Latest / The Father's Business Podcast / Free To Be You: Ruler Gift

Transcript

Free To Be You: Ruler Gift · The Father's Business Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: The Father's Business was founded by Sylvia Gunter to encourage people to a deeper relationship with God.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: I'm Elizabeth Gunter Powell.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: And I am Kimberly Roddy.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Father's Business Podcast.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: We are so glad that you've joined us.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: Welcome everybody to the Father's Business Podcast.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: In this episode, we have the great privilege of interviewing two of our favorite people.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: We have our friends Pam and Richard joining us.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Pam has been to our rural conferences in the past and served on our leadership team for many, many years, and Richard is a dear friend of both my mom and I and our family.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: He is also been a member of the Father's Business Board for quite some time, and they both are wonderful examples of the ruler gift, and so I'm so excited for you to hear from them today about what it means to be a ruler.
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Elizabeth, I'll jump in and give us a couple of key points of the ruler gift.
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: But before I do that, if you want to go back and listen to a more, a little bit more comprehensive teaching on the ruler gift, you can go to our Free to Be you intro podcast, which was July 18th, season six, episode one.
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: Check that out.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: We talk about all seven of the gifts and the scripture behind that, and that'll be a place where you can learn a little bit more.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: As you're listening today, you'll get to hear from the ruler gift.
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: So when we think about the ruler gift, one of the most important things that characterizes that gift is order.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: They love logistics, thinking through a plan.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: They're good leaders.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: They're gifted in taking a group of people and getting the maximum production from them.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: So they love chaos because they can bring order to it.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Time is also a characteristic for them.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: They try to squeeze in as much as possible while still keeping a schedule.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: They're also more of an implementer, not necessarily a visionary type person, but they love to take someone else's idea or vision and create the steps to make it happen.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: They're also not necessarily feeling oriented.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: They can be more focused on the task.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: But, as you'll hear today in our episode.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: These two leaders are great at addressing their feelings and caring for people and shepherding people in the midst of being task focused, so we really hope you enjoyed today's episode.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: Pam and Richard both have a lot of good key nuggets to share about the ruler gift and we had a great time with them.
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: What do you love about your ruler gift?
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: word order.
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: When I'm brought into a situation I bring order, even unintentionally.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: If you give me two of something, I will put them in some kind of order.
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: I'm hardwired to see the moving pieces and put them in order.
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: Bringing order brings peace.
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: Chaos is crazy making and messy situations don't frighten me, because I can see the end from the beginning and the sense of accomplishment is very fulfilling.
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: A real life example was I was once hired as a bookkeeper and when I got on site I discovered the client hadn't opened his mail in a year.
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: His desk was literally an inch deep, the entire surface with envelopes.
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: He was putting out fires and so I sat down and opened all the mail and sorted it and filed away all the stuff that was out of date, and then I created processes for him to stay current.
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: I thought it was fun cleaning up a mess, but it just isn't how I'm hardwired, and so that was a physical mess.
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: But an organizational mess is the same.
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: It's just that putting things.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: I call it bookkeeping.
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: I tell people I'm putting things in buckets, and that's kind of how I do life, I guess.
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and I would certainly agree that order in all things is so very, very important, and the lack of order brings about an emotional response that makes it essential that I do whatever I can to bring order back into the environment, back into a relationship, back into just something that's visual and that is so incredibly important to me.
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: Being in an atmosphere or an environment of chaos is just difficult to take.
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: Well, I'm kind of afraid to let you come to my office and see what my office looks like.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: I might need you to come and bring some order to my life as well.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: Well, I hire a.
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: U a desk with my husband and you can clearly see where my side starts.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh, yeah, yeah, you would definitely walk into my house and I would invite you over for coffee and you would go straight to my desk and you would start trying to rearrange everything on my desk.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: And I would definitely need it, everything on my desk, and I would definitely need it.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: So where do you see?
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: God's character in the ruler gift.
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: Well, I guess thinking about order made me think of creation.
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: And the earth was without form and void and the Lord turned on the lights and started sorting and he separated things into proper order, he divided the waters beneath from the waters above, he pulled the dry land out of the sea, he categorized all of the herbs and the trees according to their kind.
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: And did you know?
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: I once alphabetized my Tupperware lids?
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: I discovered a little letter on the tab and I got so excited.
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: The Lord, our creator, had great time management and he kept a very tidy schedule, which makes my heart happy.
