Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / TOT Mom Casey Anthony 'Finds Love;' Married Man Convinced She’s Innocent

Transcript

TOT Mom Casey Anthony 'Finds Love;' Married Man Convinced She’s Innocent · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Taught mom Casey Anthony, did you really think she was
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: going away?
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: No way, tot Mom.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Casey Anthony finds love with a married man blowing up
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: here's twenty year marriage and guess what. He apparently is
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: convinced she's innocent, just like the jury in Florida. Good evening,
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: The infamous mother charged and acquitted in her two year
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: old daughter's death. Is she's stirring up trouble again?
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: Well that's an easy answer. Yes, she's stirring up trouble.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: I wonder what this guy's wife has to say about it.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: A married man twenty years in two boys. But it
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: didn't all start here. It didn't all start with her
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: convincing another since she's innocent, finding somebody else to foot
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: the bill for her lifestyle.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: This is where it started. Listen, there's something wrong.
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: I found my daughter's carts today and it's not like
• 1:11
  Speaker 4: there's been a dead body.
• 1:13
  Speaker 5: Okay, what is the three year old's name?
• 1:15
  Speaker 4: Kaylee c A Y L E. E.
• 1:17
  Speaker 5: Anthony, Kaylee Anthony, Yeah, okay, she white, black, her Hispanics
• 1:23
  Speaker 5: It's like, how long has she been missing for?
• 1:27
  Speaker 6: I have not seen her since the seventh of June?
• 1:32
  Speaker 7: What is her data?
• 1:33
  Speaker 4: Verse eight nine, two thousand, Oh God, you're free two
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: thousand and five.
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: True. Listen what true?
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: I still hate to hear that part of the Night
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: on One call where the grandmother Kelly's grandmother breaks down
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: and screams, George Kelly's missing. Okay, So what's top line
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: Casey Anthony doing during all this?
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: Listen?
• 2:10
  Speaker 5: Ago, Okay, I need I understand? Can you just can
• 2:18
  Speaker 5: you calm down for me for this cemitute? And so
• 2:20
  Speaker 5: I need even know what's going on. Okay, I'm gonna
• 2:22
  Speaker 5: chime out.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: And it goes on. It goes on. Now you hear
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: the grandmother.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: That's Cindy Anthony, and she and her husband, George, who
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: are very fine people. I'd like to report I've met
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: them and spoken to them in depth, and the world
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: saw them at their very worst.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: I wonder how they're responding to their daughter.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: She trash her dad like crazy because he had an affair,
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: and now she's shocked up with a married man twenty
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: years in the marriage.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: That's that's gone.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: That said, back to where the starter you heard Cindy
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: Anthony and his Derek's But listen when taught mom Casey
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: Anthony gets on the nine one one?
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: Is your Is your daughter there? Have song with them?
• 3:09
  Speaker 7: Is your daughter there?
• 3:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah? Can I speak with her? Do you mind if
• 3:14
  Speaker 5: I step with her? Thank you?
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: I called them two hours ago.
• 3:17
  Speaker 6: They haven't taught here. Finally, there is a very.
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: Problem, ma'am, ma'am.
• 3:27
  Speaker 6: Okay, they want to talk to you.
• 3:31
  Speaker 7: Question Hello, Hello, yes, hi, Well can you can you
• 3:36
  Speaker 7: tell me.
• 3:36
  Speaker 5: What's going on a little bit?
• 3:38
  Speaker 7: I'm sorry, can you tell me a little what's going on?
• 3:40
  Speaker 6: And my daughter's been received for the last thirty one
• 3:43
  Speaker 6: days and you know who has her? I know who
• 3:46
  Speaker 6: asked her. I've tried to contact her. I actually received
• 3:49
  Speaker 6: a phone call today now from a number that is
• 3:52
  Speaker 6: no wronger in service. I didn't get to speak to
• 3:55
  Speaker 6: my daughter for about a moment, about a minute.
• 3:58
  Speaker 5: Okay, did you guys call an important.
• 4:01
  Speaker 6: And yes, my mom did.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Got to speak to my daughter for about a minute.
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: What did you have a seance? Because Kelly, baby Kelly
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: is dead.
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: Do you hear taught mom lying through her teeth? Uh? Yeah,
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: I just got to speak to my daughter for about
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: a minute, and now this guy blows up a twenty
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: year marriage.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: For what a piece of that?
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: Okay, joining me an all star panel to make sense
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: of what we are hearing.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: It's just, you know, I wonder what the jury's thinking
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: right now. Steve Heiling.
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: Steve Helling joining me, Senior national news reporter at New
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: York Post. Author of Outrage, the Casey Anthony Story, author
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: of Tiger the Real Story.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: It goes on and on and on.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: But Steve Heling, it's I wonder what the jury's thinking
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: right now, because this is not just a flame with
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: a married man. It's the same modus operandi, method of operation.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: You lie, lie, lie, lie, lie to another person. I
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: mean analyze at Helling. First, she lied to her parents
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: that she had a job while she sit on the
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: sofa eating chips all day, while they pay for everything
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: for Kelly. She lies about the father of Kelly. People
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: still don't know who the father is. She lies to
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: her employers and coworkers. She lies to her friends, she
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: lies to her living she's living with him in a
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: bunch of roommates. That's a romantic situation to everyone. Then
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: lies to a jury. And remember this, Steve Helling, she
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: even lied to police, and everybody's believing her until she's
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: taking them to her job.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: And all this time she's been.
