Latest / For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast / #218 - For Azeroth!: “Happy Father’s Day, Daddy D”

Transcript

#218 - For Azeroth!: “Happy Father’s Day, Daddy D” · For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast

• 0:06
  Victory for the Forsaken for Lord are on for the Kirin, Tor
• 0:13
  and Dario for calendar or gilneas us endure.
• 0:30
  For the alliance for Azeroth. This episode of for Azeroth, is
• 0:43
  brought to you by our wonderful patrons over at patreon.com
• 0:47
  fast. Phase will always be free, but
• 0:50
  if you enjoy the content, we produce consider becoming a
• 0:53
  patron at patreon.com slash Faz Hi and welcome to another
• 1:23
  episode of for Azeroth. I am Olivia, as always.
• 1:26
  I am joined by the illustrious True Villain Manny Manny.
• 1:31
  How is the World of Warcraft been treating you this week?
• 1:34
  Well, real life has been a little crazy.
• 1:38
  I know people in the Discord. Me of noticed, I haven't been
• 1:41
  posting as much and everything but things are settling down and
• 1:46
  I think good if if all the chaos had to happen I'm glad it
• 1:49
  happened this week. Honestly, it's been a pretty
• 1:53
  slow news week in terms of stuff coming into the game.
• 1:57
  We've had nine point two point, five out for a few weeks and we
• 2:00
  had even said on the last episode feels like we've
• 2:03
  explored through all of that season. 4 is on the horizon, but
• 2:08
  we haven't seen any sort of thing that's like.
• 2:11
  Oh, season 3 is coming to a close or anything like that.
• 2:14
  So we're still waiting on that. They are pushing new versions of
• 2:20
  the 9.2 52 the PTR, which means that they are still doing some
• 2:25
  testing on that. However, if there is any
• 2:27
  significant changes, obviously we would have seen the data
• 2:30
  miners bringing that to light, so it just seems more about
• 2:35
  stability more. About making sure everything
• 2:38
  runs smooth, then any, yeah, any kind of brand new content or
• 2:43
  significant changes. So what we're going to see in
• 2:45
  season 4 and we will be covering the stuff that Is coming in
• 2:51
  season 4 whence, we are close to that, but I guess the all people
• 2:59
  would be looking at right now, would be well, what about dragon
• 3:03
  fight? Are we getting any more news for
• 3:05
  dragonflight? And we've gotten the talents,
• 3:10
  but then again, your silence since then?
• 3:12
  Yeah, we get the two, we get the to talent trees and then nothing
• 3:16
  else. Yeah.
• 3:19
  It's, it's been, it's been slow. News in terms of dragon flight,
• 3:23
  like we had like the big announcement there was like a
• 3:26
  whole slew of interviews after the fact, which we covered as
• 3:29
  much as we could hear. But you know, there's a lot of
• 3:35
  in these interviews whenever they shotgun them like that,
• 3:38
  there is a lot of information that is just repeated.
• 3:42
  So going through each of those interviews and trying to find
• 3:47
  any ounce of new information that we can about the upcoming
• 3:50
  expansion. Ian was quite a lot and Then
• 3:57
  we've had virtually nothing since then, outside of just to
• 4:02
  talent trees, that weren't weren't even really
• 4:06
  interactable. Like we had, we had like a
• 4:10
  readout of what the tooltips were and wonderful people over
• 4:14
  at Wowhead and sites, like Mythic trap have made actual
• 4:21
  like interactable talent trees, you can go and play around with
• 4:25
  but nothing. Like that from blizzard.
• 4:27
  So it's kind of been a lot of speculation, a lot of, a lot of
• 4:32
  discourse around, what may be coming down the road in
• 4:39
  dragonflight granted that they're going to be changing.
• 4:43
  A lot of these, these Talent systems as they go through
• 4:46
  development, and as they get more, and more feedback on them,
• 4:50
  But we haven't really seen much else other than that.
• 4:54
  And so, like last week we talked a lot about Diablo Immortal and
• 5:01
  that's where the vast majority of the attention around.
• 5:06
  Activision Blizzard has been in the last couple of weeks because
• 5:09
  it's quite quite polarizing, but we didn't like last week or
• 5:15
  other this past week, in terms of Blizzard they had Big
• 5:20
  announcement for OverWatch to and that was a lot.
• 5:24
  But leave it to corporate to like rain on the parade.
• 5:29
  When all this like new stuff is coming out, they're announcing a
• 5:33
  new hero and a and they put that forward as well as all these
• 5:36
  details. Then corporate decides to put
• 5:39
  out their own little report, their own little news that, hey,
• 5:45
  they've investigated the horrible.
• 5:50
  Stuff that was happening at blizzard and they came to some
• 5:53
  conclusions. So yeah, Activision Blizzard put
• 6:02
  an SEC filing looking at the allegations and the report is
• 6:10
  that their senior Executives had responded in a timely manner and
• 6:16
  with integrity and Resolve to improve the workplace.
• 6:23
  And then they further go to say that while there are some
• 6:26
  substantiated in incidences of gender harassment, those
• 6:30
  unfortunate circumstances do not support the conclusion that
• 6:34
  Activision, senior leadership, or the board were made aware of
• 6:39
  and tolerated, gender harassment, or that.
• 6:43
  There were ever, there was ever a systematic issue with
• 6:48
  harassment discrimination. Ian or retaliation.
• 6:52
  And that statement is early in the report that they provide and
• 6:58
  the report is a summary of the investigation.
• 7:02
  Now I had said earlier that this is an SEC filing because this is
• 7:07
  in response to the SEC investigation where they should
• 7:13
  have properly notified shareholders.
• 7:17
  So that the shareholders would Being able to make informed
• 7:20
  decisions. This is the third filing.
• 7:23
  Remember, there is the EEOC that has been settled.
• 7:28
  There is the D, Fe H, which is currently being fought in the
• 7:33
  courts and the SEC, which is the federal one and that is dealing
• 7:39
  with their fiduciary duties and their responsibilities, to their
• 7:43
  shareholders. Not the underlying claims that
• 7:47
  brought this about. So they're saying that, no no,
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  they did their best that they didn't cover it up that there
• 7:54
  that the management was totally blameless.
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  And obviously, they don't need to address the other issues
• 8:05
  involved in this. Because it's not pertinent to
• 8:10
  this particular filing. So it's not that blizzard is
• 8:13
  saying or Activision Blizzard is saying that nothing bad
• 8:17
  happened. All they are basically throwing
• 8:21
  the lower ranks under the bus and saying, no.
• 8:24
  They never told us we didn't do. We weren't aware of it to any
• 8:27
  degree that it was so bad and we didn't we definitely didn't do
• 8:31
  anything to cover it up. And and, and retaliate against
• 8:35
  people who were bringing Bringing this forward, there's
• 8:39
  been several reports. We're up to and including Bobby
• 8:46
  kotick intervened on behalf. They did not respond to that in
• 8:51
  this report. It is just a general statement
• 8:55
  of their position and their findings.
• 8:58
  And of course, everybody who saw this media was like, oh yeah,
• 9:03
  you investigated yourself and found yourself to be innocent
• 9:08
  No, they were hired by their bosses to go investigate their
• 9:14
  bosses and without any cause to feel like they're their jobs
• 9:22
  would be threatened came to the totally unbiased conclusion that
• 9:26
  their bosses were perfectly perfectly innocent.
• 9:30
  Because they brought on a former high-ranking figure of the EEOC
• 9:39
  to give this report more clout. This is not just their own
• 9:44
  internal investigations team. They literally brought on a
• 9:47
  former head of the EEOC to help with this report.
• 9:53
  Yeah, specifically, they hired him, they gave him money to, to
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  do this in. Say to conduct this
• 10:01
  investigation and come to this conclusion for them that there
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  was there was no knowledge of wrongdoing happening in their
• 10:11
  workplace which is not how this works.
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  Period. You do not get to.
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  If you're on trial for something, you do not get to
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  hire a investigator separate from whatever other
• 10:26
  investigations are going on to then come in and Absolve you,
• 10:32
  you don't get to do that. That's not how that's not how
• 10:35
  this is. That's how it that's.
• 10:36
  That's exactly how this worked. It is, of course, a non-binding
• 10:41
  internal investigation that they can point to and say, hey there
• 10:46
  are investigations showed that it wasn't there.
• 10:48
  The findings themselves could be reviewed.
• 10:51
  If in terms of Discovery, right, this is not the be-all end-all.
• 10:56
  This is more PR stunt than anything else, really?
• 10:59
  Yeah. To the point of it being a PR
• 11:03
  thing, the report spends in absorbent amount of time talking
• 11:08
  about the actions that a BK has taken to better the workplace
• 11:15
  situation. Of course, there is no time
• 11:17
  lines on this and if you look at the the details that are in our
• 11:21
  show notes and look to see when they did it, you will often find
• 11:26
  that the dates for this are going to be 2021.
• 11:30
  In 2022, after the investigations, were well
• 11:36
  underway and they were heading towards courts, and those
• 11:40
  lawsuits being launched. This is not them over time,
• 11:44
  constantly being like, we're going to improve, we're going to
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  improve, this is them responding to the suits coming through and
• 11:52
  honestly, I can't see that as good faith in my opinion.
• 11:59
  Yeah, it is basically, they got caught.
• 12:03
  They got caught with their, for lack of a better phrase.
• 12:09
  They got caught with their pants down and are like scrambling to
• 12:14
  get their their pants pulled back up to avoid embarrassment,
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  but the embarrassments already there, in my opinion.
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  Like it's, it's just not a good look to pay someone to come in
• 12:28
  doing it. Sedation on your dime.
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  Because no matter, no matter how detached that person that you're
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  bringing in to do this investigation or to do an
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  investigation like this is there is a bias.
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  There is an inherent bias in being brought on and paid to do
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  an investigation. For someone because then it
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  becomes your job too. Make sure that the person that's
• 13:01
  paying you is satisfied with the results that you find well.
• 13:04
  And again that's specifically how this is formulated.
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  It is not saying that harassment discrimination.
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  All of those things did not happen.
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  It is not even saying that some level of management caused
• 13:21
  issues or that they weren't helped by some level of
• 13:27
  management. It's simply Here's the senior
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  level of management from being involved with it, covering it up
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  or not working as best as they could to resolve this once they
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  became aware, right? So it's very narrow in who it's
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  protecting and what it's covering it again, it
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  acknowledges that incidents happened.
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  It doesn't say how many, right? It doesn't even qualify them.
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  It's like yes, incidents happened.
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  We're not going to say a lot of instance, when I can say little
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  incidents, we're not going to say major incidents, when I can
• 14:06
  see minor incidents were just going to say incidents happened.
• 14:11
  Then pushing past that the senior, the CEO group, the
• 14:16
  chief, executive group, the chief officer group, they
• 14:21
  weren't involved in any of the that dirty stuff.
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  Even if it is proven later that it happened at lower levels,
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  right? The board.
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  They, they, they did the best that they could.
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  The sea is the c-suite? They did the best that they
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  could. And it doesn't actually address
• 14:40
  even claims that were made specific against specific
• 14:45
  individuals. Like I said, but with Bobby
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  kotick? Right is very narrow in its up
• 14:50
  its defense. So this is kind of like a
• 14:54
  Defense lawyer that comes in, right?
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  You can have a bunch of people who are quote, unquote Witnesses
• 15:01
  against you and it's like, oh yeah, like those guys, they did
• 15:04
  bad things, but you don't have a trail that connects my client to
• 15:08
  it. And that's, that's how I put
• 15:10
  this forward. I do really want to tell people
• 15:13
  that this is not saying that this is not Activision Blizzard.
• 15:17
  Once again, changing it's a it's a tune and saying that like oh
• 15:21
  these claims are unsubstantiated.
• 15:22
  It's them. hurrying their defense to protect a very select
• 15:28
  a bunch of people to even that even that boggles my mind
• 15:32
  because if your if you're in the c-suite of a company that there
• 15:38
  is rampant and noted documented well-publicized harassment going
• 15:48
  on at your company and you have no idea until the news story
• 15:53
  start coming out and then the subsequent Court action is taken
• 15:59
  against you and your company that is gross.
• 16:03
  Incompetence. Should be replaced from the
• 16:07
  board for not having the wherewithal to be able to look
• 16:13
  in your own company and see these things happening.
• 16:16
  I honestly, why do you think that Jabs not there anymore.
