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Big Hair Band Beer · Sips, Suds, & Smokes

• 0:00
  > Speaker A>On the next episode of Sip, suds.
• 0:03
  > Speaker B>And Smokes, we're doing a very special chats episode. Yes, the Suds people can do chats episodes.
• 0:11
  > Speaker C>Um, we'll find out.
• 0:14
  > Speaker B>Okay, fair. Joining us at the table today is president and co founder of the Black Abbey brewing company in Nashville, Tennessee. We have Carl Meyer.
• 0:28
  > Speaker D>Hey, it's me.
• 0:32
  > Speaker C>In 2013, Iron Maiden frontman Bruce Dickinson partnered with Robinson's brewery in Cheshire, England, to create a premium bitter, fittingly called Trooper.
• 0:43
  > Speaker C>And since then, Iron Maiden has expanded the lineup to over a dozen beers brewed by multiple breweries around the world. We have four of those beers today.
• 0:53
  > Speaker E>We'll be right back after this breakup.
• 1:17
  > Speaker A>Brought to you almost live from the dude in the basement studios. Why? Because that's where the good stuff is. It sits suds and smokes with your smoke. And host the good old boy.
• 1:49
  > Speaker F>Get ready to learn everything you ever wanted to know and a whole lot that you didn't.
• 1:54
  > Speaker F>It's time for a chats episode.
• 1:58
  > Speaker B>Scream for me, everyone, in podcast land.
• 2:07
  > Speaker B>I had to do that. And you'll understand why in just a moment. Welcome, everyone, to another sud segment where good beer meets bad radio. I'm one of your hosts, good old God Juliana. And joining me at the table today is good old boy Drew.
• 2:23
  > Speaker F>Oh, wait, uh, it's me. Oh, yeah.
• 2:25
  > Speaker D>Hi.
• 2:26
  > Speaker B>Hi.
• 2:27
  > Speaker F>It's good to be back.
• 2:28
  > Speaker B>It is good to have you back. Good old boy Dave.
• 2:31
  > Speaker C>I thought we weren't going to have him back.
• 2:33
  > Speaker B>I think he snuck in the back door.
• 2:34
  > Speaker C>He forgot to lock.
• 2:36
  > Speaker F>There you go, baby. Got back.
• 2:41
  > Speaker F>Great beast with two.
• 2:44
  > Speaker B>Okay, that's a little early.
• 2:46
  > Speaker F>Sorry.
• 2:47
  > Speaker B>Once again, I know you're excited. We're all excited. And especially excited because we're doing a very special chats episode. Yes, the suds people can do chats episodes.
• 3:00
  > Speaker C>Um, we'll find out.
• 3:03
  > Speaker B>Okay, fair.
• 3:04
  > Speaker B>Joining us at the table today is president and co founder of the Black Abbey Brewing company in Nashville, Tennessee. We have Carl Meyer.
• 3:18
  > Speaker D>Hey, it's me.
• 3:21
  > Speaker D>I'm here.
• 3:23
  > Speaker B>All right, cool. Well, everyone who's listened to the show or followed us on social media has heard us wax poetic about our love for the Black Abbey brewing Company and their amazing beers. But there is something even more profound about this man, something that makes him my kindred brother. His love of Iron Maiden, about the.
• 3:48
  > Speaker D>Irons.
• 3:51
  > Speaker E>I left alone.
• 3:54
  > Speaker E>My mind was blank.
• 3:57
  > Speaker E>I needed time to think, to get the memories from my mind.
• 4:02
  > Speaker D>This makes me want to throw the table through the window.
• 4:05
  > Speaker B>I know, right? The rage is building.
• 4:08
  > Speaker C>If you're going to throw something throw. Drew.
• 4:11
  > Speaker F>I'm heavier than I look.
• 4:14
  > Speaker D>Dense.
• 4:14
  > Speaker C>He's very dense.
• 4:15
  > Speaker D>Yes. Hey.
• 4:18
  > Speaker B>Okay, so for those of you didn't instantly recognize them, and I'm questioning why you're listening to us then or you don't recognize them or living. I'll let the band introduce themselves in their own words. From ironmaiden.com Iron Maiden are an institution.
• 4:38
  > Speaker B>Over the course of 46 years. How many bands get to say that number? They have come to embody a spirit of fearless creative independence, ferocious dedication to their fans, and a cheerful indifference to their critics that's won them a following that spans every culture, generation and time zone.
• 5:03
  > Speaker B>A story of gritty determination and courageous defiance of the naysayers. Theirs has been an adventure like no other.
• 5:11
  > Speaker C>While we love talking about music, this is, after all, a show about beer. In 2013, Iron Maiden frontman Bruce Dickinson partnered with Robinson's brewery in Cheshire, England, to create a premium bitter, fittingly called Trooper. And since then, Iron Maiden has expanded the lineup to over a dozen beers brewed by multiple breweries around the world.
• 5:34
  > Speaker C>We have four of those beers today.
• 5:36
  > Speaker D>Good old boy.
• 5:37
  > Speaker C>Drew, would you give us today's lineup?
• 5:40
  > Speaker D>The Iron Maiden beers we'll be tasting today are from Robinson's brewery, the trooper premium bitter, the red and the black porter.
• 5:52
  > Speaker F>That went very Bruce Dickinson into Foghorn likehorn southern pasture. The fear of the dark english stout. Then from Brewdog USA, we have the hellcat India pale lager. And if time permits, we may have a bonus.
• 6:13
  > Speaker B>Perfect. Perfect. Good boy. Dave, why don't you give us the suds ratings for today?
• 6:18
  > Speaker C>We'll be discussing and rating these beers with these suds ratings. Plus our signature belching sounds. Here are those ratings now. One, that sucks. Give me anything but a bud.
• 6:31
  > Speaker C>Two, was that a belch?
• 6:33
  > Speaker D>Just totally not a belch.
• 6:36
  > Speaker C>Three, what a relief.
• 6:41
  > Speaker C>Four, a body should really not make that sound.
• 6:45
  > Speaker E>Uh.
• 6:48
  > Speaker C>And five, listen to that hang time. Give me another.
• 7:00
  > Speaker F>Carl's giving us a look.
• 7:01
  > Speaker B>Boy, that's a.
• 7:02
  > Speaker D>That was disgusting.
• 7:03
  > Speaker F>That you'll judge.
