Latest / The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast / Episode 285. CO2 Experts: Transitioning to CO2 as a Service Technician Q & A with Andrew Freeburg

Transcript

Episode 285. CO2 Experts: Transitioning to CO2 as a Service Technician Q & A with Andrew Freeburg · The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast

• 0:00
  Andrew: The thing about CO2 that I really like is A lot of it's programmable, so I, I guess I'm kind of lazy because I really like going onto the computer and looking at every single case and every single component.
• 0:00
  And as long as I know what it should be, I know it's good. With higher pressures, I mean, I'm guilty of it too. I was nervous but after you get, thinking about it, this isn't the most pressure that I've actually dealt with,
• 0:00
  Just knowing that just made me feel a lot more comfortable with Working with co2.
• 0:01
  Just knowing that just made me feel a lot more comfortable with Working with co2.
• 0:01
  Trevor: So this week we're going to be doing a Q& A session. Hopefully some of you have some questions. Or, or solutions you're looking for help troubleshooting on. This is what refrigeration mentors all about. And CO2 experts live is really to bring you as much value as possible, bring you the knowledge on CO2.
• 0:01
  It's continuing to grow has been saying for two or three years. And we're, I'm seeing just a fast track of CO2 installs, startups. People transitioning it. I just had a conversation with a company in New York that I'm doing tons of training for. And they were like, Trevor, we got to prepare, starting to prepare my guys and getting them in my, our training programs, CO2 training programs from the intros to the service and maintenance to control programs, and just, we're starting to continue to roll out because this is the, the journey you start planning now and preparing.
• 0:02
  It's continuing to grow has been saying for two or three years. And we're, I'm seeing just a fast track of CO2 installs, startups. People transitioning it. I just had a conversation with a company in New York that I'm doing tons of training for. And they were like, Trevor, we got to prepare, starting to prepare my guys and getting them in my, our training programs, CO2 training programs from the intros to the service and maintenance to control programs, and just, we're starting to continue to roll out because this is the, the journey you start planning now and preparing.
• 0:02
  So when you get up to that equipment, we know. You need the hands on, you need it. But if you're working on supermarket refrigeration now with 404 or 448 or any, any refrigerant. That transition is not as difficult. It's just, you have to learn some of the theory side and cause this is what Andrew's doing.
• 0:02
  Andrew is crushing it out there. He's actively looking for CO2 system. He is actually changing locations so he can work on more CO2. And this is. What's huge about Andrew, he's, he's willing to put the work in and he's willing to make the difference to progress his career. So Andrew, welcome. How you doing brother?
• 0:02
  Andrew: Good. Good. Yeah. I'm super excited about that. I mean, I am changing locations as you know but yeah, I want, I want more CO2 the thing about CO2 that I really like is A lot of it's programmable, so I, I guess I'm kind of lazy because I really like going onto the computer and looking at every single case and every single component.
• 0:03
  Andrew: Good. Good. Yeah. I'm super excited about that. I mean, I am changing locations as you know but yeah, I want, I want more CO2 the thing about CO2 that I really like is A lot of it's programmable, so I, I guess I'm kind of lazy because I really like going onto the computer and looking at every single case and every single component.
• 0:03
  And as long as I know what it should be, I know it's good. It's when the moment becomes where, well, maybe that's a little bit weird. That shouldn't be open that much. That's when I would actually go to that device per se, and, and figure out what is causing maybe why that's open more than it should, or, or closed, or, you know, anyways.
• 0:03
  That's, that's one of the big reasons why I like CO2. And then, of course, the different challenges that it does bring. With higher pressures, everybody, I mean, I'm guilty of it too. I was I was nervous when I first worked on CO2 and I saw, you know, 12, 1300 pounds. I mean, that's a, that's a shocker because, you know, any of the regular synthetic refrigerants, we don't nearly get even close to that.
• 0:03
  So but after you get, you know, thinking about it, my biggest thing was like, okay, I know that this isn't the most pressure that I've actually dealt with, where have I used higher pressure? And, and then I'm thinking about hydraulics, hydraulics uses a whole lot more pressure. Then, then the CO2. So it made, it made me feel more comfortable knowing that we, as a, I guess, people work with higher pressure stuff than CO2.
• 0:04
  So but after you get, you know, thinking about it, my biggest thing was like, okay, I know that this isn't the most pressure that I've actually dealt with, where have I used higher pressure? And, and then I'm thinking about hydraulics, hydraulics uses a whole lot more pressure. Then, then the CO2. So it made, it made me feel more comfortable knowing that we, as a, I guess, people work with higher pressure stuff than CO2.
• 0:04
  So just knowing that just made me feel a lot more comfortable with Working with co2.
• 0:04
  Trevor: So I got a actually a training tomorrow. And it's the, the presentation name is called taking the fear out of co2 and low flammable refrigerants. Because this is what it's not only co2 that technicians like yourself have to deal with.
• 0:04
  You're going to deal with all these new a two L's or as well as propane propane is more in the smaller commercial, but we're going to see a two L in the larger commercial going forward. A lot of people say it's just going to be CO2, but what I'm seeing, there's still a big push for these low GWP refrigerants into the market.
• 0:05
  You're going to deal with all these new a two L's or as well as propane propane is more in the smaller commercial, but we're going to see a two L in the larger commercial going forward. A lot of people say it's just going to be CO2, but what I'm seeing, there's still a big push for these low GWP refrigerants into the market.
• 0:05
  And us as refrigeration mentor, we want to train, help the technicians, those technicians who are out in the field, having to deal with this and don't know. So this, this present training that I'm going to do tomorrow. Is on taking the fear that I'd love to hear some of the the things that either anyone on the line participants how they taken the fear from working on these equipments for themselves and their teams, as well as you, Andrew, some of the things, one of the things you said is that you compared it to hydraulics.
• 0:05
  Is there any other things that you that maybe give me some advice for for the training that I'm going to do tomorrow for a large group of technicians?
• 0:05
  Andrew: I mean, honestly for me was I, I just thought of what, what's higher pressure. I mean, you could think of steam as well, especially on like if you have any Navy people, they, I mean, that's what they use on their, on their ships and steam, which is actually higher pressure as well.
• 0:05
  But really what, what did it is just getting my hands on that piece of equipment and, and just being, just thinking about what you're doing. Is also another thing, because, you know, I can hook up on any synthetic type refrigerant and I feel very comfortable, so I'm moving really quick. CO2 just makes me stop and makes me think a little bit longer before, how fast should I open this ball valve per se, you know?
• 0:06
  But really what, what did it is just getting my hands on that piece of equipment and, and just being, just thinking about what you're doing. Is also another thing, because, you know, I can hook up on any synthetic type refrigerant and I feel very comfortable, so I'm moving really quick. CO2 just makes me stop and makes me think a little bit longer before, how fast should I open this ball valve per se, you know?
