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Commercial Real Estate Reinvented: Putting the Client First with George Pino · Beyond Fulfillment Podcast

• 0:04
  Unfortunately, a lot of people have fallen into this trap of, you know, well, I deserve this, I deserve that.
• 0:10
  Well, what you deserve is really what you earn.
• 0:17
  All right, George Pino, welcome to Beyond Fulfillment.
• 0:22
  Thank you for having me.
• 0:23
  David.
• 0:24
  Yes, sir.
• 0:25
  We're excited to have you and have this conversation.
• 0:28
  So George, you are a co founder of Commercial Brokers International and you've had a very successful career in commercial real estate for the past 30 years.
• 0:40
  Can you just talk about your background and how you got into this space?
• 0:45
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 0:47
  You know, I've been lucky enough to be, have, have been in this industry for over 30 years.
• 0:53
  And frankly, like a lot of people, I fell into it by accident.
• 0:58
  So you know, I had, and, and it's, I was actually just telling the story the other day someone was asking about how I got into the business.
• 1:06
  And in college I had started a business for myself and it was doing very well, but it was very seasonal and it's perfect for a college student because I had summers off.
• 1:18
  Well, I can, I thought I was going to continue that business.
• 1:21
  I decided to do so, but it happened to be right after I graduated and it was that seasonal transition period where I wasn't really having any business.
• 1:30
  And a buddy of mine called up, said I'm working at a new company.
• 1:33
  Do you want to make, you know, a few thousand dollars for a couple of weeks worth of work?
• 1:39
  And I thought, you know, what the heck, why not?
• 1:41
  And sure enough, within a week or so they actually offered me a full time position.
• 1:48
  And I thought about it and I said, you know, there's actually, I think more opportunity here in real estate than there is in my business that I had.
• 1:56
  And it wasn't necessarily a path that I had originally thought about, but looking at it and looking what they're doing, I, I thought, you know, this is something I could do and I think there's more opportunity here.
• 2:06
  So jumped into that and that was actually doing real estate auctions.
• 2:10
  And that was right after college.
• 2:12
  And I ended up jumping in, learning quite a bit about general real estate itself.
• 2:17
  And you know, through a lot of hard work I was able to rise up fairly quickly within that company.
• 2:23
  Opened up several office them around the country and unfortunately they went public.
• 2:28
  I got, I was one of the casualties of going public, meaning middle management, getting paid too much, getting laid off.
• 2:39
  And you know, immediately right after that when I, as soon as I got laid off, I mean my first call was to a competitor.
• 2:47
  They offered me a job on the spot, but I would have had to pick up and Move.
• 2:51
  And then my current business partner, we talked about it, and he said, you know what, I have a opportunity where I'm starting a real estate auction company for a gentleman up in Los Angeles, where we're at.
• 3:02
  And he said, if you're interested, let's sit down and talk and let's talk about a partnership.
• 3:07
  And we've been partners ever since, since 1993.
• 3:09
  And that's kind of how I fell into the business.
• 3:12
  And then from there, there's been a couple of evolutions.
• 3:15
  Obviously, we were sold a couple of times.
• 3:18
  Initially, right after the.
• 3:22
  We grew to the number two real estate auction company in the nation and that the gentleman that owned the company decided to sell.
• 3:32
  At the time, we were too young, didn't know about asking for equity for helping set up a company.
• 3:37
  We were happy to have a job.
• 3:39
  And so we ended up getting sold and that when we got sold, they decided to close that division down.
• 3:47
  Once they closed that division down, we were actually put in contact with another gentleman that wanted to open up a commercial real estate division for his large residential firm.
• 3:57
  And initially we told him no because we were doing quite a bit of investments ourselves, and that investment company was taking off pretty well.
• 4:03
  And.
• 4:04
  But he all of the, you know, godfather made us an offer we couldn't refuse.
• 4:09
  It was a very much a win win proposition and also became a really good mentor of ours.
• 4:15
  So.
• 4:16
  And that's ultimately how we started.
• 4:17
  We started his commercial real estate division for him when he sold his company.
• 4:22
  We actually ended up starting our own company back in 2005.
• 4:24
  And that's the genes of Commercial Brokers International.
• 4:28
  Okay.
• 4:29
  All right.
• 4:29
  Appreciate all the background there and a lot to unpack there too.
• 4:32
  So let's talk about the, the first auction company that you're part of.
• 4:37
  So.
• 4:39
  And I don't know how big that space is, but growing a company that.