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: And then, after he finished all the earthy tasks, he sorted the animals and he made man and he delegated tasks to his man.
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: Then, being the ultimate ruler, he blessed man and encouraged him.
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: So we can also see that God enjoyed the accomplishment of creation because he kept saying this is good, this is really good.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: I know that feeling.
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: That's how I feel when I accomplish a task.
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: This is good.
• 6:31
  Speaker 4: You know, I had the most fun, most every day that I can see and this particularly happens at our little lake place when I look outside and I can see the sky, I can see the trees, I can see the water and I can see God's order in everything.
• 6:49
  Speaker 4: He created this world, he created us with such order and everything works.
• 6:58
  Speaker 4: It works on time, it works repeatedly, repeatedly, and you know, it just is wonderful to see the way God is himself just such an orderly being and loves to see things in order, loves to see us in order, and that's why I suppose he made rulers, so he could help put things in his world in order.
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: One of the things that's fun when we're doing these recordings we get to see your face, and the smile that came across your face when I said how do you see God's character in your gift was kind of cool.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: Just to see that smile of yeah.
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: I really do.
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: It's something that is just a daily thing with me.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: So obviously we all have parts of ourselves that we don't like in our giftedness.
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: What part of your ruler gift do you struggle with?
• 7:46
  Speaker 4: I think being, in my particular case, a ruler gift can sometimes our task orientation is so significant and so great that sometimes it can lead to well.
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: It can lead to a performance orientation.
• 8:01
  Speaker 4: That is not good.
• 8:03
  Speaker 4: It can even if you reach out further.
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: It could even lead to an effort to, through one's work and through one's efforts, to bring about or to try to earn one's own salvation.
• 8:17
  Speaker 4: It can even go that far, and so, rather than because the focus is on one's effort and there's just performance orientation and trying to earn one's own salvation, is just a very negative place to be and it's not where you're supposed to be and it doesn't give the Lord Jesus what he deserves and where he is, and knowing that it's all dependent upon him and it's only because of him that we earn our salvation, and so that's not a good place to be.
• 8:49
  Speaker 4: But when you wake up with a list of tasks in your brain before you open your eyes, you know it can.
• 8:58
  Speaker 4: It can lead to that.
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: So you just have to be careful about that as well, as I think the excessive task orientation can bring about a lack of focus on people and a people orientation.
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: That's not a good place to be either what part of your gift do you think that you struggle with?
• 9:24
  Speaker 3: Self-sufficiency, I can see a way to make things happen, and so then I will get very excited about something and if I'm not careful, jump leap before I look kind of thing because of the excitement, and so I've placed I have placed safeguards in my life to keep myself in check.
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: I will not answer the question can you do this thing?
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: Because too often the answer is well, yes, I can.
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: And you all at RUAC taught me a better question Is this my assignment question?
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: Is this my assignment?
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: And I have used that so many times since I learned it, and then I've learned to sleep on decisions that I make after talking it over with my husband.
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: He helps keep me grounded and helps keep me sane because, like I said, I'll just oh sure I can do that.
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: So that's been really helpful.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: Pam and Richard, while y'all are describing your gift, so far, I resonate as a profit gift with a lot of it.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: Time is very important.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: Order is somewhat important to me not as important as a ruler but the task orientation versus people orientation, the tendency towards self-sufficiency, these types of things, is people orientation, the tendency towards self-sufficiency, these types of things.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: So when you were first discovering your gift, what was it about your ruler gift that made you decide that you were more ruler than prophet?
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: Because in a lot of ways they're similar.
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: To me it's the difference.
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: The prophet's vision and ability to see new things is the bigger deal In my case.
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: Actually, in thinking about this, I came to realize really for the first time that every organization I've ever been a part of I've always ended up leading.
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: But I didn't create any of those organizations, I didn't start them from scratch.
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: It was something that was already there and I did everything I could to make it better.
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: But to me, that would be the vision and the insistence upon keep pushing that a prophet has to overcome every possible obstacle to get that vision make and to overcome all every possible obstacle to get that vision.
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: Make that vision a reality, which I got to see in in participating on leadership teams with Ruach and was always fun to see you and Sylvia lead the way.
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: The big one is the visionary piece.
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: I can have great ideas, but I don't have that many and it's not like breathing.
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: I feel like for a prophet it's like breathing and for me it's a problem solving.
