Latest / Three Rebel Souls / Episode 8: Courage

Transcript

Episode 8: Courage · Three Rebel Souls

• 1:33
  Hello.
• 1:34
  We are back.
• 1:36
  Where's our thing?
• 1:37
  I always have to do my board just like.
• 1:44
  Oh, I wish we could hear it.
• 1:49
  No, still no.
• 1:50
  Wow, that's impressive.
• 1:52
  Yeah, I'll have to record the sound somehow and make.
• 1:56
  And do it.
• 1:58
  I just pitched my finger.
• 2:00
  Oh,.
• 2:02
  This thing has become a hazard.
• 2:04
  All right, that could be the sound.
• 2:06
  How.
• 2:07
  Ow.
• 2:11
  Okay.
• 2:12
  Hi.
• 2:13
  Hi.
• 2:14
  What's up?
• 2:17
  All right, what are we talking about today?
• 2:19
  Oh, first tell me how you are.
• 2:21
  Real answers only.
• 2:22
  Right.
• 2:26
  I don't know if I'm sick or not to have a throat thing going on.
• 2:34
  It's kind of weird.
• 2:35
  I have a cough and my voice is weird.
• 2:37
  Her hotline voice today.
• 2:40
  Yeah, right, Exactly.
• 2:42
  Low and raspy.
• 2:44
  Hello, Adriana.
• 2:46
  Well, that's.
• 2:47
  I feel like I sound like a man.
• 2:48
  That's how I feel today.
• 2:51
  My ears.
• 2:52
  That's what I hear.
• 2:56
  Yeah.
• 2:56
  Other than that, I'm excited.
• 2:59
  I'm excited to be here.
• 3:00
  Always excited to see your faces.
• 3:03
  Yes.
• 3:04
  Yes.
• 3:05
  So excited to be here.
• 3:06
  Keep getting three of pentacles, like, in everything I do.
• 3:09
  So super excited.
• 3:12
  We've switched from three of cups to building the thing.
• 3:16
  So super excited about that.
• 3:20
  Um, we'll celebrate later.
• 3:23
  Um, yeah, I'm good, actually.
• 3:27
  Things are moving, and that feels good.
• 3:33
  I'm a little nervous.
• 3:34
  I'm super excited.
• 3:35
  We're doing courage today because Mars moves into Aries tomorrow and we're gonna have that seven planet stellium this month.
• 3:43
  And my Aries moon is making me a little nervous.
• 3:47
  That's all.
• 3:48
  All those kids being born tomorrow.
• 3:50
  Ooh.
• 3:51
  Don't mess with them.
• 3:54
  I like it.
• 3:55
  And you, Erica?
• 3:58
  I am.
• 4:01
  There's a lot going on.
• 4:03
  Demo started on the bathrooms today.
• 4:06
  Have a lot going on at work.
• 4:10
  Continuing to set unrealistic expectations for how much I can accomplish in one day and then beat the shit out of myself when I don't get everything done.
• 4:19
  So we're just riding that train right now.
• 4:21
  We just coached on that.
• 4:24
  I know that old pattern is just creeping right on back, and I know.
• 4:28
  I know it's a work in progress, but we're here today and we're doing the damn thing.
• 4:36
  So we are talking about our fourth core value today.
• 4:41
  Courage.
• 4:44
  So let's start with how we define courage.
• 4:49
  We have no fucking clue what we're doing.
• 4:51
  We're a little scared, and we do it anyway.
• 4:54
  Yep.
• 4:55
  Growth isn't linear.
• 4:57
  Healing isn't clean.
• 4:58
  But we show up again and again willing to look at our shadows and learn from them.
• 5:04
  We let the fire forge us, not destroy us.
• 5:09
  Yes.
• 5:10
  So speaking of growth isn't linear.
• 5:12
  That's what I was just saying.
• 5:14
  So we're going to lean into a little courage conversation.
• 5:19
  So first and foremost for each of you, what does courage actually look like in your world?
• 5:28
  I have a hard time answering that because I don't ever look at, like, I don't ever try to see where I am being courageous.
• 5:39
  You know, I think it's always in hindsight, it's never like, oh, I just did that.
• 5:46
  That was courageous.
• 5:47
  You know, it's always like way after and like, oh, you know what?
• 5:50
  Now that I think about it, that was courage.
• 5:55
  I feel like in daily.
• 5:56
  I don't know if I actually would describe it that way.
• 6:02
  I'm gonna agree with you on like the small day to day things that we may not.
• 6:09
  That we may sometimes discount as courageous because they don't feel big.
• 6:15
  Right.
• 6:16
  But I can specifically remember many times within the last year where you have been intentionally courageous.
• 6:25
  Oh.
• 6:26
  Where you've leaned into hard conversations or done things that made you uncomfortable.
• 6:32
  Yeah, no, definitely, that's true.
• 6:35
  I just, Yeah, I guess I was thinking of it more as like a day to day thing, you know, Like, I'm not looking at it.
• 6:40
  It's like I'm being courageous every day.
• 6:42
  But I can definitely look back at.
• 6:45
  I've.
• 6:45
  I've had to be really courageous this past year, you know, with family especially.
• 6:53
  And yeah, I think, I think it was just finding the courage to really stand up for myself or to stand up for myself in the right way finally to finally like stop sacrificing myself like that.
• 7:12
  You know, so many people would talk, I, you know, like reels and all this stuff.
• 7:16
  Like I would hear about things that intellectually made sense to me, but not in act, in actual like taking action.
• 7:26
  It didn't make sense to me in that way or I didn't see it.
• 7:30
  Like, I didn't see that I had to do that in my own life with certain people until I had to do it, you know, until I was faced with the situation where I was like, oh, yeah, no, I'm
• 7:42
  done.
• 7:44
  I'm done with that part of, you know, not being considered right or not being included in certain things or being.
• 7:52
  Taken for granted, not feeling like you're a priority.
