Latest / The Curve / A Beginner’s Guide to Crypto, With Industry Expert Danielle Lukins.

Transcript

A Beginner’s Guide to Crypto, With Industry Expert Danielle Lukins. · The Curve

0:00
Oh my god, oh my god, oh my god.
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Normally I don't record the intros for episodes straight after
0:06
doing them.
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I just like to give myself a bit of time, let it process, you know, think about what
0:11
the main takeaways were and then I record my intro.
0:15
I really need to preface this by saying
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if you do not like crypto or you've never thought crypto is an investment for you,
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please give this episode a listen.
0:24
This conversation is with Danielle Lukens and
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she is the founder of Crush Circle, which is essentially a place to learn all about how to
0:31
invest in crypto.
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So as you can imagine, she's making a living out of teaching people this and
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her testimonials, the people she's worked with, I mean, this woman knows what she's talking about.
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And she's really good at taking quite complex explanations or information and making it really
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digestible.
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So if the idea of blockchain or crypto or Bitcoin has flown over your head,
0:53
that's fine this conversation won't do that and I would really recommend you listen there's so
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many moments where I was like you know the emoji where the brain explodes that was happening she's
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one of the few female content creators educators experts in the crypto space which is obviously
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why we wanted to get her on but she explains really what crypto is especially if you're a
1:15
beginner and how to understand its use cases because if you don't understand what an asset
1:20
is or how it works, it's really hard to invest in it confidently.
1:24
She speaks about her investing
1:25
approach and the things that she invests in in the crypto space, as well as the top four crypto
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investments for anyone that's a beginner.
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One of the biggest things that absolutely had my head
1:36
just flying open was what is happening in the online banking space.
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Now, this is something I
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didn't know a lot about.
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In fact, I knew nothing about this and I could not believe what she was
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telling me.
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So I don't want to give it away because the way she explained it is so much
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better than what I will do, but it's going to change the way that we transact, pay people,
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even potentially get mortgages.
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Like the whole thing was just wow, wow, wow.
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And listening to
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her speak made me think we should have way more regular constant updates about what's going on in
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the crypto space.
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Because the fact that it's an amazing time to be thinking about crypto,
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the fact that it's at like a four-year low and what she said about the way that crypto moves
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in cycles I mean it's the most amazing opportunity so I realized that this is not a financial advice
2:30
platform so I got really excited about this but I just want to preface that any decision you make
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about any investment needs to be totally your own and this podcast is meant to be purely educational
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so please don't take this as a recommendation make your own decisions and enjoy the episode
2:49
Danielle I am so excited to speak to you so I'm quite secretly passionate I would say about
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crypto and bitcoin you know what I bought bitcoin a couple of years ago with my business partner
3:02
Vic it must have been three years ago we put like a thousand dollars in and it was the most
3:06
exciting thing ever we made actually I think we doubled our money and then we sold it and I never
3:10
board again.
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And I feel like this is the conversation that I need.
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And I'm feeling
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quite proud of the fact that we're having it while crypto, while particularly Bitcoin,
3:20
is not like roofing it.
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Because often, I feel like you start hearing people speak about
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cryptocurrencies and Bitcoin when it's doing outrageously well.
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And I'm always gutted that
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I didn't invest when it was doing a bit worse.
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So I feel like this is coming out at a time for
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people to really seriously think about this as an investing class if they haven't already
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and kind of a crypto is kind of on sale right now so literally 100 this is the best time possible
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I would love to basically start off by getting a bit of an intro as to who you are and your work
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because a lot of people and particularly women who is a large portion of our audience
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are quite separate from conversations about crypto so they may not have come across your
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work, which is incredible in the community that you've created.
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You're such a trusted voice in
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the crypto space.
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So we're really grateful to have you on.
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But can you just give a bit of an intro
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for those who may not know?
4:18
Yeah, sure.
4:19
So some of you may know or may not know, my page is Crypto
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Crush.
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And my primary focus is to give people basic education around cryptocurrency, the crypto
4:33
markets, even trading, but also going into macroeconomics, geopolitics, giving you a
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rounded view of what's going on and how that affects the crypto markets.
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And I started getting into crypto.
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I bought my first Bitcoin when I was 17.
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So it was quite early on.
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This is about eight years ago now.
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And then just since that point kind of caught the bug.
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I bought Bitcoin right at the tippy tippy top of 2018.
5:01
Oh, did you?
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Yeah.
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So I ended up pretty much losing like that money on paper for the next like two, three years.
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Can I just say before you keep going into that, I think that there's something quite interesting about the fact that you not had a disaster, not to be dramatic, but, you know, you invested at not the most ideal time and it didn't put you off.
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which I think for a lot of people when you're starting investing particularly if it's a new
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asset class and something does fall off a cliff or do quite badly it's so easy to lose hope or
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interest in whatever it is that you've invested in so it's amazing that that didn't happen for
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you so I'm assuming you didn't sell at that point you just sort of left it yeah I held on to it the
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reason I didn't get scared around it was one I was a really new investor so I didn't really know
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what I was doing anyway.
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And my dad has always told me that like, you know, if you're investing,
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you invest for the long term.
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Don't worry about what's happening in six months, in one year,
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in five years, you've got to invest for the next 20, 30, 40 years.
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So I thought, okay, look,
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it's down 80%.
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I've had it, I've held it for a year or two, like, let's just see, let's just see
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if it, if it recovers and does well.
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And then the other side of it is I actually researched what
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Bitcoin was and I researched what crypto was and the deeper that I went into this asset class,
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the more I understood about the technology and what its purpose is.
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That's when I was like,
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oh, I've got no worries.
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This is going to stay.
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This is eventually going to be worth something.
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This is exactly what I want to get to in a second is the use cases and a bit more
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context around the history of where it's been and where we think it's going.
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Because
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I completely agree with you and in the same way that Vic my business partner talks about
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invest in the things that you know and you understand if you don't understand anything
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to do with digital currencies or crypto the point in which it had done badly in those couple of
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years after you bought it a lot of people could panic and sell it and that's what I think is a
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really amazing learning that you went straight into that research piece so maybe a really
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interesting next step could be actually just understanding if people have no sort of concept
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or maybe a light understanding of how crypto or Bitcoin works.
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I mean, firstly, do we talk about
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them as two in the same or should we totally separate them out?
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Technically, I mean, Bitcoin
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is the first crypto, right?
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So technically, it's still a cryptocurrency.
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It's the OG.
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It's the
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number one.
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It's the first one to ever be created.
