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Transforming Grief: From Suffering to Personal Growth with Tara Nash · The James Granstrom Podcast - Super Soul Model series

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: In this episode I'm speaking with author Tara Nash.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Tara is a spiritual psychologist and conscious grief guide, and she helps people transform heavy emotions like grief and helps people find their center again.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: Enjoy this enlightening episode.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the James Garnson podcast Super Soul Model series, where I help people tune and tap in to their natural state of well-being.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: This week I have returning guest Tara Nash.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: Tara is a spiritual psychologist and conscious grief guide and she's just written her first book, conscious Grief Transforming Pain into Evolution and Growth.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: I'm so excited to have Tara back on the show.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you so much for having me back, James.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to our conversation.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: Since our last conversation, which was probably about a year ago, you've been guiding people through a conscious grief program.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: You've been doing lots of programs, perhaps a little retreat.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: You've been doing online summits, really helping people heal through this conscious grief.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: Give us a little recap about what conscious grief is and perhaps maybe you could just tell us a little bit about your story again so we can refresh the audience about how we can potentially help them in that word grief, because it seems a.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: It seems quite a heavy word, but when I speak with you I get a lot of joy from you, tara, so it just shows what you've done, uh, with your own process.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: So fill us in a little bit about what conscious grief is and your own story, if that's okay.
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: Well, I guess my experience was kind of unconscious grief for many, many years, because my father died in 1990 of a heart attack and my mother died in 2002 of breast cancer, and I didn't really know anything about what grief was or how it impacted you.
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: I don't think my mother either really delved into it.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: You know, when my father died we just kind of we were brave, we were strong, we didn't really stop and process it.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: In fact, my mother got remarried very quickly, um, which was not a good marriage, so then she went through a divorce and I could always, I would always think about how, you know, stress impacts us and I often wondered my mother getting breast cancer?
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: She was a very sort of healthy person in terms of diet and exercise and and yet she got cancer.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: And I I just mimicked my mother really when she died, that I would just not kind of let this, these deaths and sadness, slow me down or stop me from getting on with life, um, but I I was always internally struggling and quite um sort of having a quite a low level of of depression really and, but, you know, determined to not, you know, let it affect me what is a low level of depression?
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: what?
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: What does that mean?
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: Is that just like you just feel depressed in the background, or what?
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: What does that mean?
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: I would say it was, um, just a kind of apathy, like I don't care if I'm here or not here, like what is the point of life?
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: Know?
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: I just wasn't feeling any real kind of joy and excitement for being alive and I was always really questioning, like what's the point of it all?
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: From a young, young age, right, and I started having, I tried with therapy in my very early 20s I felt very ashamed of going to see a therapist.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: It was something I was extremely secretive about.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: I didn't find her to be somebody particularly helpful.
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: I always struggled in relationships.
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: So that's kind of what would get me to seek help, not thinking, oh, I need to process the death of my parents, um, and then it was.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: And then my late 20s, I did find a good therapist, but again, we were taught talking a lot about you know what happened in my childhood and realizing that that was a big trauma and I hadn't allowed myself to even think of that as a trauma.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: Leave losing my father very suddenly of a heart attack when I was nine.
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: So that was good.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: You know, I started to have therapy.
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: I worked in fashion beforehand and then I started to do, you know, self-development workshops in this therapy and I became quite, uh sort of enchanted by this world and I started thinking I'm not really happy in fashion anymore, I'd like to move my career into something that's more about helping people.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: And I found this master's degree in Los Angeles called spiritual psychology, and I'd been I was always quite enamored with the US.
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: I had friends who are moving to New York and I was kind of going to visit them.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: So I found this, this program, and I moved to LA and I started studying spiritual psychology, and it was during that two years that I I started to process my grief, because in the second year we had to choose a project of our choice and I decided to base my project on death and grieving.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: Um, I mean, I won't go into the full story, but that's what, how the book begins, um and uh.