• 7:57
  Exactly.
• 7:58
  So, yeah, and, and you know what?
• 8:01
  I guess I hadn't looked at it as being courageous actually until until now.
• 8:07
  Right.
• 8:07
  I just kind of looked at it as like, oh, okay, good.
• 8:09
  I did that.
• 8:10
  You know, but never actually giving myself the credit for being courageous, for actually taking Those steps.
• 8:18
  So.
• 8:18
  Yeah.
• 8:18
  But thank you for the reminder or.
• 8:23
  Because I like.
• 8:24
  I mean, I watched you kind of process those things and know that you had to do a hard thing, and I didn't see you shy away from it, even though you knew that it was going to be hard.
• 8:37
  Yeah.
• 8:37
  But I was finally ready to do it.
• 8:39
  And maybe that's why I didn't feel so courageous, because I was finally ready to do that versus maybe sometimes you think that you have to.
• 8:45
  To be courageous, you have to do something that is just so incredibly difficult or that is going against maybe something that you believe in so much.
• 8:54
  But I think when the time is right, it doesn't feel so big and heavy because it feels right.
• 9:00
  Because you have the clarity.
• 9:02
  Yeah.
• 9:03
  Like you had the resolve to.
• 9:05
  Yeah.
• 9:05
  Actually follow through.
• 9:07
  Right.
• 9:08
  Okay.
• 9:09
  I want to ask.
• 9:09
  Follow up question to that, but I want to hear from you first, Sloan.
• 9:14
  I think I probably have the opposite view.
• 9:19
  To me, the everyday things are huge.
• 9:27
  Yeah.
• 9:28
  I mean, bravery is one of my personal values, and that's.
• 9:33
  That's essentially how I define it from.
• 9:35
  For myself.
• 9:36
  It's.
• 9:37
  It's not those big things.
• 9:39
  Not the things where, you know, you're running into a burning building to save somebody.
• 9:44
  Yeah, that's courageous.
• 9:45
  But that doesn't really happen all that often for me.
• 9:48
  Sometimes just showing up, that's like, buckle up, buttercup.
• 9:55
  We're going in.
• 9:56
  You know, like, it.
• 9:57
  And it's.
• 9:59
  To somebody else, that would be nothing.
• 10:00
  It wouldn't even.
• 10:02
  They wouldn't give it a second thought.
• 10:03
  But to me, it's literally like, I got this.
• 10:06
  Like, I have to talk myself off the ledge to, like, go hang out with people that I know.
• 10:14
  Like, that can be super scary to me.
• 10:19
  So.
• 10:21
  And, yeah, difficult conversations are something I'm still working on.
• 10:28
  Uh, so, yeah.
• 10:32
  But I love.
• 10:33
  I love the very first line.
• 10:35
  Like, I laugh every time I see it and I'm like, yep, we have no fucking clue what we're doing.
• 10:42
  No, I do agree with you, though.
• 10:46
  I do think that, like, the everyday things are also courageous.
• 10:49
  Right.
• 10:49
  Because sometimes doing the thing every day is.
• 10:54
  Is hard or you don't want to.
• 10:56
  Right.
• 10:56
  And so I do.
• 10:57
  I do agree with that as well.
• 10:59
  Well, I think there's, like, something in our societal conditioning there.
• 11:04
  Right.
• 11:04
  Like, that we see these pictures or these images of what courage looks like, and that's the only definition of what courage looks like.
• 11:11
  When in reality, all of these small little moments.
• 11:16
  Right.
• 11:16
  Like, all of these small little moments can be just as courageous, especially if it's like, huge growth edge for you, or there's, like.
• 11:28
  There's a bit of, like, an unraveling or an unlearning involved because we're trying to break a pattern, and we know that it's just going to be deeply uncomfortable and we're going to wade through it anyway.
• 11:39
  Right.
• 11:39
  Like, those.
• 11:40
  Those to me, are the things.
• 11:42
  And I think kind of going back to what you were saying, Adriana, is like.
• 11:50
  It's Even in those little moments where it's like, setting the boundary is courageous, and then holding the boundary is courageous, and then holding the boundary is courageous, and we have to do those things over and over and over
• 12:04
  again and feel solid enough in ourselves to not abandon ourselves or jump ship when things get hard, to just keep going through.
• 12:17
  When things get uncomfortable.
• 12:19
  Yeah.
• 12:20
  We have such a low tolerance for discomfort, like, especially for other people as a society.
• 12:29
  Yeah.
• 12:29
  And for those of us who were raised as people pleasers.
• 12:33
  Yeah.
• 12:34
  Yeah.
• 12:34
  I've a very.
• 12:35
  Had a very.
• 12:36
  Had a very low tolerance for other people's discomfort.
• 12:40
  I'm better at that now, knowing that it's not my responsibility.
• 12:45
  It still isn't easy for me to do or say something that I know is going to make someone else uncomfortable or sad or angry or whatever.
• 12:52
  Yeah.
• 12:53
  Yeah.
• 12:53
  But I feel more sure about it now than I used to.
• 12:57
  Right.
• 12:59
  I think I agree with most everything you guys said.
• 13:02
  It's.
• 13:03
  For me, it's the smallest steps.
• 13:06
  Like, the smallest steps that.
• 13:08
  That are.
• 13:09
  That are sometimes the hardest.
• 13:10
  Because I think for me, it's that, like, recovering perfectionist mindset.
• 13:16
  For me, courage is like doing something imperfectly because my body has, like, a visceral reaction to that after how much I've been sort of, like, conditioned in all this pressure that I've been putting on myself pretty much my
• 13:32
  whole life to do things perfectly.
• 13:35
  It's courageous for me to do something imperfectly, or it's courageous for me to, like, take a risk or know that I'm gonna fail even when I start.
• 13:47
  Right.
• 13:47
  Like, that's.
• 13:48
  That feels courageous.