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: Wearing the uniform and wearing the id and going to work,
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: or the parents think so. She's even dressing up like
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: she's going to work at the theme park. They get
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: all the way there with her in the car. She
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: gets all the way to the door, she goes, Okay,
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: you got me. I haven't worked here in a long time,
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: and now she's lying to this guy.
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's the same mo. The jury's got to
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: feel like a big idiot.
• 6:20
  Speaker 8: Steve, Nothing that Casey pass can ever be taken at
• 6:22
  Speaker 8: faith value. You know, she doesn't care that he has
• 6:25
  Speaker 8: a wife, she doesn't care that he has kids. She
• 6:27
  Speaker 8: doesn't care any of that. It's all about her. It's
• 6:29
  Speaker 8: all about what she wants, It's all about what she needs.
• 6:32
  Speaker 8: That's how it's been for her entire life.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: Okay, Steve Hawling, I appreciate you going into that psychological analysis.
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: I have doctor Bethany Marshall for that. I'm asking you.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: About m oh method of operation, modus operandi. That is
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: how todd Mom escaped justice, that is how she lived
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: rent free, for so long.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: That is how she had her parents taking care of Kelly.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: All this.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: This is herm to just squeeze everything she can out
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: of people, lie her way through, and fake it till
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: she makes it.
• 7:09
  Speaker 8: That just shows you that she's able to say things
• 7:12
  Speaker 8: and just kind of worm her way in there, no
• 7:14
  Speaker 8: matter who it hurts, no matter who's in the way,
• 7:16
  Speaker 8: no matter what. And you know, she's very very good
• 7:19
  Speaker 8: at it. She just has those the words that she
• 7:22
  Speaker 8: needs to say.
• 7:23
  Speaker 9: You know.
• 7:23
  Speaker 8: He says that she has an intoxicating aura, which I
• 7:26
  Speaker 8: don't even know what that is.
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: Oh, please stop, please stop, please stop.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: This guy is blowing up a twenty year marriage because
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: tot Mom has an intoxicating aura.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: Is that what you just said?
• 7:40
  Speaker 8: That is exactly what I just said, Nancy, And that's
• 7:43
  Speaker 8: what That's what everybody around him says.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: Intoxicating.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: Now that's an interesting choice of words, because whenever I
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: want to find tot Mom, I just put out the
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: APB to all the local bars because she will be
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: there in a pair of hotpants.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: Having a shot. And I'm not judging. I'm not the
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: church lady. I don't care.
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: But after her daughter was murdered, rephrase after she killed
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: her daughter. I would have thought escaping life behind bars
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: would have made her out there she is on a
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: stripper pole at Fusion Bar for the hot body contest.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: I would think that she would dedicate her life to
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: good works. Well that ain't happening, guys.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Where did it all start? Well, as far as we know,
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: right here?
• 8:31
  Speaker 6: List Okay, So I've been a vehicle so on too, No,
• 8:34
  Speaker 6: this was my vehicle?
• 8:37
  Speaker 5: What a vehicle was?
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: So on?
• 8:38
  Speaker 6: You need ploniac sunfire?
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: Who have her?
• 8:41
  Speaker 10: Do?
• 8:42
  Speaker 5: A name?
• 8:43
  Speaker 6: Her name is Janevas Fernando's Doodallas.
• 8:47
  Speaker 5: Who is that?
• 8:48
  Speaker 6: Maybe she's been my nanny for about a year and
• 8:52
  Speaker 6: a half, for almost two years?
• 8:53
  Speaker 5: Why why are you calling now? Why didn't you call
• 8:55
  Speaker 5: it any one days ago?
• 8:56
  Speaker 6: I've been looking for her and have gone through other
• 9:00
  Speaker 6: resources to try to find her, which is stupid.
• 9:04
  Speaker 5: Okay, can you can you give me the name of
• 9:05
  Speaker 5: the the nanny again?
• 9:07
  Speaker 6: Like spell it out for me, wineva V n A
• 9:11
  Speaker 6: I E A last name Fernandez, Fernandez hyphen Gonzales.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: I love the way that she lies through this. She's
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: so calm.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: Her mother, Kelly Anthony's grandmother, Sandy, who supported her and
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: took care of her and.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: Treated her like her own child.
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: The grandma's is hysterical and she is lying so well
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: she can spell this fake person. This person does not
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: even exist. Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez.
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: And she actually says, yes, that's with a hyphen. It's
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: Zenaida z and I d a.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: Her daughter is quote missing last name Fernandez hyphen Gonzales.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: You know, Raymond Judice with me, renowned criminal defense attorney
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: located in the Atlanta jurisdiction, but practices everywhere.
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: Judice, It's just the criminals do.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: The same thing over and over and over. How many
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: times were you in court with me and somebody had
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: have a bond, fourth tour and I'd say, just go
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: home to his mom's house.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: He's under the bed.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: If you go, we'll be able to plead him not
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: guilty and go to trio in about two hours. Same thing,
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: same thing. Here, she's doing the same thing using another man.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: I might add another man. Just milk them till they're dry.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: It's happening all over again. Does the jury ever stop
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: and think, wow, I aft up.
