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BPS 346: Directing The #1 Christmas Film On Netflix With Janeen And Michael Damian · Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast

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You are listening to the IFH podcast Network. For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting
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podcasts, just go to ifahpodcastnetwork dot com. Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast,
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Episode number three forty six. We elves try to stick to the four
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main food groups candy, candy canes, candy corn, and syrup Buddy Elf
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broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood when we really should be working
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on that next draft. It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft
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and business of screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof. And
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here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the
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Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble host Alex Ferrari. Now, today's
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show is sponsored by Bulletproof script Coverage. Now. Unlike other script coverage services,
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Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses on the kind of project you are and the
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goals of the project you are, So we actually break it down by three
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Brothers, The Blacklist, and many many more. So if you need your
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screenplay or TV script covered by professional readers, head on over to covermiscreenplay dot
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com. Today we have on the show filmmakers Janine and Michael Damien, who
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are the director and producer of the number one Christmas movie on Netflix, Falling
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for Christmas, starring Lindsaylohan, and we had a fascinating conversation about how they
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got their start in the business, who they worked with. I mean,
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some of the stories and you're gonna hearing this episode are pretty insane. Some
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of the people they've worked with in the course of their career, and how
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they've been able to transition from where they were in the business to directing and
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producing, and why do they love Christmas movies so much? Because they keep
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making them again and again. So, without any further ado, please enjoy
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my conversation with Janine and Michael Damien. I like to welcome the show,
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Janina, Michael Damian, how you guys doing. Hello, Alex, so
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nice to be here. Thank you for having us. Oh, thank you
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for coming on the show. This is like a Christmas special episode because I
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haven't had a like a Christmas heavy filmmaking, you know, partnership on before.
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I mean, looking at your filmography, you guys are fairly obsessed.
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Uh, she'd asked the decorations here, I just realized, what happy decorations?
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No heavy weights before that. Yeah, we're honored. We'll take it.
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Take it. So before we get started, you I have to ask
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you one question. What was it like working on the stead of Captain Ello?
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WHOA? What? That was a career highlight? I have to say,
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but everybody, everybody listening. Captain Yo was a short film directed by
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Frescis roo Popolo, produced by George Lucas, starring Michael Jackson in nineteen eighty
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three something like that. Eighty forty five. Oh my gosh, that in
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that world, Michael Jackson was basically at the They just made a They made
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an amusement park ride around Michael Jackson. At that point, I thought he
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did and that was I remember seeing that a thought and many times and I've
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watched it online ever since, but I've never spoken to anybody was on set.
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What was that light? It was? It was phenomenal. You know.
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The production design was by the production designer who did Blade Runners. So
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so there was all that steam and all this crazy smoking it and it was
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really loud, actually, and Michael had to speak to everybody with his with
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the microphone. And then and when we first we actually hadn't rehearsed with Michael.
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We rehearsed without him. And then he came out on set and the
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very first take, you know, you got Francis Burcopola yelling action. You've
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got George Lucas has created this pretty camera for this movie, and bleachers forgets
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like Elizabeth Taylor, Nick Cage, and you know, it was just this
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celebrity bleacher over there, and and Michael was in the bleacher. I got
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tod and bite Michael because Michael is a celebrity. Well I was there watching
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it and they and so when he yelled action, Michael Jackson goes and it
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was rainbows blew out of him and it blew all our hair back, and
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we all messed up the boreography the first take, and they had to redo
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it, but it was really amazing. It was an amazing experience. So
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that's one of those special ones. I mean, it's like it's in the
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George Lucas Coppola and Michael Jackson all of like with a short film with an
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insane budget that never would have had happened any other way other than if it
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was an amusement park ride like it. I mean, Angelica Houston was was
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the was the wicked Witches say, I forgot she just did such a great
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job. I can't recognize her, but she was there. Yeah, she
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was terrifying and fabulous. Told him about the music wasn't loud when they first
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started, and Michael Jackson couldn't feel the music out of rhythm, and so
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he quietly so he gets he gets on the microphone and he says, you
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know, I'm sorry, I can't feel it. I'm not going to try
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to him anyway. He says, I'm sorry, I can't feel the rhythm
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of the music and until I can, I can't work. So thank you
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very much. And then he and mccaullachull hook and who he keep brought with
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him left and we all stood there and said, Okay, what's happening,
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and so we're going to take a break, and while we're waiting, they
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bring in these ginormous spects of Marshall speakers that go from all the way to
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to the ceiling, and that's on the sound stage and that and then the
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music was so loud that, you know, we came back in and Michael
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was happy. Everybody's happy. We're shooting, and then we get a visit
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from next door and they were shooting Matthew Broderick and Ali Sheety in war Games?
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Is that yeah? And they said, well, we hear you were
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over here, so we can't work now, and so we had to stagger
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our shooting between war games. It was either war games or uh, I
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think it was work. It was War Games with John John Batham directed that
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one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, So that so that was
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kind of that was I don't even know how they worked that out, but
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they worked it out where we actually rotated who was gonna shoot wet awesome,
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so sane. It's a great story though, and it was really it was
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intense and amazing, and we had a phenomenal photographer. So how long did
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you go a shoot for? By the way, was i' sale we were
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all I mean it was also it was we had rehearsals as well, and
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then they showed up shot a bunch of stuff without us, without the dance
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scare stow. That was a big we were on that show for I was
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on it for a month that I don't I don't actually know what I had.
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When I saw that in your filmography, I had to ask you,
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so thank you for indulging me. I appreciate that. Now, how did
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now, how did you guys meet and start collaborating and working together as a
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direct producer? Oh? How did we meet? Well? We bet at
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an airplane and I thought that Janane's dad was her boyfriend because I didn't know
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at the time, and I later found out it was her dad and it
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was awesome, and I was like, oh great because it was one of
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my favorite actors, James Best Roscoe from The Dukes of Hazzard. So I
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was like, I've got him of a young girlfriends like her, but I
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want to make her mind, So I Startings's girl Roscoe's girl, no h.
