Latest / Becker’s Healthcare Podcast / Developing the Next Generation of Healthcare Leaders

Transcript

Developing the Next Generation of Healthcare Leaders · Becker’s Healthcare Podcast

• 0:00
  - This is Scott Becker with the Becker's Healthcare
• 0:03
  - Podcast.
• 0:04
  - I'm thrilled today to be joined by a
• 0:05
  - long term leader and a fabulous person.
• 0:08
  - We're joined today by Dan Collard,
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  - the cofounder
• 0:12
  - of Healthcare Plus Solutions Group. I've known Dan
• 0:16
  - and I've known Quinte Studer for a very
• 0:17
  - long time. They're both absolutely exceptional
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  - people and leaders and
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  - inspiring people.
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  - We'd love to talk to you today
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  - about what you're seeing about the changeover and
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  - leadership in organizations,
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  - the sort of next level developing leaders, and
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  - a lot more. Dan, let me ask you
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  - to take one moment to introduce yourself and
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  - tell us about Healthcare Plus Solutions Group, and
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  - then we'll dive in. Yeah. Great. It's always
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  - great to be with you, Scott. So I'm
• 0:44
  - Dan Collard. I always introduce myself in one
• 0:47
  - of two ways.
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  - Number one, I'm an operator. You know, my
• 0:50
  - my background is in health care operations,
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  - and I've always really tried to retain that
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  - lens that I that I look through in
• 0:58
  - health care because I think,
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  - when when folks know that you've walked in
• 1:01
  - their shoes,
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  - there's a you know, it just brings a
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  - a nice sense of credibility, and and you
• 1:07
  - know what folks are facing.
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  - Number two, I'm the husband of a nurse.
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  - And, when my wife Melissa first became a
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  - nurse, I wasn't in health care. So everything
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  - I learned about health care early on was
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  - through the lens of of a nurse, and
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  - that also, I think, helps me keep grounded
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  - in that sort of day in the life
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  - view.
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  - So when Quint and I got back together,
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  - handful of years ago to create HPSG,
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  - we really wanted to be better listeners than
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  - ever before, be really good diagnosticians
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  - as to what the real pain points are
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  - in in the industry, in the market. So
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  - I'd say that's really how I describe ourselves
• 1:44
  - today. We we diagnose first, and and then
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  - we design work with our client partners, and
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  - then we just help them execute because everybody's
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  - busy.
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  - No one's got that extra twenty fifth hour
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  - in the day. So we just try to
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  - be a great diagnostic partner with folks.
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  - Oh, and I and I and I love
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  - that. And I've just loved watching what you
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  - do.
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  - We've talked about previously
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  - the rise in the number of percentage of
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  - new leaders in health care organizations.
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  - You had a lot of retirements
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  - during COVID.
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  - We've got the average age of the nursing
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  - and doctor population in the late fifties,
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  - and we're starting to see a lot of
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  - turnover in new leaders.
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  - Why is that important, and how do organizations
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  - need to address that? Yeah. Well, you know,
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  - like you referenced, during COVID, we had this
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  - one, you know, sort of new language term
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  - called the great resignation.
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  - And when we thought of the great resignation,
• 2:39
  - that was mostly staff that we thought of
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  - with folks leaving the field. And as you
• 2:43
  - said, we saw a number of retirements, early
• 2:46
  - retirements.
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  - But what we've seen is that that pace
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  - has not reversed nor has it slowed down.
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  - Great example, we're working with an organization today
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  - that when they ran their own numbers
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  - on the newness of leadership,
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  - they were surprised to to realize that 67%
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  - of their leadership team is new.
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  - So why is that important? If you think
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  - of folks
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  - that say, well, you know, we wanna make
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  - sure our basics are intact. Well, what if
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  - that leader wasn't there when the basics were
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  - introduced?
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  - The second piece of that,
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  - and it's becoming more and more prominent, is
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  - a lot of these new leaders
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  - are also young leaders. And as we think
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  - of the generational
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  - differences, the generational
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  - dynamic,
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  - It means that we just, you know, it's
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  - sort of like that old ad, it's not
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  - your father's Oldsmobile anymore. We gotta be sure
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  - that we're meeting folks where they are today.
