson touchdowns.
49:29
SPEAKER_01: One was a pick six, and one was he he made Jim Kelly fumble, and then somebody else fell on it.
49:33
SPEAKER_01: But like literally, that's the only two scores they had, and they beat the the four-time defending AFC champions because of a cornerback.
49:41
SPEAKER_01: So to me, that's that's his greatness.
49:43
SPEAKER_01: He's my all-time favorite Steeler.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: Steve, I your thoughts.
49:47
SPEAKER_02: Uh he's the greatest defensive back in NFL history.
49:51
SPEAKER_02: There you go.
49:52
SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
49:54
SPEAKER_02: And here, and I know you know everybody say Dion or Ronnie Lott or who else is up there?
50:01
SPEAKER_02: And uh who's the guy from W Washington?
50:04
SPEAKER_02: Daryl Green.
50:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
50:06
SPEAKER_02: And there's been a lot of other um who else?
50:08
SPEAKER_02: There's been a lot of other good corners that have played Daryl.
50:11
SPEAKER_02: Charles Woodson, Darrell Reeves, Darrell Reeves, yeah.
50:14
SPEAKER_02: I Revis could tackle, but that's the thing is Rod Woodson had the speed to play corner, but the physicality to play safety.
50:23
SPEAKER_02: And later in his career, he switched to safety.
50:25
SPEAKER_02: That's why he extended his career like another five years with the Raiders and Ravens.
50:29
SPEAKER_02: Played another Super Bowl with the Raiders, I think.
50:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
50:32
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
50:33
SPEAKER_02: And so he he was a very and when he did that at the end, he was a very good safety.
50:37
SPEAKER_02: He was one of the best safeties in the league.
50:39
SPEAKER_02: I think he made all the Pro Bowl with safety.
50:42
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
50:42
SPEAKER_02: So I Rod Woodson, like, to me, just like he could tackle, he could cover, he could, you know, hit.
50:52
SPEAKER_02: Dion never tackled anybody.
50:55
SPEAKER_02: And that's fine if you want, oh, I'm a corner, that's not my job.
50:59
SPEAKER_02: But you know what?
50:59
SPEAKER_02: You're a football player, and it is your job.
51:01
SPEAKER_02: You're on the field, and sometimes you have to tackle people.
51:05
SPEAKER_02: And you know, I just, you know, it is what it is.
51:09
SPEAKER_02: They say this Paul Krause to the guy for the Vikings, that is the all-time, he's the all-time leader.
51:14
SPEAKER_02: I still believe in interceptions.
51:16
SPEAKER_02: And that is that guy in the Hall of Fame yet?
51:18
SPEAKER_02: He wasn't.
51:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think he he finally is.
51:21
SPEAKER_02: Like, yeah, because they always held, well, he doesn't have a lot of tackles.
51:24
SPEAKER_02: Well, he's a free safety.
51:25
SPEAKER_02: He shouldn't be tackling people, but I mean but I yeah, it's it's tough to judge.
51:31
SPEAKER_02: He he has more interceptions than a lot of other people that are high more highly regarded.
51:37
SPEAKER_02: But in my mind, he's not.
51:39
SPEAKER_02: In my mind, for whatever opinion a guy from Beachview is worth, it's whatever.
51:47
SPEAKER_01: So number 10 is Tony Dorset, pit running back between 1973 and 1976.
51:53
SPEAKER_01: Four times, all four of his years, he was a thousand-yard rusher, all four of those years he was an all-American.
51:58
SPEAKER_01: Pitt's only Heisman Trophy winner, led them to their only national championship of the modern era.
52:04
SPEAKER_01: And to this day, almost 50 years after he left Pitt, is still the fourth all-time leader in NCAA rush.
52:12
SPEAKER_02: So who are is it Ron Dane, Ricky Williams, and Priest Holmes?
52:16
SPEAKER_02: Is that the R.
52:17
SPEAKER_01: No, the guy that I think the guy's number one is like a um I I won't remember his name, but he played for like San Diego State or like one of those kinds of schools that are.
