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Mental Health Journey through Shamanic Healing · Authentic Living

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Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we have as conversations about
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things that really matter in our lives.
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And now here's your host, Roxanne Durgesh.
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Hi, everyone.
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It's Roxanne Derhodge.
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Thanks for tuning in, this week.
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This week, I have a a special guest, someone that I, I'm trying to think we met said last
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December, or was it in June, not even?
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Yes.
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We were, privileged.
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Last December because we, were involved in a speaking course.
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That was, I would say, challenging and enlightening all at once from what I can
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remember.
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So we have the privilege of of seeing each other on stage, and doing our our talks for 20
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minutes.
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So I would, like to tell you a little bit about onion, onion.
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Thanks so much for taking the time to come and spend some time with, my listeners today.
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Is it?
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My pleasure, honestly.
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Yeah.
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Is it as dark in Toronto?
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Is it is here in Niagara Falls?
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I'm actually in Ajax now, but, yes, it's, it's quite rainy.
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Yeah.
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It's kinda dark.
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Not you know, we're getting into that weather.
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So I'm gonna tell you a little bit about Anya and, we're gonna talk a little bit about her
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path.
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So Anya goes by Anya, miracle, Walker, Sagan.
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She's a shamanic practitioner and mentor, an emerging filmmaker, author, and the CEO of
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Medical Walker Enterprises.
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Her first short film was shown, at the rendezvous with madness filled festival.
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And she's been practicing traumatic healings since graduating, about a year ago from
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traumatic healing certification program from the Medicine Circle in 2013.
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Alright.
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So I guess the way it's written
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selves, but it's longer.
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So thanks for clarifying that, Anya.
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After being in a cult for 5 years, which, you know, obviously I think I'm, like, you know,
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very curious about some of the things that Daniel will share.
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Anya's fellow to a pretty tough time where there were some issues with severe mental
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health, illnesses, including schizophrenia, and In most traumatic tradition, it's believed that
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mental illness can be an initiation and awakening of a person's true spiritual power
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and potential, as long as a person, I guess, deals with it.
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Is that what it that's meant to say on you?
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Has the right guidance
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is really more, what yep.
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She believes that we go through difficulties.
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Sometimes even tremendous ones for us to surrender our limited beliefs and turn it to a
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higher power, our divine guidance is not the truth.
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She knows from personal experience that no matter what a person's going through, there
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could always be hope even when experts say there isn't, which is is so so very important
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in some of the work that I know, but obviously, the depth of what you're gonna share with us,
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there is hope even in the darkest places And sometimes it feels like there isn't.
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Anya loves nature, when she's not doing shamanic healing or film work, she can be found
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hiking, camping, and writing poetry, or paintings.
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So a lot of very, very, creative things, in your spare time.
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So, Anya, is there anything that, wasn't shared in the bio that you think, people should know
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about you?
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I I just I'm very Adam.
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I I I'm very passionate about whatever it is that myself into, and I put myself into things
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wholeheartedly, I guess, could add.
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Awesome.
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Awesome.
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So as you know, my my show is talked is obviously about healing, but I'll stay
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connected to yourself.
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And that's kind of my brand, which is, you know, the more authentic we are, the more we
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are connected to our essence.
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And if we're able to do that, which is easier said and done when there's difficulties in
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life, that's it brings us to a lot of different places.
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So, a bit about my stories then, and I think you heard that stage, when when I spoke is that
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I've been through some adversity and and then that kind of platforms, for things that I went
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on to go further.
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So I what I'd like everyone to know is to tell them a little bit about your path.
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And I know the most curious thing probably would be about, two things for me, but I'm
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gonna assume if I'm thinking it, others are thinking it also above, the cults, you know,
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how did you get there?
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What is that like?
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You know, I think of Colton, I think of Jim Jones, with what little I know.
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And then, obviously, you know, that experience and kind of where it brings you to today.
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Wherever you'd like to start on?
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Sure.
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It's actually it's the there's no one specific legal definition of a cult at least not that
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I've found and and there's not much teeth in the legal system in order to actually bring any
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of these people to, to to trial or to justice or what we wanna call it.
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It's it's I use the term cult when I refer to it, and I I guess I could have to use it in pre
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in the in quotation marks because they when you're in it, they tell you you're all you're
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you're perfectly able to leave.
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But, essentially, what they say is, like, know, in Harry Potter, they have the muggles and the
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wizards.
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The muggles are sort of the calm and everyday, like, people that don't matter according to So
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you can quit any time, but if you do, you know, you're essentially throwing away your your
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entire spiritual journey and you're essentially negating yourself as a as a spiritual warrior
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as they work for themselves.
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The reason why I found myself in that cult.
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I was working in a dead end job that every 3 months was on contract being renewed every 3
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months for 8 years.
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While it had benefits and things like that.
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And there were, you know, people there that were some some people that were nice and things
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like that.
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The actual work itself was demoralizing and they were always reminding us that there are
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lots of other people out there that if we, you know, don't keep up, with everything they put a
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they would put a lot of load workload on this, and we'd be stressed and things like that that
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we could be easily out the door.
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You know, they implied it.
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They didn't stop your statement writing, obviously, but it was heavily implied or
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inferred.
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And I really I hit rock bottom in in in some ways, emotionally, at least one level of rock
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bottom.
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That wasn't bedrock yet, but if if you were you we use the analogy.
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I was depressed.
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I didn't realize it specifically, but I I hated my job.
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I hated going to work every day.
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I woke up in the morning going, oh my god.
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I have to go to the same old.
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And people were understandably back biting and stuff like that and backstabbing.
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Sorry.
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And, just not a healthy environment.
