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Transcript

He Endured Three Hell Weeks! Why This Navy SEAL Refused to Quit · Making Shooters Better

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: So in the sequence of phone calls that you're making after an incident, when you finally call 911, because I have heard so many various thought processes on this, what are you telling 911 when you call them?
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I think people uh they they want to be a good witness, which is great, but the most minimal information is possible as far as there's a um uh shooting in the house.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um we need authorities at at this location.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've let them know that I'm armed just so that they're aware.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: I don't give them any situation of like what happened, where they came in, what they're wearing.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: They don't need any of that information.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_00: Also uh note that uh I believe the phone starts recording as it's ringing.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: So when you're calling 911, it's gonna start recording.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: So don't be like talking to your spouse.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I'm just gonna tell them that this happened.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um so just be aware that everything you say that phone starts ringing.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: Hello and welcome to Making Shooters Better, brought to you by Laser Ammo.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: My name's Terry Vaughan, and today's guest, Perry Yi, is a former Navy SEAL who served with SEAL Team 7 during Operation Enduring Freedom.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: Now, he spent time in combat, and that's gonna be bloody fascinating and something we're gonna cover in a minute, but it's also what he did after leaving the military that I find super interesting.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because instead of stepping away from service and just walking away, Perry doubled down.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: He founded Active Valor, a nonprofit that pairs military veterans as long-term mentors to the children of our nation's fallen heroes, making sure that those kids have someone in their corner.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: In addition to that, he also launched fortified measures, bringing practical, personalized home defense training directly to everyday families who want to become better protectors of the people they love.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: So today we're going to be talking about service, responsibility, mentorship, and the mindset behind protection.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: Because whether you're a former SEAL, a parent, or just someone who simply believes responsibility for personal safety starts at home, the lessons are nearly identical.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: Harry, welcome to making shooters better.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: No, thank you so much for having me.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: Appreciate it.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_02: So how old were you when you first started shooting, mate?
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know what?
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: I actually didn't start shooting until I want to say just a few months before I enlisted.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that would put me at about 20.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I didn't grow up um around firearms other than you know, your your nerf guns and your super soakers.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh so I always had, you know, I always enjoyed uh paintballing as well.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: I did a lot of paintballing throughout high school.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I don't think I actually shot my first firearm until um yeah, a couple months before I enlisted.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um a friend of mine brought me to the range and you know, we rented a few a few pistols, I think uh an MP5 too, which was pretty awesome.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: And uh yeah, that was my first experience until I until I went into the military.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's funny.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Did you grow up in the city?
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: No, uh I grew up in a s in a small uh a small city uh in uh New Hampshire, a small place called Nashua.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: Not like small town, I mean there was 80,000 people.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um but you know, we we weren't super like backwards or anything like that.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: So um it was accessible.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: I just didn't have a uh like family group to to kind of introduce me to it.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um other than like the paintballing was the first time I really got into like uh any type of really shooting sport and uh did that quite a bit for years, years throughout high school.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: And um yeah, really enjoyed it.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: But uh other than that, it was it was just I think the the nature of how our home was and like home life wasn't uh the most exciting where I where I grew up.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um my parents were always working separate schedules, and so like we didn't even really have a whole lot of like family dynamic because my dad worked the days, my mom worked nights, and um but yeah, so it was really kind of just on me to um even the military.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was I was the first in my family to join the military.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So um it was very like average, your your average home of just super average kid, and uh nothing nothing spectacular.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_02: That's funny, so what you went to the range, you were months away from joining up, which we'll get into in a minute.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_02: You shot H ⁇ K, did you rent out pistols?
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: Did you rent the rest of the rifles?
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was two different pistols.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: I believe one was a 226, uh SIG-226, and then uh Glock 17, Glock 19, yeah one of those two.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: And um, yeah, I mean it was there there wasn't a whole lot of I don't know, I think coming from uh again, like the like the paintball side of things, I wasn't like, oh this is my first gun I'm shooting, and it did it wasn't a whole lot of like nervousness to it.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's like okay, this is what I'm gonna be doing in the future.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um what's but I just kind of want to get an introduction before you know I show up to boot camp, not knowing that Navy boot camp you don't even do shooting.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh yeah, I kind of just wanted to get a quick introduction.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_00: And uh a friend of mine who I worked with was um uh uh he was a shooter and he was like, hey, let's just go to the range and went and rented a few things, spent probably like an hour in there and had some fun.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um I have zero recollection of how I did at all.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm I'm probably probably terrible.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but uh yeah, I I don't remember it being like the most exciting thing.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's just like, hey, this is I want I want to get hands on time and not look like I've never shot a gun before when I enlist.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because it can feel a little bit daunting otherwise, right?
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: Because you know you're gonna be standing up there against all the other uh guys trying to figure out how to shoot accurately.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and I don't I don't know if you've at least back when I went through um with Navy boot camp, you literally have one day of shooting, and it's you go to one day, and and it's not I'm sorry, it's not even a day of shooting, it's a line.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: You walk up to your your stall, it's pistol and shotgun.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: There was no rifle.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so you you pick it up, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, you step to the next line, beat your shotgun.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like that was it.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's Navy booking for you.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's weird.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_00: We are not riflemen, um, so it was definitely not not like a like a marine boot camp or anything.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's funny.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: So if you were the first to go into the military, if you how did your family feel when you said, hey, guess what I'm doing?
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know what?
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: They were um they were okay about it.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um I was so I graduated high school in 2003 and went to college for a semester, and I was like, nope.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was just, you know, the higher education was not for me at the time.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: And um one of my best friends from high school enlisted right after graduation, and so I um, you know, 2003 time frame, it was still that era where if you didn't have a college degree, you're not gonna make it in life, you know, it's you have no future.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so the military was kind of just a last resort of like, all right, how do I get out of my small little city and do something with myself?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: And uh so yeah, I called up uh my friend who was who he he uh enlisted in the Navy as well.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh he was a uh a CB in the Navy and uh yeah, just kind of talked about his experience.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: He really enjoyed it, you know, he was having a great time in the service, and so he he didn't like talking into it because he gave me like his his personal um experience so far, which wasn't a lot, you know.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um I guess we're talking high school, a semester of college, and then maybe some change.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so yeah, I ended up going to the the recruiter's office and just went to every branch.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, what do you got?
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: What do you got for me?
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: What's the hardest thing that you can offer?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um I was a very quiet shy, uh quiet, shy, timid kid growing up, and um you know, lacked tons of self-esteem, confidence, I had none of it.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was kind of like, hey, what's the hardest thing I can do to maybe prove something to myself?
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_00: And um when I got to the Navy recruiters, you know, they were telling me about BUDs, and I had, you know, this was pre pre-movie era, um we had nothing to go off of.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: There was a couple books, and um, and the movie Navy SEALs, I think was the only one that was really around at that time.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, I had no idea.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I'd heard of the term Navy SEALs, but I, you know, had no idea of what they actually did.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so after just hearing him talk about BUDs and you know what it what it entailed, I was like, all right, that sounds like the one.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so ended up enlisting with the Navy in uh 2004.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: I was put into the delayed entry program for 11 months just because my the availability of my rating that I needed.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: So we still needed a source rate to um before we went to BUDS.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now nowadays, you know, there's the all the special operations have their own so uh their own rating.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: So kids going in today can go straight from boot camp to BUDS or to pre-BUDS.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: But for me, I still had to go to boot camp, go to A school, get my rate for the Navy, and then I was able to go to BUDS after.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: But uh, and how long is that process then if you've got to kind of work up to even get started?
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: It it depends.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on um what the rate actually is and how long the schooling is.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: Normally I don't think there should be an 11-month wait.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: It just happened to be like the availability of of that rate opening up.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um it so you know it gave me time.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: I spent the entire rest of the year just you know working full-time, uh, trying to build up some cash, and then um I ended up finally leaving for boot camp in January of 05.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then um your boot camps nine weeks, and then my A school was another three months, and then I got put into uh back then what was called the Dive Motivator Program.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: Now it's it was it's a uh it's called pre-buds.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's actually an actual structured, I think, eight-week time frame before you go to the actual uh Buds program.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: But um back then it was a very unstructured.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: You go to the dive motivator program for X amount of time.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I was there for many months just waiting for a slot for BUTS.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, and then all we did there was we literally just PT'd five days a week, um, pretty much all day, and um just got as physically prepared as possible before actually going to the program.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_02: So with little to no knowledge about what buds really entails, and essentially only the careers guy telling you what it's kind of gonna be like, did it give you enough of a an accurate impression that during that 11-month wait you were like, okay, I need to get my ass in gear, I better get fit.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, he actually did a pretty decent job um for the whole state of New Hampshire.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: He was like the the top recruiter that had his candidates make it through Buds.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um at least he had his little you know printed out plaque on his wall, which could have done himself.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: But uh either way, he he did a good job with explaining it.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I you can you you can never get fully really mentally prepared for what you're gonna go through until you're there.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I think uh it was the best job possible.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: Plus that that time in the dive motivator program, um, our instructors were all special operations.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um and they they whooped our ass.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I had worse beatings in the dive motivator program than I did at BUDS.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: So it it uh it definitely got you prepared mentally, uh and physically.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: And they we I went and I went to Buzz and just stellar, uh stellar shape, um, especially leaving boot camp.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I got out of shape and needed boot camp.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: I went in at 179 pounds and I left at 145 and just lost all muscle.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: And um so yeah, you kind of get out of shape going through that, and then when I was going through my A school, you know, it's on you.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's on you to just, you know, PT however you can.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, that uh dive motivator program really it was it was a kick in the nuts.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um they they definitely um did not hold back on us.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: And again, it was an instructor program, so I think they kind of went past their limitations on what they should and should not do.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: But uh, but it was it was good.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was a good good mental check.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then by the time we got we actually actually left that program, which was still in um uh Great Lakes, Illinois, where where Boot Camp is, um and my A school happened to be.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I was there for just uh uh about a year, just over a year total.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: And um we left that program with 35 guys to go out to BUDS.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: And um yeah, I mean I would I would say we were in pretty tip top shape, maybe a little broken already in certain areas, but um but I think it was the most prepared I could have gotten um in order to really like handle the experience of what BUDS is.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of funny because when I told my grandfather I was going in, I'm like, I'm gonna join the Royal Marines.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: And he just raised one eyebrow and he's like, Really?
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: Is that is that what you're gonna spend your time doing?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, well, you know, he was a World War II veteran.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, I'm all ears.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_02: What you got for me, Bobs?
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like, tell me something inspiring.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: And he gave me a couple of pieces of advice.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: He says, You always want to be the gray man.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, Don't uh don't volunteer for anything.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_02: And uh was it everything's a joke?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I I'm sort of sitting there, I don't know what I expected him to say, but that wasn't it.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, what do you mean everything's a joke?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I need to tell jokes, I need to be good at telling jokes.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_02: But it was funny because after a a couple of weeks to the beginning of training, I'm going, I get what he meant now.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: Everything's a joke.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: If you could literally take everything like it's just someone taking the piss, and can you hack their sense of humor?
