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Jamie Burrows | The Christian Reeve Podcast | #87 | · The Christian Reeve Podcast

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  It's another episode of the Christian we've podcast.
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  But are you subscribed? If not make sure to like, share
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  and subscribe, spread the word about the Christian Reef podcast
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  and enjoy this episode. Hello and welcome to another
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  episode of the Christian Reef podcast.
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  Today's guest is an actor, podcaster and marketing
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  professional hailing. All the way from Rochester.
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  New York in the United States is name is Jimmy, Burrows.
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  Welcome to the show. Jamie, how are you doing?
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  I'm doing well, how are you? Thanks so much for having me?
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  That's a pleasure. Thank you for agreeing to do the
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  show. I'm doing very well.
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  Yeah, let's let's just jump straight into your podcast.
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  So you host this read your regular video podcast where you
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  interview Range of different people to tell us about exactly
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  the format of the show, the type of topics that you discuss and
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  who the podcast is actually intended for sure.
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  I'll try, that's for sure. So, gosh about a year ago now, I
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  work for a marketing company and about a year ago, when
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  everything started hitting the fan, you know, my boss.
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  And I got together to try. You know my boss I work for a
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  small company so my boss is actually the owner.
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  He's like look man I want to keep you on.
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  I want to you know, continue to pay you but it obviously isn't
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  going to be calling businesses or you know, going to lunch with
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  business owners selling marketing.
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  So what can we do? So we came up with the idea of
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  doing like webinar, Is about things like working from home.
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  The Google Suite of products things that we had been using
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  for years, because we've been remote for years.
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  But all of these things were about to become very important
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  for people who had never used it.
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  So that was how we started and then if you remember around that
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  time, Everybody and their brother started doing the same
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  thing. You know, BuzzFeed is doing
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  articles about you know Outlook versus Gmail and not that ours
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  weren't better. Ours were better but it's tough
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  to compete with those big names so I just you know my boss is
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  very Hands-On and like you Is mean about to do my thing.
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  So I started reaching out and interviewing people just because
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  it's a lot more interesting to me and interactive and let's be
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  honest at you know a year ago when no one knew what the heck
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  was going on. That might have been my only
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  outlet for the day to have a conversation with somebody.
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  So especially given that. Time I was amazed with the
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  people that responded right back to me and we're not only
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  gracious but accommodating and you know, awesome for the
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  interviews and the shows. Hmm and so who is it for?
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  And I'm sorry. Who was it for?
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  Whoever watched isn't, I'll be honest.
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  When I, when I first Started and, and with some of the shows,
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  you know, if a couple of my Facebook friends watch, I didn't
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  expect much more than that. But depending upon the guests, I
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  mean, we've had thousands of people watching, so, hopefully
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  something for everyone. I would just sound a side before
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  I press you on that. I know the feeling, I mean,
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  like, okay, on my personal Facebook account, I think I've
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  got like, Over 400 friends people have actually met in real
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  life and stuff and who I've had over the years and a BFF, you
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  wisdom. I think, like my official
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  Facebook page and stuff, but that like probably hand for were
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  talking like three or four people and that includes Family,
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  actually bothers to check out my stuff.
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  And I've been doing this now for like, two and a half years and
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  is interesting, I have to say and it'll be interesting as
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  well. I guess for the both of us as
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  things progress and we start to like, get more attention with
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  these things to see if those people will actually suddenly
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  taken interest. Because people are like that,
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  it's interesting when they see that you've started something
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  small and they're kind of like, okay, that's nothing.
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  That's just a little pet project.
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  I remember someone I won't say who, but someone said to me on
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  the phone, I was catching up with them and they were like, oh
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  yeah, you know, that passion of yours.
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  And it's like, yeah this this is this isn't a Hobby for me, this
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  is like, I'm going all the way with this, but In fairness, I do
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  understand that response, but it'd be very different when
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  these things take off. Yeah.
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  But anyway, and what's funny to me Christian is that some of the
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  guests that I've had The people would pay to go see, okay.
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  But they're not tuning in for free with to watch me interview
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  them or things like that. And it's funny and I think it I
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  think it does go back to the familiarity.
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  You know what? Like my brother you know?
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  He cannot and this is something that I see in marketing.
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  As well. And you know it's that the
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  Paradox of choice, you know, and when and availability you know
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  if it let's just say my brother is watching a boring baseball
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  game and says oh my brother's got that guy on his show today
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  that I really like but it'll be on Facebook and it'll be on
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  YouTube. I can watch it anytime I want
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  there's no reason for me to watch it live and then another
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  The tabbouleh a week from now you're like, well, if anything
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  super awesome happened, I would have heard about it by now.
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  What am I going to watch something?
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  That was recorded a week ago. That's a very good point.
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  You know I never thought about that actually.
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  Oh yeah, obviously. I thought about the concept of
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  yeah, people just might not be free when it comes live.
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  Like you know everyone has a life but yeah, that's a very
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  good point. But the thing is, the way things
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  work, you know, especially with things like podcast and stuff
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  there, what I would term Evergreen content, which is
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  always something. I'm sure, you know, that I'm
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  being in marketing, I am also in marketing by the way, so we can
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  chat a lot about that but yeah, that's what Always strive to
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  kind of deal with my content is to make it as Evergreen as
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  possible because funnily enough, these things do pick up.
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  I've had certain episodes pick up many views.
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  Many many, many months later. And yeah, and you're like, what
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  the hell happened there? Well, not I think it's, I think
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  it just, you know, here's the thing with, with podcast
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  interviews, particularly people who you interview who have
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  somewhat of a public following, like you said, people don't know
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  the interviewer. So it's like, why should I care?
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  You know. What is what of interest is
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  there, really? You know, why should I bother
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  watching? And, you know, I thought about
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  this a lot as well. And here's my response to that,
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  the reason that you should watch an interview where the
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  interviewer may be, is someone you've never heard of, but the
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  guest is somewhat prominent, or even if they're not even
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  necessarily prominent, they can just be someone of interest,
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  right? Is that you don't know what that
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  interviewer is going to ask them there for, you don't know what
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  you're going to learn from that guessed it might not be the same
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  old you know interview that they go for Here's the thing, like
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  with my interviews, it's different, you know, I do
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  obviously have research on my guests and, you know, there's a
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  structure and a format and everything.
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  But to tell you the truth, a lot of the time, I'm just pushing
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  for a good conversation too. Kind of naturally, see where we
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  go and what we get from that person so I ad-lib a lot.
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  Yeah, sometimes I don't even ask questions and you know, being a
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  fellow podcast, I'm sure you can appreciate that.
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  The more you do this, the more kind of comfortable you get with
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  it, the easier it kind of becomes to do that.
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  And so now I worry less and less even if I don't have a lot of
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  research on my guess because sometimes there's a lot
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  sometimes there's nothing. It doesn't concern me as much.
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  It's more about like can I sustain a good interesting,
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  engaging conversation. And that would be my response.
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  Like I've had people, you know, people have reached out to the
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  celebrities that I'm still, you know, trying to get them on the
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  show and it's just a conflict issue.
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  It's nothing more than that. And when I actually said that to
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  them, I mean, by said, I've said this on the show, For sorry for
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  repeating this. But I said to this person like,
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  hey, you know, I know I don't have like much to offer you but
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  you know, maybe it'll be a good conversation and they were like,
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  oh no, it's okay. Like I want to, you know, appear
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  on your show and it made me start to think that like it
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  doesn't matter if you're starting from nothing and like
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  that's the perception that people have of you.
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  Because people who you really want to follow you, people that
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  you would want to become part of your community will.
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  I find you and will enjoy all of your content.
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  But there's people that follow me now, that maybe only come for
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  the live streams I do, or maybe they only listen to the podcast
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  or maybe they're only interested in music or whatever, right?
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  But they're coming for something and they keep coming back for
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  that thing. And it's like, okay this should
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  be the focus Building from here because the numbers will come
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  much later and it doesn't matter what people's perception is.
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  You know, it's the same as a business, you know, if you see a
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  business and it's just starting out and it's only got A couple
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  of thousand followers on Facebook or something and you're
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  like, okay, they just the start up, like, who cares, right?
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  But then you're going to pay attention when they've got like
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  a hundred thousand followers, you know, you're gonna, oh,
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  maybe that's something I should check out.
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  And obviously, it's the same with YouTube channels.
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  Social media platforms podcasts, you know.
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  So its inevitability, it's a case of when, rather than if
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  someone was obviously, you keep pursuing what you want to do and
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  you keep kind of pushing it. But that being said, I am kind
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  of surprised that people don't take more risks on on small
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  content creators, small channels, small podcast because
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  you'd be surprised. Yeah, you'd be surprised like
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  yeah. Yeah.
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  I mean you know this is me being I guess.
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  I don't quite bold here but I think it's fair.
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  There are like major podcasts that I've listened to where the
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  creators found Fame elsewhere. Like maybe they were YouTube
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  channel first, and they decided to just join the craze of
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  starting a podcast and they are not good podcasters because
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  here's the thing, like just because you have a big
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  following, that doesn't mean you're automatically going to
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  become a good podcaster, like it takes skill, it takes effort,
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  like there's people that, you know, even 50 to 70 episodes
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  later, I listen to their stuff and it's like this is still bad
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  like they've learnt nothing in 70 episodes.
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  Whereas for me always this now Episode 87.
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  I've learned a lot in that time and I continue to learn.
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  Then it's a case of always growing and learning and
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  absorbing information from people and different places and
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  different different situations and I'm sorry for interrupting,
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  that's a great point and that's why to go back to one of your
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  earlier points. You know how much you script it?
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  I can, it can really be a hindrance.
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  You know, I know you're an actor as well.
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  I've been acting for years, I've been in sales for years, so I
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  understand the importance of listening, even when it looks
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  like, I'm doing something else, which sometimes I am, I am still
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  listening where I have a list of questions.
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  It's almost like you don't listen to the answer because you
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  already know where you're going next you know like hello
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  Christian can you tell me how you got started in podcasting?
