Latest / Leaders In Payments / Women Leaders in Payments: The Future is Human with Jaime Hawkins, Ingenico | Episode 511

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Women Leaders in Payments: The Future is Human with Jaime Hawkins, Ingenico | Episode 511 · Leaders In Payments

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Leaders Aquipment Podcast, where we talk to two levels of task deployments and stuff, and we'll be discussing the products and services that are fast deployments out today, as well as products and productions for the future of payments.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: We will also hear stories from our guests about their journey to the top.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: So, Jamie, thank you so much for being here.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the show.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm thrilled to be here, Greg.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: Well, let's start with a little icebreaker, if you don't mind.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: If you could instantly become an expert in one non-work-related skiller hobby, what would it be and why?
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think the thing that is top of mind for me right now is using AI in my personal life.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a busy mom of three.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: My husband and I both have demanding travel schedules.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a constant juggling act.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's something that a lot of women are very familiar with.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've tackled the whole like use AI to plan your vacation or maybe meal planning, but I need to figure out how to take it a step further.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: If I could get it to drive my kids to and from practice, that'd be great.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: But I think that's a bit of a stretch.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: But in all seriousness, with AI, the subject of so many conversations right now, it's definitely something that from a personal standpoint, I'd love to be able to use more.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: Well, let's talk about your background and your career journey a little bit.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: So give us a quick snapshot of your background, maybe where you grew up, what you studied, and maybe what led you into payments.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: I'm originally from Louisiana.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: I come from a very Cajun family.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: We know how to cook great Cajun food.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: But when I was younger, we moved from the New Orleans area to central New Jersey and then eventually to the Atlanta suburbs.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: So moved a good bit in my formative years.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: I attended high school in the local Atlanta area, Gwinnett County, and then went to Georgia Tech, right here in Atlanta, to study industrial engineering.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: From there, my husband and I moved around a few more times before settling back into the metro Atlanta area.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: And we actually were fortunate enough to experience living abroad along the way.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: So working for the U.S.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: embassies in Panama for three years and then in Bogota for two years.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: That was really an amazing and incredible experience.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: But when we got back to the States, it was kind of like, okay, let's get back to the career.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so I ended up taking a role at Equifax, which is globally headquartered here in the Atlanta area.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it was their focus on data and analytics in their business that lined up really nicely with my background in engineering.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so I ended up spending 13 years there.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think I probably had seven or so different roles in the 13 years.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: And it was one of those things where anytime I thought I was getting bored, someone would tap me on the shoulder and say, Hey, what do you think about this?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: We need you to do this, Jamie.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: But it was there at Equifax that I really got introduced to financial services and the fintech space.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's a huge part of their business, right?
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: Working with banks and fintechs.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so eventually that experience at Equifax opened up this opportunity for me to come to Ingenico.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: And what brought me here originally was to lead what we call the banking and acquiring portfolio of our business in the US.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so that is working with, as you could imagine, the top banks and acquirers.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: Similar audience to a lot of the business that I worked on at Equifax.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_02: Was there a person or an opportunity or maybe an unexpected moment that helped you shape the direction of your career?