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And we met pleen to Utah going to the Osmond's Children's Miracle Network telethon,
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and that's where we first met and then we started writing together. Jeanine
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was dancing, you know, she was on the show Solid Gold. She
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was dancing with as you know, Jackson Prance, you know, George Michael,
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John, Diana, Rosslano, Richie. The list goes on and on
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and on a bile a long. And so I was doing The Younger the
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Restless and my music career rock you know, tours and uh uh Broadway and
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all that, and we just started we started writing together. We started with
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the script short stories right in New York. Yeah, I started it there,
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and well Michael started. He wanted to he wanted to try the other
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side of camera. So he actually was the impetus to us trying to write
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together. Actually he was writing and he said, well we can write.
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I said, well, we can't write. We're not writers. We ain't
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really help me a lot. You are you died that. He doesn't take
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no, he doesn't put limits on himself. And so it was really amazing
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the way we made that career pivot, uh together. But it started small
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and then just kept going. I'm Michael, if I make director with Roscoe
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Pea cole train, if you if you peak Coultrane, yeah you get a
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peekultry train back in the day. Oh, my guest, Dolid Hold,
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I remember watching that growing up, Mike. That's I'm going back from Michael
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Jackson all that. Roscoe was Quittin Tarantino, who was Engineer's dad's acting school
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and he was one of the students. Oh so he's he was the one
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that was teaching written how to act back in the day when he was trying
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to be an acting and he was encouraging him to write their scripts, and
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he brought scripts in from reservoir Dogs. We'll be right back after a word
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from our sponsor, and now back to the show. And Jenny would rehearse
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the scenes with him, as you know, she was just an actors.
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Yeah, and she would always she was very kind to everyone, and she
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was rehearsing dialogue of these scenes. She's kind of weird that all these characters
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with bizarre names and mister what were then, mister Blob, yeah, yeah,
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mister Page. Yeah. She was like, this is kind of wild,
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you know, but he's really, you know, passionate about you know,
10:24
acting. Never heard had this guy? Did he ever do anything ever
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come out of him? Did he ever do anything else? He is world
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about Oscars all the time. Anytime you write something, you just see him
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at the Oscars. But so those are all really fun. These are all
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the movie experiences you know that we grew up in our background. You know,
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with Jenny when I say dance, it's really important because she worked with
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Barry Levinson, she worked with Uh look they're both Uh so the lift goes
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on and on some great people. And I got a chance to work with
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Gary Marshall and a lot of fabrics me directors and uh so you know,
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this was our background. We were take We were like sponges, uh,
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not really knowing, not realizing at the time this would be transferred to the
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other side of the camera. We were just taking it all in as performers
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and uh and you know, great experiences and always listening. Uh And you
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know, I had a great opportunity working with Andreloid whatever for two years when
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I did Joseph on Broadway, and that was an amazing experience. So we
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got we got all these you know, these amazing mentors, and that's really
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kind of that's where it started. So, I mean, you it was
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was pretty much osmosis at this point. You were just kind of absorbing it
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all just being on set, you know, and from masters. I mean
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he's talking about legends. Yeah, yes, exactly. It's really inspiring and
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a little intimidating, but but awful at the same time. I mean,
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I could only I could only imagine being on set and just watching these these
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masters work and then just not knowing that this would all ever do anything else
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for you other than like, oh, you know, it's nice that I
12:05
worked with Andrew door Wood whatever and parvolhoven'siod. We were fans and we're like,
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it was great and it's really good to you know. We ran into
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Paul a couple of times and pre their Hoven and it was really wonderful to
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see how we reacted when when he saw you, it was what these days,
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it was really nice to me. Yeah, So that was that was
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a really fun experience working with him because he's kind of a little bit of
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a different personality than what I had worked with before. They worked like basically
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Basic against Oh, I know, I saw that too. I was asking
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about Basics the game you worked on basicas you know, it's still funny,
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but I have a funny Paul story, Paul Warhoven's story. I reached out
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to his people a year a year or two ago, and I'm like,
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hey, would you like to come? I'm a huge fan Paul, you
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know, would you like to come on the show? And his agent goes,
12:54
Paul is respectfully decline. Actually I'm putting them respectfully in because he thinks
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podcasts are absolute shite. And oh and I said that is perfect because that's
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Overhvid. He's well, he doesn't, that's for sure. You know,
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he's just honest. Oh, he's still honest. But he made some of
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the greatest movies. I mean, just whatever, mister Paulhovid, whatever you
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like. But I just thought that was such a wonderful way. So much
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that's coming from him, and just like because i've no like I've heard stories
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about him and just seeing his interviews, he's just a he's an intense dude.
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But that's how he made his movies back back in the days. So
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they're great now. All those years that you guys have been in the business,
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I kind of believed that it wasn't all happy go lucky, puppy dog
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tails and unicorns, uh, the entire ride, right, I'm assuming as
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as actors and performers, well as actor performers on one side of the camera
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is one thing, and you guys get it's just that the noes the amount
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of rejection that you get as an actor. I'm assuming that prepped you for
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the moment you said, hey, I want to be a filmmaker and people
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are like, yeah, that's nice. Pretty much, right, that's the
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biggest let you get, actually, because I think that I think that today
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they're much more open to people crossing over. And but at that time you
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didn't. I mean, you did film, or you did TV, or
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you or you did Broadway. And Michael Is He's just the other day was
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saying to me cross She's like, I'm just better denial than you are.
14:39
You know, I crossed the streams like in Ghostbusters. It's like, you
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know, when when I was doing the music that well you can't act and
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do music, and I just didn't understand why I couldn't do that. And
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then it was about, well you can't do this and then do broad Away.