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  Well yeah, I was out on the cricket pitch one day and a UFO
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  landed right in the middle and handed me a golden microphone.
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  And I said this must be my sign. Well, that's very interesting
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  Chris. Yeah, exactly.
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  Is a great way. Yeah, you're right.
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  You're right. That's something I learned very
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  early on like what I often tend to do as well is yeah, pay full
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  attention to the to what they're saying.
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  They guessed is saying and then get when it gets to a point
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  where I get seems like it's beginning to wind down a little
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  bit more like maybe it's towards the end of that particular point
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  that the person is made. And there's no obvious direction
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  that that's going in or whatever.
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  That's when I tend to sort lights.
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  Start to stray away and start looking at my paper.
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  I'm still listening because every now and again you get
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  like, oh and this, and then they'll go off and you're like,
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  okay let's let's listen, let's see what happens.
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  That's, you know, I mean like yeah, that's yeah, it's a very
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  important aspect to this and I've seen that is so
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  frustrating. I always tried to think like,
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  okay, is there anything here that I conceivably missed that,
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  my audience would want to know that my audience would be like,
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  screaming, like in the headset, a Why didn't you ask that like
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  what's wrong with you? Wait, who plays Cricket anymore
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  Christian. And I want to hear more about
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  the UFOs, you know. Yeah, absolutely.
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  And I hear the same thing where it's and I get it and I don't
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  begrudge anybody either having a font having their fun, making a
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  living, having a hobby, all of that stuff.
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  But also, yeah, as a listener to a podcast, or Or, you know,
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  something, it shouldn't be frustrating.
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  Like, you shouldn't want to jump in to ask the question a
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  follow-up question, you know, I think it's the same as like,
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  when you watch people when a game show and they just, you
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  know, they just have an idiotic response to something you know,
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  like how do you not know that I feel.
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  It's the same exact same feeling.
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  This is that laughs frustration? Yeah, so when I did my research
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  on you initially, I mean this might have been because I do my
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  research Way ahead of time. So this might have changed and I
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  noticed that you mentioned that you've had a couple of episodes
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  that have had a few thousand views.
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  So obviously there's been changed since I did my research
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  on you, but when I initially checked it, you know, I was
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  seeing very few views on your YouTube and that's the same for
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  my channel. That's not me like this and no
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  anything but that the reason that I ask this question because
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  intrigued me is being that you are a marketing professional.
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  Do you or have you at any time? Kind of spent a considerable
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  amount of time on social media, marketing, networking
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  advertising, any kind of like paid stuff or any kind of like
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  stuff that you would normally use in the context of marketing
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  for the podcast? Or is there maybe like another
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  barrier that you're facing in terms of bringing in the views
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  right now? Yeah that's a great question and
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  it's funny because when this Started and I was brand new as
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  you saw me earlier today, I had enough technical hurdles and I
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  was doing five shows a week. Oh wow at I mean for months I
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  was doing 5Ks shows a week and I'm the only one doing it.
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  So I'm reaching out to people doing the research, doing the
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  show and so a lot of them came up.
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  So, you know, so quickly that any sort of legitimate marketing
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  effort wasn't possible. You know, I would kind of do the
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  guerrilla marketing on my social media and leveraging.
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  The company I work for and I got it honestly in this probably
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  speaks to human nature more than anything else.
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  The best response I got was when I was legit in the middle of the
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  interview, reaching out on my Facebook saying, hey, I'm live
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  right now with so and so and you know, and then it's kind of hard
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  to put off its like oh right now not so all I have to do is press
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  the, you know, and you had a thing with the views and and
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  this Is something that was that's frustrating to me because
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  we stream live on our website as well as on Facebook and on
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  YouTube. Yeah, it's damn near impossible
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  to get an accurate. Number of how many people are
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  watching at any given time or have watched total.
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  You know, because I know how many people have watched our.
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  Yeah, I've watched on Facebook, how many have on YouTube?
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  And I'm sure I can dig down into the analytics, to find out how
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  many people have watched on the website.
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  But that's definitely, you know, and you can tell me if this is
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  something that you've seen. It's a hurdle.
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  Because not many people are watching on YouTube.
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  It's not Nyan. It's probably the least
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  convenient of the options. If someone can go right to our
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  website and go to a web page, mmm, and there it is.
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  And there's the list or go to Facebook and there it is or go
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  to YouTube. Find the channel if it's live,
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  that's easy. But if not, you got to find, you
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  know, so there's a lot of hurdles there.
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  And I also understand who the heck's going to watch something
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  on YouTube that has, you know, 209 views.
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  I mean I think it I think it depends but yeah no, yeah that's
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  it. I think so. 108 people have
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  obviously so now you're right. You're right.
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  They say it, goes back to the perception thing I was speaking
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  about earlier. You know, I can if I are if
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  someone asked me, how many Subs are gone and I say, oh, I got
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  600 there. Like okay, then same thing but
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  yeah, no, I've actually thought about Christian and I'm sorry
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  for interrupting. Again, I have a TD, I do it.
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  Like I do it so much and I know when I'm doing it that it's rude
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  and I'm not a rude person. But I have thought about, maybe
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  not streaming to YouTube because it's one of those things, you
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  know, like in marketing where I will tell business owners, you
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  know, they'll tell me, nope. I don't want to be online
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  because all it's going to do is get, you know, get fake,
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  reviewers to talk trash about my business and it's like, well,
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  guess what, they can do that already.
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  So, So if you're not owning your message, it basically becomes a
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  tool for someone to talk themself out of it.
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  Rather than if you own the message, you can try to talk
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  them into it. So I almost feel like with you
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  to the way it is at least for where I am, it almost gives,
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  people more reason not to watch it, then it does compel them.
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  To watch it, do you because okay, when it comes to my
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  podcast, I diversify our, I do many different things.
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  So, I have adjusted quickly explain.
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  So, like, I have a separate Tick-Tock for my podcast.
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  I recently set up and separate Clips channel.
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  So, the main version of the podcast in video form appears on
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  the YouTube channel, that's where it generally gets the
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  least views and going back to your convenience.
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  Point my podcast tends to perform best on the audio
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  platforms. That's something I've noticed in
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  general, it's better on Spotify or apple podcast or whatever,
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  right? But the clips I don't do but I
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  should you should. Yeah, go get that set up as soon
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  as possible because it's free so why not?
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  But I know personally when I'm driving I listen to podcasts all
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  the time. Yeah was a video podcast for
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  some Reason I feel like I need to watch it even though
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  nothing's happening. No one needs to watch me and you
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  they're not going to miss once they can pick up from listening.
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  Yeah you about to be honest with you the main reason that I do
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  the video version is our a is because why not why not do a
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  video version looking? Yeah yeah well tell that to my
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  single life of three years but yeah like that.
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  The second thing is the fact that the clips work best you
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  know like the most views I've ever received for the podcast
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  have been in clip form some have had like tens of thousands of
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  you so there's clearly a more of a market there and also in
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  general short content short form content is the most popular form
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  of content right now. Yeah but like you said like for
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  instance I know there's people in my network people that I'm
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  friends with that will listen to my podcast but in that Kind of
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  like on in the background kind of thing, which is exactly what
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  I do with podcast. So I completely understand.
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  But the clips is more, what people engage with and that
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  draws people more into the podcast, but have you ever done
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  podcast Clips is that something you've tackled with or try it
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  out? I'll be honest, I'm not
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  familiar. You got to do it, man.
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  Very good. It's you, as the name would
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  imply you take clips of your podcast.
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  Yeah, cut it up. You know, I edited.
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  Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, I really do need to,
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  and I'll be honest as we've started to pick up traction.
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  Okay, I'm doing less fewer and fewer shows.
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  All right? Yeah, big, I mean, for a number
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  of reasons one, you know, I'm back to quote unquote working.
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  Yeah. And people, I mean, people
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  aren't quite as accessible and available as they were when they
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  couldn't leave the house, right? Yeah.
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  Because I do it stuff. Yeah.
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  That's right, right, right. Absolutely.
• 24:13
  And I wanted to ask you a question that from earlier, you
• 24:16
  know, when you would said, you'd reached out to people and
• 24:19
  working on scheduling, I obviously have done the same
• 24:25
  thing and I I get to a point where I just want to ask people.
• 24:30
  Look, if you're just responding to be nice, I appreciate it.
• 24:37
  But don't like, if you have no interest in doing the show, that
• 24:44
  is totally fine. I'm not going to hate on you.
• 24:46
  I'm not going to talk crap about you.
• 24:48
  I get it. Just let me know.
• 24:50
  So, I'm not reaching out to you every week or every two weeks.
• 24:55
  Have you ever found? That or or is that just me and
• 24:58
  my insecure head saying, you know.
• 25:01
  Listen, you got Point. There's two people that I
• 25:03
  reached out to. Well I've reached out to a lot
• 25:05
  of celebrities people. I know.
• 25:08
  People don't know. There's two major ones have been
• 25:10
  trying to get for a while. One of them, I've just given up
• 25:13
  on. I contacted this person many
• 25:15
  times and their last message they saw it and just you know,
• 25:21
  didn't respond. So I'm kind of like okay, no
• 25:24
  worries. And the second One, I think they
• 25:28
  are genuine. They just really busy with
• 25:31
  everything that they're doing and I have a feeling, it will
• 25:34
  happen. It's just a case of when.
• 25:36
  But the way I look at that because I thought about this a
• 25:40
  lot and I think that part of me feels like our it's because, you
• 25:44
  know, you're a nobody, no one knows this show.
• 25:47
  Why do they care like, you know, it's going to do nothing for
• 25:49
  them part of me. Feels like that.
• 25:50
  But then part of me also, feels like what we were discussing
• 25:53
  earlier that one day, this podcast will be a SAS and people
• 25:57
  will be queuing up to come on there.
• 25:58
  So that's another factor to this.
