Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / EP324 | Get Out Go: Bridging Cultures Through Overland Adventures

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EP324 | Get Out Go: Bridging Cultures Through Overland Adventures · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm your host,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and I'm here with Christophe and Vanessa A. Laird,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: and they are Get Out Go from Southern Africa. Incredible travelers.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: They have a fantastic YouTube channel, and they have been
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: a huge support to XOverland and our logistics and planning
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: and being able to really enjoy Southern Africa. And we
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: are going to talk a little bit about South Africa
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: on this podcast. But you guys have so many travels
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: around the world. And you guys have done such a
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: great job of documenting your experiences that there's lots to
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: talk about. We could probably do six podcasts to cover everything.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: So thank you both so much for being on the
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: podcast with me today.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Well, thanks for having us.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having us.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: And a special thanks to Hankook Dynapro Tire for supporting
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: this week's Overland Journal podcast. Be sure to visit ExpeditionPortal.com
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: to see our features on the recent Honkuk experience at
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: the fourth annual Bronco Stampede in Pigeon Forge, Tennessee. We
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: took a look at the full line of DynaPro tires
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: and some great Ford Broncos from all over the country
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: as they gathered at this community event of enthusiasts and
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: top brands. Thanks again, Honkuk. Well, you're very welcome. And
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: of course, those that listen to the Overland Journal podcast
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: know how much I love Southern Africa. It feels like
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: a second home to me. I think if I wasn't
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: living in Prescott, Arizona, in that little old historic home,
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: I would be living somewhere in Southern Africa and finding
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: a way to live there because there's really no place
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: on earth that I have found that best fits kind
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: of meets my confluence of interests and loves for travel
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: and even the cool vehicles you guys get to have
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: and everything else. But what would you say in, you
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: guys have just spent weeks here in the United States,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: but what are you seeing as the difference between not
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: only the two countries as travelers, but what are you
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: seeing as the difference between overlanding in the U S
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: and overlanding in South Africa, the communities?
• 2:18
  Speaker 4: Yep.
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  Speaker 2: So I think, first of all, what we've seen is
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: the communities are very similar, if not exactly the same.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: That's cool to hear. Yeah.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: You might have differences in gear and how you approach
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: different things, but the community itself is as friendly, as informative.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: We've seen very little, well, I know, and you're a newbie, right?
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: Folks have been tremendously helpful around us finding camps and
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: what to do and what not to do. So, yeah, that's,
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: I think, very similar. the rigs are a little different
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: yeah sure so we've been using a tundra and we
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: used to a 79 series and it is wide it's
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: very wide.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: It's a big car very powerful very big car.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: And we've seen a lot of those and those get
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: spicy in little forest roads sure that's that's been a
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: learning curve so we do see a lot of overlanding
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: gear from simple to complicated that's been good to see
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: as well it's not just hardcore overlanders or off-roaders, you
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: just see rooftop tents everywhere. And that's, that's very encouraging. Yeah.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: Well, and Southern Africa, the reason why roof tents really
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: were so successful there is you have lots of tourists
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: coming in that want to rent a Hilux or a
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Land Cruiser, and there's nothing better than a roof tent
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: for that kind of a situation. It gets you up
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: off the ground because there are things like black mambas
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: and lions and things that go bump in the night.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: And that's another good reason to be up on off
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: the ground. And a lot of people don't realize that
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: that's really where roof tents. I mean, if you look
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: at Jack Stuhler from easy on, I mean, he was
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: not the one that invented roof tents, but they were
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: certainly the first to start to mass produce them and
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: definitely made them popular in Southern Africa. And that's because
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: it's such a great solution. So yeah, Oftentimes I see
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: people using roof tents in the U S uh, when
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: a ground tent would actually be a better choice, but
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: for sure in Africa, what are some other things that
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: you notice that Americans use a lot as overlanders that
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: came from South Africa that maybe we don't even need here,
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: but that's because they became so popular in Africa.
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: I think scottles, that was an interesting one. That's invented.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: And we'll really use those in our backyards for stir
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: fry and that sort of stuff. Here we see a
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: lot of that being used. A lot of extra fuel
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: like jerry cans or the different systems you get here.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: But there seems to be a fuel station every 100 miles.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: So do you really need that?
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  Speaker 1: That's a great observation.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: I think sometimes it does just become automotive restyling. It's
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: like there's nothing cooler than a couple of jerry cans.
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: On the roof.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, it is always a good idea to have
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: a fuel can with a little bit of extra fuel.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: You know, you may come across a motorcyclist that needs
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: a little bit of extra fuel or a local that
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: could really benefit from that. I mean, I've certainly run
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: out of gas on bikes and things like that where
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: it's nice if somebody had a couple extra gallons. The
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: scottle is a great point too because... that's a bulky item. Now,
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: of course, they're indestructible. They'll last a lifetime. But you wonder,
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: do you need to bring that much weight and complexity
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: with you?
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, correct. So weight and space is at a premium
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: for us. So we always say to people, it's different
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: if you're a weekend warrior or go away for a
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: week at a time. If you're on the road full time,
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: you start to look at things very differently. Everything that
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: takes up space and adds weight is different. Do I
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: really need this thing?
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: Or, a lot of times, we want to do multipurpose things,
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: that this should do one or two things, not just one, because, again,
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: it takes place and it adds weight.
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and water is an issue as well when we're
• 6:10
  Speaker 4: out there. So cleaning is a problem if you have
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: big things that you need to clean and oily things.
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes sense.
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: So you need to keep that to a minimum.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: That makes a lot of sense. So then what is
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: the reason why South Africans bring poiki pots?
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: I have still not received a satisfactory answer on this
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: after many years.
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: Oh, well, I can answer that.
• 6:30
  Speaker 4: Okay. A poiki is easy to clean, funny enough. You
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: do not over clean your cast iron pot at all. Okay.
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: It just gets flavor after flavor after each dish that
• 6:41
  Speaker 4: you make. Okay.
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: So you can rinse it.
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: Out and you can just wipe it out, but you
• 6:45
  Speaker 4: almost don't use dishwashing liquid in it.
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: Hmm.
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: And it's easy to clean.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: It just works great. And do you put them in
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: the fire? Is that what you typically do?