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there definitely was.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: At Equifax, I started out leading operations teams, different types of operations teams, but always client-facing.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: And eventually I moved into a role that was supposed to be an operations leader dedicated to a very top banking account of ours.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: So think top five banks in the US.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: And it was in that role that I had a boss who really changed the trajectory of my career.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: Her name was Melissa Monk.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: So Melissa, if you happen to listen to this, thank you.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm giving you a very well-deserved shout out.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: But she said something to me, and it was along the lines of Jamie, we need you working on the business and not in support of the business.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: And essentially her message to me was she saw that I had more to offer to the company beyond my operational expertise.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_01: And with my background in engineering and especially industrial engineering, which is very process-oriented, that was really like my safe space and comfort zone in the operations world.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: But she was right, and it took a little bit of a leap of faith, but eventually I began to transition into sales.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: And to this day, I still strongly believe that it's my operational background and an engineering degree that makes me a different type of commercial leader.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm grateful that I started where I started, but I'm equally grateful that I had someone like Melissa to bring this sort of, I like to call it an aha moment.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: You look back in your life, and there's these probably five to ten aha moments, and that was definitely one of them, and it really changed where I went from there.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: Tell us about your role today at Ingenico and what part of your work are you most excited about?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: I joined Ingenico early 2025, and actually in May of this year, so just a few months ago, I stepped into a new role at Ingenico, and so that is leading the North American business.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: We define that as Canada and the United States, and I'm temporarily looking after the Latin American business, so that's like Brazil all the way up to Mexico.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: Previously, when I joined, as I mentioned earlier, I was only focused on what we call banking and acquiring in the US.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: This is a really exciting chapter for me because I had a year or so under my belt doing a lot of really cool things with the banking and acquiring business in the US.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: But now I have this opportunity to look at the whole market, not just banking and acquiring, but our retail market, our fintech markets, and not just in the US, but in the US and Canada.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: And my time in Latin America that I mentioned earlier has been one of those things that I didn't think would come in handy, but it does come in handy just understanding a little bit about the culture in that area.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so temporarily looking after that side of our business, there's been a really great connection there.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_01: But I think beyond just the personal career journey, I'm probably most excited at this point in time for Ingenico about our next gen suite of devices.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's more than just sleek hardware, which we'll tout and you know we're very proud of.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: And you'll see that.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're interested in more information, anyone who's listening, please go visit our website.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: But it's really more about what happens at the platform level.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: The open API integrations are important because it's allowing us to take complexity out of the equation for partners that need to layer on bespoke software, really, right?
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: Or streamline transaction services or create some sort of tailored point of sale experience.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: As I say and may say a couple times today, it's no longer just about taking a payment, it's about turning every interaction into some sort of actionable intelligence.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: But you really can't do that with a sleek piece of hardware alone.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_01: You need the platform level, right, to go with it.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's really the combination of the two.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: So our platform that I'm referring to as Ingenico 360, coupled with our next gen suite, where like the magic happens when you put those two things together.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that's exciting for us, but really what should be more exciting, and I think it is, is when you think about the power that that can create for small businesses and merchants.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: So being able to understand customer behavior, optimize performance of stores, things like that, putting a lot more data and actionable intelligence in their hands, that's pretty powerful and exciting to me.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, let's pivot a little bit and talk about leadership and perspective.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: This year's theme is the future is human.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_02: When you hear that phrase, what does it mean to you as a leader in payments?
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think to me, it means remembering that technology, no matter how advanced it may be, it exists to serve people.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: And behind every terminal, swipe, tap, online click, whatever it may be, there's a real human moment.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's a small business owner running their shop and it's a lifetime dream of theirs.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's a family buying groceries, a doctor caring for someone who is ill.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: There's human elements and there's emotion behind some of these things.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: The future is human to me is a reminder that our goal isn't just to build faster tech, it's to build tech that can operate flawlessly in the background so that it frees people up to focus on what they should be focusing on, and that's the human, the customer or consumer on the other end of that transaction or behind the service they're providing.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_02: Well, as you well know, payments is becoming more digital, more embedded, and as you already mentioned, more intelligent.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think leaders need to keep front and center as this industry keeps evolving?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: You're right.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: It is.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: I think leaders need to keep trust, and again, the human element of these interactions front and center, top of mind.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Payments are becoming more and more embedded and intelligent, but the technology needs to feel effortless, I think, but it also needs to feel like it's adding value.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: You don't want the friction, that's the effortless part, but you also don't want it to be such a non-event that you lose kind of the meaning and the engagement behind it.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: So there needs to be some sort of value for us as the consumer.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: Ideally, you're at a checkout and there's some sort of personalized experience, like a promotion that pops up on the screen, or a snapshot of your loyalty rewards.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: You feel like they know you, you know, they know Jamie, they know she likes to buy this particular brand, or she loves to use her loyalty rewards, so she's gonna do that.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's fast, it's frictionless, and it has that built-for-you feeling.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: This is really what Ingenico is focused on delivering through our Axiom suite of products.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: So when I mentioned next gen earlier, that's the next generation of our Axiom line.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: And so the fact that the tech works really smoothly, it opens up all sorts of opportunities for focus and capacity from the associate standpoint to be directed at what really matters.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: And again, that's the consumer and the experience that they are getting.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, well, what is something that you've learned about leadership that you wish you had understood earlier in your career?