• 26:00
  And thirdly my focus at all times is to just continue the
• 26:06
  podcast. Continue having guests on
• 26:08
  continue having conversations because you know what, like it's
• 26:11
  all great. You know, having someone of
• 26:14
  significance on the podcast, you know, ideally because it you
• 26:17
  know it brings people on obviously.
• 26:19
  Every time I check a guest I do look at their follower, can't
• 26:22
  I'd you know, I'm a numbers guy because of marketing so I do
• 26:25
  focus on those things. But to be honest with you, the
• 26:28
  more important aspect to all of this is, can I have a good
• 26:31
  conversation with Ray? Are they a doorknob?
• 26:34
  Because yeah. Because that just because they
• 26:35
  might be significant, that doesn't guarantee.
• 26:37
  You're going to have a good show with them and like, that's my
• 26:39
  goal above all else is, can I get a good show out of this
• 26:43
  person that I can give to my listeners?
• 26:46
  Can I continue to have guests? And luckily I found a lot of
• 26:49
  tools recently, certain platforms that give you guests
• 26:53
  and opportunities and stuff like that, and I've met some Amazing
• 26:56
  people. And that kind of noise is my
• 27:00
  focus. Really, you know, I feel like
• 27:03
  the people of prominence so to speak will come later.
• 27:08
  But the podcast should always be about two things for me and this
• 27:14
  is just my podcast one. Giving people a platform to
• 27:19
  discuss their projects and discuss what they want to talk
• 27:22
  about. And to, you know, being able to
• 27:25
  have fun. An engaging interesting
• 27:27
  discussions that people can listen to and enjoy Whenever
• 27:32
  Wherever and continually, you know, I want every show to be as
• 27:35
  good as the last one I want to put maximum effort into every
• 27:39
  single show. So that that's where my head is
• 27:42
  at. So I don't really take it too
• 27:44
  badly if they're not interested. I mean yeah sure it's a night.
• 27:47
  I mean I'll be there, I'll be honest.
• 27:48
  Those people, both of them, I have kind of stopped messaging
• 27:52
  now. Yeah.
• 27:54
  But to be honest with you I'm kind of like to be Peter to
• 27:56
  chase them because I'm busy and they do when I was because I'm
• 28:02
  gay Jam, engage in with people such as yourself.
• 28:04
  That do give me a chance and we have a good time and that's my
• 28:08
  biggest thing. Like I get what you're saying
• 28:11
  about. Hey, above all else, I want to
• 28:14
  make sure I can do XYZ. I'm almost to the point now
• 28:19
  where I don't want my time would be wasted right.
• 28:24
  Want to waste anybody? Else's time.
• 28:27
  Like you said, I have plenty of other things it because I can't
• 28:33
  say no to a project. Why I not going to have quote
• 28:38
  unquote free time for probably five years like where I can just
• 28:43
  literally put my feet up and play a video game all day and
• 28:46
  say I got nothing else to do. What could you say no to
• 28:51
  projects? Um, I don't, I don't know if it
• 28:56
  sounds fun or rewarding and maybe it's cuz, you know, maybe
• 29:04
  it's narcissism or whatever because if I'm a people pleaser
• 29:07
  and I don't, you know, I just kind of maybe to your point
• 29:12
  earlier you never know where it will lead, so I don't want to
• 29:18
  close doors that I don't even see yet.
• 29:23
  I'll give you an example. I former professor of mine,
• 29:28
  William. Hey, Ian.
• 29:29
  He's a very prolific poet. I mean, dozens, and dozens and
• 29:35
  dozens and dozens, and dozens of books of poetry published and I
• 29:42
  still keep in touch with him and want to one time, I had stopped
• 29:47
  at see him, he's 80 years old now but he's hail.
• 29:52
  And Geez, an awesome guy but we were talking one day and he has
• 29:58
  about 50 letters that Archibald macleish had sent him in the mid
• 30:06
  70s to early 80s. They had a literary friendship
• 30:13
  that was completely letters. They never picked up the phone
• 30:19
  and talked so he had asked me one.
• 30:22
  Days. Hey, Jamie, would you be
• 30:24
  interested in maybe editing this book?
• 30:27
  Turning it into a book and editing it?
• 30:30
  Yeah, of course I would I didn't know what that meant.
• 30:36
  What that looked like I said, yes.
• 30:41
  And I'm figuring it out. I'm about halfway through that
• 30:45
  project now and it's something that I'm glad I said yes.
• 30:51
  But like Guys said I can't ever and I can this is a me thing but
• 31:00
  I can't fully enjoy free time because I know that there's
• 31:06
  something I could or should be doing.
• 31:11
  I know the feeling but I must say you do need to find time for
• 31:15
  yourself because I know I know exactly where you're coming from
• 31:19
  because I'm a workaholic but the way I look It is, is like you
• 31:23
  need to know. I said this to my flatmate
• 31:26
  because he's been working every day suddenly for, like two
• 31:29
  months, right? Trying to raise money for him
• 31:31
  and his family and I get it and I was like, listen you need to
• 31:35
  take one day a week or one day every two weeks to rest,
• 31:40
  otherwise your body will choose it for you.
• 31:43
  You'll just get sick and then you can't do any work, says it's
• 31:46
  important to have that moment. I supposed to disconnect but I
• 31:48
  do understand because working is addictive.
• 31:51
  It's exciting work. On projects like you say, you
• 31:54
  don't know where it's going to go, who you're going to meet?
• 31:56
  What's going to happen? I get that.
• 31:57
  I understand and it's weird because these you know these
• 32:02
  projects that I take on you know I don't have a glass chewing
• 32:07
  project coming up you know these are things that I like doing.
• 32:13
  Hmm. But I've said this a million
• 32:17
  times that once you start getting paid Paid for something
• 32:24
  or it becomes an official responsibility.
• 32:28
  It's a great way to take the fun right out of it.
• 32:31
  You know, those people that say, do something you love and you'll
• 32:34
  never work a day in your life. I, I believe that to a certain
• 32:39
  extent, hmm? But I can also see how when,
• 32:46
  when it's not your hobby or your your leisure time activity.
• 32:52
  You know, when there is actually a deadline or a responsibility
• 32:57
  or pay, you know, or expectations to me, that's kind
• 33:03
  of where it jumps, you know, or crosses the line to where you
• 33:08
  may still enjoy doing it. I'm having a great time talking
• 33:12
  to you right now. I love researching.
• 33:16
  You know, what was happening around those letters and the
• 33:19
  book that I'm doing and researching that It's different
• 33:24
  than putting my feet up and grabbing a book can just saying
• 33:28
  I'm going to read until I don't feel like reading anymore, you
• 33:32
  know. It's you get what you come from
• 33:35
  but like I think at the same time.
• 33:39
  Okay, here's where I sit on that, right?
• 33:41
  I think every job has certain things or every thing we do in
• 33:45
  life that we want to do that, we can get paid for has aspects to
• 33:48
  it that aren't enjoyable. Like for instance, okay.
• 33:51
  Right now, I edit everything. I do.
• 33:54
  I spend more hours editing than I actually do creating content,
• 33:58
  right? It's the bane of my life.
• 34:00
  Yeah, I don't have enough time to do it all.
• 34:02
  Unfortunately, in terms of, you know, promoting what social
• 34:07
  media and all these different things.
• 34:09
  So, I do what I can with the time that I have, and Straight
• 34:14
  away. I know that, like, if I would
• 34:16
  get somewhere with this and I could pay people to alleviate me
• 34:20
  of these things tasks, then I would enjoy it more.
• 34:26
  Like a, I be able to do more and be I could because for me, the
• 34:31
  my favorite aspect of this is just actually doing this.
• 34:34
  Doing the show talking to people doing the live streams, doing
• 34:39
  the actual content, but everything else, it takes so
• 34:43
  much. My time.
• 34:45
  Yeah, that it does become can't become a bit.
• 34:50
  Draining. So I often have to take breaks
• 34:53
  not necessarily a whole day but like extensive hours where I'm
• 34:56
  just not doing that, just so I don't get demotivated.
• 35:00
  So I do understand you and so that it looks good or it's late.
• 35:04
  It's a necessity. You have to, you have to do it
• 35:06
  but like I understand where you're coming from.
• 35:11
  But at the same time I think it depends on the amount of things
• 35:14
  involved. With the thing that you love
• 35:16
  that you have to do the you don't want Dude, if you know
• 35:20
  what I mean. Like if you're if we just look
• 35:22
  at the example of a podcast, let's say that's your living you
• 35:25
  earn from podcasting, right? If you spend most of your time
• 35:29
  editing and promoting and stuff, I can see the monotonous of it
• 35:33
  and it can take the suck some of the fun out of it, right?
• 35:36
  But the same time, I don't know, I mean I've worked in some jobs,
• 35:39
  I've hated over the years, I think the memory of that can
• 35:42
  really push you to not feel that way.
• 35:46
  Yeah, I am. I I can Definitely see that
• 35:50
  Christian and maybe you know if I if all I had to do was show up
• 35:59
  20 minutes before it started and do the on-air part and not book
• 36:05
  the guest and not remind them to be there and you know, all of
• 36:10
  those things if I just showed up and had the conversation, I
• 36:14
  would like to think that I wouldn't find anything to
• 36:17
  complain about I do. I think it does exist.
• 36:20
  I mean, when I look at someone like Joe Rogan, that seems to be
• 36:23
  the supp. I'm pretty much 100% sure that
• 36:26
  he doesn't do any of the backgrounds, I reckon.
• 36:30
  What if I had to guess? I reckon he glances at the
• 36:35
  research that someone's done for him beforehand, just to
• 36:38
  familiarize. Okay.
• 36:39
  This is the latest projects with this person, blah, blah, blah,
• 36:41
  blah, blah, right? Well, you just know that
• 36:43
  someone's involved with everything from booking.
• 36:46
  The guests during the promotion bubble butt.
• 36:48
  Like he won't be doing any of that.
• 36:49
  Self not because he can't be bothered or something.