• 16:21
  Those are people who take the fall for this sort of stuff.
• 16:24
  It's just, it is just corporate positioning.
• 16:29
  You can be far enough away. To not take responsibility but
• 16:35
  close enough to reap the profits.
• 16:37
  Regardless, there is some better news because we also saw that
• 16:44
  Microsoft has in entered into a labor neutrality agreement with
• 16:49
  the CWA. And this means that when if the
• 16:54
  Microsoft takeover happens, the merger that Microsoft will
• 17:00
  respect. The unionization of the
• 17:05
  employees at Raven and this particular agreement covers, all
• 17:12
  of Blizzard Entertainment, Activision Blizzard and it
• 17:19
  consists of five. Provisions.
• 17:22
  So, one provision is that Microsoft will take a neutral
• 17:25
  approach when employees covered by the agreement express
• 17:28
  interest in joining. A union to covered employees
• 17:32
  will be able to easily exercise their right to communicate with
• 17:36
  other employees and Union Representatives about union
• 17:39
  membership in a way that encourages information-sharing
• 17:44
  and avoids business. Disruptions Three employees will
• 17:50
  have access to an Innovative technology supported and
• 17:54
  streamlined process for choosing whether to join a union.
• 17:59
  For that employees can maintain confidentiality and privacy of
• 18:04
  that choice if they wish. And five, if a disagreement
• 18:11
  happens to arise between the CWA and Microsoft under the
• 18:16
  agreement, the two organizations will work together promptly to
• 18:20
  reach an agreement and we'll turn to an expedient arbitration
• 18:24
  process if they cannot. Now, all of this means that
• 18:29
  they're not going to block unionization, they're not,
• 18:33
  they're going to Be neutral in this.
• 18:36
  And this is very much in contrast with what a BK has been
• 18:40
  doing. We're in December, they
• 18:43
  specifically asked not to sign Union cards when those were
• 18:48
  going around in the wake of the two weeks unpaid leave right at
• 18:53
  Christmas. And hey, guess what your your
• 18:57
  staff members, your friends are getting fired which will
• 19:00
  completely make. You wonder about your own
• 19:03
  Security even if you weren't one of People who just got released.
• 19:07
  This is in contrast to the emails that were going around by
• 19:13
  what's-his-name Buffalo. That's okay.
• 19:17
  Somebody over a night where he strongly urged everyone to
• 19:23
  consider what would happen if a union came in and other
• 19:28
  Executives who said that it would hurt their ability to be
• 19:32
  creative and everybody would be negative of a union came in.
• 19:36
  So neutrality is where Companies are supposed to be they are
• 19:43
  supposed to of course respect the right and the choice to form
• 19:47
  a union but often there are captive audience meetings.
• 19:52
  There are lots of anti-union sentiment that is put forward
• 19:58
  and in fact, Activision Blizzard was determined by the National
• 20:05
  Labor Relations Board, to have threatened staff, and taken
• 20:10
  other illegal actions, to discourage unionization and
• 20:14
  Activision Blizzard. Now needs to face to face those
• 20:18
  claims, as well, Now, the report showing that Activision Blizzard
• 20:26
  resisted proposals to diversify their workplace, that's on
• 20:31
  record. That was actually a proposal
• 20:35
  that was brought forward by members of its shareholders and
• 20:39
  they said that it was unworkable and then two years later
• 20:43
  suddenly, they made it work Under Fire from various
• 20:47
  Industries rather various Governmental agencies.
• 20:52
  So yeah, it's one of those things where the language and
• 20:58
  the feasibility seems to change quite quickly and it is a matter
• 21:03
  of the pressure that is put to them, to make a better change to
• 21:07
  make. I don't want to say better ABK
• 21:11
  because that seems very on the nose, but there it is.
• 21:14
  Yeah, I mean, that's, there's a reason that the organization
• 21:17
  around all the collective bargaining efforts, At a b k is
• 21:22
  called a better ABK because they that is what they're striving
• 21:25
  for. They are striving for a place
• 21:27
  where the workers of Activision Blizzard do not have to fear
• 21:32
  They're do not have to fear retaliation for standing up for
• 21:37
  themselves. Well, as things move forward,
• 21:42
  hopefully things will get better just uh, full disclosure.
• 21:48
  We recently had the lead or former CEO of Warcraft radio,
• 21:58
  step away from the company to take a position with blizzard F,
• 22:02
  we wish you the best in your new position but of course, for
• 22:07
  Azeroth stays independent from that and will continue to do so,
• 22:12
  With that said, let's talk a little bit more about the game
• 22:15
  because the other controversy was due to Wrath of the Lich
• 22:22
  King. Servers tell me about this.
• 22:24
  Yeah so Chi bags hit the blizzard forums earlier this
• 22:29
  week and made a announcement to to the joy of many people within
• 22:39
  the Wrath or not the Wrath class but just the Classic Our
• 22:41
  community in general myself, included that they are starting
• 22:45
  fresh servers for Wrath of the Lich King.
• 22:48
  Everyone was excited about this. Everyone was just like, yes.
• 22:51
  Yes. Please give me more.
• 22:53
  We need these. This is such a good thing for
• 22:57
  several reasons. Chief among them being that
• 23:03
  there is still an ongoing bot issue within the classic Realms.
• 23:09
  Even in the even in the like the the season of Mastery, like
• 23:15
  vanilla classic Rome's, there's still also a bot problem.
• 23:19
  There rampant by problem, both there and in burning Crusade
• 23:23
  servers, where you can't go anywhere without seeing just The
• 23:29
  entirety of trade chat or local chat.
• 23:31
  Just completely filled with gold selling spam and like just
• 23:36
  various various spam from Bots that that used to be like a
• 23:42
  Hallmark of MMOs that has kind of like gone by the wayside.
• 23:45
  Like, I don't know, really like the last time like I guess the
• 23:51
  last time in in retail well, that we had a lot of that was
• 23:57
  around the the boosting Services.
• 24:00
  So like the the Mythic plus key boosting services or the the
• 24:05
  Mythic raid boosting services that were being sold, which a
• 24:12
  lot of that has been dealt with within live.
• 24:15
  We have over the last couple of months that has really just not
• 24:20
  been that big of a thing to deal with anymore, but it's still
• 24:24
  very much, a huge issue in the classic Realms and this is
• 24:30
  Obviously, there are other reasons other than dealing with
• 24:33
  the bot issues for why they are making these servers.
• 24:37
  They are, you know, there's a lot of people that that, you
• 24:41
  know, when you have the server's up for several years because
• 24:43
  there's on every single one of these burning Crusade servers,
• 24:49
  they are carried over from, you know, the the previous vanilla
• 24:52
  servers where there were a lot of people that were able to
• 24:55
  amass a lot of wealth. It is very difficult in some
• 24:58
  servers. To be able to break into the
• 25:01
  economy and be able to make any amount of Gold without
• 25:04
  tremendous effort, or just extreme dumb luck.
• 25:08
  And a lot of people feel the need to To do, you know, do you
• 25:14
  know, unhealthy things in in the game in order to be able to keep
• 25:19
  up and to be able to afford stuff like your epic flight?
• 25:23
  Or, you know, if you're one of the the brave few that want to
• 25:27
  go and farm out, the nether Drake's and all that.
• 25:31
  Like, all of that takes a lot of gold like a real huge amount of
• 25:37
  gold. And A lot of people are rather
• 25:41
  just turned off by it because the prospect of going in farming
• 25:45
  Elemental Motes is a little bit too much for them, but that
• 25:50
  being said, this is a chance for people to come in, get a fresh
• 25:55
  start on a server that there is no immediate economy.
• 26:00
  It's a it is a economy that gets to start from from the very
• 26:04
  beginning. They're going to be people that
• 26:06
  are like you're basically you know, starting On equal footing
• 26:10
  with everyone else. Then after the announcement was
• 26:15
  made of couple hours later, people started noting that part
• 26:19
  of this post was that Quebec said that there was going to be
• 26:24
  a at least 90 days prohibition on transfers to, and from the
• 26:31
  servers. and people started getting real upset about this,
• 26:37
  because everything that I just said, as soon as they open up
• 26:41
  the floodgates, to let people transfer to and from these
• 26:44
  servers that completely ruins, the entire purpose of having the
• 26:50
  server's made in the first place, where people want a
• 26:54
  unique experience, they want a, an experience where they get to
• 26:59
  come in on a ground level, at the same level of everyone,
• 27:02
  where there aren't going to be People coming in with thousands
• 27:05
  upon thousands, hundreds of thousands of gold under these
• 27:08
  servers and be able to you know participate in a much more
• 27:13
  healthy environment for themselves.
• 27:17
  So that vet started getting dissected and spun up this
• 27:21
  entire dialogue around. All of this sparked, a huge
• 27:25
  controversy where a lot of the the blue posters Came under Fire
• 27:32
  for for this and and rightfully so because as soon as you as
• 27:38
  soon as you do open up transfers, you open up, things
• 27:40
  like Bots coming in from other Realms like already established
• 27:44
  Bots like transferring over, or you open up.
• 27:48
  People just bringing hundreds of thousands of gold into the
• 27:51
  server. So there's there's a lot to look
• 27:54
  at with with regard to the servers in particular and that
• 27:59
  dialogue is already started back. there was another post
• 28:02
  made by a gerund later on in the week where they pointed out that
• 28:09
  in the initial post that said at least 90 days, meaning that they
• 28:13
  are going to be monitoring these servers and monitoring the
• 28:17
  health of these servers in order to make sure that that they are
• 28:23
  healthy, that they are healthy servers with Healthy
• 28:26
  Communities. That there isn't, you know, like
• 28:30
  one one faction is just completely dominating the other
• 28:32
  faction which tends to happen on these servers like this.
• 28:37
  And is another issue that is, is being faced amongst everyone in
• 28:42
  the, in the classic community. So, that's, that's where they
• 28:47
  stand. They have come out and said
• 28:49
  they're going to be monitoring the server.
• 28:52
  And the 90-day limit is just to make sure that there isn't any
• 28:59
  interference within the first 90 days.
• 29:00
  And then after that, 90 days is up, they'll start looking or
• 29:04
  well, they're not going to start looking at 90 days, but they'll
• 29:06
  have been monitoring things. And at the 90-day Mark, they'll
• 29:10
  be able to make decisions based on what they're what they're
• 29:14
  seeing on the servers as to whether or not, they think it
• 29:16
  would be a good idea to open up transfers.
• 29:19
  So there is a lot to be discussed there.
• 29:22
  I think one of the more important things that needs to
• 29:24
  be needs to be discussed, is not whether or not, they should open
• 29:28
  up transfers. I think, at some point with the
• 29:31
  health of any server, it is a good idea, to, to monitor server
• 29:36
  health, and make sure that these communities are thriving, okay?
• 29:41
  So, I have a couple of questions because I'm not on the pulse of
• 29:45
  classic discourse, sure? So then, What's the gold cap on
• 29:52
  transferring that? I don't know.
• 29:55
  I think it's similar to where it was back in the day, so it may
• 29:59
  be around 100,000, okay? But I'm not sure when were
• 30:05
  talking about, like, these classic servers and
• 30:07
  accomplishments in them. They happen at record speeds.
• 30:11
  Like, oh, we opened up the aisle of kalfus and within 56 minutes,
• 30:18
  you're the raid is Is cleared out, right?
• 30:21
  People are defeating things and clearing through this stuff at
• 30:24
  an alarming rate. So, in that world, I know that
• 30:31
  most of the establish servers are going to happen at have that
• 30:34
  happened incredibly quickly. The new servers, of course,
• 30:37
  you'll need to level up and that will take a little bit more
• 30:41
  time, but I still expect that a lot of the most aggressive
• 30:46
  players on these fresh servers will have the content done.
• 30:52
  Far quicker than 90 days. Oh, absolutely.
• 30:56
  Yeah. Like, even though these four
• 30:58
  servers, I think that there's going to be a problem, Probably
• 31:00
  probably within like the first week there will be people
• 31:03
  clearing the the first raid and those people are the more likely
• 31:09
  people to take advantage of the gold that can be farmed by Bots
• 31:14
  and and put into the economies and such.
• 31:19
  So then what remains after the 90 days or people who were not
• 31:25
  that Cutthroat to begin with? Or started later perhaps.
• 31:30
  So would it right? And then they didn't say that
• 31:36
  when they open up a server for transfers they're going to open
• 31:40
  it up to Transfers from any server, could it be much like
• 31:45
  they're doing with the server mergers where they're like, oh,
• 31:47
  here's an alliance heavy one here to hoard, heavy one.
