Latest / Financial Planner Life Podcast / Restricted or IFA? What is best for my Financial Planning Career - with Wayne Griffiths from One Financial Solutions.

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Restricted or IFA? What is best for my Financial Planning Career - with Wayne Griffiths from One Financial Solutions. · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I'm still at the coalface, I'm in the trenches, still being an advisor.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I'm not a CEO.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: I know what I'm good at.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: I know I'm good at talking to clients and I'm good at helping advisors build their business the intricacies of running a business.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: There are better people than me to do that.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: I think it was looking at Jamie Vardy.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: He still thinks he can go and do what he can do when he's 21 years old and I think of myself as an advisor going.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Do I want to carry on being an advisor for the next 10, 15 years?
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: I'm now falling into that male, pale and stale you know, I am now that thing that I always looked at and went oh my God.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: What's going on in your mind at that point, then?
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: Is it when you say like you feel yourself going that way?
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: Let's kind of like our listeners might be going that way as well and feeling that way.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: So what does it feel like to you?
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: What is tried and tested in your career that's never changed and always gets you moving forward towards winning business, even when you feel like you don't want to do it.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: I want to tell everyone about the mistakes I've made Probably the worst PR exercise of all time.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: But I don't want to be that person that says, oh, you want to be like me because look how wonderful I am.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: That's not the way to teach.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: I want to teach people how not to make mistakes or learn from my mistakes.
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: I believe in the advisor enough to put my money into their businesses underneath us, and that helps them grow their business.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: You know I'm on the line for that.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: You know, and that's what I want to do for them.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: I want to see them grow.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: I want them to, you know, to be brilliant at what they're good at.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: So, wayne, thank you so much for joining me.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: Finally, on the financial planner life podcast, I've been asking and knocking on your door so many times.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: You just turned me down.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Every time you said to me come back to me, sam, when you got a top 10 podcast.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: And here I am it's been a long time.
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: I remember standing in my living room talking to you about it and it's just yeah, it's been.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: I've been looking forward to it so, so much and you know I'm I feel like a bit of a proud dad moment.
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: I've looked at you for years and just gone.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: How you're doing, it's just amazing.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: What you do is fantastic and and you know, it's just amazing, really good um you know you've always been a really big advocate and you've always been somebody that I phoned up and spoken to and looked up to myself.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: Um, even back in the days when I spoke to you when I was doing the articles remember that for two plan and I had that kind of partnership and we did a conversation back then.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: You've been running a business now for how long?
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: so 12 years, we're 13 years in in January 13 years for one financial solutions.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a business I've always admired, one of the best businesses at two plan yeah, it's um, uh, and I have to give two plan credit.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: You know, without them we wouldn't have grown the business.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: Um, yeah, they've supported us all the way through the journey.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: You know, it started out of a flat, um, me and my, uh, my business partner, the operations director.
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: You know, we started it and and we had our first born, as in uh, a guy called paul keely.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: We name all our advisors like children, so they're our firstborn, secondborn, and we used to sit in this flat and we used to go right when we're really good at this, this is what we're going to do, we're going to have an office, and when we do all of this, and that's how the business has grown.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: You know, when I interview someone new, I'll always say to them never fear saying the words.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: When I was here, we used to do it this way, because the way we build the best business is by nicking everyone else's ideas.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: So if a power planner comes in and says I used to work at so-and-so and they used to use this software and it's really really good, you're not going to get me saying, oh, I'll take that idea and I'm going to go and work it out.
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: You'll get me go back to you say, right off, you go's brilliant, I love that idea, fantastic.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: Thanks for doing that.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: Don't fear saying you know, when I was here, we'd do it this way.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: I wanted to adopt that.
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: But I'm empowering you now to go and actually do that as a project and bring it to me.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: And so I think we've grown by taking on people, using their ideas, empowering them to come to us with ideas.
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: You know we're 26 people now.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: We should hopefully be at 40 by the end of march next year.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: Um, we have had some bumps along the way.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: Uh, mostly driven by me thinking I could do everything.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: Um, and then last year we took a massive leap and built a leadership team, and that leadership team now run the business.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm still at the coalface.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: I'm in the trenches, still being an advisor.
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: You, know I'm not a ceo.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: I'm uh, I know what I'm good at.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: I know I'm good at talking to clients and I'm good at helping advisors build their business.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: Um, the intricacies of running a business there are better people than me to do that, oh same.
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you said that we're not all born.
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: So I had a recruitment business right and and I'm not I'm not a cfo, I'm not somebody that gets excited about processes.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: In fact, like I really love the idea of them, I really do right and I can visualize them and I can see them and I can articulate what it is that I want.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: But if you put me in front of it to do it, I even try to engage with somebody to do it.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: I find it really hard, really stressful.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: I need that person who's working alongside me.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: You can take my idea and then run with it.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: Is that you then?
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: Is it You're in that space?
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I also have to be very cautious of my emotional rollercoaster, as, in decision-makings, when you've got highs and lows is maybe not the best you know best time.
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: So, um, I, I like, I like being the center point of everyone coming to me with ideas.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, and I and I like to know what's going on.
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, that's a bit of a problem for me.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: It's not a control freak, it's I like to know what's going on.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Um, but yeah, I like, I like other people to go and do what they're good at, and that don't like using the word empowered, but seeing them excited by what they're good at, yeah, it's brilliant.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: Seeing other people just doing what they excel at is so so good because you're growth minded right.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah you 100.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: You enjoy that.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: You're a hunter, you're a man, you want to go out there and win.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there are lots of things that are going on in my mind at the moment.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm a massive football fan, you know, and I look at footballers as they're coming towards the end of their careers and go.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: What's their next fix?