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: It can look visionary when I'm working through a problem and trying to find a solution, but it's not the same as the prophet who has just idea after idea after idea and I love pairing with prophets because it's just so much fun to hear their visions and go, yeah, we can do that, we do this, then this, then this, and the timeline just unfolds like a scroll inside of me.
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: And that's where I get in trouble, because it's exciting.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: And I love working with rulers because I know that they can take a big idea and break it down step by step and help us get somewhere.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: So I appreciate that.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: Richard, what do you wish people understood about your gift or your design, or that internal dialogue as a ruler?
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: You know, in every case and in so many people, I have said that an understanding of the seven gifts is the greatest tool for personal relationships, personnel management, that there could possibly be, and I was thinking at one and this is really not really an answer to your question but it's not only understanding ruler, but it's understanding all of them that can be so beneficial.
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: At one time I was trying to replicate in my business.
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: I had multiple managers and I had some really successful managers business.
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: I had multiple managers and I had some really successful managers, and so I did psychological testing on all those managers and came up with a graph of the components of their personalities that made them so successful and tried to then give job applicants testing to see how they would fit into those measurements.
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: And it really didn't work.
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: There were too many other things, too many fundamental things that really were not included.
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: But the teaching on the gifts really would work.
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: That would work.
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: That would work.
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: And understanding what that gifting was and being able to see and understand other people you know what gift another person has that is so foundational and fundamental and drives so much of behavior, and I really wish that people would understand.
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: They understand what a ruler was, that you're driven that way and that's the way it is.
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: So, just like I have to learn how to live with a mercy which I am not, and yet love being in relationship with a mercy, and yet love being in relationship with a mercy, then others need to understand who a ruler is and be able to appreciate what a ruler does.
• 15:14
  Speaker 4: Even though all those tasks and all that organizational ability may not mean much to them, it nevertheless is very important part of human behavior.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: That's a great answer to the question.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: I think sometimes in some of these stronger leadership roles, people can have a tendency to think that we don't have emotions.
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: I know you have very famously said many a time feelings won't get the job done, but that does not mean that there isn't also a shepherd heart inside that ruler gift.
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: Well, and that does not mean that there isn't also a shepherd heart inside that ruler gift.
• 15:45
  Speaker 4: Well, and that is correct, because that's what I've been doing for the last couple of hours is shepherding the leadership team at Restoration Academy and letting them know that their primary job is to observe, to encourage and to hold accountable, but 95% of it should be observing and encouraging and doing whatever needs to be done so that they arrive at that point.
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: No, that's correct.
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: I mean, I always said that if a person didn't work out in an organization, then it was my fault for hiring them.
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: It wasn't their fault.
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: My job was to help them find a place where they would be happy and to help them succeed elsewhere, but it wasn't going to happen in this organization.
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: Apparently, way you're just the way you're talking about those things is as a ruler.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: There is a desire for things to run efficiently, and sometimes people miss that and they just see the task oriented side of it rather than recognizing there's a purpose behind that and you can see all the pieces and you want them to come together and you maybe you don't see all the pieces, but you know what it means for something to run efficiently and effectively and you want it to be a well-oiled machine.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: And so in that, talking about hiring people and getting like the psychological testing and all that kind of stuff trying to get, you're trying to get the right people in the right parts, and so the intention there is for something to run effectively and efficiently and you're taking people into consideration with that.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: But, like you said, with the psychological testing you miss parts of it because there's a piece of our gifting that gets so much deeper underneath the surface, right, and so I think, even as you're talking about that, you see the heart of the ruler caring for things running well and people being a part of that.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: I think you do hear the heart of those things when you talk about it being a part of that.
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: I think you do hear the heart of those things when you talk about it.
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: Particularly with regard to our little Christian school, that is much more readily apparent because the culture is so Christ-centered that that keeps us all grounded in that particular way, so that we have a greater appreciation and are much more sensitive to really the needs of each person there, and that's why it's such a beautiful place to be involved.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: So what do you wish in general, but also specifically as a female ruler?
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: What do you wish people understood about your gift and your design?
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: While I can do a lot, I am more than what I do and I care deeply.
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: But you may not see that side of me because I manage my feelings very differently than other gifts, and feelings don't get the job done.
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: In fact they're unproductive sometimes, and I will almost always process my feelings privately, which is also how I refuel is privately.
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: That's probably why I do that and others may not understand that.
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: Sometimes also I struggle with the name ruler because other people interpret it in a way with a superior attitude, and I don't like that.
