Latest / GenX Adulting Podcast / Episode 38 - GenX Speaks Series: Julie Golden - Founder and Host of The Big D Dating Show

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Episode 38 - GenX Speaks Series: Julie Golden - Founder and Host of The Big D Dating Show · GenX Adulting Podcast

• 0:00
  [MUSIC]Welcome to Gen X Adulting.Today we have Julie Golden,who is the founder andhost of the Big D Dating Show.Welcome, Julie.Thank you. Thank you for having me.We're thrilled to have you.The first question wealways ask our guests is,what year were you born?1969.So you are Gen X.I am Gen X, baby.I'm cringing and now Ijust said that by the way.So I have the firstthing I want you to lose.Now it's fine.There's no cringing inGen X. We own it all.That's true. Failure is funny to us.Yes, exactly. Where were you born?I was born in Chicago, Illinois.Midwest.Yeah.Are your parents from there?Yes. I had to just do aquick because of course,as a Gen X gal,I have two sets of parents.All of them from the Midwest, yes.Your mom and dad, doyou know how they met?I do. My dad was a jazz pianist.He played at theJewish Country Club known asNipper Sync and my mom,it was like dirty dancing.My mom was there and they fell in love.I mean, it didn't stick,so I don't know whatthey did, but they had me.That's awesome.That's cool.He played the piano.Yeah. He actually played thePlayboy Mansion in Chicago.He toured, I guess hedidn't tour with Phil Stiller.I've been tellingthat story. I was wrong,but he played for her.So he was a jazz pianistand then my mother's father,who was a lawyer at the time,informed him that he wouldno longer be a jazz pianist.He would be a lawyer andhe would come up for him.So was he always musically inclined,like through his childhoodand college and everything?Yeah. He's where I get allof my creative compulsions.My mom would disagree,which is always funny to me,but yeah, my dadraised me on Mill Brooks,Carl Reiner, Looney Tunes.He's a hilarious,former actor, jazz pianist.So that's definitely whereI get all that stuff from.And my mom, well, that'sgoing to be a much larger story.But she was a big deal in publishing.Like so impressive.I mean, the biggestbadass woman, love her,but she thought she was funny.I'm like, no mom,they were paid to laugh,bigger jokes, that's different.Like if you're the boss,you have no idea if you're funny, but.Yeah.So was she a writer?Was she involved in the movie?
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  No. She actually, she, youknow, back in the day,I'm trying to do the math, I guess,they split up when I was like two,so that would be, I guess 1972, right?That's probably most people were like,hey, let's get out of here.I don't know.She was a stay at home mom at the time,which is a very strange concept to me.And that is no shadeto stay at home moms.That's just, if youknew my mom, that's crazy.Right. I don't think that wasever going to be her path,but she had not gone to college.She used to be embarrassed of that.I think it's one of thecoolest parts of her story.They split up and this wasback in the Don Draper divorcedays, you know, wherethere was no shared,I mean, there was shared custody,whatever it was like,I went with her and I saw him.Yeah.So essentially, I mean,not, he was a great dad.I'm not saying he was negligent on his duties, but she really was. A single mom and shehad to make a living.So she got a job as a secretary.I can't remember the name of the place,but she worked her way upthrough the kind of the adselling space of publishing.And without a college degree behind her,she ended up becoming the group publisherof Crane's communications,like just ran the whole thing.So, very cool.Would that have been like, so through the same thing, she was building hercareer and then in the 80s,kind of took that over basically.Yeah, she was the shit.She would not like it.So she was like thatquintessential, oh, that's okay.We see.She was like thequintessential, like 80s working woman,working mom can do it all.Yes.Everything.So that was your example with your mom.And then your dad, yousaid gave up his son's lifeand then he gave up his life.
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  His arts, his love for thearts and became a lawyer.Yeah.That was definitely back in the daywhen he had to grow up early.And if he had a kid, hebecame a responsible adult.So he, I don't know if hehad already gone to law school,but my mother's father was asuccessful lawyer at the timeand said, you're gonnacome work for me, kid.Did he keep working for his father-in-lawafter they got divorced?No, because fun story.And yes, I almost had adevelopment deal for this.My grandfather,I don't know if he wasembezzling money from clients,but the law thingdidn't work out for him.I think my dad was involved withdefending him at one point.He was disbarred forsome kind of shady dealingsand became a travelingsalesman, my grandfather.So no.And then I can bury the leader.I can get right intothe juiciest part of this.But it's so interesting to mebecause it's like the arcof feminism, like my mom.Anyway, my grandmother, my nani,was totally like afabulous stay-at-home Jewish momin the suburbs in Skokie of Chicago.I remember there was just like Tab.You remember Tab?Oh yeah.Yeah.I mean, I can't believe I'm saying,do you remember Tab on a Gen X podcast?I can taste it.I can taste Tab as you said it.But back then, I loved it.I didn't get into the diet drinks tilllike now I'm addicted.I loved it.And then they came out withone that was like with lemon.Yeah.And I loved that one.Just rat poison in a can.It was great.Yeah, yeah.Pretty much.Did she work for Tab?No, sorry.I just had a flashback tohanging out at the pool.There was always Tab there.No, so in addition to mygrandfather not being greatwith the client'smoney and all that stuff,he had started to have,I'm just laughing because I'm like,"Wow, I'm just tellingthe whole family story."He had an affair with my uncle's friendand left my grandmother for her.I don't know how old she was at the time.I don't know if she was,but she was young, she was very young.But here's what I'm gonna say.Right.With him to the end.They were soulmates.So there's something there.But the point is-So she stayed with him?She stayed with him?I mean, the mistressbecame the wife, yes.Oh, okay.Sorry.Your grandma was a stay-at-home mom.Did she end up going to work?Or did he support her?No, that's the fun twistthat got Hollywood allexcited at one point.I'll come back to it and sell it one day.There was this great place in Skokiecalled Myron and Phil's.It was a red leather booth, restaurant,just boozy, the broads,the cocktail waitresses.And I guess she was there one nightcrying over her martini to a friend.Oh, sorry, I forgot this part.She tried to get work,but the governmentwas garnishing her wagesbecause of my grandfather's crimes.So she literally could not make money.She could not make an honest living.And so she's crying over her martini.And this guy next toher hears it and says,"Hey, are you good at math?"And anyway, his name was Irv.I thought he was my uncle Irv.That was his crime name.He was a bookie for the mob.And he hired her to be a baglady and they fell in love.And she worked for him foreverand they worked together till she died.So yeah. That's amazing.Yes. That's cool.That's very badass actually, I think.It's a history of badass womenthat did what they had to do to get done.Yeah, no, that's awesome.So, and this was all,everyone stayed in thatChicago area, your whole family.Yeah, my mom, my biological fatherand I were born in the city.And then there was,then we moved out toMount Carroll, Illinois.There was this big movement back thenof like city peoplemoving out to the country,like to Little Town, USA.And that's where they split up.And then my mom and Imoved back to the cityand then she met my now stepfather.Well, she squeezedanother marriage in therewith another guy, but whatever.That was, he was one and done, Herschel.My mom did the same thing.She was, you're saying your mom wasmarried three times?Correct.So was mine.Yep, they liked to get married back then.Yeah. They did.I think they thought they had to, right?It wasn't as easy.I know with my mom,with my second stepdad,and I don't know if you ever refer,he used to laugh because I'd be like,well, that was with my second stepdad.And then there was my third stepdad.That's hilarious.
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  But-I still laugh. Yeah.Your entertainment.
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  I know, I know.But I remember my dad had said to my mom,because they were living together.And he said, well, I don't want her thereif you're not married.And so she just, they got marriedbecause my dad had saidyou can't live togetherand they shouldn't have gotten married.They should have just datedfor a while and lived together.But I think back then women thought,well, we have to getmarried to these people.Yeah, I mean, I thinkthat's still part of our psycheuntil you get divorcedand started dating show called "Live D."But yes.For the women before us though,I think it was just out of my-Oh, for sure, for sure.I think you've got a story there.It just probably has to cycle backwhen Hollywood's producing storiesabout in Chicago again, right?Right.They don't seem to bedoing it at the moment,but that stuff will come back.I think you're right.Yeah, thank you.I've always held onto it.It got so far, it was one of those like,lunch ships coming, andthen it just broke my heart.And I'm like, this will be later.It's not going anywhere.I'm sure it's meant to be.So do you know whyyour parents got divorced?I was so young.I mean, knowing them now,they were never gonna be together.Like, I think she wassuch a larger than life,fiercely independent womanthat was going to takeover a portion of the world.I think she was probably,if I had to guess, shewas probably restless.I don't know that she wasarticulating that at the time,but they definitely fought a lot.I remember hearing themscreaming at each other.It was not good.And did you have siblings?Nope, just me.Okay.And then did your dad,was he still a lawyerafter they got divorced?Did he continue down ordid he go back to the arts?No, he did continue lawyering.And actually he stayed inMount Carroll, Illinois,his wonderful littletown, a little college town,when we moved back to the city.And that's where he met my now stepmom,who's amazing, Patty.And she was clerking,I think at the time,but she was another lawyer.So, lawyers in love.Yeah.But he's still, just to be clear,he's never stopped playing pianoand he gigs whenever he can.He has, it's thehappiest you'll ever see.That man is on the keys.That's awesome.That is cool.From the other marriages,were there other children?No, unlike you, thesecond husband for my mom,well, yes and no,sorry, my mom, Herschel,it was like, I don't know,she claims that he was really mean to me.I don't remember that, but there's nostepfather one and two.Like when Michael, my stepfather,entered the picture, Iwas seven and it's been him.Like he's still, you know, he's my dad.Yeah, but my dad's my dad.You know what I mean?I don't mean, I'm lucky.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Yeah, yeah, yeah.That was great.And then my stepmomand my biological fatherdid have two boys later, youknow, I was in high school.And the weird thing is, you know,they were babies whenI was in high schooland now they're in their30s and we are so closeand we are so similar,which is so interesting to me.I mean, talk about nature nurture, like.Yeah, that's awesome.Cause you weren'traised in the same home.Did you see them likeevery other weekend or no,you would have been by high school.Yeah.You've been doing your things.So that's awesome.You guys are close.I can't even explain.I mean, my dad and I andone of my brothers, Josh,it's like triplets when we're together,the same sense ofhumor, everything, you know?That's awesome.And Zach's amazing too, but he's more,I feel he's more like Patty.It's just interesting, yeah.So I'm very.To have that wide of a age gap tooand not grow up in thesame house and be like that,it's very cool.Yeah, I can't even explain it.Cause I also moved out to Los Angeles,like pretty much as soonas I got out of college.So I, apparently according to my brother,Josh, who now lives out here,I'm the reason he came out to California.I'm like, do not put that on me.I have no idea what you were witnessing,but I was constantly havinga nervous breakdown of my 20sworking in Hollywood.So I don't, it lookedvery glamorous to them, but.Yeah, of course, of course.Now, would you say your childhoodwas a typical Gen X childhood?Did you have some of those,how we all say we were feraland no one was watching usand we were unsupervised?Like what would yourperspective be on that for yourself?Well, so funny when you were like,tell us some memories, like by you sayingthat I just remembered whenwe moved back to the city,so now we're in Chicago.Like this is crazy tome in hindsight, right?We're in the city.Like were there less serial killers then?I don't understand, how am I alive?You know?No, I think that they didn't know.It was ignorance is less.Right, in a way.But if I'm doing this right,I was in second or third gradeand all the kids on theblock, we all knew each otherand we were just, you know, the classic,like out till the sun came down.I remember there was a boy older than uswho in hindsight should nothave been hanging out with usand he had like a kissing contest.I mean, it's crazy, you know?Yeah.Yeah, now you thinkabout the things we didand what we were exposed to,we would never, ever, everlet our children do that.Raising them.No, there was an intersection there.Sorry, go on.Well, no, did you hang outon like a stoop anywhere?Somebody stares like arandom set of stares?Well, we were in the city,I have, we moved 15 times growing up too.So that's another part of my, yeah.But so in the city, wewere in apartment buildings.So there weren'treally stoops, as I recall,it was just running around the streets.And I was just gonna say there was thisintersection nearestthat was insane, one ofthose like 10 different,like we would cross that.I think I almost diedonce, I do remember that.Like, oh, kidsshouldn't be crossing here.No, no, I think that to write itin some ways, Gen X becamekind of helicopter parents.Like our pendulum went this way,because I feel like Gen Xtried to give our childrenthe childhood that wehad wanted as far as,not that all of ourchildhoods were horrible,but there are certainthings we probably all wantedand we tried to make surewe gave that to our kids.And as a result, some of our kids have,then I think issues inother areas because of that.They're totally in it,they have no life skills.I have a whole set ofit, believe me, yes.Yeah, yeah.Yeah, but we are, we'recompensating and overcorrectingfor what, which wasreally parental neglect,but they didn't know any better.Yeah. They didn't.And we survived.Yeah, we did, we did, we did.But I think that all ofus to some degree could saywe have some sort oftrauma, whatever it isthat we could unpack andI think it's because of,he's still working on that.But, you know, and now we have Gen Z,and Gen Z is awesome.I love Gen Z, but there are certainthings where you're like,I was doing that when I was nine,how do you not know how to do that at 22?I don't understand, youknow, but that's because of us.Well, I have a newtheory, because it's so funny,this is my new theory,we did too good a job,we should pat ourselves in the back,because my son who's 15, no interestin getting his driver's license,like doesn't need to leave the house.Like, you know, youcouldn't keep us insidewhen we were kids.
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  Yeah.Yeah. Yeah.But to a degree, I'mlike, he doesn't hate me.He wants to be near me, you know?Yes, it's a great trade off.It's true, we have kids in their 20s,and then we have a 15 year old,and they all wanna hang outwith us, and it's awesome.Yeah, and it's not like the cool parentsare irresponsible, it's just like,not this like black and white, I'm the,because I said so,right, the generation of kidsshould be seen, but not heard.Like, that's a lot, you're not supposedto be heard as a kid.Yeah.No, we've given them aspace to express themselves,and we listen, and it's so cool.You know, I love thatyou brought that up,because I will takethat trade off any day.Yes, same. I'll teach them my skillsif what I created wasan authentic relationshipwith my child.Sounds great. It's a great trade off.I agree. Yeah, 100%.So why did you guys move 15 times?Oh, can I circle back a little bit to somethingyou Bryan said, andthen move back to the 15?Absolutely. Because Bryan,you're saying we survived,but I think what's interestingabout that is, I wannacompare therapy bills later in lifewith how much therapy our kids have,and how much therapy we've had.But anyway, that's, we'll see.(laughing) That's a good point.But we don't know, we don't know.Okay, 15 times.This is interesting,this is another time, okay?So, well first of all,there's a bigger psychological thingI've realized now is that my parents,rather than a hobby orany existential whatever,or any therapy or any like,they would just remodel housesand move, and move, and move.There's a psychological thing.But financially andeconomically, that was back in the daywhen you could just be aregular person who had a job,you got raises, you could buy a house,you could then buy a nicer house,you could keep improvingyour life, and that's over now.So they did that, westarted off in a rental apartment,and I remember they boughtthe first little teeny fixer,and they were very, they built the deck.They knew how to do everything too.Yeah, I don't know how to do anything.So they kept doing that, and then I thinkthey just gotaddicted to avoiding staringinto their souls, and justlooking at wallpaper instead.There's a fine equal incentive there too.You can parlay, parlayand keep making money.And they did.I don't wanna, you're absolutely correct.They were great with money.I didn't get that part from them.But they were great with money.They could, money waslike rabbits for them.They could just, yeah.Yeah.They were ahead of their time flipping.They really were.That's so funny, Ididn't even think of that.Now wouldn't be considered anything.Yeah, no, but I mean, andI get what you're saying,it was probably adistraction for them, like you said.But it was also, they were way ahead of,because now that, thenflipping, it's gone crazy.That's a whole thing,but they were way ahead.But we moved three times ina three block radius once.That was weird.Yeah.(laughing) Did you have to change schools that much,or were you able to atleast go to the same school?Yeah, this is so fun.I feel like this is, Ilove what you've created,a safe place for kids today.No, but I mean, this wasback when public school was,well, okay, wait, there was also,I feel like this ispolitically incorrect to say,but it was a thing that happened,and I don't know what to call it.So we started off in the city,and the Chicago PublicSchool System collapse,as it did in so manycity public school systems.So there was thisthing called white flight,which I don't, I mean, it's,I think it's a historical term,but basically everybody moved out.White people moved to the suburbs.Correct, yeah.Yeah, worked with, yeah.So that's what we did.So the schools were excellent out there.So to answer your question,you went to your local school.There was no, you guysare in Florida, right?Yeah, yeah.I don't know if you'vegot the whole magnet points,it's like all thiscraziness of magnets and charters,or is your local school good?We have, publicschool's great where we are.And so what it is is wehave great public schools,and then the privateschools are excellent.And then our public schools have,it's kind of maybe likecharter, I'm not sure,but they have programs.Like one of them has a pre-med program.One of them has anentrepreneurship program.And you can, if you're not zoned,you can apply to be in a lottery.Yes, charter, yes.And if you're part of your stuff,like let's say it'sfive miles across townor 10 miles across town, you get picked,your kid can go there.Yes.So if you're zoned, youautomatically get to goto your high school, let's say,but you can try to go to others.Is that kind of what you mean?Yeah, and I don't know ifyou have the magnet system,we have a version of that too,where you have to like game the systemwhile your baby's in utero,you have to like apply it.The point is it's so brokenthat we're trying to create these waysto ensure a school path,but my kid hasn't been to the same schoolwith his friends the whole time.But to answer your question, Brian, yeah,like I moved, but I still went to thesame elementary school.I still have the same friends.I still went to the same high school.Like it wasn't that, yeah.That suburbia kind of smallish town.Yes.Limited number of schools, right?Yeah, yeah, there really were.If you go to like Manhattan, right?There's public school one through 99.And they're in differentneighborhoods and all that.And depending on where youlive, that's where you go.The suburbs, like where I grew up,we had two elementaryschools, one junior highand one public highschool and one private.Where'd you grow?For your choices.What's that?Where did you grow up, Brian?I grew up in a placecalled Sparta, New Jersey.Okay.About 50 miles west of Manhattan.Got it.The northwest corner of New Jersey.Very rural farmland,very beautiful actually.Not what you think of Jersey.Not like Tony Soprano.No.No, we could go see Tony.He was 30 miles east, but yeah.You could visit Tony,but then you get to go backto your nice farmland little town.All of Tony's guys nowown all the McMansionswhere I grew up.Of course, exactly.Yeah, yeah.That Chicago style thing, right?Once you get out,probably Chicago, metro suburbs.Yeah, yeah, there was a lot of that.So at least when that was going on,you didn't have to change schools.You had the consistency offriendships and your schools,but that had to have caused some anxietyright as you would getsettled into your bedroom againand into a routine in this home.But you probably neverreally totally rootedbecause you knew this is not gonna stay.It's not permanent.That makes sense on paper.And yet I swear to you,I loved when we moved.It was exciting to seewhere my new room was gonna be.It's weird.No, that's great.That is cool.But I'm gonna just throw out a crazypsychological theoryhere, it's not crazy, Ithink this is correct.I remember it being very happy andexciting when we movedbecause they were happy,because they liked the project.So the smell of wallpaperor paint, things were good.Yeah, that makes sense.It was kind of tied.So you knew that thatmeans everything's okay.Yes, oddly.We were good, so you guys were all good.Yeah, I never thoughtabout that till now, but yeah.Now have you found as anadult, you fix things upor that you enjoy it?Do those scents bring back a feeling of,I don't know,contentment or happiness for you?Does it trigger anything good?Yes and no, I lovemoving into a new place.It's totally empty.It does feel like, Imean, it's a fresh start,but I also feel like aprisoner of this compulsionto look at open houses constantly.And they were alwaystrying to suck me in.They're like, look atthis house down the street.I'm like, I'm happy here, leave me alone.So that constant need.That lingers, that haslingered it seems like.Yeah, I've licked it, yes.I don't feel good whenI go into an open house.I start to hyperventilate.I'm like, no, what are we doing?This is avoidance.That is really interesting.So when you were in elementaryand did you call juniorhigh or middle school?Where you were from?That's interesting.I feel like it was called middle school.I don't think it wascalled junior high school.Okay, so through elementary, middleschool, high school,did you play any sportsor were you involved with music or arts?Well, I don't know about you guys.Wait, where did you grow up, Nicole?Oregon, Portland.Okay, so we had elementary schooland those separate middle schools.That what you guys had in high school?I think you called it junior high.I think you called it junior high, right?But it was separate, yes.No, I mean, I did, but Iwas not an athletic kidand sadly my son has followed suit.Yeah, elementary school,I think I was alreadykind of a theater kidwanting to be in plays.Junior high school,all my friends dumped meand I became unpopular.So I was just trying tosurvive the three years there.Middle school sucks.I think it's the worst time for peopleand I think it's theworst time to be a parentbecause I know I wentthrough hell and my kids did.I saw PTSD from what my kids went throughand there are kidswho were mean to my kidsand I could be 80 and seethem in the grocery storeand I'll still curse them.I'm with you.Our kids have gotten past it.I will never, no, my kids maybe havegotten past, I won't.I'm absolutely with you.I know it's unhealthy.I'm absolutely with you.I despise these children.I don't see them as children.I see them as future dictators.I know exactly who they're gonna be.I don't buy any evolution for thembecause I remember them.100%.Parenting is re-parenting.Yes, no, I know that's the worst thingis they then do it with their kids.It's just the bullies havingmore bullies and more bullies.So listen, when you said that about howyour friends flippedand then you were justtrying to get through,I hear you, it's the worst.It's the worst and my son,it's so funny becauseI totally take pridein being a former nerdwhile a lot of people saythey were a nerd.Like you weren't a nerd.I know I can smell nerd on people.You don't have trauma on you.But it's easier to be popular.So I was hoping myself would be popular.And the moment I saw it, I'm like,first of all, it makes total sensebecause he's, you know, and he's amazing.He's like hilarious and weird and loud.I'm like, that was me, that was me.Not cool, you know?And it was great in elementary school.The kids loved it, butthen it's like weird.It's like they wanted, wedon't do that here, you know?Yeah, well, and then the alpha boys,they all try to bethe alphas of them all.And if you're not anasshole, you're screwed.Yes.That's really what it is.So, and you're not raising an asshole.So, you know, it's the worst thing.But then what we found with our kids isthen through high school, it gets better.Yes, he's doing, yes.
