Latest / The Parenting Podcast / Unwrapping Yuletide Realities: Navigating Family Holiday Stress | Ep. 103

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Unwrapping Yuletide Realities: Navigating Family Holiday Stress | Ep. 103 · The Parenting Podcast

• 0:06
  Hello to all you fantastic parents out there, and a heartwarming winter welcome to the Parenting Podcast.
• 0:15
  I'm Cheryl Lang, your friendly parenting podcast elf, and I'm delighted to be back with another episode in our special TPP Yuletide series.
• 0:28
  Today, we're diving into the beautiful, uh, chaos of family holidays.
• 0:35
  While we all dream of that perfect white Christmas, and it's a wonderful white experience, our reality just often falls short, leaving us parents feeling disappointed.
• 0:52
  and stressed.
• 0:53
  Join me and our team as we unwrap the complexities of seasonal stress, discussing the art of setting realistic expectations, finding joy in simplicity, and truly embracing the spirit of the season.
• 1:11
  Get ready for a candid but uplifting conversation that we hope warms your parenting heart.
• 1:18
  Oh, much like a comforting cup of hot cocoa on a cold, wintry day.
• 1:24
  And again, I'm sorry to tell you, my microphone in particular was still glitching when we recorded this, so Thanks for understanding and your patience and maybe next time we'll have that resolved.
• 1:48
  Cheryl: So Okay, it seems that I end up with a question, because we've never discussed it, the really important questions of life as we're getting ready to talk about the holidays.
• 2:00
  Christie: Oh, wow, really?
• 2:01
  Ellen: Oh,
• 2:02
  Christie: huh.
• 2:02
  Cheryl: Okay,
• 2:02
  Cheryl (2): do you you listen to Christmas music?
• 2:05
  Cheryl (2): And if you do how early?
• 2:06
  Cheryl (2): Do you have a line in the sand that it can, I mean, this we talk about the really important things.
• 2:11
  Cheryl: This is an important time.
• 2:12
  Cheryl: Last time in Santa Claus, now it's Christmas music.
• 2:15
  Cheryl: Where do you fall?
• 2:17
  Ellen: I fall.
• 2:18
  Ellen: Stop putting Christmas music on before Thanksgiving is even finished.
• 2:24
  Ellen: I agree.
• 2:24
  Ellen: By the time Christmas comes, especially if I've been out and about, I do not want to hear another Christmas song.
• 2:30
  Ellen: Yes.
• 2:30
  Ellen: And I prefer In my own home, maybe a week before Christmas to start, maybe two, to start listening to Christmas music, but I hate that it's piped in in all the public places by
• 2:42
  Cheryl: Thanksgiving.
• 2:43
  Cheryl: I knew I would be bringing up some really deep feelings.
• 2:46
  Christie: We're different in one way, because I agree, hold off on the Christmas music, but it's because I love it so much.
• 2:52
  Christie: I just want it to be in its own category.
• 2:54
  Christie: Right.
• 2:55
  Christie: My turkey's not digested before I'm thinking about pulling down the tree and getting the Christmas music on.
• 3:01
  Christie: So I do love it, but I want it after the turkey.
• 3:04
  Cheryl: See, I'm, I'm with you, okay?
• 3:06
  Cheryl: I just get so mad going in and hearing it too
• 3:09
  Ellen: early.
• 3:10
  Ellen: And it's usually bad Christmas music in the mall.
• 3:13
  Christie: Yeah, the poppy.
• 3:14
  Christie: Yes.
• 3:14
  Christie: Yeah.
• 3:17
  Cheryl: And so it's, like, I try to start decorating after Thanksgiving and then you have to have Christmas music when you decorate, so I'm good but after Thanksgiving, and I
• 3:25
  Christie: do have it.
• 3:25
  Christie: Black Friday is usually our tree day, and we're ready for all the Christmas things, but to me, like, I want all the brown and the orange for all of November.
• 3:33
  Christie: Me too.
• 3:34
  Christie: And then we can do red and green in December.
• 3:36
  Christie: Right.
• 3:37
  Ellen: Well, you want to take your time and enjoy.
• 3:39
  Ellen: And Christmas, in particular, just gets thrust upon us the minute the turkey's out of the oven.
• 3:45
  Ellen: And, you know, you're just like, I just want to enjoy.
• 3:48
  Ellen: I want to
• 3:49
  Cheryl: savor it also.
• 3:50
  Cheryl: Yes, that's what I'm saying, savoring it.
• 3:52
  Cheryl: I would keep up.
• 3:53
  Cheryl: Fall decorations all year long.
• 3:54
  Cheryl: They're my colors.
• 3:56
  Cheryl: I love them.
