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Maimah Karmo Is Redefining What It Means To Survive · Get Real with Jim Weiss

0:00
Speaker 1: Really really excited for you to see this one. It's
0:03
Speaker 1: my old friend, Mama Karma. She's not old by any means.
0:06
Speaker 1: She looks fantastic. You know, she's really the bomb. Has
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Speaker 1: overcome so many different traumas in her life. There's so
0:15
Speaker 1: much we can learn from somebody who's gone through the
0:18
Speaker 1: cancer journey and has paid it forward again through the
0:22
Speaker 1: Tiger Lily Foundation, where she refers to her patients. She's
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Speaker 1: not a doctor, but she's the ultimate patient advocate when
0:30
Speaker 1: it comes to breast cancer in particular and in particular
0:34
Speaker 1: in women of color. It's all about better diagnosis, better living,
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Speaker 1: better treatment experience, all the things that everybody thinks are
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Speaker 1: easy to navigate. And as patients and people are being
0:48
Speaker 1: diagnosed younger, which was something that she went through. She
0:52
Speaker 1: was diagnosed in her thirties, someone like Mama continues to
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Speaker 1: be incredibly relevant and incredibly inspiring. So I can't wait
1:00
Speaker 1: to share this morning here. Hey Mama, how you doing.
1:05
Speaker 2: I'm great, I'm blessed and highly favored and God is good.
1:09
Speaker 1: Sounds good. I'll say that same thing what she said,
1:13
Speaker 1: what she said, welcome, It got real. It's been a
1:17
Speaker 1: long time since we sat down and broke some bread
1:21
Speaker 1: and chatted it up, and I'm excited to catch up.
1:25
Speaker 1: I like origin stories. What in your history and background
1:29
Speaker 1: enabled you to deal with your diagnosis of stage two
1:33
Speaker 1: triple negative breast cancer and this hardship. Did that reframe
1:37
Speaker 1: the way you live and operate in the world or
1:40
Speaker 1: were you the same before?
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Speaker 2: Well, in terms of my diagnosis, I was thirty one
1:44
Speaker 2: years old when I found my own tumor. My mom's
1:46
Speaker 2: a nurse. She was a nurse in Liberia, where I'm from.
1:49
Speaker 2: And it's funny how sometimes like your nature and nature
1:53
Speaker 2: come together at these they coal us at a certain times.
1:56
Speaker 2: So I grew up watching my mom tream women who
1:58
Speaker 2: will people call here community health workers to become nurses.
2:01
Speaker 2: People would get in there and taxis buses walk to
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Speaker 2: the capital to become nurses, and she would teach them.
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Speaker 2: So my first job was creating people's papers and walking
2:11
Speaker 2: with doctors in the halls, and I got body trained
2:14
Speaker 2: in those hospital halls. And so people that I saw
2:17
Speaker 2: growing up on the streets, people were in a wheelchairs
2:19
Speaker 2: with broken limbs, and I knew that that wasn'tjust or right,
2:22
Speaker 2: and so I also knew that my mom taught me
2:24
Speaker 2: the importance of like knowing my body. So seeing what
2:26
Speaker 2: she took care of and how people would needed to
2:28
Speaker 2: help came to her and how she empowered them. My
2:31
Speaker 2: dad also helped people a lot through he was a
2:33
Speaker 2: commodity trader and he gave back a lot of people
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Speaker 2: who were under privilege and vulnerable. And so when I
2:38
Speaker 2: got diagnosed, my mom taught me bris ex SAMs first
2:41
Speaker 2: of all at thirteen years old, and we're being totally
2:43
Speaker 2: embarrassed and she's like, take off your shirt and I'm like,
2:44
Speaker 2: oh my god, And she said, your body's going to
2:46
Speaker 2: change over time, and knowing your body and what it
2:48
Speaker 2: feels like when it does change and what it might
2:50
Speaker 2: look like is important. So when I found love of
2:52
Speaker 2: my breast, I knew it was a normal thing. I
2:54
Speaker 2: knew it then belonged there. And so she taught me
2:57
Speaker 2: also she and my dad to always ask why ask
3:00
Speaker 2: why not? Don't just accept what you're told. When I
3:03
Speaker 2: found the lump, at the time, the age of screening
3:05
Speaker 2: was about fifty years old. I was thirty one, so
3:08
Speaker 2: I was way beneath the age for screening. I didn't
3:10
Speaker 2: fit the profile as a young black woman with no
3:12
Speaker 2: previous history of cancer in my family, and I got
3:14
Speaker 2: dismissed by doctors for almost a year, well about a year,
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Speaker 2: and I had to push for a mamagram and came
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Speaker 2: back clean and they said it's clean, you don't have cancer.
3:22
Speaker 2: And I said, well, this wasn't there, and your machine
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Speaker 2: can't see what I can feel, so it must be wrong.
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Speaker 2: It turns out that monogravy didn't detect tumorous and denser
3:30
Speaker 2: breasts at the time, so I was right and the
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Speaker 2: machine was wrong. Technology was not where it is now.
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Speaker 2: I'm saying that to say that all of my parents,
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Speaker 2: what they taught me to question people, policy whatever, and
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Speaker 2: ask questions and know my body. That's what empowered me
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Speaker 2: to push for a diagnosis and ultimately get diagnosed early
3:48
Speaker 2: enough to be able to get treatment. However, there was
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Speaker 2: no triple negative breast cancer drug at the time on
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Speaker 2: the market, so even though I had done all the
3:55
Speaker 2: right things, I was totally can't give you anything to
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Speaker 2: targeting your subtype and you could die in five years.
4:00
Speaker 2: And I was like, that's not going to happen because
4:02
Speaker 2: I'm Mee and Ma Carmelo, and I have a daughter
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Speaker 2: to live for she's three years old. I can't, you know,
4:06
Speaker 2: So I feel like my parents' ability to also, like
4:10
Speaker 2: when the wars happened in Liberia, my father sacrificed himself
4:13
Speaker 2: for us. My mom rescued my dad from a jail.
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Speaker 2: You know, I told you the story before. So he
4:17
Speaker 2: went because they were calling people to come to a meeting.
4:19
Speaker 2: He knew I wasn't a meeting. It was a trap.
4:21
Speaker 2: But if he didn't go to the meeting, they were
4:22
Speaker 2: going to come from my family. That man's raping killing.
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Speaker 2: People were getting massacred and shot, and it was horrible
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Speaker 2: seeing my dad sacrificed himself for my family, my mom,
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Speaker 2: seeing her then go to rescue my dad from the prison,
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Speaker 2: which she got him back, and people were massacred on
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Speaker 2: that same beach, in that same prison. The next day,
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Speaker 2: he told me a lot about sacrifice, told me a
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Speaker 2: lot about other people, and we ultimately fled from Liberara
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Speaker 2: to come to the States to be secure and safe.