• 13:50
  Like, those little moments of, like, knowing something's gonna be hard and uncomfortable and.
• 13:55
  And also that it's gonna be worth it because it's helping me rewrite that story, that, like, internal narrative or that pattern.
• 14:02
  But damn those.
• 14:03
  Because it's vulnerable.
• 14:05
  Right.
• 14:06
  Like, failure is vulnerable.
• 14:08
  Like, fear is a vulnerable feeling.
• 14:12
  And that's.
• 14:14
  I think, even just.
• 14:16
  I mean, shoot, we could now go down a whole nother rabbit hole.
• 14:18
  Like, feelings.
• 14:20
  Feeling your feelings are.
• 14:22
  Is courageous.
• 14:24
  Just allowing yourself to be authentic and vulnerable is courageous because that was also a thing we're told, like, stop crying, suck it up.
• 14:35
  Like, don't bring that gear.
• 14:37
  We don't do that.
• 14:38
  Right.
• 14:38
  It's weakness.
• 14:39
  Yeah.
• 14:40
  I think actually feeling your feelings is an act of courage too.
• 14:45
  So you just mentioning that's, you know, like the.
• 14:48
  The everyday things, like the little thing or doing the thing.
• 14:50
  Right.
• 14:52
  I never actually considered that courageous.
• 14:55
  Like, I, like, I mean, as far as, like, myself.
• 14:58
  Right.
• 14:58
  Like, I don't never looked at it.
• 14:59
  It's like, oh, wow, I did that and it was courageous.
• 15:02
  It was more like finally you did it right.
• 15:04
  Versus looking at it as something courageous.
• 15:09
  Right.
• 15:10
  Like, because what came to mind was, you know, the message that I got early on, if you can't do it right, don't do it at all.
• 15:18
  So therefore it's scary to do the thing right.
• 15:22
  Because if I'm not going to do it perfectly, I shouldn't.
• 15:26
  I should just shouldn't try.
• 15:27
  Right.
• 15:28
  So when I actually do something that take a step at some.
• 15:31
  I wasn't connecting it to courage for doing something uncomfortable.
• 15:36
  Well, it's exactly what you just said.
• 15:38
  It's that, like, old internal narrative.
• 15:40
  Yeah.
• 15:41
  That instead of celebrating our courage in that moment, we're like, geez, it's about time.
• 15:48
  By still beating ourselves up.
• 15:50
  Right.
• 15:50
  We still.
• 15:51
  So it's again, it's like rewriting that old narrative.
• 15:56
  Yeah.
• 15:57
  Because those things are courageous.
• 15:59
  But that's why they're so easy to overlook.
• 16:02
  That's why it's so easy for so many of us to just not even call that courage.
• 16:07
  Instead, we're looking at the other side of it.
• 16:09
  We're like, well, you also procrastinated on that for six months.
• 16:13
  Or like, you put off that hard conversation, you put off trying that thing, you put off taking that risk.
• 16:18
  It's about fucking time you did it.
• 16:19
  Instead of saying, like, hey, even though it was hard and even though you hesitated, you did this really hard thing.
• 16:26
  Go, girl.
• 16:26
  Yeah.
• 16:27
  Like, we don't.
• 16:30
  We just tell a different story.
• 16:32
  And the funny thing is is that if someone else came to me and told me that or they had the same situation, I'd be like, oh, my God, that's so brave of you.
• 16:42
  Right.
• 16:42
  Like, I would recognize it in someone else, but I'm still telling myself the old story.
• 16:49
  The programming runs deep.
• 16:51
  It sure does.
• 16:55
  Okay, so I want to go back to what you were saying earlier, Adriana, because again, I know that you've got a couple of, like, really specific examples.
• 17:04
  I'm sure you've got some too, Sloan, of like, specific things that have been hard in the last year.
• 17:13
  And you said I was ready, like I was finally ready to do it.
• 17:19
  Yeah, but I don't think being ready made it not hard.
• 17:23
  Right.
• 17:24
  Like, it's still.
• 17:25
  It still took courage for you to actually follow through on it.
• 17:28
  But what was it.
• 17:30
  What do you think it was that made it made you feel so sure even when you knew it was going to be hard or uncomfortable?
• 17:39
  What gave you the, like, resolve to do it or what told you you were ready to do it?
• 17:46
  That it was in my best interest.
• 17:48
  That it was that I was doing it for me.
• 17:51
  You know, like I, you know, like, for instance, I mean, you guys know the whole story about my dad, and I won't get into the whole, you know, all the details of it, but reconciling with him and.
• 18:04
  But before I could fully reconcile with him and see him when he came here, I felt the need to hold him account accountable.
• 18:11
  And that was really uncomfortable.
• 18:13
  And I didn't know how that was gonna go, but I just felt like I really needed to have that conversation for myself before I could move forward.
• 18:26
  And not just, you know, people do reconciliation, I guess, all different kinds of ways.
• 18:31
  And a lot of people are like, just because you say, like, you forgive someone that you just automatically, like, go back to, like, as if whatever was that pulled you apart didn't exist.
• 18:42
  And I had a hard time with just going from 0 to 100 and pretending like, you know, 40 years didn't of no communication didn't happen, so we.
• 18:53
  Just waved a magic wand and hit the reset.
• 18:56
  Yeah.
• 18:57
  So I just felt like I really needed to speak up because it's who I am.
• 19:02
  Even though.
• 19:03
  Even though I am a truth speaker, it doesn't mean that it's easy for me in a lot of situations.
• 19:11
  But yeah, with.
• 19:11
  This was difficult, but I.
• 19:13
  I just felt like I had to do it.
• 19:16
  And it actually worked out really well.
• 19:17
  You know, it was a conversation and not a confrontation.
• 19:20
  Although I'm always ready for a confrontation.
• 19:22
  So if we have to.
• 19:24
  If we have to.