• 31:50
  If you want to bring Alliance characters into this horde heavy
• 31:54
  server, you could or Horde characters over this line of
• 31:57
  heavy, servers will allow those those servers to trade in
• 32:01
  between, I think there's like, ways of doing or offering
• 32:05
  transfers that are not opening it up to every server and every
• 32:10
  possible. Source of these quote-unquote
• 32:13
  Bots. Yeah, I think I think the the
• 32:17
  smart thing to do is to both take that that way of
• 32:23
  approaching it of like, looking at like syrup population between
• 32:27
  the two factions and, and opening it up that way.
• 32:31
  And also keeping it kind of similar to how how they are P,
• 32:35
  Rome's work in live retail where you can transfer or well, I
• 32:38
  mean, back in the day you can transfer between RP realms.
• 32:42
  Freely. But they are P Realms couldn't
• 32:43
  really transfer between the rest of the Realms because they
• 32:47
  wanted those characters like those, those communities to be
• 32:51
  kind of separated out and to feel more more close-knit
• 32:59
  because you're dealing with, you know, less people.
• 33:04
  And so that's that's another way that they could go about.
• 33:07
  It is limiting these servers to be able to like to move around
• 33:12
  within themselves. I would imagine that if there is
• 33:16
  just like a clear dominant server of the ones that they do
• 33:21
  spin up for this, that, that will be one that remains
• 33:23
  untouched. And then then, then they look at
• 33:25
  the other servers that there are that there are less populated
• 33:32
  Realms that they are going to start looking.
• 33:34
  It consolidating those at some point, like they've already,
• 33:38
  they've already started. Consolidating, these lower
• 33:40
  population Realms within the Realms that exist within PBC.
• 33:43
  Like they started that a couple weeks ago where they started
• 33:46
  looking at it, wrong populations and have started combining, I
• 33:50
  think they combined like eight servers and total so far, and
• 33:55
  we'll continue to monitor those throughout.
• 33:59
  So, this is, I think that they did that, in order to kind of
• 34:03
  like, make Room for for these Fresh Start servers that are
• 34:07
  coming up within within the server infrastructure.
• 34:10
  So that they had, they had the, you know, physical disk space to
• 34:13
  be able to offer this to players at least.
• 34:18
  That's the way it looks like I do.
• 34:20
  Obviously, I don't know exactly if that's the, the rationale
• 34:23
  behind it. But for me, that makes logical
• 34:26
  sense that they would do that. I'm like, yeah, ever engineer.
• 34:29
  So I'm going to leave that one alone I think.
• 34:32
  Yeah, there are obviously different things that they
• 34:34
  Considering in terms of server population that and obviously
• 34:38
  three months is a good amount of time to consider the general
• 34:42
  Trends in a server and what it may or may not need, you can
• 34:46
  have those servers where influencers streamers or
• 34:51
  whatever all Converge on a particular streamer.
• 34:55
  Like, we had with the initial vanilla, that'll be an explosive
• 34:59
  server, but eventually, those streamers move on to other
• 35:01
  content and that server needs help.
• 35:04
  Help afterwards or is needs people to get off of that server
• 35:09
  even still. So, yeah, those different
• 35:12
  fluctuations should be considered.
• 35:14
  I don't, I think that fresh server would be different than a
• 35:19
  pure server. I think a pure server would be
• 35:21
  something where it's like this is locked in and it'll stays
• 35:24
  isolated from anywhere else and there's nothing to stop them
• 35:28
  from saying. Yeah, this server is doing just
• 35:31
  fine doesn't need any help and therefore doesn't To be exposed
• 35:35
  to the risk of bots, but those players who or those entities
• 35:41
  that create bots, of course, they're going to create bots on
• 35:44
  the new server, even if they have to spin them up from, like
• 35:48
  from scratch, those Bots didn't get transferred over from like
• 35:52
  the void into the old servers. So, just opening up transfers,
• 35:57
  doesn't, doesn't save you from Bots.
• 35:59
  It's just, I think it is. Players being a bit irrational.
• 36:04
  At this point, is what I'm going to say like the true.
• 36:07
  The fear of bots isn't purely from transfers and transfers is
• 36:13
  not like the, the end of the world, especially when they are
• 36:16
  being put off for such a long time in a game that has been
• 36:22
  shown to be. Moving at a highly accelerated
• 36:28
  rate. Mmm.
• 36:29
  No. Yeah.
• 36:30
  For sure. And I think, I think a lot of
• 36:34
  the fear around Bots being transferred to these to these,
• 36:39
  these fresh servers is that there's kind of like a
• 36:42
  survivorship bias with the Bots where if they like after, you
• 36:46
  know, after so long of being able to farm whatever they're
• 36:50
  doing, if they haven't been banned at that point, they're
• 36:52
  probably not going to get banned. and so you have you have
• 36:57
  these, these Bots makers that have these, you know, fleets of
• 37:03
  characters that they that they have access to that they can,
• 37:10
  they can kind of just do whatever they want with them
• 37:11
  because they're, they're like, unless they get reported
• 37:15
  individually, there's not really there's not really anything
• 37:20
  stopping them at this point because It like they have had
• 37:26
  waves of bands. They've gone through and like
• 37:30
  gathered up all of the user generated reports that have come
• 37:35
  in about suspicious activity on accounts and done like big
• 37:40
  massive band waves of bots. But you're making the assumption
• 37:44
  that there's like this thing where a bottle survive, one wave
• 37:48
  and therefore Will Survive the next wave in the next wave.
• 37:51
  It could be that a bot gets has banned right?
• 37:55
  Or bought doesn't get banned and then the next wave, enough
• 38:00
  evidence is built up to ban them because it's like there are
• 38:03
  always people who will make the claims of false negative report
• 38:07
  and actions being taken against their account when they haven't
• 38:11
  done anything wrong. And I see those constantly, I
• 38:14
  saw that like this week where someone who's, like, oh, I put
• 38:18
  up a harmless Post in in the group finder and I And for an is
• 38:24
  like, yeah, but you were you were advertising like yes, you
• 38:28
  weren't advertising for paid service but you were advertising
• 38:32
  for a service. So even though you felt it was
• 38:35
  in, it was fine. So many times it's like come
• 38:38
  join my group, and then you get the whisper being like, go to
• 38:40
  this website and we'll go and pay off for this sort of stuff.
• 38:44
  So they have to be careful about those things.
• 38:45
  They build the rules around. These things Bots, do get caught
• 38:49
  all the time and boss get created all the time.
• 38:53
  So, The Bots that that are being hit from an account, typically,
• 39:00
  they're not holding the money on themselves.
• 39:01
  They're sitting as part of a guild right and that Guild will
• 39:08
  then transfer the money around and that sort of stuff and the
• 39:12
  count will get suspended. That's fine because they'll take
• 39:16
  the guilt of the money out of the guild and then sell it off
• 39:18
  this stuff and it is, as you said 8 A Tale As Old As Time.
• 39:24
  Time that they're all environment around.
• 39:27
  So the survivorship bias and the issue with that is that the
• 39:32
  longer one of these accounts Remains the longer, these
• 39:37
  characters, remain active, and remain able to farm, the more
• 39:42
  gold that they are able to to amass.
• 39:44
  So the fear is that these these long-standing bought accounts
• 39:51
  have this gold, they have, you know, Several accounts that they
• 39:55
  can spread out all of their gold over.
• 39:58
  And then they have, you know, who knows how many accounts that
• 40:02
  they have access to that are at the the gold cap that they can
• 40:06
  then transfer gold and just keep transferring characters over and
• 40:10
  over with, with the gold transfer cap bringing all of
• 40:14
  this gold, gold makers and Bots. Don't hold the gold primarily on
• 40:19
  characters. They put it in Guilds guilds can
• 40:22
  hold way more gold and Under gets banned or an account gets
• 40:25
  banned. All that gold isn't lost.
• 40:29
  It's only when they're selling the gold.
• 40:31
  Do they take the gold onto a character?
• 40:35
  So if the bought quote-unquote gets banned but those characters
• 40:39
  can still be transferred to the servers and carry that gold over
• 40:43
  to the servers with them. That's what the issue.
• 40:45
  That's what that that character could be transferred whether
• 40:48
  it's a day old or 100 days old, right?
• 40:51
  It's still a bottle. How long it's been around?
• 40:54
  Around doesn't matter because the gold is coming from a guild
• 40:57
  that the Bots have access to that.
• 41:00
  The people have access to probably on account that they're
• 41:02
  not actively botting because that Shields them, right?
• 41:07
  Yeah. So the body count doesn't hold
• 41:09
  the gold. It puts it in a guild that is
• 41:12
  likely owned by by the same person on a different account
• 41:17
  that doesn't bought. So it doesn't get banned.
• 41:19
  Then when you ban the bot account, The Guild doesn't get
• 41:23
  punished, you can't. Make that initial leap.
• 41:25
  Unless you start Banning IPS mmm, which You Won't Do Right?
• 41:31
  Which is, they haven't done thus far and then they start up an
• 41:35
  account that maybe isn't even bahding.
• 41:39
  Take the goal transfer it over to the server, right?
• 41:42
  All that ill-gotten gold is going over to server whether the
• 41:45
  bought was banned after 100 days or every 10 days, 10 Bots were
• 41:50
  banned and they still amassed all that gold.
• 41:53
  Like, I guess that's, that's where that's where the pushback
• 41:57
  against even opening up transfers in the first place
• 42:00
  comes in. Because if, if they do open up
• 42:03
  transfers, it does allow people to flood these servers with gold
• 42:08
  and it do you know pretty massive upsets to the server
• 42:14
  economy whereas if they never turn on transfers from these
• 42:21
  established servers into these, these fresh servers, then any
• 42:28
  Bots that that spin up accounts on the servers are having to,
• 42:34
  you know, start from square one and grow, whatever reserves that
• 42:37
  they that they need to do whatever business that they're
• 42:40
  trying to do. They have to start from scratch
• 42:43
  to build it up so that would aren't on that server on day one
• 42:47
  because they start up a new thing and they don't need to
• 42:50
  live for a hundred days. They only live to 90 days and
• 42:52
  they've got all that that goal that they've been working again.
• 42:56
  Same thing where the bought works on an account.
• 42:59
  The Guild Master doesn't bought the Dozen bought with that
• 43:02
  account. It all goes into, it all goes
• 43:05
  into the guild. And the server the server is
• 43:09
  disrupted, especially if you're saying that some Bots survive
• 43:13
  these band waves over and over and over again.
• 43:15
  Then your own argument works against you where there will be
• 43:18
  these Bots that are surviving band wave after ban wave and
• 43:21
  disrupting the economy. It's just the, the further
• 43:27
  injection of more gold outside of what is able to be generated
• 43:31
  on the server that people are against.
• 43:33
  Yes, and in perfect servers, don't turn on the transfer.
• 43:37
  See if that is a If that is a large enough fear, if the server
• 43:41
  economy and health and batten faction, balance is totally
• 43:46
  fine. Then don't just, there's no
• 43:49
  reason to expose it to that risk.
• 43:51
  If yeah, the faction imbalance is bad and you have another
• 43:56
  server. That is a new server, where you
• 43:58
  can decide, okay? Both of these are low risk for
• 44:03
  spots because their economies are fine but both their server
• 44:07
  faction. Balance is off.
• 44:08
  Let's pair these up and you have a limited transfer, right?
• 44:12
  And each of those factors and risk factors can be decided,
• 44:16
  like they do this all the time. They've been doing it since
• 44:20
  vanilla and it seems very odd that the bot problem is so bad
• 44:24
  on classic servers versus live servers where these Bots have
• 44:28
  had years and decades to like build up so much gold.
• 44:33
  So like I feel like it's in the bias isn't Survival bias, but
• 44:39
  maybe with a perception bias on this one.
• 44:43
  But again, I I said at the top and I'll say it again, I don't
• 44:47
  know, classic that. Well, so maybe I'm off on this
• 44:50
  right in and tell us, guys, honestly, you can send your
• 44:52
  emails to for Azeroth either through our Twitter joining.
• 44:59
  The Discord or sending an email to phase podcast at gmail.com.
• 45:05
  Was there anything else you wanted to talk about this
• 45:07
  subject? Tecton.
• 45:09
  No, I'm just in a holding pattern until we get wrath beta.
