Latest / We Are For Good Podcast - The Podcast for Nonprofits / 121. How to Build a Pipeline of Talent and Inclusivity - Birgit Burton

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121. How to Build a Pipeline of Talent and Inclusivity - Birgit Burton · We Are For Good Podcast - The Podcast for Nonprofits

• 0:01
  Jonathan McCoy: Hey, I'm john.
• 0:02
  Unknown: And I'm Becky.
• 0:03
  Jonathan McCoy: And this is the we are for good podcast.
• 0:06
  Becky Endicott: nonprofits are faced with more challenges to accomplish their missions and the growing pressure to do more, raise more and be more for the causes that improve our world.
• 0:15
  Jonathan McCoy: We're here to learn with you from some of the best in the industry, bringing the most innovative ideas, inspirational stories, all to create an impact uprising.
• 0:23
  Becky Endicott: So welcome to the good community, where nonprofit professionals, philanthropist world changers and rabid fans who are striving to bring a little more goodness into the world.
• 0:34
  Jonathan McCoy: So let's get started.
• 0:36
  Becky Endicott: Howdy, Becky.
• 0:36
  Becky Endicott: Hi, john, Julie, and a very special Rockstar today
• 0:42
  Jonathan McCoy: we have got a world changer on the line with us today and honestly, her reputation precedes her. The people in our life that no beer get personally have just emoted and reflected on what an incredibly kind, visionary, wonderful human being we get the honor of talking to you today.
• 0:59
  Becky Endicott: I really think she's like the godmother. She godmothers of philanthropy.
• 1:02
  Becky Endicott: She's like one of the philanthropy whispers and I am just feel sorry, Alaska.
• 1:09
  Jonathan McCoy: Yes. So let me tell you a little bit about beer get Burton. She is the founder of the African American development officers network.
• 1:16
  Jonathan McCoy: And the chair elect of AFP, global that is the association
• 1:22
  Becky Endicott: Association
• 1:22
  Jonathan McCoy: for Fundraising Professionals. very casual, but she's also the executive director of foundation relations for the Georgia Institute of Technology Office of development in Atlanta, we love Atlanta. So many listeners out Atlanta, appreciate you guys listening to. But she is a visionary leader, I want to share a little bit about your career highlights, I mean, raising more than $500 million over your 30 year career so impactful, most recently 300 million toward the Institute of Technology's successful capital campaign, which is just so impressive. You know, we had the chance to talk to bill a couple weeks ago just to get to know her. And what sticks out to me is just that specifically with standing up the association is that you saw a need, you felt a need, you saw space that you didn't feel supported or didn't feel like you had a place at the table. So you literally went and created the table, and you allow people to be seen to elevate and now you're casting vision and dream for more diversity, more equity, more inclusion in this space, which desperately needs it. And you're leading that conversation, and you've got big dreams to unpack there. So I really want to dive into that conversation today. But just everything you can imagine service on board and a mentor to so many people. But just an incredible honor to have you here today and an aspiring Broadway singer, man as well, too.
• 2:43
  Becky Endicott: already asked her to sing she wouldn't do it.
• 2:45
  Jonathan McCoy: Sorry, guys.
• 2:45
  Jonathan McCoy: Maybe on our follow up episode.
• 2:47
  Jonathan McCoy: Good to see
• 2:48
  Becky Endicott: ya. Welcome.
• 2:48
  Becky Endicott: Might be so glad you're here.
• 2:51
  Birgit Burton: Thank you. I'm glad to be here.
• 2:52
  Jonathan McCoy: I really am.
• 2:52
  Jonathan McCoy: Well, Birgit would you give us a little bit of your story, connect the dots, what made you land in such an influential place? Now I'm sure you had no idea. This is where you would end up many years ago.
• 3:03
  Birgit Burton: So I am, you know, going to go all the way back to the beginning. And I will make this very short. This is only going to, you know open up the door for more questions, and maybe a follow up podcast on this. I don't know if I shared this with you. This might come to you as a surprise. But I was born in Germany, which you might not have gotten from that chapter in collecting courage is that my mother who is German and I don't know if she's still alive, gave birth to me, and decided to keep me I don't know what the story is around that there's some speculation, but she decided to keep me and she kept me until it was almost three years old. And then she decided that the better life for me would be to be with a family that I you know, could see myself in that looked a little bit more like because I definitely am Brown. And I stand out. I didn't blend in. And, um, and so my parents, my adoptive parents were stationed in Germany, my dad was in the Air Force, and they had been married 10 years without children. And this is way back in the day before you know the fertility stuff. And you know, it was like, okay, you didn't, you know, have a child didn't do a whole lot of figuring out what it was, but they decided to adopt. And there was an agency there that knew that, you know, my mother wanted a family to have me until my parents asked me, and so I never spent a night when my brother in the orphanage when my mother delivered me. Can you picture that? Let's think about can you imagine, you know, giving your child up at almost three years old, and the impact I don't remember it. The odd thing is I remember days following it, but I don't remember You know, those days, so I remember being with my new parents, and I remember, you know many things about that experience. And so, um, you know, I thought about that when my son was almost three, and it tore me apart to think I could never, I would be selfish enough that I just would have struggled and had a miserable life trying to make sure you know, he was okay than to give him away. So a selfless was that my parents adopted me. And they brought me back to the United States brought me to the United States, across the SS, United States, a chip on my toes back in, you know, with the big steam things, I ran around with it, black shipped the whole thing. So fast forward, on my, I met my grandmother, and my grandmother actually was a minister, she pastored a church for 30 some years in a very white community.