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It is seen differently to the rest of the
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crypto market because of its functionality and what its purpose is as in you've got other
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cryptocurrencies like you know ethereum or solana those have a different reason for functionality
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than than bitcoin if that makes sense so that's why it's slightly seen differently when you first
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bought that bitcoin in 2018 was it yes did you buy other cryptocurrencies or did you just buy
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Bitcoin and were you scared, overwhelmed, nervous before you invested or at all during that time
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or did it feel like an obvious investment for you?
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I mean back then I was like 17 so I was at school
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right so most people.
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I know but not many people do that do you know what I mean like it's quite
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a rogue thing to do at 17.
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It is very rogue I think I've always had like an entrepreneurial
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like spirit and I also have a really high risk tolerance so I'm like the type of person that is
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willing to risk and bet on things that could better my future so I saw it as that opportunity
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to be like you know what let's just risk a little bit of money here and the way that I contextualize
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it is I like to invest first and then find out later which usually isn't the best way to go
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about it.
8:54
Wow, that is so interesting.
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Yeah.
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So I like to put a little bit of money on the line
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because then it's going to force me in a position to be like, what am I actually investing in?
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Like,
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what is the thing that I'm risking right now?
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And then I do the research and understand it
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and deep dive research.
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And then I make my decision of whether that's the right decision
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or the wrong decision.
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Can I just say, I think there's two things that you just mentioned,
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which really, I don't think I've had anyone else in the podcast say this, and it's really cool to
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hear.
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Firstly, the idea of just investing a little bit and putting something on the line so that you
9:31
then learn more about it, I think is a really interesting approach for two reasons.
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Women often
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learn for far too long and don't do anything.
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And I think that we can fall into this trap of
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wanting to learn and learn and learn and know absolutely everything before we invest.
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And
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while I think it's really important to be educated and to make educated decisions,
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not just like you're not gambling, like this is investing.
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This could be $100.
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It could be
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50 pounds.
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It doesn't need to be a lot, but it's enough to pique your interest to want to learn
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more and decide if it's an investment you want to keep making and keep putting more money into.
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I think for people who are interest-based learners, aka the type Bs of the world,
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that's what's going to make someone interested and do a deep dive in cryptos if they already
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have money in it so I think that's a really cool approach yeah that's the way I do it and I started
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with like $500 so it's really like I'm not putting my my life savings in although I did do that a few
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years later when it when COVID hit I took all of my life savings and dumped it all into crypto
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which again is like pretty insane to do how much was it at the time I wasn't a lot I think like
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bear in mind at that point I may be 19 so I've I've got just like an internship job making I
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don't know a thousand dollars a month like really not a lot but I was a really good saver so I saved
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a lot of money so I think it was about 10,000 that I put in and that to me at 19 I was like
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that's everything that's huge oh no 100% that's and and sorry I actually forgot the other amazing
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point that you made which was you've got quite a high risk tolerance because again I don't feel
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like I hear people talking about that a lot.
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And I feel similarly, which is maybe why I lean more
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towards being interested in Bitcoin than Vic does.
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This is my co-host and business partner,
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because she doesn't really invest in crypto and is kind of skeptical.
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And I'm sure there's a lot
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of people listening that also aren't sure on crypto.
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So we'll get there in a second.
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But
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I also feel like I never really own it in that way, saying I've got high risk tolerance,
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but I totally do as well.
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I'll give you context around the reason why I have such a high risk
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tolerance, right?
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So number one, I'm Gen Z, right?
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So I've been brought up in an era where we can't
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afford homes, our wages haven't gone up in many, many years in the UK, it's a travesty, the cost
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of living is insane.
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So when you're in that position, you kind of have no other option but
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to be higher on the risk of to get yourself out of the situation that the economy has put you in,
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you don't really have a choice.
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That's why everyone in my generation is more like,
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I don't want to work a nine to five.
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I'm going to try and figure out social media.
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I'm going to start my own business.
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They are a lot more risk tolerant and want to take larger
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risks because they've been put in a position where they actually don't really have much of
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a choice, but to do it, to get themselves out of their situation.
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So that's one of the reasons why
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I think I have such a higher risk tolerance.
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And then the other reason, again, comes from
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my dad, where he's like, you've got time.
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You're young.
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Take risks now.
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Take risks when you're in
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your 20s, in your 30s, because when in your 40s, 50s, 60s, your risk tolerance becomes a lot less
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because you have more responsibilities.
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I'm a young girl.
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I'm single.
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I have no responsibilities
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at that point.
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At that point, I was living in my parents' home.
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So I was able to take that risk,
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and I was in that fortunate position to do so.
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I know that not everyone's in that similar position.
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some people have families some people have other things to think about so obviously I'm not saying
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everyone just go all in right now but it's just understanding where you are in your life and like
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how risk tolerant you can you can be and that was the position that I was in at the time.
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Yeah hearing you say that makes me think perhaps the reason Vic is less of a risky investor and
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when I and by the way she's an amazing investor I don't think that there's like right or wrong I
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just have noticed that I can get more excited by things that are probably riskier than she's really
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good at the tried and true long-term investing strategy when it comes to stocks.
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And I wonder
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if it's because she's invested basically her whole life.
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She's already on that, I don't want
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to say gravy train, but I can't think of what another context for that is.
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So perhaps because
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I'm later to the investing party, I really want to catch up and I really want to see returns,
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which I guess can also come with the risk of being reckless and making decisions that aren't great.
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So I do want to say I'm not trying to hype up the idea that being risky is the way you should go,
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but I just wanted to reflect back to you.
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It's quite nice to hear someone say that because I'd
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never really heard it explained in that way.
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One of the questions that I wanted to ask is,
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you know, you're obviously in quite a male-dominated space.
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And I know that that's
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kind of the case across all of the financial industry.
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But firstly, why?
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Why are there so
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many more men that are interested in crypto than women because I feel like it's not just in the
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sort of educating space or you know the business that you own but actually investing in it it
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appears from my very loose not quantitative research that I've done that um yeah it's kind of
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it's more favored by guys is that something you've experienced like living and breathing
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crypto?
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Yeah, 100%.
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I mean, if there's 1000 people in a room, there's probably like,
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you know, a handful of females, you know, four or five of them, right?
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So it's like,
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it's very male dominated.
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There's a couple of different reasons for it.
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Number one,
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for some reason, crypto and the way that they explain it, and the jargon and the language that
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they use is extremely complicated.
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And it's complicated for a reason, maybe to try and
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confuse people, maybe to try and make it harder to get into this asset class.
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A lot of the people
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that developed crypto and blockchain are tech, they're nerds.
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So they use complex language.
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And
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then when you're looking at all of that, and you're trying to research, you're like, I have
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no idea what's going on.