• 10:47
  Speaker 11: Look at the bottom of that form that the jury
• 10:50
  Speaker 11: handed back many years ago. It said, we the jury
• 10:54
  Speaker 11: find casey Anthony not guilty. And if this guy wants
• 10:58
  Speaker 11: to believe that that's the true, he's entitled to do so.
• 11:01
  Speaker 11: He's a grown man.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: Did I not just say it's men. It's like somehow
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: she gets them of the hook and they believe everything.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: And her mother, of course, you know Raymonds, you to Jay,
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: I believe everything my children tell me, but I trust
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: and then confirm.
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: Remember that. But here she has this unique ability.
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: And I know doctor Bethany Marshall is chomping at the bit.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: But let me go to Rob Dick.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: This is Top Mom Casey Anthony's former bodyguard, a bounty hunter,
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: private investigator. An interesting observation was made when Top Mom
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Casey Anthony first got out of jail. And now this
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: is when she was charged with some minor offense obstructing
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: justice or welfare of a.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Child something like that.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: She got out on bond and then was later arrested
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: from her her but the first the things she said
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: when she got on on bond, the first time she
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: went home, okay, remember her daughter still missing. Her parents
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: have like cement blocks in their stomach. They're so upset,
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: walks in the door and says was for supper?
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Because you know, Rob Dick, but my fiance was murdered.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: I couldn't eat. I lost down to eighty nine pounds.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: I couldn't think. I couldn't hear music. I could hear
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: the clock tick in our home.
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: My mother had to stop all the clocks because they're ticking.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: Just drove me crazy because Keith was dead and nothing
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: should go forward.
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: That's what it felt like.
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: And she waltzes in and says, hey, hey, mom, what's
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: for supper?
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: Supper my rear end? What were your observations, robbed Dick.
• 12:52
  Speaker 10: Well, that was a critical moment because that was the
• 12:54
  Speaker 10: exact moment.
• 12:55
  Speaker 12: That we knew it was bad.
• 12:57
  Speaker 10: I mean, you have to understand the timing of that.
• 12:59
  Speaker 10: She had been missing for thirty one days and then
• 13:03
  Speaker 10: been in custody for thirty days, so she's out of
• 13:06
  Speaker 10: the public eye, she's in the jail, she has no
• 13:09
  Speaker 10: way to look for her daughter or do anything. And
• 13:12
  Speaker 10: the second she's out and in front of her parents,
• 13:14
  Speaker 10: I mean, it should have been you know, where are
• 13:16
  Speaker 10: we at, what's the latest tip? Where can we find something?
• 13:19
  Speaker 10: You know, what are we doing? Screaming and nothing? It
• 13:22
  Speaker 10: was like, hey, I'm here, let's get the party started.
• 13:27
  Speaker 10: It was bad at that point.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: Joining me also in addition to Rob Dick, Girardo Bloise,
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: former forensic investigator in the Casey Anthony case, testified in
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: the murder trial, president of G and JAY Forensics and
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: author of CSI, the Casey Anthony child murder Case.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: Girardo, thank you for being with us.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: I know that you focus on the forensics, but I'd
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: like to hear your analysis of what's happening right now.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: Girardo, Well, it.
• 13:59
  Speaker 13: Is said that happened at this time, and thank you
• 14:01
  Speaker 13: for having me in your program. In relationship with this
• 14:07
  Speaker 13: new relationship that Casey has. Well, Casey is a pathological liar,
• 14:15
  Speaker 13: and she's a selfish person, and she always thinks about herself,
• 14:20
  Speaker 13: and she wants to leave the crazy life without responsibility.
• 14:24
  Speaker 13: And right now I believe that Casey is one of
• 14:29
  Speaker 13: those cold blood human beings as well as a sociopath,
• 14:35
  Speaker 13: and it's a sick liar.
• 14:37
  Speaker 14: I remember being asked about this at the very beginning,
• 14:40
  Speaker 14: when I talked about walking up to that car and
• 14:41
  Speaker 14: getting about three feet away from it, and the smell
• 14:44
  Speaker 14: that emanated from that car. I could smell it three
• 14:46
  Speaker 14: feet away on the passenger side when I opened up
• 14:50
  Speaker 14: that card tour. Yeah, it smelled like decomposition, human decomposition.
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: Something wrong. My dad's car would go not a bad
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: day the clock.
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: Okay, what is the three year old's name?
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: Cayley c A Y l E E Anthony.
• 15:09
  Speaker 5: Hailey Anthony? Yes, okay, she white? Black? Her Hispanics? Who's white?
• 15:15
  Speaker 7: How long has she been missing for?
• 15:17
  Speaker 5: I have not seen her.
• 15:18
  Speaker 6: Since the seventh of June.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: True listen, True listen a month ago.
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: More bad behavior from the party mom who was out
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: on the town while her toddler daughter was missing.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Todd Mom back in the headlines again, surprised.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: No, this guy blown up a twenty year marriage to
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: be with top mom Casey Anthony because of her quote
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: intoxicating aura. But this isn't the first man that fail
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: for her b s. Listen our friends A and A.
• 15:57
  Speaker 7: Did you knowingly conceal Killy's wearing?
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: No?
• 16:03
  Speaker 10: Okay, so you're struggling with that one a little bit.
• 16:05
  Speaker 7: Tell me why?
• 16:07
  Speaker 14: Mean it's because I was so close to our house?