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  - And then finally, if I'm a leadership team
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  - that has two thirds of my population of
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  - leaders as new,
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  - we gotta ask ourselves, are we going to
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  - be able to affect the outcomes that we
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  - want to affect? So, again, there's that operator's
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  - lens just saying, you know, day in the
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  - life of operations, how do we take care
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  - of all these new folks?
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  - Thank you. And take a second. We we
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  - we sort of know that there's such a
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  - new evolving group of leaders
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  - and their younger leaders.
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  - What could be done to address specifically some
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  - of the needs of those new evolving leaders
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  - that are I mean, they're so much different
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  - in lifestyle and how they manage family and
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  - everything else
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  - than we were forty years ago when when,
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  - you know, I don't wanna date you, but
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  - I know I started in business a long
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  - time ago now. But talk about how do
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  - we address how do you address some of
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  - the needs of the new leaders? And I
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  - know you've got a multi generational team that
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  - does that, but how do you do that?
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  - Well, first and foremost, you you nailed it.
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  - We can't just do the things that we've
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  - always done. And and so if I'm even
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  - more specific,
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  - we we've gotta really get away from this
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  - one size fits all.
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  - So from a learning strategy,
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  - even a problem solving,
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  - perspective.
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  - These newer leaders are are indeed different than
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  - some of our longer tenure leaders.
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  - And and so what we have found that's
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  - really working well is that when organizations
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  - take a really precise approach,
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  - meaning
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  - instead of a topic that gets rolled out
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  - to 300 leaders simultaneously,
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  - why don't we diagnose first and and see
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  - what the skill assessments are of each individual
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  - leaders? Let's also find out how do they
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  - learn. Are they visual? Are they auditory? Are
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  - they
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  - experiential?
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  - And then what that allows us to do
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  - is to create an individualized
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  - development
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  - plan for each of each and every leader
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  - in the organization
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  - so that we really recognize the nuances, especially
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  - of these newer leaders.
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  - And and it does a couple of things.
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  - Number one, it's a confidence builder because there's
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  - nothing like coming into an organization where maybe
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  - I look at my peers and think, gosh,
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  - I'm never gonna be as good as them.
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  - But if I can create
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  - my own personal approach to development,
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  - first and foremost, before you start watching the
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  - needle move on metrics, it's it's a real
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  - confidence builder.
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  - And and so we've seen that work. And
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  - you know what's really neat about it? We've
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  - also seen it be completely scalable from smaller
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  - organizations, let's say, like a critical access hospital
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  - that might have twenty, twenty five leaders
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  - up to large academic medical centers that might
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  - have somewhere between 900 and a thousand leaders.
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  - Our concern early on was could we scale
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  - this idea, and we've seen it become completely
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  - scalable.
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  - But most importantly, what we've seen is sort
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  - of that sense of confidence in these new
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  - leaders to walk out and say, you know,
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  - I can do this. And if you've got
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  - a new leader thinking like that, you know,
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  - you you've got half the battle won on
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  - the on the front line there.
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  - No. A 100%. And and I and I
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  - love that. I I've heard you say over
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  - the years
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  - that so much of leadership is being able
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  - to ask the right questions.
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  - And and talk to us about that framework
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  - for thinking about moving more towards asking the
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  - right questions. Like, I find so much in
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  - my daily leadership, if I'm not careful,
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  - I'm doing too much talking at people and
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  - it's vulnerable to ask questions and then sometimes
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  - get uncomfortable. But talk us about the process
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  - to ask questions and why leaders get better
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  - outcomes as they teach themselves to spend more
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  - time learning
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  - listening and asking questions.
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  - Yeah. You know, and this is the fun
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  - part because this begins to engage that layer
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  - of leaders right above these new leaders. And
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  - so when we think about asking the right
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  - questions, if I'm a leader of leaders in
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  - an organization,
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  - that's really my job. My job is to
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  - become sort of the mini chief development
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  - officer of my leaders that that I guide
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  - throughout the, the the course of time together.
