Latest / Construcción Plural - Radio Trend Topic / Construcción Plural - Programa 1154

Transcript

Construcción Plural - Programa 1154 · Construcción Plural - Radio Trend Topic

0:01
Plural construction, the renowned journalistic program of political analysis and current in its twentieth
0:08
season, with the leadership of Fernando Mauri and a team of prestigious analysts listen
0:15
to it on radio train topic. Our President was born in Argentina, Dr
0:25
Rabiero Mirey was the President hello. To all there is no stabilization plan,
0:42
not good, but the delay to change. Here' s a problem of
0:45
currency arrears. It is impossible to achieve the zero deficit in the twenty-
0:50
four thousand. Good. It' s very little speck. Raya is a
0:54
lot of equator, but you' re not liberal. There were taxes in
1:00
the province. No, but if I add one plus three hundred and sixty
1:04
- five times and give me three sixty s I can' t do it.
1:07
If there' s no video and there' s no one who invited
1:10
me to be a fede, you Fideo Cotuk. They want to know how
1:11
the economy is going to grow, it' s going to go up like
1:14
a diver' s fart. But there are no good anchors, because there
1:17
is no comprehensive plan. But you should set the path. This is not
1:22
a liberal government because it did not release the drug. Not because there'
1:26
s a changed appreciation. I have a changing appreciation, but good freedom that
1:33
few this how my friends, very but very good afternoon a new start of
1:42
week in plural construction and here we go. We will be in a little
1:45
while with the political analysis of the flight, with our columnists Uwaime in the
1:49
first place, and after that, Zoom will join us as a political consultant.
1:53
There was a cop I saw him. We' re already fixed next
2:00
week that' s short, but we' ll still be Tuesdays, Wednesdays
2:04
and Thursdays as usual. Tomorrow we' ll be with Gustavo Farrary Wolfson,
2:08
with Marcelo Pantel. Thousand juedes count the Reticornia with Alexander Rosman and it is
2:12
to come from a new week, averaging the six months that seem how many,
2:17
five, six, seven years. Good for the presidency of Don Javier
2:23
Miley and his government, El Blue El Donar Blue, on his fifth consecutive
2:27
day of consecutive roll- up, played one thousand three hundred and now low
2:31
little bit. It' s in a thousand two hundred ninety- five.
2:34
Make a mistake one thousand two eighty, yet with low lequi a little bit.
2:38
It is in one thousand three hundred four, but above the thousand three
2:40
hundred and the risk country that is very important. The over- tax that
2:43
would be paid from Argentina to take the debt. Today they don' t
2:45
do it on the voluntary credit line about what United States bonds have on a
2:51
thousand cholo which for the United States starts to educate at 1, 500 eleven,
2:55
that is, fifteen more points. This is a one- on-
2:58
one climb. Fifty percent had touched one thousand six hundred. I had gone
3:00
down a little bit on Halla' s day. Luis Caputa, in a
3:05
liberal forum, announced that negotiating a new program with the fund asking for platita,
3:08
asking for platita to the fund Desperate, desperate. I' m still
3:14
reading in the hominfobasta now live dollar. The blues count is in the ninety
3:17
- fives. Riggo equals over 1, 500. As I told them a
3:22
parish in Buenos Aires that looked more like a basic unit. Another thing.
3:23
He performed a Mass in which there were chants and slogans against Milays and if
3:29
Cristini Miley did the same as professional politicians. The morning column in radio by
3:34
Marcelo Longobardi, which transcribes infobada and calling a kind of CoA room, which
3:38
is surely going to take place between the center of ultra right macroing in France
3:43
starting in July, with the compu four the elections of the French President.
3:49
After the fierce defeat on the weekend in the selections Europe for selections for the
3:53
European Parliament, the Bank Munda Altisi informed or trusted Milay, but estimated that
3:58
Argentina, which is for the gene has a recession of three point five percent.
4:02
Three point five percent. This year, the Oran government suspended the free
4:06
thank- you trips, which was a bit of a misnomer, but well
4:11
confirmed by the Minister Government, Carlos Bianco, at a press conference, argued
4:14
that the national government recalled one point, seven million pesos to the province of
4:16
Buenos Aires, to which it has to accommodate the structure of costs, expenses
4:23
and investments. Okay, and that' s where we go, that'
4:30
s where we go, that' s where we go. So it'
4:31
s happening a little bit today so far. Let' s go over a
4:35
little bit. We' re going to clear point with the dorar bu set
4:43
a new record for the tracers of the Yugua Bueno to see that the sweat
4:46
of home was delayed. He was making the rum that goes on in Congress,
4:48
not last negotiations. There is put the axis of the week, along
4:51
with Thursday to low inflation below the five, already anticipated the minitor economy of
4:56
capoint, but with possibility that the five or above in June with all fees
5:00
and other last net sections. It says clarín, at hours of debating the
5:04
law, bases that this you recognize tomorrow with the average sanction of deputies,
5:09
everything that puts at stake the government. Of course, we' re going
5:13
to talk about this height with skin and aime. It is no more,
5:15
let' s say in the need for a parliamentary triumph than what it conceives
5:18
or what the law can almost serve for the government in the midst of the
5:23
help of the dollar top- up message of the markets, said that it
5:26
will begin to negotiate a new program with the fm that in search of funds,
5:30
as they advance the government of heo of inflation, it will be better,
5:33
the best in a long time stayed by the effect of the future of
5:36
the rates, what I told them May in low, but June slows down
5:42
the decrease that will later be able to return in. Eventually, in the
5:44
month of July it will be and until we have the best of cases,
5:47
four or five percent, which is something. It' s not much,
5:50
but it' s kind of a neito count. In the United States,
5:53
a son of Joe Biden was clearly guilty of gun position while he was drugged
5:59
in the neighborhood of San Cristóbal, the mass that became a militant act of
6:01
gynerism with chants against thousands Well, I' m going abroad with European elections
6:10
on the weekend. As I say, see, see, see and minute
6:14
we answer with Aime el Paine, Madrid says the Supreme, that is,
6:20
we are talking about the Supreme contribution. It would keep Pugemon in order as
6:24
he studies applying it to my spies. All that is Catalonia and not so
6:28
much, why and where the soe resists what the numbers of the duel Sánchez,
6:32
fiho Sánchez Partido de salida breo español, titular of the fixed executive,
6:38
leader of the opposition, Moderate Center Party, Popular Party and the Right,
6:43
to the friends of box the last right, which are those of the Milay
6:46
Party. Catalan judges activate the proceedings in the cases of former presidents. More
6:55
toras also say the country of Madrid and good there we hear well. First
7:00
guest in the afternoon was told I have it online. One guaime before one
7:05
last tip. My reading will finally go to Switzerland to participate in the summit.