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And it took me a long time to be able to really understand what crypto
15:33
was.
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But there was that light bulb moment where it all switched.
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And I was like, Oh, I get it.
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They're just making it more complicated than it needs to be.
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It's actually quite simple when you look into it.
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So that's one of the reasons.
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The other reason is, of course, the risk of crypto.
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It is volatile.
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It's the most risky asset class.
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And typically, females tend to be a lot more risk managed.
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That's why a lot of traders who are female do very, very well because they actually risk manage properly.
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But the thing is with crypto is it is seen so high on the risk curve that some women might not want to go down that route because it's out of their risk managed reach, if that makes sense.
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So that could be another reason as to why there's less females in the space.
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And then also from a society perspective, like if we really look at it, like females have only or women have only been able to use credit like they have credit cards in the last 40 years.
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They haven't had the same financial access, information, education as their male counterparts.
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So they feel like they're crowded out in that scenario.
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So that's why podcasts like this are really important.
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So you just said, I had a moment where I realized, oh, I get it.
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This all makes sense.
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It's actually really easy.
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What was that moment?
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and can you explain it in a way that will make sense to our audience?
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The way that I look at it is it is money that is integrated with the internet.
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So you're now putting money on the internet.
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So kind of the way that I see social media,
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usually social media as a place where you can create content
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and you can monetize that content and you can create businesses
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and a foundation of earning money on that side.
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Crypto is essentially the same.
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It's the financial layer that is built on top of the Internet.
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So that's how I see it.
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And then Bitcoin itself, I give the idea of Visa and MasterCard.
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So Bitcoin is the Visa and MasterCard for everyone.
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So every time you make a payment in a shop to get your groceries, you pay with your Visa card.
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And a percentage of that transaction goes straight to Visa.
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Visa is the one that makes billions and billions of dollars a year.
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Bitcoin works the same way.
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every time a transaction is done every time someone pays for something in bitcoin a percentage
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of that goes back to the miners the people that are helping uh keep this blockchain alive so i
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have bitcoin miners i get paid bitcoin every single time there is a transaction made on the
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blockchain so i have my own bank i get given a percentage of all of the transactions that happen
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on the bitcoin blockchain that's how it works and that's how it's fundamentally a global monetary
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system that anyone can get access to and you can get a piece of the pie of that money and that
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currency.
18:26
I guess if you zoom out, are you then saying you think the future of cryptocurrencies
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is that that's going to be how a lot of things are paid for?
18:34
A lot of trading is done through that
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and therefore the more that people use it, the more money that comes back to the miners and then
18:41
the more people that are using it or buying it obviously drives the price up.
18:46
So it's more the
18:47
idea that the future of cryptocurrencies will be embedded in the way that we pay for things?
18:52
Yeah, so there's over 130 countries right now that are developing something called a central
18:57
bank digital currency, which is a cryptocurrency.
19:02
So it's a digital euro, it's been announced.
19:04
So
19:05
the Central Bank of European Union announced that their CBDC is going to be introduced in 2029.
19:12
All of Europe are going to be using crypto, whether they like it or not.
19:15
This is the new
19:16
system that they're upgrading.
19:18
All governments and the entire world are upgrading their system
19:23
to crypto.
19:24
Everyone's going to be using crypto, whether they like it or not.
19:28
So that's why
19:29
understanding cryptocurrency is super important because everyone's going to be utilizing it.
19:35
So can we strip it back and basically explain perhaps specifically the difference between
19:43
Bitcoin, Ethereum, the way that all of those different cryptocurrencies show up.
19:49
The reason I'm asking is when it comes to investing, let's just say I got my head around
19:53
the idea of the stock market or the idea that there's lots of companies that you can buy shares
19:57
of.
19:58
I'm likening the entire cryptocurrency space to that.
20:01
There's the overarching concept,
20:04
but then there's also the subcategories and how you pick what kind of investments right for you.
20:09
how do you describe those nuances and helping someone think about this whole asset class not
20:15
just bitcoin as an investment opportunity okay there's a few different categories that you can
20:22
look at but the way i like to explain it is bitcoin's like digital gold so it's like a hard
20:27
asset you you hold that that's a way in which you can uh invest in accrue value over time bitcoin
20:35
doesn't have that much functionality other than it's that store of value.
20:39
And it's the first global
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monetary system that is basically built on top of the internet.
20:45
Now, the rest of the cryptocurrency
20:47
space, the way I describe it is like tech stocks.
20:50
They're all tech businesses.
20:52
All of them are tech
20:53
companies.
20:54
They're all building their own little piece of technology that is going to help the
20:59
future of the economy of finance etc now within those tech companies they have different categories
21:07
so for example ethereum is a blockchain and the way i describe ethereum is like it's the apple
21:14
app store of crypto what it does is it facilitates a bunch of different crypto projects that's built
21:25
on Ethereum.
21:26
So kind of like think of it like the iPhone, it has a bunch of apps in the App Store.
21:31
And that's what Ethereum's functionality is, is to facilitate that.
21:35
Now within Ethereum,
21:37
you might have a DeFi bank that is built on Ethereum in that App Store.
21:44
So that bank gives me
21:47
the ability to lend and borrow money in crypto instantaneously.
21:52
And this is where my mind was
21:55
blown in terms of, for example, I've gone and got a mortgage in the real estate market.
22:02
It's a
22:03
nightmare.
22:03
It took me months to get credit checks, a bunch of questions, all of this malarkey to
22:10
basically give me the availability to get a loan.
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If I go into my DeFi bank right now on crypto,
22:20
I can borrow money instantaneously with zero credit check.
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It doesn't matter where I'm from,
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what my background is.
22:27
If I have the collateral to back the borrow rate, I can borrow it within
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five minutes.
22:34
Wait, what's the collateral?
22:35
Do you mean in your crypto investing portfolio,
22:40
if you have the assets and you can prove that, they'll lend without any questions.
22:45
Yes, correct.
22:46
You're kidding.
22:47
No, I'm not kidding.
22:48
No, I can't believe this.
22:50
So wait, hold on a second.
22:52
So what you're saying is if I had a DeFi
22:57
bank, which is a digital bank through the crypto world, and I had, oh, look at my 50,000 portfolio
23:07
of Bitcoin, Ethereum, you know, whatever I own, I could use that as proof to loan money.
23:15
Yes, correct.
23:15
Oh, you're joking.
23:16
Do they give you Bitcoin or assets or do they give you actual money?
23:20
Like, how does that work?
23:21
So you can choose.
23:22
So you can essentially borrow against your Ethereum to get USDC,
23:30
which is US dollars, but just the crypto version of US dollars.
