Latest / Muppet Fan Podcasts with ToughPigs.com / Fraggle Talk: Back to the Rock - Ep. 207 "This For That"

Transcript

Fraggle Talk: Back to the Rock - Ep. 207 "This For That" · Muppet Fan Podcasts with ToughPigs.com

• 0:08
  Hello and welcome to Fraggle Talk Back to the Rock, the
• 0:12
  unofficial Fraggle Rock podcast brought to you by toughpigs.com.
• 0:16
  This is the podcast where we cover Fraggle Rock Back to the
• 0:18
  Rock episode by episode, along with the talented producers,
• 0:22
  performers, writers and builders who helped put it all together.
• 0:25
  I'm your host, silly creature Joe Hennes.
• 0:28
  Today we are talking about Season 2, episode 7, This for
• 0:32
  That, in which the Fraggles learn the value of a dollar.
• 0:36
  This week we've got two truly priceless guests.
• 0:40
  Our first guest is the brilliant director of eight episodes of
• 0:43
  Backs of the Rock, including this one.
• 0:45
  It's Jordan Canning. Hello, Jordan.
• 0:48
  Hello. Great to have you here.
• 0:51
  Thank you. Great to be here.
• 0:54
  And our 2nd guest is a Co creator of the original Fraggle
• 0:57
  Rock as well as a writer and producer on Back to the Rock.
• 1:01
  It is such a joy to welcome Jocelyn Stevenson back to the
• 1:04
  podcast. Hi, Jocelyn.
• 1:06
  Hello, really nice to be here. It's so good to have you both
• 1:10
  here. I'm really excited to jump into
• 1:12
  this episode with the both of you.
• 1:15
  Which Jocelyn you wrote, Jordan, you directed and and you just
• 1:18
  told me before we got started that you've never met.
• 1:21
  How is that possible? Well, I've been I've I'm in
• 1:25
  Canada. I was in Calgary during the
• 1:27
  shoot, but I think the writers room, Jocelyn, where were you
• 1:30
  guys? Were you all over the?
• 1:30
  Place I'm in I'm in London, Uki mean, so even in the writers
• 1:35
  room that always went every evening for me from six till
• 1:38
  9:00 and after that I really was no brain dead.
• 1:41
  So so it's yeah, I was in I'm in the I'm in the UK.
• 1:45
  So, you know, though when we did the original series, you know, I
• 1:49
  would fly over lived in Toronto while we that this is just that
• 1:53
  this is different. And it's too bad because, you
• 1:56
  know, that was really fun to have that kind of collaboration.
• 1:59
  But I completely understand how I just in this world now, it's
• 2:02
  just was not possible. So does that mean that, so
• 2:07
  Jocelyn, in this case, you, you wrote a script, you went through
• 2:10
  several drafts, I assume, and then you just kind of handed it
• 2:13
  over to Jordan and there's no real overlap or no, no real
• 2:18
  conversation between the writer and the director in this case?
• 2:22
  No, I mean, I bet we both would have loved it too.
• 2:25
  I just don't. It just wasn't worked into the
• 2:27
  schedule. Matt and Alex, I kind of took
• 2:31
  that on and when And also for me this time too, it's right.
• 2:35
  I was writing and I've never written in an American writers
• 2:38
  room like that. And that was really interesting
• 2:40
  how much everybody contributes to the scripts and you know, but
• 2:44
  we I think all the writers because none of them really I I
• 2:48
  know Charlie Feldman, they went up for her their episode, but it
• 2:54
  was just because it wasn't part of the budget and it wasn't part
• 2:56
  of the schedule. The writers couldn't go.
• 2:58
  And you, you've learned so much. Just been this set this time
• 3:01
  too. Whoa, blew my mind.
• 3:04
  Jordan. I don't know how you did it.
• 3:05
  What a thing. It's gigantic.
• 3:08
  It was. Big.
• 3:09
  It was a big set. It's a big set, Yeah.
• 3:12
  Yeah. Matt and Alex are there on set,
• 3:14
  or one or the other is usually there on set.
• 3:15
  So I mean, we shot the first season during COVID, and so they
• 3:22
  were really keeping the number of people kind of as contained
• 3:26
  as they could, you know? Yeah.
• 3:28
  So I didn't hand. I handed the script over to Matt
• 3:31
  and Alex, who had been involved in it anyway.
• 3:34
  So, you know, it wasn't and, and and yeah, that.
• 3:37
  But Jordan and I didn't, you know, I didn't, I didn't even
• 3:40
  know Jordan was directing it until I knew Jordan was
• 3:42
  directing it. You know what I mean?
• 3:44
  When in the old days we would have had a big table read and
• 3:48
  everybody in it and the whole thing.
• 3:49
  But you, you know, we just couldn't do it this way, that
• 3:51
  way this day. Maybe for season three, you'll
• 3:55
  come out to Calgary. Jordan, a lot of folks on this
• 4:00
  podcast, so we've been recording, have been crediting
• 4:02
  you as one of the big driving forces of The Voice and the look
• 4:06
  of Season 2 of Back to the Rock specifically because you've
• 4:09
  directed so many episodes on the front half.
• 4:12
  Can you talk a bit about the work that you personally put
• 4:15
  into this season as a whole? Yeah, I mean, I was, I, I mean,
• 4:19
  working on season one, you know, it's like, as you can imagine,
• 4:22
  just the best job in the world with the greatest people and the
• 4:26
  most creative, joyful work environment you can ever
• 4:30
  imagine. And so I was so thrilled to come
• 4:34
  back for Season 2 and to come back as the producing director
• 4:38
  and to get to do the opening episode.
• 4:40
  And so I did 136 and seven, I think.
• 4:44
  So one is the big, you know, sort of setting the stage for
• 4:48
  Season 2. And then three, I mean, I know
• 4:50
  we're only talking about 7:00 today, but.
• 4:53
  No, we're talking about all of them, yeah.
• 4:55
  Learned so much from season one. You know, we, that's the first
• 4:59
  time I'd worked with puppets. And it was also, you know, it
• 5:02
  was first season, so we were all learning a lot.
• 5:03
  A lot of us who worked on the show had never worked with
• 5:05
  puppets either, hadn't shot them, hadn't been in sets
• 5:09
  designed for puppeteers. And so part of it was, yeah, was
• 5:15
  was bringing what we learned from season one in terms of what
• 5:18
  really worked. You know, kind of what what is
• 5:21
  the best way to shoot the puppets?
• 5:24
  What's the best sort of what are what are the things that puppets
• 5:27
  do really well that we can highlight and do more of?
• 5:30
  And what are the things that kind of like maybe didn't work
• 5:33
  so well or tricky for for puppets to do?
• 5:36
  And maybe we kind of like do less of those.
• 5:40
  So you know, one of the things specifically I, I know you know,
• 5:45
  and like puppets look, it's tricky.
• 5:47
  Obviously, when you're thinking about puppets, there's certain
• 5:49
  shot sizes, frames that you can't do because if you widened
• 5:52
  out, you'd see a bunch of people's heads.
• 5:55
  So, you know, that limits you sometimes in terms of your
• 5:59
  coverage. But what I really took note of
• 6:03
  from some of my favorite episodes of season one was like,
• 6:06
  puppets look great on a wide lens up close.
• 6:09
  So that was something that I really took into season 2 was
• 6:12
  like, OK, I know it's very tempting to be like, OK, we have
• 6:14
  our, you know, a cameras doing a kind of wider shot of all of
• 6:18
  them. And then you just throw a long
• 6:20
  lens on B Cam and that's how you get your tighter stuff.
• 6:23
  It's just not as good, doesn't look as juicy as when you, like,
• 6:26
  come up close to the puppet, you put a wider lens on, you get
• 6:30
  that same sort of tighter shot, but you can see so much more of
• 6:36
  the environment. You see so much more of like
• 6:38
  what the puppet does best. So that was definitely like a
• 6:41
  kind of cinematic creative thing that we brought into Season 2
• 6:45
  that I think carried through the rest of the season.
• 6:47
  And it looks fabulous, I think. Yeah.
• 6:50
  I I think that that you hit the nail on the head there that it
• 6:53
  feels cinematic. Not that the first season
• 6:55
  didn't, but this season is definitely more specifically
• 7:00
  blatantly cinematic in a lot of those ways, Especially with the
• 7:04
  way that you all have used the these, like enormous sets, these
• 7:08
  gorgeous backdrops. And you want to have such a good
• 7:11
  focus on them because they're so beautiful.
• 7:14
  And like you said, like the characters can be so small at
• 7:16
  the bottom of the screen. Exactly.
• 7:18
  Big wide shots are kind of, unless you have a lot of great
• 7:21
  ways to layer and kind of different heights of puppets in
• 7:24
  the frame. It's a bummer 'cause you just
• 7:26
  have these little little guys at the bottom that you see the big
• 7:29
  set. But you got to find the balance
• 7:31
  between feeling the sad and the environment, but also making
• 7:34
  sure the puppets are sort of like they're the, they're the
• 7:36
  main chorus, right? Yeah, absolutely.
• 7:41
  Speaking of updating to the second season, Jocelyn, you were
• 7:44
  obviously such a huge influence on the original Fraggle Rock, as
• 7:47
  well as the launch of Back to the Rock.
• 7:50
  Now that the groundwork has been set for for what Back to the
• 7:54
  Rock is, how did you feel about starting to sort of change up
• 7:58
  little things for Season 2? I I was sort of designated the
• 8:03
  essence checker, which is in the in the writers room.
• 8:07
  So it was kind of self designated, but also agreed by
• 8:11
  Alex and Matt so that if you know, I I loved everything
• 8:17
  people, but if something didn't quite fit, I had the you know, I
• 8:22
  had the ability to say you guys doesn't quite stuff doesn't
• 8:25
  quite fit right. So there was that, but that
• 8:30
  didn't happen for everybody knows and loves, you know,
• 8:33
  Fraggle Rock. The thing, the thing actually
• 8:35
  that happened after finishing the first season, I was in the
• 8:39
  writers room for three weeks and I wrote one episode.
• 8:42
  And then the second season they asked me to be in the room for
• 8:45
  the entire 20 weeks, which was really, really great.
• 8:49
  I was so I was so pleased that they that they did because
• 8:52
  instead of just thinking, oh, who's old, that old bag in the
• 8:54
  corner telling us we can't do this and that I was, and it also
• 8:59
  meant I could work on every script and, and so that that
• 9:03
  made a difference to me too. But at the end of Season 2, when
• 9:06
  we finished the writing, I remember thinking, Oh my God, we
• 9:10
  we did things in this in these last two seasons that we like
• 9:15
  the Jerry, Jim, Michael, Frith, me and Duncan are at the
• 9:18
  original sort of Fraggle 5. When we were when we were first
• 9:22
  developing the show, we never ever would have dreamed of these
• 9:26
  things. But they're all Fraggle rock.
• 9:29
  So the thing that I really came away feeling was, my God, it's
• 9:33
  so flexible this world. So, so if there's so much
• 9:37
  possibility in it, which we felt at the time, but then I think
• 9:41
  this group has just this, you know, the new version right back
• 9:44
  to the rock has just taken it into all those areas we just
• 9:48
  couldn't even dream about then. So did that answer your
• 9:52
  question? Yeah, yeah.
• 9:53
  I mean, and you know, talking about you were just mentioning
• 9:56
  your role as the essence checker and to be able to also say that
• 10:01
  you can do almost anything in Fraggle Rock, which feels like
• 10:05
  like you made your job really easy there.
• 10:06
  Like I'm making sure that you can.
• 10:08
  Only do things there would be little character things like,
• 10:11
  you know, you know, that wouldn't happen or, you know,
• 10:14
  or, or it would be a lot of a lot of what I did too, was just
• 10:17
  structure, 'cause we, we were, we used 3DX structure always in
• 10:21
  Fraggle Rock and, and Matt and Alex are, are comedy writers and
• 10:27
  they did American, you know, they did the New Girl.
• 10:30
  So that's live action. As to what what Jordan was
• 10:34
  saying, you know, he constantly wanted to sort of say, you know,
• 10:36
  you guys, guys, guys, puppets don't sit on sofas and have
• 10:39
  conversations. You have to, you know, you have
• 10:42
  to keep the movie when that has to be something to to her point
• 10:45
  about how you know how to write for puppets.
• 10:49
  It's important that the episodes are, are somebody's story and we
• 10:54
  when it was Jerry Jewell who first introduced sort of the,
• 10:57
  our four questions, which I introduced in tonight.
• 10:59
  Whose story is it? What is their goal, IE, what do
• 11:02
  they want to do? What is the risk, IE, what
• 11:05
  happens if they don't do it and what do they learn?