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  - And so asking the right questions really goes
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  - really well. It
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  - aligns very well into this whole diagnostic perspective
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  - about, you know, what are the skills
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  - that together we'll work on developing?
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  - Second question, what do you need? What are
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  - the resources that you need? There there's an
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  - old truism that I've I've sort of tucked
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  - in my hip pocket and kept for years
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  - that
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  - expectations
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  - without training and resources equal cruelty.
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  - And and no one wants to be cruel,
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  - especially in health care with any, you know,
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  - intent. There's never any malicious intent.
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  - But if I'm not stopping and asking the
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  - questions
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  - as opposed
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  - to predicating
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  - the answer,
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  - I, you know, I I I find that
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  - we can sort of circumvent or short circuit
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  - the development.
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  - The other piece of asking the right questions
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  - is a is a concept that for years
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  - we've talked about
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  - called park ranger leadership. And it's kind of
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  - a a a, you know, an a neat
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  - analogy of if you go to a national
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  - park, you go to Yosemite, you go to
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  - Yellowstone, we really don't worry about that much
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  - about getting off the path because we know
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  - the folks in the Smokey the Bear hats,
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  - the park rangers will come and rescue us.
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  - And unfortunately, in healthcare especially,
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  - we're such a we want to help others'
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  - DNA in our makeup that oftentimes
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  - we do just that. We jump in and
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  - help
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  - as opposed to stopping and asking the right
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  - questions. So a really specific example is someone
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  - that reports to me comes to me with
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  - a a problem,
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  - a a quandary, a challenge.
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  - It'd be so easy,
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  - and and the more years that we get
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  - under the belt, the more natural it becomes,
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  - says, I'm probably gonna know the answer to
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  - that question.
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  - But if I
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  - just answer the question for them as opposed
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  - to sort of turning the mirror back on
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  - them and asking the right questions,
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  - it looks at at in the beginning, it
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  - looks like I'm solving things for them. But
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  - in essence, I'm actually robbing them. I'm actually
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  - depriving them of our of their own development.
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  - So something as simple
• 9:38
  - as saying,
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  - I don't know. What would you do? And
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  - and it sounds so simple,
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  - but it actually puts the conversation in motion.
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  - And as you just referenced, you know, there's
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  - that adage,
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  - he or she who asks the most questions
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  - wins. And I think it just holds really
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  - true true as we develop those leaders coming
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  - up through the ranks.
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  - Well, this concept that the very best way
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  - to learn is to teach. And if you
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  - ask the question
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  - and keep on asking the question, you allow
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  - the person to really teach themselves, to sort
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  - of to teach, to sort of like think
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  - and learn and open up their mind, whereas
• 10:14
  - you just roll the ideas at them, you
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  - end up in a spot where it's almost
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  - like what's happening today with too much artificial
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  - intelligence.
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  - We end up sometimes not being as rigorous
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  - in our own disciplined thought process. So I
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  - love this concept for so many reasons of
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  - asking the questions, keep on asking the questions,
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  - and using that to drive somebody else's learning
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  - and their engagement. And I I think it's
• 10:35
  - just wonderful advice on so many levels.
• 10:39
  - Dan, let me ask you another question.
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  - And I do want you to touch at
• 10:43
  - some point, if you're okay, on the new
• 10:44
  - book, Rewiring Excellence.
• 10:46
  - But before we do that or work it
• 10:48
  - into the answer, however you'd like, tell me
• 10:51
  - a little bit about the Gallup research that
• 10:53
  - you've spent seem to be spending a lot
• 10:54
  - of time on right now in helping learners,
• 10:57
  - leaders to bring that into life. What does
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  - that Gallup research say? Tell us a bit
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  - about it, and and how do you work
• 11:03
  - with it? Yeah. And I'll sort of, you
• 11:06
  - know, approach this from from three different angles.
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  - The the rewiring angle,
• 11:10
  - our most recent book called Genfluence,
• 11:13
  - leading a multi generational workforce.