• 45:17
  That I am, I am pretty excited about it.
• 45:19
  And then the less. I don't I don't understand the
• 45:24
  betas for these as much. I mean, I guess they're just
• 45:27
  short and betas to make sure you have stability.
• 45:31
  Yeah, in this one because they are making changes to it.
• 45:34
  I guess there's a little bit more reason for it yet because
• 45:36
  the server Is completely different from the server
• 45:40
  infrastructure from back in the day, like, they're basically
• 45:42
  superimposing the Wrath environment on to Modern
• 45:48
  servers. So that were able to use
• 45:50
  functionality, like Battle.net and a whole bunch of other
• 45:54
  stuff. Some some phasing technology
• 45:57
  that didn't exist Back in the Day, stuff like that.
• 46:00
  So that's, that's primarily what they're testing to make sure
• 46:03
  that nothing is broken in that regard.
• 46:06
  Well, with that said, Said I wanted to cover the last little
• 46:10
  bit of story that we got with nine point two point, five.
• 46:13
  And that is the final epilogue meeting between Sylvanas and
• 46:21
  anduin. So, this is the farewell little
• 46:24
  line cinematic that you get. When you go to or Bose and
• 46:28
  Toronto's bird is there and saying like, oh, I need to show
• 46:33
  you something and it's like, okay, and you get this vision
• 46:35
  and the vision is - toiling away at her task of claiming, every
• 46:41
  soul in the mall, reclaiming every soul in the mall so that
• 46:45
  they will escape that place. And until that day, which he has
• 46:49
  found and freed Every Soul. She is.
• 46:52
  Damned to the mall. so, the story of The entire expansion,
• 47:01
  the entire story of shadowlands has really result of revolved
• 47:04
  around three characters, the Jailer Sylvanas and anduin and
• 47:11
  the Jailer manipulated both Sylvanas and anduin.
• 47:14
  The Jailer is gone. Both of them are now on their
• 47:18
  own separate paths and their meeting again in the mall.
• 47:22
  So it is kind of this contrast between the two characters so
• 47:28
  vanes who Came, the jailers pain willingly is really contrasted
• 47:33
  against and Owen who held out all the way through and held
• 47:37
  onto hope and there was that the constant conversation of like
• 47:41
  you want me to go willingly because you gave up hope and you
• 47:44
  want me to justify your decision is how anduin post it to some
• 47:50
  honest. And then now they're on the
• 47:53
  other end of that they've both broken away from the Jailer and
• 47:58
  the juxtaposition is in full. Play in this cinematic.
• 48:01
  So now we're looking at them and Sylvanas has been banished to
• 48:05
  the ma she willingly and openly accepted that punishment and
• 48:10
  she's doing her job with like conviction.
• 48:13
  She has a renewed sense of self. Her soul has literally been
• 48:19
  restored back to it, a hole. That she didn't even realize it
• 48:25
  had been splintered for all these years, and she's accepted
• 48:31
  the acts that she made while her soul.
• 48:33
  Wish it was shattered. She made those actions.
• 48:38
  She accepts, she accepts what she did, and then we look at
• 48:42
  anduin and anduin is now. Utterly lost, he doesn't trust
• 48:50
  in himself. He doesn't have the slightest
• 48:53
  bit of conviction that he did going into this entire mess.
• 48:58
  I think it's like really great to see like that kind of depth
• 49:01
  and anduin. Absolutely.
• 49:04
  And it's amazing that they like they use this this sort of
• 49:08
  contrast, and they've sort of flipped the script on the two of
• 49:11
  them as well because while Savannah's was like no this is
• 49:14
  the way it is. And and it was like You actually
• 49:16
  don't believe that you're just sort of like you sort of little
• 49:19
  lost their. Now, it's and Owen who's like,
• 49:24
  ah like I want am I supposed to do like with it?
• 49:26
  I did these things in Solana says, like, you have to know the
• 49:30
  difference between what you did and what you were forced to do.
• 49:34
  And then there is that line where in just exasperation and
• 49:41
  wings, like I can't trust myself.
• 49:44
  Like, how am I supposed? Expect people to trust me.
• 49:48
  If I can't do, if I can't even trust myself.
• 49:51
  Sometimes this, why are you putting that weight on your
• 49:53
  shoulders? Why are you doing that to
• 49:55
  yourself? And anyone says, I don't have a
• 49:57
  choice, a king doesn't have a choice and that line right
• 50:01
  there. That's when Savannah says, like,
• 50:05
  I thought you believed in free will like you always have a
• 50:09
  choice. Everybody always has a choice.
• 50:11
  So, Vaughn is the saying I had a choice all the way through this
• 50:15
  and I made a lot of Wrong choices and anduin.
• 50:18
  You always have a choice. And that's, I think she kind of
• 50:23
  gets through to anyone a little bit because he, but like, he's
• 50:27
  just not in a place to hear it. Hes scoffs and he realizes that,
• 50:30
  she sort of, she sort of one this exchange and he said once
• 50:36
  again, it's like I don't know what to do.
• 50:38
  Like I can't I can't right now. I need time to think I if he
• 50:42
  needs time to ponder and he moves off.
• 50:46
  And Cervantes just says, farewell Little Lion as he as he
• 50:52
  goes off to wherever he's going next.
• 50:56
  But again it is just such this contrast between the two.
• 51:00
  So vanes is dedicated to a path that has been laid out for her
• 51:04
  by the by the people that she wronged.
• 51:07
  Meanwhile anduin is running from the people that want to welcome
• 51:11
  him home and is utterly lost more lost than he's ever been
• 51:14
  before. Yeah, you Just these people who
• 51:21
  both were rulers. Both had a kingdom.
• 51:23
  Both had followers and supporters.
• 51:26
  I'm not entirely. Sure, you can say, Sylvanas had
• 51:29
  friends and family, but she had something going on with with the
• 51:35
  Thanos. Yeah.
• 51:39
  Whatever you want to call that. Yeah.
• 51:41
  But right. She definitely had family her
• 51:45
  sisters that wanted. I wanted to see the best in her
• 51:49
  right at times, right? And all of them basically said,
• 51:55
  like, you've done all this wrong and she agrees with them, and
• 51:58
  she is. Now working towards atonement
• 52:01
  and Doin doesn't know, doesn't even know if he is supposed to
• 52:06
  atone for it. He was, he was collared and his
• 52:11
  movements word his own but he felt something while doing that.
• 52:16
  Isshin, right? Yeah, some sort of like Rush
• 52:21
  from those those horrible horrific actions and that's the
• 52:26
  guilt that he finds. Yeah.
• 52:27
  It's like he he says, specifically like what if I
• 52:31
  enjoyed that? What if I What if there was a
• 52:36
  part of me that enjoyed inflicting, that pain, that
• 52:41
  enjoyed doing a subjugation. Like, what if, what if that is
• 52:47
  something that that is part of who I am that?
• 52:50
  I didn't know was there before. I don't even think that he, it
• 52:56
  was a. What if he admits that there was
• 52:59
  part that the, yeah, but like, that there was something there
• 53:02
  and because that part is there, He's like well like I he doesn't
• 53:08
  even know who he is. If he could enjoy such things,
• 53:10
  such horrible things like, who easy, really?
• 53:14
  Like it is it is this scary thing and there has been all
• 53:19
  this talk about Shadow and Owen, like it was like a little bit
• 53:26
  foreshadowed in the pre expansion novel.
• 53:31
  There is a lot of question about like The balance between all
• 53:37
  these different forces, like can't shoot.
• 53:39
  And when be totally loyal to the light, or can you should you be
• 53:43
  loyal to any of these Powers, right?
• 53:46
  All of these powers are being shown to be flawed.
• 53:48
  We have the Winter Queen who is trying to do her best as saving,
• 53:56
  the souls of the people and Arden wailed, but then is making
• 54:00
  mistakes and on irrationally angry at Her sister.
• 54:06
  Who elune is the body is a goddess or embodiment of life
• 54:11
  and also made mistakes because she didn't know when she let
• 54:15
  those Souls die. That then we're being condemned
• 54:17
  to the mall, right? We have seen like a very
• 54:22
  totalitarian light that destroyed a you drain or and of
• 54:29
  course fell and Shadow that have shown multiple times that
• 54:33
  they're not really all that good.
• 54:35
  So at this point we're wondering about order.
• 54:40
  Is that the last one that seems to be still trying to be like,
• 54:44
  yeah, we're perfect, don't worry everything order good.
• 54:47
  Well, I think that's already kind of been addressed in some
• 54:50
  way because like we saw, like obviously we went to the
• 54:55
  pantheon, at the end of Legion, we saw the seat of the pantheon
• 55:00
  of the, the Titanic Pantheon and We saw that they are imperfect.
• 55:06
  We saw that they They made terrible decisions because they
• 55:12
  they created surgery office like they didn't.
• 55:16
  Yeah but like to Believers good until the fell got to him but it
• 55:22
  was he was he's not like look like the pantheon has always
• 55:27
  been shown as like good and orderly and we haven't seen them
• 55:35
  really do something that was like Like it would be better to
• 55:40
  show like Odin who is like again a tide in water, not like not
• 55:46
  one of the pantheon of order but like the set of the level below
• 55:51
  that and he's done some horrible things.
• 55:54
  Like hella has legitimate complaints, he fought with his,
• 55:59
  with his brothers, and was like, screw this.
• 56:01
  I'm taking my ball and going home and tore apart of old or
• 56:04
  out and then shipped it halfway around the world because he
• 56:06
  couldn't play nice with his Brothers and sisters.
• 56:09
  So like that is more order, not always being good but in terms
• 56:13
  of the pantheon themselves we haven't really seen that.
• 56:16
  It's not like sired and a theist who Happy Father's Day.
• 56:23
  Daddy was one of the people who one of the people who just like
• 56:32
  did poor decisions and was selfish and hurt his followers
• 56:37
  and caused all of Reverend, ref to fall into an anime drought
• 56:42
  that he didn't need to actually have happened.
• 56:44
  So like you have seen evil Shadow, right?
• 56:49
  You have seen evil or Shadow, make bad, it issues.
• 56:53
  You have seen all of the forces, really kind of do that and I
• 56:57
  would say that. Yeah, like again.
• 56:59
  Odin is a good one of order, not always being good for you, but I
• 57:04
  don't think we have seen the pantheon do that yet.
• 57:06
  And in fact up until a loon was shown not to be all-knowing.
• 57:12
  We haven't really seen life stumble that much.
• 57:15
  We are outside of like you're rolling over growth in a you
• 57:21
  drain or which was like threatening to take over
• 57:23
  everything. Yeah, well I feel like I need to
• 57:27
  defend my statement that the the the Titanic Pantheon created,
• 57:31
  sir, Jairus in that. Sir Jairus came to them with
• 57:38
  evidence that the old, the old gods are not the old gods but
• 57:42
  the was the old avoid was crapping planets and the void
• 57:48
  Lords and that they were they were corrupting the planets and
• 57:52
  that they needed to do something about it and he felt helpless
• 57:55
  about it, but he felt the need to do.
• 57:59
  To take action and they said, don't worry about it, which
• 58:03
  drove him to Insanity because he was ostracized for wanting to
• 58:09
  take action against against this perceived threat that ended up
• 58:13
  being a very large, massive threat.
• 58:16
  They didn't listen to him and he then started the burning Crusade
• 58:21
  as a result of that our socialization.
• 58:24
  So in that regard, that's why I'm saying that there.
• 58:29
  There is, there is textual evidence to support that.
• 58:33
  The the Titanic Pantheon isn't isn't nearly as perfect as yeah.
• 58:41
  Okay, I'll accept that one there.
• 58:43
  Yeah, okay but getting back to Savannah Sand getting back to
• 58:49
  anduin. We've put them in this place and
• 58:52
  this is a basically, a direct scene that follows the Sylvanas
• 58:58
  book. So it's the very last little
• 59:01
  line of that is literally anduin walking up to Sylvanas and we
• 59:05
  were left at that quasi. Yeah, Cliffhanger and this is
• 59:09
  the conversation that follows, but which in the book, we don't
• 59:13
  know this and do and it's just highly highly speculated that it
• 59:16
  was an doing and then like like literally three months later,
• 59:22
  Literally, three months later we get a cinematic and game that
• 59:24
  just picks up exactly where that left off.
• 59:26
  So so then the question is, where do you see these
• 59:29
  characters going from here? So, We're, what would you say
• 59:34
  for Sylvanas? Where do you see Cervantes going
• 59:37
  from here? Obviously Sylvanas.