• 28:11
  And of course,in college and, you know,and I'd rather have thembe the person they are with depthand all the wonderfulthings we've raised them to bethan be an asshole and bepopular in middle school.Oh, a million percentas if that's a number.Now you say I'm bad at math.And to go back to theovercorrecting for our childhood,like I remember in middle school,I was obviously depressed,and all my girlfriends all dumped me.And I remember my mom very clearly.I mean, who knows, it's so long ago.But I feel that I recall her saying,well, what did you do?Yes. Yeah.Right? Yeah, yeah.I think it's a boomer thing.Yes. I think that's more common.I think it's more common.It's just like they also havea hard time complimenting us.Yes. Without there being a,but, but yeah, no, I was raised that,look at it from theside they're coming from.Yeah. What's their outlook?Where ironically, Brian'sparents were silent generationand he was raised inIrish Catholic Jersey.He was raised like, fuck him.Yeah, pretty much.That sounds so nice.I know, I know, I know.And so we- Mr.
• 29:17
  Christ.Yeah. Our kids-I'm in that mode now though.I'm in the fuck them, who cares?Let it go. He gave me permissionto raise my kids like that.Cause I would have done how I was raised.Like, well, let's see what side they're,maybe they're having a hard time.And he's like, fuck that.Yeah. Yeah.You know, they're screwed.
• 29:35
  They're dicks.Yeah. Yeah.Yeah. They're dicks.So, and I think Gen X,we have our kids backsbecause we felt ourparents didn't have ours.Yes, yes.In fact, yeah, my son reached a point,which is this dance, right?Where he didn't want to tell me anythingcause he knew I wouldcome in like guns blazing.Yeah. Yeah, yeah.Like, I promise I won't, you know?Cause I knew at acertain point you can't, right?But. Yeah.I don't know because letme tell you a quick story.My daughter is 24 and she plays on anadult softball team.And we thought there was a,somebody had writtensomething mean on the rosterthat was online, but wecome to find out it wasn't.It was like a technicalthing that just sometimes goes,but it was, no one did anything.I called the city.I called the city.
• 30:25
  I'm laughingcause I knew, I love it.You're ready. I did.I'm like, LMG.Yeah, I'm like, whohas access to this app?I want to know.The poor guy who picked up the phone.No one has access.I'm like, well, and then he explained.I'm like, oh, thank you.And she's 24.So I don't know if it ever really ends.No, in fact, my mom, forall of her, what did you do?The truth is, years later,she called me giddy and excited.I was mortified.She was a big deal executive.She's like, you'll never guess who wasjust here interviewing.I'm like, who?And then she mentioned a name.I'm not going tomention who was my best friendwho would hurt the most.I'm like, oh gosh.She's like, I made her cry.I'm like, mom, don't tell me that.That's horrible.She's a grown human.She's like, I'll never forgive her.Like, I wish she hadn'tblamed me back in the day.This doesn't help.Right, right.I almost think they did itbecause they just wanted to fix it.They wanted it to be done.Yes, they know, they know.They knew and they were mad,but they went about it a different way.Now what about in high school?You were in theater?So yeah, so then high school,I feel like there wassomething else I was going to sayabout my kid in middle schoolthat I can't remember now.Oh, I was going to say theover-correction thing.I don't know if you've done this,but I've gotten so bad with himabout protecting him fromthe pain from these peoplethat I know I've done him a disservicebecause he does notstomach discomfort well.Whereas ourgeneration, I feel like anythingwe can put up with,I cancompartmentalize anything, you know?Yes.Yeah, no, it's true.It's bad.They feel everything,they express everything,and any little blip,there's no grinding through.They don't grind through.No.So it's acknowledgingit, and you're right.No, that's the same with our kids.I'm curious because Ithink she handles thatbetter than I do.I wonder how you handle that.Are you, I'm abrasivemaybe, for lack of a better word,where it's like, ah,come on, knock it off,keep going, where she'll sit and listen.Where do you fall on that spectrum?Yes, not good, not thegood side of the spectrum.My ex-husband, hisfather, was really goodabout being themeasured, disciplined one.He's got a really goodsense of when to push our son,and he knows it, and I know it.Because of what I wentthrough, I have royally fucked upand gone the other way.So if he ever doesn'twant to go to school,I'm way too lenient, butthe flip side of that is,sometimes I feel guilty,because I'll hear my ex-husbandor an ex-boyfriend'shead, my mom in my head,you're being too soft onhim, and then all of a sudden,I'm like, you gotta get out of bed.It's like I'm schizophrenic with him.And it's like all youranxiety, you're like, protect.Yes, yes, but do better.You're not gonna get oneover on me, but are you okay?Yeah, but are you okay?Are you happy?Yeah, I'm sorry.Have I said I'm sorry?Yeah, yeah, it's so funny.It's so true though.It's funny, mydaughter with my 15-year-oldwill get like that,because some days we don't knowif he cares if we exist,and other days he loves us,because he's 15.But then she'll justbe like, are you happy?Everything okay?What can I do?And he's like, I'm fine, leave me alone.So now there's oldersiblings that are overcompensating.This poor kid.But okay, so highschool, were you theater?So high school, wewere still in Evanston.Evanston is, sorry.Evanston, Illinois?Evanston, Illinois isvery, it's where John Hughesis from, so 16 candles, all that stuff.That's where I grew up.But I was the nerd.Okay, anyway, high school was lesspainful, as you said.So I was there freshman, sophomore year.I was on the soccerteam, I have no idea why.And my only memory was Iscored a goal for the other team.Like I remember that to this day.I was very proud of myself.I didn't understand whynobody was getting in my way,and everyone was yelling.That sounds like somethingthat would happen in a movie.Yeah, that's me, yeah.Yeah, if it's, yeah.Now were you in plays?Oh, wait, I do haveanother embarrassing thing.I also was in synchronized swimming.Nice, they hadsynchronized swimming in Chicago?In Evanston, yeah.And it was one of those like--In Illinois, actually in the 80s.Yeah, it was not cool, just to be clear.It was not a cool thing to be doing.You could still do it.So you were a theater kid who didsynchronized swimmingis what you're trying to say?I couldn't get cast.Oh no.Yeah, and it actually--You had a different play?Oh yeah, the theater program at Evanstonis kind of a reallywell-known theater program.John Cusack, JeremyPiven, like it was a very--Okay, okay.So, but still, fuck them anyway.Were you in school with any of them?No, they're older, so.But I do have some famousnames coming up to hit you soonbecause my mom movedus then back to the cityfor my junior and senior year.And I don't, she said itwas to be closer to work,but I almost feel like she could seethat I was socially floundering.I mean, it wasn'tpainful like middle school,but I kind of justfelt invisible and lostin this huge school.Did you find your people at all?Not there.I mean, I found some people, you know,you find someone to hang with,but it wasn't untilwe moved into the cityand we went to a fancy private school.I guess my mom musthave been doing really wellat that point.And it was called Francis Parker,and there were two bigfancy private schools,Latin and Parker.And Latin was definitely more of the,it was known as the, I don't know,the, Francis Parker was thehippy dippy theater school,you know, and Latin wasmore like around the path.I don't know.And so at Parker, Anne Hage, I don't knowif you remember Anne,she was in my class,so we were in Fiddleron the Roof together.And- Oh, wow.Yes. That's cool.Yeah.And you got parts there.Oh yeah, sorry.Then I was theater kid.Yes, I thrived and flourished.And this is interesting.This is gonna get back to theovercorrection of our kids.At that school, it wascool to be smart and weird.And then I was like, oh, it was great.I'm like, this is my place.God knows how much a year.So I've always feltbad that I can't afford,I mean, private schooltoday compared to then.Well, I don't knowwhat it's like in Florida,but you know what private school here is?Like 55 grand a year.Yeah, I mean, we havesome schools like that.We have schools like theCatholic schools are less.Yeah, you're good with Jesus, 20 grand.Yes, right.But the other ones arewhat you're talking about.Okay, so his dad and I can't afford that.And I've felt as I saw him beingunpopular, getting bullied,I was like, I feel so bad,I can't put him in a private schoolwhere I feel like he would flourish, but.Yeah, no, and I can seethat because I do thinkfor kids that struggle in that largepublic school environment,they do thrive in that smaller space.And I feel you because you did.Because I think itsounds to me like you wereon a totally higher level than thesuburban public school.Like what you had inside of you.I mean, I'm glad you said it, Nicole.It is.(both laughing)It's just, once you got into a city,it was just moreevolved, I think probably,and there's more goingon and the school itselfcould cater to your interests and talentsin a better way, I have a feeling.There's no publicschool options like that.So, yes, so that's where thewhole magnet thing comes in.So I have done a good job as a mom,I will say I have foundthe best least bad version.He does like where he is now.I guess middle schoolis gonna be a shit showno matter where he went.Also, you have a 15year old, so you know,right off of COVIDgoing into middle school.Yeah, yeah.They were just feralanimals, feral animals.Not in a fun way, not in adrink from the hoe's way.Right, yeah.So I think they all werestruggling in middle school,but it was, ironically,he loved theater as a kid,and then he went to middle school.It was a performing arts middle school.I thought, this is gonna be great,but they were bullies.I'm like, oh no, they're bulliesin the performing arts program.They're all asshole, get that age.Oh my gosh, I think it's the age.Yes, they need to push down, isolate,create stratus of popularity.So--It's like Lord of theFlies years, I call it.Yes, and also my sonis a cop of the world.He's like into justice and gets up ineveryone's business.And I was like, wheredid he get this from?Like, oh shit, that's me, that's me.And that's with a fly in middle schoolbecause they can't fit.Yeah.They're sick, they're sick.Like I remember hearingthat word, my 15 year old,I'm like, what do you mean?He goes, no, you can't snitch.It's like, it was thebiggest thing in middle school.Yeah, he was a snitch.Yeah.(laughs)But he also, sorry, go on.Now it's the same, but nowhe's in high school, right?I was in high school, so he's in this,so then you go and it'sall the magnet program.So you go to a big school,but at least they figured this part out.You're in a smallschool within the school.Maybe that's what you're talking about.Yeah, yeah, yeah.So he's in this humanities program,which he's such a history kid.I mean, it blows me awayhow he just connects dotsand this whole program isabout weaving all the topicstogether through the lens of history.I'm like, yes.That's awesome.So he's doing well, yeah.That's perfect, that's perfect.So for you, you got into the,what you call it, the liberal arts?Was it a liberal arts?Oh, the high school?The high school.It wasn't known, itwasn't technically that,but it was, like you had just been here.Okay, and you were therefor junior, senior year?Junior, senior year, yeah.It looked likeWoodstock in the hallway there.It was hilarious.And then during those years,did you kind of knowthat you wanted to furtheryour education in that in college?Is that what you went to school for?Yes, and if I'm ever acting too muchlike a producer myself, please stop me,but can I circle back andjust talk about one more thingabout middle school and high school?Of course, yeah, we do all that.We do that all the time.Okay, because I knowyou're gonna relate to this too.Okay, so my son wasdiagnosed with ADHD for real.I know their kids beingover diagnosed, I get it,but it explained so much ofhis behavior in middle school.He didn't stand achance, you know what I mean?Anyway, his dad and I didn'tagree about how to handle it,and then we did, and things got better.But the point of the story is,I'm realizing thatwas me in middle school.That was me, and theydidn't have terms for that,so they put me in alearning disability classwith criminals, like kids.I mean, you know, butlike, you know, trouble kids.Yeah, but you knowthat's Gen X girls were,because when they didfinally start diagnosing it,it was boys.Like the Gen X girlswere ignored with ADHD,because I think it'sharder to diagnose in girls,because girls are so high performing,and I think they can mask it easier.The boys were hyper, hyper, hyper.The girls, I think itwas a little bit different.But I can't tell you howmany women I've met our agethat came to find out they have ADHD.Yeah, I mean, again, Ihave not diagnosed it,but honestly, I don't need to.I'm watching my kid.Can I have some of that live ends?Yeah.I've learned ways to curve it, you know?But, and so the other,I'm sure you know this too.So he's gifted, whatever that thing is.He tested gifted, but he's like 2E,because he's got ADHD and gifted.So again, like where does he fit?We got him the thing, it's fine.But the point is, one of the thingsabout his type of brain, again, I don'tknow about you guys,it's like light bulbsabout your childhood,is I started doing welljunior and senior year,because suddenly they were small classesof super advanced topicsthat I was interested in.Like the big general stuff, I was like,drool, you know, and that's interesting.And that continued into, I know for me,that continued into college.Thousand percent.I also started picking up that,once I became an upperclassman,all of a sudden I was like focused,and this isinteresting, and then I was ableto carry that in throughschool, through college.Yeah, I struggled.But I was kind of just like--Yes, total struggle academically,freshman, sophomore year,junior started to get interestedin senior year, always.Yeah, yeah.Just like--So is that, in that, did you know,did you have colleges picked out,where you wanted to go,like once all of this--I only got into one college,because my grades werenot great, so I got into--From the earlier years in high school?So it was, like where dowe put this delinquent,no, I'm just kidding,there was no record.No, I just, yeah, mygrades were so spotty,I didn't test well,SAT, no, that was not--Yeah, yeah, yeah.I think those should just all go away,but so the only school Igot into was easy to get into,now it's really hard to get into,which is so funny to me,but it was Universityof Wisconsin, Madison,and it was amazing, itwas a five star school,but it was also a five star party school,so it kind of got--Yeah, that's a party place.Yes, now it's also anextraordinarily hard schoolto get into, which is funny.Yeah, yeah.Whoo, Madison's cool,we've been there once, and we liked it.It was amazing.It's a cool town.Yeah, yeah, it was great.It's a crazy town in many ways, right?That's kind of when itblew up when you were there,I think it blew up as a party schooland a cool place to be.I had my fun, for sure.I was arrested twice.What were you arrested for?Well, the first timewas underage drinking,of course, the cops putus in the back of the carand took us back to ourdorm, and I was such a brat,I was like, don't youhave something betterfor important to dowith your time, coppers?It's poor peopledealing with college assholes.And then the secondtime was my senior year,and we were throwingthe most epic party ever.I've always thrown great parties,which is what the big,I'm not trying to get usto the big D, but it is funny,I've been throwing hosting parties in,I love people pleasing,that's probably a bigger mom issue.Anyway, the cops totally screwed us,they waited outside andthey caught an underage drinkerat me now of a college party, of course,because it was, Idon't know, a soft drink.So I had to go to court and my dad,my biological fatherhad to come as my lawyer.There, it paid off,you had your own lawyer?Did he get you off?He did, in fact, I don't understand.When I think back to that, I'm like,how was I arrested and brought to court?I don't have any, nothing happened.I mean, I guess in Madison, they're like,get in line, kid, you know?So when you first got there,I assume you were in the dorms, right?I was in the dorms, Iwas on fraternity row,I rushed, which wasweird, I went to the sorority,which is not me, Idon't know if you can tell,but that I don't, that's what I did.Was it like a theater?Did you go to different sororitiesand then pick which one was it?It's just ruthless though.Oh, it is.Their daughter did it,the whole grief systemfor boys and girls, butespecially girls was crazy.It's all judges youon, it's just appearance.Yes. Or anything else.Yes, and I have to say,they couldn't fire me, I quit.A few of them wanted me, but I was like,this isn't, I don't think this is my,this is not my people, this is not my--So you weren't in the sorority at all,or you were like--I was a little sister, doyou remember that thing?Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, they still have it.That's the biggestscam ever, like really?You know, you just havea bunch of young girlscoming over to yourparties, well done guys.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Our daughter dropped after two years,she was like, this is enough.Yeah, yeah, yeah.It's just, you'reeither in it or you're not.Yeah, I don't think you'reright, there's no middle ground.There's no middle ground.So you were in the dorms your first year,did you know your roommate?That was such a spoiled brat.I didn't want a roommate, so I demandedthat my parents give me a single.Nice.Yeah, and they did.But here's what I'll say, Igave back to the community,I became the party room.So we would smoke a ton ofweed, I would play Led Zeppelin,and I had a really nicefridge full of snacks,I made sure everybody was well fed.There you go.The RA hated me.We didn't have thatoption where we went to school,you couldn't choose to be in a single,you had to have a roommate.Yeah, don't worry.Where were you?So many people dropped out.We went to a school called,well now it's calledSouthern Oregon University,but when we went, it wasSouthern Oregon State College.I think it was like 6,000 people.Yeah, roughly.Small, in Aspen, Oregon.Is that where you guys met?Yeah.Oh, college sweethearts.Yeah.He came out there from New Jersey,and went to school,and I was from Portland.So I was like four and ahalf hours south in Oregon.Have you been to Ashland?Being in LA, it's, Imean, it's not close,but it's closer than Florida.I have not, should I?Yes.It's cool, actuallyit's a very artsy town,and they have a very big,they're well known fortheir Shakespeare Festival.So every summer there's aShakespeare Festival there.It's pretty cool, actually.It's beautiful.It's an outdoor secret.It's only 20 miles northof the California border.All right, I'll put it on the list.So if you're ever up that way, inNorthern California,it's worth stopping inAshland, it's beautiful.I love it.I love Northern California.That's where my son and I both thinkthat we should beliving, just so you know.We love Northern.When we go to California, we go toNorthern California.What do you considerNorthern California, though?Okay, right.Well, I took him on a trip, oh my God,we did like RussianRiver, Russian Valley,like that whole area,and then we went down the,is it Mendocino Coast?No.From Mendocino County, sure.Yeah, oh my God, it was like Pegasuswas gonna just come in offthe clouds, off the craggy.Oh, so beautiful there.Did you go to the Eel River area?Like the Eel River and--Like Arcata.Yeah, and what about the redwoods?Have you checked out the redwoods?Yes, I mean, it's just,that's where we're allsupposed to be, right?Like, just know it's awesome.It feels like heaven.I don't even believe inheaven, sorry if you do,but that is heaven,that would convince you.It's beautiful.Now you'd love Ashland,you gotta check it out,but where we went tocollege, there was no choices.You were in a dorm with a roommate.So it's nice you had that, that's cool,and that you were able tokind of have everyone come in,but then you were able to say,okay, go back to yourroom now and get my own.Yes, I'm going to sleep now, yes.And then your sophomore year,were you in an apartmentthen, or did you have a roommate?A bunch of us girls from the dorm decidedit would be a goodidea to have seven girlsrenting a house together, so.That sounds like fun.It was fun until it wasn't, yes.Yeah, that sounds crazy.A lot of drama. How many bathrooms?There were a lot of bathrooms.It was like those crazy college houses.I don't know if it was aboarding house at one point,but it was like this, but no, it was,we had great parties,but at a certain point,I don't think people evenwanted to come to the partiesbecause there was alwayssome drama that was exploding.With the girls.