• 11:07
  So that, that, and that's like the, the, the basis for almost
• 11:11
  every story, you know, you know, 3X structure.
• 11:14
  And so I would be pulling people back into that.
• 11:16
  That was was my also my role going wait, wait, wait, wait.
• 11:20
  We've been vamping on a Moki joke now for the last hour and
• 11:24
  it's hilarious. The people in the room are
• 11:26
  hilar. I love all of them.
• 11:28
  I'm such talented writers. It was so much fun.
• 11:31
  But this is Wembley's story and we haven't seen him for two
• 11:34
  scenes. You know, it would be that kind
• 11:36
  of thing that I would contribute.
• 11:39
  And that's why I thought they'll never ask me back.
• 11:41
  But that. You kept them on track though.
• 11:44
  That's. Important.
• 11:45
  They could go, they could go as far as they wanted.
• 11:47
  And I, I was in the room to say, you know what, it's almost
• 11:50
  there, but it's just just not quite.
• 11:52
  It's not really fragging. You know, I was, I could do
• 11:54
  that, which was useful I guess. Sure.
• 11:57
  I mean, you had to be, you had to be bad cop a little bit to to
• 12:00
  kind of keep them from going. Like you got to say no a few
• 12:03
  times to make sure that everything keeps staying concise
• 12:07
  and fragging. They're always so gorgeous
• 12:09
  because they just would go, oh, Oh, yeah, you're right, you
• 12:11
  know, yeah. Yeah, that's it's called tough
• 12:15
  love. It's called collaboration.
• 12:20
  Come on. Yes, yes, all of the above.
• 12:24
  Jordan, by my count, you directed 5 episodes this season.
• 12:29
  Yeah. Do you have?
• 12:31
  A favorite. No, I did 5 total.
• 12:34
  I did two last year. Is that right?
• 12:37
  No, I think you did eight. I think you did 8 total for my
• 12:40
  again for just for my count. Oh my God, did I?
• 12:43
  Wait, should we look this up before I actually ask my?
• 12:45
  Question so I don't get #1 So note that to.
• 12:48
  Seven, you're going to have to look it up because I said that
• 12:51
  in the intro and I was like, I thought it was only 5, but
• 12:54
  you're right, I did two blocks. I did, I think I did 5 in Season
• 12:58
  2. OK, so you did.
• 13:00
  So season one you did Flutterflies, Crackle Lagoon,
• 13:03
  and Giggle Gaggle. That's three.
• 13:05
  This season I did eight. I did eight.
• 13:07
  You're right. You did great wins Moki and
• 13:10
  Lanford Repeati birds mezzo live in concert and this for that.
• 13:14
  I love this show I'm so happy it.
• 13:17
  Just flies by. Honestly, you said eight and I
• 13:21
  was like, that can't be right, Surely I didn't do that, mate.
• 13:23
  But yes, eight, yeah, eight amazing episodes.
• 13:26
  I loved every one of them. I love all of my children
• 13:28
  equally. Does.
• 13:29
  That mean, does that mean that they didn't pay you for some of
• 13:31
  them? No, no, they paid me.
• 13:32
  They paid me. OK, good.
• 13:34
  Yeah, that's maybe the most important.
• 13:37
  OK, so that said, with all these episodes that you've directed,
• 13:39
  do you have a favorite? Oh God.
• 13:44
  OK, Should we keep it to season 2 or of all of them?
• 13:47
  Let's let's keep it to season 2, But if you do want to talk about
• 13:51
  something from season one, I'm not going to stop you.
• 13:53
  Well, I there's so many elements of each one that I love.
• 13:58
  Like there's musical numbers and one that I like, you know, my
• 14:02
  favorite favorite musical number probably of this season is
• 14:06
  radishes versus strawberries. It's so much fun to do I but I
• 14:12
  also love you know, it takes 2, the Moki Lanford's duet.
• 14:16
  I love that one so much. And then just re watching this
• 14:19
  for that. I was like, this is solid one
• 14:21
  too. They're all there's all such
• 14:22
  great episodes. There's amazing themes and then
• 14:26
  there's such great character moments.
• 14:27
  There's such fun songs, but got a favorite?
• 14:32
  Probably. Probably when Moki met Lanford,
• 14:36
  just because I love Lanford so much and you know, you just
• 14:39
  getting to spend time with him is really fun.
• 14:42
  I agree and and especially on this rewatch of mine that I'm
• 14:45
  doing for this podcast, I'm finding so much more to love
• 14:49
  about Lanford just because Ingrid Hansen is.
• 14:52
  Such a goofball and she put so much of herself.
• 14:55
  Into it she really is. She sent me a birthday voice
• 14:58
  memo wishing me singing Happy Birthday as Lanford, so I will
• 15:03
  keep that forever. I love it.
• 15:08
  Jocelyn, one more question for you.
• 15:10
  Did you, since you only wrote one episode solo for for this
• 15:16
  season, did you assign it to yourself or did someone else
• 15:21
  kind of say like Jocelyn? Seems like a like a new episode.
• 15:25
  I can't honestly remember. No, I think he I think they all
• 15:29
  had in their heads who would do. Honestly, that's the that's a
• 15:33
  very good question. I can't remember how it happened
• 15:36
  because it it wasn't, it's not the IT wasn't the usual.
• 15:40
  You pitch an idea that you have and then you get to write that
• 15:42
  show. We everything was so
• 15:44
  collaborative in the writers room And and it's interesting
• 15:48
  because my the other season one I did was both times were Moki
• 15:51
  stories and both both episodes that I did.
• 15:55
  Which one did you do in season one, Jocelyn?
• 15:57
  It was the one with the the where the echoing echo cave.
• 16:02
  Oh. Yeah, Echo.
• 16:04
  Yeah, that's a great one. Yeah.
• 16:06
  I knew you'd ask me that and I suddenly went, no, you're not
• 16:08
  going to remember. You know that voice in your
• 16:10
  head. And and yeah, the echo, which
• 16:14
  that was a great episode. And Moki, it's hilarious.
• 16:18
  And it was really fun working with Donna.
• 16:20
  I mean, I again, I didn't get to meet her to work with.
• 16:22
  Her but was a dream. Yeah, yeah.
• 16:25
  And yeah, and I just, and because in the in the original,
• 16:29
  in the original series, Red was my, was my Fraggle cause Red was
• 16:34
  my Fraggle cause Karen and I sort of developed her together
• 16:38
  again, that thing where people, you know, a writer working with
• 16:41
  a, with a performer, it was really fun.
• 16:43
  But then Boober, I, you know, it was, it was side bottom,
• 16:47
  discovering the side, the side of Uber that he keeps on the
• 16:51
  bottom. I worked with Dave on that.
• 16:53
  And that was, that was really fun.
• 16:55
  And then so I really didn't have, I really hadn't done a lot
• 16:58
  of Moki. And so it was really fun to do
• 17:01
  'cause she can be hilariously serious.
• 17:05
  And I love them and and and for this episode, yeah, this this
• 17:12
  big idea. When you say that about if
• 17:14
  somebody I I think I can't remember who is somebody in the
• 17:17
  writers room suggested could we could we try to tackle
• 17:21
  capitalism? And we all went well.
• 17:24
  That's an interesting idea for kids, you know, but but you
• 17:28
  know, Fraggle Rock is all about big ideas and yeah.
• 17:31
  And when, as we got to talking about it in this, in this
• 17:34
  character, you know, Price, Aha, right.
• 17:37
  Coming from yeah. And it all started and it all.
• 17:41
  Yes, it it, it all started to. Yeah, I didn't can't.
• 17:44
  And I can't remember if I said I, you know, I want to do that
• 17:47
  episode or whether I think Matt and Alex might have just decided
• 17:50
  that that was the one I should do.
• 17:52
  So they they were like, oh, you seem anti capitalistic.
• 17:56
  Maybe like you just. Yeah, exactly.
• 18:00
  It's it's like, no, you know how you could, we know, you know how
• 18:04
  we trust you to be able to break this down for kids, right?
• 18:07
  Yeah, and it is a complicated topic and and I mean, we're
• 18:10
  going to have to jump into this episode just to like kind of
• 18:12
  break it open a little bit. But it is such a, like you said,
• 18:14
  it's a huge topic. I wouldn't have known where to
• 18:18
  even start to talk about it without getting into some sort
• 18:23
  of problematic or or overly confusing territory.
• 18:28
  As I'm remembering now, the whether I can't remember that,
• 18:31
  whether I hit on it or I honestly don't remember or
• 18:34
  whether it's, but the idea just this for that to me just opened
• 18:38
  the whole thing up because it was so simple.
• 18:41
  And you can get. That and so that's where it's,
• 18:44
  you know, that's where it started.
• 18:46
  And yeah, once you once, once that idea was there, then we
• 18:51
  could work with that. Yeah.
• 18:52
  And thankfully you don't have to get into the whole like like how
• 18:55
  does currency work and how many radishes per thing.
• 19:00
  But what is currency? But this whole?
• 19:01
  But this is what it's about. Totally, yes.
• 19:05
  And and it's, yeah. And it's, it's arbitrary.
• 19:08
  That's what's so, you know, And in the end, Moki, something's
• 19:13
  bothering her about this whole thing.
• 19:15
  I mean, if we go through the episode you.
• 19:16
  But there's that moment when I can't remember the character,
• 19:20
  but he was on get, he was, he was getting a ride from Is It
• 19:24
  Grizzard? The.
• 19:25
  Grizzard, Grizzard. I don't know some of the new
• 19:27
  characters anymore. I don't know some of the new
• 19:29
  characters. He has Grizzard's back and he
• 19:32
  lost his hat or it and and Moki said, Oh, I'll, I, you know,
• 19:36
  don't worry, I'll pick it up for you.
• 19:38
  Well, you no, I can't accept it because I don't have a
• 19:40
  strawberry to give you for picking up my hat.
• 19:42
  And that was this. That to me was a huge and you
• 19:45
  did it beautifully. Jordan, this, this moment when
• 19:47
  she's like, wait a minute, this is.
• 19:51
  And so that was like a pivotal moment where she's something
• 19:54
  about this is really bothering me, basically is what Moki was
• 19:57
  what happening with Moki? And then, yeah, the, the, she
• 20:02
  goes to the trash heap, but the trash heap doesn't give her the
• 20:04
  answer. The trash heap gives her the way
• 20:06
  to think about it, 'cause that's the other thing I always, you
• 20:09
  know, we don't want to give your main character has to figure it
• 20:11
  out for themselves. And yeah.
• 20:15
  So yeah, I was, I was pleased with how all that worked out.
• 20:18
  Watching it again, I was really pleased with how it all worked
• 20:22
  out. You should be.
• 20:23
  It's a, it's a great episode and and I think I think you are both
• 20:26
  really successful in, in conveying this, again, very
• 20:29
  complicated message. Yeah, you know, it's solid and I
• 20:34
  and it was brilliantly directed. Brilliantly directed.
• 20:37
  Brilliantly written. Brilliantly watched by me.
• 20:41
  Yeah, absolutely. Excellent.
• 20:44
  OK, so now sorry, we'll stop and you can.
• 20:46
  No, it's OK. Let's talk about this episode.
• 20:52
  We open as Wrench and Turbo Doozer are like being belayed
• 20:55
  down from the ceiling kind of Mission Impossible style.
• 20:59
  They're searching for Gusty's. One of them.
• 21:01
  I can never remember which one is Wrench and which one's Turbo,
• 21:03
  but one of them has this like great device on their back
• 21:07
  that's like they're not just holding onto the rope.
• 21:09
  It's like coming out of this backpack thing.
• 21:12
  Doozers. Got a propeller on it and like a
• 21:16
  mean light bulb and like whatever.
• 21:17
  I mean, there's no comment on it.
• 21:19
  It's just a cool Doozer thing. And I love, I love seeing that
• 21:23
  stuff. It looks so good.
• 21:25
  Yeah, I mean the Doozer, the Doozer stuff this season two, I
• 21:28
  think we really, we went, we leaned into it.
• 21:31
  I mean, those dozers are man, they can be really tricky to
• 21:34
  work with, but they're so fun when they work.
• 21:37
  And the little, the miniatures and the little tools and the
• 21:40
  little details that the creature shop puts into it are just like
• 21:45
  unparalleled. So, yeah, we had, I think what
• 21:47
  there's a little spinning, you know, propeller on it.