• 36:52
  It's just, he's busy, you know, doing things like networking,
• 36:56
  obviously his MMA style, the podcaster.
• 36:59
  A part of it? Yeah.
• 37:00
  And I think like he probably did all of that in the beginning,
• 37:04
  you know? It's like me either way, that's
• 37:06
  the way I see it. Like okay.
• 37:07
  Yeah, I have to do it all myself now, but one day I won't have to
• 37:11
  and I can focus on just the stuff I love.
• 37:14
  And I think that is often the case with all of us.
• 37:16
  When we're chasing our passions, we have Have to do all the stuff
• 37:20
  we don't particularly enjoy that makes the dream possible, you
• 37:24
  know. But yeah, I do get what you're
• 37:27
  where you're coming from. I think that but a way to
• 37:29
  alleviate that potentially is to always kind of pursue new
• 37:33
  projects. Like make sure that what you're
• 37:34
  doing, doesn't become monotonous or something.
• 37:37
  Sure, which is why, you know and this is transition into the into
• 37:40
  the acting side of podcast. Now that's why acting I think an
• 37:45
  actor's never have an issue or get bored of their crop.
• 37:49
  Because every project is completely different.
• 37:51
  You're working with different people every time.
• 37:55
  So you know me and like because one could argue like oh when you
• 38:00
  get bored of doing the same thing you know I get but I guess
• 38:02
  you do it for the money but since it's an r and there's a
• 38:05
  craft to I think and it'll bring the bad to podcasting it relates
• 38:09
  in the same way. I think that that's one of my
• 38:12
  biggest draws as I never know what to expect from every single
• 38:14
  conversation and that is kind of intriguing.
• 38:17
  I never know what's going to come up.
• 38:19
  Where we're going to go with the conversation.
• 38:20
  Right. It's you know it's the live
• 38:25
  without a net sort of thing. Yeah you don't know what's going
• 38:30
  to happen and that's why you need to be present and in tune.
• 38:37
  And you know it's amazing to me how few people actually listen
• 38:47
  to understand. Rather than listening to
• 38:51
  respond. yeah, well that's just most people do that and it seems
• 38:58
  like Society values that more and more like it doesn't seem to
• 39:05
  me that Society values, anything more than a glancing
• 39:13
  understanding Although a lot of things rather than I just, I
• 39:19
  think the people that have really said, hey, this is my
• 39:24
  thing. And I am going to understand
• 39:27
  every single thing about it, even something that no one cares
• 39:32
  about because I do. But, you know, it seems like
• 39:38
  fewer and fewer people really care about, you know, getting
• 39:43
  that depth of knowledge or Understanding.
• 39:47
  Yeah, I think the key the key aspect to this is like, if
• 39:50
  people want to succeed in life and do well like everyone that
• 39:54
  you see the that has risen to the top, like the famous actors
• 39:57
  musicians, whatever. They spent time, as you say,
• 40:01
  learning listening to their peers, people above them, people
• 40:05
  more successful than then, people more intelligent than
• 40:07
  them and they kept learning and they never stop doing that.
• 40:11
  Whereas I think people that aren't as successful in life.
• 40:16
  They're the ones not listening. Because if they were listening,
• 40:21
  They wouldn't kind of be stuck in that that not everyone but
• 40:24
  you know what? When there's people that
• 40:25
  complain about their position but they do nothing about it.
• 40:28
  It's like you you would be able to change it if you listen to
• 40:32
  the people giving you advice. Or I think also it requires
• 40:39
  some, some, some self-realization or
• 40:45
  self-actualization whether it's knowing what you don't know.
• 40:51
  No. And and knowing that they're I
• 40:55
  mean, what, I don't know. Would fill a library?
• 40:58
  Yeah, I know that. And you know what?
• 41:01
  And I am not going to sit here and have a discussion with you
• 41:04
  about the War of the Roses. I'd because I can't without
• 41:10
  potentially sounding like an idiot.
• 41:13
  And you know, those those the one question of what it to ask
• 41:16
  you as well. Yeah, I think it was a But yeah
• 41:22
  and that's and I feel like you had mentioned it with podcasters
• 41:27
  earlier but I feel like I see that with actors.
• 41:30
  Okay. You know whether big time or
• 41:35
  small-time actors I just will watch something and be like why
• 41:40
  did he do that? Like what you mean?
• 41:48
  Emotion gesture line reading like, you know, I'll just be
• 41:56
  like and I could be dead wrong here.
• 41:59
  But it seems like this line reading is the only one that
• 42:05
  makes sense. So why couldn't they figure that
• 42:09
  out? You know, why are they, you
• 42:12
  know, how did they even get on this thing?
• 42:15
  Because this is the only way to say that line.
• 42:18
  That makes it make sense in relation to these other things.
• 42:22
  Now, I also know that in filming and acting that might be the
• 42:27
  last take that they ever wanted to use, but it was the only one
• 42:33
  that didn't have a train going in the background or someone
• 42:37
  sniffling or, you know, any number of things could also be
• 42:42
  the director's Vision, you know? I mean jerk like I've had that
• 42:45
  way. A director is told me to do
• 42:47
  something. About all of the light, wouldn't
• 42:49
  it be better like this way, you know, know because I
• 42:53
  particularly care. Yeah, obviously, I want it to be
• 42:54
  the best it can be. That's that's my kind of
• 42:56
  Fascination. But when I think about the
• 42:58
  Logics of like a character and how they would and wouldn't
• 43:02
  respond to a situation when they pose something like, oh we want
• 43:06
  you to say it this way, or we think the characters should do
• 43:08
  this and it's like that doesn't make sense.
• 43:11
  I mean, this is the story that we've told this is what we're,
• 43:13
  why would they do this? And then they're just like, well
• 43:15
  let's just try it and, you know, okay.
• 43:18
  Yes. And then you do it and then it's
• 43:19
  crap. And then everyone's like, why
• 43:21
  did you do that way you like, right?
• 43:24
  And you always ask, I will always ask why?
• 43:27
  Yeah, yeah, I absolutely I think it's I think if anything is an
• 43:30
  actor's responsibility to do that, I think they should always
• 43:34
  question. The director doesn't matter how
• 43:36
  successful the director is speak up.
• 43:38
  You know, don't be afraid because let everyone is there to
• 43:42
  make a great movie or TV show or whatever like that.
• 43:45
  The put the that everyone has the same goal.
• 43:48
  So long as you're not like, you know, just arguing for the sake
• 43:51
  of it, or it's like an ego thing.
• 43:52
  Like you know, again it goes back to as long as you're not
• 43:55
  wasting people's time, you know, sitting around listening to you.
• 44:00
  Yeah, being an a-hole, but in the other thing that I've found
• 44:05
  is, you know, out if you're the director, I will do obviously,
• 44:11
  whatever it is that you want, but if I feel really strongly
• 44:16
  about something, We'll ask, can we do it once this way?
• 44:22
  Yes. Yo, you will either see it and
• 44:27
  or you will have it on tape and, and it's there.
• 44:32
  And if you tell me, jeez, Jenny that that was, as stupid as I
• 44:35
  thought it was going to be no problem.
• 44:39
  Yeah, I think that I've said this on the show before as well,
• 44:42
  that goes back to, like, the way that you voice things, like a
• 44:46
  lot of people make the mistake a growing who you are, dudes.
• 44:49
  Crap, I think we should do it my way.
• 44:50
  Like, no, no, never never dis someone's idea, just suggest an
• 44:55
  alternative. And as you say in the context of
• 44:57
  acting, it's better to just be like why don't we try it your
• 45:00
  way and my way and see, which is better.
• 45:03
  And then, as you say, they've got an option and to be fair a
• 45:06
  good way of a good reason for doing it that way.
• 45:09
  Wow. Is it could become a parent
• 45:11
  later in like, later, edits or whatever.
• 45:15
  That your way is actually, the better way to do it and now
• 45:17
  they've got two options. You know what I mean?
• 45:19
  They and they're not forced to use their way that maybe didn't
• 45:22
  make sense because they've got those options because you gave
• 45:25
  them that option and you respectful in doing, so you
• 45:27
  didn't kind of like make them angry about it, you just because
• 45:31
  that's what people forget, I think an acting is, you know, it
• 45:34
  that's the director's vision of all the writers vision of that
• 45:37
  particular thing. But it's a creative project like
• 45:41
  all creative projects. If you've got loads of people
• 45:43
  working on a project is okay to suggest an idea but don't try to
• 45:47
  disparage other people's ideas like you know it's a create an
• 45:51
  idea comes it's a personal thing.
• 45:53
  It comes from that person so when you attack the idea you
• 45:57
  attack the person. So it's I think it's all in the
• 45:59
  great, especially something is Creative Vision.
• 46:04
  As you know, the film medium or something and I am actually I
• 46:12
  run into this pretty frequently because there is one company
• 46:17
  that I work with pretty frequently and that I'm
• 46:20
  currently working with right now and they love horror films,
• 46:25
  okay? And I'll be honest they don't do
• 46:29
  anything for me. I don't understand the draw.
• 46:37
  I don't get what? Makes a good horror film, you
• 46:42
  know. So a lot of times, it is a leap
• 46:45
  of faith for me, where I'll ask him, guys.
• 46:49
  How did that look? Dude, it was amazing, really
• 46:52
  okay, good. Good and it reminds me of Leslie
• 46:56
  Nielsen like the naked gone. Someone someone had said to him.
• 47:01
  You are so funny. How do you keep a straight face
• 47:05
  when you stay these hysterical lines?
• 47:07
  He's like, I don't It's funny. He's like maybe Natan I just
• 47:13
  don't understand the humor, but I don't think it's funny, you
• 47:19
  know. So that's a perfect.
• 47:24
  Yeah. And, you know, it kind of
• 47:26
  crossed my mind. The last time we filmed
• 47:29
  overnight in 20, °F whether you know, when when literally I'm
• 47:38
  just Ending their freezing, my ass off.