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, as she was pound right.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: Steve Helling joining US senior national needs reporter in New
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: York Post, author of outrage the Casey Anthony story Steve Helling.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: From what I've learned, this guy, this married man, really
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: believes she's innocent because they're at a bar, her natural habitat,
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: not judging, don't care. But it just reminds me that
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: right before it all came out that Kelly was actually dead,
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: I've observed surveillance video at a store where top Mom's
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: in there getting case after case after case of beer.
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: Oh Anson, push up, bras, got to have that to
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: go your beer. But that said, has he not seen
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: this a and he special? Does he not see any
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: of the testimony at trial?
• 17:01
  Speaker 11: Hiling?
• 17:01
  Speaker 8: I don't know if he thought or not, but he
• 17:03
  Speaker 8: sure didn't pay attention to it if he watched it,
• 17:06
  Speaker 8: because you don't have to watch very much about Casey
• 17:09
  Speaker 8: Anthony to know what she did. And if he thinks
• 17:11
  Speaker 8: that she's innocent of everything and she was just you know,
• 17:15
  Speaker 8: this poor innocent girl back then, then he hasn't been
• 17:18
  Speaker 8: paying attention. But I don't think he cares Nancy. He
• 17:21
  Speaker 8: doesn't care. He does not care if she's innocent, He
• 17:24
  Speaker 8: does not care if she's guilty. He doesn't care. He
• 17:26
  Speaker 8: just wants to get with Casey Anthony.
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: Okay, you know what.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: George Anthony is hyperventilating and getting close to vomiting during
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: a polygraph because he's visualizing Cally's burial site.
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: Listen, how did you can seal her whereabouts that I
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: conceal her wearabouts?
• 17:51
  Speaker 15: I do not know where she was at?
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: Okay?
• 17:53
  Speaker 15: So why are you struggling with that?
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: From our friends at A and A and George Anthony,
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: who she threw under the bus, isn't the only one
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: that suffered.
• 18:04
  Speaker 15: Listen, I'm sorry, I take my hand till I'm sorry
• 18:23
  Speaker 15: to depress. Please, I'll take on with you.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: We're going to get through this.
• 18:31
  Speaker 14: You want to go to the hospital, need to breathe.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: From our friends at A and E. And it just
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: goes on and on and on.
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: You think George and Cindy are over this, They'll never
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: be over what happened to little Kelly? Read you to
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: Jay renown criminal defense attorney. You've tried a lot of cases.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: Did you notice that Cindy Anthony says, I'm one per
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: convinced she tot mom knows what happened. Even now, even now,
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: they can't bring themselves to say.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: She killed her.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: I know she killed her. Now they still can't say it.
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: They just say, she knows what happened.
• 19:21
  Speaker 11: It's hard to fault parents who loved their daughter at
• 19:26
  Speaker 11: some level. For those words to come out of their mouth.
• 19:30
  Speaker 11: Would just, I can imagine, be so painful, and I
• 19:33
  Speaker 11: would assume and doctor Marshall can obviously address this better.
• 19:37
  Speaker 11: But they've had to live with this for all these years,
• 19:41
  Speaker 11: and they've had to develop their coping mechanisms and their
• 19:44
  Speaker 11: language and their message to allow them to get by.
• 19:48
  Speaker 11: But again, this guy in Tennessee, he ought to look
• 19:51
  Speaker 11: at what Casey put her own parents through, let alone
• 19:55
  Speaker 11: what she did to her child before he goes any further.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: And joining us.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Renowned psychoanalyst out of Beverly Hills, author of deal Breaker.
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: You can see her now on Peacock Dr Bethany Marshall.
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany, Look, I'm just a late person. I'm just
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: a trial lawyer. Just hit me because I don't even
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: know where to start with this.
• 20:18
  Speaker 9: And Nancy, this whole situation is so tragic. Let's remember
• 20:21
  Speaker 9: that this whole saga with Casey and Kaylee began when
• 20:24
  Speaker 9: Cindy Anthony went to see a therapist about her daughter's
• 20:28
  Speaker 9: lack of maternal bonding towards the granddaughter, and the therapist said,
• 20:33
  Speaker 9: I think you need to get Casey to take more responsibility.
• 20:37
  Speaker 9: It's when Cindy encouraged Casey or forced Casey to take
• 20:42
  Speaker 9: responsibility that Casey just killed her daughter. So let's put
• 20:45
  Speaker 9: that in context and hold on to the fact that
• 20:48
  Speaker 9: Casey is not likely to have responsibility in any relationship
• 20:53
  Speaker 9: if she didn't have it with her own daughter.
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: I need to find you.
• 21:00
  Speaker 5: Your daughter admitted that your the baby is where, but you.
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: Kind of took a month together that my daughter's been
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: looking for. I told you my daughter was no since
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: for a month. I just found her together. But I
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: can't find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me, but
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: she's been trying to find for her herself. There's something wrong.
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: I found my daughter's car today and it's not like
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: theirs been a bread battery and the car.
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: Okay, what is the three year old's name?
• 21:23
  Speaker 4: Kaylee?
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: C A Y L E E.
• 21:26
  Speaker 6: Anthony?
• 21:27
  Speaker 5: Is your Is your daughter there? I wind have phe
• 21:30
  Speaker 5: with them? Is your daughter there? Yeah? Can I speak
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: with her? Do you wind it my secret her? Thank you?
• 21:37
  Speaker 6: I called them two hours ago. May I haven't gotten here?
