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51 - Facing Fate in Final Fantasy VII Rebirth · Mythic Mind Games

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Even though these terrible things have happened. In the end,
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: if you play a role, everything's going to be okay.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Everything is going to work out the way that it's
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: supposed to. Doctor a Doctor Andrew mythic mind game Day,
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: we're discuss day. We're just Fantasy seven Rebirth. Welcome back
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: as we wrap up our final Fantasy seven mini series
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: at least until Revelation comes out. This time so far
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: away' for done the original, We've done Remade, done Advent Children,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: and now we are doing Rebirth. This is a game
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: that I think does some things really well. Overall, I
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: really enjoy it, so I shouldn't sound so gloom as
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: I say that. But it does some things really well.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: But I think that there is definitely some room for criticism.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: In fact, I probably have more criticisms of this game
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: than I did for Remake, even though I still think
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: that they're both great. And we'll get into some of
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: that as we move forward. But Michael, what did you
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: think of remake? You mean Rebirth? Rebirth? Sorry, Rebirth, Yeah,
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: I'll saw the res Yeah, I loved Rebirth. I liked
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: seven Remake quite a bit. I think, on balance, I
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: liked Rebirth more I do think kind of related to
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: what I think you were probably thinking. It feels like
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: Rebirth in contrast to remakes tighter focus. Rebirth feels like
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: it's biting off a lot to chew on, and it's
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: just sometimes it feels like, guys, you did not need
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: to try to do this much because it doesn't do
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  Speaker 1: like everything well. There's weak points, but the points that
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  Speaker 1: it does really really well, which I think is most
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  Speaker 1: of it, it just does unbelievably well. The combat in particular,
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: I remember, I feel like they made some tweaks to
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: it that make it much much more fun. Yes, they
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: add more party members so you're not stuck with like,
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: what is it like four characters in remake because they're
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: following the story, so you really you just barely have
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: met read thirteen and you don't even get to play
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: with them really by the end of remake. But here
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: it's like, Nope, beats a full party member. You get
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: other characters, including Kate Seth for better and for worse,
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: and yeah, it's just super fun story wise. I think
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: they continue like the reimagining of Fan Fantasy seven that
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: they started in remake, and they just continue to do
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: it very well. All the characterization is very solid. The
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: intro I remember being just spectacular. Yeah, like I never
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: thought that conversation they haven't. What is the town called Calm?
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: I think I in fun Masey seven original, Like that
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: was important because you get a lot of backstory. I
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: did not expect they would make that such a killer
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: intro to the game, where you have this splashback where
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: you're playing a cloud and seth Rothster. Why not? And like,
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: it's just a really strong intro. They get all the
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: dramatic beats downright. It hads like an open world mechanic
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: to the game, which I have some some mixed feelings on.
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: But that makes the world feel more much more expansive,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: So there's that. That was their way of handling here.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: We're in the overworld of the original fivety seven, so
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: let's just make these big open areas you can just
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: go do like open world stuff like get towers and
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: go inside missions. And yeah, it's it's paced somewhat slow,
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: like the filler problem that remake has is still here,
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: but I feel like for the kind of game they
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: wanted to make, they almost had to do that in
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: some places. So it's like, you guys, could have tightened
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: it a little, but it is closer to like what
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: a lot of modern JRPGs are, where it's more of
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: like a full one headed hour adventure for better or
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: for worse for those of us with less time. And
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the ending I think is very strong, which is unfortunately
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: part you have not yet gotten to see. But it
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: has one of the when I told you at our
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: discord good luck with the final boss. I was about
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: to throw by controller with that final boss. It's like
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: he smirks at you at one point if he beats you,
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: like it's me, so you have that to look forward to.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: But I will stop there. It's it's overall, I think,
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  Speaker 1: really enjoyable, just big, well good. I like a good, good,
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  Speaker 1: big boss battle at the end where you want to
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  Speaker 1: break something like I feel this one should be in
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: the grand finale. You are right in predicting that. My
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: main Christism comes from the fact that it's just it's
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: not nearly as tight as remake is, and there's it's
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: a lot more gamy, Like there's a lot more gamy
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: stuff to do, you know, go go to these towers,
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  Speaker 1: go scan these maco things, go you know, do this
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  Speaker 1: combat thing and like, I know, you don't really have
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: to do all that stuff, but if it's there, I'm
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: going to do it, Like I just feel compelled to
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: do it, and so you know I'm putting I don't
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know how many hours I've
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: I just put more hours into this game that I
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: have into a single game in a very long time,
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: which they're fun hours. I don't really I regret those hours.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: But the same time, as far as what I most
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  Speaker 1: want at this point in my life, it's different than
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: what I would have wanted as a teenager, you know,
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: early twenties or something. And that I like the artistic
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: kind of experience that you get in more of a
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: tight narrative. That that's what I like about Remake. That's
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: what I like about some parts of Rebirth, like when
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: we really get into the heart of the story. I
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: think it does that really well. But sometimes I even
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: forget what's really happening, kind of spending all this time
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: doing all this stuff for Chadley. But I don't know.
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: I know that I saw around the news of Revelation
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  Speaker 1: coming out, there's a post about, you know, how he's
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: such a popular figure that they're bringing him back. I
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: never heard anybody actually say they like, I feel like
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: the bloat of the gaming mechanics, And I mean, it's
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: a game, so this is more personal opinion than like
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: objective grading on it. But I mean, I feel like
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: if we cut down on the gaming bloat and focus
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: more on the narrative, the characters, the heart of the story,
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: Like that's the kind of stuff I feel like it
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  Speaker 1: does really really well. As you mentioned, I didn't finish
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: just today. I wrapped up chapter thirteen with the Temple
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: of the Agents. Like when you do the I know
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: we're jumping to the end here, but the trial, like
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: the companion trial phase where they all get these background
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: or you know, flashback experiences of their most traumatic traumatic
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: things have happened in our lives. Like it's it's devastating,
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: but I feel like that's the kind of thing that
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: I really like for Final Phase seven to do, because
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: it's it does so well with the characters and dealing
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: with sorrow and grief and it's it was just such
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: a devastating scene. But I feel like that's the kind
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: of thing it did really well, and I would like
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: to see more of that maximize versus the Chaddley stuff. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: I saw you posted on X about the Earth. Yeah,
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: like I feel which legit that might be the only
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: time a game has ever brought tears to my eyes
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: because that was so emotionally traumatic. Yes, and that is
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: exactly what I want in a remake series. And that
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: takes these things that are obviously already sad in the original,
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: but it brings you into them in a way that
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: you couldn't really do in nineteen ninety eight, Like you
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: get more of that existential experience of poor little Erath
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: wandering around Midguar with nobody helping her. She's trying to
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: find help for her dying mother. Like it's it's devastating.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it feels like an emotional cheap shot,
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: but it works, Like I enjoy that on an artistic
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: level versus simply a game level. And also that whole
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  Speaker 1: scene of all these companions living out their worst experiences
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  Speaker 1: and on one hand, you're not exactly watching it, and
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: that you as the player, are doing some things, but
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: you don't really have any choice over what's happening, and
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: that feeds directly into Era's little speech I should gives
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  Speaker 1: after everyone comes out of that in that you know,
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  Speaker 1: you as the player being forced to do things but
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: not really have any decisions to make, not having any choices,
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  Speaker 1: no no agency. She's bringing out the fact that there's
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  Speaker 1: some things that have happened in your life that you
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  Speaker 1: simply cannot control, and getting bitter and angry isn't going
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: to bring you strengths, that's actually going to empty you out.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: Real strength comes through forgiveness and really just walking in
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  Speaker 1: faith and accepting that even though these terrible things have happened,
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: in the end, if you play a role, everything's going
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  Speaker 1: to be okay. Everything is going to work out the
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: way that it's supposed to. And so I think that
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: especially really all throughout, but especially in the final sequence,
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: I think Earth really shines as this ambassador, this example
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  Speaker 1: of faith in a really powerful way, which is not
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: very often that I say that a character in a
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  Speaker 1: video game models faith or really any virtue, and I
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: could really truly primary world inspiring way. But I think
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: they did really do a good job with Earth in
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  Speaker 1: that and then Cloud immediately afterwards sayss enough, let's move
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  Speaker 1: on on, which is awful. Like I hate Cloud in
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: that chapter. Yeah, he's like a brick like I hate
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  Speaker 1: him so much. Yeah. Yeah, one thing that comes to
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  Speaker 1: mind when you're talking about like I was talking about,
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  Speaker 1: like you can't just hold on to bitterness that consumes you.