23:33
It's pegged one-to-one,
23:34
There's no difference.
23:36
So if I've got 100 ETH, then I can borrow, let's say, just to be safe, 30% of the value of that.
23:44
So I could borrow 30 ETH worth of money and then have that in USD and I could do whatever I want with that.
23:49
I could cash it out, use it as cash, do whatever.
23:52
I could put it back into another cryptocurrency.
23:56
I can do whatever I want because the way that this DeFi bank works, it's all ran on code.
24:02
It's all verifiable.
24:03
It's all through wallets.
24:04
There's no reason for them to check who I am as a person because I have the money to back that up.
24:09
And it's all proven it's verifiable through the blockchain.
24:13
That's how crypto works.
24:15
And that's why when I found this out, I was like, this can change the world because this is this is insane.
24:20
Anyone in a third world country, anyone whose banking system is collapsing right now, anyone that's going through war has access.
24:30
No questions asked as long as they've got the money to back it up.
24:33
Oh my God.
24:35
Like I'm really gobsmacked because that is game changing because I have had exactly the same experience.
24:43
I've had to go and get a mortgage.
24:44
It was a huge process.
24:45
It took a long time.
24:46
Whereas if I had put that money into digital currencies and I had that in my portfolio that way, I could have borrowed.
24:55
How does it work in terms of the amount you can borrow compared to the amount of assets you have?
25:00
So it differs.
25:01
And also you've got to obviously realize that there's like risk management here because crypto is so volatile and these assets can fluctuate.
25:09
Because I was about to say there's obviously the idea of like if you're like, oh, I've got a million Bitcoin.
25:14
and then the next day they totally fall off a cliff.
25:17
It's obviously like it's still quite volatile.
25:21
So what you have is collateral could go up and down a lot,
25:25
a lot riskier than actual money.
25:27
A hundred percent.
25:28
And like there's no denying that there is still risk.
25:32
Serious amount of risk.
25:33
Serious amount of risk.
25:34
So I'm not recommending it, but it's just giving you an idea.
25:37
You do not go and buy, anyone listening to this,
25:40
no one goes to buy their house with crypto money.
25:43
We're not going and getting a loan for something like that.
25:45
But the reason we're bringing this up is because this is such a tangible way to explain what crypto and blockchain is going to be used for in the future.
25:57
sure crypto is incredibly volatile but if all of these you know banks around the world are
26:03
collapsing and traditional banking is no longer and this is the go-to perhaps there is a world
26:09
where it becomes a lot less risky and therefore you know you actually maybe one day could borrow
26:14
money to go like a lot because if it stabilizes in terms of the fluctuations then it would there
26:20
would be just as much risk in taking a loan that way than there would traditionally through a bank
26:24
Yeah.
26:25
And just to give you perspective, so BlackRock owns $11 trillion of asset under management.
26:30
It's the biggest institution in the world.
26:32
They own everything, Tesla, Google, Amazon, all of the big tech stocks.
26:37
They own a large percentage of the S&P 500.
26:39
They own pretty much everything, right?
26:42
So their number one priority right now is building infrastructure inside of crypto and blockchain because they know that it's moving that way.
26:50
Everything, all your traditional financial assets are also being put on the blockchain.
26:54
So I can trade stocks inside of my crypto exchange.
26:59
I can trade indexes.
27:01
I can trade commodities.
27:02
Everything's moving on chain and it's 24-7.
27:06
so there's a massive use case for crypto and blockchain right now and the the investing in
27:13
cryptocurrencies is you're just betting on these companies doing well in the future and facilitating
27:20
things like lending and borrowing banking trading all of that that's what you're essentially
27:26
investing in is the upside that everything's moving on chain on crypto so it's the if you
27:34
invest in crypto, it's because you believe that there will be a world in the future that relies
27:39
more heavily on digital banks, on cryptocurrencies to move money around.
27:44
I mean, if you think about
27:45
even for us, like if I was, for example, in the UK to try and get a mortgage and I was guaranteeing
27:52
and it was because I had houses in Australia or in New Zealand and I had money there,
27:55
they don't use that as that doesn't count.
27:59
So it's really interesting that particular use case
28:02
where all of your assets are globally recognisable
28:06
because I think that that to me is a real block
28:10
in the system of traditional banks
28:12
because you can't use, something's in another country,
28:16
it's almost like it doesn't exist,
28:17
which is so odd because you could literally sell that house
28:20
or transfer that money in a day, yet it doesn't count.
28:25
So the idea of that and investing in a more global,
28:29
easily instantly accessible banking system if you believe in that then you can find ways to
28:36
invest in crypto am I sounding stupid I'm really unsure if I'm repeating things correctly or not
28:41
no 100% it's it's all about efficiency so like one of the big things is in my company I hire
28:49
people globally all over the world I have people in Puerto Rico I have people in Australia I have
28:55
people in Bali, in Portugal, in the UK, right?
29:00
So if I want to pay my employees, I pay them through stablecoins,
29:06
through a pegged one-to-one to the dollar.
29:08
You're still paying them in dollars, it's no difference,
29:10
but they get their paychecks within 30 seconds, right?
29:14
As in, if you're going through a traditional banking system,
29:18
you're waiting days, you're paying high fees.
29:22
It's super, super inefficient.
29:24
So that's another use case for crypto.
29:26
It's fast and it's efficient.
29:28
It can be cross border.
29:29
I don't have to go through other banking systems.
29:31
I don't have to open other bank accounts.
29:33
I don't have to switch to different currencies.
29:36
It doesn't work like that.
29:37
I can just send it and everyone gets paid instantaneously all at the same time.
29:42
And what do you pay them in?
29:43
I pay them in dollars.
29:44
So you have something called a stable coin.
29:47
So it's basically what
29:48
it says.
29:48
It's a coin that is stable.
29:50
It's not volatile.
29:51
It's pegged one to one to the dollar.
29:54
So I'm paying them in dollars and it's denominated in dollars, but it's just a crypto version
30:00
of a dollar.
30:01
How would they use the money you're paying then?
30:04
Some of my employees use that money
30:08
to go back into the crypto ecosystem.
30:09
Maybe they trade with it.
30:11
Maybe they borrow against that
30:14
money in the DeFi banks that we talked about before.
30:17
The other way is they just completely
30:19
take it out and it gets sent to their normal bank account and it gets put back into their
30:23
normal currency.
30:25
Oh my God.
30:26
Honestly, the fact that you can do that just blows my mind.
30:29
So really,
30:30
they could just literally pull it out straight away and have a one-for-one.
