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Sarah Kellen And The 302 Interview With The FBI · The Epstein Chronicles

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to start taking
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: a look at the Sarah Kellen three point two profer
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: that she gave to the FBI, and this proffer was
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: given on April twenty third of twenty twenty. Redacted date
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: of birth, Redacted was interviewed pursuing to a proffer agreement
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: at Redacted. Present for the interview was Redacted's attorney legal
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: team including redacted along with Ausa Redacted, Ausa redacted and redacted,
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: and special Agent redacted. After being advised of the identities
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: of the above listed individuals and the nature of the interview,
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  Speaker 1: Redacted provided the following information. Redacted wanted to provide clarification
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: from her last interview in regards to when she first
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: learned about the investigation into Jeffrey Epstein, saying that her
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: feelings were a progression. Redacted received a payment from Epstein
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: in late twenty eighteen. In September twenty fourteen, Redacted and
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Redacted renovated their apartment. Redacted and Redacted were left with
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: a gutted apartment and they could not get a bank loan.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: When Redacted stopped working for Epstein. They still talked regularly
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: and visited together when he was in town. Redacted spoke
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: to Epstein monthly. Redacted spoke to Epstein about their situation.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: Redacted asked Redacted to borrow money from Epstein. They were
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: waiting for stocks to go public, but it kept getting delayed.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: At the end of November twenty eighteen, Redacted met Epstein
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  Speaker 1: at his New York house and told them about their financials,
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  Speaker 1: saying that she only had one hundred thousand in her
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: bank account. While Redacted was meeting with Epstein, he picked
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: up the phone and called his accountant, Richard Kahn, to
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  Speaker 1: wire her two hundred and fifty thousand. This meeting with
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: Epstein happened because Leslie Groff told her to come and
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: meet him if she was in New York. Ebstein told
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: Redacted not to tell anyone about giving her the money,
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: but did not tell her why she should not tell anyone.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: Redacted assumed it was because Epstein did not want Redacted
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: to feel bad about it. Redacted and Redacted kept separate finances.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Epstein also gave Redacted one hundred thousand when redacted. Redacted
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: did not think she received other money from Epstein. Redacted
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: told redacted and redacted about having received the money from Epstein.
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: Redacted called redacted and told her that he gave her
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: one hundred thousand. Redacted then told her Redacted that Epstein
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: gave her money as well. Redacted told redacted that Epstein
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: called her and asked her if she could use or
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: needed money. Redacted thought that Epstein was just feeling generous
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: with them. Next section. Redacted Redacted with see Epstein once
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: every couple months, depending on where they both were at
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: the time. Redacted told Epstein that it was rough. Epstein
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: came to Miami to meet with an architect and help.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: Redacted thought this was in early twenty eighteen. Months before
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: their conversation in November, Redacted had asked Epstein to come
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: to her apartment in Miami. Redacted gave Epstein a rundown
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: of the renovation, burn rate and cash. Epstein told them
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: he did not see how they could keep the apartment,
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: saying it did not all add up. Epstein told her
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: that she cannot put her head in the sand. Redacted.
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: Epstein told redacted that she would always be safe and
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: he would always take care of her. Epstein sent redacted
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  Speaker 1: an email one saying one hundred percent safe. Redacted brought
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: up the financial discussion with Epstein. Redacted did not know
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: what Epstein wanted to talk to her about. When Groff called,
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not ask Epstein for money. Epstein had another
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: meeting after he met with redacted. Redacted thankd Epstein and
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: sent an email after thanking him. Redacted lent the money
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: to Redacted. Redacted did not report the money on taxes.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: Acted was not sure how reporting the taxes worked. Redacted
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: understanding was that Epstein would have to pay the taxes
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: on the money he gave her. In April twenty eighteen,
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: Redacted was aware of a reporter looking into Epstein the
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: day the article in the Miami Herald came out. She
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: had been aware that someone was looking into Abstein. The
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: article came out before Redacted met with Epstein in November.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: Redacted thought that she and Epstein may have acknowledged it,
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: but did not talk about it in depth. Redacted remembered
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: skimming through the article and did not remember what she
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: and Epstein talked about the article. It was not a
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: topic of conversation. Redacted did not think they talked about
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: it afterwards either. Redacted and Redacted talked about it, but
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: did not talk specifically about the article. Redacted and Redacted
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: wanted to figure out the best way to tell their
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: own stories. Redacted had thought about writing a book and
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: told Epstein, in which he told her it was a
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  Speaker 1: good idea. Redacted did not associate the two one hundred
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  Speaker 1: and fifty thousand she received from Epstein to the article
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  Speaker 1: from the Miami Herald because Epstein was always generous to people.