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  Speaker 1: Like this isn't something I would ever have thought i'd
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  Speaker 1: associate with fa fancy, but it reminds me of something
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  Speaker 1: that's always stuck with me that my dad used to
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  Speaker 1: say about, like people as they get older. A lot
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: of people when like older people, when you meet them,
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  Speaker 1: it feels like they're kind of either really really bitter
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: people or they're like some of the nicest people you'll
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: ever meet, almost Like what is it like there's like
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: a CS's quote this relevant somewhere from that idious strength
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: where it's like everything is coming to a finer point
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: as time moves on, where it's like my dad's philosophy
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  Speaker 1: was that you kind of just become more and more
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  Speaker 1: of the person you're gonna be by the time you're older,
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  Speaker 1: you're just kind of there. And so if you're on
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: that trajectory to be better or to be able to
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: be joyous despite everything in life, like that's who you're
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  Speaker 1: going to be. And so that's always stuck with me
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  Speaker 1: as something I need to remember as I get older,
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  Speaker 1: is I need to make sure I am on the
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  Speaker 1: course where I don't become a bitter old me because
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: I don't really want to be one, and so I
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: want to like still have sight of the joys of
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: the world that God has and the life that God
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: has for us to live, and having joy in the
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: Lord fundamentally, and having faith as you're talking about. So, yeah,
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: that does resonate with me, even though I don't remember
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  Speaker 1: think about that much when I played that scene, but
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: it's cool to bring that out now. Yeah, And as
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: she was remarkable that of all the characters, you know,
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: she is the one most marked by sorrow, grief, trauma,
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: not only because we all know what happens to her
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: that you know, we know that she dies, and even
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: you know as early as remake that's pretty obvious in Kate,
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: you know, it's assumed that you know that she's going
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: to die. I mean, as soon as Cloud meets her,
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  Speaker 1: there are these quick little flashes of her materia dropping
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: down the stairs, you know, go echoing what you know
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: from the original if you played the original, like that
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: is her dest scene. And so that's been there in
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: the forefront from the beginning but even aside from that,
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, you know, her mother dying and never really
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: having a place her the closest thing she had to
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: a father is like saying the turk or something like
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  Speaker 1: she has that kind of connection with him or something
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  Speaker 1: like a friend. And yet she is the one who
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: has learned to let go of things the most. And
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: it reminds me of this is a time for exceptions.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: Not not only am I praising this video game character,
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: but but I'm also good to reference Stephen Colbert I
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: don't normally look to as a philosophical hero, but there
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: is this interview that he had with Anderson Cooper a
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: while back, and he's talking about the various hardships that
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: he's had in his life, and Colbert says that he's
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: learned to be grateful for the things that he most
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: wished didn't happen. I think that's a powerful line, and
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: even in that interview he quotes Tolkien saying something similar
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: to that about, you know, the the things that we
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: don't want to happen, Like, we're not glad that we've
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: experienced various kinds of suffering, but we've learned to be
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: grateful because they've allowed us to relate to reality, to God,
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: to ourselves in a way that we wouldn't otherwise be
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: able to do. I know I found that in my
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: own life, but I just think that Earth really bodies
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: that remarkably. And then even after Cloud has been so
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: mean to her, you know, he's chasing her down trying
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: to get the Black Materia, and she finally lets go
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: and gives it to Cloud and basically just accepts that
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: as long as she plays her part, even he will
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: be okay in the end, his soul will be okay.
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: So she just lets go with that kind of faith
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: that whatever she's letting go of will be gained back
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: in the end. And I think it's a great model
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: of Christian faith there. Well, maybe maybe we should you know,
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: I know I jumped to the end here, Maybe we
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: should go back to the beginning. You know. I was
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: very impressed from the very beginning when you start off
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: playing as Zach, which was very unexpected, and so that's
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: kind of cool. I think I kind of like what
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: they're doing here with the multiverse stuff, which yeah, I
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: said last time that I'm not I'm kind of burned
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: talent on multiverses, But I think It's interesting, especially since
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: in this game the Zach stuff is very much on
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: the proof Frey. You know, you play a little bit
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: here and there, these little snapshots. Obviously they're going to
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: do more with that in Revelation, because correct me if
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: I'm wrong, because I didn't finish the game, but I
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: think I understand that. Toward the end of Rebirth they
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: keep forgetting what these titles are. At the end of Rebirth,
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: there's some talk about Zeffroth like bringing the timelines together
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: or can you tell me at all what's going on
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: with that. I wish I understood what happened there. So,
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: for what it's worth, you actually do get more Zach
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: at the very end, and like it's pretty significant stuff
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: at least if you care about Zach as a character.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: I feel like I've never been in touch with Zach
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: as a character, so it's hard for me to care.
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: But it was still cool stuff. Yeah, And then like
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: so there's these scenes where you end up if you
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: don't mind me spoiling, no, please, I figure out up
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: on it. There's these scenes at the very end where
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: you end up, like in Alternate mid Guar walking around
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: with Earth and you like, just she's going shopping at
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: stalls or something. But then like Cephyarroth shows up randomly,
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: and it's like it's clear they're kind of playing with
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: like this like ethereal exploration of the other universes, and
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: Sepharroz says something about somewhere about this is the moment
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: when all the universes come together and the convergence I
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: think is supposed to be around when he kills Earth
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: and because then when that kicks off, that's when everything
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: goes nuts and you get the mount Boss battle and
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: they play that up for like a lot of emotional weight,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: but I'm not sure they actually made it very clear,
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: so I couldn't say, like what exactly Revelation is going
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: to do with that. It does feel like at the
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: very end there's a notion that there's like some kind
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: of rift that he formed between the multiverses that somehow
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: Cloud is sensitive to. At the very end, it's super unclear.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: Don't rely on me to explain this, but it does
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: play with that notion more and it's clear it's setting
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: up for them to do something crazy with it in Revelation.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: I just don't know what it is. Yeah, So I
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: don't know, there's not much to say about that right now,
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I know when steph Roth gets the Black Materia,
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: he says something about, you know, bringing reality back together
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: basically around him. It's kind of what he's trying to
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: do here, and that is the reunion. You know that
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: along there's let's talk of the Genova reunion, which is
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: basically the original idea of the reunion that you know,
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: all of these that that Genova was fragmented and basically
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: is being brought back together with seff Roth sort of
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: I don't know, being one with his mom or or something,
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: but this one, the idea of reunions is I think
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: it's getting expanded even more where we have basically all
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: of reality getting reunited in Sepharroth is his plan. At
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: least that's my understanding. That's as good a theory as
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: anything I've got for what's going on there. But yeah, again,
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: I don't know like how they would do that in
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: Revelation because multiverses they come with a lot of unique
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: problems to solve. In a story where it's like, do
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: we care about this other universe where Zach's alive, we
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: kind do because he's there, He's alive. People are that
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: we're not alive in the other, but we also got
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: to care about the main one. That's where we spend
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: all our time. So how do they reach a conclusion
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: that satisfies both sides? I feel like the easy end.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: I don't know, so I guess we get to see
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: what will happen with that. One thing I found interesting
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: was that they still kill Earth, because going out of remake,
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: I know one of my theories was that they were
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: trying to set up so they could just totally change
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: a whole bunch of major points in the story. I
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: thought that they would kill Tifa instead of Earth, which,
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: in hindsight now, especially understanding the themes they're going for,
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: I understand now why they did not do that. But
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: it was interesting to me that, like the arguably the
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: most memorable part of Found Fantasy seven, they very specifically
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: capped even though they were setting it up so things
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: could change. So it's almost like to me, it feels
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: like there's almost themes of inevitability combined with the explosive
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: possibilities of the molt. It is interesting that, especially at
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: the end of remake, it doesn't make they're opening things
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: wide open. The focus is on defying fate, and it
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: seems like maybe you can even do that, right, you
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: kill this arbiter of Faate grain whisper thing, and so,
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: you know, you feel like the path is wide open.