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: What's their next?
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: That's going to inspire them.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: And I think it was looking at Jamie Vardy, you know, it's like he still thinks he can go and do what he could do when he's 21 years old.
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: And I think myself, as an advisor going.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: Do I want to carry on being an advisor for the next 10-15 years?
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: I'm now falling into that male, pale and stale you know, I am now that thing that I always looked at and went oh my god, you know everyone's this type of and I'm getting inspired as much teaching other people to advise as I am seeing clients.
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: So I still love being an advisor, but I can feel that change in me that I've got however long I've got left to enjoy being an advisor.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: But I'm getting more and more each year year inspiring people running their businesses underneath us and seeing them change and how well they do well let's just bring that into the light, then, because there's probably people there is.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: You know, the average age of an advisor is like 56, 57 years old, so there's plenty of people that are approaching that next phase of their career and you know it is the, it is the phasing out and going on to the next chapter in life, you know, which is towards retirement, right?
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: Um, what's going on in your mind at that point, then?
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: Is it when you say, like you feel yourself going that way?
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: Let's kind of like our listeners might be going that way as well.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: I'm feeling that way, so what does it feel like to you?
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: Um, it feels so there's nothing wrong.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: I'm 53, right, there's nothing wrong with being a 65 year old financial advisor and doing a 45 years, if that's what they're still passionate about and what still drives them and they're still really good at it.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Um, so I'm not sort of jumping on the bandwagon to go.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: Oh my God, we should like only have recruit 18 year olds into the bridge, the business to bring average age down.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: But I think for me as an individual, there is I've made thousands of mistakes in my career, okay, and some of those have been really, really costly.
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: And when I see, when I see youngsters coming into the business now, I sound like an old granddad youngsters, you know, 25 year olds when I see them come into the business.
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: They're all going through that same process and have the same ideas that I had 30 years ago and I want to go to them, them no, stop, don't do that.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: Because I did that and it cost me thousands or six months of my time.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: So when I help other people, the feeling for me at the moment is I want to tell everyone about the mistakes I've made Probably the worst PR exercise of all time.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: But I don't want to be that person that says, oh, you want to be like me because look how wonderful I am.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: That's not the way to teach.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: I want to teach people how not to make the mistakes or learn from my mistakes, and I get that from.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: I go and see like four clients in a day and I get the uh, I get the drive from.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: I still love seeing the client.
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: I just hate the paperwork that comes afterwards.
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah right, I hate the paperwork, I hate the follow-up.
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: We have to do it.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: But the the nice thing is sitting with a client talking to them.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: You know I've said this hundreds of times over the years.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: I think I've had tens of thousands of experiences in my life.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: 99 of them are actually through the eyes of my clients, the stories they tell me.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: There's experiences, they've had all their memories and I might go and repeat that to another client or I might repeat it to another advisor.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: I still get inspired by that.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: But it's the coming back to the office and then I get a phone call from another advisor saying oh, do you remember that case we discussed?
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: The client went ahead.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: And I can hear in their voice that they're even surprised themselves that the client actually believed them, went ahead.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: And I'm like which one feels and they're both feel equal at the moment.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: Go back 10 years ago, the client.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: One would have felt much, much better than helping the advisor one oh, right, okay so it's definitely drifting that way to you know, uh, I feel like I just I feel great when other people do really really well.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: But this is it, it's not.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: It's not black and white.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: Right, there is a transition.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: So you're transitioning away from being 100% geared towards the client hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt, which makes sense when you're in a stage of your life where money is massively important because you want to build a home family, all that kind of stuff so it's hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: You want to build a home family, all that kind of stuff so it's hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt, hunt.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: And all of a sudden you kind of flip it slightly and then that joy is coming from seeing those people that are on that journey and passing on the experience that you've had so they hopefully don't make mistakes and get to the stage quicker, which to me shows leadership, mentorship and coaching through experience.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: And I think you know, when you look at the younger generation that are coming through, the bit that they do lack is the experience of being client facing.
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: That's that's the bit that they lack and each and every time I speak to them, that's the bit they want to know how to do.
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so being able to have a business like yours, where people can come through at different stages and be able to lean into someone like you who is actually as excited about passing on the experience of how to win a client over and deliver great service as much as going out and doing it themselves, it's almost a perfect recipe for somebody in that stage of their career to actually tap into and plug into to help progress them.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Is that what you're finding?
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: yeah, definitely I'm not.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to give up advising because, I think from my point of view, you know when I'm trying to talk to other people about you know how they're becoming an advisor, becoming a better advisor.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: I have to stay relevant, yeah, so still having you know business clients and and and uh, personal clients is really important that I still do that.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: But I think one of the things that we need to get around is misconceptions.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: One of the misconceptions I think we have is that younger advisors won't get on with certain clients because they haven't got any life experience, and that's not correct.
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: They don't have the life experience that we're telling them that they don't have.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: They've got other life experiences.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: I've got an amazing lad called Jasper.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: He's at university.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: Right, we're coaching him to become an advisor.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: Stunningly good footballer, got released from Leicester as a youngster and, at 21 years old, you know, sat down with one of my clients who is going to.
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: In their mind they're probably sitting there going.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: What does this lad know about inflation, getting married, having kids, getting divorced, buying a house?
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: Knows nothing.
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: The dad's a massive Leicester fan.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: The mum's got a daughter who's going through university having a bit of a tough time.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: Jasper had some good times and some bad times at university and I might as well have just left the room.