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That's just not how it works, and so all these kind of things.
14:56
You know, she started actors weren't really direct being so much. And
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now I have to say that we've really ate ball and as as in the
15:07
entertainment community and and I think the stringing services have helped also to sort of
15:13
to make it an easier flow to move from one, you know, on
15:16
some of the camera to the other. But if you're right, that was
15:18
a really big no. As a matter of fact, we actually had to
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go to France before somebody would let Michael direct something because he was the most
15:24
popular in France than anywhere else in the world at the time. And we
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thought, what was my accent, Go where you have the most heat,
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and that was Brets. Yeah. Yeah, And we developed a U with
15:37
t F one. It took quite a while because everything had to be written
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in English, transcript translated back into French, and then back in English again,
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and we had to do it at two languages, and tooot in two
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languages, and it was it was an adventure. Betty was a great experience
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and that really got the Firs there. It was real, real off and
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running what Mike, I mean, I I completely understand it because I can't
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walk the streets in Japan. I mean, I'm just saying, I'm joking.
16:07
I was gonna say I've seen you before, I don't see and I
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saw you everywhere. It's funny. It's funny. I was doing the alcohol
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ads. Uh it was. Yet just like just like the y I did
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tell those with John Travolta, can't you high? Did you? Did you
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do? You must have in the same amount of stories. I mean things
16:29
you could say on air and things you could say off air, she was
16:33
right, or seats in commercials nine knife wheeling, Uh no. But the
16:40
country high commercial was was back when so celebrities were doing Japanese commercials when you
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didn't do television commercials in America back then, yea, when you no no
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for yeah, and there was no YouTube where there was no internet, so
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it stayed in Japan exactly. Nobody knew that they were doing them. Yeah,
16:57
you giveing away Johns for Bolt's secret stand. Honey, trust me,
17:00
he's fine, He's done all right. I think I think the cat's out
17:06
of the bat on that that's all right. The kid I remember gwentn doing
17:11
some like commercials over because in Japan she was huge after all the you know,
17:15
pulp fiction and all that stuff, and he would do commercials over there
17:17
to. I've seen some of them. It's just like the weirdest they have
17:19
weird commercials. I mean just was your was your It was weird. It
17:29
was that Hilton estate in the pool and we had for some reason, they
17:33
put bunny tails on us and fifties swimsuits and beach balls. Sure, and
17:40
what John was doing. It was another point before we were writing Rockets.
17:45
This was on a sound stage. We did a couple of camp and they
17:48
put these crazy weeks and they could only bottom fake eyelashes on us. It
17:51
was really you know, and they were like fashion Boward, that's a very
17:56
polite way of saying it's weird. Director. They said, put this on,
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and you said so. So once you got once you got that first
18:04
production off in France, which is is fast because I've heard that from so
18:08
many actors that they go overseas because they can't. They won't get a shot
18:12
here, but it overseas they're much more open. Even back then, two
18:17
actors are like, oh, yeah, he's a big star here because moveen
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watching him, and you know all that kind of stuff. After you got
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done with that, did that open the door here for some projects? Well
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no, because then we were back in America and then the nose kept coming.
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But you just have to keep pushing, you know, just so let
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me ask you this, then, how did you guys keep moving I always
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love asking that question, how did you guys keep moving forward? When you
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he's constantly getting nose and nose and nose. And I remember that time.
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I remember, you know, I wasn't. I was young, coming up
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in the nineties as a director, and I remember everyone was there. You
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have to be in a box. You couldn't move back and forth between things,
18:51
you know, like I was. I came up in the commercial world
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and like, if if I happened to do a Spanish language commercial, my
18:56
agent would tell me you're done. You have to then you can't do general
19:00
market. I'm like what what? Like, oh, we can't. You
19:04
didn't get the jump? Why because you never had you never shot anything with
19:07
any dialogue in it. I'm like at the camera to speak, I could,
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I don't. It didn't. It didn't make any sense to me,
19:12
like you have to like everyone's so boxy and everything. So how did you
19:17
during that time? Well? Actually, Indian movie, Well, actually let's
19:22
back up just a little bit, if you don't mind. We did a
19:23
short film and this was really great. We we put together a short film.
19:29
Then he has a mini show and Janine produced it and and I directed
19:34
and we wrote it. But what was great about it was that Janine did
19:38
all of the producing and the live producings, so she literally had to learn
19:42
on the fly, hire everybody, ensure the film ricks this. I mean
19:51
she she really It was like a super master's quick class on on you know,
19:56
how to produce. We'll be I back after a word from our sponsor,
20:04
and now back to the show. And you know, run a budget
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and and I was, you know, doing the same thing, and we
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were working together, and we picked a lot of people's brains. I was
20:15
over at Burns and Sawyer. Uh, I've seen them there every day after
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Young and the rest. But sure, yeah, when we're restless, I
20:23
have to do my shoot my scenes. That was his. That was his
20:26
cool kind of go over there and I would just harass them. Uh.