• 59:39
  Just gonna be, you know, serving out her sentence in the mama,
• 59:46
  where she goes from there. After the sentence is completed,
• 59:50
  which could take any any number of years months, she could be
• 59:55
  really efficient at re-caulk about it.
• 59:57
  In terms of expansions, are you expecting her to sort of out
• 1:00:00
  this sentence and be back in ten?
• 1:00:04
  Or 11.0 or 12.0 like we're would you see her returning?
• 1:00:10
  Because like obviously this sentence thing is basically them
• 1:00:13
  shelving her for a time and obviously and when needing to go
• 1:00:17
  and think about things is them shelving and went for a time so
• 1:00:21
  they're both being shelved. Yeah, when would you expect to
• 1:00:23
  see them come back and learn what kind of capacity not for at
• 1:00:28
  least two expansions like I don't expect to see see either
• 1:00:33
  of those characters and dragonflight in any form at all,
• 1:00:37
  like maybe Whispers of anduin and what anyone's doing
• 1:00:40
  depending on, if they do anything to further, the the
• 1:00:46
  kind of Alliance leadership storyline within the
• 1:00:49
  dragonflight expansion, which I do expect, you know, there to be
• 1:00:52
  some level of that where, you know, turalyon and again, and in
• 1:00:59
  Toronto and malfurion and all of the Your ship within the
• 1:01:04
  alliance. Is going to be going to be
• 1:01:08
  hurting because they are without their figurehead now because
• 1:01:13
  he's doing whatever. He wants, whatever he needs to
• 1:01:16
  do to get his head back on straight and maybe maybe won't
• 1:01:21
  get his head back on straight, who knows?
• 1:01:23
  But regardless I think that he may be indirectly involved but
• 1:01:29
  not directly involved in the events of dragon flight and I
• 1:01:33
  certainly don't think that Sylvanas is it Be back for
• 1:01:36
  dragonflight, I think these are two characters that they are
• 1:01:41
  like in Sylvanas this case. I think that they're, they're
• 1:01:44
  holding on to her until like, the, the big Cosmic disco War
• 1:01:48
  happens. Very much, very, very much
• 1:01:53
  keeping her waiting in the wings, for a much bigger threat
• 1:02:00
  to come down down the pipeline. But, and when I think that there
• 1:02:04
  is, there is is more of a reason to bring him back for something,
• 1:02:10
  even if it's just to bring him back to say, I'm not King
• 1:02:14
  anymore. I don't want this anymore.
• 1:02:16
  It's this isn't my character this isn't me.
• 1:02:18
  I'm gonna go off with I'm gonna go off with villain and we're
• 1:02:22
  gonna go travel around the star system and try to learn more
• 1:02:25
  about the cosmos. I think that that's much more
• 1:02:28
  likely for much more likely of a path for him to go down, rather
• 1:02:34
  than him coming back and being being the, you know, the
• 1:02:39
  variance. Tandon that he met It may or may
• 1:02:43
  not have felt the pressure to be in the absence of his father.
• 1:02:48
  And there there's probably going to be like a huge Reckoning
• 1:02:53
  within the alliance just like there has been a massive
• 1:02:56
  Reckoning within the horde. Now that the horde doesn't have
• 1:02:59
  a singular Figure Head. I think that the alliance
• 1:03:03
  heading in the same direction what I want and what I think
• 1:03:06
  they'll do is going to be a little split.
• 1:03:10
  I know that they have talked about And him being a
• 1:03:14
  recontextualizing where he stands with the light.
• 1:03:17
  That is a conversation that came up with Steve deducer and
• 1:03:22
  interviews. Fact, it might have actually
• 1:03:24
  happened with the interview we had with him in terms of where
• 1:03:31
  Tyrion is and how he is ruling over.
• 1:03:35
  I think that's got to be something that has to be
• 1:03:37
  addressed in dragonflight. Now if Tyrion goes, Full Garage
• 1:03:45
  on us. I would hope not so much because
• 1:03:51
  I don't want that kind of story beat repeating itself, but him
• 1:03:57
  being more extreme or more extreme and a kind of return to
• 1:04:01
  the king of the king moment could happen sooner than later.
• 1:04:04
  So yeah, I think I agree with you that anduin stepping in
• 1:04:09
  stepping, in having this return moment would be Something that I
• 1:04:14
  could see happening not necessarily early and dragon
• 1:04:19
  fight, but maybe later in dragon fight itself in terms of
• 1:04:28
  Sylvanas, I agree she needs to be put on the shelf for a lot
• 1:04:32
  longer mostly because we have had such character fatigue with
• 1:04:35
  her. I think we've also had a bit of
• 1:04:37
  that fatigue with anduin, both of them, really sort of jumping
• 1:04:41
  to prominence. Actually, I think anduin started
• 1:04:44
  jumping the problems earlier because he had a lot more to do
• 1:04:49
  with things in terms of Mists of Pandaria.
• 1:04:54
  There was a strong and when presents their got put to the
• 1:04:58
  side again in terms of Warlords but really started moving
• 1:05:03
  forward. Same time as Sylvanas in Legion.
• 1:05:09
  So vanes was like okay I guess I'm going to be the the hordley
• 1:05:13
  And anduin was like, oh my dad's dead.
• 1:05:17
  I need to step up to the plate here and I didn't mean to make
• 1:05:20
  that sound. So callous Happy Father's Day
• 1:05:23
  once again. And so like it's being the rise
• 1:05:30
  of these. Two characters almost in
• 1:05:31
  lockstep with each other and then the fall of these two
• 1:05:34
  characters almost in lockstep with each other.
• 1:05:36
  So, I would want to separate those characters upon their
• 1:05:39
  return. If they do choose to have them
• 1:05:42
  return, So have anduin step forward because I think that I
• 1:05:49
  would like to see more and Doin before I see more Sylvanas.
• 1:05:53
  I think I personally have had my fill of Sylvanas for a good long
• 1:05:57
  while. Yeah.
• 1:05:59
  Just like we've all had our good.
• 1:06:01
  Our fill of Illidan for a good long while we've had.
• 1:06:08
  We've had our weed. I promised I'd had my fill of
• 1:06:11
  anduin sorry rather For a good long while if he if he shows up
• 1:06:15
  and says I'm back boys, what else do I have to give up?
• 1:06:18
  I'd be like yeah right I can do with this for an expansion, it
• 1:06:21
  is not an expansion, a tear tear, don't give him an entire
• 1:06:25
  expansion, give him a tea. Only the only way that I would
• 1:06:30
  be okay with Illidan coming back at this point, is him showing up
• 1:06:34
  sweating bullets, panicked, saying, he got out and just
• 1:06:39
  leave it at that. I keep that it's like I'm
• 1:06:45
  thinking that's like it do did you ever see the the comic of it
• 1:06:49
  was like someone someone made a comic of a couple of the
• 1:06:55
  characters and Destiny where one of the characters gets back to
• 1:07:01
  the Vanguard and says moons haunted and the other character
• 1:07:07
  replies, what do you mean? And it just goes back and
• 1:07:11
  they've got a gun in their hand and there.
• 1:07:12
  I can get this said moods haunted and the last frame is
• 1:07:15
  them fleeing towards the moon. That's kind of how I feel like
• 1:07:21
  illidan's return should be where he just comes up and says
• 1:07:24
  Serge's got. We're just like what do you mean
• 1:07:27
  is Hindi just like grabs his glaives sargeras's kind of any
• 1:07:30
  flies off. That's the only acceptable way
• 1:07:33
  that I want Illidan to be re-injected back into the story.
• 1:07:39
  I mean that seems so against illidan's character sort.
• 1:07:42
  Of thing. He would be like, oh, geez you
• 1:07:45
  all look being up. Maybe like what's happened, it's
• 1:07:48
  like he's escaped he'd escaped, it's like, oh, get him to the
• 1:07:51
  hospital. We gotta save me.
• 1:07:52
  He's like, no, I am my scars, and then fires and falls asleep.
• 1:07:55
  And then we have to go fight whatever the hell it is, and
• 1:07:58
  find out because like, you know, every single time that you have
• 1:08:01
  those conversations, where it's like, I've got enough words,
• 1:08:04
  sorry, I've got enough life in me to say about forwards and
• 1:08:08
  I've already wasted three of them on garbage Who lit it and
• 1:08:10
  it's like, oh what the hell, why didn't you?
• 1:08:12
  Tell us what was happening. That's how Illidan goes down.
• 1:08:17
  Oh gosh. No, but seriously seriously
• 1:08:20
  answer for Sylvanas, I think that there is a value in having
• 1:08:26
  a character because she is a very powerful character.
• 1:08:30
  Like, you look at the at like and this is, this is, you know,
• 1:08:34
  another issue with with, you know, the The Grand Design of a
• 1:08:39
  game like World of Warcraft, where every expansion, you kind
• 1:08:42
  of Have to one-up yourself in terms of Threat Level because
• 1:08:45
  you've got no you don't all of the I mean you don't you don't
• 1:08:49
  but they're there is a pressure for that to happen because you
• 1:08:54
  as a player you have amassed this power and you have gone to
• 1:08:58
  get we lose an ever-expanding literal don't happen, right?
• 1:09:01
  But you still have the feeling of you've accomplished these
• 1:09:04
  things and you have gone toe-to-toe against literal Gods,
• 1:09:11
  like I need something a little bit more.
• 1:09:12
  Exciting to keep me interested in going after the big bed.
• 1:09:15
  And so there is kind of this like ever ever.
• 1:09:19
  Increasing power scale that is happening within the story
• 1:09:24
  itself where you've kind of you kind of have to go after the
• 1:09:27
  next big thing and so vanes, what she represents is a very
• 1:09:34
  powerful level within the story because she was allied with the
• 1:09:40
  Jailer, literally the god of death.
• 1:09:42
  Death. Like the most powerful being
• 1:09:46
  within the death Pantheon within our universe.
• 1:09:50
  And we took him out and she survived, which means she is
• 1:09:56
  arguably more powerful than the Jailer at this point.
• 1:09:59
  Oh I mean like okay yes more powerful than somebody who is
• 1:10:02
  effectively dead and gone back Bolivian but I wouldn't say that
• 1:10:08
  I would put her at It's all levels with Rena fall without
• 1:10:14
  the crown. Oh put her at manifold levels
• 1:10:17
  without the crown. I would say that I hate power
• 1:10:23
  scaling fights because now we're going to be like oh yeah load if
• 1:10:26
  her versus Winter, Queen load. If Wintergreen be Stern on are
• 1:10:29
  like like I hate power scaling things that she is powerful.
• 1:10:36
  Yeah, could she take on Jayna? Yes, right.
• 1:10:39
  She's right there with like Jana and khadgar and bolvar, right?
• 1:10:46
  Like she is a monster but she is still part of like our our level
• 1:10:51
  right and win was the boss after and all these powers powers that
• 1:10:56
  infused and like oh I got a taste of the Shadow and I kind
• 1:11:00
  of liked it so he comes back and he's like running around like
• 1:11:03
  being like a mix of the powers. I could see him.
• 1:11:06
  Coming back with like, oh, I've decided to embrace light and
• 1:11:09
  Shadow and the balance between the two and being at the same
• 1:11:13
  level, if not as strong as Sylvanas.
• 1:11:15
  But, yeah, I could silly Sylvanas.
• 1:11:17
  Like it's like, The were in a very dire situation and we're
• 1:11:23
  calling pain Powers. It's like oh what do we what do
• 1:11:26
  we need, right? And then Sylvanas makes a
• 1:11:29
  comeback and and there's a save and then everybody's like, yeah
• 1:11:32
  we won, but like still don't kind of like you and that, that
• 1:11:36
  becomes part of the the expansion or she could show up
• 1:11:41
  very early in the expansion and it's it's very much like you had
• 1:11:48
  with Illidan Shows up early and expansion and is alongside the
• 1:11:53
  heroes being like, we have to stop this.
• 1:11:55
  This is this is what the Jailer was.
• 1:11:56
  So afraid, a bit of, I'm going to put something out there into
• 1:12:00
  the universe and I want you really should everyone.
• 1:12:03
  I really want everyone to not hate me for what I'm about to
• 1:12:08
  say, but I feel like and Owens about to go on a revin Arc.
• 1:12:13
  Yeah. And I wouldn't hate it.
• 1:12:16
  I would be. What am I?