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because they were connecting and everything was was fine.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: I can teach jasper and we can teach jasper how to be an advisor and all the technical stuff, but you've got to have it in you to want to talk to someone and and ask them about their lives and learn from them, but actually be really interested in them, not their money, not their paperwork, just interested in them.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: And I sat there in that room and just went.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: It's a myth that everyone's going to go, oh, 21 years old, going to know nothing, or how were they going to manage my money?
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: Where do we start otherwise?
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I love the idea like be a journalist, right?
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: Journalists are inquisitive.
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: They want to know, they want to understand, they want to you know, they want somebody to provide them with an answer.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that is going to be interesting enough for them to also ask a follow-up question.
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: I think that's the way to do it.
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: It's like you got this.
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: Who is?
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: Use them, listen to what someone's actually saying and really, really evolve as you're listening to what might come and shut your mouth and don't interrupt people.
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: Let them go through them.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: Go through it, because just that extra five to ten seconds of them talking could give you such key information and you're like I know exactly where this person's at right now and it triggers something in you and then you can ask an emotive question that will lead them on even further.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: And and that's the skill, isn't it?
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Early doors.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: It's don't try to prove yourself.
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: Don't say like, oh, I do this, I do that and I know this about the markets and I know and understand this.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: I've got this many qualifications and I can teach you everything you need to know about investing.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: It's not to give a shit.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: They and asks them about maybe some of the fears or worries or troubles that emotional intelligence is probably the most important thing, regardless of whether you're a financial planner right, it's the most important thing in an early stage of a career.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: How can I emotionally connect with this person in a way that makes them like me?
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: But we're not focusing enough on that.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: You know you deal with a couple of them.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: There are some amazing academies out there and the academies are brilliant at getting you through your exams and teaching you technical knowledge.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: I'm not so sure they're great on the other stuff.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Now that's where I think your AR principals or the leader of the business should really come in with their skill set, and there's nothing wrong to say that certain people get on with certain people.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: You know I've got another lovely, you know girl in my office, alice, who Alice has.
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: You know she's been sort of taught that.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: You know, when you work in the industry it's selling and I sit there and I go.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: Alice, you're brilliant at going around and seeing people with me.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: You know having a cup of tea, two.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: So, alice, you're brilliant at going around and seeing people with me.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: You know having a cup of tea, too many slices of cake, but you come away from that meeting.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: They've told you all about their nieces and nephews and their money.
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: They've told you about the next door neighbour, because they're not fearful of you.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: They really enjoy your company and they want to open up and talk to you about things, and I think that the best advisors can talk to the fund manager and can talk to the fund manager's grandparent.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: You know, and will be different with different people.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: They're the best that you know, that old, being able to sell a pen four different ways.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: But you must do it.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: Naturally it must be in you to want to be that person that deals with all the different clients.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: Nothing wrong with just only dealing with fund managers and being an ultra high net worth advisor.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: Nothing wrong with that.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: But there's a, there's a place for people who just want to be, using the old words, hunters and farmers.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: They just want to look after a book of clients that are lovely clients and just know everything about them.
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: We just our industry at the moment seems to be just know everything about them.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: We just our industry at the moment seems to be infighting about exams, infighting about restricted and ifa, infighting about who's better than everyone else.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: Do you see?
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: Do you see solicitors doing that?
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: Do you see accountants doing that?
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: no, not at all.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: I want to get into that in a minute, in a minute with you.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: But there is something you that we're talking about here which I think is really important.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: Um, I love the way that you you have a boutique practice, that you're growing right, and actually I think your practice is going to grow even faster when you start to make that transition, if you like, from being 100 all in on on the clients into being a bit 50 50 and then moving then into the ecosystem of educating the advisors, and I think that because, from a contrary perspective, you've got so many years of experience, wayne, and I know how personable you are and how much you care about your clients, and I think what I also know about you is that you love talking about that.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: So when you talk to your clients and an advisor might observe you and you ask those open questions, I bet you're the type of person that goes back and talks about the experience, what you asked, and then questioned the advisor as to what perhaps they might have learned and what else they could learn after the conversation.
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: What could have been done differently?
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: What might you have asked them?
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: Here's some opportunities, here's some more things, and you start to go a bit deeper on it.
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: Is that something that you you like to create?
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: is that 100 new advisors, we offer them the opportunity to come out in appointments with me and I'll go out in appointments with them.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, and, and that's not how I was originally trained, where a sales manager would sit behind the client's back with a clipboard saying did they give out a business card?
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: In terms of business letter, it's I sit there with a client, I sit there with a, an advisor and say what was really phrases that I used that you liked, that you'd like to use yourself.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: But, more importantly, was there anything that I said?
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: And you went.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: I looked at the client's eyes and they might not have liked that.
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: I said, because I'm still learning, yeah, you know.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: So what went well, what didn't go well, tell me about it and be be honest.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: And and because I you know, if there's other ways I can do things that I'm going to be even better, then then then talk to me about it.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: I think COVID's been and I'm massive about this.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: Covid's been difficult for a lot of advisors coming into the industry.
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: You know I was very fortunate that I learned in a bank and you'd sit in amongst loads of other advisors who were listening to everything that was going on all the time.
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: We're very quick to rush to everyone working from home and having teams meetings, and it takes longer to learn experiences when you're not sitting there amongst amazing power planners, amazing advisors who come back in and talk about a customer they've just seen you mentioned it there.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: You have to talk about these things because you're going to come across something new and you go.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: I don't understand this one.
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: You know what do I do about it?