7:09
For peace organized by Celensky. The President included another stop in the tour
7:14
that will start tomorrow and will also include and hit them with the will include
7:17
lego non nimo time va has two. It would include in the descent to
7:20
Ge seven of Italy. It' s okay with this kind of days that
7:24
if it' s okay now, to this day, it' s traveled
7:27
a month of six months, a month' s travel practically four stops in
7:31
the United States, a lot of self- promotion, a lot of entrepreneurs,
7:33
a few chief states. Now this sele qui this Ge seven is phenomenon.
7:38
Well I have it online from Uruguay. I had a good afternoon.
7:40
How' s it going, how' s it going, all right,
7:45
thank you for being there. Wu as always good. What balance is made
7:48
of the management of the presidential figure and the management of the President thousand the
7:53
two who betray the player does not listen. I do not say what balance
8:00
he draws public loppion according to his works, his studies six months from the
8:03
Mille administration in terms of his image, on the one hand, and obviously,
8:07
in terms of government management, we do not have a totally polarized public
8:16
opinion, polarized in these terms beyond the numbers. Not because the numbers don
8:18
' t. I' m handling forty- five percent of the approval and
8:22
fifty percent of that discharge the personal image of President. For the first time,
8:28
the negative balance has forty- seven positives, fifty- three negatives.
8:33
That is more or less the situation, with forty- six percent forty-
8:39
seven percent of the population maintaining expectations of things improving that by one- hundredth
8:45
and this is one- hundredth forty- seven. Yeah, I mean,
8:52
all the numbers go to Halla. Likewise, they all move between forty-
8:56
five and fifty points for President. But there is a process of polarization.
9:03
Even though before there were many people who said I don' t know,
9:07
I can answer us and now people are beginning to appear more, opponents,
9:13
genders. I don' t like what the President' s spinal government is
9:20
doing. And that makes that. That makes this polarization process that we'
9:28
re talking about now and these numbers let' s say see two or three
9:33
data. One is that this forty- five government discharge and forty- seven
9:39
and more President' s position. Yes, it is more skillful, it
9:43
is more expectation and hope than I necessarily support. And on the other hand,
9:48
that fifty disapproval of the management pardon fifty the potion of management and forty
9:54
- seven of fifty- three of one thousand forty, yes, fifty-
9:58
three appropriation of linen. What' s firmer. The government is sitting down,
10:05
it' s the one that' s testing. It' s the
10:09
government that' s saying. I have expectations of what I voted for and
10:16
before and this is the fault of the previous government. If you adjust economics
10:18
because you have to make all the sacrifices that you have to make, that
10:22
I think will be worth it and all the blame Alberto Fernández has more to
10:30
the caste, etc, that I hope that things will improve when one later
10:37
evaluates each of the policies of the government, exactly in the case of security
10:41
and fight against the trastic narco that is party in all the social and economic
10:46
policies have in balance negative. The country course itself has negative balance. That
10:58
' s why this is already part of the story. I run into a
11:03
businessman friend. What do you think of this? There' s my opinion.
11:07
Oh, you don' t tell me, but it used to be
11:11
deprivation because they all failed. Then I' m sorry. You asked everything
11:13
I tempted about this government. Then why are you talking about the other government?
11:18
That would be it. I' ll put it on my lik.
11:22
Okay. Yeah, I don' t really like what the President does,
11:26
but I think it' s bad. What a passion I have. I
11:28
like it. That is a little bit the image of the idea of an
11:35
adherent to the Government, which is a vision to say that faith of the
11:39
above. I don' t want the Peronism back in all this. You
11:46
have to understand one to try forward. Not that in Argentina no one is
11:52
accurate, minedie diego, because it is not something. No one said what
12:00
disappears to the State, that is, that the State gives me neither health,
12:03
nor education, nor security. The demand is for an efficient Extrado or
12:11
a deficient state with a social lie. Let' s say what would differentiate
12:16
someone today than yours my law, someone that your mass. They' re
12:20
both in Austria. It' s one was going to ask for a more
12:24
social look and the other is going to have one half a little more productive,
12:30
but nobody' s going to say no. No. This has to
12:31
be destroyed. That' s why it' s like turning to anarchism.
12:35
Not this and well, they also do civil war. It means that you
12:41
have to see how the president of the administration of the government is taking you
12:46
and get back to the age of where you are aiming, thinking that my
12:52
idea is that the government has air. I think it' s just something
12:58
that' s very dramatic in the economics. Now people keep their pockets how
13:09
much distractions affect the style. I don' t know in Europe it ran
13:15
more to the ultra right. So my lay capitalizes is that in theory it
13:18
already capitalizes people how much it really distracts. With this it is not worth
13:22
supmeracado and on that it evaluates the management of government. Let' s say
13:26
no, but let' s think about the following. Who voted the thirty
13:28
percent mile, which is what he owns, which is basically a sector of
13:31
young people thinking that he is, that the problem is not known that he
13:37
gave them, because Peronism was something here merism and ended up being equal to
13:41
social plans and lack of oral intention and lack of opportunities. And the pro
13:48
amos sector that if or gitate between find me this let' s say a
13:56
disclaimer that promotes investment and not the private now. But an important part of
14:01
the pro has been eating it. No, let' s say no,
14:05
no, no. That' s why he' s eating it as an
14:09
average in the investment process and as long as it' s towards the iamen
14:16
of Peronism. It' s both let' s say then, there are
14:20
two sectors. Let' s say electoral now the electrond of the prot is
14:26
also institutionalist, Republican. The basis of the young people who voted for it
14:31
not so much, then there is a mixture of reactions to the actions of
14:39
the Government. I believe that if there is little republicanism, attacks on the
14:46
press, this attacks on Parliament and then there are no achievements in terms of
14:56
international institutions. And the part of the proof to tell you is everything doesn
15:01
' t work and in the case of young people you have to see what
15:05
happens to their job insections. Then everything else is ideological, because let'
15:11
s say he won. What the Nazis have to give from a centre in
15:16
Germany with Millay. Looks like nothing. If Mileke is with Israel, finish
15:22
not letting that bequeath to leave Mondino or not because there was the ambassador of
15:28
Palestine. What do the protectionist and anti- immigrant governments of Europe have to
15:35
do with President Well, there' s nothing an anti- tras has to
15:46
do with it. Let' s say a promonopoly like the president with an
15:52
an policies I have a U S apolio. Nothing. So it seems to
15:56
me that there is a confusion between the forms and the background, but not
16:00
I do not think that the Argentine population is discussing that I ask. You
16:07
can make a division, something you said the electorate of the most institutional prob,
16:11
that of the most institutionalist, republican, that of the youth of my
16:14
laws a lot of young and male voters. Not so much, we can
16:17
make a sort of subdivision that some colleague of yours made me see in this
16:21
sense of the vote. The vote for my law was less pocket, more
16:25
institutional, more anti- quineristic, and the mass vote was much more pocket
16:30
- sized, much more economical. You can make that kind of split that
16:33
some colleague did pretty much coincide with that game when he loves the second round,
16:40
all the second round votes are for that he doesn' t win the
16:44
other one. I do not mean the votes in the first round, which
16:48
are the originals of each one of my neida, let us finish with the
16:56
caste and olaricemos and that of mass was I weep. We see that the
17:00
process of privatization does not come to the right, we will piss the state.