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think that it would have been good to realize earlier in my career that leadership isn't always about having all the answers.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have to have all the answers.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's about encouraging that curiosity at every level.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's absolutely about asking questions, not necessarily being the first one to have the answer to the question.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_01: The right questions, sometimes the ones that no one else is asking.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: Those are the things that need to be put on the table.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: And in a really fast-paced changing sector like fintech, you have to keep learning.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's constantly evolving, and you have to keep pushing, keep pushing to challenge why we always done things this way, or ask the questions that nobody wants to ask.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'll use this opportunity to plug a quote that I like that I think says it all.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: Never stop learning because life never stops teaching.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think anyone who's been in this industry for a while can attest it doesn't stop teaching.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: We're constantly throwing curveballs and things that we have to adapt to.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: And that's okay.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: That's what this is all about.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_02: Well, let's go back and talk about the human side of payments again, dig a little deeper.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: And you mentioned this behind every payment or transaction, there's actually a person or a business, a real need there.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So, how do you think about the human side of payments in the work that you do every day?
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: The first thing I'll say is I don't think the human element could be overstated here.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's really important to keep at the center of perspective.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: You take your pets to the family-owned ice cream shop that your kids love, local grocery store, et cetera.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: They all involve a human who may have strived to achieve their dream of business ownership or is filling a need for a family in a critical time, taking care of a loved one.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_01: The common thread to me is that it's not just a transaction, it's a payment moment.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's taking care of some fundamental need that ultimately is addressing a gap or a need or a want or desire that the individual has.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's enabling small business as well, it's boosting the economy.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: Those are all things that I think each of us, no matter what chair we're sitting in, you can understand the value in that, whether it's from the small business perspective or the consumer who is having a moment of a lifetime kind of vacation with their kids at Disney or has a sick child and is taking care of paying for that.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like these are important things in their life.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: And whether you're on the business side or the consumer side of it, you need to be able to count on that and have it be the experience that you need at that point.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you mentioned a word earlier, trust.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_02: And as you know, trust is such a critical part of payments in fintech.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_02: How do you think companies can build and maintain trust in this industry as it becomes more automated and technology driven?
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: Again, you're hitting all the points that I really believe in the human element and trust.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: Trust to me is like the backbone of this whole global payments ecosystem.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Every transaction that occurs, we need to have the confidence that goes hand in hand with trust, that it's secure, it's seamless, and ultimately it gets accepted, right?
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: We need it to go through.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so if for any reason that trust breaks, there's a component of commerce breaking.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's our job in the industry to not just maintain the trust, but bolster the trust even more as technology evolves because things being introduced can have people a little uneasy, people uncomfortable with the concept of paying with Bitcoin, things like that.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: There's a little bit of uncertainty that can create uh concern from a trust standpoint.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_01: So, from my view, innovation needs to go hand in hand with trust.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so, what I mean by that is we need to be anticipating what's going to drive customer trust in the future so that we can innovate around that and meet the consumer where they are in terms of that trust need.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: So, offering flexibility and payment methods, like I talked about wallet services, digital assets, things like that.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: But I think you have to maintain that trust, but you have to make sure, in order to do that, you have to be thinking about what's the next thing that people are going to need to embrace and it's a change and it's gonna threaten to shake that trust a little bit.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: How can we anticipate that and be where they need us to be from an innovation standpoint so we can maintain that trust?
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what is one trend or change in payments that you believe will have the biggest impact on people and businesses over the next few years?
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're kind of already seeing it, but it's the shift from physical hardware to digital interactions.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: We're moving into this world that's shaped by biometrics, AI, IoT integrations, conversational commerce purchasing through chatbots.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it's less about a piece of hardware and much more about creating that digital interaction that's seamless and makes these everyday activities that we need to complete faster and more meaningful.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: So as the normal things we're used to needing to complete a transaction become less and less required or involved, you don't need your card, you need your phone, or maybe you don't need your phone, you need your eyes, it's going to get faster and faster and even more of a, hey, I don't really have to think about this much.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's just happening as a consumer, right?
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: You're just sort of going through the motions.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_01: So then the question becomes how can merchants make that a positive moment or experience for their brand?