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: You know people are there are going to be people who are far better at trust work than me, people that might be better offshore than me.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: We have our areas that we're really strong in and areas that we're maybe not so strong in, but we have to then get round this.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: We all have this fear of that every advisor should walk into the room as an encyclopedia.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: You know, we've got this.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: Everyone seems to think an advisor should know absolutely everything about everything in front of a client.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: Do solicitors know that or do they go?
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: Do you know what I'll?
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: I'll do some research and that I'll come back to you.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: There seems to be this fear that we can't do that, and there's nothing wrong with going to see someone talking about it amongst other people.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: You might get 10 different ideas, but coming back and talking to people as a group of people going, I'd look at it this way, look at it that way, yeah, well, that's the emotional connection to money again, isn't it?
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: and the insecurity and feeling like the imposter syndrome element and that's even more rife in younger people anyway coming through.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: So the next generation are coming through.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: It's not just that, it's like I'm 43 years old, mate.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: I still get that, you know, I still have that kind of feeling, and the only way that I can work through it and and and um uh, elevate my, my level of understanding is by by by coming into a situation where I can talk and ask questions and break it down and look at it from a different example, and I am a bit of a nightmare with people because I will dissimilate something.
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: I'll keep going and keep going and keep going, because it's just that's how my brain works, man.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: I like to know the depths and the levels of what I'm actually understanding, what I'm learning, and it's it's not from an emotionally manipulative perspective, like I walk into a room and dominate the conversation, it's just from a place of understanding, because it allows me to shut up again and it allows me to kind of understand and ask the right question again.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: That I know is going to lead somebody down to a place where they're going to go.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Holy shit, now I'm working it out.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: You know, sam sat in front of me and he's spoken for five minutes, which is very much a rarity.
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: Um, but, I and, but, but I understand, and that's the bit that I love is getting somebody in front of me to work it out without having to hammer them with the reasons why I think they should work it out, without having to hammer them with the reasons why I think they should work it out.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: I think the other thing, we we're again we're it's not just will be me.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: Everyone else out there might be, you know, not thinking this way, but I I now make a conscious effort to ask people before a meeting starts, as in you know, how best do they learn?
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: You know, so do they?
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm very pictorial, so I like making scruffy notes during a meeting and I find a lot of my clients of an age group will sit and look at those notes and because they can visualize those notes, that helps them to remember things.
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: Um, and so I'll say to a client you know, is that you know?
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: Do you prefer I write notes while I'm sitting with you and you can read those notes with you?
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: Prefer that I follow up with a detailed document, like, if you're going to use an AI note taker, send those to you?
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: Um, you know, or do you want to make your own notes?
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Um, we all learn differently and we remember differently and we're not rushing into vulnerable client territory here we're talking about.
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: People learn a certain way and it's important that they understand things.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: It's important that, fundamentally, clients should clients should come to an advisor because they either make their life easy or they come to an advisor because they can help them understand things in the way that they can understand them.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, our industry is forcing clients to come to us because they're they feel they have to have an advisor, because we use terms all the time and we're we're developing even more terminology that makes it even more confusing, because people are worried that the clients are going to go direct to consumer, direct to a sorry, direct to a platform and direct to and there's fear about that.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, actually, most clients won't do that.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: They like you and they like reading things and then go.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Can you explain that to me?
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: And one of the best things that will ever happen is if you get a client ring you up and say I know you think I'm going to be an idiot or I know you think this is going to be silly.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: If they're opening up enough to say to you you're going to think I'm a bit silly asking this question, then that person trusts you and the FCA has that term trusted advisor.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: That's key to what we do.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: Client rings up, they're in a position where they want to trust you and they believe in your experience and believe in you and they want your opinion on something and that might be about buying a car.
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: That's very true.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, 100%.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: Let's get back to what you said earlier ifa versus restrictors, this, this infighting that often happens, that we've seen on, you know, linkedin and money marketing.
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: I think you know there was a big phase of that and especially when, like your likes of sjp are in the news etc.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: People just jump on the bandwagon, want to bash everybody who isn't what they think the perfect financial advisor, and it causes, I think, negativity, an echo chamber of confusion.
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: So if I'm on the outside looking in and we so desperately need new people to join us and get ahead in the financial planning profession, then there's this weird kind of infighting going on.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: Not only does that look shit for clients, but it's not good for attracting talent right.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you've only invited me on because you know I won't sit on the fence.
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: Basically, the comments are going to be really bad.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: So you've heard me say this a few times I'm only the IFA that I am because I had 17 years restricted Okay.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: So I started off working for a direct sales force company in 93, ally Dunbar Went to 95, joined Midland Bank in 95, which became HSBC.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: I had 17 amazing years there and I've got some amazing friends.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: I had some amazing bosses there.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: What that enabled me to do?
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: To only have like one product suite.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: It enabled me to go out and talk to clients for 90 of the meeting about them.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: It's honed me into being the person I am inquisitive, nosy.
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: You talk to the clients because when I came back, I didn't have to do six hours worth of research, um, and that that made me who I am, um the only time.
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: And so there's nothing wrong with restriction, nothing wrong with restricted advice versus you know a whole of market advice or ifa, um.
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: There are just as many great restricted devices that I know as there are terrible ifas, um.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: So, but the truth is, restriction doesn't work if the product isn't very good, okay.
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: So if you work for a company that is giving restricted advice and that product is as good as other products in the marketplace, I will stand there with you and say there's nothing wrong with restricted advice.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: Okay, if the product isn't good, then you need to have a look at what you're doing, because you know you are now advising on something that would you advise on that to your friends, your family, your parents, your grandparents?