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I was working in this one place and this woman came and everybody else was functioning at a
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very sort of serious, unhappy kind of level of of consciousness or whatever.
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This lady flounces in, and she's so happy no matter what, and she's on contract and stuff.
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And yet, she's still happy and positive and laughing and joking around with people.
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And we're like, oh my god.
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And I finally I was so going, wow.
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Almost like a a deer in the headlights kind of thing, like, wow, they're bright, shiny light.
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And I came I approached her.
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I said, how do you maintain such a positive attitude in this fill in the blank hole.
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And she said, it's this amazing spiritual group that I meditate with.
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And then I pressed I I just we got her to talk about it a bit more.
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Why did she come and and and sit in on a meeting and see if you like it?
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And by this point, I would have given my left foot to to be out of the situation that I was
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in.
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I hated my life It was going nowhere.
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My relationship was kind of flatlining.
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Nothing.
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There was no hope in my life.
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There was nothing positive that I could I mean, I wasn't able to find anything positive.
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So I I went to this meeting and I thought, oh my god.
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I found my spiritual group who are gonna help me out of this situation.
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And for for the 1st in a while, for the first day, I was I was in it for 6 levels.
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It's been compared to Scientology.
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It's not quite the same thing.
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It's she has the the leader has her own.
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She borrows a lot of things from all different religions and things like that.
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So it's not quite the same, but it does have a hierarchical structure, hierarchical structure,
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that when I was in, went up to 14 levels, probably higher by now.
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I went up to level 6, and that's when you start to teach the material.
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And I started experiencing, like, the first three levels work was pretty fun.
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The 3rd level started getting a roof scarier.
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But as it progressed into level 4, 5, and 6 are in a fairly short period of time together, and
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I started experiencing hallucinations.
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Like, my couch started talking to me.
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And and I'm not kidding it.
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It started laughing at me and taunting me.
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And I and they were saying that it was a natural part of this 4th level or whatever, and
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that's it's normal paranoia, whatever is the There's like a a challenge with each level, and
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and paranoia was the challenge of the level 4.
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And it started to It started to go a little bit better when I was in level 5.
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And then in level 6, I kind of made reached a point where I was almost stable.
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And then I was told by the group leaders, by the all this they they called them the upper
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levels that I was denying my true sexuality that I was actually gay.
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And I have I mean, I I have no problem with anybody, you know, you love who you love, but I
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just wasn't I didn't feel I was built that way.
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So I I it was on several levels.
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I was like, oh, I'm denying.
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I'm lying to myself, and I'm denying who I really am, but then I don't feel and and then
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there must be more denial because I believed so strongly that they knew better for me than I
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knew about myself.
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And so I entered into a relationship with one of the upper levels who was a woman.
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And because I thought I have to challenge this, and I've always been one to when I have
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something I can do that I know I've been guided to that I'll do it.
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So I went into this relationship, and it was kind of the the lynchpin that really pulled out
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the all the all the stops on the on the insanity.
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I I remember the, like, levels of going down.
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There was the first one my mind started snap, during a meditation.
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And then the the may the major breakdown happened in front of a whole citizenship sir,
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test.
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I was standing there with a bunch of papers in my hands, and I was supposed to, distribute
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them and then put them put the results into this little machine that was like, one of those
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punch card things.
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And I honestly didn't know how a machine worked.
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I'd done this hundreds of times.
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I was so all of stuff in my head all came crashing down.
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Like, in this cult, You had to like, by level 6, you had 21 of these things they call
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shields.
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There are these, like, kind of be tact you from certain things, and they also help.
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They tell you they also help you.
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And
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then are these things that you save yourself these shields?
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Tell me a little bit more because I'm curious when you say shields, is it a is it a mantra?
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Is it a
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No.
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It's it's a visualization combined with your meditation.
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Like, you're, the first level, I remember there being a mirror shield, and there was an ice
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shield at one point.
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There was a pink 1 and obsidian 1.
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There's a whole bunch of them.
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And you had to each day constantly be retweaking these things and being aware of them
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in existence and having them help you.
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And the premise of having all of those shields, especially by level 6, is you are on what they
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refer to as the vanguard of human consciousness So you are battling what they they call these
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things and blobs, these, collective entities in in the human is that maraud around and make
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life miserable for people.
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And so he had double these shields and and all of these crazy systems of, trying to fend those
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things off, and you were constantly thinking and meditating 24 hours a day pretty much.
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I mean, when you're asleep, you're it runs on automatic, but if you're doing work and stuff,
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you have these two levels of of under of awareness.
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What I'm doing and also I'm meditating at the same time.
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So you're doing that concurrently.
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So you might be doing go through your your job at work, but you're constantly in a, are you
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chanting something, or you're meditating?
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Meditating.
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Yep.
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It's like a it's like a dual focus.
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You have the real, like, the physical world, and then there's this whole metaphysical,
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whatever you call it, world where you have shields and you're battling these things and
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blobs that get more intense as you go up into levels.
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And, yeah, it's and that there would be these times when they would say, oh, the attack is
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really thick.
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So, you know, and you would co what they would say, you cozy up your they they refer to as a
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pillar.
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A lot of terminology.
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Sorry if it's getting a bit confusing, but it's like an extension of yourself, your higher
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self, you would connect it with the upper levels of the the area you're in, and you would
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strengthen each other and battle these demon things together.
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Wow.
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It sounds, intricate and confusing.
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Yep.
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Right.
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Okay.
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Which is probably the state potentially that they want people in.
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Yeah.
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I mean, they they want I
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mean, they they say they give lip service to wanting you to be empowered that you want to be
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of service and stuff like that, but there's also this like, but our way is the only way
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that nobody else really knows the stuff that we know.