• 21:51
  And we we incorporated some of those kind of there's like a
• 21:54
  specific vehicle. I don't know if it's in this
• 21:58
  episode or not. I know we have the gusty sucker
• 22:01
  in this episode. But there's also like there's a
• 22:03
  there's a one of the vehicles that they drive maybe in six
• 22:07
  that was a sort of retrofitted version of the the dooser
• 22:12
  vehicles. But we added a whole bunch of
• 22:13
  whirly gigs onto it to make it feel more like this is for
• 22:16
  finding wins. You know, it's just fun to take
• 22:19
  the kind of base of something and then, you know, put a bunch
• 22:23
  of silly silliness on top of it. Yeah.
• 22:26
  Two, two things I wanted, two things I wanted to say.
• 22:28
  One is it's a long away, away from the days when we first were
• 22:32
  doing the Doozers and there would be a moment when the the
• 22:36
  remote control didn't work and a Doozer would just walk off the
• 22:39
  end of. Well, there's versions of that
• 22:42
  that's still happening. They might not go.
• 22:44
  And that was a lot of money that you're losing if your dozer
• 22:46
  falls on the floor. But the other thing I wanted to
• 22:49
  say about just about that, starting with that scene is the
• 22:51
  other, the other challenge for us was we had all these big arcs
• 22:57
  that were going on with there was, you know, the, there were
• 23:00
  the Gusties and, you know, all this stuff going on and things
• 23:02
  going on with the frag and the relationship between the
• 23:04
  Fraggles and the Gorgs. And you kind of had to touch in
• 23:07
  on those every episode. That was challenging to keep it.
• 23:11
  Yeah, there's a lot of serialized stories in this
• 23:14
  season. There were in season one too.
• 23:16
  But this season, yeah, it had some really ambitious, big
• 23:19
  overarching storylines that yeah, like you said, you had.
• 23:23
  You had to have them in every episode.
• 23:25
  Pretty. Yeah, and you know, Alex would
• 23:26
  be up like madly drawing on the, you know, the whiteboard, making
• 23:29
  sure we got it all in. And yeah, that was, it was
• 23:32
  challenging and all. What's going on with Doc and her
• 23:36
  career and, you know, and how you make it all work?
• 23:38
  Yeah, that was fun. And to that point, I I feel like
• 23:43
  it must have been a challenge specifically for the Doozers
• 23:46
  because their through line through this season is a little
• 23:50
  simpler than the others, especially the Fraggles.
• 23:53
  Definitely the Gorgs. And I don't know, just I've
• 23:57
  noticed that that their storylines are kind of peppered
• 24:00
  in just a little bit. There's a little we're looking
• 24:02
  for the Gusties or we're planting a seed for for radishes
• 24:08
  or, you know, like it. Not a full story most some of
• 24:11
  the time, but just a little something.
• 24:13
  Just don't forget the Doozers are out there and this will come
• 24:16
  back in two episodes. Yeah, and then bringing
• 24:18
  Cotterpin, once Cotterpin kind of joins forces with the
• 24:21
  Fraggles, you know, in the back half of the season, then you
• 24:24
  kind of have a more organic way of keeping the Doozers stuff and
• 24:27
  the Doozer technology alive throughout, you know, the the
• 24:31
  main AB storylines and stuff. Jordan, it was your shot where
• 24:35
  the little Periscope comes up. Yeah, I remember writing that
• 24:42
  was one something that. I oh man, it took us a while to
• 24:45
  figure out how to do that too, 'cause like we wanted to shoot
• 24:48
  it in the real garden, but the way the set goes, you know, it's
• 24:52
  on a little bit of a decline. So we had a puppeteer like
• 24:54
  crammed. Oh, no.
• 24:56
  That was at first what we thought we were gonna do.
• 24:57
  Then we smartened up and we made, we made a separate little,
• 25:01
  almost like a little sandbox that, you know, we could shoot
• 25:05
  just the insert in so that a puppeteer didn't have to climb
• 25:08
  underneath the floor of of a very, you know, shallow set.
• 25:15
  They. Would have done it though.
• 25:17
  They would have done it. They would have but.
• 25:19
  The idea of it, it amused us so much in the writers room that
• 25:22
  when you actually shot this idea of this teeny little thing
• 25:25
  coming into news that that Matt and Alex actually sent me, you
• 25:30
  know, they took footage of it on when they were watching.
• 25:33
  It was very fun to do that. Yeah, that's exactly what you
• 25:36
  know. You write it and you're like,
• 25:37
  Yep, that's going to be fun. That's going to be cute.
• 25:39
  Yeah, I bet they won't be able to do it, but then.
• 25:44
  But that's. Also, that's also one of those
• 25:46
  things that I, I think about a lot.
• 25:48
  I'm sure the two of you do too. And maybe not many other people
• 25:51
  in this world where, you know, the Fraggle Rock, especially the
• 25:53
  old show was so much about the Fraggles and their relation to
• 25:57
  relationship to the Gorgs and the relationship to the Doozers.
• 26:00
  But we don't see a lot of the relationship between the Doozers
• 26:02
  and the Gorgs. And we get these tastes of, you
• 26:06
  know, the Doozers are still harvesting radishes from the
• 26:09
  Gorg's garden. And they, they're interacting
• 26:11
  without knowing that they really exist for the most part.
• 26:14
  And so I love seeing these little things like, like the
• 26:17
  Periscope, like, you know, in another episode, there's like a
• 26:20
  laser beam that circles a strawberry and sucks it down
• 26:23
  and. The scale was so hard to figure
• 26:26
  out. Just the scale was so hard to
• 26:27
  figure out in the old days with we just didn't have the same
• 26:31
  technology that we just couldn't.
• 26:34
  So we just had to be satisfied that that the this, this, that
• 26:38
  the audience could see the connection.
• 26:39
  The audience could see that the Doozers were connected to the
• 26:41
  Gorgs by the blah, blah, blah, right.
• 26:43
  But yeah, we to be able, oh, I can't tell you how satisfying it
• 26:48
  was to to be able to write that thing a little Doozer Periscope.
• 26:52
  I know it seems silly, but a little Doozer Periscope goes up
• 26:55
  into the Gorgs garden. He's just, we never would have
• 26:58
  been able to do that. So.
• 27:00
  Now I feel like you all do that a lot as writers where you're
• 27:04
  like, I had this idea like Jordan, now it's your problem
• 27:07
  you figured out. Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 27:09
  But she would have been, I would have been able to talk to her.
• 27:12
  You know, we would have been going through the script with
• 27:15
  her, you know, red ink and saying no.
• 27:18
  What do you? Yeah.
• 27:18
  This is too hard. We can't do this.
• 27:20
  What if we do this? And I mean that process does
• 27:22
  happen once I get the script, I just I have to do it with I do
• 27:25
  it with Matt and Alex instead of Jocelyn or whoever wrote the the
• 27:28
  original draft of the script. I know, but there are also open
• 27:32
  to, I mean, we again, it's I'll say it a million times, like we
• 27:36
  learned so much in season one of what worked and what was a
• 27:41
  nightmare to try to do. And you know, so now I can like
• 27:44
  I can go through a script, a Fraggle script or a puppet
• 27:47
  script and be like, no, don't try to do, don't bother trying
• 27:50
  to do this. We can find something cooler and
• 27:53
  more achievable to do here than this, because it will take us
• 27:57
  three hours and it won't look that great even if we get it,
• 28:01
  you know? That's why I could never believe
• 28:04
  they allowed the floping episode in series one.
• 28:07
  I mean in the original series where the doozers were on Pogo
• 28:11
  sticks. I know, but that.
• 28:13
  Looked great. I.
• 28:15
  Know four in the morning and yeah, I have to confess that
• 28:19
  wasn't that was my idea. And now people did not like me
• 28:25
  then as we were like 3 in the morning.
• 28:30
  That's how you make. That's how you make TV, Yeah.
• 28:33
  Well, and I mean the, the, the how much we use the blue screen
• 28:36
  helps a lot obviously now in, in, in the new iteration of the
• 28:40
  show. So a lot of things are more
• 28:42
  possible. Like in the first episode of the
• 28:44
  season when we have the big windstorm, we wanted to do all
• 28:47
  these crazy, you know, we wanted to have the like Wizard of Oz
• 28:50
  sort of Doozers. You know, we had a Doozer rowing
• 28:52
  a boat and a granny in a rocking chair and it's like great,
• 28:57
  that's not on a string. That's like we just shoot the
• 29:00
  elements on blue screen and then they get laid in and it looks
• 29:02
  great. It's like a a lot easier to kind
• 29:04
  of try some of those big silly things because they won't eat
• 29:09
  into your day. It's like actually quite an
• 29:10
  achievable little fun visual joke to to layer into an already
• 29:15
  great scene. So now you know Jocelyn add more
• 29:19
  stuff like that into the scripts, they can handle it.
• 29:22
  No, but now that I, now that I know Jordan, I'd be ringing her
• 29:25
  up saying what do you think about this?
• 29:26
  I. Love it.
• 29:28
  Yeah. Do it.
• 29:29
  So wrench in turbo. They find a cave full of wind.
• 29:34
  It's the mother lode. And, you know, actually, we
• 29:38
  were, we were just talking about having dozers on green screens.
• 29:41
  Is that, is that how they're being puppeteered here?
• 29:44
  Or they're I, I, I I don't really have a concept of.
• 29:48
  So are they all remote? They're 100% remote.
• 29:50
  There's no cables attached to them.
• 29:53
  If their head is always remote, the head and talking is always
• 29:58
  remote, they will be raw puppeteered for like hand
• 30:04
  movement. You know, if the later in the
• 30:06
  episode you've got Cotter pin and you've got the four of them
• 30:12
  about to suck all the gusty suckers in, they are sort of
• 30:16
  secured onto the surface of the set and then puppeteers
• 30:20
  underneath with two little rods rodding their arms so that the
• 30:24
  arms can move. And then another puppeteer is
• 30:26
  off to the side doing the head and mouth stuff.
• 30:29
  And then sometimes you just have them on a stick and it's just,
• 30:32
  that's my favorite. It's just a doozer on a stick.
• 30:34
  So if you want to have them walking in the background, just
• 30:37
  that. Yeah, Doozer on a stick sounds
• 30:39
  delicious. Doozer on a stick, yeah.
• 30:42
  Or if you put them in at you know, if you put them in a
• 30:43
  vehicle or whatever, then they're secured somewhere.
• 30:46
  But you never sometimes you do a little bit of kidding.
• 30:50
  You can sometimes don't do a lot of like steps with the Yeah
• 30:54
  watching their. Feet move, yeah.
• 30:56
  Yeah, they they hop around. Yeah.
• 30:58
  Right. They just bounce.
• 31:02
  So in the Great Hall there's we see 4 little fraggles listening
• 31:07
  to the storyteller tell a story we've learned on this podcast.
• 31:11
  That's Peach Pit, Cantaloupe, Honeydew, and I believe the 4th
• 31:14
  one is Dicky if I'm not mistaken.
• 31:17
  I don't know, everyone's got a name.
• 31:19
  Remember what the last one is called.
• 31:22
  I'm pulling all this off. I'm up at Wiki.
• 31:24
  Yeah. Dicky doesn't seem to fit the
• 31:25
  the theme of the rest of them. Yeah, as we said that we we see
• 31:30
  a Fraggle riding on the Grizzard's back and the
• 31:33
  Grizzard's kind of going. I'm having the time of my life.
• 31:36
  He's very low energy. And Moki says she's off to paint
• 31:41
  a mural of Lanford. Red sarcastically said she's she
• 31:46
  would love to help, but she told Pogey that she teached them a
• 31:49
  new swim stroke. And then we see this amazing
• 31:52
  outfit on Pogey with like goggles and arm floaties and a
• 31:55
  swim cap in this rainbow swimsuit.
• 31:58
  It's beautiful. That's a that's a wonderful bit
• 32:00
  of costuming. I will say in my director's cut,
• 32:03
  and I know why they cut it because we had to cut it for
• 32:05
  time, but I did manage to get one more shot of Pokey in that
• 32:08
  look into it of of them dancing because that that look was so
• 32:14
  good and it deserved almost an entire episode worth of
• 32:19
  featuring it. But yes, incredible.
• 32:22
  I mean, Pokey's amazing and you know, that's swimming tap.
• 32:26
  Love it, I love it. Gobo is busy writing a song for
• 32:30
  Wembley and it's a doozy, which is the name of the song.
• 32:33
  A doozy. And Boober is making backward
• 32:36
  soup, which apparently entails walking backward with the pot
• 32:39
  and falling. Falling is part of the soup
• 32:41
  recipe. I love all of this.
