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David Collinge & Frederick Torrance | The Christian Reeve Podcast #355 · The Christian Reeve Podcast

• 0:00
  Hello and welcome to another episode of the Christian Reef
• 0:02
  Podcast. Today's guests, that's right
• 0:05
  plural, are Frederick Torrance and David Collins from Flat Pack
• 0:10
  Theatre. Welcome to the show.
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  How you doing? Oh, we're doing good, Thank you.
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  Doing. Very good.
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  Yeah, it's going really, really well.
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  Don't believe you? It's.
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  Doing great, yeah. Why don't we sound so like sad
• 0:23
  and depressive the second we're? Like we're British, it's what we
• 0:27
  do. Yeah.
• 0:31
  We are good. We are, we are very, we're in a
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  brilliant state right now. We're just in the process of
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  doing Pirate Theatre 2026, which show we do every year.
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  So we're in a very, you know, good and creative mindset at the
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  moment, you know, but for some reason our British 12O clock
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  brains when, yeah, we're good. Well, I thought this was a
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  reasonable time to. The listeners, like we have just
• 0:57
  had a whole conversation about sort of why do we as people just
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  just like we'll say, Oh yeah, things are fine when when
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  they're not, yeah. But so I'll things are fine.
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  I promise I'll explain. Now, so basically I was asked
• 1:14
  how are you since we last spoke? And I said, well, it's been
• 1:18
  shit. And then obviously there's that
• 1:20
  like awkward silence thing where it's like, and I'm like, I
• 1:24
  quickly just said, no, no, it's not your responsibility because
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  I don't think, because a lot of the time it, it'll be like the,
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  you know, you meet up in a pub, you have a drink.
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  So how you been? Yeah, everything's shit.
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  And it's like, oh great. So the next 5 hours of my life
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  are going to be consoling this person and giving them three
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  therapy. And it's like, no, no, no, no,
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  no. I think you're a selfish twat if
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  you do that. Now don't get me wrong,
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  sometimes people are actually going through things, but then I
• 1:52
  I think like it's on the person who is experiencing the thing to
• 1:57
  give the other person a bit of a heads up like.
• 1:59
  Yeah. Like you can reach out to your
• 2:01
  friend, but then you've got to be like, yeah, no, I'm really
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  going for it because then the other person needs to be able to
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  know if they're prepared as well.
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  I feel a. 100%, you know. What I mean, because he's
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  taking. Yeah, because this is the big
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  thing I learned about empathy years ago was that it's, it
• 2:19
  takes a lot of energy. I don't know how that will
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  sound, but like you're essentially giving your energy
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  to this other person by listening, being there, you
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  know, supporting them in different ways.
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  It it takes a lot out of you. And it's, I don't know, like I,
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  I think people kind of overlook this sometimes.
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  And then going back to what you were saying before about the,
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  the British politeness thing, it's like you feel like you have
• 2:43
  to stand there and listen to this person's entire fucking
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  life story and how terrible everything is.
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  And it's like there's only so many hours in the day.
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  We're all going through shit or we're going through shit or
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  might go through some shit. And it's like I just, I could
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  see the the life drained out of people sometimes when you stop
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  doing. Yeah.
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  Oh, like the worst one is when, like you go to the pub and
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  you're like, I've got some shit I want to talk about, actually.
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  And then you get there and they're like, actually, yeah,
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  some shit works in this and that.
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  You're like, oh God, I wanted to speak about this, like this fun
• 3:19
  thing. And now I let you feel guilty
• 3:21
  being like, Anyway, Transformers.
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  You know, I know exactly what you mean.
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  It's it's like, oh, it's going to be one of those nights.
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  Yeah. I mean as a good friend, you'll
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  sit there and you'll be you'll be available and you'll.
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  Be like, of course we will, yeah.
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  But then like, you're like, ah, I need, I need some energy after
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  this. Now like this.
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  Yeah. This is, you know, obligation.
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  On a sort of similar topic, So I want to start off with a with a
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  really brilliant sort of one of my one of my great personal
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  mentors, Philippe Gollier, passed away recently.
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  Sorry for your loss. He like it's like last week he
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  passed away. Wow.
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  OK, I'm sorry. But in I mean, you know, but he
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  was a clown and he was a he was a performer that that based
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  himself in clown and comedy. So it's weird because one, he's
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  French and to that sort of like that.
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  It's the final policy, of course.
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  That wasn't bad enough. And but what if that wasn't bad
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  enough? But so he say that he doesn't
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  have the British, he doesn't have the British politeness
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  about him too, because he he works in a way that is very is
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  the opposite to to what we we know because clowns are the
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  opposite to like regular life. No one's sad about it.
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  You know, I think like Matthew Bainton has posted about it,
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  like a lot of people have worked with Golly a have posted about
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  it and it's like it's he's passed away and it's like the
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  funniest thing ever. What?
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  Do you mean? Because he genuinely so he
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  because he because he's a clown and he's always said like, I
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  don't care, like no one should care if I die.
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  It should be funny. So people of in his memory just
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  said it's the funniest thing ever.
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  So it's like, you know, it's we're only having these weird,
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  we're having these like weird British polite reactions because
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  we think it's right. And then this guy, someone who I
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  hold very dear to my heart, unfortunately passed away
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  recently, and his dying wish was that everyone found it
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  hilarious. Like, I love that.
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  I love that. To be fair.
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  OK, all right, I, I, I hear what you're saying.
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  I, I, when I die, I want everyone to just get pissed up
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  and have a like fucking great time.
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  Like that's what I want. I don't want any of this.
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  I want like, maybe like 2 minutes of crying like, oh,
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  we're going to miss you, pal. And then everyone just gets
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  really fucked up on my dime and then moves on with their life
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  because that's just what happens.
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  But. Are you paying for the booze or
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  is it? Is that coming out of your will
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  now? There's an idea.
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  Yeah, who's picking up with that man?
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  I'll pay for the piss up. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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  Oh yeah, yeah. I think so.
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  Oh, that would be great. Sort of like it's a real test of
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  a real test of strength. You can put your debit card on
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  top of the coffin and like. And then someone comes along and
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  I'm a card reader. Like sorry, I know, I know, I
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  know you're it's a funeral, but we got a bar tab from before.
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  Sorry, sorry. Here we go.
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  I just I just. I need to pay for parking real
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  quick. I just need to pay for parking
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  real quick. I'm so sorry.
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  I'm so sorry. I think it's even better knowing
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  that contactless only works like 5 or 6 times and let's be
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  honest, you yeah. Imagine the awkwardness if you
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  try that. The server's trying to like scan
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  the card on the coffee. It's not working and they're
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  like, his cards declined. I know he's dead.
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  Does. Anyone know the pin you?
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  Know what I mean? Say Chris, what's the pin?
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  Oh, nevermind. No.
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  Sorry. When I die, I want my my coffin
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  to be lined with cardboard so everybody writes Oh yeah.
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  We do live in. Manchester so that people can
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  like write one of their favorite quotes of mine love that you
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  know what I mean, or like write just something that like just
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  made them laugh about me. So then it's an instance have
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  been the whole thing of like, oh, Pooey, he's dead.
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  It's like a thing of like, oh, yeah, yeah.
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  But remember when he said this stupid thing?
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  You know what I mean? It doesn't have to be, like a,
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  like a funny thing or a great thing I once said.
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  It could just be, I don't know, one time when it turns out, you
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  know, what's it, David? And it was like, David.
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  I I I I really need a shit right now.
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  Write that down on my coffin. You know, it could be literally
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  anything. That's what I'd want on my, on
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  my deathbed. I want a coffin lined with
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  cardboard. You know, I saw a guy recently
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  film a video where he like, slept in the woods in a
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  cardboard tent, and it was kind of fascinating, to be honest.
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  Yes, because it was a legit cardboard.
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  Like, you know, cardboard is like really, really good.
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  Like it lasts a while in the rain.
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  Yeah, I didn't think I'd be talking about this, but here we
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  are. And that was because my first
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  thought is, oh, it'll get soggy and it'll just fucking.
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  Yeah, that's the last thing. Surely right?
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  No, but it lasts a really long time.
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  This is why you often see homeless people using cardboard
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  to reinforce. It only lasts like a few days.
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  You can't get much out of it but with light spurts.
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  I mean in Manchester you'd you'd be like fucking drowning within
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  like a day so. But in other cities where it
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  doesn't rain as much. Might get.
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  Some usage out of it, you know, and he'd legit just, you know,
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  slept in a cardboard tendon. It's kind of fascinating.
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  That's mad. I never thought cardboard would
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  be a good thing to camp in, you know?
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  It's a good insulator, apparently.
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  Yeah, apparently. Yeah.
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  Keeps heating. That's mad.
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  I mean because I love like using cardboard to like make sets, not
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  stuff. Because I think it's hilarious
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  when you think, Oh yeah, you've got this like strong wall and a
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  steady wall and an actor comes over, tries to lean on it and
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  just starts going backwards. I think it's one of the best
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  tools to use for like set making or prop making or whatever.
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  You name the company after it, you know.
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  Yeah, yeah, literally flat back theatre.
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  I mean our our logo. Is like finally get the story.
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  So I mean, well, literally the story's not as fun as like,
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  people would think. I was like, I was at the top.
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  I was at the pub and like, what's with my brother and my
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  partner? And we were just talking about
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  like, oh, if I was to make a theatre company, what I call it.
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  And we were like coming up with like these like really cool
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  names of like, you know, like, you know, like ones your Bros
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  will say about like, oh, Dragon Theatre and all that type of
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  stuff. And they were just really cringe
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  because we were drunk. We didn't realise how cringe
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  they were. And then like, I was like, I
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  don't know, I just want something that like, gives off
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  the vibe of like, you know, from the ground up, you know,
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  building it yourself. And then like, I can't 1 of this
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  is the thing. We never know which one it is.
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  But one of us turned around and was like, what about flat pack
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  theatre? And we all kind of laughed at
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  like, oh, that's a stupid name. And then the next day I woke up
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  and I was like, flat pack theatre.
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  That's kind of fucking cool, you know?
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  And then like from then on we use that and full enough.
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  Actually, it was a similar way we came up with pyre theatre.
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  So for ages and ages when we were first doing pyre theatre,
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  we couldn't think of a name for ages.
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  It was, you know, it was, you know, boozer spotlight or it
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  was, you know, apartment to showcase us.
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  We were just we, we just knew we wanted something to do with like
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  booze and alcohol and, and and theatre and we were just like,
• 10:51
  we were over complicating it. And I can't remember what we, we
• 10:54
  came out at one point, I think at one point it was like on
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  stage shots or something like that.
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  Again, we were at, we were just at the pub.
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  It was me, Felix and my brother. And my brother was like, you
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  know, a few pints in and he just turned around and went, I don't
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  know, what about Pint theatre? And we went, what the fuck?
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  How are you? How did you come up with that?
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  That's not fair. Like we spent months on this and
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  Pint Theatre just comes out your ass.
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  What the fuck? And like you, never let me live
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  that down. It gives, it gives.
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  It's you think about how quickly you finish a pint.
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  I mean, obviously it varies from person to person, but it's like,
• 11:30
  it's almost like a taster of it, I feel like.
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  You think about that name. Is it's like, OK, this isn't a
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  full on theatre show, but it's a taste.
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  It's a collection and this kind of brings us on to it.
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  So like from what I've found, it's you basically getting lots
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  of writers and actors together to collaborate and come
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  together. And so like each person's going
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  to have probably like what, like a 10 minute, 15 minute start
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  something. Like that?
• 11:54
  Yeah, yeah. OK.
• 11:57
  Go on, Go on. I'll let David, you know, let
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  you take it away. Explain how.
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  Yeah, so I originally when I first started working with the
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  company is is through pint of theatre through the through the
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  first one. Yeah, what what we do is we get
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  10 odd writers and we get 10 odd actors and we bring them
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  together because we want to build community.
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  So we're going to we're going to take new writing and it really
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  exciting stuff that that people aren't seeing, You know, anyone
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  that wants to work on some stuff.
• 12:29
  If someone's got a play that they've they put on later on in
• 12:31
  the year, it's an opportunity to work with it.
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  If it's people have never anything before, but they want
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  to try it, then they can. It's giving spotlight to people
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  that maybe don't have the opportunity for it.
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  Like at the end of the day, I consider was lucky.
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  I consider was lucky to the fact that we are getting theater
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  spaces and we're getting people to buy tickets and we have the
• 12:52
  opportunities to get actors and directors and all those sort of
• 12:55
  people. A lot of people don't have that.
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  And so why not give back to the people that spores?
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  So we get the writers in and then we we audition anyone who
• 13:07
  wants to do it. Like because we get the writers,
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  we'll spend time with them working on the material they
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  have. It can be whatever.
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  I mean, the first point of theatre was more focused on
• 13:18
  theatre itself, on acting. But this time we've got
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  comedians, we've got poetry, we've got like spoken word
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  stuff, theatre. And we've even got the guys
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  called Lip Bum, which is another completely separate company to
• 13:34
  us who just do really fun comedy sketches.
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  And we're like, yeah, fuck it, get in there, let's do that.
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  You know, excuse my French, but it's like, it's that sort of
• 13:45
  it's raw talent of just new entertainment that people aren't
• 13:49
  seeing. But yeah.