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: If you wouldn't, that's not, that's not correct.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: But yeah, that whole restricted versus ifa you know, when you see an ifa pick on an sjp person, an sjp person fight back and then it gets bigger and bigger and bigger.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: It makes us look dickheads Excuse my French, it does.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: It just makes us all look stupid.
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: And it is not just from a reputational point of view across the industry, it's a human point of view.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: When you're saying Nothing wrong, I'm very proud to be an IFA, okay, and I will.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: You'll see me talk about being proud to be an IFA.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: You won't see me go.
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: I'm proud to be an IFA because restricted advisors are rubbish.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can be proud of what you do without belittling what other people's do, and that's what we're doing.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it looks so emotionally insecure as well, I think.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: And it makes it looks so emotionally insecure as well, I think.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: And it just makes me look at that person and go, you're insecure because you're attacking people.
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know from what perspective.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: And I know restricted propositions, whole of market, restricted right.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's so many energy and effort that goes into actually selecting those product ranges and the research that goes into it is probably more than what most high phase are doing.
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you, know, it's insane the amount of energy, the effort goes in the investment committees they have and what is actually done.
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: You know it's a bit old school now to kind of shit on it, really isn't it?
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: Oh?
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: it is, it completely is.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: And I think we're in a position now where you know, before I was an IFA, you know, and there's still IFAs out there that do it and they do it very, very well.
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: But you know I look at it and go, can you really be a one-man band IFA and saying that you're running your own investment committee?
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: You know now you can.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: If you're outsourcing that to a fund house square mile, rsmr, you know, research house that can do all your work for you.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: So but can you do that and then also actually go and see 15 clients a week or 12 clients a week?
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: You know it's very, very tough.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: You know I look at it and I go, I give advice.
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: I'm not an investment house, I'm not an investment research analyst.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: You know it's not what I do.
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: You know we use Fundhouse who are just unbelievable and you know they give us the information, they give us the insights into stuff that I talk about to our clients and I'm sure the openworks, sjps, your quilters, you know, foster novo, all the companies out there that are doing all that work for their advisors they probably don't get the um, the praise that they probably should get for all that work they do for their advisors?
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: yeah, I probably haven't named the right people but hey, I think we get it.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, 100, I think what you're saying is absolutely spot on.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: Let's move across into um, financial planning, okay, and the services and the solutions that are being offered to clients.
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: And when I was working for aviva, which was 20 years ago, I was a trainer and it was always protection first, then it was pensions and then it was investments, and I think often you find with financial planners these days, there's such a heavier focus on investment and that protection doesn't seem to get as much airtime.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: You have featured on the podcast that I produce for Legal in General.
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: Nice little plug there.
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: If anybody else is looking for a podcast, give us a shout.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: But yeah, so I produce a podcast.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: It's all about protection and the value that protection has, and I've had some great guests on here, like Guy Skinner, who is such a huge advocate of protection.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: Where does protection sit within the advice process for you, and is it an area where it gets overlooked and could be a great place for people to start to kickstart their career?
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: It's massively overlooked.
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: If you can get the opportunity to start being in front of clients, that's what we need to do Get client experience Now.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: If that means the quickest way for you is to go to an academy and then you get your first couple of exams, which means you can be a protection advisor, then a protection and mortgage advisor, then, then that's a great way to start learning in front of clients.
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: The the problem I see and I'm probably it's happened to me is that we then move on, instead of saying we've built up a protection business, let's add to it with pensions and let's add to it with investments.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: We sort of build up a protection business and then go oh, we're going to move on to this new shiny toy, you know which is a pension, and people maybe stop talking about it.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: What we do for our clients is being there at a time of need, and that time of need is kids going to university, buying a home, you know, retiring.
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: But when's the most critical time of need?
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: When a loved one dies or something like that, you know, a critical illness, and that's that trusted advisor.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: If we walk away from that, we're not really financially planning the clients anymore.
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: There will be people who don't have a protection need.
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: But if we haven't covered that protection need, we're not really the financial advisor they thought we were, because we're not looking after them so how would does somebody start a conversation that can often feel uncomfortable, perhaps talking about the perception, you know, idea, of death and perhaps someone getting critically ill?
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: How do you approach conversations?
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: What approach do you have to being able to bring to light what potentially could happen which would be quite nasty for a family right?
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: How do you approach it?
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: Do you have examples of clients you've worked with, situations that you've been in 100%?
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: All the people that have been on the Legal in General podcast.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: They talked about how they've helped people, most of them talking about how they do claims, claims, and when you see people who have benefited from a claim and what you've actually done for them or what the life insurance has paid out, it's life-changing and you want to tell other people about it.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: So it's not selling the policy because it's paying you commission.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: It is actually recommending what they need and if a client then goes I don't want it, hey, that's fine.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: You know you've done your job.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: You sleep at night saying they came to me for advice, I gave advice.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: But talking about your personal experiences and that might be your experiences that you've heard from another advisor in the office that you know that's now become a personal experience to you.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: But that's a good, a good door opener as such.
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: I think also we overlook the.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: The most simplest and the most simplest is you sit with a client, the client brings out all their documents and they've got some life insurance.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: Have they actually put that in trust?
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: Very, very simple, very powerful.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: You know the advisor might have done an amazing job, done the life insurance and done the, done the trust.
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: They might have done the life insurance and then not got back to do the trust.
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: Just looking at what they've got and is it set up correctly doesn't necessarily mean you're going to earn any money, but you're earning that person's trust and you're there as their trusted advisor.
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: They want your help and support, and your help and support might just be completing a piece of paper that means there's no inheritance tax on the payout.
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: Being open and honest and say I'm here to help, that's what you do as an advisor.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, perfect, yeah, definitely.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: When I speak to financial planners who totally value the life cover, critical illness or income replacement plans.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: They all talk about stories.