• 4:43
  That was a startup to the number two company in the nation.
• 4:47
  I mean, what, what was that process like?
• 4:49
  And how did you.
• 4:51
  How did you play such an integral role there?
• 4:54
  Well, the, the process was a lot of hard work that if it wasn't for youth, I don't know if I could replicate it today, you know, I mean, we literally were working 16 hour days, at least, you know,
• 5:08
  every day.
• 5:09
  You know, Saturdays and Sundays we would work as well because, you know, it was, you know, eat what you hunt basically, and get the business.
• 5:18
  Now the beautiful part was there were really only three large real estate auction companies at the time.
• 5:24
  The company we were at was the number one company, and they were the largest out there, and they were international and.
• 5:31
  But at the same time, when I started with them, they were a smaller shop, 30 or so employees, and they grew to a very large international company where I was opening offices for them around the country.
• 5:45
  When we got laid off, the company that wanted to start up a new real estate auction company, it was a gentleman by the name of Fred Sands, and he had at the time the largest residential real estate company
• 5:58
  in the United States, over 2,000 agents.
• 6:01
  And so we leveraged that, but also leveraged what we knew about the company that we were at for many years.
• 6:10
  I mean, I was at the previous company for six, seven years.
• 6:14
  And we leveraged what the, what the weaknesses we saw and felt were and how we could do it better.
• 6:22
  And we were able to outperform them to the point where, you know, and, and we're talking thousands of properties a year that we're selling.
• 6:30
  You know, we'd have multiple closings a day.
• 6:33
  And when we got to that size, I mean, I actually, I still remember when I knew that we were actually having an impact and how large we were becoming when the competing company or the company that we came
• 6:50
  from, we were up for.
• 6:52
  We were the only two companies up for a very large portfolio.
• 6:56
  A company out of Miami and with offices in Dallas, they had bought 10,000 properties or homes in southern California, and they were going to auction off about 3,000 of them.
• 7:08
  They bought them all through the reos and the banks, the great Western Bank, Washington Mutual, the companies that pretty much aren't around anymore.
• 7:16
  But they bought a portfolio of about 10,000 properties.
• 7:18
  They're going to sell 3,000.
• 7:20
  And we're all excited about that.
• 7:22
  They came to us and they, at the meeting we were told, you know, what we're going to do is we're going to give you half.
• 7:31
  We're going to take 450 properties to auction.
• 7:33
  You're going to get half roughly, and your competitor, where you came from, is going to get the other half.
• 7:39
  And whoever does better gets our business for all 3,000 properties.
• 7:44
  I'm ecstatic because I know I can.
• 7:47
  We can outperform them.
• 7:48
  I know that we, you know, we knew their weaknesses.
• 7:50
  We knew how we could be able to outperform where we could outperform and how we could do it and do it better.
• 7:56
  And we're extremely excited about that opportunity.
• 8:02
  Cut to getting on the flight, coming back, landing in Los Angeles.
• 8:06
  You know, it's only a three hour or so flight, but, you know, total five hours.
• 8:10
  We, there's a Voicemail message, you know, hey, we're talking to your competitor.
• 8:14
  We told them the plan.
• 8:16
  They said that they would do your half the auction for free with no commission or marketing money.
• 8:21
  And so we're just going to go with them.
• 8:26
  So I knew we were at least having a, I mean it was bittersweet obviously, you know, being able to grow to a position where, you know, that we were competing against a company that had laid us off and
• 8:39
  taking away millions of dollars in business from them within years or so, a couple of years and from there, but at the same time losing out on a sale of 225 properties.
• 8:56
  So, you know, a little bittersweet, but at that time that's when we kind of realized that we were actually growing it.
• 9:02
  And a lot of it was this is back in the day before emails, this was back in the day before, you know, the Internet was still there but you know, we were doing open outcry auction so it was
• 9:11
  really hard to convince people to do it.
• 9:14
  But it was all personal hand touch.
• 9:16
  So a lot of was cold calling.
• 9:18
  We'd wake up, I would start cold calling at 6am and you know, when new air chains asked me how'd you cold call at 6am I'd cold call time zones because the people that our clients were banks, institutions, financial
• 9:32
  institutions, private equity companies that were all around the country.
• 9:36
  We would literally start at 6am making phone calls, calls to the east coast, work our way from the east coast to the Midwest based on the time zones, all the way through the west coast, all the way to
• 9:45
  Hawaii from there.