• 5:54
  Birgit Burton: And she actually there's pictures of her newspaper pictures of her with with other white ministers. And, um, I used to go with her sometimes when she would visit people in the community, and she would pay clothing, she would even brushed children's hair, you know, that, whose parents were, you know, having challenges before they went to school. So that was like my connection, my experience of feeling what it felt like to connect and give, you know, to people, and so fast forward all the way to, you know, as the desire for a Broadway career.
• 6:32
  Birgit Burton: another story for another day.
• 6:32
  Birgit Burton: Actually, I made it into a program that only took 15
• 6:41
  Becky Endicott: freshmen at State University of New York at Fredonia, and they had over eight 900 people audition. And that first year, my advisor told me that I should consider another career, not because I wasn't talented, but because he felt that it would be too difficult for me as a black person to be successful. Now, we're not talking 1940 we're talking like, this was 1980, he was telling me this, and I listened to him, I believed him, and never shared that with my parents, who were the first in their family to go to college, you know, my father would have had a fit if he had known that I left because of that. Um, and so I, I stumbled into a fundraising career instead, by accident, doing it an internship for an ad agency, and the chairman, the President, was involved with the United Negro College Fund. So I stumbled into that, and, you know, realized that I had a knack, a passion and an interest for fundraising. One, the nonprofit industry is so blessed that you made that hard pivot to, I really want to thank you for being so honest and open and raw, about like the systemic racism that existed for you, even in the 80s. And again, I mean, even to today, but specifically in that instance, because these are the kinds of conversations we have got to have in this community, we need to understand, because we need to figure out how we can radically do something differently that makes someone feel like they can chase their passion. You know, in, in the purest sense without any roadblocks. We talk about that all the time. And so I'm incredibly sorry that happened to you, you know, Broadway's losses are gain here in the nonprofit sector. But I also think the thing Birgit that's just so interesting to me about your story, which I have to say, that might be the most interesting story we've ever had on the podcast of how someone's gotten into philanthropy. But it's not lost on me that your mother, your birth mother made the ultimate sacrifice. And she gave you up in the spirit of trying to give you a better life and trying to give you a life surrounded by people who look like you. And then you my friend, in turn, created a nonprofit organization for people who couldn't find other people who looked like them.
• 9:17
  Becky Endicott: That is an extremely powerful, almost love letter back to your birth mother that you have carried her legacy on in such an important way. And I just want to thank you because we have talked to a couple people who are a part of the African American development officer organization. It's an awesome organization. They have an incredible inclusivity pledge.
• 9:38
  Becky Endicott: They've got amazing resources, we will definitely link that up in the show notes. But it just feels so full circle. And I just had to connect that back and I just want to give you like the biggest virtual hug because I think that is a really cool part of your story.
• 9:55
  Birgit Burton: Well, thank you when I ended up at Georgia Tech after 11 years with the apryl college fund where I'd say 95% of my colleagues were people of color. I ended up at Georgia Tech for my second career. And I didn't know that I was the first frontline fundraiser of color that Georgia Tech had hired. I didn't realize that they didn't announce it. They didn't say, Hey, you know, and I saw other black people, you know, in the development office. I mean, they were at that time at 90 of us, but I didn't realize the other people of color. Were not fundraisers, frontline fundraisers. So when I realized that, I wanted to create a network, selfishly, you know, where I could be with people, and the color of my skin didn't stick out? You know what I mean?
• 10:45
  Birgit Burton: So, um, I just wanted to be able to have conversations about our jobs. Yes, some of the racism we might have experienced, you know, I, I, you know, my first encounter with an alum at Georgia Tech, you know, was at a luncheon, a scholar luncheon, and he said, You know, I remember the good old days when there were no blacks or women at Georgia Tech. And that was in my second week. And I was like, Whoa, what am I getting myself into, you know, like, people really think he's 85 years old, but still, you know, and that was true for him. Those were the good old days. So I just wanted to find, you know, community.
• 11:27
  Birgit Burton: And that's all. And so, when I worked for the United Negro College Fund, the the HBCUs, that were part of uncf in Atlanta, right down the street, from Georgia Tech. So I thought, hey, let me reach out and see if they just want to get together.
• 11:43
  Birgit Burton: Let's just get together. And hey, what if I invite them to Georgia Tech, because I wonder if anybody's really been on the Georgia Tech campus, because the Olympics came in 96. Right. And the oldest, you know, formal projects housing project was across from Georgia in the country, the oldest one in the country, was across from Georgia Tech. And the school that was in that community was called a Fowler street Academy. And through the years, no child had ever attended Fowler street Academy, and ended up going to Georgia Tech one day ever. So when they tore down the projects and the school for the look for the Olympics, that the city did that, because they didn't want that to be, you know, in the, in the picture for the Olympics, they built another school of beautiful school called Centennial place Academy. And, you know, there was a dream that maybe one day, some students from there would end up at Georgia Tech, maybe we would, you know, reach out across North Avenue, and, you know, embrace this school. So I was thinking this might be the first time that, you know, people from HBCUs had been on campus, the Georgia Tech campus, I hosted the breakfast. We had such a good time, you guys. He had such a wonderful time. And we decided to do it again the next year.