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  What would you say you guys generally get out of it?
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  Like how does it benefit flat pack theater?
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  Well, I mean, to 3rd when we first started it off like we,
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  we, that was something that she weird enough, we didn't even
• 14:03
  think about. We didn't think about like, how
• 14:06
  is this going to benefit us? And it wasn't until, I can't
• 14:10
  remember who it was, but I was trying to convince someone that
• 14:12
  this would be beneficial. It was probably like either
• 14:14
  like, you know, like one of my parents or like, you know, like,
• 14:16
  you know, another company or something.
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  And I was like, Oh, well, I guess what you could say we get
• 14:22
  out of it is that, you know, we get possibly more of an audience
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  because there's people that will be, you know, related or
• 14:29
  connected in some way to the performers that we would never
• 14:32
  have reached out before. And then also, you know, we get
• 14:35
  to kind of scout talent, you know, like, I mean, like David
• 14:40
  just said, we we literally met, not met, but got connected
• 14:43
  through. What's it David, thanks to π
• 14:45
  theatre after working with us on π theatre, it was then do you
• 14:49
  want to help direct when you die?
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  And then he basically directed when you die.
• 14:53
  And now he's our full time drama surge, you know, so that's
• 14:56
  literally a perfect example. And then we met a lovely woman
• 14:59
  named Stella Stevenson was it did a monologue that was going
• 15:04
  to be in when you die. And we thought she was so
• 15:06
  brilliant. We brought her back to the full
• 15:07
  play. And then like so and so forth.
• 15:09
  I mean, this year, you know, we've got people that we just
• 15:12
  think are so brilliant. I mean, we've had some people
• 15:14
  that, you know, really want to build that monologue into a full
• 15:17
  show or like, you know, really want to test working with us.
• 15:20
  And this is an easy way for them to do it in a really relaxed and
• 15:24
  almost it's like with a going with a full play and being like,
• 15:28
  oh, I'll dedicate all my time to it.
• 15:31
  It's kind of got this air of worry because you're like, oh,
• 15:34
  well, I'm not sure if I want to give all my time to a company
• 15:38
  that I don't know anything about.
• 15:40
  With Pythes, it's one month of rehearsals and that's it.
• 15:43
  You know, you do one month rehearsals, like only two or
• 15:47
  three rehearsals in general because it's just a monologue or
• 15:49
  a little bit of stand up. And then, you know, after the
• 15:52
  show it's like, great, I enjoyed working with them.
• 15:55
  I want to work with them again, you know, and we keep you guys
• 15:58
  in mind because we know we work well with you.
• 16:00
  We already know how to direct you, you know, so it it without
• 16:04
  was realizing that we actually are getting a lot from this show
• 16:08
  that we didn't realize we were getting from it.
• 16:11
  You know what? Would you say makes a
• 16:12
  collaboration successful? Oh, for me, like a really
• 16:19
  successful collaboration is when one person comes in with an idea
• 16:24
  and like a very strong image of how something should go and
• 16:29
  someone else has the exact same thing they have.
• 16:31
  They have a very strong idea of how it should go, but they're
• 16:34
  completely different and they come together and they're able
• 16:37
  to merge the two without letting their egos get in the way of
• 16:42
  like, oh, well, you're taking what I had and making something
• 16:44
  different. If you're just able to go,
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  let's, let's merge them. Let's let's make, let's find
• 16:48
  this lovely middle ground that's kind of like what I see.
• 16:52
  Is that something you guys have come across quite often?
• 16:54
  Because I feel like one thing I, I, the vibe I get from what I've
• 16:59
  heard about flat pack theatre, what I've seen online is it's
• 17:02
  very much like tight knit. And from what you've laid out,
• 17:04
  it's you've quite rightly, I think you, you've looked and,
• 17:10
  and brought people in who you've worked with and gone.
• 17:12
  Well, you've got the right vibe, you've got the right energy.
• 17:15
  Welcome on board. Like let's, let's do more
• 17:17
  together. Let's work together more.
• 17:18
  I mean, I can think of a bunch of directors and
• 17:22
  cinematographers I've worked with on like several projects
• 17:24
  because we just enjoy working together and you know, what to
• 17:27
  expect. But yeah, could you speak to
• 17:32
  that? Like maybe like things that are
• 17:37
  red flags, I guess. Maybe like things that.
• 17:39
  Warn you off for me, I would say in terms of what makes really
• 17:43
  good sort of like Unity in work, it's chemistry, not conformity.
• 17:54
  I think with me and Fred work in two very different ways.
• 17:59
  For example, like obviously like we work together in Planet
• 18:02
  Theater when he brought me in for When You Die.
• 18:06
  We had the chemistry. Like for example, me and Fred
• 18:09
  have known each other for years. I mean, we've known each other
• 18:12
  since since we went to college together, but we had went our
• 18:16
  own separate ways in our lives. I went to drama school, we went
• 18:18
  to university, we went separate ways and he contact me back to
• 18:23
  play theatre and we just got along together.
• 18:28
  Now, when we got into the rehearsal space, I we had the
• 18:34
  chemistry together. We had that.
• 18:35
  We know what makes each other tick, but we weren't afraid to
• 18:40
  push each other's buttons for the sake of being again with.
• 18:46
  I don't know why we're going back to it.
• 18:47
  The politeness, you know, like if I, if I disagree with what
• 18:52
  Fred is saying for something, I don't have this anxiety to tell
• 18:59
  him that I think what I was saying is ridiculous, you know,
• 19:03
  But it, it's having the, it's having the, the power to say
• 19:09
  that and also having that underlying respect to know that
• 19:15
  like what I may say may sound, you know, extreme at its point,
• 19:20
  but it's, it comes with a level of respect.
• 19:24
  Like I would not be saying it in such an emotional way if I
• 19:29
  didn't respect you enough to say it, you know, like, I think
• 19:32
  that's for me, that's where it is.
• 19:34
  It's like as soon as you build those connections with people
• 19:37
  and you can be genuinely, truly honest in that workspace,
• 19:41
  there's nothing you can't do. Yeah, yeah, I think a lot of the
• 19:45
  time it comes down to understanding that you're not
• 19:50
  criticizing. Like, I don't know, people.
• 19:52
  People do take a lot personally and I never really get it
• 19:55
  because it's it's work. I mean, obviously there are
• 19:58
  going to be instances when someone's just a bit of an arse
• 20:00
  and they're just trying to get at you, but I think that's rare.
• 20:04
  Like one thing I've discovered about acting is that most people
• 20:08
  are pretty like, hey, we're in this together kind of vibes
• 20:11
  like. Trying to get better, trying to
• 20:13
  look out for each other. Like that's the vibe I see
• 20:16
  generally. And whenever you see someone
• 20:18
  that's a bit of an egotist, like it's just kind of awkward
• 20:22
  really. Everyone just kind of looks like
• 20:23
  a bit of a twat. Yeah, I I saw, I saw it on on a,
• 20:28
  on an audition for a film one time that we all went out to
• 20:33
  somewhere in Greater Manchester. Took fucking forever to get
• 20:36
  there and we're all waiting and everyone befriended each other.
• 20:40
  Still have contacts. I got, I got a job through one
• 20:43
  of the people like, you know, it's, it was cool, cool people,
• 20:46
  right? Everyone's chatting, having a
• 20:47
  good time. And then there's this one guy
• 20:49
  who's just like who too important to fucking introduce
• 20:54
  myself to you guys. And it's like, how do you not
• 20:56
  see how much of A twat you look like?
• 21:00
  How do you not? If I could put this on camera
• 21:04
  right now, I'd make millions. Sorry my cat had an opinion on
• 21:12
  that. What I don't know what?
• 21:14
  He's like, I hate those people. No, they are those people.
• 21:20
  They're trying to defend themselves.
• 21:22
  That's what it is. I mean, I don't know, like, have
• 21:25
  you come across that a lot in the theater world?
• 21:29
  I think in auditions, yeah. Really.
• 21:32
  Yeah. In auditions, we've had a few
• 21:34
  people. We're not going to name any
• 21:36
  names because. No names?
• 21:38
  No. No.
• 21:38
  No, no, no, no. No, no.
• 21:41
  No, there's one guy, there's one small guy called Ryan Reynolds
• 21:43
  wants an audition. Now see, that's interesting.
• 21:47
  Though that it's auditions because yeah, you know,
• 21:50
  auditions are essentially our version of a of a job interview,
• 21:53
  you know, and really it's not just oh hey, am I good enough
• 21:58
  for this play? It's can we work together?
• 22:00
  Do you have the right energy? Because with the theatre show,
• 22:03
  obviously you're going to be doing it for like a, you know,
• 22:06
  maybe it's a three month round, a six month round, you're doing
• 22:08
  it for a while. So you're going to be with these
• 22:11
  people all the time. So why wouldn't you want to win
• 22:15
  someone over like? I think it's because like the
• 22:21
  sort of the industry promotes this idea of like showing your
• 22:25
  best self. And I think a lot of people can
• 22:28
  mistake that as showing yourself as the best.
• 22:34
  It's like people will come in and they'll create this facade
• 22:38
  if they are like as dumb, just like the perfect human.
• 22:41
  It's like also I do acting. So it's like, you know, it's
• 22:47
  like. Hi, I'm an asshole, please put
• 22:52
  me in your theatre. Yeah.
• 22:55
  I'm I'm fucking dickhead like you should.
• 22:57
  Definitely work with. I will make.
• 23:01
  Your life a misery, so you should definitely put me in your
• 23:03
  play. Exactly.
• 23:05
  But people see the idea was perfect.
• 23:07
  It's like, oh, like I don't need you guys, you need me.
• 23:12
  Yeah, What the fuck? What are you talking about?
• 23:14
  Yeah. There's always something you can
• 23:17
  learn, even if you've done something like 1,000,000 * a.
• 23:21
  100% like every. Time I've set foot on on on a
• 23:25
  set, right? Even if I've worked with people
• 23:27
  a million times, I shut my mouth until I know kind of what's
• 23:31
  going on. And then if I have an idea, I'm
• 23:34
  like, well, what if we would try this?
• 23:36
  Or if I have a concern, I'll raise the concern.
• 23:38
  But then if say, like the director disagrees, it's like,
• 23:41
  OK, and you just shut up and do it, you know?
• 23:44
  Like, yeah, yeah. I don't, I don't understand
• 23:47
  that, like because I know what you mean.
• 23:49
  Like I've seen that in real life and it's like.
• 23:53
  I think it's also because, like in our auditions, we always make
• 23:56
  sure to give some kind of direction, even if that
• 23:59
  direction is like got nothing to do with the actual piece.
• 24:02
  Like they just nailed it and we're like, right, let's give us
• 24:05
  some direction to see how they take it.
• 24:06
  And like you can just see like sometimes someone will do a
• 24:09
  great audition and then be like, OK, can you try it like this?
• 24:13
  And then we'll go, I don't know why I try it like that.
• 24:17
  And it's like, come on, man. Like play the game.
• 24:21
  You know, I play the game like, like, you know, when you go into
• 24:24
  an audition, they might they might ask you to do some weird
• 24:26
  shit. I mean, I think David once gave
• 24:29
  like a really crazy note in an audition kind of what it was
• 24:32
  like. It was it was something like
• 24:33
  just just be a wolf, just be a wolf in this one.
• 24:36
  And it was just a test them just to see.
• 24:38
  No, it was basically. I'll give you the context for
• 24:41
  that. Yeah, please, because I can't
• 24:42
  remember it. I'll.
• 24:43
  Give you the contract for that. So I was watching this person
• 24:47
  perform and I was, I was classically trained and I
• 24:51
  spotted they were using animal studies, or at least I thought
• 24:55
  they were. Oh, Oh no.
• 24:59
  And they, they, they finished doing this, this, this
• 25:04
  monologue. And I turned to Fred and I'm
• 25:07
  like, I've got this. I'm thinking, and I turned to it
• 25:15
  and I said, oh God, it was really great.
• 25:18
  It was really sort of like it was, I really like the sort of
• 25:22
  pack work you were doing. Obviously I've seen like, like
• 25:27
  I've thought you've like probably also classically
• 25:30
  trained. You've probably looked at animal
• 25:32
  studies and that sort of vibe. I'm like, I realize all the pack
• 25:36
  work you're doing. I really like the sort of.
• 25:38
  They were like, what's like, say that again?
• 25:41
  I was like. Can you, can you just try it a
• 25:43
  bit more sort of like growly nasally, bit more bit more wolfy
• 25:49
  like a bit more like and they look at me like I've just told
• 25:52
  them to shoot their parents like I'm like.
• 25:54
  But I remember, I remember turning to David and just being
• 25:57
  like. What?
• 25:58
  The fuck are you talking about? Just to be fair, there's a,
• 26:03
  there is always an element of like, if you told me to do that,
• 26:06
  I would what? And then and then because,
• 26:10
  because, no, because you'd be like, are you fucking with me?
• 26:12
  And then it'd be like, no, no, no, like serious.
• 26:14
  And then I would probably like, I'd laugh out a bit and then I'd
• 26:18
  probably give it a go, to be honest.
• 26:20
  Like just. Fuck it, you know.
