Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #528 Raising Twins Without Comparison

Transcript

#528 Raising Twins Without Comparison · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Now, having twins can be a bit of a carnival,
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: and there's actually often a lot of pressure on twins
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: to be the same.
• 0:17
  Speaker 3: And so as.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: Parents, our work really is to help our children to
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: have their own identity, regardless of whether they're twins or siblings.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: And now here's the stars of our show, my mum
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: and dad.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: Hello, this is doctor Justin Coilson. Welcome to the Happy
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: Families Podcast. I'm here with Kylie, my wife and mum
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: to our six children, and today a listener question. Somebody
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: has gotten in touch and said, hey, Justin, longtime daily
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: podcast listener, member of Happy Families, and I've also had
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: the pleasure of reading some of your books and I
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: first saw you deliver a wonderful presentation in twenty nineteen,
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: back in the day to before COVID. Anyway, this emailer
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: via podcasts at happyfamilies dot com dot Jenna has said,
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: I'm a school teacher. I'm teaching you too, and I
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: use your strategies, advice and knowledge both personally and professionally.
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: But this year I have a number of twins in
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: my class and parents are coming to me needing help.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: Parents are trying not to compare their kids, they understand
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: and are trying to raise their kids to know that
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: they have different strengths and interests. Do you have any
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: advice for our twin parents who are struggling in these areas?
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Please do an episode on raising twins. I thought we
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: have not covered this off at all, Kylie. We've never
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: talked about twins, So rather than me talking about this,
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: I thought we would call in an expert, somebody who
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: doesn't just know about raising twins, but has done it twice.
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: Let's tell the number then give a call.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: Hey, oh hello, mum. Hello, it's Justin and Kylie.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, we're calling to ask us some advice from you,
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: right because you're the expert. Yes, Mum, We've had a
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: request from somebody who wants to know about raising twins,
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: and we were talking and decided that we didn't know
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: anyone who knew more about it than you because you've
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: done it twice. So you had me and then you
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: had twin girls. Then you had my little brother, and
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: then you had twin girls again, two sets of twin
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: girls in a period of I don't know. You had
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: six kids over what was.
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: It, fifteen years eleven?
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: Well, whatever it was, it was really really short and tight.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: And now we've got all these siblings and two sets
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: of twins.
• 2:35
  Speaker 5: So you were fifteen when the younger sit were born.
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: So we thought we would ask you a handful of
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: questions mum about raising twins to help this person who
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: has been in touch with us, Jenna, to work out
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: what she can do to help parents with twins.
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: So Jenna is actually a Grade two teacher and she
• 2:55
  Speaker 4: has a number of twins in her class, and she
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: suggested that she only has one of each of the
• 3:03
  Speaker 4: sets in her class. But she's really curious as parents
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: have come to her and talked to her about some
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: of the concerns they're having. They're trying to work out
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: how they can expand their social circles because there's such
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: a strong bond with these twins. They just want to
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: hang out together. So, how did you help with your
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: sets of twins, you had two of them, how did
• 3:24
  Speaker 4: you help to expand their social networks or did you
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: find that they actually did that all on their own.
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: My twins were fraternal, which meant that they were two
• 3:34
  Speaker 5: separate genetic backgrounds. You know, they were obviously separate genomes,
• 3:40
  Speaker 5: and so they were like a natural natural sisters. I
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: had two sets of twin girls, and they were like
• 3:47
  Speaker 5: they just happened to be born at the same time,
• 3:49
  Speaker 5: genetically coded very differently, so you know, one was from
• 3:55
  Speaker 5: just looking at them, though different physically, and from their
• 3:58
  Speaker 5: emotional side, their very different, and they had different sets
• 4:02
  Speaker 5: of friends. They were friends because that's what happened when
• 4:06
  Speaker 5: they were growing up as two year olds and three
• 4:07
  Speaker 5: year olds and four year olds, so were just naturally
• 4:09
  Speaker 5: together because that's just how it was. But once they
• 4:12
  Speaker 5: started school, they formed their own friendships with others who
• 4:17
  Speaker 5: had similar interests or that they felt that they connected
• 4:21
  Speaker 5: with better. So I never had the problem of them
• 4:24
  Speaker 5: being clingy or just wanting to be with each other.
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: Great told you this would work. Great expert, not an
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: expert on that one.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: No, no, okay, what was it like raising the kids, Mum?
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: Raising all these twin girls in terms of the extent
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: which they compared themselves with one another and competed against
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: one another for attention from you or for admiration and
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: adulation when they're doing something well, How did you deal
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: with the ongoing challenges of competition between twins, which it
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: has to be different competition between siblings generally, simply because
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: they're the same age, they're going through the same things together.