• 13:08
  Birgit Burton: And it wasn't just about being black. Because then we started talking about best practices, I mean, regular fundraising things. But our, our color of our skin wasn't an issue. Does that make sense? It was like, that does not what showed up.
• 13:26
  Birgit Burton: When we walked in the door, we're all black. Whenever I sat down, we talked about those things. So that was 25 people.
• 13:32
  Birgit Burton: And now it's grown over 23 years to 3000, I'd say about 10% our allies, not people of color who support excuse me what we do.
• 13:45
  Birgit Burton: And so it's been a great network over the years. I mean, your story is is difficult to hear.
• 14:30
  Birgit Burton: And I realized we are third party 30 years later responding to it. But
• 14:36
  Jonathan McCoy: thank you for standing up to the voices and the hate that you endured to get to this place. Because, you know, one of our core values is community is everything. And that is a thread of your story.
• 14:48
  Jonathan McCoy: And you saw and you're a testament to the power of how much easier it is to push together in with community. And I love that you've been a champion of that with so much of your story. So thank you for sharing that and goodness.
• 15:06
  Becky Endicott: So I think I want to dive in to the African American development officers network. Can you share with us kind of the founding story, what was the impetus for it and where are you today?
• 15:16
  Birgit Burton: So you know, the reaching out creating, really, so when I had that first gathering that breakfast, and selfishly I wanted them to come to tech and see Georgia Tech and see see somebody here you know, of color. You I was working on this campus. And then I also wanted to see if there are ways we could partner, what can we do? You know, are our universities with, you know, my university with your university?
• 15:46
  Birgit Burton: How can we grow this. So they're more opportunities, you know, to, to partner on projects on ideas. And we decided, after a few years in to start a conference, and so the conference was, at the time the ADL conference, we would have speakers come and address issues of diversity, but also issues of talk about best practices, and in a way that people who could really use the support could get it, you know, some of the things that I'm, you know, you're expected to know, you know, in the job that you do, that you might not feel as equipped, or the kind of might feel like an imposter. You know, I got this job, and I'm not exactly sure, you know, so we can address those things. I remember, once the executive director of Coca Cola Foundation, his name is Michael Evans, and he came and spoke to us, you know, a black man to a group of black professionals, I'm gonna say, for that meeting, there might have been 75 of us. And he said, you know, make sure that you are not just invited to be a part of a discussion, because of the topics that you bring diversity to the group, you know, he said, He's had people come in, had people come to Coca Cola, to talk about a program. And clearly they brought the black person, you know, from the office to be a part of the conversation, and they had nothing to contribute. They were just kind of sitting there to be the person of color. And he would direct the question, and they had nothing to offer. So he said, Don't just be the token person, you know, be the best you can be no your job, contribute, make sure that you're invited when you have something to contribute. But he also told a story to us of getting on the elevator, Coca Cola, I don't know if you've been in Atlanta, you know, Coca Cola headquarters, a tall building in Atlanta. And he said, he had been out of the building for lunch or something came in on the elevator. And he spoke to these two white gentlemen who had gotten on the elevator with him. And they did not speak back, they did not return the greeting. They just kept talking and ignored him.
• 18:13
  Birgit Burton: And he said, they got to the floor. And they got off and went one direction he went another, about 10 minutes later, they were brought into their his office, because they were there to meet him. And they didn't know that he was the person that they were going to be meeting with. So when they walked in and saw that he was the executive director, they were mortified.
• 18:36
  Birgit Burton: You know, they're like, oh, oh, well, you know, because they realized that they had, you know, ignored him. And so even if the high level that he, you know, was that when he was just a regular black man, he didn't earn their, you know, respect and integrating. So he was sharing with us, you know, his experience, from working with the fundraiser to his experience of being an executive director, kind of giving the real, you know, the truth, and the real honesty behind, you know, being a person of color showing up in, in this philanthropy work that we do. Um, so that's how that's kind of how the conference grew.
• 19:23
  Birgit Burton: And then after about, I don't know, 10 years, we partnered with the council for advancement sort of education. And the conference has grown now, it's the diverse philanthropy and Leadership Conference, about 250 300 people,
• 19:42
  Jonathan McCoy: again, like the most painful stories that you're sharing, but speak to just what an important role that you're playing and lifting these stories and finding community locking arms and making a impactful difference now, so I would love to, we want to talk about how we can apply some of these principles into the nonprofit's that are listening today. And I want to put out a disclaimer because as white people in Oak in Oklahoma that have spent the majority of our life in Oklahoma, our perspective is not always enlightened. I get words wrong, I get vocabulary wrong, you get definitions, wrong, all of that.
