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Write Your First Nonfiction Book with Honorée Corder: The 5 Stages · The Daily Writer

• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Daily Rider Podcast, where we bring you tips and inspiration each day to help you build habits for writing success.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: For more resources, including your free Daily Rider Starter Kit, visit DailyWriterLife.com.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm super excited because here in the podcast this week, we're doing a series celebrating the launch of Honore Corter's new book called Write Your First Nonfiction Book, A Primer for Aspiring Authors.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: And this is exciting to me because people talk to me all the time about their desire to write a book.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: Most of the time, and it's it's a nonfiction book.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: So this is the exact resource that you need to get rolling with writing that first nonfiction book.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: It gives you a very simple pathway for doing that thing that you've been dreaming about for a long time.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Now in today's episode, Honore is going to help us understand the five stages that you will go through as you write your first book.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think this is a great insight that I don't really hear many people talking about.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: So you're really going to enjoy this because it's going to help you understand part of the uh, I guess what I would call the emotional landscape as you write this book, because there are highs and there are lows, and then there are highs again and so forth.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: And she'll go into all that in this conversation.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and of course she's brilliant as she always is.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: But this is really important because you need to kind of understand what lies ahead before you embark on this journey.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: You can grab, write your first nonfiction book on Amazon, and I also recommend signing up for her email list, which is uh which you can get at honorequarter.com.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: Now she does a daily email just like I do, so uh, you know, I'm I'm always kind of careful about recommending that you sign up for different people's email lists because I only want you to get stuff that's truly, truly helpful.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: But hers is stuff that literally every single day, it's like a little nugget of gold landing in your inbox.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's really, really good stuff, and I promise you're gonna love it.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Now, before I get to the interview, I want to mention that we've got five copies of the print book available to give away.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: And the first five people to leave a review of the Daily Rider Podcast on Apple Podcast will get a copy of the print book in the mail.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: All you've got to do is leave a review, take a screenshot, and email it to me at Kent at DailyRiderLife.com along with your mailing address, and I will be thrilled to dropy to dropy, to drop.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I haven't had any caffeine y today, can you tell?
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I will be thrilled to drop a copy.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: Now I've got the giggles.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I'll be happy to drop a copy of the book in the mail.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: I should record this whole segment over again, but I'm not gonna.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just gonna leave it right there.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so without further ado, I am excited to bring you part two of this conversation with Honore Corter.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: This is really good stuff.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: As always, thanks for tuning in.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Here we go.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back, Honore.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: This is round two.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: I make it sound like this is a boxing match, but it's we're not boxing, we're just talking.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, where's the we where's the guy with the bell?
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: I've never boxed in my life.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: I probably get knocked out in like three seconds flat, no doubt.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, um, speaking of boxing, that's a terrible transition, but I'm just gonna go with it.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, speaking of things that involve enthusiasm and energy, we're talking about your brand new book.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: Write your first nonfiction book, which I absolutely love.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things that you talk about, this is specifically in chapter three, is and I and I love these five things because they're really fascinating.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: You talk about going through each of these five stages of kind of these different emotions as you write your first nonfiction book.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: So you talk about excitement, self-doubt, disbelief, and overwhelm, the aha moment and delight, I did it.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: And you mentioned a minute ago before I hit record that these come from the stages of grief.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm I'm just curious if you can expand on this.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: I think this is really fascinating.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I've never never heard anybody talk about it this way before.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well, because someone goes through the stages, and if you go through the loss of someone in whatever way, death, divorce, right, or something happens, you go through certain stages, and any therapist will say, You're gonna go through these stages, and if you're me, you go, No, I'm fine.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm fine, really.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm fine, really.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's fine.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: I, you know, I'm not I'm not angry, I'm not sad.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not angry, I'm not angry, I'm not you know, like, but of course, they're textbook because they apply.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so, as someone who has written several books and have worked with authors who have written several books, and also there is an author I follow who has applied uh the process of buying something, of buying real estate as going through these stages, he can say, Oh, wait, this is when someone goes, Oh, snap, I just spent five spent$15 million.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm freaking out.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: So he has his own stages and they resemble the stages of grief.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so when I was thinking about what do these resemble, knowing about the stages of grief, I went and looked them up and thought, sure enough, there is a there is a similar path that authors grow go through, aspiring authors go through on their way to publishing.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's really interesting because we think of writing a book and publishing as a positive thing, but obviously stages of grief is related to a loss of some kind.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: Where do you see the connection between those two things emotionally?