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was just sort of easier, or slightly easier, I should say, to manage the beastings and all the stuff that came.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: But it was just so funny.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: I was waiting for my my World War II veteran grandfather to just lay it down and give me, you know, these um these incredibly solid bits of advice.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_02: And he's just like, Blend in, don't volunteer for shit.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: Everything to joke.
• 14:41
  unknown: Okay, great.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: Right, great, honestly, great pieces of advice.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: I I get it.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: It it's good that was the big thing for me, too, is you never take anything seriously.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: They especially in boot camp, like Navy boot camp, they try to be super hard and you know they're yelling at you and stuff, and it's just you know, it's it's it's not it's not if you can go there and not take it seriously and know that it's an act.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: That that stuff that stuff doesn't never never get to me.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like the yelling in your face screaming, that that was never anything that that gets to me.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh there's times in BUDS where the worst part is like when the instructor does show you that they're like disappointed in you guys or something, then they're like, alright, that sucks.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, the yelling and screaming, it's that is doesn't get to me.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: So is there any point during your training evolutions where you consider ringing the bell?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: No, for sure.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I was actually I was in three BUDS classes.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: I got um two different medical roles in in both in Hell Weeks.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've had to I have a start over.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: I've I've been at the beginning of Buzz three times.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um the worst the worst part of BUDS is from day one until you complete Hell Week.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I've had to go through that three times.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: Three times?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, three times.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it was I I got injured.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um the first time I got rolled, um I got nerve damage in my neck.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: I lost complete movement and feeling in my left arm.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I'm I'm going through buds running around with my arm is dangling, and they ended up uh you're you're wearing your your life vests throughout um throughout like Hall Week and stuff.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: They just like shoved my arm in my life vest.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then it got to the point where I started losing feeling in my right one, and they're like, all right, you're done.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it was cool to actually kind of let me try to try to progress a little bit to see like how far I can make it.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: And then once I started losing that feeling again, they stopped.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: And um I ended up um I ended up, man, it was three and a half months before I started getting feeling back into my arm.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: So it's uh the good news was I saw a medical, they're like, hey, good news is you're gonna get feeling back, bad news is we don't know when, you know, it it cause it happens every class.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it's you know, you're running with a boat on your head and you just get that constant bouncing going on.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: And so I ended up um getting that nerve damage, and it pulled me out of class.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I uh this was class 259.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: We started in February of 06.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_00: And um Hell Week for those who aren't familiar uh where it is in the timeline.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: So Buds itself is a seven-month-long journey.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_00: And Hell Week is the uh fourth week of first phase.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: So you have three weeks of indoc, um which is just kind of getting you in introduced to what Buds is gonna be like.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's not it's not nearly as demanding as as it's gonna be when first phase starts.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: First phase starts, Hell Week is the fourth week into it.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it's actually pretty early on in training.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I um yeah, I got the nerve damage, I ended up getting pulled out, and then I skipped a whole class just because I just I wasn't physically ready yet.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: And um, they just stuck me in the in-dock office, and I was just being like an office uh little office rat forum for a few months, which is actually kind of cool because you know you kind of I got to like know the instructors a little bit more on a personal level.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then I classed up again with 261.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: So started 261 over again, middle of how week, I ended up getting uh pneumonia, and I just I face I literally like faceplanted in my meal during chow when I was out.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I woke up I woke up in the ER to like they were cutting my boots off, my shirt, like to see like stuff flying.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: I had no idea what was going on.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: And um surprisingly I mean surprisingly they kept me around, especially after two medical rollbacks.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_00: They they um there was there's like no thought in my mind that they were gonna let me uh have another try at it.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: And so um the end they ended up being like, hey, you can class up right away with this next class, which was 262.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: And um so I I went into that class so broke so broken.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: I had stress fractures in my femur.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: I had um my stress fracture in your femur?
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, my hip flexors were shot.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: I was I was a mess.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: Tanninitis in my knees.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like you could feel every time I I bent my leg, you could feel the grinding on the outside of my knees.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that was a mess.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: But um so yeah, I started back up again with them and uh ended up making it through all the way with 262 and um graduated with with that class um in 2007.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm sorry, I didn't even I didn't even talk about uh I didn't answer your question.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um yes, there's plenty of times when you think about quitting, and one of them was uh during my first class, I was sitting there, so we were in our boats out in the water.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: We were we were doing some um um over the beach stuff and doing some surf passage so you can bring the boats out, you dump them, put them back over, you go in and you're you're doing races with each other.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I remember I was sitting there on the boat, my arms in my in my fly fest, I look like an idiot.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, you just started thinking about man, like how like what did I get myself into?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: Am I gonna permanently damage myself and is it worth it?
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and you just but the the number one thing, which was like my biggest why, was I did not want to be in the fleet.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: I could not see myself living on a ship regular Navy life, you know, and no offense to those guys who could do it.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_00: I can't I just can't do it.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think yeah, it's it's just a a challenge in itself, but uh, I just did not want to go to the fleet.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: And um that was that was the first moment.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: It was at my the first class during Hell Week, and I was like, this is just you know, what what am I doing here?
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: And um I think it was actually, you know, it's good they they they pulled me from class.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: I had time, you know, to reflect and think about it, and I was I mean, I was out of Hell Week, so you know I wasn't going through the crap anymore at that point in time, and it kind of gave me uh the ability to kind of just you know come to my senses a little bit, give it some time, heal up, and then um yeah, af after that, um even when uh when times were the hardest, I don't I don't think I really thought about it too much because I can always just envision being on a boat somewhere in the middle of the ocean.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: Just bowled out of your brain.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: We had uh my the um I think it was during my third class.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Every Monday morning you have your four-mile-time run on the beach.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's super early, it's like four in the morning, and it's it's dark, it's cold, and you know, you you line up on the beach, just wait for the instructors to show up, and right off the shore was a ship.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and you're like, that's not for me.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'd rather be here getting getting, you know.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_02: my stuff pushed in uh here on land and um so it was a big motivator for me to just not to not have to go to the fleet yeah it's funny because I had I didn't at one moment and it wasn't it wasn't nearly as heroic as what you've just described but at one moment when I felt like I'm like I'm done like I'm just I'm over it we had because training to get into the Royal Marines is about seven months and you go straight from Civy Street to the Royal Marines and if you don't make it the Royal Marines basically you you're out like it there's no fallback plan.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I went into it quite honestly going yeah I'm not gonna quit like I am bloody minded enough that once my mind's set to this I'm in but there was one moment and I can't remember what the training exercise was now but it was a big yomp in it was overnight there was no sleep and then we had to start digging trenches and this is trenches out in the Welsh hills and it's rocky and stony and it takes you about 12 13 maybe even 14 hours to dig the first trench and then the training team comes out and they pace it out and of course when they pace out the first dig they do little steps and they say you just need like 10 of these and three wide and you'll be good.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_02: And then when they come out and measure it again they take extra long strides and then they tell you you're way too short you're not it's not deep enough it's not wide enough go again.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_02: And this goes on for what felt like eternity but really is just a couple of days.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: But during this couple of days we started to dig, it started to rain and not really a rain like a fine mist.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: And it was a cold wind blowing off these Welsh bloody hills and it was freezing.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: And we hadn't slept I think at this point we're coming up on like 40 something hours.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember looking there were four of us supposed to be digging this trench.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: I was digging one of the little Yorkshiremen I was paired up with he was digging.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_02: But the other two had just basically given up they'd climbed in their uh Cortex Bivi bags and gone to sleep and we couldn't get them to get up and the rain started it went from that mist that soaks you to the bone to a really heavy stormy downpour.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember standing in this trench up to my calves in mud and water and uh the guy who was who kept digging the little little Yorkshire guy actually a rugby player and he was short and he's like hey Terry Terry is like don't give up on me now mate and I really need you to dig in and go with me on this.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: We've got to dig and I remember looking at him and looking at the training team that were in a tent probably about a mile from where we were and you could smell the bacon they were cooking in the tent.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I I remember looking at him going I hate you I remember looking at the tent going I hate them too.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_02: I love bacon I really do love bacon and I hadn't slept in days.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember going okay I've quit I've had enough and then I realized I was so cold and so tired.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't have the energy to walk up the hill.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and then when the orchard guy taps you on the shoulder and he's like dude you haven't you haven't dug anything for the last 10 minutes he's like yeah I really need your help I looked to this guy and I'm like he's like the energizer bunny he never stopped once I went fine I'll dig for 10 more minutes and then during the course of like the next few hours I just broke it off into like 10 minute intervals.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna dig for 10 more minutes and if I yeah if I still need bacon then I'll quit.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: Of course I never did but it was hilarious to think how close I came I was just literally too cold and tired to go up the hill and tell them I quit even though I could smell the bacon hell one of the training team could see him like lifting up his hot cup of tea you know at the top of the hill I'm like I hate you I hate you like I've never hated another human being but I didn't do it.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: And it's funny to think how close I I came to not making it off the scent of bacon and the potential to be dry and getting some sleep.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: Crazy That's uh the I think the good part about buds is when it you know it doesn't rain here a lot in San Diego but when it does it it rains hard and uh especially during buds when you're wet already.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah you're already wet because you're in the now though in the ocean all day and it's like okay whatever it's it's if anything it actually kind of makes it less painful because you don't get dry and then have to get wet again and they're like you're just a constant wet so you're good to go.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: So did you find having gone through that experience that there was sort of a common theme between the guys that made it and you know maybe perhaps the guys that did ultimately ring out call it a day?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know what it's so funny because you know we were talking earlier about perception of like what people envision you know a seal is and there's I told you I went I went out to BUDS with 35 of my really close friends from the Diet Motivator program to BUDS and there's people who are like they're for sure going to make it and just you know the their stature and the way they hold themselves and um the way they perform and you're like alright there's no there's no chance that they they quit and like you you're so surprised with when you see people ring out and you're just like how and um you know we had Olympic athletes that were in our classes that were ringing out and you're just like you don't get it.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: I would say that the the common denominator is just is it's what's up here.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: That's really what it is.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_00: If you can just stick it out um and hold on to whatever your reason is um but when you look across the board it's a very mixed group of people it's a it's a really diverse uh group of people that end up making making it uh to the end and I don't really know uh what that common denominator is other than the uh the mental fortitude that's just really it and if you can handle being cold wet and sandy for six months um or my case thir 13 months then you're yeah then you're good.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um because it's it's funny like I explain this to people buds is extremely tough but it's so easy.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like you have no responsibility other than you you do what you're told.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's unless you're an officer and you're you know you're kind of in charge of your boat crews and stuff but you get told where to be when to be there what to bring you know what the evolution's going to be and you just perform and uh if you can't perform it well do it to the best of your ability because I I did notice that the instructors will go out of their way to see people who are really pushing themselves.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um and and I know that goes a you know there there were times for me too where you're just so beat and tired and exhausted and it's like hey and you're you're trying to go to their count for push-ups and you can't you just can't keep up with their pace but hey I'm gonna make damn sure that my chest hits the ground every single time and I'm going to full extension every single time and I'm not gonna um you know uh drag on it but uh yeah it's when I look at you know all the people that I I graduated with it's a good mix of people you know some small some big some athletic some that were not um you know it's you know good runners, bad runners good swimmers.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean I was a terrible I was probably in the lowest tier of runners in my first class.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: I just I was not built for running.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: I was great in the water um I could handle my body weight well I mean I had like the pushups pull-ups sit ups area was was easy day but uh I just cannot run for the life of me and uh uh enough to make the times I needed to but by the end of my third class I was probably within the top five people uh when it comes to to running just because I was doing it so they will build you to where you need to be um as long as you just put out and but yeah it's a weird it's a weird mix.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I agree there were a lot of people I saw fall by the wayside that just quit couldn't hack it.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_02: But every time one of those guys did that I went I'm still here I'm still here and it did serve as additional motivation because I was like that dude quit yeah and I'm still okay right I got I'm good for another couple of days let's go see who goes down next it get yeah it gets to the point where every time you hear that bell ring you know you're like it wasn't me it is what it is and uh again by by my by my third class yeah I went to my first class with a lot of friends and that hurt seeing guys go.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: By the time I got to my third class you know I was like I'm not making any friends until post Hell Week.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's yeah because you're gonna see so many people go.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah you hear that bell walk and you're like oh that sucks.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think the most the the scary part is when people quit they they turn it into like a like a team event.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know they'll be sitting there doing surf torch or locked arms with each other and one person will want to quit and they'll just go up to the person next to them hey I'm gonna go to the bell you want to go.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: And it's sometimes just the motivation they need and you see three four people at a time going to the bell and you're like man it's it it's it sucks because you know maybe they were on that fence and all it took was it could have been someone that says hey stick it out for you know five more minutes we're almost done versus hey I'm going to the bell if you want to come yeah and uh it you would always see multiple people going to the bell at the same time.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_02: Safety in numbers like you're isolated and make an extra if someone had offered me a bacon and egg sandwich at my moment if they'd have been like wafting it in front of my nose, like you know what you gotta do is reach out and take it.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not sure I would have had the fortitude to not take the bacon sandwich I don't I would live with the regret the rest of my life but it probably would have been the best bacon and egg sandwich I've ever had in my life.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: And you you would never be able to replicate it.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_02: Nope ever because the fatigue and the general dismay I was feeling at the time that's funny.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: So what obviously you you made it through actually I have one more question.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_02: Your stress fracture in your femur how long did it take to heal?