• 20:21
  Jonathan McCoy: But on top of this, my mind has just grown in my heart has grown leaps and bounds over the last year and I'm thankful to so many people that have stepped up and share their experiences. And have grown my heart and understanding. And I just want to make sure that this conversation, which is building on many that we've done over the last year on the podcast, is, the answer is not to check the diversity box. So if you're in that camp, you may as well shut down this podcast, because that's not what this conversation is. That may have be the starting place of where you're at. But we're going to talk about really the evolved way of how do we really get more inclusion in our industry. And that is about taking a stand about building the entire pipeline, building the entire process for how people feel that they can show up authentically, and not feel like they're, you know, not seen not being able to be their full self in the workplace. And that is so much.
• 21:18
  Jonathan McCoy: So I would love to talk to you about this building the talent pipeline of philanthropy, today, and just, you know, some of the energy you're passionate about, if you kind of walk our listeners through where do you start with this conversation and give us some vision of where to go.
• 21:33
  Birgit Burton: So, um, I appreciate that I really do. And let me say that none of us are perfect, right? I don't care.
• 21:42
  Birgit Burton: Um, you know, how you identify, um, you know, I speak a lot, but and I am always checking in to try to make sure that I am staying, you know, as current as possible, which is a challenge because I was speaking somewhere and in the fall, Toronto, I was speaking to a group in Toronto, and somebody reached out afterwards. And I had used a chart, and I had a gender question. And I had me had a major misstep on that particular part of the chart. And I said, I'm in and the person reached out to me, I said, help me, you know, help me I want to learn, I will make mistakes. But I want to learn. And, you know, and I'm going to answer your question, but I just want to take the opportunity to say one thing there about apology, we don't know how to apologize, we apologize. And don't let the apology rest, we have to put but, or we have to explain what our intent was, I'm sorry, that I said that, you know, I hurt your feelings, or I insulted you, or I'm sorry. But what I was trying to do was just explain XYZ, we need to I ask all your, your your viewers to think about it, and apologize and say, I am so sorry, I offended you. I didn't mean to forgive me, and let it lay there. It's so simple the PA is, but we don't do that we don't do that. We want to explain and justify well, and I said that, you know, because what I really meant was, and you've taken everything, you can't, you haven't just let it simply rest.
• 23:37
  Birgit Burton: And I apologize. Please forgive me. And I've had to learn now.
• 23:41
  Birgit Burton: And so along the journey, you know, we're always learning things. And I heard somebody on on Good Morning America this morning, say, I'm a disabled person, you know, and I was like, No, a person with a disability. It's person Earth.
• 23:57
  Birgit Burton: Yeah, you know, it's the person is not that is not defining who they are. So we've learned things every day on this journey. We're making mistakes.
• 24:08
  Birgit Burton: So don't beat yourself up. You know, because if you have good intentions, and you know, you are, I've had people say, Well, what do you people want to be called? You know, do you want to be called black African American, and I always laugh because I was born in Germany, my mother's German. And I just found my birth mother two years ago, here in the States, by the way, and he's from Barbados, and he's from Barbados. And in New York, they call Barbados in stages. So I'm a German Bayesian. Hi, not even African American agents. Oh, no, we really want to get down to the real end. Somebody says, What do you want to be called? I'm like, bereiken.
• 24:53
  Unknown: Yeah,
• 24:54
  Birgit Burton: I get it. No. Are you black? Are you African American, it is difficult. And it's, it's evolving, you know, we are using bipoc now. And so sometimes it's just safer to say what do you feel most comfortable? Whatever the form is, you know?
• 25:10
  Becky Endicott: Yes. This is such a great conversation about how to be a human being, how to have empathy, how to see all people I and honestly I, I understand for everyone listening like this is this is a hard conversation to get through, but we have to work through the hard conversations, because until we know the weight of pain, we talk about this all the time. We don't know how to lean in to change, and so understand and change the behavior. So I'm sorry, keep
• 25:40
  Birgit Burton: going. So when we're getting, you know, on, how do we bring diversity, you know, into our organization? Well, first of all, this is my opinion, it's inclusion that we're bringing in, right?
• 25:52
  Birgit Burton: diversity is the the measurable result, if we have inclusion, then we the end result will be a diverse, you know, team, so people I am, you know, a part of panels and webinars and stuff, where people get on the run down this whole list of things. And it's very, you know, it's very deep and involved, and I get lost, you know, and, and I'm thinking, Oh, my goodness, if I'm somebody that tuned in, and I say, you know, I want to start from ground zero, what do I do?
• 26:29
  Birgit Burton: You know, you walk into our organization, and you call everybody, you know, to the, to the front, you would see, you know, a sea of homogenous people, you know, so what, how do we do where, you know, I love this on, there are all the professionals of color, we don't even know where to find them?