17:07
If we have social policies, they press a sandbox that comes to us
17:11
in Millay, then plus the forty- four that turns us doggonism was going
17:17
to fifty- six point and in this half of society less that it is
17:22
supporting the President of has the expectation not give a little bit of the typical
17:27
division Peronism antiperonism What happens is that it has been said that a part has
17:30
stolen from Peronism, especially in the youth. No, but one at least.
17:33
Perhaps he does not tie himself to youth, but from there up and
17:34
I partly go through youth, I see as a gorilism, antinerism, before
17:37
Peronism. Let' s say it' s my law or it' s
17:44
Álvaro, Alsogaray or Manrique, or I' m saying it' s for
17:48
the ones we' ve got in a few anitos or this macre. Let
17:48
' s say there. I' m not very surprised. I don'
17:49
t say to see. I mean, there' s an issue of anti
17:53
- peronism and anti- peronism. He' s a little stronger than that,
17:56
President. They' re better off with you. Yeah, that we
18:03
' ll be more than propinerism. Let' s say because there' s
18:07
a mix there, because let' s say in the government there' s
18:11
a Peronist, there' s an issue you need to talk to the antikine
18:12
himself. It' s good present. There you go. Let' s
18:22
say how all this evolves, because we have to see how it evolves.
18:23
Peronism and quinerism relate to alteronism and how everything that is going to evolve Doing
18:30
that, I say that the big question if it looks and does well,
18:34
it is clear I electorally, the country will grow, etcetera, etcetera.
18:41
I mean, the question is mine and he' s doing bad for society,
18:45
he' s going to go away. Everyone produces one o. That
18:48
' s always it. That' s always no. As long as the
18:53
government is doing well, getting out of opposition dispossession is more difficult now if
18:57
the government starts out badly and people start looking the other way. But in
19:00
the meantime let' s say no look, no elections, they' re
19:03
looking at it so much. No, I mean if the government goes down
19:06
and people start to open their eyes more. Don' t be in front
19:08
of me. There are two sectors, let us say clearly, there is
19:15
a Peronism but Quignerism and a non- faced Peronism. That' s the
19:18
only ones. Which is what peronism not k is not that, but no.
19:25
Peronism falls, of course, in the end, in Cristina Keisner Peronism
19:29
does not fit. There is conceptually, there is no incarnateness of diligence.
19:34
Yes, of course concept Where Axel put it that if you don' t
19:41
put it in alquinerism, today I put it in quinerism tomorrow. I do
19:44
not know and speak from the point of view of public opinion. Yeah,
19:47
yeah. It' s okay in the public opinion that I do understand and
19:52
we won' t get out of there. Next year' s battle will
19:53
surely be with Peronism, as a great opposition force and there is no great
20:00
other third actor. Well, let' s see what happens if there'
20:06
s not a third actor where a sector of penonism is set up. Some
20:10
don' t fall any more, but they don' t like what they
20:17
' re doing. Yeah, and if at least other fronts. But it
20:23
must also be thought that the elections are then defined in the provinces. No,
20:29
then there we can get so many surprises, because beyond the national,
20:33
it also prunes quite the characters and candidates. Surprises in what way. Of
20:41
course, or it would seem that if you make a prene today, you
20:45
ask who' s going to vote for who almost thirty- eight calls you
20:48
Minal' s candidate. All right, but thirty- eight later you have
20:53
to put up the candidates. Yeah, well, after one looks on the
20:59
other side, there' s also a couple sum. The problem, let
21:03
' s say today, Miles would be the first minority. But the question
21:07
and I remember, when one worked in the provinces and he asked him to
21:12
vote whose candidate did not from Miley, and the candidate took as many votes
21:18
as the deputy Miley did not pass. José Pérez was trying, and the
21:25
people José Pérez didn' t want it. So that' s what I
21:30
say in a year' s time and said a century for Argentina. I
21:37
would like to remind you of my agreement that in another context, now,
21:42
if you are President, you have the resources too, that is to say,
21:48
voting for the government' s official candidate is easier. In that sense.
21:48
I always say the candidate has to have flesh. The candidates without a
21:53
doubt. If you put one candidate, you will not vote that without any
21:56
doubt, you present one of the pro with more force. Let' s
22:03
say this radical with more force and it says they support one part of Miley
22:06
' s city and others not so much, but it' s a long
22:08
way from here. I would like to recall that the Argentine society of the
22:12
homia to the presidents when it won him the most in two thousand seventeen of
22:18
the Argentine society gave them two years. Not that we all said there'
22:23
s already Macli passed four more years ago, it wasn' t. He
22:27
didn' t get past the question. It doesn' t make macre that
22:33
he had a better image than Milaky has, he had better approval than he
22:37
has at the moment. He wins a mid- term election and is not
22:44
president, he is not re- elected. And how much Argentine society is
22:47
going to put in Miley before electoral progress comes. We don' t know.
22:52
That' s why I say, it seems to me that these are
22:56
things that are clearer. That year, it' s not very difficult.