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: So that would be, okay, that makes a little more sense. Because,
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: I mean, they're heavy.
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah, they are.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I mean, like Front Runner even has like brackets for
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: the rack to hold those things.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: So we tend to use a flat bottom poikie so
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: it doesn't take as much space.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: So like a cast, like what we would call a
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: cast iron pan.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: Dutch oven.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: Dutch oven, yeah.
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: So that's usually what we use and you can make,
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: poiki in there we use it to make bread muffins
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: pizzas you name it so.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: It's what is poiki so i thought that was just
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: the part is that a dish that's a dish okay
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: so what's the what is.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: A poiki closest comparison would be a stew okay yeah
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  Speaker 2: so it usually goes for quite a few hours to
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: make especially the meat fall off the bone we usually
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: will use something like oxtail or chuck And then that
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: gets mixed with veg and it's over a long period.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: It's slow cooked. So it's very specific spices.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a day thing almost where you'll fry some onions,
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  Speaker 4: then put the meat in, a lot of wine depending
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: on the.
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  Speaker 3: Dish, which is great.
• 8:01
  Speaker 4: It takes a long time period and it's served with
• 8:04
  Speaker 4: either rice or mash.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: Pup.
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: Pup.
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  Speaker 1: Okay. So over mashed potatoes.
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  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: And then I have, I know I have had pup,
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: but I don't remember what it is. Is that like
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: the cornmeal?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: That's great.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: So it's maize meal.
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: Maize meal. That's right. I like that though. That stuff
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: is really good. It's like a porridge and- Like super sticky,
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: dense porridge.
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  Speaker 4: 100%.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: And it's similar to grits, but the density is a
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: lot more. It's It's a lot thicker than grits.
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you feel it sticking to your ribs, literally.
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  Speaker 4: But that's also something you can eat as a breakfast.
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  Speaker 4: It's not as thick.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 3: Dinner or breakfast.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: Sugar and milk, you've got breakfast there.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: And that's one of the things that I've noticed in
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: your guys' travels is that you have made cooking healthy
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: meals together a part of your story. It's a part
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: of your channel. You can see you guys making these
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: amazing South African meals. And a lot of people don't
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: realize just how good, in general, food, produce. If you
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: go into a South African grocery store, the average South
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: African grocery store is on par with our premium grocery stores.
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: And some of them are just downright luxurious in there.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, you see the produce. I mean, South Africa
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: is like the bread. bread basket of Africa certainly South
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: Africa Zimbabwe and all of that hopefully Zimbabwe is getting
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: back to being that bread basket that it used to
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: be but when you guys plan because you have a
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: smaller camper you're in a 70 series how do you
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: guys plan food and meals when you're on.
• 9:47
  Speaker 4: The road a menu I literally set a menu for
• 9:51
  Speaker 4: every day so I know I start off with meat
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: that's a prime requirement for every dinner so we try
• 9:58
  Speaker 4: and fry as much as possible but I try because
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: we're out so often I try and look at the
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: dishes to make sure it's homey so it doesn't feel
• 10:06
  Speaker 4: like you're out in the bush the whole time but
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: you've got a bit of home and bush yeah yeah
• 10:10
  Speaker 4: we were out there for two weeks so I put
• 10:12
  Speaker 4: a whole menu together I can fit about two weeks
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: worth of meat in our freezer wow yeah I pre-pack
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: everything for every meal And then I decide what side
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: dishes need to go with it and what equipment is
• 10:24
  Speaker 4: needed to make sure.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: It's with that.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: To support the food. I like that.
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, a can opener is important.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I remember when we were
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: all camping out right before we made that kind of
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: final mile to Cape Agulhas and just seeing how you
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: guys had your camper so well-suited. It was one of
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: the things that I noticed about you guys is that
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: you travel enough where you really have learned what works
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: and what doesn't work. And it doesn't mean that things
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: don't fail or create problems, but it seems like you
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: guys have done a good job of getting as much
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: weight out as you can. So what are some of
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: the tricks that you found through the years to keep,
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: because the 70 series has a big payload, but the
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: downside of getting up to gross vehicle weight with a
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: truck like that is then it struggles off road because
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: it's so heavy. So how have you gotten kind of
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: that balance of weight?
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: So first of all, you want mechanical sympathy as well
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: because the more weight you add, the more everything's working
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: from the engine right down to the suspension and tires
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: and so on. So I think it's a process of elimination.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: We've been doing this for a few years and I
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: always suggest to folks, don't just go and build the thing.
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: Understand what's your needs and how you camp. That will
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: determine a lot of it. Is it a daily driver?
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: Because Hour 79 with the camp, it doesn't make exactly
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: something you'd take into an office parking lot. It doesn't
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: fit most places.
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: Oh, and if it got stolen or something, it'd be tragic. Yeah, yeah.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: So you guys need to really keep it safe.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: And people forget things like if it has to go
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: for a service and we're not in our base camp,
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: that car is now in the service and where do
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: you go? Because that's your house, that's your transportation, and
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: you're kind of there sitting waiting for the service to
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: be completed. But how we got to it is just
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: trial and error. I think over the years we've sort of,
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: you know, we know what we want and we've gone
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: through different iterations as well. I used to do a
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: lot of solo traveling. Then I had a Fortuna, which
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: is very similar to like a Forerunner.
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: And that suited our sort of on and off needs.
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: But the moment we went full time, this is very different.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah. And what's your camper set up right now? Because
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: you have a... It's a 79 series. It's a single cab, right?
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: Single cab, yep.
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: And then what's the camper module on the back?
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: So it's an alley cab canopy camper. And we looked
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: around at a lot of campers. And that one, again,
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: suited our needs. Because, A, we've got an inside living space.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: Because if you're on the road full time, it's not
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: like you can go to your couch inside when the
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: weather's bad, right?
• 13:02
  Speaker 4: So.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: you have two options there really you have a camper
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: with an inside living space or you need to tow
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: something we have tried towing and we've broken a few
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: things and the problem is the complexity that goes with
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: that full time you have you know a set of
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: extra wheels and tires bearings another axle you know dampener
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: shocks and this and that so we tried that and
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: that didn't work so.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: Most of us have made that loop. I mean, the
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: idea of a trailer makes so much sense, but in practicality,
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: you know, they just, in order to make them hold up,
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: they have to be so expensive.