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um uh post-BUDS I don't know a long time um so after so after you finish buds yeah there's an there's another seven month period so you don't you don't finish buds and then go your team there's another seven month period that was called SQT that's SEAL qualification training.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so buds is where you know they're trying to weed out the people um the first half of BUS and then you do get into like the learning after that but SQT is you know where you you put it all together.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's you know the games are over you're there they're there to teach you and you go through all your different blocks of training to get you prepared to go to the team.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_00: So start to finish with no interruptions you're you're looking at about 14 months of training.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_00: But um I I I I can't give you a time.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: You just push through with a stress fracture in your FEMA.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah and there's you're you're never at least for me you're never not in pain throughout PUDs.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_00: So it you kind of just learn to live with it.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: I will say you know my my body will never be the same.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so beat up today um internally and uh it just you look back and you're like alright well yeah I'm I'm now reaping those all all that time of uh you know just destroying yourself and um you know I'm I'm 41 years old and you would you would look at me and the way I walk and move and you're like the guy looks like he's in his 80s and it's just I get out of bed in the morning and I I can't bend down to to put socks on.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's rough.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's rough it's just like listening to myself.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's snap rapple and pop getting out of bed in the morning.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: It takes a good five ten minutes to you know shake everything loose.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: If it makes you feel in a walk through my room and not wake up my daughter and her crib and oh you just hear click crunch click crunch.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: We recently were at an event where a number of UFC fighters uh attended and they were brought in you know as you would expect VIPs they they arrived in this very nice coach but it was a slightly smaller coach and some of these were some big dudes and the first person who got off this bus is Forrest Griffin.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if you do you know who he is okay he's a lot taller in real life yeah he's a big dude not when he first got off the bus he got out hunched over trying to get his neck to straighten out it took a good two minutes before he got up to full height.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: It was like he was crinkling himself.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: The same thing for everyone that got out behind and I'm like the things we do in our youth that come back to haunt us in our later years it was funny to watch I was like okay I feel a little better about my theatrics in the morning when my joints don't seem to want to work properly and everything hurts these guys that with with what they put their bodies through is just crazy to watch them try to maneuver from a smallish seat to standing up.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: We I will say I'm pretty sure nowadays uh within the Buzz pipeline they have you know they have physical therapists, they have nutritionists so it looks like they're actually doing a better job with trying to make sure that they have more longevity throughout their their career and afterwards versus like hey he just gonna throw them in and you know don't fix what isn't broken until they're broken.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: But um yeah it does it does look like they're doing a lot more intentional things with keeping guys healthier uh throughout their their time in BUDS and through the uh in in the teams so you obviously you deployed for Operation Enduring Freedom What lessons do you feel like were the ones okay I I learned this during that so this was 2009 um so um we were originally slotted to go to uh Iraq with the rest of the team and about a month before we deployed they ended up picking out my platoon and um one of our sister platoons at the team to go to Afghanistan and so we ended up having to you know do all this additional mountaineering training and stuff like that and um it was a I mean fortunately especially being new at the team it was probably like the best case scenario for a deployment because it was it was very heavy with um operations and um it was a good eye opener to what you know what what you wanted to do as you know as a SEAL.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many times we were you know we would meet dudes that had been in 12, 15 years that hadn't seen combat and you know it's it's just what it is what it is.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's at the time that they joined everything.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: So um being new at the team um young guy first deployment it was you know we were very fortunate to to have a deployment that we did.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_00: And um man lessons learned though it's I would say the biggest thing for me is that was the point in time where you under you kinda understand that your world is different.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right here we're so we're so used to you know being here in in America and uh you know living the most luxurious life we can and we we do.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: No, we we have it made here.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: Especially if you were born here, you won the lottery and going over and visually just encountering and seeing one just how people live was just so mind blowing to see you know there's there's no electricity there's no running water there'sn't there's no plumbing there's no it your way of life is so different.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then also seeing on the other hand is how how much evil can there be in life as well.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: And it's um it was a a eye opening slash terrifying slash exciting time for me.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_00: And um it was cool.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: I I look back on it now and you when you when when you're there, you know it it said sucks.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know it's 130 degrees you're climbing up these mountains you're staying um you know two to five days in an area um get in firefights and stuff and it's uh it's a whole different way of life but um it definitely makes you like realize how much you take for granted um but yeah for me it was just really it was a great experience but I look back on it now you're like man it there's you know obviously things that you wish you could do differently.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: There's things you wish you enjoyed more.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um because at the time you know all all the games you go through during your workup with your platoon, being a new guy, all that was was over once you you know you get in country and you're like, hey we're here to work.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I look back on it now and you're like man it's it's I enjoyed it a lot more than I thought I did.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: And uh you know it might sign sound like psycho too but it's like man it's going over there again would be the really I mean I I don't because I have a wife and and daughter but um you know I saw friends that are going overseas and operating and contracting and doing all these things and they're um they're doing way more than they what they did when they were even active duty and it is that little bit of jealousy where like man I would love to go back and just get back in action.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_00: And it's you never for me personally I never quite see myself as that type um you know even within the SEAL teams I I I am not that alpha personality.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: It was a job for me not not the lifestyle and but every time I I think about it you're like it's it is true.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like you're just you're built different you're just it's ingrained in you and maybe that is just you know the training you go through or what you experience when you are on active duty but you're just we're we're built different and um you know things that we enjoy I would I would much rather you know go get into shootouts versus you know go have to put a PowerPoint presentation together for my business.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_00: You know it's just it's just different.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: Hey that animation PowerPoint can be pretty challenging.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't made for the classroom I wasn't made for um you know that that that type of environment and um it just yeah you look back on it and you're like man I just you know and as a veteran you're always gonna be like I never did enough which is you know true in your in your own mindset.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_00: But uh yeah I just yeah I would I would love to get back there and do it again and to relive it, do things differently and uh but you know you can't and uh all I can do is just hold on to some of the good memories that came with it.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah did you find af like while you're going through that that mindset and in particular at this point I'm thinking the humor was one of the contributing factors to managing the stress oh yeah it's uh that's what gets you by.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: No, that's that's life.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_00: If if you can uh like you were talking about if you can with with your your your trench digging you take it piece piece by piece you know and when you're going when you're going through it it's like you're just one one evolution at a at a time is what we would say it but in in in buds, right?
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_00: Because you if you can just get through this evolution you're good to go.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can reset.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_00: But um yeah same thing overseas I mean you're you're constantly just giving each other a hard time um you're able to it it it's really fascinating to see how quickly people's f their their intentions can turn or not intentions their um their attitudes can adjust of like hey we're here not that it's not taking anything seriously we're joking around you know our body armor's off when and our helmets are off our guns are over here and um you're just you know shooting the shit with each other or giving each other crap or you're quoting movies that you know that's the biggest thing.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know how many you know anchor man quotes you can say in a single operation but um and then you both start flying and it's just you see guys locking in and that that transformation of like going from hey we're taking literally nothing seriously to like hey like we're locking it in and uh so it's the humor definitely is a big factor in keeping your your sanity there and just enjoying the moment as much as you can.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_00: I mean you're you're halfway across the world uh in in a whole different planet really and um you know away from your family and you know fortunately I I I didn't have a family of my own back then um which made things a little easier but um yeah it's weird it's it's a weird dynamic just to see how how quickly you can turn it on and off.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's also funny to watch the dynamic between the guys.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone's giving each other crap and sometimes some pretty personal crap too like you people look from the outside looking in like you guys don't seem to like each other very much.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_02: But if somebody outside of that core group starts trying to chime in I've seen guys turns so quickly and it's like it's that family unit like we'll give each other crap absolutely we'll we'll give ourselves some really good you know right there on the nerve kind of crap.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_02: But if somebody else tries to jump in and mix it up you're like who are you yeah like immediately it's like everything shuts down and the person who tried to chime in and say well there's a another place I'm I need to go it's a pressing engagement I forgot.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_02: I l I missed that I missed that kind of crap back not too long after I moved to the States I had met an American on the beach in Aruba during my time in the military and then she was nice enough to import and marry me but I had a voicemail left on the the home phone back when we had a voicemail you know a little cassette recording.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_02: I remember those days yeah back in the day.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_02: And somebody called And just gave me copious amounts of crap.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what, I don't know what they said, whatever it was.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_02: I remember just coming home, and Carol's like somebody somebody called.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know who it is, but they don't like you very much.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, well, that's there's a long list of people that don't like me very much.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, let me listen to the message.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, oh, it's Sean.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_02: Don't worry about it.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, he's a good friend.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, that's how your friends talk to you.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, yes.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_02: And the minute they stop talking to me like that is when I'll worry.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's just that's just like the male dynamic, regardless of military or not.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's so different to see how you know the the women are the ones that are so nice and and and friendly to your face, and then you leave and they're just talking behind your back.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, oh man, he's such a nice guy.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: I love hanging out with him.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, what?
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: Nah, I get it.
• 44:52
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• 44:55
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• 45:09
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• 45:20
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• 45:28
  SPEAKER_02: And now back to the episode.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_02: So what do you think one misconception might be about how service people and SEALSPA, perhaps in particular because of your background, respond to danger, respond to a stressful incident.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: You think there's a misconception there?