20:30
They were so nice to me, and I just I said, can you
20:32
can I see the inside of the thirty five millimeters? Okay? Now what
20:34
now? What is this? Now? How do we load this? And
20:37
these guys were they were showing me everything, and I just sat and learned
20:41
how to load, learned how to shoot, bought my own cameras and started
20:45
shooting and we and we were we started making stuff, you know, so
20:48
then then I guess are the first project that we did in America was that
20:52
we but then we came back and we raised money when Michael raised money and
20:56
we shot at Anyone was like, well, no one's gonna go. And
20:59
then we sold after Yeah, we did a Brendon Audust. We were off
21:02
and runn Yeah, we did a bodest you know Indy film. Met fabulous
21:07
producer a named brag Or boy who makes a lot of movies. Do you
21:11
know Brad dumb and Dummer. He's the guy that made that film happen and
21:15
he bought the movie. Yeah, and so he bought that short film and
21:18
sold it worldwide. And then we we've been working to the direction. We
21:22
worked with him on following for Christmas. Yeah, he's actually Brad was the
21:27
one that was the big turning point in our career. Yeah, they were
21:30
aded to the Sister twenty Century Fox. Fox hired us for the flickas the
21:34
prequel to Marley and the Uh. And so we just sort of again networking
21:40
through people and working with people and building up you know, you just have
21:44
to. You got to It's great at where we started and we were able
21:47
to to you know, inch up the budgets and get higher and hire with
21:52
the budgets and take on bigger responsibilities. And it's been still understand the value
21:56
and understand the dillar because when you raise your own money and you working on
22:00
that, it really teaches you a lesson on oh yeah, and and really
22:03
how to and putting your own personal money into into it. And we've learned
22:07
along which you don't do, don't do that, don't do that. No,
22:10
well no, we don't do, but we used to do it.
22:14
But but it really helps you respect of course every dollar you put into a
22:18
film. And that's why you know, we're always asking a lot of questions
22:22
about stuff and can we get this, and do we have to and you
22:25
know what's that going to cost? And these are any other options? Uh,
22:27
because we'd love it, but it's too expensive, right exactly. It's
22:32
uh, well, it's nice that Brad was like the eight hunter pound gorilla
22:34
in the room. That kind of opened the door. And you know,
22:37
you need everyone needs a champion. Everyone needs a champion, I mean.
22:40
And it's many times they've interviewed so many filmmakers on the show Oscar winners and
22:45
everyone in between. They they always have a champion. They always have either
22:49
a someone who's crazy, like the producer of Oliver Stone, who was like,
22:55
oh, make go make this into the Vietnam movie. Here's six million
22:57
that nobody would give it to him for twenty years, and then and then
23:02
he goes off and makes Plutunan and the rest of it. Do you ever
23:03
have a crazy eight hundred pound gorilla or it's very skilled. Let's see something
23:11
in you, you know, I think, and and Brett I was like,
23:17
I really would love a Christmas script? Can you write a Christmas script?
23:19
So that brings me to my next question, what is this this obsession
23:23
with Christmas guys? Seriously, you're out of control, Like I just no,
23:29
I look at her with your filmography, I'm like, Christmas, Christmas,
23:30
Christmas. Like I think, I think I see a pattern here.
23:34
So this is what I mean. It's it's great and it's fun, and
23:37
I see they may have obviously the Marley Me and the Flip doesn't nothing.
23:40
But then recently it's just been Christmas, Christmas, Christmas, Christmas. I
23:42
know the new movie coming out with Lindsay's next ones, the Irish the Bride
23:47
movie just act yeah, yeah, go ahead, Well yeah, no,
23:57
no, it's like, well, well we well, we love doing Christmas
24:02
movies. It's so I mean, you know, the first one was because
24:04
we actually loved Christmas and our big fans of Christmas movies, and we thought,
24:10
well, let's make one and see if everybody will watch ours every year.
24:11
Yeah, let's do it a castle and let's go to Europe and shoot
24:15
it at this beautiful castle. Let's find some place. Brad hit go off,
24:18
I'm going to send you. I found he sent to Romania, go
24:22
to castle in Romania, and here's here you go and make the movie.
24:26
And it was he got us, you know, Roger Moore got us.
24:29
Roger Moore, We we found Sam Pami. It was awesome. Yeah,
24:33
Sam, Sam. Nobody knew who Sam was. And we were telling back
24:36
to the States like we have this. This guy is amazing and he's going
24:41
to be a mega star and oh really yeah yeah, and Sam is obviously
24:45
he has you know, exploded and uh but as Genie said, Roger Moore,
24:49
I mean, Brad is like, I know, Roger Moore, do
24:52
you want James Bond in the movie, Like, yes, how do we
24:55
get him in this movie, and so it was it was an awesome movie
25:00
and it went number one. So then we be then we were sort of
25:03
you know, we were prove it and Christmas films and had a lot of
25:07
requests in a lot of Christmas. Yeah, and so go where the work
25:11
is and they're beautiful and fun and they're inspiring and hopeful, and so why
25:15
not you know, definitely to go where the work is. Hey, you
25:18
know, if people like what you know, that's that's one of the big
25:22
mistakes I've heard from a lot of people on the show that talked about They're
25:25
like they get a big hit in something and they're like, Christmas, No,
25:27
I want to do horror. Now I don't want to do Christmas,
25:30
but I just want to go into horror films because that's where my passion is.
25:33
Like, no, just stick to Christmas a little bit longer and then
25:36
go off and make something else. But you have to establish yourself on a
25:38
path of success before you can start, you know, you know, playing
25:42
bait an other words, Michael Jackson can am Michael Michael Jordan can jump from
25:48
basketball to baseball because he was Michael Jordan. He shouldn't have we all agreed,
25:52
but but he could because he had established himself. Yeah he took the
25:56
shop. Yeah you're right, Yeah right, I forgot about that. But
26:02
imagine doctor's rookie hear. He's like, you know what, I know,
26:04
I'm like the greatest, but really you needed a little time. So that's
26:07
a lesson that people should take. If you're lucky enough to have a lot
26:11
of success in one arena, they would stick with it. And you gotta
26:14
love it. It seems like you guys do love it though you do love
26:15
the Christians, you love it. I mean it was if it was something
26:18
that we were really unhappy doing, then I'm sure that we would, you
26:21
know, look up another way to kind of transition out. But we really,
26:25
we really do like we love when we love rom coms in general.
26:27
And also what's happened is is that rom coms sort of had you know,
26:33
they sort of kind of fell out of fashion and they're now coming back again.