• 3:57
  Cheryl: And then, let's all do Christmas, but I want everybody to stay in their corner.
• 4:02
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 4:03
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 4:04
  Cheryl: we might lose some listeners.
• 4:07
  Cheryl: I think that maybe we should go, like, to the White House or the U.
• 4:10
  Cheryl: N.
• 4:11
  Cheryl: And the three of us.
• 4:12
  Cheryl: Get some legislation going.
• 4:13
  Cheryl: Get some legislation on this.
• 4:14
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 4:15
  Cheryl: Um, I understand like Hobby Lobby and all, they have to have Christmas things out, right?
• 4:19
  Cheryl: Yes,
• 4:20
  Christie: the people that are crafting.
• 4:22
  Ellen: But July is really early.
• 4:24
  Cheryl (2): But no music
• 4:26
  Cheryl: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:27
  Ellen: That's, that's, yeah, because it's sad.
• 4:29
  Ellen: It takes away from the specialness of Christmas music if you've been listening to it since before Thanksgiving.
• 4:36
  Ellen: And
• 4:37
  Cheryl: we're teasing about this, but there really are stresses.
• 4:40
  Cheryl: That take away from what we would all like all the holidays to be for ourselves and for our families.
• 4:47
  Cheryl: So how about if we look at that today?
• 4:48
  Cheryl: talk about The reality of stress and expectations and how it works in families and in your own lives.
• 4:59
  Ellen: I think, um, like finances are the biggest stress around the holidays.
• 5:03
  Ellen: Every year I say, I'm going to set aside a Christmas account and start saving.
• 5:07
  Ellen: Of course, I never do.
• 5:08
  Ellen: Or if I do, it doesn't get very full and, you know, just having to manage.
• 5:14
  Ellen: Expectations and, you know, how much we really do have to spend because we have never ever gotten in debt at Christmas or the holidays.
• 5:23
  Ellen: That's been a really big strong role in our personal lives, but just trying to, to manage that and now we're up to 17 grandchildren and trying to figure out, okay, how does all of that work?
• 5:34
  Ellen: And, you know, yeah,
• 5:36
  Christie: Talk about expectations.
• 5:38
  Cheryl: If I just were listening to you and didn't have The cultural reality If I were saying, so you're talking about celebrating Christmas, and Jesus's birthday, and giving thanks at Thanksgiving, and people go into debt over it?
• 5:54
  Cheryl: I mean, it would just sound really antithetical between the two.
• 5:58
  Cheryl: But it is a problem, particularly.
• 6:02
  Cheryl: As family grows or as expectations rise in families.
• 6:07
  Ellen: I think I told you guys this before, I remember one Christmas years ago, um, because we had five children and one of the ladies was sharing how much she spent at Christmas on her two children and my mouth dropped because she spent almost more than we did on five.
• 6:25
  Ellen: Wow.
• 6:25
  Ellen: So I was like, Whoa, what kind of Christmas are those kids getting?
• 6:28
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 6:29
  Ellen: So, you know, it's that expectation.
• 6:31
  Ellen: And sometimes people, if you put your expectations up so high, you can't bring them back down because now all of your kids are expecting it to be the
• 6:42
  Christie: fairytale Christmas.
• 6:43
  Christie: It sets a tone.
• 6:44
  Christie: Like we said on the last episode, you know, whatever you start when your kids are young, just try to keep it sustainable and manageable because like you're saying, then the expectation is set.
• 6:54
  Christie: We, we always did three gifts and stockings for our kids and I.
• 7:00
  Christie: We didn't know that we were doing that intentionally, but I'm glad we did because then as income fluctuates over the years, it wasn't about the amount, you know, they, the girls from their young didn't really notice probably how much we were spending on gifts individually.
• 7:14
  Christie: But, you know, we could just say, you know, the three gifts and that's, that's, you know, sufficient and they have grandparents and all the shenanigans that go on there, but it made it meaningful.
• 7:25
  Christie: And we say
• 7:26
  Ellen: we don't want to make it about.
• 7:28
  Ellen: The stuff, but then we can easily fall into the trap of making it about stuff.
• 7:33
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 7:34
  Cheryl: Yes
• 7:34
  Ellen: So I think if you start looking through your traditions and say, is this about stuff?
• 7:40
  Ellen: Is this about gifts?
• 7:41
  Ellen: I don't want it to be about that.
• 7:43
  Ellen: So let's Let's figure out creative ways, and we can talk about those later, but, you know, creative ways to get away from massive gift giving to people giving.
• 7:53
  Cheryl: Right.
• 7:53
  Cheryl: I was just thinking when we're talking about it again, looking at it, we talk about values and establishing family values all the time here TPP.