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I don't I don't think so.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_01: I I mean I think the response conception is pretty spot on.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think people like on the outside just think, oh, like you're you're just you're built for being in danger now, which is which is true.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think the misconception is the fact that people don't understand that there's there's just two sides to us, like we like I just mentioned.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's that same person can be the most you know charismatic person as well and be the family man, they can be a brother, they can be a son, um, and they're not just this, you know, uh operator or commando, whatever you want to call it.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I think the I think the misconception is just like who who they are outside of that.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that I think there's there's this persona of like we're just a you know, you're just a hard warrior a hundred percent of the time, and you know, you're like you're like the David Goggins, so you're just like your whole life is nothing but staying hard and and destroying yourself.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, when you look at these people and you you can know and understand them from a deeper level, and you're like they're just we're you know, normal people that made us have a weird switch that can turn on and off.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: But uh but it's it's that controlled chaos that I think is what makes makes it dangerous, you know, is uh you know they're able to be in those situations and just immediately lock it in and just take control of the situation and is and kind of put put the put the the fear aside and put all the uh the emotion aside that's attached to it and just get the job done and then when it's over, it's like hey, it's over.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now I can go back to just being a regular guy.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_02: One misconception I've run into usually when I go out to teach, and I teach personal safety how to recognize threats based on nonverbals.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_02: And one portion of a class I was teaching was uh how to respond or the correct response with active shooters.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_02: And I had I asked the group, a couple hundred people if shots are fired right now outside the corridor, outside this conference room that we were in, what do you think my response is going to be?
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_02: And sort of nearly uniformly there was just this uh consensus that you would immediately move towards a shot to go deal with it.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, Possible.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: I said, but first of all, I'm gonna do exactly the same thing all of you are gonna do, which is to jump.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna have the startle response.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_02: Adrenaline's gonna hit my system.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'm gonna go, okay, this probably sounds bad.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_02: Is it what I think it is?
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna have all those conversations in my head as I try to contextualize or find a logical reason for why that noise just occurred.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it was funny to explain to them that my physiological and psychological response was gonna be exactly the same as theirs.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_02: The difference was likely to be, although not not completely different, depending on who was in the room, because I didn't know who had, you know, who may have served, who had different experiences, etc.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: They said the difference is likely to be the response time is going to be shorter than yours.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: The the okay, I'm afraid, my adrenaline's in my system, I'm gonna move both of those things into the now I need to be angry, locked in, focused, and move category immediately, and then I'm going to make a decision on what I'm going to do.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_02: But the primary difference is going to be the period of time it takes a decision to be made comparative to someone that has never experienced shots, it's any shots in a building, what their response is going to be and how long it will take them to get it to a similar decision, regardless of what the decision was.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_02: It was just interesting to watch them realize there is no superhuman secret source, right?
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_02: They're all the same physical physiological responses occur.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_02: There's quite there's a distinct possibility I'll crack some kind of funny before I crack on with getting something done.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_02: But the the primary um um response can be exactly the same.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_02: It's just the time it takes to get to a decision will probably be less than for you, regardless of what that decision is.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_02: And it was watching them go, oh, because there was an element, I think, that you don't feel those things when you've done this thing.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like you have been a seal in your case, and now you don't feel those things.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_02: You just go straight into this.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_02: You're like, no.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_02: I still feel the exact same things.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_02: Can I work around it?
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: Can I channel it?
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_02: Can I, you know, do whatever's necessary to still put my you know feed into action?
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_02: But how long?
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_02: It was just it was very interesting to watch this audience go, oh, okay, okay, I get it.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think the the I see a lot of the flip side as well, where they think their response is going to be a lot quicker, and they think they're just gonna, hey, shots start flying, I'm gonna, you know, pull my carry gun and I'm gonna go to the threat.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, no, you're not.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_00: I can't guarantee you're not.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_00: One, again, I mean, like you mentioned, like they've never been put in that stressful situation, and they think just because they can they go to the range a lot, and um, you know, that's that's the equivalent of being combat ready, and uh that's uh it's it's so important for me, so for me, with with when I'm sure we'll talk about here later, but um I do a lot of uh force and force classes here in the area.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, because it it's that's for me the closest thing you can get from being in a firefight.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean you're you're in a firefight, it's just non-lethal.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_00: But you do you see people's reactions when that first shot comes flying by your head with a little paint round, right?
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_00: A little eight uh eight millimeter paint round comes flying at their head and is out the window.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's game over.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I I I use that Mike Tyson quote all the time.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's you know, everyone has a plan until you get punched in the face, and that's what it is.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's you know the force and force stuff is it's tactical sparring, and that's that's a a punch coming right at your face, and that just their their demeanor changes real quick from something they know is not non-lethal, or they yeah, they know is not lethal.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um but it's just that it's the only thing I have found that actually induces somewhat of the same amount of stress.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_02: Is there anything else you do to get them also kind of stressed out?
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's all it takes.
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like uh uh on you know, live fire range, you know, we'll do some physical activity and we'll we'll bring out the kettlebells and pull up bar and stuff like that to try to get the heart rate going, we'll get them running, but it's a different stress.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's it's yeah, like the stress of I'm trying to beat the buzzer with an elevated heart rate is different from the fear stress of I have something shooting at me right now.
• 53:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but no, it's it's all takes then there's no like pre uh precursor stress things that we need to do beforehand.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's um they they do it on themselves, you know, because it and what happens is everyone uh the first thing they do is their their breathing gets shallow because they can they can hear their own breathing, so they want like they try to quiet their breathing and then they're not breathing and they're sucking in air, and that right there is elevating the heart rate, and then uh even the smallest movements, you know, they're not running around, but like you do one evolution and your heart's racing, you're just drip in sweat, and you're not even moving, you're not, you're not doing anything.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you're going into a room, you know, that's it.
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, but yeah, it's it it does what it needs to do on its own.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's funny.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: I had a two realtors come to a shoot house with me, and it wasn't I was already there at the time at the range, and they were we put on the stress vest, get the electric shot.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_02: And one of them said he'd been doing paintball and other things.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_02: And this is actually nothing against paintball because there's a lot of people that play using the paintball and all that stuff, they're good, like their tactics are good, like genuinely.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_02: But he's like, I used to play paintball and I think da-da-da.
• 54:15
  SPEAKER_02: And somebody at the range said, Well, you should probably go try and hunt Terry down in the shoot house we had.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_00: It was a lot of things.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_02: I I just posted up, I just found different hiding spots and did ambush.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, I'm I did some movement initially just to find those spots, but then just hunkered down, let them come to me.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_02: And it was funny because uh after about seven or eight rotations of this, the vest was giving them electric shocks on the stomach, and that alone was enough to induce jitteriness, elevated heart rate, the the breathing, which you just mentioned, kind of that shallow breathing where they're trying to be super quiet, their mouths open, but they're going.
• 54:58
  unknown: It's funny.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_02: Because after seven rotations, like your vo your vest must be broken because I've shot you numerous times.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, you shot nowhere near me at the time you shot.
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_02: But we would run the drill because at the very end of this, they hadn't got me once, and then I let them shoot me to show them that the vest was working.
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, well, how come you didn't get all bent out of shape and everything else?
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, well, partly because I already knew how difficult it is to clear a build, and difficult, especially to do it with two people that don't really know what they're doing.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_02: So I hold I held my position, let you come to me.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_02: You took all the risks.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_02: They're like, well, if somebody got into my house and I went, exactly.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm gonna let you pick it up from here because this is literally what you're now teaching.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_02: But I think one thing that I'd really love to hear from you about is if there is no need to go out into your house to the sound of a bump in the night, because there are there, you don't have little ones, you've got to go secure, or family members on the other side of the house or in a different room.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_02: Do you advocate for go hunt the bump?
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_02: Or do you advocate for I'm staying here, I'm gonna wait an ambush?
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_00: No, you always you always stay.
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_00: Always stay and wait.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um that is, yeah, that I mean that's it's the the number one thing we teach.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: So our home defense classes, what that looks like is it's all in the person's home, right?
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_00: So we travel to their their their residence, and uh, you know, where better to learn home defense than in your home.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_00: In your own home.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_00: In your space that you actually need to protect.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, fur first thing off the bat is we help them find whatever the best defendable position is gonna be, and we go from there.
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's right, here's here's your your room that has one entry in and out.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, even better if you're on a second floor, uh, or somewhere where you can see down a long hallway and you have so you know, distance is your friend, somewhere where you're gonna be able to see a threat coming your direction with some distance.
• 56:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then you can either be barricaded or you can be, you know, at the door just looking down the hallway if you have that distance.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: But uh there's just there's we want to just get the point across to them that you know your your possessions, your things aren't worth dying for, they aren't worth going to jail for, they aren't worth taking a life over.
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so, like you mentioned, if you don't have to go physically retrieve somebody to bring them back to your defendable position, then what's the point?
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's there's no point to go rush to your death.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, get keep the advantage.
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um if you listen carefully, you can actually hear little angels singing over my shoulder.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_00: There's the only question that I don't have a good answer for um is you know, do I do I make my presence known and let them know I'm armed, that I call the the the police, or do I not?
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and uh at the end of the day, is the in the information you give them is nine times out of ten, if you say, hey, I'm armed, I called the cops, most likely they're not there looking for a fight.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and maybe that's enough to get them out of your house.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: They might grab some stuff on the way out, all right, big deal.
• 58:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, that that that 10% of the time, you know, maybe they're there looking to do harm.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um maybe they're, you know, you don't know what what mental state they're in, what substances they're on.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and you saying that just gave away your position.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_00: They let them know now they're gonna get into a gunfight, their demeanor might change to be a little bit more aggressive.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a give or take.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's it I it's I can't tell you what's right or what what's wrong.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's all gonna be what's up to you, really.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um again, I I believe that more than not announcing yourself um is gonna be able to keep everyone alive, you know, and hopefully they flee.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um I don't know.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's a tough decision that you're that you're gonna have to live with.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like maybe they flee, but then they go to your neighbor's house and kill your neighbor, and so you you have no idea.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: You have no idea what's gonna happen.
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh yeah, it's you know, for me personally, I'm not saying anything.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want people to know where I am or what I have with me, and I want them to be surprised when they walk into my muzzle.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_00: So um but it's yeah, you know, it it kind of it just depends on who you are as a person.
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because you're right, that's an impossible choice.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody's gonna make it for themselves.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_02: I had someone recently ask me, well, how do you know that the vi advice you are giving is the right advice for that person for you know defensive stuff or self-defense or any of these factors.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, You I don't.
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'm giving you the information I would want available, I'm giving you choices, I'm giving you options.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_02: There's a selection of things that you will need to choose from based on the circumstances that you find yourself with.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_02: There is no such thing as these are absolutes.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_02: I never taught that way because I always knew there was something else I needed to learn.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: There was also that sense that if you if you try to pigeonhole people, you know, ramp eggs and square holes and say, Well, now you need to move to contact, you've got to go through this, go through your house and clear it regardless.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_02: Somebody's gonna do exactly that.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_02: And I was always on the side of why would you do that if you don't have to when you know posting up somewhere, waiting for them to come to you, assuming that that's what they do, is absolutely always gonna be the safest option.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_02: I have a friend who was fifth SF and in for a lot of years and did a lot of deployments, and a great guy.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I I liked him before I heard him tell this story.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_02: I liked him even more afterwards.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_02: He and his wife came home from a shopping trip Saturday afternoon.