23:00
Yeah, I see. That' s very clear. That' s very
23:03
clear. And you here if lov puts it inside the side the Peronism k
23:08
beyond the gesture with this thumb made towers, etcetera, etcetera, the visits
23:15
of Kislov ah is a bulla sa there it seems to me that what there
23:21
is is an internal dispute between maximum ts Lope. It is clear that a
23:29
Kihiros who says that we must open up, we must open up to other
23:34
political forces, we must seek other alliances. Now that means I' m
23:40
gonna break up with Cristina. It' s not necessarily clear. Let'
23:44
s say no Carlos pro Cristina. We don' t know what Cristina thinks,
23:48
not really clear. That' s why then this I say kins Love,
23:52
it' s in process. He' s going to see the Pope
23:56
now. It' s a painting for him. It' s clearly Santa
24:00
Fe' s, tor et cetera. Then the pain. That makes it
24:06
happen. It' s a movement in politics. Sure, he' s
24:08
got a problem. It is in the province of Buenos Aires, which is
24:11
the place part of pinerismo. But, well, you' re gonna have
24:15
to go solve that situation. Well, that must be given as it evolves.
24:21
I don' t put anything on him. Let' s see we
24:25
' re defending total, total, total. Now how is it seen to
24:27
see this Kislov, that strong in came from Buenos Aires, that relión despite
24:30
the milleista ball on the other side, it is said, and that because
24:34
we were separated and we go together with the offspring we can take out the
24:37
province. Or what to gain or whatever it was, but I say how
24:38
you are that if we have seen in public opinion your image is forbidden at
24:45
most, as Christino of Cristina down, or that it begins to fall.
24:48
Wait, wait, wait, perepre if Miley starts to fall and that I
24:52
say to see Cristina, I think that I will no longer raise even with
24:56
a cherub, that Milay is put down, falls and if it can be
24:59
a figure of Contex pulsing with this opening and that I can come to fall
25:02
in love with that ten, fifteen or twenty that is in the middle,
25:04
it is the one that goes and comes that he wanted to take out Cristina,
25:07
because he wanted to take Macri and then he wanted to take the image
25:11
less Cristina and that if they are they give almost the same thing. A
25:14
little more fancied than if now what number we were of personal image. What
25:19
a number forty- two points of positive image. Well, about what I
25:25
have to forgive me, forgive me that' s national, national, yes,
25:30
well, but forgive me that, forgive me the interruptions. No,
25:33
that' s nothing else. And you tell me that Milake I' m
25:36
looking fine. He may be falling, but he' s very high.
25:37
It' s forty- seven, forty- two great number. No,
25:41
no, but it' s clear. Eat is the negative. No,
25:45
it' s negative. Yeah, almost reverse, I don' t remember.
25:49
Let' s look at it more or less like that. How much.
25:55
I don' t know if fifty- three is negative. The president
26:00
of three hundred and four more negative points, to say the question of how
26:04
he does to fall in love. Well, and this is the pe quen
26:07
la has to give you the province of falling in love. She can fall
26:11
in love, she can, I think she has to be young. It
26:17
has a future. As he says, he has to change the song,
26:22
not the lyrics and the song. If he can do that, why he
26:26
won' t be able to fall in love. I could do it quietly,
26:33
but that needs a clear opening to another or another preaching. Let'
26:44
s say now, let' s reflect a little bit and the two of
26:47
us are probably not older than you. We can be wrong. I don
26:48
' t see Cristina Fernández closed or making a strong internal bid against what we
26:52
did more makes her want to have her deputies whatever it was. I mean,
26:55
for example, closing his luston or closing something to a tower. I
27:00
mean, I think you' ll correct me. I don' t see
27:03
Cristina and I don' t have to go with pure. Let us make
27:06
no alliance at all, to defeat what we have now. I do not
27:08
see Cristina justly closed and beyond internal puge tensions. I said I think it
27:12
' s a possibility that if the candidate can do it. We are speaking
27:18
neoludo Argentina in all three years. But I say with a gun behind him,
27:21
as he wants, with some limits of Cristina Fernández and others if he
27:25
came to the case. But I say I don' t see Cristina and
27:26
Parradas. We don' t have to go with maximum or we don'
27:29
t have to go with pure. I don' t see her in that
27:30
game at all. I see it as realistic. The point is if society
27:33
sees it here, xylofus I see a pujaro, a clear tower that is
27:37
not known, then we have to see who complements who. I think this
27:45
is a game that is open so The theme is also how much leather backpack
27:48
in quotation marks can turn out. She' s hot on her back.
27:52
Now, yes, if we are now seeing silence with the information that is
27:57
handling us, we are seeing that the people of Cristi want to do an
28:02
act in San vicent on July 1. For the way and on the way.
28:06
I think it' s from the field that he' s doing an
28:08
act on the other side, he' s throwing it and taking over the
28:12
yew driving. Okay. There you have to see how Cristina solves sereo can
28:18
prose. Now it' s okay, if I want to see it quietly,
28:21
it' s good. The court is being marked, down cards until
28:22
the time comes for the decision or to play or to put effectively, in
28:26
the balance. Who' s got better, better on deck, let'
28:32
s say, but yeah, if he opens tensions, there' s that.
28:33
No one can deny it and I' m not saying or denying that,
28:36
obviously, or talking well that if I want to say it as yes,
28:40
what tensions are there now. If they solve it more or process it
28:42
more or less right now the problem, I repeat is a little embrace of
28:45
the bear of Cristina. No, but good. That' s why I
28:48
say it' s a whole subject that' s open. It' s
28:52
been a long time. I mean, it seems to me that the main
28:56
thing today is as I said, the but nema that what is the discourse
29:02
in journalism towards the future. The problem cannot continue to recite the strong protection
29:07
state and not realize that there is a state that will be failed and the
29:15
reasons because the state fails if it does not explain to us, it looks
29:18
there totally, totally. It' s good. Well, then there'
29:21
s something that theronism has to check out. The peronite does not totally reverse
29:25
it and is going to have the problem, but pure laughter can re-
29:32
emerge or a new national movement will arise, where Peronism is also, but
29:36
you do not go to the center. That' s it. I open
29:37
it, I don' t see it locked. You see it' s
29:44
hard for something to come up, and at least the parliamentarians that it comes
29:48
in, that there' s still a lot missing, that it' s
29:51
central and that it' s not Peronist. I say it has a preponderance,
29:52
that it is like the most important actor, that it has in front
29:56
of the current officialism. I don' t say no for sure, but
29:59
what happens in Cordoba, who will win to we don' t know,
30:02
not well, every province is a world? All right? Is it okay
30:03
if the province is a world? Then everything, out there, puts together
30:07
the provincial party, yes, the provincial liar, there' s going to
30:14
be something to look at. It' s okay. The great battle,
30:17
of course, is the province of l Aire. Total, total and good.