• 7:04
  > Speaker B>That was perfect.
• 7:05
  > Speaker C>That'll clear a room.
• 7:08
  > Speaker B>Yes, it will. Okay, we're going to be playing clips from several iron Maiden songs so we can discuss them. But while you're listening, you should fire up some vinyl or log on to your favorite streaming service, pop open some iron maiden beers. Or better yet, pop open some black abbey beer and play along with us.
• 7:31
  > Speaker B>Now let's get into our first beer and get things going. And of course, we have to start at the beginning with the trooper.
• 7:40
  > Speaker E>You'll take my life but I'll take yours, too.
• 7:43
  > Speaker E>You fire musket, but I'll run you through?
• 7:46
  > Speaker E>So when you're waiting for the next attack?
• 7:49
  > Speaker E>You better stand there's no turning back?
• 7:52
  > Speaker E>But there was thousands of times again?
• 7:55
  > Speaker E>But on this battlefield, no one will.
• 8:01
  > Speaker B>The galloping guitars anyways gives me chills. Okay. The trooper, named after this track from the 83 album Peace of mind, is a 4.7% premium british bitter that combines Bobec golding and cascade hops. A quick note on Robinson's brewery. They're a family run regional brewery in Stockport, Cheshire, England, that was founded in 1849. That was originally the Unicorn Inn. They currently own about 260 pubs, mostly across northern England.
• 8:32
  > Speaker B>And, um, yeah, I thought it was, like, a good pairing for Bruce to pick Robinson's.
• 8:38
  > Speaker B>All right, what are your initial thoughts on the beers, guys?
• 8:42
  > Speaker D>260 pubs. You know who can't do that? Anybody in the United States.
• 8:48
  > Speaker C>Very true.
• 8:49
  > Speaker D>That's called a tide house, uh, which is fascinating, right? That was prohibited in prohibition. It's the nature of the three tier system.
• 8:57
  > Speaker D>So it's like, if you go to Taco Bell, you know what you're not getting at taco bell?
• 9:03
  > Speaker D>Coke. Right? You can only get Pepsi.
• 9:05
  > Speaker D>Tide house, uh, that's illegal in the alcoholic beverage industry in the United States. So I thought that was really interesting to read that, uh, doing my show prep, like, wow, this brewery owns 260 pubs. That's more than tailgate.
• 9:19
  > Speaker B>But that's the thing that.
• 9:24
  > Speaker C>You know what?
• 9:27
  > Speaker E>There you go.
• 9:28
  > Speaker D>Too soon, was it? Too.
• 9:29
  > Speaker B>No, that was right on time. Right on time. Yeah. But that's the thing, though, in England, right, is that they're all, I mean, like green King and young's and Fuller's, Samuel Smith, everybody.
• 9:42
  > Speaker D>Uh, yeah. Yes. All over Europe, you roll into a.
• 9:44
  > Speaker C>Work, you order a bitter for them.
• 9:46
  > Speaker D>Uh, you don't necessarily say, oh, well, I would like a trooper, or I'd like a, uh, fuller's. If you're in a fuller's bar, you're going to get Fuller's.
• 9:54
  > Speaker B>Right.
• 9:54
  > Speaker D>Uh, which is fascinating, I think. Just.
• 9:57
  > Speaker D>Do you want me to just chime in on what I think about the beer?
• 10:00
  > Speaker D>Yeah, it's funny.
• 10:04
  > Speaker D>So I went and got my haircut this morning with my son, and we were listening to Iron maiden in the car on the way there, uh, as part of my week long deep dive.
• 10:13
  > Speaker D>And we were listening to, um, out of the silent planet, or sort of the post return three guitar attack records. And I said, iron Maiden is unapologetically who they are.
• 10:28
  > Speaker D>These records are influenced by the time, but they're not defined by it. Uh, and I think that is how I would describe this beer. Right. It's influenced by the time. You wouldn't put cascade hops in an ESB. That doesn't seem to make sense.
• 10:44
  > Speaker C>Right.
• 10:44
  > Speaker D>Uh, that's very much sort of in a west coast American hop varietal.
• 10:49
  > Speaker F>I'm just glad it's not mosaic, you.
• 10:51
  > Speaker C>Son of a.
• 10:53
  > Speaker D>I'm just glad it's not fuggle fuggle hops taste and smell like feet. Not that I know what feet taste like, but I do know what they smell like.
• 11:02
  > Speaker C>Hey, budy. Judgment free zone, buddy.
• 11:05
  > Speaker B>This is totally judgment free.
• 11:07
  > Speaker D>But it's like troopers. Uh, trooper is a working man's beer. Right.
• 11:14
  > Speaker D>We just actually rolled a beer out at Black Abbey called pub ale. And pub ale is just what it sounds like. It is a beer that you would find in an english pub. And trooper fits that model.
• 11:27
  > Speaker C>Definitely. In the session beer, because that's the british model, too, is a drinking session. 4.7%.
• 11:35
  > Speaker C>You can put down quite a few of these. It's very even keeled to me.
• 11:41
  > Speaker C>Not too much of the malt, not too much of the hops. It's pretty well balanced.
• 11:46
  > Speaker F>Yeah, I agree with it being well balanced. I would say that it's a good representation of the style. But calling out that the hops are not exactly representative, uh, of what you might see in a pub in.
• 11:59
  > Speaker C>Sure.
• 11:59
  > Speaker F>Um, it is, however, I think a, uh, good update to a classic, which is also how I feel about some of Iron Maiden's newer stuff.
• 12:11
  > Speaker D>Nice.
• 12:12
  > Speaker C>Okay. He's testing out the.
• 12:15
  > Speaker B>Testing out the waters. That's fair.
• 12:18
  > Speaker C>If that was controversial.
• 12:19
  > Speaker B>No, uh, that's fine.
• 12:22
  > Speaker D>Do, uh, you mean slow and bloating?
• 12:24
  > Speaker D>Wow. Yeah. Anyway.
• 12:26
  > Speaker D>Okay. Have we gotten to that part of the show yet?
• 12:28
  > Speaker C>We've got about two more beers.
• 12:33
  > Speaker F>Now. You'll figure out the belching.
• 12:36
  > Speaker B>And. Yeah, to sum up what everyone's saying, I mean, this is classic maiden to me. I was really impressed when it first came out because I've always viewed maiden as being a blue collar band.