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: Writing a book and then losing someone that they they both involve loss.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: They vol they both involve stages.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: They both involve going through stages that are that are clear to see from the outside.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: Not not necessarily the fact that there that there's grief, but there are five stages, and I've been through them, and then I watch my authors go through them and anyone I'm working with, and I don't all go, oh, you're angry.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: I don't say, oh, you just had your aha moment, you're almost there.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: I just focus on you're gonna love being an author because that last phase, right?
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: That last stage is, I did it, I'm thrilled.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so you have to stay focused on that, otherwise you're gonna give up when you feel like this is too hard.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: I can't do this, this is for other people, when all that self-doubt kicks in that we were talking about, you know, in the previous conversation.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: Why do you think we get into we we get partway into a book project?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Where does this disbelief and overwhelm come from?
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: Because we start out excited.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: Why does that, why or how does that shift into such a negative sort of space about halfway through?
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: Well, part of it is the I think part of it is the the limiting beliefs that we hold about our ability to do something, and then also where books are put in the hierarchy of accomplishments in society.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because being an author is like, wow, that's really awesome.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like, if you're an author, you must be someone special.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: And if someone doesn't have self-confidence and belief in themselves, they're gonna go, well, I can't really be an author.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I can speak to that because it was after I had published my seventh book, I was at a networking event and I was with someone and we were meeting people.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the guys said, What do you do?
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: That I met, and I said, Oh, I'm a I'm a business and executive coach and I'm a speaker.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: And the person who was with me said, and she's an author.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: And the guy said, You're an author?
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, Oh, yeah.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: And after that conversation ended, my friend leaned over to me and she said, You know, you could lead with that.
• 7:43
  unknown: Wow.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: You could leave with that.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's really insane.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_01: I said, Well, but I'm a self-published author, I'm a lowercase W writer, I'm not a capital W writer like people who went to college or took writing classes or have their MFA.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just a little honore with a with a few self-published books.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: And she's like, I'm sorry, let's try that again.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: And then then subsequent to that, because I was thinking about our conversation this morning while I was working out.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I have someone I have to thank, I'm going to thank her publicly right now.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: Deborah Koontz is the author of a fiction series, the lucky series, set in Las Vegas.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I met her at a uh, she's a a former lawyer, now a full-time writer, and she was speaking at a gathering for lawyers.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I got invited by one of my clients.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so she was talking and she had this um, the first book in the series that she had released, and it was it's want to get lucky.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a fun, sexy murder mystery series set in Las Vegas.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: So it's very, very fun.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: And I became friends with her, and she read a couple of my books, and and I said, you know, I'm this lowercase W writer, and she goes, Honey, you're a writer.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_01: So you're a capital W writer and you need to own it.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, Oh, well, okay.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I felt validated by her because she was a capital W writer, she was traditionally published, she had a law degree, so it's obviously very smart and very accomplished.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: In my mind, I don't have any of those boxes at this time.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: And so I wasn't comparing myself to her in terms of like, oh, I'm not good enough to talk to her.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: I just was thinking, well, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna be in my place.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna know my place and be in my place, and I'm okay with my place.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: But like when someone would ask me about it, I was like, no, no, no.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just a I'm just, you know, I'm the little W writer over here, just you know, like the cat on the keyboard having a good time.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: But I know my place.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm not gonna presume to be, you know, equivalent or a peer.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm an aspirant, I'm not a I'm not a peer.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: And she was like, oh no, that that nope, that doesn't work.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it was just like my friend who said, You're a writer, you're an author, you need to lead with that because that's cool.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_01: And it and sure, sure as as you know, the sun rises, every time I meet someone and they ask me what I do, and I tell them I'm an author, or they see my name on a book, they're like, This is so cool.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: It never doesn't get old, and it also doesn't stop.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think the the average reader, because the those of us who spend a lot of our times in in the book world, there's a lot of debate about self-publishing and traditional publishing and hybrid, and there's a lot of discussion around that and the pluses and minuses and yada yada.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, but the average person doesn't really care or even they're not even aware of that half the time, correct?
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, not if your book is done well, not if you're if you have a great book, they don't even know like what what does that even mean, traditional publishing?