• 19:24
  Always ready to throw down, do not cross.
• 19:26
  Ready to throw down if we have to.
• 19:30
  But it wasn't that.
• 19:31
  But yeah, I just.
• 19:31
  I felt.
• 19:33
  I felt for my healing, you know, like as much as his.
• 19:38
  I felt I needed to do that.
• 19:40
  It was almost like for both of us.
• 19:43
  Okay, so I.
• 19:46
  This is so interesting because I just was.
• 19:49
  I've been thinking a lot about, like, leadership lately because that's been a hot theme at work and how Like, I think the prerequisite to good leadership is good self leadership.
• 20:01
  And I kind of mapped it out in this.
• 20:05
  Like, what are the phases of what it takes to become a really good leader?
• 20:10
  And the first phase that I wrote down is sovereignty is like, yeah, like, being.
• 20:18
  Being firm in your own self, like, your own self ownership, self rulership, and being able to do the work on yourself.
• 20:26
  And then the next piece of that is courage.
• 20:31
  It's being able to, like, step forward and, like, do the hard things.
• 20:34
  But I think it's so much easier for us to do the hard things when we feel grounded in ourselves.
• 20:40
  Yeah.
• 20:41
  Or like, for me, it's easier to do the hard things when I know that I've got, like, people who will catch me if I fall.
• 20:50
  Absolutely.
• 20:51
  Right.
• 20:51
  Like, I know that I've got, like, this to.
• 20:55
  To stand me up when I'm, like, shaking.
• 20:59
  Right.
• 21:00
  Yeah.
• 21:00
  So it's.
• 21:00
  It's a combination of, like, seeing yourself and knowing yourself and then having the courage to do the hard things.
• 21:09
  Yeah.
• 21:10
  I love.
• 21:11
  I love that you said all that, because I felt that I was claiming my sovereignty.
• 21:17
  I feel like that was a lot of what last year was about for me.
• 21:21
  And so, yeah, I did have to find the courage to do that, but I found the courage to do that because I had you guys to talk to through that.
• 21:33
  And.
• 21:34
  And because I was able to process what that was like for me during that time, it gave me the confidence and just the clarity to say, like, no, I can do this, because.
• 21:45
  Right.
• 21:45
  Like you said, like, I just.
• 21:46
  I have this support.
• 21:47
  I have people that have my back, you know, because you guys would ask me the right questions to really make me think about why I wanted to or didn't want to do something that helped me come to the
• 21:58
  right conclusion.
• 22:00
  So, yeah, all that you said right there is so powerful because it all applies to what I went through last year trying to claim my.
• 22:08
  My sovereignty.
• 22:09
  Yeah.
• 22:11
  If you missed the sovereignty episode, go back about four.
• 22:16
  Right.
• 22:18
  But, yeah, that's a.
• 22:20
  That's another thing that's sort of like.
• 22:22
  I think that's our first value for that reason.
• 22:25
  It's like, the catalyst for so many of these other things.
• 22:29
  We have to be able to, like, look inward first.
• 22:33
  And I don't think that.
• 22:36
  Well, actually, before we go down that path, I'm gonna.
• 22:39
  I'm gonna throw that same question over to you, Sloan.
• 22:41
  What made you feel sure even when you knew something was hard, what gave you the resolve to do the hard thing?
• 22:49
  Do you have anything to add?
• 22:51
  Well, I think a lot of times, right.
• 22:52
  They say, what the.
• 22:54
  You're not gonna make the change until the pain of where you are outweighs the pain of.
• 22:59
  Or the fear of where you're gonna go.
• 23:02
  And I'm like, yeah, I can be pretty comfortable in just about any situation, and I've put up with a lot to keep my comfort zone around me.
• 23:17
  But, yeah, when it.
• 23:19
  When the comfort zone, I guess, turns into.
• 23:24
  Yeah, that.
• 23:25
  That's all I'm going to say.
• 23:29
  Well, because that's a good point.
• 23:30
  Right.
• 23:30
  Like, oftentimes, courage is the thing we need to initiate change.
• 23:36
  And I love that, like, that quote or that reference.
• 23:39
  Like, I think I've heard it phrased as, like, people won't change until the discomfort of changing is less than the discomfort of staying where you are or something like that.
• 23:52
  Right.
• 23:52
  Like, yeah.
• 23:54
  If staying where you are still feels more comfortable than the discomfort of change, then you're going to just stay where you are.
• 24:01
  Just.
• 24:01
  We're just going to keep dealing.
• 24:02
  Right.
• 24:03
  But it's the.
• 24:05
  Once you reach that sort of tipping point and you know that you have to do the hard thing, then you're kind of able to move forward.
• 24:15
  Yeah.
• 24:16
  But in other aspects, it's me, like, looking around and going, I'm super comfortable.
• 24:24
  What am I going to do to disrupt that?
• 24:26
  That also feels like an act of courage.
• 24:28
  Yeah.
• 24:29
  Willingness.
• 24:30
  Oh, it totally is.
• 24:31
  But completely different perspective from it.
• 24:38
  Right?
• 24:38
  Yeah.
• 24:39
  Not like somebody shoving me over the line, but me going, oh, look, there's a line.
• 24:44
  Right.
• 24:44
  Right.
• 24:45
  What's over here?
• 24:48
  Let's try this thing and see what happens.
• 24:50
  Yeah.
• 24:51
  It could blow up in my face, or it could be super awesome or anywhere in between, and let's see what happens.
• 24:59
  So, yeah, you need courage to start.
• 25:02
  Right.
• 25:03
  Whatever it is.
• 25:04
  Right.
• 25:04
  Yeah, you need courage to start.
• 25:06
  But not to say that it wasn't uncomfortable.
• 25:07
  It was totally uncomfortable.
• 25:09
  But at the same time, it's like, pushing against my comfort bubble.
• 25:14
  Yep.
• 25:15
  To take that risk.
• 25:16
  Right.