52:27
SPEAKER_02: But Ron Dane and Ron Dane and Ricky Williams are still like two.
52:31
SPEAKER_02: I think so.
52:32
SPEAKER_01: I think so.
52:33
SPEAKER_01: But but I mean, again, 50 years later and and he's still number four, that's pretty impressive.
52:38
SPEAKER_01: I mean, Pitt just he just carried Pitt for four years.
52:42
SPEAKER_02: Now this is the opposite of the quarterback.
52:45
SPEAKER_02: Like Pitt has had a slew of great running backs.
52:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
52:49
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, it's uh but he's still you know, head and shoulders, probably a little a little ahead of Curtis Martin or you know, some of the other you know famous people that have played at that university.
53:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
53:00
SPEAKER_02: I mean, we talk about Shady McCoy, Curtis Martin.
53:03
SPEAKER_01: Like you said, great running backs.
53:04
SPEAKER_01: Guys, we had didn't even mention James Conner.
53:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
53:07
SPEAKER_02: You know, but but Tony Dortmund.
53:08
SPEAKER_02: Eon Lewis, yeah.
53:11
SPEAKER_01: But but but uh Tony Dorset just man, just this dominant.
53:15
SPEAKER_01: And and again, won a national championship, won the Heisman.
53:18
SPEAKER_02: The only Heisman winner from Pitt, so which is odd to think about.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: It is.
53:24
SPEAKER_01: So Tony Dorsett's our our number 10, so we're into the top ten now.
53:28
SPEAKER_01: Number nine, Troy Palomalu, played safety for the Steelers between 2003 and 2014, won a Defensive Player of the Year award, made eight Pro Bowls, is in the NFL's Hall of Fame.
53:41
SPEAKER_01: And another guy where again, just take take away the stats, he really revolutionized the safety position.
53:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I yeah, he did crazy stuff.
53:51
SPEAKER_02: There was that one against the Falcons, Matt Ryan threw like an out route to the sideline, and Troy Polomolo picked it off.
53:57
SPEAKER_02: Like safeties really shouldn't be able to do that.
54:01
SPEAKER_02: Like he undercut the wide receiver and tapped his toe.
54:05
SPEAKER_02: I mean, or the jumping over like in on a QB sneak.
54:10
SPEAKER_02: Wouldn't it be fun to see Troy Polomalo with that that uh the brotherly shove play they have now?
54:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that would.
54:17
SPEAKER_02: He would he would totally like he would jump over the top, but he I mean, I guess Hertz would just carry him very hard.
54:24
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
54:25
SPEAKER_02: That would be interesting.
54:26
SPEAKER_02: That'd be fun to see.
54:28
SPEAKER_02: But um, yeah, he was great and very smart, very smart player, too.
54:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
54:33
SPEAKER_02: And um another person that's a good person off the field.
54:36
SPEAKER_01: So yes, another another beloved Pittsburgh star.
54:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, could run for for mayor, whatever, city council.
54:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
54:44
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
54:46
SPEAKER_01: Number eight, a guy that probably would not, well, maybe now, but that at one time would not have won that race for mayor.
54:52
SPEAKER_01: It's Yarmir Yagger, played for the Penguins between 1990 and 2001, nine-time All-Star, five time scoring champion, league MVP.
55:01
SPEAKER_01: Uh you know, Yager is an all-time great.
55:04
SPEAKER_01: He he certainly, you know, there was a period of time where we all didn't like him, and and maybe deservedly so, but I think that's all changed.
55:11
SPEAKER_01: Uh time really healed those wounds.
55:14
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, the other thing to say about Yagger, obviously all the accolades that I mentioned, he has four playoff overtime goals.
55:22
SPEAKER_01: Uh Mario Lemieux and Sidney Crosby have combined for one playoff overtime goal in their careers, and Jagger had four.
55:30
SPEAKER_01: So talk about a really clutch player.
55:32
SPEAKER_01: Yarma Jager was absolutely a clutch player.
55:35
SPEAKER_02: So is he the second or third greatest penguin of all time?