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also, again, it depends how you camp.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: So why we picked the Alley Cab Canopy Camper is
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: it's easy to set up.
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: It's fast, yeah.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: It's really like a minute to set it up or
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: tear it down. Your bedding stays inside, and you might think,
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: you know, I've got an eye camper and I've got
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: to move my bidding in and out. It's not a
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: big problem. But if you do that three times a
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: day for a month, it soon becomes a problem.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: And it becomes dirty. You've got dust in and out.
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah. No, that makes so much sense. I mean, I
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: remember the first time I had to go in reverse
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: very quickly away from a charging bull elephant in, where
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: was I at? Uganda. I realized, yeah, trailer's not for me.
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: Because like... What are you going to do? Exactly. You're
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: in it. It's going to be a big problem. And again,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: it's not to take anything away from trailers. I think
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: if you look at a trailer as an RV, you're
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: going to be fine. If you want to use it
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: as a backcountry overland vehicle where you're going into the
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: parks and you're going into rough terrain and rough conditions,
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: I don't think it's a good idea.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: Personally, no. So again, it depends on how you camp.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: Some folks like to stay in one place for two,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: three weeks.
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: They might have a family with a couple of kids
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: and they have a daily that, you know, when they
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: go back, needs to go to the office and back
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: and slug around kids to the school. So then that
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: makes real sense. But in our case, we kind of
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: tried it. And we used to camp when it's not
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: full time like that, stay here two weeks, a week there.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: But now it's like two days, one day. I wouldn't
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: want to struggle with that.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: It's also not a get-out-go trip if we don't get lost.
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: So it's easier to turn around with just a Land
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: Cruiser and not just a Land Cruiser and a trailer.
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: That's so true. I mean, even where we camped near
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: Cape Agulhas at the end of the trip, You know,
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: there was a couple folks that were there with their
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: trailers and man, they had them all extended out with
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: all the awnings and all the rooms and everything else
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: like that. I mean, how nice would that be? But
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: it doesn't, most Americans don't tend to stay in one
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: place for a week or two. We do see that
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: a lot in Australia. The Australians do like trailers and
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: they also make very heavy duty trailers, but they're extremely expensive.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: They could be twice the price of a Land Cruiser
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: just for the trailer. And they do hold up, but
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: you have to really pay for that. But they do
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: tend to have a lot more time off than we
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: do here. And they will camp out for three, four days,
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: five days at a time in one location. And that's where, yeah,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: having a hot shower and a microwave, that'd be probably
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: pretty nice.
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: But I mean, even in our camper, we have a
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: lot of that. We've got the hot shoes. hot showers
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: every day. Do you have an air fryer?
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: An espresso.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: An espresso machine.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: Well done, well done.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: But we sail. The same token, we've done a build
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: on Vanessa's little chimney just to show people, don't let
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: that be your barrier of entry. What's the best vehicle? Well,
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: it's the one you have. And you might, if you've
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: got a 4x2, you might not go to all the
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: 4x4 trails, but there's lots of places you can go.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: So it Spend that money first on gas or diesel
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: or whatever.
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: Figure out what you like. You shouldn't have told me
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: that Vanessa has a Jimny because now Vanessa and I
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: are going to talk about Jimnys for the rest of
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: the podcast. They are the coolest little trucks.
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: I love my Jimny.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: They're truly amazing and it just breaks my heart that
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: we don't get them here in the United States. Although
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: there is a greater possibility that we might be able
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: to now after some recent changes in regulations. But yeah,
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: just one of the coolest little rigs. I mean, how many.
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: A couple hundred thousand rand, right? Yeah.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: So the older model like we've got, that you can
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: get for 150,000 rands with little or no kilometers on.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: The new ones have become a little expensive. So they're
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: in the sort of 400,000 range, up to 500 for
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: the five-door. So it's lost a little appeal in the
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: pricing range.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: You spend two million on a Discovery.
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: Correct.
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: Correct. So it just, you know, that's, that's a lot
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: of money in South Africa. And I mean, the, the one,
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: there's a bunch of things that are an advantage in
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: South Africa. You guys don't have a lot of corrosion
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: unless you live right on the coast. So vehicles do
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: tend to last a long time. You guys also have
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: some of the best shops in the country. I mean,
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: you think about Paul Marsh and in Cape town where
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: we stored the vehicles after the milestones trip and, Just
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: having someone with that level of experience to make sure
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: that your overland vehicle is well taken care of. So
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: South Africa has incredible infrastructure for overlanding.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: We don't lack for choice. You just have to go
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: to the shows and every year there's a new trailer
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: or new accessories and there's lots of choice.
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: For all the adventure seekers out there in search of
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: something new, I want to introduce you to MoHAB. Mohab
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: isn't your ordinary rooftop tent company. They have created a
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: complete mobile habitat. That's where they get the name Mohab.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: Mobile habitat, hardwall cabins, rack systems, awnings, portable kitchens, and more.
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: It's a complete ecosystem of gear designed to work together
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: and engineered for quick, hassle-free deployment so you can spend
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: more time doing what you love. This is innovation built
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: for the outdoors. Start your discovery at gomohab.com. That's G-O-M-O-H-A-B.com. MOHAB,
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: discover what's out there.
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: I find that the South African overlanders are, they're very industrious. Here,
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: we have more of an emphasis on content and creation,
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: content creation. less of an emphasis on something like you
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: would find from David. where it's the highest level of execution.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: Whereas I find it's almost flipped in South Africa. The
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: South Africans, if they start to enjoy overlanding, then they
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: make something. They physically make a product. Yeah. there are
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: certainly content creators in South Africa like yourselves, but that's
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: gotta be nicer for you guys. Cause then it's not
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: so much noise. Whereas here, every, you know, you get
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: walk around here at the big thing and everybody's got
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: an Instagram channel. I'm trying to, I'm trying to keep
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: track of like, you're like, it's how many different ways
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: can you say overland? And I, yeah. So I lose track. Yeah.
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: So on that, we've tried to tell good stories, especially
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: we've got a mission sort of twofold. One is to
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: get bums off couches.