30:21
And that' s where we' re going to have the most clear
30:26
totality, the last salt I like to see where the best country ends,
30:30
where the olear ends. Where we present you neolarsua mos. Yes, we
30:34
or other issues, he' s not totally, totally, totally in agreement.
30:40
Last question and already gives you the stirrup, pro and pro and libertarians,
30:44
the two sides should first ally or should go for serpo sacamas And second,
30:51
what do you think will happen? First, what should be like political
30:53
advice and second, what do I intuit? What' s going to happen
30:56
way me. I think there' s a sector that' s going to
31:00
be that we' re not going to bulge. There are discussions there and
31:03
they are governments, they are part of the Government or not, they are
31:07
part of its Government. Yeah, yeah, so Patricia' s been defined
31:10
as part of the government. Mauritius defined as not. Yeah. Yeah.
31:14
I believe that Macrie believes that the gobitema has a management failure and that a
31:19
strong management change must be made with former officials and Patricia clearly that it is
31:26
already my law. Then you have to figure it out. So, with
31:32
which it would seem difficult that it will be. Together let' s say
31:37
well, there are those who say there' s going to be a negotiation,
31:40
there are pro people who say to Mira at the end you end up
31:45
negotiating and that the same macri was zapped seeing some Buckle, some fall,
31:48
some needs that starts having Millay call him and there you have. There'
31:51
s a deal with Macroupo Pa. That seems more difficult, but good can
31:56
happen. That' s what Maclen needs his party to exist as a functional
32:00
trans. Thank you, politics, well, there was a taste, as
32:06
always, thank you very much. They didn' t pass big hug uaime
32:10
here in construction plugar our columnist. We went from a prominent independent fan to
32:15
the other part of Ballane, Don outstanding Hn Charras and in others our collaborators
32:19
friends, Don Sergio de Piero, Sergio, Good afternoon, how are you
32:22
doing, How are you, Fernando, how are you? Good afternoon,
32:24
All right, well, growing up in the second international cup at stake.
32:28
Well, well, freedom isn' t the liberator who doesn' t give
32:32
them the leather, but it' s laudable anyway. I' m going
32:36
to those things. I' m going to start the hatred of Stone Seresco
32:37
and Chicana. Last year we played the liberators, what to remember, well,
32:42
but where did they get to and friend doesn' t matter like you,
32:45
we' re out of things. All right, all right. Well,
32:49
let' s just stick to the last thing we talked to Wime.
32:51
You heard something a little bit about the studio. In the end let'
32:55
s say we weren' t talking about internal dilemmas. First chatting like a
33:00
lot of people, I think that the opinion of many is within Peronism.
33:02
It' s good, now we' re measuring, not me, but
33:06
then, in the end this is going to end up closing behind Axel and
33:10
others in the maximum atsel fight that you don' t know exactly where Cristina
33:14
is playing with. My intuition is that that can happen and that Cristina will
33:17
also accept an opening, as Kislovs poses with the meeting with the pujaros,
33:22
a tower fact. I mean, she' s not going to be a
33:24
Cristina bound or closed to Quisnerism, but she' s going to have,
33:28
as she does today in the Senate with light. I' m company,
33:30
open the game and get a little bit closer, at least I' m
33:34
going to mark the court and win yours on lists and so on to play
33:37
a little bit in the new song that proposes that if it' s not
33:42
complicated electorally what look you have on that. Well, as you say,
33:45
this just started, yes, it' s still a long way off.
33:50
Perhaps if you look back on the strategies developed before. Well, in the
33:57
two presidentials, Cristina bet us on a construction that' s a closed narist.
34:01
He did not end up choosing, accepting to see Daniel sun and clearly
34:08
choosing Alberto Fernández. So the two times he had to decide on presidential candidatures,
34:15
he chose to look for Let' s say out of the nearest environment.
34:20
The first image is really the first. Let' s say sorry,
34:22
with which one would deduce if you would continue in this line in coherence between
34:29
quotation marks that and more before, what we have as officialism today is called
34:32
everything can fail and everything to the other side, I say it would be
34:37
called effectively, to continue in that line of opening or opening more than ever.
34:37
If you want to see it that way, it would seem so,
34:42
as we say well in the current context, by the very conduct of that
34:45
policy. Now let' s say no and that if it seems so,
34:49
move in a similar sense and there may now be some sort of nonsense,
34:55
but your opinions with towers, with pull with the rollor even shows it in
35:00
that strategy. And how much new song there can be. How much there
35:05
is of Cristina as a backpack of stones, as I say there it is
35:07
necessary to do a plural, national and popular construction towards the center and going
35:12
towards the center, center left. How much, in that sense runs the
35:15
risk that if you put it, we are flying, but well, talking
35:17
almost as if it were a coffee of a construction for the coming parliamentarians and
35:22
for the presidential in three years. How much Christian Fernández represents in stone backpack,
35:25
for this xsilo who wants to play a little bit, a new song,
35:29
open the game, have some allies, pro a little radical alias,
35:31
etcetera, etcetera. Yeah, even though here if he showed some moves,
35:37
let' s say no. I know how to put it ever. He
35:42
never showed any distant movements to Cristina Fernández, let' s say no.
35:45
No. No, it' s just that this implies some level of rupture.
35:51
It does not seem to me that attention must be paid to the capacities
35:54
or not in agreement that can be generated between Peronism and Radinsm and even to
36:00
a pro sector In particular, looking at the Congress of the Nation, the
36:07
agreement that achieved radicals and Peronists to vote the university financing law, well it
36:14
was against all that expectation that radicals would never vote with Peronism, with GN.
36:21
It happened with one subject, well, open the door, make it
36:23
happen with another not. Then that would be in July, let' s
36:28
say in Congress. It was not clear that it was dealt with in commissions
36:32
last week or the other week. It seems to me that I open the
36:36
door there to the fact that, well, the law of bases apparently would
36:42
not have voted. Let' s hope it happens tomorrow. There' s
36:44
a lot of inconclusive tomorrow, but it' s not that it' s
36:46
defined. It seems to me that he is still in a slow construction and
36:51
every actor will be watching. This will also depend on how the Government evolves.