55:39
SPEAKER_01: That's that's a good well, according to how we rank them.
55:43
SPEAKER_02: He's the third, yeah.
55:44
SPEAKER_01: We have two other guys coming.
55:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:46
SPEAKER_01: And I bet you can guess who they are.
55:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:48
SPEAKER_02: We won't spoil it.
55:49
unknown: Yeah.
55:49
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's he's very good.
55:51
SPEAKER_02: He plays a different position than those other two people.
55:54
SPEAKER_02: So I I don't know.
55:55
SPEAKER_02: I look Yager is a very good player, very good at like what he did, cycling down low, and he's still playing.
56:01
SPEAKER_02: I think he's still playing as of this year in whatever Czech League.
56:05
SPEAKER_01: At age 53 or whatever he's saying.
56:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's unbelievable.
56:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
56:08
SPEAKER_01: Guys is never gonna stop playing hockey.
56:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it'll be like 67.
56:12
SPEAKER_02: Ah, I can still take these guys.
56:14
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
56:14
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
56:15
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, he's over back in home in the Czech Republic, so good for him.
56:20
SPEAKER_02: Maybe we'll run for mayor over there.
56:22
SPEAKER_01: There you go.
56:23
SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna talk about number seven and number six together.
56:27
SPEAKER_01: Uh, because we have Terry Bradshaw and Ben Rothesberger as our next two on our list.
56:32
SPEAKER_01: And I think, you know, we have them as Terry Bradshaw Seven and Ben Six.
56:36
SPEAKER_01: Oh, but I don't know.
56:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
56:39
SPEAKER_02: Bradshaw one more Super Bowls, Tim.
56:41
SPEAKER_01: I think I think we almost call this a tie, right?
56:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
56:45
SPEAKER_01: So let's talk about Bradshaw first.
56:47
SPEAKER_01: Uh Steeler quarterback between 1970 and 1983, uh, won four Super Bowls, was the MVP of two of those Super Bowls, was also the league MVP in 1978.
56:56
SPEAKER_01: Then you have Ben played for the Steelers between 2004 and 2021, won two Super Bowls, including one with a last second drive when they were trailing, holds every Steeler passing record, and is also in the top five in yards in NFL history.
57:10
SPEAKER_02: Does he have the most fourth quarter comebacks of all time now?
57:14
SPEAKER_02: I think I think it's between him and Peyton, isn't it?
57:17
SPEAKER_01: Or yeah, I thought it was him and Brady were both.
57:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, that's right.
57:20
SPEAKER_02: It's him and Brady.
57:21
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Brady might have more, but yeah, Ben I think Ben has more than Tom Brady.
57:25
SPEAKER_01: But both of these guys were really clutch, right?
57:28
SPEAKER_01: They were super clutch.
57:29
SPEAKER_01: Um the I guess the one thing you could you could knock on Terry Bradshaw was it took him a couple of years to really get going.
57:36
SPEAKER_01: He wasn't very good early in his career, whereas Ben really kind of just shot out of the gate as a star.
57:42
SPEAKER_02: Uh but the Steelers weren't very good when Terry Bradley got there.
57:46
SPEAKER_01: That's exactly right.
57:47
SPEAKER_01: And and it was such a different era, too.
57:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
57:49
SPEAKER_01: So I I I I I don't I don't know, Steve.
57:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't really want to debate who is better, Bradshar Ben.
57:54
SPEAKER_01: I think, like I said, this is almost like a tie at seven and six.
57:57
SPEAKER_01: They're they're the two greatest quarterbacks in Steelers history.
58:00
SPEAKER_01: Just like with Dan Marino, there's a huge drop-off to third place.
58:04
SPEAKER_01: The Steelers don't win.
58:05
SPEAKER_01: And the Steelers are what are the Minnesota Vikings if without these two guys.
58:09
SPEAKER_01: They're they're the team that was consistently good and they've never won a Super Bowl, if not for these two guys.
58:14
SPEAKER_01: Would you agree?
58:15
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's that's yeah.
58:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and it's a shame Minnesota.
58:20
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I keep forgetting Minnesota's never and they've been to what four four Super Bowls?
58:24
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
58:24
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, never won one.
58:28
SPEAKER_02: Go figure.
58:29
SPEAKER_02: They really haven't had a great quarterback, though.
58:31
SPEAKER_02: That is the one like you think about Minnesota, they really well, Fran Tarkington.
58:35
SPEAKER_02: I guess they had to Fran Tarkington.
58:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's a YouTube channel called Secret Base.
58:38
SPEAKER_01: They just did a like a seven or eight part documentary on the history of the Minnesota Vikings that I just watched this week.
58:44
SPEAKER_01: So it's kind of fresh in my mind.
58:46
SPEAKER_01: Uh I I don't want to stick there too long because it's a Pittsburgh podcast, but it's really interesting and fascinating their history and all the reasons they never won one.
58:55
SPEAKER_01: But I I think the Steelers, again, you you at the end of the day, with very few exceptions, I know there was the Trent Dill for a year and all that kind of stuff, but with very few exceptions, you need a quarterback to win championships.
59:06
SPEAKER_01: And the Steelers had two great ones, and and not only were they great, but they were great when they had to be in those big games.
59:13
SPEAKER_02: Well, look at Belichick with Al Brady now.
59:15
SPEAKER_02: He's gone back to the Bill Belichick from Cleveland.
59:18
SPEAKER_01: From Cleveland, yeah, absolutely.
59:19
SPEAKER_01: So yep, Brad John are seven and six.
59:23
SPEAKER_01: Number five is Sidney Crosby.
59:26
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Penguins from 2005 to the present, has won three Stanley Cups, has won two Conn Smise, has been league MVP twice.
59:34
SPEAKER_01: And I again throwing the accolades out the window for a minute, I think he's the greatest competitor I've ever seen.
59:41
SPEAKER_01: Like I've never seen anybody want to win as badly as Sidney Crosby and work as hard at it.
59:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I don't think he I think even after he retires, he's gonna do something with hockey.
59:52
SPEAKER_02: I mean and he it like what a weird like has he ever had a scandal off?
59:58
SPEAKER_02: I've never heard like he's another one of these guys, like I don't even hear like anything ever negative about him.
1:00:05
SPEAKER_02: Like, not that we are ever hearing anything about Larry Fitzgerald, but geez, he just he just like kind of like one of the few people that was hyped coming in, has lived up to the hype, and is you know kept his nose clean off the field or off the ice or whatever you want to call it.
1:00:20
SPEAKER_01: And I would say he's done a really good job of if not even like no scandals, but just privacy.
1:00:25
SPEAKER_01: Like you don't really know.
1:00:27
SPEAKER_02: I think he had a girlfriend or something.
1:00:28
SPEAKER_02: Like one day, like they announced he had a fiance at the arena, and I was like, what?
1:00:33
SPEAKER_02: Huh?
1:00:33
SPEAKER_02: I didn't even know.
1:00:34
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:00:35
SPEAKER_02: He's like a major I don't is he like that in Canada too?
1:00:39
SPEAKER_02: Because like, you know, Canada's you know I I guess he doesn't play in Canada, so maybe he's able like if he played in Toronto, I'm sure it'd be a big it'd be it'd be harder for him to maintain his privacy for sure.
1:00:51
SPEAKER_01: But he's again, he's from Nova Scotia.
1:00:53
SPEAKER_01: He's not you know, so even even when he goes back home, he's goes back to Cole Harbor, it's not like a big big city necessarily.
1:01:00
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, he he we had the experience a couple years ago watching Ben retire, and I think when Sydney Crosby finally retires, Steve, I feel like that's gonna be Ben times like 10.
1:01:12
SPEAKER_01: I really do.
1:01:13
SPEAKER_01: Like I just it's gonna be we're gonna have to brace ourselves for that because it's gonna be a flood of emotions for all of us, I think.
1:01:21
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and he almost had to retire because of when he got hurt, and yeah, yeah, came back from that.