• 9:48
  In the late afternoons we would stop calling and start hand typing notes to every single person.
• 9:53
  We talk, talk to every single person, got a hand typed written note with a hand signature on it and, and then we would mail that out that day and then follow up with them again.
• 10:04
  And it was really just that old school methodology that really was able to get us to that, that and being able to perform, you know, there's always that too, but being able to perform or outperform the, the clients.
• 10:17
  But that ultimately was how we got the business.
• 10:19
  It was just, you know, I'd love to say it was from connections and that we're so smart and whatever, but no, it was just hard work, dedication, persistence and you know, being able to convince people to trust us.
• 10:36
  And so when you're doing that too as a young kid starting off, you see this opportunity and you're putting in those type of hours and maybe for the younger people listening, they would be hard to even imagine that
• 10:49
  type of, you know, world with, with no email and it's, it's all, you know, cold calling, which is not, you know, it's much different today.
• 10:58
  I mean, we're.
• 11:01
  Was there.
• 11:01
  Did it take time to break through?
• 11:03
  Was there time where you're just, you're doing all that and you're not seeing results, but you just continue to persist?
• 11:09
  Absolutely.
• 11:11
  You know, I, I think, you know, we were again lucky in that we understood, I mean, we, we understood all aspects of the real estate auction business.
• 11:23
  And we also understood because there's limited competition, who our competitors were and what their weaknesses are.
• 11:31
  So we're able to position it like, okay, this is how we can fix things.
• 11:34
  This is how we can do it better, cheaper and get better pricing.
• 11:37
  And, you know, part of that was also realizing at a certain point when you're young, you only have one asset really, you know, and that's time.
• 11:49
  So I have two choices.
• 11:50
  I can either make the time to do the work and get to where I need to be and want to be, or I can take my time.
• 11:57
  And you know, it's, it's that old, it's that old adage of sacrifice, you know, like work life balance.
• 12:06
  And you know, there's another.
• 12:13
  Cohort or associate, not with our company, but he owns another company.
• 12:18
  But he was interviewed a little while ago and you know, what was interesting was he had a very similar story in that, you know, everyone was talking about work life balance and how you could do that.
• 12:30
  And he goes, well, I would argue that right now, at my age, I have better work life balance than anybody else at my age.
• 12:37
  And the reason for that is because I sacrificed.
• 12:40
  You know, when I was younger and 20 years old, I didn't have a family, so I had time.
• 12:44
  I would spend 12, 14 hours working every single day and then working the evenings to set my day up.
• 12:51
  Next it was, did I have much of a social life?
• 12:54
  No.
• 12:55
  But right now I'm 45 years old.
• 12:57
  I volunteer for every single one of my kids classes.
• 13:01
  I'm there every multiple classes a week, volunteering.
• 13:05
  I'm at every single one of their games.
• 13:07
  We take multiple family vacations every single year.
• 13:11
  I would argue, and I don't have to work.
• 13:13
  I can retire at any time and therefore be able to spend as much time as I want with my family and doing things that we love.
• 13:21
  So he goes, I would argue that I have a better work life balance than anybody else my age.
• 13:27
  And it's all because of the sacrifices that I made before.
• 13:30
  So that's how, you know, we've looked at it and it was a very similar story that, you know, you have.
• 13:36
  When you're young, your main attribute or what you can offer them is time.
• 13:42
  You know, you don't have that many clients.
• 13:43
  I can give you more time to be able to focus on you, yourself, your client.
• 13:48
  You know, that's your main goal.
• 13:50
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• 13:55
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• 13:58
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• 14:06
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• 14:28
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• 14:37
  Have fallen into this trap of, you know, well, I deserve this, I deserve that.
• 14:42
  Well, what you deserve is really what you earn.
• 14:47
  Yeah, love that.
• 14:49
  All right, so George, let's talk about your, your current company, Commercial Brokers International.
• 14:55
  So you, you and your partner started that in 2005.
• 15:00
  So talk about what you there, what you do there and the trajectory of that company.
• 15:05
  Okay, well, Commercial Brokers International, we are full service for service commercial brokerage company.
• 15:12
  We started in 2005 and it was actually because again that company that we previously that we started, the commercial real estate division was actually sold.
• 15:22
  And at the time we had an investment company, it was going very well.
• 15:26
  We were actually going to focus on that.
• 15:28
  It was not really our initial thought to create another brokerage company for ourselves.
• 15:33
  And what ended up happening though was, you know, we were skiing at the time we got the news that we're shutting down.