26:37
But they but Christmas is always wrong comm so so for us we thought,
26:42
well that's great, Well we can stick with wrom com. You know,
26:45
if we stay in Christmas, then we can still do our wrong comp
26:48
And now it's starting to have a resurgence again. So so Irish Wish is
26:52
not Christmas and it's still a wrong comp right exactly. And in the days
26:56
of when Harry met Sally in Sleepless and Seattle with the studios are making these
27:00
big rom comms they don't like are My Best Friend's Wedding? That those don't
27:04
exist anymore in the studio system, not really. Now it's all Netflix,
27:07
Hallmark. Uh you know these many studios. Yeah, you're the ones.
27:11
Yeah, they're the ones making it rom comms, and that the bigger studios
27:15
are more on the franchise, franchise action, you know. I mean,
27:19
I think we'll exchange is doing stuff and you know, Rebel Wilson a little
27:25
bit. I mean, I think they're starting to kind of come back in
27:26
a more offbeat way, but you know, not quite the classic rom com
27:30
like they were back then. But Irish Wish is I think more what what
27:34
people are thinking of when they think of Lazim And Yeah, got to think
27:40
you're right fact brandbase is looking for because it's not the Christmas genre. It
27:44
really is more of a classic. Yeah. So let me let's talk about
27:47
your latest film, Falling, Falling for Christmas, which I saw on Netflix
27:51
before I even knew that you, because my wife and I were looking like,
27:52
oh, this would be a great family film that we've got the girls
27:55
there, and we started watching it and it's just a fun you know,
27:57
Saturday night, you know, everyone around around the campfire kind of watching movie.
28:02
And it was still it was so beautiful. It looked gorgeous. I
28:04
know, I was asking you before we got on I'm like, is that
28:07
a real place? Did you build the sets? Like? And I'm like
28:11
analyzing, I'm like it, I think it's because my wife was like,
28:14
I don't know, it looks I think it's real. I'm like, yeah,
28:17
I think it's real too. So I like, there's some sets there.
28:19
They built some stuff there, but it's not like a completely it's not
28:22
the green Stutle Christmas built the entire world send area. It was so it
28:27
was beautiful. So how did that? How did did did Netflix get involved
28:32
first? Or did you make it and they get Netflix? How does that
28:33
work? No, this was our first movie with Netflix, and we were
28:37
really excited when they they approached us with the script and Lizzie attached. So
28:45
yeah, so we with Brad are wonderful Bard. Yes, and you all
28:49
came together, yeah, and we yeah, and they wanted to show.
28:53
And what was great was that Lindsay's schedule worked out so that we could shoot
28:56
it actually in December, so we shot it in the snow in Utah Deer
29:00
Valley Park City Midway, YEP. So we were able to actually shoot it
29:06
in the snow. So that made it just that much more authentic. And
29:08
the location is that you're talking about our extraordinare because what we found was a
29:12
gem. It's the Goldener hersh in Deer Valley is they have the Austrian side
29:19
and then they just built this spectacular modern side and there's a passer rail between
29:26
them. And not to give away all the secrets and the magic of it,
29:29
but we had some stuff at our that was real physical right there that
29:33
we had at our disposal that we could really address and work with those structures
29:38
and they were and they were so close in proximity that we didn't have to
29:41
move our base camp so we were able to shoot. So we so our
29:45
days, we were able to use our our days actually shooting as opposed to
29:48
moving around. And then we found the beautiful doors Star Extender is this charming
29:52
in in Midway, Utah called Blue Boar Inn. We'll be right back after
29:59
a word from our sponsor. And now back to the show. And we
30:07
that's the one you know, the the North Star exterior saw that's the blueboard
30:12
in and it's and and we did build like the we built a little stable
30:17
for the horse and the and then WORKSHD and they're still there. They kept
30:19
them, keep them to care them down. We didn't tell them that part.
30:26
We just need to put And so fun because we go visit, uh,
30:30
the Blue Ori and you said he have brunch and then there's Balflazar,
30:33
there's our sets, this little stable right there, blighting area and this in
30:41
this film is it if I'm mistaken. It went to number one right on
30:44
Netflix. Yeah, it went number one on Netflix and in the world.
30:48
And then I think with all streamer, all streaming of all this all streaming
30:52
service, that's insane. How did you guys feel after you I mean,
30:56
that's that's a pretty decent accomplishment that I excuge. We were really excited.
31:03
We pop some champagne for sure. I mean, so you know, Lindsay
31:07
is such a wonderful actress. I mean I've been a fan of her since
31:11
uh, since she was a kid. And I've spoken to some of the
31:14
directors who worked with her on like Freaky Friday and and a Parent Trap in
31:18
those kind of days. But she's such a fantastic actress. Uh. And
31:22
and in this project she was she was, she was great, and she
31:26
has this fan base that just love her. Obviously because I saw it,
31:30
I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, she's one of those people
31:33
that we all recognize, we all remember, and we all generally have fond
31:37
memories of the work that she did, you know, when she was coming
31:40
up. And I think that's one of the reasons why everyone just gravitated to
31:44
this film and made it number one around the world no less, yeah,
31:48
you know, and it's multi generational for her fan base, and then the
31:51
young people are embracing mean girls again, and so that's three mean girls forgot
31:56
everybody's kids and grandkids and so her her fan But when we were in Ireland,
32:00
her fans were yep, and there's all these little school girls in their
32:05
little you know friends at thirteen. Yeah, they're like thirteen, fifteen years
32:07
old, you're stylid, know, hundreds of them get up the streets.
32:10
Yeah, We're like, wow, we're how do they know her? And
32:15
like you said, so if she just crosses over and and well deserved because
32:20
she really is an amazing talent and we're so excited that she's decided to come
32:23
back right exactly, and then yeah, now you have the new movie coming
32:28
out, which I'm excited to. Look, I love bron comms. It's
32:30
like one of my dirty the deep secrets. I just love walking, my
32:35
dirty cheek, but I just love walking. It's like calls what is a
32:37
dirty secret? It's a dirty secret? And I was like that is uh?