• 8:03
  Cheryl: I mean, whatever it is, whether it's going to bed or what you eat or how you educate or how you correct your children.
• 8:10
  Cheryl: It's all about figure out your values and let's live out our values and yet it is so easy to get way off base when it comes to holidays and you just get consumed with more or better or bigger or
• 8:25
  Ellen: prettier.
• 8:26
  Ellen: Oh, that magazine looks gorgeous or that, that show on TV with the way they set their table.
• 8:32
  Ellen: Those are always my problem.
• 8:34
  Ellen: Oh, that was so pretty.
• 8:35
  Ellen: I want to make it like that.
• 8:36
  Ellen: Yes.
• 8:37
  Cheryl: And the feeling of personally feeling your failure if you can't do what everybody else does.
• 8:44
  Cheryl: Or you can't produce it.
• 8:46
  Cheryl: You know, we've had a lot of years, a whole lot of years, where finances were a real reality to us.
• 8:52
  Cheryl: And I would just tell you for a number of years, um, I shopped all year for Christmas.
• 9:00
  Cheryl: And so what I would do is, Grudge sales and thrift stores and estate sales, and I would buy nice things, but then store them, but at, you know, pennies on the dollar, um, having to do that so we could really have fun, but I was aware of the budget, and I just, uh, there were years where I would have to budget For Thanksgiving, because we had a very small budget, So I would encourage families to really try and keep your values in front of you, because I love the idea that you instill the values in your children, not the gifts.
• 9:40
  Cheryl: Because nobody regularly asks
• 9:42
  Cheryl (2): what did
• 9:42
  Cheryl: you get Last year
• 9:43
  Cheryl (2): Right, right.
• 9:43
  Cheryl (2): Oh, usually
• 9:44
  Ellen: they can't remember at the end of the month, but all they got, you know.
• 9:48
  Cheryl: At the day, Christmas.
• 9:48
  Christie: Yeah, that's true.
• 9:50
  Christie: That's true.
• 9:50
  Christie: Yes.
• 9:51
  Christie: Well, I think, too, another thing I've thought of and observed is, you know, we can say with our mouths the values we have, you know, of giving and generosity at Christmas and then maybe be a little bit frustrated that our kids aren't catching on to that.
• 10:08
  Christie: And if that's the case, maybe look at if we're saying those things all year round.
• 10:13
  Christie: Oh, that's good.
• 10:13
  Christie: You know, if those are our values, then they should be year round values.
• 10:18
  Christie: And that might help in our kids for it to actually come to fruition a little bit more And then the expectations aren't set so high with our kids.
• 10:28
  Christie: I remember
• 10:30
  Cheryl: there had been a ministry that one of my daughters, starting in her early teens, would go and serve.
• 10:36
  Cheryl: Um, to people of a needy financial situation where she could bless them serving in it.
• 10:42
  Cheryl: But, after doing it for a number of years, they finally really, it was, they had so many people volunteering, particularly Christmas.
• 10:54
  Cheryl: Um, the same thing with Thanksgiving like serving a Thanksgiving dinner to people who didn't have one.
• 11:00
  Cheryl: And the problem is, So many people, Offering to serve at that time of year that they said, well, we really kind of don't need you anymore.
• 11:10
  Cheryl: And So we tried to do what you're talking about is, well, what can we do the other 11 months of the year rather than just
• 11:19
  Ellen: at the holidays.
• 11:20
  Christie: And, you know, like with gift giving, we didn't necessarily buy a lot of toys and things for our kids throughout the year.
• 11:28
  Christie: And so they were pretty content to get.
• 11:32
  Christie: That sounds awful to get anything, they had what they needed, but we weren't ones that every time we went to Target they got something new.
• 11:38
  Christie: And so I think that helped too, to keep those expectations minimized at Christmas and.
• 11:45
  Christie: So,
• 11:46
  Cheryl: what would y'all say to parents what are some of
• 11:49
  Cheryl (2): other
• 11:49
  Cheryl: stressors that families feel or outward expectations on them from society?
• 11:55
  Cheryl: What do y'all think are the things that are, that our families that are listening to go, oh, that's our reality?
• 12:01
  Christie: Comparison.
• 12:02
  Christie: Yeah.
• 12:03
  Christie: It's a big one.
• 12:03
  Christie: Comparing to your kids friends.
• 12:06
  Christie: It's really, yeah.
• 12:06
  Christie: You know, traditions, comparing to other family members, what's your brother in law's family's doing or your, you know, cousin's family's doing.
• 12:15
  Cheryl: And like we always say, that...