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And if you do if you don't do our stuff, you're kind of a wimp when you're a loser and you
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won't be able to accomplish anything major, you know, that kind of thing.
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So when you start to have the hallucinations, so you are starting to have an issue with
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separating reality from what was your hallucinations, I would assume, at one point,
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Yeah.
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But with with all these crazy shields and meditations, you're constantly running.
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It's really hard to kind of it's like you're living in both worlds at the same time.
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So really hard to differentiate between the 2 eventually.
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Okay.
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So so tell me, what happened?
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How did you how did you you said there's 14 levels and you got out at 6.
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If you're in such a a balanced state between consciousness and presentness and this other
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altered state, how did you How were you able to decipher to stay present long enough to get
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out, or did someone help you?
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Oh, there was no help.
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I had a mental breakdown.
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They tried to help me, actually, the people in the the organization tried very hard.
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Like, well, some of them tried very hard to help me.
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There were there were some people that were just wonderful.
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And I really, like, I it was hard for me in some ways, you know, because I knew that I
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couldn't stay with them.
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And even after I had the breakdown, I still believe that they knew better than me and stuff
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like that.
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And I fell into the severe illness, and I wasn't able to even I was to the point at one
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point, I think about a year or so.
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I didn't leave my apartment.
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I was on I was lying on my floor because I was believing I was stealing the energy of everyone
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around me.
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And so I would lie on the floor and try not to breathe too much because I didn't wanna take
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too much energy.
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Wow.
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So when you went to work that day, you couldn't do your basic job.
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At that point, you knew that something obviously you had had nervous breakdown at that
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point.
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The person I was doing a test with didn't believe me.
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She thought I was faking.
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Thought I was trying to to get whatever, to get some leave or something like that.
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And, like, I they had a psychiatrist a month or so later come and assess me.
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I literally didn't know.
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I mean, I have a university degree of college diploma.
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I've done all kinds of, like, bread so much stuff.
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I didn't know how to file files in order.
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And this will is not.
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I wasn't faking this.
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I was literally so much like all these voices and stuff in my head were going.
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I couldn't concentrate enough figure out how to put them in order.
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Wow.
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So that just basic basic cognitive functioning had, had left you.
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So what did you so when you have that, then you tell us what happened next?
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Like, where did you Did you go into psychiatric treatment?
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Did you get some other healing?
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Tell me a little bit about the path because I'm, again, I'm Obviously, I know in my
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practice and things like that kind of the stages that people go through, but obviously
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when there's psychiatry involved and and things like go into hospital, then obviously people go
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off.
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But what other thing, tell me what happened.
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And, I'm sure others are curious like I am now because this is a part of the story, you know,
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20 minutes on stage does not justify, you know, your whole, path and and what you're sharing
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with the world.
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So
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So what happened?
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I was on after the breakdown, I was institutionalized.
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Pretty much I don't remember it was right away.
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My mom's not a 100% sure, but with within about 2 weeks of that of of that, I was I was just a
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mess and, I was institutionalized in the closed ward facility I was medicated on
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antipsychotics.
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I don't remember the actual name of the one that I was given.
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Over the over the ensuing years, they tried so many different types of things, so many
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different types of, drugs.
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I've tried, dietary changes, but I mean, I wasn't really able to concentrate it very well,
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but I did my best.
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I tried yoga.
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I tried reading things.
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I researched.
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I even had my superintendent who took who took took me in as her friend.
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Had her bring a Catholic priest to see if I was possessed because I I I didn't know what was
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going on.
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And then this crazy, I had this crazy relationship with very, very brief relationship
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with this man, and I felt myself.
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I thought that I was pregnant after he'd gone.
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And I was like, oh my god.
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It's
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While you were while you were in touch and Also, I was
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Not in the institution.
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Sorry.
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I got out of the institution and came back.
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I was relegated, remanded into my parents' care.
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Okay.
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I was able to stay home, and I ended up in this relationship.
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And found out I was pregnant.
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And then after that, I start I was desperate to try and find something.
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I didn't find the way out of this thing until just after my father had passed away, which,
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and my son, was about three years old.
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And that was in 20 my father passed in 20 10.
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It was near the end of the year in 2010.
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I was supposed to go from my because nothing was working.
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Oh, my apologies.
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My I I was in, Yeah.
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Nothing else was working.
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And I I I said, I'm I can't keep doing this to my son.
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He deserves a mom who can play with him, who he's not embarrassed cheap to to show his
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friends.
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Right?
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And I was a mess.
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I was I I I couldn't function.
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I was I was just sit there and stare in this space sometimes.
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I would I'd be able to interact with people, but anyway, so I institutionalized myself at
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this point.
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And I was in, for about a month.
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And toward the end of that month, they've tried everything, all all forms of therapy, I tried
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yoga.
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I tried the, you know, I was eating regularly, taking my medications regularly, and stuff like
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that, and nothing was working, not even healthy.
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And the voices were so loud in my head.
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I I could barely, you know, function.
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It was it's funny because I was able to look like, a normal person probably because of the
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training I had with the gulp, the cult.
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I was able to still, like, speak to people when they spoke to me, and I would I would almost
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sound normal until someone asked me something complex middle of my glitch up.
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But, it was on the morning.
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I was about to just go for my very first electroshock therapy treatment because I swore
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I would do everything I could to get better.
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And if this would help me and help my son have the mom who could love him and to, you know, be
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happy with, I try it.
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6:30 in the morning.
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I couldn't sleep that night, and the nurse was there was one nurse that was so wonderful.
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She let me go and sit in the exercise activity room kind of thing.
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And, it was still dark and people were still asleep.
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Everybody in the ward was asleep.