36:54
Let' s say, the government is an endless question mark. Almost
37:00
everything he does, so it' s hard to know exactly how he can
37:05
impact the actors every month, governors, etcetera. Because it is not clear
37:08
to us what the Government is going to be. Well and I return to
37:13
the point Cristina Fernández, that in a construction, in an eventual or potential,
37:16
plural construction, part of a new song of kislov shares radiocalism or part
37:22
of the pro what it was. To what extent is the problem of having
37:25
Cristina de Fernández supporting it more passively as it happened with more in fact,
37:30
as a stone backpack, as being pointed out there is Cristina' s candidate,
37:35
etcetera, etcetera. Look, Cristina Fernández is gonna be there, that
37:40
' s the tip. It' s the one who' s going to
37:43
be, he' s not going to run from the political scene, he
37:45
' s going to continue to exercise his leadership, which will be smaller than
37:49
a sector what it was. But it' s going to be in fact
37:51
today. So that' s that giving it the data is that you'
37:52
re not going to run what' s going to happen with that' s
37:55
what we' re going to see over time. But she' s not
37:59
going to dilute her figure, let' s say, she can' t,
38:01
but get to preside over the party, which one, in general their
38:04
history, I haven' t seen, but well, it wouldn' t
38:07
seem. It doesn' t seem like a pardon, it wouldn' t
38:12
seem, but well, we' ll see what you do with that leading
38:15
role you have that for now is being more intense than what you thought was
38:17
going to happen. No, yes, yes, it intervenes quite daily.
38:22
He did say Wame. Now you heard it. I think it' s
38:28
just the end. I think you heard it. What is the discourse here,
38:30
I noticed no, what is the discourse of Peronism. It is the
38:32
future poses gog who is also a specialist in Peronism. With this state that
38:36
has failed every place s Millay. If he doesn' t check, he
38:39
' s gonna be in trouble. If you check, you can walk.
38:40
Let' s say it' s okay, Milake produced a hecatombe in the
38:46
opposition on its own, together for change and so on, we can'
38:51
t ask so much in such a short time if we want to look kindly
38:52
at the opposition. But I' m saying what you' re gonna tell
38:55
me there' s time, that this is so green. I mean,
38:58
but there' s a speech missing or there' s going to have to
39:01
be clearly a different speech, which if, for example, I speak,
39:06
we' re going to take back a bit of another song or part of
39:07
playing another song. I say the opposition speech, which is not just to
39:12
put on, which is not just to talk about facism or what was outside
39:15
my law that you believe that there is time missing. The problem seems to
39:22
me to be the difficulty of establishing a consistent opposition discourse in front of a
39:36
discourse such as that of Javier Miley, which breaks with almost the entire democratic
39:42
political tradition of Argentina in the sense that it is a discourse, on the
39:45
one hand, with irrational borders, say, with constructions that have nothing to
39:51
do with the plot. As a matter of fact, let' s say
39:52
I' m not going to do such a thing for someone else because Miley
40:00
has a relationship, that relationship does not appear and, on the other hand,
40:04
a very intolerant discourse, not towards the whole of the political, social,
40:09
economic, cultural actors So, what is the line to find an answer
40:12
to that discourse. Not well, now it has just triumphed in some parts
40:14
of Europe. We will see how it unfolds is not the same discourse.
40:17
I think you didn' t go to us I don' t remember that
40:21
I got something. Sea discourse LEPN the economic discourse of sea Lepen, has
40:25
nothing to do with Miley' s. It' s not a protectionist statist
40:30
discourse like trum let' s say. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
40:31
Sure, then, there' s one thing that' s still not
40:35
easy to find. Looks like the valet hole to me. Journalism was said
40:38
in that sense. What you have to do is promise. Like any political
40:43
party that has visions of power, it has to build two things. A
40:46
power building tool and a message of the future. They are not the two
40:52
things that are essential to achieve a government and in that obvious good, you
40:57
have to review your message of the future, because the last, the election.
41:00
No, Lees didn' t finish it. No, and only Miley
41:02
' s failure is not enough for you to talk about in a future option.
41:07
Not that' s more than clear. So I say it' s
41:13
a presto and very soon very little time passed. The damage that the Government
41:16
of my law is causing in many sectors is very profound. But politically that
41:22
doesn' t fit as fast as one would if a friend came, yours
41:30
another political scientist from Madrid. I don' t know about Madrid and asks
41:34
you and Sergio and Peronism, where I have to look at myself, I
41:37
guess here, if phobia, is the governor of forty percent of the promising
41:39
pattern Ebrosar, Where do I have to look at Peronism? If I want
41:43
to see a little future important actors. Well, the presences in Cristina'
41:46
s luvio that we believe, I think you' re going to share,
41:50
that I don' t know if she' s a candidate for the legislator
41:53
she' s coming in, but to President over there I don' t
41:55
think I' m saying what actors we have to look forward to. This
41:57
one I' m not just talking about presidential, but actors matter so much
42:00
within Peronism and mass inclusion in that game I still do. I think so.
42:07
You saw the theme of building a national leadership. It also has some
42:13
difficult to guess ribets. Let' s say there are leaderships like that of
42:17
Nestor Kinner, who appeared in very few hours with the Presidency of the Nation.
42:21
Let' s say it wasn' t in the middle of Menem'
42:24
s in the' 80s. Well, this isn' t serious. He
42:27
' s not gonna make it. Let' s say, no, I
42:30
mean by thinking with some governors that today they' re having a certain intention
42:37
to play in the national game. I don' t know about Governor Quintela
42:38
de la Rioja, for example. I repeat, I have no idea if
42:42
that' s going to be successful, but it' s meant to be
42:45
a very small province. And then one sees the case of Arzora with Córdoba,
42:49
in a province where Peronist Cordobecism can already be defined as a provincial party.