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: But then, especially as you get towards the end of
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: Rebirth from the Companion trials up through, I've played just
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: part of that Earth Dream sequence at the beginning of
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: the last chapter where you're picking Alec presence and candy
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: and that sort of thing, And you know, I noticed
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: that Cloud keeps being given a choice, but then his
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: choice doesn't really matter, right, his agency's taken away from him.
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: So you pick whatever gift you want to for Earth,
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: and then the shopkeeper says, no, you know, how about this?
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: You pick whatever candy you want to and the shopkeeper says, no,
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: how about this? And so that makes me really think
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: they're setting up from the fact that fate is pretty solid,
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: that you don't have complete agency. Some things are just
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: gonna happen no matter what you choose, some things are
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: locked in. But at the same time, and not having
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: finished the game, I mean, when when Earth does die,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: isn't there some kind of ambiguity there or some kind
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: of multiverse thing happening with that moment they do some shenanigans.
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: I feel like I came away from it thinking, Okay,
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: they're very clearly saying that in the proper sense, she
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: did die, but somehow spiritually she's still there, because like
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: this is this is mainly a spoiler that you would
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: want to know, so you don't unequip her. You use
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: her and Cloud together in the very final fight, Like
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: she just basically comes out of a portal in this
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: like alternate space and then you fight the final boss together.
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: So clearly she's still around in some sense, but the
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: way in which she is is unclear. It's almost like
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: she escaped into the life stream or something and is
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: somehow living on through that and then interacting almost like
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: in an obi wan kenobi kind of way, you strike
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: me down, I've become more powerful, you can possibly imagine.
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: It feels almost like they're doing that with Earth, but
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: again they're not super clear about it. Unfortunate don't have
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: a more information to really talk about that. Yeah, or
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: maybe they're cheating by bringing her in familiar universe. I
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: don't know. Well, we talked a lot about the ending.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to think, like, what else from the early parts.
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: I remember I've talked a lot about Rufus because for
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: some weird reason, I like Rufus as a character. I
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: feel like you get a lot more of him here,
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: which makes sense. He only gets to show up at
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: the very end of the first game because that's when
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: he takes over Shinra. You see him a lot. So
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: you have like the whole parade sequence and was it
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: junn I think and there it was pretty I feel
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: like the performance that the actor did in the way
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: they choreographed him, he almost sold me, like legit almost
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: told me that he was going to be like, yeah,
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: we're not gonna fight or anything. Even though I had
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: played the original game, I knew he was lying through
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: his teeth. This still kind of worked. And then Goofy
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: comes in and ruins it is what it feels like.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: So they dive more into the politics of it with
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna Japan landy Wu Tai, Thank you. There's
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: a lot more stuff between Shinra and Wu Tai and this,
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: and they have this random other character who I'm pretty
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: sure was not the original, who's claimed to be a
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: representative of Wu Tai who's interacting with Rufus and the
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: others the whole way through weird stuff going out with him,
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: but it's clear they're trying to explore more of that
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: space in a way that I think was interesting. I'm
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: not sure how I feel about how well they explored it,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: but it was interesting. Yeah, it's always kind of on
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: the proof free, but it's definitely there more than it's
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: pretty much non existent in the original. I mean, there
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: was some mention about the genera of war with Rutai,
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: but they didn't really get into it. But yeah, that
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: was interesting scene. And you know, it makes sense that
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: Rufus would say, like you want to take down stuff, Froth, Okay,
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: go for it. You know that politically speaking, that that
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: makes a lot of sense for him, And he definitely
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: comes across as a pragmatist. Where his father was just evil,
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: Rufus at least seems to have actual goals and he
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: thinks about how to achieve those goals. Now he's yeah,
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: he's ambitious, he's a bad guy, but he's he's smart,
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: he's rash, he's more politically minded, and so yeah, I
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: agree that he definitely is a stronger character. You mentioned
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: UFI think of her throughout this Ufie annoys me so much.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: I feel almost like she's supposed to she is. I
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: don't know. I kind of like her, but I mean
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: she's I don't know, she's very lighthearted compared to me,
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: you know, the more somber. I mean, I appreciate that
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: she has. She has a lot of engagement with with Barrett,
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: who is obviously kind of a father figure, and he's
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: very annoyed by her, but he also kind of guides
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: her and puts up with her. And I don't know,
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: I think like she is kind of annoying by herself,
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: but she she provides for some worthwhile relationships and engagements.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: I did like how they played when you meet her
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: and she joins the party, which, if I'm wrong, aren't
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: they on the dialogue choices? There are they playing off
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: of in the original where you could just choose the
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: wrong ones and then she doesn't join your party? Yeah,
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I think so, But here, I don't think that can happen.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: I think she always does yees, because I'm pretty sure
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: I chose all of the walk Away because I thought
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: it was hilarious. When claud I was just like I'm
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: done bye, She's like Wow, I'm going to join you anyway.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: I'll take it right. She has what to play as though, yeah,
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: she is. Did you swap out your characters or do
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: you stick with one party? No, I tried to swap out.
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: I like variety in everything, and that includes games. So
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: if they're give me party member, I'm gonna find way
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: to use him. Some of them, I will admit I
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: did not figure out how to use very effectively. I
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: feel like, particularly I don't know who knows how to
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: use Kate Seth Well, I want to talk to that
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: person because I don't know how to use these super
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: weird characters as well. And Red thirteen, I feel like
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: I never totally got I did try to use him.
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: Sometimes it forces you to use him, but I feel
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: like something about his play style never quite clicked for me.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: He's like not quite a mage. He's almost like a
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: like a red Mage class, I feel, which is ironic
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: because he get read in the name where he's a
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: little bit of a jack of all trades but mass
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: of none, and it's just we're playing as a dog
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: as opposed to a person mechanically. But yeah, I definitely
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: did swap out a lot of them, but I think
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: my favorite ones were usually Barrett, Cloud Tifa like standbys,
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: and er It like the ones or their original right,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: and then UFI was fun to swap in some as well. Yeah,
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: I just I don't maybe just lazy. I just don't
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: like swapping out my material and stuff, you know, like
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: to maximize my party, and so I pretty much just
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: went Tifa and Errath the whole way. I mean, they're
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: great stand bys. Yeah, but I think part of the
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: fun of when you get in different ones is you
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: get diferent synergy attacks, which is like one of my
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: favorite things in this game. It's basically like the dual
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: text and chrono trigger mm hmm. Yeah. I will say Cloud,
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: Tifa and uf you are probably my favorite to actually
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: play as. Yeah, I totally get that they need some
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: fun combos with those. They're all just very fast moving
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: and very punchy. Yeah. So you so, I gather you
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: were not a fan of the Kate Sith Factory sequence
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: where you're throwing blocks everywhere, you know, even up to
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: that point, Yes, I already felt like there was a
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: good bit of gaming bloat in the game. Uh. That
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: was the first part of the game where I felt
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: bored and I just wanted to be done. I did
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: not enjoy that. I think it's like everybody's reaction to
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: that sequence. For a while, I was like, Okay, fine,
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: I can get through this weird part of the game.