• 1:00:46
  SPEAKER_02: I who knows where they'd gone, probably Costco, because that's the best store in the world.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_02: And they arrived home to as they drove into their driveway, they lived a little bit out in the country, the front door was open.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_02: They knew they hadn't left it open.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_02: And as they drove in, they're both looking at this open door, and his wife starts kind of chuckling and she says, Somebody is really screwed up because when you go in there and you let them know how badly they screwed up, yada yada yada.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_02: And he said he stopped the truck and looked at her and said, I'm not going in there.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, why am I going in the house?
• 1:01:22
  SPEAKER_02: And she's she's like, You're you're literally special forces.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_02: You've been doing this for years.
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_02: He says, Yeah, doing it long enough to know how dangerous it is to be single entry, even in an environment that I am very familiar with.
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_02: He said, Everything I love is in the truck.
• 1:01:37
  SPEAKER_02: Why am I going in there for the TV?
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_02: And it took her a minute to kind of realize that what he had done was incredibly mature and incredibly ego-free.
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, No, I'm not, I'm not doing that.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_02: And once they had that conversation, and she got past her disappointment, because I don't know in her own head she had this thing, like, he's gonna, he's going in, right?
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_02: No, he's like, it's too bloody risky.
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_02: Why am I making entries?
• 1:02:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like, there are people I can call whose job it is to make sure my my home is secure, and I'm not on the hook for it.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, your fam is there, there's there's no need.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe you know, you can park it and watch to try to be at least a witness to know, hey, yes, maybe you can see what they are wearing, what direction they went, what they stole, you know, whatever.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it's it's there's just I don't know, people I think are just so amped up to just get into the fight uh with with that misconception of like it's it's not gonna go the way you think it is, especially especially in California when um the law's not on your side either.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if if I was to do that and I went into my home and and killed the intruder, I'm going to jail.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's just the way it is.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that there's so many things that the prosecution is gonna throw at me that's like, why, you know, why would you do that?
• 1:02:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and um I wouldn't have an answer for it, other than you know, you'd be like this bloodthirsty guy is just going through his house and just wanted to kill somebody when everything important is right next to him.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, we're we're that's just a whole nother level that we have to deal with is the legal aspect and in the state that we're in.
• 1:03:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because in the home, home defense situation, the law is actually pretty well on our side.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_00: The second you leave your your front door with your carry gun, it's it's 180 degree different.
• 1:03:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's yeah, they are just not friendly to you whatsoever.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: No, and that's an important point, is the fight that's gonna come after the fight.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_02: Let's say you are victorious.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's just the beginning.
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:03:43
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody thinks about the aftermath.
• 1:03:45
  SPEAKER_00: No one thinks about we we even have to go through like with our our classes, you know, we we teach them how to talk to authorities after, and they're like, we it's things you don't think about.
• 1:03:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like you they might fantasize about you know, I mean for every guy fantasizes about, hey, if someone comes in my house tonight, here's what I'm gonna do, and I'm gonna be this hero, that's all fine and dandy, but uh no one thinks about after.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_00: No one thinks about before.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how do how do I fortify my house to not even you know put myself in this position?
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's it's the best thing we do is like when we leave, people are like, hey, these there are so many things that I never thought of that now I can start thinking about.
• 1:04:23
  SPEAKER_00: And um and then hopefully it's a little overwhelming and they need to invite us back to do more training.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_00: But um it is, it's it's very uh it's very eye-opening.
• 1:04:32
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's there's a lot that people don't think about.
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of things people don't even know enough on the topic to not to to know what they don't know.
• 1:04:43
  SPEAKER_02: So when they get training like yours, it's eye-opening on a number of levels, and not least of which is I hadn't even thought about that.
• 1:04:52
  SPEAKER_01: Then you can just fill in the blank.
• 1:04:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's um I would say some of the biggest things are the one strength thing in the house of the easy tips they can do outside of their home, inside of their home, of like, wow, this is super simple.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, for instance, it's um uh outside talking about lighting.
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, I 360 light your house, you know, don't don't have any dark corners.
• 1:05:19
  SPEAKER_00: If you're gonna have cameras, have them visible.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_00: Don't have the hidden camera in the birdhouse, you know, like let people know when they're walking up the driveway, hey, I'm being watched.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's all about deterrences, right?
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um maybe I, you know, I have my dog toys out so they they know, or even to beware of dog sign.
• 1:05:37
  SPEAKER_00: You don't even need to have a dog.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_00: Just put a beware of dog sign in your yard or an ADT security sign in your yard, you know, something so simple.
• 1:05:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um it just maybe it's just like, hey, this house, you know, sorry neighbors, but hey, this house isn't worth it.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'm moving on to the next one.
• 1:05:53
  SPEAKER_00: Inside the home, hey, I can put bars in the tracks of my doors and windows just to prevent them from being Being opened.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_00: Alright, that's easy enough.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_00: Put an additional lock on your front door that's different from the Deadbolt.
• 1:06:06
  SPEAKER_00: Put it in a position where someone can't break a window and reach in the corner and undo it.
• 1:06:11
  SPEAKER_00: And you have a really obscure place where you have an extra lock.
• 1:06:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's super simple.
• 1:06:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um putting in, you know, uh longer screws in your um your uh plate, your strike plate in your door, you know.
• 1:06:25
  SPEAKER_00: There's very, very easy things you can do.
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I actually do a a home defense seminar.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's just lecture, it's a PowerPoint in a lecture, but it gives them all this information for you to take home, right?
• 1:06:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's do this now.
• 1:06:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's very simple.
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh the talking the the post post-actions um after an event is something that you get a lot of eyes opening of like, I never thought of that because you know the thing is people when they're talking to law enforcement law enforcement is they they want to overshare.
• 1:06:56
  SPEAKER_00: They want to justify their actions on you know why they had to shoot this guy, not knowing that they're probably uh you know incriminating themselves or saying things that um also you've been in this life-threatening situation, you're gonna remember things differently than how they actually happened.
• 1:07:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's tons of studies they did with law enforcement with with post-um uh uh shootings where they would give their statements, and then sure enough, you find out on camera footage it didn't happen the way they said it did.
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_00: It did in their mind.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um so you might be saying things that aren't true that are just you know gonna put yourself in a bad situation.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a talk to, you know, call for me personally, my first call is to my attorney, then then to law enforcement.
• 1:07:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um actually, probably attorney, then my USCCA, and then uh then law enforcement.
• 1:07:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um and that's fine, you know, like it's as long as you're not calling 30 people before the authorities, but um because there's cases too, like the uh one of the attorneys out here with USCCA, um, like there's times he's shown up to crime scenes before law enforcement.
• 1:08:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's best case scenario.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_00: They show up and your lawyer's already there.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_00: Heck yeah, I don't have to say anything.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um but uh yeah, that's a big eye-opener.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then when we talk about the actual home defense portion, like I said, it it's yes, we harp on the finding the defendable position, but the class is how to clear your house.
• 1:08:22
  SPEAKER_00: And then we we have to teach them.
• 1:08:23
  SPEAKER_00: So that the bulk of the class is how to do this one-man clearance in your home, which is extremely difficult to do.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_00: There are safe, safe-ish ways of doing it that will help to increase your odds of winning an engagement, you know, no guarantees, there's never going to be a guarantee in anything.
• 1:08:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but just showing people of like, how would you go through this room?
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, we see it a lot in our force and force classes, especially if they have like a center-fed room with one person, and you're like, oh, a lot of people teach a way that gets people killed immediately.
• 1:08:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I've run people through this drill to show them this is a losing battle.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, hey, you might go through another class where people teach this, they don't teach it in a force and force setting.
• 1:09:07
  SPEAKER_00: If they did, it would just show you that you're gonna die.
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so we run them through this drill of how a lot of people teach like a center-fed entry with one person, and it's a hundred it's 99.9%, you're gonna get you're gonna die.
• 1:09:21
  SPEAKER_00: The only 0.01% is God willing, this person has a malfunction and you're able to take advantage of it.
• 1:09:27
  SPEAKER_00: This is the only way you're coming out of this alive.
• 1:09:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it's it's yeah, the training portion is very eye-opening.
• 1:09:35
  SPEAKER_00: Because I mean, people don't really do CB training on a regular basis, regardless, but um showing them about how difficult it is as a solo person where you are in charge of 360 degrees by yourself, you are going to turn your back to unknowns.
• 1:09:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's just how it is.
• 1:09:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like you so you have to know when it's slow and methodical, you have to know when your actions have to be fast.
• 1:10:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I tell people, it's like your movements are slow, your actions are fast.
• 1:10:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because you need to have that dial of when I'm when I'm going past, when I'm slowing down, and you need you need to know those those points of time too where where it's most effective.
• 1:10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, it's it's difficult training.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's very hard.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_00: And uh it's it's it's eye-opening to see how quickly you can die in this situation.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um But that's the best way for them to learn.
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because everybody has this misconception, I think, in their mind, that it's gonna be like a a John Wick movie.
• 1:10:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna roove roll into this room and I'm just gonna hit everything I'm shooting at, and there's no blind spot.
• 1:10:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I heard somebody much smarter than me say years ago, you're always with CQB, you're always going to give up something to get something.
• 1:10:46
  SPEAKER_02: You cannot move through a a room or take a corner without giving something up of yourself.
• 1:10:52
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, you know, Center Fed rooms have come, they're a bloody nightmare.
• 1:10:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm a big proponent of fighting from the doorway, clearing as much as you possibly can.
• 1:11:00
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:11:01
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not going in that room until I I'm as sure as possible I know where someone is most likely going to be.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_02: I am not making, you know, speedy entry, running the rabbit into the corner.
• 1:11:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's gonna turn out in the opposite one.
• 1:11:16
  SPEAKER_02: You're like, or or they're further into the room than you expected.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's just it's a shit show.
• 1:11:21
  SPEAKER_02: But that's something beautiful about what you teach is it actually shows people how messy it gets and how quickly it can get out of hand.
• 1:11:30
  SPEAKER_00: Well, in that situation too, um, like if you happen to be, let's let's say you keep the element of surprise as you're moving through your your home, if they're in a room, they have to come out of that room.
• 1:11:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why do I have to go into that room to to you know do my attack or chase after them?
• 1:11:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if they also don't know I'm there, I the same the same concept of I'm in my defendable position, I can get it in a defendable uh position waiting for them to come out of that room.
• 1:12:00
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's it's not always offensive.
• 1:12:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's just where that misconception is, that it's uh it's always and I there's you know Hollywood Hollywood ruins that a lot where it's everything is just fast, dynamic, and yeah, and even in the teams, you know, we we did nothing but dynamic for a very long time.
• 1:12:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh then we started getting into at least the combat clearance where we would clear the active part of the room from the doorway, but we would still take our corners dynamic.
• 1:12:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think I think more people are getting it now where I mean the fighting from the door is getting more popular, which I'm super happy about because that's that's how I do everything.