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: A mature ruler is not about bossing people around.
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: That's not the motive of my heart and it's rather lifting people up and encouraging and helping facilitate what they need to accomplish a task together.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: It's not me sitting on my chair and bossing you do this, you do that.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: It's teamwork, it's that synergy of coming together.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you mentioned there.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: It's not motivated by bossing people around.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: Sometimes people don't see our motivations.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: Oftentimes people don't see our motivations.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: So how would you say that others can be hurt by your gift, even if it's unintentional?
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: can accomplish a lot in a small amount of time.
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: My husband and I tease about this.
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: He will sweetly offer to help me in the kitchen, which I would just prefer.
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: He gets out of the way and lets me get it done, but that's not always the best answer.
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: But like we have the family over and there's a big mess after Thanksgiving and he'll look at it and think how will we ever get this done?
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: And he'll go in the other room to get something and come back and it's mostly done because I just attack it and it's just, I work fast.
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: I don't know why, but I do, and so I know that intimidates people.
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: Someone with a different gift trying to work at my pace would struggle and certain gifts might love it like a servant or maybe an exhorter, but a mercy would probably feel tortured.
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: And a giver might struggle with my decisiveness and certainty because I do it like that, you know, and I do it right now and just keep moving and I'm not going to be flexible, so I can see where that might cause a problem.
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: But then the other piece would be how I process my feelings.
• 21:13
  Speaker 3: I once had someone say to me you're so hard, and what they meant was.
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: I react to hard situations differently.
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: I don't react in the moment, I just simply deal with what's going on.
• 21:28
  Speaker 3: I process the information, I find a way to navigate the difficulty and I deal with the emotions of it later.
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: I've said to my friends before I can fall apart later.
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: Right now there's a job to do.
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: There's that old saying it's all over, but the crying Well, that would be me.
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: I'd be crying on it later.
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: But right now we got to get through this.
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: So I can see where.
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: Someone could misunderstand that and think I'm just hard-hearted, and I'm not.
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: I do care deeply.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember years ago going on vacation as the guest of a ruler gift and by day two I was exhausted.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: I was like I didn't realize this never shuts off.
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: And we were able to have a conversation and I was like I'm some down, like I'm all in on some of these projects and things that you want to go do, but I also just need some time that's not scheduled and organized and with another activity of something for us to go do.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: But it really made me appreciate the Energizer Bunny that the Ruler gift is, because if there's chaos or a task to be done, you're not going to stop until it's done or a task to be done.
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: You're not going to stop until it's done.
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: It's why I never take a nap, because I can't rest.
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: I'm sitting there thinking, oh, I need to do this, I need to do that.
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: It's not pleasant, my brain won't shut down because I'm still working the list.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: So I am wondering, because I don't know the answer to this how do rulers relax?
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: Well, it's not real easy when we go to the lake.
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: I've got a list of projects and I had the real joy of.
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: There's a ministry down there called Children's Harbor that ministers to seriously ill children and their parents, that ministers to seriously ill children and their parents and they have the camps and they have free camps for these families to come every weekend and that provides.
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: And then they have volunteer boaters who come and take the families and the children on boat rides, take the healthy siblings, tubing and that kind of stuff.
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: So I got to do that this past saturday.
• 23:47
  Speaker 4: I do, I've done it in the past quite often and that that was really a great way way to relax.
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: But it but relaxation has to be intentional.
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: You know, playing golf is not relaxation, that's it's competitive and that's it's competitive and it's fun, especially if you win.
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: But it has to be real intentional, you know.
• 24:26
  Speaker 4: That's why I take a walk every morning, reading devotionals and keeping up with my Bible and in prayer time.
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: That gets the day off to a great start.
• 24:33
  Speaker 4: Thankfully I don't have to get up at 4.30 in the morning anymore to get that done.
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: I can stay in bed a little longer.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: So, Richard, we just asked Pam this question a minute ago.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: But how would you say?
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Others can be hurt by your gift, even if it's unintentionally.
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: I would have to go back to a ruler gift, unintentionally asking someone to do something that they're just simply not prepared to do and not equipped to do.
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: And so you're just asking somebody to take on a task or a job that at which they're going to fail, and you set them up for failure in addition to just insensitivity, and you can one or both of those things, because we're, you know, while we may be thoroughly educated on the gifts, we may not have known anybody long enough, a person long enough, to really be able to grasp that, and yet we may put them in a position that is not good for them and would put them in a position to fail.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: How do you see the gift of ruler?