• 12:18
  Cheryl: That was always here, but now with social media, everybody
• 12:24
  Christie: can, yeah, have access to people's lives in ways that, you know, you see every good thing of their lives and you don't see that they had a full on meltdown getting that pretty bow in the hair and the tree done and, and it's not just financial, you know, it's the, the standard that we see is just.
• 12:45
  Christie: Excellence and perfection everywhere.
• 12:48
  Cheryl: And because of social media, Yeah.
• 12:50
  Cheryl: They can show the excellence and make it look like they did it without any effort.
• 12:56
  Cheryl: Mm hmm.
• 12:57
  Cheryl: Well, all you see is the end result.
• 12:58
  Cheryl: Right.
• 12:59
  Cheryl: See, like, Ellen, how many different kinds of cookies did you traditionally make in the Christmas season?
• 13:04
  Cheryl: I
• 13:04
  Ellen: think I made, like, 12 different types of, varieties of cookies, I
• 13:09
  Cheryl: think, at least.
• 13:10
  Cheryl: And I knew it personally, but with social media, you see that and think, Oh, my children and we are losing out because we only make sugar cookies, you know, maybe And you know, Cheryl,
• 13:20
  Ellen: sometimes I would feel really bad because I'm one of those people that enjoys doing that and it doesn't feel like work.
• 13:26
  Ellen: And it's the same with like decorating.
• 13:28
  Ellen: And people would come over and see my table at Christmas.
• 13:33
  Ellen: Then I would, I realized, oh, that actually made them feel bad.
• 13:37
  Ellen: It made them feel lesser because they didn't do it.
• 13:40
  Ellen: So I always felt like I had to explain, no, I really love doing this.
• 13:44
  Ellen: This is really fun.
• 13:45
  Ellen: You know, I don't, I don't mind the time.
• 13:48
  Ellen: It's just something that I
• 13:49
  Cheryl: enjoy doing.
• 13:50
  Cheryl: Yeah, because for me to do those 12 different kinds cookies, I'd have to start in February.
• 13:56
  Cheryl: For the fall and Christmas.
• 13:57
  Cheryl: And It wouldn't be fun.
• 14:00
  Cheryl: But the things I did that I enjoy, you know, that are me, the maturity and the self awareness to go, I need to express myself and not feel that pressure and I just really have compassion because it was bad enough in the past, but there's just so much pressure with social media and the expectations just keep rising and rising and rising.
• 14:27
  Cheryl: Well,
• 14:27
  Christie: and then we find ourselves doing things, stressed out about it, and then it's supposed to be a blessing for our family, but we're barking at them for, you know, messing up whatever we've created.
• 14:37
  Christie: Crying in the corner because you're so tired and stressed.
• 14:40
  Christie: And then there's no, no blessing at all by the end of it.
• 14:44
  Christie: And I think it's
• 14:45
  Ellen: important to take inventory.
• 14:47
  Ellen: of what you like to do.
• 14:49
  Ellen: And if you're the main person that's doing it, with maybe a little help from the kids, pick those things that really are important to you and bring you joy.
• 14:57
  Ellen: Maybe each kid has one thing that they like and work together.
• 15:01
  Ellen: Because I realized over the years, I just started taking things off the inventory because nobody really cared.
• 15:06
  Ellen: But the things that they did care about, I might have cared.
• 15:09
  Ellen: and i might have enjoyed doing it, but I realized nobody cared that I made this.
• 15:13
  Ellen: So why am I wasting my time?
• 15:15
  Ellen: And I could, I could be more, because my kids would say, well, mom you're usually so tired by the time that everything's done.
• 15:21
  Ellen: But to me that didn't bother me because what I was doing was the gift.
• 15:26
  Ellen: And so for my personality, doing all those things was a gift to my family, making the cookies, setting a beautiful table.
• 15:34
  Ellen: That wasn't like for my ego.
• 15:35
  Ellen: It was like this.
• 15:36
  Ellen: I love you.
• 15:37
  Ellen: I want to give this.
• 15:38
  Ellen: Yes.
• 15:38
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 15:39
  Ellen: That was part of
• 15:40
  Cheryl: it.
• 15:40
  Cheryl: Well, and, you know, everyone would agree it's family time and relationships that really
• 15:46
  Cheryl (2): matter.
• 15:47
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 15:47
  Cheryl: I mean, regardless, and, and so I would really encourage just what you're saying, taking inventory.
• 15:54
  Cheryl: Are we living that
• 15:55
  Cheryl (2): out?
• 15:55
  Cheryl (2): Mm hmm.
• 15:56
  Cheryl (2): Or are we mad dashing all the time?
• 15:59
  Cheryl (2): Yeah.
• 16:00
  Cheryl (2): Or trying to make...