• 12:49
  > Speaker B>And I come from a very blue collar town. I will run blue in that regard, um, for my entire life. And I totally relate to this because growing up, we had, um, friends houses that had a pub. Like, the ground floor would be their pubs or gin mills. And they would always serve something like this. Not that I would know anything about that being underage, but this just relates to all of that to me. Um, and just makes me feel at home.
• 13:19
  > Speaker C>What do you want to do for this?
• 13:21
  > Speaker B>So we'll return with more about the trooper in just a minute.
• 13:27
  > Speaker B>Welcome back, everyone. Today is a chats episode. This is our premier chats episode.
• 13:35
  > Speaker C>Probably one and done.
• 13:36
  > Speaker B>Oh, whatever. Well, I mean, where can we go after this, though?
• 13:40
  > Speaker C>Honestly, downhill from here.
• 13:42
  > Speaker B>So the founder of the Black Abbey brewery in Nashville, Tennessee is here with us today, Carl.
• 13:50
  > Speaker B>And Carl is not only a great brewer, but he is my brother in the sense that our love for Iron Maiden is very strong and very deep. What we were talking about right before the break was the trooper beer, um, which was our first foray into premium bitter. Premium bitter.
• 14:11
  > Speaker C>Robinson's brewery.
• 14:12
  > Speaker B>Yes. Thank you. Thank you.
• 14:13
  > Speaker D>Sure.
• 14:13
  > Speaker B>And, uh, we are going to rate that quickly, and we're going to rate it a three.
• 14:20
  > Speaker B>So, Carl.
• 14:22
  > Speaker D>Yes.
• 14:22
  > Speaker B>What was the first beer that you remember enjoying?
• 14:27
  > Speaker D>Uh, well, it's.
• 14:28
  > Speaker C>Without incriminating yourself.
• 14:30
  > Speaker E>Yeah.
• 14:30
  > Speaker D>I mean, I think the first beer that I remember drinking was, uh, Milwaukee's best. Okay.
• 14:39
  > Speaker D>And for a long time, I think that's what we probably all have a similar beer experience. That. That's what we just thought beer was. Sure, right.
• 14:50
  > Speaker D>Because you were drinking beer not as something to enjoy, but rather a means to an end. Right. It was like, we need to get drunk, so we're going to drink this stuff. It, uh, doesn't really matter what it tastes like. And, uh, when I was in college, the college I went to had a big hotel school. And, uh, the hotel school had a course called introduction to wine and spirits. And, uh, the seniors all took.
• 15:13
  > Speaker D>It didn't matter what sort of part of the college you were in, you would go take wines. And my birthday is in February, so, um, I was older, so I took the course in the spring of my junior year, whereas most everybody else took it in their senior year, which was the smaller of the category. Right. So they brought in better speakers, I would say better guest lecturers.
• 15:40
  > Speaker B>Okay.
• 15:41
  > Speaker D>And, like, Robert Mundavi came and, uh. Serious. It was serious. Yeah, sure. And so, uh, they did a whole class on beer. And Michael Jackson came. Uh, uh, for those of you who don't know, I'm talking about the world premier beer critic, not Billy jeans.
• 16:03
  > Speaker D>Um, but. So Michael Jackson came. And I remember, like, I kept my notes from that lecture. And we tried Celis white. We tried Sam Smith's Tattie Porter. We tried Brooklyn Brown and Brooklyn lager. And then there was one other one that I can't remember.
• 16:22
  > Speaker D>So there was a bar, we had a little hotel on campus, which is where that lecture took place. Was in the auditorium of the hotel. And so we'd go into the hotel bar, and we'd get pictures of Killians for$5, which should date me a little bit. But I remember sitting in there drinking Killians, being like, what is this? This is no longer acceptable for me. Right. Uh, so Sam Smith's tatty Porter was really the first.
• 16:47
  > Speaker C>That's a game changer, man.
• 16:48
  > Speaker D>That just rattled my cool. And I think a lot of people have that experience where they go from domestic lager to euro something.
• 17:00
  > Speaker D>Sometimes it's St. Pauly girl or Heineken or sort of that euro lager, but then it moves into the ambers and the porters and the stouts.
• 17:07
  > Speaker C>You can't really go back.
• 17:09
  > Speaker D>Yes. And then it's. Then you get into hopping your face off. Yeah. And then I think eventually you kind of swing back into whatever your favorite category is. Uh, but that was for Porter. Hmm.
• 17:21
  > Speaker C>That's a good m chocolate. That organic chocolate stout is probably one of the best stouts I've ever.
• 17:31
  > Speaker D>Yeah, we put it on tap in our tap room as a guest tap. Not long ago, uh, the distributor brought in six or eight kegs of it.
• 17:39
  > Speaker D>And, um, it's not the distributor we use, but I'm on the mailing list. And just immediately messaged in. I was like, I'm going to need that.
• 17:48
  > Speaker D>Yeah.
• 17:51
  > Speaker B>Classic. And another brewery that's been around forever.
• 17:54
  > Speaker B>So was it the porter that prompted you to start brewing?
• 17:59
  > Speaker D>Um, I would say probably yes, eventually.
• 18:03
  > Speaker D>Um, I think that's really what we understood was, um, we're now interested in flavors that are too expensive for us to, uh, be buying all the time as end of college career, to getting your first job and trying to figure out how to manage your money and all that stuff. And that was when we started homebrewing.
• 18:26
  > Speaker D>It was me and a couple of buddies from college, bought each other homebrew kits for Christmas, bought Charlie Papazian's, um, the complete joy of home brewing.
• 18:34
  > Speaker C>That is such a great book.
• 18:36
  > Speaker D>Yeah. Just started trying to make beer for ourselves.
• 18:40
  > Speaker D>Whether you collect vinyl or you're into whiskey, like, you get into these hobbies that suddenly become way more expensive than something you should be referring to as a hobby. Uh, and at some point in that it was probably in kind of the early 2000s, my wife was like, this is no longer a hobby. This either needs to be a career, or we need to kind of pair this thing back.
• 19:04
  > Speaker C>Yeah.
• 19:04
  > Speaker D>And, uh, it was about that time in 2008, we won a silver medal in the national homebrew competition. It was in Oakland that year, uh, for a bare laged Belgian, uh, quad.