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Speaker 2: My parents said, well, after the wars calmed down, we're
4:50
Speaker 2: going to go back home, and they did. And I
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Speaker 2: was like, why would you go back to where you
4:53
Speaker 2: were almost killed? My dad said, there are people who
4:55
Speaker 2: live who are back home, who are less fortunate than
4:58
Speaker 2: we are. They didn't have the money to escape, whether
5:00
Speaker 2: we're that means to escape, we had to go back
5:02
Speaker 2: and help them. So when I got to diagnosed, it
5:04
Speaker 2: was only natural for me to think. Of course, I
5:06
Speaker 2: first see your cell shocked, you're overwhelmed. And then my
5:09
Speaker 2: next thought was who else is in that burning house
5:12
Speaker 2: of who may be young and at risk and we
5:14
Speaker 2: have TNBC or whatever else may be vulnerable and not
5:17
Speaker 2: know how to get support. How can I utilize what
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Speaker 2: I'm going through for someone else's betterment? And that's kind
5:22
Speaker 2: of how it started. After my first chemop therapy session,
5:25
Speaker 2: I went to the office depot, got some big post
5:28
Speaker 2: its or whatever it wasn't put them on the wall
5:30
Speaker 2: and map out what I wanted. And then I just
5:33
Speaker 2: pray to God and said, if you are God, you'll
5:35
Speaker 2: show me what to do with this. And the next
5:36
Speaker 2: morning I had the answer. It was Tiger Lily, which
5:39
Speaker 2: is about beauty streat the transformation before, during, and after
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Speaker 2: breast cancer. And that's how it began in my mom's bedroom, bald,
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Speaker 2: single and no money, no power, no real power, no body,
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Speaker 2: just love, love, a question and a prayer and then
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Speaker 2: I promise to God.
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Speaker 1: So you start Tiger Lily, you build a coach in company,
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Speaker 1: write a best salad, you turn hardship into a new chapter,
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Speaker 1: and you do it over and over. That's what I
6:04
Speaker 1: feel like I'm doing given my experiences. You know, we
6:09
Speaker 1: talk about cancer being a gift wrapped in barbed wire.
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Speaker 1: It's awful, but it has led to so much accomplishment.
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Speaker 1: I'd love your coaching based on that experience.
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Speaker 2: My dad taught me to never be embarrassed about is
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Speaker 2: that I'm extremely intuitive and I have a huge, huge,
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Speaker 2: huge heart. It's like wide open. And he said that.
6:29
Speaker 2: He said to me, your softness and your love for
6:32
Speaker 2: people is your gift beyond any other thing you can
6:34
Speaker 2: ever learn in school, Like never change that. And so
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Speaker 2: I have this thing for feeling people. When someone comes
6:40
Speaker 2: to me and says i'm breaking, I can't go further,
6:43
Speaker 2: it's just saying I got you, I feel you. I'm
6:46
Speaker 2: going to hold a space for you, and I'm here
6:48
Speaker 2: and just to breathe, just breathe. You're safe, and you're
6:51
Speaker 2: here in your home. And when someone starts to breathe
6:55
Speaker 2: and they feel like you are with them and they
6:58
Speaker 2: can feel their heartbeat and they can get ground. Then
7:00
Speaker 2: you can map out for them what the future might
7:02
Speaker 2: look like. But to get there, these little steps of
7:05
Speaker 2: what you do in this moment, to calm yourself, what
7:08
Speaker 2: you do to see beyond where you are. I feel
7:12
Speaker 2: like in people's the time of their crisis is grounding.
7:14
Speaker 2: And then if you could use this challenge where you
7:16
Speaker 2: are and what you're learning to create the most amazing
7:19
Speaker 2: nirvana in your life or the most magical living legacy,
7:22
Speaker 2: what would that look like? And so it's giving people
7:24
Speaker 2: these practical tips to deal with stress and to deal
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Speaker 2: with trauma. I've learned amdr so butterfly tapping, other things.
7:32
Speaker 2: I've learned somatic work as well. And most people the
7:35
Speaker 2: fears begins with a body.
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Speaker 1: So you study with Tony Robbins, right Ecker Toll, the
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Speaker 1: Dalai Lama, Louise Hay and others. What in their teaching
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Speaker 1: inspired you most? How have they informed your approach?
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Speaker 2: I would say that one of the things I've learned
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Speaker 2: is that love is a beautiful and powerful and big thing.
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Speaker 2: And so really learning to be general with yourself and
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Speaker 2: loving yourself and hearing yourself. I don't believe there is
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Speaker 2: any Guru. I know there is God, but there's not
8:05
Speaker 2: anybody that can tell me how to be on this earth.
8:07
Speaker 2: And so I picked things from Tony, and pick things
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Speaker 2: from Dalai, and pick things from Oprah, and pick things
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Speaker 2: from Brene and pick things from whoever. And I've learned
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Speaker 2: to move through life with a sense of reverence that's
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Speaker 2: my word for the weak reverence and sacredness about my life.
8:21
Speaker 2: And even when it's a painful time, this life is
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Speaker 2: really sacred it you have this moment, then it's gone.
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Speaker 2: Then you look in a month and that's gone. So
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Speaker 2: really it to be present to where you are and
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Speaker 2: ask yourself, why am I here? What can I learn
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Speaker 2: from this experience? And then also being gentle with yourself
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Speaker 2: when you're in a place of suffering and pain, because
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Speaker 2: suffering and pain teach us a lot of human beings.
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Speaker 2: So we're comfortable and happy. We're not studying, we're not learning,
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Speaker 2: we're like living our best life.
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Speaker 1: Right.
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Speaker 2: My life was a ride, and we kind of learned
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Speaker 2: to like pull in and kind of nest and figure
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Speaker 2: out why. So I've learned to find grace from myself
8:52
Speaker 2: and those times and learn to really mind my mind
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Speaker 2: and mind my thoughts and know that everything's possible as
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Speaker 2: a woman who came from Liberia as alone at fifteen
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Speaker 2: years old, with no money, only one suitcase with those
9:05
Speaker 2: without citizenship at the time, and to now be running
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Speaker 2: a global nonprofit for women's incology and health and be
9:11
Speaker 2: aknown and author all the things you said. It's not magic.
9:15
Speaker 2: It's a lot of intentional work. I don't like the
9:17
Speaker 2: word hard work, intentional work, manifestation, but it's been a
9:21
Speaker 2: lot of like mind, third eye, heart eye and body
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Speaker 2: work that gets me where I get to. It's again
9:27
Speaker 2: in love and connectivity. I look back at Tiger Lulling,
9:30
Speaker 2: and I built it by person by person, through relationships
9:33
Speaker 2: and through loving people and seeing who they are, seeing
9:36
Speaker 2: how it could help them or someone they loved, and
9:38
Speaker 2: then they wanted to help me as well. I didn't
9:40
Speaker 2: have all the answers. I didn't have a lot of power.