• 21:40
  Speaker 7: Hey, finally and there is a very month ago, ma'am, ma'am.
• 21:50
  Speaker 5: They want to.
• 21:50
  Speaker 7: Watch Hello, Hello, yes, hi, we can you? Can you
• 21:57
  Speaker 7: tell you a phone on a little bit?
• 21:59
  Speaker 5: I'm so, can you tell me a little bit? What's
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: going on?
• 22:02
  Speaker 6: My daughter's been received for the last thirty one days
• 22:05
  Speaker 6: and you know who has her? I know who answer
• 22:08
  Speaker 6: I've tried to contact her. I actually received the phone
• 22:11
  Speaker 6: call today now from a number of the business wronger
• 22:14
  Speaker 6: in service. I did get to speak to my daughter
• 22:17
  Speaker 6: for a bottom moments about a minute.
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: Okay, did you guys call and report a vehicle?
• 22:21
  Speaker 15: So on?
• 22:23
  Speaker 6: And yes, my mom did.
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: Joining us Steve Helling and senior national needs reporter with
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: a New York Post and author of Outrage to Casey
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: Anthony's story, what twiggered your story?
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: Why do you care if tom mom's sleeping with a
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: married guy?
• 22:39
  Speaker 8: Well, you know, I got to give certainly a lot
• 22:41
  Speaker 8: of credit to Rob Dick, who's on our panel today.
• 22:44
  Speaker 8: He knew about it. And you know the thing is
• 22:47
  Speaker 8: that when you start hearing all these things that she
• 22:50
  Speaker 8: does and this wake of destruction that she's been leaving
• 22:53
  Speaker 8: behind her now for fifteen years or sixteen years, you know,
• 22:57
  Speaker 8: you start, you start feeling. It's newsworthy, it's something that
• 23:03
  Speaker 8: is interesting if nothing else. You know, I heard from
• 23:07
  Speaker 8: a couple women who have been talking to this guy
• 23:10
  Speaker 8: to Tyson and now don't want to date him anymore
• 23:14
  Speaker 8: because he's dating Casey Anthony. It's a public service at
• 23:18
  Speaker 8: this point. You need to know what she's up to.
• 23:20
  Speaker 8: You need to know what she's doing.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: So you're basically in it for altruistic reasons and you
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: consider it a psa public service announcement.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: Okay, I didn't see that coming.
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: I give you all the credit for pulling that one
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: out of your well pocket.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: Rob Dick joining me Casey Anthony's former.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: Bodyguard, bounty hunter, private investigator, extraordinary.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: How did you find her?
• 23:43
  Speaker 10: Well, I'd gotten a tip that she was in Tennessee
• 23:45
  Speaker 10: when I was actually there at a conference, and somebody
• 23:49
  Speaker 10: could give me a tip and watch your back.
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: What conference?
• 23:52
  Speaker 10: It was Crime Con twenty twenty four. I was there.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: I had no idea that I was just so close
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: to top Mom Anthony.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: So you get a tip and then what happens.
• 24:02
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I just happened to look her up to see
• 24:04
  Speaker 10: and then it just kind of all came out from
• 24:06
  Speaker 10: there and unfolded with you know, her living with this
• 24:10
  Speaker 10: tyson and looked at that and tried to figure out, well,
• 24:14
  Speaker 10: who's this guy? And then they had both come from
• 24:17
  Speaker 10: West Palm so I just kind of all fell together
• 24:19
  Speaker 10: with him and his wife moving to Murphy's Bruro and
• 24:23
  Speaker 10: then her following him out there, and then next thing
• 24:26
  Speaker 10: you know, they both have an apartment together.
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: So she basically followed this guy from Florida. Okay, speaking
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: of a quiet life, listen.
• 24:34
  Speaker 16: A recent article on the life of Casey Anthony claims
• 24:36
  Speaker 16: the infamous tot Mom leads a solitary life these days.
• 24:40
  Speaker 16: In the Peacock series, Anthony reveals she is working as
• 24:43
  Speaker 16: a research assistant for Patrick McKenna, the lead investigator for
• 24:46
  Speaker 16: her defense team at trial, and has been on the
• 24:48
  Speaker 16: job for the last ten plus years, leading a quiet
• 24:51
  Speaker 16: life in West Palm Beach, Florida. But now news is
• 24:54
  Speaker 16: breaking that Casey Anthony is having an affair with a
• 24:57
  Speaker 16: married man and is relocating to Tennessee.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: Okay, Well, a solitary life, it doesn't look solitary to me.
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: The notorious top Mom is dating a father of two.
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: She allegedly blew up a twenty two year old marriage
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: to get him.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, very very curious.
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: Gerardo Bloise joining me, former forensic investigator in the murder case,
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: I'm curious about the forensic evidence you found in top
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: mom casey Anthony's car explained.