• 32:44
  This feels so fraggly to me. If it reminds me very much of
• 32:47
  like the first episode of the original Fraggle Rock series
• 32:49
  where we just see a gaggle of Fraggles and everyone's just
• 32:52
  doing their own thing and this is just a normal day in Fraggle
• 32:55
  Rock. But we're also setting
• 32:57
  everything up. Yes, can.
• 33:00
  You see all of it later. That's.
• 33:02
  Right for. Free.
• 33:04
  I just thought I'd point that out.
• 33:06
  No, it's important that's it's like a like a foreshadowing.
• 33:09
  Is it foreshadowing? I guess it is foreshadowing.
• 33:11
  Yeah, you could, I suppose, but it's just setting.
• 33:13
  It's just, it's set up, you know, so that there's a payoff
• 33:16
  later. Yeah.
• 33:17
  Yeah, and I, I, I because it was so nicely written that way of
• 33:21
  like, here's, you know, here's what it's normally like.
• 33:24
  And then later we're going to see when this for that sort of
• 33:26
  infiltrates and and kind of changes a normal day in fragile
• 33:30
  rock. And so how I conceived of that
• 33:32
  is it it's the it's the same shot twice.
• 33:35
  You know, it's it's sort of, you know, Moki leading us through
• 33:39
  the Great Hall and you sort of see all these things unfold.
• 33:42
  And it I mean, we had a bit of coverage, but it plays out
• 33:44
  nicely in this kind of one tracking master.
• 33:46
  And so that there's a mirror to the way that both of those
• 33:49
  scenes play out. Yeah.
• 33:53
  So just, you know, hammer that home even more.
• 33:55
  Yeah, isn't it wonderful in the direction?
• 33:59
  Just totally supports the writing.
• 34:02
  I love it. Everyone's working well
• 34:05
  together, like Frank. So does that mean did you film
• 34:11
  this scene and the scene that we'll see later on, the mirror
• 34:14
  scene back-to-back, just to make sure that you had that
• 34:17
  continuity? No, because honestly, the the
• 34:19
  last thing you're ever waiting for is the camera.
• 34:21
  Like we're set up and ready to go.
• 34:24
  It's it's not hard to change things around with the camera on
• 34:27
  Fry Rock, you're like redressing Red changing all the hand props,
• 34:32
  all that stuff takes way longer. So no, we would have shot those
• 34:34
  on different days. For sure.
• 34:36
  Interesting. Yeah, yeah, and all the
• 34:38
  radishes. I'm sorry, the strawberries.
• 34:40
  The strawberries, all that stuff.
• 34:42
  Yeah, Right, right, right. Yeah.
• 34:44
  It was more so it was just sort of conceived that way.
• 34:47
  Sure, this is where we get our first check in with Doc and
• 34:51
  Sprockets. Doc is sorting through her
• 34:54
  e-mail. Riveting.
• 34:56
  Kind of a whole episode of just throwing old emails into the
• 35:01
  trash bin. She gets an e-mail from a
• 35:04
  company that makes yachts. They are offering her a job.
• 35:07
  And this is such a highlight of the episode where Sprocket has a
• 35:11
  fantasy of him and Doc. I'm a yacht, which I just love,
• 35:16
  and they're wearing little captain's hats.
• 35:18
  Sprocket with a hat on is always a good day.
• 35:21
  Always, always. And he's drinking something out
• 35:24
  of a coconut with a crazy straw. Great prop work.
• 35:27
  No, that was again, that was another right.
• 35:29
  I think this, yeah, the straw has a little doggy bone, sort of
• 35:33
  like flourish on it, yeah. This is this is Henson.
• 35:38
  I would be surprised if it didn't.
• 35:40
  Yeah. My favorite detail here though
• 35:44
  is that so Doc is steering the boat and then when they snap out
• 35:48
  of the fantasy, her hands are still kind of in the same
• 35:51
  position, but she's doing like pointer fingers.
• 35:53
  Yeah. That's such a cool little
• 35:55
  detail. I love that.
• 35:56
  That must. Have been well that that cut
• 35:57
  worked great. On the day thing, right?
• 36:00
  Like is that just like? You'll be funny.
• 36:01
  It was about keeping them in. I always wanted to keep them in
• 36:04
  the same position like so that it could be that really fun sort
• 36:07
  of snap back to reality moment. But yes, I think the finger
• 36:10
  pointers was all her. I love it.
• 36:14
  It's good stuff. So Doc knows that if she takes
• 36:17
  this job, she'll have to give up volunteering at the high school.
• 36:19
  And so she's got a big decision to make.
• 36:22
  And I think we've all been in this position where there are
• 36:25
  opportunities in front of you and you have to make that that
• 36:27
  big choice. So Jocelyn, how in your eyes
• 36:32
  does this storyline kind of not mirror, but like layer along
• 36:38
  with the this for that story? She has to figure out what she
• 36:42
  values that and that's what that's where it comes around to
• 36:47
  because it's the episode's not about choosing, because you
• 36:50
  could think, OK, this is going to be an episode about making a
• 36:52
  choice or whatever. Now it it comes around when she
• 36:56
  at the end has to figure out what she values and fitting it
• 37:01
  towards the yes, it's because it's at the bit after Moki now.
• 37:04
  I was trying to figure out what it.
• 37:06
  So it's so now we're looking at what is what do you value?
• 37:11
  And so, yeah, she and she, I thought that that the whole DOC
• 37:16
  thing, and it really helps support that whole idea 'cause
• 37:20
  yeah, you know, unlike if she's not going for the money, you
• 37:23
  know, she knows she'd get paid, she'd get new boots.
• 37:26
  I mean, that scale was ridiculous.
• 37:28
  Oh yeah, the scale was really fun.
• 37:30
  It's. So body and and it's.
• 37:33
  Yeah, and it's and then again. And even the even the thing, the
• 37:36
  diorama, which was the wet sand, whatever they made for her was
• 37:40
  ridiculous too. But, you know, oh, I really
• 37:43
  touched her. She didn't want to give that up.
• 37:44
  So she and it is. And it also echoes the whole,
• 37:50
  you know, a show where you can say, you know, you can say the
• 37:53
  more love you, the more love you give, the more love you get.
• 37:56
  When I was able to write that line because I thought that's
• 37:58
  such a Fraggle line. And then, you know, you want and
• 38:01
  it you don't want to just feel heavy-handed and stuff.
• 38:03
  And it didn't really I thought you work up to that and the
• 38:06
  whole doc thing. I didn't think it felt.
• 38:08
  Do you guys felt think it? Felt.
• 38:09
  No. It's beautiful.
• 38:10
  It. Was it's such a pure, it's such
• 38:12
  a pure important idea. Yeah, no, I mean, obviously if
• 38:16
  Matt and Alex had thought it was heavy-handed, it would have been
• 38:18
  wouldn't have been in there. So they obviously didn't.
• 38:20
  And, and and yeah, the whole doc thing really supports that.
• 38:24
  So that's how it layers in you, you know, you don't get it right
• 38:28
  away. And then as you know, it sort of
• 38:30
  comes comes around when she's having to go.
• 38:32
  Wait a minute, what do I value? Yeah, yeah.
• 38:37
  Well, especially, you know, because the other side of it is,
• 38:40
  is also related to money. And like we're not talking too,
• 38:42
  we are a little bit like, you know, with like, oh, I could buy
• 38:44
  new shoes and I could quit the other job.
• 38:46
  But, you know, for kids who maybe don't really understand,
• 38:51
  you know what, like the, the larger ideals around money, you
• 38:56
  know, I, I think I think it worked really well for that of,
• 38:59
  you know, like, is it worth getting money for something that
• 39:02
  I don't really feel strongly about?
• 39:04
  You know, and then vice versa is actually much more powerful.
• 39:08
  We get into so much more of that in this episode.
• 39:11
  I love that theme. We check in at the Gorg's
• 39:14
  garden. The strawberries are growing
• 39:17
  like hot cakes and they're huge. Like, these props are big.
• 39:21
  Those are big strawberries. Yeah, they were fun.
• 39:24
  Yeah, what? What is the consistency?
• 39:27
  Of that. There's different ones.
• 39:29
  There's some that are sort of, I mean, they're all sort of like a
• 39:32
  yeah, what are? They made out of.
• 39:33
  Some of them are like a kind of hard hollow.
• 39:37
  I don't even know what they're made of.
• 39:40
  Some sort of hard foam sort of thing, I guess.
• 39:42
  And then there's also squishy foam ones for ones that had to
• 39:46
  like be thrown around. There are squishy ones, but
• 39:50
  yeah, there's different. There were different versions of
• 39:53
  them. Yeah, that makes sense of them
• 39:55
  too. Yeah.
• 39:56
  Yeah, well, especially the one that paws holding in this
• 39:58
  episode. It's like, I mean, it must have
• 40:00
  been, I don't know. I'm holding out.
• 40:02
  Yeah, they're about. Volleyball.
• 40:04
  Yeah, about a volleyball size, yeah.
• 40:07
  Yeah. And then you have ones that have
• 40:09
  to like interact with the fraggles that are meant to be.
• 40:12
  The whole scale thing is a whole.
• 40:14
  It's a that's a. Nightmare.
• 40:15
  You could do a Ted talk on the. I couldn't.
• 40:17
  I'm sure a. Production designer could, yeah.
• 40:20
  And it helps that the strawberries, specifically in
• 40:23
  this episode, are of all sizes, so you can have a tight one and
• 40:27
  a tight. That was encouraged.
• 40:29
  That was sort of like, let's have a few different sizes so
• 40:32
  that we aren't too stuck on the scale thing because it gets
• 40:36
  tricky. Like the scale breaks down at
• 40:38
  certain points where you're like, well, now it doesn't
• 40:40
  really work. But yeah, so we had, yeah, a bit
• 40:45
  of variety in the strawberries helped.
• 40:47
  Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's there's a
• 40:48
  certain Muppet logic that we kind of erase in our minds.
• 40:52
  The the stuff that I always think about is, you know, when
• 40:57
  let's say like there's a Fraggle on screen and a little ink spot
• 40:59
  comes up next to them. It's like, well, that ink spot
• 41:01
  is maybe, you know, 8 inches shorter by the where their eye
• 41:06
  line is. Never.
• 41:07
  Think about the floor. Yeah, hit the hit their legs
• 41:10
  have to are they on stilts to get that high?
• 41:12
  It's don't worry about it. Just enjoy the the funny
• 41:16
  puppets. They're telling you a cute
• 41:18
  story. They're singing you a song.
• 41:20
  Yeah, it's just strawberries, just radishes.
• 41:23
  Don't worry about it. Pod declares that they are BBO
• 41:27
  now, big berries only. And so it's so dumb.
• 41:34
  It's so dumb. I'm, I'm relishing in how dumb
• 41:36
  Pod Gorg is in this whole season.
• 41:38
  He's so stupid. He orders Junior to dump all the
• 41:41
  tiny ones. And so Junior just, like, takes
• 41:44
  a wheel, wheelbarrow and chucks them all down a hole.
• 41:48
  Darn the environments. They're just, they're there's
• 41:50
  someone else's problem now. And Moki is down there.
• 41:54
  She's painting her mural. And there's, like an avalanche
• 41:58
  of strawberries coming toward her.
• 41:59
  And I love this bit where she, like, braces for the impact.
• 42:02
  And she's like, oh, it wasn't even close.
• 42:03
  Yeah. It's like 7 feet between them,
• 42:06
  yeah. Yep, yeah.
• 42:08
  That was a very another great dumb joke.
• 42:10
  I love it. The Dumber the.
• 42:11
  So good. Yeah, and again, Donna sells it
• 42:14
  as as Moki. Yeah, but someone is not quite
• 42:18
  so lucky. She hears a voice, a British
• 42:20
  voice asking for helps because someone is buried under the
• 42:24
  strawberries. And she pulls them out and it's
• 42:28
  price. There's Price, our new best
• 42:30
  friend. He is voiced by Brett Goldstein,
• 42:35
  the one of the stars of Ted Lasso.
• 42:37
  And is he is John Tartaglia doing the puppetry.
• 42:41
  I forgot to look it up, but he looked like Johnny's mannerism.
• 42:45
  So I just. Assumed.
• 42:48
  We call him Saint John. Saint John.
• 42:52
  I do. He's just that nice, I'm not
• 42:57
  surprised. I'm not surprised he's just done
• 43:00
  so much. I mean, he's just such the
• 43:02
  engine and the force and the force of nature behind all of
• 43:05
  this, you know? Anyway.
• 43:06
  I. Had to see my praises of Johnny.
• 43:09
  As we do in every episode of this.
• 43:11
  Podcast, I'm sure. You do.
• 43:12
  Even the ones that he's in, people can't shut up.
• 43:15
  How much we love John Tardaglia Price is so thankful.