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: Redacted was stressed about her finances and felt Epstein was
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: trying to be helpful. Redacted did not know that she
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: viewed it any difference. Currently, Redacted had told Epstein that
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: a journalist reached out. Redacted did not recall Epstein saying
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: anything about it. Epstein did not tell Redacted not to
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: talk to anyone. The first time Redacted or remembered being
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: on the island after Redacted, Epstein asked her to make
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: him a bath and told her to get in with him.
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: Redacted was sitting across from Epstein when he told her
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: that Redacted redacted. Epstein took Redacted to the bed and
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: she sat facing him. Epstein directed or Redacted on what
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: to do and how to touch him. Epstein masturbated. Redacted
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: took this to mean that she had to perform sexual favors.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: After this incident, Redacted had a lot of sexual contact
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: with Epstein. It was pretty often, It varied and happened
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: in all locations. Epstein would wake Redacted up by beginning
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  Speaker 1: to fondle her. There were some situations that involved other people.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: The first time another person was present, it was Glenn Maxwell.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Epstein was laying down, Maxwell was touching Redacted and instructing
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  Speaker 1: her on what to do. Maxwell told her Redacted where
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  Speaker 1: to touch Epstein and how to touch him. Before Epstein
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: went to jail. The first time was the last time
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  Speaker 1: Redacted had any type of sexual contact with him. Epstein
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: would ask Redacted to come over and sleep in his bed.
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: Epstein called Redacted his human water bottle. The sexual contact
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: with Epstein phased out after Epstein went to jail. Redacted
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: did not sleep in his bed anymore. The majority of time,
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: the sexual contact would begin with Epstein waking Redacted up
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  Speaker 1: by fondling her. Epstein would direct Redacted by grabbing her
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  Speaker 1: hand to follow him to his room. Epstein would lay
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  Speaker 1: down and masturbate. Sometimes Epstein would touch Redacted, tell her
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  Speaker 1: how to sit and had to move her head. Epstein
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: would ask Redacted to give him a blowjob. In Palm Beach,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: Epstein and Redacted were working out in the cabana. Epstein
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: was on the bike while Redacted was doing sit ups.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: Epstein turned the music up loud and put the Hurricane
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: shutters up. Epstein basically aggressively raped Redacted. Epstein pulled Redacted's
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  Speaker 1: pants down and had intercourse with her. This was the
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: only time Redacted remembered him having intercourse with her. There
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: were two other times besides the time when Maxwell, where
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: other people were present during the sexual encounters. There was
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: a time on the island where Redacted was present. Redacted
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: remembered being on the bed with her while Epstein directed them.
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: There was a time in New York where Redacted was present.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: Epstein asked both of them to come over, and it
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: led to a similar situation as it happened on the
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: island with Redacted. In Palm Beach, the sexual contact with
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: Epstein happened, and Redacted the gym and those she couldnot
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: picture it. Redacted was sure that it also happened in
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  Speaker 1: his room in New York. Epstein would call Redacted over
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: to sleep with them, usually at night. Epstein's cold word
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: was cold cheats. In the beginning, Epstein would have Redacted
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: sleepover and it turned sexual when Epstein was with Maxwell.
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: Redacted or recall being afraid that Maxwell would find out
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: because redacted worked in her building. Redacted thought that when
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: Epstein started dating redacted, he just had Redacted sleep with
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: them with no sexual contact. On the island. The sexual
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: contact occurred in Maxwell's bedroom. There were also times Redacted
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: would draw Epstein baths and she would be in the
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: bath and that would lead her to the bedroom. Maxwell
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: had approximately four girls, including redacted or redacted and redacted
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  Speaker 1: on the island. For Epstein's birthday. Maxwell asked them to
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: get naked and wrap themselves in saran wrap. Maxwell took photos.