1:01:26
SPEAKER_01: Thank God for Tom Brady, you know.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
1:01:29
SPEAKER_01: Like we talked about in the previous episode.
1:01:32
SPEAKER_01: All right, number four is Hannes Wagner, played for the Pirates between 1900 and 1917, won eight National League batting titles, led the league in RBIs five times, stolen bases five times, won a World Series in the Hall of Fame, uh, arguably the greatest hitter, just pure hitter in Pirates history.
1:01:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, has a statue outside BNC Park.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_01: Just, you know, for somebody that played over a hundred years ago to be in our top five, it just says a lot to the kind of the enduring legacy of this guy, Steve.
1:02:01
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he was one part of the original um members of the Baseball Hall of Fame.
1:02:05
SPEAKER_02: He was that original class.
1:02:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:02:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:02:08
SPEAKER_02: Uh he's uh in a good guy.
1:02:10
SPEAKER_02: No, like it's a lot of these guys like were good people off the field, too.
1:02:14
SPEAKER_02: I mean a couple or two there that for the Steelers, maybe not so much, but you know, Honus Wagner, Sidney Crosby, Larry Fitzgerald, you know, just just off the field like good people too.
1:02:27
SPEAKER_02: Like that was a famous story.
1:02:28
SPEAKER_02: That's why his baseball cards so hard to find is because he didn't like that.
1:02:34
SPEAKER_02: I guess what they did back then was like, remember you used to get bubblegum and packs of baseball cards?
1:02:39
SPEAKER_02: Well, they put you know, cigarettes with small cards because uh oh, I want a car to you know, Honus Wagner, I'm gonna buy this pack of lucky strikes or whatever.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_02: And so he didn't like that, so he would buy the packs of cigarettes and rip up the his baseball cards, and that's why his are so valuable because there aren't very many left.
1:02:59
SPEAKER_02: So um very, very good, good player too, won a couple World Series with the Pirates.
1:03:04
SPEAKER_02: And if you go on YouTube, there there is some YouTube video of him like doing batting practice with like it's well, he's well past his prime.
1:03:12
SPEAKER_02: I think.
1:03:12
SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah, yeah.
1:03:13
SPEAKER_01: We played that in our last audio episode.
1:03:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was pretty fun to watch.
1:03:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's pretty cool.
1:03:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he has like the old-fashioned glove, like you know, with the the fingers that aren't sewn together.
1:03:23
SPEAKER_02: It's like, gosh.
1:03:26
SPEAKER_01: So number three on our list is Roberto Clemente, which should come as no surprise.
1:03:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:03:32
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Pirates between 1955 and 1972, 15 time All-Star, 3,000 hits, four-time batting champion, 12-time gold glove winner, 1966 National League MVP.
1:03:44
SPEAKER_01: Steve.
1:03:46
SPEAKER_02: Greatest greatest right fielder to ever play the game.
1:03:49
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
1:03:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:03:51
SPEAKER_02: He used to throw people out at first.
1:03:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:03:55
SPEAKER_02: From right field at first base.
1:03:58
SPEAKER_02: Right.
1:04:00
SPEAKER_02: Single-handedly won the 1971 World Series, him and Steve Blass.
1:04:04
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
1:04:04
SPEAKER_02: Maybe not single-handedly, but the big pretty pretty much.
1:04:07
SPEAKER_01: I mean, and and a guy that just transcended race and and that kind of stuff, too.
1:04:13
SPEAKER_01: Um, just a hero, a legend.
1:04:16
SPEAKER_01: I I like I said, we gotta do it.
1:04:19
SPEAKER_01: We we said this when we talked about our tragedies.
1:04:21
SPEAKER_01: At some point, we really have to dedicate an entire episode to him.
1:04:24
SPEAKER_01: I think to me, the the thing about Clemente, you know, I you and I weren't born yet when he tragically died.
1:04:30
SPEAKER_01: But there are people that I talked to who who were alive back then that still remember where they were, what they were doing when they heard the news.