• 26:22
  I mean, to be fair, I'll, I'll be honest with you, most of the
• 26:25
  direction I give in auditions is pretty bullshit.
• 26:29
  Like it is pretty like it's because it is.
• 26:32
  It's like, let's be honest, the stuff that we're asking you to
• 26:34
  do has no impact on the physical audition you're doing.
• 26:39
  What we're doing is going, all right, let's see how we work
• 26:41
  together. I'm going to offer you something
• 26:43
  and just see, like for me, I'm very old fashioned in the sense
• 26:49
  that I think an actor's job is to give ideas and a director's
• 26:54
  job is to mold them. Interesting.
• 26:57
  An actor, just like they need to come into a room and they just
• 27:00
  need to offer things and the director will see those offers
• 27:04
  and then go, OK, let's run with it.
• 27:08
  I don't think it's the job of the director to give the actor
• 27:13
  ideas or to tell the director to tell the actor what to do.
• 27:16
  I also don't think it's the job of an actor to have his like
• 27:20
  vision of the piece in his head. I think he just comes into the
• 27:24
  room. You offer stuff, you play around
• 27:26
  with ideas and the director goes, OK, let's let's try this.
• 27:29
  So most of the time in an audition, what I'm looking for
• 27:35
  is people who come in, come into the room with a really strong
• 27:39
  idea. And then when I throw a spanner
• 27:42
  in the works and I make that first idea null and void, how
• 27:47
  they react to that and how they have to change up to still
• 27:50
  promote what they want to promote?
• 27:52
  Yeah, I mean, I, I get, I get the, the the concept, the
• 27:54
  concept is, is to kind of get someone out of their comfort
• 27:57
  zone to test them. Yeah, as you say, like, OK, if I
• 28:01
  give you something pretty, because it's not, it wouldn't be
• 28:04
  easy, for example, to to imitate a wolf and and make it
• 28:07
  convincing as well. Anyone could go.
• 28:10
  But like, can you like do I buy you as the wolf, the energy of
• 28:14
  the wolf? Like, you know what I mean?
• 28:17
  And like, I think a lot of that would be you mentioned an animal
• 28:20
  study. So like I imagine in that
• 28:22
  there's probably a lot of study on on like movement and, and
• 28:26
  pacing and breathing. And because when I think of like
• 28:29
  a wolf, it's it's quite it's quite a calm animal that only
• 28:34
  gets savage when it's in a pack and it's, you know, organized.
• 28:38
  But like generally it's, it's quiet.
• 28:40
  It's, you know, stalking its prey.
• 28:43
  It's slow, methodical you. Know yeah, exactly.
• 28:46
  So that like I mean thank you Fred for such an awful example
• 28:51
  of my sort It's a good example but yeah no, I love I and I
• 28:58
  hardly abuse it myself. It's just something that isn't
• 29:00
  compatible with me. It's not a system that I, I
• 29:04
  subscribe to but I think it's really great in in the rehearsal
• 29:07
  room. But yeah I love it, man.
• 29:10
  It's so ridiculous and so stupid, but it's sort of like
• 29:14
  you take the aspects of things that work for you.
• 29:18
  It's like like what you're saying, it's like you can't,
• 29:21
  anyone can go like raw and snarl.
• 29:24
  But it's like I said, it's the ideas of like, how do you take
• 29:27
  the ideas of being methodical and sort of having this sort of
• 29:32
  like constant constantly being stalked and sort of kind of
• 29:39
  something I did in drama school about animal studies and things
• 29:43
  like that. It's like being sort of prey and
• 29:48
  predator animal. And it's sort of the idea that
• 29:50
  wolves, wolves look at you, it's like, and prey animals look
• 29:55
  around them. So it's like the like things you
• 29:59
  can take of like that. And it's like, if you're
• 30:01
  obviously, I'm never going to ask someone to like be an animal
• 30:05
  because it's it's. You know, no, but I, I think
• 30:08
  there's a point. Well, there's a lot of, there's
• 30:10
  a lot you can take away from it. Yeah.
• 30:12
  Like, for some reason, like I'm just thinking of professional
• 30:14
  wrestling right now that there's two, there's two wrestlers,
• 30:18
  Randy Orton and Stone Cold Steve Austin.
• 30:21
  So for those who don't know who that is, Austin was the biggest
• 30:25
  wrestler ever. Orton's, Yeah, been around for
• 30:27
  the last 25 years. Anyway, both of those guys were
• 30:32
  associated with an animal. So Stone Cold Steve Austin was
• 30:35
  associated with the rattlesnake. And the whole point of it was,
• 30:40
  you know, he could bite you at any time.
• 30:42
  He could stun you at any time. You never know.
• 30:44
  He's unpredictable. And Randy Orton's the same, but
• 30:47
  he went with the Viper and it's but it was, I don't know, like
• 30:52
  when you look at how they moved in the ring and how they would
• 30:55
  talk and before they were going to do something, Austin, you
• 31:00
  knew it was coming. You could you could see it and
• 31:03
  it was maybe more vicious. Whereas with Randy Orton it was
• 31:09
  it was slower and almost a bit more.
• 31:12
  I wouldn't be surprised if those guys got got animal like
• 31:17
  training. Maybe.
• 31:18
  I wouldn't be. Surprised, but when you when you
• 31:20
  watch them at their best, you really kind of do buy them as
• 31:25
  that animal. I know it sounds crazy, but like
• 31:27
  it's, I don't know, there's something to it, yeah.
• 31:29
  I get it and. And, and I think what you were
• 31:31
  saying before, like you take these elements like, OK, I want
• 31:35
  this character to be methodical. I want them to be a calculated
• 31:39
  villain. Like I love playing villains.
• 31:41
  I adore playing villains. And, and what I tend to do is
• 31:44
  focus a lot on how I voice the character pacing in particular.
• 31:50
  If I want to kind of create a bit of dread, I'll slow my
• 31:54
  pacing down a lot more and kind of make it a bit more
• 31:59
  unpredictable in that sense, you know, because everyone just
• 32:02
  always goes for the like the really obvious shit.
• 32:05
  And I just think, you know, if you want someone to believe this
• 32:09
  person's really evil, it kind of comes down more to creating a
• 32:15
  character that doesn't act in the standard way a person or the
• 32:19
  standard, standard way a person would react or how you expect
• 32:25
  someone to react. Maybe, yeah.
• 32:27
  The best villains don't realize they are villains.
• 32:29
  They think that they're good guys, you know?
• 32:31
  Yeah. I mean, that's the.
• 32:32
  Classic. That's what makes them so messed
• 32:34
  up. When you look at the best like
• 32:35
  movie villains, you're like Christoph Wolfson and glorious
• 32:39
  bastards, you know, Josh Rowland and Sanos and all stuff.
• 32:42
  And they truly believe what they're doing is the right thing
• 32:46
  to do, you know? And it has that air of like it
• 32:48
  makes you almost go wait, are they right?
• 32:51
  And that makes it so much more villainous when you re when you
• 32:55
  then remember what their goal is.
• 32:57
  Their goal is fucking genocide. Part of my French, you know,
• 33:00
  their goal is genocide. And it's like, but that the way
• 33:03
  they're speaking and like how like righteous they sound makes
• 33:07
  it feel like, well, maybe they are right, you know.
• 33:10
  And like, that's why every time that, you know, I mean, we've
• 33:13
  never really had like a villain in our plays yet really.
• 33:16
  But like, every time I've been called to direct a different
• 33:19
  show, there's been a villain in it.
• 33:21
  I've always turned to him saying stop playing the villain.
• 33:23
  You know, the script does enough for, you know it to be a
• 33:27
  villain. You know, you need to focus on
• 33:30
  the villain feeling normal, almost normal.
• 33:33
  And like this, it makes it much more creepy and disgusting in
• 33:35
  that way. It's also just like how how
• 33:39
  people act like I never had formal training right?
• 33:42
  But one thing I learned pretty quickly is I don't know how this
• 33:46
  sounds, but to stop acting they say don't act react.
• 33:53
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a big one.
• 33:55
  Yeah, but like more more. Especially the camera.
• 33:58
  Right, but, but like, OK, you want your, your character to be
• 34:03
  disturbed. So you need to get your, your
• 34:06
  mindset that you need to be disturbed.
• 34:09
  You need to kind of get tap into that emotion somehow and live
• 34:13
  within it and then react to the other character and how they're
• 34:17
  reacting to you and, and use them as as your partner in in
• 34:20
  that scenario. There's like a darkness.
• 34:22
  I suppose that's, I mean, that's just the way I see it anyway,
• 34:24
  but. Yeah, there's this amazing book
• 34:26
  called The Actor and the Target, and one of the things it says in
• 34:29
  it is I think therefore I am. I am therefore I act and that
• 34:35
  was such a really interesting is that it starts talking about
• 34:37
  how, you know, in every day you're kind of acting, you know,
• 34:41
  you know, like you, you'll see one friend group and then you'll
• 34:42
  see a different group. You're going to act differently,
• 34:44
  you know, whether it's, you know, you're holding your tongue
• 34:46
  on certain jokes or if it's, you know, you're a bit more
• 34:49
  excitable than others. I know, for example, like I've
• 34:52
  got my what I call cheese board friends, the ones that I go to
• 34:56
  talk about classy things about and then, you know, and then
• 34:58
  I've got my my quaver friends who are like my friends that I
• 35:02
  go to and have a bit fun with. You know, that's not to say
• 35:05
  what's. Your friend Chris?
• 35:08
  Mine, Fred. Which one am I in?
• 35:10
  To say that neither of them are better.
• 35:15
  I mean, like you have the friends that you go to to talk
• 35:17
  about like Fine Arts and literature and all, and
• 35:20
  sometimes you just want to talk about, you know, who's going to
• 35:23
  win, the Transformers or Godzilla, you know?
• 35:26
  And like the cheese board friends might turn around and
• 35:28
  go, well, that's never going to happen.
• 35:31
  And it's like, oh, I missed my quaver friends, you know, and
• 35:35
  like. I love if you went with the
• 35:36
  cheese boyfriends and then they actually just turned out to be
• 35:38
  experts on Godzilla, actually. In Godzilla.
• 35:44
  XYZ 15. Installments Bumblebee, who once
• 35:49
  did this Axe. But yeah, but like, so you you
• 35:54
  will always be putting on a different mask with a different,
• 35:57
  you know, friend groups. The greatest friends you have
• 36:00
  are the ones where you can take the mask off.
• 36:02
  You know, so just living life is to be an actor.
• 36:08
  Therefore you just need to find, you know, OK, what makes me
• 36:12
  different in these different friend groups?
• 36:15
  And it's like a thing of like, OK, well, now I know how to act
• 36:17
  without acting. You know what I mean?
• 36:20
  It's it's an amazing book. The actor in the target, It's
• 36:22
  got some amazing tips that just really helped me find my way as
• 36:26
  a director. Yeah.
• 36:28
  It's. It's such a.
• 36:29
  Beautiful book. Shakespeare quote, The world's a
• 36:32
  stage. I remember the first time I
• 36:33
  heard that and I was like, oh, what does that mean?
• 36:35
  And then as you become an adult, you realise like, oh, everyone's
• 36:39
  acting like all the fucking time.
• 36:42
  Yeah, like. Anyone who says they can't act,
• 36:43
  everyone can act. Everyone's doing it 24/7.
• 36:46
  Do you know what I mean? It's just some people are better
• 36:49
  at it than others, you know? Yeah, yeah, rabbits, yeah.
• 36:54
  Yeah, I love that quote. I love the second-half of it,
• 36:57
  which is all the stage and us merely players.
• 37:01
  Yeah, he doesn't call people. Shakespeare doesn't call people
• 37:03
  actors for for a good reason. But that also makes it sound
• 37:10
  like like we're pawns in the game as well.
• 37:12
  Like we. Are, yeah.
• 37:14
  Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean.
• 37:14
  So just. Players, we're nothing more.
• 37:17
  So one of the sort of styles of acting that I subscribe to and,
• 37:20
  and one that I, I really try and push for flat pack is the joy of
• 37:25
  acting like the fun of it all. So, you know, I explained to
• 37:32
  people that are like, it's, it's everything should start from
• 37:35
  joy. Like even when you're like your
• 37:38
  character is super depressed and you know, crying and weeping,
• 37:41
  you should be, you should be having fun doing that.
• 37:44
  And also we love to see actors who are just like chewing the
• 37:50
  scenery, you know, I mean, who do we love?
• 37:52
  We love like, what Willem Dafoe, you know, Robert Pattinson,
• 37:58
  actors that sort of go into a thing and just like, absolutely
• 38:02
  just chew the scenery. And we love it.
• 38:04
  Yeah. And you know, it's like, how
• 38:06
  many times do you see an actor and they're just doing the same
• 38:10
  stuff? And it's like how, how
• 38:14
  interested even that. And it's like, oh, you're just,
• 38:18
  you're like, you're doing this for work.
• 38:20
  You're like, you're like, you're working right now.
• 38:22
  You know you're not having fun. You're just, I got into acting
• 38:25
  because I looked at like, the top actors, if you like, and I
• 38:28
  was like, I know I can act better than that.
• 38:31
  Yeah, I don't. And it's, it's not even like,
• 38:35
  like I see it as, yeah, as an art form, a craft, you know, And
• 38:39
  I think like the very best see it the same way as well.