• 0:06
  Or, you know, it just has different characteristics, so for me, that would be, that, that's how I overcame the the higher pressures. Was first. Figuring out what do we work with that is higher pressure and then just getting my hands on it. And then, you know, after two or three times getting my hands on it, I was like, okay, well, this is enough.
• 0:06
  What was I scared about?
• 0:06
  Trevor: And I think that's the biggest thing is the first step for me though, is talking to the people because. Giving them advice on what they're to expect, because if they don't expect you know, if they don't know, they're going to see 1200 PSI or 90 bar in a system, that's going to be very surprising, but that training aspects, super, super important because that is the start of taking the fear out of it.
• 0:07
  Trevor: And I think that's the biggest thing is the first step for me though, is talking to the people because. Giving them advice on what they're to expect, because if they don't expect you know, if they don't know, they're going to see 1200 PSI or 90 bar in a system, that's going to be very surprising, but that training aspects, super, super important because that is the start of taking the fear out of it.
• 0:07
  And my, my goal is to relate it to what people are working on because a lot of people think it is you know, the unknown. But when I go through my CO2 trainings and the CO2 training program, I started showing all the controllers and I started showing all the valves and I started showing the piping.
• 0:07
  They're like, I didn't working on this the whole time. And for the new people that are coming right into the industry, they don't know, like they don't know pressure. So I think it's going to be a real easier transition when the schools and the education system start to get in there. And that's what I'm going to start pushing for over the next few years is that hopefully we can get it refrigeration mentor CO2 training programs into all the different schools across the world, not only here.
• 0:07
  And if there's people, you know, that want to partner up or collaborate to figure out how do we get this. Deeper into the education system. Cause even in Europe, it's not, it's not, there's, there's courses and stuff, and which is great, but it's not like it's a, a full on thing. There's segments of the market.
• 0:08
  And if there's people, you know, that want to partner up or collaborate to figure out how do we get this. Deeper into the education system. Cause even in Europe, it's not, it's not, there's, there's courses and stuff, and which is great, but it's not like it's a, a full on thing. There's segments of the market.
• 0:08
  How do we make this as a a team effort globally to really help educate that those next generation of technician who are going to only be working on low flammable or flammable refrigerant, who CO2. As we continue to progress they will still have to work on the. The other refrigerants the, you know, the stuff that's still out there.
• 0:08
  Cause there's millions to billions piece of equipment out there. If we count air conditioning and stuff. And so it was our job to help uplift industry and share that knowledge. And I, and I like those points that you put Andrew, is that. We really need to get our hands on it. But if you're brand new, you need to be with a journeyman or someone who's experienced, because this is how we learned refrigeration in general.
• 0:08
  And we're supposed to learn here in Canada, you're supposed to be with a journeyman for that first four years until you become a journeyman. But that doesn't really happen because you can't, that you can't, you would never win jobs and it would cost so much. So it's, it's segmented compared to when I talked to you guys 30 or 40 years ago in the industry where they worked alongside with someone for, for a long time versus now someone's in a truck in six months on their own.
• 0:09
  And we're supposed to learn here in Canada, you're supposed to be with a journeyman for that first four years until you become a journeyman. But that doesn't really happen because you can't, that you can't, you would never win jobs and it would cost so much. So it's, it's segmented compared to when I talked to you guys 30 or 40 years ago in the industry where they worked alongside with someone for, for a long time versus now someone's in a truck in six months on their own.
• 0:09
  And it's our, our job to help build their confidence, show them how to do it safely and correctly and really be there for them when they do have questions. And, because I've seen people get hurt with HFCs. I've seen people get hurt with CO2. I've seen people get hurt with flammables. One of the biggest things I think it all comes back down to is education, training and development.
• 0:09
  There are do for, don't get me wrong. There's accidents that do happen just like happens on the roads happens with electrical, like we can relate it to anything. The biggest thing is that training and development.
• 0:09
  Speaker: I want to take a minute to talk about what refrigeration mentor training is all about. We are all about helping contractors increase profit. We help end users reduce bottom line costs and really helping technicians make more money. And our mission is to empower those contractors and technicians by equipping them with the, really the skills that they need and the knowledge that they need for success.
• 0:10
  Speaker: I want to take a minute to talk about what refrigeration mentor training is all about. We are all about helping contractors increase profit. We help end users reduce bottom line costs and really helping technicians make more money. And our mission is to empower those contractors and technicians by equipping them with the, really the skills that they need and the knowledge that they need for success.
• 0:10
  And what we do is we help contractors. By building customized training packages that work for their technicians, that work for their busy schedule to advance their skills in gauging them in continuing education and testing them. All these programs that we really do is really by the hands on approach, getting them to go out there and do.
• 0:10
  The field work. So they get tangible results and we are committed to getting you the results you're looking for. All our programs are online drip model. So I can meet with technicians or the refrigeration professional. I can coach them. I can mentor them and our team of professional really want to take your business, to the next level.
• 0:10
  So if you're a service manager, business owner or technician, reach out, head to refrigerationmentor. com or check out in the show notes, there's a book a call link and it doesn't matter where you're at in the world. We can help develop a program that's going to help you and your business be more profitable in the commercial refrigeration and aid vac industry.
• 0:11
  So if you're a service manager, business owner or technician, reach out, head to refrigerationmentor. com or check out in the show notes, there's a book a call link and it doesn't matter where you're at in the world. We can help develop a program that's going to help you and your business be more profitable in the commercial refrigeration and aid vac industry.
• 0:11
  Now let's get to the conversation goal.
• 0:11
  Trevor: So you do a lot of training now Andrew with apprentices and technicians and all the organizations you work on are with is what are some of the things that you.
• 0:11
  Work with, with the younger or the newer people. They don't even have to be younger. I shouldn't have said that with newer people to CO2, what are some of the main steps that you want to get out to them right away? Main things.
• 0:11
  Andrew: Yeah. Okay. So the main thing is understanding what is normal. If you could understand what is normal, then you at least have a sense of direction, like, Ooh, that's, there's something wrong here.
• 0:11
  So if you got a compressor that that's ramping up and then it just goes way down and ramps up and then goes lay down, okay, there's something going on or any like condenser span banging on and banging off and there's a VFB on. And so just understanding what, how a normal system operates is key to finding issues or problems related to the piece of equipment or whatever you're working on.
• 0:12
  So if you got a compressor that that's ramping up and then it just goes way down and ramps up and then goes lay down, okay, there's something going on or any like condenser span banging on and banging off and there's a VFB on. And so just understanding what, how a normal system operates is key to finding issues or problems related to the piece of equipment or whatever you're working on.
• 0:12
  And it doesn't have to be necessarily CO2, I mean It could be, like you said, the H2Ls or I think they're A3s. Yeah, A3s. As long as you know what it should be doing, that is the very first step. So before we even get into the machine room, I'm already letting them know what head pressure should be.