• 50:14
  Yes, yes.Are you still friends with any of them?Yeah, well, actually, my, so my,we were friends in high school,but not best friends until college,and she's now a veryfamous actress, Amy Landecker.I don't know if you know Amy,but she was in the show"Transparent."I don't know if youwatched "Transparent."Should we?It's a great show, yeah.Okay, I'll take it out.Do you watch "YourHonor" with Bryan Cranston?No, but everyone keeps telling meI need to watch that show.She's in that, she'smarried to Bradley Whitford,but I don't wanna just be like,she's married to Bradley Whitford.No, she's a very talented show.Right, right, right, okay.So now I have to, everyone says I gottacheck out that show.Yeah, so we were bestfriends throughout the four years,and we had lots of fights,but yes, that she's my sister.You guys did tell friends, that's cool.Yes.So then junior year, didyou guys ditch the house?No more seven girls in the house?I don't know if youguys went through this,but I feel like, so sophomore yearis when the whole likedeadhead revival thing happened,like the fake dead head.Oh, we went through it.Yeah, do you know what I mean?It was deadhead.You were deadheads?We are deadheads.You are deadheads.I don't know, can you see the cassettes?I don't know if she can see them.No, but I don't see like a tapestry,Paisley tapestry behind you.We had that at one point in our lives.Of course you did, yes.Okay, so yeah, we joined in that hard.We've probably seen overa hundred dead concerts.So if you combineJerry Garcia and all that,but that would have beenlike our sophomore yearin high school when we started.Yeah, I was gonna say it started earlier.Yeah, or before college.Like we were, we were born in 71.Oh, okay, right, so that makes sense.You were like ajunior, we were a sophomore.Well, it did start in earnest then.Yeah.It really came out with a,what was it, Touch of Grey in 1986,which then just moved on.You know what, oh my God, you were rightbecause now I'm flashingback to my ex-boyfriendwho was so cool in high schooland he had all these tinydye shirts he was selling.He was soentrepreneurial and I was such a dorkand I wasn't coolaround him, you're right.It was high school where it started.Yeah, it started in high school.That's why I hate the dead.Maybe, yeah.Hey listen, no, a lot ofpeople don't like the dead.It's an acquired taste.I blame the mushrooms that didn't workthe first time I went.I think that--There you go.Gotta try again.There you go, yeah, yeah.(laughing)Was it a show?I did, so sophomoreyear our house got dividedvery quickly intohardcore dead heads and not.And I remember thesepeople would bring people backfrom the concerts to liveoff our food and our moneyand they had names that were not realand they were down on capitalismbut they were not downagainst using our money.And I just remember thatwhen I would hear the bellson the ankles, I was like, shit.Yeah.I'm dying.I wore--You summed it up perfect.Yeah, that's the goal.You ran our house.Yeah, probably.No, but it was all hypocrisy, right?Because we all came fromgood families with money.Exactly.We were struggling ortrust safari and kidsand everyone was like, no, and itrebelled against that.It was all just so, we have a listenerwho said it was pick mes.We were like the first pick mes.That's hilarious.I don't know if you'veheard that term, pick mes.Oh, pick me, yeah, pick me.Yeah, yeah, yeah.I'm a pick me girl for my son, actually,that's what I joke about, yeah.I'm like, right here, love me.Yeah, exactly.Madison was like--Matthew Tippie.Oh, massive.They used to have the420 Fest in Madison.Oh, Harvey's Fest, yeah.Here's the thing, Iwas in a weird position.I was a hippie who hated the dead.I like Crosby, Stills,and Nash, that was my jam.So I was a hippie.I think it was the peoplethat I came encounter withkind of killed it for me,but also, you have to admit,it is, and I'm a musicnerd, like I love music,but it is a jam band,you have to like jam bands.Yeah, yeah.And the drugs do helpand for whatever reason,mine did not work when Iwent to that one concertand there was a huge stormand we were sleeping in mudand I was like, so Idon't, but I wanna be clear,I totally respect them and I get it.Oh, no, no, no.No, but I do, like the music's good.It's just, it comes with such a great--No, but you have to like jam band.You have to like jam band.And I don't, I'm not a jam band.I'm with you though, thepeople, I love the music.I feel like I was going tochurch and then it all ended,but the people were drivingme crazy there at the end.100%.Yeah, and it still happens.We go see dead cover bands,there's one place in our townand our kids are dead heads, so we go.That's so cute.Yeah, it's good, we love that, right?But there's still like, asadults, like asshole dead heads.Like everyone's trying to be like,I'm more dead headthan you, it's like, stop.But they were like that then.I'm so glad you saidthat, that's what it waswhen those people with the anklebracelets chiming around,there was a holier than thou,some kind of spiritual superiority.And I'm like, what?And I just, it was bullshit.And so it is unfortunatebecause I don't think I've ever,because I'll find myselfsinging some of the songs.I'm like, fuck, it's a good song.Just let it in.It makes it, yeah, hecalled him the Uzers,but it was just likejust pseudo, just fakeness.And it was all this clout crap.And you could never behippy enough or hardcore enoughor dead head enough.And it was dumb, trust me, I get it.And in Ashland, whichwas such a hippy town,it was like, everyone'scompeting to be the mostlike granola that you can.They're like mean girls,they're granola mean girls.100%.I'm like, I know you people,I went to middle school with you.You just have armpit hairnow, that's the only thing.Yes.And that's all who smells funnywith bells on their ankles.Yes, and is eating all my food.Yes.That's hilarious, I love that.We agree with everything you say.What's funny is we really love the music.Like we really love themusic, but no, the scene,and sometimes you see them, like weweren't really into fish.We saw fish, this is aninteresting story, I think,is at our school, therewasn't, what was it like?It's called the Brit Ballroom.The Brit Ballroom, it's likethe size of like a cafeteria.Yeah. In a middle school with a stage.And we saw fish there andthere was only 100 of us.It was when fish first started.And that was the onlytime we've seen fish.We're like, it's nevergonna get better than this.Everyone was on mushrooms.And they were just on this stagewhere you would put ona play in middle school.That's cool.And there was a keg, and it was cool.So we're like, we nevergot into the fish scene.And I know there's awhole asshole scene there,I think everywhere.There's assholes everywhere, exactly.But yeah, that makes sensebecause you had thatgoing on in your house,and then you had anex-boyfriend that was into it.So the dead has a lotof negative connotations.Exactly, I'm gonna have to rewire.I mean, it does helpthat like John Mayer,even though he's like a total slut,but I mean, I get thatall these professional,why they're drawn to it.I will revisit it, I willwear a mustache and a wig,so nobody knows.Like you hate the dead.Well, it's the cash engine.Yeah.Right, it's the cashengine for these guys now.Oh yeah, the Sphere inVegas, have you guys done that?Yeah, it's crazy.But you know what also was going on?I mean, this was more, yeah, this waswhen we were in collegewas grunge was also--And that was me, I was like, yes.Yeah.Did you hop on thatearly when it came out?Cause we missed it.Yeah, oh no, I loved it.It was a great reactionto all that dead stuff too.Yeah.To me, the Grateful Deadmovement was toxic positivity.It was oppressive.And this was justangry and like mud on meand just badass and thestooge, like all that stuff.I was so into it.And I remember whenNirvana happened, I was like,what is this?Yeah, yeah.Yes, I'll never be in a dream room.That was right out of college, yeah.Yeah, well, they were the authentic--Yes.To the fake positivityor the toxic positivity,they were the authenticity.Yes, exactly.And it was so refreshing.It was, yeah.No, it was all of that whole sceneand that movie Singles, I tell my kids,Singles and RealityBites are the two movies,if you really wanna knowwhat it was like for usin our early 20s.Yeah, oh my God, Reality Bites, yes.Yeah, those two movies.But that music, and what'sfunny is I feel like kids noware really looking at thewhole grunge scene in the 90s,like how we looked at the 60s.Which is crazy to me.I know, cause I don'tlike that 10 years ago.Exactly.I know, how crazy was it?It was like, that was 50years ago, you're like, no.No, there's no way.But I mean, and think aboutit, when we were in collegeand we were doing all these things,going to concerts orwhatever, there were no cell phones.It was more like, meetme at that one light postin an hour and you werehoping we'd find your peopleor anything social you wanted to do.If you weren't home with the landline,you're just likehoping you're gonna meet,run into your friends, that spontaneity.And they don't have that now.No, and they have noneed to leave the house everbetween video games and cell phones.Yeah, no, I'm sograteful that we had that timewhere we could be fully presentand there were thosemoments of where everythingjust kind of came together.It just worked out.Yes, it just worked out.And it was just-And we lived to tell about it.Yeah, it was the universe.The universe would just,you didn't have to work at it,plan it, text about it.And no one had 24 sevenaccess to you, which they do now.And I think that time, Idon't know about for you,but that was when raveswere starting too, right?I feel like that was right out of collegethat they started.And for us, I think itwas like our junior year.I think it was our junior year.Yeah, like terrainspotting and all that stuff.Was that my 20s?Like, yeah, but the raveculture and San Francisco,like warehouse raves.And I was already likean adult way too soon.So I didn't go to any of that stuff.Yeah, no, we didn't go, but I knowecstasy was startingthen like up untilthen it had just been pot.We got into theecstasy in my junior year.That was, we used to haveecstasy parties at our house.At the house with the girls?I was at Madison.Madison was a little aheadof the curve of many words.Yes, there were a lot of drugs.I only ever wanted to do hippie drugs.To this day, I've never been cocaine.I'm like, I'm good, I'm really hyper.We haven't either.Just weed, shrooms and LSD once.I felt nothing, thank God.And I'm like, I'm too scared of LSD.That's not.Yeah, yeah.You might have been tripping your ass offand didn't know it.I might've, yeah.I'm sober.Yeah, exactly.And then for us, we smokedcigarettes and now it's vaping.And I would trade it.I would rather see kids smokingcigarettes and vaping.Yeah, yeah. And then crystallize their lungs.Yeah.Yeah.By the way, I don't know about you guys,but I mean, I love smoking.It's the greatest thing in the world.And I obviously quit itbecause I want to live.But I've told my son, like, smoke,just every time I see asmoker and like, if he only knew.My stepdad just foundsome old photo album.I have no idea where this came from.Somebody put an albumtogether, me from college.I am smoking in every photo.Yeah, that's funny.It was so accepted.You could smoke in restaurants still.You could smoke in bars.Airplanes.Airplanes.You could still do that then.Even in like in the early90s, you could still do that.What'd you smoke?Camel light?I did some camel lights, Marlboro lights.What was it, an American spirit came out.Oh yeah.Oh yeah.Oh yeah.Trying to go natural and healthy.Yeah, exactly.Yeah.Ridiculous.The drum roll your ownso you're really healthy.Yeah, we did that too.Those were rough on the front.Rolling jellies.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Did you do any study abroad programs?I did.And I have to say what's so sick of it,nicotine is I'm salivating.So for anybody watching or listening,it is a highly addictive drug.It is, it is.Okay, all right, I need some gum.Here, I'll just gnaw on this pizza crust.Yeah, so when the house finally explodedand then Amy and I with the one,we still had a sororitygirl in the group, Maria.It was so funny.I know what she liked about us,but the three of us ended upgetting like a really posh,I don't know why these developersbuilt these like nice condos, you know?And then it was like wehad a reaction to all that.So we moved in there andstill kept doing ecstasy.But anyway, so yeah,I went to Italy abroadback when people could afford to do that.And it was amazing.And-Did they go with you?Well, Amy and I had avery codependent relationshipwhere I would pull back quite a bit.And I'm like, how muchdo we talk about this?We had a lot of conflict.I think she would agree with that.So I was like, I'm going toSiena, you can't go to Siena.So she went to Florence.No way.Could we be any morebasic bougie bitches?So we were both inItaly at the same time,but we were in different cities.And I'm like, I'm having myexperience, you have yours.So we saw-That's actually areally healthy communicationat that age with a friend.A lot of young womenstruggle with communicatingwith their friends.A lot of women wouldstruggle communicatingwith their friends.So the fact that you guys could do that,it's pretty evolved.That's true.You're right, I will-Yeah, take that.And you're still friends today.Yeah.We are, we have-That's pretty good.Probably because you didn't go together.Say it again.Probably because you didn't go together.We've had our, youknow, the movie"Beaches",like we've had our moments.But we will-Yes, yes, yes.Like when the times are really tough,if we really need a hand,I call her, she calls me.Like, nobody knows mebetter, nobody knows her better.Like it's, I don'tknow, at a certain pointwith an adultfriendship like that, you know,I think we all hit thesecrossroads, like, well,what are we doing?You know, are we splitting up?And we had a very clearmoment in my 30s, in our 30s.And we both decided,you know, I don't knowif we articulated it,but it's like, no, we're-Right.This is, come on.Anyway, so yeah, she was-Yeah, that's cool.Yeah, and-Were you alone, where you went?Did you do this all on your own?No, I did, it was a program.So I lived with a familyand there was a group of us.And so of course therewere horrible dynamicswithin the group.Groups suck, that'sreally what it comes down to.It is impossible to have a healthy group.Yeah, I got pregnant there, that was fun.No way.Yeah, I was very-An Italian?An Italian, my Americanboyfriend was not really happy.I was a very busy girl.I had a lot of fun incollege and I was very fertileand very stupid.And you know what's sofunny when you're olderand I don't know about you guys,but I'm trying to do the math.I mean, I waited till thelast possible biological momentto have my son.So I was dancing on the edge of, oh, oh,maybe I waited too long, you know?And then you have to timeit and when I'm re-obulatingand well, you know, you-Right.But back then it waslike pregnant, pregnant.And it's like, oh, it's such bad luck.No, you're ovulating.The body is designed to make you hornyand irresponsible in that moment, so.And you were in Italy.Oh yeah.It's a trifecta.Yeah, it was bound to happen.And the ecstasy is the love drug, right?Interestingly enough though,I feel like the ecstasy is a cuddle drug.I don't feel like it's a sex drug.Interesting, yeah.That would make sense.And I'd love to blameit on the ecstasy, Brian,but it was just me.Yeah.Yeah.Did you come home when youfound out you were pregnant?No, I, the man I was involved with therewas in love with me and wanted me to stayand have the baby and marry him.And I'm like, I haveto get home and graduateand I'm gonna make movies.I'm a film major.Like, no, bro.So I did have an abortion in my life.I did have an abortion thereand I had had one here in the States.It was traumatic.And so if you can believe it,I actually have a comedy set around this,which is very funny,but I will not tell you thefunny version now, obviously.I thought, I am so screwed.I'm pregnant in Italy?Like Italy, the most conservative.I don't wanna say it was the bestexperience in my life,but they treated me like,it was just interesting.They was like, it wasso human and humane.I don't know.They like put you under.I don't know.Does anybody that watches this or listensjust wants to hear this?I have no idea.No, I think that there's womenthat this wouldresonate with, definitely.Yeah.So it was like crazyhow nice they were to meas opposed to herewhere the guy was like,why is she crying?I'll never forget that.The guy that did it here.Oh my God.Oh my gosh.No, that's amazing they put you under.That's wonderful.They kept you there allday in a hospital room.That's amazing.Yeah.That's amazing.I've talked in, I did mystory on one of our episodesand I did share, I also hadan abortion when I was 22,not Brian, other boyfriend.And I will say the doctor was nice,but it was incredibly rushed, sterile.He did go to a doctor's office,but it was just verylike, okay, you did itand then you went home.And I, looking back now as a 54 year old,I shouldn't have just gone homeand life shouldn't havejust like continued on.That hospital staywould have been amazingjust to have that moment,because it's not a positiveexperience no matter what.It's not like something that you're like,yay, I get to go do this.So the fact that they made this,they were gentle with you.And as you said, humaneand honored your experiencefor you is amazing.It was.It was a shock to me.You know?Yeah.Cause there's always, Imean, I don't know about you,but even being pro-choice and all that,there's still some shameto what you're like for me.Of course.I wasn't proud ofwhat I was doing, right?I was actually mad at myself.And like, how did I get myself in?And I know how I did.Yes.But you feel stupid.So you don't need morepeople making you feel that way.So it sounds like they didn'tmake the situation any worseand actually helped make ita little bit better for you.So that's really cool.1000%.And yeah, I was just like, where am I?This is bizarre.Did your parents know?Like, did you reach out to your parents?No, that's a fun story.So I got back from Italy.Well, actually firstthen my American boyfriendcame to visit me and Ithought I could just pretendthis didn't happen.And of course I broke down in tears.And I'm like, I haveto tell you something.So that was fun.So it was a love triangle.Did you guys stay together?We traveled throughSouthern Italy togetherfighting and crying and having sex.And then we had to go back to Sienacause I owed a paperto get my 16 credits.And then my then boyfriend was so upset.He came to the window.He's like, "Julia!"Like it was so crazy.It was very dramatic.It was very dramatic.Yeah, yeah, yeah.You couldn't wish for moreout of a trip to Italy, frankly.Yeah.Definitely sounds memorable.It's, it's yeah.And did the Italian guy disappearor was he also chasing you?He wanted to stay in touch.And it's funny, my mother,that's the only man she's ever met.They came to visit me and that she loved.It was so interesting.I don't know what it was about Bob.Just gotta call him Bob.There must've been something about him.He was lovely.He was a lovely guy.I mean, but you know, I have,avoid an attachment, like 20?Like, this isn't happening, bro.Like, you have no ideawhere I've been raised.Right.But he was, he was very sweetand we stayed in touch over the years.And then once I got married and had a kidand he was Facebook messenger,marrying me, I'm like,"No, I think we need to."Yeah, yeah.Yeah.You're done with that.Yeah.So then when did you, when you got back,did you share with your?Yeah, so I went to thegynecologist with my mom,a twofer, I don't know.Like she was seeingher and then I went in.And this is so crazy.We went at lunch afterwards and she said,"So why didn't you tell methat you had an abortion in Italy?"I'm like, "What? The doctor told you?Like that's illegal."Yeah.Did the doctor tell her?Yes.Wow.So crazy.And you weren't underage or anything.You were an adult.Yeah.Was HIPAA a thing then?I don't remember.I'm pretty sure.I don't know.Oh no.HIPAA didn't rollaround until the early 2000s.Yeah, so I don't know.It maybe wasn't illegal.It wasn't illegal.All right, well itwas super, super shitty.Yeah, yeah, yeah.So I had to assure my mom it was okay.And like, let me tell youabout the 20 other ones.Just kidding.I'm joking.It's a joke.It could be like,"Butthere could be 20 more,but there's not."No, exactly.Exactly.I mean, knowing my mom,she was probably relieved, frankly,because I think she looks at her lifeas having a kid so young and dereguled.So much for her, but anyway.Right, so yeah, I could see that.I could see both sides of that.So that was your junioryear when all this was?Junior year abroad,then came back senior year.And I really soundlike I was a troublemaker.I really wasn't.I was pretty middle of theroad, Madison, Wisconsin gal.But anyway, yeah.