• 47:41
  That's what I feel like shivering is as close to acting
• 47:46
  as I'm getting. And I'm asking a guy's house, it
• 47:48
  looked like brilliant. Great.
• 47:52
  And I'm just like, all right. Perfect.
• 47:54
  Then, you know, maybe there is part of that we're either.
• 48:00
  I can't understand or they can't articulate what it is that they
• 48:05
  appreciate about the performance, but it doesn't
• 48:08
  matter. Italy, you know, they're happy
• 48:11
  and I don't know why, but that's good.
• 48:13
  Yeah, I think it's important people.
• 48:15
  Be critical though in. Like be, if do not be afraid to
• 48:18
  speak up because, as you say, when everyone's just going.
• 48:20
  Yes, yes, yes, it's great. Like, I don't know, this cynic
• 48:23
  in me is always like, no, we can always improve this.
• 48:25
  There, always a better way to do this, like, surely there must be
• 48:28
  something. There is nothing worse than
• 48:32
  watching, like a rough cut or whatever to be like, dude.
• 48:37
  What did? That's what you thought was
• 48:41
  great. Come on, you know, because, and
• 48:45
  that's the big thing. I think whether it's podcasting
• 48:49
  acting or any creative Endeavor, that has your name on it, that's
• 48:58
  that's all you have. Is your name, you know.
• 49:01
  So why would you want Less than your best work, right?
• 49:10
  But out there? Yeah, no, I agree.
• 49:13
  I remember, I learned this lesson, very young.
• 49:15
  I remember when I was producing trying on producer recording my
• 49:20
  first bands, like EP was like the first proper professional
• 49:24
  music work at ever done. It was amazing and we lucked
• 49:28
  out, we got an amazing produce at this guy was in former band
• 49:31
  he'd had a little bit of light success in the UK with his work
• 49:35
  and he He was transitioned into a production career music
• 49:38
  production and I noticed the pattern of that.
• 49:42
  How all the rest of the band would leave the studio, but me,
• 49:45
  and him would still be there to after hours, you know, working
• 49:48
  on stuff, and we would get chatting that naturally, right.
• 49:51
  Sure. And because we had similar work
• 49:53
  ethics, and I remember We he would always work with me past
• 49:58
  the hours that we paid for and I remember saying to him one
• 50:01
  night, like listen II can't afford to pay, you passed the
• 50:05
  hours like can we continue it tomorrow?
• 50:08
  And he just cut me off there and said, listen, I'm going to keep
• 50:11
  working on this out of hours, I always do.
• 50:14
  And he said, this isn't just a record for your band.
• 50:18
  This is something that has my name attached to it.
• 50:21
  That goes out, you know, under my label and it will not label
• 50:25
  but like My name. So it's important that it's very
• 50:29
  high quality and that I won't be satisfied with it.
• 50:32
  It basically. I won't be satisfied until it's
• 50:37
  up to my standards and therefore I will work.
• 50:40
  As long as I need to work on it regardless of whether or not you
• 50:42
  paid me for the time. And I remember, I don't know
• 50:46
  that just really inspired me. I've always had that kind of
• 50:49
  attitude now since then like to put in just maximum effort every
• 50:53
  single time because yeah, if your name is attached to it,
• 50:57
  that's a reflection of you. And for many people watching
• 51:00
  that stuff, that might be the first time they've ever seen or
• 51:02
  heard anything from you. And if it may be the only, Hey,
• 51:06
  there you go. Yeah.
• 51:07
  If it's bad quality or your heart's not in it they're going
• 51:09
  to tell may be able to tell. Yeah I get that I like sports
• 51:15
  and that that's a thing in the NFL you know they say the eye in
• 51:20
  the sky doesn't lie because every practice is recorded.
• 51:28
  Every game is recorded. So you know, let's say I play
• 51:34
  for Or the Dolphins. Whatever.
• 51:37
  I play for professional football, team.
• 51:39
  My team sucks. We're going nowhere this year,
• 51:43
  we're getting blown out in this game.
• 51:46
  We're not going to win this game.
• 51:49
  But guess what? Some team is going to watch this
• 51:55
  tape. And if they see me taking this
• 51:58
  playoff, because I don't want to get hurt because we're going
• 52:03
  nowhere this season and I've already lost this game.
• 52:07
  Well, that team is going to see the tape and say, what this dude
• 52:12
  takes place off. Why would I pay someone millions
• 52:16
  of dollars? You know, to work when they feel
• 52:22
  like it's important? Hmm, that's a good point.
• 52:27
  I didn't actually know that they do that in the NFL, according.
• 52:29
  Oh yeah. Absolutely.
• 52:32
  You know and like I said in the games and That's why you know,
• 52:37
  when you're talking about these freak athletes who are, you
• 52:42
  know, that's hop, 1% of athletes in the world.
• 52:47
  The difference between, you know, the worst player in the
• 52:54
  NFL and the best player not in the NFL is miniscule in, maybe
• 53:00
  it is a tenth of a second that you did.
• 53:05
  Hold that block in the fourth quarter of a game that was
• 53:09
  already over. Yeah, since we were talking
• 53:15
  about acting before. Let's talk a little bit about
• 53:16
  that. So how long have you been an
• 53:19
  actor? How did you get into that?
• 53:20
  And what are some of your best and worst moments from
• 53:23
  marketing? I got into it in high school
• 53:28
  with musicals and things like that.
• 53:33
  And then through college I did, you know, stage acting and then
• 53:41
  College. I did a lot of community theater
• 53:46
  and I was where we had a pretty, pretty consistent cast, for
• 53:54
  three years. We did three shows in a row with
• 53:56
  the same producer and the same core cast.
• 54:04
  And I would hear a lot of them talking about film work and I'm
• 54:06
  like, guys, how do you get into film?
• 54:08
  You know, and they told me well, RIT T.
• 54:11
  Rochester Institute of Technology is a very prestigious
• 54:16
  film school. That's four miles away.
• 54:21
  So I started auditioning first audition.
• 54:25
  I went to, I was hammered, never done a film audition or a film
• 54:32
  before and I got the role and I didn't know what to do.
• 54:41
  I'm on the set, you know, and there was one lady, you know,
• 54:46
  I'm working with professional actors like that are up from New
• 54:51
  York City for the weekend to film this and everybody was
• 54:56
  super friendly and helpful. And you know, but I had asked
• 54:59
  one of the ladies they said, hey, I've done theater before.
• 55:03
  I've never done a film. Any advice that?
• 55:07
  Going to take less than 5 Seconds.
• 55:11
  She's like yeah. If in doubt standstill, which
• 55:15
  was perfect for me because you can't tell, but I'm six foot
• 55:21
  four, 220 pounds and it's the opposite in theater, because if
• 55:27
  you see me on stage and I'm standing still, you're like what
• 55:31
  was wrong with that, dude? Right.
• 55:33
  Because he's huge and he's just standing there.
• 55:37
  We're similarly, in film. If I'm fidgeting, and you know,
• 55:41
  keeping something in my hand, it takes the focus away from where
• 55:45
  it should be. So since then, I have done a
• 55:50
  number of films, you know, anything from student short
• 55:55
  films to thesis films to Independent films, and I'm
• 56:01
  working right now on an independent feature film, okay?
• 56:08
  In the best or worst. I don't, I don't know that.
• 56:18
  I could even identify one, you know, it's, it's such an active
• 56:28
  craft and I'm sure, you know, this that, you know, I'm
• 56:34
  constantly trying to Be better. Right?
• 56:40
  You know where it's almost you know you miss the forest for the
• 56:44
  trees that you know I'm trying to be in the moment and you know
• 56:53
  to where when I can sit down and watch the finished product
• 56:59
  that's maybe the reward that I get.
• 57:04
  If it's good or if I'm good. Excellent.
• 57:11
  Moving it forward. So you mentioned earlier that
• 57:14
  you suffer from add, I just wanted to ask you because I
• 57:19
  think it's beneficial, you know. I like to discuss things like
• 57:22
  this learn more about it, talk to us a little bit more about
• 57:26
  sort of your experience of and how you handle add and how you
• 57:31
  manage it. Like how it's affected your life
• 57:33
  over the years, talk to us a little bit about that.
• 57:36
  Well, I wasn't Officially diagnosed until my 20s.
• 57:41
  Okay, so after college didn't things, I can tell you that
• 57:46
  nobody who knows me was surprised with the diagnosis but
• 57:51
  for whatever reason I just you know and I'm a little older
• 57:56
  maybe it just wasn't a thing back then.
• 57:59
  You know it was it was well, Jamie's a smartass and you know
• 58:04
  if Jamie wasn't trying to make everyone laugh Maybe he he'd be
• 58:08
  able to pay attention better and things like that.
• 58:12
  But really it's the medication really really helps my doctor
• 58:22
  awesome guy. You know, he sent me to a
• 58:25
  psychologist to get tested. You know, he's like look the the
• 58:31
  prescription for this is street-level amphetamines, I'm
• 58:37
  not Just going to give you drugs because you have a hard time
• 58:44
  remembering laundry soap at the grocery store and that testing
• 58:50
  was so humbling because you know, I'm a pretty bright
• 58:54
  person. So I could always think my way
• 58:58
  through tests or figure them out.
• 59:01
  Well, not this test and then I'll just give you a couple
• 59:05
  examples of things. So The first test I had to take
• 59:10
  was without my medication, so to get a baseline of kind of where
• 59:15
  we are. So there's this Flipboard, you
• 59:19
  know? So the doctor says, all right,
• 59:20
  there's like three like symbols. He says the square means horse.
• 59:26
  In this, you know, half triangle thing means, man, and the circle
• 59:30
  means ride. Got it.
• 59:32
  Yeah, I'm not an idiot. And then he flips the page and
• 59:35
  there's only symbols. He says read me that.
• 59:37
  Sentence. Good, what's the circle one?
• 59:41
  Again, you know, it's just like, and it's not because I'm
• 59:45
  ignoring him, it's just that. And again I've studied the
• 59:50
  physiological thing. Basically my mind or basically
• 59:57
  anyone with add your mind, can't prioritize.