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: And then they make you solo fid a boss. I'm like,
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: what the crap game? Yes, really hard one, so mean,
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: but it is interesting also to me. So one of
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: my pet peeves and a lot of JRPGs is a
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: lot of them likely mini games. Rebirth loves its mini
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: games some extreme degree. It's like everybody in the team
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: was pitching mini game ideas to the director and he
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: just didn't say no to any of them. Just like guys.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: But to their credit, they do a really good job
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: of trying to flesh the ball out. I'm very picky
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: about card games and RPGs. They rarely worked for me.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: I actually kind of liked this one, Queen's Place. I
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: like Queen's Blood. Yeah, the collectible card thing I could
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: do without, But I mean, the actual mechanics of the
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: game made sense. I was like, I can see an
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: actual tabletop game that plays like this and it would
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: probably work. Someone may have made it for all I know.
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: Probably have you probably find on taptop simulator or something,
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: but that that was legitimately fun. I think I went
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: through the entire Queen's Blood sequence, like all the way
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: to the end and fought the Queen thing. Okay, so
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: you did that one too. I said that you really
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: were doing everything. I was doing everything. Did you get
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: all of the proto relics as well? I did? But
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: I did not defeat Gogamesh because I went to his island.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: First of all, I think it's cool that it included Gogamesh.
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: You know, from the older games. I appreciate them, so
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: that was cool. But I got all the relics Proto relics.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: I went to his island. I fought the first pair
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: of summons and said, Nope, this is not going to
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: work out. Yeah, that's clearly post game content that you're
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: supposed to go to maybe after you've done the final boss.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: And I thought about going back there, but I always
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: think I'm gonna do a post game content and I
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: rarely do. And I never went back and thought them
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: because they were freaking hard. I'd have to really work
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: on my bills to do that. Yeah, I mean, I
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: after not doing postgame basic as soon as I could,
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: recognizing it, it's not gonna happen. I thought, all right,
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: let me grind up and then go back, and I
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: did that for a little bit and decided, no, I
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: do not have time for this. I'm not gonna go
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: grind for twenty levels or whatever I need to do. Uh.
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: So that's what I decided. I just need to go
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: the Coumple Agent Ancients, and you'd be overpowered for the
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: final boss at that point any way. So yeah, but
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: it was kind of disappointing. I go through the work
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: of getting all these produ relics and I'm not gonna
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: have anything to show for it. You do get that
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: cool scene where what is it Sepherrof Summon's guilt combs
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: right accident in nibble him and then he's like, nah,
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: you guys, deal with this guy. I'm out right. That
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: was hilarious. But yeah, that that was fun. What did
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: you think of the Golden Saucer. I like the Golden Saucer. Uh,
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: there's a lot about this game where they're obviously going
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: for levity that actually they go too far and making
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: it cartoony and was that I don't think really fits
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: the main aesthetic of the game, like, for example, that
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: kid g the Little Goblin guy. Oh my goodness, legit
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: hated all of his stuff. Yeah, like he didn't need
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: to be there or or even that, like that Johnny.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: I don't like Johnny. Well, I think he's probably dealt
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: with now, so that, yes, But I mean I didn't
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: think he'd served any real value in remake. I don't
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: think he serves any real value in this game. I
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: don't like that that motorcycle guy that was in both games.
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: Wait was Johnny not the motorcycle guy, which was Johnny
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: Johnny dorky friends right, who somehow gets clones of himself
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: right about you? If he clones him, I don't, I
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: don't know. Yeah that was weird, Okay, Yeah, I didn't
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: care abou him either. Yeah. I didn't like him. Didn't
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: like the motorcycle guy. And so this over the top
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: cartoony type characters. I just don't think they suit this game.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: But I am a fan of levity in the right
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: kind of way, and I feel I like the Golden Saucer.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: I like the Golden Saucer in the original, I like
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: it in this game. I feel like it adds some
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: levity in a way that doesn't take away from the experience,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: but I feel like it I don't know if it's
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: right in and I enjoyed the mini games, like the
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: Chocobout Racing is kind of fun. I did get the
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: Gold Cup on that. The the like Star Fox Flight
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: simulator game is kind of fun. And so I don't know,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: I like Golden Saucer. What do you think? Uh, yeah,
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: I'd forgotten about the choke about thing. They actually made
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: it into like basically a Mario Kart. Yeah, it's kind
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: of fun. Finally seven I was like, this is impressive.
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: How much work they put into this. Yeah. Yeah. I
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: think one of the reasons why the Golden Saucer worked
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: is because, at least to it felt like it was
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: pretty closely associated to the characters and their experiences going there,
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: and how it's clearly like the moment they needed as
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: characters for their levity, whereas characters like Johnny, I don't
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: feel like they're giving the character or the main characters
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: any real benefit. But the Golden Saucer does. You get
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: two dates there potentially with different people, depending you can
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: still accidentally go on a date with Barrett. It's like, well,
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: where's all the girls, but I think I actually did
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: end up going on dace with both girls, like because
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: I think I had Erith for the midpoint and then
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: at the very Antifa, which I feel like it is
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: the correct arc for Cloud because at some point he
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: has the transition between them. And I feel like those
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: were actually pretty well done. It's clearly they were very
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: invested in the relationships of the characters and getting those right.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: The what is it the opera scene that's very end
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: of the Golden Sauser thing, I think was superbly well done. Yeah.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: That was fun, super interesting. Yeah, and I'll need to
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: go back and you know, try the different date experiences
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: because I'm interested in the relational things. Yeah, I had
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: Earth for both of them, and yeah, you know, you
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: said there needs to be a transition at some point.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: I think seph Roth will help with that. Yeah, yeah, Yeah,
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: I feel like they were good. They had some heart.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: You know, I don't know what the other one you'll like,
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: but I always appreciate that the dynamic of Earth, like
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: throwing yourself at Cloud and Cloud just awkwardly not knowing
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: what to do, and they do kind of explore to
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: Erath's whole thing about like I got much more of
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: the sense playing this game than I remembered being a
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: thing in the original, where she's kind of struggling with
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: what to think of Cloud because she associates him so
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: closely was Zach, who was her old boyfriend and he's gone,
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: and she's like, well, what do I do now? I
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: kind of like Cloud, but I also really like Zach,
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: So it's like there's this weird psychological barrier to their
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: relationship there. And I think probably also she has some
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: awareness that she's going to die later too, which calls
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: back to in remake when she tells Cloud don't fall
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: in love with her because she senses she is a
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: doomed character. I think because again I think there's some
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: time travel shenanigans where she she has some knowledge from
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: the lifetream that tells her what's going to happen. So
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: there's that sense to her and that just makes it
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: a very like difficult kind of relationship to happen. But
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: it's still interesting to see them try to navigate it
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: as well. I don't know, I really like what they
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: did there. I think that's I think I said before
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: on Finally seven Talk, But I think like the Cloud
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: Tifa Eric relationship is like the best love triangle I've
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: seen in video games. Definitely not what you want to
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: hear on a date that you remind her of her
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: ex boyfriend. Yes, that is also very true and very awkward,
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: but it really does kind of make you feel for
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: Cloud in that he really is just this hollowed out person,
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: you know, when she says that he didn't only look
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: kind of like Zach, but that he acted kind of
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: like Zach and his mannerisms were kind of like Zach,
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: and so you know, he really just did embody the
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: at least surface level of Zach, but he is just
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: this empty person inside, which is what Sephroth really plays
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: off of, you know, saying you know later on that
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: you you've seen people you know. It's actually during Cloud's
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: trial and the Temple of Ancients, like when he goes
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: back to seeing Jesse die and Bigs die and says like, look,
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: you saw them die and you didn't really care, like
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: you are an empty person, And so he really does
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: really play on that, But it just makes me feel
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: for Cloud's character. Now do you think that in in
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: remakes she does Eric does say don't fall in love
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: with me. It's obviously she knows she's going to die,
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: but then right from the beginning of Rebirth, she's obviously
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: like attracted Cloud, isn't trying to push him away anymore
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: from the very beginning. Do you think that she's still,
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: throughout rebirth knew that she was going to die or
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: is that something that the whispers took from her? But
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: she's like slowly losing knowledge that she has throughout remake. Ah,
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: I don't know that I had any sense that she
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: was losing knowledge. Really, I could say some things that
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: would get me in trouble with women for how some
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: of them think. But I feel like Eric kind of
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: is trying to not think about that during a lot
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: of this, and so she's struggling with it, and she's
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: she's a character who loves to escape, I feel like,
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: and so like she's is very easily drawn into, oh,
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: let's be happy and have fun with Cloud and not
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: think about the horrible stuff that's coming. But then when
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: it comes, at least she's able to deal with it
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: at that point. So I feel like she kind of
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: flits about. If that makes any sense as a character
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: in her mind. I may be totally wrong on that.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: That's just my take on her character. I feel like
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: Tifa is a much more consistent character than her. But
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: Tifa doesn't have the weight of the world on her
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: shoulders the way that Earth does. She just kind of
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: has the weight of Cloud, right, and which is a lot,
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: but it's a different kind of weight. Yeah, and I
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: will say that that that is portrayed really well. And
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: that's one area where I think that this does deepen
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: what we get in the original, where we look at
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: Tifa and the way that she is caring for Cloud
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: in that you know, from the end of that first
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: flashback to Nibelheim toward the bend of the game that
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: you were talking about, when she says to Earth like
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: Cloud wasn't there, He wasn't doing those things. Yeah, so
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: she's just trying to hold on to his frail psyche
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: that she knows is not what it's supposed to be. Yeah,
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: I thought that was super interesting. That was something I
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: was going to mention everythone we're talking about Cloud being
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: called out. It's like he's got the Zach's Memories problem
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: going on, where he's confused about what happened in his past.