9:42
Speaker 2: I didn't have any power. The only power I had
9:44
Speaker 2: was love and intention and the belief that if I
9:48
Speaker 2: wanted something, that anything was possible. And I think that's
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Speaker 2: what I've learned the most from those teachers and what's
9:54
Speaker 2: got me here today.
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Speaker 1: Well, I think also what's common denominator with a lot
9:59
Speaker 1: of the women in particular that I've talked to, because
10:02
Speaker 1: that seems to be you see the unmet need, you
10:05
Speaker 1: know it personally. So Tiger Lily's mission is focused on
10:09
Speaker 1: women of color whose cancer diagnosis is often overlooked, like
10:14
Speaker 1: yours was. What are one or two example you've seen
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Speaker 1: of this reality other than your own to illustrate to
10:21
Speaker 1: our listeners what goes on. I think people don't realize that,
10:26
Speaker 1: you know, yours was a young diagnosis. You keep hearing
10:28
Speaker 1: there's a lot of people being diagnosed younger things they
10:32
Speaker 1: wouldn't expect. I've certainly talked to doctor Bio about doctors
10:37
Speaker 1: looking at you a little funny. And my own wife
10:40
Speaker 1: went through a year of diagnosis hell before we knew
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Speaker 1: what she ultimately had, and even when she had that,
10:48
Speaker 1: we couldn't even pinpoint the cancer type right away. So
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Speaker 1: what do people need to know and how do they
10:55
Speaker 1: navigate it? What's been your experience?
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Speaker 2: I feel like the thing that's been hard for me
11:00
Speaker 2: to just really stomach and I should by now, is
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Speaker 2: that the story I've told about being misdiagnosed for a year,
11:05
Speaker 2: I've being dismissed just being told today still by a
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Speaker 2: woman of color, a young woman, women of different colors,
11:10
Speaker 2: by women who were younger as well at a page.
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Speaker 2: A friend of mine were good friends. But she found
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Speaker 2: her tumor in her early twenties. She's a nurse, by
11:17
Speaker 2: the way, working in a hospital in a not rural error.
11:21
Speaker 2: She's working in a nice hospital. And she literally went
11:25
Speaker 2: to a doctor with a lump and then it was itching,
11:27
Speaker 2: then it was redness. Literally they blew her off for years,
11:31
Speaker 2: and so she went back with a lump that was bloody,
11:33
Speaker 2: bleeding nipple. Then they said, oh, okay, I think this
11:37
Speaker 2: must be really bad. She's been going to them for
11:39
Speaker 2: about eight years complaining about this very lump, this very issue,
11:41
Speaker 2: these different things manifesting a black woman. But unfortunately for
11:45
Speaker 2: her that when she finally found, when she finally got diagnosed,
11:48
Speaker 2: she was metastatic. If she had not been dismissed for
11:51
Speaker 2: almost eight to ten years, she would have found her
11:53
Speaker 2: found a lump earlier, the cancer early, whatever it was,
11:55
Speaker 2: tumor rash, and gotten diagnosed. But she will die of
11:58
Speaker 2: cancer at some point. Is somebody who I love dearly.
12:02
Speaker 2: Her story is not different from many others I've heard.
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Speaker 2: Another patient of mine a friend of mine, she is metastatic,
12:07
Speaker 2: and she had some pain, went to the hospital, was
12:10
Speaker 2: in a hospital in DC, in a major hospital center
12:13
Speaker 2: for almost a month, and kind of just blown off,
12:16
Speaker 2: just we're gonna stop treatment. Just lay in the bed
12:18
Speaker 2: and we'll take care of you here and there. And
12:20
Speaker 2: then I'm like, but if you stop treatment, you will
12:22
Speaker 2: probably die. And the doctors just kind of we're just
12:25
Speaker 2: treating her the casual basic and this is not okay.
12:28
Speaker 2: I had friends of mine dorine cole, but who are
12:30
Speaker 2: white friends who are calling doctors? They would call them back.
12:32
Speaker 2: They would give them their cell phone to text, and
12:35
Speaker 2: the black patients were just kind of like, wait, what
12:37
Speaker 2: can't see you right now? It happens all the time.
12:40
Speaker 2: Even myself. I have a really high histamine issue, high intolerance,
12:44
Speaker 2: and I ate something. One time I had a really
12:46
Speaker 2: bad reaction, went to the and I began to like
12:48
Speaker 2: this all blew up. I was like, couldn't breathe went
12:51
Speaker 2: to the er and they kept asking for my ID
12:53
Speaker 2: and my insurance and I'm just literally like my whole
12:56
Speaker 2: face is like getting swelling up. Until says she's not breathing,
12:59
Speaker 2: She's gonna I black out. A nurse head comes out whatever,
13:02
Speaker 2: he's Latina and Latino. He says she has to go
13:05
Speaker 2: back right now. She's an EpiPen, give me a pen
13:08
Speaker 2: and my body calms down, and then after a few
13:10
Speaker 2: minutes it kind of began to happen again, so I
13:12
Speaker 2: have another EpiPen. But then a matter of like an hour,
13:15
Speaker 2: so the nurse says, you can't go home because your
13:16
Speaker 2: body's really excessively heightened, and we're gonna keep you for
13:19
Speaker 2: the night. So I say you for the night. My
13:22
Speaker 2: daughter comes back in the morning. She was like probably
13:24
Speaker 2: like sixteen seventeen. Doctor comes in, this white guy and
13:27
Speaker 2: he's like, this is not it normal? Do you do drugs?
13:29
Speaker 2: Are you an alcoholic? And I was like, what do
13:33
Speaker 2: you mean. He's like, well, people don't react like this
13:34
Speaker 2: to whatever it was, and are you here for drugs
13:37
Speaker 2: or more medication? He was thinking that I'm here for drugs.
13:40
Speaker 2: We were both like show shocked. I started crying of hurt,
13:44
Speaker 2: and she says, Mommy, tell him who you are, and
13:47
Speaker 2: I said, honey, it shouldn't matter who I am and
13:49
Speaker 2: what I do. People should get proper care and support.
13:53
Speaker 2: Why is he asking me if I'm here for he
13:55
Speaker 2: thinks I'm on a drug addict or whatever, and I
13:57
Speaker 2: ran on medication whatever, whatever I was getting before. I
13:59
Speaker 2: needed some some support for medication. And I was just
14:02
Speaker 2: so shocked that he asked me that the nurse her
14:04
Speaker 2: face turned red. She was so embarrassed and she said,
14:07
Speaker 2: I'm so sorry after he left. But I just felt like,
14:10
Speaker 2: even I live in Loudon County, it is the highest
14:13
Speaker 2: per capita income county in the country. I lay five
14:15
Speaker 2: minutes for a hospital, five minutes. I pay my taxes,
14:19
Speaker 2: I'm above the law, like I'm not underrepresented at this
14:22
Speaker 2: time in my life. My point is that in places
14:25
Speaker 2: where it's rural and more urban, those things happen. But
14:28
Speaker 2: it happens in the hospitals where are good hospitals, where
14:30
Speaker 2: there's access and money, and it really is about the
14:33
Speaker 2: color of your skin.