• 1:00:03
  What is the most important? That thing right now.
• 1:00:09
  So it's not that I'm not paying attention to you.
• 1:00:13
  I am but I'm also listening to the birds outside.
• 1:00:18
  Wondering, what time it is wondering if that thing was it
• 1:00:21
  two or three. And I'm also working on a
• 1:00:24
  Rubik's Cube under the desk, you know, like all of those things.
• 1:00:28
  So so what happened was, there was no quality of understanding
• 1:00:36
  happening. Another part of the test, and
• 1:00:40
  it's funny because now that I know these things, I see them
• 1:00:43
  and they drive me nuts, but they're just tell you to more.
• 1:00:48
  I won't keep you here all day. So one of them was a series of
• 1:00:51
  numbers. So the guy would say I'm going
• 1:00:53
  to say a series of numbers and you're going to say them back to
• 1:00:57
  me backwards, okay? For 12-9 912 for you know, but
• 1:01:04
  then it's five numbers in a row. And then it's six numbers in a
• 1:01:09
  row and my brain doesn't work like that.
• 1:01:14
  The other one was he played a recording and it's someone
• 1:01:20
  talking and again you have to like say the numbers back or
• 1:01:25
  whatever the prompt is, but there's background noise on the
• 1:01:28
  recording in the background noise keeps getting louder.
• 1:01:33
  And at some point I can't Can't tune out the background noise,
• 1:01:41
  just to listen to what I'm supposed to listen to.
• 1:01:47
  So I did awful on that test, which I was supposed to.
• 1:01:54
  And the next time I went back and did the test again medicated
• 1:01:59
  and I scored 80 percent higher on the medication.
• 1:02:05
  And The other thing with the medication, if you see someone,
• 1:02:12
  who's who doesn't have ADD? It's takes the amount of
• 1:02:17
  medication that I do. You think they were on cocain?
• 1:02:21
  Because they're fidgety, they're sweating, they're hyper.
• 1:02:26
  I'm like, that unmedicated. You ever seen someone, their
• 1:02:29
  leg, like goes non-stop. Yep, that's how I am.
• 1:02:34
  Like, if I'm watching a movie, like my legs, go.
• 1:02:37
  I'm fidgeting. So the medication actually calms
• 1:02:42
  me down because allows my brain to process and order things.
• 1:02:50
  Excellent. Okay, what what kind of tips
• 1:02:53
  could you give to people that might be struggling with ADD
• 1:02:57
  right now, like based on your life and what you've learned if
• 1:03:01
  you and mean first off, I would say, see a doctor if That's
• 1:03:07
  available to you. And if that's something that's
• 1:03:10
  possible, you know? Don't let this stigma of a TD or
• 1:03:16
  anything else get to you, you know?
• 1:03:21
  And the other thing is, I don't know.
• 1:03:24
  It's almost like a catch-22 here where by being able to build
• 1:03:33
  something. Selfishly for me it's great.
• 1:03:39
  But how many great works of art or how much different would our
• 1:03:48
  world be today? If everybody who had add or
• 1:03:54
  something else wrong with them, was medicated for it to you know
• 1:04:03
  really Change their behavior, you know?
• 1:04:09
  So and obviously that's not advice.
• 1:04:12
  That's more, you know, a rhetorical because I guarantee
• 1:04:18
  you that, you know, a lot of these quote-unquote Geniuses
• 1:04:25
  would not have been able to do what they do.
• 1:04:31
  Did unlock s, they were soft and Sufferings not even the right
• 1:04:36
  word, but you know, unless they were dealing with ADD, unless
• 1:04:40
  their brain were wired differently.
• 1:04:43
  Like - he mentioned, I don't know.
• 1:04:49
  No, I got that. I got that.
• 1:04:50
  You mentioned about that being a stigma which I understand that
• 1:04:53
  there would have been many, many years ago.
• 1:04:55
  But given how we've sort of progressed, a lot of society and
• 1:05:00
  mental health conditions and I'll take it more seriously.
• 1:05:02
  And I know this doesn't fall under mental.
• 1:05:05
  By the way, I know it's more. It's hey, hey, viewer condition,
• 1:05:09
  I guess would be a better way to put it.
• 1:05:10
  Well, I'll tell you Christian, I used to have really, really bad
• 1:05:15
  anxiety, okay. And and I don't know if a TD was
• 1:05:21
  100% responsible for it, but I can tell you that since I've
• 1:05:26
  been medicated for add. Hmm.
• 1:05:29
  My anxiety is next to nothing. Yeah, man.
• 1:05:32
  This is just like how Just told me that is very, very common
• 1:05:38
  because the game again, your brain can't prioritize, you
• 1:05:43
  know, regular things. And here is or fuels your heart.
• 1:05:48
  Skip a beat and says shit. This is the big one.
• 1:05:51
  This, what's going on? What do you know when it's know?
• 1:05:54
  It's you know, so there is a mental health aspect to it.
• 1:06:01
  I would say, but do you still think there is a stigma you
• 1:06:04
  mentioned that the stigma is that something you you referring
• 1:06:08
  to like when you were growing up or do you mean there is still
• 1:06:11
  today? I think that anytime you are
• 1:06:19
  reaching out to a professional or coming out you know to find
• 1:06:25
  out there's going to be a stigma because maybe you're just stupid
• 1:06:31
  you know? Maybe it didn't.
• 1:06:35
  I don't mean that to be a jerk but maybe you say you know what,
• 1:06:39
  I must have ADD because I'm getting off oh grades or maybe
• 1:06:43
  it's a parent that says that, you know, my little Johnny is
• 1:06:47
  the smartest guy in the history of the world, but he's getting
• 1:06:49
  such bad grades. He must have ADD, you know, so I
• 1:06:56
  do think that there's a potential for stigma because
• 1:07:00
  anytime you go into a head doctor or something, You're
• 1:07:05
  almost at their Mercy, you know, with their diagnosis.
• 1:07:11
  So, yeah, I don't you know, it's certainly not as stigmatized as
• 1:07:16
  some other mental health issues in afflictions, but I do think
• 1:07:22
  the potential is there. Tell us the best and worst
• 1:07:27
  things about Rochester, New York.
• 1:07:31
  Hmm. Well, I don't want this to be a
• 1:07:39
  cop out, but I would say, there is a same answer everywhere that
• 1:07:47
  I have lived, you'll, you'll find what you look for.
• 1:07:55
  You know, if if you go online and say, top 10 things to do in
• 1:08:02
  Rochester, you go do those Ten things that everybody dies, you
• 1:08:06
  may say this. Yeah, I don't get, this is the
• 1:08:10
  same as here but worse or it's the same as there, but the
• 1:08:14
  stairs are nicer, you know, for your own trail.
• 1:08:21
  There are, I mean there are beautiful Parts I feel like of
• 1:08:30
  any and every city and and sometimes you got to bring your
• 1:08:36
  own Beauty, you know, maybe maybe.
• 1:08:39
  You just need to on a lunch break, go sit under a bridge and
• 1:08:42
  listen to the water, you know, or go walk in the Woods by your
• 1:08:48
  side with a key. And I'm going to sound like a
• 1:08:52
  hypocrite because I take pictures of everything,
• 1:08:55
  especially cool things but maybe leave your phone in the car and
• 1:09:02
  just you know and just enjoy. Your surroundings.
• 1:09:09
  So I I'm sorry if that's a cop-out, but I do I feel like II
• 1:09:16
  don't know what it's like across the pond, but I truly feel like
• 1:09:21
  in America, everybody will tell you the crappiest part about
• 1:09:28
  their Hometown or the city. They live in, you know, and it's
• 1:09:32
  all the same thing, the parking sucks are.
• 1:09:35
  There's no This there's no that it's so expensive.
• 1:09:39
  The foods this the foods that and you know and they'll say but
• 1:09:44
  you know where you live? Oh that such and such is to die
• 1:09:48
  for and it is just you know it's finding something that you like
• 1:09:57
  and focusing on it or finding something that you hate and
• 1:10:00
  focusing on it because both will always be there.
• 1:10:04
  Fair enough, tell us about your marketing career.
• 1:10:08
  What if you learn over the years, through your sources,
• 1:10:11
  your your work in marketing. I mean, it changes almost daily,
• 1:10:22
  hmm. But so I have enjoyed that
• 1:10:26
  learning aspect of it and it really is fascinating to me
• 1:10:32
  because Even five years ago, you know, if you would have said to
• 1:10:39
  me, you know, Jamie, how do you feel about the internet and
• 1:10:42
  search engines tracking you? I be like nope, DuckDuckGo.
• 1:10:47
  All my privacy. No, no, no, they're not going to
• 1:10:51
  know a thing about me and now I still try to be cautious but I
• 1:11:03
  try to be Be more cautious about other people's stuff.
• 1:11:07
  You know what I mean? I'm not if you and I are having
• 1:11:10
  lunch. I'm going to be a lot more
• 1:11:13
  hesitant to say. Hey me and Christian are going
• 1:11:18
  to lunch today at 2 and we're going to eat at such-and-such
• 1:11:21
  because that's your business. Now, after the fact, I might
• 1:11:25
  say, hey, had a great lunch today with Christian.
• 1:11:28
  Try the fish and chips, whatever.
• 1:11:31
  But I can also See how the advertising experience and
• 1:11:38
  really the whole online experience is sculpted towards
• 1:11:47
  me as a person because my phone knows me better than just about
• 1:11:53
  anybody in this world. So, you know, the bad example
• 1:11:59
  that I use all the time is, I don't get douche commercials in
• 1:12:06
  my pre-roll on YouTube because YouTube knows exactly who I am.
• 1:12:12
  And they know exactly what ads just show me to get me to buy
• 1:12:17
  something, which is the ultimate goal.