• 26:49
  Birgit Burton: Well, while they are out there, and you know, you've been there, you know, the jobs in places where people are looking, such as the ADL network, and you can post it in LinkedIn, you have to be careful advice and counsel on how to write your job description. So that it, you know, and you can get consultants to help you, so that you write it so that it's, you know, clear that you want, you know, to invite people, you know, diverse people to be a part of your group. But I'm discovering, you know, even before last year that we're doing a better job of, you know, attracting, and maybe getting a little bit better at hiring a little bit better at hiring. Let me talk to that for just a second, though, on the hiring thing that people don't always save a think, is, Well, sure, we want diversity, and we have to lower the bar. So it's like, we have to lower the bar, and lower our expectations. So that, you know, we can get diverse candidates if you can't find candidates who can meet your expectations for your organization. And here are some simple things that that organizations the hiring managers aren't thinking of, especially when it comes to fundraising you all, here's something, you know, you look at the portfolio, how much money have you raised? You know, that's a big thing, because we are, you know, metrics is huge when it comes to fundraiser and expectations. When I worked for the United Negro College Fund, I had a goal of a million dollars a year, I still say that was the hardest job I ever had. And I had to raise a million dollars, as you can see, you know, from my, my bio money that I've raised, the bigger chunks of money, and I probably raised, you know, like 15 million in my 11 year career. But the big money that I've raised at Georgia Tech, you know, buildings, you know, amazing programs, that money is easier than that million dollars that I raised each year. So I want to why not hire somebody that really knows how to roll up their sleeves, do a job, a difficult job raising money for historically black colleges and universities in Buffalo, New York, time was identified as one of the most racist cities in our country. I mean, give me a pat on the back, I want to hire me.
• 29:37
  Birgit Burton: We don't take those things into consideration. They will look at somebody coming from a small HBCU and say, well, they don't have the experience. You know what challenge it is. Some of those offices are one in two people offices, and they have to do it all. I want somebody that has learned how to do it all, you know, with with very little budget. So those are the kinds of you know, that's the kind of scrutiny that shows up when we're hiring, and we're passing over diverse opportunities.
• 30:14
  Jonathan McCoy: Taking a quick pause from today's episode to thank our sponsor who happens to be one of our favorite companies virtuous. You know, we believe everyone matters. And we've witnessed the greatest philanthropic movements happen when you see and activate donors at every level. And virtuous is the platform to help you do just that. It's so much more than a nonprofit CRM. virtuous helps charities reimagine generosity through responsive fundraising.
• 30:33
  Jonathan McCoy: And we love it because this approach builds trust and loyalty through personalized donor engagement. Sound like virtuous may be a fit for your organization, learn more today@virtuous.org Follow the link in our show notes. I mean, that's just such a powerful thing, because that's a bullet on the resume that you could say, Hey, we don't have any, we don't have anything to worry about. We're accepting of diverse candidates, but you have one bullet that says you need to have raised X dollars, you're automatically missing the point.
• 30:59
  Jonathan McCoy: And this is what we're talking about is the next level of inclusion is looking at those kinds of things.
• 31:09
  Birgit Burton: And then the hiring process, I can tell you all, I've collected the stories, they come to a do, they email, they call, they share their experiences. Listen, I had one two hours ago, two hours ago, we're not talking about 1862 hours ago, I make no stories up, I was talking to a woman, she's exceptional, you know, women of color. And she called me and said, Oh, my goodness, I was interviewed for a position and she's got the search firms coming after her. And she said that the the firm, the CEO, a woman said to her in response to her saying, this job really requires a salary of $25,000 more, I'd like to ask you to consider this, the salary is really low. And I definitely in the person for this job.
• 32:09
  Birgit Burton: $25,000. And the woman agreed, but said to her, I could get a whole bunch of white women who would take this job at this salary as it is. And she was absolutely floored that she said that to her. She obviously said, if, you know, first of all, you know, you're saying this and representing this organization.
• 32:39
  Birgit Burton: And, you know, I don't want to work for that organization, if they have you representing them, and this is the message that you're delivering. Um, so and then when we talk about people coming into the organization, you know, we attract, we recruit hire, but what about retention, the stories of retention, um, you know, we we let you in, now it's your job to, to fit in, it's your job to fit in. And we don't think about those things.
• 33:14
  Birgit Burton: Even as simple as a team of colleagues, going to Duxbury grill after work. You know, I'm down the street, because they've done that all the time. And somebody can't go because you're a single parent, and we have two kids that are coming home from school, they need to be there for you know, and that's such as somebody of color, I'm saying, when we're considering having a, you know, a culture and atmosphere where people fit in, they never get to go down the street to Joe's Bar and Grill and be with the team. How about a lunch gathering? And how about at a place where a person can get a vegan meal? You know, um, how about recognizing and celebrating other celebrations that you might not be familiar with? Why don't you help us understand and bring some food and we can experience and learn, we don't think of those things.
• 34:10
  Birgit Burton: And then the last thing I'll say about that is, have a team, you know, Becky, john Julian beer get, let's come together and be a welcome crew. for, you know, the the people that are coming in, you don't have to fit this one person in that role. Let's have a team. And let's embrace you know, somebody and help them understand the culture and understand the organization. And let's have a part of a stretch project. So they get some visibility doesn't always have to be you, john, you don't always have to be the one that gets picked by the bus as the favorite one and you're happy, you go skip it off and do the job. You can say, you know, thanks, Joe, can I ask B or get to be a part of this team on this project? Because, you know, if she's, I've worked with her on some things, she's really talented when it comes to blah, blah, blah, or this would be a great way to amplify her voice.