• 1:12:27
  You were Gen X.I was Gen X, exactly.We can just say that.We all saw them.I remember that.Like we were crazy as, wewere 30 when we were 10.Yes.We just took that energy and vibethrough high school, through college.Once we were out, we just were chaos,like Tasmanian devil.Yes.Doing all the thingsand not thinking at all,because that's how we were ranked.Yes, how about age 14?I'm in bars.I don't know about you guys.Like bars, age 14.I looked like an adult, had my fake ID.Kids don't look older than that.In our town, they would have warehousesand they would have like teen clubs.And we'd go to that,but everyone was drinkingand smoking clove cigarettes.Do you remember clove cigarettes?Oh yeah, oh yeah.Oh, that's gross.And so it's like, I just can't evenpicture my kids doing.No, no.I think I'm 13.Yeah.Everything you've described so farsounds totally normal to me.Yeah, we could.I'd never let any of my kids do it.No, exactly.And I don't need myson to know any of this.Whoops, no.Does he know anything?If he watches, well,he'd be like, oh my God.Oh, it's fine.I mean.He's old enough.He is old enough.I mean, I don't havehim come to comedy shows.Yeah.Yes, as needed at theage appropriate time.Knowledge at the age of pro.It's not like she's gonna be like,look at this episode.She'll share it when he fill his ready.Fast forward to the abortion story.You'll like that.Well, see, I would want him to know that.I would want him to know that.Right, right.There's like thisfeminist in me that's like,Yeah.I feel like I don't havea problem sharing factsabout my life with him,but by the time I'm on stage doing it,it's so, I think itwould be very upsettingto see your parent.It doesn't make sense.Do you know what I mean?Like why is she making funof this painful experienceabout herself?I just also,It's a new one.Half my stuff is about himso that he can't see that.Yeah.That'll come with age.Yeah, with the rightage, you get all that.So then your senioryear, you were in Madison,back in Madison?Yeah, back in Madison and,Did you live with Amy again?Oh yeah, we had another epic,just, it was bad, man.It's really crazywhat we've been through.I remember our biggest fight was,I have always loved tocook and serve people foodand whatever.And I made this incredible meal for her.And to this day, whenI get mad at my son,when he's not eating,I remember this fight,but she wasn't coming out of her room.And I'm like, "You get outhere and eat this meal now!"It was so crazy.We were like an old married couple.Oh my, was it just thetwo of you that year?Yes. Did you have other people?And I was fallen to thefilm world at that point.She had become a theater person.So we were in different worlds, you know?Was that your major?They didn't have a filmmajor, but they had com arts.So yes, I was a film head, my whole plan.I made horrible 16 millimeter filmsand she was my news,she was always in them.And I mean, they really were horrible.And yeah, screenwriting, all that stuff.And then my big plan was Iwas gonna move to New Yorkand be this gorillafilmmaker and I moved to LA.Now why did you decide to move?After the break, sorry, just kidding.(both laughing)Why did you decide to move to LA?So you graduated, you moved to LA.Why did you decide to move to LA?So I graduated, I startedworking in Chicago as a PA.Also, by the way, back then,do you remember getting out of collegeand you had to find a job?There was no internet, likeI remember the yellow pagesthat looked after film.Like I, how did any of us do anything?If you left yourmarket where your parentsmaybe had someconnections, you were on your own.Yeah, classified ads,yellow pages, hit the street.Classified, I remember that.Circling the jobs,walking into these businessesand be like, can Ifill out an application?Just going to the next business, yeah.And they wait for themto call your landlineand leave a message onyour answering machine.Answering machine.Yes, yeah, it's crazy.You know what's crazy, and I know this isa non-linear moment, but Idon't know about your kids.My son is obsessed withthe 80s and I don't know why.Yeah, I think that's a thing right now.Is it?A lot of kids, yeah.The 80s and the 90s.So funny.They think that time was like magicaland nothing bad was happening.They romanticized it.They romanticized it, yeah.It was a pretty good time, wasn't it?Yeah, yeah.I don't know.Well, we were all having fun,but we probably were soused to blocking out any risks.Yeah, we were like, "Yeah, it's all fine."Everything's fine, let's just go."So, you know.I don't know if we blocked it outas much as we just, it wasn't there.Or we didn't care.Our parents weren't inour heads like we are.True, true, yeah.With our kids.Yes, I mean, my sonbelieves there is dangeraround every corner becauseI told him that was the case.It's funny because Ithink Gen Xers have anxietyfrom the parental neglect,but our kids have anxietythat we've put in them of fear.Both have anxiety, butfor two different reasons.Totally.My son is probably sixfeet tall, 160 pounds,and he's still terrifiedhe's gonna be kidnappedand trafficked, I havea whole bit about it.And it's all because Itold him when he was,I was just, "How do I gethim to not leave my side?"You know?Yeah, yeah.Oh, we told our kids that,you can't go to the bathroom.I'm like, "You guys are ahot commodity on the streets."Listen, they could geta lot of money for you."So, just remember that.Unfortunately, there's some truth to it.There is, that's what's--Well, that's, you know.So, you didn't go straightto LA, you went to Chicago?So, I went back to Chicago,you know, I live with myfolks, they were on vacation,I opened up the YellowPages, like, "Film, film."I don't even know how,but I found the firstproduction in Chicago.And I will say this aboutGen X, like, we get shit done.I was like, "I will figure this out."So, I founded production, Icalled them, just cold call.I went in, I waslike, "You gotta hire me."You know, and they hired me as an intern,and then they got in trouble.And they're like, "We have to pay you."I'm like, "You don't have to?"They're like, "No, we have to pay you."I'm like, "How do you?"So, I started off working for $250 a weekas a locations assistant.I thought, "This isamazing, you know, this is crazy."I'm getting paid to be in a movie set."And I'm pausing,because I'm trying to figureout how much of the next part,I want to tell you.So, I'm going to tellyou a shorter version.Okay.Okay, well, this is the...So, as much as I'm a love avoidant,I also fall in love really quickly.That might be the thing.So, I've had a lot of relationships.I don't know if that was important.Okay, I'm on a movie set,and I've fell in love with this guy,and we moved in together.I moved in quickly with people.I was like, "Let's probably..."Because...The movie.Yes, I'm like, "What's the big deal?"Let's just get a place together."The movie, that's what you do.That's hilarious.I can do some wallpaper.Oh my God.You should have been like,"Can you wallpaper?"I'm heading into that."Yes, that is hilarious.I never...That's why I was like,"Yeah, what's the big deal?"Let's go have a take."Oh, Lord.Yeah, yeah.Yeah, so,hopefully you know this about me by now,from the time you've been on the phone.If anything I'm saying feelstoo in the weeds or boring,you can just cut me off,because I can get lost inthe next chunk of details.No, go for it.Okay, so,my mom was a very bigdeal in Chicago at the time,and she's like trying to helpme out with her connections.And the only connection she hadwas with like this insurance guy.I'm like, "This is myHollywood connection?"I am so screwed."But what I didn't realize is he insuredand bonded all the films in Hollywood.Like it was actually a big...I just didn't even know about that role.And then he introduced meto this like real estate mogul in town.And again, I'm like,"I'mnot gonna get anywhere."But it turns out he wasfinancing movies in Hollywood.So we became fast friends.He used to fly mearound on his private jet.And yeah, anyway.That's nice.So what were you inlike your early twenties,or was this in your twenties?Yeah, I was 21.Yep, it was nice.It was a little crazy.So you're living with the new guyand flying on a private jet.Yeah, so he kept trying to...He got me a job as a PA in some movie.And I went off and did that.And then finally he was like,"Well, if you wanna come out to LA,you can be my assistant."So yeah, I was an assistant.And then I got bumpedup ridiculously fast.We started a new companyand all of a sudden Iwas a very fancy executive.I was a...And how old were you?I think I was 22 or 23.Wow.Yeah, I mean, it's a young town.Like they don't like you.Older with experience here.They like their executives really young.But anyway, we werestarting this whole...But I did work forhim for quite some time.Yes.So did you move into alone then?Into a place?Yeah, then I got alittle studio out in the hillsand in Beechwood Canyon.And I was happybecause it was a new place.I was like, "New place, new place."New place.There's a theme.Exactly.So this would have beenduring like, what, the mid 90s?It was right after the riots.I moved out to LA.I remember that.There was a store on Melrose.It was called Great Balls of Fire.And obviouslysomebody thought it was funnyand it had burned to the ground.It was like half burned.And that is burned in my memory.That was the heart of the riots too,I think that area, right?Yes. Melrose area.Yes.And then OJ happened right after.So that's how it went.Yeah, that was wild.You were there.I was there, man.I was there.And then we had our first earthquake.I was like, "Hell no, I'm leaving LA."And I didn't.And they say if you getthrough your first earthquake,do they have earthquakes in Portland?No, I don't think we, nothing.I think when I lived upthere too at the time,they would happen, butthey were like in the middleof the night and they were minor.Yeah, you didn't feel anything.Nothing like what you guys went through.No, no.Or like San Francisco.What was it, the mid 90s?Yeah, there was the big one.That was, yeah, the 80s.Yeah, yeah.So this is the Northridge?Did just Northridgeearthquake mean anything to you?Yes.Yeah.Okay, so I was there for that.That was, wow.Yeah, I stayed.You had a lot happen.Oh, a lot, a lot.That's a good thing about being Gen X.We've all had a lot.Yeah, that's true.And as long as you justkeep moving, you're good.Exactly.I think it's interesting,because I think I wrote about this.This was the pre-Me Too movement time.This was, I find this aninteresting period of my lifebecause I was raised by this incredibly,bulbusting feminist mother,but she had also come upin the kind of Don Draper,Mad Men time.So I can only imaginewhat she had to put up withas she was coming up.So on the one hand, she taught menever to rely on a man for anything.So I just was like, great.And I married men withno money my whole life.She's like, that's not what I meant.Like you said, neverrely on men with money.But she'd been soburned from my grandfatherand all that stuff.So, yeah.So, I don't know.I think we were like amisinformed feminist generationwhere we were taught,don't look vulnerable,don't be shrill, don'tcry, don't get upset.You look hysterical.So you just shoved everything down.But then as I progressed in Hollywood,I experienced otherforms of discrimination,which even now, as I say it, I'm like,I feel like I'm whining, but it was bad.It was bad.Well, just because?Like there were thingslike this said to me.I usually just pullthese two out and then again,the picture is painted.There was a director I was working for,I think I was executivevice president of productionat the time.I sent notes on his cut and I wasn'tthere when he said it.So I don't know if he actually said it,but it almost doesn't matter.But supposedly orallegedly he got the notesin a fax machine paper coming out.I was so upset he startedto jump up and down and say,I'm gonna chop her head off and,oh, probably she was a trigger warning.I'm so used to this.I'm gonna chop her headoff and fuck her dead corpse.Oh my God.Yeah.And the craziest part about that,it was told to me by my boss at the timewho thought it was so funnyand then kept tellingthat story in front of peoplewith me at the table.And I just had to laugh about it.And it's crazy, what the hell?It's crazy.Oh yeah, that's crazy.It's crazy.That was okay.It's actually trauma.It is, it is.It's trauma.Yes.And it's repeated exposure to trauma.Yes.And we can go talk aboutthe patriarchy and all that,but it's just the waywith women having treatedand even through the Gen X womenand the Gen X women Ithink just grinded through.Yeah.Just compartments,light, took it, took it.And I think it's another reason,like with our children especially,we have a daughter,is the Gen Z women donot put up with shit.Which I love.Yes.But I think it's becausethe Gen X women had to.Thousand percent.And we were like,"No, we're changing this.Guess what we're gonna give you?"The Gen Z women, have fun with that.No, thank God for the Me Too movement.Yes, yeah.Is it so like that, do you think?No, no, it really revolutionized things.Yeah, cool.Because of social media,you could get canceled very fast now.Sorry.Yeah, yeah, yeah.But that was that, the Me Too movement,wasn't that a lot of GenX, would you say women?Was that, is Ashley Judd Gen X?She started it.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah, and Rose McGowan.She's Gen X.So I think the Gen Xwomen finally were like,they broke.Fuck this.We're done.Yeah.Yeah.If I had stayed as an executive,I would have been with them.I mean, what was theother story I usually tell is,we was in a boardroommeeting and I laughedat some man's expense who was like 20years older than me.He's like, "You think that's funny, youstupid fucking bitch?"And everybody laughed about it.If that happened today, you'd get fired.Yeah.I can't even imagine that.I work in a corporate environment.Yes.That's just not happening.Yes.No.The dude is walked out.Exactly.And it was all verylike, and then the other.Thank God, thank Godall of that has changed.Yes.And it isn't just in the work area,because talking about social media,you can be filmed anywhere now.Right.And so everyone can be held accountable.Yeah.Right.And so everyone--It does suck for kids though.I do feel bad for our kids.1000%.It was nice to be able tosmoke if you wanted to, right?You could get in trouble under eachsmoking or whatever.Yeah.Now it keeps you out of college maybe.Yeah.No, it's horrible.They have no idea whenthey're posting stuff.They shouldn't.No, no.And like I know that theysay that Gen Z doesn't dance.We all dance when wewould go out, we dance.And the millennials dance.But they don't dance.When they go to bars andstuff, they just kind of,although I know mydaughter and her friends well,but it's becausethey're like, we don't care,but it's not a group thing whereeveryone's doing it.I think a lot of it's due to,they don't wanna get filmed.Mocked.So make them more inhibited.It's very sad.So that part's bad.It's good and bad.Yeah, I like everything.It stops some peoplefrom maybe hourly doingcompletely inappropriate thingsbecause they might get filmed.But then the younger generation,it also can make them more inhibited.But thank God.So now in the industry,would you say is completely differentthan when you firstwere there in your 20s?Well, I'm out of thatgame, but absolutely.I went from that to being a screenwriter,which I didn't experienceany of that, which was lovely.And then I moved into reality TV,and that was when Ireturned to the corporate world.And I hadn't been in it for so long.And that's when I wassuddenly like, you're saying,"Whoa, there are rules and paperwork.If anything, I'm worried.I'm gonna joke around too much."Right, right.But--It's HR.Yes. Yeah.I had never met an HR.That is so funny.I'm just realizing we never had HR.Yeah.Yeah.You couldn't have had it back then.Most people think HR is there for you.They're there for the company.Right.They're gonna make sureexecs don't do stupid shit,illegal shit, discriminatory things.Yeah.Protect the company.When you were a screenwriter,did you sell any of your stuff?I did.I sold features and pilots,and you have not seen any of thembecause none of them got made.And you can actuallymake a kind of decent livingselling things and not having them made.But at a certain point, ifyou don't get things made,then they show you the door.But it was during this period.Sorry, go on.I was gonna say, but youwere paid for what you wrote.I was paid for what I wrote.It was amazing.It felt amazing.I was sad andfrustrated when it didn't take,like it didn't havethe traction to really,but at the end, I was always like,most people don't even get this.Like this is good.So it was great.It must be interestingthough to create somethingand there's no outletfor the production of it.So it kind of just exists, right?Well, that's my love, standup comedy,not to jump right to that,but it exists immediately.There's no notes.Well, the notes are the audience.Yeah.I mean, yeah, it was thegatekeepers or whatever.This could be anotherfive hour podcast on comedy,but I would just say,yes, this comedy for meis a massive sigh of relief after yearsof being an executive,after years of being a screenwriter,of years of being a reality TV producer.Like it's just so pure.So what got you there?The comedy.Well, let's see reality,but I feel like wasthere something in reality?There were someshenanigans in reality TV still.I just want to be clear.It's not perfect out there.I just want to...Did you work on any reality shows that...That you would know?That we know?Maybe.I did a lot of food stuff.Do you guys watch food stuff?Like American barbecue showdown?No?No, I think the closestwould be the chef one.I can't remember where they battle.Oh, yeah.They have to make the frilly pass.Yeah, I can'tremember what that's called.Sam and I, I don't know.Something.Okay, but you didstuff like cooking stuff.I did docs.I did whatever.I mean, it was mythird leg in the businessand it was a fallback plan,a place to get paid to tellstories without healthcareand a decent wage.It's a great world.So did you travel?Was it all in LA?I came up through post, which means,like writers basically getthrown into the post pile.Meaning production sidegoes out and shoots the thingand then they hand the footage to post.And I see you are musicians or musicians?Musicians.We attempt, but none of usreally do any of it well.We own enough instruments to have a band,but no one can play any of them.I find that they're hard to believe.It's just for show,it's not for lack of shame.Just completely suck.Yeah, that could beviral, the band that sucks.I like that.Yeah, yeah.They look, it looks good though.They look awesome.You have a beautiful setup.I did not even compliment you.I love the setup, thedepth of field behind you,the plant, it's very nice.Thank you.That means a lot.Yeah, it's always appreciated.In this world, so thank you very much.That's gorgeous.Do you like mine, thebroken ceiling head fanthat's missing a thing?It's very classy.We can't see that anymore.Yeah, thank you for pretending.I like the kiddies though.I love whenever they walk by.Oh, I know, and the little tail goes by.I love that.So yeah, in post,it's almost like you'regiven a bunch of musical notesand you make a song out of it.So they shoot somethingand then we take all of itand you build a scriptwith scenes and words.It's really interesting work.If they paid better andthey had health insuranceand it was unionized,it'd be a great job.But it was created as aunion busting work alternative.So it will, in my opinion, we'll never,well, now the whole town's over.I don't know how muchof that you know about.So, okay, so yes.How long did you do that?The reality.Longer than I anticipated.I remember when I went into my first dayand I felt like a failure.Like I didn't hack it as a writer.It was very embarrassingand they brought me my little cubby hole.I'm like, cubby hole?It's come to this?I was so demoralizingand my name was on it.I was like, whoa,whoa, you don't, you don't.I'm not, this is temporary.And the woman who brought meto the cubby hole said, sure.And just watch away.Oh my gosh.Again, that could be in a movie.I know, she was right.Oh my gosh.You're in a really,really tough industry, right?Yeah.It's hyper competitiveand just, it's crazy.It is.I mean, by the one hand,I'm crazy that I stayed this long.On the other hand, Iguess it's impressivethat I found new ways to reinvent myself.I don't know, but.Yeah.No, that makes sensethough with your theme.Like starting over,starting over, starting over.Oh yeah, oh my God, it's all the moving.It's all the moving.Well, it's persistent too.Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.And determination, let's be real.Do I have to pay you at the end of this?This is better than anytherapist I've ever met.Oh, that's funny.When you were done with reality TV,were you in your 30s by that point?No, no, I didn't start that until,so I had my son at 40,because we startedtrying to have him at 36.And I'm always like thiscrazy old lady in the housewho's like, "You kidsbetter freeze your eggs."You know, I'm like,"What are you waiting for?"Like, "We're not even in a relationship."I'm like, "I don't care."No, it's mostly the people,my friends who aremarried and they're young.I'm like, "What are youjust, if you want them,just get on with it, trust me."Yeah, yeah.So anyway, I don't have any regretsbecause I don't haveanything in my bucket list,so there's that.But obviously, miscarriages,miscarriages, whatever.So by the time I finally had my kid 40,and I was still writing,but I was running out of money,we were doing a short sale on our house,and the writer's strike had happened,and I had married a writer.It was like, not good.How did you meet your ex-husband?I was an early adopter ofonline dating, I'm glad you asked.Back when it was weird.Which one?I was on an app that I didn't realizewas like a super sexual app.I thought it was justfor interesting people.It was called Nerve.com.I haven't even heard of that.I don't even know.