• 5:06
  Speaker 5: I watched what they were naturally gifted at and what
• 5:10
  Speaker 5: they enjoyed doing. So to begin with, because I'm time
• 5:14
  Speaker 5: poor and wanted to be more efficient, I had them
• 5:17
  Speaker 5: in the same thing. So they'd go ballet together, dancing together, trampoline,
• 5:21
  Speaker 5: singing together, piano together, all of the different things they
• 5:24
  Speaker 5: did together. But it became pretty obvious over a few
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: months that one loved it and one didn't want to go,
• 5:32
  Speaker 5: And so they ended up excelling in their own areas
• 5:37
  Speaker 5: because I let them follow what they wanted to do,
• 5:41
  Speaker 5: and they were different and they chose different things, so
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: the competition in that area wasn't that great.
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: I just to remember growing up, though Mum and the
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: kids would be like there was always that sense of
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: it's unfair you let her do stuff that I'm not
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: allowed to do, or why does she get to do that?
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: In ni heart, even though they were twins.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: How do you how do you recall managing and dealing
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: with that and how long has that persisted through their lives.
• 6:06
  Speaker 5: I think the competitive they can't help but compare. I
• 6:10
  Speaker 5: don't know. I just thought because there are individuals, because
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: they were fraternal twins, there wasn't what one might have
• 6:18
  Speaker 5: with identical twins, which would be a very real comparison
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: when they've got very similar backgrounds. But because they chose
• 6:26
  Speaker 5: different friends, chose different hobbies, chose different things to do,
• 6:29
  Speaker 5: had different interests, the comparison and that wasn't as great.
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: But there was definitely still that she's better than me
• 6:38
  Speaker 5: at this, and you know you favor this on her.
• 6:41
  Speaker 5: But I think that was more to do with just
• 6:43
  Speaker 5: being children rather than twins.
• 6:45
  Speaker 4: It's interesting you say that, Mum, because coming into the family,
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: the younger set of twins were six when I joined
• 6:51
  Speaker 4: the family, and I just I remember how individually you
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: treated them. They weren't, you know, kind of two peas
• 7:03
  Speaker 4: in a pod. And I've loved watching how you both
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: you and Dad have worked with each of them individually
• 7:11
  Speaker 4: to you know, support them in the choices that they've
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: made throughout their lives.
• 7:15
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so that was really it. I mean, I saw
• 7:18
  Speaker 5: them as individuals. It was an exciting thing to have twins.
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: I think I learned a lot with the first set
• 7:23
  Speaker 5: of twins. The first set of twins, I just tried
• 7:25
  Speaker 5: to get them to do everything together. And with the
• 7:29
  Speaker 5: second set, I learned that I was better off letting
• 7:32
  Speaker 5: go of the fact that I was time poor with
• 7:35
  Speaker 5: six children and the two sets of twins and trying
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: to get two of them to the one event, rather
• 7:40
  Speaker 5: than splitting myself again and getting two children as well
• 7:44
  Speaker 5: as the other four to different things. But I just
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: knew that it wasn't going to work to have Rachel
• 7:49
  Speaker 5: do piano and Leah du ballet. It just didn't work.
• 7:53
  Speaker 5: So I just had to work within that and let
• 7:57
  Speaker 5: them follow their passions and do that rather than try
• 8:01
  Speaker 5: and you know, put a square pig in a round hole,
• 8:05
  Speaker 5: just trying to force them into things that worked for me.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: Listening to you say that, it reminds me of just
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: the absolute chaos that we lived through with.
• 8:11
  Speaker 5: The It wasn't chaos. It was organized with all of
• 8:15
  Speaker 5: the activities, very organized.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: Kids going left, right and center and NonStop all day
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: every day.
• 8:20
  Speaker 5: It was that's right, very organized.
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: Thanks mum, thanks for the memories, Thanks for the advice.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: I think I think there's some useful things that some
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: parents can take from that.
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: That's great.
• 8:30
  Speaker 5: Can I just say the best thing is to leach
• 8:32
  Speaker 5: child be themselves, love regardless of who they are, follow
• 8:36
  Speaker 5: what they love and what they're good at, and let
• 8:38
  Speaker 5: them develop who they are. Thanks grammar with individuals, Bye.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: Love, chatting with mum, and maybe some useful bits and
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: pieces that could be helpful for parents of twins. I
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: think that's really the crux of it, isn't it. Hey,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: after the break, we're going to talk about what science
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: says will help parents of twins to navigate the challenges
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: of social life and comparison as they grow up and
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: go through.
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: The schooling experience.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: Starting school is an exciting time, but it can also
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: be a little worrying. The Starting School Activity Book is
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: a printable workbook that will help prepare your little one
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: for the first thrilling school days and give you tips
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: on the best ways to talk about all the new
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: things they're going to experience. Perfect for KINDI, preschool or
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: big school, and absolutely free online at happy families dot com.
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: Do a you.
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: It's the Happy Families podcast, the podcast for the time
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: poor parent who just wants answers. Now The Science we're
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: going to get serious.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, actually there's not. I struggled to find really
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: good science around this, and most of what Mum said
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: was kind of check in harmony what the science says. So,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: having twins can be a bit of a carnival of sorts,
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: like when you show up you're a curiosity. People want
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: to ask all the questions. They want to say, oh,
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: how much are.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: They the same?