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: So it was you know, however, many years later, over a decade later, that I actually picked up books about grief and I thought, my goodness, why, why has the therapist or the coaches that I've been working with?
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: They haven't ever really explained to me what grief is and how it can impact us, and a lot of my experience and my behaviors started to make sense because, of course, it was really directly related to grieving but I hadn't been aware of it and I hadn't been conscious of it and I didn't know when I started that program that you know, sort of talking about death and grief would be where I would land.
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: But I was so kind of, I was so sort of lit up that there was all this whole community and you know, all of this knowledge around a subject which I had been dealing with for most of my life and and yet I hadn't um researched it, I hadn't looked into it and I was quite surprised how a lot of therapists or coaches they won't have a lot of training on grief it while they're doing that um, while they're studying.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: So, unless you've had a very direct experience of a big grief, I think it's almost something that you have to have an experience of um.
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: But obviously grief there's.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: It can be all kinds of different grief.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: It doesn't have to just be um, it's not just the death of a person yeah, it could be like a relationship breakup or it could be, you know, a loss of something you know.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's usually a loss of something because you feel disconnected, which is why something that was secure is has been taken away.
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: Until you can return back to yourself where you feel that inner security again, which is basically what your book's all about.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: I'm fascinated by your book.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: So when you're talking about your book, you know you talk about, like this, why it's so important to be mindful of grief.
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: Tell us a little bit about that, because that's quite fascinating, because sometimes we're not even aware of what's happening.
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: And it said you were just saying I wasn't even aware that I was grieving for years or most of my life.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: So if someone's listening in the audience, you know like you'd be, like yeah, I feel a little apathy or I feel this, or I feel that I don't feel like myself, because when you feel yourself, you feel fulfilled, you feel filled up, filled up with within.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: But if you're, if you're not feeling great, you're just sort of existing or getting by.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: That's not really living.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: And in your book you know, you, what is the mindfulness and intentionality behind, like understanding, like this conscious grief, and why is that important?
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: Well, for my experience, I went into a state of, you know, which most people do shock, when my father died and I that I decided that it was safer to not feel because the feelings, you know, was so overwhelming, and also I was watching a lot of adults breaking down and crying, so I was like, oh my gosh, I don't want all of these emotions, I don't want to put that on anybody else, and so I basically went into numbness for a long time, you know, and that's that is normal at the beginning.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: But it's not normal to stay there for years and years and years.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: And if you, you know, if you're in that place of numbness, then of course you know you're not going to be able to feel like you say, you're not going to be able to feel like you say, you're not going to be able to live fully because you're turning the volume down on the really painful feelings.
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: But you can't just choose to turn the volume down on certain feelings, you know.
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: You turn them down on on the excitement and the joy and the wonder and awe of life too, and the joy and the wonder and awe of life too, and so when I think nobody grieves in the same way and you may have to not consciously grieve because your life might not have the space and the time to be able to sit with your feelings.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: If you have a busy job and young children and you don't, you know, you just haven't got the space in your life to really like have those days of feeling and crying and processing or being angry.
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: So you never know when it's going to come for you.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: And I do believe that our consciousness will present what needs healing when you're ready to heal it.
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: And I don't want people to sort of think, oh well, my father died, I'm going to read this book and I'm going to follow the instructions and then you know, these messy, uncomfortable feelings will subside and I will never have to revisit them.
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, you know, grief isn't like that and we don't know when we're going to have the feelings come up.
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: But if you're conscious and aware of things that you're feeling, I mean that's really what it is.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Things that you're feeling, I mean that's really what it is, and a lot of us, I think it's different in the next generation, but we were never taught to be in touch with our feelings and, as most of us, as soon as we feel anything uncomfortable.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: You know we reach for a distraction yeah change that usually some sort of addiction or whatever.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: Can I ask a question why is it that most women are more in touch with the feelings than men?