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It was a claw closed door.
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And I was, sitting there.
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This is plastic pink plastic phone that was hanging on the wall that you would make allowed
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to make outside calls, local calls with.
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And I was sitting in this plastic chair.
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It was pink beside this pink plastic phone.
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And suddenly, I I and I was praying.
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I was saying, please let let me make me strong enough to go through this, help me to get
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better.
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You know?
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And suddenly, the voice is I don't remember if it was how long after that, but the voice has
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finally stopped.
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After I think it was, what, 6 years of having these voices constantly, like, in my head,
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like, a whole gang of bullies.
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They suddenly stopped and this one female voice.
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It was like, she was like, it it felt like there was a person standing in the room talking
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to me, like, right over my shoulder kind of thing.
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She said, no.
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This meaning the electro shock therapy is not for you.
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Go find a shamanic healer.
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And I was so I mean, you don't not listen to something like that.
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You gotta go do it.
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So I declined the treatment discharged myself because I was able to.
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I had admitted myself.
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And my my roommate, who was helping me take care of my son, found me a shamanic healer in
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in Toronto.
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And from there, even from the very first treatment, I started to feel like, you know,
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when you kink off a hose, like, the water doesn't flow at all.
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Right?
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It's it was like someone that unkinked the hose enough for the water to start flowing for We
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need to start feeling things because psychiatric medications, are wonderful in that
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they don't allow you to feel the negative emotions too much.
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They also restrict your positive ones.
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It's almost like a cast that you put over your emotions.
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And with this first, the very first treatment that I had with the shamanic practitioner, the
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the hose became on somewhat unkinked, and I started to feel a trickle of life coming back
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into me.
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I actually my roommate even told me she I told the joke on the way back.
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From the first treatment and laughed.
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And and she was like, she was so amazed.
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She grabbed me by the shoulder.
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She's like, my aunt is back.
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We had become friends.
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She was my superintendent from that first place that I was lying on the floor, and she became
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this guardian angel for my my friend, my my son, and I.
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And and she was like, I have my idea back.
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Like, this is the real you.
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It's you're coming back, and she was She had tears in her eyes, and and I was I I did I did
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too because I realized something had changed.
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So tell me about traumatic feeling because This is powerful.
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Right?
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Because and I often, you know, dealing with a lot of complex PTSD and stuff like that.
23:54
You know, there are a lot of mental health issues that get coupled with complex PTSD.
24:01
And it it it somatasizes into in the issue of mental health.
24:05
So you'll have people having all these problems.
24:08
So I'm curious then because not knowing anything about your manic healing, and I'm
24:12
wondering if anybody listening, maybe people listening will probably have more knowledge
24:16
than me.
24:17
What what is it all about?
24:20
And that may be a big a big question.
24:22
So you break it down accordingly to help.
24:24
You know?
24:26
It's not a huge question.
24:27
It's a very valid one because a lot of people I mean, I'm I was notingly familiar with the term
24:32
shamanic healing.
24:32
I knew it had something to do with traditional culture and something to do with medicine, but
24:37
I didn't really know.
24:38
And and I by medicine, I don't mean ingestibles.
24:41
It's like something to do with psychic medicine.
24:43
That's about all I knew.
24:44
What it really is is, the the big of the, what do you call it, the the big load of of of
24:52
healing that comes through is a thing called soul retrieval.
24:55
And what we what we believe in or what the the what I was taught in core shamanism is that a
25:02
person when they experience trauma, especially in childhood, but even in later in life, when
25:07
it's something that's so overwhelming, it's like you can't deal with it, essentially the
25:11
experience and the memory of that is to or the of the of the negative experience, anyway, is
25:17
encapsulated and then ripped out of the person and stored somewhere for for later on when the
25:24
person's able, to retrieve it and benefit from the learning.
25:28
That that had.
25:29
So each time I would go and see the practitioner, another piece of me, my energy or
25:35
whatever, was the puzzle of who I am was returned to me and created more and more of a
25:41
solid foundation.
25:43
The bedrock on which I could rebuild myself, because my I was raised the ground, literally.
25:48
Mhmm.
25:49
Mhmm.
25:50
And the weirdly the the the actual shamanic healing, you you're also extracting harmful
25:55
and, intrusions harmful block, any kind of blockages person may be experiencing.
26:01
And you also help clean up their space and, things like that as well.
26:05
And there's there's more there's more technical stuff and more advanced stuff that you can get
26:10
into as you go on, but those are the 2 basic things that oh, sorry.
26:13
Also spirit help for retrieval, which is, you get spirit guides that, you're also it's it's
26:22
my understanding of it is when you have a spirit guide come to you, it's not that a,
26:28
like, say it's an elk.
26:29
It's not like a physical elk or what if psychic elk spirit necessarily is coming and living in
26:37
you.
26:37
What it is is the frequency of what that spirit represents is why that energy is coming to you.
26:49
And as you work more with that, the more balanced you become, and the more it helps you
26:54
to unearth what, I guess, you can call your medicine.
26:57
The the the talents and the gifts that you have as as a human being.
27:02
So okay.
27:03
I have another question.
27:06
So is it when you see a shamanic healer like yourself?
27:10
What should what would someone ex what when they come in?
27:12
Let's say I go in.
27:14
Right?
27:15
What what happens?
27:16
You're meeting me and I'm saying, telling you what the issue is.
27:21
The issue might be let's say I'm disconnected from myself or I'm finding it hard to connect
27:27
to a child or whatever it is.
27:29
Is that where you start?
27:31
Or do you do an, like, a formal, I mean, assessment with healing?
27:35
How how do you approach it?
27:37
Cause I think I'm thinking again, I'm thinking with my my kind of hat.