• 0:12
  And depending on, you know The type of condensate you have and the the outdoor air temperature is, you know, that's always going to fluctuate, but I give them a range where it should be, depending on. Where it's at the flash tank pressure, typically, depending on what it is. I know every manufacturer does differently, but there's always a range.
• 0:12
  And then you got your medium temp and then your low temp. Of course, there's a range too. So that's where I really first start off is doing that is getting them. So they know what to expect. So they don't just. When I tell them to go hook up their gauges to the flash tank and they see 550 pounds, their eyes get big if I don't tell them because they're, they just look at the pressure of like, that's not right.
• 0:13
  And then you got your medium temp and then your low temp. Of course, there's a range too. So that's where I really first start off is doing that is getting them. So they know what to expect. So they don't just. When I tell them to go hook up their gauges to the flash tank and they see 550 pounds, their eyes get big if I don't tell them because they're, they just look at the pressure of like, that's not right.
• 0:13
  That's not right. 550. We need to shut the system down. And really 550 is normal.
• 0:13
  Trevor: Exactly. And I like that. It's, it's preparing them when they get into before they get there. And I think that's, that's a huge thing that We need to do as an industry, because I've had technicians reach out to me on LinkedIn or Facebook or Instagram and say, Trevor, I was on call.
• 0:13
  I showed up to the store. I didn't even know we had CO2 stores. Now, do you blame the company for that? Do you, you know what I mean? Do you fault the tech, other technicians for that? No, I don't. It's sometimes it just happens so fast. You get a big contract, you get all these stores and maybe they don't even know that they have.
• 0:14
  I showed up to the store. I didn't even know we had CO2 stores. Now, do you blame the company for that? Do you, you know what I mean? Do you fault the tech, other technicians for that? No, I don't. It's sometimes it just happens so fast. You get a big contract, you get all these stores and maybe they don't even know that they have.
• 0:14
  CO2 source, they pick up 50 stores and I know it's starting to get talked about more, but it depends on where you're at in the world as well. And I think that's a step one is to really give them that guide and that expectation of what they're going to see. What are a few other things that you after you do that talk, Andrew, what are some of the other things that you do with the technicians?
• 0:14
  Andrew: Yeah. Then we go into the machine room and then what I will do is kind of. Go through the piping and explain what each valve is and what it's supposed to be doing and how it acts so I start with the literally the discharge service valve and I move forward all the way Up to the condenser and depending on what type of condenser it has and if there's anything reclaimed so Oh, yeah.
• 0:14
  I mean, I just don't run through the whole entire system with them. Very, I wouldn't say very quickly, but I mean, it takes about an hour to go through just the, the the rack area, right? So, cause there's just so much involved in it and that's not it. That's just the mechanical portion. We haven't even talked about the electrical on it and the, and the programming that goes.
• 0:15
  I mean, I just don't run through the whole entire system with them. Very, I wouldn't say very quickly, but I mean, it takes about an hour to go through just the, the the rack area, right? So, cause there's just so much involved in it and that's not it. That's just the mechanical portion. We haven't even talked about the electrical on it and the, and the programming that goes.
• 0:15
  You know, along with it. So for, for me, that's for any new person coming into any, any CO2, it doesn't matter if it's a cascade system or transcritical system, either way. That's how I started off. I just walk through step by step first, what they should expect, go in, talk about the valves, how they're supposed to be, what they should be at, and then.
• 0:15
  Yeah. I mean, you got oil management you could talk about. I mean, we could talk all day about that. Right. Yeah. So,
• 0:15
  Trevor: Exactly. And so, so the thing is though, Andrew is, would this be any different than what you would do for someone new coming into standard supermarket rack?
• 0:15
  Andrew: This is, it would be the exact same way I would go about it.
• 0:16
  Andrew: This is, it would be the exact same way I would go about it.
• 0:16
  If it was a fresh person right out of a trade school or someone someone coming out right off the street or whatever, that would be the way that I would do it.
• 0:16
  Trevor: Exactly. And this is the, this is what I'm trying to talk to a lot of companies that we do training with because they're doing the same, they're doing this already with the silver or they should be anyway.
• 0:16
  Some of them are, some of them are, but we got to train and develop them. It doesn't matter if it's CO2, it doesn't matter if it's HFC, HFOs or propane, whatever the refrigerant. We, as an industry, we need to help all each other. People coming in new. Yes, it is CO2. Is it scary at first? Yes. It's scary for some people who have heard that, Oh man, it's high pressures and there's dry ice.
• 0:16
  And then what happens if something fails and all these stories that don't get wrong can happen, but it can happen in HFC, it can happen in ammonia. It can happen in any, with any type of refrigerant. And the manufacturers today, I work with so many of them around the world and they're doing such a great job on protecting the people that are on it.
• 0:17
  And then what happens if something fails and all these stories that don't get wrong can happen, but it can happen in HFC, it can happen in ammonia. It can happen in any, with any type of refrigerant. And the manufacturers today, I work with so many of them around the world and they're doing such a great job on protecting the people that are on it.
• 0:17
  Do you have any thoughts on that? Like on the equipment now, on how the safeties are involved because you've been working on more and more CO2. Have you found that the CO2 systems have they're very diligent on the safety for these, these pieces of equipment?
• 0:17
  Andrew: Yeah, there's actually more safeties involved in CO2 than any, you know, synthetic type refrigerant.
• 0:17
  I mean, you got the programming in itself has a safety built in, as long as it's programmed right. You got mechanical safeties, you got PRVs. In multiple locations, just in case you know, you have an event where the pressure increases too high. I mean, yeah, there's just, there's way more safeties involved in CO2 than, than any, any synthetic refrigeration.
• 0:18
  I mean, you got the programming in itself has a safety built in, as long as it's programmed right. You got mechanical safeties, you got PRVs. In multiple locations, just in case you know, you have an event where the pressure increases too high. I mean, yeah, there's just, there's way more safeties involved in CO2 than, than any, any synthetic refrigeration. That I've, I've worked on.
• 0:18
  Trevor: Yeah. And I'm not saying that we're not saying that it hasn't been on HFC because I've been to stores that have the leak protection, the mechanical exhaust vents. They had high pressure controls. They have a PRVs and so on and so forth. But today with all the fear that has been put into because of CO2 because of the higher pressures, which we know there's way other, other industries that work at way higher pressures, they've been doing it for.
• 0:18
  Decades and decades and decades. It's just something new for our industry and the change is hard. Right? And I've talked, we talked about this so many times that in different CO2 conversations or even refrigeration trainings that change can be hard. Something is new is more difficult. I'm used to doing it this way.
• 0:18
  Now I'm going to do it this way. And that's where even this low flammable trainings that I do and then Flammable refrigerant trainings that we do is that we want to talk to them about all those processes that you've done in the past are the same as you're you do with these refrigerants. Maybe there's a little bit other safety things that you need to look for.