14:34
Speaker 1: Well, let's talk about that. You know, how do you
14:36
Speaker 1: feel when you're told to soften your message about this?
14:40
Speaker 2: Well, I think what was even more painful is getting
14:43
Speaker 2: the list of banned words which you may have seen
14:45
Speaker 2: and to not use words like black or brown, or
14:49
Speaker 2: bipock or female or vulnerable or advocacy. And I am
14:54
Speaker 2: a black woman who does advocacy for a living to
14:56
Speaker 2: take care of people who are vulnerable and underserved. That
14:59
Speaker 2: is my job. That's why God has kept me here.
15:01
Speaker 2: And to be told to soften that message, it was
15:04
Speaker 2: really shocking. But you can soften magic, You can soften
15:08
Speaker 2: like I say, you can soften your promise. I cannot
15:11
Speaker 2: hide who I am, and so I really had to
15:15
Speaker 2: speak up more than ever because people's lives depends on
15:17
Speaker 2: me being true to what I say when it's comfortable
15:20
Speaker 2: and when it's not. If you buckle under pressure, then
15:23
Speaker 2: you're not who you say you are. I remember my
15:26
Speaker 2: dad telling me, like, this is times in life when
15:28
Speaker 2: you're gonna have to speak up for what you believe in,
15:30
Speaker 2: whether it's pretty, whether it's scary, whether it's you know.
15:34
Speaker 2: And my father was facing a firing squad. My mother
15:37
Speaker 2: rescued him. So in a sense, I was on that
15:40
Speaker 2: virtual Reubio firing squad almost like I was in, Like
15:43
Speaker 2: are they gonna shoot tigably down? Shut me down? We
15:46
Speaker 2: lost a lot of funding, we had to cut back
15:48
Speaker 2: for staff, and we were literally it was a bad time, Jim.
15:52
Speaker 2: But I remember my dad and mom, and so he
15:53
Speaker 2: asked me, like, what makes me who I am. My parents,
15:56
Speaker 2: you know, it's what they did, not just what they said.
15:58
Speaker 2: What they did. So he stood up what he believed
16:00
Speaker 2: and he put himself out there. He almost got killed,
16:03
Speaker 2: and love rescued him, and purpose kept on going back
16:06
Speaker 2: into the fire for other people, into the war, open
16:09
Speaker 2: it again. And then that purpose and love and commitment
16:12
Speaker 2: got us here and I'm here today. So I just
16:14
Speaker 2: did what I was born to do and what I
16:16
Speaker 2: was taught my parents is to do and just show up.
16:19
Speaker 2: And what was really cool is that we applied for
16:21
Speaker 2: a Melinda Gates Grant. We put my origin story in there.
16:25
Speaker 2: It's about who I was and why I was and
16:28
Speaker 2: what made me work in this space for fourteen years
16:31
Speaker 2: unpaid because people weren't supporting black patient girls, black curls
16:35
Speaker 2: who didn't have money. You had an idea back in
16:37
Speaker 2: the day until the murder of George Flood and COVID happened,
16:39
Speaker 2: and oh my god, you guys are well we loved it,
16:42
Speaker 2: you and I. Then now it's like, you know, we're
16:43
Speaker 2: back to being the black people in the in the closet.
16:47
Speaker 2: And I think those tough times really show you who
16:49
Speaker 2: you are. The Gates Grant we applied for the grant
16:51
Speaker 2: and my team was like, well, maybe we should kind
16:54
Speaker 2: of soften where we can, and I was like, no,
16:56
Speaker 2: we're not doing that because we were kind of split,
16:58
Speaker 2: and I'm like, we're not. And so I just was
17:00
Speaker 2: like full blast, heart centered love, unicorn, magic and my family,
17:06
Speaker 2: where we came from, how I built Typer Lily. We
17:08
Speaker 2: only had my daughter and I and family and friends,
17:10
Speaker 2: and how it was like volunteer lead in this ground
17:12
Speaker 2: swell and who were helping on the ground in the community,
17:15
Speaker 2: people who were young, vulnerable of all colors, but with
17:17
Speaker 2: black and brown people being at heightened risk, we're doing
17:19
Speaker 2: more of that. We were the only nonprofit that got
17:23
Speaker 2: an award in North America in public health. Out of
17:26
Speaker 2: four thousand applicants I believe. I believe four thousand, they
17:28
Speaker 2: only gave eighty one awards. We were among them. So
17:32
Speaker 2: I feel like when you really speak your truth and
17:34
Speaker 2: you're who you are, at some point, we literally were
17:37
Speaker 2: this close to like what did we do last year?
17:38
Speaker 2: And now this year we're in a better place because
17:41
Speaker 2: we didn't soften our message. Because we softened our hearts
17:44
Speaker 2: and kept going.
17:45
Speaker 1: Is it harder for people to get weird about the
17:50
Speaker 1: white black brown issue. When you're face to face and
17:55
Speaker 1: you're telling the story and somehow, like you said, so
17:58
Speaker 1: much is about vibes connection. Do you think it's essential.
18:03
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously you have to do both, but it's
18:06
Speaker 1: getting in person, speaking live more effective.
18:10
Speaker 2: When people are looking in your face eyeball to eyeball,
18:13
Speaker 2: it's hard to tell you that you're not a human
18:15
Speaker 2: being and it it doesn't matter you lessen human to
18:18
Speaker 2: them when someone's talking to you and you're saying who
18:21
Speaker 2: you are, where you're from, what your pains are, what
18:24
Speaker 2: your challenges are, why you're here, what you need to
18:26
Speaker 2: do to help people who's like their children and their
18:28
Speaker 2: wives and husbands, and why keeping their hearts beating, keeping
18:32
Speaker 2: them fed, keeping them okay in their health care journey.
18:35
Speaker 2: People have a heart time saying no because it's a
18:37
Speaker 2: black humanity, not color. I do think people were exposed
18:41
Speaker 2: this year for who they really were a lot of
18:43
Speaker 2: companies who were all throwing money at everything DEI They're
18:46
Speaker 2: done quiet and silent, and that really hurt a lot
18:49
Speaker 2: because people you thought were allies, all of a sudden,
18:52
Speaker 2: I can't fund you until I figure this out. Well,
18:54
Speaker 2: you were throwing money at me in the past four years.