• 38:41
  Even if they're multimillionaires, they're doing
• 38:43
  it for the love of the game because of what it brings, the
• 38:47
  magic of bringing a character to life and making it convincing.
• 38:50
  And. And as you say, like, like, how
• 38:52
  much can we use from this scene to.
• 38:55
  To really. Like like I think of like the.
• 38:58
  Film saw the first instalment. Oh yeah, yeah, it's just two
• 39:01
  guys in a fucking. Bathroom.
• 39:03
  Yeah, the entire movie, but it's amazing like how they they
• 39:08
  managed to make that work and and I'm like.
• 39:12
  You can make anything. Work, if you've got that kind of
• 39:15
  dedication to the craft and the scene and and you know, I mean,
• 39:21
  like as you say, there are a lot of people that just see it as
• 39:23
  work and I, I suppose, yeah, like some people, you know, you
• 39:27
  could just it's a job, you got to pay the bills, but I just
• 39:29
  think if you've gotten into that as a just as a job, like it's
• 39:37
  kind. Of sad it's it's almost like
• 39:38
  the. Love of it has died because
• 39:41
  can't. Remember, there was a big.
• 39:43
  Actor, I can't remember who it was.
• 39:47
  It might have been Christoph Waltz, I can't remember.
• 39:49
  And he, he was in an interview, he was talking about sort of,
• 39:53
  you know, it's like, what's it like being on set on all, you
• 39:56
  know, every day and being able to work in all these amazing
• 39:58
  films? He's like, look, I'm just paying
• 40:00
  the bills. How many people would keep?
• 40:07
  Kill. Steal.
• 40:08
  Murder. To be in the position you're in,
• 40:11
  how many thousands, if not millions of other actors want to
• 40:16
  be in the same place surprises me about Christopher Waltz as
• 40:19
  well, because. I looked up his life story
• 40:22
  recently and he worked for like decades and decades and decades
• 40:26
  to get to the point where he was given a shot by Tarantino.
• 40:32
  Before that, his career could have been described as
• 40:34
  fledgling, like just not happening.
• 40:38
  And but it seems like now he's. He's worked so well.
• 40:41
  Like in the full interview, he explained that he sort of like
• 40:44
  he worked so hard to get there right?
• 40:48
  That like, it killed it for him. Yeah.
• 40:52
  I think if you feel that way. It's time to walk away, come
• 40:56
  back, Yeah, and rediscover, do you know what I mean?
• 41:00
  And he's at, he's at a point where he's.
• 41:01
  Earned enough money he can just he could take a year out.
• 41:05
  You should do because then you realise like what?
• 41:08
  You what you're missing and then also you don't take it for
• 41:12
  granted. Yeah.
• 41:13
  But I can say this in the last year I've had some some pretty
• 41:16
  hard times, right. And it got to the.
• 41:19
  Point where? Even like the basic things we're
• 41:23
  now missing. And instead of like feeling
• 41:26
  sorry for myself or feeling bad, it just taught me this, this
• 41:29
  life lesson about gratitude. Like, you know.
• 41:33
  Anytime you. Take things for granted, even
• 41:36
  the basics. When that gets taken away from
• 41:38
  you, all you can think about is that one thing.
• 41:41
  But it then made me think about all of the things that I get
• 41:44
  upset about, like oh, creative stuff not working out, you know,
• 41:47
  music, acting, everything. It's, it's just stagnating.
• 41:51
  Every day I try is a win. Every day I try is it's, it's
• 41:55
  persisting in the, in the pursuance of that dream.
• 41:58
  And, and, you know, I get to decide if it lives or dies.
• 42:01
  You know, no one has control over that except for me.
• 42:05
  And I realized I was putting too much into trying to win other
• 42:09
  people over rather than, you know, being grateful.
• 42:13
  For the opportunity to try. Yeah, you know, I mean, I, I
• 42:17
  feel like I'm in a very similar. Situation right now and I was
• 42:19
  saying this to to to to David and to Felix, our other, you
• 42:22
  know, creative head. I was saying, like, you know,
• 42:25
  I've been writing all these projects, which I love writing.
• 42:29
  It's one of my many joys. I mean, I see it almost like my
• 42:32
  therapy. You look at, back at, like, the
• 42:34
  first show I ever did was all about alcoholism.
• 42:37
  At the time, I was an alcoholic. Now I'm two years sober.
• 42:39
  You know, it's clearly fixing something, you know?
• 42:42
  Yeah. And then when I did When You
• 42:44
  Die, I was going through some grief, and my granddad had just
• 42:47
  passed away. I lost my childhood dog.
• 42:50
  So I was going through quite a lot of stuff there.
• 42:52
  And so I wrote, you know, a story about grief, but I've been
• 42:55
  doing so much writing recently now, and the only thing I can
• 42:59
  think about now is like, God, I just want to get back on stage.
• 43:02
  You know, I just want to get back acting again.
• 43:05
  And, you know, we've got plans for the next show for it to be
• 43:08
  me and, you know, my best friend and Co creative head Felix, you
• 43:12
  know, acting together. It just fills me this, this joy
• 43:17
  to be like, I can go back on stage and I cannot wait, you
• 43:20
  know, because writing is gorgeous and brilliant and like
• 43:25
  making your own world is fantastic, but like being able
• 43:29
  to create those worlds for people is like so much like it
• 43:36
  gives you this almost. Adrenaline.
• 43:38
  And like this amazing rush and then when they people come off
• 43:41
  stage and when you come off stage and people will be like,
• 43:42
  you were so amazing and that it's just, it fills you so much
• 43:45
  more pride and joy. You know what I mean?
• 43:48
  It's this lovely sense of like completion, you know, I know
• 43:53
  exactly what you mean, like. I I live for performance and you
• 43:59
  know, I miss it when I'm not doing it.
• 44:00
  Like I haven't played on stage musically since like September
• 44:03
  last year. Oh, I did like a quick open mic
• 44:08
  in December, but it wasn't really the same.
• 44:12
  And I've, I've not done a film, yeah since since December.
• 44:16
  But every time I do it, it's like I missed this.
• 44:20
  Like, yeah, I need some. I need some now.
• 44:22
  I'm like, I'd live for this. This is what it's like.
• 44:25
  Like I like even when it goes wrong, it's it's, oh, I don't
• 44:29
  care. It's brilliant.
• 44:32
  Oh. Yeah, definitely.
• 44:35
  I mean, there's this kind of like partial part of me that's
• 44:39
  like not, not dreading, but. Like has this feeling.
• 44:42
  Of like, have I lost it? You know, I feel like Atkins
• 44:45
  were the only careers where you have to keep proving to yourself
• 44:48
  and to others that you can still do it.
• 44:50
  You know, like, I mean, if you were to go into like Subway, you
• 44:54
  wouldn't be like, can you make a sandwich still?
• 44:57
  Like it's been 2 years since you made a sandwich.
• 44:58
  Can you still make it like you You?
• 45:02
  Don't have to go with any other career.
• 45:03
  But like with with acting, you even have that self doubt of
• 45:07
  like can I still do it? Like if I go on stage now, like
• 45:11
  right this second, would I still be able to do it?
• 45:13
  And then the second year on stage, those worries melt away
• 45:16
  and you're like, yeah, of course I can still do it.
• 45:18
  You know, I've not just lost everything.
• 45:20
  That's how it works. I noticed with.
• 45:23
  With my acting and my music, like writing and stuff, yeah.
• 45:26
  That actually being away from from it, I mean.
• 45:31
  The the best way you can. Learn and and become a better
• 45:34
  writer Is is to live life. Amen.
• 45:37
  Experience here. Amen.
• 45:38
  And then that. Will inevitably inform, for
• 45:41
  example, there's no point writing about heartbreak if
• 45:44
  you've never had your heart broken.
• 45:46
  You know, once you have your heart broken, it's easy.
• 45:48
  You just, you know, not not the the tricky part is is the medium
• 45:52
  like figuring out how to express yourself.
• 45:54
  But as far as like the feeling itself, you remember how it
• 45:57
  feels because it's right there, it's fresh, it's real.
• 46:00
  It's it's and I always say that to people like write about what
• 46:04
  you know, and, and, and make it as real and as authentic as
• 46:09
  possible. And then that ultimately will be
• 46:11
  the relatable thing. The thing that, you know, when
• 46:13
  people come and see a show that they are most moved by is, is
• 46:18
  the real raw emotions that are on display.
• 46:21
  You know? Yeah, I mean to kind of go back
• 46:23
  to the. Whole anyone?
• 46:24
  Can act thing what was really cool for us is so as a writer I
• 46:29
  have obviously, you know, writers that I based my work off
• 46:32
  of are like take inspiration from and a big one is a writer
• 46:35
  named Darren Shannon who he writes like stories that are
• 46:41
  aimed for like younger children. But when you read them, you're
• 46:44
  like, Oh my gosh, like, this is so brutal and messed up.
• 46:47
  Like, how is it? Could this be for children and
• 46:49
  get away with murder with? Yeah.
• 46:51
  Oh yeah. Yeah, I remember the Darren.
• 46:53
  Show books they would. Yeah, written in the 2000s and.
• 46:56
  Yeah. Yeah, knew someone who was
• 46:58
  obsessed with them. Oh God, yeah, literally, I live.
• 47:01
  Literally have an entire hardback copy of his work.
• 47:05
  So like first prints and like some of them signed as well.
• 47:09
  But yeah, it was, I actually got to meet him and I got to like at
• 47:12
  a book signing and I was just telling him about, you know, how
• 47:16
  he's been an inspiration or stuff.
• 47:18
  And he, I gave him my e-mail for the Flatback Theatre company.
• 47:22
  And then he actually sent an e-mail basically just saying,
• 47:25
  you know, I hope everything goes well.
• 47:27
  And because I just tell him how obviously how much of an
• 47:30
  inspiration he was. And just getting that e-mail
• 47:32
  gave me like so much more like inspiration to keep going.
• 47:36
  And then I was like, I was like, no, I'm going to be a bit
• 47:39
  cheeky. We have this like radio draw,
• 47:42
  like the radio bit where between scenes you hear a radio host
• 47:46
  interviewing different people. And we wanted to get a bunch of
• 47:49
  cameos and I was like, do you want to?
• 47:52
  Do a cameo where you'd. Like, do the voice of a farmer.
• 47:54
  And he was like, oh, I'm not sure.
• 47:56
  I'm not really an actor. Not stuff.
• 47:57
  And I was like, yeah, give it a try.
• 47:59
  You know, if if you know, if you don't love it, you don't love
• 48:02
  it. And he sent this like this audio
• 48:05
  file and I was like, ready to guide.
• 48:07
  And you'll go, oh, gosh, it's not going to be good.
• 48:09
  How am I going to tell my childhood hero that, you know,
• 48:10
  it's not going to be good? And I listened to it and I went,
• 48:13
  holy shit, that that was amazing.
• 48:16
  It was the honestly. And what was so great about it
• 48:19
  is you could just hear like him just enjoying doing it.
• 48:23
  Do you know what I mean? Like he was just there go like,
• 48:25
  yeah. And I was doing this and this
• 48:27
  and like, he put on this voice and I was like, Oh my gosh, this
• 48:30
  is amazing. I'm like, you can just tell.
• 48:32
  He's been reading stories to people for so long that he knows
• 48:35
  how to do the voices now. And like, Oh, it was amazing.
• 48:38
  And instantly at the text of Felix and text David be like,
• 48:42
  this is so good. You're listening to this.
• 48:44
  And then I sent it to my brother as well.
• 48:46
  He's also a massive fan of of Darren Chan And he was like, he
• 48:50
  actually responded. That's amazing.
• 48:52
  And like, Oh, it just it gave me so much like just inspiration to
• 48:57
  keep going and like that feeling of even someone like Darren
• 49:01
  Sharon being able to be like an amazing performer.
• 49:03
  He's just such a cool aspect knowing that, you know, anyone
• 49:07
  can act as long as they have that enjoyment of it, you know,
• 49:10
  as long as they can enjoy it. And really just like you're like
• 49:13
  David was saying, just go on stage and just have fun with it.
• 49:17
  That's all you need really. That and the foot ton of
• 49:20
  classical training. You know, crazy when you do.
• 49:23
  This and then you and then you. Get recognized by people who are
• 49:27
  already successful. I remember there's two things
• 49:32
  that stick out in my mind. I had a a brief came here in
• 49:36
  Hollyoaks a couple of years ago and I was on the stage with on
• 49:42
  stage. It's because we talk about Thea.
• 49:45
  Yeah, yeah. We were on set.
• 49:48
  There we go. And I was with the actor who
• 49:51
  plays John Paul, and it's kind of surreal because I'd like, I
• 49:54
  grew up watching this guy, this is weird.
• 49:56
  And he was lovely, really nice. Everyone there, sweethearts, all
• 49:59
  of them. He checked out my stuff online
• 50:03
  and he started. I was telling everyone that I
• 50:05
  was a really good voice actor and I was like.
• 50:09
  I was like, wow, thank you, Yeah.
• 50:12
  And then? Like.
• 50:13
  Around the same time or a year later, I had on the 250th
• 50:18
  episode of my show, there was a guy, a famous voice actor called
• 50:22
  John Bailey, who's like worked with Marvel.