• 43:19
  He offers Moki his hat and then when she doesn't take that he
• 43:24
  offers her this giant pile of berries which I don't know why
• 43:27
  he feels like he owns them and can give them away but he sure
• 43:31
  why not. That's capitalism, baby.
• 43:34
  Yeah, sure. A Fraggle passes by, asks for
• 43:39
  Berry and Moki, without thinking, just go ahead and
• 43:42
  gives them one. And Price is fascinated by this.
• 43:46
  He tells her. You've got all these berries,
• 43:48
  that fraggle one-on-one, but you also want help painting your
• 43:51
  mural. And Moki says I also love
• 43:54
  listing true things, which is a great line.
• 43:57
  Yeah, yes. Price introduces this concept,
• 44:02
  this for that to her. And that's the name of the
• 44:04
  episode, by the way. Yeah.
• 44:08
  And oh, I, I also like the bit where he says, like, do you like
• 44:12
  songs and that line reading, God, That line reading Price,
• 44:16
  price, price, price. Yeah, we like songs.
• 44:20
  God. Is that funny?
• 44:21
  And you got Lanford going? Yeah.
• 44:26
  Is that so? Now is I?
• 44:28
  I assume that you wrote that in the scripts, Jocelyn, but I I
• 44:32
  can't the yeah, we like songs that bit or is Yeah, is that.
• 44:36
  That's correct. I can never take credit for the
• 44:39
  funny lines are often written by, you know, Alex or Matt or
• 44:42
  No. Yes, I'm sure I did.
• 44:44
  But is the the the intonation that?
• 44:48
  That's all, Donna. That's got to be Donna.
• 44:50
  Yeah. Oh yeah.
• 44:51
  That's totally Donna. Yeah.
• 44:53
  And Lanford adding to it is must have been improvised.
• 44:56
  I don't remember adding, you know, who knows if he would have
• 44:59
  been given a line. No, that was just all them.
• 45:03
  Yes. So good.
• 45:05
  So this is where we get our first song of the episode.
• 45:09
  This for that, and this is mostly Price singing as they
• 45:13
  kind of walk through the rock, they're passing all the sorts of
• 45:15
  creatures. I won't list them, but it's just
• 45:17
  such a beautiful menagerie of all the different puppet styles
• 45:21
  that we've seen in Fraggle Rock outside of the Fraggles.
• 45:25
  And there's one shot that I I really like of two creatures and
• 45:29
  the one of them has a strawberry, one of them has a
• 45:31
  gourd and they toss them to each other.
• 45:32
  They kind of pass in the air. How did you do that?
• 45:37
  Well, it takes there was at least 4 puppeteers dealing with
• 45:42
  that because you had each of them had the things were on
• 45:48
  sticks. I mean, the answer is generally
• 45:50
  something's on a stick. But the strawberry and the I
• 45:53
  can't remember what the thing was called.
• 45:54
  If you've got a Berry, I can't remember what.
• 45:57
  I can't remember what the other thing was called.
• 45:59
  Oh yeah, it's like a like a donkle Berry or something,
• 46:01
  right? Yeah, I can't.
• 46:03
  Remember what did I make that? Up.
• 46:05
  No, it's something something silly like that.
• 46:08
  So, you know, you had John and Donna dancing down the thing,
• 46:13
  getting to that. Then you have the two puppeteers
• 46:15
  who are puppeteering the little fuzzy creatures.
• 46:17
  And then you had two more puppeteers who had, you know,
• 46:21
  one had a strawberry and one had a dongleberry or whatever it is.
• 46:24
  And so then they had to time it. So it's like puppeteers look
• 46:27
  like they throw it and then they had to go do the arc of it and
• 46:31
  go over there. So yeah, it it took a lot.
• 46:34
  It took a few takes to get that to work.
• 46:36
  It was actually a lot more complicated than it.
• 46:38
  It looks just so like easy breezy.
• 46:41
  But yeah, you just. Toss a toss.
• 46:43
  Probably did seven or eight takes of that because, you know,
• 46:45
  sometimes they'd throw it and then it wouldn't quite look like
• 46:48
  the other one caught it or the arc didn't quite look real.
• 46:53
  So yeah, it was, it was fun though.
• 46:55
  I love that song. My, I had a real sort of hope
• 46:58
  for the end. Shot it.
• 47:00
  It got it as close as we could. I really sort of had this
• 47:03
  vision, sort of weird mixed vision of like, I don't know if
• 47:06
  you know that the Bjork video, I can't remember what it's called
• 47:11
  falling in love, that great one where she's dancing around and
• 47:14
  like the mailbox dances with her.
• 47:15
  And anyway, at the end of it, she gets on to, you know,
• 47:18
  essentially gets onto a crane and sort of like, rises up above
• 47:22
  and you see everybody dancing from below.
• 47:24
  And I had this sort of fantasy of like, that's how the song
• 47:27
  would end of, like, Price and her being sort of lifted up by
• 47:30
  this idea. And then a sort of Muppet Show,
• 47:33
  you know, all The Muppets in these little crevices and caves
• 47:36
  in the background dancing behind them, sort of intro to The
• 47:39
  Muppet Show sort of vibe. Got it.
• 47:42
  As close as we get. I'm one of the puppets back
• 47:44
  there. I'm back there.
• 47:45
  Yeah. They let me go in there and do a
• 47:47
  little. Which one is you?
• 47:49
  We got to know. His name is Rapscallion.
• 47:52
  He's my favorite puppet. He's one of the greatest.
• 47:56
  He actually. He appears.
• 47:58
  The puppet appears. He's Lil Raggo in.
• 48:02
  Lil Raggo. Lil Raggo is is the character,
• 48:05
  but the puppet's name is Rapscallion, and I just love
• 48:08
  him. He's a great size puppet.
• 48:09
  He's like a perfect little little guy to just have on your
• 48:13
  arm. So I snuck in there and did a
• 48:14
  little bit. Of a simple.
• 48:17
  Choreography I I was able to do it.
• 48:20
  And, and this goes back to what we were talking about before of
• 48:22
  just like filling the screen with all these characters and
• 48:27
  like, yeah. And.
• 48:28
  That's height. Height is really like the name
• 48:31
  of the game. Having we added, that's another
• 48:33
  thing we did this season when you were asking earlier about
• 48:36
  like changes was we added in. This actually came out of doing
• 48:42
  the 1st Jamdlin episode, the The Troubadours episode last season,
• 48:48
  season one, we had those sort of layered when we had the band all
• 48:53
  set up, we called it like the bandstand and they were these
• 48:55
  sort of like rock face here and rock face here, which obviously
• 48:59
  makes it great for puppeteering because they can hide behind it.
• 49:02
  You can get fill up the frame nicely.
• 49:05
  And we learned from that and said, OK, well, let's have some
• 49:07
  rocks of different heights. We had this rock that we called.
• 49:12
  What did we call it? I feel like we called it like a
• 49:14
  coffin rock or something, but it was just like a kind of tall,
• 49:19
  friendly rock. Yeah.
• 49:20
  I can't remember why it was called that, but you know, you
• 49:24
  see it a bunch actually in this season, just in the Great Hall,
• 49:27
  when people are walking through the Great Hall, you'll see like
• 49:29
  2 fraggles sitting on top of this tall rock.
• 49:32
  Oh yeah I noticed it in this episode because there's like 2
• 49:35
  fraggles that are like kind of canoodling at the beginning of
• 49:37
  the episode. And because it just, it just
• 49:39
  fills up the frame, you have the stairs.
• 49:42
  The stairs are really hard to puppeteer on because you they're
• 49:45
  stuck in a hole. It's not that chill.
• 49:47
  At least behind on Coffin Rock, they can be hidden behind it and
• 49:50
  they can have a bit more flexibility there.
• 49:52
  So we built in four of those different height pieces that
• 49:56
  could just be sort of, oh, bring in cotton roll in one of these
• 49:59
  rock pieces. And we used the bandstand.
• 50:01
  I think they chopped the bandstand up a bit into other
• 50:03
  pieces, but you really just need those foreground elements to
• 50:07
  help with puppeteering. If you have a big empty space,
• 50:10
  you're limited to those tiny little heads at the bottom of
• 50:13
  the frame, so. Yeah, that's great.
• 50:16
  I feel like if you all decide to do a Halloween episode, you
• 50:19
  should bring Coffin Rock into continuity a little down the
• 50:22
  coffin. Rock make a creepy Halloween
• 50:24
  episode. Yeah, we, we, we have a
• 50:26
  Halloween special ready to go. I think.
• 50:28
  I think that probably have it all laid out, but we'll see if
• 50:32
  it ever gets to be made. That's exciting.
• 50:35
  That's a good tease. That's a good tease.
• 50:36
  Just just in case. There's more coming, hopefully.
• 50:39
  I hope so. I hope so.
• 50:42
  So in the song, Price teaches Moki all about trading goods for
• 50:45
  services or goods and services and essentially introducing the
• 50:49
  concept of economics and socialism to her, which got
• 50:53
  again, such a big topic and like, well, well explained.
• 50:57
  I mean, I, I understood it. At least that's all I can say.
• 51:02
  You know, I'm not a child, but I got it after the song's over
• 51:06
  another fraggle. I think it's Peach.
• 51:08
  Pit asks Smokey for a strawberry, and she says OK, but
• 51:12
  as long as they help with the mural and Peach.
• 51:15
  But it's like, oh, that sounds like fun.
• 51:16
  And, you know, it works. Like, it's we're on, we're on
• 51:19
  our way to trading, this is for that.
• 51:23
  And eventually she gets a whole bunch of fraggles to help out
• 51:25
  with the mural, including Gobo and Wembley, who aren't helping
• 51:28
  for strawberries. They just find it fun.
• 51:32
  And this is where Gobo reads his travelling Mat postcard.
• 51:35
  Oh, yeah, Matt is in my hometown in New York.
• 51:41
  And I love this because whenever I see anything that's filmed in
• 51:43
  New York, I'm always like, where are they?
• 51:45
  I've got to figure it out. And like, even before we started
• 51:48
  seeing a real signage, I'm like, I know exactly where he is.
• 51:51
  I've passed that intersection many, many times.
• 51:54
  He's like in Long Island City in Queens, and he's watching a
• 51:59
  break dancer and his eyes are immediately drawn to something
• 52:02
  valuable. And just past that hat full of
• 52:05
  tips, it's a shiny gum wrapper. And of course, Matt falls and
• 52:10
  does a break dancing move and everyone loves it.
• 52:12
  Gives him a bunch of cash as if it's that easy to make money is
• 52:15
  a feeding his. Hat they're feeding.
• 52:18
  They're feeding his hat. Yes, of course.
• 52:20
  It's that I liked about that, he thought as they were feeding his
• 52:25
  hat. He never knew that he was
• 52:26
  hungry. But there you go, Dave got his
• 52:28
  hat. Thank goodness, or else his hat
• 52:31
  would have been like chewing away at his scalp.
• 52:34
  Yeah, somebody else comes and takes away that that gum wrapper
• 52:37
  that he was so. Somebody.
• 52:38
  That's Alex. Somebody.
• 52:40
  Alex, I didn't even notice. That yeah, Alex plays the I'm
• 52:43
  going. To have to go back with your.
• 52:45
  Guy cleaning up the street cleaner guy, Yeah.
• 52:49
  And personally speaking, I was so disappointed to find out that
• 52:51
  you all filmed in New York. And I'm like, I could have just
• 52:54
  hopped on the subway and I would have been there.
• 52:56
  So mad I missed. It tell you.
• 52:58
  Joe so disappointing, So, so angry at this episode of Fraggle
• 53:03
  Rock. Glorifying capitalism, Shooting
• 53:08
  in New York. Yeah, everything wrong about No,
• 53:11
  it's nothing wrong. I love everything about this so.
• 53:14
  But I love that Matt sends Gobo the cash that that he that he
• 53:18
  earned and then immediately Gobo just like tips it on the ground
• 53:21
  in shrugs like it's it's it's actually worthless.
• 53:24
  Everyone agrees. It's worthless, yeah.
• 53:27
  And even like every other episode or most every other
• 53:30
  episode, like they use whatever Matt sends back in the plot and
• 53:33
  this is the one where it's just like, no, why'd you waste the
• 53:36
  postage to send this to me? Yeah, after the good.
• 53:42
  Price offers Gobo a strawberry in exchange for reading the
• 53:45
  postcard, which inspires Gobo to do other things to earn
• 53:49
  strawberries. And so now all the Fraggles are
• 53:51
  in on this. Gobo is starting a songwriting
• 53:53
  business and I love that he's got a sign advertising for it
• 53:57
  with this like beautiful hand drawn, like strawberry equal
• 54:01
  sign picture of Gobo and his guitar.