• 25:32
  Speaker 13: Yeah, in July sixteen, two thousand eight, I was working
• 25:34
  Speaker 13: at the sheriff's office and one of the detective called
• 25:37
  Speaker 13: me that they have a vehicle to be processed for
• 25:40
  Speaker 13: forensics analysis, and they only say to me that was
• 25:46
  Speaker 13: related to a missing child. So I focused my investigation
• 25:51
  Speaker 13: of the vehicle, and I'm always looking for for DNA,
• 25:55
  Speaker 13: any kind of blood, body fluids, and especially heirs. And
• 25:58
  Speaker 13: also when I start to photograph the vehicle, of the
• 26:02
  Speaker 13: seal of the vehicle and they went open the driver's side,
• 26:06
  Speaker 13: a smell immediately decomposition of a human. Decomposition's author. So
• 26:11
  Speaker 13: I immediately called the detective say hey, look, I have
• 26:14
  Speaker 13: suspicions of out playing this case. And after that, I
• 26:19
  Speaker 13: recovered some thirteen years from the trunk. One of them
• 26:24
  Speaker 13: was positive for mitochondry DNA. That the micro contate DNA
• 26:29
  Speaker 13: came from the mother's side. So those two species of
• 26:32
  Speaker 13: evidence are the early examples that we call it the
• 26:35
  Speaker 13: front the trunk. Because we have two questions in order
• 26:39
  Speaker 13: to prove that that smele came from a decomposed body.
• 26:43
  Speaker 13: That was a challenge. The second challenge was that the
• 26:46
  Speaker 13: one of those hair came from Kayley and the key
• 26:50
  Speaker 13: was in the trunk, and both analysis from the Tennessee
• 26:54
  Speaker 13: lab came with the chemicals compound of a decomposed smell,
• 26:59
  Speaker 13: and the FBI lab came with a positive DNA microconduct
• 27:03
  Speaker 13: from the mother's side, which is Q twelve that came
• 27:06
  Speaker 13: positive for DNA.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: Of yeah, you're right, all right, erardau Bloise.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: Because the hair could have only come from three people.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: That would be Cindy Anthony, top Mom, Casey Anthony, or
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: baby Kelly. It wasn't Cindy's because Cindy's hair was treated blonde.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: It wasn't top Mom's because her hair also is chemically treated,
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: which means it could only be one person in the world,
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: and that is Kelly Anthony. So top Mom's car smelled
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: like a dead body in the trunk, and in the
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: trunk from where the smell emanated.
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: Is her child's hair. She had her child in the
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: trunk of her car.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: So doctor Bethany Marshall we have Gerardo Bloise on today
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: for a very special reason as a reality check to
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: what really happened. And this guy he wants to be
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: with todt Mont Casey Anthony.
• 28:13
  Speaker 9: Oh, Nancy, you know he has as serious a corruption
• 28:17
  Speaker 9: of conscience as she does. Tyson moved his wife out
• 28:22
  Speaker 9: to Tennessee while he was already having an affair with Casey.
• 28:27
  Speaker 9: What does that tell you about him? It tells you
• 28:29
  Speaker 9: that he's evil too. He is not detached, He doesn't
• 28:32
  Speaker 9: care about his loved ones. He is willing to blow
• 28:35
  Speaker 9: things up. As you said earlier, Again, people have affairs
• 28:38
  Speaker 9: not because they're in love with the other person, but
• 28:41
  Speaker 9: because they're in love with how that other person makes
• 28:44
  Speaker 9: them feel, I mean, think about it. So she paths
• 28:46
  Speaker 9: like Casey Anthony. They come across as charming, outgoing, at
• 28:51
  Speaker 9: the center of things, and so they charm people into thinking,
• 28:55
  Speaker 9: lull people into thinking that they're sort of at the
• 28:58
  Speaker 9: pinnacle of things, at the center of things. So he
• 29:00
  Speaker 9: finds that very gratifying. He's not really putting together in
• 29:04
  Speaker 9: his mind the gravity of the crime with who he's
• 29:08
  Speaker 9: sleeping next to. And we've seen this in prison studies
• 29:11
  Speaker 9: with women who visit men in jail. They'll be in
• 29:14
  Speaker 9: love with a man, but they'll claim not to know
• 29:17
  Speaker 9: the nature of the crime, so they refuse to put
• 29:19
  Speaker 9: their thoughts together about it.
• 29:21
  Speaker 12: In a recent BuzzFeed News article, the showrunner for Where
• 29:24
  Speaker 12: the Truth Lies, Alexandra Dean, is quoted as saying Casey
• 29:27
  Speaker 12: Anthony has a small life with a small circle of
• 29:30
  Speaker 12: friends and loved ones. Dean says Casey still talks to
• 29:33
  Speaker 12: her brother and her mother, but not that often. Dean says,
• 29:36
  Speaker 12: they communicate, but I wouldn't call the relationship close. After
• 29:40
  Speaker 12: accusing her father, George, of sexually abusing her in her
• 29:44
  Speaker 12: youth and claiming he killed Kaylee to cover up his
• 29:47
  Speaker 12: abuse of her, Casey and George Anthony don't communicate with
• 29:50
  Speaker 12: one another.
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: She doesn't care if he's married or not, says a
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: friend of Casey Anthony. The top Mom saying she's quote
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: living the life I want.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: And again, I'm not the church lady.
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: I don't care who sleeps with who, who does what,
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: as long as it's not a felony. Herm is the same,
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: her modus operandi, method of operation, same thing all over again.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: Go from one man to the next to the next
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: to the next exclusion her mother.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: She did to her mother.
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: Too, Squeeze everything you can out of them, lie through
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: your teeth to get what you want, and then move
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: on with me.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: An all star panel.
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: To make sense of what we know right now, first,
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: take a listen to Holden Zapple crime online dot Com.