• 50:27
  He was the the voice of Honest Trailers.
• 50:31
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. A few other things.
• 50:33
  And. He agreed to do the show and I I
• 50:36
  did. I was saying was you.
• 50:37
  I was a bit cheeky. I was like, hey, could you do
• 50:41
  like I have a little script for the intro and it's kind of you
• 50:45
  know, but it was like mocking me in the start, his style.
• 50:48
  And I was like, here's like a little bit of an idea.
• 50:51
  Could you say this? And then just kind of riff a bit
• 50:55
  and and he did it. I like I've got it and it's and
• 50:59
  it was surreal. Because it's like.
• 51:01
  Here's this voice I've I've heard in like cinema and on my
• 51:04
  favorite YouTube channels growing up and he's doing the.
• 51:08
  Fucking intro to my. Show.
• 51:09
  What the hell? What and the biggest thing the.
• 51:14
  Reason I brought this up is because we were going back and
• 51:18
  forth for talking about voice acting and he described me as a
• 51:22
  peer and he said voice actors like us.
• 51:25
  And I was like, like us. Like I was thinking, yeah, yeah,
• 51:29
  I've been in the gate. I mean, I've been doing it a
• 51:31
  while now about six years, but he's been like doing it 20 plus
• 51:34
  years. And then I realized, like, yeah,
• 51:37
  I've had my own little, you know, it's no way comparable.
• 51:40
  But like I've, I've been doing it a long time.
• 51:44
  And you, you, you do start to over time, you, you obviously
• 51:50
  you get better, right? Like podcasting.
• 51:52
  I've been doing this six years now and thank you so much.
• 51:56
  I appreciate that guys, but you know there.
• 52:00
  Was a time when I felt really. Awkward sitting down and talking
• 52:02
  to people and maybe not really knowing like, you know, I was
• 52:05
  like sitting there in my notes, like, what's the next question?
• 52:08
  And then whereas now it's it's, you know, there's a system at
• 52:12
  play. Don't believe me?
• 52:14
  There's a lot of research that goes into this.
• 52:16
  There's a lot of planning, but like if you.
• 52:19
  Find your own style. And the way of interviewing and
• 52:22
  doing these things, then it becomes more natural and you
• 52:26
  kind of learn to take a step back and trust yourself with,
• 52:29
  you know, your skill set and what you do.
• 52:31
  And you stop worrying about like, can I?
• 52:34
  And it's more about what am I going to do?
• 52:38
  Yeah, that's. Something I really.
• 52:41
  Try and live by. I think talent is untrustworthy.
• 52:48
  Interesting. OK.
• 52:50
  Explain I think I think. Everyone has talent to a certain
• 52:54
  degree. But.
• 52:59
  What we rely. On and what?
• 53:01
  We live by is the skills and the toolkits that we have in
• 53:05
  whatever craft it is. We might.
• 53:08
  We might. Have an insane.
• 53:10
  Amount of talent for a specific craft, but.
• 53:14
  It's the skills that we incorporate.
• 53:16
  And talent can fail us the the skills.
• 53:20
  We have. Are meant to catch us when we
• 53:24
  fall. And it's like you were saying,
• 53:29
  it's like you know, you've been doing podcasting and then voice
• 53:33
  work for years and you've built a toolkit for yourself.
• 53:39
  You've built a. System and a structure.
• 53:41
  That works. You know you.
• 53:44
  Found. You found your feet in it all.
• 53:47
  You found your place and you've worked.
• 53:49
  You've worked in it and you've worked for it.
• 53:52
  It's like you might have had a. Talent for it.
• 53:56
  But the skills and the structure and the way that you've built
• 53:59
  what you've built is. Is the reason why why it?
• 54:03
  Works. I mean, it should be commended
• 54:06
  by itself that you've like, you've built this like, and that
• 54:10
  in itself should be congratulated.
• 54:12
  But where, where as as performers, we get our, we get
• 54:17
  our thanks. Is the applause afterwards or
• 54:21
  the little compliments afterwards, all that that bit
• 54:23
  was great. It's like, yeah.
• 54:27
  But there's structure and there's work behind it and
• 54:30
  there's, there's there's time and there's effort that's gone
• 54:33
  into these sort of things. I think I get what you're
• 54:36
  saying. Like talent alone is not enough.
• 54:39
  Essentially, no, no, no. I completely agree like I I
• 54:43
  think. Even if you've been doing this
• 54:45
  like 30 odd years, the minute you stop preparing and you stop
• 54:50
  putting the effort in is you just like, prepare to.
• 54:52
  Yeah, isn't it? You know, like, I mean, I'm an
• 54:54
  awful actor. I mean, it's like I'm awful In
• 54:59
  terms of talent alone. I've got nothing.
• 55:01
  I'm sure that's not true. No.
• 55:03
  OK, Fred. When we met in college.
• 55:09
  When we met in college. How bad was I?
• 55:12
  I mean like comparing. From now yeah you you weren't
• 55:16
  the best comparing from now but like see fair in college I I
• 55:20
  can't remember anyone that was necessarily a great actor you
• 55:24
  know but. Yeah, like you definitely like
• 55:28
  how? Like you can tell that you've
• 55:30
  come up, come around like experienced and learned so much
• 55:34
  more since college. I, I just remember being in
• 55:36
  college and just messing around with one of our friends cameras
• 55:39
  and just making stupid videos, you know, and now, now we've got
• 55:43
  a theatre company and we're messing around with one of our
• 55:45
  friends cameras, making stupid videos to put yeah, cameras
• 55:49
  more. Expensive now, I think it's
• 55:53
  worth if you're looking back. Like like I I was showing a
• 55:57
  friend of mine short films I've done over.
• 56:01
  The years. And we looked at a few ones I've
• 56:03
  done in the last year and then looked at my very first one and
• 56:07
  I was like giggling at how shit my acting was in the first one.
• 56:11
  But then I was like, no, but like, that was my first ever
• 56:15
  time. You know your first.
• 56:17
  It's what we have. Yeah, yeah.
• 56:22
  You know you're not going to win the gold medal.
• 56:24
  In the first try, like you got to, you got to win the bronze
• 56:27
  first, aren't you? Yeah.
• 56:29
  Like that scene in the Matrix where he.
• 56:30
  Like jumps off the building, everything, everyone thinks he's
• 56:33
  going to make the jump and he doesn't.
• 56:35
  And like everyone walks away disappointed and then the guy's
• 56:38
  like you know, nobody makes the 1st jump and it's like but it's
• 56:43
  a good life lesson. Like, of course not like hard
• 56:46
  work and effort is what it's 90% of it.
• 56:50
  But people only really ever look at the results, don't they?
• 56:53
  Like, I always get fiercely judged on the results of what
• 56:58
  I've done. And, and mostly what people will
• 56:59
  say is, oh, well, you're not successful, you're not rich and
• 57:02
  famous, so you're a failure. And I'm like, it's it's.
• 57:06
  Hard to hear. That, but I also understand that
• 57:09
  those people have obviously never tried to do anything in
• 57:13
  their life before because if they had they'd understand like
• 57:17
  just how much you have to sacrifice put in how hard you
• 57:21
  have to work and particularly in the acting in, in the
• 57:25
  entertainment industry, it's really difficult to get
• 57:27
  opportunities. You really have to work for it
• 57:30
  and and come numb to rejection and numb to the thoughts and
• 57:35
  criticisms of other people. Obviously always take it on
• 57:37
  board, but like, you really got to be strong to to try and do
• 57:41
  this. Yeah.
• 57:43
  No, yeah. I mean, it's like.
• 57:46
  It takes a a weird mix of like I'm the best and I'm the worst,
• 57:51
  like you that you need to have to be an actor.
• 57:53
  Do you know what I mean? Like that you've got to be able
• 57:55
  to tell yourself the both of the at the same time in in a weird
• 58:00
  way, like, because if you just tell yourself that you're the
• 58:02
  best, you know, like we said before with the auditions,
• 58:04
  you're going to go in there and you're just going to be way too
• 58:06
  egotistical. But if you just tell yourself
• 58:08
  you're the worst, then nothing's going to happen.
• 58:10
  You know, it seems to have this like nice.
• 58:12
  Little Mix. Like, but at the same time, you
• 58:14
  can't be like, I'm the most medium, like, you know, no one
• 58:18
  wants that. Just yeah, confidence.
• 58:21
  But humility, yeah. 100% I think that sums up well I'm AS.
• 58:28
  Well, and another another reason.
• 58:31
  Why me and and Fred are the opposites?
• 58:37
  I like like Fred would quote. Sort of, you know, like humility
• 58:41
  and passion, strength. And for me it's, it's for me,
• 58:45
  it's pride, envy and greed is what it is.
• 58:50
  It's like. I know what I can do.
• 58:54
  It's like, that's what. This means for me.
• 58:56
  Because that's what drives me, man.
• 58:58
  Like I like. Like you see, like a movie.
• 59:02
  Like Devil Wears Pardo. And you're like study time.
• 59:06
  I could. Vanquish my enemies.
• 59:07
  This. Way it's 100% a Slytherin man.
• 59:10
  Like definitely no, no question about it.
• 59:14
  But it's like a, you know, with, with what you've achieved, are
• 59:18
  you proud of yourself? And that is a hard question.
• 59:23
  You guess so. Yeah, I don't.
• 59:25
  Know I mean I. I'll be honest, I I do look at
• 59:28
  my lack of progress as as being. Yeah, it's been a long time,
• 59:32
  boys. It's been like 7 years.
• 59:34
  Second time doing music. I've got to the point now where
• 59:39
  I don't like seek the validation of others.
• 59:42
  I think that's a dangerous trap we all get down.
• 59:44
  I'm proud of, I'm proud of what I've done.
• 59:46
  I guess I'm proud of that. Yeah, sure.
• 59:48
  How about you? I put, I put the same question
• 59:51
  on to you boys. Like, what are you proud in
• 59:54
  terms of like? Me myself, yes, because.
• 1:00:02
  I mean of. Course, this is the same with
• 1:00:04
  the theatre company, but that's, that's what pushes me more
• 1:00:09
  because I can see what we've achieved in, in, in the time
• 1:00:13
  that we've had and I can see what like which just push
• 1:00:17
  harder, you know, I mean, you know, with myself, like I've, I
• 1:00:24
  went through drama school. I, I graduated last year.
• 1:00:27
  I mean, I've had like the professional work I've done is
• 1:00:30
  like zilch, like I'm not done much.
• 1:00:34
  I've done, you know. Like a couple of indie plays and
• 1:00:37
  short films here and there. Does that make me not as proud
• 1:00:43
  of myself? No, I think and I'm blessed for
• 1:00:46
  the achievements that I've done so far.
• 1:00:48
  Like I'm like the fact I went to got classical training at drama
• 1:00:52
  school is, is something to be like proud of myself, something
• 1:00:55
  of surviving it. The fucking 12 hours a day, six
• 1:00:58
  days a week, you know, like. Just that in itself and.
• 1:01:06
  Yeah, it gets crazy. Sometimes it gets crazy.
• 1:01:09
  But then I look at, say, Flat Pack and I say, like what?
• 1:01:13
  What have we done with no money and no support and nothing at
• 1:01:17
  all? But we filled theaters and like
• 1:01:21
  what? We filled theaters and we've
• 1:01:22
  made performances that have like changed people's lives and
• 1:01:25
  changed people's outlook and in the world, even if I would still
• 1:01:29
  be proud of us if we got no one in the theatre, because either
• 1:01:33
  way, we brought a group of people together to create
• 1:01:36
  beautiful work. What more can we want, man?
• 1:01:40
  Like if it wasn't for the fact that we need money to survive,
• 1:01:43
  that's all I care about. Like, unfortunately, I've got,
• 1:01:47
  I've got rent and bills, so I've got to do other things.
• 1:01:49
  Like I also like work. I work like a Muggle job to try
• 1:01:53
  and, you know, make ends meet. But like, if I didn't have to
• 1:01:56
  pay rent and my bills and I could go and ask the local
• 1:01:59
  farmer to put food on my table, that's what I do.
• 1:02:02
  I just create beautiful work because that's all.
• 1:02:04
  That's all my soul needs. So in in.
• 1:02:07
  In to answer your question. I'm very proud of myself because
• 1:02:10
  I I make beautiful work. How?
• 1:02:13
  About you, Frederick I. Mean I've always.
• 1:02:15
  Struggled with. Like pride and, you know, being
• 1:02:19
  proud, not stuff, you know. So I mean, I'm a Christian, so
• 1:02:22
  like I'm dealing with like sin and like pride, of course is a
• 1:02:26
  sin, but where is the line between pride of and like being
• 1:02:31
  proud of yourself and being proud of what you've achieved?
• 1:02:33
  And pride as in like, you know that again, that ego, it was a
• 1:02:38
  fine. Line, I think, yeah. 100% there
• 1:02:41
  is. So I started flat pack on my
• 1:02:44
  own. Well, I stay on my own.
• 1:02:47
  You know, I had the support of, you know, my amazing, you know,
• 1:02:50
  partner Poppy Kirk and my amazing, you know, very close
• 1:02:54
  best friend Sophie Stewart. So we started that kind of
• 1:02:57
  together, but they were never a part of the company company
• 1:03:00
  wise. It was just me like Soby
• 1:03:02
  Stewart. She was there to be a producer
• 1:03:04
  on the first show. Poppy was just there to help
• 1:03:06
  out, you know, mentally and physically.