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: It's the stories of what could happen or what did happen to somebody that I know, and the claims process, and then it becomes a peace of mind conversation, doesn't it?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: It's like, do you could happen, or what did happen to somebody that I know, and the claims process, and then it becomes a peace of mind conversation, doesn't it?
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: It's like, do you want that peace of mind?
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: Can you put your head on the pillow at night and know that if you were to, I don't know more than likely get a critical illness right as opposed to die right?
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, what actually would you do in that situation?
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: Because most of us kind of sit there and we worry a little bit about that.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: But actually when you've got a piece of paper, it's in, you know, in your vault, and it's, uh, saying that you know your wife and your daughter is going to be looked after if you died.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: You're kind of like, well, even in death, I guess they're sorted.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: So it's kind of like a nice comforting feeling, although it doesn't have to be dark, does it?
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: Like you know, protection is an idea of peace of mind it is.
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: Uh, it definitely is.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, I I think on the, the uh, the podcast, you know, I gave the statistics which was at that point I'd had 17 critical illness claims and only one death claim right but the death claim was my closest friend, so you know, for me I'm, I tell people about that and I tell them how it affected their family, what that meant to me to be able to, you know, to make sure they're okay.
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: But it also reassured me that when I'm recommending Life Cover, sometimes you need the reassurance you're not doing it because it, you know, is paying you an income.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: You are actually doing it because you see the end result.
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: Um, and we'd all love to go through life and no one passed away, no one has critical illness and everyone you tell them to retire at 55 years old.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: Shit doesn't happen like that.
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: Um, you know, it's just yeah, and it's raw and it's like you just have to explain to people.
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: But you can't, you can't go through life going, uh, protection, most important.
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: You'll come across some customers and you'll go.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: You really need this and you can sit there and go.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: In a harsh world they're struggling to put food on the table and roof over their head you know your job is not to sit there and go.
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: Oh, but what happens if this happens?
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: You haven't got life cover.
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: No, your job is to.
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: Clients should always be financially better off after seeing an advisor, not worse off yeah, that's fundamentally it.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: And if you can help them save money in other ways by redoing their mortgage or refinancing or whatever, and that enables you to then get a premium that can protect them, you've got to put the client first and look after them.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, love it, yeah, love it, I love it.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: So I want to finish on what is tried and tested in your career, that's never changed and always gets you moving forward towards winning business, even when you feel like you don't want to do it oh, that's a tough one, um, tried and tested.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Constantly think the client has to be better off after seeing you, not worse off.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: Why'd you go and see someone that they're going to cost you more money than they're saving you or, you know, not making you better off?
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: So always think that about a client you know, um, and that that means I sleep at night.
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: That's really important to me that you know that imposter syndrome.
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: I really want my clients to be walking around and saying you know you're not going to see Wayne, he's a really good guy, he's a really nice person, he's a great advisor.
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: The fear of anyone ever saying, oh, that Wayne is not a very good advisor, that's yeah, that that that would definitely, you know, partially finish me that I thought that someone thought that about me.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: Um, so that drive to do a good job for someone's really really good, that what was keeping me going at the moment was keeping me going at the moment is, you know, last year we had a really, really good growth spurt in the amount of advisors came on board those advisors this year, wow, you know they.
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: There's people there that I'm never going to name them because they're far better than me, um, but they are just unbelievable advisors and it inspires me because I'm learning from them.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to tell them, I'm learning from them, but they are, they're brilliant.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: Um, and it's inspiring me because maybe some of them I didn't think they were going to be as good as they really are and I sit there and go, hey, I get it wrong every single day.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: They are brilliant.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: Having the younger advisors coming through, that's the real passion.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: I love my 40-year-olds that are going to be the next generations of me, but those 25-year-olds, the 35-year-olds, they are so enthusiastic and so great, going to be the next generation to me.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: But those 25 year olds, they're 35 year olds, they're.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: They are so enthusiastic and so great and I just don't want I I want to keep them because I don't want them to be damaged by anyone else yeah, so you're creating that ecosystem at one financial solution.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it is that one financial solution right there isn't.
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: You know, we're only looking for people who are 25, we're only looking for people that are 25.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: We're only looking for people that are 40 or whatever.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: You're creating an ecosystem of learning and development.
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: You're open, you're training, you're sharing and you're creating a culture of excellence when it comes to the mindset in respect to the client's story and the client journey.
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: We believe in our advisors.
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: You know we've got numerous occasions of where we've gone out and borrowed money to lend money to advisors to buy a retirement advisor's book and I'm standing as a personal guarantee on that.
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: Now I believe in the advisor enough to put my money into their businesses underneath us and that helps them grow their business.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Let's not lie, I make a margin so we make money out of it.
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: But we are.
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm on the line for that, you know, and that's what I want to do for them.
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: I want to see them grow.
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: I want them to, you know, to be brilliant at what they're good at so is there a big commitment from you to grow and develop and we're not.
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: You mentioned it there before.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: I took your track.
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: We don't just go.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Oh, we only want people that are ex-bankers sure as we've got a load of them.
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: We don't want people that have gone through an academy that maybe aren't getting the support that they wanted to okay.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: We don't just want people that are getting to the end of their career and they're going okay, I want to come to you now so that you can buy my book in the next few years.
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: We want all of them because we have a business that can help everybody.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: Uh, we have a, you know, we have a a lovely guy called mark french who's massively into emotional well-being and financial well-being in um, in the corporate marketplace.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: So we don't charge it for him.
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: We send him out to companies and he goes in and he talks about the employee benefits package.