27:41
I'm just wondering whether it's it's all these diverse modalities, which I think is
27:45
phenomenal, by the way.
27:47
But curiosity.
27:49
They all they all meet each other on on some level.
27:51
Like, there's there's some there's because each one of us sort of addresses a facet of the
27:55
consciousness.
27:56
And I believe that, you know, all of them are essential.
27:58
What, I'm blank.
28:00
I've just started drawing a blank.
28:03
When a person comes to see me, what I do is a quick pre, pre, like, a journey beforehand to
28:10
to diagnose things, to see what in energy is presenting itself.
28:14
And then, what you would come in and say would inform it to a degree, but whatever the my
28:21
guidance tells me it has to get done also needs to get done.
28:24
And whether that gets addressed directly during that meditation, it'll get whatever the root of
28:29
that is or whatever the root of whatever you need to have cleared or worked with or returned
28:33
to you will come to you and it'll facilitate whatever it is that you're here to do and to
28:39
bring back to you parts of yourself energetic parts of yourself that have been through
28:44
trauma, taken off and and stored someplace else.
28:47
So you we would journey to I would journey as a practice or to wherever that is located.
28:52
There's different places for it to be.
28:54
There's, they have some brother dramatic names that the land of the dead is one of them.
28:58
The middle world is where we are.
29:00
Sometimes it's there.
29:01
Sometimes it's in a place called The Cave of Lost Children.
29:04
And each one of these things has a different sort of frequency and type of trauma, it that
29:11
that it gets stored in.
29:14
Am I I'm kinda getting off a little bit on a tangent No.
29:16
No.
29:17
No.
29:17
But this is this this is fascinating because, again, not having any kind of concept.
29:21
It helps me, you know, be ask them really be question.
29:24
So I don't think you're going off on a tangent.
29:26
I think Okay.
29:27
For people that are looking at all, you know, alternatives, I think that's important.
29:32
Obviously, you, like you said, when you got into a situation, you you went the conventional
29:37
way, something happened and something opened up let's say, bigger than you to say to you, to
29:44
give give this guidance.
29:45
Obviously, we're not promoting anything either way other than to say there's different ways to
29:50
heal.
29:51
Definitely.
29:52
And and there's no one that's any necessarily more valid or anything than any of the others.
29:57
It's just what you kind of need at time.
29:59
Like naturopathy works for certain things, allopathic for others, psychiatry, you know,
30:04
that kind of stuff.
30:05
Each one has its place.
30:06
Right?
30:07
So as a if you were coming to see me, what I would do in a typical session is I would,
30:12
cleanse your, like, with, use sage or, PawSanto to clear your energy field.
30:19
And then I would go in, with my guides, we would remove any kind of unwanted energy,
30:25
spiritual intrusions or energy blockages and things.
30:29
We also work with, past life things with, things that are ancestral as well.
30:35
And sexual healing, which is sort of clearing, like, memories, things that have been passed on
30:40
both DNA as well as your, what you've been programmed through your parents' experiences
30:44
and things that.
30:46
Then I would do the civil retrieval work.
30:47
And if a spirit help or spirit guide was, being called to help you out do that.
30:52
And then after that, I would write the notes down, and then I usually do my work on via
30:58
Skype, or Surnet Skype, Zoom, and then I would take down the notes, and I would read the to
31:04
you and record it and send it to you so that you have an idea of what it it's not
31:08
necessarily all the negative stuff, but at least the stuff that came forward, like,
31:12
whatever healing was being brought
31:15
Interesting.
31:16
Very, very fascinating.
31:17
So, so this is an like, a it's like a protocol or a process that you go through, but you're
31:26
using you're going into a meditative state.
31:28
Is the client also going to in a meditative state?
31:31
They go into a bed.
31:31
They don't have to they they
31:33
can if they want to, but it's just you just sort of wanna lie down with your eyes closed in
31:37
a comfortable place where you can won't be disturbed by anything like folks or people
31:41
coming in.
31:41
Okay.
31:42
Interesting.
31:43
So can I ask you a question?
31:45
A logical question comes to my mind.
31:47
And I wonder again, I may be off base, but I think I asked not too bad questions often.
31:52
When you talked about the cults, We talked about different states, and now we're talking
31:58
about shamanism, and we're talking about states.
32:02
Do you have a a a comment on that?
32:04
Because I'm thinking, you know, if I'm scared about trying something new, Right?
32:10
You know, that's a logical place that I go, but how kind of help me understand or the who's
32:15
listening, how how it's different.
32:19
This one, I know it's different because it doesn't, like, when when I was in the cult,
32:24
there were, like, there were always constantly instructing you and looking over you and things
32:29
like that and and, you know, so you have to do it exactly like this or whatever.
32:32
And there were so many different things you had to do.
32:35
What I do now is enter into meditation into what's called an alternative state of
32:38
consciousness or alter to the consciousness, and I journey on a person's behalf to wherever
32:43
that soul fragment is.
32:45
And, a shaman generally will travel down through something, an opening in the earth or a
32:52
a body of water or things like that.
32:54
And enter into the subconscious into the collective unconscious into, like, altered
32:59
states.
33:00
And It's not it's not something that I fear at all because I know that my guidance my guides
33:06
are always with me, and I know that I was meant to do this work.
33:10
And there happens sometimes when I've been working with people and stuff that was quite
33:15
scary would come up.
33:16
I wouldn't, you know, I'm not gonna tell the person every single detail of it, but there's
33:21
been some forces and things like that where kinda challenging, but each time I I just know
33:26
somehow I'll make it through and every time I have that, what I'm doing is it's it's a simple
33:33
it's almost like an intention, almost even supersedes the the technique.