• 19:16
  > Speaker D>Don't mind me as I belch off.
• 19:19
  > Speaker E>Um.
• 19:21
  > Speaker D>We were. When we meddled at a national level, we thought, all right, maybe we ought to write a business plan. Like, maybe this has got something. So it was me and two partners, and we sat down and started on Thursday. We all had regular jobs, quote unquote.
• 19:36
  > Speaker D>And so we started, uh, working on business plans, homebrewing a lot, trying to come up with what the idea was going to be. Not just, all right, well, we're just going to brew beer and try to sell it to people. Uh, we wanted to very much have this sort of thematic approach to what we wanted to do. Uh, and what we found was that we were mostly drinking and brewing european style stuff.
• 20:00
  > Speaker D>Uh, so in that respect, I do think that Taddy Porter really helped kind of drive who we were looking at.
• 20:07
  > Speaker D>Um, but we also were in a 2008 2009 kind of run through there. In that timeline. Most of the breweries, especially in Nashville, had this sort of 50s retro us feel. Like if you look at Mayday and Yazoo and fat bottom and the breweries that were active at that time, they very much had this kind of 50s vibe.
• 20:31
  > Speaker D>But there was a gap, I think, in both the beer being produced in Nashville and nationally, honestly, that had sort of a european influence. So we very much wanted to be in that world. Uh, and what more typifies a european influenced brewery than this sort of monastery type feel, right?
• 20:53
  > Speaker E>Oh, sure, yeah.
• 20:54
  > Speaker D>Like, some of the greatest, generally thought of as the greatest beers in the world are brewed at belgian breweries.
• 21:01
  > Speaker E>Monastery.
• 21:01
  > Speaker D>Uh, breweries. And so we never really wanted to be a belgian brewery. That wasn't ever our thought process, although our flagship brand runs on belgian yeast. So, um, this sounds crass, but we get hung with that a lot. I don't think that's necessarily true of who we are, but it is a part of who we are, because we run. Our flagship beer is called the Rose, and it is a belgian blonde, and it runs on belgian yeast, and it has all those belgian characteristics. But the majority of what we do is more specifically european driven. So, like I was saying about pub ale. Do we do IPas? Yes, we do IPas. You have to do one. Uh, if you want to be a brewery in the United States today, you got to have it. Um, but we really try to focus on european stuff. Yeah, cool.
• 21:48
  > Speaker B>Okay, now, what do you think about the trooper, the song, the character?
• 21:54
  > Speaker D>All right.
• 21:55
  > Speaker B>The whole thing.
• 21:56
  > Speaker D>All right. I'm a marching band guy. So I grew up playing trumpet. I was always know, Allstates symphonic band, all that stuff.
• 22:05
  > Speaker B>French horn.
• 22:05
  > Speaker F>You look like a trumpeter.
• 22:07
  > Speaker D>Yes, predominantly. I mean, you can tell, you can pick people out based on their instrument. Drew, you're probably more of a trombone guy. Nailed it.
• 22:17
  > Speaker F>Only played it for two years.
• 22:18
  > Speaker D>Yeah. So I think that, uh, the trooper, I've always said, man, what a marching track that'd be, right. It would be great.
• 22:29
  > Speaker D>Um, my first experience with iron maiden, I was an early teen and up the road, somebody we went to church with lived up the road, owned a house that an old farmhouse had been converted into apartments, four apartments. And, um, we lived very close to the Knowles atomic laboratory. So as navy, uh, guys, they were building nuclear, uh, engines for submarines.
• 22:55
  > Speaker D>And so of course they're in the navy so they're getting moved around all the time. So they had these apartments in this old farmhouse, but down in the basement the farmhouse had a coal furnace and the coal furnace had been removed. But what had not been removed was the mountain of ashes. M you imagine this, you live in a farmhouse where your house is heated by a coal furnace and you're just digging the ashes out and throwing them in the corner. What a great way to not have a house.
• 23:20
  > Speaker C>Yeah, for real.
• 23:21
  > Speaker D>But anyway, that was a summer job. I had a summer job where I had two five gallon pails and I would carry the ashes out of the basement of this house and dump them in the woods. Uh, and I did that all summer. And somebody gave me a copy of Live after death on cassette. And I had a Walkman with the headphones with the little orange pads on were I had three live after death triumph stages and, ah, worldwide live scorpions. And I listened to those records over and over and over and over again that summer while I was digging ashes out of the basement of this house.
• 23:57
  > Speaker D>Uh, and that was my intro to Iron Maiden was that live, uh, after death record. So that screamed for me, long beach. Also, I promised before show to give you this. And this is why. In 1984, on the world slavery tour, Iron Maiden stopped in Nashville. They played municipal auditorium in front of a crowd of 3000 people. This was on, wow. On the world slavery tour where they sold out two nights at the Long beach arena in California. 20,000 people each night recorded a live record, were the biggest band on the planet. And in Nashville, uh, 3000 people showed up. People.
• 24:37
  > Speaker D>Their management said, never again, we're not going back. And they didn't come back to Nashville until 2013, which is the year that our brewery opened and the year they launched Trooper and our distributor, uh, also distributes trooper and brought us to the show, trying to court us. Oh, wow. I went to that show on Ajax Turner's dime.
• 24:59
  > Speaker B>Wow.
• 24:59
  > Speaker D>Uh, and promptly frightened them with exactly how into it I was.
• 25:06
  > Speaker C>Nice.
• 25:07
  > Speaker B>No, um, that was a great show, though. Um, I didn't see it here. I saw it up north, but, yeah, that was a great show.
• 25:16
  > Speaker D>It was the greatest hits tour.
• 25:19
  > Speaker B>How could you not?
• 25:20
  > Speaker D>Yes, they played Phantom of the Opera. It was great.
• 25:23
  > Speaker B>They played all the greats. And I started a little bit later. In the scheme of things, seven son of a 7th son was my first foray into them. And, um, so I missed a lot of the beginning, but once I got caught up, just amazing.
• 25:43
  > Speaker B>All right, let's move on to beer number two.
• 25:49
  > Speaker B>This is our hellcats IPA, or IPL, rather 6% us only release that was first brewed in collaboration with Brew Dog in 2021, which I thought was really interesting since it's not named after an iron Mane song. We picked one that pairs well with it. The title track from their second studio album, Killers, that was released in 1981.