32:43
And boy bands like I like listening to boyd What am I gonna do
32:45
it? I mean, come on, I don't care lead the comments if
32:47
you walk, guys, I don't care. I wear it with pride now
32:51
best friends, the finest one, right, I swear, Oh the stop.
32:54
But don't get me started. I'm you're not going to get me to
32:57
sing it on air because they will become a me and I'm not going to
33:00
let that happen. In my head, I can't even all be I won't
33:07
be there. But but so I always like asking directors, uh this,
33:13
and producers this, what was the worst day? Onto that? Meaning like
33:17
we all have that day that the entire world's come crashing down around us,
33:21
because that's production. So what was that day for you and how did you
33:23
overcome that challenge? I know the day, Well, what happened was is
33:28
that we had no snow in its November and we all did a snow dance.
33:32
Oh yeah, and it snowed so much that we couldn't get anybody.
33:38
Everybody was stuck down at the bottom of the mountain. Jeanne and I stayed
33:43
at the top of the mountain. So we lost a half a day and
33:45
so like and also none of our backgrounds tell it made it up. Yes,
33:49
so we had to figure out how to Yeah, we had all a
33:52
crew had to step in and be and be background for I was scene like,
33:57
Yeah, it was, but it was we were I mean, it's
34:00
really hard to maneuver in a lot of snow. Yeah. And do you
34:05
ever the market, the Christmas markets? Yeah, of course it was coming
34:09
out it was ten below zero. I was gonna say, you know what,
34:13
I literally said, my wife, my wife look at it because we're
34:15
she's she's become a visual effects expert all of a sudden. Over the years
34:20
after being with you, still just like, is that And she's like is
34:22
that real? And I go, they didn't have the budget. This is
34:24
no way they had the budget to do that digitally. That's not that,
34:28
that's real. It's really that cool. The month I promise you was probably
34:31
that cold, and it was it was. It wasn't all that snow and
34:35
we were in a watershed, so we weren't allowed to make any snow.
34:38
So that's why we all had to do the snow dance. Put snow on
34:40
the trees. We couldn't be on a synthetics in any synthetic anything, nothing,
34:45
or the snow bubbles, we couldn't do anything. So so here we
34:49
are with a Christmas market, no snow, and then all of a sudden
34:52
it just dump it's snowed brief feet and then we couldn't get anybody up there.
34:57
Wall cut it off the snow and then we couldn't get anybody up there.
35:00
But anyway, so that was the most challenging day. But so we
35:02
had to shoot really fast picked as we lost a half a day, and
35:07
that's a it. So in other words, you showed up with one hundred
35:08
and fifty shots on your shot list and you shot ten basically exactly exactly here.
35:15
Okay, wat shot here, move the cap there and we're out boys.
35:19
Let's go okay, move on, move on. We will have the
35:22
five er extrays. We have fifty okay, so uh let's put them all
35:27
over here. Now let's get other jackets and move them over here. I
35:30
did that all the time. But that's the best. I mean, you
35:34
don't need five hundred. I mean unless you're Ridley Scott. I mean you
35:37
know you need a good twenty thirty. Just fill the screen. Just fill
35:42
the frame. That's all you need. What you want that you can't tell?
35:46
Yeah, no, I put it. I couldn't tell it all.
35:49
No. That was a beautiful little Christmas town and we did get we finally
35:53
they came up. And what was great is that it actually made it.
35:57
But it was now eleven o'clock at night, and then we weren't allowed to
36:01
think. They started. We can't playing music at the eleven. So we
36:05
had the whole singing and the fireworks and with everybody speaking and they were all
36:08
there to sing, and then we couldn't sing because we couldn't play music.
36:12
So we just kind of you know, it's one of those we just said,
36:15
just ask forgiven that. Yeah, so let's just crank up the music
36:19
was what we're probably one take at this. Let's just turn around, put
36:22
it on eleven, go to eleven, sing everybody until they just say stop,
36:27
you know that, until they pulled the power plot on. I see
36:30
that. But you know it was Christmas and it was a Christmas song and
36:32
everybody, Yeah, nobody complained. Actually they were so worried about the people
36:36
in the condos complaining, but nobody was complaining. It's not like hard it's
36:39
not like rash metal. You guys. That was a twenty old world,
36:45
the world and the shop, not until too you know they did. He
36:49
shut us down on Joy to the World, and what kind of You're gonna
36:52
go straight to hell? And you go straight to hell at that point,
36:54
I mean, what's the point now? Another question that was asking, you
36:59
know, the couples who work together, how do you balance I mean,
37:02
because it's insane to be in the film industry, how do you balance the
37:07
work relationship with the personal relationship, especially on step because on set is a
37:13
stressful place. Production is a stressful praise, feelings get hurt, egos get
37:17
crushed. You know, how do you especially working so closely together as a
37:21
producing directing team. How do you balance that for other other teams out there
37:25
might be listening, want to say something, well, you know, go
37:30
ahead. Oh. I think that it starts with the fact that we have
37:37
very similar artistic tastes and tendencies, and so our vision tends to be a
37:44
cohesive idea, and we don't really argue a lot about stuff because we we
37:52
tend to like the same things, and we tend to want and a lot
37:54
and especially because we write, you know, most of the stuff are at
37:58
least rewrite and always share thing we do. We're so close to it,
38:01
we've already worked through it. So we finish a lot of thoughts in writing.
38:07
Like we'll be writing, She'll start a sentence and then I'll just it
38:10
just comes out. I'm finishing, and that she's perfecting the night, and
38:14
then and then she does the other character, and then we start to have
38:15
a dialogue. We start acting out the scenes right there in the office,
38:20
and so it's well between the script and then free productions were ously we like,
38:25
we're really specific about everything that we want to put on screen, so
38:30
up time that we finally get there, I think that we have a pretty
38:34
good, a pretty good idea, and we don't really have a lot to
38:37
fight about except for fight for something together exactly. That makes sense, That
38:45
makes perfect sense. Let me ask you if there was something that you guys
38:49
could say, each of you, if you can go back in time and
38:51
tell your younger self one thing about this business, a warning if you will,
38:57
there's a little piece of a device at the beginning of the career.