18:57
Speaker 2: But then there are people who who stood up for us,
18:59
Speaker 2: who are as I said, I can't give you the
19:01
Speaker 2: money under this bucket, but I'll figure this out because
19:03
Speaker 2: of your work matters, and I'll make it work for you.
19:05
Speaker 2: And then you saw who really had your back. And
19:08
Speaker 2: so I do think it does matter showing up in
19:11
Speaker 2: person and talking to people. But people that care about
19:13
Speaker 2: you will find you. They will seek you out to
19:15
Speaker 2: ask you how you're doing and ask you what you need.
19:17
Speaker 1: Necessity is the mother of invention. You also probably brought
19:20
Speaker 1: in new partners that got it and rather than going
19:25
Speaker 1: to the same old wells, right, did that open up
19:28
Speaker 1: new avenues for partnership and sponsorship and awareness.
19:32
Speaker 2: Several partners well, we have a lot of partners, but
19:34
Speaker 2: there are some who said, Okay, this is bad, We're
19:36
Speaker 2: going to figure this out. There's some who said we can't.
19:39
Speaker 2: But I think within advocacy is hard because many advocacy
19:41
Speaker 2: groups in the cancer space are working with pharuma, and
19:44
Speaker 2: there's a lot of regulation and all the things you
19:46
Speaker 2: know about around guardrails. So it really forced us to
19:50
Speaker 2: think out of the box because when you're doing with
19:52
Speaker 2: like sixty partners. You can't. That's your time. You're on calls,
19:54
Speaker 2: you're doing events, you're doing ad boards. So we really
19:57
Speaker 2: have to think think about diversifying our funding for our pipeline.
20:01
Speaker 2: So we're looking at more grains for foundation grants, We're
20:03
Speaker 2: doing our walk round again, we're doing our gala, which
20:06
Speaker 2: that's something we're doing, but we're looking at just kind
20:08
Speaker 2: of branching out of just one bucket. To be honest,
20:12
Speaker 2: even though when bucket was reliable for a long time,
20:14
Speaker 2: right now it's still up in the air. I will
20:16
Speaker 2: say that I was surprised, pleasantly still that our advocacy
20:21
Speaker 2: work on the ground in communities is what people needed
20:23
Speaker 2: the most of So as you're looking at NIH losing
20:25
Speaker 2: funds and hospitals people having less money in hospital centers,
20:29
Speaker 2: or even FARMA having less money to give to advocacy groups,
20:32
Speaker 2: people still need community engagement to be able to recruit
20:35
Speaker 2: for trials at some point or do community health work right.
20:38
Speaker 2: And that's what our Angel program does in the midst
20:40
Speaker 2: of all these things happening. It kind of shows you
20:42
Speaker 2: when you one thing you're facing a challenge, like what
20:45
Speaker 2: rises to the top is what's working. So our ANGEL
20:47
Speaker 2: program which is community engagement, our clinical trials work which
20:51
Speaker 2: is really you know, clinical trial referrals to socites and
20:54
Speaker 2: things like that, and then our health literacy work really
20:56
Speaker 2: really began to grow because people need to be helpliterate.
20:59
Speaker 1: Well, let's have a lightning round on some of your initiatives,
21:03
Speaker 1: Rick and Dirty. Like Angel Advocates, what do they do?
21:06
Speaker 2: Angel Advocates take our training into fifteen module program. Fifteen
21:11
Speaker 2: modules are available ad RAM mandatory. They learn about self advocacy,
21:15
Speaker 2: family health history, and biomarcrot testing, clinical trials policy, all
21:19
Speaker 2: those things. Once they learn, they can go out there
21:21
Speaker 2: and do speaking on the hill, federal level or state level.
21:25
Speaker 2: They can be a partner with the sponsor for clinical
21:27
Speaker 2: trial referral, recruitment education. We do campaigns, so social media,
21:31
Speaker 2: we do patient insights work, We do all kinds of things.
21:34
Speaker 2: So we're kind of our own agency led by patients
21:37
Speaker 2: who have gone through breast cancer and other cancers, to
21:39
Speaker 2: be able to utilize them their voices, to be able
21:41
Speaker 2: to amplify their voices in many ways. Our My Life magazine,
21:45
Speaker 2: it's a magazine and it goes over ten thousand locations
21:47
Speaker 2: ten thousand across the country, and it's all patient driven
21:49
Speaker 2: and it's all content about patient stories, from policy to advocacy,
21:54
Speaker 2: to fertility, to survivorship to all things with mental health,
21:58
Speaker 2: all of it. We do a lot of policy work.
22:01
Speaker 2: I mentioned that we do a lot of work on
22:02
Speaker 2: the ground with clinical trials apart and would be a
22:04
Speaker 2: mess right now doing a brunch series where we're going
22:07
Speaker 2: around having a brunch and communities that are underrepresented and
22:11
Speaker 2: talking about women's issues and clinical trials and people are like,
22:15
Speaker 2: what are clinical trials? They're scary and we're just talking
22:18
Speaker 2: about it and having a great brunch, right. We also
22:21
Speaker 2: do a lot of work around health literacy, Like I
22:23
Speaker 2: mentioned campaigns as well well.
22:25
Speaker 1: What's Breathed TV pree.
22:26
Speaker 2: TV is me and my being Oprah around women's health
22:29
Speaker 2: and ecology. So we launched pre TV. Actually during the pandemic,
22:33
Speaker 2: people were afraid to breathe and they were just overwhelmed
22:36
Speaker 2: and they were separated. So I thought, a how do
22:39
Speaker 2: people get together, get connected rather while they're apart, and
22:43
Speaker 2: so they end up not breathing because we're all afraid
22:45
Speaker 2: of air and we're going to breathe and die. So
22:47
Speaker 2: people were by team was like, you want to call
22:48
Speaker 2: this breed TV during COVID, I said, yeah, I do.
22:51
Speaker 2: And we have people come to my house and they
22:53
Speaker 2: stood ten feet away and I had cameras and we
22:55
Speaker 2: had the Angel Advocates on zoom via Zoom remotely and
23:00
Speaker 2: people fought also connected and we launch during that time
23:03
Speaker 2: and now it's it's a recurring series that's on Facebook
23:06
Speaker 2: and YouTube where I'm the host. People come in either
23:08
Speaker 2: they fly in or we fly out to them, or
23:11
Speaker 2: we do it at conferences and discuss what it's like
23:14
Speaker 2: to have cancer and we have husbands on and we
23:17
Speaker 2: have sisters and friends and children. And because cancer is
23:20
Speaker 2: not just about the disease, is about you being a
23:22
Speaker 2: human body living with this thing that as you with
23:25
Speaker 2: your wife is all the things. It's distress is the trauma.