• 35:10
  Birgit Burton: Give her an opportunity. We all can play a role in how we elevate and support you know, people. Um, I had an organization and then I'll pause I had an organization asked me to do a survey of your team. I like doing a diversity survey.
• 35:25
  Birgit Burton: What is your How did they feel?
• 35:25
  Birgit Burton: We did the survey and the team was irate. They're like, we don't have diverse leadership.
• 35:33
  Birgit Burton: We blah blah You know, and these were all people of color, these are non people of color. And the head, she didn't want me to share the survey. She's like, nevermind. She's like, nevermind, we won't share the results. I don't feel comfortable with that. So we've got to hold our leadership accountable. And if we come together as a team, then we can go further.
• 35:57
  Becky Endicott: It's not I just sit here and think I don't know what everybody else is getting out of this. But I feel like I am growing. And having this veil lifted. over every time we have one of these conversations. It's like, we are peeking behind the curtain to see what life is really like for people who are not like us. And I love this conversation. I so appreciate how, honestly, you're talking to us. I am very glad you're not sugarcoating anything. Because I want to know exactly what the scenario is and how I can help.
• 36:28
  Becky Endicott: And we've heard a lot of these trends. On the podcast, the one that I'm thinking of, when kushana Palmer came on, she talks about, you know, if you are someone who wants to get more inclusion in your organization, that's wonderful.
• 36:42
  Becky Endicott: Yes, we don't want you to just check the box. But the culture is really an outgrowth of your policies, of procedures, of your working practices of your norms.
• 36:55
  Becky Endicott: And it's like, we all get so busy, we forget about that. And so it's not just to your point, Birgit. It's not just hiring someone. It's about, again, retaining them. It's about creating, how do we create a succession strategy so they can be promoted, so they can grow.
• 37:10
  Becky Endicott: And I'm not just saying people, you know, have have diverse backgrounds, I'm saying any human being and what this is, is a call to arms to me, to be kind to be human. So bear get, please keep taking our blinders off educating us giving us examples of how we can poor and because that is how we change movements.
• 37:33
  Becky Endicott: Okay, the last thing on that is I pivot just a little, because we do want to change the way that that our world is the way that our sector is. And we talked about this a little bit before we started recording, and we have some serious alignment here. Talk about how we prepare the next generation of minority students to become nonprofit professionals, because we believe that they are kind of an untapped potential. Our high school students are college students who are looking for the What am I going to do with my life? How do we pour into them and tell them that this is a space where their gifts are valued?
• 38:13
  Birgit Burton: Yeah. Well, I love that because it didn't happen. For me, I stumbled into it as, as most of my contemporaries did, you know, we all have stories, you know, of what we were going to do, and how we ended up in fundraising.
• 38:29
  Birgit Burton: So now, it's really a respected, you know, field, the Bureau of Labor Statistics predicts that it is one of if not the fastest growing professions between 2018 and 2028, I believe it's growing by like, between 10 to 15%. And we know what that's a result of, I mean, less government funding, you know, organizations are really having to reach out for, you know, private sources of support. And so, and organizations are recognizing they need fundraisers, you know, to to organize their fundraising campaigns. So, it is a true profession. Listen, when I stumbled in, I used to laugh about and say, it was better, you know, to admit to playing a piano in a bar than to admit to being a fundraiser. fundraiser, hold on to your wallet, it was a go. But now, you know, we are in this I don't have the the report to back this up. So I apologize for saying this. But there was a report, I think it was Bank of America. It said that people have high net wealth, depend more on their development, you know, relationship, their fundraising relationship with their organizations that they support, and their alma mater and whatnot, more than their financial investment. You know, I'm wiser, yes. So we have a reason to let these young people know. And every time I talk to someone who knows a little bit about it, fundraising as a profession is always something that they're passionate about, that they get excited about. And I'm like, What better job to have than to have one where you're raising money for something you absolutely care about that when you get up in the morning. You get excited about the work that you're going to do. So one of the things that at IDEO is doing is partnering with the associate of Fundraising Professionals to establish more collegiate chapters, more AFP collegiate chapters focused on, you know, providing information and you know, connecting the students with careers in fundraising. And so there aren't the think there might be one AFP chapter, collegiate chapter at an HBCU.
• 41:03
  Birgit Burton: There was one at Spelman, I actually established that one in 2010, when I was president of the AFP, greater Atlanta chapter, they established a collegiate chapter at Spelman, and it didn't last year, because it didn't have all the support that was needed. So we're going to do that we're going to provide some financial support, we're going to provide leadership for each one of these collegiate chapters that we establish the let the students know about, you know, career opportunities, and you know, what they can, they can do to have a lucrative career as a fundraiser. And then it's also part of what Agios is going to be doing, we're going to have a Leadership Academy, where we will bring you know, students in to learn more about the profession, and we're gonna have a mentoring program, we're already have moved into that it calls every week for people that want mentors, that effect, I was on a panel a little while ago, and somebody asked the question from the audience, how do you find a mentor, if you're at an organization where you don't see many people that look like you, and as like, call me?