• 0:19
  Now I'm going to do it this way. And that's where even this low flammable trainings that I do and then Flammable refrigerant trainings that we do is that we want to talk to them about all those processes that you've done in the past are the same as you're you do with these refrigerants. Maybe there's a little bit other safety things that you need to look for.
• 0:19
  But all those things we were supposed to do it for the HFC. It's just, Oh, well, I don't have to do that. You know, and that's not as big as the risk as when it first came out. Cause for sure. And I've heard this when 404 or 410 or even R12, there was all these safety things around it concerned right away.
• 0:19
  But over time, as it started to go, people found different ways to do it. There was complacency. It's kind of like pulling a vac. Like I've read documents like from the fifties and sixties where they pulled it to a hundred microns that was pulling systems to a hundred micron you know, that's, that's very, really, really low where people are like, ah, a thousand microns.
• 0:19
  We're good. You know, you can't, can't do that. You got to pull down to 300, 200 microns, 0. 3 Tor, whatever you, you, whatever scales you use, it doesn't matter. And then do a decay test. To make sure it doesn't rise up over that 500 microns in a certain amount of time. And so now we know there's no air in that system or no non condensables, no nitrogen or air, basically that's where they're at.
• 0:19
  And when you, you follow the, the best practice rules that we have here in North America, at least, and then especially in Canada, you follow the best practice rules and I guess around the world is that working on CO2, working on these other refrigerants are going to be very, very similar. Now, yes, we have low flammability and 83, like propane, but man, I know technicians that have been working with a threes for over 10 years.
• 0:20
  And when you, you follow the, the best practice rules that we have here in North America, at least, and then especially in Canada, you follow the best practice rules and I guess around the world is that working on CO2, working on these other refrigerants are going to be very, very similar. Now, yes, we have low flammability and 83, like propane, but man, I know technicians that have been working with a threes for over 10 years.
• 0:20
  You know what I mean? And that's what they do on a daily basis. Manufacturers have switched like true manufacturers. One example where they switched to full propane years and years ago. So anybody that worked on them. It's already been working on us and you, they didn't have their more equipment now for a two L's and a threes, and even for CO2.
• 0:20
  So some of the tools may change, but. Mostly the same, but you're not going to, or an A3, you don't need different gauges, but for CO2, you do need on the high side, you need different gauges, right? When you're, you're doing that, that burst pressure, higher burst pressure. What is your thoughts on the tools now?
• 0:21
  So some of the tools may change, but. Mostly the same, but you're not going to, or an A3, you don't need different gauges, but for CO2, you do need on the high side, you need different gauges, right? When you're, you're doing that, that burst pressure, higher burst pressure. What is your thoughts on the tools now?
• 0:21
  Andrew versus the tools you have, you have to go buy a whole whack of new tools for your toolkit, or what are your thoughts on CO2 versus what you have now in the toolkit?
• 0:21
  Andrew: Honestly, as long as I'm not going on to, like you said, the high side, the transcritical side. The irregular gauges that you have that you've been using works.
• 0:21
  So, but that is the one, I'll say one tool that I had to get was the trans critical set of gauges. Just so I could verify really just the no, what is that? Pressure. Yes. Pressure transducers just to verify that they're reading correctly. Yeah, but that, I mean. That's really the only time I, I do it.
• 0:21
  Oh, adding, adding refrigerant to the system. If there's a leak somewhere, I use the transcritical gauges just for a safety aspect, because honestly, I mean, if you have a tank that's sitting outside and it's you know, 80 degrees outside and you're, you're talking, yeah, probably a thousand pounds. I don't know off the top of my head.
• 0:22
  Oh, adding, adding refrigerant to the system. If there's a leak somewhere, I use the transcritical gauges just for a safety aspect, because honestly, I mean, if you have a tank that's sitting outside and it's you know, 80 degrees outside and you're, you're talking, yeah, probably a thousand pounds. I don't know off the top of my head.
• 0:22
  Don't quote me that much. Yeah, that's a thousand pounds. And that's not what gauges they're not rated for that. So I see you have the transcritical data gauges, so that's why you that there, but other than that, yeah, no, I don't, there is no other special souls. Oh, I guess the, you got to have a CO2 leak detector, which it is tricky.
• 0:22
  That's, I mean, since we're talking about tools one thing that when I first started with CO2, I would get random hits walking through the store and I didn't understand, and then I, then I had. When I thought about it, we exhale carbon dioxide. So, so if you got a group of people standing there talking, it's actually going to go off.
• 0:22
  So it, it was trying to find leaks when I first started was difficult because it would fluctuate to 300 and then drop back down. But yeah, so that's something to be aware of when you're leak checking out there. I think the only one I've used is the Stratus with the CO2 cartridge in it. I don't know if there's any other ones out there currently.
• 0:23
  So it, it was trying to find leaks when I first started was difficult because it would fluctuate to 300 and then drop back down. But yeah, so that's something to be aware of when you're leak checking out there. I think the only one I've used is the Stratus with the CO2 cartridge in it. I don't know if there's any other ones out there currently.
• 0:23
  But
• 0:23
  Trevor: there are, yeah. So back rack has some DTAC, so you. One of the thing about the strata is you can change those characters so you can do CO2, you could do A3s or A12s, which is pretty cool on that. And then, yeah, BACREC has a list of leak detectors. And I've talked to many people, I had someone message me on LinkedIn and it's like they're running into issues to find some CO2 leaks and so they're looking for some advice and they're using the strata too.
• 0:23
  So if anybody has advice, if they've been working on CO2 leaks and figure it out the process, because they, they can be difficult, but you know what I told them is that HFC, there's so many systems out there that are leaking and people can't find them. So it's not that it's, CO2 is harder, there's thousands of HFC racks out there that are leaking and people can't find the leaks.
• 0:24
  So if anybody has advice, if they've been working on CO2 leaks and figure it out the process, because they, they can be difficult, but you know what I told them is that HFC, there's so many systems out there that are leaking and people can't find them. So it's not that it's, CO2 is harder, there's thousands of HFC racks out there that are leaking and people can't find the leaks.
• 0:24
  Or maybe they don't want to find the leaks, whatever, it's our job to find them, fix them, repair them, and get it back up and running. So there are no leaks in any system, CO2, HFC, or whatever, you know what I mean? So yes is it different? Oh no, you're looking for a leak. Is it maybe a bit harder potentially?
• 0:24
  Cause we have CO2 in the air, but yeah, I think that's it.
• 0:24
  Andrew: Yeah, I had a fun leak. So here's, here's one of the examples I had. I was looking for a leak using that Stratus, like I said. And I was walking in the, well, not in it, but I was walking beside the meat cases. And all of a sudden it would spike up just a couple hundred parts per million.
• 0:24
  And then, and then as I walked past it, it would drop back down to the normal. And then I would go back, it would spike up a couple. I'm like, there has to be something here. It's just, it was just that slight change that I noticed. So I was like, okay, so then I kept leak checking the store. But I went back and I pulled the product.