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: Hmm.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: So it's fine consuming overland content on TV and YouTube.
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: At some point, you've got to take the leap. And
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: whether it's in a Jimny or a Land Cruiser, just
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: get out there. We also say you don't need to
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: be an overlander for that. You can go hiking, backpacking,
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: just walk your dog, go to the park. And then
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: the other one is really to show people Africa. There's
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: a lot of misconceptions and fears around Africa. And once
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: you get into Africa, you get that sand in your shoes,
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: you'll always want to come back.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it feels like home to me. I mean,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: we all came from there. So, you know, it's really
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: neat to see how you guys have shown Africa in
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: such a positive way. I did notice in the late 90s,
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: early 2000s, that there had become kind of like more
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: of a negative tone from overlanders in South Africa that
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: all this has changed and it's no longer safe and
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: you don't want to come here. And people were trying
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: to leave. And I think that that's come full circle
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: that every country has its challenges, United States included, every
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: country has its challenges, but where in the world can
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: you go and buy a brand new 70 series, buy
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: a home in the mountains for the equivalent of $ 35, 000
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: US dollars, You could be having wine that was made
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: at the winery sitting on the beach for sunset, and
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: the next day you're hearing lions roar in the Kruger
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: National Park. And then you can be up in the
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: snow in Lesotho. And the access to the other countries, too.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: Namibia is so close. Botswana is so close. Mozambique is
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: like the Baja of Africa, and better in some ways.
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: Different i mean baja is also wonderful but mozambique just
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: doesn't get the traffic yeah it's very quiet there.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: I think that's the general thing we've seen here that's
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: also very different is there's a lot of traffic there's
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: just so many more people and a lot of the
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: the parks for instance are very accessible so with a
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: sedan you can get there which is great in its
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: own way but We prefer very remote travel, and Africa
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: still has a lot of that.
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's more of a challenge to camp, I think,
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: in Africa than it is. Yeah, it's quite easy to
• 22:49
  Speaker 4: just find a camp and camp.
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: It's great, though.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can go down about any dirt road, and
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: next thing you know, you're popping camp. And sometimes you
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: get a great view, and sometimes there's a beautiful river
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: coming through it. Just make sure you pack your food
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: away so the bears don't come get you, especially up
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: in this part of the country. What has been some
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: of the highlights for you guys in your trip here
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: in the U.S.? You guys have had several weeks driving
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: around in cool Ex-Overland trucks. What were a couple of
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: your high points?
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: I think people is probably the first one.
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: My goodness.
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: Everybody is so friendly. It's always overwhelming. Everywhere you go,
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: they ask you, how are you? Are you okay? So
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: much interest in who you are. The safety aspect is amazing.
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: And the fact that you can just literally almost camp everywhere,
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: everything works well, everybody follows rules, and it's very clean.
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: That's great.
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it might lack some of the flavor of a
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: lot of African countries, but certainly you can go anywhere
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: very easily. National Forest, BLM land, there's just so much
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: of it. You're quite fortunate with that. You can, like
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: you say, camp almost just anywhere.
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: It's green.
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: There are mountains, and there's always a river running through somewhere.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: Big mountains. And one of the things that I notice is,
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: like in South Africa, the equivalent of your Rubicon, which
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: I'm sure you have more difficult trails in South Africa,
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: but same here. The Rubicon Trail is very challenging. It's
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: certainly not the most difficult trail we have. You guys
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: have Baboon's Pass, and that you could drive in a
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: stock Jeep Rubicon. It would be... So the trails in
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: the U.S. do tend to be more recreation-focused, so they
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: can be very difficult, which is fun in its own way.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, we really don't have rock crawling,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: aside from, like you say, baboon spas and sales spas,
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: and like a standard Rubicon, that wouldn't even break a sweat.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: So in a 79 Series, it's a different story because
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: you have real lifts for days. But yeah, they're awesome,
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: but we... You won't find any gunshots or Black Bear
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: Pass and that sort of stuff.
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's one of the things that I noticed
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: that's different. There's a bunch of things that I've learned
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: from South Africans, and maybe we can expand upon that
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: a little bit more around the travel side. But the
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: South Africans do a really good job of making sure
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: that the suspension and the vehicle configuration can hold up
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: to long distances of corrugation. Yeah. That's something that we
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: see here. There'll be a suspension that is designed to
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: travel at speed, so like a Baja-style suspension. But what
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: a lot of people don't realize when they install something
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: like that is Baja suspensions are meant for one race,
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: and then they get completely rebuilt and serviced, and you
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: can't do that. So in Africa, I'll see larger diameter shocks,
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: but it'll still have rubber bushings. You'll see heavy-duty leaf
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: packs installed as opposed to swapping out to some fancy
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: 5-link or whatever else. That'll just have more wear-out points.
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the biggest car break is corrugations, so washboard.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: You can go from Puros in Namibia to Sesfontein and
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: have 300, 400 kilometers of non-stop corrugations. And literally as
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: it's shaking your teeth out and you feel like you
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: need a kidney belt, you know something's breaking. Or some
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: other bolts coming loose in the process. So that's probably
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: some of our biggest challenges is just the condition of
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: the roads. Even tar is a very relative term. Sometimes
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: there's more potholes than tar and it's better to drive
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: off the side. That adds some of this adventure, but
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: you have to be really careful, like I mentioned before,
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: around mechanical sympathy. If you just go Baja style there,
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: like you say, you will ruin your shocks for sure.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you'll wear the car out. When Tavia and I
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: were going through the Serengeti, going from Ngorongoro into the
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: Maasai lands, it was this really long, very corrugated, but
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: it was corrugated with embedded rock. So you couldn't get
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: to the right speed. And we had to stop because
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: we were worn out. Fortunately, that grenadier never fell apart,
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: but like, It felt like it was going to fall apart,
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: and it was so stressful for me as the driver
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: that we actually had to stop for 20, 30 minutes
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: just because of the banging and the pounding of the vehicle.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: It was so stressful.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we do the same, and also to let the
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: shocks cool down. But yeah, after a while, it's like,
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: I'm feeling grumpy, and there's nobody to be grumpy at,
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: so you stop and take a break.
• 27:38
  Speaker 4: And you're worried about what's breaking except for the car stuff.