• 25:16
  Like, you need courage.
• 25:18
  And.
• 25:20
  Yeah, sometimes it pays off and sometimes it does not.
• 25:24
  But either case, learning and growth.
• 25:30
  So I feel like, though, even if.
• 25:33
  I'm sorry.
• 25:34
  Even if you.
• 25:35
  Even if you.
• 25:36
  Even if it doesn't work out, you still win.
• 25:39
  Right.
• 25:39
  Because you took that chance.
• 25:41
  Right.
• 25:41
  Like, you were courageous enough to take that chance on the thing.
• 25:45
  Yeah.
• 25:45
  Still proud?
• 25:46
  Yeah.
• 25:47
  Like, yeah, that didn't go well, but.
• 25:51
  You win or you learn.
• 25:52
  It's all good.
• 25:53
  Yeah.
• 25:53
  Like, shit, I did that.
• 25:55
  Right?
• 25:56
  Yeah.
• 25:58
  Well, I'm glad that you said, Adriana, it Takes courage to start.
• 26:02
  Because it.
• 26:03
  It does take courage to start.
• 26:05
  I think so many people feel like they need to wait to feel confident to start.
• 26:11
  And I think that confidence, or.
• 26:14
  Yeah, courage precedes confidence.
• 26:18
  Like, you have to have courage first, and you have to prove to yourself that you could do the hard thing over and over again, and then it builds your confidence to keep doing hard things or keep leveling up.
• 26:29
  Yeah, I still struggle with that one.
• 26:30
  But, yes, I think it's very true.
• 26:33
  I sometimes do feel like I need to be confident first, but I'm learning more and more that.
• 26:39
  Just do it.
• 26:40
  It gets easier.
• 26:41
  Just like the podcast.
• 26:42
  Right, Right.
• 26:44
  Because we have no clue what we're doing.
• 26:46
  Just as a reminder.
• 26:47
  No clue.
• 26:49
  We are.
• 26:49
  We're like, on episode eight.
• 26:50
  We haven't edited anything yet.
• 26:53
  Right.
• 26:55
  But we're doing.
• 26:56
  We're having fun.
• 26:57
  So hopefully you guys press and record.
• 27:01
  Well.
• 27:02
  So for me, like, this is.
• 27:04
  That confidence piece is what ties to perfectionism.
• 27:07
  Like, to tie that back to perfectionism.
• 27:09
  Because the reason that feels like such a battle for me is that, like, perfectionism is me trying to, like, control outcomes or have certainty that I'm doing the right thing or moving in the right direction.
• 27:28
  And I think it's very, like.
• 27:31
  I don't know.
• 27:32
  I think letting go of the need for certainty and being able to, like, just get.
• 27:41
  I hate.
• 27:41
  Sounds like such a fucking cliche.
• 27:43
  But, like, get more comfortable with being uncomfortable.
• 27:45
  But, like.
• 27:46
  Right.
• 27:46
  It's actually so true when you just start to do it, doing it anyway, even when you're scared.
• 27:53
  Like, what is that all the cliches?
• 27:56
  Yes, all cliches apply.
• 27:59
  Do it scared.
• 28:00
  Yeah, like, all of them.
• 28:03
  We just.
• 28:03
  I think for me, like, the.
• 28:05
  The lesson.
• 28:07
  And this came from you.
• 28:10
  Stacy was like.
• 28:12
  You said this way back in, like, one of our perfectionism workshops where, like, doing it perfect the first time robs you of an opportunity to learn something.
• 28:21
  And I was like, oh, fuck.
• 28:23
  Oh, my God.
• 28:27
  Because you don't.
• 28:27
  If you.
• 28:28
  If you just get it right, you're like, okay, great.
• 28:30
  Got it right.
• 28:30
  Let's move on.
• 28:31
  But if you get it wrong, then you give yourself an opportunity to learn something from it and do better and continue to improve.
• 28:38
  And I was just like, oh, that Just.
• 28:41
  Something clicked in my brain when you said that, and I was like, oh.
• 28:46
  Cause we like to learn.
• 28:48
  Exactly.
• 28:48
  I know.
• 28:49
  And I like.
• 28:49
  I love to learn, and I love to be curious.
• 28:52
  But the way that I had always approached that was I need to learn everything before I try something.
• 28:58
  Yeah.
• 28:58
  It doesn't work that way, though.
• 29:00
  I know, but the number of times that your girl just got completely paralyzed or.
• 29:07
  Or, like, stuck in full analysis paralysis mode.
• 29:11
  Because I was trying to have that certainty.
• 29:15
  Yeah.
• 29:15
  Because I was too afraid to try and fail.
• 29:18
  Like, God, I wish I could get all that time back because I just think about, like, how different things would be now, but I know they're as they're supposed to be.
• 29:27
  I get it.
• 29:27
  But it's also a learning opportunity.
• 29:32
  There is no certainty.
• 29:34
  It's very meta.
• 29:36
  The paralysis is real, though.
• 29:38
  Like, it really is paralyzing.
• 29:41
  Yeah.
• 29:42
  Like, I have to hype myself up to do stuff sometimes and just be like, well, here we go.
• 29:48
  Let's just give it a go, see what happens.
• 29:52
  I love.
• 29:52
  I love saying to my friends that are trying to do something different, I'm like, I hope you up.
• 30:01
  I can't wait to see it.
• 30:03
  That's great.
• 30:04
  I can't wait to see what you learn.
• 30:06
  Right.
• 30:07
  Yeah.
• 30:09
  Because that's.
• 30:10
  I know we're slipping it to general again, but honestly, it's.
• 30:17
  Yeah, I like, it's never.
• 30:20
  There is no perfection, you know?
• 30:23
  Like, that's just a myth that we tell ourselves to keep ourselves small.
• 30:28
  Yeah.
• 30:30
  It's a shield.
• 30:32
  Right?