• 0:24
  And it actually, it was a leak. It was leaking from a factory U Bin and what was crazy was it was actually at that triple points when it was coming out. I was hearing this tick tick tick sound and I was like, what is that? That doesn't sound right. Was that a fan? So I pulled it out. It was actually shooting out dry ice out of the spot.
• 0:25
  And it actually, it was a leak. It was leaking from a factory U Bin and what was crazy was it was actually at that triple points when it was coming out. I was hearing this tick tick tick sound and I was like, what is that? That doesn't sound right. Was that a fan? So I pulled it out. It was actually shooting out dry ice out of the spot.
• 0:25
  I thought that was the craziest thing.
• 0:25
  Trevor: Yeah. And I've talked to a lot of people who look for CO2 leaks and they say it's easier. I don't know. Honestly, I haven't been doing a lot. I haven't been doing any CO2 leak checked in probably six or seven years. So it's it's something that I am not, but I talked to a lot of people and they say, man, usually when it's a leak, a CO2 leak, I hear it or exactly what Andrew said.
• 0:25
  If it's on a place where it's liquid, they can, the dry ice hits something or they. They see it, it's making a different type of sound. Not saying that it's hard because leaks on any type of system can be very, very hard, especially when it's a microscopic leak. And, and we, every system has like every, every joint, there's a, that's a 0.
• 0:26
  If it's on a place where it's liquid, they can, the dry ice hits something or they. They see it, it's making a different type of sound. Not saying that it's hard because leaks on any type of system can be very, very hard, especially when it's a microscopic leak. And, and we, every system has like every, every joint, there's a, that's a 0.
• 0:26
  000 some. Percent of a leak, you know, I mean, even through a standard pipe, there's a percentage of leak, but it's, it's, it's not that it's leaking. And you can look in manufacturer's literature, they'll say every, every piece of equipment that they make, there's some tiny microscopic percentage of a leak, but this is something that's important, even though it's CO2, you still, again, I say this time and time again, you still got to fix those leaks. You don't want to be just draining systems. I'm not, I have people asking me all the time too. It's like, Oh, well, I just blown off the last 400 pounds of the suction medium temp suction line.
• 0:26
  That is like 400 feet. You know what I mean? A couple, a couple hundred meters, we'll say. And we're just blowing all that out. But inside that vapor, there is POE oil. This is a problem. We don't want to be getting that into the environment. And people say, well, there's no recovery units or cylinders. Well, there's different ways of doing it.
• 0:26
  Talk to smart technicians. They're like, well, we use the 410 refrigerant recovery unit because the pressure is below and we pump it into another part of the system. So we try to keep as much as possible. People disagree and and agree with me on how to do that. But that's no different than with an HFC system.
• 0:27
  Talk to smart technicians. They're like, well, we use the 410 refrigerant recovery unit because the pressure is below and we pump it into another part of the system. So we try to keep as much as possible. People disagree and and agree with me on how to do that. But that's no different than with an HFC system.
• 0:27
  Now you can't, you got to make sure that you follow the recovery unit manufacturers got pressure guidelines. 100 percent make sure you don't go over that, but 410 is the same pressures. You know, when you're doing it on the subcritical vapor side, not liquid, we're talking about vapor right now,
• 0:27
  Andrew: right? Yeah.
• 0:27
  No, I agree with that. I if it's on a medium temp and it is a transcritical, you got 200 pounds that you could put, put that right back into the rack without even getting any type of machine. Yeah, the low side is running a right about, excuse me, the low temp low side is running about you know, 200 PSI and you got 400 pounds there, just put it right in there, you know, and then now you're only working at 200 pounds of pressure that I mean, we, we work today before CO2, 200 pounds of pressure we use all the time.
• 0:28
  No, I agree with that. I if it's on a medium temp and it is a transcritical, you got 200 pounds that you could put, put that right back into the rack without even getting any type of machine. Yeah, the low side is running a right about, excuse me, the low temp low side is running about you know, 200 PSI and you got 400 pounds there, just put it right in there, you know, and then now you're only working at 200 pounds of pressure that I mean, we, we work today before CO2, 200 pounds of pressure we use all the time.
• 0:28
  So that machine, that recovery machine could handle that, that pressure
• 0:28
  Trevor: easily. But then I have I, then I have technicians saying, well, we get paid so much per hour, so it's a, it's a waste of time. That's not the, that's not the point. You know what I mean? I totally understand. Yes. It's, it doesn't cost more time and money.
• 0:28
  It does. But the thing is, is that we have to be professionals. We have to do the job right. And people say, well, then, then we lose jobs and there's a whole backside. And I totally understand that. And yes, the thing is, is that we got to. Follow the rules and regulations of our, our states, provinces, and countries, and, and some of them don't have it.
• 0:28
  Honestly, I talked to people all around the world that we don't have any regulations. We do whatever we want. At the end of the day, for me, it's what is the best for us, safety. Safety wise as technicians, as well as what is the best for our customers and what is the best for the environment because this is only one place that we live and we and you know, and people start to talk to me about other industries and other countries.
• 0:29
  Honestly, I talked to people all around the world that we don't have any regulations. We do whatever we want. At the end of the day, for me, it's what is the best for us, safety. Safety wise as technicians, as well as what is the best for our customers and what is the best for the environment because this is only one place that we live and we and you know, and people start to talk to me about other industries and other countries.
• 0:29
  It doesn't matter, but what to me, it doesn't matter what they're doing. I want to make sure that I'm following the rules and regulations to my point. And as they change, we got to follow them as to. That's because 50 years ago, R12 was totally fine. But over time we figured out there was issues with it.
• 0:29
  And I know for sure down the road, CO2 A2Ls, all that stuff. There's going to be issues with that as well, down the road. There's going to be regulations, maybe not in our, my career time, but I, I'm seeing it already. Question for you, Andrew. So Jeremy, thanks for the question. More of a personal preference, but curious from A service technician standpoint, do you prefer EVs or pulse with modulation valves, PW valves in cases and walk in EVAPs?
• 0:29
  Andrew: I, I personally liked EEVs better. I've actually dealt with more pulse valves, but you can get way more accurate with, well, I shouldn't say way more. You can get more accurate with a EEV and I find it for me personally, easier to tune than a pulse, pulse pulse valve.
• 0:30
  Andrew: I, I personally liked EEVs better. I've actually dealt with more pulse valves, but you can get way more accurate with, well, I shouldn't say way more. You can get more accurate with a EEV and I find it for me personally, easier to tune than a pulse, pulse pulse valve.
• 0:30
  Trevor: Yeah. And I, I feel the same.
• 0:30
  I've worked with. Pulse with modulation valves and electronic valves for years and years. I used to train them at, when I worked at Copeland to thousands of different people and I just the way the stepper valve works or or the EEVs, but it is a stepper valve. There is just, for me, there's more control.