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  Speaker 1: Maxwell had massage tables brought down to the beach. Max
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: and Epstein got on the table with the women surrounding
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  Speaker 1: them while she took a photo. All the women were topless.
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  Speaker 1: Maxwell also had them paint on their breasts to put
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  Speaker 1: on a canvass to give to Epstein. Redacted thought this
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  Speaker 1: happened around January of two thousand and two in Paris.
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Epstein would have Redacted sleep in his bed Epstein would
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  Speaker 1: direct Redacted on what to do, how to sit, where
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  Speaker 1: to put her shoulders, and had to put her head
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: so that he could not see her face. Epstein told
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  Speaker 1: her that he did not want to see her face.
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: Epstein wanted his nipples rubbed. Redacted stayed with him in Paris.
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: Redacted or recalled Epstein leading her to his bed in
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  Speaker 1: New Mexico. Most encounters in Epstein's bed were with Epstein masturbating.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not recall revolving around the massage room or
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: during a massage. Epstein asked redacted to give them two
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: full proper body massages, once on the island with a
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: massuse and once on the ranch when no missuse was available.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Redacted massage Epstein's feet all the time, along with rubbing
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: his shoulders and cracking his back. Redacted described Epstein directing
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: her meant that he would tell her how to touch him,
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: where to touch him, and how to sit. Sometimes Epstein
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: would touch redacted. Redacted recalled being around during approximately two
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: thousand and two. Two thousand and three, Redacted was present
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: for a sexual encounter on the island. Redacted viewed redacted
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: as Epstein's girlfriend. Redacted thought Redacted was a redacted and
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: thought Redacted to be in her twenties during this time.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: Redacted or called redacted being around during approximately two thousand
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: and two and two thousand and three. Redacted did not
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: know how Redacted met Epstein. Redacted traveled a lot when
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: redacted had started. Redacted thought redacted was in college viewed
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: as Epstein's girlfriend. The sexual encounter involving Maxwell happened very
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: early on, but did not happen the first time Redacted
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: met them. This happened when Redacted came back. Redacted did
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: not remember how it started, but recalled being on the bed.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: Maxwell was naked and told Redacted that Epstein liked his
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: nipples rubbed. Maxwell told Redacted that Epstein liked to liked
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: how to touch him. Maxwell was rubbing his nipples. Maxwell
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: touch redacted. Maxwell. Redacted did not talk about it afterwards.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: Maxwell always made comments and jokes about sex. She was
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: outwardly very open about it. Maxwell said she had gone
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: to a blowjob class. Maxwell offered to demonstrate what she learned.
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: Maxwell discussed this very generally out at the common table.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not remember who was all present for the conversation.
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not know if Maxwell engaged in other sexual
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: contact with other women. When Redacted first started, Maxwell made
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: a comment to her saying, listen to what Jeffrey says.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: He knows what he's doing. He's very successful. You do
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: well to listen to what he has to say. During
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: the sexual encounters with Epstein, Redacted felt ashamed. Redacted was
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: nervous and scared, not sure what was going to happen.
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not feel that she had a choice. Redacted
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: did not know where else to go. Maxwell made comments
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: about other girlfriends being trash. Redacted did not want Maxwell
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: to put her in that category because she did not
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: want redacted. Maxwell was Epstein's girlfriend. Maxwell approved of the bills,
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: ran all of Epstein's houses, and was in control of everything.