• 30:32
  So again, like, going back to.
• 30:34
  I love this when we were reading the Gifts of Imperfection in our, like, book club.
• 30:38
  Right.
• 30:38
  Because it's.
• 30:39
  Perfection is a shield.
• 30:41
  It's armor to.
• 30:43
  To protect ourselves from the vulnerability of showing imperfections.
• 30:47
  Yeah.
• 30:48
  Right.
• 30:49
  Shout out to Brene Brown.
• 30:52
  If you're listening.
• 30:57
  But.
• 30:58
  But that also, like, kind of broke something in my brain because I.
• 31:02
  I didn't see it as a protective.
• 31:05
  I didn't see it as the protective mechanism that it is.
• 31:09
  I saw it as I hold myself to high standards.
• 31:13
  Like, I thought it was, like, all Gucci and healthy, and it is for sure not.
• 31:18
  Right.
• 31:19
  Like, I thought.
• 31:19
  I'm just like, okay.
• 31:20
  Like, I'm just like, I have great work ethic and I'm like, I have great attention to detail.
• 31:26
  Like, I tried to fluff it up in every possible way.
• 31:29
  And if I just boil it down to, like, what it actually is, it's like, oh, no, girl, you're just scared.
• 31:34
  So.
• 31:35
  Right?
• 31:37
  You're just scared that someone's gonna, like, see you fail and woof.
• 31:43
  So even just rewriting that story, like, leaning into all of that feels courageous for me.
• 31:48
  So, like, that's where still, I still feel a little bit of a.
• 31:53
  A struggle in, like, fully embodying this value, because, damn, that perfectionism is deeply rooted There are so.
• 32:01
  I mean, even just at the top of this episode, setting unrealistic expectations for how much I can accomplish in one day.
• 32:07
  Still doing it.
• 32:08
  We've talked about this ad nauseum in separate conversations without microphones in front of our faces.
• 32:15
  Right.
• 32:15
  Like, I and I still here I am still trying to, like, rewrite that pattern in that story for this one.
• 32:23
  I don't know if it ever truly feels easy for me.
• 32:26
  Her courage always feels a little bit hard and a little bit scary.
• 32:30
  But, like, what about you guys?
• 32:32
  Where is it still a challenge?
• 32:35
  Where does it feel easy?
• 32:37
  Yeah.
• 32:38
  Are there certain people or situations, like, specifically.
• 32:45
  That's funny.
• 32:45
  See, my answer to that is, it depends on.
• 32:48
  Because if my moon is engaged, I will say almost any damn thing.
• 32:55
  I don't care who you are, how much I love you, I will start a fight at Thanksgiving.
• 33:02
  Watch me.
• 33:04
  Do not say stupid.
• 33:06
  I will you up verbally and it'll hurt your heart.
• 33:12
  Let's see.
• 33:15
  Everywhere it's hard.
• 33:17
  Everywhere.
• 33:18
  Where is it easy?
• 33:20
  It's not easy.
• 33:21
  That's the point.
• 33:22
  Like, that's the point.
• 33:25
  It's hard.
• 33:26
  Courage is always hard.
• 33:27
  I love this.
• 33:29
  This.
• 33:30
  I should have this tattooed on Maddie.
• 33:33
  Maddie said once when we were in coaching school, he's, like, telling the story and he's like, oh, fear is what courage feels like.
• 33:44
  I was like, damn, Damn, damn it.
• 33:48
  Okay.
• 33:49
  Damn it.
• 33:51
  So courage isn't feeling courageous.
• 33:53
  It's not feeling confident.
• 33:55
  It's being piss scared, ready to your pants and doing the dumb thing anyway.
• 34:04
  Because it's dumb.
• 34:05
  It.
• 34:05
  Like, what does it really matter?
• 34:07
  Like, so true.
• 34:09
  Do you know what I mean?
• 34:10
  Like, right.
• 34:11
  In the whole grand scheme of things.
• 34:12
  But it doesn't matter, girl.
• 34:14
  Seriously.
• 34:15
  Like, I.
• 34:15
  I'm looking at these little photos from Artemis right now and thinking, I am a fucking speck of dust.
• 34:22
  None of this shit matters, right?
• 34:24
  None of this shit matters.
• 34:27
  Like, talk about perspective.
• 34:29
  Thank you, moon people.
• 34:30
  People that just flew around the moon for reminding me how small.
• 34:34
  Yes.
• 34:35
  Astronauts.
• 34:36
  And being so beautiful doing it.
• 34:38
  Oh, my God, I loved it.
• 34:39
  I have lovely people watching it.
• 34:41
  Like, I get excited to turn the TV on and see where they're at, what they're doing.
• 34:44
  I love it.
• 34:45
  No, seriously, it's amazing.
• 34:47
  Okay, so where is it easy?
• 34:49
  I don't know.
• 34:50
  It's easy.
• 34:51
  When.
• 34:51
  I was going to say, when I feel ready.
• 34:52
  I don't ever feel ready.
• 34:54
  It's easy.
• 34:55
  Oh.
• 34:55
  Oh, okay.
• 34:57
  It's easier when I know.
• 35:02
  Not intellectually.
• 35:06
  When I know in.
• 35:08
  Right.
• 35:09
  I think Glennon Doyle calls It.
• 35:12
  Or your intuition or whatever it is, then it's like, it's easy to dismiss the storytelling programming piece and be like, no, I, I know this is what I'm supposed to be doing, so it doesn't matter as much how
• 35:30
  hard it is or, or if it's for somebody else.
• 35:35
  So I can definitely do hard things.
• 35:39
  Glennon Doyle, again, I can be courageous.
• 35:41
  On other people's behalf.
• 35:44
  Yeah.
• 35:45
  Because I don't think about it.
• 35:46
  Yeah.
• 35:47
  Or, yeah, I can be uncomfortable for somebody else.
• 35:53
  So it's taken a long time to do that for myself.