39:00
What would that be? Well, I would say, I would say,
39:07
if you really believe in yourself, and you really believe in something and and
39:10
and know it to be true, You've You're gonna hear a lot of stuff
39:16
down the road, and I'll give you Mike quick by Mike quick spray,
39:22
of which is my record. When you say, that's probably the best.
39:24
No, we's saying you're gonna tell yourself something, something different, something to
39:29
work, something like you know, guys, is that I bet is wanting
39:32
other people? I thought that's wanting your other people. Something would happen to
39:36
me. No, no, no warning, Like you personally can go back
39:38
in time with Martin McFly. You talk to your sixteen year old self and
39:42
you're thinking about getting into this business, and you go listen, guys,
39:45
you're gonna have an hell of a ride. I can't tell you anything else,
39:46
but the one thing you should be weary about is it's gonna take a
39:52
long time. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor, and
40:00
now back to the show. Uh, you're gonna have to write. Uh.
40:06
I don't know. The sooner that you can figure out what what it
40:09
is, what your passion is, and what it is that you want to
40:12
do, go for it and it may it may not present itself right away,
40:16
but really, pay attention to what is meaningful to you in whatever industry
40:22
you know. Within the industry, I wish that I would have paid more
40:27
attention, and I wish that I would have transitioned out of dancing sooner,
40:30
or at least while I was while I was arm camera, I would have
40:35
paid more attention to what was going on in the camera. But I didn't
40:37
know that that's where I was going to go, so I would have a
40:39
lived my direct And you want to go with Copela and Lucas and all those
40:44
great people, So don't waste your youth, don't waste your nd the moment.
40:51
No, really, I mean, if you want to go into the
40:52
entertainment industry, the sooner you know that you can get in and get work
40:55
experience and actually dive in there and and not and not wait for stuff to
41:01
come to you. I don't know. That's what I would say. That
41:05
make that makes perfect sense. Now I'm going to ask you a few questions.
41:07
I ask all of my guests what advice would you give a filmmaker trying
41:10
to break into the business today? The tenations and created and and if you
41:20
know, if one door doesn't open, find another door, because there's a
41:22
lot of doors available. Now, I would say, get on a movie
41:25
set as fast as you can. Yeah, I don't care where are you
41:30
going to be? Because Jeanine and I have elevated people on our sets that
41:37
came in and had no experience, and we just said, you know what,
41:42
this young person should be over with the production and design team. They're
41:45
they're they're they're getting us coffee, and this person needs to be over there
41:51
learning because if we saw, we saw what was happening, you know what
41:53
I mean? And so we need to get on a set and be and
41:55
be a really good troubleshooter and bit qually yeah exactly, and be open and
42:01
listen and anybody just any department engaged with them, you know, don't harass
42:08
them. But you know, like I did with birds and sorry or about
42:10
the camera? Now, how don't was that sprocket doing? No? But
42:14
you know, you know, there's a point where you're annoying. But but
42:17
just really be there and be present and listen and pay attention. Uh,
42:23
it is so important, and have positive energy. Upset, don't don't yond,
42:29
don't yond. That's a really big one. Yeah, don't have to
42:31
yon. Really try not be y on. Yeah, go outside, go
42:35
wait, go go in theok outhouse or something on. But just don't let
42:38
anybody see if Yanni upset? Now, what is the lessons that took you
42:43
the longest to learn, whether in the film industry or in life? Good
42:49
question, I okay, why is the opposite of Michaelson? That is to
42:53
be confident in myself? That believing yourself more believing myself and that I am
43:01
I am prepared and I am I am worth it. So it took me
43:07
a long time to have a lot of confidence in myself. Michaels the most
43:13
confident person that ever worked, I mean not bus and said too much.
43:19
I was just I just thought, you know, my parents just instilled that
43:23
it just are you're going to do it because all the way, do you
43:29
not ever quit anything? I don't care. What is the only thing I
43:34
did quit? I want to tell you is that I had a paper route
43:37
and I had to quit because the dogs attacked me. Every time a dollar
43:40
rook. My pants were shredded. Sorry, I just I've never told anybody
43:45
in any interview. That's all that I quit. The question the most question.
43:53
So Alex, remind me that what is the lesson that pick you the
43:59
long is to learn? Whether the film industry or in life the longest to
44:05
learn, I would say, probably, uh not jacko you but I think
44:12
I think a lot of it was learned, really just learning and paying attention
44:17
and and really picking up all the all the nuances on the set. I
44:22
could have learned a lot more. I did learn, but I think I
44:25
would have I guess I didn't know I was going to be on the other
44:28
side of the camera. I would have been I would have been paid a
44:30
little more attention to certain things. But uh gosh, any good answer,
44:37
it's a good answer, that's a good answer. And and also never underestimate
44:42
the power of naivete Uh, it is it is a very did I was
44:46
not and it is a gift. It is a gift. But also the
44:52
the thing I always tell people is like, there isn't there's an insanity to
44:55
what we do. It's insane. It's insane. It's insane th a whole
45:00
bunch of people together try to tell a story and up a hill with snow
45:02
and that there's just it's an insanity to even believe that we could do this
45:07
in the first place. Do you need that? Do you even just get
45:08
in on the field to play? But then when you're you have denial and
45:15
you have like you're completely clueless. All love the way, but it's very
45:21
powerful but extremely dangerous, and you don't want no, you're just that's you've
45:29
got such a good team. You know, why aren't girls such a good
45:31
team? This is why you need balance. Yeah, you gotta you gotta
45:37
know your stuff. And we're we're we like to have a lot of fun,
45:40
but we're really detail oriented. We have a plan every single minute,
45:46
and you know, and of course the plan is going to go right out
45:50
the window. The meaning you get on the set and we now find out
45:52
that we can't shoot this way because now all the wind is blowing the blue
45:55
screen into the set, and now we have to shoot another thing. And
45:59
you've got to learn how to adapt quickly. The most important thing is keep
46:02
the train moving, don't addic find a way to adapt, and always keep
46:07
rolling camera. It's really when I see people just stop and everything just grinds
46:13
into the hall. It's painful sometimes yet it's necessary. But try to keep
46:20
shooting. Find solutions, find something to shoot, Buy solutions, and find
46:22
something to shoot because it's in the taxi with the meter running and you've got
46:28
the end of the day. I miss the you know, the enemy,
46:30
but constantly you know, have a plan, but be prepared for the unexpected.