• 1:03:08
  I remember I was talking to to Sophie recently and we were
• 1:03:13
  talking about, you know, our struggle is not stuff.
• 1:03:16
  And she's been such an amazing person to help me out with like
• 1:03:19
  mental health and all stuff. And basically she just, she just
• 1:03:23
  told me, look back at like what you've done and like truly
• 1:03:26
  think, did you ever believe you could have done it?
• 1:03:30
  If, if you could go back in time and be like, hey, by the way,
• 1:03:33
  you're going to do a theatre company that's already done like
• 1:03:35
  3 or 4 shows you're planning to do.
• 1:03:37
  What's it five extra ones? You've got, you know, 5 plays
• 1:03:40
  written. You've written entire, you know,
• 1:03:42
  entire shows and all type of stuff.
• 1:03:44
  You're at this point. Would you believe yourself?
• 1:03:47
  And I was like, that's a really good point.
• 1:03:49
  And I never thought about that. And it's also like a very good
• 1:03:51
  friend of mine sounds who is just such an amazing, you know,
• 1:03:56
  person to like bring up your spirits.
• 1:03:58
  He, he, he, he, he has this amazing like aura to like when
• 1:04:01
  you step into the the same room as him, he's like, he, he makes
• 1:04:05
  you have that feel of like, look back at what you've seen and,
• 1:04:07
  and, and just think to yourself, like, we did this.
• 1:04:10
  No one else did this, but we did.
• 1:04:12
  And it's like the amount of times when people come up to me
• 1:04:14
  and be like, how did you do it? How did you start a company?
• 1:04:17
  And I just, I, I can't even tell them how I'm just like, I, I
• 1:04:21
  just did it. I, I just did.
• 1:04:23
  And it, it sounds like I'm being like a, oh, it's super easy.
• 1:04:26
  Just did it. But it's like, no, it's, it's
• 1:04:28
  like, I literally, I just looked at what theatres were available,
• 1:04:32
  you know, paid for the theatre space and I put on a show and I
• 1:04:35
  just wrote the play in free time, you know, like there was
• 1:04:39
  it was, it was hard. It was difficult.
• 1:04:41
  There was a lot of moving pieces that had to happen to make it
• 1:04:44
  happen. But I eventually did it.
• 1:04:48
  I mean, two of my friends came to see it, the first show I ever
• 1:04:52
  did. And they were thinking to
• 1:04:54
  themselves, oh God, it's going to be so bad at what we're going
• 1:04:57
  to say to him after the show. Like he's worked on this for
• 1:05:00
  years. And they watched it and they
• 1:05:02
  were blown away about how good it was.
• 1:05:04
  And then so when they came out, they were like, that was
• 1:05:07
  actually good. And I was like, thank you.
• 1:05:09
  Like, no, no, no, Fred, you understand?
• 1:05:11
  It was actually good. And I was like, OK, no, no,
• 1:05:15
  Fred, thanks for the belief in me, OK.
• 1:05:19
  And no, it was. It was meant to.
• 1:05:20
  Be bad, but it was good and I was like, huh, it was meant to
• 1:05:24
  be bad, but it was good. And I, I've, I've always thought
• 1:05:27
  no, just thinking back on that. So to kind of answer your
• 1:05:32
  question, I struggled to have to be proud of myself a lot, but
• 1:05:37
  I'm so proud of the company and the community that we have made,
• 1:05:41
  you know, and I have to kind of take a bit of pride to be like,
• 1:05:47
  that wasn't me, you know? Like if it weren't for me doing
• 1:05:50
  that, I and in a way I have to have been the catalyst to then
• 1:05:54
  be proud of this company, you know?
• 1:05:58
  But yeah, So yes and no. That's like a good answer.
• 1:06:03
  It all starts with an idea, doesn't it?
• 1:06:05
  I. Mean I remember a few times I've
• 1:06:07
  been asked why did I start the podcast and I said well, you
• 1:06:12
  know, I always. Wanted to do a podcast.
• 1:06:14
  You know, way before podcasting became successful, like I was
• 1:06:18
  listening to podcasts in like the 2000s listen, listen to it
• 1:06:22
  every day on the way to work. And I was like, this is an
• 1:06:24
  interesting medium because, you know, I listen to a bit of radio
• 1:06:27
  as well. And I was like I want to do this
• 1:06:31
  one day and with the idea. A bit and then.
• 1:06:35
  See, when the world shut down, I had a very short lived show with
• 1:06:40
  a few other friends and then it ended abruptly and I was like,
• 1:06:44
  what now? And I was like.
• 1:06:47
  I want to do this. I want to keep doing.
• 1:06:49
  This but how can I do it? It's just me.
• 1:06:52
  So I was like fuck it and started doing this show, didn't
• 1:06:56
  know what it was. And over the years it's kind of
• 1:06:59
  grown into into what it is today.
• 1:07:01
  And it's interesting looking back, you know, right now I have
• 1:07:07
  like a professional microphone here, right?
• 1:07:09
  Yeah. Camera setup.
• 1:07:10
  I started with I can show you the fucking microphone.
• 1:07:15
  Where is it? I still have it I.
• 1:07:19
  Should still have. It I was looking at it the other
• 1:07:20
  day. I realized like people listening
• 1:07:23
  to the show, just like, like lots of shovel.
• 1:07:27
  Shit, it was like a very soft ASMR. There's like me rattling
• 1:07:30
  around even here. Yeah, I hear we can start.
• 1:07:33
  Wrestling around as well we can add to the.
• 1:07:35
  Soundscape. This was my first.
• 1:07:38
  Microphone. What I was going to, I was.
• 1:07:41
  Going to Kyle, Kyle. I don't even know what that
• 1:07:44
  brand is. This is my first microphone
• 1:07:47
  guys. It's a piece of shit.
• 1:07:48
  I bought it in Europe. For like 20.
• 1:07:51
  Dollars or €20 and I was using this for like a year before I
• 1:07:59
  got my first proper microphone lime that's how while while
• 1:08:03
  we're doing microphone show and. Tell I actually have my first
• 1:08:06
  mic here as well. Oh God, when I say.
• 1:08:09
  When I first. Started voice acting now I
• 1:08:11
  literally like I put this thing into like here it is.
• 1:08:16
  It's got a little, it's got its own little sound booth as well.
• 1:08:19
  It's the. I.
• 1:08:21
  Don't. Know the same thing actually.
• 1:08:23
  The the same guy, yeah. I don't.
• 1:08:26
  Know if you'll know it. You know, the Scarlet solo.
• 1:08:28
  Like the the audio like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:32
  Yeah. So they have like.
• 1:08:34
  A bundle which was literally a scarlet solo just like the.
• 1:08:40
  Little sound, the little. Sound equalizer and it came with
• 1:08:45
  its own mic and the shop I bought it from, which is I think
• 1:08:52
  it's called PMQ in in Manchester Town centre.
• 1:08:58
  It's literally a workhouse just filled with like random
• 1:09:00
  instruments and shit. If you, if you're an artist and
• 1:09:04
  you have no money and you want to play some instruments, go
• 1:09:06
  down there because it's just a warehouse full of instruments.
• 1:09:10
  But I bought it, I bought the mic and then it came with that
• 1:09:15
  that like stand like a hole, like a six foot pole with just
• 1:09:19
  like literally you see, like screw it on until the rubber
• 1:09:22
  like presses into the thing. And yeah, man, that's what I did
• 1:09:27
  over COVID. Like I just, I voice acted over
• 1:09:29
  COVID and I did. I also, I joined the stuntman
• 1:09:36
  registry as well thinking it's COVID, I'm not going to work and
• 1:09:42
  I did. You did.
• 1:09:45
  You became a stuntman. Yeah.
• 1:09:48
  I did so like my my claim to fame, which I I never I I tell
• 1:09:55
  my close friends and I don't tell anyone else.
• 1:09:57
  I was tell the world now. I can quite.
• 1:10:01
  Be fair. To be fair, the Ndas have
• 1:10:05
  probably run out. Now, so it's fine.
• 1:10:07
  So I for the Kenobi TV series was a yeah, you're fine.
• 1:10:12
  I'd be safe for the Kenobi. TV series I was a.
• 1:10:16
  Stormtrooper for a lot of that. Wow, fucking flex.
• 1:10:20
  Man. Jesus and then also.
• 1:10:23
  Do you get to add to any scenes with Anakin?
• 1:10:27
  So we're. For the Kenobi TV series, you
• 1:10:29
  know, on in on Tatooine, whether it's episode 2, they're on the
• 1:10:33
  truck in Tatooine and it's it's everyone Kenobi and like a very
• 1:10:39
  young Princess Leia, right? Yeah.
• 1:10:42
  It's like episode 2, they get on a truck and.
• 1:10:44
  Six of the stormtroopers get on the truck.
• 1:10:47
  Now if you if you notice, one of the stormtroopers is quite
• 1:10:51
  considerably smaller than the rest of the stormtroopers and
• 1:10:57
  the other stunt guys I was working with RAW, like 6 foot 36
• 1:11:00
  foot four. Listen, I'm a crisp 511.
• 1:11:03
  I am. So yeah, if you notice it.
• 1:11:06
  Will go like Stormtrooper, Stormtrooper, stormtrooper and I
• 1:11:12
  remember watching. It I was like, no, it's me.
• 1:11:13
  That's me, right? There but.
• 1:11:17
  Obviously it's the actor who. Plays Boba Fett, who who does
• 1:11:21
  all the voice acting for them because still they they they use
• 1:11:25
  the same voice actor from the clones to stormtroopers.
• 1:11:30
  It just keeps the same thing. Another thing I did, another
• 1:11:36
  thing I did, which was the end of my stunt career, is I.
• 1:11:42
  Well, I've not I've not done it. Professionally, since because I
• 1:11:46
  I think it might. The end so far.
• 1:11:48
  The end so far. Yeah.
• 1:11:50
  And so far, yeah. Is I was one of one of the
• 1:11:55
  Riddlers like goons in The Batman and Rob Pattinson.
• 1:11:59
  Batman, you're the person. I've.
• 1:12:03
  Had on the podcast. Oh, no, hold on.
• 1:12:06
  No, I tell a lie. That might have been big.
• 1:12:07
  I know, I know. Someone who was.
• 1:12:09
  In the film, but it was never on my podcast.
• 1:12:11
  Yeah, they they. We filmed it in Liverpool
• 1:12:16
  because obviously when you think of a crime written city that
• 1:12:18
  Batman could stalk, of course. Liverpool is Gotham.
• 1:12:23
  Yeah. Yeah, so I was in the end of the
• 1:12:29
  film and it's the part where, you know, they're fighting on
• 1:12:34
  top of the stadium and then the stadium half collapses and he
• 1:12:37
  falls. He thinks he's gonna fall.
• 1:12:40
  And Robert Pattinson had broken my hey, dislocated my shoulder.
• 1:12:48
  That's like. My that's my claim to frame
• 1:12:50
  that. That sort of he he had beat me
• 1:12:52
  up and then he had dislocated my shoulder.
• 1:12:56
  Well, basically the the set was is that there'd be a certain
• 1:12:59
  point in the choreography where the stage would tilt and then.
• 1:13:05
  We would like. Fall and roll off and it'd be
• 1:13:08
  scary now in the bit we've. Just dragged Rob.
• 1:13:12
  By the bike his like back cloak about 6 feet over to to the
• 1:13:18
  point he kicks my legs out from underneath me and starts beating
• 1:13:22
  up one of the stunt guys. The stage tilts and what we were
• 1:13:26
  told was just roll push and fall onto the nice safe crash mat
• 1:13:32
  underneath you. My legs get kicked out stage
• 1:13:35
  moves. I roll.
• 1:13:37
  I'm about to push off and then Rob falls next to me and my.
• 1:13:44
  Arm gets stuck in one of the. Railings as we fall off and just
• 1:13:48
  pops out on the way down which at.
• 1:13:57
  The start of the. Film.
• 1:13:58
  You know, in the start of the film, Batman just beats the
• 1:14:02
  brakes off This one poor sort of like criminal.
• 1:14:07
  That was supposed to be me because I dislocate my shoulder.
• 1:14:11
  Not me it's not. Fair.
• 1:14:13
  Not him. It's not fair.
• 1:14:19
  But yeah. That was that was supposed to be
• 1:14:22
  me, but you've not been up by Batman.
• 1:14:24
  What a flex. Yeah, Yeah.
• 1:14:26
  Well, I'll. Meet I was beaten up by a
• 1:14:29
  railing, but I was I remember when like we.
• 1:14:34
  First reconnected, like after our long not knowing each other,
• 1:14:38
  so between college and uni we didn't know each other.
• 1:14:40
  And then we reconnected randomly one day at a pub and he was
• 1:14:44
  telling me that story and like my face was going like, Oh yeah,
• 1:14:48
  that's so cool, that's so cool. And in the back of my head I was
• 1:14:50
  going, You fucking are, you lucky bastard.
• 1:14:54
  I wish that was me. Wish I got my.