1:04:39
SPEAKER_01: Like the like JFK assassination.
1:04:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:04:41
SPEAKER_01: You know, it impacted Pittsburghers that deeply.
1:04:44
SPEAKER_01: So I he has to be high on this list, and we have him at number three.
1:04:49
SPEAKER_01: Number two is Joe Green, Steelers defensive tackle from 1969 to 1981, also on that 100th anniversary team, two the only stealer to ever win the defensive player of the year award twice.
1:05:03
SPEAKER_01: And Dan Rooney has said he's the greatest stealer of all time.
1:05:07
SPEAKER_01: So once again, Dan Rooney was pretty qualified to make that uh assessment.
1:05:12
SPEAKER_01: And and I think again, just taking away the stats and everything, the the greatest dynasty in NFL history was literally built around Joe Green.
1:05:24
SPEAKER_01: That's where it all started.
1:05:25
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:05:26
SPEAKER_02: First pick.
1:05:28
SPEAKER_02: What didn't they did they have to flip a coin to get him too?
1:05:31
SPEAKER_02: Or that was Bradshaw.
1:05:32
SPEAKER_02: Oh, that was Bradshaw, okay.
1:05:33
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, they had the they was one of Chuck Knoll's first picks and made it a good one.
1:05:39
SPEAKER_02: And he changed the out of gosh, the trajectory of the Pittsburgh Steelers.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_02: Like you said, they had basically been the you know the Los Angeles Clippers or Cincinnati Bengals of sports franchises, and now they became you know more like the Yankees or Giants.
1:05:57
SPEAKER_02: So uh they wouldn't be the Steelers without Dan Riddle.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_02: Rooney and me and Joe Green.
1:06:02
SPEAKER_02: That was definitely where it all started.
1:06:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:06:06
SPEAKER_01: I don't think you can say enough about what Joe Green meant to the franchise, like you just kind of pointed out.
1:06:10
SPEAKER_01: That's and that's really his value.
1:06:12
SPEAKER_01: He's obviously a great player, all-time great player, but his value to the franchise is what puts him this high on our list.
1:06:19
SPEAKER_02: And they didn't know losing.
1:06:20
SPEAKER_02: He didn't know lose, and the guys that came in after him didn't know losing, and that that changed the culture.
1:06:25
SPEAKER_02: It's like kind of a study in like how to change the culture and the business that maybe needs a culture changed.
1:06:32
SPEAKER_01: That's a that's a good point too.
1:06:33
SPEAKER_01: And the culture, again, 50 years later, is still the same culture.
1:06:37
SPEAKER_01: And and there's a story about the 1974 season, the year they won that first Super Bowl.
1:06:42
SPEAKER_01: Uh he was ready to quit.
1:06:45
SPEAKER_01: Uh he was he literally was like, I'm I'm just done because this team is not gonna is not winning, they're not playing as well as they should.
1:06:52
SPEAKER_01: And he was again, he just willed them to to to be the greatest team of all time.
1:06:57
SPEAKER_01: And they they built it around him.
1:07:00
SPEAKER_01: He was the like you said, he was the OG.
1:07:02
SPEAKER_01: So well, that finally brings us to our number one greatest player in the history of Pittsburgh sports.
1:07:11
SPEAKER_01: Drum roll, please.
1:07:14
SPEAKER_01: And that is Mario Lemieux.
1:07:17
SPEAKER_01: Played for the Penguins between 1984 and 1980, then came back and played for the Penguins between 2001 and 2006.
1:07:25
SPEAKER_01: Just some stats here.
1:07:26
SPEAKER_01: Three-time MVP, six times scoring champion, two times Taunt Smythe winner, five times Stanley Cup winner if you count as years as owners.
1:07:35
SPEAKER_01: Uh is there ever been a guy that was more exciting and more dominant that you've ever watched in your life in any sport for any team?
1:07:46
SPEAKER_02: No, it's I I would have to say it has to be the feeling that maybe like people that are LeBron James fans or Michael Jordan or Jordan's a good comparison.