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's a very valuable time and moment that the merchant gets to kind of engage with the consumer in that checkout process.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: And it's getting cut thinner and thinner as we get faster and faster.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: So that's an important, valuable piece of real estate for that merchant.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: So we have to figure out how to really make the most of that going forward.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's part of this evolution of shifting away from hardware to more digital interactions.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, well, let's talk about mentorship and impact.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: So who has influenced you along the way, whether directly or indirectly, and what did you learn from them?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I mentioned Melissa earlier, Melissa Monk, the boss that I had that sort of changed the trajectory of my career.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: But in addition to her, I have to take a step back and say that my dad has had just a tremendous influence on me.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm the oldest of four girls.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: He's very much a girl dad.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: He was very emotionally connected with us and very involved in what we did.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: He was also an engineer by degree.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: And he raised all of us.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: We never would have at the time thought of it as him doing anything different or specific, but he raised all of us to believe that as women we could do anything.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there was no, well, you should focus on this type of career because you're a girl, or you shouldn't study engineering because you're a girl and you may not be good at math and science.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: There was none of that.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: And again, at the time, it didn't seem like anything strange.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: It was just normal, it's just what I was used to.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: But as I look back, and my sisters would all say the same, it's just such a gift that he gave us.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: We've all had very successful careers.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: We're all working moms, struggling to find a way to balance it all, but just very fulfilling pursuit of our careers and of the value of hard work.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_01: That was definitely something that he instilled in us as well.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: And we all have it, and I hope to pass it to my three children.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: Great.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a girl dad too, so I have raised three girls, not four, but three.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's not much difference between three and four.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: I get it though.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: I totally get it.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: A couple of final questions before we wrap up.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: What advice would you give to the next generation of women that are entering payments?
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: I would say be adaptable.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: We live in a world now, even more so than when I was coming out of college and starting my career.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: Things are just changing.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: And to mention it again, AI, who knows what the world is going to look like when our kids are entering the workforce.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: There may be a lot of jobs that aren't even available to them because there's no longer a strong need for them.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_01: So you've got to just be adaptable and ready to roll with the punches.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's kind of point number one.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's for anyone really in the next generation, but for women specifically, I would also say don't limit yourself.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: Don't hold yourself back.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of times I find women just internally they think, well, there's no way I could do that job, or that would be too big of a stretch for me, or I could never do that.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm too nervous to put myself out there.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: Don't be, don't limit yourself.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: You have to take chances.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: With risk comes reward, and you can decide how much risk you're willing to take.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it can be a calculated risk, but you only get to do this once.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: So take chances, take a leap of faith every now and again.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: You're never gonna have that perfect path, like, oh, this is the perfect time, everything looks perfect about this job.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's never gonna be that way.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_01: But you just have to take the step forward.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: And again, don't limit yourself and be ready for somewhat of a roller coaster ride that may be coming your way.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: But as long as it's fun along the way and you're getting value out of what you're doing and you're adding value, that's really what you want.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, well, let's wrap up the show with one kind of final fun question.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_02: What is one app or podcast or book or maybe TV show or hobby or maybe even your favorite way to unwind that gives us a glimpse of who you are outside of work?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny because when we answered the earlier question about something that I wish I was an expert at, one of the things I didn't talk about was golf.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I like to play golf.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: My dad taught me how to play golf.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: My husband loves to play golf.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: So I play with him.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: We've taught our kids how to play, but I'm not very good.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's a common theme in golf, right?
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: Those three or four really perfect shots keep you coming back.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: But I would say that's definitely something that I enjoy getting outside, putting the phone down, and especially playing the game with either my husband andor my kids just helps me relax and unwind.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: But I also really love to cook.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mentioned earlier that I'm from Louisiana, and so I can make a mean gumbo and really good red beans and rice and croffici to fait and things like that.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, that's kind of my happy place.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: Even after a stressful day of work, some days I come home and it's like, well, I don't have the energy to do this.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: But if I can convince myself to just do it, put on some music, and you just start chopping and cooking away, you know, you just kind of go into this zone and you let go of whatever might be plaguing you from the day.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'd say those are two things that I really enjoy.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously, I have a family to provide for.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: So when I can cook and provide good food for the family and friends and that type of thing, we do a lot of entertaining.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: I get just a ton of satisfaction out of that.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: Jamie, I think that's a great way to wrap up the show.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_02: I know your time is very valuable, so I really appreciate you being here.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_02: And thank you so much for being on the show today.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, Greg.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: I really appreciate the invite.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: And thank you for doing this.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for doing this feature.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's really important.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you so much.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: And to all your listeners out there, I thank you for your time as well.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: And until the next story.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for joining us this week on the Leaders Employments Podcast.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure to visit our website at Leadersinformance.com, where you can subscribe to the show and where you'll find our phone notes.