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: From your experience as being a conscious grief guide, and I've got to ask that question do you tend to have more women come to your type of workshops and things that you do than, yeah, you do yeah okay.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: I do, um, I mean, I think women are just generally more able to talk about their feelings, um, because that's been more socially acceptable and many men from a young age, you know, of a certain generation, were told don't cry, you know, be strong and be macho.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and those.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: That's the messaging from an old programming, you know, which I think is changing a lot and when, in my schooling and when I grew up, you know, everything was exactly like that.
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: So like you gotta show zero emotion, you gotta make sure you're strong and hard, um, but at the same time it doesn't stop you feeling or trying not to feel those feelings, because they do come up, whether you like them or not, even if you're a guy.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: Um, but I'm fascinated.
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: I always, I I've always thought that maybe women are more in touch with their emotions because of their body and just the natural DNA of being a female in gender.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: And men's natural inclination is to want to provide and have to protect, and that protection means I'm not going to let any vulnerability seep in.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: But actually then you can't actually begin to nurture yourself and nurture anybody else unless you let that in anyway.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: So it's a bit of a catch-22, um.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: So in my own healing journey I've, you know, looked at myself and gone okay, it's okay to be, uh, a man and it's okay to also be open and share my feelings as well.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: It took a long time.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: I remember even my sister saying like you never tell me how you really feel.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: You know, you always say, yeah, it's fine, it's fine, but I know you're not fine and I'm like yeah, so it took me a little while until actually a friend of mine so any guys listening a friend of mine said he goes buddy, you know it's okay for you to tell me how you feel, I'm not going to judge you.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: You to tell me how you feel, I'm not going to judge you.
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: And I was like wow, that was the first time that had actually been allowed in my life when I was growing up.
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: I was like I've been allowed to actually say, oh, I don't even know what this feeling is, but I know it's not my centered feeling, I know it's not joy right now, or I know it's not, you know, know an optimistic feeling.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: And then that's the process, or at least in my experience, of a male being able to go.
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: I can be open to a feeling and just accept it for what it is rather than try and push it away.
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: So if there's someone listening who's struggling right now, in your book you sort of talk about the emotional and the spiritual aspects of conscious grief how can someone find that peace again?
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: You know, between those two aspects, the emotional and the spiritual, to find that harmony again, because you know your journey is so unique.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: You were in that space of extreme non-acceptance to then, so total acceptance, and now you're helping so many people, tara, you know what?
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: How would someone in the audience who's struggling right now find that balance?
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: well, I think you you mentioned the word intention before.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: I think you have to have a, you know, curiosity and an intention to find what is going to work for you, and maybe you're gonna have to try various modalities of healing and for some people, talking about what's going on for them is helpful.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: Maybe for other people it's creative pursuits like art, or it could be physical forms of exercise or journaling, um, so, you know, really it's finding what works for you and I would encourage people to try, you know, multiple forms of processing, because what the problem that we have?
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: If we, if we don't process it and allow it to the energy of the grief to move, you know it becomes stuck inside of us.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: And that's when, you know, we either start having physical ramifications like aches and pains, or maybe you get IBS, or perhaps you know you get serious back pain, yeah, and and the breath, the lungs, is where we hold the grief, so you might have short and shortness of breath.
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, broken heart syndrome is a real thing and this happens a lot.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: When you know people who've been together for for many years, one of them dies and then the other one may, you know, get something to do with the heart that that then also makes them very unwell or even they die.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: That happened with my um grandparents, actually after my father died.
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: So, having the awareness, that grief, and because we're very because we're talking about it relating to death, because it's a subject that we're not very good at talking about or accepting, then we sort of just want to close the lid on it and not deal with it and think that we're okay.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: And I think nowadays more and more people are, you know so much, more aware of, like our mental health, for example, and getting more aware that our physical health is often attached to our mental health.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: And so you might sort of feel like you're fine in your mind but your body is telling you that something needs attention.