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: How do you see your gift impacting others?
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: Put them in a position to fail.
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: How do you see the gift of Ruler?
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: How do you see your gift impacting others?
• 25:52
  Speaker 4: I see it quite often really positioning people in a way to be successful, whatever they are trying to do, to be successful and to have very positive feelings about what they're doing and about themselves.
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: And if you have an organization where people feel that way and are just glad that they're there, you end up with a very healthy organization.
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: You end up with very healthy personal relationships.
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: And if somebody is not successful and not feeling successful, then ultimately you know they need to find a place where they can be successful.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: I think that's something I've seen you do really well, richard, on our leadership team.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: That's where I specifically get to interact with you the most and you bring a joy and a value of excellence and joy at the same time to our team and you'll keep us moving forward.
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: You'll keep us focused on the task, but you do it with joy, in a way that shepherds us, and I see that gift in you.
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: Everyone brings something to the table right, like every key person, is a joy and a delight, and to see you shine in that gift, to see you shine in the ability to lead us well and to do some of the tasks that we don't even think about sometimes Some people just aren't even thinking of the task and you pick it up and Richard comes around.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: He's like, hey, I took care of that and it's like thank you so much.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: You know just the ability to to do those things that other people may not be thinking of and to shepherd us and to care for us, and you you'll often even ask us how are you doing?
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: What?
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: Do you need any help with anything?
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: You know and just that I really, for me, I really see a picture of our father's and I'm very appreciative of that.
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: Thank you for saying that.
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: It's really easy to do when you're with such a great group of people and we're having all having so much fun together.
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: I miss that.
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: I really miss that.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of laughs.
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: A lot of laughs.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: Those, those, those, some of those, those.
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: That teacher gift could be really funny yeah.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: Got to listen for it, right.
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: Well, my hope is that my gift motivates and enables the other gifts to fulfill the call of God on their life.
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: Now, for example, I serve on the women's team at my church and my role is organizer timekeeper often.
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: And my role is organizer timekeeper often, scheduler behind the scenes, creating forms, gathering information, organizing the information into a useful you know mode and then tracking all those pieces and placing orders and processing all the paperwork, all that good stuff.
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: We have a lovely mix of gifts on my team, and one is a precious mercy and she keeps us in touch with the heartbeat of the church.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: And another is a giver who is passionate about the next generation and she keeps us from overlooking them or leaving them behind.
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: And another is a larger-than-life exhorter.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: She just brings joy to every occasion.
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: And I see us in the example of building a house, and this is kind of how I presented the gifts to my team, and that is, we download the plans from the great architect, we pray through what would the Lord like us to do this year, and then I'm the guy that goes in and puts up the walls and runs the plumbing and the electrical, and then my team comes behind me and brings beauty and function and we each need the other.
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: Without my ruler gift there wouldn't be a wall to paint.
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: But nobody wants to live in an unfurnished house, so you need the furnishings and the other gifts just really do that.
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: They bring that warmth and make that house into a home, and so I love working that word again synergy of working with the other gifts together.
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: It's just delightful.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: And Pam, I know from my own personal experience just the empowering grace that you have as a ruler and other rulers have had in my life, but you in particular.
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: We were at a conference together, leading conference years ago, and I used an analogy of a sled dog team for some reason, but I can't even really remember what we were talking about at the time, but I used that and after that, any time I've reached out to the team and said, hey, we've got this coming up, or I need you to pray about this, or whatever, your response has always been to me I'm strapping in the harness and I'm going to run right alongside you and you call yourself sled dog two and you call me sled dog one and I.
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: There is such a comfort that comes in that just knowing you know I'm my, my, my, my ruler friend is right here and it's going to pull this sled with me and we're going to, we're going to be able to complete the task together, and I think that is some of the beauty that I see in this ruler gift.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: It is a lot of organization, it's a lot of productivity, but there's also this shepherding side and this nurturing and coming alongside each member of a team that you're on and going.
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: What can I do to help you be more?
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: And so I always love it when I get an email from Sled Dog 2.
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: Yay, help you be more, and so I always love it when I get an email from sled dog too.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: Well, and I love Ruach for this reason.
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: I was talking with my friend we were, we were planning an event and I said something about my mind was going to the logistics and making a list, and she's a mercy.