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: And yeah, the way Tifa reacts when he tells the
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: story as if he was. There is really subtle and
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: interesting here in ways that I don't think they were
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: able to get across in the original because if you
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: this is where I think you really do need to
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: a play finally seven before you play the remakes, is
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: so that you have that context, because if it doesn't
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: explain to you in this game that that was not Cloud,
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: at least not very clearly. I think I think you're right.
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: I think Tifa alludes to it, but it's very late.
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: But yeah, when you see Tifa just kind of looking
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: concerned at Cloud as he's describing things, that is a
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: very clever, little subtle bit of I don't know if
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: acting is the right term because it's animated, but it's
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: a clever little bit of choreography to just give that
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: emotional weight of ah, something's not quite right, but it
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: doesn't seem right to contradictum. So let's keep going because
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: who knows what happens with Cloud later. Let's just try
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: and care for him as west as we can't at
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: the beat time, Right, that was really interesting to me
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: and really interesting part of their relationship. Now, Craig, if
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: I'm wrong, because it's been forever since I play it
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: a couple of years. But don't Tifa and Cloud have
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: a fight at the beginning of the game as well,
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: and they have like a check outside where they don't
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: really know how to talk to each other properly. Yeah,
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: And so Sephroth is basically whispering in Cloud's ear that
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: it's not real a Tifa, that she died, and so
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: this must be some kind of trick, and so he's
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: trying to make Cloud not only not trust her, but
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: like think she's fundamentally not real or something. And so
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: he just continued to press it in on these wounds
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: on Cloud Psyche, and so Cloud keeps lashing out, like
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: you know, there's no scar, and so he just doesn't
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: trust her on a fundamental like existence level. Yeah, and
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: then that plays out when he throws her in the
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: live stream later, which I remember playing that and I
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: was like, I don't buy that Cloud would do this,
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: But I think now that you're talking, I think they
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: do set that up. It just feels I think it
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: just feels weird when it's a character you've played as
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: the whole time, acting in a way you would not
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: want the character to act. It feels weird, but it
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: does get across that sephy Roth is causing some serious
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: problems here, right. And I do remember in in the original,
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: wasn't a Tifa that Cloud really like slaps around that one?
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: I can't remember one of them. I can't remember it.
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: There's a scene that is not exactly played out in
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: the remakes where Cloud is literally just like beating up
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: earth Artiz. I can't remember which one it was, just
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: because he's so taken over by the seph Roth stuff.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: And yeah, there's so many moments of this game where
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: I just do not like Cloud, which I guess it
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: is entirely his fault, but I mean going back to
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: just Tifa sort of holding this together for Cloud. I mean,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: I really appreciated the the not the flashback, but when
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: you actually go to Nippelheim, you go up to the
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: reactor and Cloud starts to kind of get these fragmented memories.
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: I can remember Zach for the first time, and he
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: brings that up to Tifa, says, you know, why didn't
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: you tell me? He's getting angry with her, and she
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: just suddenly looks down and says, besides, I did want
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: to upset you. It makes me feel so bad for her.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: She's got to have a situation there, right, it's just
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: this like abusive situation she's in, but out of her
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: strength and reallyious love for Cloud, she's trying to hold
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: it together the best that she can, which really makes
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: me feel bad for her and just not like Cloud.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: That does raise an interesting question if these are obviously
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: not real people, but if that you were hypothetically new
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: people in this situation and Dipa came to you for advice,
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: would you tell her to get away from Cloud? Yes? Yes, yes,
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: I obviously it's you know, a game, things have to
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: go the way that they have to go. But in
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: real life, yeah, I mean especially you know, after he
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: takes a sword to her a lie, I agree, cast
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: her into a weapon. Yeah, thankfully she's got the live
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: stream I guess, and the crazy abstract sequence to go
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: through there. Yeah, the live stream whales or whatever they're called.
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: I was surprised that they brought in weapons this earily.
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah they did. I've always hitted that term weapons because
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: it doesn't sound like what they are. But yeah, you're right,
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: they clearly are a very important part of the next game,
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: like after you go to the crater. But if I
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: feel like I remember that was when I first remembered
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: them being mentioned in the original. I don't know if
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: they were foreshadowed, but I guess that was their attempt
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: to foreshadowed that event later on. Yeah, because in the
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: original they weren't released until Suffrath was Yeah, and we've
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: seen for the trailers in Revelation that's clearly going to
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: happen probably pretty early on the next game. Yeah. What
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: do you think about I don't know this really has
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: much story significance, but it did it bother you that
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: they moved some things, so they were not in the
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: same places as they were in the world in the original.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: So like the Temple of the Anxious is not in
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: the same place. They cut out the whole Bone village. Yeah,
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: the is it fort condor the big mountain with the
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: bird You see it at a distance, but it's not
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: in Uh what is the Junon region? I think is
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: where it was originally, right, So clear they were moving
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: things around, so they didn't I think it was so
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: they didn't have to do it all in one game,
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: and the Tuple of the Ancients where it was in
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: the original, didn't mesh with how they were trying to
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: do the world, because they were clearly trying to keep
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: it confined to just this part before they open up
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: everything in the next game. Yeah, and so I'm okay
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: with that. I don't. I feel like, as long as
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: doesn't mess with the story too much, I'm okay with that. Yeah,
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: it is kind of interesting that in this world you
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: have a whole game on, like defending Fort condor many games.