• 1:12:17
  That's like the thing. I wouldn't hate it.
• 1:12:21
  Okay, explain, explain this, this like Light Side dark start
• 1:12:26
  stuff for our audience that may not have the background on this.
• 1:12:32
  Okay. If you so I'm gonna do a
• 1:12:36
  terrible job of explaining it, so I will instead recommend very
• 1:12:42
  thoroughly that you go play the Knights of the Old Republic
• 1:12:45
  games because that will explain it way better than I can.
• 1:12:49
  Okay, So I'll do a really crappy job, explaining it quickly
• 1:12:52
  without please do the plot. But basically I would say that
• 1:12:59
  it is somebody who has a Mastery of the good side the light side
• 1:13:06
  and then also starts seeing into the dark side and realizing that
• 1:13:11
  it isn't good and bad, it is a balance but then coming to the
• 1:13:17
  wrong conclusions on how to achieve Proper balance.
• 1:13:21
  Yes right there you go, that doesn't ruin it but it is very
• 1:13:26
  cold notes that is that is 100% 100% coals or CliffsNotes
• 1:13:32
  depending on where your, where your car.
• 1:13:34
  Yeah, we go canadiana versus u.s. know but it is like this.
• 1:13:41
  This type of story is is the is the story of and this this is
• 1:13:47
  Star Wars universe. So we're talking about.
• 1:13:48
  If anyone hasn't picked up on that, this is starting Where's
• 1:13:52
  we're going to that level of nerdom right now?
• 1:13:56
  But listen, I just started talking about, like, power
• 1:13:58
  scaling, we're past that level of nerdom weirdo Garrett.
• 1:14:03
  Killers will get Garrett it here.
• 1:14:05
  And deer will explain Revan, and then we'll put it with, like,
• 1:14:08
  inserted right here. The episodes going to come out
• 1:14:11
  like two weeks later, like, eyes always busy good grief, but I
• 1:14:17
  wouldn't be mad. I wouldn't be mad at that, like,
• 1:14:20
  that. I feel Feel like that would be
• 1:14:22
  an acceptable way for him to to step into, not a direct villain
• 1:14:27
  role but a kind of kind of like anti-hero ish role of.
• 1:14:33
  He's he's trying to find balance and finding answers to questions
• 1:14:41
  that he's asking but the questions that he's asking are
• 1:14:44
  the wrong questions and he is arriving at Not the best
• 1:14:48
  conclusions. Are you mean like, he could go
• 1:14:52
  down that path and then find out and then correct?
• 1:14:56
  Because I believe he always had had a has a good heart and the
• 1:14:59
  and the best at there and him fighting the light matches up
• 1:15:04
  with valon because vallon is also Now, sort of like mmm.
• 1:15:08
  Like I, I'm cool for light but some of this stuff that I've
• 1:15:12
  seen isn't totally cool with me. And then Having that contrasted
• 1:15:19
  with Sylvanas and we have a kind of a trinity where its valence
• 1:15:23
  of honest and doing. That is a good play out but
• 1:15:27
  again I don't want those characters to come through so
• 1:15:33
  much right now villain being late last displayed or showcased
• 1:15:39
  in Legion, has had some time. So sure have him sort of
• 1:15:43
  contrasted against Tyrion would be the I think that it The next
• 1:15:48
  step towards it and then have and Owen come back in as like a
• 1:15:51
  third, third part there in. But before, even that I think I
• 1:15:58
  would like to say is, see greymane get a bit more of
• 1:16:02
  standing on his own greymane being like not the eternally
• 1:16:07
  angry guy, but more of the heart versus a very militant Tyrion.
• 1:16:10
  I think that would be a good way of rounding out greyman because
• 1:16:14
  I feel like that character needs rounding out.
• 1:16:17
  Yeah. And having some Alliance
• 1:16:20
  intrigued. Yeah, cause that's that's
• 1:16:21
  something that still has yet to be addressed, is the zealotry
• 1:16:26
  that, that he displayed that, that turalyon, displayed that,
• 1:16:32
  like he was using his light powers to interrogate and get
• 1:16:38
  answers out of people. Well, looking for Sylvanas,
• 1:16:42
  like, that's something that has not been addressed.
• 1:16:44
  Yet at all, it was something that was casually brought up.
• 1:16:47
  Up in before the storm and then just kind of left and I'm fine
• 1:16:53
  with it being sort of left as something that they'll pick up
• 1:16:56
  later, but I hope that they do, pick it up later.
• 1:16:58
  I do think that the relationship between the two between turalyon
• 1:17:05
  and between, alaria is something that they've also hinted at in
• 1:17:10
  the Nile otha thing. Where it's like, oh, you
• 1:17:12
  sacrificed your sanity and gave into the void?
• 1:17:17
  Delirious thing in the ultimate world.
• 1:17:23
  But what if they juxtapose that with Tyrion going too far in
• 1:17:28
  Elyria being like no no no you can't give in to that.
• 1:17:32
  You can't go you can't go full Kool-Aid, would be a kind of way
• 1:17:39
  of giving Illyria a different Vantage Point sort of thing.
• 1:17:46
  And of course there's There's like the there's a lot to look
• 1:17:50
  at on the side of their and we're we're where they could go
• 1:17:56
  from there. So I definitely want to explore
• 1:17:59
  that more. I just hope that in Dragon
• 1:18:03
  flight, even if it is more focused on Dragon lore and that
• 1:18:07
  sort of stuff, we don't forget the rests of the Azeroth world
• 1:18:12
  and the things that need to move forward there.
• 1:18:15
  I think that in Mists of Pandaria, They had a good
• 1:18:19
  balance of. Hey, stuff is happening at home
• 1:18:22
  while you're in this This Strange Land.
• 1:18:24
  And I hope that they keep that sort of same sort of balance,
• 1:18:26
  because we said it before that. We think that dragonflight heads
• 1:18:30
  a lot more Homage to Mists of Pandaria and I'm hoping that is
• 1:18:36
  one of the things that carry through.
• 1:18:38
  Yeah, absolutely. So with that you want to move on
• 1:18:43
  to some questions from our dear listeners.
• 1:18:46
  Let's take some questions and wrap this up so you can send
• 1:18:52
  your emails too fast podcast at gmail.com or you could submit
• 1:18:57
  those to us on the Discord or through Twitter.
• 1:19:00
  These questions are coming to us through the Discord and the One
• 1:19:03
  is from Garland Graphics. So Goblin ass.
• 1:19:07
  Game designing has a lot of behind those curtains, Mystique
• 1:19:11
  to it. If you could get a step-by-step
• 1:19:13
  glimpse of a design departments process in the wow team, which
• 1:19:18
  would it be gay. Um, I'm going to say that I
• 1:19:27
  would, there's so many. I'd like to sit in on so many
• 1:19:30
  departments. I would love to see the
• 1:19:34
  encounter team. And we don't honestly you be
• 1:19:40
  sitting in there for like months of reiteration of them coming
• 1:19:44
  back to stuff and just weird. Like I'd love to see the initial
• 1:19:49
  creation of an encounter and what their basic thing is and
• 1:19:55
  then see it get bumped over to Q&A.
• 1:19:58
  And that first initial testing about like, oh, is this fun?
• 1:20:01
  And honestly, this is something that they've talked about.
• 1:20:03
  There was a Morgan day interview with Our and athletes were, they
• 1:20:08
  talked about like the initial design and it's just like, oh,
• 1:20:12
  let's do a boss. Here's our concept here.
• 1:20:13
  Some things. And is this fun?
• 1:20:16
  Is this even fun? Don't worry about balance.
• 1:20:18
  Are you like doing this encounter and be like, oh, he
• 1:20:22
  got us, are you doing this encounter me?
• 1:20:24
  Like, I never want to do this again.
• 1:20:27
  That's the initial thing, right? And then once they get through
• 1:20:31
  that, and they've got a basic design, then they start making
• 1:20:36
  sure. I'm sort of works in concert and
• 1:20:39
  we get some initial internal testing than they're throwing it
• 1:20:42
  out to testing on the PTR on the on a beta Alpha, whatever to
• 1:20:50
  have those go through and then you get bosses like how londres
• 1:20:54
  who were completely different in the PTR.
• 1:20:58
  Scaffold that design and then we get what we got on live and I
• 1:21:04
  love whole Andhra see, he is such an amazing boss.
• 1:21:07
  The first time I did it on heroic and it was like the
• 1:21:12
  bisecting beans. I'm like oh my goodness, like
• 1:21:16
  all that boss and it was something that they basically
• 1:21:19
  didn't get to test it in its in the live iteration, they
• 1:21:24
  basically didn't get the test that on the PTR.
• 1:21:26
  Yeah. Right.
• 1:21:27
  Yeah, so like the entire process is something I would love to see
• 1:21:32
  play out. And get an appreciation for that
• 1:21:36
  but even still with the different fights.
• 1:21:39
  Like there's a there's talks about like oh the Jailer and how
• 1:21:43
  it scales with group sizes. So if you have less people on
• 1:21:49
  the Jailer and you have the same amount of room to spread out
• 1:21:54
  those circles, it's fairly easy, but if you have more people, and
• 1:22:01
  people are getting those circles, how do you balance for
• 1:22:04
  that? And so for, so in the live, it
• 1:22:07
  caps at 20. Like once you have 20 people,
• 1:22:09
  you don't get any more Circle. So, we can't take up 30 people
• 1:22:12
  worth of circles, sort of thing, but then there was discussion
• 1:22:17
  about well what if everybody gets a circle, but the circle
• 1:22:20
  itself is smaller based on how many people you have so larger
• 1:22:24
  circles, Less people. Smaller circles with small
• 1:22:29
  people and I hadn't thought of that, that's the kind of things
• 1:22:32
  that like, designers come up with, and it's just like, those
• 1:22:35
  are just amazing things. So like, yeah, like, but like at
• 1:22:38
  the same time Quest design. I'd love to see what the quest
• 1:22:41
  designers do, and how they put that put that through or even
• 1:22:45
  just the all these systems, like there's there's I can't answer
• 1:22:49
  this question, everything. Everything that's your one.
• 1:22:54
  I think I think the astute among you will know that I would a
• 1:23:00
  hundred thousand percent. Pick the class design team,
• 1:23:04
  like, put me in the room at the class design team.
• 1:23:06
  I will be a, the one I wouldn't do 100%, 100% clowns laughing
• 1:23:11
  all day every day. I love class design.
• 1:23:15
  It's my favorite part of the game.
• 1:23:17
  I like class design, but I hate class balancing.
• 1:23:24
  I think that every time I look at class design, I am all about
• 1:23:30
  the mathematics and how it can work in synergize with this and
• 1:23:34
  yada. Yada yada like, I love that kind
• 1:23:36
  of build a character and how these moves tell a story about
• 1:23:40
  like where they draw their powers and blah, blah, blah,
• 1:23:41
  blah, blah blah. So like in terms of class
• 1:23:45
  balance know in terms of if I was sitting down with the
• 1:23:49
  designer, that was doing the casting animation and VFX for
• 1:23:56
  lava. First that I would love like
• 1:23:58
  just the story you do with that animation and how you make it
• 1:24:01
  impactful and how you handle off the sound design and they make
• 1:24:05
  the sound help. Sell it that I love how much
• 1:24:08
  damage it does and where it fits on the rotation?
• 1:24:12
  No, no. I get it.
• 1:24:16
  No, but that's that's the part of the game.
• 1:24:17
  That that intrigues me the most is, is learning and figuring out
• 1:24:22
  where where these abilities like a, what the These are and how
• 1:24:28
  they fit together to make a coherent specialization or just
• 1:24:33
  like you know, looking at classes as a whole seeing how
• 1:24:36
  the whole class fits into like as a puzzle piece into the
• 1:24:40
  greater puzzle of the game that you're trying to put forth like
• 1:24:45
  that. That is it just gets me going.
• 1:24:49
  I'd like, I can't I can't explain it any better than that.
• 1:24:53
  It's just it's just something that that I enjoy looking at.
• 1:24:56
  All of the, the different moving Parts within within the classes
• 1:25:01
  and figuring it out. I mean, I get it a bit like,
• 1:25:06
  okay. So we're talking all about like,
• 1:25:09
  various geekdom Xander Dems and stuff.
• 1:25:11
  So I play Magic the Gathering, right?