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: And she said I literally broke out in a sweat when you said logistics, where to me that's like a bowl of candy.
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: So I just love working with the gifts because God knew what he was doing.
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: He gave us each a different ability and it's that learning to love our gift, our own gift, and the gifts of others.
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: And when we do that, then something beautiful happens every time.
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: It's just, it's fun, yeah.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: So we've been talking with you today, a very mature ruler who obviously has a deep walk with God.
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: Talk to me a little bit about what does it look like when the ruler gift is not under the control of Father, son and Holy Spirit, or someone who is less mature in this idea of needing not only to have the gift but also character?
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: Oh, the word that leads to mind is not a nice one, it's abuse.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: Think about a precious mercy who does not lose at my pace, but I'm lording it over them as a tyrant making demands of them they simply can't deliver.
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: That's not kind, that's not loving, it's not going to be productive because they're not going to be able to function in their fullness of their gift under those circumstances.
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: So I think that's the worst.
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: Extreme is someone who is only thinking about themselves and not seeing the gift of God in others being different from them.
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: They would be abused.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because I mean all of the gifts can be in a mature state or an immature state and some of us, as we're talking about all this, because you may hear a description of a ruler and go, well, that's not who I live with, it could still be a ruler gift, just not working on that character part and surrendering the gift back to God.
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: Yes side of things and being insensitive to the needs of other people in a team atmosphere.
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: You know, driving for the goal, driving for success, whatever the goal may be, without losing sight of the other people and the value that they bring to the team, then a team can just fall apart and that's a blind spot of a ruler.
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: But a mature ruler can bring so much.
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: A strong, deep, christian, mature ruler I have the joy of of having just been with one who is the man who runs restoration Academy, who is, who is a ruler through and through but has is has such depth and is so.
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: He's got 70 people that he's working with and in a school environment which can be very complicated.
• 35:06
  Speaker 4: And you've got coaches, you've got teachers, you've got, you know, people with every kind of personality.
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: In our particular case, you've got it's very multiracial, it's very.
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: You've got young, you've got old.
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: I mean it's it's complicated, and having to being both a ruler but also being sensitive to just all the different places people come from is a beautiful thing to see, but it is a terror if that is missing.
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: Richard, I have one bonus question for you, because we're going to have the honor of interviewing your wife tomorrow and she is a mercy gift, and you've alluded to this before that a ruler gift and a mercy gift can be a pretty tough mix to put together in a marriage.
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: What wisdom or what have you learned through many decades of marriage between a ruler and a mercy of how your ruler gift and her mercy gift can clash with one another and also complement each other?
• 36:30
  Speaker 4: My sensitivity to being in alignment, which she's always sensitive to, is, I think, has been important for the two of us.
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: She has an amazing what I call and I don't remember where I got this phrase, maybe I got it from you, elizabeth but what I call blessed self forgetfulness.
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: You didn't get that from me, but I like it.
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: Blessed Self-Forgetfulness.
• 36:45
  Speaker 4: You didn't get that from me, but I like it, it is.
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: She really really shines forth in blessed self-forgetfulness and with a ruler in all of our tasks and all of our focus.
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: We can, in addition to what I said earlier, we can also be just very self-absorbed because we're focused on getting our job done, our tasks done, our this, our that.
• 37:15
  Speaker 4: So what I've gained is an enormous appreciation for her blessed self-forgetfulness and just the great.
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: I mean and you know I'm not there, it is and it has such a positive impact on other people that I and, of course, and I see her, her love of beauty, and it just is everywhere around us all the time.
• 37:44
  Speaker 4: And I think you know we're at the age now where what would it be like without being, you know, without having her, and you know there's so much that would go away.
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: You know, not get morbid in those things, but just realize, you know, what would be missing.
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: So, and that realization brings about a greater, just a greater appreciation and real depth of love for who she is.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: I love both Pam and Richard so much that I could just listen to them talk about their gift all day.
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: So if you would like to know more about the ruler gift, you can go to the Rock Journey study that is available on our website at wwwthefathersbusinesscom, and there we have a more extended video interview with both Pam and Richard as they explain the beauty of the ruler gift.
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: So thank you for joining us and we look forward to being with you next time when we look at the mercy gift.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: I want to thank you for listening to the Father's Business Podcast.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: This podcast is made possible through donations by people like you.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: To donate, go to wwwTheFathersBusinesscom.
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: Be sure to follow us at the Fathers Biz on Instagram and Facebook.