• 15:39
  It was December 9th and we're shutting down December 31st.
• 15:43
  Not much lead way of time.
• 15:46
  And initially my business partner and I were skiing together along with some of the agents that we'd recruited and trained and were part of our, part of the team that we brought on board.
• 15:55
  And you know, we thought, okay, you know what, no worries, we'll just focus on investments.
• 15:59
  And we broke for lunch again.
• 16:02
  And at lunch we both looked at it goes and we said, well, what are we going to do with the agents that we brought on board?
• 16:08
  How you know, they trusted us to come on board over here.
• 16:11
  And then all of a sudden there's no company for them.
• 16:13
  So we started making calls.
• 16:15
  I found a couple of shops that would take them on and a handful of them came to us and said, you know, you have your broker's license.
• 16:24
  If you start a brokerage company, then we'll come on board and we'll come with you.
• 16:31
  And although it wasn't our first thought to do that, it was what we felt was the best thing and the right thing to do.
• 16:39
  People that trusted us, they're asking us to help them and continue.
• 16:42
  We felt it was the right thing.
• 16:43
  But we also felt that if we're going to do this, we're going to create a company that addressed concerns that if we were an agent, one, we would want to be there and two, if we were a client,
• 16:53
  we'd want to use them.
• 16:55
  So Commercial Brokers International actually did start off as the initial CBI and the initial stood for client's best interest.
• 17:04
  Because in 2005 and even today, I think most commercial brokerage companies don't have the client's best interest in mind.
• 17:10
  They're more interested about making the transaction happen and chasing a deal and making a commission versus creating a long term relationship and guiding and working with that client and looking at.
• 17:22
  And the only way to do that is by understanding what they're looking for, what their goals and objectives are and fulfilling that for them.
• 17:30
  Basically looking out for their best interest.
• 17:33
  I think that there was a lot of issues with transparency, especially back in 2005, that's cleared up a little bit more, not as much.
• 17:39
  So we addressed a lot of that, of how our company is going to step forward and do business.
• 17:44
  This is how we're going to act, this is how we're going to react.
• 17:47
  This is how we're going to handle agents that are maybe a little bit more.
• 17:52
  Maybe not up to our standards as far as being scrupulous or unscrupulous and, and things like that.
• 18:01
  So we actually had a plan of action that if we're going to do this, we're going to do something that is actually meant to give back.
• 18:07
  And also every single one of our companies that we have also has a giving back component that we try and do things to help the community.
• 18:14
  You know, for instance, this weekend where we planned a.
• 18:19
  The Santa Monica promenade has been having a very difficult time in downtown Santa Monica in general for the retailers.
• 18:26
  So we decided to bring people back in conjunction.
• 18:29
  A client of ours.
• 18:30
  We're holding an exotic car show right after the farmers market.
• 18:33
  We're in conjunction with the city and we're shutting down two blocks of a street right at the promenade.
• 18:41
  In addition to that, our agents then went out and they talked to all the retailers in the area and they worked out deals that they can actually get discounts in for people that come to the car show which
• 18:51
  now.
• 18:52
  But at the same time it just boosted our agents careers because now they've talked to every single decision maker in that area.
• 19:00
  And so it's a win win situation.
• 19:02
  We're bringing people in to try and give back to the community.
• 19:06
  We're hosting this event, not asking for it.
• 19:08
  There's no payment, there's no tickets or anything else.
• 19:11
  And then we coordinate all the retailers and all the other businesses in the area so they can benefit from it as well.
• 19:17
  And you know, that's been our core for Commercial Brokers International that we want to be able to give back to the community and really provide the best service and keep the client's best interests in mind for that.
• 19:30
  So we do everything from leasing to sales.
• 19:33
  I have 27 affiliate offices around the country.
• 19:36
  We can operate in all 50 states and we even have a commercial lending arm that we can do commercial loans, everything from SBA financing all the way through ACT rehab, bridge loans, whatever thing or construction loans.
• 19:53
  So you know, it's, it's kind of a full service shop but with the customer service of more of a regional boutique type firm.
• 20:04
  Okay, fascinating story.
• 20:06
  And I just want to dig into that a little a bit more because.
• 20:11
  Okay, so the company you're at is you find out they're shutting down.
• 20:16
  You had done very well there and you had an investments that were doing well.
• 20:20
  So you really didn't, you weren't worried from your own personal standpoint and you didn't even need to start this other company and you were basically asked to do so by all these agents that wanted to continue to be
• 20:32
  part of your team.