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: Are your eggs still alive?
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: Totally.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. You're going to have scrambled eggs by the
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: time that you get there. So let's talk a little
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: bit about your guys' history. So what was the thing
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: that kind of, I mean, obviously you lived in, you
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: grew up in South Africa, so there's lots of reasons
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: to want to be outside. But what was the thing
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: that kind of really pushed you in towards overlanding? What
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: was your origin story for becoming.
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: Who you are? We camped a lot as kids and
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: my father especially liked fishing. So we were always outside.
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: So especially in the beginning when we moved to the city,
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: it's like, oh, I'm missing a lot of this and
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: all these concrete walls and artificial lighting. So what's the
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: easiest way to sort of get off the beaten track
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: the furthest you can? And that's to have a 4x4.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: Like I said, you don't need one, but it just
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: takes you that much further off the beaten track.
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: We started out with an old Pajero, Montero we called it.
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: Great choice, yeah.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: And we put more than 400,000 kilometers on that thing
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: and we went everywhere. So it literally had a roof
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: rack with an easy on soft tent.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: Perfect.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: It had a battery box with a solenoid to the
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: alternator and a little fridge and that was us.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: And we had some of the best times ever. That's great.
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: So it's really, for us it was to to get
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: off the beaten track. Just get that little bit farther
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: out of civilization and enjoy that.
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: And you guys had like regular day jobs that.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: You were working. Yeah, so we were both in corporate.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: Those days we were just starting out. Vanessa had never
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: camped before.
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: As a family, we never camped.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: And where did you grow up in South Africa?
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: In Woodbank.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: And then lastly in Rustenburg, and that's where we met.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: Oh, nice.
• 29:35
  Speaker 4: But our parents never camped, and then Christoph took me
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: to Botswana.
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: You want me to figure out?
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: To could see and that was my first camping experience
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: in the middle of nowhere with lions long drop lions
• 29:48
  Speaker 4: and i said to him i'll go camping but there
• 29:50
  Speaker 4: are three requirements i'm not sleeping on the ground I
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: want to put a potty and I want to be
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: clean when I go to bed at night.
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: And that's it.
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: Seems like a fair request.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: Exactly. And it was a case of you're either going
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: to love this or you're going to hate it. So
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: let's find out.
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: Well, it's always good to know early on. And Vanessa,
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: when you think back of those early trips... What were
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: the aha moments for you? What were the things that
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: you thought, like, wow, I really do love this part
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: of it? What were the things that you enjoyed?
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: I think it was the second night I arrived here already.
• 30:22
  Speaker 4: So we were sleeping, and I think a few steps
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: away from us, there were two lions, and they started singing.
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: And my heart just pounded. You literally just feel it
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: in your heart. It just vibrates through your entire body.
• 30:35
  Speaker 4: And that was just amazing. And I think there I
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: pretty much fell in love. It was funny, though, because
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: I'm lying in bed hearing these lines. And then Christoph
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: just took the car keys just to get the car
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: open and close so the lights go on.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: And I grabbed his hand and I said to him,
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: don't move. He's like, they know you here already.
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: And the next morning, going to see the tracks and
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: just looking at those faces.
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: Paw prints they're so big they're so big and.
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah i'm not sorry the second thing i think is
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: when we in that same trip we it was quite
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: hectic because we had a fire felt fire and we
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: had to.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: Rush they can be really big that was.
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: Crazy and we had the fire behind us and the
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: two lines that we heard in the in the road
• 31:19
  Speaker 4: so we're stuck between a rock and a hard place
• 31:21
  Speaker 4: But I got such good shots from that.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you can't beat it.
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: It's just where you should be in nature, where you
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: belong at the end of the day.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: And that has continued to pull you back.
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: Absolutely.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: I love it. I love the sounds. I love the smell.
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: Going to walk.
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: It's the best thing, to be honest. There's nothing else
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: that resets your brain and your body like taking off
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: your shoes and going for a walk and just looking
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: at what's around you. Yeah.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: South Africans do that. They walk around barefoot all the time.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't make it 10 feet. Oh, three feet. I'm
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: such a, what do they call that? A soft foot? Yeah, no,
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: but South Africans do walk around barefoot a lot, which
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, there's been lots of studies around the benefits
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: of doing that. Of course, humans walk barefoot for most
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: of our history. So it makes sense that it would
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: work with the brain in a certain way, which is
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: really cool. Yeah, I remember the first time that I
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: camped near lions and you like you hear what would
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: be a lion roar. You see that in TV and
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: movies and things like that. But it was actually this
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: really strong grunt that I heard. And I don't have
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: any hair on my head, but what was up there,
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: whatever vestiges of hair was up, it all stood on
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: end because it was unmistakable to my body what that was.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: Yep, it's primal.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very primal. So I thought that was kind
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: of an interesting experience of like an autonomic response. Of course,
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: wonder and awe and excitement and everything else like that,
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: but just how physically my body responded of like, That's
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: a threat. It's probably going to eat you. So yeah,
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: that goes way back in the human DNA for sure.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: For sure. So let's talk a little bit about what
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: made you guys decide that you wanted to tell your stories.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: Talk a little bit about your channel and what kind
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: of content do you have on your, because you have
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: a huge variety, but what are the things that you
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: guys emphasize?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: So right to the beginning, I started this part time.
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: first started with a blog and then realized very little people.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: Read still unfortunately yeah.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: And firstly just part-time i wanted to show these places
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: for two reasons one for people to have these experiences
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: and two a lot of these places do not market
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: themselves because they just don't know how in the middle
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: of nowhere so it really started with that little campsite
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: reviews and then people were starting to ask well you
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: know what is it like and all that and we
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: started literally filming our little trips. And not just to,
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: not really to be filmmakers, but to tell good stories
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: and show these places and, you know, inspire you to
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: see these places. So that's pretty much where we started.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: At that stage, I'd been in corporate for a little
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: more over 20 years. And at that stage, I was
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: really fed up with it, you know, We were, or
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: I was, you know, living the dream, but I realized
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: it's not my dream. And I took a year off.
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: And then, you know, by starting this part-time, it became full-time, fortunately.