• 1:36:36
  It's gone.It's gone.It shared an engine orwhatever with the onionand other smarty pants.Oh, that's awesome.The smarty pants go.The bad one, B.Yeah, and I couldn't understandwhy I was getting so many dick pics.I'm like, what is wrong with this app?Sony fans now.Yes, and that's not to--There's another one nowthat's just for hooking up,but I can't remember what it's called.Maybe.Tinder's actually become more of arelationship thing now.I think there's so much fun going on.I don't even thinkhooking up's happening anymore.It's just all, everything's over.Yeah, I know.So you were at thebeginning of that whole--I was at the beginning, yes.I met my first real, yeah,I had two big relationships.All my relationshipsare from the internet.Even this show is from the internet,so I guess I have to thank it.You guys are from the internet for me.Yeah, so we met there,and that's not to suggest hewas on there for that reason.Well, maybe he was.I don't know.No, I don't think so.Anyway, it was very sweetand we fell in love, whatever.What was this question?How you guys met?Yeah, that, we met there.And so how long fromthe time you guys met?When you got married?Yeah, not long.I was 35, so I was like, chop chop.But within a year?Yeah, he's also, he likes to be married.He's a guy that likes to be, you know.Was he married before you?He was, yes.And so he was not oneof these commitment,fob dudes, and I'd always gone in threes,like asshole, asshole, niceguy, asshole, asshole, nice guy.So he was like the niceguy after two assholes,and he was really nice.And yeah, so we gotmarried and very fast,and then of course started to trainof the babies very fast.And this is what I tryand explain to young peopleif you're listening,miscarriage just take a long time.You have to recover andthen you have to wait.And as the years go by,it's like, then I had an-How long, I actuallynever had a miscarriage.Oh, you're so lucky.I know, I know, I know.I do feel very, very lucky.But how long do you have to waitafter you had one to try again?I don't remember the exact time,but it was, it feelslike it was a couple monthsor something, likeyour body has to recover.I don't recall.The real time suckthough was they thoughtthe reason I washaving so many miscarriageswas because of fibroid tumors.That's a sexy topicbrought to you by fibroid tumors.I've had them.Okay.Were your pain- I know about them.You know about them.I do, yeah.How many, did you have painful ones?Were you like bleeding and stuff?No, mine weren't bad at all.No, I was bleeding so bad.This was in, I thinkthis started in my mid 40s.I was bleeding so bad.I became anemic and it was,my cramping was like labor pains.Right.And it was affecting my life.Like it got to thepoint where I couldn't goand participate in things with thembecause I was laying in bed.Yeah.And I ended up having a hysterectomy.Oh, wow.I did, but I'd already had my kids.Yeah, yeah, yeah.I kept my ovaries, but it freed mefrom the bleeding and everything.Oh my God.Yeah, but you had, itsounds like that was affectingyour fertility. Ididn't have any symptoms.I had no symptoms.They did an ultrasound and they're like,you have, like most of youruterine cavity is blocked.So like, wow.So they did the surgeriesand that took almost a yearto recover from that.That was a big--Okay. And then--Because they went inand removed them, right?They removed the tumorsand it was like a C-sectionon steroids, you know?Did you have C-section or vaginal?No, it was with the robot.Oh, wow.And yeah, it was a whole thing.I only have like four little cutsthat are maybe halfan inch on my stomach.You wouldn't even know.And so they, and thenthey removed everythingvaginally, I think.Oh, wow.It was with the robot.No, it was very--Yeah, more laparoscopic, yeah.Laparoscopic, yeah.It was 2020, I had it done.Yep, there was something about minewhere they were positioned, I don't know.So they had to cut you like a C-section?Yeah.And when you don't leavewith a baby after that,that's not a fun recovery.That was--Yeah, because you werein the hospital, what,like three, four days?I don't even know ifit's that long, right?They like to kick youout and get the bed back.But it was--That's true, that's, yeah.But that was the first surgery.Oh, the recovery was intense.So the C-section was actually nothingwhen I went back in.Like, those child's play,but they also had a baby.Right, right, right, right.So once you had thesurgery and you recovered,then did you get pregnant?Yep, and it was full term immediately.So it was amazing.I'm surprised.How long did it take youtrying and having miscarriagebefore they finally did the ultrasound?I mean, they may havedone it, I can't remember.They may have thoughtlike it was a theory.It wasn't like 100%, you know?Because I got pregnant rightaway, as we've established.So I was getting pregnant,but just losing it every--Yeah, yeah.You had three miscarriages,and after that, that's when--Yeah, so I wonder if theywould have done the ultrasoundand taken care of the fibroid sooner.I don't know.If that were, I don't know, yeah.Then they had that like--That blows me away.What was that?That blows me away,that just blows me away,that to your point, how the hell do younot piece it together?Yeah.I was always surprised that women'shealthcare is ignored.And I'm always like, dude,that's just what we go throughall the time with everything.I've been shit on too for my responses.It's being totally ignorant.Yeah.That blows me away though.Well, it's amazing,you're just saying this,and I'm like, yeah, why didn't he do it?I've never thought like that.I just kind of assumed--Because you're a woman.Yeah.If it was a fibroid blocking the man'spenis, they would have--I'm starting to believe that.I've resisted it'sbecause you're a woman.I'm starting to believe it.It is, I'm telling you.That's crazy.Don't even get mestarted on perimenopauseand how no one talked to Gen X.We didn't knowanything, and all of a sudden,we're in perimenopauseand we're having depressionand brain fog and gain 20 pounds.And I feel like we'regoing crazy, but God forbid,anyone told shit thatcan start at age 35,because none of ourmothers talked about it.Yeah, unpleasant.So there's so manywomen that are being treatedfor anxiety and depression that probablyare in perimenopause.And can do somehormone replacement therapy.So that's one thingI'm big on is Gen X womenneed to talk about itso that the younger womenare prepared, because we weren't.You will be happy to know,I talk about my menopauseon stage to people intheir 20s, and I talk about,oh, I do not, that's a really crude joke.Sometimes I end uphaving, because I do the creams,the compound creams, andsometimes I'll have themon my clothing and I'll have to say,this is not what you think.This is splooge.This is not a Monica Lewinsky situation.It is the opposite.Yes, yes.Wouldn't it be exciting ifit was, but I would tell you.Oh my God, yeah, no.No.Not top of mind.I do, yeah, I love it.And I also talk about howwe're all just sacks of chemicals,and the way I know this is,because I overdid it one daywith my testosterone,and I wanted to have sexwith everything, I'dnever had that urge before.It was, I was like edging all day,and it was so uncomfortable though,that the woman in me went out.The woman was like,no, we don't like this,must stop this, you know?Balance back out, balance back out.Well, you know they say toonly do it in the morning,because it can keep you awake.Oh, the testosterone at night, really?You don't do it laterin the day or at night,because it gives you a, like with men,that's why they have a,not just the sex drive,just that like, not aggressiveness,but you know what I mean?Like that oomph,because it gives you that.So they say do it in the morning.That's what I was told, and I asked why,and she said because itmight keep you awake at night.The oomph, the male oomph.Yeah, I do that.I didn't know that.I do the patch, do youdo the estrogen patch?No, I've been doingthese compound creams.I think I got caught upwith like a very expensiveBeverly Hills witchdoctor, and got completely likeGrandma Nigerian Prince into this guy,and now I'm stuck withhim and his magical creams.But he is retiring, and I am literallylooking for somebodyto like save me, Idon't wanna not have them.So I think I might do the patch.But finding, sorry, you go.No, I was gonna say, Iget it through my OB.The OBs will do it.I need a new OB, that's the problem.And I am auditioning themright now, which is so fun.Yeah.It's so fun finding somebody newto take care of my lady parts.Well, because--Brian, are you enjoying this part?I mean, two two.That's the best thing, yeah.Two two.So many OBs though.I hear this.This is another complaint.Yeah.There's so few OBsfocused on midlife for women.It's all still babies, babies.And so there's just thoserandom ones that will focuson perimenopause,menopause, hormones, hysterectomies,all the things, like not just,you don't just get ahysterectomy midlife.I know younger women do too.But they need more OBs to focus on thatbecause there's all of usGen X ladies are in our midlifeand we don't need to be onthe floor with the babiesor we're like beingrushed in for 15 minutesbecause your doctor isseeing so many pregnant womenand they only have so much time.So now I actually see a nursepractitioner in the practiceand she can do all thesame things the OB can.So look into that, anurse practitioner in--Interesting.The medical group orwhatever, you know what I mean?Okay, see, that's so funny.I just rejected somebodybecause I was sent to this officeand then they were gonna meet with me.I'm like, wait, it's just the nurse?No shade to nurses, but it's--Yeah, the nurse practitioner is great.She can order all the same stuff.She prescribed the testosterone cream.I have an estrogen patch and I takeprogesterone at nightin a pill form andthat will knock you out.You will fall asleep.It's like a natural sleeping pill.I really like to not have thesemysterious white stainsall in my clothing.That would be--Yeah.You at least have a littlebit, just the testosterone.Do it in the morning, itabsorbs and then it's--It has to be good for the bit, right?Oh, it's a great bit.And you know what's funny about it?I'm always fascinated.I can't believe how many young menwanna hear about menopause.I'm like, really?They find it really funny.I don't know what that is.I don't know if it'sbecause they're kids of Gen Xers.I don't know, but I'm always--However you'regetting the information out,you're doing the work.Keep doing it.I even had this idea toembarrass them in a fun waywhere I would leanout with my microphone,tell me what you think menopause is.And they actually--You knew.I'm like, what?Wow.Interesting.I love that.That gives me hope.Yeah.But it is LA, it is LA,so this is the land of--You'll have to let us knownow that you're taking iton tour, which we're gonna get to,like you find the men inother parts of the countryare as attuned as in LA.But how long were you andyour ex-husband together?We were together all in 10 years.And yeah, yep.And then you co-parented?Yes, yes.Our son was seven.I have to say, as a child of divorce,it was a bummer, like I didn't want this.And I think we all, well you guys, kudos.Are your parents together?His would still be.His dad had passed away in 2007,but they would have still been married.So he comes from likethis perfect family,leave it to Beaver,traditional background.And I came from psychoticthree divorces on both parents.Right, sorry, you told me that, sorry.Yeah, no, no, halfsiblings, step siblings,all the craziness.So what's ironic is that weboth wanted the same thingbecause I didn't have it and he did.You broke the cycle.What do you think the secret isthat you were able to break the cycle?Determination.And we were best friends for three yearsbefore we got together.And that friendship, whenlife gets ugly and shitty,no matter what, westill were best friends.Even if I wanted tokill him in his sleep,I didn't because he was my best friend.I survived a couple attempts.He survived, but, andthere's times you hate each otherthrough the years, butit was that friendship.It was a friendship.I'm with you.Interesting, I feel like Iwas my most me in collegeand I could see had I hadthe emotional wherewithalor parenting, if I hadgrown up, I don't know.I could have had a lasting relationshipwith somebody I met in college.Do you know what I mean?There's a familiaritythat I think you guys havewith each other when it'sright that is so wonderful.And I've been lookingfor it my whole life.Yeah, I always tell,and my kids know this,but I think it's soimportant to have friendship,like true friendship,like where you treateach other as best friends.Because you treat your bestfriends so well, typically.You would never do really horrible thingsto your best friend.And so I always say you should betreating your spouseas well as you would treatyour cherished best friendor better.And that's always my advice,is to try to find that friendship.So what's funny is Idated his best friend,not best friend, verygood friend through college.So it allowed us to become platonicfriends through college.And then right before we graduated,we realized we love each other.That was nice.Your friend was the warmup act.And then you came in.Absolutely.He was not happy about that.Was there crossover?There was some...No, but what's funnyis when you have a groupof friends in college, likehalf of them think there was.So they turned on usand the other half don't.And even like Facebookcame back, came aroundand we all kind ofreconnected with people we knew.And that group still, Ithink they treated us like,they didn't believe us.I think it was shocking.It was shocking.Wait, how many years?Exactly, that's crazy.Yeah, yeah.It was very strange.So it was a big deal becausemy boyfriend and I were likethe couple in the friend group.And then it was abig, big traumatic thingat the end of our college years together,I guess for everybody, I don't know.Apparently a lifelong scar.They're all in therapytalking about you guys still.How could they do that to us?I think, could be.And then one day one ofour shorts from the podcastis gonna come up on Facebook and be ajump scare for them.There they are.Yeah, happy marriage.Why are you at a, it is sofunny to me now as an adultwho's, as I like to say, seen some shit.That's our age, we've seen some shit.You didn't mean upset about like cheatingwith a boyfriend or something like that.It's not.No, no.That's not cheating.No, no, no, no, no, not at all.Not at all, it's so funny.So that is funny.So you guys, when you separated though,you were, it wasamicable and you've been ableto co-parent togetherand everything's good.We had a tough time inthe beginning and yeah.I think he was, yeah, he was very hurtand I still feelhorrible about to this day.I never wanted to hurt him.It's really hard whenone person wants the thingand the other doesn't.But I think he wouldprobably agree at this point.I don't know that we were really,really the right people for each other.But I also have no regrets.I know it sounds cliche,but we had this beautiful son togetherand it has been eight yearsand we are very good co-parents now.But it was a challenge at first.And I'm sure.Yeah.You know what's weirdis I know people who,and nothing even interesting happened.There's no cheating,you know what I mean?I know people with thecraziest, most toxic storiesand they are best friends with their,I think it almosthelps to have a bad guy,something to point to.Yeah.I don't know what that is.I'm like, you forgave them?I mean, that's cool,but it's just interesting.It's almost like theytrauma bonded or something.Yes, and they triangulate.They're like, yeah, that person.Yeah, so they couldn't totally separatebecause they're trauma bonded.But for you guys,there wasn't that trauma.So you just kind of can drift stuff.You just kind of drift it.So, but I'm glad that nowyou guys have found some.Yeah, and our kid'samazing and he's a great dad.And yeah, I mean, Idon't recommend divorce.It's not fun.No, I know.I know, no, it's amazing howmany Gen Xers have divorcedor are divorcing now midlife.Well, I hope so.Just kidding.I'm not here to celebrate.I am not here to danceon the grave of divorce.I just want to be clear.Well, we've talked aboutjust the whole also Gen X.We've talked about Gen X men,emotional development, communication,but I think so many of us as children,grinded through, grinded through.Our emotions were notacknowledged, discussed.We didn't know how toidentify what we were feeling.And then we got married.And so it's a wonder thatany of them have survived,any of the marriages,because right now wesay we grew up together.And that's when I say determination,because there were times when,because of not having that preparation,how to communicate, itwas just almost like,we're gonna communicate.I don't know how, but wegot to figure this out.No one taught us.So, but it's not easy.No, and for listenerviewers who just heard me say,I'm not here to danceon divorce is grace.I just want to be clear.I was talking about my business,my, of the big D.If divorce stops, I don't have a show.But I was joking.I just want to put that in context.Now I'm gonna come backto what you were saying,because the little voice, the publicistin my head was like,you need to button that one up.No, I was gonna say,there was this one bookthat I do recommend tocouples who are struggling.It just brings clarity.And I think it's called"Hold Me Tight."And we did all the therapy.We tried.That's the other thing I think.It's not like, what ifwe, like we really tried.But that book had this one metaphor,this one thing in there.And anytime I havefriends who are strugglingand wondering, I mean, this image,and I feel like couples likeyou, it's a very easy answer.And it's just, are youboth on the dance floor?If you're both on the dance floor,you can accomplish anything.Yeah.When somebody's left the dance floor.Yeah.That's a great analogy.No, it is.It is.Even if you'refighting on the dance floor,you're both there.Exactly.You are engaged.You are invested.Yes.I get chills thinking about itbecause I knew I hadleft the dance floor.Well, it's so true.You both have to committo trying to make it workand figure it out and be committed to it.It's to her point though, it's, you know,I mean, I feel very lucky.I think we both do.But you do work at it.Of course.And you have to evolve.Especially guys, right?Gen X guys that werefairly obtuse, I think.And you just have to, Idon't know, somehow you evolve.And I think maybe it's through kids.You had said something earlierwhere I think you'velearned about yourself.It was the ADHD thing, right?ADHD, yeah.Yeah, your son.And you're like, oh mygosh, I see myself in him.You kind of see yourself in your kids.And that helps, I think,kind of keep it all together.Yeah.I don't know if thatmakes sense or not, but.Well, I think us coming from school,from when we were youngand having such historyand vetted, we are so vetted.Like we don't have to explain anythingor pass to each other.That does help.So to your point, when yousaid you could have seen yourselfin a long-term relationshipfrom college, I mean, yeah.It makes sense.It does make sense.Yeah.And you're in that situation.Yeah, and my two best friends out here,people are like, who'sreally happily married?Like, I know happily married people.I'm not anti-marriage.Like, I'm pro-marrying the right person.But these two friends of mineare both collegesweethearts as well, or two couples.And I know that that's not,but they're supposed to be together.They're both I guess for.But I love that metaphor.Not mine, it istrademarked, hold me tight, great book.It's a whole workshop.But I will tell you kind offunny, sad, mostly funny noteabout the Americanboyfriend that came to Italy.He was the one for me that got away.And I regret it.We didn't really know each other.But in my mind, over the years,I always became if only, if only.So I did that thing thateveryone does on Facebook, right?I like found him.Yeah.Like, this is gonnabe the thing, you know?And I wrote him.And all I said, I'm justclearly fishing, right?And I'm like, how'sit going or something?And he said, oh, Julie, you never change.And that was the last I heard from him.I'm like, what the fuck does that mean?(both laughing)Oh my God.That's crazy.Forget about being hurt.I need to know what's inthe box, you know what I mean?Like, what did you mean by that?I mean, you're probably right.But can you explain that to me?Yeah, yeah, yeah.Oh my gosh.That's too much.That's too much.Okay, so when did you get into comedy?Okay, so.Were you still married or was this post?No, in fact, myex-husband was into comedy,I think right before our son was born.So I used to go around to see himperforming and you know.Oh, okay.So you said he was a writer too, right?Yeah, I mean, he was trying out comedy,you know what I mean?Okay.Yeah, so I just remember being exhaustedand not wanting to go tothese late shows anymoreevery time I went to go see him perform.But anyway, I don't know.I've always been funny my whole life,but I would see him,I would see other people doing comedy.I'm like, I should do that.And then I just, the years,I don't know about you guys, just like,as soon as you have a kid, I mean,I don't know where it went.But then we split upand it wasn't even then.I kept filling the void,an unfortunate metaphor with boyfriendswhen I left the marriage.And I really wasn't finding myself,I was avoiding the pain of the divorce.And there's no good way to do it.I'm not shaming anybody who does it.You just, there's no waythrough but through in time.And then when the timehad gotten to a good placeand reality TV had shit the bed,which again, I don't know how much this,Hollywood is like over,do you know about this?No.Well, I feel, I reada little bit about it.I'd be curious what your,Yeah, what is that?Well, I mean, there's the reality sideand there's a scripted sideand the shortest versionis streaming didn't work.So it's like, thereare too many streamers.Like how many, you know what I mean?Do you even care about any shows anymore?Like there are so many good showsthat you almost don'tcare about them, right?So it ate itself.And they claimed theyweren't making money.I imagine they weren't, but then again,the writer's strike waslike, they are making money.They're not paying us enough.So I don't wanna getinto that side necessarily.I'm sure they're notgetting paid enough writers,but I think thebusiness model was not workingand it was, there was a bubble basically.And so it affected bothscripted and unscriptedand all the networks started to mergeand companies weregetting slashed and like,they've just been trying to,like David Zaslov wasbrought in to take overWarner Discovery and justkind of, he made HBO Max.And the whole thinking of that was,I think he said, you'll be able to findanything fromsuccession to Dr.