• 1:12:35
  SPEAKER_00: I I I stay so far away from dynamic movements unless I am doing a video shoot and they need us to look cool and sexy.
• 1:12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's the only time I do it.
• 1:12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um but again, right?
• 1:12:47
  SPEAKER_02: That that leads into that Hollywood-esque sort of perspective of if you're going to do this it and you go and you want to look good, you're gonna do it fast.
• 1:12:56
  SPEAKER_02: And you're like, no, I if I want to look sexy, I'm gonna live.
• 1:12:59
  SPEAKER_02: And if I'm gonna um and live means slow and methodical, and then if I have to act, then it's fast.
• 1:13:06
  SPEAKER_02: But it's funny, yeah.
• 1:13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but yeah, it's just you learn these principles, and what's good is they translate everywhere.
• 1:13:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it's yes, they're learning home defense, but if they find themselves in an active shooter scenario, what they are learning translates translates over.
• 1:13:25
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's great information.
• 1:13:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I love doing it.
• 1:13:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's um I've been doing it now for um just about like four and a half years is when I I started this this company.
• 1:13:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've been I've been in the training space now for 12 years.
• 1:13:38
  SPEAKER_00: But um for my my personal company, it's it's very fun to see your you know, your average everyday person who just is uh you know gun enthusiast and wants to keep their family safe, um, to see them go through the extra steps and want to better themselves.
• 1:13:57
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just it's incredibly satisfying to see things click and you're like, wow, like this makes sense to me.
• 1:14:05
  SPEAKER_00: And or why was I not taught this in this class?
• 1:14:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it's it's very it's very satisfying just to know that, hey, maybe hopefully they never have to use this, but maybe what they learn here might keep them alive.
• 1:14:18
  SPEAKER_02: So in the sequence of phone calls that you're making after an incident, when you finally call 911, because I have heard so many various thought processes on this, what are you telling 911 when you call them?
• 1:14:36
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I think people uh they they want to be a good witness, which is great, but the most minimal information is possible as far as there's a um uh shooting in the house.
• 1:14:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um we need authorities at at this location.
• 1:14:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've let them know that I'm armed, just so that they're aware that they're not coming in, you know, and expecting there to be no.
• 1:15:01
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, clearly it's gonna be I'm gonna be armed.
• 1:15:03
  SPEAKER_00: It shouldn't be meshed because like clearly, you know, this guy's somebody's unalived.
• 1:15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um it and it's uh very, very minimal.
• 1:15:13
  SPEAKER_00: I don't give them any situation of like what happened, where they came in, um what they're wearing.
• 1:15:18
  SPEAKER_00: They don't need any of that information.
• 1:15:20
  SPEAKER_00: Also uh note that uh I believe the phone starts recording as it's ringing.
• 1:15:26
  SPEAKER_00: So when you're calling 911, it's gonna start recording.
• 1:15:28
  SPEAKER_00: So don't be like talking to your spouse.
• 1:15:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm just gonna tell them that this happened.
• 1:15:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:15:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um so just be aware that everything you say with that phone starts ringing.
• 1:15:36
  SPEAKER_02: That is incredibly important information that you just dropped there.
• 1:15:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's one of those golden nuggets that half a dozen people just went, hold on, what did he say again?
• 1:15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:15:44
  SPEAKER_02: It starts recording the minute it starts ringing.
• 1:15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it's great because my my sister-in-law was a dispatcher for for many years.
• 1:15:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so talking to her is great hearing the stories that that she's had in the horror stories that she's had to go through as well.
• 1:15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, being being the last person that was, you know, talking to somebody before they died is is very rough.
• 1:16:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, the most minimal information.
• 1:16:08
  SPEAKER_00: Let them know that there is, you know, there's a a shooting in the house and need, you know, your your address.
• 1:16:15
  SPEAKER_00: Let them know that that I personally let them know that I'm armed, um, just so that they're aware.
• 1:16:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um and that's basically it.
• 1:16:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um you might even let them know that an attorney's on the way.
• 1:16:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, one of the the biggest aspect is when when law enforcement gets there, that's when it matters the most.
• 1:16:36
  SPEAKER_00: Because they're gonna ask you all these questions.
• 1:16:38
  SPEAKER_00: And nothing nothing against law enforcement.
• 1:16:41
  SPEAKER_00: You just need to know you have zero control over what goes in the report, you have zero control on how they perceive what you're saying and what it what you know, how they write it down.
• 1:16:52
  SPEAKER_00: And um uh again, you have no control over like any of this situation.
• 1:16:57
  SPEAKER_00: They're not there to be your friends, right?
• 1:16:58
  SPEAKER_00: They're there to take a statement, they're there to get as much information as they can, and then figure out from there.
• 1:17:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um so you can let them know, hey, I've spoken to my attorney, yeah.
• 1:17:09
  SPEAKER_00: I want I want to be as cooperative as possible.
• 1:17:12
  SPEAKER_00: I spoke to my attorney, he's actually on his way here.
• 1:17:15
  SPEAKER_00: They might take you, they might take you to the station.
• 1:17:18
  SPEAKER_00: That's fine.
• 1:17:18
  SPEAKER_00: They they they can attorney can meet you there, that's totally fine.
• 1:17:21
  SPEAKER_00: Don't like don't be alarmed if you get arrested on the spot.
• 1:17:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like that might be procedure and protocol.
• 1:17:27
  SPEAKER_00: So don't be alarmed if that happens, just go through the steps of a I did my right procedures, I call my attorney, I want to be cooperative and give you as much information as I can, and then you know, they'll they'll take it from there once they get here or once once they meet us down at the station.
• 1:17:42
  SPEAKER_00: And so literally it means as minimal information as possible just so you don't overshare, just so you don't tell them things that might incriminate you exactly.
• 1:17:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:17:56
  SPEAKER_00: So it's let them get there, give them the information, you know, and then they're they're the your interpreter.
• 1:18:03
  SPEAKER_01: But let them do their job, they're what you pay them for, and um yeah, just keep as much spotlight on yourself as possible.
• 1:18:14
  SPEAKER_02: All right, touch on one other thing that you mentioned in the when the adrenaline is pumping, and you've just lived through what is very likely gonna be the worst experience of your life, and may have ultimately resulted in you having to take a life in order to protect yours.
• 1:18:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna feel like talking.
• 1:18:31
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna be a chatty cathy.
• 1:18:32
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna wanna because you want to defend what you did.
• 1:18:36
  SPEAKER_02: But the reality is, as you said, and I want to reiterate this what happened in reality is likely not gonna be what your brain is telling you happened.
• 1:18:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you can be like, hey, I shot them three times, and then there's there's there's ten casings on a round because you're just gonna die.
• 1:18:58
  SPEAKER_02: You did a mag dump.
• 1:18:59
  SPEAKER_02: You're like, no, I think it was three controlled shots.
• 1:19:01
  SPEAKER_02: You're like, I'm looking at brass all over the floor.
• 1:19:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like, really?
• 1:19:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:19:05
  SPEAKER_02: But the brain is you it's it doesn't function the way you expect it to function, especially under that kind of stress.
• 1:19:12
  SPEAKER_02: So talking a minimal amount, giving what's needed to kind of at least you know give a sort of very superficial overview of what happened, I think is phenomenal advice because you write law enforcement, nothing against them.
• 1:19:25
  SPEAKER_02: I love the job they do, and there's not enough of them doing the job.
• 1:19:28
  SPEAKER_01: But I do not envy their job.
• 1:19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you can do it.
• 1:19:33
  SPEAKER_00: And and also, depending on where you are, like in the firefight portion itself, why the defendable position is so great as well.
• 1:19:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you are moving throughout your house, here in San Diego, homes are on top of each other, right?
• 1:19:48
  SPEAKER_00: Every every corner you turn, you're you're pointing at a different neighbor at some point.
• 1:19:52
  SPEAKER_00: If you are not trained and you're not hitting your shots, that's more accountability of like, hey, my bullet went into little Timmy's room next door.
• 1:20:00
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe, grace of God, nobody got hurt.
• 1:20:04
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, people aren't really thinking about how responsible they are for every single round that leaves their firearm.
• 1:20:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and when you've got neighbors you know next door or even half a block away, depending on what that round hit before it exited your house, it could it's good, it's still traveling.
• 1:20:23
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't stop.
• 1:20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's good, that's great advice.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_02: So when you left the military and you started at the act of valor non-profit, was there a catalyst specific to you that started that, or you just looked at the state of the world and went, I need to do something?
• 1:20:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I left the military in 2011 and tried to, you know, I got out of the tactical world for a little while, had some odd jobs here and there in in 2014, got roped back in, you know, and it does that, it pulls you back in.
• 1:21:04
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I started working for a CQB shoot house, it was it was a civilian-based shoot house, um, all force on force, which was phenomenal, and um very eye-opening for me.
• 1:21:14
  SPEAKER_00: We I I I learned so many things there that I didn't learn in the military, and I was like, why?
• 1:21:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why were we not taught these things?
• 1:21:25
  SPEAKER_00: It just it blew my mind.
• 1:21:26
  SPEAKER_00: And so um I kind of like not completely up a data dumped the way I did things before and just dove into just dedicating my time training here.
• 1:21:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was I was with this place for years, and we were we were doing force and force training four hours a night, five days a week for years.
• 1:21:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's the most consistent training I've ever had in my entire life, right?
• 1:21:52
  SPEAKER_00: And you think about in in the military, especially in the SEAL teams, it you know, you are a jack of all trades.
• 1:21:57
  SPEAKER_00: You only spend X amount of weeks of time on one thing, and that's considered specialized, right?
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine taking three or four years of your life of constant CQB force and force training, most eye-opening thing I ever did my entire life.
• 1:22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um we and we didn't even really do force and force in the in the teams.
• 1:22:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we would spend uh six weeks doing all of our CQB stuff dry into live fire, and then we do our final exercise with role players.
• 1:22:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, why are you gonna train in perfect conditions for six weeks at a time with nobody shooting back at you, and then you throw then you throw in role play uh role players and it goes out the wind, everything goes out the window.
• 1:22:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, very eye-opening.
• 1:22:39
  SPEAKER_00: But um that was my first introduction after leaving the military of working or of meeting another veteran for years.
• 1:22:48
  SPEAKER_00: I had never even met another veteran.
• 1:22:49
  SPEAKER_00: I became kind of a hermit when I left the military.
• 1:22:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um very isolated.
• 1:22:54
  SPEAKER_00: My entire family is back on the East Coast, and um, so I was alone, very alone.
• 1:22:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um so at this point in time, it was my first time ever meeting vets.
• 1:23:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so just getting to know these guys, becoming friends with them, hearing their stories about their time in service, about their hardships, about how how their transition has been and the difficulties they've had, and you're like, wow, we are the same person.
• 1:23:16
  SPEAKER_00: And vets have this weird thing of we always think we're going through something alone, and we're we're super unique, and we're the only one going through this struggle when in reality, we're all going through the same thing.
• 1:23:27
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe a little different, but it's it's the same thing.
• 1:23:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so um at the time, my uh uh my my girlfriend at the time, my now wife, um, she was helping us actually do our our videos and our photos and our web design for this company.