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Redacted never told anyone what happened. Redacted felt ashamed and
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: buried it deep down. Redacted did not know who to tell.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: All of redacted friends were through Epstein. Redacted could not
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: tell any of her boyfriends because they would get rid
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: of her. One of her redacted previous boyfriends was Epstein's paralegal,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: who she met through Epstein. Redacted thought that maybe there
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: were times that there was not sexual contact. Once she
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: traveled with Epstein between two thousand and two to two
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: thousand and five, but it happened more than not. Redacted
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: described at the time where she and Epstein were in
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: the gym was the first time she saw him being aggressive.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: Epstein seemed to have a rage about him. It was
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: unexpected and out of the blue to redacted. Redacted had
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: no conversations about sexual boundaries with Epstein. Redacted did not
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: want to have contact with them. Redacted described Epstein as overpowering,
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: ominous figure. Redacted could feel Epstein's wrath if she did
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: not do what he wanted. Epstein was mad at redacted
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: when she booked a car rental and she did not
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: do exactly as he said. Redacted saw him yell at
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: Maxwell and Redacted. Epstein dictated Redacted's hairstyle color and silent
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: clothes that she wore. Epstein had redacted dire hair blonde,
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: cut it to a boycut, and have bangs. Sometimes Epstein
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: would go to the salon and tell them what to
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: do to her hair. Epstein would buy redacted clothes. If
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: Redacted wore clothes that Epstein did not like, he would
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: talk to her when she got them. When Redacted ball closed,
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: she would show Epstein to get his approval. Epstein also
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: directed to redacted redacted or redacted or redacted and Redacted.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: Epstein commented on Redacted's weight. Epstein would tell her Redacted
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: to lay off the brownies and tell her she should
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: go to the gym. Epstein generally made comments to others
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: as well, including redacted. Redacted would go to Epstein to
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: get approval for every decision she made. Redacted renovated the
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: guest apartment and went to him to get approval for it.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: Epstein knew that Redacted had boyfriends because she talked about them.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: Epstein gave his opinion to her about them. Epstein told
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: her that one of them was a loser and she
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: needed to break up with them. Epstein mostly put her
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: boyfriends down. Epstein still had sexual contact with Redacted while
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: she had boyfriends Redacted. Time with Epstein was a whirlwind,
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: and they were constantly traveling. Epstein controlled where Redacted lived
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: and where she went. They travel every three days. In
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: twenty ten, Epstein was released from jail and Redacted's responsibilities increased.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: Epstein did not have a chef at this time, so
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: Redacted was responsible for food when they traveled. Redacted was
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: renovating and decorating the rooms on the island and all
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: the apartments at three oh one East sixty sixth Street
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: in New York. After Epstein was released, Redacted did not
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: recall setting up or scheduling massages for Epstein. Epstein was
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: still getting massages. Epstein traveled with a masseuse who was redacted.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: Redacted did not recall if there was any other messuse.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: In twenty twelve, Redacted met redacted. Epstein was not involved
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: in their meeting each other. When Redacted met redacted, she
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: began traveling with them. Redacted set up a design business.
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: Epstein told Redacted she could still help with the renovations.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: The first people Redacted told about sexual encounters with Epstein
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: were her lawyers and then her therapist. Redacted have two
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: conversations with Epstein about writing a book. There was no
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: conversation about putting the sexual experience in that book. From
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: twenty thirteen to twenty eighteen, Redacted received two large payments
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: one hundred thousand and two hundred and fifty thousand from Epstein.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: Redacted had to sign a healthcare proxy so that if
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: anything happened to her, Maxwell and Epstein would be responsible
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: for her well being. They did not want her family
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: to be responsible. Redacted thought that this was Maxwell's idea,
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: but she was not sure. Redacted also had to sign
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: a confidentiality agreement. Redacted visited Epstein when he was under
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: house arrest in Palm Beach. Epstein would get massages from
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: Redacted or whoever was traveling. Epstein paid for lawyers for Redacted.
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: One of the lawyers was redacted. This was after Epstein
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: went to jail and there was civil suits. Redacted thought
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: that she may have been deposed while he was in jail.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: When Redacted had a lawsuit against Maxwell. Redacted was told
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: by Epstein's in house counsel, Darren Endike, to find the
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: lawyer and Epstein would pay for it. Redacted paid for
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: some of the expenses of the lawyer. The lawyer was redacted,
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: but he eventually stopped representing redacted because he wasn't getting paid. Redacted.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: Not all subject matter was discussed during the course of
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: this interview. Dates and times are approximate. All right, folks, there.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: It is one of the three h two reports from
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: Sarah Kellen Vickers and her interview with the FBI. All
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: the information that goes with this episode can be found
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: in the description box.