30:34
There's no risk for
30:35
them that it's going to go anywhere and be worth less or anything?
30:38
Nope.
30:39
Oh my goodness.
30:41
And so
30:42
let's say someone's listening to this and they think, right, I'm pretty sure that this Danielle
30:46
girl knows exactly what she's talking about.
30:48
And I'm very much on board with the idea of investing
30:51
in cryptocurrencies.
30:52
What's a good place to start?
30:53
And like, what are some of the most obvious,
30:55
I guess, stable and inverted commas, keeping in mind that crypto is still volatile, regardless
31:01
of sort of where you're invested, even Bitcoin, which has been around for quite a while now and
31:06
has been going up and down and sideways.
31:08
So what's a good place to start?
31:10
Because I really want to
31:11
build my portfolio, but I don't really know the types of cryptocurrencies other than Bitcoin that
31:16
I should consider.
31:17
The best place to start is Bitcoin, because it is the number one asset in
31:22
crypto.
31:23
It's the one that's being mass adopted by institutions like BlackRock.
31:28
They have their
31:28
ETF products now.
31:31
It's being adopted by governments like the US wants to create a national strategic
31:34
reserve in Bitcoin, same as they have for gold and other assets and oil, they're going to have
31:39
Bitcoin on the balance sheet.
31:42
Many countries like El Salvador use Bitcoin as legal tender.
31:45
So it's very adopted globally.
31:49
And it's understood to be that, you know, that store of value and that
31:53
particular money on the on the internet that I was talking about before.
31:56
So Bitcoin is a great
31:57
way to start if you want to dip your toe into crypto and you want to invest in the least
32:04
volatile asset of all of them.
32:07
And then I would look at other institutional ETF products because
32:13
the way that I see the risk curve is that if institutions are willing to pour billions of
32:20
dollars into this asset, then they must see a future in this asset.
32:26
So at the moment in the US,
32:28
the main ETF products are Bitcoin, Ethereum, XRP, and Solana.
32:35
Those are the four.
32:37
Now,
32:37
Ethereum is what we talked about before.
32:39
It's like the app store of all of these different
32:43
tech companies that are building on ETH, right?
32:47
So that's Ethereum.
32:49
Solana is exactly the same
32:50
thing.
32:51
They're competitors of each other.
32:53
It's like, I don't know, Samsung versus iPhone.
32:57
They're basically the same thing.
32:59
One is more efficient than the other.
33:00
For me, Solana is more
33:01
efficient.
33:02
I use Solana more.
33:03
That's just my personal preference.
33:06
Do you want an iPhone?
33:06
Do
33:07
want a Samsung.
33:07
I prefer Solana.
33:09
And then XRP is the banking settlement layer.
33:13
So all of the
33:15
banking infrastructure that we talked about before in terms of all of these governments
33:19
and countries wanting to move to central bank digital currencies, they're moving to crypto.
33:24
XRP is the infrastructure and kind of the glue to make that happen.
33:30
So that's why XRP is very
33:32
well known and people invest in that is because it's the future of banking in a sense.
33:38
So those
33:39
are the four sort of cryptocurrencies to get you started.
33:44
And those are like a brief overview of
33:46
what they are.
33:47
I know that you said you didn't really go into Bitcoin because you sort of at
33:52
this point assume people understand what that is.
33:54
But can you give the use case for Bitcoin for
33:56
those that don't know?
33:56
The use case of Bitcoin, again, it has multiple different use cases.
34:01
So the main use case is a store of value.
34:05
So it's digital money on the Internet that people are storing their money into, similarly to gold in a sense.
34:15
It's people store gold because they see it as a store of value and they see that they want to park their money there for some time and it accrues value over time.
34:25
Bitcoin is basically very similar to that, except it's just on the internet and it's digital.
34:30
So the problem with gold is if you have physical gold, it's hard to move and transfer.
34:36
Digital gold, you have to go through brokers and middlemen, etc.
34:40
As in with Bitcoin, I have Bitcoin in my hardware wallet.
34:43
I can travel all throughout the world and I know that I've got my Bitcoin there.
34:46
It's a way in which I can park my money.
34:48
It's my retirement account.
34:49
It's my investment account.
34:51
I park money in Bitcoin every year for the next 20 years, and that's going to accrue in value over time.
34:57
This is my retirement pot.
34:59
That's how I look at it.
35:00
It's a store of value.
35:01
It's a place to park your money that will accrue in value over time.
35:05
As more governments buy it, as more institutions buy it, as it becomes a global asset that everyone holds, I'm just storing it into that asset.
35:16
So that's Bitcoin's use case.
35:19
It's global.
35:21
It's borderless.
35:21
It's a place where people can store their money and that accrues value over time.
35:26
So I know for you, because you're used to Bitcoin, you think, oh, it's a store in value.
35:32
It's just like gold.
35:33
But we have to be honest in that it's gone like this and this and this and this and this, whereas gold, not as much.
35:40
so can we just chat about that and and why it's so volatile still even though it's the most stable
35:48
and no one won yes and then I guess the part two to that is like how do you personally manage the
35:52
fear or volatility when markets move given that's your retirement savings because that's you know
35:58
like that's a it's definitely a more risky place to put a lot of money so I would yeah I'd love to
36:05
hear kind of sorry it's a bit of a two-parted question you might have to pull me back a little
36:09
bit because I'm going to explain the reason why Bitcoin goes up and down.
36:14
Yeah, I think that would
36:15
be really helpful.
36:16
Let's start there.
36:16
Okay, so Bitcoin is extremely linked to liquidity in the
36:24
world.
36:25
So what happens in the world is there's a bunch of governments that are printing more money
36:32
and they're devaluing their currency.
36:34
So, for example, the US dollar.
36:37
From 1913 to today, the dollar has lost 98% of its value.
36:43
Oh, my gosh.
36:44
Because it continues to print money.
36:47
COVID, for example, we printed a large percentage
36:50
of the entire supply of dollars ever in less than one year.
36:55
That has a knock-on effect.
36:57
So, basically, what's happening is governments
37:01
are printing more money and the value of your currency goes down.
37:04
So where does that free
37:06
flowing money go?
37:08
It eventually lands in Bitcoin.
37:12
So Bitcoin is intrinsically linked with liquidity
37:14
around 83% of the time.
37:18
So what this means is as long as governments continue to print money,
37:24
Bitcoin will go up because that liquidity eventually lands in Bitcoin.
37:29
So that's why it
37:30
goes up and down so much is because there's periods of times where governments print money,
37:37
there's periods of times where they go into something called quantitative tightening,
37:40
which is where they take liquidity out of the market.