46:36
And I think that's what happens almost every day. Upset to be honest
46:39
with you, and three of your favorite films of all time Days of Heaven,
46:46
Star Wars, The Natural, Feel, The Dreams, The Dreams.
46:55
Where's your baseball movie coming out? Mike? You? I you like those
46:59
three? Love? I love all three of those movies. When is it?
47:05
Juliet Ye? And Uh? Heaven and Juliet and Well, because these
47:09
Jesus were sort of life forming experiences for me. So and then also A
47:14
Star is Born the Barbarstrison. Okay, all right, that's a good.
47:19
That's those that's a good. That's a good. Stat The ones that I
47:22
those were the ones that made me want to get into the felt. Can
47:25
I throw fourth in there? Sure? Reece. Oh that was the one
47:30
that when I sat in that theater, it just oh, man, I
47:34
mean you want to talk about the spense of disbelief though you were forty five
47:37
year olds playing teenagers. I mean seriously, yeah, I mean seriously,
47:44
I mean seriously, what was it? Was it Candon? Was that what's
47:46
what's her name? Scard Canny? She was like thirty three peck out.
47:52
Yeah, I didn't know. Listen, I didn't know about me an,
47:57
I love that movie, but like we go back and like they're they're like
48:01
fifty what is going on? And why aren't you flying away at the end
48:06
into the sky that was never established? Like what's going on? Also?
48:13
I asked all those questions, just said, you know, I like Praese,
48:15
but I did want to know what was with the A And he said
48:17
you she was asking me all these I was like, I don't really care.
48:22
I just love the movie. Michael I'm like, you, I completely
48:25
suspend this believe. My wife, on the other hands, like that's not
48:29
the way it would happen. I'm like, it're just can you just enjoy?
48:34
Can you suspend that little disbelief. I need to watch movies together,
48:37
Alex, you and I need to watch because I just my mighty cruise.
48:42
But she's like she just watches it and she's like ruined stuff, and I'm
48:45
like, I'm like it's it's like, oh, that's not the way a
48:50
doctor's office would because I'm like, I don't care. I don't care.
48:53
I just let me enjoy. Like she's ruined many a movie for me,
48:59
and I'm very care now, like this is okay. So I forced her
49:01
to watch Star Wars. Okay, Michael, I forced all six of them.
49:06
This years ago, years ago when we first started dating. And at
49:08
the end, she goes she's like, you know, Darth Vader's kind of
49:15
a punk, and I'm like, how do you what do you mean?
49:16
She's like, you know, he's basically the the The Emperor's like you know,
49:22
you know, like lap dog, and he goes around in timid any
49:28
people of this deep breathing and choking people out with his imagination. I don't
49:30
understand it. And I was like, oh my god, that is really
49:36
amazing description of Darth with his deep breath and chokes people out with his bats
49:43
and base. But I was like, no, what I think? Do
49:45
you want to talk about balance? There's the balance, there's you always need
49:50
the battance. I don't have Star Wars too though, thank you I did.
49:54
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor, and now back
50:01
to the show. I like, I sneak I sneak up, and all
50:08
of a sudden, I hear Jenny like, are you watching Star Wars?
50:12
Like it's done? Of that? Are Indiana Jones? And hey look hey
50:17
I really I was going to have that as like for my fifth film,
50:21
Indiana. Yeah, Rader is the Lost Star. Oh I did see the
50:24
new trailer. I'm I just came out. It just came out, like
50:28
awy hours ago. It looks really nice. It looks good, it looks
50:32
good. I am James Mangold as the director. So also I have high
50:39
hopes. I have high hopes that he's not going to be blown up by
50:43
a nuclear bomb in the refrigerator this time, so we could keep geeking out
50:49
about movies forever. Guys. I appreciate you coming on the show. It's
50:51
such a pleasure talking to you, guys. Continue success. I can't wait
50:53
through to see Lindsay's new movie. And You're a new movie. When it
50:57
come? When's it coming out? By the way, Irish Wire, Oh,
51:00
we don't have a release date. Well, we're just editing it now,
51:02
so I think they'll it'll be forthcoming your release state. But we're not
51:07
cheering yet. Twenty three, twenty twenty three. Yeah, we'll be done
51:12
fire at April May with you know when we picture lock and colored her in
51:15
sound music. All that should be around by April May. Well, guys,
51:20
continue success, and it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you. Guys.
51:23
Thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you so much
51:27
for having us so much. Thank you. I want to thank Michael Njanine
51:30
for coming on the show and dropping their knowledge bombs on the Tribe today.
51:35
Thank you so much. Guys. If you want to get links to anything
51:37
we spoke about in this episode, head over two of the show notes at
51:39
Bulletproof Screenwriting dot TV Forward Slash three forty six. Thank you so much for
51:45
listening, guys. As always keep on writing no matter what. I'll talk
51:49
to you soon. Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof Screenwriting
51:53
dot tv.