• 1:14:56
  Shoulder dislocated by my Robert Pattinson.
• 1:14:58
  I love that movie so much because I'm such a comic book
• 1:15:01
  nerd. I was there watching it like, Oh
• 1:15:03
  my God, that's such a good film. Yeah, I've learned to now be
• 1:15:07
  like, it's OK it's OK I'm glad I didn't get my shoulder
• 1:15:10
  dislocated. All right, a couple of final
• 1:15:12
  questions for. You guys to close the show out?
• 1:15:15
  Oh, yeah. What has acting taught you about
• 1:15:17
  life? Go on, David.
• 1:15:20
  I feel like you've got some philosophical thing.
• 1:15:21
  To say about this. That.
• 1:15:25
  We shouldn't take it too seriously if.
• 1:15:30
  Anything else? I mean, you know, I could talk
• 1:15:33
  for hours about about that sort of thing, but if I had to
• 1:15:37
  condense it into one thing, it's the like, it's not that serious.
• 1:15:44
  It's not, I mean. People can take.
• 1:15:45
  It seriously and people can, you know?
• 1:15:50
  People can. Spend vast amount of.
• 1:15:53
  Time trying to. Understand it, but you're not
• 1:15:57
  any less fulfilled unless you're doing the thing that fulfills
• 1:16:01
  you. Yeah.
• 1:16:05
  And that's. You know.
• 1:16:07
  And if your if your passion is is, and this goes for acting all
• 1:16:10
  life. If your passion is dedicating
• 1:16:12
  yourself to one thing and really putting your whole soul into
• 1:16:16
  that one thing, right, brilliant.
• 1:16:20
  But if you, if you just want to just move your way through it,
• 1:16:25
  if you just want to sort of find your way through and whatever
• 1:16:27
  works, who works and what doesn't, doesn't and you find
• 1:16:30
  your flow and that's how you work, great.
• 1:16:34
  Just don't take everything seriously, you know, because
• 1:16:39
  either things happen for a reason or they don't.
• 1:16:42
  It's just things happen. And the way that we, the way
• 1:16:46
  that we react to that and the way that we act to that is, is
• 1:16:52
  just people and who we are. But yeah, that's again, I could
• 1:16:57
  talk for a thousand 1000 years about about about all the things
• 1:17:01
  that life and and acting is coincide.
• 1:17:04
  But yeah, that's my one thing. Amazing.
• 1:17:07
  Thank you. This is right.
• 1:17:09
  This is my son. 'S.
• 1:17:15
  Idea. He's got me.
• 1:17:20
  Honestly. For me, like, it's a lot more
• 1:17:22
  like a lot more of a simple thing because, you know, Davis
• 1:17:24
  can be right. But for me, I guess it's taught
• 1:17:28
  me to like, stop masking as much in public.
• 1:17:31
  Do you know what I mean? So because I spend so much time
• 1:17:35
  acting and masking and pretending to be someone who I'm
• 1:17:38
  not, when I'm in my real world, I'm like, OK, let me actually be
• 1:17:43
  the person who I am because I spend so much time being the
• 1:17:45
  person I'm not, you know? So yeah, it's just, it's just
• 1:17:49
  taught me to be me a bit more and discover who me is, You
• 1:17:53
  know, I guess that's, that's my take away.
• 1:17:57
  And I'm sorry, it's not as philosophical as David.
• 1:18:01
  Is, is, is is interesting. You know, there's a concept.
• 1:18:04
  Who who am I? Yeah, I think people can spend
• 1:18:07
  their lives trying to figure that out.
• 1:18:10
  Like for me, I realized once I let go of people's expectations
• 1:18:16
  and limitations and I just was fully myself and accepted who I
• 1:18:20
  am, that's when I became happiest.
• 1:18:22
  You know, the naysayers, the critics.
• 1:18:26
  You know, they're, they're always.
• 1:18:27
  Going to be there, but like, if you can fully immerse yourself
• 1:18:30
  in you, no one can touch you, yeah.
• 1:18:35
  Amen. Yeah.
• 1:18:37
  What has theatre? Taught you about life.
• 1:18:40
  Oh. I'm actually kind of glad you
• 1:18:43
  made that distinction. Though this is a nice
• 1:18:45
  distinction between like acting and theatre, you know, for me,
• 1:18:52
  like what? I've always been more of a
• 1:18:54
  theatre actor than a screen actor, if I had to choose one.
• 1:18:58
  I love doing both, but I always love doing theatre more.
• 1:19:01
  And I feel like it's because when I'm on stage, like I, I
• 1:19:07
  have this like, weird sense of like, you know, power and pride
• 1:19:11
  and authority of like, it's like me turning around, grabbing them
• 1:19:15
  by the bollocks and being like, hey, listen, this is my time,
• 1:19:19
  you know, listen to me. And so I feel like being on
• 1:19:25
  stage teaches you to like not bore people almost like when you
• 1:19:31
  have a you know what I mean, like boring bastard and like get
• 1:19:35
  on with it. You know, like when you tell you
• 1:19:37
  can't really fast it I suppose exactly when you tell the.
• 1:19:40
  Story tell the. Story don't be like so I was
• 1:19:42
  getting some milk and it was really rainy and then I got some
• 1:19:47
  milk like that's boring. Make make an actual I would I
• 1:19:51
  would pay to see. You got to, like, tell the
• 1:19:58
  story. You got to make everything
• 1:20:00
  interesting, you know? You can't bore people when we've
• 1:20:05
  got such little time on this earth, you know?
• 1:20:08
  I mean, don't you think? Though some of it's a bit.
• 1:20:09
  Unpredictable. I mean, you, yeah, you can make
• 1:20:12
  something that in your eyes is is killer.
• 1:20:14
  And then like the crowd just might be dead and it might just
• 1:20:17
  be the crowd that night. Or maybe it's just, I don't
• 1:20:20
  know, it's just not landing for some reason.
• 1:20:22
  And you know, yeah, I mean as a as a quick follow.
• 1:20:27
  Up there. Has has there been any shows
• 1:20:29
  like that where you where you sort of learned a hard lesson?
• 1:20:32
  You had to kind of go back to the drawing board?
• 1:20:35
  I guess I wouldn't say full shows.
• 1:20:39
  For me, like I feel like with When You Die, it was funny
• 1:20:44
  because there would be times when people would laugh at
• 1:20:48
  certain jokes that we had forgotten were funny because
• 1:20:50
  we've done them 1000 times. And there'd be times when, like
• 1:20:53
  jokes that we have literally been on the floor laughing about
• 1:20:57
  in the rehearsal space. It's been on stage.
• 1:20:59
  And like, all we've got is a little like, you know, exhale of
• 1:21:03
  laughter. And it's just, yeah, it's, it's
• 1:21:07
  been interesting. I want to say there's been like
• 1:21:08
  a full show where we've been like, oh God, that was terrible.
• 1:21:11
  But you're just learning from those little bits of like, you
• 1:21:16
  know, sometimes, you know, it just doesn't translate the right
• 1:21:19
  way, or sometimes the audience doesn't find something funny
• 1:21:21
  that you found hilarious. You know I was.
• 1:21:24
  Going to ask this later, but are you guys planning to kind of
• 1:21:28
  move out of Manchester and and take this maybe more national
• 1:21:33
  and moving theatre? Like, you know, it's flat pack,
• 1:21:36
  so I suppose you could sort of reassemble it anywhere.
• 1:21:38
  Yeah, yeah. I mean.
• 1:21:40
  There's always been like the, the, the, the concept of flat
• 1:21:43
  pack is you can flat, you know, flat pack it and put it into a
• 1:21:45
  van and take whatever you want. What we want to do is we really
• 1:21:50
  want to grow out our network and test things out in Manchester in
• 1:21:54
  our, in our creative hub. And then once we feel like we've
• 1:21:56
  found our one show or our one niche that would translate best
• 1:22:02
  and like explain what flat Pack is to everyone best.
• 1:22:05
  Once we find that one, we want to tour it.
• 1:22:07
  We want to take it to Edinburgh, we'll take it to London, want to
• 1:22:09
  take it to Leeds and Liverpool and literally anywhere we can.
• 1:22:13
  You know, it's like David once said to me, if anyone.
• 1:22:18
  Will be willing to watch. We will perform, you know, so
• 1:22:22
  we'll gladly take it wherever we can, I mean, at the moment.
• 1:22:26
  I. Sort of around December, January
• 1:22:30
  time, a lot of theatres, a lot of western theatres, we'll do
• 1:22:36
  like 6 months to 10 month internships in terms of like
• 1:22:42
  becoming like learning to become a producer in a West End show in
• 1:22:47
  or things like that. Now they only started doing it
• 1:22:51
  this year, but this year I've started really sort of looking
• 1:22:54
  for those and applying for those.
• 1:22:56
  But I've always said what in those applications when?
• 1:23:01
  I do this this is this. Is going to be my foot into the
• 1:23:07
  West End door and it these are flat pack shows.
• 1:23:13
  There was one, I think it was the, I can't remember the name
• 1:23:17
  of the theatre, God knows, but they had said we've got 6 plays
• 1:23:22
  that we want to do next year, tell us which one.
• 1:23:27
  You want to do and we'll. Help support you doing it now.
• 1:23:29
  Funny enough, I'd already been planning to put on that show for
• 1:23:34
  about 3 years. It's a play called Attempts on
• 1:23:38
  her Life. It was written in the mid 90s
• 1:23:42
  and it is 19 scenes but 19 attempts on trying to create the
• 1:23:50
  life of a fictional person. Like the play centres around
• 1:23:54
  this woman called Anne. Now it's very obvious from the
• 1:23:57
  start that Anne isn't real, but what she is is sort of a
• 1:24:02
  manifestation of all of the things that the media and art
• 1:24:06
  produces. It was written in the mid 90s,
• 1:24:11
  but it's scary how how on how on the nose it feels about modern
• 1:24:16
  culture and modern media and journalism and art and stuff
• 1:24:20
  like that. Some things never change, but I
• 1:24:26
  I put that play forward and I said look, I've been planning to
• 1:24:33
  display for years. Hey Rd., I literally sent them
• 1:24:35
  my notes, my script notes on it and I said I have one.
• 1:24:40
  Condition for. Doing it so I have everything
• 1:24:42
  lined up for you, but this is a flat plot production.
• 1:24:47
  That's my only thing. And.
• 1:24:50
  I'm getting nose, you know, I'm getting nose to mail.
• 1:24:53
  But yeah, for now one. Of them are going to say yes.
• 1:24:56
  At some point we're going to get a yes, and that's our foot in
• 1:24:59
  the West End door and but until. That point.
• 1:25:04
  With we're, we're, we're killing the Manchester Fringe.
• 1:25:07
  We killed it last year. We're going to kill it again
• 1:25:09
  next year. And then, you know, maybe
• 1:25:11
  Edinburgh Fringe next year, maybe Candom next year, maybe
• 1:25:15
  Leeds Fest. You know, the Sky's the limit,
• 1:25:19
  man. It's like like.
• 1:25:22
  So this is what we're doing like.
• 1:25:24
  We're doing it because we can, not because there's some
• 1:25:27
  arbitrary like that's how theaters are supposed to be run.
• 1:25:32
  You know, it's like, we might turn around next year and go,
• 1:25:37
  you know what, Berlin Film Festival and we'll just, we'll
• 1:25:42
  just do it like we'll just because we're this, we've got
• 1:25:44
  this passion, this energy. The reason that I joined this
• 1:25:47
  company in the 1st place is because I saw Fred and Felix and
• 1:25:50
  all the people involved. I was like, these are the most
• 1:25:53
  ambitious people I've seen so far.
• 1:25:58
  I like. So.
• 1:26:00
  It makes me just as ambitious, so yeah, yeah.
• 1:26:03
  What's the worst advice you've? Ever received?
• 1:26:06
  I know exactly what mine is. OK.
• 1:26:10
  What was a fantastic point? With just this question I mean
• 1:26:15
  the worst advice I'd ever. Received has actually nothing to
• 1:26:19
  theatre. Someone once told me that it's
• 1:26:22
  almost something that you could. Smoke cigarettes.
• 1:26:24
  Because it kills all the toxins in your body.
• 1:26:27
  I don't know even know how there's any even.
• 1:26:29
  Why even believe that? So I started smoking cigarettes
• 1:26:31
  and it'll make me healthy. Oh no.
• 1:26:36
  Luckily I don't smoke anymore. Yeah, it was.
• 1:26:38
  It was like it was just short phase.
• 1:26:40
  I did it for like a month, like smoking.
• 1:26:42
  And I realized, wait, hold on, this is the stupidest thing I've
• 1:26:45
  ever heard. As as.
• 1:26:51
  Someone who's been smoking for 11 years, I can confirm that's
• 1:26:56
  not true. Are you sure?
• 1:27:03
  But what's the worst piece of us ever got?
• 1:27:08
  I'll tell you one thing. I'm going to circle back to to
• 1:27:12
  the brilliant Philippe Gallier. I was one, one time I was doing
• 1:27:19
  this this. He's a clown.
• 1:27:22
  He works on a lot of improv pieces and things like that.
• 1:27:25
  And there was an improv piece we were doing and he golly had a
• 1:27:32
  drum. If you have a look at any of the
• 1:27:34
  stuff that he had, he had a drum and if he bangs the drum it
• 1:27:37
  means he was about to RIP you to shreds like it was we were
• 1:27:44
  doing. This one like.