• 16:01
  Cheryl (2): that invisible other audience happy instead of choosing to delight in this moment.
• 16:09
  Cheryl (2): And I would encourage everybody look for simplicity.
• 16:12
  Ellen: that's a good point Right
• 16:13
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 16:13
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 16:14
  Cheryl: And so that you can have the fun of having like we used to keep in the corner a card table and have an ongoing jigsaw puzzle over the holidays to do that.
• 16:25
  Cheryl: And I mean, it's a simple thing, but just, Too much of the distraction of too much and go, go, go, go, go, go.
• 16:33
  Cheryl: And
• 16:34
  Ellen: simplicity is a vogue right now.
• 16:36
  Ellen: It's in style.
• 16:37
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 16:38
  Ellen: People are realizing I want to keep things simple.
• 16:41
  Ellen: So you can look around and go, I can do something.
• 16:43
  Ellen: I can set a lovely table, but it can be simple.
• 16:45
  Ellen: Right.
• 16:46
  Ellen: And
• 16:46
  Christie: you can incorporate that into your traditions too.
• 16:50
  Christie: One thing I've always done for myself, for sanity, is after the tree is decorated, after, you know, The dust has settled from Thanksgiving.
• 16:59
  Christie: Usually everyone's starting to like, you know, just want to lay around.
• 17:02
  Christie: And yeah, I escape and go and buy my wrapping paper.
• 17:06
  Christie: That that's my thing.
• 17:07
  Christie: I get a coffee and I just roam a slowly around Hobby Lobby and I look slowly at every roll of wrapping paper and decide which patterns I want to use that year.
• 17:17
  Christie: And that's something that I can just catch my breath from Thanksgiving.
• 17:21
  Christie: Before we move into December, and it's just a little moment of quiet, and it's not a list that I'm trying to get everything done, and I'm not in a rush, and so I think you can find little things like that, and like for your family, we do a movie night at least once in December, and that's a tradition, but it's not stressful, you know, we're just vegging in front of the TV, but it feels like we're doing Christmassy
• 17:44
  Cheryl: things.
• 17:44
  Cheryl: And I just love that because you two are the decorators and the party girls, and I mean, the cookies both of you can make and, and you love thinking through your wrapping
• 17:56
  Cheryl (2): paper.
• 17:57
  Cheryl (2): I would never think through wrapping paper.
• 18:00
  Cheryl (2): I would just go, Oh, that's cheap.
• 18:01
  Cheryl (2): I'll get it.
• 18:02
  Cheryl (2): I don't mind it.
• 18:02
  Cheryl (2): You have to stay with your feet, right?
• 18:06
  Cheryl: And what I want to do is convey, do what works for you.
• 18:11
  Cheryl: Like the old me would hear this and think, Oh my goodness, my children are missing out, our family's missing out, because I'm not doing ten different kinds of cookies, I'm supposed to have a theme in my wrapping paper?
• 18:22
  Cheryl: I didn't realize that.
• 18:24
  Cheryl: And I want everybody to have the freedom to do what you enjoy.
• 18:29
  Ellen: I remember my daughter one time went to a party and she came home and she was maybe 10.
• 18:34
  Ellen: She goes, gosh, mom, it was a fun party, but they didn't have a theme.
• 18:39
  Ellen: And
• 18:39
  Christie: I was like, oh.
• 18:40
  Christie: But see, if it's your thing, it comes naturally and it's not hard.
• 18:44
  Christie: It brings you joy, like we were saying a minute ago.
• 18:47
  Christie: And that's just.
• 18:48
  Christie: One of those silly things.
• 18:49
  Christie: Now, I, you know, someone brings a gift in a wrapping paper that doesn't match my tree.
• 18:53
  Christie: I, I acknowledge that in my mind, but I don't throw it out.
• 18:57
  Cheryl (2): So you move it to the back
• 19:00
  Christie: Or we unwrap it first or.
• 19:02
  Christie: I'm teasing.
• 19:02
  Christie: I'm teasing.
• 19:04
  Cheryl: You know, but I'm going to say particularly because finances were a real challenge for a lot of our years and my children
• 19:12
  Cheryl (2): being raised and.
• 19:15
  Cheryl (2): It really does matter the time you spend being together and keeping those priorities.
• 19:21
  Cheryl (2): And even if you had all the money, I would say don't spend the money.
• 19:26
  Cheryl: Look for fun things you can do.
• 19:28
  Cheryl: That we go and we look at Christmas lights or like Christmas caroling and whatever.
• 19:34
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 19:34
  Cheryl: Yeah, you know, like.
• 19:35
  Cheryl: Last year here where we live in Edmond, we started a downtown Christmas Carol thing.