• 26:12
  > Speaker E>My faith is believing it's stronger than lifelines and tight the glimmer of metal my moment is ready just to like the death Colorado's green wakes are still out the night another tomorrow remember to.
• 26:31
  > Speaker D>Walk in the singer's different.
• 26:33
  > Speaker B>Uh, yeah, I know. We'll get into that in a minute.
• 26:36
  > Speaker B>Okay, let's talk about Hellcat. What are our thoughts? Do we have any thoughts?
• 26:42
  > Speaker C>What's your opinion of the IPL versus the cold IPA versus.
• 26:49
  > Speaker D>This is probably a whole show, honestly. Um, the history of IPA, uh, where it started, where it is now, how it exists in predominantly America, um, is, I think, a whole separate, but like the a in IPA stands for.
• 27:11
  > Speaker D>I I'm hesitant to use that kind of terminology, IPL, because it's a hoppy lager. And I think it's fair to call something what it is, right? I think you could call this a hoppy lager and people would understand what that means. So it feels like the marketing department somewhere came up with this concept of IPL.
• 27:28
  > Speaker F>Yeah, but don't hate the player, hate the game.
• 27:35
  > Speaker D>Uh, I believe in love.
• 27:39
  > Speaker F>Help me. What have I done?
• 27:41
  > Speaker D>This glimmer of mental is moment is ready to strike.
• 27:47
  > Speaker D>I think, uh, as far as a trend goes, hop forward beers on lager, yeast, uh, I mean, they taste good. Um, I'm all right with things that taste good.
• 28:00
  > Speaker C>Clean finish, you know.
• 28:01
  > Speaker D>Um, I saw maiden on Legacy Ah, the beast in Columbus. Friend of mine worked for brewdog at the time and was ah, able to get us the hookup at the Brewdog hotel.
• 28:14
  > Speaker B>Oh, nice.
• 28:14
  > Speaker D>In Columbus, so it was my son's first show.
• 28:17
  > Speaker D>Oh, nice. First concert ever. He and I went up there and stayed at the hotel, went to the show, so drank a couple of hellcats in the hotel which is attached to, I think it's their barreling facility. I don't think they're actually doing a lot of brewing packaging there.
• 28:33
  > Speaker D>Um, and it's interesting because I feel like this might have, this has maybe got a couple of months on it.
• 28:42
  > Speaker D>It's not quite as bright and sparkly hop forward as I remember m but I think overall as a beer, I enjoy drinking this more than I enjoy drinking trooper. Uh, partially. I think it just fits my personal flavor preference.
• 28:58
  > Speaker B>Tastes a little better right now. Sure.
• 29:00
  > Speaker D>Um, but I don't know.
• 29:03
  > Speaker D>It's bright and it's fresh and it's dank.
• 29:09
  > Speaker F>I like it as a lawnmower beer.
• 29:10
  > Speaker D>Mhm.
• 29:11
  > Speaker F>Sure. Give you something hot outside, cold beer, crisp finish, refreshing. 6% isn't going to kill you. Maybe not.
• 29:22
  > Speaker F>I'm a little bigger than some folks.
• 29:26
  > Speaker C>Yeah. Okay.
• 29:27
  > Speaker B>Yeah, I mean it's, it's not bad. It's a modern, like, dare I say that it's more of a new album versus an old album. You know what I mean?
• 29:38
  > Speaker F>Because it's long and bloated.
• 29:42
  > Speaker B>Well, we're getting to that. But I just mean that it's not traditional classic maiden. It's a modern take of maiden. But I could see why they went with brew dog and I think that fits mean. It's something. Personally, I'm going to drink the trooper more than I'm going to drink this, but that's just me.
• 30:02
  > Speaker B>Um, Dave, your thoughts?
• 30:04
  > Speaker C>Um, I'm kind of with probably I typically go for more m malt forward beers, but this is nice and bright and refreshing and I think hopheads would like it.
• 30:15
  > Speaker C>Um, even though it's not going to blow your mind. But I think it's a tasty, citrusy little beer.
• 30:23
  > Speaker D>It's a four for me. Yeah.
• 30:25
  > Speaker C>All right, we're going to four for all of us.
• 30:28
  > Speaker B>Now, which singer do you like?
• 30:33
  > Speaker D>Bailey. Oh, I'm kidding, I'm kidding, kidding.
• 30:37
  > Speaker F>Uh, I think juliana was about to come across the table.
• 30:40
  > Speaker B>I was.
• 30:42
  > Speaker C>Blaze did his best.
• 30:43
  > Speaker D>Uh, who can follow Bruce? The thing about those two blaze records is for me, it's more about the production than it is about his singing. Like, the songwriting is the same. It's still. Steve is mostly doing the, uh, just, I don't know, they all sound kind of muddy to me.
• 31:02
  > Speaker D>I, uh, love those Paul Diano records, like the first two and then made in Japan. Uh, I just love them, but I love them for what they are. And I think, um, when you go from listening to killers to then stepping into number of the beast, it's almost like a totally separate just, uh. So Dickinson's my guy. I think he's stood the test of time.
• 31:34
  > Speaker D>I think that his body of work is much more complete. I think Paul Diano is kind of one dimensional, uh, in terms of what he's able to deliver behind the microphone. But, man, I love those first two records, man.
• 31:50
  > Speaker B>I've kind of, like, raised on Bruce, so when I hear the earlier records, I have a hard time. And I know that's wrong. I know that's wrong, because killers is great, and those first couple records were great. But, yeah, it's. For me, it's Bruce. And I think it's because I started seeing them live with Bruce. And that whole theatrics and everything that he encompasses, to me, is the big essence of maiden. I mean, Steve Harris is as well, but you know what I mean.
• 32:20
  > Speaker D>I, uh, do.
• 32:21
  > Speaker B>Well, to be continued in just a minute.
• 32:24
  > Speaker B>Welcome back, everyone. Today we are doing a special episode.
• 32:30
  > Speaker B>We are doing a chats episode, and that's what we're doing. We're chatting, and we're drinking beer, some really interesting beer about an interesting band with an interesting guy, Carl Meyer, who is the founder of the Black Abbey.
• 32:45
  > Speaker C>Thought you meant Drew.
• 32:47
  > Speaker D>Uh, well, I mean, he's pretty interesting.
• 32:50
  > Speaker B>He is.