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: But he'll also talk about emotion.
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: You know your emotions towards money, how you feel about money and the amount of people we talk to that don't understand money.
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so we then get from that.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: We get a constant stream of people saying can you come and help us?
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: And I'm at a point where you, a point where I'm probably doing the accounts in the evening.
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: I'm not really there to do the 6, 8, and 9 o'clock appointments every night anymore.
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: I still do some of them.
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: But we are open to having people who are great advisors that maybe aren't great networkers and can't lead you in, because we've got more than enough to actually go here's lead you, because we've got more than enough to actually go here's some clients.
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: You know we've got advisors that will retire in the next few years.
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: We'll help migrate those clients over to you.
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: So there isn't honestly there isn't an advisor that we wouldn't talk to great.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: So this huge opportunity that's going on there at one financial solutions.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: It doesn't look like you're slowing down.
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: You're developing more client relationships, but this new leadership team that you've got in place as well is creating that real strong structure and is creating a environment where people can either inherit clients potentially whether it's retiring ifas an ecosystem where you can support people to develop their own business but also the potential to feed off of the great work that you're doing around things like the employee benefit side.
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, 100, all of the all of the great work that you're doing around things like the employee benefits side.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, 100, all of the all of the uh leadership team that we have have all worked in teams, so they've all either been advisors, then sales managers, then national sales managers, or they've been a very successful advisor that then trained other advisors, uh.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: So because of that, they're very much driven by.
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: We want people to come to us to be part of the family.
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: The only people we won't take on is individuals that come to us.
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: They just go oh, I'll have my garden shed and I'll trade all on my own and I'm not really interested in being part of the family.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: We want everyone to feel part of the family.
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: As I say, everyone's a first born, seventh born born, you know.
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: So, um, we look after everyone like that and, and the whole leadership team is there to support the growth.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: The best thing ever done was bringing on people that are non-selling.
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: So you know, we've got five people in a leadership team of eight that don't advise clients.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: Okay, they're there to support the advisors.
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: Perfect.
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: So that wonderful.
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: Again it goes back to the business that is supporting.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there is a lot about you and and me where we are connected in the sense of how we think, 100%.
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: You know, we're both a bit neuro-spicy, aren't we, to say the least?
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: You know, we've got the same sort of philosophy in life really as well.
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: I think, and that's important, and that's a good thing, that guys can openly discuss their feelings, how they feel, how hard business can sometimes be, how we're perceived by others, especially around social media, for example.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: That can make us feel a bit less than sometimes I think, um, definitely there's, there's a, there's an element of we've got rawness and we've lost our embarrassment about, you know, welling up and being tearful about things.
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: You know there's nothing wrong with that in that when I talk to you about things that are troubling me, or we just talk about things about how other people are struggling, there's nothing wrong with being emotional about it.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: You know there really isn't no and you're always a big supporter as well with the men's mental fitness, um, whether it's physical fitness, whether it's mental fitness.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: So that's about some of the things that you get up to in your community, some of the things you do to connect with other men, to make sure that you're almost always really there for others and emotionally supporting others as well as looking after yourself.
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: I think the most important thing is to be truthful about your own mental struggles and talk to other people about them.
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: We had a conversation recently about that.
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: I sit there sometimes and I talk to my brain and go are you not normal?
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: You know why why?
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: Why have I got these thoughts?
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: Why can't I be like all these other people on LinkedIn that are driving the the best businesses and they all seem as though they've got everything going for them?
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: And why is my brain going this way?
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: And then you sit there and go actually, no, no, it's not the word normal.
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: We're all unique.
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: You know my brain drives me this way.
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: It makes me actually slightly better than someone else or different than someone else, and you know it can really get you down sometimes.
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: But the truth is it's about your support network around you and because I've got an amazing support network, I then realised that can I be support for other people?
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: Because if someone's helping you, you owe it to them to help someone else.
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: And I think, yeah, that's really really important.
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I get into things like boxing, football stuff like that.
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: Don't play, don't box anymore.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: You know I should, because I eat like I'm boxing, but I'm no longer boxing anymore, but I get that passion from watching other people box and play football to a decent standard and the amount of people that you see high-functioning sports people that are neurodiverse as well, and the reason they're good at what they do is because of the way their brain works.
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: You then start to get it that actually, neurodiversity is a great thing.
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: It makes us what we are, rather than a bad thing and shoved in a corner.
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the bit like yes, great, great, great example, um, the bit that I struggle with the most, really with myself.
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: I had a diagnosis of adhd um, which in its own right almost spins you out a little bit, because you kind of then start looking at yourself a little differently and then look back on your life and your past and think, oh, my god, I can understand, everything makes sense now.
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: But you get a bit sad as well and then you start kind of hyper, focusing on the fact that you have been diagnosed with it and you start looking into it even more and it kind of fucks you up for a little bit.
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: It kind of derails you for a little, for a little bit, um, but as you said, it's recognizing the areas and the parts that where it adds value in your life and then the bits where you are finding it challenging.
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: So for me, this perceived rejection, sensitivity, this idea that I'm not good enough or that someone's going to tell me off, it's really weird.
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: Right, it's heightened sense of feeling that, even though, if I'm doing all right, that I'm not doing all right, yeah, that someone's going to come and tell me off or something.
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: It's really, really weird.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: And I'm 43 years old and I feel like a little boy sometimes in that sense and it and when I learned about this rejection, sensitivity and it's not about being rejected because I can handle rejection, it's perceived rejection that I struggle with, this fear, yeah.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: I think there's.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: You know that, that that then goes into you ask questions of yourself, that you then make up the answer.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: So you go right, if someone does this, that's going to mean that.