• 2:01:33
  Pimplehopper.I'm like, oh no.But it was, I can't remember the numberof how much debt he had to clear,but it became clear pretty quickly.It was like, theproducers, like it was easier to,even if a movie or TV show was done,it was easier for them not to put it outand to take the loss to recoup money.So it was just, I don't know if you'reGame of Thrones fans,but it was like, okay, itwas a red wedding in town,like just massive layoffs.So many people have lefttown, writers rooms have shrunk.Everybody thoughtreality would then balloonbecause of scripted, butit didn't because we're all,you know, basically atthe same teat, if you will,of the streamers.So it just, thebusiness doesn't work anymore,the business model.And so as it reburts itself,there've been so manyfinancial casualtiesfor almost everyone I know.And that was a very lofty way of saying,everyone I know is out of work.So work's starting to slow down.Well, I was just gonna saya lot of it's left LA too,right?It's moved on to other areas.Because there's been no tax incentives.I think I just read that maybe it's back.I don't know.I think the wholebusiness is just gonna becomepeer to peer YouTube.Like you look at howour kids consume material.Like, I just don'teven think we can conceiveof what it's gonna looklike in the end, but it's-I think that social media, like TikTok,has taken a huge chunk.Like I know for myself,I'll just go on TikTokat night and not watch TV.And I know a lot of people like that,that won't even turn on the TV.I'm a YouTuber.Yeah, so I think that reality TV, Iguess, quote unquote,where it's actuallypeople, like regular people,you know what I mean?Watching regular people.I think that's takena chunk out of things.I could be wrong.No, I think you're right.Like, did I make that worse or better?No, you're good.No, you're fine.Like there's an ad for Jimmy Fallon.It was like three billion views.It's all about who's watching it,the monologue the next dayand the bits the next day.So yeah, I mean,everything's changed for all of us.But I watched my sonand like, I was like,oh, 28 days later, maybe you're oldenough to see that now.He's like, I saw it.I said, where?He said, YouTube.I'm like, what?Okay, well, that's a great movie.You need to see anyway.But, and I think forpeople not in the business,they're like, but there's so much stuff.But if you notice,there really isn't anymore.Like a lot of stuff stopped being,like we're watchingBrooklyn Nine-Nine right now,you know, like old seasons of it.Yeah.Yeah, a lot of people arewatching like older shows.Yes, because that is by design.That's how Netflix is like,hey, you might like this series.Because they're trying toavoid making other series.Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.So it's a pretty-I have a question for you.Have you ever doneany like major own film,like a short film?You mentioned the 16millimeter back in the day.No.Technology's pretty good these days.You know, Brian, I agree.And I kick myself all the timebecause there is no excuseto not make my own thing.Well, time, other things, you know.No, no, no, but it is true.I mean, now more than ever,you can make an entiremovie on your phone, you know?Yeah.So you're reminding meof a goal that I droppedand I'm going to get back to it tomorrow.So you just saw my entire souldisappearing from my body.Well, I'm in the same boat.I wanna do something.I have no background or anything in it,but I would love to,because it is sort of accessible.I don't have a theme.That's my problem.I know all thetechnical attributes of it.Free, post, everything,but I don't have a story.You mean you wanna drive to film?I'd love to make afilm, like a short film,five, 10 minute type of thing.I don't really have a theme though.It'll come.Well, to answer your question, yes,writing is horrible andpainful and nobody likes it.And that is why I am notdirecting a movie right now,but it is in my mind to justfinally sit down and do it.If you do it, you have to let us know.Oh, of course.You'll be the first one I'll complain to.Yeah, come on and talk about it.That would be awesome.So because of what wasgoing on in Hollywood,did that lead me to comedy?Yeah, well that and my mom was dying.So, it's always so strange.I love when I meet guysonline and they're like,oh, you're a comic.How'd you get into that?It's not good.Nobody becomes a comicbecause of a good story.You're not gonna like this.They're like, that's not sexy.Okay, no, it's not.My mom died.Okay, so--My mom died.Yeah, so what was I saying?About your mom, when's she dying?She never stood a chance.I don't know about your mom,but it's like, I have awhole thing about this too.It's like, there was notime for gentle parenting then.Like they were survivingand she was a child of trauma.And, you know, it just,I have forgiven her forevery whatever, you know,because I'm just so awareof what she lived through.And we wouldn't be this wayhad we not had that, you know?So-- Yeah.Now there's pros and cons,definitely pros and cons.I mean, look, I wish I did that.Yeah, would've, should've, could've.Anyway, so yes, so we werevery close, very codependent,but also I moved 3000 miles.She's in Chicago, I'm in LA, like, youknow, there's stuff.And then she got sick and, you know,it's very hard to showup and care for somebodythat you have to protect yourself around,if that makes sense.
• 2:07:30
  Yeah, yeah.So she had cancer.It was, I can'tremember the name of it, CUPS,which is Cancer of Unknown Origin.Oh, yeah, unknown forsure. 15% of all cancersare considered cancers,they can't figure it out.And then-- Wow.7%, they finally just go under,and they just look atwhere the tumors areand they just treat it as if.So she basically was-- Like hasmetastasized alreadyand they're not sure where the source is.Correct. Okay, that makes sense.Yeah.So that was about ayear and a half of hergoing through that.And I just had to show up and be there,but not really be there,you know, like gray rocking.Are you guys, do youever talk about gray rockingon your show?No, what's gray rocking?So gray rocking is, I don't know,it's one of the eight million trendsthat you talk about online, they,but it's, if you havesomebody like that in your life,that you don't wannanot be in their lives,it's a way to show up and be there,but not really be there, Idon't know, it's hard to--So you kind of have aprotective boundary around you,and you don't really emotionally andmentally connect to,like you don't empathize completelyand put yourself intheir shoes and connecting,completely immerseyourself in the experience,but you're there physically?Yeah, but you try and be there,you're still pleasant tobe around, you don't engage,you don't take the bait really is the--Right, okay.Llamins terms.You could explain it betterthan I'll just butcher it,but we've talked about that,where children whohave this relationship--Yeah, we talked, well,what we talked about was,a lot of Gen Xers are having to carefor their elder parents, anda lot of those elder parentsare the source of their childhood trauma.And it can, if youhaven't had a chance yetto totally resolve your childhood trauma,or even if you have, it can re-trigger,even if you've gonethrough all the healing work,you can still be re-triggered right backinto that space again.Or if you haven'tdealt with it or impacted,you're right back in thatspace when you were 10 years old.And so the struggle ofhaving to care for this personthat caused you pain.Yes.A lot of Gen Xers aregoing through that right now.So that's so interesting.And also, I think that's how I found you.I think I saw maybe a clipof you talking about that.Was that it?Because you said thatand I just got chills.I'm like, right.That must've been the short.Yes.That during that, whenyou reached out to us.Yes.That resonated for a lot of people.Yeah.A lot of people in their age.Because you feel less alone.You feel, you feel guilty.You know, your parentssick and you're angry at them.Yeah, that's what it was.I think a lot of guiltand people were like,oh my gosh, I'm not alone in this.A lot of people said,I thought I was the onlyone that felt this way.And then there's tens of thousands ofpeople that are like,no, I feel this way too.There's a lot of people too though,where that were like, fuck them.I don't care.Yeah.Cause me trauma.Yeah.I'm no contact for the last 10 years.They can die alone.At least half the people.It's very interesting.Extremely visceral.Yeah.I wonder how those people are doingbecause I found,I was in like a horribly toxicrelationship with this guywho gave me tons of material.He's in my first set.So this is the other question.So the other thing is Iwas in a bad relationshipromantically, great sex ofcourse, great sex, bad people,always a great combination.Anyway, he was hot.Okay.So, and it's, I've come a long waybecause I could seethose guitars I'm not having.I'm not triggered.He was a guitarist.I'm fine.I'm totally fine.I'm totally fine.Yeah.So.Just don't rub toomuch your patch on there.Yeah, exactly.And then rub.Pretty good. Yeah, exactly.Then she lost it.And so with him, she's sick.And he said to,actually it saysbefore she even got sick,because he knew about her.He said, I'm really worried about you.That you're going to lose your momand you're not goingto have forgiven her.And you'll never beable to forgive yourself.And I want you to do this for you.And if that was the reasonthat fool came into my life,great, you know, cause Idid start working on it.And I did start, it wasmaybe less spray rocking.I was able to actually be there,but I was still, you know,the dangler fish, you know,the light, I was not,not going to, you know.And then she got sick and Iremember calling him crying.I'm like, oh my God, my mom has cancer.And he's like, what?And I said, but I'm so glad that you,I'm just remembering this now.I said, I'm so gladyou had me on this pathbecause when she toldme I was able to cry,I was so sad about losing her.So I actually was in areally good emotional positionwith my mom when itstarted, but, you know,the things would happen.So I guess it's too lateto say long story short,but we had, I had avoidedgetting super engaged with herand anything.And then there was this, butthis fight was so importantbecause this is what led to comedy.So I was with her and Iguess every Gen X parentwho talked about thiswill love this story.She's on her deathbed.I mean, it took a while,but she was still on the bedthat she would sendbe, you know, whatever.That doesn't sound right.Okay. And she says tome, I don't know where I,I don't know what I, Idon't know what I did.I was like, I'm so wrongwhen you were a little child.Like basically I thought, oh my God,she's apologizing to me foreverything she ever did wrong.It's happening.Yeah. And then shefinished the thought and said,for you to have suchhorrible taste in men.Oh my goodness.And I had broken up withguitar man who I knew was badand have so much shame around that.I said, you know, well,don't do this, don't do that.And she just was, and I think, you know,it's a familiar, she was excited probablyon some subconscious level, you know,and then we're justyelling at each other and like,don't do this stuff.But I go in the other room and I'msobbing uncontrollably.And my stepdad comes in,he's like, what happened?Why are you crying?And I had said it and shesaid, you know, your mom,she's always beenemotionally distant with you.That is the first timeI'd ever heard that before.My gosh.Yeah.Like, what?Wow.That before, anyway, I had it in my mind.I'm like, well, I've beenwith her for a long timethrough this sickness and this isprobably the last timeI'm gonna see her.Cause I can't, this isthis cut deep, you know,and I have to protect myself.And I had seen this comedyteacher, shout out, right?Leslie Wolf, amazing comedy teacher.If you ever want to takestandup comedy, it's all on Zoom.You can do it.It's incredible.It's therapy.It's amazing.Okay, there.I had to say that.Leslie Wolf, we can also probably--Yeah, send the links.Yeah, any links you want to anyone,we'll put it in the description.Yeah, I recommend everyone do this.I don't care if youdon't want to be a comic.It's an amazing experience.So she, I'd been seeingher workshops, her showcaseswith friends of mine over the years.I'm gonna do that all ofa sudden 10 years goes byand I see that she's, oneis starting the next dayand I'm like, I'm doingthis, you know, my truth.I'm gonna burn everything to the ground.Everyone's gonna know, you know?And then I got home and I calmed downand I called her and I was like,yeah, I'm not doing this.I haven't worked in a while.I don't have the money for thisand I'm really raw with my,you know, I can't do this.I don't even think I mentioned my mom.And she said, I know this isgonna sound suspicious, right?Like she's looking to close the, itwasn't, I swear to you.She called me back.She said, I will give you a deal on this.I could tell you need this class.And she was right.And I started thatnight and I did burn it downon that first Zoom call with everyoneand they're all laughing and crying.I'm like, this is gold.This is incredible.You're so lucky.I'm like, I'm so lucky.That's what a comic says.And then my mom went tohospice the following Mondayand I was like, oh shit, Ihave to start a whole new set.So I drove out there and I already,it was like rebooted us, you know?And I was like, okay, I'm here again.And anyway, it wasjust this weird blessing.I mean, I don't like the word blessing,but I started torewrite everything and realizethat I am more than thestories of me and my mom.And I started, and I, everything I wrotehad nothing to do with her.In the beginning, we hadeverything to do with her,but nothing to do with her.Yeah, yeah, yeah.And I was able to show upand be likeemotionally vulnerable with herand be with her and forgive her.I'm gonna start crying,thinking about like compassionbecause I had this thingand I was just talkingto friends about this.They said, because youfinally felt heard and seen.Yeah. Like I always had this fantasyof a jury hearing me as a child,like, can you believe whatI'm putting up with, you know?And then I finally had iton that Zoom call, you know?And they were like-- They were validated.They're just like, yes, you know?And they were verydisappointed when I dropped that set.I'm like-- But you were validated,like you said. Yeah.The child on you wasfinally seen and acknowledgedand validated. And not by her.That's where we all go wrong, right?We can't wait for them.We can only forgive themonce we stop, you know?You went and found your own closure.Yes, yes.But did it come from yourstepfather, saying those words?No, it came from theZoom call where she--No, but I mean, it was the catalyst,him kind of acknowledgingand validating it, right?Yes.Your mom's alwaysbeen emotionally distant.Where the hell have you been, dude?He put words to-- That's what I'm saying.Like you were probablyalways wondering, what is it?What is it?And then he put the words to what it was.I didn't feel crazy in that moment.I thought he was comingin to shame me about tears,which he was a littlebit, because that generation,they're like, "We don't cry around here.What are you doing?Did you try it?Shove that down."Yeah, bury it.Bury it.So it was a shock that he said that.I was like, "What?You're right."Yeah. It's almost like you were gaslit.Like I think a lot ofGen Xers were gaslitthrough their childhood.Totally.You're not feeling that way.Like what are your, ormade fun of for being dramaticfor all that stuff when we were gaslitfor all of our lives.And then finally whenwe're not and we're validatedand we don't feelcrazy, like we're not crazy,it's like, "Wow, I'm not crazy."And that's what that was for you.Yeah, you're right.That's what it was. You had that closure.So then from there, did you just,like how did youdecide, okay, I'm gonna--Yeah, it was a four week class.And my secret planwas I'm not performing.I'm just gonna do the classes.This woman's crazy if shethinks I'm getting on stage.She doesn't, you know, I'mjust gonna do these classesand be done with this.And then as the, it's four weeksand then you perform right away.And that's one of thethings I love about her class.You go on the main stage at Flappers,a really good club here in Burbank.So you don't have time to like,it's, you know, you'regetting shoved out of the plane.It's an incredible likegrowth thing that happens.And she really works withyou on your personal story.It's not like set up punch, set up punch.And so it's very therapeutic, her class.But as the performancetime is getting closer,I was like, I think I am doing this.Oh shit, you know, and I was petrified,but I didn't tell my parents.I didn't tell them for months.And it felt so empoweringthat I had the secretlife out there, you know?Yeah.But anyway, I showed upthat night and Leslie was thereand she's like, this is crazy.You should be working all the time.You're natural.And she's like, trust me,you're gonna be addictedthe moment you do this.And she was right.Like my foot hit the stage.It was like, just likeelectricity and light.It was amazing.And I was completely hooked.I, if they had a cane,they probably would have had to pull meoff stage, you know,because I totally ran the light.I was like, get another thing.And yeah, I was like, okay,when do I go again?And it just has been nonstop since.And I think it is theGen X thing, you know?It's like, all right,we're gonna do this.We're gonna crack this nut.I don't even, it'sinsane, but I'm gonna do it.I'm gonna, you know?Yeah, so when was that?My two year comedyanniversary will be this October.So how old were you whenyou went on that stage?I was 53.So I think that's a great exampleof we're never done, Gen X especially.We are always going tolive life and tackle itno matter how old we are.There is no, well, I'm in my 50s,I'm in my 60s, I'm in my 70s.I think Gen X is gonna godown fighting and livingand taking on new experiences andchallenging ourselves.I think a lot of itdoes come from the grindof our childhood.And that's the pro of how we were raisedbecause I don't think anyother generation is agedlike we are.And I think you're such abeautiful example of that.Oh my God, thank you.Can you guys adopt me?Is that weird?No?No, honestly though, because--That's so beautiful.When we were raised--What you said, by theway, I just wanna stopand say that you guysare amazing, thank you.No, it's true.I think when we were growing up,we thought by the timeyou hit 50, like it's done.Like it's done, now you'regoing to your older years.And, but no, that'swhere Gen X is actuallyprobably starting tolive their biggest dreams.And I think we should be an inspirationfor the younger generations to say,because some of these younger generationsthink your 30s is old.And I keep saying, youguys don't even know.You don't know anything yet,but just wait till you hit.I found 50 very liberating, but I thinkyou're just such a greatexample of what Gen X is doing.Thank you.I mean, look whatyou've done in two years.I think it's remarkable.You've reinvented your entire life again,but this time it's 100% on your terms.Yes.And it's coming from such a place of,you're really standing in a healthy placeon your two feet, a solid foundation.And you probably areyour most authentic self,I would say.Yes.Yeah.All that.It's so interesting.You feel reinvigorated.Oh my God.In a sense.When I hear, I am never bored.I am never depressed anymore.I might get anxious, but I know,I do have a lot of friendswho have not found this thing,whatever it is for them.And I feel bad for them because I don't,but I just, I could do this to the grave.I'll be doing this in"Sing Your Citizen's Home."You know what I mean?Like it is incredible.And you can be broke and you can do it.You can do this.Nobody can stop you from doing comedy.Amazing.And I do want to say theyoung thing is hilariousbecause I'm friendswith so many young comics.And it's so funny whenthey get up there and like,I just turned 30 andI'm really feeling my age.Or I'm, the ones I kind ofhave to give a little slack to,it's like I'm turning 40.And I'm like, I know youthink it's old, it's not,but it is, it's the beginning of old.Like your body's changing for sure.Your eggs are dead or whatever.If you're a woman.Yes.Yeah, if you're awoman, the perimenopauseand the menopause and all that.Yeah, for sure.But the 30 year olds,I'm like, you're a zygote.Like you are not,you're, they don't know.They don't know.And I don't know how to help them.Like one of my closest friends is 30.And I'm like, dude, you're so good.Like you're fine.Just, it's cool, man.You've got this.I think what's hard forthem with social mediais there's so much FOMOand so much comparisons.And comparisons, the thief of joy.And I think that when they all thinkthey're supposed to be doing that,and even when they accomplish something,then in an hour they could see somebodydoing something better.And they're like, oh, but mything isn't as good as that.Now I gotta, they'realways having to chaseand probably neverfeel satisfied or contentwith theiraccomplishments because social mediaand most of that's fake.Yeah.Most of it's not real.Perform.And it's performative, but I don't thinkthey still understand that fully.I'm sucked into it.Yes, yeah, we can all, you know,it's, we all have to take a moment,remind ourselves that it's performative.Yes.But I think for the younger generations,I really feel bad for them.Oh, I do too.Because I think ittakes a lot longer for themto feel like proud of what they're doing.Yeah, and is there any joy in anythingif it's not being recorded and posted?Like that's so awful to me.That's what I'm fun.My son, actually, here's the good news.My son, not on social media, thank God.He's always complainingthat I'm filming too much.But that's new, that'swhen this comedy thing,like it was not new before, you know?But I do have to be careful,because I'm like, oh,can I, no, mom, you know?Yeah, yeah.He's like, great.I have a clarifying question, I guess.So that first night you went out,you went out byyourself and did stand up.Yes.In front of a crowd.Sorry, yes, and beforeyou think I'm super bad ass,it's a class, you'refriends with all your classmates,it is the warmestaudience, but it was terrifying.I was shitting myself, yes.But I had friends there, Ihave my friend Amy there.Yeah.I mean, in fact, if you had to--No, but that's stillpretty, that's some pressure.Oh, it was the scariest day of my life.I just wanna be clear.Yeah, that's awesome.And I was evacuatedfrom the airport at 9-11.So this was scarier than that.This was like, oh, I'm gonna die.Okay, cool, I'm dyingtonight, this is fun.Because you're hoping for laughs, right?That's the whole game.You're hoping that people, it resonatesand people laugh and clap at the end.Yes, I think that firsttime though, you're just like--Get through it.Get through, you're like,am I gonna remember ever anything?Am I gonna be shaking so hard,they'll see how nervous I am?Am I gonna embarrassmyself in front of everyone?And it was probablythe best set of my lifethat will ever happen.That first set, if youhave a great first set,you'll never be that,I didn't know other comics at that point.You know what I mean?I didn't have anything to compare it to.And it is, they call it ahot room, it's a warm room.Like everybody's thereto support you and laugh.So it was incredible.But yeah, I was terrified.I recommend that for everyone.Say that again.What about your first experiencewhen it wasn't the warm room?Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, the bombing.Yeah, that was horrible.That early on, you'dthink, oh, I'm delusional.I should never do thisagain, all or nothing thinking.And then I've, well, I would say I'vebeen fortunate enough,but again, the Gen X, I'mvery good at finding mentorsand finding people and researching it.So I actually reached out to,so I had some people thatI had kind of befriendedand they hooked me up with this comicand it was this very established comic.And it's funny, I hadjust gone up the night beforeand bombed and I wasdoing so well before that.And I was, I went inwith a whole new set.I hadn't even tried outin a mic, I didn't know.And it doesn't work like that,and I'd only been doingit a couple of months.And I completely was like, well,I don't know, maybethis is too in the weeds,but I mentioned it to her.She's like, what are youdoing doing in your set?You just started.No, you gotta just get used to the stage.You gotta like, just do your set.Maybe add a new littlenugget within your set,but you need to knowwhere to get back on.And if you bomb thisearly on, you're gonna go,you're gonna get in yourhead, think I'm not funny,and you're not gonnaknow where to get back on.I said, oh my God, that's what happened.So you start to learnlike, oh, this is part of it.And I met this, andnow it's not fun to bomb,but I feel like it'snot even bombing now.I look at it more as, okay,I didn't communicatecorrectly with the crowd,what went wrong, howmuch of that was them,how much of that was me,what jokes need to get better.So the longer I do it, and my friends,I'm very good friends,we have a support system,where we talk eachother off the, I suck ledge.Also, it's a drug, so thenyou go back and have an amazingset the next night,you're like, I am God!So it's like, it's crazy.What growth, I mean, Ialways say as we get older,we should try toalways be making ourselvesfeel uncomfortable,because I think through thatcomes growth, and it keeps our brains,it keeps our brains growing and strong,and it keeps us on our toes.And so what you're doing,it's almost like every night,you are experiencing some form of growth,because you don't knowwhat your crowd is gonna be,you don't know what'sgonna come your way.So you're just havingsuch this beautifully fluidgrowing experience,every night you go out there,it's awesome, it's so cool.Truly magical thing, yeah.I get so excited as I take the stage,it's like, ah, this ismy happy place, you know?That's amazing, so did you do--That's awesome.Stand up, so when did youcreate the Big D dating show?So how long did you just do stand up?Real quick, tell us whatis the Big D dating show?Oh yes, it is not what you think,but I did name itthat to get men to laughwhen I gave them flyers onthe street, and it does work.We're simple.Yes, you are, it'sokay, I love that about you.Everybody thinks we'recomplex, we're real simple.I don't think they thinkthat right, I'm gonna be honest.No, I'm just kidding, totally joking.So it's called the Big D,and the D is for divorce,and it is a comedymatchmaking show for divorced singles.And the way the show worksis I have a panel of comics,and myself as the host,and then for about a month,I cast, and by cast Imean find real people,not actors or actresses, Ifind three men, three women,ideally they're alldivorced, got a stand brand.But also, because I started this as asingle divorced mom,I just felt like as Iwas swiping on the apps,I was always looking veryclearly for a divorced parent.It was, what if I just created a placewhere that was who showed up?And also there are allthese, I don't know how muchyou guys know, so ifI'm telling you something,you know, whatever, but there are a lotof dating comedy shows inLA, but they're for the kids,they're young, and it's very much like,and I love talking to people my age,it's like the Gong show.That's such a goodanalogy, and when that gets lost,I'm my 30-year-old friend, Steven Cha,I'm just gonna say this soI can clip this out to him.It bums me out, Steven, because it's areally good reference.Okay, anyway, he nowmentions the Gong show.Deep cut, but you know,it's like mean-spirited,put freaks on stage, laugh at them.I never liked that even as a kid,I'm like, this is making me sad.So there's a lot of that comedy out here,and I actually got roped into doing onefor a friend of mine,and it's a very successful comedy show,it is no shade to hisshow, but as soon as I watchedthe video after I saidyes, I was like, oh no!I'm like, blah, blah, blah, you know,and I did it, and it wasfine, but I remember thinking,there's gotta be aversion of this for us,and that's actually really heartfelt,and taps into my loveof interviewing peoplefrom when I was areality producer, and comedy,and I've always matched me.I have always connected people,Malcolm Gladwell talks about connectors,I love connecting folks, and anyway,I'd been doing comedy for a year,and I'd already beenproducing another showwith a friend of mine, and basically,it's so crowded in LA as comics,it's almost impossibleto get into the big three,you know, you have to get past,so you kind of have toproduce shows to ensurethat you get stage time once a month,and then you ingratiate yourself,or endear yourself with other comics,and they put you on your, it's acommunity building thing,and you get your reps in,like the only way you get betteris rep, rep, rep, and so,so I'd already kind ofgotten my producing chops,like I wasn't scared of that anymore,but it was pretty crazya year into doing this,West Side Comedy Theater,great place, Santa Monica,shout out, they put alittle ad up that said,got a new show idea, and is this Gen X?I love trying to sell things,I just love being ballsyand go, well, what about this?Yeah, yeah.You know, like, and then you don't even,you can't even cash that check,but you're just like, how about this?Yeah, yeah, yeah.Yeah.Fake it till you make it.Right, and so I was like,well, how about adivorce matchmaking show?I literally just said what it is here,and he wrote back, he's like, I love it,can you have it ready ina month up on its feet?I was like, wow.But I said sure,because I'm not gonna fail.Yeah, yeah, yeah.So I hyperventilated my way through upuntil opening night,and I got LA Times todo an article on it,and it was sold out,and it was incredible,and it was next level.It really was all myfavorite things in one,and I knew there was something,like you could feel itin the room, you know?I'm sure a lot of what youguys feel doing your podcast.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Yeah.Absolutely.It's just connection, it's incredible.Yeah, it is, it's the best.Yeah.No, it's why we love doing this.I can tell, yeah.We love it, yeah.Well, good, I'm glad, I'mglad you are feeling that,because we genuinely--It's just an honor for us to sit hereand have this kind ofconversation with you,and you share so much with us.It's really fucking cool, actually.I feel the same way about you guys.I guess I have to startlistening to Grateful Dead now.There you go.So yeah, it was really--The privacy of your home, you'll be fine.I would, Tesh of Grey, I mean,it's a good fucking song, I get it.Okay.(laughing) And if you listen to the studio version,they don't jam, it's quick.I think, you knowwhat, it might be my ADHD,it might be theproblem with the jam band.Honestly, it's like,"Oh, when are theygonna go to the next one?"I'll give you some shows for start with.Okay, yeah.We'll send you some--Some quick shows.Yeah. Yes.No, they won't be quick, they'll be good.Yeah.Yeah, so that's what happened,and I was like, "I gotta do it again,"and I've been doing itfor the last seven months,and it's been amazing,and I'm taking it on the road,which I kinda knew I'd getto see if it really had legs.If I could really scale this thing up,I knew I'd have to leave LA,because also if you have it every month,I'm noticing a lot of people are like,"When's the next one?"Like, "This is the one Ineed you to buy tickets for,"right now!"Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.So how do you do thaton the road, though?How do you vet people?Are you advertising in Chicago?Yes, I'm basicallyfiguring it out on the fly,very Gen X, I guess.No, I don't know about you guys,but the whole socialmedia ad marketing thing,I mean, I'm trying.Nobody knows is what I'm learning,but yeah, I'll put up,I'll boost the ads, target people,and then I'll try andmake clips go viral,hasn't quite happened yet,but I reached out to the clubs,and again, just balls to the wall.I'm like, "I can sell out your club."I really thought I could in Chicago,because I'm from Chicago.I'm like, "I got this."And now I'm like, "Oh no, this is harder."This is harder than I thought."But anyway, so from Chicago,so it was, I thoughtmaybe a little easierto spread the word there,and that I knew lockingin press would be huge,so I got the ChicagoTribune to do a story,and that's coming out Sunday,which I wish was coming outbefore three days before the show,but it's fine.It's gonna be a nice splashy piece,Sunday paper, online Monday,so that'll hopefully get us over theticket hump a little bit,and then I find the men on me.Sorry, go on.I was gonna say, do youalready have your contestants?Yes, yes.That's the very first thing I do.Until I have them, Ican't sleep at night,because those are the,this for you guys is what I do with them.Until I have this, I don't have a show.I have to find the comics,which is a little harder to do,because that's not my community,but I asked all my friends here,I'm like, "All right, whodo you guys like in Chicago?"So I was able to findcomics, locked them in.Like, "Oh yeah, I don'tthink about that now."And then I find the men on Hinge,which is a very complicated transaction,as you can imagine.But I have my poster up there,and I always approach them first.I worked on a non-offensive flatteringopening intro with chat GPT.I'm like, "Help memake these men feel okay."Yeah.I don't know if it did, but anyway,most, half of them are like,"This sounds like ahoot I wanna talk to."Some of them are like,"What's the big idea?This is catfishing."I'm like, "It's not, look up thedefinition of catfish.This is not catfishing."Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 2:36:53
  That's me.I'm single, shoot yourshot, come to the show.Like, you don't even live in Chicago.I'm like, "You got me."I mean, there's no, "Here's my Instagram.Here's a website.Are you just using this to find men?"I'm like, "Yes, I'mliterally using this to find men."Again, you figured it out.It's not catfish.Here's the absolute opposite of catfish.Total transparency.They don't know what to do with that.I know, and they, I know.But I do wanna say so manyof them are cool about it,and I love when I meet those guys.That's awesome, that's awesome.Were you gonna say something, Brian?Yeah, I felt like you had--No, no, I just, I mean, I get it.I'm from Gen X, I don't trust anything.So maybe that's what's in play here.But if, I mean, if you have a website,Instagram page, it's good, ever.She's legit.Yeah.She's very elaborate.And I don't say,"I thinkyou're hot, I wanna do you."I don't start, I'm literally like,"Would you like to be abachelor on the dating showI'm bringing to Chicago?"I'm very clear about it.And the funniest thing thatI'll see over and over again,it's funny to me iswhen the next comment is,"So you don't wanna date me."It's always the next line, I'm like--Oh my God.It's literally, that one is funny.This is why we're still married.This is easier.Yes, yes, yes, definitely.And then, yeah, so that's a funny one.This is one guy was like,"This is pathetic asif I'd ever spend moneyto come to some show to meet someone."I'm like, "You'reliterally on a show called Hinge.What are you talking about?"Yes, yes, yeah.But honestly, then the menthat find it fun and funny,it's so cool.It just makes me feelbetter about the human race.And then I get on the Zoom with them.I always gotta get them onthe Zoom, then they're fine.And then they're like,"Oh, okay."Every time they get on theZoom with me, they're like,"Okay."I'm like, "Yeah, it'sjust, this is it, just me.I'm not here to embarrass you.If you are easy to embarrass,I don't even want you on stage.I don't want a roastable man.Please tell me now.Are you roastable?Cause I don't want you up there."So yeah, also the men inChicago are hot, by the way.Wow.Well, it's probably nice tohave a whole new demographicover there and kind of fresh.And Midwest is totally different than LA.Yes.So you're in Chicago on the second.July 3rd. Oh, July 3rd, sorry, July 3rd.Yep.What's the venue?It's Zany's, which Idon't know if it's oneof the big chains, so Iwas happy to get that.That's awesome.I feel like I've heard of Zany's.Yeah, they're all over.So they, and there's one in Nashville.So Zany's, Rosemont, Iwas hoping for downtown.It's fine.Why am I saying that out loud?And I'm shitting on my own show.No, I just want tomake sure nobody's like,I don't want to drive allthe way out to Rosemont.So yeah, it's in Rosemont.What was I saying?Three women, three.The women were harder to findbecause I don't live in Chicago anymore.So in LA, it's like,hey, who do you, you know,I don't know, I justfind them easier here.And then the men are harder to find herebecause I don't know whysomething's in the water in LA.But I find them, but it's a lot harder.Oh my God, the men inChicago are fabulous.I had to comment.Are the women more suspicious of-No, I just don't evenknow how to get to them.I think the problem really was I justdidn't have the press.Like this was, I wasreally hoping this articlewould come out a week ago.It's like a bat signal, you know?Yeah, yeah.So it's just grassroots.Do you have the women?I do. For Chicago?I just locked the last one in yesterday.That's how nerve-wracking this was.And I was like, and I didn't even knowwhat she looked likeand what she would sound like.I'm on the Zoom and she comeson and I'm like, okay, okay.And then she startstalking like, yes, yes.Because I need to connect with them.We need to become friends.And then it's reallynice on stage, you know?Yeah, yeah. And she was lovely.And I don't know, it's like,you just know and you know,but I'm also, sorry, I'm matching them upas I'm talking to them.And that's what somepeople don't understand.So I'm not like rejecting a person.I'm trying to put threeand three people on stagethat a couple differentcombinations could make sense,age-wise, interest-wise.You know, it's like a dinnerparty I'm putting together.I'm trying to create chemistry.Have you had any loveconnections that have lastedmore than say that night?Yes, more than that night,but nothing big, big time yet.Yeah, that's mypreface, or included that.Yes, no, but there definitely been,there was one show wherethere was a very popular.As a cat. Okay, thank you.He or she just dippeddown on the way to that.Oh, did you just see her?That's her here?Yeah, I was like, is that a person?Now she's a cat.Okay, good.So, oh yeah, so we do the show,there's a single mingle at the beginning.And when you walk in,I say, are you single?And they get all freaked out.I'm like, I'm single too,I just wanna put this lay on you.And then they're like, oh, I'm laid.So it's a funny joke,but it was just thecheapest thing at Party City.That was it, now I'm stuck with this.That loosens everybodyup, they have drinks.So the whole audienceis supposed to be single.That's the best show, right?And then they sit downand then there's asingle mingle afterwards.And then the peoplethat come up on stage,I just bring them up from the audience.And it's very exciting for the audience.Like, who's it gonna be?And you just lean forwardand everyone lovesgetting to know them on stage.And so we interviewthem for five minutes,the comics hopefully don't get too,and we say, these are normal people,please be nice to them.But they have to be funny too.So it's like a weird balance.Don't make them lookso bad that the other,like the girl doesn't want the guybecause you roastedthe hell out of the guy.Yes, and honestly, it'susually not the comic's fault.Like, I think the men get most nervousand then I have to step in and say,I think what he meant tosay about his ex-wife was,but anyway, then we pair them together.They have a five minute date on stage.I have a stack of cards,like a trivia gamenight you'd have at homeand they get through asmany others as possibleand then you take them for a long five minutes,bring them all up on stage,and then the audience votesfor their favorite couple.And it's not like gymclass when you weren't picked,like everyone's applauding for everyone.And then one couple tends to get, yeah.It's almost like you took your backgroundin reality televisionand put it into the show.That's exactly what I did, yes.There's a lot, youcombined your comedic talentwith your reality television experienceand created the show, it seems.Yeah, because I canpicture everything you just saidand there's so many things I'm like,I kept thinking thiscould be a reality show.I can picture peoplelaughing their asses offthe whole time.It is like that, it's so coolbecause they'recomedy sets throughout too.So I'm like, worst case scenario,because everyone, you wantto spend money on a night out,I want to make sureit's good for you too.At least you've comehome and you've seen comedy,but it's always more than that.It is always more than that.There's anauthenticity and a vulnerabilityin that chair and the comics.I get chills talking about itbecause I didn't knowif it were, it's magic.It's just, it's the special sauceand everybody is laughing so hard.It's really funny.I mean--How long is the set orhow long are people there?It is a long show andnobody has any sense of it.I cannot make the show shorter.It is quite frustratingto me as I watch the clock,but it's supposed to bean hour and a half showwith a half hour pre and post mingle,but the show alwaysends up, well, you know,you said people don'trealize the time though.It's the same thing.I don't know why, it's almost two hours.It's going well though,because people don't realize.Nobody is restless.They all get frustrated with the datesand I'm like, nope, that'sit, your time's up, sorry.And you know, like youdon't actually get to see themhave a real date, butyeah, at the end of--Where are you going after Chicago?Oh, then I'm going toDallas to Mike Drop Comedy,which is another comedy chain.So I picked Chicagobecause I'm from Chicago.So that just seemed like a good,like I'm pilot testing this.I don't know if it's going to work.I mean, I kind of think it isbecause of the peopleI'm talking to already.They're like, I lovethat you're doing it.Like they love it.So it's just aboutgetting the word out, you know?But the people I talk toare like, this is incredible.Thank you for doing this.Nothing like this exists out there.Those are the things youwant to hear, you know?Yes, yes.So Dallas, I was a littlenervous going into Texas.I'll just say that.And I really need toconnect with these peopleto be on stage.So I'm like, what am I walking into?And I have to tell you,I have put no money into the Dallas show.I was told by a comic,this is why I picked Dallas,that Dallas is known asthe big D for divorce.I had no idea.So I'm like, all right.I didn't know that.Neither.Here I go.Yeah, right.So I posted the ad, I boosted it.That's all I did.And all these womenstarted applying on the website.And I was like, what is happening?And I have a question on there.Like, what are your deal breakers?What are yourpolitical or religious leaningsthat are important to you?And they're all justlike, no MAGA, no MAGA.Every woman was like--The women are saying that?Yes.I was shocked.Yeah.And I got on the phone with all them.I'm like, what?So I'm confused.When I think Texas, you know,so they say they havea hard time finding menwho aren't conservative and that's whatthey're looking for.And I'm like, allright, well, I'm going in.And so I've been going into hingeand I've actually foundlots of wonderful men so far.Apparently Dallas itself is pretty blueand progressive or whatever.I was just about to say that.I was gonna say the city.Yeah, I think Dallas is the city.Transplants there to havesome diversity of thought.That's what it is.It's so interesting.And there's so many Chicagoans there.But they're all very anxiousabout sharing theirpolitical opinions with me,which I was on thephone with this one womanand they're gorgeous.These women, I mean, I don'tknow what is happening there.It's like just cheekbones.And I don't, she said, yeah,it's really challenging here.It's a lot of competition.If you're not beautiful, you can buy it.I'm like, okay, well,I guess that's Dallas.Yeah.Gorgeous women.We're talking Southern Belle.And I said, well, whatabout your, you know,is there anything you want to tell me?Like political, whatever.And I just kind of looked down.I don't want anyone to feel the spot.They don't have to answer me.And she kind of looked down and was like,why I don't want you to hate me.Like, uh-oh, why would I, I really can't,I can't be with thosepeople with red hats.And I'm like, oh, okay.I, but she was worried.So I think for themliving there, at least,I am getting the impression that theydon't feel comfortablesharing that opinion.Yeah.It's probably the opposite of,like if somebody was an LA conservative,they're nervous to say that.That's exactly what it is, yes.Or if you're a Portland conservative,you're nervous to sayyou're conservative.So now you're in Dallasand they're nervous to saythat they're liberal.So it just depends on where you are.And I find it fascinating.This is amazing to me, funny.Yeah, yeah.So I think it totallydepends on where you are on,you know, the flip.Then there's places it's all mixed up.What's the setup of the theater?It like, cause we havea place here in Boca.It's called the Boca Black Box.I would check it out.Oh, cool.But I don't know if it's the right,it's the right size I would think,but I don't know ifit's the right layout.They have seats and-Well, how many people, howbig is your audience usually?Well, that's the scarypart about Dallas and Chicago.I'm deaf, I'm jumpingfrom a 79 seat theaterto a 250 seat theater.Wow.Well, yeah.That is so cool.Well, I mean, it's only coolif we have more than 30 people show up,but I'm going with it, man.It's fine.We're just, I am trying to becool with the fact that like,of course, Julie, you'regoing to take it to a new town.This is about spreading the word.Like this is why you're doing it,but it's hard becauseI'm such a perfectionist.I mean, I'm not a perfectionist.You know what I mean?Is that like a thing too?Yeah.Yeah.I want to fail.At least with Dallas, you have more time.Yes.For public, like, youknow, we're at Chicago.Like how long have you had to,you don't have asmuch advertising, right?Sunday's going to be the first time?Yeah, it's brutal.But it's already moving.It's moving.I, it'll be fine.It'll be fine.There's a lot of people there.Yeah.If you're going to wantto the Tribune, right?And 250 seats for 270.That does, that should do itbecause that's what didit for our first show here.There's something aboutsomebody reading it in the,I don't know.Yeah.Yeah.And it's such a newconcept that nobody's done.That I think if you sawthat and read about it,you'd be like, oh my, I'mgoing to go check this out.It's not, it's new.It's different.And people are alwaysopen to something newcoming into their area.Cause they're sick of all the same stuff.So, you know, I wouldn't besurprised if, if at least,I think Chicago for, well,definitely you'll be good.I think Dallas, it's soundingjust from what you're saying.You got all these women that were,I think Dallas, theword is going to spread.That's what it sounds like.Men and women are going to the playing.And I'm surprised.I thought the men werereally going to get aggressivewith me on the hinge, but they have not.I've only gotten a couple.Well, I didn't see, I'mlike, okay, I just, you know,do you want to watch me or not?Like I don't, it's cool, it's cool, man.It's not for you.Like let's move on, you know?Yeah, yeah, yeah.It's just one night, right?Just one night.Yes.And-So then, are you going to continue onin different cities in different towns?I mean, yes, but not yet.I was like, let me just try these two.I foolishly decided tohave one tomorrow here in LAbecause I got reallycocky off the last showbecause Kathy Griffin was on it.It was sold out.Oh, wow.I saw that, yeah.That was cool.That was crazy.It was amazing.A friend of mine, a comic was like,hey, a girlfriend of minewants to be on your big day show.I'm like, yeah, sure, whatever.And she said, it's Kathy Griffin.I'm like, what?Yes, of course.It was so crazy.But she wanted to be a bachelorette.I'm like, that's even cooler.And so she was.And to answer your question, Brian,she really liked this guy.He likes her.They're going to go out.I don't know what's going to happen, but-Yeah, no, that's cool.That is so awesome.That is so awesome.Amazing.Was that the first time you'd met her?Yeah.And I met her in theback, the green room.And I was worried.It was like, this isn'tlike a celebrity thing.What's it going to be like?Is she going to be cool?She's totally cool.She hung out in thegreen room and I went back.I could tell she got there late.So I went back there to say hi to her.And my friend said, this is Julie.She created the show andKathy put her arm around me.We took a picture andshe's like, you did?You are a badass.No women ever producedcomedy back when I was coming up.And I just thought ifmy mom could hear that,that would have been like-Yeah.That's amazing.That's amazing.That was about whereyou were two years agowhen you first started this.Kathy Griffin putting her arm around you,telling your about, I mean-That was, that was-That was for real.Yeah.That was, there's so fewmoments in life where you stopand go, oh.Yeah.That's one of them.I was in the moment.I was like, oh my God.And such a sign to keep going with this.You know, that this is something,and to keep going with it.Yes.That's very cool.Because she's been in the game forever.Oh yeah.No, she loved it.She put nice things onher website about it.Like everyone that's donethe show, every comic is like,oh, this is different.Like the audience, why are they so happy?And like, cause we're tellingthem stuff they want to hear.Like this, I knowexactly who this crowd is.You know, usually you have to go inand you have to do alittle sleuthing work.You burn a lot of topat the time at the top.Like, do they want your sex jokes?They want your mom jokes.What kind of group is this group?I know exactly.I walk out and I'm like,are there any divorcedpeople in the audience?They're like, whoa.They don't have tofeel bad about themselves.Yeah, no, it's so true.Gosh, do you think most of yourdemographic is Gen X?That's the target.Cause I always say we'renot the golden bachelor.We're not the bachelorette.And I mean, as of now,the show isdefinitely an extension of me.Like I can, who I connect with.So yeah, like 50 to 55 iskind of that sweet spot,but I've also had, I saythe age range is 40 to 60.I've had younger folks on there as well,because if they'vebeen divorced, you know,but I make sure if Ihave somebody youngerthan I have somebodyyounger, like I don't,I try not to have a phrasein the ages all over the map.Because actually people don't want that.You will be happy to knowwhen I ask men who they're,and I'm like, there's no judgment.I swear you can be honest with me.They don't want the young ones.They want their age?Their age or like around their age.I don't know that whole, I mean,I think there are likesome gross guys out therethat are like, I want to be with the-It's our neighborhood.What?That's South Florida thing.That's the age disparity is pretty,I don't know if yousaid it, I don't know.We've definitely got a sugar daddy.What do they call the girls?Sugar daddy, sugar baby.Yeah, in SouthFlorida you see that a lot.That's huge, I'm notsaying it's not huge here.But for this show, theseare people you would know.You know what I mean?Like you would do it.Yeah, yeah, yeah.So I think much likeme, all these people,if I think about it,are looking for somebodythat could have been in college with.They're looking forsomething that feels like home,that feels familiar.Yeah, that makes sense.Yeah.You know, it's just, youreally have created this spacefor Gen Xers that have had a divorceto come and really try to find somebodyor at least be aroundpeople that can relate to them.They don't have toexplain certain things probably.And it resonates with them.And I'm sure as funny as it is,there's also that joythat people are feelingoff your audience.They can probably relaxand just be themselves.It's an outlet, it's an outlet.That's awesome.