42:53
Practically how good it cost your predecessors a lot. In fact, they
42:59
could not settle on the national scene, neither the Sota nor Eretti. And
43:02
good because the Cordoba discourse is also a very anti- amba discourse that feeds
43:09
a lot on a speech that all the blame or that both is a vacuum
43:15
of resources and good. If you can cneres, the president can' t
43:17
have a speech like that with the region that has thirty- seven percent of
43:22
the registry. Then you have as true, as certain limits. I don
43:25
' t think those are the actors, obviously if you obviously mass it more
43:30
like that, but yes, I think that, as far as the will
43:35
was concerned, he' s a candidate for president. He didn' t
43:37
make a bad choice. He was three points away from winning. In the
43:38
first round. It has a political structure with some expansion in the national territory.
43:46
No, it doesn' t have the weight of having a governor like
43:50
Buenos Aires, as you have to say, but it has a weight there.
43:57
It was a very unexpected defeat, not in the previous days let'
44:00
s say, but if unexpected, losing to a candidate who emerged almost overnight
44:02
and that to Peronism leaves it a little. If you allow me the Turulate
44:08
expression, then beings still have a hard time thinking about how to reorder that
44:14
not. It may also happen that suddenly a figure emerges within the ruptured Peronism
44:19
that has nothing to do with it. This makes it more complicated, but
44:21
it can happen. Let' s say, I don' t say what
44:27
would be great I don' t know, I don' t know say
44:30
someone hadn' t thought of dra today thinking that it might arise to someone
44:38
who today is not present in the possibilities anymore in a dynamic that we reproduce
44:43
this breakout thing of using Millay. No. I think outsider would not do
44:45
well to the political structure periodism, because it is raising the bet of good.
44:49
Let' s keep making candidates overnight and that doesn' t end well.
44:54
It doesn' t usually end very well. Speaking of not ending well.
45:00
We took the picture six months from Miley management. Let' s look
45:04
forward to seeing it obvious, value it backwards and or a little while ago
45:06
what I thought be the listener. I think also how you look at the
45:08
movie forward and grab this doesn' t end well. Let' s say
45:13
he hooks up, hooks us up. You think the expectation will continue to
45:16
prevail more than the support, although good a bit of support, but I
45:20
say the expectation and the vote, responding to the vote that made half of
45:22
the country, more than half of the country, how you see the next
45:25
six months is going to be treated a little bit original to see back,
45:29
forward, how in the next six months for putting a period or Look a
45:32
little bit more Miley, Let' s say, Look, there is a
45:37
political merit of my law, which is put a lot of story and epic
45:45
to its management of government, which is a little unusual. Let' s
45:46
say no, well, generism, we get tired of hearing storytelling and epic
45:50
everything. We also had some of that stuff that got over it. He
45:52
matched them. But I' m saying it' s not right, but
45:55
it' s not. There was no adjustment of size, there was content.
45:58
All right, there was that, there wasn' t fair. It
46:00
' s okay, or wages didn' t fall this way. In that
46:05
sense. It' s a meritorious one. Let' s say no,
46:07
because well, it compensates the material basis with this discursive question forward. Well,
46:19
as always, it' s hard to know what' s going to
46:22
happen for the future has those things, but the truth that costs a little
46:29
thinking good, look what the President said today is Tuesday there the same not
46:32
tweeting about wages that had had a rebound. Well, yeah, they horded
46:37
three hours before they lied, let' s just say it wasn' t
46:38
true. It wasn' t like that. That alien nova measurement. It
46:44
is very difficult to think with a Monetary Fund that is challenging him to accompany
46:47
him. Let' s say they' re not so clear about where the
46:52
leverage is going to be so that the fall stops and a government begins that,
46:58
besides Fernando, has many operational problems, which is in sight, let
47:02
' s say, in many problems they don' t have people able,
47:08
obviously, to carry out big things and small things of the everyday by a
47:13
state is not a joke and what difference? What difference? Maccrino philosophically,
47:15
I mean in that sense he had brains. We can' t like ses,
47:20
but I had ges you had, I mean we can' t like
47:22
where the boat was going with the Seuts, but it had management, let
47:27
' s say what difference? Evidently, there was also a political experience,
47:31
in this case of state management, but perhaps there is an experience of handling
47:35
the most private thing and they paid the costs of that, of the bureaucracy,
47:37
etcetera. But, but that will be the differentiation that with Matrik we
47:42
liked, we liked there was a course and in this sense we do not
47:45
get caught. Let' s say the steering wheel and they don' t
47:50
even know where or how to take the boat to that destination they want.
47:52
And one of the ones I tell you seems to see in a lot of
47:57
public agencies is that they don' t disarm the agency without a lot of
48:00
idea of the agency' s work. If maqui macrie pardon, he also
48:04
generated many layoffs in the state had some higher level of say choosing where he
48:09
wanted to disarm taking care of the functioning of many areas. Now what you
48:15
see is that what you see and say it by known people who are inside
48:19
the public agencies, is that the agency is disarmed without an evaluation of why
48:22
that agency is disarmed. But let' s not deduce. But how much
48:27
this has the mole he says. I mean, but I beg you.
48:29
We' ll be two readings away. There' s no lack of management,
48:31
but it' s also like a destruction on purpose, power, I
48:35
say, or both. No, but I' m saying, but it
48:37
seems to me that' s going to complicate your management of the state.
48:39
That' s what happened to you. I understand that the food issue,
48:42
indeed, did not see a very high interest in preserving a care structure for
48:49
people who are in a more difficult situation. But the truth is, it
48:52
was an endless clumsiness. Let' s say no to the argument of that
48:55
is that the argument of that is that the ninety for quoting something like this
49:00
comes from water and so on from the allocations. It' s not about
49:01
the issue of caring for poverty the humblest with the food issue, I don
49:05
' t know what they tell you. I' m not saying that this
49:07
will be like the collateral and small part, although it has had a lot
49:12
of media impact, but they' re paying costs for that. But it
49:13
' s like the little part. We, in real terms, won the
49:15
huatch is the first thing they tell you, not that there you tend more
49:19
to the humblest, yes, no, but the one that the canteens are
49:22
complements, let' s say I work in the southern urban choir of Buenos
49:25
Aires. Yes, the dining rooms are a fundamental complement. The kids,
49:30
mostly those eaters and adults too, then that starting to falter is a problem.
49:37
The huache is good news that I have denied it increased, but it
49:42
covers a number of costs. But not all of them. No, I
49:45
say look general. It is a Government that does not have, in other
49:50
words, the resignation of fifty officials and the number of posts that have not
49:54
yet been filled. It is this one did not talk with a colleague who
50:00
came from a meeting with the functional of the province of Buenos Aires and came
50:06
from a meeting with officials of the province of Santa Fe through shared water basins.