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: I thought that was funny too. Which did they introduce
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: that in Grade? Yeah, that's in Integrade, and then you
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: have to do it for some of the proto relics
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: in the Rebirth, and then you get the amusing commentary
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: from the carriage why do we look polygonal? Right? Uh so, Yeah,
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: they also moved Gones whatever the name of the town
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: is where Earth dies. I forget what it's called, but
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: it's apparently next to the Tiple of the Ancients in
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: that new location. Now, and you don't have to go
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: through that snowy area snowboard through get to it right
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: where in the original you have to snowboard to, you know,
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: burn off the grief of exactly the next game opens
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: with snowboarding. It's what needs to happen, right, now snowboarding
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: and pops and balloons. Yeah, that's that seems appropriate. I
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: was sorry to think so they also like explort some
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: other things that I don't remember being in much detail.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: I mean, that was obviously part of the premise here.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: But what did you think of the uh, what are
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: the name of the races that had the Black Materia.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: It's or something like that. Yeah, and it's like this
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: weird death cult tribal area you go to. It was interesting.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: It's an interesting world building. They obviously added basically all
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: of that from the original, and I think it's it's
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: an interesting idea that, you know, this is what gives
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: us the black material, that they were invested it or
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: in making the Black Materia, because they can't really die
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: because they don't belong to the planet, so they can't
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: go to the live stream, and so they're just these
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: nihilists who just want to destroy everything because they want
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: to cease to exist, and and so that gives us
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: some lord to the general world as well as to
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: the Black Materia in particular. I don't I don't know
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: why they assumed that after you go off and get
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: the Black Materia, you would actually bring it back to them.
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: I I don't know why they thought you would do that,
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: but I don't know that was interesting. I don't know
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: that I have strong feelings about it. Yeah, I don't
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: think I did either, which is true for a lot
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: of the middle parts of the game, where I'm like, Okay,
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: this is interesting. I don't have strong feelings like it's
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: another exempt. So when you go to Kenyon, Oh my god,
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: why can I not remember the names of anything? Cosmo Kanian,
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: thank you, And suddenly Red thirteen stops talking like this
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: old sage and like a teenage boy is like, no, no,
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: stop talking with that voice. What are you doing? I know,
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: But to be fair, something like that does happen in
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: the original. It does. So it's like I under say
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: they're trying to do it, just it sounds so wronged.
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: This image of who he is up until that point.
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: Then it sounds just wronged for that point as a character.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: I doesn't prefer him as the stoic warrior to ye
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: this kid. Yeah, and then you get more of the
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: kind of Mother Earth, kind of guy Earth religion stuff
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: that that they clearly have there in Cosmo Kanyan that's
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: delved into a little more. Like I've said before, I'm
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: not a huge fan of those kinds of themes, so
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: that made the Kaswokanian stuff not that interesting to me.
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: It is a pretty area, So there's that. I mean,
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: I did appreciate that the guy who's the main guy,
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: he's named after a Lutheran and reformer bugen Hagen. Yeah, Bugenhagen,
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: which is fun to say, right, So you got Bugenhagen.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: Uh so Buganagen. At first, when they're saying all these
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: things that have happened, he just says, no, that couldn't
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: have happened because in his ideology, like like, there's just
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: no way that Tifa got swallowed by a weapon and
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: carried into the live stream, and so he just doesn't
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: believe it. And so you know, part of his process
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: is learning to get outside of his raw ideology in
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: order to learn to to be humbled. And you know,
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: even as Christians being humbled, or especially as Christians being
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: humbled is a good thing that A. C. S. Lewis
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: says that God is the great iconoclass, constantly breaking our
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: own image of who he is through his presence and
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: his revelation to us. And so I think there's something
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: of value there even if we don't accept the root
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: Earth worship philosophy. Yeah, that's a good point. I had
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: not remembered that about Bugenhagen, I guess because I was
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: just skipping through that area. But yeah, and in Earth,
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: that's another good speech around a point as well. I
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: have wanted them to explore more of the It's this
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: would not be the right game for it because we
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: haven't been a rocket town yet, but I've wanted them
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: to explore more of like what exists beyond the planet. Uh,
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: Like it's not clear to me, like where Genova even
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: came from in the first place. That was never really explained.
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: Its just this alien innovator, I guess. And you have
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: this notion of a media coming in. Where does the
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: media come from? Ah, it would be interesting to me
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: if they explore that further, because clearly in the backs
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: for Shitra had an interest in exploring the stars beyond
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: the planet and seeing what else was there. But I
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: don't know, the planet is so much the focus here.
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: I think it'd be more interesting to know the context
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: of the universe beyond it, just because they've clearly hinted
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: at it. But I don't know if they're going to
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: get right, I mean right between Genova. The Ghi are
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: from another planet apparently, so they're definitely opening that up more.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: Be interesting to see if they say, give us any
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: more revelations in revelation about the broader world, that would
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: be interesting. What do you think of how they handled
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: the sid He's the character that I think they did
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: the worst. Buy ah. I mean, I think he's fine
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: as a character, but I don't see him as the
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: character from the original in that. For one thing, that
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: they took away his cigarettes, which I mean he needs
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: to have that. And also they obviously cleaned up his
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: language quite a bit, which and I'm not necessarily saying
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: I want my games to be profane, but at the
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: same time, it's part of his character, and so I
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: think they definitely softened him, softened his edges on a
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: number of angles. But so I think he's fine as
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: a standalone character, but I don't see him as the
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: character of the original, whereas I do see pretty much
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: all the other characters as a deeper version of the original.
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: I think he's not wired, But I don't know what
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: you think. I actually have forgotten they took away the cigarettes.
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: I liked him, Okay, I think because I was not
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: particularly attached to him in the original in any real way,
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: but this one I like, well enough, you don't get
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: to play as him in this game. That's clearly being deferred.
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: I thought he had a good voice actor in the yeahlish,
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: I think that's fine pretty well. Who played played the
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: kid pretty well. Vincent Valentine got almost no screen time.
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: He shows up because I guess he's supposed to show
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: up when he does when you go to the area
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: under the manor and you get to fight his Castlevania
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: Dracula form or it's called, but then he just kind
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: of hangs out for some reason with you. I'm like,
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: why are you here? Sure? So you can't be a
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: party even yet, because this is the game where we're
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: doing that. Yet, I know, he just kind of broods
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: around just because he has this grudge again Stuffer Froth,
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: and he figures you can help him get some atonement
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: with that. So I like him. Obviously we haven't really
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: explored him very much in this game, but I like him.
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: I guess I've mentioned before. In the original, you know,
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: Vincent always is kind of a fan favor. He's kind
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: of cool. But I didn't feel like His writing was
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: particularly good in the original in that he just his
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: only character was just this brudian guy who doesn't care
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: about anything, and that's just not super exciting. We already
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: had that in Cloud. In this game, I feel like
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: they make him, I don't know, a little bit more
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: of a character, and I appreciate that. So I don't
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: I think he's cool. Yeah, we'll see if they do
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: try to flush him out a bit more in the
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: next game, which they probably because they're trying to flush
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: out absolutely everything they possibly can. But this just was
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: not his game. So what would you say was your
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: favorite part of the game, Not that I played the finale, right,
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: not having played the finale, I think my favorite part.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: I did really enjoy the end of chapter thirteen, like
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: the companion trials and that sort of thing where it
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: just gets emotionally devastating. I like that. I liked, as
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: I said, the lead up to the Nibelheim Reactor where
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: Tifa is trying to hold it together, and you know,
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: Cloud is like echoing the words of Sepharroth without knowing
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: it when he sees the Maacco Fountain and you know,
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: he's verbatim quoting Zepharroth. And doesn't really know it, but
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: Tifa does. So I feel like that whole scene is
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: really compelling on a psychological level. So I think those
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: are probably some of my favorite places. My favorite places
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: are just wherever we get the deep character relations, especially
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: when it has a strong psychological emphasis on it. Don't
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: care for Chadley or lot of this fluff. Maybe like
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: Badley gets developed the next game, I always want it. Yeah,
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: it's like no more Chadley, No, no more Chadley. You know.