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: If we don't have the awareness, then we're just going to keep soldiering on in life and not feeling 100% and not living fully.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: And I think and the other difficulty is, of course, when we feel intense pain and we don't want to feel that again.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: So we sort of shut down down and that's a form of protection because you know our hearts have been broken.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: Essentially, you know whether that could be a relationship or somebody dying.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: We think I don't ever want to feel that again and therefore you're sort of not open to.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: You know, receiving love in your life, which is essentially the most important parts of of being here so that's a really good point.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: Actually, when you're grieving you, you're not feeling love, are?
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: you, yeah, disconnected from disconnected from love and at our essence or at our core, that's what we are.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: So it's almost as if it's just being pulled away from you, not feeling that love.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: So, in your experience, what did you do?
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: What were your practical tools that you used to to get back to that state of life?
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: Because if you ever meet tara, tara's like this beautiful, glowing soul and she's just got this wonderful thing or energy that is kind of a little indescribable.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: When I had dinner with Tara and a few friends at a birthday party a year or two ago, I remember we all were around the dinner table.
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember this, tara, but uh, we were all told to say how do you, in one word, describe someone that you see across the table?
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: So do you?
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: remember this and I said, okay, when I, when I look at you know, because I've never met Tara before and and I only knew another person at the table, a mutual friend and I described when I looked at our I was like I would say the towers very peaceful.
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: That's what I said.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: I said Tara's very peaceful that's my interpretation of when I met you, because you had this very calm, gentle, glowing persona and then you sort of you went.
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: Thank you, that that means a lot and that just goes to show the amount of work that Tara's done and that she's very authentic in her work number one and and what she's doing, because to go from where you were to have those very difficult experiences in your formative early years, to where you are and living in this beautiful energy that you do and helping the people you do, just as a massive testimony that this is possible.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: You're a testimony that you can have like some really outrageously difficult experiences and yet you can still return to love, you can still return to peace, you can still return to calm.
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: It's possible and you can still be glowing and beautiful and bright and cheerful and fun, despite whatever life throws at you.
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: And anyone who's listening is definitely going through something.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: And and I love the way you are a testimony about your work and and I think that that energy really like sort of speaks, this sort of volume of calm throughout your work, that these, that your, your processes, that your ideas are actually possible, although you might have to find your own way through creativity or yoga or movement or exercise or all the things that you tend to mention.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to go back to one thing.
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: In your book you sort of talk about transformational potential of grief, but what does that mean?
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: Well, everything that happens to us in our lives, you know, we can see, say, the obstacles, and a lot of us, you know, and myself included, would be like why is this happening to me?
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Would be like, why is this happening to me?
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: I mean, when I was younger I used to think, well, maybe, like, maybe if we went to church more or I was more of a good person, like perhaps bad things would stop happening to me.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: And in some, some way, you know, I would think is it my fault that these things are happening?
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: Or you know, why is this happening to me?
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: And I think the spiritual psychology you know, which is becoming much more like from taken from Buddhist traditions or things that we're more commonly coming up, you know, noticing more now, maybe in popular culture, that actually the obstacles are really opportunities for us and the difficult things that happen in our lives are not there to punish us, to tell us that we're a bad person.
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: They are happening, you know, for us rather than against us.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: And then what can we learn from every obstacle or difficulty?
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: And if we have, when I started learning this approach, it was really transformational for me because I stopped being in this sort of victim mentality of why me and you become more like well, why not me?
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: And what am I learning from this and how can I grow in my wisdom?
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: Or how can I then use what's happened to me to help other people, and that was a very empowering position to come from in life, as opposed to you know what?
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: Why me?
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: Why, why aren't these?
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: playing the victim basically yeah and it's.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: It's so easy to play the victim when you're unconscious because you're just not sure that you have any power whatsoever.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: You're like I'm just reacting to life, um, and I love that approach.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: You know, like I don't know what it's called in uh chinese, is it Wu Wei?