50:10
There are people who gather to check on the cynical basins, future floods,
50:15
future droughts. There are people working to cost you that you don'
50:19
t see it and you have no idea that that happens. But this is
50:21
fundamental for a lot of things. If you neglect that impact, you don
50:23
' t have it today, you have it in five months, between eight
50:27
months you have a crisis for having taken care of that. Then that set
50:30
of abandonment that does the whole route, the videos, n i e of
50:35
everything, if it' s going to end up jumping on the tab,
50:38
I' d find you a lot more trouble than you can see. Today.
50:38
Let' s say it' s not like the ante that, unfortunately
50:42
the water. Unfortunately, that is going to happen. I mean, it
50:45
' s not like I' m running out of time for the future.
50:47
But if you don' t take care of the routes, well, there
50:51
' s gonna be an increase in accidents. No, no, it'
50:52
s not that that' s not going to happen then an East Government For
51:00
the same reason, the President' s neglect to be there now was alge
51:02
seven. But you can be traveling to anything that has nothing to do with
51:06
anything. That can' t not impact your internal policy and your foreign policy.
51:12
That has consequences. They will not be immediate, they will not be
51:15
direct, but those consequences exist. To drive again, to run a stage,
51:20
is to run a tremendously large company, then the impacts on the same
51:25
structure. It can make the impact not immediately visible, but it can be
51:28
seen shortly afterwards. Now, if we have this diagnosis, beyond the economic
51:31
one, the growth of poverty, unemployment, etc, etc, in a
51:37
scenario of relatively low context of that acceleration of inflation in the middle of recession,
51:42
plus all this that we are adding to what you say I just took
51:45
notes. The consequences will not be immediate or direct, but they will arrive.
51:49
I mean, if we have the scenario today, the consultation and we
51:52
see the holes that are being generated, you have to think that this then
51:57
I don' t say it' s going to talk in the air,
52:00
but I say it' s going to have a lot of problems to sustain
52:01
itself in terms of management and governance. Or Bernalia tomorrow and that would look
52:05
like it at once. Or people don' t know. Or people continue
52:09
with expectation, expectation that antichism or anti- macism. That' s still
52:16
permeating half a society or a little less. And that eats everything. Let
52:22
' s say I think there' s a group of voters about the first
52:25
round in particular, and surely some of the second that need to believe that
52:30
this is going to work, because other failures don' t want to.
52:31
Then you need to believe that this is somehow going to work. It seems
52:35
to me that some of that is going around and then, well, what
52:40
happens sometimes in the crises of a federal system like Argentine Argentina, the governors
52:45
and the intendents will be holding part of that crisis with the scarce resources they
52:52
have, but they will be doing that, they will be trying to sustain
52:55
that, which is a little the intention of the national government not to throw
52:59
the crisis down. I think it' s going that way. Let'
53:05
s say later, it' s a way of doing politics, that the
53:08
canons in which democracy was dissolved, even from those who had macrism, and
53:13
it establishes this war against the political system. Let' s just say it
53:22
raises my law that good one. I' d think it doesn' t
53:25
have much of a future, but we' ll see even more when I
53:31
get to pass the Senate- based bill tomorrow. You have to see what
53:32
it does with that, because it is a giant package that today is a
53:38
political reading. It' s just that he needs the law more like the
53:42
governance event, to prove that he won one, that he got a law,
53:45
although it' s not a lepo with a lot of rules, but
53:46
I say he got one. That is political success more than the law itself
53:49
to generate what the law could promote. We noticed at that point. I
53:53
' m not total. We must see why, I repeat, we say
53:58
what is to be seen, that is, it is a political success to
54:00
bring them out a law. Finally, now what do you do with all
54:04
that package, which is a huge package. Not things that affect everyday life
54:07
are the idea that a SME of people are not employees, but collaborators.
54:15
Changing the working system in Argentina is not my impact. It can be tremendously
54:21
good, Sergio, a taste as always. Thank you so much, Fernando.
54:25
It' s a hug, a big hug, Sergio. I want
54:28
to ask you for the political scientist. Here in plural construction. We'
54:30
re with Roffman, there in the cans, Don Juan, we have to
54:35
see him. Juan fired me with Rockman. It' s okay. We
54:37
go with Rockman, with the first audio of the two of each week of
54:38
Rocfman. Well, then let' s go with Rockman. We said good
54:43
- bye to Alejandro Roffman these last six minutes of the show. We meet
54:45
here tomorrow at four o' clock in the afternoon with Gustavo Ferrar el Golfo,
54:50
Ani Marcelo who goes before me with Rockman. One okay, yeah,
54:52
Juan Damelo okay yeah, well let' s go with Rockman till tomorrow.
54:54
Thank you, Juan Hello. How are Alejandro Roland in his usual weekly column.
55:10
In the first praa, I would like to refer to a very hot
55:15
topic. It does not have to do perhaps directly with the conjuncture, with
55:23
the economic and social trends, which are generally the ones I comment on,
55:30
and one with a global profile of the management of the current Government in relation
55:39
to the relations between society and the State. In the vision of the President,
55:49
the State is a criminal organization. He described it as such last year
55:58
and added in his interview with a television station in the United States last week
56:07
that for him the state is a robbery and that the then he hates the
56:19
textual state is as if there was a personality that had the name or position
56:30
of the state, with which there is a harsh ruthless confrontation, because he
56:39
considers it a group outside the law, in the first place, and,
56:46
in the second place, that he tries to intervene in the distribution of economic
56:57
resources among the inhabitants of a country and, therefore, must be definitely relegated
57:08
to zero and, moreover, hated. This is a very evident sign of
57:17
the President' s profile, the relationship between his objectives and those of what
57:27
they share with us and that then poses a relationship of hatred, not enmity
57:35
or theoretical questioning or impliric epirit, directly hatred. Hate leads to solutions that
57:45
can be calambitous, but it affects them and sometimes even says it smiling train.
57:57
So what to say about the State in Argentina is that it is an
58:07
organization that must be destroyed, but destroyed from within. That' s why
58:14
I said that he is like a mole, that a spy, an external
58:22
agent who smuggles into the functioning of the state and corrodes it from within,
58:31
is eliminating it, destroying from inside plural construction led by Fernando Maurito, by Radio trentopic