• 32:50
  > Speaker C>It's kind of weird to look at, but.
• 32:52
  > Speaker B>Well, there's.
• 32:54
  > Speaker D>That's why we're on the radio, right?
• 32:55
  > Speaker B>Exactly.
• 32:56
  > Speaker B>Okay, next up, we're going to talk about another beer. This is the third in our lineup.
• 33:01
  > Speaker B>It's a 6.8% english porter first brewed in 2016. A blend of chocolate and crystal malt that gives a full bodied beer a roasted malt and caramel backbone. The Robinson's yeast provides hints of both licorice and honey to create a delicious warming brew from Iron Maiden's 2015 album, Book of Souls. This is the red and the Black.
• 33:32
  > Speaker E>How many chance I can.
• 33:46
  > Speaker D>We're pouring it.
• 33:47
  > Speaker B>We're pouring it.
• 33:48
  > Speaker D>We're pouring it right now and we're drinking it. We didn't totally open the wrong bottle. It's fine.
• 33:52
  > Speaker B>Oh, I totally open.
• 33:53
  > Speaker F>We're letting it warm.
• 33:55
  > Speaker C>This has got some age on her.
• 33:57
  > Speaker D>Oh, it does, uh, and it's my fault. Uh, I brought a bottle of trooper, uh, with the limited edition day of the dead uh, label on it. Yeah, kind of looks like the label on red and the black.
• 34:14
  > Speaker C>Well, there's a guy with a skeleton guy on there.
• 34:17
  > Speaker D>There is skeleton guy on it, but yeah, that.
• 34:18
  > Speaker B>So anyways, as we're now drinking the red and the black, which, that is a nice song for it being a newer.
• 34:26
  > Speaker F>It's not long and bloated.
• 34:28
  > Speaker C>Well, quit saying long and bloated.
• 34:30
  > Speaker B>Yeah, we're going to.
• 34:31
  > Speaker F>That's like the visual.
• 34:32
  > Speaker C>You're freaking me out.
• 34:34
  > Speaker D>I don't know, the last two, book of souls, uh, and Senjitsu, have some tracks on them that could have realistically been that, as Forrest Gump would say. That's all I got to say about that.
• 34:47
  > Speaker B>Okay, let's talk about a porter for a minute.
• 34:50
  > Speaker C>Okay, now this one looks like a porter, it smells and tastes like a porter.
• 34:55
  > Speaker B>Yes, it does.
• 34:57
  > Speaker D>I think like, uh, we talked about with trooper, Iron maiden is a band for the working man, right?
• 35:06
  > Speaker D>They know exactly who they are and they deliver just the way you would expect. Right?
• 35:14
  > Speaker C>Yeah.
• 35:14
  > Speaker D>And I think this is much the same. This tastes like an english porter. Right. It's not over the top roasty. It's not over the top malty you could drink.
• 35:26
  > Speaker C>Um, that's what I like about english beers in general, is there's a lot more balance and control.
• 35:32
  > Speaker C>American beers a lot of times go one way or the other. Like we're going to go all the hops or we're going to go all the sour, whichever way, we're going to lactose or whatever.
• 35:43
  > Speaker B>Yes.
• 35:45
  > Speaker C>Where do you stand, Carl, on bottled versus cans? I think cans tend to keep better in general.
• 35:54
  > Speaker D>Yeah. Um, uh, we only put beer in cans. And as a european influenced brewery, when we were getting ready to open, we decided we were going to put beer in bottles.
• 36:05
  > Speaker D>And I think that was from the very beginning, that was what we were going to do. And then when it came down to, okay, now it's time to start packaging beer. We had been open for two years. Um, we realized that not only the mechanics and the expense of putting beer in the bottles were significantly more, uh, but that cans really, there had been advancements in can technology, uh, in how the actual cans contain beer and keep beer from being, um, metallicized, if that's a word. Yes. Made that up.
• 36:36
  > Speaker E>Yeah.
• 36:36
  > Speaker D>I like it that we decided that cans were the way to go. And for a number of different reasons. The logistics and the money of it because uh, you could fit more cans on a pallet. Cans uh, are lighter than bottles. Uh, all of the packaging that goes along with bottles, the mother carton, the six pack holders, the labels, the crowns, all that stuff.
• 36:56
  > Speaker D>Uh, a lot of stuff. It's a lot of stuff. It's expensive.
• 36:59
  > Speaker C>I always like going into your brewery and seeing walls of cans.
• 37:07
  > Speaker D>Your beer is not going to get light struck in a can.
• 37:09
  > Speaker C>That's true.
• 37:11
  > Speaker D>I think cans, it was cans for us.
• 37:13
  > Speaker C>So the reason I asked is because uh, this is the first one we tried today that came in a bottle and it's a brown bottle.
• 37:21
  > Speaker C>So obviously Brown is supposed to protect.
• 37:24
  > Speaker F>And it's a larger format.
• 37:26
  > Speaker B>Yeah.
• 37:26
  > Speaker C>So drew, what do you think about this English? Uh, Porter?
• 37:33
  > Speaker F>I enjoy it. It's very uh, English.
• 37:40
  > Speaker F>The first quote unquote craft beer that I enjoyed was uh, a Newcastle brown ale. So this very much reminds me of that. But at eleven, to uh, quote the uh, world's loudest band, it's something that in a. What is that, a 500? No, seven. I don't know, in a large nine. Gosh, I guess I've been drinking cans for too long. That looks almost like a bomber.
• 38:05
  > Speaker D>But anyhow, it's not.
• 38:06
  > Speaker F>But yeah, um, it's something that I could conceivably finish off myself but also share with someone else and.
• 38:14
  > Speaker D>Yeah.
• 38:16
  > Speaker C>What do you think, JB?
• 38:18
  > Speaker B>I like very. It's English to me.
• 38:21
  > Speaker C>And it's not taddy.
• 38:24
  > Speaker C>No, but it's good.
• 38:25
  > Speaker B>No, but it's easy. It's very drinkable. And when I think of a good english bitter or a good english beer, it's something where I can have a few of them and I don't have to think about it. I can just enjoy and be done with it.
• 38:41
  > Speaker D>Uh, this is just a nerd, but I can taste the similarity in the water.
• 38:47
  > Speaker D>I think there's a consistency between trooper and this beer that is likely attributable, uh, just to the water.