• 30:48
  Speaker 16: In her most recent move Casey Anthony has uprooted her
• 30:50
  Speaker 16: life in Florida to be with her new man in Tennessee,
• 30:53
  Speaker 16: who is married for twenty two years and has two
• 30:56
  Speaker 16: young adult sons. One of Anthony's friends tells the New
• 30:59
  Speaker 16: York Posts once accused murderer doesn't care if he's married
• 31:03
  Speaker 16: or not, saying all she knows is that he makes
• 31:06
  Speaker 16: her feel good and she likes that. She was willing
• 31:09
  Speaker 16: to follow him to Tennessee. She sees a future with him.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, ronoun psychoalyst, did I just hear the
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: words she uprooted her life?
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: What life? I mean? The no job, no anything up route?
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: What this is?
• 31:24
  Speaker 9: One of the core features of sociopathy is that the
• 31:27
  Speaker 9: person wants to suck the life out of everyone around them.
• 31:32
  Speaker 9: That's her only most She doesn't have time to go
• 31:34
  Speaker 9: to the library, get a degree, read a book, make friends.
• 31:38
  Speaker 9: She is taking advantage of everyone around her. She will
• 31:42
  Speaker 9: take advantage of Tyson too, probably as much as he
• 31:45
  Speaker 9: is taking advantage of her.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: You know, Raymond Judice, did you hear earlier that she's
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: portrayed of having a quote small life and a quote
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: solitary life. What this sounds like a bond or a
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: sentencing hearing where the lawyer just drones on and on
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: and on about how awesome their client.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: You'd think it was a nun appraised or a virgin.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: It ain't.
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, she is not at home tonight where the doors
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: locked and the shades pull sipping hot co co, reading
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: more and peace. Okay, that's not what's happening. So the
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: way that criminal defendants can change, they're like chameleons, and
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: they can't present in a way.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: That is entirely different than what they really are.
• 32:35
  Speaker 11: They're like water flowing down the side of a mountain.
• 32:37
  Speaker 13: Nancy.
• 32:37
  Speaker 11: If they hit a rock, they go around it. When
• 32:39
  Speaker 11: they come to the tree route, they go under it.
• 32:41
  Speaker 11: They adapt, they learn. I've had many clients that I
• 32:46
  Speaker 11: would say to them, you know, if you've just taken
• 32:48
  Speaker 11: the time to apply all of your scheming and your
• 32:51
  Speaker 11: manipulation and your energy to getting a college degree or
• 32:55
  Speaker 11: opening a business, you'd probably be very successful in their
• 32:58
  Speaker 11: own weird way. Some criminals are absolutely brilliant, and I
• 33:05
  Speaker 11: think she is convinced Casey Anthony is convinced that she is.
• 33:08
  Speaker 11: But she is consistently rewarded. She never pays the consequences
• 33:13
  Speaker 11: as everybody's pointed out for her manipulative behavior. I want
• 33:17
  Speaker 11: to one quick legal thing. Should there be a divorce
• 33:20
  Speaker 11: in a state of Tennessee, the infidelity of this gentleman,
• 33:25
  Speaker 11: his wife is going to be compensated with alimony and
• 33:29
  Speaker 11: any resources from the family assets that he uses to
• 33:35
  Speaker 11: party with Kathy Antony, take her out, vacations, hotels, gifts
• 33:39
  Speaker 11: that can be given to the wife in a proportionate
• 33:43
  Speaker 11: financial manner. Unfortunately, Tennessee does not have the old alienation
• 33:48
  Speaker 11: of affections lawsuit. A handful of states still have that
• 33:52
  Speaker 11: that allow a spouse to sue the intervening boyfriend girlfriends alienation.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Does Florida have it? Alienation of effections?
• 34:02
  Speaker 7: It?
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: Does Florida have that?
• 34:04
  Speaker 11: No Florida North Tennessee have it. Very few states have anymore.
• 34:07
  Speaker 17: I just looked it goes back because there have been
• 34:09
  Speaker 17: major cases where the mistress or the lover was sued
• 34:15
  Speaker 17: and had actions brought against them for alienation of affections.
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: You know, I'm just thinking, you know a lot of
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: people put irreconcilable differences.
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: She's just gonna write tot mom, blew up my life.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to this.
• 34:30
  Speaker 12: The now thirty eight year old tot mom meets her
• 34:32
  Speaker 12: latest conquest at the South Florida gym where they both
• 34:35
  Speaker 12: work out. Tyson Ray Rhoads, an engineer for an aerospace company,
• 34:39
  Speaker 12: and his wife of twenty two years, moved from South
• 34:42
  Speaker 12: Florida to Tennessee at the beginning of the year. Casey,
• 34:45
  Speaker 12: Anthony and Rhodes have been spotted together at n upscale
• 34:47
  Speaker 12: Tennessee apartment complex getting into roads truck, each wearing workout clothes.
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: The infamous mother charged and acquitted in her year old
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: daughter's death. Is she's stirring up trouble again?
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: Steve Helling joining us from the New York Post. I
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: understand that she's living in a luxury apartment near the family.
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: Home where I guess the wife is still living. Who's
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: paying for that?
• 35:19
  Speaker 8: Well, you know, we don't see the records, but I
• 35:21
  Speaker 8: can tell you that he was part of her finding
• 35:24
  Speaker 8: this place and knowing that she doesn't make a whole
• 35:27
  Speaker 8: lot of money. I don't know how she can afford
• 35:29
  Speaker 8: it without his help. It doesn't make any sense.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: Are you telling me Tonom has a job?