• 11:15
  - But but bring its roots back to the
• 11:17
  - Gallup, organization. We've always big been big fans
• 11:21
  - of Gallup because their research has always been
• 11:23
  - so
• 11:24
  - practical, so pragmatic.
• 11:26
  - And a number of years ago,
• 11:28
  - they were in the process of really converting
• 11:30
  - one of their early books called Strengths Finders,
• 11:34
  - into a leadership platform. And so they they
• 11:36
  - called it strengths based leadership.
• 11:39
  - And they conducted research early on that said,
• 11:42
  - when you blow the smoke away from the
• 11:44
  - relationship
• 11:45
  - between employees and their bosses,
• 11:47
  - what are the employees really looking for?
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  - And and it was really a kind of
• 11:52
  - a neat surprise to see because there there
• 11:54
  - are any number of answers that you might
• 11:56
  - think would would come about, but but the
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  - four elements that emerged
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  - were these elements,
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  - trust,
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  - hope,
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  - compassion,
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  - and stability.
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  - And then we'll ask people, well, which one
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  - do you think came out on top?
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  - And and sometimes there's as many answers as
• 12:13
  - there are people in the room.
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  - But interestingly enough, the answer was hope, and
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  - and not just by an inch,
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  - but by a mile. Almost twice as many
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  - respondents,
• 12:26
  - said the greatest need was hope from their
• 12:28
  - leaders, versus trust and about 10 times as
• 12:32
  - much for compassion and stability.
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  - And and we've always been intrigued by, you
• 12:36
  - know, what what does that really mean? Is
• 12:38
  - that you know, is it just this warm,
• 12:40
  - fuzzy feeling that it sounds like, or is
• 12:42
  - there is there something more there? Well, interestingly
• 12:45
  - enough, Gallup recreated
• 12:47
  - that research
• 12:48
  - just recently. So within the last year, if
• 12:50
  - you go to the Gallup website, you'll see
• 12:52
  - that very same question posed.
• 12:56
  - And really interestingly enough, the answers were almost
• 12:59
  - identical.
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  - So fast forward to 2025,
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  - just last year, hope comes out by a
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  - mile.
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  - And, you know, I've always been one of
• 13:08
  - those guys. Let's not just sit on a
• 13:10
  - 40,000
• 13:11
  - foot answer. What does that really mean in
• 13:13
  - an organization, especially if we think about health
• 13:16
  - care where sometimes the future can look sort
• 13:18
  - of dim given everything that we face from
• 13:20
  - the external environment, from the payer and provider
• 13:24
  - relationships,
• 13:25
  - all the things that are going on in
• 13:27
  - mergers and acquisitions and consolidation?
• 13:30
  - Is it just about, oh, hey. Stick with
• 13:32
  - me and things will get better? And the
• 13:33
  - answer is really no. So we take and
• 13:35
  - and break hope down. And and in, the
• 13:38
  - book Genfluence with my coauthor, Katharine Mies, these
• 13:42
  - were the four items that really emerged. Number
• 13:44
  - one, context.
• 13:46
  - Here's what's happening out there. Because, see, the
• 13:48
  - reality is frontline employees don't get the benefit
• 13:52
  - of coming to a Becker's conference or an
• 13:54
  - American Hospital Association
• 13:55
  - conference and seeing the external environment.
• 13:58
  - So it's up to the leader to to
• 14:00
  - communicate the external environment. Here's what's happening out
• 14:03
  - there.
• 14:04
  - But more importantly,
• 14:06
  - here's what we're doing about it in here.
• 14:09
  - So folks on the front line are typically
• 14:11
  - head down, shoulders forward, delivering
• 14:14
  - exceptional care,
• 14:15
  - and and they might not always be as
• 14:17
  - closely attached to the strategy of the organization.
• 14:20
  - So it's really important that the leader says,
• 14:22
  - you know, here's here's what's happening out there,
• 14:24
  - but here's what's happening in here.
• 14:26
  - And and then we have to go sort
• 14:28
  - of cause and effect. Here's the impact. Here's
• 14:31
  - why we're doing what we're doing,
• 14:33
  - and here's how it'll make things better.