1:07:56
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like like you just knew when you had that guy and he was playing for your team that anything was possible, you were never out of any game, and that you just never knew when he was just gonna say, uh, I want to win tonight and kind of take over.
1:08:11
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
1:08:11
SPEAKER_02: And then a lot of once again, the guy seems at least pretty good off the ice, you know, does a lot of stuff around the community, and um, you know, with all his struggles with cancer and such, and playing after chemo, and what an inspiration.
1:08:26
SPEAKER_02: And then a great owner, ends up being a great owner until I guess he's he's not doesn't own the team anymore, but saved the penguins twice, saved them in the eighties, and then saved him in the you know 2000s from bankruptcy.
1:08:39
SPEAKER_02: So good good for him, God of a new arena.
1:08:43
SPEAKER_02: I mean, definitely probably one of the most influential.
1:08:46
SPEAKER_02: He's only above Mean Joe Green because he owned the team.
1:08:50
SPEAKER_02: To me, I know we weren't supposed to include that, but he literally the penguins would not exist.
1:08:55
SPEAKER_02: I the Steelers would still exist if it wasn't for Mean Joe Green.
1:08:59
SPEAKER_02: Right.
1:08:59
SPEAKER_02: The Penguins would be in Kansas City or Saskatchewan somewhere, yeah, if they if Mary Lemieux did not come around.
1:09:09
SPEAKER_02: And twice, like two different times that would have happened.
1:09:13
SPEAKER_02: And what what a what what a privilege like between Crosby and Lemieux and you know Malkin.
1:09:19
SPEAKER_02: I mean, that the Penguins have been really fortunate.
1:09:24
SPEAKER_02: We've been fortunate as fans to live through it.
1:09:26
SPEAKER_02: Like, you know, maybe 100 years from now, somebody'd be doing a podcast and think, oh, what are those, you know, people are so lucky to live through that.
1:09:34
SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, it's it's the it's kind of the equivalent of like being a Yankees fan through Ruth and Gehrig and Damascus and Mantle, right?
1:09:41
SPEAKER_01: It's it's very similar to that.
1:09:43
SPEAKER_01: And and you're right, the the team wouldn't exist without him.
1:09:46
SPEAKER_02: I what other player on any team in any sport it's hard to oppress like the Cleveland Cavaliers would still be in Cleveland, I think.
1:09:56
SPEAKER_02: The Lakers definitely aren't going anywhere.
1:09:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:09:59
SPEAKER_02: Maybe maybe Wilt Chamberlain, or not Wilt Chamberlain, um the other one, Aldul Jabbar.
1:10:04
SPEAKER_02: But even then, didn't he play for Milwaukee?
1:10:07
SPEAKER_02: Right.
1:10:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:10:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:10:09
SPEAKER_02: I just don't think that there's one.
1:10:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:10:11
SPEAKER_01: I can't I can't think of another player that's single-handedly like I think George Hallis played for the Bears when he first owned them.
1:10:20
SPEAKER_01: Like you'd have to go back to something like that.
1:10:22
SPEAKER_02: Like a Bronco Negerski, like even yeah, I mean you'd have to go back to something like that.
1:10:28
SPEAKER_01: So in the modern era, there's nothing like Mary Lemieux.
1:10:31
SPEAKER_01: And and then when you so so that's one thing.
1:10:34
SPEAKER_01: And then when you add on the fact that he was again, like you said, the Michael Jordan-esque dominance, highlight reels, just could take over games, wasn't even fair to the competition kind of a player.
1:10:46
SPEAKER_01: When you add that in, I he's he's just to me, you and I, again, we both did our list independently, and we both had Mario at number one.
1:10:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:10:56
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, yeah.
1:10:58
SPEAKER_02: And uh I think he's better than Gretzky.
1:11:02
SPEAKER_02: I mean, but that's just me.
1:11:03
SPEAKER_02: I'm biased.
1:11:04
SPEAKER_02: I guess Gretzky has the better numbers.