33:39
It's like, I wanna clear and free this person, whatever way I am able to or to get them to
33:47
fully express themselves as a as a and express their genius in the world.
33:51
And when I enter into my work, I always say a prayer, let me be a most beloved of all
33:58
beloved's divine source, make me a conduit of all that thou wets to have for this person.
34:05
And I, you know, that's that's what my intention is so that they express themselves in
34:10
all the ways that thou created them to and all that thou hold within thy heart for them.
34:14
To come
34:14
through.
34:14
That kind of stuff.
34:15
That's what I do.
34:16
Like, really positiveness.
34:17
You're looking for the positivity, and the positive energy, but and I would think that,
34:22
you know, with cults, it's it's almost the opposite.
34:26
Right?
34:26
They're trying to take that, that person's individuality or voice or mental space away
34:33
from them.
34:34
And, I know with, you know, being exposed to things like Reiki and things like that, it's
34:40
different, right, because they're person is working.
34:42
I've done also sound therapy.
34:44
I don't know if you've ever been exposed to that, and that's interesting.
34:47
And I and I don't even know how to explain that.
34:50
Other than how fascinating.
34:52
Right?
34:53
Other than there's so you know, I know we're all energy, but, again, going into that space
34:58
to really recognize, like, how can these tuning forks be doing stuff and reading stuff, you
35:04
know, at certain parts of my body and then knowing knowing that you're it or you're
35:08
lighter.
35:09
You know, again, the unconscious and how how little we know about the brain and the body.
35:14
We know so much, but we know so little.
35:18
Right?
35:19
I guess there's there's also the intervention of the spirit, which is what transcends, you
35:23
know, this is this physical form is a wonderful vehicle with traveling in.
35:26
But our spirit is what's eternal.
35:28
And it it is the, like, overarching what we are, but our ego consciousness has such small
35:35
little blinders on it that it doesn't let itself see these things.
35:39
I think that's, like, even with the the the sound therapy you're talking about, the tuning
35:44
fork has to do with vibration all things are about any vibration unless it's, like, absolute
35:47
absolute zero or something to that effect.
35:49
Right.
35:50
Right.
35:50
There must be someone once said, Magic is is only science we haven't discovered yet.
35:57
So I don't know if that if that's entirely true.
35:59
Well, I mean, sometimes you get into these different modalities and you're like, you know,
36:04
when, you know, I've done Reiki before and Mhmm.
36:07
You know, I've had all these massive images in my head, and I'm like, where is this coming
36:12
from?
36:12
Like, you know what I mean?
36:14
Sometimes when you're thinking, wow, it's like, it's like, kinda like when you meditate or I I
36:19
I have lucid dreams, and I think, wow.
36:23
Is this is this happening, or is it am I dreaming?
36:25
Right?
36:26
Like, I mean, I'm asleep.
36:27
I know I'm asleep.
36:28
Yeah.
36:29
But I feel like I've been, like, flying all night or something.
36:32
Right?
36:33
Look.
36:33
So again, all the all the alternatives, and I think in the western word, world were still I
36:38
think we've come a way long way, to accepting a lot of, different non quantifiable things.
36:46
But, you know, we're still not there, like, you know, the eastern world.
36:52
We're getting There's been a
36:53
lot of studies.
36:55
You know, the
36:55
the there's been studies.
36:57
Yes.
36:57
Definitely.
36:57
We are.
36:58
By even, a person, a gentleman named Leonard Laskow, who's a doctor, and he did, like,
37:04
actually on psychic phenomena and how they actually can affect physical matter even over
37:08
distances.
37:09
There's some very interesting articles he wrote about that.
37:11
And he's a PhD, medical doctor or was.
37:15
And he turned he had a sort of an epiphany experience at one time.
37:19
He was unaware of his near death or something, and he ended up leaving.
37:22
Like, he was Harvard educated, like, really, really high credentials and pursued this
37:26
because he was called to.
37:28
So it was kinda an interesting thing because so there I know that eventually we will I don't
37:33
know about figuring everything out, but at least have some more scientific proof of what
37:37
we do psychically.
37:39
The thing is I'm gonna go off on a tiny bit of a a tangent, if you don't mind.
37:42
When I do work on people, especially people who are energy sensitive, they will feel when I'm
37:47
working on certain areas until you can see the same things that I'm seeing.
37:51
And as I'm re recounting to what I saw, they'll be like, I saw exactly the same thing.
37:56
Oh my god.
37:56
That's stuff like that.
37:57
Because we're all on some level.
37:58
We're all one.
37:59
And our, like, our collective unconscious is collective.
38:02
Right?
38:02
And We all somehow un some level can communicate with communicate with communicate
38:07
with one another energetically.
38:09
Right.
38:09
Which I think, wow.
38:11
Right?
38:12
Because I know sometimes when I work with people and I will, you know, I'm, you know, I'm
38:18
a, you know, in that psychotherapist space, and then I Am I, you know, I I am listening.
38:26
But sometimes I feel like, you know, I will say something back to the person in front of me,
38:31
and they'll say, there is no way.
38:33
Where did you get that from?
38:35
And I'm like, I don't know.
38:37
I I wasn't getting lost in your words, and I was just listening on a different level.
38:42
And, I've been told several times that eye channel and whatever however that term is,
38:49
what, you know, I'm not so sure.
38:52
Other than for me, I think I've been doing this kind of work now for how long that I can listen
38:57
and say to me, you're reading my mind.
38:59
And I'm like, no, I'm not.
39:00
In my mind, I'm like, no, I'm not.
39:01
And I'm thinking, Sometimes I feel like I get messages.