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: So that then means this and you actually haven't been rejected in the first place.
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, your brain is spiraling, um, and I think that comes from your ups and down days, and your down days are the days when you need you know well, no, actually, your ups and down days, you need people around you all the time, because you're up days you actually do need someone to go.
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: Is there a crash coming?
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: And we need to be around you.
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: So, um, there are.
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: There are things that are important.
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: So, definitely, you know, I see it very much with boxing and football that that exercise I wish I'd have more of it, but that exercise definitely helps with the leveling out.
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: Um, there's nothing wrong with talking to people about medication, you know, I think it's really important that we talk about it, but it's really important that we talk about actually the good things you know there are.
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: We spoke about this the other day.
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: There are personality traits from an ADHD person that are amazing personality traits you know, absolutely fantastic and you would go if I was in this line of business.
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: I just fill the room full of adhd people, um, and I think we need to talk that way because otherwise it's we're still not there.
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: You know, we're still.
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: People talk about mental health and we talk about men's mental health and we don't necessarily then link that to people who've got ADHD or have got autistic traits or OCD.
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: They've all got anxiety issues that go with it and there are some amazing clinicians out there that know everything.
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: I know nothing, you know they will know, but it's getting people to, especially men, to reach out and go do you know what?
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: It's not right that I don't feel normal.
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: It's not right that I have imposter syndrome.
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: It's not right that I don't feel normal.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: It's not right that I, um, have imposter syndrome.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: It's not right that I'm sitting there thinking why is everyone else better than me?
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: And also, when you're turning yourself and go, my brain's not working.
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: It's not working the way I think it should.
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: Why am I negative?
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: Why have I got?
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: Why have I got?
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: Bad thoughts.
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: That's when someone else needs to come to you and say you know you need to to go and talk to someone you need to talk to friends, to you and say you know you need to, to go and talk to someone.
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: You need to talk to friends, work colleagues, partners, and just just let it out yeah, you know, I agree, mate, talking and listening is like one of the most powerful things, which is why, like you know, I I've connected with you over the past and you know I've told you things, um, that are going on in my head, but I haven't told everybody because I just know there isn't a judgment coming.
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: Um, and I think that's the powerful thing is when you can connect with and build an audience, um, and a network of people that don't judge you for for feeling um, vulnerable.
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: Yep, is power like, and that gives you the space to be able to articulate something that, in your head, at that point in time, almost feels shame and guilt, right, and that's a terrible thing to hold on to, right?
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: When you yeah, it is and when you get, when you get the right people around you, like my leadership team at work, are just unbelievable, and my friends and family are unbelievable.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: They not everyone needs to cuddle you.
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: I need to kick every now and again.
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, yeah, you know.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: So you know, I've got a really good friend of mine, alan next professional boxer, who trains the boxers that that, um, I sponsor and you know I had a white collar fight and I was down and out after after two rounds, didn't want to get up, and if it had given me a cuddle it wouldn't have worked.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: You know I needed a kick, um, and I think that we all need people around us, that I need someone that sometimes just puts a bit of fun back into life.
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: I need somebody who wants to give me a cuddle.
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: I need somebody who needs to give me a kick and you get the right people around you and they they can see the signs, yeah, and when they see the signs, and you know you're open to getting that kick and that cuddle and that love, it's brilliant, but you have to be open to it.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you do, and it's extremes, isn't it?
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: I feel things in extremes and I wish I didn't, I wish I was more balanced, but I don't.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: I feel things in extremes.
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: So when I'm in that extreme place, like you say, you want that person who's like the sensitivity that, okay, you are actually in a really shit place right now.
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I get it and let's just bring you back on track with a bit of encouragement.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: And then, once I've got that encouragement, I feel like I've got something out of my system.
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: That might one person seem really stupid, yeah, or silly, but to me it's like literally the end of the world yeah and and it's um I find it might be different to other people I find that actually, actually, when I'm being my most heightened and bravado, I'm actually hiding the bit where I'm most vulnerable, Masking yeah, because you are literally going.
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: I'm thinking everyone here is looking at me, thinking you're nobody, you don't know what you're doing or you're not good enough to be on stage or whatever it might be.
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: So you come out to prove that you are that way and you are masking your own vulnerabilities and insecurities and things like that.
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: So quite often that person that's the loudest, brashest in the room is also the most vulnerable.
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: No 100 I get that.
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: So, wayne, what did you think your first experience of the financial plan life podcast it's been a long time coming.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: Um, I've uh I'm not going to say I've enjoyed it, because I always tell people that, uh, this gig's quite, uh, quite a tough gig, so that is great.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: I so so wanted to come and talk to you.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: You know, um, I just think that what you do is brilliant and I'm just, yeah, it's been been a great experience well, it's been an absolute pleasure having you on, finally, and I'm looking forward to getting some more people on from one, financial solutions, and I do believe that you're in the next stage of some serious growth, because the foundations are obviously clear, um, and it's an ethical company and it's built off of trust and it's exactly what I think that's needed.
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: But the foundation of that is you, wayne, and I think your approach to client development, your approach to people, is what's going to make that business super attractive to advisors in the future if anyone ever wants to have just a chat about their own business, um, not not to come to work for us, but just want to come and talk to me and just go oh, I like this or I like that, or can I have some advice on this, just reach out to me.
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: Honestly, it might not, I might not come back the same day, but please, I just I'm happy to talk to anyone about anything, because I think it's all about that connection and you never know what's going to happen in the future.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: Perfect, and I think they will Cheers Wayne.
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: Thanks so much for your time.