• 2:55:58
  That's cool.Yeah, nobody's walking out to them going,how could you be single?It's like, that is thestupidest question on the planet.Like, and I can't even,everybody in that audienceis basically choosing tobe single at this point too.There's a veryinteresting shift happening,dating with intention of what do I want?Because I don't really need anything now.Like these are very,the people that are drawnto the show are verycontent, people who have typicallydone the work, they feel kind of whole.I don't know how many of them there be,but there's a lot of them.That's what I'm trying to figure out.That's a goldmine.Because there's so many people out therethat are not like that.So that's a goldmine right there.The question is, do I startdigging into the other groupsto keep the show going?I don't know.That's a first-seller, right?So are mom jokes still being told?They don't seem to be told.I grew up on mom jokes.Mom jokes. I just don't generatemom jokes.Oh no, there's a lot.Yeah, we have a, in fact, great questionbecause it's Gen X mom jokes now.So it's very edgy humor.It's all about, Imean, my set has changedbecause I didn't like it.It was very much like,kids today, you know?I'm like, I don't know.You know, part of that, to me,it's more interesting.What have I done to contribute to this?So I used to have this joke about like,it wasn't a joke.My son threatened to run awaywhen we were having a fight once.And at first I was terrified.And also I'm like, oh no, I'm my mother.I moved 3,000 miles away.Like, it's happening again.He hates me.I failed.And then I realizedit's absolutely ludicrous.He's not going anywherebecause he has no life skills.And then I added, butthen I added this line later.Now I like the joke.I didn't like it before.Now I added a line where it's like,because we haven't given them any.Like, this didn't happenout of nowhere, you know?Yeah, yeah, yeah.You added the self-deprecating humor.Exactly, exactly.And I noticed, you go, sorry.So many Gen Xers can relate to that.In fact, I would think most Gen X parentscan relate to that.They all can.I see a lot of this inthe audience when I do.Yes.Yeah.Like we all know we did it.Yes, exactly, exactly.And this to me is the best,if you could threadthis needle out there,because I have definitely played toconservative crowds.And my very first time I bombed big timeand it was horrible.It was in New Mexico at a casino.Everybody was married.It was total Trump country.And I knew not to do my divorce material.Like I have my like, I'm adivorced mom having sex or not.I mean, so like I have all those jokes.And then I have the kidstoday and me raising him.And I was so, it was myfirst 30 minute feature spot.And I was so nervous.I wouldn't have enough materialif I didn't do the divorce stuff.And I knew not to do it.I knew it, but I got up there.I'm like, anybody divorced in here?I was like, was there anyone?No, it was just dead silence.And I feel like all theyheard from that point forwardwas just, "Hoor,whore, whore, whore, whore."Like they were not having it.And as soon as I startedtalking about mom stuff,they warmed up and they were laughing.So my point is, I dofind that the mom stuff,I try not to like throw away my jokes.I try and find a wayto tell them in a waythat can appeal toanybody without sacrificingmy point of view or my belief system.It's hard to do, butit's really something we do.Yeah, I'm sure.And that's another moment of growth.Huge. Uncomfortableness.Oh my God, yes.Yeah, and when you do it,you're probably like, yes.Oh, it's huge.You know, you're gonna pull it off.Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's cool.Do you think you'llcome out to Florida ever?I mean, yeah, sure.Yeah.If you think you have to let us know,we'd love to come see it.Oh my God.The married couple in the South.Anywhere in the South, because we go up,we all over the South,we love the road trip.So we'll drive up to Georgia, theCarolinas, Tennessee.Like Texas is too big.It's too big.It takes us six hours to get out ofFlorida heading to Texas.And then you're likeanother, so that one.But we'll drive pretty far.So obviously we're gonna keep an eyeon everything we're doing,but he doesn't like to fly anywhere.I don't think we canstand flying anywhere.Well now, we can blame you.That's crazy.It's crazy.But so not even just Florida,but if you comeanywhere else in the South,other than Texas, we wanna come.For real, the Vocablack box is a really cool--No, I'm going to, becausealso there is some place in,there are a couple of clubs I was told,well, you shouldreally check it out there.I don't know if it was, Ican't remember the name.They're all these names.They're all the silliest names,like McCab's corn on thecomedy, or I don't know.But you know.Voca black box is cool.And if you ever are toldanything around in South Florida,we can always, you can reach out to usif you ever wanna know more about itand we can look into it too for you.We have divorced friends.Yeah.Yeah.So collaboration, as the kids say.Oh, we do. Yeah, we have divorced friends.Oh, we do have divorced friends.That reaction is exactlywhy I started the show.I always say, youmarrieds never think about us.So we have to think about ourselves.You're like, oh, I do havea bunch of divorced friends.We're just, I know.We do. We're so cute.Yeah, they're so cute.Yeah, they're crazyindependent lifestyle.Those kids.Yeah.No, we do, we do.We totally do.So, okay.They would be pretty good.They would be great.They have personalities.Well, yes.And they're very pretty.This is how I'm pickingwhere I take the show.I have to have a foothold in somewhere.So to know you guys would be amazing.Anything we can do to help.And we know some men too.You said all the magic words.All right, yeah.You know the worst people.You know the worst people.Yeah, we know the worst people.But you doesn't want the husbandand the hideous wife.Oh no, but we know somethat aren't connected.So, yeah.No, well, if you ever--If you want to find your matchmakingskills, you can help.Yeah, no, I love it.I love it.I'm just gonna go for it assoon as I get through July.I'm just gonna go for itwith what you've createdin such a short amount of time.Like tackling this newadventure in your life with comedyand where you are now with it,creating something sounique and different.It's so impressive, so cool.Thank you, I love it.I think if you dosomething, this sounds so cheesy,burr, but I think you guys can relate.If you love what you're doing,it just kind of startsgrowing like you guys.People smell it.Yeah, yes, because it's authentic.Because it's authentic.You're not pretending, it's not fake.And you're coming from a good place.That's also it too.It's coming from a good place.I just think it's really coolhow you just took kind of a leap of faithand it worked and now it's resonatingand it's building a life of its own.You don't have it figured out.You don't have a master plan,but it's coming together and it'sresonating with people.I mean, it gives me kind of goosebumpsto think that you're inthe studio or the theater.I can picture peoplelaughing their asses off,having a good time.And then you're almost like,I can't believe this is happening.That's really cool.Congratulations.Thank you.That is exactly the feeling.Like it is torture leading up to it.And then as soon as they take the stage,well, there's alsosomething when I take the stage,like, well, it's gonnabe, but it's gonna be,like at that point, you just, you know,but once it starts, so.So leap of faith.Yes, yes.See if it works.I encourage.And it's very Gen X ofyou to just go for it.Right?Yeah.Absolutely. So listen, the last questionI always ask our guests is,where do you see yourself in five years?Well, first of all, I have to say,I'm embarrassed to say,I don't like that I'mgonna be older in five years.I don't know if you feel that way.Like I like that I'm reinventing age,but I'm like, slow down.I like what I'm doing now.Which you need to go and reverse.Yeah.I know, I know.It's going too fast.But that being said, where I wanna be,I want to just, I wannabe a professional comic.I want this to be my livelihood.I want this show to be a success.I want me performing to be a success.I just wanna be able to do comedy.It's, and I feel like I don't even,if this thing grows and keeps growing,I'm not even sure what it really will be.I feel like it's got weird potential.I know that sounds strange,but I don't even knowwhat it's gonna look like.I mean, it could be in other countries.It could be a boardgame that you play at home.It could be a reality TV show.I just, so many afriend of mine was like,can I, this should be a reality TV show.I'm like, you go sell it.I am tired of reality TV.So sure, if somebody comesand dumps the money truck,I am all for it.But yeah, I justwanna see it keep growingand the community and people and,I think that's been thecoolest part about this,is this developing community.Like I lost a bacheloretteyesterday for the show tomorrow.I could not sleep last night.That was not the testosterone.That was me going, what have I done?Lay off the cream.Yeah, and then I woke up in the morningand I remembered all these different,like the people I've gottento know through this show,it's crazy.I'm like, oh, I need to ask them.Maybe they know somebody.Maybe they don't know.It was just like, it was like theAvengers came togetherbecause they all loved the show so much.So they're telling people,and then people trust me.It's almost like you're creatinga Gen X cultural movement, honestly.Again, by creating this space.So it would be, and I think it willtumbleweed or snowballand because word ofmouth, everyone's talkingbecause it's unique, it's different.No one's ever seen it before.And I think our generation can usesomething like that.And we're always up for something new.We're not scared of that.So I wouldn't besurprised if it does expandand evolve and change.Well, right back at you,we'll be writing our dreams together.But you guys have been hugely successful.You've got incredible numbers.How long have you had the podcast?I think less than a year.Oh, here you aretelling me, look at you guys.That's incredible.I think August, theend of August is when we-We set up the studio around, startedsetting it up in March.And then our-And then we got our firstvideo out, I think, in August.End of August.That'll be our first, our oneyear is at the end of August.So it's been awesome.We just, again, are so honoredthat people will sharetheir life story with us.We cherish that.And what we've been able to experiencethrough learning about people and whatthey've gone through.But then also our goal was honestly,if just one personfeels seen and less aloneby something they hear from anotherperson's life story,then that's the whole point.It's just, and especially, I mean, mentoo, definitely men,but especially women.Because there's somany women that go throughso many things,especially around our age.And it's not talkedabout enough, but men too.I know some of our shortssometimes get people maxed.It sounds like I'malways ragging on the men.And I don't mean it that way,but we just, it's a way we're tryingto help people feelconnected by sharing stories.And then sometimes Brianand I will talk about topicsthat we feel people, not just our age,but that people would like to hearthe male and female conversation about.And neither one is bashing the other.We're just truly havinga discussion about it.Almost like if you were sitting herejust listening to ustalk about something.So that was kind of the concept.It's beautiful.And it's why I responded to you.It was like,"Strummingthe pain with your fingers."It really was.So I think weactually have the same goal.Agenda.Hearing you talk about what you want.I'm thinking that'skind of what we want too.And in some ways, I don'tthink you're trying to steer itin a specific direction.You're seeing where it goeswith some semblance of a core value.And I think we've got this core valueof just being authentic really, right?And then we'll see where it goes.Exactly.And that's been the exciting part.It kind of sounds like you're sort ofdoing the same thing.Same.Because it's such a, Ithink at our age two,I don't know about you guys,but there is like aforced Buddhist detachmentthat we all start to accept.I'm not forcing anything into anything.I'm not forcing a guy toget on the phone with me.I'm not forcing areluctant person to be in the show.I'm not forcing a club.Oh, it's happening.Okay.I like this thing and it's growing andit's opening up to me.And I try and juststay in that mentality.So, you know.Yeah.As much as I'm like,"I wonder if I hadstarted comedy 20 years ago."I wasn't even myself 20 years ago.You know what I mean?Like, I have-Right.Now you have to be whereyou were for it to happen.You had to get to thatplace for it to happenthe way it's happening.And the way I view it is,if you're creating somethingand it's coming from a good, positive,genuine, authentic place,and you create whatever it is,the art that you're creating,and then you put it out there,it's no longer yourresponsibility anymorebecause it now belongsto whoever receives it.And however they receive it,doesn't have anythingto do with you anymore.Yeah.Because you just, you knowwhere the source is positiveand good intention.And so it takes off the pressurebecause you're proud ofwhat you're putting out there.It doesn't really matter.It's great if peoplereceive it and it resonates,but the process was the satisfaction.Yeah.Does that make sense?Oh, totally.I mean, the part nobody sees in the showis when I have myinitial talk with peopleand I always say,it's usually worth the man.I don't know why that is,but I think cause I know that you guysare not taught to emote as much, right?You're shamed intosuppressing your feelings.So I always take a moment and say,by the way, I just,let me begin by saying,I'm so sorry for your lossbecause it doesn't matter who left.It's a death and I'm really sorry.And they always stop and go, thank you.Because nobody wantsto talk about divorceexcept divorce people.It's depressing.I don't know.It's like, and yeah, Iwish this had existed.Something like this hadexisted when I first got out.It's a very lonely process.So when I see somebody'seyes light up a little bitand I tell them it gets better,they say, thank you.It's like, it's a great feeling.Yeah.And I love that you do that with the menbecause you're so right.No, I mean, that's girls too,but the boys reallydid not get any attentionwhen it came to emotional development.No.None.Yeah.So, and then there are these men nowand they've gone througha lot of pain themselves.So it's awesome that you recognize that.We were guided to push it all in.Like who's talking about it?Suppress it.Yeah.Like Homer Simpson, shove it down.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.Well, listen, Julie, wecan't thank you enoughfor coming on and sharing your storyand talking about the Big D dating show.I'm so excited towatch the progress of that.I hope you come to Florida so we can,even if you came to Tampa,we would drive to see you.We would drive in Florida to see you.How about this?I'm coming to Florida, it's happening.There, that's the Gen X way.We're not gonna, yeah.We're making this happen.We will help you find people.Yes.All right, that sounds good.But if anyone, for our listeners,if you're in Chicago, July 3rd,the Big D dating show will be there.We were gonna link Julie's socialsand the Big D dating show informationin the description of the podcast.But if they wanna, like, let's say they,as soon as they hear this, they wanna,where do they go to get tickets?They can either go to my website,thebigd dating show.com,but that will probably annoy thembecause that just takesyou to Zany's Rosemont.So if they just go to Zany's Rosemontdirectly to the seller,they're selling the tickets themselves.So Zany's Rosemont is who's selling--Zany's Rosemont in Chicago.And then in Dallas.Mike Drop, it's called Mike Drop Comedy.And they have two clubs there.This one's in Plano, Texas,which I've been toldis part of the Dallas,Fort Worth, Plano area.It's all over one area.It's urban sprawl.Yes, exactly.Yeah, it's crazy there.So Mike Drop Comedy in Plano, Texas.And go straight there orgo to your website for that.Yeah, Mike Drop.The website's good if they wanna knowmore about the show,see some videos on the show,see how it works.But if you just wanna gostraight to the tickets,go right to the club.And when is Dallas?Yeah, when's Dallas?That's July 17th.And I do not have that cast yet,although I do have lots of lovely womenand I do have two men.God, it's almost cast.But the casting goeson up until the show.Because if I suddenlysee an interesting match,so hit me up, y'all.Yeah, if anyone's interested.Yeah, July 17th.And if any of our listeners have anycomments, questions,especially about the Big D Dating Show,we will get theanswers from Julie for you.Or Julie herself willanswer them for you.But please don'thesitate to leave any commentsor any questions or anyexperiences you have yourselfif you wanna shareabout, if you're divorcedand you're in the dating worldand you'd like toshare those experiences,we would love to hear that too.So, oh wait, we have a bonus.(laughing) Okay, the bonus thing is, Iforgot I did this other thing.If you're starting your own businessand I don't know whereyou guys are with this,you gotta get sponsors.Anyway, I have thisincredible clothing rental companythat just came on board to sponsor me.It's called Armwar Style.It's a very hard word for me to say.It's like Rent the Runway.I don't know if you'refamiliar with that company.But these are these--No, but I know what the concept--They're rental clothing companies,which is good for theenvironment and on your packet books.So, you pay a monthly subscriptionor you can just do it be one and doneand you get like sixdifferent looks sent to you.So, they're gonna start sending me looks,but more importantly at the shows,I'm giving away a freeglow up unlimited membershipto Armwar.If you use the big D, Ican't remember what it is.Oh, I'm screwing this up.We'll put it on the post somewhere.But yeah, we're givingaway one month unlimitedmemberships at the shows.It's gonna be done through Raffle.It's like a $250 value.And then also if youjust wanna check out Armwarand sign up for it, you canget like up to a 50% discountand some other bonus itemsif you just put the big D dating show.Okay.I did my first, yes.And we'll include that in the description.All right.Yeah, so it's, what's it called again?Armwar?Armwar style.Armwar style.Yeah, we havesomething like that in Floridaand I can't remember the name of it,but I know exactlywhat you're talking about.Armwar style and wewill attach the informationfor Armwar, Arm, Ican't, I can never say that.That's a very hard word to say.Armwar, I don't know.No, that's awesomethey're doing that though.Yeah.So, and we'll get the code.We'll get the promo code.Excellent.Anything else?No, that's it.We can edit.No, that's it.No, we got it all?I think that's okay.Okay, all right.So again, any of our listeners.So hang on one minuteonce we're wrapped up here.Wrap it up.So thank you again,Julie, for joining us.And again, any of our listenerswant to leave anycomments or questions, please do.We love to hear from youand we will see you next time.Bye.(upbeat music)