• 1:23:42
  SPEAKER_00: And um it was just very like, what can we do?
• 1:23:49
  SPEAKER_00: What can we do for these guys who are they have so much to offer this world?
• 1:23:55
  SPEAKER_00: They have crazy experiences, tons of experience, knowledge, things that they can pass on and share.
• 1:24:01
  SPEAKER_00: You have, you know, in their mind, they're they're no longer doing the the greater thing in their life that brought them that mission, that brought them a purpose in their being.
• 1:24:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so how do we activate that again?
• 1:24:13
  SPEAKER_00: How do we take what they have and share it with the community again?
• 1:24:20
  SPEAKER_00: And and um so we bounce around the ideas of, you know, what we'll do these community service projects, and it's what it's just not lasting.
• 1:24:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's just it didn't it didn't feel enough, right?
• 1:24:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you feel good in the moment.
• 1:24:31
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe I cleaned up a beach or I built this park bench or something, whatever it is, but it you know, it's not gonna be a lasting movement in in their uh in their soul there.
• 1:24:39
  SPEAKER_00: So we kind of just created what we call uh Valor Adventures, is what our main program is, and we're like, what if we you know connect them with the Gold Star family community?
• 1:24:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you have these families that have all lost their connection to the military due to the you know the loss of their their service member in the home.
• 1:25:03
  SPEAKER_00: You have all these guys who have lost their connection with the military from discharging, and you know, they've lost that camaraderie, that lost that purpose, and like why not let's let's bridge the gap, bring these two together.
• 1:25:15
  SPEAKER_00: And um it it seemed like a no-brainer, right?
• 1:25:19
  SPEAKER_00: There was nothing out there that we saw, and especially in San Diego, which is a huge military town, and and unfortunately, like a very big old-star community town as well.
• 1:25:30
  SPEAKER_00: And um no one was doing it.
• 1:25:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh the the problem, a big problem you see with the veteran community is they all want to start their own thing instead of like, hey, let's see what's out there, how can I get involved?
• 1:25:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so you have a billion different nonprofits that that just operate very smallly.
• 1:25:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but we did, we looked, and we're like, there's not nobody doing this.
• 1:25:52
  SPEAKER_00: So, like, all right, maybe this is something we start.
• 1:25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so um it was very challenging to get into the gold star community.
• 1:26:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they're very closed-off um community, right, rightfully so.
• 1:26:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um a lot of people benefit off their tragedies and exploit that for you know personal gain stuff.
• 1:26:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it was very hard getting it getting into that.
• 1:26:17
  SPEAKER_00: And um it got to the point where we were like, hey, let's we decided to be vulnerable.
• 1:26:21
  SPEAKER_00: I I found um some of my goal star groups on Facebook and would just go in there and just message people directly, like, hey, here's who we are, um, here's what we're looking to do.
• 1:26:33
  SPEAKER_00: And um, like so with our program, we we host a series of of elaborate themed outdoor adventures throughout San Diego where the veterans can now just like pour in their knowledge, their skill sets into these kids that don't have this learning in their home anymore, and just give them value, bring them um uh the the vets get the opportunity to feel purpose-driven again.
• 1:26:58
  SPEAKER_00: They know that what they're doing is for a worthy cause, it's for a worthy group of people that really need their help and their assistance.
• 1:27:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's from guys that have walked in the shoes of their of the kids' fallen parents, you know, and and they're not there to be dad, they're there to be the mentor, the role, the role model, you know, it's just a positive influence.
• 1:27:18
  SPEAKER_00: And um and then in turn, that, you know, it's like the kids are getting all this value from these men that were like their fathers.
• 1:27:27
  SPEAKER_00: And uh it's just a win-win.
• 1:27:29
  SPEAKER_00: And what we didn't what we didn't anticipate is what it did for this for the widows.
• 1:27:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it, you know, it it brings a space for all of the women to come together.
• 1:27:38
  SPEAKER_00: They get to share their stories with the other women.
• 1:27:41
  SPEAKER_00: They get to, if depending on where they are in their stages of brief, they get to learn from these other women about how, you know, what what worked for them and uh and then they get to, you know, give free babysitting and they they pass their kids off to these guys who they know they're gonna be learning some good, valuable skill sets from.
• 1:27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's gotten to the point now where It's uh feels good to us where like, you know, active valor has become a bargaining chip for them.
• 1:28:04
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, hey, if you don't behave, we're not going to the Valor Venture this weekend, and uh it's a good bargaining chip for them for the parents.
• 1:28:10
  SPEAKER_00: But um it's it was just really it came down to just seeing a need and um trying to do something meaningful.
• 1:28:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then selfishly for me, you know, I get to live this out as well.
• 1:28:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because I had just awful struggles transitioning back into the civilian life.
• 1:28:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean I brought it up already.
• 1:28:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was like incredibly alone and isolated, had all the dark thoughts, had um, you know, the the suicide in it.
• 1:28:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's just it was bad.
• 1:28:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um so in turn, selfishly, I'm like, hey, I get to start this thing do something impactful for other people, I get to feel good inside.
• 1:28:49
  SPEAKER_00: That's really what it is.
• 1:28:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's um I get to get that warm and fuzzies.
• 1:28:54
  SPEAKER_02: And um philanthropy behaviors like that are supposed to give you the warm and fuzzies.
• 1:29:00
  SPEAKER_02: You're building an entire community that is helping a com uh a variety of other communities within it.
• 1:29:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's an incredible cause, mate.
• 1:29:11
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:29:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm you know it I'm I say it all the time.
• 1:29:14
  SPEAKER_00: I am not the entrepreneur type, even though I've I've started all I do is start businesses now and start things, and it's mainly because I just have that personality where I can't work for anybody else.
• 1:29:24
  SPEAKER_00: And um so we we launched our so uh this June we hit 10 years.
• 1:29:31
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so we're coming up on our tenure mark, and actually we're having our big uh every year we do a an adventure on Father's Day weekend.
• 1:29:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so um it just coincides that same week as our tenure mark.
• 1:29:42
  SPEAKER_00: And so we're we're you know doing this awesome big tactical adventure for the kids with the Unisolutions guns, or going to this um this training facility in San Diego.
• 1:29:51
  SPEAKER_00: That's it's just it's a phenomenal place.
• 1:29:53
  SPEAKER_00: But um Yeah, so sure enough, you know, our our first adventure we had, we launched in 2017, and we had we had uh 11 kids in veteran pairs um that came together, and we were like, you know, this is we have one shot at this.
• 1:30:10
  SPEAKER_00: That we can we could ruin it.
• 1:30:13
  SPEAKER_00: We don't know if what if being around these guys is too sad for the kids because they remind them too much of them of their dads, and you know, it's like this could be a mess.
• 1:30:22
  SPEAKER_00: We we ended up setting up this big mission-based treasure hunt.
• 1:30:26
  SPEAKER_00: We were out in some private land out in uh uh about an hour east of San Diego County, and um the the week prior we actually went out with the mentors, they would um find their waypoints.
• 1:30:39
  SPEAKER_00: At each waypoint, the the the kids and the vets, um, the pairs had to go through some puzzle, something that they had to finish together to get their coordinates to their next ones.
• 1:30:48
  SPEAKER_00: They had to be successful at their mission, work as a team, get the information so that they can move forward and progress.
• 1:30:53
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's actually buried treasure that they had at the end.
• 1:30:57
  SPEAKER_00: And uh so seeing these guys like take these kids.
• 1:31:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and we had kids as young as four show up, and so you see these giant men walking with their tiny little kid behind or next to them, um, some of them even holding hands, right?
• 1:31:13
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, this is the funniest thing.
• 1:31:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's like watching like, I don't know if you've seen Monsters Inc., but seeing like Sully with Boo and this big giant fuzzy bear um with this tiny little kid, and um we originally had it set to where the moms were actually gonna go with them, right?
• 1:31:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, hey, these kids are going off into the wilderness with some strange men.
• 1:31:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, let's let's have the moms go with them.
• 1:31:36
  SPEAKER_00: And as we were getting ready to start, um, so we we showed up, everyone showed up.
• 1:31:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, kids, we got uh backpacks with all this gear, compasses, maps, e-tools, you know, all this fun stuff for them to be outside and um put them through like a little first aid class as well.
• 1:31:54
  SPEAKER_00: And then the vets took some time where they got to teach them, you know, how to read their compass, how to, you know, how to point uh plots on their map.
• 1:32:02
  SPEAKER_00: And so just giving a little rough land nav course.
• 1:32:05
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, they'll have like the ranger beads on their backpacks and stuff, and so then they set off, or they they're we're getting ready to set off, and um all the moms are getting ready to go, and the kids are like, you know, get out of here, like this is our thing.
• 1:32:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so they're like, all right, and so that's and then we ended up luckily we already had like a station set up for the moms for afterwards, but so they just ended up hanging out for the day, and the kids and pets went out for the the adventure itself.
• 1:32:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's always a two-hour period.
• 1:32:33
  SPEAKER_00: So they went out for their two hours and came back and just you know, the kids are covered in dirt, and some of them are inner city kids from LA and never even never been in the woods, they've never seen the wilderness before, and like they're dirty, and it's it was so fun, and um super emotional.
• 1:32:51
  SPEAKER_00: It was an emotional day um just to see them because we don't we don't cover any of the grief aspect, right?
• 1:32:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's plenty of organizations out there that help them with their their transition there and their grieving, and then like for us, it's like hey, just we show up, you know you're gonna have a good time, you know you're gonna be with your mentor, you're gonna be with the other gold star kids, and it's just it's fun.
• 1:33:11
  SPEAKER_00: We're trying to just incorporate some memories that you can include um in you know in your uh your toolbox there.
• 1:33:19
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, it was a super emotional day, everyone had a phenomenal time.
• 1:33:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we had food cater that that came out there, and it was uh this awesome like barbecue came out.
• 1:33:29
  SPEAKER_00: So everyone had a good meal, everyone had a fun event.
• 1:33:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um we even had like some of the guys camped out that evening um for the night.
• 1:33:39
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, we kind of had one shot at it, and it's like it could be terrible and we could never do it again, or it could be a good time, who knows?
• 1:33:46
  SPEAKER_00: So it just it it was a great success, and from that point on, we never had to market to the Gold Star community because it was all word of mouth.
• 1:33:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, all the moms sharing their pictures on social media and stuff, and then they're like, hey, I know this family here, I would love to do this, and so it was just it was it just came about in a day of like it blew up that day.
• 1:34:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um and uh it was funny enough, is we get we get a uh a phone call from one of the gold star um spouses later that week and uh her son that showed up, um they came with a friend.
• 1:34:23
  SPEAKER_00: She they were actually in their first um eleven months of their loss.
• 1:34:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was still very new for them.
• 1:34:30
  SPEAKER_00: So she came with a friend, and um, she was calling and saying, on the drive home, her son starts crying, and she's like, What is going on?
• 1:34:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I thought you had a good time, and and uh his mentor, this guy Kevin, who act who was a former SEAL as well, um, he's just like, You need to marry Kevin.
• 1:34:49
  SPEAKER_00: He's just so much like dad, and you need to marry him.