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: They just think here's a book that's published, it's good.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: End of story.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: I 100%.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: I've not had anyone look at my books except maybe the first, you know, couple of books that I look back on fondly, but also with a little twitch.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: I go, that could have been better.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I don't have any of that.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: I actually have people in traditional publishing who tell me what a good job I do on my books.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_01: They actually say, Wow, this I can't believe that you did this.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: This is actually really well done.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: Which, of course, I still have that, you know, little farm girl from Ohio, honore, going, that's so cool that someone who, you know, is is a the real deal is recognizing that I'm able to do something.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: That's cool.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not like traditional publishers do everything 100% correctly all the time.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's no down, that's not a like a downgrade on them.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's just they're people and mistakes happen sometimes, and things aren't always what they should be.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that's just that's the nature of being a human being, I think.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: So that's correct.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I also like the standard that they set because it gave me a bar.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it gave me a bar to jump over, right?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: It gave me like, how do I make this?
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the word I use.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: How do I make this book and every book indistinguishable from traditional publishing so that if someone looks at it, who knows?
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: Because there's a difference between a lay person who doesn't have publishing and they don't know the difference between self, hybrid, and traditional and someone who knows because they're in the business.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: How do I make this so that someone in the business would go, Who did this?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: Did we do this?
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: Did this come out of our office?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: Hmm.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: Then if you have your own publishing company, you know, that has a logo and all that stuff, people really don't know.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: But I think it's kind of fun if you're a self-published author, you can set it up to where I mean you you actually are the publishing company, like legit and legally, you have a publishing company.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's just kind of fun to say.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, I have a publishing company.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's also not hard to figure out since it has my name in it, that it's not a traditional publisher, but I did that on purpose.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: I used to have a different publishing company.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: And when I moved from one state to the next and I was incorporating um, someone else already had that publishing company name, and I was like, well, no one's gonna have my name as the publishing company.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna go with that because then there's no there's no guess as to who did it.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and also I think because I do aspire to do it as to to publish as professionally as possible, then it allows people to question their assumption that you can't publish yourself as professionally as traditional publishing.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_00: Totally agree.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this is this is fantastic.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually absolutely loving this conversation.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um in the next one, we're gonna dive into uh my favorite part of the book.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, I'll save that for the next episode, but for now, I'll wrap it up and I'll see you in the next one.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, I hope you enjoyed part two of this series this week, where of course, today we were talking about the five stages that are involved in the author journey.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: And again, this is a really, really important topic that I don't hear many people talking about.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want to dive into it further, make sure and grab a copy of Honore's book.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: You can do so by going to Amazon, and there's also a link uh here in my show notes to grab the book.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now, before I close up shop on today's episode, I want to make sure and give a huge shout-out to our sponsor today, which is my good friend and collaborator, Karen Hunsinger, also known as The Word Wizard.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I've gotten to know Karen the last couple of years through Honoree's Empire Builders Mastermind, which is a phenomenal mastermind group.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: I've learned so much from it and it's had a huge impact on my life and my business.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I met Karen through that group, and Karen has become not just a good friend, but I'm also just in awe of Karen's editing skills.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: She's very, very good.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: And if you've never hired an editor before, you know there are different levels of editors and different kinds of editors, of course.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of editors who just kind of do what's required and then they move along to the next thing.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: Karen is not like that at all.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: Karen is a top-tier or top-level editor, which means she doesn't just do the quote unquote editing stuff, she also improves things in your book that you may not even realize need improving, such as transitions, clarity, accuracy, uh shifts in tone and voice, making sure you don't use uh particular words, making sure your manuscript doesn't get too wordy.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Karen is very, very good at what she does, and in fact, there was a client book that she edited, one of my client books that I wrote.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Uh this has been just probably six or eight months ago, and there were several things in the book.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_00: This was kind of a technical book on a sort of an arcane and research-driven topic, and she noticed several things in the book that that we got wrong just in the process of writing the book.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: And it was so great to know that I had an editor who was paying so close attention that she corrected those things and brought them to my attention so we could, you know, make sure and put it the best possible book for the client.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: An editor is truly your secret weapon for producing a phenomenal book.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I highly, highly recommend Karen, not just because she's incredibly skilled at what she does, but because I've worked with her numerous times in different capacities and we've gotten to know each other pretty well.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but also Karen is just an amazing person to know.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Even if she was not an editor, uh, I would still want to be Karen's friend because she's just a great person who makes you better.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I love being around people like that.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're looking for a great editor who's also a really phenomenal human being, you're gonna really enjoy working with Karen.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: You can go to her website, which is Karen Hunsinger.com, and you can get a free sample edit.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure to mention that you heard about her on the Daily Rider podcast with Kent Sanders.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: I would definitely appreciate it.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: All right, my friend, as always, thanks for listening.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure and grab Honore's book.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: And if you need an editor, connect with Karen Hunsinger and you will be good to go.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: I'll catch you next time.