37:43
So when they take liquidity out of the
37:44
market, Bitcoin goes down.
37:46
When they add liquidity to the market, Bitcoin goes up.
37:49
That's what it's
37:50
linked to.
37:50
But why would they ever take money out of the market?
37:53
And why would they add more money
37:54
into the market?
37:55
Like, if you're devaluing your own currency, why would that ever be a good idea?
37:59
Yeah, it's the way in which the economy functions now, pretty much post 2008.
38:03
That's pretty much how they do it.
38:06
So they take liquidity out of the market if they need to slow the economy down.
38:10
If we're going into a period of time where inflation is too high, goods and services are skyrocketing in prices.
38:16
We saw it in COVID, right?
38:18
So we had the initial injection of a bunch of money.
38:21
Everyone had money.
38:22
They had their stimulus checks.
38:23
It was great.
38:23
Everyone was spending money willy-nilly.
38:25
Everything went up.
38:26
House prices skyrocketed.
38:27
Crypto skyrocketed.
38:29
everyone made a bunch of money, right?
38:31
That's a way in which you quantitative ease.
38:34
So you're
38:34
adding liquidity to the market.
38:35
Everyone's having a great time.
38:37
Then it gets to a point where
38:39
inflation starts to rise.
38:40
So you see the cost of eggs tripling.
38:42
You see the cost of all your
38:44
goods and services start to go up.
38:46
You're like, oh, hang on a minute.
38:48
This isn't good.
38:49
So then
38:50
the governments go or the central banks go, oh, we need to stop this.
38:54
So then they rein it in.
38:56
They're like, no, no, no more.
38:57
So they stop liquidity going.
38:59
People feel like they're in tightening conditions and they're trying to start to get the prices down.
39:06
That's why you're seeing real estate starting to take a little bit of a dip now.
39:10
It's why you're seeing prices of things start to slowly start to come down because they've been in that quantitative tightening environment.
39:16
They've started taking liquidity out of the market.
39:19
That's also why Bitcoin's taken a massive hit.
39:21
Oh my God, that makes so much sense.
39:23
So that's why Bitcoin has gone down so much.
39:25
Yes.
39:26
I mean, there's other aspects of it, but if we look at it from a global top-down perspective, that's one of the reasons.
39:33
So if that's how Bitcoin goes up and down and that's sort of the reason and what it's attached to in terms of the volatility, then how do you feel comfortable putting your retirement money in there?
39:46
How do you see the future of it growing so much if it's so tied to that liquidity?
39:50
see?
39:50
Because governments have no choice but to continue to print more money to get themselves
39:54
out of the deficits that they're in.
39:56
So it will continue to happen.
39:58
I mean, like the government
39:59
and the US have been printing money since the beginning of time.
40:02
I don't see that slowing down
40:03
anytime soon.
40:04
If anything, it's actually speeding up.
40:06
So for me, my bet is, is that governments will
40:10
continue to print money and they'll continue to devalue their currencies.
40:13
And then Bitcoin is
40:14
going to be the safe haven against that.
40:15
So is gold.
40:16
So is other commodities.
40:17
But Bitcoin is
40:18
just one of those assets that if it's linked with liquidity and they have to print more money,
40:23
that's the way it's going to go.
40:24
It's going to eventually go up over time.
40:26
But putting your retirement savings in that is quite bold.
40:32
Obviously, you would because this
40:33
is the whole world that you live and breathe.
40:36
But, okay, tell me if this is wrong, but is the
40:39
idea that in the short term, the volatility is attached to or linked to the liquidity,
40:44
the printing money, etc.
40:46
But because there's genuine use cases for cryptocurrencies, Bitcoin,
40:52
etc., over time, that volatility will sort of separate itself from the printing of money and
40:58
the liquidity piece because the use cases and the functionality is going to be so much more
41:03
advanced by then that the value will stop being so volatile.
41:08
Correct.
41:08
It's becoming more and more
41:09
like the Nasdaq.
41:10
So as years have gone on in the last five years or so, Bitcoin has actually
41:14
been linked to the Nasdaq around 0.7.
41:17
So about 70% of the time it acts like the Nasdaq.
41:21
So that's
41:21
the way that I kind of see crypto and Bitcoin going eventually.
41:25
It's going to be treated like
41:27
a tech stock.
41:28
People have got no problem investing in Amazon, in Facebook, in Google.
41:34
These are all
41:34
tech stocks.
41:35
No one's scared
41:36
of these companies.
41:37
So that's the
41:38
way that I see Bitcoin and crypto.
41:41
They're essentially going to be the same.
41:42
There's going
41:42
to be a bunch of companies that win
41:45
in crypto, have real
41:46
use cases that will start to
41:50
act more
41:50
like tech stocks.
41:51
So I'm just getting in
41:52
on the ground floor.
41:53
I'm getting in like early,
41:54
early, early.
41:55
Is it high risk?
41:56
Yes.
41:56
But the rate of return that I will have
41:58
in the next 20 to 30 years is going to be
42:01
astronomical because
42:02
of the fact that I see the way in which this is going.
42:05
And also Bitcoin, every single cycle
42:08
is less and less volatile.
42:11
And the rate of return is also less and less each time.
42:14
So how do you manage the volatility in the market moving around crypto?
42:19
Do you panic?
42:20
I'm assuming not.
42:22
But do you have any advice for people who might invest and start investing in it?
42:26
And then, you know, there are going to be lots of cycles and lots of ups and downs.
42:30
How do you
42:30
personally deal with that?
42:31
And what advice do you have to new crypto investors?
42:35
Yeah, so I mean,
42:35
my portfolio is diversified very differently in terms of I'm more heavy in crypto, which is fine.
42:42
But I think the first thing is to have a foundation of a diversified portfolio.
42:46
So like,
42:47
you know, have your medals, have your stocks, have your, you know, real estate, like have that
42:52
diversified portfolio, and then choose a percentage that you want to invest in crypto.
42:59
I mean, the
43:00
recommendation from institutions around 4%.
43:04
Last year, it was 1%.
43:06
So they've gone up quite
43:07
significantly on the amount of exposure that you should have in crypto.
43:10
So if you want to go
43:12
and meet at the same rate of institutions, then you should have around 4% to 5% of the portfolio
43:18
in crypto.
43:19
Because if, for example, crypto goes down, then it's a very small hit on the portfolio.
43:26
However, the opposite is true.
43:28
If crypto goes up, that 5% could turn into 10%, 15%, 20% of the portfolio very quickly
43:36
and quicker than investing into the S&P 500, for example.
43:41
Because Bitcoin and crypto can go up hundreds of percents a year.