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, good. And I think one thing is every time
• 34:39
  Speaker 4: you went out and you came back, I'm like, I
• 34:41
  Speaker 4: want to see more of it because I'm not going
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: with necessarily.
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: I was still in corporate.
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: So I want to see more, you know, feel more
• 34:47
  Speaker 4: the area and what you're doing so that I can
• 34:50
  Speaker 4: be part of it. And I think that's how it
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: also just grew.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and Vanessa joined full-time, fortunately, about two years ago.
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: She was retrenched and it was the best thing ever.
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's scary, but yeah, it was the best thing ever.
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a lot of times life will throw things
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: at you. And at the time, it's like, well, this
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: is terrible. But if you connect the dots going back,
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: you say, okay, this led to that, that led to this.
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: And if you let it flow, sometimes you end up
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: where we ended up.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember when we started Overland Journal, I still
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: worked in software for... over another year. Cause I was
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: so afraid to, and I just got a great piece
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: of advice from a friend that had been successful in business.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: And he's like, you got to pick a horse and
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: ride it. Cause you can't do both. You can't be
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: doing software during the week and trying to run an
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: overland mag and hope that you're going to have a
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: good outcome in either location. So yeah, that yeah january
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: 1st of 2008 like it was and but then all
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: of a sudden you find all kinds of motivation yeah
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: because you're like you got to make it work yeah
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: you got to.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: Make it work so yeah it's also to inspire other
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: people to just i'm not trying to change your mind
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: but just open it there's lots of possibilities i'm not
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: saying everybody needs to be content creators but you know
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: adventure is necessary so create a little adventure in your
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: life at least some balance doesn't Cost anything to walk
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: the dog, go to the park. And we often ask
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: that question to people. It's like, six months into the year,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: have you taken a break? A lot of times, especially
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: as kids, you might not take a trip that you
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: planned because there's a deadline, that project. And you'll never
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: remember years down the line what was that deadline and project,
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: but you'll remember not taking the trip.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: So that's sort of the philosophy we live by.
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: A different point of view as well. To see life
• 36:43
  Speaker 4: a little bit differently than just the normal corporate or
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: have to have a dog, a house, a car, insurance.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: What else is out there?
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, travel has taught us to live minimally. And it's
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: not a negative thing. It's actually, well, we don't need
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: stuff or as much stuff. And I'd rather spend money
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: on experiences than things. Now, overlanding, you know... you need
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: some kit but don't go overboard spend that on your
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: gas or diesel yeah that's your first.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: Priority yeah i'm on a 20 year old motorcycle right
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: now it cost me 2500 bucks it's like off off
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: you go i mean the price of a new 1300
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: gs adventure is the whole cost of the trip what
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: do you feel was one of the and you guys
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: can both answer what was one of the most intense
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: moments or experiences that you guys have had in your
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: travels and what did you learn from that.
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: So i I think there's two. I'll take the first one.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: I was driving on 31-inch tires on Sales Pass. That's
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: listed on the most dangerous roads in the world. So
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: you have to be really careful. You have to trust
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: your spotter implicitly because you cannot see. Some of it
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: is right up your noses in the air. You just
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: see sky. A lot of it you see vehicles that's
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: literally rolled off the sides. It makes it very real
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: very quickly.
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: And that was incredibly intense, but what gets you through
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: that is just taking it a step at a time.
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: Every moment, be there. And that was the great thing
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: about it, though. You cannot be thinking about, oh, this deadline,
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: and I'm worried about that, because that could have fatal consequences.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: So you have to be right there in that moment,
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: trust the guys traveling with you, and If you come
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: and do that, you just get through it.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I do remember there was a couple of buckies
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: down at the bottom of that ditch.
• 38:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: Like I said, it makes it very real. I think
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: the next one was in Mozambique, which wasn't a great experience.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: This was sort of just after Mozambique opened, after all
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: the war. And we made the mistake of getting in
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: there at night because we had a very, very long
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: border crossing. And especially in those days, guys were taking chances.
• 39:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: We got stopped by police. The guys were drunk and
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: they were armed. But basically what got us through there
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: is just being calm and talking our way out of it.
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 39:13
  Speaker 4: I mean, the guy was standing next to my window,
• 39:16
  Speaker 4: tapping on the window with an AK.
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: So it's quite real.
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: You need to keep calm and just, you know, you're
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: in their land. So you need to just be kind.
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: And yeah, we got through it by.
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: Just keeping calm. heads, I think.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not a place for temper.
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or anxiety, as much as you might have some
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: of that. And that's not the norm. I mean, in the,
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: you know, what is it now, 20, 30 years of travel,
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: that's been the only incident.
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: And.
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: If you take with you a friendly, positive attitude, that's
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: one of the best pieces of gear you can take
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: to Africa. As with any place, you will find people
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: that take chances like that. And usually just calm and
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: patient demeanor will get you through that.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember a story from Kingsley Holgate that they
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: got thrown into a prison cell in Mozambique. And fortunately,
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: his wife had tucked a cell phone into her sock.
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: And, of course, they're well-known and loved in southern Africa,
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: and they're huge. They do a lot for the community.
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: So as soon as they got word out, a bunch
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: of people with a lot of influence got a hold
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: of that police chief.
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, correct. And there's ways around that, especially nowadays with
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: everything being so connected. There's a very good group called
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: Drive Moz where you get some stickers, you put that
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: in your car, and then there's some infrastructure where you
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: can press a button And somebody from the tourist department
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: is on that line. And if you're getting hassled, you
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: just hand over the phone. Have a little conversation. They'll
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: have a little conversation and off you go. To the
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: point now where if you have those stickers, they'll leave
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: you alone. So you do find that in Africa, but
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: the message is it's not the norm.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: Mozambique, geez, what a beautiful country. Camping on some of
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: those beaches, just unbelievable. Yeah. Yeah, and the food, the
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: fresh fish and stuff. If you want fresh fish, that's
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: the place to go.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: That's the place, for sure.
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very inexpensive. I mean, all of Southern Africa
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: is very fairly priced, for sure. And how do you
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: guys feel that, because you guys have made a big
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: life change. This is your career now, and you guys
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: have made the shift out of corporate life. How has
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: this travel changed you guys as people?
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: I think the first thing is to live with less.