• 1:25:14
  And part of what people do with match, the Gathering is,
• 1:25:18
  sometimes they'll design their own custom cards in that sort of
• 1:25:20
  stuff and they'll post it up. And I'll be like that is
• 1:25:23
  absolutely broken. How the hell are you trying to
• 1:25:25
  make a? Card with, like all those
• 1:25:29
  abilities and cost that little and I will break it down and be
• 1:25:32
  like, what are you costing these for?
• 1:25:33
  And all of that sort of stuff. So that is basically the same
• 1:25:38
  thing as like, you're balanced design, but for magic cards.
• 1:25:42
  And I am somebody who's actually pretty good in the communities
• 1:25:47
  that I play with. About card balance and how you
• 1:25:53
  can like, create these different things that can or alter the
• 1:25:56
  abilities to give it a justement adjustments or different
• 1:26:00
  synergies. And that is something that you
• 1:26:02
  could definitely do with, with class balance, you can have a
• 1:26:09
  class that loves crit because you can make an ability proc off
• 1:26:14
  of crit damage or you get which would also be like, okay what?
• 1:26:18
  Made the ability proc off the crit of a DOT.
• 1:26:21
  Well, then, that gives Synergy with haste and with crew with
• 1:26:24
  the crib as well, you can have things that auto-create, which
• 1:26:28
  devalues basic rate values and like I could these are things
• 1:26:32
  that I'm constantly talking about.
• 1:26:34
  I dislike it with class balance because classes have to be
• 1:26:37
  balanced against each other. Yeah.
• 1:26:39
  Right. In a way that I find
• 1:26:42
  aggravating. So I don't think it's the class
• 1:26:44
  balance in and of itself. I think it's because of the way
• 1:26:47
  that the community has started. To view class balance that I
• 1:26:50
  don't want that shade. I would just like to say for the
• 1:26:54
  record that I did not at any point and say that I am there
• 1:26:57
  for the class balancing. I'm there for the design itself
• 1:27:01
  of making it like just the the sequence of buttons that you're
• 1:27:06
  pressing the like figuring out what the abilities do that,
• 1:27:12
  that's the level of design that that interest me the balance of
• 1:27:16
  it all and everything is This in my mind, completely separate
• 1:27:20
  from just making the class work. No, it isn't.
• 1:27:24
  It isn't like that's the thing, it isn't.
• 1:27:26
  But that's not what I'm there for specifically, okay?
• 1:27:30
  Because like, yeah, when you design an ability where you have
• 1:27:34
  your tuning, knobs is intrinsic to good design, right?
• 1:27:38
  You need to have, you need to have these abilities.
• 1:27:41
  And in fact, sometimes you do ability specifically to address
• 1:27:45
  a balance, a balance concern, you have Fire Mages, that
• 1:27:52
  revolve around hot streak and hot streak by itself, isn't
• 1:27:56
  something but hot streak makes the entire spec work because it
• 1:28:01
  focuses on like, oh, I want to get these crits and I want to go
• 1:28:04
  through that. You do things that are like,
• 1:28:07
  okay, early enhancement because we're looking at Wrath of the
• 1:28:13
  Lich King today. Early enhancement had an ability
• 1:28:16
  called Flurry, right? And it's a relatively small
• 1:28:22
  ability, it's just that when you crit with one of your weapon
• 1:28:27
  strikes, you would then get your auto attack a percentage faster.
• 1:28:34
  What is that? That works both for and against
• 1:28:38
  Jesus? Because it itself does, it means
• 1:28:42
  that like if you do it, your weapon strikes come faster.
• 1:28:45
  Which means that you don't need haste on your as much for your
• 1:28:48
  weapons. Strings.
• 1:28:49
  But the more haste you have the more chances you have of
• 1:28:52
  actually profiting it. So that's that's one thing and
• 1:28:54
  like there's so many different ways to have abilities,
• 1:28:59
  synergize with each other, with different traits with different
• 1:29:05
  stat lines and all of that and I yes it is something that I would
• 1:29:10
  definitely love to do or at least like that's one of those
• 1:29:14
  things where I wouldn't sit and watch.
• 1:29:16
  I would want to have the conversations.
• 1:29:18
  Yeah. So like in that way, yeah, I'm
• 1:29:20
  110% with you and I realized that having this conversation
• 1:29:25
  that I'm going into such stupid nitty-gritties that like yeah,
• 1:29:27
  clearly. I'm excited about that sort of
• 1:29:29
  stuff. I just was like, wait, you
• 1:29:32
  wouldn't? You wouldn't want to be in the
• 1:29:33
  room for classes and I doubt I wrote, I think they were, there
• 1:29:38
  were there are two options one, you record it, and then send it
• 1:29:42
  to me, or you have me in a room, knowing you're not getting
• 1:29:46
  anything done, because I'm gonna ask a 22.
• 1:29:48
  Twenty questions video Goblin. There's my 3 for answers and and
• 1:29:58
  live one answer, but I hijack. It is, there It Is.
• 1:30:03
  Well, I have another question, fortunately that we can, we can
• 1:30:08
  go ahead and answer this one. Coming from calculus who asks
• 1:30:12
  should time walking gear, eye level be increased as an
• 1:30:16
  expansion progresses I'm running cattle.
• 1:30:18
  Mocking this week by the way. Kat, I'm walking is up for those
• 1:30:21
  of you who didn't know on a woefully under geared, alt, and
• 1:30:26
  it's not even an upgrade for that character.
• 1:30:31
  I am gonna say probably the probably the only thing that I
• 1:30:38
  will say in this episode that will actually get me in trouble
• 1:30:41
  and say no, I do not believe time walking gear should level
• 1:30:45
  throughout and an expansion because the end reward of doing
• 1:30:51
  the weekly quest for a level kept character is the purpose of
• 1:30:55
  doing that that time walking otherwise it is a good tool to
• 1:31:00
  help. Level characters up to that
• 1:31:04
  level. So it is a it is a tool that you
• 1:31:06
  can use to help level your characters that are below, level
• 1:31:09
  60 but above level 50 in order to get them a little bit closer
• 1:31:14
  to that level. So in that regard, I think that
• 1:31:18
  the the purpose of running time walking isn't for the gear
• 1:31:22
  except for the the weekly quest, which does scale as the as the
• 1:31:28
  expansion progresses. Whereas the item level of the,
• 1:31:33
  the actual gear that's dropping out of out of these dungeons is
• 1:31:39
  Kind of not relevant because you're able to go in.
• 1:31:43
  You're able to go in and run heroic dungeons at level cap
• 1:31:47
  which are going to be giving you that that you know, higher
• 1:31:51
  slightly higher item level that scales with with the expansion
• 1:31:54
  as the expansion goes on. So yeah, I don't think that it
• 1:31:58
  should be used as a primary source for gear.
• 1:32:02
  It is, it is just there to help with leveling and for the weekly
• 1:32:06
  quest for characters that do. It.
• 1:32:11
  Yeah, I agree with you. I don't know if that is super
• 1:32:15
  hot take. I think that time walking needs
• 1:32:18
  to find rewards outside of gear. Hmm?
• 1:32:22
  Because you are always going to have gearing systems that are
• 1:32:27
  needed for people to progress from fresh 60 or getting to
• 1:32:32
  getting 60 70 in the next expansion into normal, dungeons
• 1:32:37
  heroic, Mythic zeros rating elephant Whatever.
• 1:32:42
  Yeah time walking, isn't there all the time so it can never be
• 1:32:47
  the primary way moving it up as an alternative to what normal
• 1:32:54
  dungeons or something. Yeah, sure.
• 1:32:56
  Maybe. But I think that it just it
• 1:32:58
  needs to be understood that it is a special event that it will
• 1:33:05
  give special rewards that shouldn't be necessary or
• 1:33:11
  competitive with the normal gearing path or they just need
• 1:33:15
  to make time walking all the time.
• 1:33:17
  So that this week, it is. This this dungeon that or rather
• 1:33:21
  this except this expansions Dungeons and X we get is another
• 1:33:25
  expansions, just completely separate it from the other
• 1:33:28
  events. And then to say okay this is
• 1:33:30
  where time walking fits in in are gearing path.
• 1:33:34
  Yeah. But otherwise it would just be
• 1:33:37
  weird and disruptive and then you'd be like oh you level this
• 1:33:40
  week? Well, Actually, even though that
• 1:33:42
  the gear that you got from, I don't know.
• 1:33:46
  Normal dungeons is good, the time walking one is better,
• 1:33:51
  itemized. And you need to wait for wrath
• 1:33:55
  dungeons to come back because that's the itemization that you
• 1:33:58
  want. And that stuff has double gems
• 1:33:59
  on it and as in a competitive item level like it's just, it
• 1:34:03
  would be silly and trouble and problematic to have that as part
• 1:34:09
  of your gearing. Pass.
• 1:34:11
  So I am fine with it falling the opulent obsolescence quite
• 1:34:14
  quickly. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:34:17
  And we're just not, we're not having a disagreement on that,
• 1:34:21
  so I guess we should just move on to the next question,
• 1:34:24
  especially, since I'm just going to add this, no go ahead.
• 1:34:27
  Add this in, just as a, like, a final note, like I think, the
• 1:34:31
  ketchup gear is rather, Rather better utilized coming from
• 1:34:39
  sources, like like the open-world content and in
• 1:34:44
  crafting, like anything that gets you out into the world
• 1:34:47
  rather than queuing up into into dungeons, on end.
• 1:34:51
  Which I mean that that may be a personal bias on my own.
• 1:34:54
  Like I don't really find fun in just queuing up dungeon after
• 1:34:57
  dungeon and you know, going through especially especially
• 1:35:01
  like heroic level difficulty stuff like it that's that's Does
• 1:35:06
  not interest me and just going through and grinding over and
• 1:35:09
  over, and over the same dungeons.
• 1:35:12
  So that I feel like that that pressure should be pushed onto
• 1:35:15
  more open World stuff as opposed to going in and having time
• 1:35:21
  walking be a good source of gear.
• 1:35:24
  I think that it is fine for professions to do it.
• 1:35:29
  Fine. If you are getting particular
• 1:35:31
  items from open world content, excuse me, but I think that it
• 1:35:41
  would become much like we have in xerath mortis where, hey, I
• 1:35:45
  can't find this gear because the world quest, doesn't randomly?
• 1:35:49
  Give me this gear. I think that open-world content
• 1:35:52
  you need to have it be more. Deliberate and less orangey.
• 1:35:59
  And that's What professions also provide far less RNG.
• 1:36:03
  So if you just need to get the materials to then take to a
• 1:36:07
  friend or a work order, I think that is the way to do Goering
• 1:36:12
  more than waiting for the particular week of time walking
• 1:36:16
  to come up. But with that said, our next
• 1:36:19
  question comes from Jazz acai and Jazz acai ass what are your
• 1:36:25
  thoughts on if the wow team came up with a way for People to
• 1:36:30
  obtain old appearances mounts, pets and toys personally.
• 1:36:34
  As latecomer to the game. There are a few things that I
• 1:36:39
  Rely sorry that I can rely on. Sorry.
• 1:36:46
  Personally as a latecomer to the game, there are a few things
• 1:36:49
  that I really on can get hmm. That sentence is odd.
• 1:36:57
  Such as end of expansion Quest mounts.
• 1:37:01
  Okay. So this was actually something
• 1:37:03
  that I was thinking about earlier, because we have
• 1:37:06
  actually clarification from our last episode, you cannot get
• 1:37:12
  Gladiator mounts anymore. You can get seasonal, PVP mounts
• 1:37:16
  by getting saddle Saddles from that.
• 1:37:19
  And then you can go back and buy old seasonal, PVP mounts, but
• 1:37:23
  not Gladiator mounts, particularly This is different
• 1:37:27
  than Mythic only mounts that drop to a one percent chance of
• 1:37:33
  getting it and all PVE content which after time can show up on
• 1:37:40
  the black market auction house. So to me, I think that there is
• 1:37:46
  a discrepancy in what can and cannot be gathered later on.
• 1:37:51
  There is also things that show up as particular events where
• 1:37:56
  Just ahead of shadowlands. You were able to get a redone
• 1:38:00
  version of The Haunted momento. Yeah, I think it was like a I
• 1:38:08
  know they gave it a different name but it was just an HD
• 1:38:10
  version of The Haunted momento. Can't get that anymore.
• 1:38:15
  Do I think everything should be available for players?
• 1:38:19
  Whether they are there for the event at the time?
• 1:38:23
  Or not? I'm on the fence about it.