• 54:04
  And he's singing the song about Pogie, which I have to know who
• 54:08
  wrote the song. It's in the I mean I.
• 54:14
  Remember whether I wrote the I know I got I actually got
• 54:19
  lyrics, PRS lyric thing for for, but I think it was the doozy
• 54:24
  thing, which was but I could have gotten it for pogey.
• 54:26
  I don't know. It's it was like they get they
• 54:29
  get written in the room. They are and sometimes I don't
• 54:32
  know how it works. I also didn't know if like, is
• 54:35
  this one of those things where like you have to send it to or
• 54:37
  you want to send it to Harvey Mason Junior's people or it's
• 54:41
  like, it's just a little ditty. Just write.
• 54:42
  It down. I think John just made-up the
• 54:44
  tune. John made-up the.
• 54:46
  He just made-up the. It was just a throwaway, yeah.
• 54:48
  Cute. That's good.
• 54:51
  Wembley is selling magic tricks. He's doing a magic trick for
• 54:55
  Large Marvin, and I love ink. I love the ink spot so much, and
• 54:59
  he pulls an ink spot out of a hat wearing Bunny ears, and it's
• 55:03
  such a good visual. I love it.
• 55:05
  Oh. Yeah, ink spots are so, so
• 55:09
  flexible. You put an ink spot at anything
• 55:11
  and it's going to make it better.
• 55:13
  Yeah, that's true for real life too.
• 55:15
  Yeah, that's not even on TV. Yeah, add an ink spot to your
• 55:18
  life and God, yeah, your day's going to get better and
• 55:20
  infinitely. Yeah, I love that.
• 55:24
  Red asks Gobo. What?
• 55:25
  What are you doing? And like, you're exchanging
• 55:28
  strawberries for things that you already do for free.
• 55:30
  And he just barely starts to explain what this for that is.
• 55:34
  And she's like, got it. OK, I'm selling dives. 2
• 55:37
  strawberries for 1/3 gets you 44 gets you a dive to swim to the
• 55:39
  end of the pot like she is in. Does not need any convincing.
• 55:44
  No, yeah, Gobo. I always then I always feel like
• 55:47
  gobo's like about to mansplain to gobo 'splain to her.
• 55:49
  And she's like, oh, yeah, yeah, OK, I got it.
• 55:52
  Relax. Yeah, I'm going to take where
• 55:54
  you're laying down and make five times more strawberries than you
• 55:56
  were. Yeah, Uber asks Moki to if he
• 56:02
  can help with her mural because he needs to earn strawberries.
• 56:06
  He doesn't want them for himself.
• 56:08
  Yeah, he he needs them to pay the bubble bubbies.
• 56:12
  So they'll give him more soapstone and we get this shot
• 56:15
  of the bubble bubbies. They're like these birds who,
• 56:17
  when they talk, bubbles blow out of their mouth.
• 56:21
  I I love. These little cutaways of just
• 56:25
  like cameras turns, we see a creature, camera turns back,
• 56:29
  we'll never see them again. Yeah, I love a little whip pan.
• 56:32
  Yeah, and those bubble, those we, we did some tests.
• 56:36
  We were like, I don't know if we can do it with the real bubbles.
• 56:39
  We had like a tube and stuff. And then the real bubbles worked
• 56:41
  out great. We were like, oh God, maybe it
• 56:42
  has to be VFX bubbles. But no, the real bubbles were
• 56:45
  awesome. Those birds are great.
• 56:48
  Those puppets barely move. Like if you want them to talk
• 56:51
  and they'll be like, like, that's as much as you get, so
• 56:55
  open your mouth and that's it. I mean they're on screen for all
• 56:58
  of like 2 seconds. So like, we didn't.
• 57:00
  Notice. Perfect for that.
• 57:01
  Yeah. And we're looking at the
• 57:02
  bubbles, so it doesn't matter. Yeah, perfect.
• 57:07
  The world's oldest Fraggle tells another Fraggle he'll reveal the
• 57:11
  secret of life for a strawberry. So he gives him a strawberry and
• 57:16
  he says, what's the secret of life goes?
• 57:17
  I don't know, do you? I'll give you strawberry.
• 57:22
  I just imagine this is how they're spending their day, just
• 57:24
  trading the same strawberry back and forth and back and back.
• 57:28
  That's good stuff. And and again, like as we said
• 57:31
  before, we're we're getting this mirror of that earlier scene,
• 57:33
  the storytellers now telling stories to the little Fraggles
• 57:37
  in exchange for strawberries. The Fraggle has paid the
• 57:41
  Grizzard for a Grizzard ride and as you explained, loses his hat,
• 57:47
  doesn't pay Moki for it. So he just loses that.
• 57:51
  Can't excuse me, thank you. Can't pay?
• 57:53
  Moki for it can't pay Moki, so he doesn't let her help him.
• 57:57
  That was twist for her. Yeah, yeah.
• 58:02
  Because she just naturally wanted to help him with their
• 58:04
  head, with his hat. And no, he wouldn't let her help
• 58:07
  him because he doesn't have a strawberry to pay her.
• 58:10
  And so I don't know that that felt important to me.
• 58:13
  And I love the way you shot it again, Jordan, because it was.
• 58:16
  It was important. Yeah.
• 58:18
  So, yeah. Because that was a moment.
• 58:20
  That was her moment really, when she starts to really turn.
• 58:23
  Yeah, well, and then the the great thing in the script where
• 58:26
  it like you have you hear Barry Blueberry's voice over voice
• 58:29
  come in, pushing in on her. And we think, wow, this is, you
• 58:32
  know, you break in the 4th wall a little bit and then Barry
• 58:34
  comes in. It's just standing off camera
• 58:37
  slightly. We'd be like, hello, can I have
• 58:38
  my Barry down? Here, he's such a goof, that
• 58:42
  character. Yeah, Barry.
• 58:44
  And I love that it ends with him being like Barry wants his
• 58:47
  Barry. That was John.
• 58:48
  John improvised. That I I knew it was.
• 58:54
  Yeah, shimmying out. Yeah, he shimmies.
• 58:58
  That also seems like the kind of thing we were like, Like, is the
• 59:00
  camera still running? Like we're just.
• 59:02
  Gonna. This is for the blooper reel,
• 59:04
  no? You liked it, right it?
• 59:05
  Was great. But also, like, it's making me
• 59:10
  realize that if this for that had room for, like, pro bono
• 59:15
  work, then I think this whole episode would have gone
• 59:18
  completely differently of like, oh, you could do stuff for free,
• 59:20
  You just don't have to do it for free.
• 59:22
  Yeah, that's complicated. Hey, come on, we only kid.
• 59:26
  We were just. Got 1/2 an hour, yeah.
• 59:28
  Right, yes, right. So Moki goes to the trash sheep.
• 59:32
  Marjorie is playing hide and seek with Philo and Gunge.
• 59:34
  Of course she knows where they're hiding.
• 59:36
  She is all seeing, all knowing, easy.
• 59:39
  And yeah, this is where we we kind of get that.
• 59:42
  Like she plants that seed of Marjorie asking her what she
• 59:46
  values. Yes, and what I like about this
• 59:51
  is, and I know you already touched on this, but the idea
• 59:54
  that the trash heap doesn't give answers, the trash heap pushes
• 59:57
  you in the right direction. And it's such a a welcome update
• 1:00:01
  from the old show where the trash heap kind of half the time
• 1:00:04
  was just kind of saying random stuff like it was this pseudo
• 1:00:08
  magic and. You know, or she's distracted.
• 1:00:12
  She's actually talking to Philo and Gunge, not to the Fraggles.
• 1:00:15
  And things get misconstrued, but they still get to the same, the
• 1:00:18
  same conclusion in Back to the Rock.
• 1:00:21
  The trash heap is, is actually wise.
• 1:00:23
  She is actually, you know, able to be like, yeah.
• 1:00:27
  And she can't. She knows that if she just gives
• 1:00:30
  Moki the answer, that's not going to help anybody.
• 1:00:32
  Like, that's just, you know, regurgitating information.
• 1:00:36
  Moki has to learn her lesson, and the trash heap knows how to
• 1:00:39
  push her to get to that point. Yeah, well, I mean, a brilliant
• 1:00:43
  example of that I thought was in the is it the next show when she
• 1:00:46
  tells Gobo to dig deep, the one about happening And you know, he
• 1:00:50
  has, he really, he has to. I just thought that was
• 1:00:53
  brilliant how that played out too, where he takes it, he takes
• 1:00:55
  it. Literally takes it literally,
• 1:00:57
  yeah. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:00:59
  And still get there. But yeah, maybe.
• 1:01:01
  Not the way he wasn't. Yeah.
• 1:01:02
  She didn't mean it literally. You know, it's, that's exactly
• 1:01:04
  what what you're saying. She doesn't just give the
• 1:01:07
  answer. So.
• 1:01:08
  Anyway. She sends Moki a way to think.
• 1:01:11
  Yeah, right. Yeah.
• 1:01:13
  Go sit in the corner. Go, go in your room.
• 1:01:16
  Have a think? Yeah.
• 1:01:18
  This is where we get our next check in with Doc and Sprockets.
• 1:01:21
  Doc is still trying to decide what to do.
• 1:01:23
  They've already done the whole like put things on a scale and
• 1:01:26
  see like does a shoe weigh the same as a clock?
• 1:01:28
  Which is interesting logic, but she gets a package in the mail
• 1:01:34
  with a note from her high school students.
• 1:01:36
  And what I like here is the note is addressed to Miss Doc.
• 1:01:39
  And Doc is like, that's funny. They think that my name is my.
• 1:01:42
  My last name is Doc. We'll have to, you know, teach
• 1:01:45
  them otherwise. And I just love that little,
• 1:01:47
  that little poke to be like, hey, remember, we don't know
• 1:01:49
  Doc's name. Yeah.
• 1:01:52
  Yeah. And yeah.
• 1:01:57
  And and as you said, there was there diorama of a of a sand.
• 1:02:02
  I I didn't write this down. It wasn't a sand castle.
• 1:02:04
  It was like a sand. It's.
• 1:02:05
  Like a of a wind wind. It was, yes.
• 1:02:10
  How? The watery and water and all of
• 1:02:12
  it. Yeah, some environment.
• 1:02:14
  They were listening. It is just a pile of sand.
• 1:02:16
  Yeah, now it's just a pile of. Sand.
• 1:02:18
  Yeah. OK, so my guess here and and
• 1:02:23
  Jordan, you can tell me if I'm right or wrong there.
• 1:02:25
  There's that kinetic sand stuff that you could buy that's like
• 1:02:28
  just sand that you can play with that doesn't actually get all
• 1:02:31
  over the place like sand. That's what it is.
• 1:02:33
  It's just clean, that's all. Yeah, it's clean sand.
• 1:02:37
  It's clean, it's and it looks great because you I mean you can
• 1:02:40
  get in like pink and purple and blue and stuff, but they have
• 1:02:43
  just sand colored and works great.
• 1:02:45
  Every time I watch it I'm like kinetic sand stuff is great.
• 1:02:48
  Yeah, it is. You've ever really gotten your
• 1:02:50
  hands in that stuff, Like it's so great, so satisfying.
• 1:02:53
  Very satisfying, yeah. Well, I know what I'm going to
• 1:02:57
  have to do after this, yes. So this helps Doc decide what to
• 1:03:04
  do. She's she'd rather have her
• 1:03:05
  students than this paycheck. And OK, so then she takes the
• 1:03:10
  Captain hat, which was previously, as far as I know,
• 1:03:13
  only existed in in Sprocket's fantasy world.
• 1:03:17
  Yeah. No, it's.
• 1:03:18
  I hadn't thought of that. And she puts it on Sprocket, but
• 1:03:22
  it's one of those puppetry things where like, there's no
• 1:03:25
  way it's that. Simple.
• 1:03:27
  There's an edit. I'm sure there's an edit.
• 1:03:29
  Yeah. She laid it on him in one shot
• 1:03:32
  and then you cut to another shot and he's licking her and moving
• 1:03:34
  his head and the cat's not falling off.
• 1:03:36
  So I'm sure they just did it in a, I assume an edit because
• 1:03:40
  otherwise, yeah, it would have just flown off his head.
• 1:03:43
  Right. Yeah, he's, yeah.
• 1:03:44
  There's nothing above the eyes there.
• 1:03:45
  He he's just, his head just kind of ends.
• 1:03:48
  Yeah. So yeah, the hat wouldn't stay.
• 1:03:49
  Definitely had to be pinned on, yeah.