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: You don't need all the things, right? And the next
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: one is I think just seeing things differently, opening your
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: perspective of things. Because if you stay in your little town,
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: in your house, in your community, you have this sort
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: of fixed view of life. Going to other cultures, other countries,
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: different way of doing things, that sort of broadens your
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: horizon dramatically, you know. And like I said, to do
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: more with less.
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, for me it's just being calmer, weirdly enough, and
• 42:18
  Speaker 4: not worrying so much. Because you're always panicky in corporate
• 42:22
  Speaker 4: and you're planning and your system is in high alert.
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: You're calmer now, you can think clearer, and it's freedom
• 42:30
  Speaker 4: basically for your brain and your entire body. So yeah,
• 42:34
  Speaker 4: I mean, we do plan and you do worry here
• 42:36
  Speaker 4: and there, but it's not the same.
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: You can see clearer.
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It's not on
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: this question list, but it is one that I like
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: to ask couples that travel together. But what are you
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: most proud of Vanessa for in your travels?
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: I think getting out of a shell. We make content
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: and she was always nervous in the beginning and not
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: wanting to be on camera at all. And now it's
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: like out of your shell, she influences a lot of
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: especially female travelers. that would be otherwise hesitant to do this.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: We've had lots of compliments from husbands, especially, since Vanessa's there,
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: now my wife wants to travel. So that's a good thing,
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: some positive influence. And in those nervous situations of driving,
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: for instance, just learning how to do it, yeah, immensely
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: proud of that.
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: And how about for you? What are you most proud
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: of Christoph for in these last couple of years?
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Just handing over and letting me drive?
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: No.
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: You have to do that.
• 43:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: What if he, you know, twists an ankle or whatever?
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: You've got to be able to drive.
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: I think in South Africa it's a thing where the
• 43:47
  Speaker 4: men drive and they don't let the women do anything.
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: We just don't operate that way. I can literally do
• 43:52
  Speaker 4: everything and it's not a competition.
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: That's all.
• 43:55
  Speaker 4: But also he's much more calmer and we bring something
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: to each other where we just... I mean, we've been
• 44:01
  Speaker 4: together for 30 years. We just communicate without saying anything. Yeah. So...
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: For me, I know it's not just being proud of him,
• 44:10
  Speaker 4: but us being together. You're a bit worried because you're
• 44:14
  Speaker 4: 24-7 together and you're not sure if it's going to work.
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: I mean, in the corporate world, you have more stress
• 44:19
  Speaker 4: and this tension. That's all gone. It's just beautiful to
• 44:24
  Speaker 4: be together all the time. I can't think of being
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: away from him for a week or anything.
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we struggle with it.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: It's like nuts, yeah.
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: Well, it's very clear to me because I've traveled with
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: you guys now to see how much you enjoy each
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: other's company. And it does seem like it all kind
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: of flows naturally because you guys have spent so much
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: time together. Yeah, exactly. You probably have your own subconscious
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: language now.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: We do.
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: I'm sure sometimes it becomes vocal.
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like any relationship, but that's one of the– Some
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: of the advice we give to people that want to
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: do this full-time as well is you've got to like
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: your partner.
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so true. That's so true. How do you
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: guys help support? I mean, there's so many incredible cultures
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: in South Africa, in all of Africa. How do you
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: guys help support other travelers? Are there organizations that you
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: guys really believe in? Or how do you give back
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: when you're traveling? Yeah.
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: We believe in organizations like Overland Bounce. I volunteer for
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: them as well. Just especially getting lineage out there. Leaving
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: places better than we find them. Leave no trace. All
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: those good principles. Some of the organizations we like to
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: support is like Pangolin Rehabilitation.
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: Those animals are really threatened.
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And also the wild dogs. The only pack of
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: three or three packs now of free roaming wild dogs
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: in the world is in the water books so we'd
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: like to give them exposure and thus get them funding
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: yeah from a culture point of view Botswana is where
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: our hearts lie and we would like to think we've
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: attributed to the tourism in a big way so as
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: much as we do small campsites and all that uh
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: I think we've really help Botswana from a tourist point
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: of view. We still try and do that.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: Just like with Namibia, it's so impressive how Botswana as
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: a government has found ways to make it work where
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: they have very low corruption. I mean, every country has corruption,
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: but they have very low corruption overall. It's very safe,
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: very low crime. People have opportunity, which when people have opportunity,
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: they're going to be less likely to be criminals. They're
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: going to be less likely to have corruption in their government. So, yeah,
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: Botswana is really done. They're definitely a forerunner of that.
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: And I think also just something simple as keeping it clean.
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: And just making people aware that you like going there,
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: but if you're not looking after it, it's going to
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: be gone tomorrow. And you won't be able to go back.
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: And that's one of the messages when we're just talking
• 47:06
  Speaker 4: to people on one-on-one basis is to remind them of,
• 47:09
  Speaker 4: you know, keep it clean, look after it, leave it better. Yeah.
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah. At the very least, it should be self-serving.
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 47:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: You want to keep using this place, look after it. Otherwise,
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: like you say, it's going to be closed and then
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: you can't use it.
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: I think what's important is if we don't do that now,
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: we're the ones that can make the impact and the change.
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: And we really need to be clear about that in
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: our communications, in our content, because there are a lot
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: of second and third world countries that are becoming more affluent,
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: which means people are starting to travel. But maybe in
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: their country it's completely common to just throw a wrapper
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: on the ground. But that wrapper will stay in the
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: Kalahari for 20, 30 years. So we have to have
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: the courage to say, I understand that that's what you
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: may do where you live, but that's not appropriate here.
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: Correct.
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: An animal may pick that up. It could cause the
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: animal to die. A lot of impact.
• 48:07
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: Or similarly, what we've seen a lot is, even first
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: world travelers where they think, oh, well, if I just
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: put my garbage back here, somebody will collect it.
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: You know, 14 hours from anybody, so no, they don't
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: collect it. Then, as you say, animals get in there,
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: so it creates a mess. So it's just really educating people.
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: It's not calling them out, it's calling them in. This
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: is how we look after these places, and it's not
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: that difficult.
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: Simple things like feeding animals. I mean, we feed us.