• 38:58
  > Speaker C>Um, you probably think a lot more about the water than a lot of people who drink. You just drink.
• 39:05
  > Speaker D>It's when people say, oh, I tried beer from founders and all the founders beers have a similar flavor characteristic. It must be their use. It's probably not.
• 39:16
  > Speaker D>It's probably the water.
• 39:17
  > Speaker C>Yeah, sure. That's how I feel about bread from New England.
• 39:20
  > Speaker F>Oh gosh.
• 39:24
  > Speaker C>That'S a thing.
• 39:25
  > Speaker B>Yeah, I know.
• 39:26
  > Speaker E>Cool.
• 39:26
  > Speaker C>How do we want to go with this? Uh, three?
• 39:29
  > Speaker B>Yeah, three.
• 39:32
  > Speaker E>We're going to rate it three.
• 39:34
  > Speaker D>All right.
• 39:34
  > Speaker B>Do you got for us, Dave?
• 39:36
  > Speaker C>Carl? Uh, when we were talking about doing this show. There were a few songs that you pointed out that you really wanted to talk about.
• 39:44
  > Speaker C>And the first one is this one.
• 39:49
  > Speaker E>The cos it left on in the right. The mariner. He wished he died along with the secret. But they lived on. So did he.
• 40:07
  > Speaker B>Now.
• 40:07
  > Speaker C>That was rhyme of the ancient mariner.
• 40:09
  > Speaker E>Uh.
• 40:10
  > Speaker C>From 1984 I believe.
• 40:13
  > Speaker C>Power slave.
• 40:13
  > Speaker D>Yes.
• 40:14
  > Speaker C>All right. Written by Steve Harris. Tell us why you picked that one.
• 40:18
  > Speaker F>Can I ask real quick what's the length of that song, Carl?
• 40:22
  > Speaker D>13 and a half minutes.
• 40:23
  > Speaker B>Shut up.
• 40:25
  > Speaker C>Didn't get a lot of radio play.
• 40:26
  > Speaker D>No.
• 40:28
  > Speaker B>Except from really cool radio stations.
• 40:31
  > Speaker D>That's my favorite Iron man song on my favorite iron Mane record. That break like coming out of the full time living men.
• 40:42
  > Speaker E>Yeah.
• 40:43
  > Speaker C>Like little acoustic.
• 40:44
  > Speaker D>And uh. Coming right back into that. You take this epic poem and translate uh. It into a 19. Uh. Eighty s new wave of british metal song. Uh. And then piece it together in multiple song pieces. Like multiple movements. Like if this was uh. Pink Floyd's shine on. You crazy diamond.
• 41:06
  > Speaker D>Right. You got shine on parts one through six. And then seven through nine. Or whatever it is. Uh. There's multiple movements in the song. And um. That pull out of the long bridge into uh. The curse that lives on in their eyes part is just absolutely incredible for me. And having seen them perform it I think twice live.
• 41:32
  > Speaker D>They're so tight. Like the changes are incredibly tight. Uh.
• 41:38
  > Speaker D>I don't know. It blows my mind every time. And what other song can you think of where the first guitar solo is at like seven and a half.
• 41:46
  > Speaker B>Right.
• 41:46
  > Speaker E>Yeah.
• 41:48
  > Speaker D>The song's already been going seven minutes before there's even a solo.
• 41:51
  > Speaker D>It's incredible.
• 41:51
  > Speaker C>This is one of the songs that really impresses me about Steve Harris. I think his bass playing.
• 41:58
  > Speaker C>There are other songs that are more impressive of his bass playing than this song.
• 42:03
  > Speaker C>But for his songwriting. And the fact when you look at him. This is like. You can't judge a book by its cover. But when you look at Steve Harris. You don't get history buff poetry aficionado. You don't see that in most when you look at a metal bass player. But this guy loves history. He loves the literature and all the things.
• 42:27
  > Speaker B>But they all do. And that's like the big backbone of what makes maiden. Maiden.
• 42:33
  > Speaker B>You know what I mean?
• 42:36
  > Speaker B>They're the combination of your best and your favorite historians. With a bit of python thrown in for good measure. And a very blue collar work ethic. Where. I mean. They're still freaking touring now. And it's like they're not exactly 20 anymore, but they just make.
• 42:54
  > Speaker D>And to call it back to the difference of the singers, for me, it's not so much about the difference between Diano and Dickinson. It's the addition of Adrian. Adrian came in, he didn't play on the first record. He played on killers, but he was very much, like, still the new guy.
• 43:14
  > Speaker B>Finding his way.
• 43:15
  > Speaker D>Yes, sure. And then Dickinson comes in, and Adrian's got a little more stamp on what gets on the songwriting in number of the beast. And the production is different. Uh, the sound quality is different.
• 43:29
  > Speaker B>Everything is just a little crisper, a.
• 43:31
  > Speaker D>Little less punk, a little more prague.
• 43:35
  > Speaker D>If that makes.
• 43:37
  > Speaker D>Don't use.
• 43:38
  > Speaker C>We don't talk about Prague.
• 43:39
  > Speaker B>Oh, no, we talk about Prague.
• 43:42
  > Speaker B>We are big fans of Prague.
• 43:44
  > Speaker D>Yeah. Like band, once again, dawn of the Dead. Uh, that record is tons of time changes, but that's Adrian's influence. All right, talking about song clips, I also should pull out, uh, reach out, which was the b side on the wasted years single. Maiden was really good about putting b sides on their singles that were covers.
• 44:09
  > Speaker C>All right, hold on.
• 44:10
  > Speaker D>This one's not.
• 44:19
  > Speaker E>Your head. You seem to understand where I.
• 44:32
  > Speaker C>That's like a different band to me, and that's adrian.
• 44:35
  > Speaker D>Yeah, right. Uh, but you can hear wasted years in that.
• 44:41
  > Speaker D>You can hear stranger, uh, in a strange land in that. Uh, you can hear heaven can wait in that.
• 44:47
  > Speaker D>And I think that Adrian's influence on the band is oftentimes.
• 44:50
  > Speaker C>I know wasted years is one of Julie's top.
• 44:53
  > Speaker D>Yeah, that's cool.
• 44:54
  > Speaker C>All right.
• 44:55
  > Speaker B>No, that is cool.
• 44:56
  > Speaker F>All right.