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: And there's actually often a lot of on twins to
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: be the same. Parents will dress them the same way,
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: they'll have them in the same activities. If they're identical twins,
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: they might even have the similar kinds of proclivities, similar
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: kinds of preferences, priorities and interests.
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: And so as parents, our work really.
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: Is to help our children to have their own identity,
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: regardless of whether they're twins or siblings. The idea is,
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: let's just work out who you are. Let's not treat
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: them like they're some sort of a sociology experiment. And
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: they're supposed to be exactly the same as one another,
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: and we're going to raise them the same way. Probably
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: not fair, Probably not going to.
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: Work out quite right.
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: And for Jenna, as a school teacher, I would be
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: inclined to emphasize, don't call the kids by their last name.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Don't say, oh, it's the calls twins, call them by
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: their names, and if they're identical, make sure that you
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: learn the differentiating factors because they are individuals. So for parents,
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: that's probably not going to be quite the issue. You're
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: not going to call you own children by their surnames,
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: but for teachers certainly would Yeah.
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: It's interesting reading Brene Brown's work, and you know this
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: idea that our most fundamental needs come down to being seen, heard,
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: and valued. You can see how easily as twins you
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: actually almost kind of blur into one, and how important
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: it would be to feel like you have your own identity.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, very much, which I guess highlights this
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: whole thing. As parents, we want to minimize the extent
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: to which teachers, relatives, Grandma Artie's uncles, neighbors are comparing
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: the twins and getting into those conversations about their abilities
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: and interests and their physical appearance and how much they're
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: the same. We want to make sure that we can
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: really allow them to be differentiated. The reality is a
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: lot of kids are going to be drawn towards their siblings,
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: whether they're a twin or not. Like you go to
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: people with whom you're familiar, we go to people with
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: whom you feel safe, and therefore kids are going to
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: go in that direction.
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: But hopefully as parents we can.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: Help the kids to figure out who they are on
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: their own and as part of the collective, as part
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: of the family. I think the main thing Kylie, whether
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: we've got identical or fraternal twins or triplets or whatever
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: it might be, is to let them be themselves. Let
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: them have their own interests, let them have their own preferences,
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: let them have their own friends.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: If they're sharing friends sharing preferences, that's great.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: But minimize the competition between them, minimize the comparisons between them,
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: and let them do what they do because they want
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: to do it in.
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: The same way that you would with regular siblings.
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: That's kind of I mean, I don't want to sound
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: like I'm dumbing it down or over simplifying it. I
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: don't want to be too reductionist or sound like I'm
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: being inappropriate to parents who are raising twins. We always
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: wanted twins, and then we had one and we were like, oh,
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: thank goodness, we didn't get two. But having been a
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: big brother to two sets of twins and watching it happen,
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: I kind of feel like mum worked out.
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: I think that.
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: Unlike a lot of parents who have twins, your mum
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: actually had this wonderful opportunity to practice what she'd learnt
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: with twin set number one. That's right, t set number two,
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: and she, you know, at the end of our conversation
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: she acknowledged that there was so much that she'd learned.
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: I think, you know, there's this romanticized, I guess version
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: of events that take place when you have twins. You
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: want to dress them the same. You know, they have
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: the same, their hair done the same, and their dresses
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: the same.
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: Is unbelievably cute when you do, and it is. It's gorgeous.
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: But and because we've never had twins, it's never really
• 13:27
  Speaker 4: occurred to me to think outside of that. But as
• 13:31
  Speaker 4: we've kind of gone down memory lane with your mum
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: today and I've watched how she has parented. You've got
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: two sets of twins, but they actually are just you
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: just have four sisters.
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they're very.
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: Very different, and they've been parented in that way so
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: that their individuality can shine through well, Jenna, we.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: Hope that this has been a helpful conversation for you,
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: and we really appreciate the question coming through via podcasts
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: that's podcasts with an s podcasts a Happy Families.
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: Dot dot au.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: Hey, if you've got any feedback on this particular episode,
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: Given that Kylie and I are talking from a secondhand
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: experience and not first hand experience on this one, and
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: looking just a little bit a couple of.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: Bits and pieces of science and evidence that would support the.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: Ideas that we've shared, we would love for you to
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: send us a voice memo let us know what you
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: think has worked for you if you're raising twins, anything
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: that we missed, anything that Jenna needs to know as
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: a teacher, or any parent of twins needs to know
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: to minimize the comparison, the competition.
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: And help the kids to be who they really are.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: Podcasts at Happy families dot com dot you send us
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: your voice memos, we would love to share them on
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: the podcast over the next couple of weeks. The Happy
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: Family's podcast is produced by Justin Ruwland from Bridge Media.
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: Craig Bruce is our executive producer and for more ando
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: about making your family happier, You'll find it at happy families,
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: dot com, dot a you