1:11:07
SPEAKER_02: Unfortunately, Lemieux had some injuries, maybe he would have caught Gretzky, at least in overall points and definitely in goals, I think.
1:11:15
SPEAKER_02: I think Lemieux was a different type of player.
1:11:19
SPEAKER_02: Lemieux was more of a breakaway, but he could pass too.
1:11:22
SPEAKER_02: But whereas I always saw Gretzky more as a facilitary.
1:11:25
SPEAKER_02: Both work, both are great players.
1:11:27
SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like comparing like different styles of basketball point guards, you know.
1:11:31
SPEAKER_02: Do you want like the magic Johnson kind of pass the ball guy, or do you want the Michael Jordan, I'm gonna dribble down and beat you off the dribble kind of guy?
1:11:39
SPEAKER_02: Both are very good players, and you're gonna win championships with both those people.
1:11:43
SPEAKER_02: It's just a matter of style, I guess.
1:11:46
SPEAKER_01: It's it's it's super hard to compare the two of them too.
1:11:49
SPEAKER_01: I know everybody always has, but the the Gretzky had Edmonton put a great team around him right away.
1:11:56
SPEAKER_01: The Penguins didn't do that until Lamie's career was almost literally half over.
1:12:01
SPEAKER_01: And then it was a different era, too.
1:12:04
SPEAKER_01: I mean, the the the second half of Mario's career was played in that clutch and grab uh era of hockey.
1:12:10
SPEAKER_01: The 80s were wide open, the goalie pads were were like nothing.
1:12:14
SPEAKER_01: You know, it just was a different era.
1:12:16
SPEAKER_01: So I think it's hard to compare the two of them.
1:12:17
SPEAKER_01: I know, like I said, everybody does because they were contemporaries, um, and and people did it back then, right?
1:12:23
SPEAKER_01: There was a Sports Illustrated cover in the 80s that that uh had Mario on the cover and said, you know, is is he as great as Gretzky?
1:12:30
SPEAKER_01: So that was always the comparison.
1:12:31
SPEAKER_01: Mario wore Gretzky's number upside down, yeah.
1:12:34
SPEAKER_01: You know, and all that stuff.
1:12:36
SPEAKER_01: Um people argue that to the end of the time.
1:12:38
SPEAKER_01: I I I stopped caring about that because I again both can both are great players.
1:12:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, both are great players.
1:12:46
SPEAKER_01: Mario, like no one Gretzky can't say that he single-handedly saved the franchise twice.
1:12:52
SPEAKER_01: Gretzky hasn't hasn't, and again, this is not a knock on Gretzky, but Gretzky hasn't Mario to me's contribution to the city, a guy that wasn't from the city, a guy that wasn't even from this country.
1:13:03
SPEAKER_01: It it it's it's Andrew Carnegie-esque in terms of the city.
1:13:06
SPEAKER_02: Well, I guess people would argue, whoa, uh Wayne Gretzky expanded the reach of hockey or yeah, you could certainly make that argument too.
1:13:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because he went to LA and Yes, yeah.
1:13:15
SPEAKER_01: I I'm not gonna I'm I'm not here to bash Wayne Gretzky.
1:13:19
SPEAKER_01: It's just Mario Lemieux to this town specifically.
1:13:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:13:23
SPEAKER_01: There's nothing in terms of comparison.
1:13:26
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
1:13:26
SPEAKER_01: I can't disagree with you on that.
1:13:28
SPEAKER_02: So there you go.
1:13:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's it.
1:13:31
SPEAKER_02: That's the list, folks.
1:13:32
SPEAKER_02: Uh all hundred.
1:13:33
SPEAKER_02: I hope you enjoyed it.
1:13:36
SPEAKER_02: And if you disagree with them, they were all Tib's choices.
1:13:41
SPEAKER_01: Thanks again, folks, so much for listening.
1:13:43
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for uh sticking with us through 100 episodes.
1:13:47
SPEAKER_01: Uh please check us out on Twitter or Facebook.
1:13:50
SPEAKER_01: Uh please subscribe to the show, and uh, we'll catch you next time.