• 20:34
  Right.
• 20:34
  So and then you started and because of that, because you're secure and because you're, you're not just starting it to, because you need to where you have these grand ambitions of growing it to.
• 20:45
  Some.
• 20:49
  You know, expanding it for strictly for financial purposes, you're able to make it mission driven.
• 20:55
  Right.
• 20:55
  And, and begin to I guess operate and fix things that are wrong with the industry.
• 21:01
  You know, I've heard other people in the industry say it's broken for several of the reasons you just stated with the, the model and the lack of training and etc.
• 21:10
  So I mean how important was that and being able to operate and basically not really need to do this to where you could address it and address the issues that you saw and make it more mission driven.
• 21:23
  Well, you know, it was, it was our key component, meaning, you know, we weren't.
• 21:29
  I think the issues, a lot of issues that rise within the commercial brokerage field have to do and circle around money.
• 21:37
  And I understand that when you're a newer agent and you're chasing a deal and you're very hungry, you want to make that deal happen.
• 21:43
  At the same time for a career in commercial real estate and a long lasting career that you're going to build on, you can't just make that deal happen.
• 21:52
  You have to make sure that it's the right deal and the best deal for your client.
• 21:55
  And a lot of times that's not really taught or trained to a lot of agents.
• 22:00
  For instance, I was interviewing an agent about a year and a half ago that we were recruiting and he asked us.
• 22:13
  He was an investment salesperson and he was like, well, you know, my company's telling.
• 22:17
  He goes, how many listings do you have?
• 22:19
  And I go, I have none right now, why would I want one?
• 22:22
  Nothing is selling.
• 22:24
  And his response was that, hey, you know, my company wants us to get as many listings as possible because they say it's good exposure for us.
• 22:34
  I said, no, it's good exposure for them because they're not paying you and you're meanwhile servicing 10, 15 clients that you're never going to have a sale with because the market's down.
• 22:46
  You're focusing all your attention on them, so you're not attracting a lot of the buyers or that's coming out of the and wherewithal.
• 22:53
  So really it's benefiting the company, not the agent.
• 22:57
  And you know, it's.
• 22:59
  I talked to him again just recently.
• 23:02
  In that year and a half he had at the time 16 listings, probably closer to about 20 something over the year and a half or so.
• 23:10
  He said, one sale.
• 23:14
  So listings don't equate to sales.
• 23:16
  So what we try and do is advise our agents on where to go to actually grow their business and how to do it in a very much a structured sense.
• 23:25
  You know, it's not so much of a company thing as it is the agents.
• 23:29
  Because the way I look at it, there's two ways that companies look at agents.
• 23:32
  They look at them as either a profit center, meaning how can I nickel and dine them or get the most out of them without giving them anything, or they look at them as partners.
• 23:41
  We look at our agents as partners, meaning if I can elevate my agent and have them do more business and be more efficient by giving them the tools to do so, then we both win because they have more
• 23:54
  business.
• 23:54
  So they're happy, they're making more money.
• 23:56
  Guess what?
• 23:57
  I'm also making more money because my income is directly tied to how much money they make.
• 24:02
  So, you know, that's a symbiotic relationship versus one that's where there's fees involved or that they're nickel and diming you for little things or they're having you do stuff like, you know what, get our signs and brand up
• 24:14
  on every building.
• 24:15
  But we know you're never going to sell it, but you're going to keep working for free for the next year trying to, you know, those kind of things.
• 24:22
  So we took out that aspect of it and said, you know what, what's good for the agent should be good for the company because that's the symbiotic relationship that most companies should have.
• 24:31
  And that's how we structured it.
• 24:34
  Yeah, I mean it makes perfect sense and it speaks to just, I guess how different that is relative to the industry because I mean, the attrition rate is what, mid 90%?
• 24:51
  Is that right for agents within a couple years.
• 24:54
  First year attrition rate is on average in the high 80s.
• 25:00
  Second year falls in the low 90s.
• 25:03
  Third year falls in the mid 90s.
• 25:06
  So yeah.
• 25:06
  Wow.
• 25:07
  Within three years, over 95% of agents that went into commercial real estate are out of the industry completely.
• 25:14
  Okay.
• 25:15
  And so clearly you're doing things differently at CBI and love that client's best interest in terms of.
• 25:21
  That was the original, the original moniker.
• 25:24
  And so you're also creating content and providing training at a mass level to just help agents become better, both at.