• 19:42
  Cheryl: Mm-Hmm.
• 19:42
  Cheryl: that
• 19:42
  Cheryl (2): the whole community came to And I have it on my calendar.
• 19:47
  Cheryl (2): To me that is fantastic Mm-Hmm.
• 19:50
  Cheryl (2): I want to go and be a part of something like that.
• 19:53
  Cheryl (2): And.
• 19:53
  Cheryl (2): In the past, we've gone with different groups and gone to nursing homes and things, and, and to me, that's a lot of joy.
• 20:02
  Cheryl (2): Yeah, I
• 20:05
  Christie: think it's just a matter of...
• 20:06
  Christie: Prioritizing whatever does give you rest in the midst of the season.
• 20:11
  Ellen: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 20:12
  Christie: And doesn't bring stress for you and for your family.
• 20:16
  Christie: And making sure those things are on the calendar and in the midst of all the busyness that can creep in.
• 20:21
  Cheryl: So what are some
• 20:22
  Cheryl (2): other
• 20:22
  Cheryl: ways you can think of to help families manage stress and manage expectations?
• 20:29
  Cheryl: One of the things...
• 20:30
  Cheryl: Uh, I didn't do really well that I'm trying to do better is open communication that we say, hey, Let's sit down and talk about what's different or how it's changed, somebody's got
• 20:43
  Cheryl (2): married or whatever the situation and talk early about it and say, let's look at what we're doing before the crunch.
• 20:53
  Cheryl (2): So we don't all feel we have to do something.
• 20:55
  Cheryl: Well, that's what I'm getting
• 20:56
  Ellen: ready to do.
• 20:57
  Ellen: It's just not quite November yet as we're recording this.
• 21:00
  Ellen: But I'm getting ready to talk to each of my kids and say, what do you want to do for Thanksgiving?
• 21:05
  Ellen: Are you going to be here?
• 21:06
  Ellen: Because they're all married.
• 21:07
  Ellen: You're going to be here.
• 21:08
  Ellen: What do you want to do?
• 21:09
  Ellen: Then I do the same with Christmas.
• 21:10
  Ellen: I'll do it in that same talk.
• 21:12
  Ellen: Are you going to be in town?
• 21:13
  Ellen: Don't you want to come up here?
• 21:15
  Ellen: So that allows them if they want to host Christmas this year or they want to do something different and everybody knows there's no obligation or expectation to come to mom and dad's house and do everything with us because that's the freedom we gave them when they became adults.
• 21:29
  Ellen: Do what's fun.
• 21:30
  Cheryl: Okay,
• 21:30
  Cheryl (2): that makes me think of something you told me, and I thought it was brilliant.
• 21:34
  Cheryl (2): I've never heard it anywhere else.
• 21:36
  Cheryl (2): Tell us about it.
• 21:37
  Christie: Yeah, I read this book, um, this woman wrote on kind of empty nesting and releasing your kids.
• 21:43
  Christie: And she said that when her children were engaged with their Christmas gifts, she would wrap up a box, a gift box with a bow on it.
• 21:52
  Christie: And inside was a little piece of paper that just said the word freedom.
• 21:55
  Christie: And what it was, was the gift of freedom to her married kids to just not have any expectations.
• 22:03
  Christie: Yeah.
• 22:03
  Christie: Like you're saying, Ellen, as far as when to be at which holiday and, you know, spend, you have to spend every holiday the same way we've always done it.
• 22:10
  Christie: And, and she was even saying, and I feel this way too.
• 22:13
  Christie: We'll celebrate on New Year's Day.
• 22:15
  Christie: I don't care.
• 22:16
  Christie: You know, we can rearrange whatever we need to do.
• 22:18
  Christie: I just want to be with you and I just loved that idea.
• 22:21
  Christie: Now, you know, it's, it's easier to say that beautiful idea and then have to digest the emotions behind it.
• 22:29
  Christie: But The action can go forward first, and then you can get in line.
• 22:34
  Cheryl: My son and his new bride won't be listening to this, I'm sure.
• 22:39
  Cheryl: And so that's exactly what I'm going to do with them when they come.
• 22:42
  Cheryl: They're coming for Thanksgiving, and then they won't be there for Christmas.
• 22:46
  Cheryl: But what a beautiful way to love your family.
• 22:51
  Cheryl: Because if that's our priority, is to love.
• 22:54
  Cheryl (2): I have to be willing to lay down my rights, to lay down my expectations, and what I really enjoy, to love my family well.
• 23:05
  Cheryl (2): Right.