• 1:03:52
  Yeah, I mean, just one of those things where like it wasn't
• 1:03:54
  until my third viewing that I. Had to think.
• 1:03:56
  Wait a second. How does Braga wear a hat?
• 1:03:59
  Yeah, I'll tell you one more hat puppet thing real quick.
• 1:04:02
  That for Uncle traveling Mat in the first episode of season 2
• 1:04:09
  where he comes back and we cut away to his thing, We come back
• 1:04:12
  and his hat is covering his eyes.
• 1:04:14
  He's like it's dark, I can't see.
• 1:04:17
  And then he has to go. He kind of moves his head and it
• 1:04:20
  slips back onto place. That was a whole rig because
• 1:04:23
  first of all, he doesn't have a head to wear a hat on.
• 1:04:27
  He's just eyes under the It's not like a nice big easy
• 1:04:31
  conehead. So first of all, they had to
• 1:04:33
  find a way to push the hat forward to make it like cover
• 1:04:38
  his eyes, but then have it have a rig where they could sort of
• 1:04:41
  pull it back and it would flip, slip back into place.
• 1:04:45
  I mean, they're geniuses. It's like, that's nothing.
• 1:04:48
  Don't don't put a hat on a puppet that needs to come off
• 1:04:51
  and on. That's one of the things in the
• 1:04:52
  script. I'd be like, don't do that or
• 1:04:54
  that's going to take a while or it's going to take someone
• 1:04:56
  building a whole rig, which they did so.
• 1:05:00
  Don't put a hat on a hat. Don't put a hat on.
• 1:05:03
  Don't take a hat off a puppet and put it back on.
• 1:05:06
  The hat's on or off, yeah. Wow, learning so much about hats
• 1:05:10
  today, I didn't I wasn't expecting that.
• 1:05:13
  Moki calls all the fraggles to the Great Hall.
• 1:05:15
  She wants to tell everyone about the most valuable thing in the
• 1:05:19
  world and I love that. Red whispers to Wembley but it's
• 1:05:22
  Lanford re related and she says remember that mural of Lanford
• 1:05:25
  and Red says told you it's. Very.
• 1:05:28
  Good aside. Yeah.
• 1:05:30
  You know, I, I, I just want to, I just want to get some props to
• 1:05:33
  Red Fraggle and to Karen Prell. She is so funny in this season,
• 1:05:40
  an absolute genius. Every little bit out of Red's
• 1:05:43
  mouth is just hysterical. And I'm just so glad that she's
• 1:05:48
  on this show like that. It wouldn't.
• 1:05:49
  It would not be the same without her.
• 1:05:51
  No, she's brilliant, Yeah. And Speaking of of Karen Moki
• 1:05:56
  brings in, I see Joe. There's I see Joe, Karen's other
• 1:05:59
  main character here. I'm bringing in this big stone
• 1:06:02
  tablet with the mural painted on it and puts it down in the
• 1:06:05
  middle of the hall. It is now a communal table.
• 1:06:10
  My question, and I'm going to have to really pay attention to
• 1:06:12
  the next few episodes here. Do we see this table in?
• 1:06:16
  Future episodes that tables are going to stay there.
• 1:06:19
  Come on, this is rag and rock. Well, I didn't say stay there,
• 1:06:23
  but like if they're ever at a table, no.
• 1:06:27
  That's special for this episode. And then it it probably goes up
• 1:06:30
  to Icy Joe's house, you know? Oh yeah, the only the only
• 1:06:34
  Fraggle who can actually lift it.
• 1:06:35
  And she's like I'm. Just going to take this home.
• 1:06:37
  She had to move it. Yeah, no, I mean, all sorts of
• 1:06:41
  things move around. If you were to do side by side
• 1:06:43
  things of that Great Hall, you'd be like, what the heck's going
• 1:06:47
  on in here? There's rocks moving, the
• 1:06:50
  Fraggle horn moves, all sorts of stuff.
• 1:06:53
  Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. But, you know, also, like there
• 1:06:56
  are things that stick around, you know?
• 1:06:58
  You know, we were talking about like in the I'm Pogey episode
• 1:07:01
  and, you know, Wembley decides that like, I want my hair worn
• 1:07:04
  like this. And like we see that hair show
• 1:07:06
  up there's. Through line.
• 1:07:08
  Oh, there's amazing, yeah. Character through lines and
• 1:07:12
  story through lines. But when you're talking about
• 1:07:14
  like, OK, we got to make this set work for this completely
• 1:07:17
  different idea, we need to roll in the coffin rock.
• 1:07:19
  It wasn't there last week, but it's here now.
• 1:07:22
  Yeah. That makes sense.
• 1:07:24
  Also fraggle rock is magic and I just assume that the rocks move
• 1:07:28
  all the time which is why they they need a fraggle whose only
• 1:07:31
  job it is to to explore and map out the rock because it is
• 1:07:35
  constantly changing. That's my that's my head cannon.
• 1:07:38
  It's my own theory. So Moki tells everyone, just
• 1:07:42
  dump your strawberries on the table because sharing is what
• 1:07:47
  they have and celebrating community is so much more
• 1:07:50
  satisfying than playing this, this for that game.
• 1:07:54
  And we're we're learning a little bit about communism here.
• 1:07:57
  Is that, is that, is that the lesson that we've been pulling
• 1:08:00
  out of this about? Community it's about, yeah.
• 1:08:03
  Community not. Community.
• 1:08:04
  Excuse me, community. Not communism.
• 1:08:06
  Community, yes, community is, is where it's at.
• 1:08:11
  And and also, you know, we know like, this is how fragile rock
• 1:08:14
  has always worked. And like, it just works for
• 1:08:16
  them. Yes, which is consequently what
• 1:08:19
  happens to Price when he sees this.
• 1:08:22
  I'm sorry you were about to go there weren't.
• 1:08:23
  You. No, that's what.
• 1:08:24
  Please no, Go ahead. No, just said that because it
• 1:08:27
  was this. He comes from a different part
• 1:08:29
  of the rock and which I love that too, that I we don't do
• 1:08:32
  that a lot. You know, it's obviously the
• 1:08:35
  minstrels and people they come from different biz, but you
• 1:08:37
  don't do that to this feeling that this vast rock with.
• 1:08:41
  We find out more about this kind of thing as the season goes on.
• 1:08:44
  But where there's other fraggles, right?
• 1:08:47
  But yeah, this idea that that that's where he, you know, where
• 1:08:51
  he comes from, it's just how they function.
• 1:08:52
  And that's, you know, so that you can't blame him and you
• 1:08:55
  can't call him greedy capitalist or anything like that.
• 1:08:59
  It's just how they work. And then he's taking all of this
• 1:09:02
  back and he's going to because he really likes this.
• 1:09:05
  And he, you know, he got this without having to give her
• 1:09:08
  anything for this, you know, he for this information or for this
• 1:09:12
  understanding and plus her friendship, you know, wow or
• 1:09:16
  nothing. That's brilliant.
• 1:09:18
  So Price is is going to introduce this idea of pro bono
• 1:09:21
  work to this community. There you go.
• 1:09:24
  Yeah, I love it. This is where we get our second
• 1:09:29
  song of the episode, It is Time to Live as One, which is from
• 1:09:34
  the original series episode Finger of Light.
• 1:09:38
  And it's which is also it's sung by Moki in that episode as well.
• 1:09:41
  I love this song. It's such a beautiful song.
• 1:09:44
  It is a beautiful song, Yeah. And I like the updates we did to
• 1:09:48
  it. You know, like to be able to
• 1:09:49
  because it's quite a long song and it's a little, you know, you
• 1:09:53
  come back to the chorus a couple of times.
• 1:09:57
  So to break it up with the little, you know, sort of
• 1:09:59
  dialogue moments where she keeps sort of, you know, explaining
• 1:10:02
  what's going on. And then having Lanford
• 1:10:05
  Singaverse is also pretty. I mean, obviously it's always
• 1:10:07
  great when Lanford does anything.
• 1:10:09
  So I think it's AI love this song and I love how it all came
• 1:10:12
  together. It's a really beautiful moving
• 1:10:16
  number. And Speaking of Lanford, I I had
• 1:10:20
  my subtitles on while watching this and when Lanford.
• 1:10:23
  Sings what does it? Say it's the real lyrics to the
• 1:10:26
  song which which is a little bit of a cheat, but now it makes me
• 1:10:31
  want to go back and see what they did in the in the When Moki
• 1:10:35
  Met Lanford episode when Lanford sings in the app.
• 1:10:39
  Because there were no lyrics for that.
• 1:10:42
  He just goes, oh, I want to know what Lanford says.
• 1:10:46
  Maybe they put in weird dialogue for him.
• 1:10:48
  That'd be. Funny.
• 1:10:49
  I'll let you know for sure. Yeah.
• 1:10:51
  And Moki, make sure everyone knows that the value that we get
• 1:10:56
  by sharing is love. Love is the value.
• 1:10:59
  And I love this song. I got so much value out of this
• 1:11:02
  number. So it worked and I didn't I
• 1:11:05
  didn't have to give anything. I just got to take the love and
• 1:11:08
  I'm sending it back through through through a whole podcast.
• 1:11:13
  And oh, and this is also, by the way, the the meaning of life
• 1:11:17
  that Moki gives to to the world's oldest Fraggle.
• 1:11:21
  The more as. You said that great.
• 1:11:22
  Jocelyn's great line. Yeah, it's beautiful.
• 1:11:25
  Exactly. And that's a nod to the
• 1:11:26
  original. Well, when the little like the
• 1:11:29
  ear, whatever that's called the sort of like earhorn, the ear
• 1:11:33
  trumpet and the little kiss on the cheek, that's a that's an
• 1:11:36
  homage to the original. That happened in the original
• 1:11:39
  too. Oh, does it I I should look back
• 1:11:41
  at that. That happens during the the 10
• 1:11:44
  with this one number and finger of light.
• 1:11:45
  Cool, That's nice. That's very nice.
• 1:11:49
  I we we've noticed a few other of those moments in this.
• 1:11:52
  I try to do that's why wouldn't you?
• 1:11:55
  There's already, there's such great moments already.
• 1:11:57
  And then it just feels so it just feels like you're honoring
• 1:11:59
  all the great stuff that the original show did and yeah,
• 1:12:03
  bringing it. And it's also nostalgia fun.
• 1:12:05
  The fans see it and they go, I recognize that.
• 1:12:08
  That's great. Yeah, that that picture of
• 1:12:11
  Leonardo DiCaprio pointing to this TV, we go like, I see that,
• 1:12:14
  I recognize it. Yeah.
• 1:12:18
  The song ends with this beautiful overhead shot of the
• 1:12:21
  Fraggles now around their new communal table with the painting
• 1:12:24
  of Lanford on it. And it's, you know, it's such a
• 1:12:27
  beautiful image, not just to see all the Fraggles together
• 1:12:32
  looking up at the camera, but just one of those like, I don't
• 1:12:35
  know how you would have done this on the old show to get that
• 1:12:38
  overhead view without getting 15 puppeteers in the shot.
• 1:12:42
  Well, you do. I mean, all the puppeteers were
• 1:12:44
  in the shot. That was a full CGI paint out.
• 1:12:47
  In the original, when you look down on the rushes, you know,
• 1:12:51
  you would see the floor, the set floor.
• 1:12:54
  You know, you'd see gear, you'd see people, people's bodies.
• 1:12:57
  But then that was our one of our big VFX shots for that one was
• 1:13:00
  to paint everybody out, put a floor in.
• 1:13:03
  Yeah. So that's actually an overhead
• 1:13:06
  shot like you have the camera straight above.
• 1:13:08
  Yeah, big tall cream shot. Yeah.
• 1:13:10
  Yeah, I guess you could have cheated that by having everyone
• 1:13:14
  just kind of hold the puppets sideways as if they're looking
• 1:13:16
  up, but. You're still going to see the
• 1:13:18
  been harder. You're still going to see the
• 1:13:19
  puppet. You're still going to see the
• 1:13:20
  puppeteers. Yeah.
• 1:13:21
  There's no way to hide the puppeteers either way.
• 1:13:24
  I. Was thinking more of like like
• 1:13:25
  you have to reposition a camera to be above.
• 1:13:29
  Everything's on a crane. It's the easiest we're talking
• 1:13:31
  about. Like everything is on the crane
• 1:13:33
  is really quite fast to sort of get big.