• 1:12:20
  So like the psfs, I'm going to work on this guy that dumped up
• 1:12:24
  other. So yeah, seeing how it can It'd
• 1:12:34
  be useful, you know, seeing how the information that's collected
• 1:12:41
  can be more than a nuisance. It can be more than a privacy
• 1:12:47
  concern. You know, if you feel that
• 1:12:52
  consumerism is a worthy Endeavor and I'm I'm on the fence with
• 1:12:57
  it. So.
• 1:12:58
  But you know, it's not big government or Big Brother.
• 1:13:02
  That's You know collecting your info for nefarious purposes?
• 1:13:08
  No. It's, you know, the the the
• 1:13:12
  local, the local music store, who wants you to know about
• 1:13:17
  records shop Day that's coming up because they know that you
• 1:13:21
  play the guitar. What kind of tips could you give
• 1:13:26
  to people who want to get into sales and marketing?
• 1:13:33
  Be able in, I would almost say the two are different because
• 1:13:41
  any sales. Yes, but selling marketing, like
• 1:13:46
  I used to work for AT&T and I was I was this the sales manager
• 1:13:53
  of the business to business team.
• 1:13:57
  So my team was selling cell phones to business.
• 1:14:04
  It was, I mean, 100's of lines. And when I was hiring thing for
• 1:14:14
  that position, he is someone who can have a conversation, you
• 1:14:20
  know. I don't care.
• 1:14:22
  Her that, you know, the specs of every phone or that you
• 1:14:27
  understand how cellphone handoffs work, because the
• 1:14:31
  person you're talking to doesn't still, my thought was, if you
• 1:14:37
  can have a good conversation, someone's calling in, they're
• 1:14:43
  probably going to buy something. If you just don't screw it up.
• 1:14:49
  So if you can have a conversation and put Nattie's.
• 1:14:53
  And they don't feel that their time is being wasted, because
• 1:14:56
  you don't know what the hell you're doing.
• 1:14:59
  You know, you're more likely not to screw it up.
• 1:15:03
  Now in selling marketing I feel like you do have to have a good
• 1:15:10
  understanding and maybe this goes back to what we're talking
• 1:15:13
  about before because I would say that 9 99 out of 100 consumers
• 1:15:21
  will tell. You that they don't understand
• 1:15:25
  cellphone technology, while probably 80 out of 100 will tell
• 1:15:31
  you. They understand how Google works
• 1:15:35
  and they understand how online advertising works.
• 1:15:38
  I'll give you one example. Everybody tells me when I'm
• 1:15:42
  explaining this search engine results pages I did these are
• 1:15:47
  the paid ads it says add oh yeah I never click on those oh yeah.
• 1:15:52
  Yeah, that's funny because you and nobody else ever clicks on
• 1:15:56
  those ads that generate billions of dollars every year.
• 1:16:02
  You know, some people and you know people say well I never
• 1:16:06
  click on those ads so I'm sure nobody else does, it's not true,
• 1:16:11
  but I do think you and that's a fine line.
• 1:16:18
  Trying to explain something to someone.
• 1:16:21
  And you had said this kind of before talking about filming or
• 1:16:24
  acting like trying to explain something to someone who thinks
• 1:16:29
  they already understand it. Without telling them.
• 1:16:33
  No, you're wrong. Yeah, a difficult thing.
• 1:16:40
  Isn't this stubbornness video, isn't it?
• 1:16:41
  I mean, it's like you said before.
• 1:16:43
  Yeah, if they just can't listen. I mean I mean the often often
• 1:16:47
  the way I do it is like I'll try and speak to them a little bit.
• 1:16:50
  If they're not receipt like receptive or they're just not
• 1:16:54
  listening. I just don't bother.
• 1:16:55
  I'm like you know what? They're just going to have to
• 1:16:57
  learn the hard way. Then let's yeah.
• 1:17:00
  What did you just wasting your breath?
• 1:17:02
  You know, I have I have done that.
• 1:17:05
  You know where I'm writing off site content for someone.
• 1:17:09
  Like no, it needs to have my name in it.
• 1:17:12
  It needs to have this and needs at that and I will just tell
• 1:17:15
  him. Look, dude, this is going on
• 1:17:17
  someone else's website. Someone is already paying to
• 1:17:23
  advertise on that website. How are they going to feel about
• 1:17:28
  this piece of content? That is blatant advertising, but
• 1:17:35
  you're not paying for it? How's that going to work?
• 1:17:38
  It's not not for Long at least so.
• 1:17:42
  So yeah it's yeah because you don't tell someone you know look
• 1:17:47
  dude you're wrong. There's a reason you called me
• 1:17:51
  and I will try to tie it back to their industry.
• 1:17:56
  You know. Hey bro, if if a shingle falls
• 1:18:00
  off my roof, I might take a shot at fixing it.
• 1:18:03
  Okay. If 40, shingles fall off, I
• 1:18:07
  might reach out to my dad who I know.
• 1:18:09
  Handy and he can probably help me if my whole goddamn roof,
• 1:18:15
  blows off. I'm calling a roofer.
• 1:18:21
  Fair enough, fair enough. Moving it Forward.
• 1:18:24
  What do you think of some of your best and worst experiences
• 1:18:29
  working in sales and marketing over the years?
• 1:18:34
  Some of my best experiences are You know, when I have built a
• 1:18:44
  relationship from scratch. And and I know that the reason
• 1:18:51
  that the client has signed on or gone forward is because of that
• 1:18:56
  because of me and whether they've set it or not, you know,
• 1:19:03
  that they're like, you know, look Jamie.
• 1:19:06
  I'm gonna do this for you and I'm doing three months.
• 1:19:10
  And after three months, when I don't see anything, I'm not
• 1:19:17
  doing this anymore, I'm not wasting that money and instead
• 1:19:24
  surprise surprise, what we see is after three months.
• 1:19:28
  We do see traction and then they do stick with you and, you know,
• 1:19:35
  you do get to you, do get to show them results.
• 1:19:41
  Because ultimately what we're talking about is we're talking
• 1:19:46
  about changing someone's life, you know if Johnny the roofer is
• 1:19:53
  one bad summer away from going out of business and going back
• 1:19:58
  to work in the factory and he says hey you know what, this is
• 1:20:02
  my last summer, I'm putting it all out there, I need to
• 1:20:05
  advertise and I need to see if this is really going to work.
• 1:20:10
  Work for me or if I need to go back to doing what I was doing,
• 1:20:15
  well by increasing the business, you know, it's it's changing his
• 1:20:23
  life. It's changing his family's life.
• 1:20:26
  If he has to hire three more people, now you're changing
• 1:20:31
  those three people's lives and their families lives.
• 1:20:37
  And, you know, it comes from Advertising in getting people,
• 1:20:44
  it's just a lot of people want to look at everything and find
• 1:20:50
  the the bad part of it. Well, advertising is really just
• 1:20:55
  taking advantage of people that, you know, are looking for
• 1:21:01
  something at a certain time. And is it?
• 1:21:03
  Yeah, you can look at it that way, or you can look at it as
• 1:21:09
  I'm identifying. Defying, someone who is going to
• 1:21:13
  buy this product from someone and instead, I'm trying to
• 1:21:19
  persuade them to buy that product from this person, whom I
• 1:21:26
  fully believe in because I have sleep at night as well.
• 1:21:30
  I'm not going to, you know, I'm not going to push it a crappy
• 1:21:34
  product or, you know, I think the biggest thing in any sales.
• 1:21:40
  Is being able to walk away from what being able to identify and
• 1:21:45
  walk away from a bad deal and to answer the second half of your
• 1:21:51
  question, my worst experiences in sales or marketing are and I
• 1:21:58
  won't mention any names. But I I had one client where I
• 1:22:02
  was relatively new in the job. And as I'm having the
• 1:22:08
  conversation, you know, all you can see are the Dollar signs.
• 1:22:11
  You're like all man. If I land this deal, it's going
• 1:22:14
  to be x amount, upfront, plus that residual every month.
• 1:22:19
  This is going to be awesome and all the warning signs are there
• 1:22:23
  right now, this guy's going to be a nightmare to work with.
• 1:22:27
  He's not going to let us do our job.
• 1:22:29
  He's going to question every single thing that we do and he's
• 1:22:35
  actually going to hinder our ability to do.
• 1:22:40
  What he's paying us to do and inevitably it happened.
• 1:22:47
  Like, literally this dude would call me and I'd have to tell him
• 1:22:51
  sit down. Take a deep breath.
• 1:22:53
  Okay. Okay.
• 1:22:56
  You know, it's a good thing, we're not cardiologist, we're in
• 1:23:00
  digital marketing, chill out, you know, he's like, but if my
• 1:23:04
  client finds out about this, how the hell would he?
• 1:23:08
  He's running a business. And you're running a business
• 1:23:14
  you to a to a certain extent. You can tell your client what to
• 1:23:19
  think if you know more about the industry than they do.
• 1:23:24
  Hmm. I just know I'll add Stars.
• 1:23:30
  Well I don't think it really because from what you laid out
• 1:23:34
  that I presume it's the sort of situation where they were hiring
• 1:23:38
  use, its B2B. So they were hiring you in order
• 1:23:40
  to do ya, do work with their client like sort of sales or
• 1:23:45
  marketing services? So it's like, third-party.
• 1:23:48
  I worked for a white label SEO. Reseller, that's how I got into
• 1:23:53
  the marketing business. And I learned so much and it was
• 1:23:57
  a great company. And yeah, it's like you don't
• 1:24:00
  have to declare that tool. Like if I was a Content producer
• 1:24:05
  or Mark that, let's say I'm a marketing agency, right?
• 1:24:08
  And I'm working with a client and they're like, hey, we want
• 1:24:13
  you to get X next done. I'm not going to tell them that
• 1:24:15
  I employ like freelance writers, or what?
• 1:24:19
  I'm not going to tell them where the content comes from.
• 1:24:21
  Like that's neither here nor there.
• 1:24:24
  It's about, Getting the product out to them.