• 23:05
  Cheryl: and I do want us to talk next time about the changing dynamics of family, but just this, to give everybody the freedom, it's also a problem
• 23:13
  Cheryl (2): when it's The first, the oldest one, that's spreading wings, and it's hard on the younger ones.
• 23:20
  Cheryl: Right.
• 23:21
  Cheryl: Yes, it is.
• 23:22
  Cheryl: It's hard because it messes with their traditions.
• 23:26
  Cheryl: So I love this idea of talking about it instead of not talking about it.
• 23:31
  Cheryl: In the past, I haven't been so good about that saying, you know, how do you feel about that?
• 23:35
  Cheryl: Let's talk about this.
• 23:36
  Cheryl: Mm-Hmm.
• 23:37
  Cheryl: because I avoided conflict.
• 23:40
  Cheryl: Mm-Hmm.
• 23:40
  Cheryl (2): And this would bring up conflict, you know, well, it's not fair because we always do this and now they're doing this.
• 23:46
  Cheryl: And, and I was just bad about it because I go, if we don't talk about it, we won't have conflict.
• 23:52
  Cheryl: We'll just all get through this.
• 23:53
  Cheryl: Right?
• 23:54
  Cheryl: And
• 23:54
  Christie: the
• 23:54
  Ellen: current underneath is yes, not pleasant.
• 23:57
  Ellen: Right.
• 23:57
  Cheryl: And I'm changing that.
• 23:58
  Cheryl: That's a new tradition now.
• 24:00
  Cheryl: I want to
• 24:00
  Cheryl (2): say, hey, let's talk about how you feel and work through it
• 24:03
  Cheryl: Even if it can't be resolved with a really beautiful Christmas bow that matches everything under the tree.
• 24:09
  Ellen: But you can communicate.
• 24:10
  Ellen: I'm doing the best I can.
• 24:12
  Ellen: We'll have to all be flexible.
• 24:14
  Ellen: Right.
• 24:14
  Ellen: You know, because that's the reality of it, especially as our kids get older, and they're going different places and want different things.
• 24:21
  Ellen: We, as the parents, have to be willing to be open handed and say, Freedom.
• 24:25
  Ellen: Mm hmm.
• 24:26
  Ellen: I love that.
• 24:27
  Ellen: And enjoy that they're doing it.
• 24:29
  Ellen: I mean, we've had times where it's just been Mike and I.
• 24:32
  Ellen: Mm hmm.
• 24:32
  Ellen: Even though we had a big family, everybody was doing stuff, and we still had fun.
• 24:36
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 24:36
  Ellen: It just was, it was quiet.
• 24:38
  Ellen: But it was just, it was really different.
• 24:40
  Ellen: But it wasn't.
• 24:41
  Ellen: Life crushing.
• 24:42
  Christie: Right.
• 24:42
  Christie: Well, and what I've been thinking too is, you know, I can, I can be like you Cheryl, where I avoid the confrontation.
• 24:49
  Christie: I don't want to have the talk.
• 24:51
  Christie: But, you know, I I could either be gracious and generous with the traditions and the holidays.
• 24:57
  Christie: Right.
• 24:58
  Christie: Or I could guilt them into coming.
• 25:00
  Christie: Yes.
• 25:00
  Christie: And they will come and they will, you know, present all whatever has to take.
• 25:05
  Christie: And then the other 364 days will have tension.
• 25:09
  Christie: And like you said, that undercurrent of resentment.
• 25:11
  Christie: Mm-Hmm.
• 25:11
  Christie: Mm-Hmm.
• 25:12
  Christie: And I don't want that.
• 25:13
  Christie: Right.
• 25:13
  Christie: Mm-Hmm.
• 25:14
  Cheryl: and Ellen, you brought it up and said, well.
• 25:17
  Cheryl: It
• 25:17
  Cheryl (2): may just be Mike and me at home.
• 25:20
  Cheryl (2): And so I'm thinking, because I have been a single parent for a long time, to think about those.
• 25:29
  Cheryl (2): Who don't have everybody around the tree, and particularly I have some friends that are recently divorced and so they're into a whole new dynamic for us to be thinking about them and remembering them, even if it's just a text, but to remember those who might be all alone because they're, maybe their children are married and this is the first year without the kids, whatever it is, whether it's a divorce, or just the growing kids that's a place where I can think about other people and reach out
• 26:02
  Ellen: Yeah, that's a good point you'd be surprised at how many people are alone at Christmas.
• 26:06
  Ellen: It's really shocking, you know, that didn't make plans or couldn't make plans, especially because we were a military family.
• 26:13
  Ellen: There were lots of times like the single military men that we knew couldn't go home or didn't want to go home or whatever.
• 26:19
  Ellen: So they're going to be in the dorm.