• 1:13:37
  That's what one of the other cool things about this the the
• 1:13:40
  show is like, there are some really epic shots because we
• 1:13:43
  live on a crane for for most of it, you know, getting up the,
• 1:13:47
  you know, some of the shots where you like, you follow the
• 1:13:50
  follow the repeati bird up through the hole into the
• 1:13:52
  gorge's garden. You know, like those are
• 1:13:55
  actually quite achievable when you're just sitting on a crane
• 1:13:57
  all the time. Right.
• 1:13:59
  Yeah. No, that makes sense.
• 1:14:01
  The things that I don't think about because I'm not a
• 1:14:02
  director, go go figure. We just didn't have the studio
• 1:14:07
  space. And we.
• 1:14:08
  Yeah. You mean you couldn't have done
• 1:14:10
  that? No, just the studio was way too
• 1:14:12
  wasn't tall enough. Sure, yeah, Price says he's
• 1:14:18
  learned a lot. He's going to take these lessons
• 1:14:20
  back to his community as as we said, and I, I love this moment
• 1:14:23
  here where he kind of heads off and then a few seconds later he
• 1:14:27
  goes back to their way going, I have no idea where I'm going and
• 1:14:30
  back again. I arrived in an avalanche.
• 1:14:32
  Don't mind me. That was all.
• 1:14:34
  That was all on set, though. I don't think that was scripted
• 1:14:36
  originally. Matt and Alex, Matt and Alex
• 1:14:38
  pitched it the way they were like, let's have them come back.
• 1:14:42
  And then we played around with it and had to, yeah, keep keep
• 1:14:44
  coming back. It was great.
• 1:14:46
  It was always just a way that after such a really like, it's
• 1:14:49
  such an earnest, sweet song. That was part of the idea of
• 1:14:53
  like adding the Lanford verse too, just to take just a little
• 1:14:56
  bit of the kind of like really sweet, sweet sting off of it.
• 1:15:00
  And then? Keep it from being you didn't
• 1:15:02
  want it to be kumbaya I guess. Exactly.
• 1:15:04
  Yeah. So adding that little as she's
• 1:15:06
  trying to sort of wrap, she just keeps trying to wrap up the
• 1:15:09
  theme in a nice way and he keeps interrupting her is so great.
• 1:15:13
  OK, Yeah, yeah, I'll show you that.
• 1:15:15
  Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah, the the whole the
• 1:15:18
  line. I arrived in an avalanche.
• 1:15:19
  I arrived in an avalanche. I have no idea where I'm going.
• 1:15:22
  Yeah. Louise, that's so good.
• 1:15:25
  So this is where we get that shot, that beautiful shot that
• 1:15:28
  we talked about the beginning of this episode of the Periscope
• 1:15:30
  kind of popping out through the Gorg's garden to confirm that
• 1:15:34
  there are no more radishes, It's only strawberries.
• 1:15:38
  The architect tells everyone, OK, we're going to go
• 1:15:40
  investigate this problem and let's just keep the Gusty's for
• 1:15:44
  now. And Turbo and Wrench mishear
• 1:15:46
  that and think he said release the Gusty's for now.
• 1:15:50
  And they release them and they winds are all blowing around the
• 1:15:54
  Doozer Dome and there's a great shot of I think 3 Doozers.
• 1:15:57
  Their helmets get blown off and their hair just go straight up
• 1:16:00
  like troll dolls. Wonderful.
• 1:16:04
  I didn't realize the Doozers will grow their hair that long.
• 1:16:07
  Hey, Doozers have all sorts of different hairs, yeah.
• 1:16:10
  That's true, hiding them under those helmets.
• 1:16:12
  Some are bald, some are have have a lot of hair, yeah.
• 1:16:14
  Yeah, yeah. And there's one Doozer who I
• 1:16:18
  love it. He just comes into frames.
• 1:16:19
  He's got a big mustache and he's just panicking.
• 1:16:22
  You know his arms are flailing. It's always great when you're
• 1:16:24
  doing stuff with Pumas and then you just have one come in really
• 1:16:27
  close to frame and do something dumb.
• 1:16:29
  It's very satisfying, yeah. It really is.
• 1:16:32
  It really is. And that's where our episode
• 1:16:34
  ends. That's we're we're going to end
• 1:16:36
  on on a note of a beautiful note of community and then utter do's
• 1:16:41
  or. Pay.
• 1:16:43
  Yes, exactly. So Jordan and Jocelyn, there's a
• 1:16:48
  question that we like to ask all of our guests when they come
• 1:16:52
  onto this podcast. How do you plan to make the
• 1:16:56
  world a little fragglier? Thinking of this episode and
• 1:17:01
  thinking of kind of Doc's journey in this episode.
• 1:17:03
  And, you know, I, I think over the years I have had a tendency
• 1:17:09
  to work all the time, to kind of take job after job after job and
• 1:17:16
  sort of try to fill up all my time with work.
• 1:17:19
  And at a certain point, you know, as I've gotten older and
• 1:17:22
  as I've gotten to work on such great shows as like Fraggle
• 1:17:25
  Rock, You know, there are, there's a sense of like how
• 1:17:32
  important balance is in your life and finding time to do
• 1:17:38
  things that you love and spend time with people you love and do
• 1:17:41
  things that fill you up that aren't just about, you know,
• 1:17:45
  your bank account or security or whatever.
• 1:17:48
  So I took up pottery and I am trying to just spend more time
• 1:17:56
  traveling to visit my friends and family.
• 1:17:59
  I'm in Newfoundland right now and not being so worried about,
• 1:18:04
  oh, I don't have work for a couple of months, you know, and,
• 1:18:07
  and knowing that that time we'll get filled up with things that I
• 1:18:11
  love and appreciate and will remember and cherish for the
• 1:18:14
  rest of my life. And not just, you know, think
• 1:18:17
  about like, well, that was four weeks of my life and I got a
• 1:18:20
  paycheck out of it. So I don't know that answers the
• 1:18:23
  question but just trying to remember that life is about more
• 1:18:26
  than work and and money. Right.
• 1:18:30
  And working for yacht making companies.
• 1:18:33
  Yeah. And saving, you know, if you
• 1:18:36
  leave some time open, then it, it leaves your life open for
• 1:18:39
  amazing things to come in it like, you know, an amazing show
• 1:18:43
  like Fraggle Rock or you know, amazing conversations with
• 1:18:46
  people about Fraggle Rock, You know.
• 1:18:48
  Yeah, I love that. Jocelyn, how about you?
• 1:18:52
  How do you plan to make the world a little fragglier?
• 1:18:54
  Well, Fraggle Rock was based on a huge idea.
• 1:18:58
  You know, Jim Henson saying to us, I want you to create a
• 1:19:00
  series that'll help stop war. And this idea of and, and all
• 1:19:04
  the episodes have big ideas behind them.
• 1:19:06
  So this idea of having a big idea, what I'm taking into is my
• 1:19:11
  next project, my third act heart project is which I what I call
• 1:19:15
  about the big idea is water and how water connects us all.
• 1:19:19
  And interestingly, that was big part of Fraggle Rock actually
• 1:19:22
  too. But it's I discovered this
• 1:19:26
  world, the water Rubas. There's 81 of them and they came
• 1:19:31
  to the planet 4 billion years ago on the same on the same
• 1:19:35
  asteroid. And this is the first of two
• 1:19:39
  books. This is a book that you've
• 1:19:41
  written. I should say you're holding,
• 1:19:42
  you're holding up the book for us.
• 1:19:43
  But yes, yes. I've put this is a book I've
• 1:19:46
  written. It's coming out in a month, so
• 1:19:48
  I'm going to let you know. Yes, and very exciting and the
• 1:19:53
  illustrations. The the also the helping me
• 1:19:56
  conceive of what the water Rubbis or lat was was done.
• 1:19:59
  I worked with Brian Froud, my old friend Brian Froud, who.
• 1:20:04
  Everybody watching this podcast will know who Brian Froud is.
• 1:20:07
  Absolutely, Yes. Yes, we all know Brian Froud.
• 1:20:09
  Yes. And because he was, he was
• 1:20:12
  intrigued by the idea of these creatures.
• 1:20:14
  These characters, they're, they aren't creatures who live in
• 1:20:18
  water. They are water.
• 1:20:21
  So you could have any blank, you could have a glass of water and
• 1:20:25
  suddenly one of them would appear out of the water.
• 1:20:27
  Anyway, what happens? The story is basically about
• 1:20:30
  this human girl who, who for all sorts of plot reasons, which I
• 1:20:34
  won't go into because it's a hard thing to pitch.
• 1:20:36
  She she this, she finds that she's going to science camp.
• 1:20:40
  She has and she needs to take something with her.
• 1:20:42
  And it turns out there's a piece of the asteroid in her
• 1:20:47
  grandmother's cupboard. It's always been there since she
• 1:20:49
  was born. And she ends up touching it and
• 1:20:52
  she can turn into water. So she turns into water because
• 1:20:56
  what I wanted was a human child that could turn into water.
• 1:21:01
  So my, one of my log lines is Earth from water's point of
• 1:21:04
  view. And also because I've worked
• 1:21:08
  with the, you know, The Muppets for most of my career when was
• 1:21:13
  starting out my career. It's also goofiness in the
• 1:21:15
  service of truth. So you learn a lot about water.
• 1:21:19
  But yeah, so that's what I'm working.
• 1:21:22
  That's that's me trying to to do, you know, another sort of
• 1:21:25
  make the world more fragilely. So I love that the water Rubas
• 1:21:29
  you say it's going to be on September, book one.
• 1:21:32
  Joe, you're on my list to to e-mail you when it's happening.
• 1:21:35
  Oh. Yes, please do.
• 1:21:37
  Yeah, we will help spread the word once it's.
• 1:21:38
  Out, yes, that would be great because the PR part of it and
• 1:21:41
  it's not what I do. I can write.
• 1:21:43
  I had to learn how to write a novel for 9 to 12 year olds.
• 1:21:45
  I didn't know how to do that. I've been writing scripts my
• 1:21:47
  entire career. It's been so much fun.
• 1:21:50
  So yes, that's my next contribution I guess.
• 1:21:55
  That's wonderful because you have so many fans that are
• 1:21:58
  listening to this podcast to follow the The Muppet and the
• 1:22:00
  Fraggle world. And I think a lot of people are
• 1:22:03
  just excited to see more from from you creatively and.
• 1:22:08
  I'd love that to happen. And then people tell me what
• 1:22:11
  they think and all that. You know, it'd be really, I'm
• 1:22:13
  really looking forward to getting it out there.
• 1:22:15
  So it's. Yeah, fantastic.
• 1:22:18
  That's so exciting. Thank you.
• 1:22:20
  Well, thank you for letting me talk tell you about it.
• 1:22:22
  Of course, of course, this is the this for that, this is the I
• 1:22:26
  want, I want everyone to hear about what you're working on
• 1:22:29
  because you're so generous to come here on this podcast, but
• 1:22:32
  also for both of you, for all the work that you did on back to
• 1:22:35
  the Rock. And it just, the show is so
• 1:22:38
  wonderful and I'm so happy to help spread the word about it
• 1:22:43
  however I can because I want everyone to know that Back to
• 1:22:46
  the Rock is such a a valued addition to the Fraggle Rock
• 1:22:52
  franchise. And I just want more of it.
• 1:22:55
  I want everyone to see it. I want everyone to enjoy it.
• 1:22:57
  And I want a third season, yeah. Joe, well, just Joe, thank you
• 1:23:00
  for loving it so much. Yeah.
• 1:23:03
  You make it easy, you really do. That's just great.
• 1:23:07
  Thank you. Fraggle Talk, the unofficial
• 1:23:13
  Fraggle Rock Podcast is brought to you by toughbigs.com.
• 1:23:17
  Produced, written and hosted by Joe Hennis, Fraggle Talk art by
• 1:23:21
  Dave Holtzine Junior Fraggle Rock mark and logo, characters
• 1:23:24
  and elements are trademarks of The Jim Henson Company.
• 1:23:26
  All rights reserved. Transcripts provided by Caitlin
• 1:23:29
  Miller. Fraggle Rock theme song written
• 1:23:31
  by Philip Balsam and Dennis Lee is used with permission.
• 1:23:34
  Special thanks to the Jim Henson Company, Apple TV Plus and the
• 1:23:37
  entire Fraggle Rock. Back to the Rock family.
• 1:23:40
  Be sure to follow tough pigs at tough pigs on all social media
• 1:23:44
  platforms including Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and TikTok.
• 1:23:47
  And please consider supporting us on Patreon or by buying
• 1:23:50
  merchandise on T public. For more Fraggle podcast fun,
• 1:23:54
  listen to Fraggle talk classic on your favorite podcast app.
• 1:23:58
  Thanks for listening and we'll see you next time down at
• 1:24:01
  Fraggle Talk.