• 0:30
  There's more of a range. Where instead of opening up and full control and then low open and low Danfoss has a very good algorithm for the A key vowels. Don't get me wrong. They got a great algorithm. And they can make it really tight control. But I've seen same thing fine tuning an EV over a a pulse valve.
• 0:30
  Sporlin or a Danfoss or an Alco, it doesn't matter. I feel that their stepper valves are, are more accurate and that's personal preference as well. And I'm more used to the stepper valve versus the pulse valve. So, so that was a great question, Jeremy.
• 0:31
  Sporlin or a Danfoss or an Alco, it doesn't matter. I feel that their stepper valves are, are more accurate and that's personal preference as well. And I'm more used to the stepper valve versus the pulse valve. So, so that was a great question, Jeremy.
• 0:31
  Andrew: Yeah. I mean, out of everything where I deal with here in Washington, there's I definitely ran across way more pulse valves than EEVs but definitely EEVs been a.
• 0:31
  I don't know which one's been around. I just, I just, I feel like I've dealt with in a long span, right? Because EEV's been on on any synthetic type refrigerants. So I've already been exposed to an EEV there. So I guess, so maybe that's why I'm a little more comfortable with it too. But I just know, because like what Trevor was saying, that it just opens and shuts, you know, and opens the shut.
• 0:31
  So it's just. And it's, I think it's 10 seconds. Is it 10 seconds there, Trevor? I think it's 10 seconds. You can say sexy. Yeah. So it all depends and it just shoves it in and then it stops and that shoves it. All right. I don't know. It just, to me, I rather have something that modulates as you just have that much better control.
• 0:32
  So it's just. And it's, I think it's 10 seconds. Is it 10 seconds there, Trevor? I think it's 10 seconds. You can say sexy. Yeah. So it all depends and it just shoves it in and then it stops and that shoves it. All right. I don't know. It just, to me, I rather have something that modulates as you just have that much better control.
• 0:32
  I mean, it's like hitting the gas, slamming the brakes, hitting the gas, slamming the brakes. Or you could give it gas and let off and then give it gas and let off. So, you know, that's why I like typically. That sort of thing too. And then, you know, when you're servicing stuff, I don't like to go over there and slap open the ball valve.
• 0:32
  I slowly open the ball valve. It's just so you don't get that hammer, you know what I mean? So. Yeah, but that's a personal reference
• 0:32
  Trevor: totally because there's so many people across the world that prefer some people prefer the pulse width versus the stepper and vice versa. So every, it's a, it's really an old an opinion.
• 0:32
  Can you make it where both of them are super tight? Fine to a hundred percent, you know, you would get a store running exactly the same on a PWM. Versus Stepper. And I've seen comparisons. Once again, it's personal preference. Who knows how to work on it? Can they fine tune it properly? Because I've seen both sides, both, all manufacturers why this one's better than that one.
• 0:33
  Can you make it where both of them are super tight? Fine to a hundred percent, you know, you would get a store running exactly the same on a PWM. Versus Stepper. And I've seen comparisons. Once again, it's personal preference. Who knows how to work on it? Can they fine tune it properly? Because I've seen both sides, both, all manufacturers why this one's better than that one.
• 0:33
  And I've seen all these case studies and studies, and both of them, they're right. You know what I mean? So at the end of the day it's a, it's a preference. And if you can, whatever you can work on better, like whoever's working service and that's the one to go, go with, you know, right. Oh, yeah. All right.
• 0:33
  Lee says he prefers stepper. Great. Yeah, I agree. I've seen the pulse wind tend to overshoot if the algorithm and delays aren't set up correctly. 100. But the same thing, Jeremy, though, with a stepper, if the stepper is not set up correctly, I see them overshoot and undershoot. So it's not only PWN, because I've seen lots of times where someone sizes a valve that's over oversized.
• 0:33
  And all of a sudden it goes to a hundred overshoots and floods that evaporator. And then all of a sudden it closes back off and it opens up and closes off, or they don't set it up after a defrost properly. Like we can get a whole control session and definitely go check out the ones I did with Kevin Mullis.
• 0:33
  It's from integral. Like we talk about controllers and we go into some of those train graphs, but that's the thing. And we're going to do that next week with Andrew. We're going to have some, some graphs to talk about overshooting, undershooting, and how to fine tune those train graphs. So make sure you come next week.
• 0:34
  It's from integral. Like we talk about controllers and we go into some of those train graphs, but that's the thing. And we're going to do that next week with Andrew. We're going to have some, some graphs to talk about overshooting, undershooting, and how to fine tune those train graphs. So make sure you come next week.
• 0:34
  So that's the thing. It's doesn't matter if it's false width or it doesn't matter if it's stepper, if it's not set up correctly, it's not going to work properly. Or it's not, well, it'll work, but it's just not going to work as efficient as it could.
• 0:34
  Andrew: Yeah, you always on anything when you're trying to I feel like especially co2 maybe because i'm a little biased to co2 but You don't want anything to just go on and off you want a smooth Trend as much as possible, right?
• 0:34
  So and that's where you get efficiency. That's where you're getting the customers saving money as far as their electrical bill So it's just and it's easier on the equipment too when you do that instead of just something going on and off on and off So definitely fine tuning Any piece of equipment, doesn't matter if it's CO2, but any piece of equipment is the longevity and energy savings just in just getting those things tuned is well worth the money.
• 0:35
  So and that's where you get efficiency. That's where you're getting the customers saving money as far as their electrical bill So it's just and it's easier on the equipment too when you do that instead of just something going on and off on and off So definitely fine tuning Any piece of equipment, doesn't matter if it's CO2, but any piece of equipment is the longevity and energy savings just in just getting those things tuned is well worth the money.
• 0:35
  Trevor: And that's a skill now. So this is, I've been learning how to fine tune racks now, getting trained by so many different people and helping technicians. And like in our training courses, this is what we're doing. We're teaching them how to fine tune because. Well, we're seeing what I'm seeing anyway, is that a rackets installed or installed crew comes in from one company, a different company has the, does the startup and then an EMS sort of field startup from the manufacturer.
• 0:35
  And then a server, different service contractor takes it over, but there's no really fine tuning afterwards. There's fine tuning at the store, but there has to be continuous fine tuning. Things change over time. So six months or a year in, or even two years. Stuff was going to change in that store, locations, different equipment, maybe the way the maybe they're doing a rental, you know what I mean?
• 0:35
  And it changes certain things. So that has to be continually fine tuned, which I'd work with lots of people who, who do on it, but a service technician needs to understand that. And I think that comes back to trend graphs, which you're really good at Android, you know, reading those trend graphs and then what sometimes it's playing with it.
• 0:36
  And it changes certain things. So that has to be continually fine tuned, which I'd work with lots of people who, who do on it, but a service technician needs to understand that. And I think that comes back to trend graphs, which you're really good at Android, you know, reading those trend graphs and then what sometimes it's playing with it.