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: You know, danger and opportunity and crisis are the same symbol, or crisis and opportunity are the same symbol in Chinese, and it's just like transmuting all of that energy from victim to creator.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: And I noticed that when my father died a few years back victim to creator and I noticed that when my father died a few years back, I was like, well, I'm really having to go through some, some energy here to have to organize things that I've never been in a position to, like moving country, selling assets, having to figure everything out, caring for my mother um, you know just all of these things right, all of these new things, and like I'm having to deal with emotions as well and be in charge, and there's no one to to tell me what I have to do.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: I've got to figure it out, you know.
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: So wherever someone who's listening in, who may be going through something or other, despite the challenge that you're going through, what tara is really saying is is that that challenge is a setup for something beautiful in another season that only you will find out as this season begins to pass.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: I always call it.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: There's contrast in the setup.
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: You know there's.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: There's a setup in disguise that you won't see just yet.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: You can't see the bigger picture.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: But when you zoom out of your life in maybe a year or two, it will all make a little bit more sense and you'll be in an even better position as a result of this challenge or this adversity.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: But it doesn't make sense when you're right up in it in the quagmire yeah, and we want life to stay the same.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: So there's this, you know it makes me laugh.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: Why do we all want that?
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: We're just like, oh, just let it be, let it be the same, so I don't have to to worry.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: I don't want my emotions to have to change, but they're going to change, right?
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: and I think it's a process of you know you're holding on because you don't want the change, but it's a process of holding on and letting go, holding on and letting go all the time.
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: And if you've had a big life change, that somebody close to you has died or you're going through a divorce, you are going to be a new version of yourself without that person in your life anymore.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: You know you're forced, in a sense, to evolve and grow like you're talking about.
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: You didn't have your dad there, who was the person that would lead the family or make certain decisions or explain things to you.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: So you have to shift into you know, even though you are an adult, like you're now the grown up and in that position of looking after other members of the family, and so you are a new version of you and it doesn't matter, I don't think, whatever age somebody is who loses a parent.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: You know I have people coming into my groups who might be 70 years old and they've just lost their mother and they're in deep pain if they had an extremely close lives and we're all children essentially, um, so it really makes no difference, like if you've lost, whatever age you are, because it's the intensity of the relationship which, will you know, define the intensity of the grief so would you say that this is a really, that's a really good point here.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: So the deeper the grief, the more joy you had with that person or love yeah yeah.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: So I remember reading this and I thought, ah, so the the deeper sadness you feel, the greater joy it brought you.
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: So there's that beautiful yin yang, that balance.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: You can't experiencing loss without immense gains.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: If you're experiencing any form of loss, don't worry, there'll be massive gain coming massive so that's why I love this little philosophy of just appreciate every time you get to spend with people you care about, just absolutely give them like lots of hugs, tell them how much you love them and appreciate them, because that is the bit that's now, that's the only bit you'll ever control, which is now.
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: So you know, like when I'm with you, I'm like Tara's amazing, so excited to talk to you, learn from you, share with you, play, you know, and that's the same with everybody in your life.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: You know, just relish that moment, because when it's gone, it's gone yes, exactly, and I think that's what can be the biggest teacher yeah for us that we really realize how short life can be and how precious it can be.
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: And you know there's no guarantee of tomorrow and that and we do spend a lot of time worrying about very insignificant things I still do, even though you know I've been doing this for a long period of time and I help a lot of clients, and very successful people at that.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: It still pops up, you know.
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: But I don't let it pop up for long enough, but it's just like it will still say hello, do you remember me?
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: I'm your friend called worry.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm gonna.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: I'll say a quick hello, I'll invite you in and then you can leave when you're good and ready, but I'm just gonna chill here.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: It's funny how that happens yeah, it is, but I think death can be such a teacher in terms of getting getting things into perspective.
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, you hear of people dying at such a young age and it is, it's heartbreaking.
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: And I had a group last night with I mean, there's six people in the group but two of them have got, you know, younger children and they had amazing fathers, they were amazing husbands.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: So I get to hear this like devastating, as you were saying.