• 42:12
  Birgit Burton: Call me, right? Here's my email.
• 42:12
  Birgit Burton: Because, like people all over the country, people of color and, and not people of color, who want to serve as mentors, some of the best mentors I've had in my entire career, we're not, you know, so you don't have to have a mentor, who looks exactly like you, maybe Vice President's been one of the best mentors I've ever had, um, because he's cared about me, and because he, he's also a sponsor connects me, you know, in the, in his network. So um, so, you know, it is our plan to continue these opportunities to bring more young people into the profession, and those that want to transition from the for profit world, people get into the for profit world, and, you know, they're 10 years into their career, and they're not satisfied. They might be making huge salaries, but they think, you know, what, I really, really, really would like to be involved in organization that mentors, young people, are I have a passion for animals, or the environment, really, you know, it's me going. So um, you know, so it's, it's just getting the information out there, and sharing it, asking people to reach out and share information on I know that some cities do philanthropy in the classroom, or they actually go in to classrooms with the young kids, and even help them understand the word philanthropy, right?
• 43:48
  Jonathan McCoy: Well, if there's something that I just hear is just a thread, and it's something that we seen on so many conversations is that if you feel that bubbling inside you to do something, don't just sit with that, like do something. And beer is raising her hand, call me, email me, which I don't
• 44:05
  Becky Endicott: know how she didn't have any time. She's got like, 10 jobs. And she's a grandma, it's like, you gotta
• 44:13
  Jonathan McCoy: start a chapter lean in with your skills and expertise. If you're not passionate about your job, plug in the nonprofit world would love to have you and we need people of all different backgrounds. We do. So much is already you know, happened over the 20 plus years that you have organized? What are your dreams?
• 44:27
  Jonathan McCoy: What's your vision for this space? What would you love to see accomplished from this network? Because we've gotten to meet several members and everybody involved is just dynamic and just has such a vision in their heart. Where do you want to see this go?
• 44:43
  Birgit Burton: Oh, my goodness, I just wanted to see it just go off the charts. Because, you know, we've really blown up a lot in the last year, and there's so many that have said, Oh my goodness, it's best kept secret I didn't ever knit you know, I never knew that aago existed. Um, however, I have people every week, that's that reach out to me and tell me how ADL impacted their lives in some kind of way. In that I mean, you know, from saying, Oh, I attended a conference that you had in 2006. And I met this person or I had this opportunity or I learned something in a session that really helped me, you know, in my career and stay in my career. So, I just want to be that support. I want us you know, in our newsletter in Ah do newsletter. It's all about the membership, telling their story, sharing wisdom. You know, we've done, what books are you reading, and all those kinds of things. So it's not, it's, it's about membership, and people will find someone, a young woman feeling very isolated, but connected in through a video.
• 45:59
  Birgit Burton: And she just emailed me this morning, and said, because of some connections that a deal made for her, she got into afps new mentoring program, she got a scholarship to our international conference. And she's met some black Canadian fundraisers, a group of black Canadian fundraisers, and so she feels, you know, connected in, that's what it's about, you know what I mean? And I have those allies that reach out and say, What can we do? You know, we have money to give, but we also want to have some kind of impact. So what is it help us, you know, we would like to find a way to support the network, and, you know, well, you could help us, you know, have a discussion, you can help us mentoring program, you can post an intern, we're gonna get our intern, ship program up and running, you can host an intern at your organization, so somebody can get paid, and learn, you know, hands on, about fundraising, and to grow this pipeline. So that, you know, when I'm talking to you all in a year from now, I can tell you, we met our goal, and exceeded our goal. You know, we have 175 new professionals, you know, that are around the country, working in the profession. That's my dream. And then, then I'm going to back off, and I'm going to let everybody keep, you know, keep it going. And my house is in Michigan, I inherited my grandmother's house, my parents house, and a house that I bought. Next one, my parents retired with Michigan, and it's two miles in from Lake Michigan.
• 47:43
  Birgit Burton: It's about eight miles south and South Haven, Michigan, which is a gorgeous resort town. And I'm gonna renovate all three properties, and you know, spend the rest of my time there, you deserve it.
• 47:59
  Becky Endicott: I was gonna say she deserves to be on an island somewhere with a cold drink in her hand, and you can just hang it up and let let the new generation take it over.
• 48:09
  Birgit Burton: I got some work to do before that, because I'm chair like the VFP. And then I gotta be chair for two years. I got six years.
• 48:19
  Jonathan McCoy: You're given this morning.
• 48:20
  Becky Endicott: Yeah, I love hearing from founders like their dreamy dreams. And I just think that's so great to keep that at the forefront because we have to keep knowing what we're fighting for, and what we're working for.
• 48:29
  Becky Endicott: And I also really appreciate that you gave a plug for the paid non, the paid internship people if you're not paying your interns pay your interns. That is a worker who's coming in to help your organization. Yes, let's get to sleep, the unpaid internships anywhere in the world. Okay, we need to talk about one good thing. And I am dying to hear about your one good thing. But before you answer, I would like to know B or get what your favorite musical is. And this is, this is a selfish question. Because I love musicals.