• 0:36
  You know what I mean? It's not that you can just go and change one thing and then it's going to fix it and you change one thing at a time. You don't go change 10 and we'll talk about this next week. What are your thoughts on that? You're what you're learning and fine tuning to the knowledge you had before and finally, because I know this is something you're working at a lot.
• 0:36
  Android is how to get better at fine tuning in, you know, tying into making that system run so smoothly.
• 0:36
  Andrew: Yeah, that's, and that's, that's the thing I was trying to, I guess, explain is, is really getting into any valve. It doesn't matter what, or you, it's not even just valves, it's like, it's even compressors, VFD, any type of VFDs.
• 0:36
  You really just want a smooth transition and getting into the actual devices where you can limit the opening, you can limit the opening after defrost, I mean, that's where you really start to fine tune these systems. But you could, if you. I have an example here. I had a compressor that was going on and off on a VFD.
• 0:37
  You really just want a smooth transition and getting into the actual devices where you can limit the opening, you can limit the opening after defrost, I mean, that's where you really start to fine tune these systems. But you could, if you. I have an example here. I had a compressor that was going on and off on a VFD.
• 0:37
  Well not on and off it just would ramp up and then slow way down the ramp up and slow way down And and all I had to do was slow it down Slow that that transition down because it was just trying to keep a real tight window, which is fine But why don't we just slow that reaction? So so what it would do just would constantly overshoot.
• 0:37
  So then I if I slowed it down Then it would, it just went so much better. That's the getting into the fine tuning of the the system. You got to start with the basics. You got to know what it should be doing. Because if I didn't know at all, it's working, right. I got my cases are cold. Hey, I'm good. Right.
• 0:37
  But that's only part of our job. Yeah.
• 0:37
  Go ahead. Trevor: We have many conversations about this too. Like me and Andrew talk a lot about how to fine tune the best. And what we see when, when we had so many conversations, he's been in many of the CO2 training programs and even helped present some of them is that. When we look at technicians and ask them about their fine tuning, it's changing too many parameters at once, as well as trying to speed things up with CO2, where we should be slowing things down.
• 0:38
  Trevor: We have many conversations about this too. Like me and Andrew talk a lot about how to fine tune the best. And what we see when, when we had so many conversations, he's been in many of the CO2 training programs and even helped present some of them is that. When we look at technicians and ask them about their fine tuning, it's changing too many parameters at once, as well as trying to speed things up with CO2, where we should be slowing things down.
• 0:38
  And that's where we see the best results. I've seen the best results. Andrew sees the best. You just gave a good example of it. And that was a VFD that's not even on the valves that we're talking about, but slowing it down the valves. And now we're not saying just, just cut it to the lowest speed as possible, but it's fine tuning is turning at one step, watching it, seeing the results.
• 0:38
  It's like being a scientist, you know what I mean? Okay. And this is a, I do science kits with my, my kids, you know what I mean? And when we talk about it, it's okay. What is the process? What is the results? And what is our conclusion going through that, that process? Okay. Is this, should we keep going forward?
• 0:38
  Did this work? Did this not work? And it's not doing, okay, I did try this or try this, try this. And now it doesn't work, but we don't know what could have worked and couldn't work. There's just too many things involved. Right. And this is kind of one of the things too, I mean, Andrew talked about before is that.
• 0:39
  Did this work? Did this not work? And it's not doing, okay, I did try this or try this, try this. And now it doesn't work, but we don't know what could have worked and couldn't work. There's just too many things involved. Right. And this is kind of one of the things too, I mean, Andrew talked about before is that.
• 0:39
  Too many people playing around with it. And I've seen that in HFC systems and CO2 systems.
• 0:39
  Andrew: Yeah going through the programming is crucial too. That package that comes with that valve, or that controller, has so much good information in there. And who actually, I mean, I'm guilty of it too. Going in there and like, oh, I don't need that and just put the valve and go right but that piece of paper.
• 0:39
  I don't care what device it is has so much valuable information of it. An example, I, so I had a, this is on a synthetic one and it was a CO2 or excuse me a Calvin Calvin to EEV controller inside there. There's a, a, a section that says supermarket mode. What that really means is that valve is controlling.
• 0:39
  There's multiple valves on that lineup, right? So just because you're working on a supermarket doesn't mean that works. So if you got one valve that that things. You know, servicing, you take it out of that and then what happens is it actually reacts faster than it would without it. So just, I mean, just that little piece of information right there caused, we were having flood backs on this rack.
• 0:40
  There's multiple valves on that lineup, right? So just because you're working on a supermarket doesn't mean that works. So if you got one valve that that things. You know, servicing, you take it out of that and then what happens is it actually reacts faster than it would without it. So just, I mean, just that little piece of information right there caused, we were having flood backs on this rack.
• 0:40
  Then we would adjust that valve and then I got and started looking at it and then I saw that supermarket mode and I was like, no way. I took it off in that valve. I haven't had any problems since. No fallback at all, just by that one setting.
• 0:40
  Trevor: And I love that. And that that's diving in a little bit deeper understanding where a lot of, a lot of even me, I'll admit that I'm like always trying to put fires out, feel like I don't have time to learn the controllers and the programs and all this other stuff that we have to learn, but we do have time.
• 0:40
  Okay. Maybe it's not during the work hours. Maybe it's outside of that personal development stuff, learning, learning your craft, if you spend one hour a day learning refrigeration or CO2 refrigeration in five years, you're going to be an expert. That's just one hour a day. Yeah. That's so see a half an hour a day, you'll become an expert in five years, you know, but are you willing to put the time in and know all of you that here are participants and you come and hang out each week you are, and this is why spending, we're doing an hour, a couple hours a week, you know what I mean, but invest in yourself.
• 0:41
  Okay. Maybe it's not during the work hours. Maybe it's outside of that personal development stuff, learning, learning your craft, if you spend one hour a day learning refrigeration or CO2 refrigeration in five years, you're going to be an expert. That's just one hour a day. Yeah. That's so see a half an hour a day, you'll become an expert in five years, you know, but are you willing to put the time in and know all of you that here are participants and you come and hang out each week you are, and this is why spending, we're doing an hour, a couple hours a week, you know what I mean, but invest in yourself.
• 0:41
  Here's another one from Jason. So Jason has a really good point. Here. I do understand that PWM has positive closure when the store power failures occur versus having to add a power module to drive valves closed for the stepper valves. Plus needing the space to add power module in the case can be a challenge at times.
• 0:41
  So this here, once again, is it all depends. You're right. Stepper valves will, they don't have a back feed depending on the manufacturer, if they don't have a back feed, they don't know how to close. They don't got any power to close, but there are controllers out there that do have that feature where it's built in, into the controller, you know, for an example.
• 0:42
  So this here, once again, is it all depends. You're right. Stepper valves will, they don't have a back feed depending on the manufacturer, if they don't have a back feed, they don't know how to close. They don't got any power to close, but there are controllers out there that do have that feature where it's built in, into the controller, you know, for an example.