43:45
It's in the S&P 500, you're looking at 8% to 10%.
43:48
So it's very different.
43:49
So it's understanding what your risk tolerance is first.
43:51
Do you trade Bitcoin or do you just dump it in and leave it?
43:56
So for example, with crypto,
43:58
are you leaving a set amount in there for a long period of time or at times when the market has
44:03
tanked like now, do you put more in and when it's really high, do you pull some out?
44:09
Yeah.
44:09
So I have two strategies.
44:11
So number one is just the dollar cost average strategy.
44:15
So
44:15
you set a set amount.
44:17
Let's say it's $100 a month.
44:18
I invest $100 a month into Bitcoin
44:21
regardless.
44:22
That is what I'm going to be doing.
44:24
And that's a commitment that I'm making for the
44:26
next five years.
44:26
So that means my average entry for Bitcoin should be relatively quite good.
44:31
The other strategy is looking at the crypto markets and Bitcoin and going,
44:35
we're a little bit oversold here, or overbought, sorry.
44:39
And I will take some money off the table
44:41
to buy back lower.
44:42
So when the October 10 crash happened, when Bitcoin went from 120 to around
44:48
80,000, it dipped all the way back up to about 95.
44:52
So we were heavily just taking risk off the table
44:56
around that area around 90 to $95,000 Bitcoin, because our expectation was that Bitcoin
45:02
potentially will go down further, and that we can buy back between 60,000 and $50,000 Bitcoin.
45:08
So that's currently what we've done.
45:09
So the Bitcoin that I sold at, you know, 90 to 95,
45:13
I've now started to buy back in once Bitcoin dipped to 60k.
45:17
So there's that strategy as well.
45:19
And that's more sort of active trading and repositioning of the portfolio because there's
45:26
periods of time in which you want to be more risk on and there's periods of time in which you want
45:29
to be more risk off.
45:30
That's kind of how I play the game.
45:32
And so when it comes to the idea of
45:36
these big swings, because it's really low right now, right?
45:39
Like it's lower than it's been in
45:41
quite a few years.
45:43
So what historically happens after those lows and what could we start to think
45:48
about?
45:49
Oh, how could we take advantage of that opportunity knowing what we know from historical
45:54
data?
45:54
Yeah.
45:54
So there's an interesting piece of data where we actually looked at what was the
45:58
percentage probability that you would be in profit in Bitcoin.
46:03
What do you mean by that?
46:04
Sorry.
46:05
So like what's the probability that you're going to be in profit depending on how long
46:11
you hold Bitcoin.
46:12
And the data point is, is that if you've held Bitcoin for longer than three years,
46:17
basically the probability of you being in profit is 99.9%.
46:21
That's how Bitcoin works,
46:26
is you may have a couple of years of down, but over the longer term, the probability of you
46:31
being in profit is super, super, super high.
46:34
Typically, Bitcoin will have one year of a
46:39
downtrend, and then around six months to recover.
46:44
And then you have around two years of a bull
46:48
market, sometimes three years.
46:50
So right now we're in the one year of market starting to go down.
46:55
The market's topped out in October.
46:57
So we're pretty much like four or five months in already
47:00
when it comes to that downturn.
47:02
So if you were going to get hold of Bitcoin, then the next six
47:07
months is going to be the prime opportunity to get access to Bitcoin at the lowest possible
47:14
prices it can be.
47:14
It's already at a 50% discount.
47:16
And then the average bear market is around 70%
47:19
to 80% of a retracement.
47:21
So you could be buying it over the next six months.
47:23
And let's say in
47:24
six months, you keep buying it, keep buying it, it keeps going down and down and down and down.
47:29
That's normal.
47:30
That's normal for what the price action of Bitcoin would do during a bear market.
47:34
And then from that point, it will start to reverse.
47:37
And then you're in a two, three year bull market.
47:40
So that's typically how Bitcoin cycles work.
47:43
And that's pretty much how it's worked every single cycle that it's been in so far.
47:47
I'm so excited.
47:48
I'm so excited.
47:50
I want to dump everything I own, including my couch into Bitcoin.
47:53
Don't do what I do, anyone.
47:55
Anyone that's listening, ignore me.
47:57
That's so exciting though.
47:58
How cool to feel like we're in the right place at the right time.
48:01
It doesn't happen very often
48:03
with investing.
48:04
It's so often to feel like you've missed the boat or you've missed out or there's
48:08
all these opportunities that you could have done and you didn't.
48:11
Hopefully people listening are
48:13
going to do a bit more research and really think about this as an asset class.
48:17
Do you have any,
48:18
yeah, I don't know, do you have any further thoughts around the idea of patience and long-term
48:22
investing?
48:23
Because I think it's interesting that you're saying there's sort of a three-year cycle.
48:26
Is that sort of what you were talking about before with these two strategies?
48:29
You have the long-term
48:29
one, which doesn't think about the three-year, and then you have maybe some shorter term taking
48:35
some profits, and it's sort of that's linked around more that three-year mark.
48:40
Yeah, so I tend
48:42
to look at them in five-year cycles.
48:44
That's the way that I look at it.
48:46
So I buy when prices are
48:49
low and then I sell when they're looking a little bit overvalued.
48:52
So like, for example, last cycle,
48:55
my first take profit was at $100,000 Bitcoin.
48:59
And that's when everyone was buying Bitcoin.
49:00
They were like, oh my God, it's 100K.
49:02
Let's go in now.
49:02
It's going to go to 250.
49:03
And I was the
49:05
one going, actually, we should probably take some money off the table here because it went from
49:08
15,000 to 100,000.
49:09
It's like, okay, this is the time in which you want to maybe start to get out.
49:14
And then my next target was 120,000 and they ended up going to 125,000.
49:19
Oh, and you took it out at 120,000.
49:21
Yeah.
49:21
So 100,000 and 120,000.
49:23
Now, was my expectation that we would get to 150,000?
49:26
Yes.
49:26
But that's why I have multiple exit targets because not everyone's going to hit.
49:30
So my
49:31
expectation was that Bitcoin was going to go to 150,000.
49:33
That wasn't the case, but that's okay
49:35
because I got out at 120 and I got out at 100.
49:37
So that's fine.
49:38
And then the rest of the money
49:40
got taken out at around 95,000 because I realized that the trend was changing and that's okay too.
49:45
So that's the way that I kind of look at the markets in terms of I want to buy as low as
49:52
possible and I want to sell on the way up.
49:54
And I'm very conservative with my expectations
49:58
in comparison to a lot of other people online.
50:00
I actually try and be more conservative because
50:03
Because the likelihood is that anything could go wrong with any asset classes, same with stocks, same with metals.