• 49:02
  Birgit Burton: I actually was in a production of Guys and Dolls.
• 49:07
  Birgit Burton: I paid played Sarah Brown. I love Westside story. I love it.
• 49:13
  Birgit Burton: I love it. I love it. I love it.
• 49:13
  Birgit Burton: Um, so here's, here's my thing.
• 49:18
  Birgit Burton: I always say and this has been, you know, my thing that she who has knowledge has power. And so through my career, the times when I have been left out of a meeting, for whatever reason, and I've told the story, I told the story in leading women at Tech, which is a program that they establish I was in the first cohort where they're, you know, raising up women in leadership at Georgia Tech. But I had an experience where I was absolutely excluded from a meeting. And there were five men who are at this meeting, and I should have been in and found out about it. But I'll tell you very quickly, the donor represented a very, very, very, very big gift. And they scheduled this meeting with her that nobody made arrangements for her parking. Like isn't that with us fundraisers do take care of our donors, you know, all those things. Nobody made arrangements and where she was going to be parking. She'd still this was seven years ago. She'd still be running around that building. It was too confusing.
• 50:28
  Birgit Burton: And I reached out to her met her at her car. And let me tell you what she told me the intelligence that she gave me from the car to that meeting was huge. It was $10 million. Huge.
• 50:44
  Birgit Burton: And so when I showed up at the meeting and deliver her, there were five guys that almost passed out when they saw me like, how did you know that at this point? You know, I didn't stay. I didn't disrupt it, I delivered her. But I wrote a report the next day. And I said, By the way, I learned that they were willing to consider $10 million more than what was going to be asked in the meeting. And if it wasn't asked in the meeting, they weren't gonna she wasn't going to offer it. And they the one of the senior people in that meeting, when he read the report was floored and wonder, how did I know that? And because it's my job to know. And so I was never left out of another meeting to get not because it pounded my fist, not because I said, This is my title. And I should have been not because I managed that donor relationship. All those were the reasons why. But because I had knowledge, and I demonstrated my value. And they invited me and made sure I was there all the time. Because I clearly demonstrated that I had a right to be there. He was knowledge has power, you have power, from what you know what you contribute. And I preach that to particularly to women all the time, know your value. And don't apologize for it.
• 52:08
  Jonathan McCoy: Goodness, thank you. This whole conversation has just given us moment to pause.
• 52:11
  Jonathan McCoy: And you already encouraged us to pause. So I just think that's another theme to is when we're playing this back, pause and process this y'all don't miss the truth that we've gotten to get to sit through and get to really learn from today. So thank you beer get so much for being vulnerable with us and just sharing so much goodness that we can bring into our sector we we are ridiculous idealists. So we believe that things can and will get better.
• 52:36
  Jonathan McCoy: And we all got to pull together.
• 52:36
  Jonathan McCoy: So I find the hope in that, and just so much appreciate you being here. How can people connect with you, you clearly have got all the things going on? What's the best way for people for listeners to connect with you and a do and everything else?
• 52:53
  Birgit Burton: So you can send an email to ag officers@aol.com a DVOFFIC rs@aol.com. And you can also send a message to me directly at Barrett burton@aol.com. Don't laugh at me, my son is like mom, AOL, when are you gonna let that go?
• 53:16
  Birgit Burton: I appreciate you all so much.
• 53:16
  Birgit Burton: This has been one of the best experiences I've had, in sharing my my story and my journey, you all are so warm and inviting, and caring, I feel that you genuinely care and want to know, this wasn't just you know, for the sake of looking, you know, looking good.
• 53:39
  Becky Endicott: We've got to do something differently than checking the box. And thank you for saying that. And I and I would just say like as the final takeaway to anyone listening today, I hope that this conversation enlightened you in some way. And I want everybody to take something away from it that is actionable. So if you are someone, and you've already made this, this decision, or you're moving forward with adding more people of color into your organization, that's a good first step. But I'm asking you, what is the next step? plan your next step? How can you pour into this? How are you looking at your website? And at the visuals? Do the people in your website represent the people you are serving? Look at your board, look at your people of color you're bringing on what succession plan are you bringing in? And if you don't even do any of that, simply speak up when you see injustice in the world.
• 54:34
  Becky Endicott: And that is where the power of community and empathy begin. We can all pour into this and I am here for it. Thank you, Birgit.
• 54:42
  Birgit Burton: Thank you.
• 54:44
  Becky Endicott: Thanks for listening to today's conversation. We hope you feel enlightened by this honest raw conversation with beer good about what we can do to create more inclusive cultures. It's going to take all our brave, empathetic voices to get there.
• 54:53
  Becky Endicott: You could probably hear it in our voices, but we love connecting with the most innovative people to help you achieve more for your mission.
• 55:00
  Becky Endicott: So come on over and join the good community. It's free, and it's an after party for every episode. Sign up today. We're for good. COMM backslash Hello.
• 55:06
  Becky Endicott: One more thing. If you love what you heard today, would you mind leaving us a podcast rating and review it helps more friends find our good community. Our production hero is Bill Gates number one fan Julie komfort Hello. Our theme song is sunray by Rumi bores him