• 35:33
  Speaker 8: Well, okay, we'll put job in quotation marks. She she
• 35:38
  Speaker 8: does research work remotely for her for her former private investigator.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: Why are you actually saying that with a straight face?
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: She does what remotely?
• 35:49
  Speaker 8: I'm trying, experiency, I'm trying. That's what she has always
• 35:54
  Speaker 8: said is what she does for a living. I don't
• 35:56
  Speaker 8: know how she's made.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: She was a photographer.
• 35:59
  Speaker 8: Oh yeah, well she had case photography in South Florida
• 36:02
  Speaker 8: that you know. She never even filed the paperwork to
• 36:05
  Speaker 8: keep it going for a second.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sorry, you're making my head hurt.
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: So all right, all right, okay, working remotely taking pictures?
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: So no job, got it. You know what.
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: Amazes me about this, It's just the same thing over
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: and over. And you know, Raymond again, you know, I
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: don't give a flying fig who sleeps with who or
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: what they do.
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: Don't care.
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: But what disturbs me is that over and over we
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: see criminal defense in this case of killer have the
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: same pattern. And at some point you'd think it would
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: break right, that the enablers would fall away, but they don't.
• 36:47
  Speaker 18: People just keep getting used and used and used. And
• 36:51
  Speaker 18: it's what happened then and it's what's happening now. And
• 36:55
  Speaker 18: I find it incredibly curious. It's like I'm looking at,
• 37:01
  Speaker 18: you know, a tarantula or a poisonous snake in a
• 37:04
  Speaker 18: glass box.
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: I don't understand how it works. How does she keep
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: doing it right?
• 37:11
  Speaker 11: And not only does she find the weak link, but
• 37:15
  Speaker 11: here's a fellow that marriage, healthy children, assumably a good job,
• 37:21
  Speaker 11: a family, reputation in his community, and no offense to Steve.
• 37:26
  Speaker 11: But this gentleman is now in the New York Post
• 37:28
  Speaker 11: link to Casey Anthony. I mean, there's got to be
• 37:31
  Speaker 11: somebody else to date, you know, go to the church,
• 37:35
  Speaker 11: join a club. There are other nice people out there
• 37:38
  Speaker 11: that But you know, I worked for an old country
• 37:41
  Speaker 11: lawyer when I was a baby lawyer, and he had
• 37:42
  Speaker 11: a great expression and it went like this water finds
• 37:46
  Speaker 11: its own level.
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: Doctor Anthony Marshall helped me out here. Again. I'm not
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: worried about this guy.
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: He's old enough to know better and what judu Ja
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: just said about water seeking its own level. But I
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: somehow doubt that he has ever been charged with murder.
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: I still don't understand the fascination.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, ladies out there, men out there, when you
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: find somebody's been charged with even if they escaped murder charges,
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: please run. The other way is if you had seen
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: a monster.
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: I still don't understand this attraction.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: And the whole reason that we're discussing this today is
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: not because she's sleeping with a married man who cares.
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: That's his problem and his wife's problem, but it's the
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: fact that criminals continue.
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: They're like vampire or sucking the blood out of innocent victims.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: And I just don't get the attraction.
• 38:37
  Speaker 9: Yes they do, Nancy, but sometimes they find somebody just
• 38:41
  Speaker 9: like them. And I think we're being too easy on
• 38:43
  Speaker 9: this guy. I mean, he has blown up a twenty
• 38:46
  Speaker 9: two your marriage. He is with the very infamous person
• 38:50
  Speaker 9: who's going to have an impact on his two sons lives.
• 38:52
  Speaker 9: They're going to read about it in the news. He
• 38:55
  Speaker 9: has to ignore that in order to be with her.
• 38:57
  Speaker 9: And I don't think she's powerful enough to manipulate a
• 39:01
  Speaker 9: man with a wife and two children into thinking something
• 39:04
  Speaker 9: that he already doesn't want to think. And at the
• 39:07
  Speaker 9: beginning of a relationship, Nancy, two people usually idealize each
• 39:11
  Speaker 9: other for the first six or seven months. That's how
• 39:14
  Speaker 9: relationships get started. They don't see the flaw in the
• 39:17
  Speaker 9: other person. In fact, they see the other person as
• 39:20
  Speaker 9: having the potential to meet the unmet needs that they
• 39:24
  Speaker 9: had from the relationship before. So let's say, if he
• 39:27
  Speaker 9: feels that his relationship is devitalized or not that exciting
• 39:30
  Speaker 9: or blah blah blah, he's going to see Casey of
• 39:33
  Speaker 9: Anthony as having the potential to fill that need for him. However,
• 39:38
  Speaker 9: within six or seven months, all the idealization will drop
• 39:41
  Speaker 9: away and he'll have to see her for who she
• 39:43
  Speaker 9: truly is.
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: I don't care about their moral issues.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: I'm interested in this from a criminal law point of view.
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: And another thing you mentioned is two children their adult sons.
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: Once you have children, I think part of your duty
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: is that you behave in a way you want them
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: to behave. I mean, the people that I want to
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: impress the most are John, David and Lucy, and that's
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: who I want to impress. And I just wonder how
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: this affects his adult children. I mean, I already know
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: how it's affected his wife. But second first same as
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: the first. Top mom Kasey n added acid. Nancy Gray
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: signing off goodbye friend,