• 1:27:45
  Comedy improv bit we were having this like slow motion race and
• 1:27:49
  we were like running our way through and finding it and have
• 1:27:51
  this like beautiful sort of like mining moments of like whatever
• 1:27:55
  whatever was happening. He banged the drum, looked me in
• 1:27:58
  the eyes and go are you having an orgasm?
• 1:28:01
  And this is this is how. Golly A spoke.
• 1:28:03
  He would, he would without without any sense of politeness
• 1:28:08
  or care for the world. You have an orgasm and go.
• 1:28:11
  I didn't have an answer for. Him and he goes.
• 1:28:15
  I like it. Good.
• 1:28:16
  Have more, have more of those. But yeah, that is the worst
• 1:28:23
  piece of advice to theatre. But you know, I'll let you,
• 1:28:28
  I'll, I'll leave that with you. Flat pack merchandise we're
• 1:28:31
  going to get on the. T-shirt have more orgasms?
• 1:28:36
  Flat Pack theatre supporter of. Orgasm since 2020.
• 1:28:39
  We are flat packed. Wow.
• 1:28:41
  Oh my God, yeah. OK, what's the best advice
• 1:28:48
  you've ever received 00? Gosh.
• 1:28:53
  I can I go first? Please do because I'm still
• 1:28:56
  trying to think of 1. OK again I'll again.
• 1:28:59
  I'll I'm going to stay with Gully A because this is the just
• 1:29:03
  the contrast of him as a person, how brilliant he was, he said.
• 1:29:07
  Either we admit that our that our forefathers were right and
• 1:29:15
  that we have to be serious, or we can admit that they are
• 1:29:19
  fucking boring and that being serious doesn't allow us to find
• 1:29:29
  the beauty and the playfulness of life.
• 1:29:34
  And that. Yeah, that is the one of the
• 1:29:37
  best piece of advice I've ever heard ever.
• 1:29:39
  Because I used to take things so seriously and now I don't.
• 1:29:44
  And I finally get to enjoy the the.
• 1:29:49
  Beauty of things. And the playfulness, you know, I
• 1:29:54
  tell. Everyone of the every.
• 1:29:56
  Actor that I work with, you know, starting from joy playing
• 1:30:00
  the game, you know, I referenced, you know, all the
• 1:30:04
  words, all the world's a stage and as merely players that he
• 1:30:07
  doesn't call them actors. He calls us players because what
• 1:30:10
  we're playing is, is is the game and the love.
• 1:30:13
  It's where we get the phrase for the love of the game.
• 1:30:17
  You know, it's like, if we're taking it so seriously, can you
• 1:30:23
  really enjoy it? Can you really just didn't just
• 1:30:26
  sit back and go? This is fun.
• 1:30:29
  I'm enjoying this. This is great.
• 1:30:31
  There's playfulness to it. There's mischief.
• 1:30:34
  And yeah, I live. I live by that.
• 1:30:38
  It's not just for. Theatre, it's for life.
• 1:30:40
  Like I live by that. I think I don't take anything
• 1:30:42
  seriously anymore because why would I?
• 1:30:48
  Yeah, it's interesting. I've had a lot of.
• 1:30:50
  Shows. Recently and the beauty of this
• 1:30:53
  show is every once in a while there'll be a guest or someone
• 1:30:57
  that will say something and I'll be like, boom.
• 1:31:00
  That's why I do this show gets me thinking.
• 1:31:03
  And this is one of them. I just it's been a bunch of
• 1:31:07
  things both of you have said where it's just got me thinking
• 1:31:09
  and kind of reassessing things. Thank you.
• 1:31:13
  No, thank you. The best advice?
• 1:31:16
  I've ever got I. Mean it's just as.
• 1:31:20
  Simple as. Do not worry.
• 1:31:23
  Be grateful. Which sounds super simplistic,
• 1:31:26
  but so from a scientific point of view, part of the brain that
• 1:31:31
  is excited and nervous is the same part you know?
• 1:31:34
  So you literally cannot do the same, the same both at the same
• 1:31:38
  time that you can never be nervous and excited.
• 1:31:41
  So stop being nervous and stop being excited.
• 1:31:43
  You know, do not worry, be grateful, you know, because,
• 1:31:46
  because worrying, I mean, from a Christian point of view, worry
• 1:31:50
  is just being like, I don't believe in God's plan.
• 1:31:52
  You know, it's been almost prideful that, you know, you
• 1:31:56
  don't trust in, you know, God's future.
• 1:32:00
  I mean, every time that I've worried about flat back, I've
• 1:32:02
  always thought, Oh, God isn't, it's not going to, you know,
• 1:32:04
  continue or one day it's never going to be known also.
• 1:32:07
  And then when the second silence that part of my brain and just
• 1:32:10
  think, shut up, even if it doesn't, you know, happen, it
• 1:32:13
  did happen. So if I'm trusting in like in
• 1:32:18
  God and that you're OK, this is what God put me on earth to do,
• 1:32:21
  then why would he stop me from doing it so every.
• 1:32:26
  Time, I've thought. About that.
• 1:32:27
  And every time I've silenced apart my brain about, OK, let's
• 1:32:30
  you know, like, oh, I need to worry about money.
• 1:32:32
  I need to worry about how this show's going to go.
• 1:32:33
  I need to worry about if this is going to bring my friendships
• 1:32:35
  and yeah, if I just start thinking, stop worrying, Be
• 1:32:39
  grateful for what I've got, be grateful for what I've done, and
• 1:32:42
  just in general just be grateful and excited for what's coming.
• 1:32:47
  Silence that part of your brain, you know, worry if it.
• 1:32:53
  If it goes wrong later. Sort it out later.
• 1:32:56
  You can't fix the problem before it's, you know, it's started,
• 1:32:59
  you know, So just stop worrying. Be grateful.
• 1:33:02
  That's the best advice I've ever I've ever seen, I guess.
• 1:33:04
  Yeah, yeah, that's definitely the best one I think I've ever
• 1:33:08
  received. What's the biggest line I will
• 1:33:10
  say? Sorry, I will say one another
• 1:33:14
  great piece of advice ever had is, is that watching a flat pack
• 1:33:18
  show is just transformative. You know, I think like just the
• 1:33:21
  act of buying a ticket and going to see a flat pack show just
• 1:33:24
  really changes your, your outlook on the world.
• 1:33:29
  I haven't that's not something from myself.
• 1:33:31
  Obviously I heard that from one of our many tickets ticket
• 1:33:34
  buyers, but you know, kind of fit to.
• 1:33:40
  Coin coincidence? By the twenty 26th 27th of
• 1:33:44
  February Quick shameless promo. Quick shameless promo, What's
• 1:33:49
  the biggest life? Lesson you've learned so far.
• 1:33:51
  I think I got to spend up all my life.
• 1:33:52
  Lessons on the what I just said previously about the whole war,
• 1:33:55
  you'd be grateful. I'll gladly pass this on to
• 1:33:58
  David. What's the biggest the greatest
• 1:34:00
  life lesson? I don't know.
• 1:34:06
  Like genuinely, I, you know, I haven't learned it yet.
• 1:34:14
  I haven't. Learned it yet?
• 1:34:16
  You know, ask me. Again in in. 70 years and I'll
• 1:34:22
  tell you the last time I asked you was last year.
• 1:34:25
  So I can't believe there's such a huge gap.
• 1:34:28
  Yeah, I. I.
• 1:34:30
  Almost. I almost wonder.
• 1:34:31
  What I said so do I because I've probably had some some half
• 1:34:36
  baked. Answer.
• 1:34:38
  And I love everyone. As I love.
• 1:34:42
  Myself but. Genuinely, I'm.
• 1:34:46
  At the moment I'm too busy living my life.
• 1:34:50
  I'm too busy living my life and I'll learn the lessons
• 1:34:52
  afterwards. We'll make the mistakes now to
• 1:34:55
  learn. From later yeah yeah, I'm I'm
• 1:34:57
  too busy making the mistakes I'm.
• 1:35:00
  You know, if anything, it's that it's OK to make the mistakes.
• 1:35:06
  That's that's because you learn from them and that's that,
• 1:35:09
  that's the life lesson, you know, but but yeah, to answer
• 1:35:13
  your question is I'm too busy living the life to learn the
• 1:35:18
  lesson. Final question.
• 1:35:22
  For you? Do you have any?
• 1:35:23
  Upcoming projects or final thoughts that you'd like to
• 1:35:26
  share with our listeners? Oh, we should have, should have
• 1:35:29
  wait for the plug, Yeah. You should have.
• 1:35:33
  There's a. Lesson for life Patience.
• 1:35:35
  Is everything patience is a virtue?
• 1:35:38
  No, that's the life lesson you just learned.
• 1:35:39
  Isn't it? Yeah, there we go.
• 1:35:41
  Yeah, we have. A lot going on.
• 1:35:45
  Literally 27th of February, we've got Planet Theatre 2026,
• 1:35:49
  which is a continuation of last year's.
• 1:35:51
  You know, we've got 10 new acts, 10 new performances ready to go,
• 1:35:55
  all amazing. We're all like super proud of
• 1:35:57
  them all this year. We're planning on doing
• 1:36:00
  including party. Theatre 4 shows, so we're
• 1:36:04
  planning on right? After that, we've got a.
• 1:36:06
  Comedy duo one with me and my best friend Felix.
• 1:36:10
  And you know, he's also the Co creative head of Flatback
• 1:36:12
  Theatre and David of course will also be helping out with it.
• 1:36:15
  You know, he'll probably be acting with it as well.
• 1:36:18
  That's called 2 Bozos in a Van. The first time I've actually
• 1:36:22
  publicly said it. So yeah, it's very like Rick
• 1:36:25
  male Bottom inspired. Yeah, probably just a fun
• 1:36:29
  British comedy. Following that, around October
• 1:36:32
  time, like Halloweenish, we're going to be doing a Western
• 1:36:36
  horror called Echoes of the Rusted Plain, which I will have
• 1:36:42
  to say for credit, where credit's due, my partner Poppy
• 1:36:45
  Kirkham came up with that title, so give him credit there.
• 1:36:48
  It's due. But yeah, that's very Cormac
• 1:36:50
  McCarthy inspired, you know, very, you know, Western horror,
• 1:36:55
  dark and grungy vibe, which would be really fun.
• 1:36:58
  And then to completely contrast that, we've got a Christmas show
• 1:37:01
  planned, which we're going to keep secret for now because
• 1:37:04
  we're still ironing out all the kinks.
• 1:37:06
  But we do have a plan for our Christmas show.
• 1:37:09
  And then after that, we got plans after that and then after
• 1:37:12
  that and then after that and then after that.
• 1:37:13
  So Flat Pack has got a 10,000 year plan.
• 1:37:17
  So keep tunes you know. But we've got like loads of
• 1:37:21
  other things that we're doing as well.
• 1:37:22
  Like we've, you know, we always try and keep like the social
• 1:37:25
  media stuff like fun and crazy. Like we're looking at doing like
• 1:37:29
  some like little short film sketch work.
• 1:37:32
  We're looking at, you know, we had an idea of doing pint of
• 1:37:35
  theatre but for based on short films and we had to do it for a
• 1:37:39
  fiver where we would give teams of people 5 lbs and say there's
• 1:37:45
  your budget for a short film, you know?
• 1:37:50
  Like things like that. We.
• 1:37:52
  Were looking at making a a a master class like workshop style
• 1:37:58
  acting school for people you know based on the concepts of
• 1:38:02
  why we did pint of theatre in the 1st place.
• 1:38:05
  These are opportunities that that we were given and, and
• 1:38:09
  should give in to other people. It's such an exciting time to be
• 1:38:15
  involved and alive and, and doing things like this.
• 1:38:18
  So, yeah, it's going to be a crazy, crazy year for us.
• 1:38:22
  And it's only just. Oh yeah.
• 1:38:24
  Exciting stuff. Well, it's been an absolute.
• 1:38:26
  Pleasure having you both on the show and just kind of hearing
• 1:38:31
  about what's what's next for you guys and also just I guess
• 1:38:35
  gaining a better understanding of what flat pack theatre is all
• 1:38:38
  about. And you know, I, I feel like
• 1:38:41
  we've got a pretty good understanding now.
• 1:38:43
  I think for anyone listening, you've got a good ground in now.
• 1:38:46
  And also, yeah, just hearing everything that you've both
• 1:38:48
  learned over the years. It's just incredible stuff.
• 1:38:50
  I wish you both the best. Well, thank you so much, man.
• 1:38:53
  We've had an absolute. Pleasure.
• 1:38:55
  Yeah. It's an absolute pleasure.
• 1:38:56
  Appreciate that. Pleasure's always mine.
• 1:38:58
  Thank you. What a time.
• 1:39:02
  Absolutely. All the listeners of the
• 1:39:04
  Christian Reeve podcast, I hope you enjoyed this show as much as
• 1:39:07
  I did. Make sure to check out Flat Back
• 1:39:09
  Theatre Online. You won't regret it.
• 1:39:12
  And yeah, as always, be safe, be well, and I'll see you in the
• 1:39:15
  next one.