• 25:34
  A mass level and also within our company as well.
• 25:37
  We do training every single day for new agents.
• 25:39
  Starts at 8:30, goes to 9:30.
• 25:41
  We have a recap on Tuesdays and Thursdays to help them rewire their thinking.
• 25:46
  Not so much of a, you know, like, like micromanaging thing.
• 25:49
  It's more about rewiring so that they start thinking for themselves and how to look at it and how to look go about it.
• 25:55
  So our training encompasses everything from goal setting to technical aspects to sales pitches to how to go about positioning or looking at even going delving into certain things that, you know, how to increase returns through utilization of different
• 26:11
  tax strategies and things like that.
• 26:13
  So we go into some pretty high level concepts as well as the basics.
• 26:17
  And we do that for the agents.
• 26:20
  We also do that for our agents.
• 26:22
  Juniors, because, you know, it's not, it's a senior agent should train a junior how they do their business, but they shouldn't have to train them how they real estate if we're.
• 26:31
  Especially if the company's already training them.
• 26:34
  So we take that on as well.
• 26:35
  In addition to that, you know, we put on a lot of videos about training just for the general public.
• 26:42
  It's open, it's out there, it's free, it's for any agent that's out there.
• 26:47
  The conversation I had yesterday, as a matter of fact, I mentioned when I was talking about our background and youth and everything else, like how we got started and what we had to put into it, that conversation was
• 27:02
  actually with a competing company's agent, agent that found me and to ask me if he could ask some questions because he's starting off and I took a half hour out of my day and time and spent some time
• 27:13
  with him and said, yeah, here's what I would do differently if, you know, when, from when I was younger.
• 27:17
  And here's what I would suggest that you do nowadays, especially given what you have.
• 27:22
  But understand that the company you're with is going to have some constraints over certain things, but you can push that a little bit going this route.
• 27:29
  So we're giving advice across the board.
• 27:32
  Again, the way I look at it is if we can better the industry as a whole by creating relationships, then everybody wins, you know, so it doesn't matter if you're a competitor or not.
• 27:48
  I know my own sales strengths.
• 27:50
  I know I can compete against most people in sales, but at the same time I'm still going to let people know.
• 27:57
  And other people have actually asked me, they said they've asked like, why are you giving your secrets away, your training secrets or how you look at things or what do you do?
• 28:06
  And you know, my bot the way I look at it and I love to cook.
• 28:10
  So I use this analogy is I'm not giving them the secrets, I'm giving them the recipe.
• 28:16
  And I know I can right now.
• 28:18
  I, you know, I love to cook.
• 28:20
  I have quite a few recipes I created on my own, but I can give a recipe that, that I have to 10 different people.
• 28:29
  I'll be lucky to have one create the exact same dish I make and or it be as good or better because it's not about the recipe, it's about the execution.
• 28:40
  It's about how you go about it.
• 28:42
  It can be a small detail as far as just even how you cut the vegetables, which you know, may be a small detail as, you know, compared in comparison to commercial real estate.
• 28:52
  It could be a small detail as far as just.
• 28:54
  Just maybe how you're underwriting a transaction or exit strategies or how you're positioning a release renewal.
• 29:01
  Little details that really turn it from a Mac and cheese dish to a lobster Mac and cheese with truffle gourmet dish kind of thing.
• 29:12
  So, you know, it's those stuff.
• 29:14
  So we may have the same recipe, but it's all about the execution.
• 29:18
  Yeah, Love that.
• 29:20
  All right, so, George, if people want to find out more, whether they're in the market for commercial real estate and they potentially want to engage your firm, or if there's agents out there that are hearing this and are
• 29:31
  intrigued and potentially want to join your team, what's the best way that people can reach out to you?
• 29:37
  Best way is either through my LinkedIn, which is just a straight George Pino, or my email, gpinobicommercial.com if you do go to LinkedIn, there is another George Pino.
• 29:49
  He's in Miami.
• 29:50
  Don't choose him him.
• 29:52
  Choose the one in Los Angeles.
• 29:53
  That's me.
• 29:55
  Okay.
• 29:55
  All right, we'll link all that in the show.
• 29:57
  Notes for everyone.
• 29:58
  All right.
• 29:59
  Well, George, thank you so much for taking the time to be here and sharing all this valuable wisdom from your journey with our audience.
• 30:04
  We greatly appreciate it.
• 30:06
  Thank you.
• 30:06
  Dave, thanks for having me.