• 44:56
  > Speaker C>Well, we've neglected drew a little bit, which we enjoy.
• 45:00
  > Speaker F>But, um, I've been sitting on my hands pretty well.
• 45:03
  > Speaker B>Okay, well, now it's your time to shine.
• 45:05
  > Speaker C>Drew actually does like Iron Maiden. And so, uh, here's one of the songs. He picked the killer.
• 45:13
  > Speaker E>Free all the demon safe. The glamour, the force.
• 45:21
  > Speaker E>Don't do war again.
• 45:23
  > Speaker E>Blood is free. Don't say, don't you pray for my soul anymore.
• 45:32
  > Speaker C>That is two minutes to midnight.
• 45:34
  > Speaker D>The hand that threatens doom.
• 45:37
  > Speaker C>Okay, we're not doing all that.
• 45:42
  > Speaker D>I was a communication major in college, and so we did a public speaking class. And, uh, one of my buddies who was premed also took that class because it was our senior year. And he was like, whatever. I'm taking this with you. And there was an episode or a lab where we had to read a poem, and he read that song.
• 46:02
  > Speaker D>Lyric song. Yeah. And, uh, from memory. It was great. He did a great job.
• 46:08
  > Speaker D>But, um, the jellied brains of those who remained to put the finger right on you. In that line, there was this very timid, shy little asian lady who was sitting in the girl.
• 46:21
  > Speaker C>Uh, children fell, right. Every chair.
• 46:24
  > Speaker D>And he was looking everywhere else in the room. And then when he said, put the finger right on you, and he put his finger right in her face and she screamed.
• 46:37
  > Speaker C>Awesome. Well, Drew, so this was also from 1984. Power slave. What did you like about, uh, what pulled you into that song?
• 46:46
  > Speaker F>I came to iron maiden much later in life than, um, probably the rest of you.
• 46:51
  > Speaker C>But you came to the world much later than the rest of us.
• 46:54
  > Speaker F>This is true. This is true. I'm the baby with my gray hair. Believe it or not, I actually didn't really start listening to Iron Maiden until I met Carl. And I heard them in the black Abbey tap room. And, uh, I've been more of a progressive metal fan than traditional british metal, if you can call anything about iron maiden traditional.
• 47:21
  > Speaker F>Um, and what I really have loved about maiden, as I have gotten into them in the last ten years or so, is the stories that they tell, the commentary on society, on events. It's poetry with power guitar, and I absolutely love it.
• 47:45
  > Speaker D>Cool. And a singer that can blow.
• 47:48
  > Speaker C>There you go. All right, let's blow through this last beer.
• 47:51
  > Speaker B>Okay, so, very quickly, we are going to talk about the fear of the dark beer. Uh, first brewed in 2020, the four and a half percent english stout.
• 48:05
  > Speaker E>A little anxious when it's dark.
• 48:10
  > Speaker B>And one of my favorite songs, life.
• 48:12
  > Speaker E>Fear of the dark.
• 48:14
  > Speaker B>Like, favorite songs, life. Okay, so as a stout, what do you guys think of this?
• 48:20
  > Speaker F>Very english.
• 48:21
  > Speaker D>Yeah. It's a math for me.
• 48:24
  > Speaker D>I like stouts to be either irish, like Guinness, where it's got this sort of back end.
• 48:30
  > Speaker C>Almost dry.
• 48:31
  > Speaker D>Yeah. It's so dry, it's almost tart. Or I like them to be big and roasty and chocolate.
• 48:37
  > Speaker B>Yeah. And this one kind of falls off the mark.
• 48:40
  > Speaker B>Yeah. Well, we are going to rate, sadly, the fear of the dark a two, but do better.
• 48:45
  > Speaker C>Iron Maiden.
• 48:46
  > Speaker B>But this song is phenomenal.
• 48:49
  > Speaker C>Is a five.
• 48:49
  > Speaker D>It's great.
• 48:50
  > Speaker B>It is. Well, that is going to wrap it up for today. This was such a great episode. And a special thanks to our guest, Carl.
• 48:58
  > Speaker D>Glad to be here.
• 48:59
  > Speaker E>Thanks for having me.
• 49:00
  > Speaker B>From the Black Abbey Brewing company. Tell us how we can find you on social media.
• 49:04
  > Speaker D>Uh, Instagram is probably the best way you could get me at Black Abbey brewing. You could get me at Black Abbey, Carl, uh, is mine. And then, uh, I also do vinyl DJ. And my vinyl DJ Instagram handle is DJ dad's been drinking.
• 49:19
  > Speaker C>Nice.
• 49:20
  > Speaker B>Goodle boy Drew. Thanks for being here. Thanks for having me, goodle boy Dave.
• 49:24
  > Speaker C>Hey, I'll play my favorite iron maiden.
• 49:25
  > Speaker D>Song I left alone.
• 49:30
  > Speaker E>My mind was blank.
• 49:33
  > Speaker E>I needed time to think to get the memory.
• 49:37
  > Speaker D>My new favorite.
• 49:40
  > Speaker C>Of course, mambo, mambo.
• 49:42
  > Speaker B>Mambo Kurt all right, this is good gal Juliana. Keep on chugging and catch you next time.
• 49:47
  > Speaker F>We hope you enjoyed this episode. If you're listening to us online, do yourself a favor and tap. Just tap it in the subscribe button.
• 49:56
  > Speaker E>Give it a little tappy.
• 49:58
  > Speaker B>Tap, tap, tap a room.
• 49:59
  > Speaker F>The easiest way to listen to our show is to ask Siri, Alexa, Google, Uncle Larry, or whoever it is that talks to you on your phone. Play podcast, sipsuds and smokes. We love your feedback and you can reach us at info@sipsudsandsmokes.com our tasting notes flow out on Twitter and Instagram with our handle at sipsudsandsmokes, and our Facebook page is always buzing with lots of news. You'll also be able to interact with the thousands, millions of other fans on those social media platforms. Do us a favor. Take the time to rate this episode. If you're listening to us online, that's a big help to us, and we get to see your feedback as well. Come back, join us for another episode, and keep on sipping.
• 50:58
  > Speaker A>This has been a one tan hand production of sip suds, uh, and smokes, a program devoted to the appreciation of some of the finer slices of life. From the dude in the basement studios, your host, the good old boys, will see you all next time.
• 51:14
  > Speaker E>It's.