• 26:22
  Ellen: You know, which is almost empty at the holidays, eating in the chow hall, you know.
• 26:27
  Ellen: So there was always a good opportunity to invite people, you know, Hey, whoever's, I mean, we'd have friends from the dorm.
• 26:34
  Ellen: They would go and I'd say, don't come unless you get everybody out of the dorm.
• 26:38
  Ellen: So they would find a couple of lone people in there and we didn't, nobody knew them, but by the end of Christmas dinner,
• 26:44
  Cheryl: everybody knew him.
• 26:45
  Cheryl: Well, and we're talking about stress and expectations.
• 26:48
  Cheryl: And when start in my mind thinking like that
• 26:51
  Cheryl (2): that it brings joy.
• 26:53
  Cheryl (2): Yeah.
• 26:53
  Cheryl (2): And otherness.
• 26:55
  Cheryl (2): To think of other people lowers my stress and helps me eliminate my selfish expectations because expectations are all about me.
• 27:04
  Cheryl (2): Right.
• 27:04
  Cheryl (2): And so it helps me to actually be thinking of other people.
• 27:08
  Cheryl: And so that would help me.
• 27:10
  Cheryl: I didn't do it to help my stress, but it helps.
• 27:13
  Cheryl: That's good.
• 27:14
  Cheryl: And doing all the
• 27:15
  Ellen: stuff for the holidays, to me, is that gift I'm giving.
• 27:19
  Ellen: So it's fun to work in the kitchen.
• 27:21
  Ellen: I mean, sometimes it's tiring.
• 27:22
  Ellen: But, you know, it's fun because it's a gift.
• 27:25
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 27:25
  Ellen: I'm giving them this really nice dinner.
• 27:28
  Ellen: Now, most of the time everybody appreciates it, but if they don't, it doesn't matter.
• 27:32
  Ellen: That was my gift.
• 27:33
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 27:33
  Cheryl: I like that
• 27:34
  Cheryl (2): Obviously haven't gotten to get all we want to talk about
• 27:38
  Cheryl: Um, so we're going to have to wrap up and we'll come back next time and talk some more.
• 27:43
  Ellen: Yeah, and I think, you know, we just got to talk a little bit about this, but the whole point is the holidays should be about others, not about us.
• 27:52
  Ellen: But what we can do, it gives us a perfect time to reach into someone's life that maybe at another time in the year we couldn't.
• 27:58
  Ellen: And invite them over, do things with them, say hello, whatever it is, um, and
• 28:04
  Cheryl: everybody's comfortable.
• 28:05
  Cheryl: Or even just acknowledge.
• 28:06
  Cheryl (2): I realize that this holiday for you is going to be hard.
• 28:09
  Cheryl (2): Whether it's, they've lost a family member, or their situation has changed through divorce,
• 28:15
  Ellen: people are really hurting at the holidays, and I think we don't ever think about it if we're happy.
• 28:20
  Ellen: You know, if we're, you know, we're enjoying the holidays,
• 28:22
  Cheryl: but if I'm all me focused, yeah, how can I be happier?
• 28:26
  Cheryl: Yeah, I want people to please me.
• 28:28
  Cheryl: Mm hmm.
• 28:29
  Cheryl: And so I love that.
• 28:30
  Cheryl: Okay, so we'll come back and look at maybe some of the dynamics that happened within families at Christmas Okay, that'll be fun So parents As always, remember, hang in there.
• 28:44
  Cheryl: Keep loving, keep persevering because it's worth it.
• 28:54
  As we conclude our exploration of family holidays, remember that the true spirit of Christmas goes beyond extravagant gifts or opulent decorations and grand celebrations.
• 29:09
  Instead, It's rooted in the values we live out and pass on to our children.
• 29:18
  Simplifying our approach allows us to focus on what truly matters amidst the yuletide rush and the overwhelming displays, especially with social media.
• 29:29
  In the middle of all this festive whirlwind, I want to encourage you to pause and reflect on what genuinely brings you joy during this season of celebration.
• 29:43
  And consider that profound gift of freedom we discussed.
• 29:47
  A powerful force for cultivating meaningful connections, especially with our grown children looking ahead, our next episode unravels the ever changing tapestry of family dynamics during the holidays.
• 30:02
  I extend an invitation for you to join that conversation, a journey of equipping, empowering.
• 30:09
  And finding hope in every season of parenting.
• 30:14
  Feel free to share your thoughts, experiences, or innovative holiday approaches with us on our website, social media, or by email.
• 30:24
  Contact at TheParentingPodcast.
• 30:27
  com Thank you for being a special part of the TPP community.
• 30:32
  Until our next rendezvous, take care, stay connected, and seek joy.