• 1:24:27
  And if there is any discrepancies, then we take
• 1:24:30
  responsibility. But then we take that back to
• 1:24:33
  the the freelance writer will say, hey I'm going to fire you
• 1:24:38
  or hey you need to change this or or whatever, you know.
• 1:24:41
  But yeah, it's interesting that they're the client reacted that
• 1:24:45
  way that's a bit bizarre I guess.
• 1:24:48
  And that's the experience. I well I don't know how the
• 1:24:54
  client reacted because the reseller was so scared.
• 1:25:00
  Witless about this and I'm going to pretend his name was Bill.
• 1:25:06
  It wasn't bill but I've had the conversation would have the
• 1:25:10
  conversation like Bill. This is how you are on the phone
• 1:25:15
  with me. Yeah.
• 1:25:17
  Do you really think your client thinks that you're writing six,
• 1:25:22
  blog posts a month and a press release and doing all these
• 1:25:28
  on-site changes yourself? I don't think so.
• 1:25:31
  Exactly. Yeah, just relax.
• 1:25:36
  Nice. Anyway, moving it Forward,
• 1:25:41
  especially when something's working, right?
• 1:25:46
  Is there any, let me, let me phrase.
• 1:25:48
  This better. What's the biggest life lesson
• 1:25:52
  that you've learned so far? It's probably a line from
• 1:26:07
  Infinite Jest, it's a David Foster Wallace novel This
• 1:26:11
  brilliant but it says you'll care a lot less about what
• 1:26:16
  people think about you when you realize how seldom they do.
• 1:26:20
  So You know, and I don't know. And obviously that can be said
• 1:26:32
  any number of ways, you know that, you know, you're your own
• 1:26:40
  worst critic, do your thing, you know, maybe along those same
• 1:26:47
  lines Doug Stanhope. Who's a brilliant comedian?
• 1:26:52
  He was in the middle of a riff about something and then he's
• 1:26:55
  like hold on. You do realize that the end of
• 1:26:59
  this we all die. Right?
• 1:27:01
  Yeah. Okay.
• 1:27:02
  Okay. In this is still what we want to
• 1:27:04
  do with our time. Yeah, feel free.
• 1:27:06
  I just wanted to make sure that we had the same level of
• 1:27:09
  understanding, you know? So it's, you know, live in, I
• 1:27:16
  live in my own head in my own thoughts way.
• 1:27:21
  Way way too much. But I've tried to make a
• 1:27:25
  conscious decision to, you know, to be in the here and now more
• 1:27:32
  and appreciate the beauty of things.
• 1:27:37
  Tell me what you think about this.
• 1:27:40
  I truly feel like when I look at the sky, these days, it looks
• 1:27:49
  different than it did. twenty years ago, the colors the shapes
• 1:27:57
  and I could be way off here, but the only reason that I can think
• 1:28:04
  of is that cameras have gotten so much better that when I take
• 1:28:12
  a picture of the sky and I see all these brilliant colors that
• 1:28:17
  the next time I look at the sky, I see those Players.
• 1:28:22
  Or is that just drugs? What do you think?
• 1:28:26
  Um, yeah, for me it's different. I I kind of feel like and maybe
• 1:28:34
  it's because I just pay more attention now to what's around
• 1:28:40
  me and I agree with your point about living in the moment, by
• 1:28:43
  the way. But yeah.
• 1:28:44
  When I look at things these days, like I went to my local,
• 1:28:49
  there's like a local nature, reserve placed.
• 1:28:52
  I went to today that go too often and I'll just sit there,
• 1:28:55
  watch The Wildlife, you know, just just relax.
• 1:28:59
  And, you know, I never used to do that when I was teenager,
• 1:29:03
  really I We used to pay much attention now, I pay attention
• 1:29:06
  to the time. Like it's very peaceful, it's
• 1:29:08
  really good, but when I look at things nature, Places.
• 1:29:15
  I used to go memories. It doesn't look much different.
• 1:29:22
  Sometimes I feel like, you know, I'm in a movie or something.
• 1:29:24
  It feels kind of like that, but it's not so much that things.
• 1:29:30
  Look different, it's the things feel different.
• 1:29:34
  The way I feel about things. The way I interpret, life aspect
• 1:29:39
  of everything is changed. Like I feel like now I'm a very
• 1:29:42
  sentimental person. I make every moment count on, I
• 1:29:46
  like now I try to take advantage of every opportunity.
• 1:29:49
  Like if someone says, hey do you want to go out for drinks?
• 1:29:52
  I'd go out for drinks. Even if I don't really
• 1:29:57
  particularly want to, I just go out anyway because it's an
• 1:30:00
  opportunity as a chance for memories.
• 1:30:02
  It's, you know, all of these things.
• 1:30:04
  But I never used to think that way many years ago in a rash.
• 1:30:09
  Yeah. But it's not even just that it's
• 1:30:11
  like, yeah, I don't know making the most of every day, you know
• 1:30:15
  because you can You don't know like how long you going to be on
• 1:30:19
  this planet? How long were going to be alive?
• 1:30:22
  And you have seen that with my own eyes.
• 1:30:25
  I've seen friends pass away and it just happens and you don't
• 1:30:30
  really they just kind of makes you think a lot about your own
• 1:30:36
  life? and, Wasting time to know what I
• 1:30:41
  mean. Like time just goes so quickly.
• 1:30:43
  Now, especially when you get older, and I always just try to
• 1:30:47
  focus on making the most of every moment.
• 1:30:49
  And really being in that moment and really kind of appreciating
• 1:30:53
  every part of it, even if it is just standing and looking at the
• 1:30:57
  sky, I think that can be as impactful as a great
• 1:31:02
  relationship or a particularly exciting moment in your life.
• 1:31:06
  Think it's all kind of the same but it's all dependent on On
• 1:31:10
  your perception and reaction to it.
• 1:31:15
  This is what I think. Have you ever heard this as
• 1:31:18
  water? Nah.
• 1:31:24
  It is a commencement speech Again by David Foster Wallace.
• 1:31:29
  And I would tell you go on YouTube and watch, it's 20
• 1:31:32
  minutes, and it is unbelievable. But basically, he, one of the
• 1:31:40
  parts is he talks about like, a crowded grocery store and he
• 1:31:45
  says, you'll be able. If you're aware, you'll be able
• 1:31:49
  to view this. Crowded grocery store in see
• 1:31:54
  that. It's a live with the same man
• 1:31:58
  magic that lick the stars in. I may not have had that quote
• 1:32:05
  direct but it's brilliant and it's a great 25 minute time out
• 1:32:09
  that gets you thinking. And how it starts is, there's
• 1:32:14
  there's an old fish swimming by two younger fish, one morning.
• 1:32:18
  And he says, hey boys. How's the water?
• 1:32:20
  And the young fish swim by. By and look at each other.
• 1:32:22
  And they say the hell's water. And you know, he basically says
• 1:32:29
  this is water that trip to the grocery store after work when
• 1:32:34
  it's the last thing you want to do in your life.
• 1:32:39
  But you have to, that's water, you know, being able to find
• 1:32:44
  something in that you know otherwise awful.
• 1:32:51
  Setting being able to find something, redeeming rather than
• 1:32:56
  just, you know, turning your brain on autopilot and messing
• 1:33:01
  around on your phone. So I'd highly recommend that for
• 1:33:05
  you and any other listeners. It's just, it's brilliant.
• 1:33:09
  I think it's 25 minutes and it's incredible.
• 1:33:15
  Thank you. I'll definitely check out and
• 1:33:17
  I'm pull my listeners to do so too.
• 1:33:19
  As we draw things to a close for today, Is there any final
• 1:33:22
  thoughts or upcoming projects that you'd like to share with
• 1:33:25
  our listeners? One more witnesses in my just
• 1:33:30
  thought of like the sky. It used to be the knee wouldn't
• 1:33:40
  picture of something and want to go.
• 1:33:43
  See it in real life. Hmm.
• 1:33:45
  And now we see it and we want to go take a picture of it right.
• 1:33:53
  Which I don't I don't know if that's the human desire to
• 1:33:59
  capture and you know own things to show their Tends to prove,
• 1:34:06
  they did it, I don't know, but what am I currently?
• 1:34:09
  Working on? I'm where I'm editing that book
• 1:34:12
  of letters. It's going to be called letters
• 1:34:14
  from Archie and it is Letters From Archibald macleish.
• 1:34:20
  Who was a contemporary of Hemingway and Fitzgerald and was
• 1:34:25
  in Paris with all of them. Hemingway was his fishing buddy,
• 1:34:30
  letters that he wrote will Former professor of mine and
• 1:34:36
  Broadway ship. So that's letters for Archie,
• 1:34:42
  letters from Archie to Bill Hayden, and the film that
• 1:34:49
  Currently working on is called never call type thing.
• 1:34:58
  I did send you a clip Christian it's just a short little fight
• 1:35:04
  scene thing and then I do have my my show was that I do you can
• 1:35:15
  find me at remotely entertaining.
• 1:35:19
  On Facebook and YouTube. Excellent.
• 1:35:23
  Yeah, well I'm plugged my listings to go, go check that
• 1:35:26
  out, remotely entertainment and I just want to say a massive,
• 1:35:29
  thank you for agreeing to be on the show.
• 1:35:31
  Thanks for sharing your story and just being a great guest all
• 1:35:34
  around. Yeah, I appreciate it.
• 1:35:37
  Thank you very much for the invite.
• 1:35:41
  Please keep in touch and best of luck to you and the future.
• 1:35:47
  Thank you, sir. And to everyone Listening or
• 1:35:49
  watching the Christian re podcast, make sure you like
• 1:35:53
  share and subscribe on YouTube. If you're listening on Spotify
• 1:35:55
  app or podcast anywhere like that, drop us a follow.
• 1:35:58
  Leave us a ray in. Let me know your thoughts, your
• 1:36:00
  feelings. Let me know who you want to see
• 1:36:02
  on the show. Next what you'd like to hear on
• 1:36:05
  the show next and as always be safe, be well and I'll see you
• 1:36:09
  in the next one.