• 35:58
  Well, that kind of just reminds me of the phrase of like, it's simple, but it's not easy.
• 36:05
  Right.
• 36:05
  Like when your inner knowing is like fully lit up and you're like, yes, this is the thing.
• 36:12
  And it is as simple as this is what you have to do and you know it beyond a shadow of a doubt.
• 36:20
  This is what you have to do.
• 36:22
  But doing the thing is still not easy.
• 36:25
  It's simple and it's very clear.
• 36:28
  But it's not easy.
• 36:30
  Right.
• 36:30
  Like, so that's the distinction, is that we're never, it's never going to be both.
• 36:37
  No.
• 36:38
  If it's truly courageous, it's never going to be both.
• 36:41
  Correct.
• 36:42
  Like, I don't think, I don't think easy.
• 36:44
  Encourage belong even in the same sentence.
• 36:47
  Yeah, it's never going to be.
• 36:49
  Right, so.
• 36:50
  Because if it's easy, it's not courageous.
• 36:52
  Right.
• 36:53
  Well, it's only easy in those instinctual situations, like seeing somebody in danger and.
• 36:59
  You know, like, like when I disarmed the psycho in the library.
• 37:05
  Yeah, exactly.
• 37:07
  Not to say that you don't feel something.
• 37:09
  You do, but your instinct to help somebody else overrides all of your self preservation, that kind of thing.
• 37:17
  That's more easy.
• 37:18
  But that's because it's like automatic.
• 37:22
  Yeah, but you know what, though?
• 37:23
  Something you think about, not everyone would do that though, so I, I would, I would say it's not easy because there's a lot of people who are.
• 37:30
  Like, no, but that's what I mean, that to me, in that situation, the people that do those things instinctually.
• 37:38
  Right?
• 37:39
  Yeah, that's easy from my perspective.
• 37:45
  Mm, that makes sense.
• 37:48
  Well, again, like, I think it's for me, like I distinguish.
• 37:53
  It's simple because it's clear, but it still feels uncomfortable.
• 37:56
  So it's not exactly easy, but it is, it is this simple, Right.
• 38:02
  Like, it is this.
• 38:03
  I know this to be true.
• 38:06
  So is it that.
• 38:08
  Is it just that that makes this value rebellious?
• 38:11
  Is it that, like, it's never.
• 38:13
  It might never feel easy.
• 38:16
  That, like, what is it about courage that is rebellious?
• 38:23
  I would say it's amorphous.
• 38:26
  There's no cookie cutter way of being courageous.
• 38:31
  Do you know what I mean?
• 38:33
  So choosing what that means to you and doing the thing that's courage to you, that is what makes it rebellious.
• 38:44
  Because, you know, saying, I feel anxious doing this thing that millions of other people do without thinking about it.
• 38:55
  That's courageous to that person.
• 38:59
  So.
• 39:00
  Which is.
• 39:02
  Right.
• 39:02
  Being vulnerable.
• 39:03
  Right.
• 39:05
  In that.
• 39:06
  In that sense.
• 39:07
  And.
• 39:07
  And I think vulnerability.
• 39:09
  It's very courageous and it's very rebellious.
• 39:14
  Yeah.
• 39:15
  I feel like facing yourself like, and.
• 39:21
  And doing the work that is required to live the life that you want to live, that you've always in your head had, but aren't living.
• 39:33
  I feel like that's rebellious.
• 39:36
  Right.
• 39:36
  Like, it takes courage to do that, to live and.
• 39:40
  And not what you've been told or society has told you that, you know, you have to live in the boxes that you need to put yourself into.
• 39:49
  Yeah.
• 39:49
  I mean, that's always my rebellion.
• 39:52
  I feel like no matter what, that's what I'm always.
• 39:54
  Stories.
• 39:55
  Yeah.
• 39:56
  In our bios, for each one of us, that there was some moment of courage that was, like, a major catalyst in our own healing journey.
• 40:06
  Yeah.
• 40:07
  Where you had to do, like, a really uncomfortable thing.
• 40:10
  Oh.
• 40:12
  And it.
• 40:13
  And it took courage to do it and do pat myself on the back for that.
• 40:17
  Because I feel like a lot of people, like we talked before, like, you know, we said before, like, that a lot of people rather stay in that comfort zone.
• 40:26
  Right.
• 40:26
  Because they don't want to be so uncomfortable with doing that.
• 40:31
  But it's worth it.
• 40:34
  It's like, the best fucking thing you'll ever do.
• 40:37
  It's so rewarding, like, in so many ways.
• 40:41
  Right.
• 40:42
  That's the rebellion.
• 40:44
  Like, you actually get rewarded for it.
• 40:46
  Well, I wasn't even, like, thinking about that part of it, but it really is.
• 40:52
  It's like the courage to truly see yourself and know yourself, to, like, reject the scripts and the checklists and the stories of this, of the shoulds and the supposed tos and, like.
• 41:07
  Yeah.
• 41:07
  Ooh.
• 41:09
  Like, what did we.
• 41:10
  What did we used to say to shine the flashlight in the corners.
• 41:14
  We're all big, like, really scary shit is hiding and just, like, kind of be willing to see it and own it and then move through it because you're right.
• 41:26
  Like, it is.
• 41:26
  It's some of the hardest work you'll ever do.
• 41:29
  Even just this own, like, inner Healing, whatever journey you're on, some of the hardest work you'll ever do, and it's also the most valuable thing you'll ever do for yourself and everyone around you.
• 41:39
  Yeah, it really is.
• 41:41
  And it really does take so much courage.
• 41:43
  And especially, like, in the beginning, like, when you start when you're in the middle, in the thick of it in the beginning like that.
• 41:49
  I feel like that's really courageous every single day.
• 41:51
  Because every single day, you're dealing with so much.
• 41:55
  Because it does taper off, right?
• 41:56
  Like, it does get a little easier.