39:06
I'm gonna use say messages because I will bring back something to the client that really just
39:12
player something massive that maybe then it's struggling for a while.
39:16
So you again, that collective consciousness is he, you know, when you talk about that and and
39:22
something that I think so little about, you know, in in the I think you are right.
39:27
We're coming along, but the Western world is still so much far removed from it.
39:33
But we've been so so married to science.
39:37
I mean, science is I love science.
39:38
I love discoveries and all that stuff.
39:40
I the only place where I really have a bit of a problem is when, they it starts to say that
39:45
nothing else exists.
39:46
Except what's quantifiable.
39:48
And it it it that, therefore, it's all in your head or some sort of thing.
39:51
There's been so much overwhelming evidence in my own experience in people have spoken to,
39:55
that there is no so no way that this isn't real, that this doesn't actually affect people.
40:00
You know, it that it's it's not psychic.
40:03
That the cult was able to do what they did with me because of that ability to, to interact with
40:11
energetically with each other.
40:14
So tell me, you know, and I I'm gonna pivot because I wish you know what?
40:18
You and I could probably talk for 2 hours at the rate.
40:20
We're going.
40:21
Yeah.
40:21
Yes.
40:22
I would love to hear for you to talk a little bit about your your film career and kind of,
40:27
well, here you are.
40:28
You get this you know, you get this healing.
40:31
How long did you do the healing before you realized?
40:35
I'm all good.
40:35
I know we're always a work in progress but I'm out of the mental health concern and that
40:40
Anya's back, like your like your roommates, and, you know, Your earth angel like you called
40:46
her said that you were back.
40:49
I I think within about a year of my like, the within a year, the gentleman that I that worked
40:57
with me managed to reverse it to such a degree that I could take the shamanic healing course
41:03
and become certified as a as a shamanic healer myself.
41:07
Whether I don't I have not actually been formally assessed, since then.
41:12
So I don't know.
41:13
I couldn't give you a clinical diagnosis or anything like that to substantiate what I say,
41:17
but I know I I mean, I still do suffer from anxiety.
41:20
Some times and some depression and things like that, but I have the tools to mitigate and get
41:25
myself out of it by focusing on what I need to and stuff.
41:28
I I have like, coping strategies and things like that.
41:30
But energetically, like, I think everybody goes through those things.
41:34
Like, you know, when parents start to age, things happen, but the thing is I do bounce
41:39
back.
41:39
And I I know that, every time I go through something, I get stronger.
41:43
I feel that.
41:44
Mhmm.
41:44
So you know, so, like, with yourself, like that it's different because, okay, if we're talking
41:49
to anxiety and depression, if you haven't talked to the average person that has
41:53
experienced or continued to have bouts of that periodically.
41:57
We're all in situations, spaces where we might be a bit anxious.
42:01
Sometimes there's too much going on or we're we're down because, you know, we haven't slept
42:07
well or lots going on in life.
42:08
So I think that but schizophrenia is a completely different thing.
42:14
Right, where, you know, you know, what it's like when you can't focus on your own thoughts.
42:20
Too anxiety and depression, which I, you know, we know can be, oftentimes if it's biological,
42:27
you can you can learn ways.
42:29
And, situationally, most of us can get through it.
42:31
So in my sense, the continuum, mental health and illness schizophrenia is definitely on the
42:37
other end.
42:38
So you would know internally the difference.
42:41
Mhmm.
42:41
And what you're saying is you know that that's spectrum, whether we wanna say it's formal or
42:47
informal that what you're experiencing allows you to function again in the world.
42:53
To a great degree.
42:54
Yes.
42:54
I mean, I I could I do another government off this job kind of thing again?
42:59
I and I don't know.
43:02
But doing what I do, I like, the more I do the shamanic work, the better I feel.
43:07
Like, and and with other people, I don't mean just ignoring myself.
43:09
When I do it with other people, I feel so much better.
43:13
And I, like, when I have the energies running through me and stuff like that, because it's, I
43:16
don't know, it's medicine for both the person and for for the practitioner as well.
43:20
Amazing.
43:21
So tell, I wanna pivot just a little bit because I wanna talk a little bit about the
43:26
film that you did.
43:28
Oh, yes.
43:29
And I tell you know, because again, you know, other than the shamanic healing and where
43:33
you've come from, you've done some fascinating things.
43:36
So tell tell us about, how did you get into film?
43:40
I had no this is right after the illness.
43:43
After I started feeling better.
43:44
I I started getting obsessed with watching movies and and sort of taking them apart and
43:49
stuff like that, what works, what doesn't.
43:51
And a friend of mine just said one day, you know, you should take a film course.
43:56
And I started with a film course in a local I don't know if you want me to if I should say
44:00
names or if I just say I went through a local college and I started realizing how much I
44:05
loved it.
44:06
Oh, sorry.
44:06
It was worked through, through through one of my therapy groups that they had this project
44:13
where you could go and do artwork.
44:15
And I ended up going into studying the film one with that and I I I was totally obsessed with
44:21
it.
44:21
I I went to a local college.
44:23
Now I'm going for my certification in it.
44:25
And I just found myself.
44:28
It's like I I I started thinking creatively.
44:31
All these ideas started coming forth, and I made a short film called emerging from ice into
44:35
fire, which is about my journey.
44:38
It's a poem that's about my journey through mental illness.
44:41
Through the cult and then in through the dark parts and then back up into the light again.
44:47
And it actually got into the rendezvous with madness film festival.
44:51
And it it was my first film, and it was funny, but I have never felt so connected and
45:00
incredibly passionate about anything as much as I did with with creating film.
45:05
And, well, I mean, my shamanic healing work is is a different kind of passion.