• 0:42
  The corral certain corral ones will have that built in where it will shut the stepper valve if you have a power failure. And I know other manufacturers are building it in. So you have that feature, or it's a quick add on so built in or an add on It's up to you. Does it cost more? For sure. It's going to cost a little bit more, but this is the thing that this is where the ROI comes in and you got to work with your customer on that.
• 0:42
  And really, as a technician, this is out of our hands. But if you're a business owner and then user, or you work with a manufacturer, or you have that connection on trying to influence it. That end user, because this is it. They trust in us as technicians. They believe that we're doing the showing them all the options that they have, and you need to understand this stuff, right?
• 0:42
  Yes. If a power failure happens on the stepper belt, they might stay all in half position and potential could slide back on that, that restart off, but there are ways that I'm, I'm seeing that. Potentially, you can stop that. You know, I am. I haven't seen this in the field before, and I don't know if it's practical, but what happens if you have some sort of pump out loop before the before the compressors, you know, so in the startup mode when it starts back up.
• 0:43
  Yes. If a power failure happens on the stepper belt, they might stay all in half position and potential could slide back on that, that restart off, but there are ways that I'm, I'm seeing that. Potentially, you can stop that. You know, I am. I haven't seen this in the field before, and I don't know if it's practical, but what happens if you have some sort of pump out loop before the before the compressors, you know, so in the startup mode when it starts back up.
• 0:43
  All of a sudden you have some sort of pump out loop where that liquid doesn't go in there. Maybe you have a, a valve that'll, that, that's the only power closing valve in the store where when you lose power, it'll shut that suction circuit. Then they're all of a sudden a pump out mode. Like I'm, you know, I'm thinking and working with lots of different people coming up with ideas for instances just like that.
• 0:43
  Or do you just put a, a capacitor, you know, a super cap people call them or a capacitor in the controllers. So great question great question, Jason. I've experienced a little with feeding AI symptoms and current settings and PID tuning to see what setting change would it recommend. Awesome. This is, this is something that I'm doing on a constant basis.
• 0:43
  I got a a troubleshooting with AI coming up in a few weeks. Definitely check out that Jason, where we walk into, I'm trying lots of different things with AI parameter settings troubleshooting, training. And a lot of people are like, Oh, AI I'm going to take our jobs. I've heard lots of, no, this is a supplement is going to help train us faster, help us figure out problems quicker.
• 0:44
  I got a a troubleshooting with AI coming up in a few weeks. Definitely check out that Jason, where we walk into, I'm trying lots of different things with AI parameter settings troubleshooting, training. And a lot of people are like, Oh, AI I'm going to take our jobs. I've heard lots of, no, this is a supplement is going to help train us faster, help us figure out problems quicker.
• 0:44
  And I'm super happy to see that you're starting to work with AI, Jason. So definitely hit that training, Andrew, any final thoughts on. Some of the things that we talked about today, you know, getting the fear to CO2, getting into fine tuning a little bit, you know, troubleshooting EEVs any final thoughts?
• 0:44
  Andrew: Yeah, my, my final thoughts is we kind of already said it before, but I always if I go into a store and I don't know what a. Valve or a piece of equipment is I I definitely will take a photo of it and then try to research it There's always something that we can learn out there and 15 minutes a day as I always always said to any of my past students or Apprentices or whoever it may be you spend 15 minutes a day I mean on a piece of equipment you're gonna be that much better every day.
• 0:45
  Andrew: Yeah, my, my final thoughts is we kind of already said it before, but I always if I go into a store and I don't know what a. Valve or a piece of equipment is I I definitely will take a photo of it and then try to research it There's always something that we can learn out there and 15 minutes a day as I always always said to any of my past students or Apprentices or whoever it may be you spend 15 minutes a day I mean on a piece of equipment you're gonna be that much better every day.
• 0:45
  So definitely take Take it into yourself, do investment of your, of you, and be better. I mean, We all could learn and we all can do better in multiple aspects. It's not just refrigeration. It's everyday life too, right? So it could be personal development, career development. I mean, it can be anything. So I highly recommend that 15 minutes a day.
• 0:45
  Yeah, that's all it takes.
• 0:45
  Trevor: I love it. And then if you want to learn CO2, we got. CO2 monies. There's over a hundred videos on our YouTube channel there. So you could take 15 minutes a day and just watch one of those from the different experts, CO2 experts. Now this video go up on our YouTube or the podcast, head to the podcast.
• 0:45
  There is hundreds and hundreds of CO2 experts on there and podcasts that you can just go listen to while you're driving. So these are the things that help you or even help your team share this knowledge too. I think the biggest thing is such. Start talking about it more with your team. Okay. You might not have CO2 systems right now, but it is coming, or you don't have any to else's now, but it is coming or you don't have a three system now, but it is potentially coming.
• 0:46
  There is hundreds and hundreds of CO2 experts on there and podcasts that you can just go listen to while you're driving. So these are the things that help you or even help your team share this knowledge too. I think the biggest thing is such. Start talking about it more with your team. Okay. You might not have CO2 systems right now, but it is coming, or you don't have any to else's now, but it is coming or you don't have a three system now, but it is potentially coming.
• 0:46
  So just have this conversation with them. It's not anything about putting fear in anyone. It's about educating them so they can make educated decisions when they're out there. Do I need to make a phone call to someone or can I do this and charge this to myself and that's it. And build a, help build a curiosity and the confidence in all these technicians.
• 0:46
  I love it. Let's see, we've got any questions, last research, learning and sharing the knowledge with others is amazing. What you will learn by sharing a hundred percent, Jeremy. Thank you so much. Sharing
• 0:46
  Andrew: is definitely key. There's there's a, yeah, just share, share the knowledge. It's a. It's great. Cause you, you get to see them grow as technicians and there's honestly, there's no better feeling watching them grow.
• 0:46
  And then they come back, you'll see them on the road or whatever. And they give you a call. I learned so much from you when we changed out all that oil in that rack. I mean, I get phone calls all the time. Thank you so much for doing this and that, you know, you're doing the industry a great thing. You're, you're, you're building the industry up.
• 0:47
  And then they come back, you'll see them on the road or whatever. And they give you a call. I learned so much from you when we changed out all that oil in that rack. I mean, I get phone calls all the time. Thank you so much for doing this and that, you know, you're doing the industry a great thing. You're, you're, you're building the industry up.
• 0:47
  And like, like Trevor said, that's what we're trying to do. I
• 0:47
  Trevor: mean, love it. Andrew, always, make sure that you guys share this with other people, share the podcast, share the YouTube videos once again and always let's get a conversation going guys.
• 0:48
  Trevor: mean, love it. Andrew, always, make sure that you guys share this with other people, share the podcast, share the YouTube videos once again and always let's get a conversation going guys.