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: It's like deep love and joy and then this deep sadness as well.
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: Sadness as well, and and you think, wow, it's such a privilege to hear about these incredible people who have sadly gone too soon and have been passed away.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: But it's amazing to hear about incredible people and really beautiful relationships and families and you know, not everybody has those, those relationships and and so there's something yeah, it's, it's deeply heartbreaking but at the same time, it's like incredible to listen to, you know yeah, but, like you say, it's like putting it into perspective, isn't it?
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: it's like you're feeling this way because that person brought you great joy, you know, but now, because they're physically not here, that joy is gone.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: Well, can you not at least remember how good it feels when you were with them?
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: That's the shift, right, that can take a little time to really focus on.
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to sort of just touch upon, like, some of the things that you're doing with the conscious grief guidance.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: You know what sort of stories of people you know have you helped where grief has led to like massive positive transformation?
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: You talked briefly about it with, like people being amazing, that that like the husbands or the great they were great husbands or whatever.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: But what sort of what stories have you got from your clients or people that you've helped where you know where your conscious grief has led to like a massive positive transformation?
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: well, I, because of the spiritual side of of what I do, the the awareness that people may never have thought about or related to before, is that we are spiritual souls having a human experience, and a lot of people never think about what happens when you die, which amazes me because, you know, I was thinking about that from the age of nine quite obsessively.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: Not everybody does that, but like Tara does, I thought about it for quite a while, but you know everyone's different right, always obsessed with death, but you know that's part of what I went through it for quite a while.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: But you know everyone's different right, always obsessed with death, but you know that's part of what I went through.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: And so you know somebody dies, maybe your spouse, and obviously you do think well, where are they?
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: And I don't want to ever impose my beliefs on anyone and I'm always very respectful of that.
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: But we do have a week where we talk about beliefs, as there is the beliefs chapter in the book, and people may decide to consult a medium and will be completely, of course, if it's a, if it's a reputable person who's doing the reading blown away by the fact that there is the opportunity still to be connected with our loved ones who've crossed over to the other side, and that can be absolutely life-changing because it shifts your whole belief system, you know, and your awareness of your existence here and where we're going next.
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: So I think for some people then they really go, you know, on a on this spiritual seeking path which they would never have have gone on before.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: They had lost somebody close to them so sometimes grief can lead to an awakening in spirituality.
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: Is that what you're saying?
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's interesting.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: I'd like to share a story, if I may.
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: Um, when my father died, probably about three weeks after um, I just sort of like, gone through the finances, I was checking things out.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: We've kind of got the files in a row.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: You know, I've managed to to get to like, right now the real work begins.
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: Had the funeral done this, you're like right now the real work begins, now the next stage.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: I was like I've got to do this, I've got to do it.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: It's like, wow, I'm climbing Everest here for my family and I'm gonna do it.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: You know, and I, but I had this little sense of peace.
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: I'd been making sure I was exercising every day, like cardio for my heart, because I just knew that doing cardio would be very healing for my heart.
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: And then I remember like I was very particular, making sure I was eating very well, doing lots of cardio meditation.
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: So I was already I've already at this stage been spiritually awake.
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: Awake, but I wasn't ready for what happened next, which was what I'm about to share, which was I was lying down on my bed and I was very, very relaxed.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: I'd done a little meditation and now it's time to to drift off into sleep.
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: I was very comfortable, like, and I just remember this feeling because this comfort and what happened was the bit that really made me go wow, this is this real?
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: And it's like this, for me, felt very real.
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: I lay down, closed my eyes and then suddenly I felt my dad like lying next to me, just very comfortably, very gently.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: I saw him in my mind's eye as if I'm talking to you.
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: I was lying down like this very comfortably, in a blissful state of relaxation between sleep and I don't know, you know an alertness perhaps.
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: And he said do you mind if I just lie here a while?
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: I just want to be here with you for a bit.
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, papa, papa, but just don't snore.