45:09
But as far as, like, creative expression goes, I found my niche.
45:12
I found myself.
45:14
Mhmm.
45:14
And even even with my very first film, I just I knew it It was something that I loved and I had
45:19
to do.
45:20
Wow.
45:21
That's an that's amazing to your point, right, to go from where you went to, you know,
45:27
obviously years of struggling and having your son and and and, I mean, and what a motivator
45:33
you know, he was and, you know, for those little angels that come along in our lives and
45:38
that the depth that it took for you to work even harder with mental health, mental illness,
45:44
which is tough, to be able to create something spectacular, which is this film that would help
45:51
I would think millions of people out there that can that have struggled with, with mental,
45:58
mental illness
45:59
That's my the the re the main driving reason why I wanna make Beyond Medicine that the
46:04
actual feature film so that people can see the depth to which a person can go and recover
46:09
from.
46:10
Absolutely.
46:11
Absolutely.
46:12
And it's so important.
46:14
Because we're human beings and we get we get, you know, tarred and feathered as we go along.
46:20
We get knocked around by so I mean, from, I think, you know, the day we're born, we're
46:25
perfect, and then we come into the world.
46:27
And ideally, we know what it takes to, you know, make things safe and secure, but then
46:32
life still has those months.
46:34
So it's about, you know, resilience and learning the elements of that.
46:38
And when it doesn't happen, and we would get into tough times, you know, and you can't
46:43
you're kinda in there and you don't know how to crawl out, be able to see something like this,
46:48
I think, would be a a truly a gift that you give in the world to be able to, for people to
46:52
understand you've been there.
46:53
It's one thing, and me as a practitioner, you know, to be on the other end, right, but to
46:59
actually have somebody go through it and be able to share that wisdom for others who feel
47:04
like there's there's no hope I think that's that's that's the gift that, you give in, in
47:09
making this film.
47:10
And I would love to see it actually.
47:12
It would be an honor to be able to to see something like that.
47:16
Thank you.
47:17
So you've shared so much and I know you and I can do complete full hour again.
47:25
I would like you to tell everyone is kind of if you have any last words, where they can get
47:31
ahold of you because I'm sure there's gonna be a lot of people that might want to reach out
47:36
and experience traumatic healing or just you know, your passion for, you're writing your
47:41
book, and now you're gonna do this feature film, and you've done your shorter ready where
47:46
where can people reach out to you?
47:50
I guess the message I would say, is that even if you're going through something really
47:55
horrible at the moment, that there can be gifts that come through it.
47:59
I mean, I had no idea I could do film.
48:00
I had no idea I could do poetry.
48:02
So many things came through once once I came through this.
48:06
So never give up hope on on your dreams because you never know where the where the universe is
48:11
gonna take you.
48:14
As far as getting in touch with me, I'm at, you can find my website at www.
48:21
Miracle walkerenterprises.com.
48:24
It's a bit of a long one, but miracle it just spelled all in one word.
48:28
Miracle Walker, m I r aclewalkerenterprises.com.
48:36
And, you can also find me on Facebook Anya Sagan.
48:41
And there's also I have some I have, Miracle Walker Enterprises also on Facebook as well.
48:46
I think it's atmiraclewalkershaman.com, the or someone at that at miraclewalker, something
48:51
like that.
48:52
It's anyways, you can find try miracle Walker Enterprises on on Facebook think
48:56
if you just put probably miracle walker and Google, you'll probably be able to find you,
49:01
because it's such a unique, you know, kind of handled.
49:05
So but, Anya, this has been, I can say that, I've interviewed a lot of people, but I think
49:12
truly, I and you know, I talk about early intervention to, you know, prevention.
49:19
And truly, I think this is, 1st of all, the shamanism is something that I think, for me,
49:26
I've not known about but I've always I'm always looking to expose people to different things
49:32
that they can do.
49:33
And definitely, it sounds like this is, something with our collective consciousness
49:37
that, you know, is a gift in the world.
49:40
And for anybody, you know, looking into possibilities.
49:45
Like, it's never, you know, never give up hope, you know, whether it's medical, or spiritual.
49:51
There is always hope and, and, you know, and I'm gonna see my times on you.
49:58
I probably thought, you know, what's and she and, you know, who what is that what?
50:02
And, obviously, her what was her her little boy, and she obviously had good people in her
50:08
life.
50:09
And even though at times it feels like you may not have good people in your life, they are
50:14
there.
50:15
Just look around and I often say when, you know, when you're down and out and you're
50:20
thinking, I can't lift my head any, you know, one more time.
50:24
Remember the people that were there through those times because those are the ones that
50:30
still see it in you, maybe when, potentially when you're lost So, Anya, thanks so much again
50:36
for sharing your wisdom today.
50:37
It has been my pleasure.
50:40
I'm so glad that Carl got us connected and you were able to spend some time with June at my
50:46
event, and I have no doubt that we will stay connected.
50:48
So, again, thank you everyone for tuning in.
50:52
If you're wanting to know more about me, you know, you can go to
50:55
roxanderharsh.comforward/blueprints sign up where you'll have the ability to have a free
51:02
course to help you understand the things that you could do to get more connected to yourself.
51:08
Get be more authentic, be more connected, learn to listen, and then, find the answers, you
51:16
know, a bit at a time.
51:18
Okay.
51:18
Take care, everybody, and hope to chat with you soon.
51:21
Take care, Anya.
51:23
You too.
51:23
Thank you.
51:25
Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
51:30
healthy change.
51:32
Roxanne is a keynote speaker psychotherapist, and coach to work with Roxanne, visit
51:38
rocksandurhaj.com/blue print.
51:42
We'll see you next time on authentic living with Roxanne.