23:27
Speaker 2: It's the how to breathe, how to sleep, how to
23:30
Speaker 2: deal with you know, pain body and are you eating
23:34
Speaker 2: all the right things? The fear of recurrence is all
23:36
Speaker 2: of that is talking about TMBC eatations and being a
23:39
Speaker 2: person existing with disease and how to get through that
23:43
Speaker 2: and how to live on purpose.
23:44
Speaker 1: So amazing. What's hope box?
23:46
Speaker 2: The whole box was something that we launched. It was
23:49
Speaker 2: my first, very first program. I had treatment. I got
23:52
Speaker 2: very sick and I had a lot of side effects
23:54
Speaker 2: and I call my nurse and she say, well, nobody
23:56
Speaker 2: else has those same effects you've had, and I'm like,
23:58
Speaker 2: well I have them. And I at some point began
24:01
Speaker 2: to want to stop treatment because I was just I
24:02
Speaker 2: couldn't deal with the side effects. So my girlfriend woud
24:06
Speaker 2: brant me. She'd come to my house every morning I
24:07
Speaker 2: had a chemo and bring me in this little bag
24:09
Speaker 2: with just cute little things, things that girls like, right,
24:12
Speaker 2: And she's like, well, let's go to quemo and I'll
24:13
Speaker 2: give you the bag. So it's like her her trick
24:16
Speaker 2: to get me to go to chemo. And so when
24:17
Speaker 2: I began Taga Lilia, I thought there are people who
24:19
Speaker 2: were in treatment when I was there who would just
24:21
Speaker 2: buy themselves with the they had the hospital bland ket
24:25
Speaker 2: and they sat by themselves with their little donating or
24:27
Speaker 2: crucheing or reading a magazine. What if they had a
24:30
Speaker 2: box of hope with a beautiful blanket, scarves, caps, Lucian chapstick,
24:36
Speaker 2: and then some tools to navigate the journey. What to
24:38
Speaker 2: ask about in terms of breast cancer and buy a
24:41
Speaker 2: Marker's Trials Support and Navigation. So people get diagnosed now
24:46
Speaker 2: and they send us an email and my daughter Noel
24:48
Speaker 2: runs that program. She said on board as well. They
24:51
Speaker 2: get the box and they had this beautiful box a
24:54
Speaker 2: diagnosis and it tells them here's what to ask about
24:57
Speaker 2: these things. Ask your doctor about your treatment, chemo radiation,
25:01
Speaker 2: your test, your screenings, your diet, nutrition, your work and
25:06
Speaker 2: just all these amazing things to know about as you
25:09
Speaker 2: get through the dirty journey. But also we have our
25:12
Speaker 2: magazine in there. We have that blanket, we have a scarf,
25:15
Speaker 2: we have things make people feel like they're getting a
25:16
Speaker 2: hug during the process. So they get this beautiful, amazing
25:21
Speaker 2: tool that's a box of hope, and the magazine actually
25:25
Speaker 2: is here. This is one of our newest ones on fertility.
25:30
Speaker 2: Isn't that beautiful? And this is one that's on policy.
25:34
Speaker 1: Well, what's pure cat.
25:37
Speaker 2: My best friend Catherine got cervical cancer diagnosis during COVID.
25:41
Speaker 2: Just before COVID, actually before she got that, she was
25:44
Speaker 2: having a lot of cramps and she was told it
25:46
Speaker 2: wasn't anything to look worried about. It was just tall
25:48
Speaker 2: lips or whatever. And turns out with cervical cancer and
25:51
Speaker 2: she died within a year. And when she died, it
25:54
Speaker 2: was devastating and she died literally at the shutdown. Kat
25:58
Speaker 2: was a yogi, she loved it zoon but and she
26:00
Speaker 2: loved to eat clean and she loved to connect with women.
26:05
Speaker 2: So we launched a Pure Cat in honor of Catherine,
26:08
Speaker 2: but doing all things people needed to do to connect
26:10
Speaker 2: during COVID. So we had a zomba class, a fitness class,
26:14
Speaker 2: sound bath, just different things about connecting during the entire
26:17
Speaker 2: COVID time, so people were like together while they were
26:20
Speaker 2: alone through the Pure Cat classes. They're still running now,
26:23
Speaker 2: although not as much. But it was a way to
26:25
Speaker 2: turn that pain into something beautiful that would keep her name.
26:29
Speaker 2: It was neither at the time. People were just needing
26:31
Speaker 2: support and it really thrived during that time. And most
26:33
Speaker 2: patients don't want to leave the house when they're sick.
26:35
Speaker 2: They want to go to chema, come home and work.
26:37
Speaker 2: So they can love into a class and get us
26:39
Speaker 2: sound bath and get calmed down, or do fitness online,
26:43
Speaker 2: or do a zoomba class, or talk to a person.
26:46
Speaker 2: If they just talk to people on the class about
26:48
Speaker 2: what they're going through, they can get support, relief and
26:50
Speaker 2: get that virtual Tiger Lilli hug.
26:52
Speaker 1: Does empower her related to that or is that different?
26:55
Speaker 2: Empower hers you're doing? Did your homework, Jim. Empower Her
26:58
Speaker 2: is support group that's online every week. So yeah, pure cats,
27:03
Speaker 2: all things movement, and then it's all things in somba
27:05
Speaker 2: and dancing.
27:06
Speaker 1: Okay, so let's talk about it. You've kind of expanded
27:09
Speaker 1: into whole health practices like that. What's driving that? Is
27:12
Speaker 1: it just the trends? Was it something you had to
27:14
Speaker 1: adapt to because of the changes. My wife was on
27:17
Speaker 1: the board of the Dempsey Center focused on the wrap
27:20
Speaker 1: around care for better cancer. She had a she shed
27:23
Speaker 1: here that you know, she meditated in and breathed in.
27:27
Speaker 1: How does Tiger Lily help patients and survivors take care
27:31
Speaker 1: of their whole selves?
27:33
Speaker 2: We do a lot around mind, body, spirit work. Everything
27:37
Speaker 2: is there's you, and then the cancer comes in. Before
27:40
Speaker 2: there was cancer, there was you. Right then it brings
27:42
Speaker 2: us whole layer of trauma, anxiety and fear and all
27:45
Speaker 2: these things that don't support and healing space. So there's
27:48
Speaker 2: disease of the body, then there's disease in the mind,
27:51
Speaker 2: body and spirit, and so a lot of our works
27:53
Speaker 2: about beauty, strength, transformation, whole plitting legacy. I had to
27:57
Speaker 2: learn how to live in a body that I hadn't
28:00
Speaker 2: had targeted treatment and calm my mind and do what
28:03
Speaker 2: I do, And so a lot of what I've learned
28:05
Speaker 2: i'd pass on through Tiger Lily Right, like the tapping work,
28:09
Speaker 2: I just got one of those higher dose maths I'm
28:11
Speaker 2: trying out now, and I want to partner with them
28:13
Speaker 2: to figure out how to get people who need to detox.