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: Because he was a massive snoring, like shake the house with thunder when he snores.
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: We're like, oh no, he's sleeping.
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: And then I laughed and laughed I guess I won't, I promise, son, I won't.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: And I laughed and laughed and laughed.
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: And I woke up and I swear I saw him just like, like lying down just gently, just as if he was just saying I, I'm okay, all is well.
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: And we were laughing, I was laughing, he was laughing.
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: And then I woke up and I was in exactly the same position, except for there was no physical dad there, and I was like, oh, wow.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: And so what I realized was that every time that I'd gotten into this state of like real relaxation, that I was more in tune with another part of my awareness, my other part of being able to connect with people that were really close to me physically, and it would always happen in a kind of dream state and that just gave me this like all is well.
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, he's not physical, but he's chipping about.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: So to some people that might seem very odd, but until you can get into that state of real relaxation, which is done through some of the exercises that you mention in the book, um and for me it was definitely doing lots of exercises nutrition, meditation that has been fantastic for me, but for other people it might be doing lots more creativity or gardening or any type of therapy, talking to people, um, but yeah, what do you hope readers will take away from?
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: Like your book, tarot?
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: you know what's the main thing you would like them to take away when, when they read your book conscious grief and well, I include, you know, a bit of my own story, um, but I also have interviewed a lot of people, um on this subject, so I include a lot of other people's stories as well, and so I hope that through all the different stories, people will feel that they can relate, that they don't feel alone in what they're experiencing.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: You know, you sometimes feel like you're going crazy.
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: So I think some form of like validation and knowing that you're not going crazy, that you're not alone, and that you might feel inspired through reading some of the modalities of healing you know the therapies, or maybe getting a reading with a medium that they might feel inspired to, to seek out some extra support in another way as well and try something that they haven't tried before.
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: But I mean, I start the book with the chapter on self-care, of which we're just talking about, um, and how you took care of yourself after your father was dying.
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: And sometimes I say to people if you've never had any sort of form of self-care practice, then this is really the time in your life to start developing that and really delving into like who am I?
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: Because it's also like who am I now, after this person has left, but like who are you truly, really deeply, and how?
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: What is your relationship like with yourself?
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: Because, again, some people have never really thought about that before.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: And so really learning to love and support yourself, because you can't really take care of yourself or do self-care, I don't think, if you don't have a very good relationship with yourself because you don't care about yourself, and so you know, I think that took me a long time to develop that.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: And just before I was walking this morning, I was walking my dog and I was thinking I used to go to New York quite regularly to see friends and I'm going to New York later this week actually and I haven't been for many years.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: Actually, and I haven't been for many years.
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: But I was thinking about it was like 11 years ago when I was there and I just felt so awful, you know, in myself, um, I really didn't like who I was.
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: You know I was in, I was just in a lot of really didn't like who I was.
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: You know I was in, I was just in a lot of pain, but not acknowledging that, and so I thought, you know, it's really an amazing feeling to not be in that place anymore.
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and, as you were saying it is, it is really possible to shift and transform and it's not necessarily something that happens overnight.
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: Um, you know it varies for everybody, but it is possible.
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: So if you're feeling like in a really low place in your life, you know, unfortunately it is up to you to change that.
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: You can't just it's a funny thing.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: I was just having this conversation with a friend yesterday.
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: I was like no one's coming to save you, no one's coming.
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: I waited, waited, waiting.
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: No one's coming.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: Once you take, once you take full responsibility, that it's all up to you, that then you suddenly get this rush of energy that comes through and I sometimes call that a rush of spiritual energy that comes through saying I'm actually going to show up for me.
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: And then suddenly ideas, books, therapies, people just start to come into experience.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: Because, because you're actually saying I'm going to take responsibility for this.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: But when you are waiting for some external source to come and sort you out, it's just, it's just not going to happen.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: You're going to to be in limbo.
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: So you're excited to go to New York with a new level of energy.