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: We want to look after everything, but it's bad to
• 48:39
  Speaker 3: do that.
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it really is. They start to be habituated, and
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: they can become quite dangerous.
• 48:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: Actually so if you could only own one brand new
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: overland vehicle what would you pick the one we have
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: how about you vanessa same one.
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: 79 series perfect i love that car so much i
• 48:57
  Speaker 4: wouldn't have changed it for anything else.
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah well it's like of any car in the world
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: that you can just have a deep respect for it's
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: a 70 series language it has a lot of personality
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: yeah they do they do and they They're the right
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: tool for the job.
• 49:10
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: So what we need, that's, that's the best choice.
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. That's good. And the fact that you
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: guys can actually buy them still new off the Toyota lot,
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: you that makes a lot of Americans very jealous. Although
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: I've heard that there's been some recent changes in regulations
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: in South Africa where foreigners can now purchase vehicles in
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: Africa and store them there, etc. There's some folks that
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: are helping to make that possible. So If you've always
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: wanted to own a 70s series, why not keep it
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: in Africa, which is the best place in the world,
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: in my opinion, to use a 70s series. So, yeah,
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: that's something to consider. I know you guys are both
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: big readers. What are some of your favorite books that
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: you guys have? And it can be about any subject.
• 49:53
  Speaker 4: Oh, yes.
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: I actually don't read that much. I audiobook, weirdly enough.
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's okay.
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: Me too.
• 49:58
  Speaker 4: My hands are always busy, so it's the best way
• 50:00
  Speaker 4: to get some content in my head. Cry of the Kalahari,
• 50:03
  Speaker 4: the first time I listened to that was just overwhelming
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: because we visited the Kalahari before I actually read the book.
• 50:10
  Speaker 4: And now reading the book, you're thinking, oh, wow, I've
• 50:12
  Speaker 4: been there and what these guys have done and what
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: they've achieved.
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: And the fact that they actually... survived and they weren't eaten.
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: It's quite a miracle.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: But yes, that is quite an inspiring book.
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: That is a great book. And how about for you, Christoph?
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: Same one. We actually made an episode about it to
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: show this is what it looks like today and what
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: was it like when they were there.
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's fascinating.
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: Some archival footage.
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: What's the name of that episode? People are going to
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: search on YouTube.
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if they search for it, just search for Get
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: Out Go, that'll bring it up. Or we've got, you know,
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: we've had to YouTube it a little bit so it'll
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: say week without any backup in the calories.
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: Oh sure gotcha cool awesome and of every place that
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: you visited in all of your travels what's your favorite
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: place you don't have to give the exact campsite location
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: but what's your favorite general area in the world that
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: you've visited.
• 51:04
  Speaker 4: Botswana Botswana and but we do have a favorite campsite
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: I don't mind yeah giving it out it's Botswana okay
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: and yeah I There's five campsites actually and they're very
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: far away from each other, but we try and get
• 51:17
  Speaker 4: there at least once a year.
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: Wonderful.
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: And that's almost like a holiday spot for us to
• 51:21
  Speaker 4: just relax and not film anything.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: Correct. It's three and a half hours from Johannesburg, so
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: it's close.
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: That's amazing.
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: That's just on the South African side of the Botswana border.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: And I just have love for the Kalahari. So the
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: Kalahari actually spans a lot of South Africa, a lot
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: of Botswana and even into Namibia. And we always say,
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: if that red sand gets into your shoes, you'll get back.
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: It's going to get into your soul. I mean, another
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: spot that a lot of people don't even know exists
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: is that Kama Rhino Reserve. And I was there in 2013. Wow, incredible.
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: And not far from that, you have Kubu Island, which
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: is absolutely mystical. The list goes on and on and on.
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Botswana is very special. Yeah. So how do people
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: find out more about you guys? What's your Instagram? It
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: sounds like Get Out Go is pretty much how they
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: find you on anything.
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: On any of it. So our YouTube channel is Get
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: Out Go. Same on Instagram. We've got a website, getoutgo.co.za.
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: And we are now on local Southern African television as well.
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: So you can find us there too.
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's fantastic. And one of the things that we've
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: worked with you on, Christophe, is because you have so
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: much specific knowledge, experience in Southern Africa, you've helped us
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: with some of our logistics and planning. So if you
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: do reach out to Christophe, just know that that is
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: part of their profession. So it would be appropriate for
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: you to be compensated for that time. But you were
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: very affordable, very knowledgeable people. So if someone's looking for
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: a team of people that have been there and done
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: it and know the regulations and know how much time
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: it takes to get from this point to the next,
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: maybe the best campsites, GPS tracks, and everything else like that,
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: you guys have been incredibly helpful.
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: And that's something we do more and more lately, purely because, again,
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: we want people to see Africa. And that should be
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: as simple as possible, especially for overlanders, because, like you say,
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: we've done it all. So, yeah, certainly we've started helping
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: people build vehicles or ship them or rent them.
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: And it's just great to share the experience and the
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: learnings from it so you don't have to necessarily go
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: through all that. Yeah.
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: You can help with it.
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: Well, and it wasn't that you guys started off with, like,
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: that's going to be our business.
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: No.
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: But you guys have developed so much specific knowledge that
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: even for XOverland, for us, it was the very best choice.
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: Instead of me trying to spend two weeks, which I've
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: been to a fraction of the places that you've been.
• 53:54
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: So I'd have to do a whole bunch more research.
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: Whereas you guys were able to very specifically say, Hey,
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: let's go there. Let's go here. And it saved us
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: a bunch of time. And again, your, your fees are very,
• 54:06
  Speaker 1: they're appropriate and reasonable. So make sure you reach out
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: to Vanessa and Christophe. If you're thinking about getting some
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: logistics support when you go to Africa and then watch
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: their content, cause it's very inspiring.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: So appreciate it.
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: Awesome. Well, I thank you both for being on the podcast.
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: It's been wonderful to get to know you both and
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: become friends, travel together in Africa, and now see you
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: again here in the United States. We really appreciate your
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: time this morning.
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: Thanks for having us, and we hope to travel with
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: you some more.
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll make that happen for sure. Likewise.
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Scott, for your time.
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're welcome. We thank you all for listening, and
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: we'll talk to you next time.