28:15
Speaker 2: Matt Right. I have an ur ring, and I track
28:18
Speaker 2: my sleep, I attract my anxiety. I see our people,
28:21
Speaker 2: and so whatever I learned has gotten me here. Jim,
28:24
Speaker 2: I'm twenty years out this year, and I'm so blessed
28:27
Speaker 2: and thankful. I want that for all those women as well,
28:29
Speaker 2: and I want to have a fruteful twenty years journey.
28:32
Speaker 2: And that means navigating a life where you have fear
28:36
Speaker 2: right here saying that might come back anytime, and you're like, yeah,
28:39
Speaker 2: but I'm going to live my best, badass life anyway.
28:42
Speaker 2: So everything I've learned about coping with cancer and living
28:46
Speaker 2: intentionally and mindfulness, I share on my Instagram and we
28:50
Speaker 2: share as well through our tager lily posts, But all
28:52
Speaker 2: my IG's about what I've learned, you know, Like I
28:55
Speaker 2: do affirmations on Sundays. I share about fear. I share
28:58
Speaker 2: about my fertility issues and I could have had a child,
29:00
Speaker 2: but I couldn't because of chemote therapy. I talk about
29:04
Speaker 2: death and dying. I talk about fitness and building muscle
29:07
Speaker 2: as we get older, and trying to counteract the challenges
29:10
Speaker 2: of chemo therapy, talk about chemo brain as well, even
29:15
Speaker 2: dating and loss. I mean in the space the longer
29:18
Speaker 2: you live is a wonderful thing, but you lose people
29:20
Speaker 2: all the time, and so I feel like you have
29:22
Speaker 2: to Once cancer touches your life, you can't forget it
29:24
Speaker 2: was there. It's like a little unwonted little like natch.
29:27
Speaker 2: It's going to hang around. Your life depends on you
29:29
Speaker 2: knowing that it's there and being aware of how to
29:30
Speaker 2: live despite cancer.
29:32
Speaker 1: But you always look so healthy and amazing every time
29:35
Speaker 1: I see you. What's your routine? What are some secrets?
29:39
Speaker 2: Thank you? Jim? My routine is like first thing in
29:42
Speaker 2: the morning, I get up and I just put my
29:44
Speaker 2: hand in my heart and say thank you. Like to
29:46
Speaker 2: have your heart beating is an amazing thing. Before cancer,
29:49
Speaker 2: I would just get up and get to bed and
29:51
Speaker 2: go and this is still beating. So I just kind
29:53
Speaker 2: of feel and and say thank you for my heartbeat,
29:55
Speaker 2: my breath, thank you for life. I meditate for about
29:58
Speaker 2: half an hour in pray as well. Then I do tapping,
30:02
Speaker 2: and I do some breath work, walk my dogs. I
30:05
Speaker 2: go to the gym immediately after for about two hours,
30:08
Speaker 2: sometimes three hours. I do an hour of Zone two
30:11
Speaker 2: cardio rather an hour of weightlifting, sometimes an hour and
30:14
Speaker 2: a half, and then I do the sauna. I come
30:17
Speaker 2: home and then I have vitamins right there, about twenty
30:20
Speaker 2: of them that I take during the week, like from
30:23
Speaker 2: ab CD, barbering, magnesium, fish oil, MAGA three like everything.
30:28
Speaker 2: I also do peptides NAD little thion and B twelve,
30:33
Speaker 2: do collagen. My biggest spend is all my healthcare. I
30:36
Speaker 2: don't play around, so I do yoga as well in
30:39
Speaker 2: the evenings to wind down and my system tight is
30:41
Speaker 2: I map out, like here's my routine to take care
30:43
Speaker 2: of my body and my spirit and my soul.
30:45
Speaker 1: And you still work eight hours plus a day. I
30:48
Speaker 1: mean that's a lot. Do you sleep? I know sleep's important.
30:52
Speaker 2: I do eight hours a day, but when you sleep,
30:55
Speaker 2: you're more energized to get things done. And one of
30:57
Speaker 2: the things I learned, I know if you ever read
30:59
Speaker 2: Tim Ferris's I think it's called a four hour work week,
31:02
Speaker 2: you talked about how if you carve our time, maybe
31:05
Speaker 2: on a Friday, to have a day of self care
31:08
Speaker 2: and then a day of like just thinking, and you
31:11
Speaker 2: have that time to rest and just do things you love,
31:13
Speaker 2: like whether it's going to a spa or going off
31:15
Speaker 2: for a walk, or going for a run or taking
31:18
Speaker 2: a nap. When you have that time to restore yourself
31:20
Speaker 2: and your mind, you actually perform better and you can
31:24
Speaker 2: get more done in lesser time. And I thought that
31:26
Speaker 2: really works for me as well. So I have a
31:28
Speaker 2: Friday me a day where I don't have anything scheduling
31:31
Speaker 2: except to just gin mindfulness, body work, and I think
31:35
Speaker 2: and I get I do some work sometimes, but mostly
31:37
Speaker 2: it's just kind of like being free to just live.
31:39
Speaker 2: And then I do have where every single day at
31:42
Speaker 2: two o'clock, I have an hour break where I do
31:45
Speaker 2: nothing except think, brainstorm, write down ideas and be creative.
31:50
Speaker 2: And I find that by having that time for my
31:53
Speaker 2: body to just just be be a human being, that
31:56
Speaker 2: human doing. I can get more done in the time
31:58
Speaker 2: I'm working. And I often work sometimes, you know, twelve
32:01
Speaker 2: hours a day or I work ten hours a day,
32:02
Speaker 2: not often anymore. But when you're more mindful and intentional,
32:07
Speaker 2: you don't have to work as much to get as
32:08
Speaker 2: much done. If that makes sense.
32:10
Speaker 1: It does. What's one thing you're trying to get real
32:12
Speaker 1: honest about at the moment.
32:14
Speaker 2: I'll be vulnerable here. So when I got diagnosed, I
32:17
Speaker 2: made a promise to God, and I've been doing that
32:19
Speaker 2: promise all these years. I love what I built at
32:22
Speaker 2: the same time, and there was a girl whose life
32:25
Speaker 2: got arrested at that time. And now it's twenty years later.
32:29
Speaker 2: I'll be fifty three in a month, actually in like
32:31
Speaker 2: two weeks, and I'm thankful. I still look great and health.
32:35
Speaker 2: I'm healthy and happy, and I want to start to
32:38
Speaker 2: do more things that are bringing me enjoyment. Not that
32:41
Speaker 2: I don't love my work. If you ask me what
32:42
Speaker 2: I love doing, I love me with my daughter, and
32:45
Speaker 2: I love Tiger Lily and my patients and my friends.