50:11
So I just try and make sure that I'm taking money off the table as much as possible.
50:15
Okay, this is so amazing and I cannot wait to go and do more research on this.
50:19
If someone was starting from absolutely zero, so they had no crypto investments, you've spoken about those four main investments.
50:27
What were they again?
50:27
Bitcoin, Ethereum, Solana?
50:30
Solana and XRP.
50:32
Where do you find those investments and how can people invest in them?
50:35
So there's two ways in which you can do it.
50:38
You can go for your traditional financial broker, like you can go to BlackRock, you can go to Fidelity, you can go through the ETF system, which I'm sure a lot of people are used to doing.
50:50
If you're more like me, then I like to stay away from traditional finance and I like to use actual cryptocurrency exchanges.
51:00
so Coinbase is the most regulated exchange in the world very safe it's very well known
51:08
they're also publicly available to trade on the stock market you can get hold of your Bitcoin
51:13
your XLP or Solana on those exchanges so that's the way in which you can start you can also get
51:18
it on you know apps like Robinhood and it's super easy to set up it's almost like just setting up a
51:26
normal bank account like you type in your details you provide your driving license just kyc to
51:31
identify who you are you transfer money from your bank into this exchange and then you can transfer
51:38
bitcoin straight off the debit card or um or credit card whichever way is more suitable but
51:44
it can be done within 10 minutes it's really not that complicated and it's it's not hard to
51:50
onboard to crypto these days and so i guess like just two more quite beginner friendly questions
51:56
when it comes to mistakes that beginners often make with crypto investing are there any we
52:01
haven't touched on yet that you just want to highlight or mention one of the main beginner
52:06
mistakes is uh one is analysis paralysis there's thousands of cryptocurrencies out there and a lot
52:13
of people like do the spray and pray kind of strategy where they're like i want to buy everything
52:17
so they just buy everything uh not really about thinking about properly curating a crypto portfolio
52:23
that's going to work for them and also not understanding the risks of doing that.
52:29
So that's like one of the main beginner mistakes.
52:31
And also the other beginner mistake is that they just don't have a long enough time horizon
52:36
to ensure that crypto works for them.
52:39
Like a lot of people have, and I don't know why, they have the mentality that if they invest in crypto today
52:46
in a year's time, they're going to be rich.
52:48
I don't know why that is the case, but in reality, you need to look at the data.
52:54
It needs to be at least a three to five year hold and to have a proper dollar cost average strategy and a proper risk management strategy to be successful in this market.
53:02
If you go too high on the risk curve, it can be a big mistake because a lot of these assets are volatile and can go down 90, 95 percent or some of them don't even come back at all.
53:12
And they also don't have a long enough time horizon to ensure that this asset is making you money over time.
53:18
When it comes to stocks, they're okay for holding it for five to 10 years.
53:22
You need to have the same mentality when it comes to crypto.
53:24
Okay, amazing.
53:25
And final question, actually two more.
53:28
What is not shilling tokens?
53:31
Because our producers have written a question here saying, you're very clear about not shilling
53:35
tokens or jumping on hype circles.
53:37
Why is that such an important value?
53:38
And I don't know what that means.
53:41
Okay.
53:41
So one of the main problems in my industry is, unfortunately, a lot of people who have a platform, they are being paid to essentially promote certain cryptocurrencies.
53:56
So it's almost like trying to do insider trading, basically.
54:00
Exactly.
54:01
So one of my main values and the reason I do this is because I believe in long term and I want to be around for a long time.
54:10
And I care about educating my audience, not profiting off my audience.
54:14
Right.
54:14
So a lot of these other influencers in the space do not care about that.
54:18
They care about making as much money as possible in the shortest amount of time.
54:22
And they don't mind doing it through their audience, getting paid by these cryptocurrencies to shill the tokens.
54:28
Oh, so shilling tokens is promoting a token, basically.
54:32
Correct.
54:32
Got you.
54:34
One of the last things that I would love to ask you is, I feel like the crypto space is
54:39
so fast moving, similarly to AI, where there's so much going on.
54:42
And often I will have a conversation like this one, and I think, perfect, I know my
54:46
next steps.
54:46
I know the things that I want to invest in.
54:48
I know how to do it.
54:49
And I understand why I would invest in the space.
54:51
But for people that want to stay up to date and make sure that they're not missing the
54:57
boat that actually crypto or something all of a sudden is no longer actually a valuable investment
55:02
or whatever what are other experts or places that we can follow or learn to make sure that we're
55:09
staying in the loop with what's going on in terms of a social platform twitter's quite good
55:13
um if you follow the right the right people so i follow a lot of macro analysts a lot of
55:18
really technical people um who provide some really good resources so a lot of people's twitter feeds
55:24
are just full of like not good stuff as in my twitter feed is just full of just education and
55:29
information that i can like consume so twitter's really good for that obviously following like
55:34
educators like myself the ones that are not shilling the tokens the ones that are more focused
55:38
on actual education talking about you know not just crypto but the macroeconomics what's going
55:44
on in the global economy that's always always really good and instagram's a great place for
55:48
that amazing and um i said to danielle at the start of this call i'm on about like i don't know
55:53
what's going to go on with my percentage of the battery in my computer.
55:57
And I can see we are on
55:58
2%.
55:58
So I'm going to have to very quickly wrap this up and say, thank you for all of the amazing
56:03
insights that you shared and for coming on the podcast and for just making this such an accessible,
56:09
interesting conversation.
56:11
I feel like I've learned so much.
56:12
I feel really excited about
56:14
what to do now and how to be involved in crypto.
56:17
So thank you so much.
56:18
No worries.
56:18
Thank you for having me on.
56:19
I really appreciate it.
56:20
Like I said,
56:21
it's a male dominated industry
56:22
so my audience is
56:24
like 95% male
56:25
so it'd be really nice
56:26
to actually like
56:27
speak to females
56:29
in this space
56:29
go the girls
56:30
go the girls
56:31
thank you so much
56:32
for listening to Raising the Curb
56:33
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56:34
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56:35
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56:36
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56:37
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56:38
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56:39
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56:39
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56:40
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56:41
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56:42
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56:43
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56:45
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56:47
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56:48
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56:53
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56:53
Yeah.
56:53
So please do it.
56:54
Okay.
56:55
Love you.
56:55
Bye.
56:57
Okay, quickly, the curve was created to empower and educate you about investing,
57:00
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57:03
Our platform exists for educational purposes only,
57:05
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57:09
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57:12
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57:13
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57:17
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57:18
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57:19
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57:21
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57:22
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57:23
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