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: I what I think that Final Ptasy seven really does
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: best is the characters of as you said, but I
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: really like how it handles the themes of sorrow and grief,
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: and for that reason, it's very natural for me to
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: put this in comparison orally in conversation with Expedition thirty three,
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: which is all about grief, and even esthetically in certain
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: elements that I see some pretty strong overlap in these games,
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: and you know, not having played really any other modern JRPGs,
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: it maybe I'm over emphasizing some of the connection, just
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: not knowing, but you know, even like in a remake,
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: when you're collecting the albums or the the records, you know,
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: it's kind of similar But nonetheless, I actually like how
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: Final Ptacy seven original and remake rebirth. I like how
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: they handle grief even more than I do in Exhbision
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: thirty three. In that expression thirty three, this story becomes
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: about grief, whereas in Final Phase the seven, grief is
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: a core aesthetic, but it is tied to something like
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: faith and hope in a way that I don't pick
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: up from Exhbision thirty three. And so for that reason,
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: I think they actually handle it better precisely because they
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: don't have to deal with it so directly because it's
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: not the focus of the game is simply the leading aesthetic,
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: which is a little bit different, it's not I don't know.
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: To me, it makes it more realistic and of more
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: primary significance. But yeah, so I like those deep, dark
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: emotional parts of the game. But what are your favorite parts? Yeah? Well, first,
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: like what you're saying. I think that's one of the
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: common themes across the FOUMP fancy games that I've noticed
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: is the notion of light in the darkness, like where
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: things can get really really really bad, but you have
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: to hold on to hope, and then that makes it
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: all the more satisfying at the endings when you do
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: overcome like the horrors of the world and the personified
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: evil you're fighting against. I think that's something JPEG's really
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: like that kind of thing, But foun Fantasy specialized. Yeah,
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: and you really have to get that kind of death
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: and resurrection, you know, symbolically played out. And you see
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: this as early as Final Fantasy four with the conversion
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: of the Dark Knight to the Paladin, where you have
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: to defeat yourself in order to become this agent of light,
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: and or in Final Fantasy six, when you know everything
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: gets destroyed and you know you have to I mean
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: that's kind of a common theme. Everything is destroyed and
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: you move on when the entire world is destroyed. That's
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: like what I view is six is a big thing exactly,
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: and I think that Final Fantasy handles that really well,
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: precisely because grief is not the focus, but you have
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: to go through that grief and that letting go in
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: order to become the hero who presses forward and puts
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: things back together. And so yeah, I think that Fall
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: Pacy in general does that really well, and I think
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: that seven does that really well. Yeah. One thing I
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: was gonna talk about earlier before you cut out, was
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: when we were talking about that really emotional air scene
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: where she loses her mom. So I lost my mom
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: about tennish years ago, and that was a huge test
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: of my faith dealing with that. One of the things
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: I remember reading in the Bible, which at the time
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: was just galling to me, is in the beginning of
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: James where it says to count it all account trial.
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: It kind of his joy when you face trials because
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: they build up p experience and faith to paraphrase. But
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: when you hear that when you're going through grief, that
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: just sounds mean and insensitive. But that's something a point
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: I had to come to to understand. Why do I
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: take joy in this trial? It's because it talks there
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: about it. It's testing your faith when you face a
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: situation like that that's really trim It forces you to
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: make a decision. Am I going to abandon my faith
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: and the Lord is the main focus there? Or am
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: I going to have a stronger faith. You don't really
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: get an option of doing any I think than those two.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: So thankfully, through that trial, the Lord was able to
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: make my faith stronger in the end, and I am
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: now able to appreciate at least what he put me
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: through to force me to come to that point where
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: I could improve my faith, and that's something that's very
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: hard to understand, especially in the moment, But that that
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: seemed kind of just seeing that reminded me of all
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: those emotions and going through all that and figuring out
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: how do I move on? And so for that reason, yeah,
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: I think if I'm going to talk about the most
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: emotionally resident part of the game, that was absolutely the
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: most But yeah, other things that I liked about the game.
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: I do generally like how the ending plays out the
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: part you haven't seen, mainly because I like it when
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: something's very theatrically presented and just manages to ride the
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: emotions really elegantly through it. And the way they transition,
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: because they transition directly out of Earth Dies Boss immediately,
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: and the way they play it. They keep playing Erth's
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: theme as you're facing off against a Genova boss and
• 56:26
  Speaker 1: it's like just it feels like the game is just
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: rubbing it in your face. You just lost Earth and
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: you don't get a chance to grieve because now you
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: have to face off against this abomination that is trying
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: to kill you all now and just the way it
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: plays that, and then as arith theme continues through the
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: first part of the boss fight, but then it has
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: this transition where slowly the boss's theme starts taking over
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: more and more, where you hear like it just gets
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: slightly more ominous with each beat of the music until
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: then fully transitions and you're like, Okay, now we're moved
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: on from Earth as much as we can. Now we're
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: focused on this horrible loss is trying to consume everything.
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: I really like how that's played out. And then it's
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: absurdly over the top, like the final boss takes forever.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: It has a zillion phases, it's legit like a two
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: three hour boss easy again, and then the final phase
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: is just brutally hard. That was the one that made
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: me want to throw my controller. So it but even
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: that is building into the emotions where it's using the
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: gameplay in a synthesizing way to it wants you to
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: feel frustration there because of how like difficult everything is
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: to overcome that the characters are going through and how
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: implacable this enemy is that they're facing who's trying to
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: destroy everything. So yeah, I just love how they managed
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: to play all that, even though at the time I
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: just want to punch a ball so so hard in
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: that final phase and it's taking so long, and I
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: was very grateful I did not unequip Earth. Don't do that.
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: That that will get you into trouble. I've heard horror stories. Yeah,
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: I love that. I love that grief immediately followed by
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: the major boss battle, which you know, that's exactly the
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: kind of thing why I naturally compare this game to
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: thirty three. You know, you expect that that powerful French
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: music start players. Uh, Yeah, that's fantastic. I definitely look
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: forward to the conclusion. I feel like I'm probably gonna
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: find it very satisfying. Yeah. One more thing also that
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: we didn't talk about that I find interesting is somehow
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: Seffroth has taken over the Whispers. Yeah. I'm not clear
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: how or what he's doing with them, but I think
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: that's part of him trying to seize control and like
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: bring the universes together there. So I don't know how
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: that plays out going forward. Yeah, it is interesting, and
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: you see some of the undercurrents of that battle when
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: Tifa gets carried off into the life stream with the
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: weapon that the planet is fighting against Sepharroth and these
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: rogue whispers that he's bent to his will, and so, yeah,
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: it's kind of interesting that the Sepharroth is trying to
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: set himself up as a master of fate. It's something
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: like the new Arbiter of Fate. Yeah, it'd be interesting
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: to see how that continues to get explored in the
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: next game. I still like the theory that this is
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: advent Children's suffer off and he went back in time
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: and now he's just trying to rig everything in his favor. Now,
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: it's very possible. I mean, I feel like either way
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: you kind of get to the same endpoint if you
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: say that this is a time traveling suffar off, or
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: if you say that simply he looked ahead and saw
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: how things could play out. You know, either way you
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: kind of gets to the same point of knowing up
• 59:46
  Speaker 1: to Advent Children. Yeah, and I think that definitely does
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: seem to be a play. Yeah, we'll see if they
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: explain it well in the next game, or they just
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: they get even more confeasing, which seems to be their
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: battern so far. They've got to leave it open for
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: children remake. Oh my goodness, I want that. I don't
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: want that. Yeah, hopefully they don't treat it as like
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: an MCU franchise and just make more Finally seven. So
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: I guess some people would want that. That could be interesting.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: I just like, I don't think we need to get
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: locked out of the univers I did see that in
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: the next game they're going to be really bringing in