32:47
Speaker 2: But I don't I put my hobbies down, like the
32:49
Speaker 2: painting and crafting and traveling. As much as I do,
32:53
Speaker 2: I travel for work, not for fun as much. So
32:55
Speaker 2: this time for me is about getting real about living
32:58
Speaker 2: the life that God has allowed me to be here
32:59
Speaker 2: till while doing my passion work and being on purpose
33:04
Speaker 2: and being a unicorn manifesting more time for Mama to
33:07
Speaker 2: be Mema. I built the thing. It's working. We have
33:10
Speaker 2: a team that's fantastic. My daughter's finishing college in May,
33:14
Speaker 2: so both babies. She's at George Mason. You met her
33:17
Speaker 2: at south By.
33:18
Speaker 1: I did. Yeah, my daughter's graduating too. I thought we
33:21
Speaker 1: had similar.
33:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, similar timelines. But it's like both my babies are
33:25
Speaker 2: now launching, and I've done the thing, and I'm still
33:27
Speaker 2: going to do the thing. The next thing is putting myself,
33:31
Speaker 2: making space for myself to manifest in terms of like
33:34
Speaker 2: I want to write some more books. And I launched
33:36
Speaker 2: my own sportswearline last year gym called Slimkick Clothing, so
33:40
Speaker 2: I want to build out Slimpthic. My father's will be
33:42
Speaker 2: My father will be in heaven in five years in October,
33:45
Speaker 2: and I want to write about him and what he's
33:47
Speaker 2: taught me. So another book's coming out at some point.
33:50
Speaker 2: So just kind of really being creative and living out
33:52
Speaker 2: loud and traveling more. Just a few little things here
33:55
Speaker 2: and there.
33:56
Speaker 1: Okay, so just some quick shot questions. You know, we've
33:59
Speaker 1: eaten together and we'd like to eat. What's the best
34:01
Speaker 1: meal you've ever had?
34:02
Speaker 2: Liberian food? Liberian food is the best. Palava sauce, cassava leaf,
34:08
Speaker 2: Okra sauce, bitter leaf is fantastic. I love African food.
34:11
Speaker 2: It's my Liberian is my best.
34:13
Speaker 1: What's the best place in DC for that?
34:15
Speaker 2: And make it at home? My mom and I we
34:17
Speaker 2: cook at home. I want that. I love eating at home.
34:19
Speaker 2: I like to cook my own food. And pepper sauce
34:21
Speaker 2: is like my thing. Make it licce and spicy. So
34:24
Speaker 2: Liberian food. Then next is sushi. Everyone loves sushi, and
34:29
Speaker 2: I would say I love going to Eddiev's in Dyson's Corner.
34:32
Speaker 2: It's my favorite place to go too because they just
34:34
Speaker 2: have a great team there in Tyson's Corner. They take
34:37
Speaker 2: care of me. I've gone there for about ten years
34:39
Speaker 2: and they have the best bronzino and they have the
34:42
Speaker 2: best wine and the best ambiance and they have a
34:45
Speaker 2: great team.
34:46
Speaker 1: All Right, we're going when I'm coming down. What's the
34:48
Speaker 1: best vacation you've ever taken.
34:50
Speaker 2: I just came back, Jim, hence my very tan face.
34:54
Speaker 2: I think I'd like five shades darker. My girlfriend turned fifty.
34:57
Speaker 2: We're in Turks for about five days and it was
34:59
Speaker 2: extra nearly beautiful.
35:00
Speaker 1: Somebody just told me and Caicos.
35:03
Speaker 2: Turks and Caicos isn't the bomb. It's just so relaxing.
35:05
Speaker 2: We got this big deala she had butlers and I.
35:08
Speaker 1: Let her get a sponsorship for this. I mean, my god, I.
35:11
Speaker 2: Need to get a sponsorship to travel more, Jim. I
35:13
Speaker 2: want to have a traveling sponsorship where I can show
35:15
Speaker 2: the importance of self care and living your best life
35:19
Speaker 2: with patients coming along right, so that you come with
35:21
Speaker 2: me and enjoy it. The tur it was, it was amazing. Yeah,
35:25
Speaker 2: that'st bi ky.
35:26
Speaker 1: Ever, last question is a music one. What's the soundtrack
35:29
Speaker 1: of your life if you had one?
35:31
Speaker 2: You want me to sing for you?
35:32
Speaker 1: Jim, Yes, I do.
35:34
Speaker 2: I can't sing, but it's I love Sinatra's Well in
35:37
Speaker 2: the String. I got the world on a string singing,
35:40
Speaker 2: you know, like the rainbow. I like everything you know
35:43
Speaker 2: that I'm playing like you know Bonny James or Butterflag
35:45
Speaker 2: like it just depends. But Sinatra, I love and Diana
35:49
Speaker 2: Ross I love, and I love Christopher Cross. The song
35:52
Speaker 2: sailing is my dad and I favorite song. So I
35:55
Speaker 2: love sailing.
35:56
Speaker 1: Oh Lily, yacht rock.
35:58
Speaker 2: Do you like to say I would love to seal, Jim,
36:01
Speaker 2: I do seal, but I don't seal myself. I get on,
36:03
Speaker 2: I get on the vessels and I exist and I
36:05
Speaker 2: being a mema, but I don't seal.
36:08
Speaker 1: I think that's the Turks and Caicos thing to do next.
36:10
Speaker 1: All right, well, listen, you really do have the world
36:13
Speaker 1: on a string. I just feel better talking to you.
36:16
Speaker 1: You know, you bring the light. You're just something else.
36:19
Speaker 1: I hope we can figure out more ways to partner
36:21
Speaker 1: and help each other. That's the goal of this, to
36:24
Speaker 1: get the good word out.
36:25
Speaker 2: I would love that. Let's catch up soon. I love that.
36:28
Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on the show. I really enjoyed it.
36:30
Speaker 1: I got the world on a string, sitting on a rainbow.
36:37
Speaker 2: I got the world around my finger. What a life?
36:42
Speaker 2: And this is life? Hey, now I'm so alone.
36:47
Speaker 1: Perfect.
36:48
Speaker 2: Just do some auto tune right there.
36:49
Speaker 1: Okay, we got you, We've got you. All right, Well,
36:52
Speaker 1: I'll see you soon. Hey, everyone, thanks for joining me
36:57
Speaker 1: on the get Real Podcast. You know, I hope you
37:00
Speaker 1: a little healthier hanging out with me. You know it's
37:02
Speaker 1: gonna be a lot of fun. Passing this along to others.
37:06
Speaker 1: Please subscribe below, Please share. I'm excited not just to
37:11
Speaker 1: talk about healthcare, but a lot of other fun topics.
37:14
Speaker 1: It's about making healthy. Talk about healthcare is not a lecture.
37:19
Speaker 1: This is supposed to be fun. And look forward to
37:22
Speaker 1: spending more time with you in the future.