• 41:58
  The beginning is really, really hard.
• 42:01
  And I mean, this could be a whole nother episode.
• 42:03
  Right.
• 42:05
  Sometimes you don't want to get out.
• 42:06
  Of bed, but you do.
• 42:07
  Yeah.
• 42:08
  Put it on the list.
• 42:11
  What's interesting is that I feel like.
• 42:14
  Okay.
• 42:15
  I just, like, was thinking of this analogy in my head is like, eventually it tapers off when you start, like, the cur.
• 42:22
  The first moment of courage is like you're actually at the base of a mountain.
• 42:29
  Like, it gets way fucking harder before it gets easier, before it starts to taper off.
• 42:35
  Right?
• 42:35
  Like, that first moment of courage is the first step of the climb.
• 42:40
  Knowing that you're in for shit for a while, and it's gonna get harder before it gets easier.
• 42:47
  My God, that's so true.
• 42:50
  Yeah.
• 42:51
  Not to say that it doesn't.
• 42:53
  That it, like, goes away and you're healed.
• 42:56
  There's no end of the line.
• 42:58
  Right.
• 42:59
  Like,.
• 43:01
  Again, case in point, how I started this episode talking about all the things that I've healed that just keep coming back to bite me in the ass.
• 43:08
  I was a total mess last week.
• 43:12
  Owning it.
• 43:13
  Hello.
• 43:14
  But it gets easier when.
• 43:17
  When you get to know yourself a little more and you've let go of some things, right?
• 43:21
  So you're not perfect, but you're able to let go of something.
• 43:24
  So it.
• 43:25
  So in that sense, it does get easier.
• 43:28
  But.
• 43:29
  No, it definitely gets easier.
• 43:30
  You don't just.
• 43:31
  You're not going to ever just be done healing.
• 43:33
  You're not.
• 43:37
  Happening.
• 43:38
  Yeah.
• 43:38
  Evolution will go on forever.
• 43:40
  That's interesting.
• 43:41
  I feel like this could probably be a whole nother episode.
• 43:44
  Maybe we should just, like.
• 43:45
  I'll make the comment and then we'll table it, because otherwise, I'm gonna be here for two more hours.
• 43:50
  But.
• 43:50
  Right.
• 43:52
  I think even raising your hand for the healing journey, to say, like, I'm gonna do this because once you start, it's never over, is, like, the most courageous thing that any of us can do.
• 44:11
  Right?
• 44:11
  Like, even just saying, like, yeah, that Sounds great.
• 44:15
  I'm in.
• 44:16
  Right?
• 44:18
  Yeah.
• 44:19
  Buckle up.
• 44:21
  Yep.
• 44:24
  You'll be stuck on that roller coaster for the rest of your life.
• 44:27
  Because it does sound great.
• 44:29
  It does.
• 44:30
  And listen, I mean, again, start doing.
• 44:32
  It and you're like, this is not the fun ride that I thought it was going to be.
• 44:37
  This is not right.
• 44:42
  Because I'm nauseous and it's not fun.
• 44:47
  Like, I thought I got on like a.
• 44:49
  Like a chill, like, old wooden roller coaster and I got on, like the loop de loop.
• 44:54
  Like.
• 44:55
  Oh, yeah.
• 44:56
  Feet dangling.
• 44:57
  And it goes backwards, too.
• 44:59
  See, I was thinking tubing in the lazy river at the water park.
• 45:04
  No, no.
• 45:05
  And then it turns into the rapids.
• 45:07
  Right?
• 45:08
  Exactly.
• 45:09
  Yeah, exactly.
• 45:10
  We're going down the scary rapids without a life vest on.
• 45:15
  It feels like sometimes, but now it's awesome.
• 45:21
  Don't run away.
• 45:22
  It's worth it.
• 45:23
  It really is.
• 45:24
  Oh, my God.
• 45:25
  But we wouldn't be here talking about it if it wasn't.
• 45:28
  Right?
• 45:29
  Stay tuned for the general fuckery episode.
• 45:32
  But this is a preview of coming attractions, Right?
• 45:37
  I think every episode is general.
• 45:39
  The more cone of our values.
• 45:41
  If it's not, we're not doing it.
• 45:43
  Right.
• 45:44
  Right.
• 45:45
  So I think I'll close on.
• 45:48
  This is courageous.
• 45:49
  And.
• 45:50
  And again, this feels rebellious for us because part of the mission of what we're doing here is like, just say the quiet things out loud in front of a microphone and to, like, stop kind of like performing, pretending,
• 46:03
  or like censoring.
• 46:05
  Yeah.
• 46:05
  Censoring ourselves in our lives.
• 46:08
  And we've had enough of that.
• 46:11
  Yeah, we've had enough of that.
• 46:13
  So this is our.
• 46:15
  Our little rebellious act of courage.
• 46:17
  Like this, this whole podcast.
• 46:19
  But this was actually a fun one to talk about.
• 46:23
  This is really good.
• 46:24
  I was so excited to do.
• 46:26
  Even though.
• 46:29
  Even though the act of courage might be hard, this was a fun one to talk about.
• 46:33
  And I'm excited for the next round.
• 46:36
  We've got two values left.
• 46:38
  Yeah.
• 46:39
  Permission and general.
• 46:41
  So.
• 46:42
  And then we really get into the general after that.
• 46:44
  And then.
• 46:45
  And then.
• 46:48
  Honestly, there's no telling what's gonna happen.
• 46:51
  Yep.
• 46:51
  But it's all going to be good.
• 46:55
  So we hope you'll come back and ride that roller coaster with us.
• 46:58
  Yeah, it's gonna be fun.
• 46:59
  And the lazy river with the rapids.
• 47:03
  Sometime and the mountains.
• 47:06
  Right.
• 47:13
  We'll see you next time.
• 47:14
  Love you.
• 47:16
  Bye.
• 47:17
  Bye.