• 1:34:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like it was uh it was a very funny story to hear, but um it was it was so positive, and the day was so overwhelming and heartwarming, and so from there on then it just yeah, they they just continue to grow and grow and grow, and um we ended up hitting a point where we had 45 children with the program and you know, 45 mentors, and uh, you know, we don't help the masses, but the people we do are they they're their family, you know.
• 1:35:22
  SPEAKER_00: We never want anyone to feel like a number, and they we have all personal relationships with all of these families, their kids.
• 1:35:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's uh being invited to like their kids' graduations, and um their um one kid is getting baptized next week or in two weeks, and it's it's it's so cool to see like it is a family reunion.
• 1:35:45
  SPEAKER_00: Every time we have an event, it's it's a big family reunion.
• 1:35:47
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone's getting together.
• 1:35:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's at the point now where the kids in and intermingle with the other mentors, and so everyone knows everyone, and it's it's just it's so fun to see it's a ton of work.
• 1:35:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's just myself, my wife.
• 1:35:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's no staff.
• 1:36:00
  SPEAKER_00: We're both volunteer.
• 1:36:01
  SPEAKER_00: We haven't taken a penny in 10 years from this organization for a full-time job for free for 10 years.
• 1:36:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um and for her, I'm off for my wife, you know, she has her regular nine to five.
• 1:36:11
  SPEAKER_00: We have a two-year-old at home and and this training business on s on the side.
• 1:36:15
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like there's so much happening, but like we'll never lose sight of this is who we are at our core.
• 1:36:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like this is we were called to do this, and um, and God has just blessed this in every step of the way uh for now ten years, and just being able to see the impact that it's had on people seeing the relationships that have been been grown from the vets and the kids over the past eight, nine years as well, and having kids that have been, you know, in our our mentors' wedding parties, or seeing guys that have taken their family with their gold star family to concerts or out on a camping trip, or one of our um one of our mentors ended up moving, you know, a lot of guys have moved out of state, but uh he was a pilot.
• 1:37:00
  SPEAKER_00: He would fly down in his plane and then you know hang out with his kid for a day and like take him on flights and stuff.
• 1:37:06
  SPEAKER_00: And it what's great about it is we don't see it or we don't know about it until we like see it on social media.
• 1:37:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so we we know that it is genuine and it's not something that we force them to do.
• 1:37:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's just you know, out of their goodness of their heart and taking their their role seriously, um, it just it means so much to us because we know that it it just brings value to both parties, and um, you know, we we couldn't have asked for more, we also couldn't have envisioned it to go in the way that it has for so long.
• 1:37:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um but it it's it's a ton of fun.
• 1:37:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's a brilliant cause, mate.
• 1:37:41
  SPEAKER_02: So for those that might want to uh either connect or support your endeavors in this, where would you like them to go?
• 1:37:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so it's uh it's activevalor.com.
• 1:37:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um you can go there on on our website.
• 1:37:55
  SPEAKER_00: We actually have a uh library of all of our recap videos of all of our adventures.
• 1:38:00
  SPEAKER_00: So if you want to really see what goes into their their production, um you can actually see the the post videos and just it's one thing to talk about it, but when you can like uh see the smiles on the faces and the laughs, and if you can if you can experience it too, um it's even better.
• 1:38:17
  SPEAKER_00: But uh yeah, activevalor.com um is is our website and you can follow us on Instagram, Facebook as well.
• 1:38:24
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, we do most of our most of our sharing of our journey there on Instagram.
• 1:38:29
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, everything everything we do is is 100% based off of donations.
• 1:38:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, like I said, like we don't take a single penny of it, and you know every every penny goes towards uh the mission.
• 1:38:41
  SPEAKER_00: And um Yeah, it's just we wouldn't be where we are today without the community.
• 1:38:47
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, we don't do a ton of fundraising drives these days just because our time doesn't allow for it.
• 1:38:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um so we just yeah, we just rely on on trying to get things like this, you know, and then sharing our our mission and our our vision with as many people as we can.
• 1:39:04
  SPEAKER_02: Fantastic.
• 1:39:05
  SPEAKER_02: So uh obviously you have your business as well, fortified, measured.
• 1:39:09
  SPEAKER_02: So tell us about that and then uh where people can go if they want to get that training.
• 1:39:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, so uh fortifiedmeasures.com for uh for that as well.
• 1:39:17
  SPEAKER_00: And every so we do a lot of stuff from I say we, it's me.
• 1:39:21
  SPEAKER_00: We sounds we sounds like I have a team behind me.
• 1:39:24
  SPEAKER_00: We do all this training.
• 1:39:25
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's um yeah, it's just me.
• 1:39:28
  SPEAKER_00: But uh we uh have a few different programs.
• 1:39:31
  SPEAKER_00: One, we we have our home defense program, which is in the home.
• 1:39:34
  SPEAKER_00: So if you are in Southern California area, um uh and that involves, you know, we we come to the house, we talk about California law, we talk about how to fortify your house from the outside in the inside, and then we talk about the we we do the actual physical one-man CQB training to get you prepared uh and how to maneuver through your home.
• 1:39:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um we also offer for those new shooters, you know, home defense isn't gonna be for everybody.
• 1:39:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot, California has a lot of new firearms owners.
• 1:40:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we have a basic fundamentals course that's also in the home.
• 1:40:05
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, look at that.
• 1:40:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh everything comes to you, it comes to your doorstep.
• 1:40:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I have personally found that taking new shooters to a live fire range is just it's not a great learning environment.
• 1:40:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's super stressful.
• 1:40:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, training under stress is good, not when you start.
• 1:40:20
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:40:21
  SPEAKER_00: Get get yeah, get you get used to how to operate firearms.
• 1:40:25
  SPEAKER_00: So we're using, you know, we're using um laser ammo tools with the the recoil pistols, um now with the um the uh smokeless range as well, the CQ being a box targets.
• 1:40:37
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's so many things that we offer as far as in the house um where you don't even I I I show people's homes and they're in their pajamas because they're like, hey, yeah, I'm in my PJs all day.
• 1:40:44
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, why not?
• 1:40:45
  SPEAKER_00: You like fight where you're gonna be in or train what you're gonna fight in.
• 1:40:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh everything's in the home.
• 1:40:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so you can learn the basic fundamentals of actually how to operate a firearm that functions uh functions exactly like an actual firearm with recoil and um uh the full functionality at digital targets that give you immediate feedback and interaction.
• 1:41:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's a and not only is it is it a learning experience, but it's fun.
• 1:41:09
  SPEAKER_00: You get to shoot around in your home.
• 1:41:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's a ton of fun.
• 1:41:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um we offer a draw from concealment class.
• 1:41:15
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, inside your home, I come to you and teach all your CCW holders that never practice drawing from your holster how to draw from your holster.
• 1:41:22
  SPEAKER_00: I can't tell you how many people that I know that should not be carrying a gun out in public because they don't train.
• 1:41:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then on top of that, we do offer force and force classes, which is um you know off-site where you can actually be in a trained for a gunfight by actually being in a gunfight.
• 1:41:38
  SPEAKER_00: And um the, I promise you, the most value you will ever get from training is force and force.
• 1:41:45
  SPEAKER_00: You need to learn how you're going to react under that pressure, under that stress.
• 1:41:50
  SPEAKER_00: You need to know what you're gonna do when you're getting shot at.
• 1:41:52
  SPEAKER_00: You need to know how to how to counter being shot at, right?
• 1:41:55
  SPEAKER_00: So, most value you can ever get out of training.
• 1:41:58
  SPEAKER_00: Not a lot of places to do it, not a lot of people teach it.
• 1:42:00
  SPEAKER_00: So whenever you uh whoever's watching, if you can find places wherever you're at, force and force is gonna be the way to go.
• 1:42:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then for LE as well, we have a LE program for um not only our um we have a multi-day uh program for SWAT teams, but also for patrol officers.
• 1:42:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's not I love this program so much because I know that they need it.
• 1:42:24
  SPEAKER_00: Dealing with LE and their budgets and working with your everyday patrol guys, it's it's hard.
• 1:42:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's very hard um to get agencies to bite on it just because the funding and the time.
• 1:42:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um and it's great.
• 1:42:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like the SWAT guys get so much training available to them, and your your patrol guys are the ones doing all the house calls, they're doing most of the clears.
• 1:42:44
  SPEAKER_00: And uh so it's it's a one-to-two-man course, it's a multi-day course of one to two man CQB, and um it's a phenomenal program.
• 1:42:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I I just hope that more more people will pick up on it.
• 1:42:56
  SPEAKER_00: But um so yeah, that's kinda everything we offer might be something I missed, but that's that's the bulk of it.
• 1:43:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 1:43:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's awesome.
• 1:43:05
  SPEAKER_00: And we can travel, you know.
• 1:43:06
  SPEAKER_02: We if if uh Yep, somebody wants you to come to them.
• 1:43:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, we we do travel.
• 1:43:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um I mean, in the past, for at least for LE, we've I mean I've we've uh we uh I've gone up to Sacramento and uh trained the uh CHP SWAT team up there for a week.
• 1:43:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um we have Arizona as well.
• 1:43:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um flying is doable, but obviously it limits me on what gear I can bring.
• 1:43:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's possible.
• 1:43:34
  SPEAKER_00: But uh it is costly.
• 1:43:37
  SPEAKER_02: But if that department already has a lot of the laser ammo equipment, close range, recall rifles, all of that stuff, CQB in a box, then you only need to take bare minimums.
• 1:43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 1:43:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 1:43:51
  SPEAKER_00: So it it helps for sure.
• 1:43:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then we do live fire stuff.
• 1:43:54
  SPEAKER_00: I don't I don't do a lot of live fire just for liability reasons.
• 1:43:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um if I do, they're they're more private classes.
• 1:44:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um unfortunately you can't go, there's no calendar of like when I'm hosting my live fire classes, it's it's they're usually upon request.
• 1:44:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, we do we do group classes upon requests that are all private.
• 1:44:14
  SPEAKER_00: So that's it's doable.
• 1:44:15
  SPEAKER_00: So people just really want live stuff.
• 1:44:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's um and you know, they're a little bit more advanced in their training.
• 1:44:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's something we do offer as well.
• 1:44:22
  SPEAKER_00: We just don't really broadcast it as much.
• 1:44:25
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 1:44:26
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you.
• 1:44:27
  SPEAKER_02: We're honored that you have taken out some time to come in here and share both about your fortified measures and your non-profit, because it's a bloody good course.
• 1:44:37
  SPEAKER_02: It really is.
• 1:44:38
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you very much for for joining me here.
• 1:44:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was uh a ton of fun and uh let's let's do it again.
• 1:44:45
  SPEAKER_00: And uh one of some more stories.
• 1:44:48
  SPEAKER_00: Life changes so much and so rapidly these days.
• 1:44:51
  SPEAKER_00: So quickly that things are different all the time.
• 1:44:54
  SPEAKER_02: All right, thank you for watching and listening to this episode.
• 1:44:56
  SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to like, share, and subscribe.
• 1:44:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's a free way to support the channel and help us keep bringing you the guests that you want to hear from.
• 1:45:03
  SPEAKER_02: For now, thanks for listening in, and we'll see you in the next one.
• 1:45:06
  SPEAKER_02: Cheers.