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: stuff from all over the F seven universe, Like there's
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: gonna be related to Advent Children or to Cerberus and
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: all this other stuff pulled together, which I haven't yeh,
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: experienced all of these things. But yeah, I think this
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: game probably had several references, probably to all of them,
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: but I do not get all the references because I
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: haven't played them mall. Maybe one day i'll play Crisis
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: for at least. Yeah, I needed that at some point,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: but I think after this, I'm ready to step aside
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: for a little while to something else. Yeah, any other
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: thoughts that you want to bring up, I don't think so. So
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: it sounds like it's gonna be one of our last
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: game plok for a while. Yeah, I can take it
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: a little bit of a break so I can get
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: some other things done. I putting. However, many hours I've
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: put into this game kind of broke me when I've
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: got another thing I need to do. And so I
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: think that'll be good because when we do reconvene sometime
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: in the fall, it's not necessarily can be a long break,
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: probably early fall. Hopefully I won't be quite so rushing
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: through games. I can enjoy them a little bit better,
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: which will probably give me a better commentary on it. So, yeah,
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: and there's lots of one hundred hour grpgs we need
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: to get you to play. Andrew. Yeah, I'm all for it,
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: but I can't be rushing through him every couple of weeks.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: That's very fair. It would be brittal for me to
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 1: do that too. I get the luxury taking like a
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: few months. Yes, we'll do something coming up in a
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: couple of months now. I might drop something in the
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: feed at least before then. I do want to write
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: up something on Final Fantasy seven and Claire Obscurt. I
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: think that there's some interesting conversations we had there, So
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: I'm probably gonna write something up and maybe I'll drop
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: in a recording of it into the feed or something,
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: so there'll be something here and there. But yeah, next
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: conversation will be Oh, I don't know, maybe October or something,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: but all right, so we'll go and wrap there. Thank
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: you Micah for being with us for these final Ftasy
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: seven talks and carrying the last few. Enjoyed it, all right,
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: we'll talk again now that I finished it. Here's some
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: brief thoughts about the ending of Final Fantasy seven Rebirth.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: I'm going to tack this onto our main Mythic Mind
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 1: Rebirth conversation and also release it by itself. Overall, I
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: really enjoyed the ending. But let me first backtrack a
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: bit with the end of chapter thirteen. Now, throughout this
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: entire chapter, Cloud was really giving me some frost moorn
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: Arthus vibes ruthlessly hunting his enemy while devoid the very
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: cumanity that he's been fighting for up to this point.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: And this continues as Sepfarroth compels him to take the
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: Black Materia from Earth, who's doing all that she can
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: to get away from Cloud. And it is really just
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: a heart wrenching scene, similar to the previous scene of
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: him slashing at Tifa and feeding her to a weapon.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: I never delight in seeing a man do violence to
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: a woman, and especially one of his close companions who's
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 1: never been anything but faithful and supportive for him. But
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: then Earth does what Earth is most known for doing.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: She surrenders her will with the faith that everything will
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: work out as it should as long as she plays
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: her role with grace. She tells Cloud that she'll always
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: be for him, and then she lets go of the
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: black material. Cloud brings it to Sephyroth, and then as
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: Earth gets swarmed by black whispers, Cloud comes to his senses.
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: He demonstrates that he is not completely hollow after all.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: He calls out her name and he grabs her hand.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: She knows that she is approaching her fate, but she
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: has this look of vindicated love in her eyes, and
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: she is content in knowing that Cloud is not lost.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: Cephiroth severs the branch that they're standing on, and they
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 1: both plummet into chapter fourteen. Chapter fourteen begins with Cloud
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: and Earth in a dream, which Sepharroth describes as a
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: dream that has accepted fate, presented with a few choices,
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: what gift to give Earreth, what treat to get, and
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: how to pose for a couple's photograph. In each of
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: these scenarios, the choice is only the appearance of choice.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: Cloud picks a gift, and then the vendor gives something else.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: Cloud picks a treat, and the vendor gives something else.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: No matter what Cloud or you, as a player seems
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: to choose, fate plays out as it must. Your sense
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: of agencies taken away again and again, remakes seem to
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: end with an open horizon. The arbiter of fate has
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: been defeated, and anything goes so it seems. However, that
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: is not the message of rebirth. Rebirth is not so
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 1: much about defeating fate as it is coming to terms
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: with fate. Remember back to the Hall of Resurrection in
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: the Temple of the Ancients, in which each member of
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: the party was confronted with the facticity of their worst
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 1: moments of suffering. It simply is there's no escape. And again,
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 1: in each of these scenes you're given a sense of agency.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: We're not actually able to write the script. Things play
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 1: out as they must. This is the reality of facticity.
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 1: Eris's words of wisdom at the end of the scene
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 1: compel them to accept their trauma and transmute it into
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 1: something that makes them stronger and more fully themselves. She
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: says to turn away from the anger and the bitterness
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: that might accompany a resistance to the reality of what
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: you've experienced, and said, you need to accept what has
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: happened and become people of even more heart, not less heart.
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 1: Erith has already come to terms with her fate. Now
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: Cloud must do likewise. Sephroth eventually shows up, and Earth
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: pushes Cloud out of the dream. Around the same time,
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: Cephroth shows up in Zach's timeline and pushes him out,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: setting up a collision course to come. As in the original,
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 1: Eras speaks with Cloud and the Forest while Cloud is
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: nearly paralyzed, and many of us have had dreams like
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: this in which we try to move but just can't
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: seem to do so. She says that she's heading off
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: to deal with Sephroth, and then she leaves Cloud by himself.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: Cloud eventually reunites with the party and goes after her,
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: pushing through whispers until you finally get to that iconic
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 1: location where you know what happens next. As in the original,
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 1: as fate decreed, Sephroth descends and impales Earth with his sword.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: Although there seems to be some timeline Shenanigan's taking place,
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: says she seems to live, but within the main timeline,
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: she obviously dies, and I'm sure we'll learn more about
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 1: that in the next game. As et cetera. With charged will,
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: Earth retains her individuality amidst the life stream and she
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: joins Cloud to fight against Sephroth, and from that point
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 1: to the end she seems to serve as an obi
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: Wan force ghost for Cloud. I don't really know if
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: I like that, but I'm willing to give it a
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: chance and see what they do in Revelation. Overall, I
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 1: would say that the ending of Rebirth retains the basic
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: essence of the original game. Now, many people are likely
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: going to jump on me for that, because obviously there's
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: a lot that is different, but hear me out. In
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: the original, cephros A goal was to damage the planet,
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: summoning forth the powers of the life stream with himself
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: at the center. Now he's basically doing the same thing,
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: but on more of a meta level with the multiverse
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: with these multiple timelines. This preserves his basic character and
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: motivation from the original, which I think is appropriate for
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: a revisit. Earth still dies and you, as the player
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 1: are left with the emotional weight that the original brought,
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: although perhaps the degree of weight could be argued it's
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: a different kind of weight. On the one hand, the
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: original had the shock value if you played it thirty
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: years ago and didn't know what was going to happen.
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: I'm certainly in that camp. However, in Remake and Rebirth,
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: you've had to deal with this in a fairly sustained
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: fashion since the beginning of Remake. When Earth is first introduced.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: In that game, you see brief snapshots of her materia
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: falling down the stairs, which you instantly associate with her
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 1: death if you've played the original. She also tells Cloud
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: not to fall in love with her. Her entire arc
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: in these games is saturated with foreboding doom in a
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: sense of life loss leading up to the pinpoint of
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: her actual death. That is a different kind of heaviness,
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 1: but it's one that I think is befitting of a remake.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: They had to do something similar to keep that impression,
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 1: but they had to find a way to keep it meaningful,
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: and I think that they largely succeeded at that. Despite
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: my criticisms of this game, which mostly revolve around gamey blot,
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: this was a fantastic game overall, and I'm really excited
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: to see what they do with Revelation. If you've enjoyed
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 1: this episode, be sure to subscribe to my YouTube channel
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: as well as the Mythic Mind Games podcast. I also
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: welcome your support on Patreon at patreon dot com slash
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: Mythic mind Mythic Mind Games is going to go on
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: a bit of a break, but we have plenty of
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: content to keep you busy until we return. In the
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: film Until next time,