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  - And then you can begin to see that
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  - hope
• 14:39
  - light begin to shine.
• 14:41
  - And then four, progress. Sometimes we get so
• 14:44
  - much stuff done, we don't often pause and
• 14:46
  - celebrate,
• 14:47
  - or even worse, we don't pause and communicate.
• 14:50
  - Hey. Here's what we've already accomplished.
• 14:52
  - We've already made steps along the way. You
• 14:54
  - know, it's sort of like mountain climbers. You
• 14:56
  - know, they they don't wait till they get
• 14:57
  - to the top of the mountain to celebrate.
• 14:59
  - Heck, they they celebrate just getting to base
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  - camp
• 15:02
  - and then milestones along the way. So those
• 15:04
  - four elements, context,
• 15:06
  - action, impact, and progress,
• 15:08
  - we have found,
• 15:10
  - it enables a leader not to just fall
• 15:12
  - into toxic positivity. Oh, things are gonna always
• 15:15
  - be better.
• 15:16
  - But here's the reality of what's going on.
• 15:18
  - Here's what we're doing about it, and here's
• 15:20
  - what we've already here's what we've already seen.
• 15:22
  - So that work comes from Gallup. They get
• 15:25
  - full credit for the research. We we feature
• 15:27
  - this as a leadership skill
• 15:30
  - in our new book Genfluence,
• 15:32
  - and it just supports wholeheartedly
• 15:34
  - this whole notion of rewiring
• 15:36
  - that you mentioned a while ago. There is
• 15:39
  - not a lot of wholesale change that often
• 15:42
  - has to happen. A lot of times, it's
• 15:44
  - just the tweaking and fine tuning, and really
• 15:47
  - that applies really well to leader communication. I
• 15:49
  - don't need to change my style abundantly,
• 15:52
  - but I gotta make sure that I'm not
• 15:54
  - missing the the nuances, the finer
• 15:56
  - points when I communicate to the team. And
• 15:59
  - we tested this message with several kinds of
• 16:01
  - leadership organizations, and what we found most was,
• 16:04
  - first of all, they were relieved that this
• 16:06
  - wasn't just a warm, fuzzy skill that we
• 16:08
  - were trying to impart.
• 16:10
  - But really specific as we go back to
• 16:12
  - those new leaders that we talked about at
• 16:14
  - the beginning of the podcast today, if I'm
• 16:16
  - a new leader,
• 16:17
  - I might not have any idea how to
• 16:19
  - communicate hope. And so if we can be
• 16:22
  - really specific, really pragmatic,
• 16:24
  - there's a skill that a new leader can
• 16:26
  - tuck into their hip pocket and use anytime
• 16:28
  - they need to in their, their part of
• 16:30
  - the organization. Does that make sense?
• 16:32
  - Dan, yeah. No. I think it's I think
• 16:34
  - it's brilliant what you do. I I I
• 16:36
  - love the way
• 16:37
  - that you and your team
• 16:40
  - teach,
• 16:42
  - visit with people.
• 16:43
  - What what what always comes away from visiting
• 16:46
  - with Healthcare Plus Solutions Group, and just yourself
• 16:49
  - and Quint over the last few decades, quite
• 16:51
  - frankly, a couple decades is
• 16:52
  - the centeredness,
• 16:54
  - the the the caring of actually wanting to
• 16:57
  - help people lead and grow in their organizations.
• 17:00
  - So, Dan, for me, just fantastic and a
• 17:02
  - great pleasure to visit with you today on
• 17:04
  - the Becker's Healthcare podcast. Just remarkable work as
• 17:07
  - always. Thank you so much for joining us,
• 17:09
  - sir. Well, it's a pleasure. You know, sometimes
• 17:11
  - there's a there's an old saying, when the
• 17:13
  - student is ready, the teacher appears.
• 17:15
  - And so sometimes you just gotta be in
• 17:17
  - the right place to to be that teacher.
• 17:19
  - Scott, it's always a pleasure visiting with you.