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a completely different person essentially, Even though I'm not and if you'd met me 11 years ago, I'm still a very similar person to be with.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: But internally I was really struggling and I didn't necessarily share that with everybody.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: But, yeah, I was really really not happy and I really didn't like myself and it took.
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: You know it does take time, it does take a real level of dedication and you know the sort of thing like I've done it myself a million times.
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: Like you think, if I pay for the gym membership or I buy these supplements that I never take, then you're going to feel better.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: But it's like you can't just make investments in things and not do anything.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: You have to be the one to put the work in day after day in order to feel better.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to say what I noticed about you and your particular experiences.
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: Your experiences seem quite long.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: You, you know a long experience of the challenge, but you help people.
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: You help people able to navigate their way through that, those trials and those emotions, through a much quicker time frame than perhaps you went through.
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: That's the blessing where you've managed to transform your pain into possibility for other people and potential yeah, and I mean I always say to people look, just because we've done an 11 week program together, this is not gonna.
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: This doesn't mean to say everything's fine after 11 weeks.
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: You know, I've given you tools, um and a community which a lot of people stay in connection with the people they've been in the groups with um long after the group completes.
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: So yeah, it's a, it's, it's an education you like, but you then have to continue that on your own.
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: But at least they've got some tools now, whereas perhaps they may not have had the tools Exactly, and that's priceless, because you know you could be walking around in limbo and not having any idea what to do, how to process, in fact, how to even move forwards, because existing feels a very slow.
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: Red light place to me.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: You're like you're constantly waiting in traffic, as an analogy or a metaphor, you know, to being able to enjoy feeling, feeling like yourself again, reconnecting, recalibrating back to that good feeling person that you are at your core.
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: Just somehow separated.
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: Tara, it's been absolutely amazing speaking to you.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: Thanks for sharing everything about you, know your story and being candid, and I love hearing the stories of how you're helping people and helping your clients.
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: I'm going to have all of Tara's links available underneath this show, but I would just like to say this you really read Tara's book book, but if you get a chance to actually being there, it is a fantastic book, um, but if you are ever in london or wherever she's doing her workshops, try and get to her workshops, because being in atara's presence is really quite empowering and whilst we might not all be able to be there in person, I think you do some online stuff as well, don't you?
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: I do.
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: I do a lot of a lot of things online, yeah, and I teach a grief, yoga and breath work as well, which are really great tools very, very uh transformative.
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: So, if you can, try and get to see tara in person, but if not, try and use some of her other workshops or online stuff or read the book, because it's it's a fantastic book and it will really help you go from where you are to where you want to be yes, and it's a small book.
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: It's a very straightforward um to read and it's available as as well on audible too.
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: So if you don't have time to read a book but you like to listen to them in the car, then you can.
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: You can get it in that format as well that's fantastic.
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: Just in closing, is there anything else you'd like to say to somebody in the audience who's listening that might help them from where they are, you know, on their journey?
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: I think we spend a lot of time judging ourselves and maybe you feel like you should be in a different place by now.
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: You should be over it, you know.
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: You know, maybe I mean, I didn't start grieving until decades after my parents have died and I would just say that one of the most important things is to really be gentle and compassionate with yourself, as opposed to, you know, criticizing yourself and giving yourself a hard time.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: Um it, we we really can be our own worst enemy, and sometimes we can internally talk to ourselves in such a berating and harsh way, like in a, in a way that you would never speak to anybody else.
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: Um.
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: So if you're somebody with that kind of voice in your head, then really begin to to make some moves to change that and and really develop a kind and nurturing voice within, because that will really transform your life so true, tara, so true.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much thank you so much.
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: I really appreciate it this week's super soul model, the wonderful tara nash.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: Thank you very much.
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: If you've enjoyed this episode or any of the others and you've been inspired, please consider supporting the show.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: Your contributions make a huge difference so we can keep giving you the best content.
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: Thanks for tuning in.
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: As always, you make this show.