• 1:38:27
  I think that it is nice to have those limited time events and be
• 1:38:31
  like oh I have this. Thing that turns me into a gnome
• 1:38:38
  because I helped take back Mecca.
• 1:38:39
  No Matt the start of I think it was cataclysm or bka or help
• 1:38:44
  take back the islands at the start of cataclysm and be can
• 1:38:47
  get a troll. I think that the legendary
• 1:38:51
  cloaks from Mists of Pandaria that you can't get any more our
• 1:38:56
  thing. Do I think maybe cosmetic show
• 1:39:02
  always be open? I don't know, I don't know.
• 1:39:05
  This one is a question that I don't have an answer for because
• 1:39:09
  I think that there are some times where it seems fine and
• 1:39:13
  sometimes where I don't like it. And I think that obviously there
• 1:39:17
  will be biases for it. I love mounts.
• 1:39:20
  I'm never going to PVP. There's a whole section of
• 1:39:22
  mounts that I won't get and will constantly be locked out to me
• 1:39:25
  because I won't get Gladiator or I could fight and get my PVP
• 1:39:32
  ranking up and start farming Saddles and start getting those
• 1:39:34
  mounts. Do I like it or do I not I don't
• 1:39:43
  know, honestly, I think that it was out there.
• 1:39:46
  Would be nice if it wasn't there, I'm fine with it.
• 1:39:51
  Amanda. I'm going to address my answer
• 1:39:53
  directly to Ian has a Kostas. Let me get the hand of a doll
• 1:39:59
  title, you coward. Why?
• 1:40:03
  Let me have it. Why?
• 1:40:05
  Why that particular one? Okay, what it?
• 1:40:09
  So we're going with the you can't extract your bias and it's
• 1:40:13
  a title. Correct.
• 1:40:16
  Like I want it, I want it. But I know if I get it if I get
• 1:40:22
  the chance to get it, everyone else gets the chance to get it
• 1:40:24
  as well and that inherently lowers the value of seeing
• 1:40:29
  someone out in the wild with that.
• 1:40:31
  A particular title because there is there is some value in
• 1:40:36
  scarcity, in their being kind of, kind of this, for lack of a
• 1:40:43
  better word fomo to like to have pressure to go get something
• 1:40:48
  like you. You see something coming up and
• 1:40:51
  you know that that is going to be something that you can get
• 1:40:55
  only in this brief period of time.
• 1:40:58
  One thing that I will say is that while I don't necessarily
• 1:41:01
  Sara Lee believe that it is the best idea to retroactively allow
• 1:41:07
  people to go back and get all of the stuff that that is no longer
• 1:41:10
  available. I think something that they
• 1:41:13
  could look forward in doing would be to have seasonal
• 1:41:21
  rewards, be much more widely advertised as something that is,
• 1:41:30
  that is available. Only in that that time period
• 1:41:34
  like to, like we talked we talked we talked briefly and in
• 1:41:42
  the last episode about, you know, around the the the whole
• 1:41:45
  idea around battle passes, I think that if they were to do
• 1:41:50
  something, to improve the seasonality of World of
• 1:41:55
  Warcraft, it would be to have some sort of some sort of battle
• 1:42:00
  pass type. Thing introduced into the game
• 1:42:03
  that lets you know. Hey, these are all the rewards
• 1:42:07
  that you can get this season. These are these are the things
• 1:42:10
  that you that you can get and they are going away at the end
• 1:42:14
  of the season as well as having a list of the things that you
• 1:42:19
  can get that will be available Beyond and having a clear you
• 1:42:25
  know demarcation within the game itself.
• 1:42:28
  Where do you put that? the adventure Guide login, like
• 1:42:32
  here's your seasonal reward, like it's I feel like it's one
• 1:42:35
  breaks, the immersion and and World of Warcraft has had this
• 1:42:38
  very strange thing where it Rides line.
• 1:42:42
  Between where do we break the immersion?
• 1:42:44
  Where do we not the adventure guy that shows up when you log
• 1:42:47
  in and says, here's your new stuff is usually the biggest
• 1:42:51
  break of immersion that you would get.
• 1:42:53
  Yeah, right. So that's, I guess where I would
• 1:42:56
  put that. Obviously, when you say a battle
• 1:42:58
  pass, you don't mean a paid battle pass within the
• 1:43:00
  description. You just mean just like, hey,
• 1:43:02
  here are things that are available for this season for
• 1:43:05
  season three. Make sure that you defeat the
• 1:43:08
  Jailer on and get your ahead of the Curve.
• 1:43:11
  So defeat him on heroic, so that you can get the Friendship bot
• 1:43:14
  because that will no longer be available.
• 1:43:17
  Once once this is done, maybe expansion, maybe this thing, who
• 1:43:21
  knows? Maybe it should be in it in the
• 1:43:23
  adventure Journal. Yeah, I think that I honestly
• 1:43:32
  think that some things that are time limited should remain in
• 1:43:36
  the game, but shouldn't be A large amount of items I think.
• 1:43:43
  There are so many things that you can currently get and obtain
• 1:43:48
  even after the fact. And that is good.
• 1:43:53
  I think that it would be biased of me to say, oh, we'll be allow
• 1:43:57
  Mythic mounts to drop after the tear.
• 1:43:59
  So they should allow me as chance to get PVP Gladiator
• 1:44:03
  amounts after the tier. I think that is just, you're not
• 1:44:07
  comparing the same thing. You are definitely not.
• 1:44:09
  Pairing the same thing. Yeah, so for me, I just, I
• 1:44:15
  generally think that we now have a lot of similar things, your
• 1:44:22
  season 3, PVP Mount season for PVP, mount a gladiator is
• 1:44:30
  contrasted against your Gladiator.
• 1:44:34
  Sorry, rather, your Mythic plus Mount that you can get in a
• 1:44:38
  season and it it doesn't show up again for rating.
• 1:44:42
  They have these these mythic bosses dropping mounts and they
• 1:44:47
  have normal bosses and LF our boss is that drop mounts and you
• 1:44:52
  can go and get those. They have tons and tons of
• 1:44:56
  mounts that are in just the open World Cup stuff and only a small
• 1:45:03
  one or two of those mounts are. Well, three in this is this
• 1:45:07
  season our time. Stricted there's so much that
• 1:45:11
  you can get and so many that are quite look alike in that they
• 1:45:16
  are basically the same model, just different colors.
• 1:45:18
  And so I think that if you have amount, you have a transmog that
• 1:45:22
  is just time-limited but has a little extra Pizzazz on it over
• 1:45:28
  a look-alike, I think that's totally fine to be time, limited
• 1:45:32
  and you can get something that is quite much.
• 1:45:34
  Like it just not all the bells and whistles.
• 1:45:38
  And you can get that later because eventually it will
• 1:45:40
  become that much easier and kind of give somebody something
• 1:45:44
  special for their loyalty for their expertise or dedication to
• 1:45:49
  the content. Yeah.
• 1:45:52
  Yeah that yeah I don't think I don't think I have anything.
• 1:45:59
  I don't have a rebuttal against that I think I agree.
• 1:46:03
  Okay pretty much all the way through with that.
• 1:46:08
  So then we kind of already covered as its AIDS question
• 1:46:13
  earlier. It's just basically with the
• 1:46:16
  recent announcement of Wrath fresh servers.
• 1:46:18
  Would you rather start over on a fresh realm or continue already
• 1:46:23
  leveled and geared on level 70s? And I know you don't have a
• 1:46:29
  horse in this race at all, but I'll go ahead and answer that
• 1:46:32
  question. I would much rather start under
• 1:46:35
  fresh realm, then continue on in one of these established
• 1:46:38
  servers. Just because I Like I said
• 1:46:43
  before these servers like coming in, at this point in the game it
• 1:46:48
  is very difficult to break into to the server.
• 1:46:52
  Economies there are ready like there's just a whole lot of
• 1:46:57
  stuff that is like outrageously blown out of proportion.
• 1:47:00
  Just because of the sheer amount of gold that has been generated
• 1:47:03
  and it is important to remember that there are not that many
• 1:47:07
  gold sinks in. That version of the game.
• 1:47:12
  Like there's your nether Drake's and that's about it.
• 1:47:15
  That's about as far as the extent of an undermount coming
• 1:47:19
  in RAF? Yes, this is Fender Mount, the
• 1:47:24
  vendor Mountain does exist, but that is, I think it's like what
• 1:47:27
  100 kid 10K even I think for the for that vendor Mount, well then
• 1:47:33
  go buy the ice, mammoth one from the sons of ho dear, I want to
• 1:47:37
  see, when I pretty sure I already know the answer to this
• 1:47:40
  but like, All the sons of hodie requests are probably going to
• 1:47:43
  be renamed and I have to go check out what they're called.
• 1:47:46
  Because those were those were definitely Quest that were like
• 1:47:49
  this is stupid humor and we and they and they may be being funny
• 1:47:55
  when you're like a tween or young teenager but they haven't,
• 1:47:58
  they haven't aged well, yeah, so then I guess for me, even though
• 1:48:08
  I don't have a horse in this race, I would actually rather
• 1:48:11
  start with my established character.
• 1:48:13
  I like my established character. I'm not an old person, right?
• 1:48:17
  I have one character and he progresses through the world as
• 1:48:20
  the world progresses. So I in this situation would
• 1:48:24
  carry the character that I've accomplished so much on forward
• 1:48:30
  into the next expansion. That's how I would answer it if
• 1:48:34
  I as That had a horse in this race.
• 1:48:36
  I would stick to that horse. All right, all right.
• 1:48:40
  I can respect that. Like honestly.
• 1:48:43
  Honestly, like, it is a, it is a raging debate going on
• 1:48:48
  internally for myself right now of do I do I start over with a
• 1:48:56
  new character because like I love my warlock, she's
• 1:49:00
  fantastic. Like I've had a lot of fun on my
• 1:49:04
  warlock, I I have I have the, the Warlock Mount already like,
• 1:49:09
  the max level were like amount and that took a whole lot of
• 1:49:15
  work in order to get. And I don't necessarily want to
• 1:49:20
  give that up, but I don't know that we're like is the class
• 1:49:25
  that I want to play going into the next expansion because I do
• 1:49:29
  want to have a little bit more flexibility.
• 1:49:30
  I think like maybe like a druid or Paladin or maybe even a
• 1:49:35
  shaman would be something much more interesting to me
• 1:49:38
  personally going into Rath than playing a war like so I'm
• 1:49:42
  looking at it from the from the perspective of I'm probably
• 1:49:46
  going to be playing a different class anyway so do I wait for
• 1:49:50
  these servers or do I? Up another character on on an
• 1:49:55
  existing server and or finish leveling one of one of my alts
• 1:49:59
  that I have on on an existing server or do I like, you know, I
• 1:50:05
  have several several friends that play on different Realms
• 1:50:08
  across crack classic and kind of want to play with them and so do
• 1:50:14
  I pick a different server altogether?
• 1:50:15
  Like there's so many so many decisions that I have to make
• 1:50:18
  around going into Rath. So I think for now Like asking
• 1:50:24
  me at this moment, I am more inclined to wait and start on a
• 1:50:28
  fresh realm that I am to go start leveling a character at
• 1:50:32
  this point just because we don't know exactly what things are
• 1:50:36
  going to look like, if there's going to be a mass Exodus from
• 1:50:38
  some of these servers onto these fresh servers that's going to
• 1:50:42
  clear up a little bit more clear more space on the economies and
• 1:50:49
  on the established servers, we don't know.
• 1:50:52
  We don't we don't Really have an answer to that, although there
• 1:50:57
  certainly will be effects throughout the entire game at
• 1:51:03
  that point. So it's tough.
• 1:51:06
  It's tough to decide. Yeah.
• 1:51:10
  Well as its Jade I hope you like that again guys, if you have
• 1:51:15
  questions for us to join us on the Discord like we got these
• 1:51:18
  questions from send the emails over 25 has podcast at gmail.com
• 1:51:23
  or tweet out to us. Again, the Twitter is at fast
• 1:51:26
  podcast so if you want to support the show please do give
• 1:51:32
  us a five star review. It does help us leave find new
• 1:51:36
  listeners so you can drop that. For on iTunes, on the warcraft
• 1:51:41
  Radio podcast, directory or on Spotify which is now giving
• 1:51:45
  reviews as well. For now live, where can people
• 1:51:50
  find you on the internet? When you're not talking about
• 1:51:53
  World of Warcraft, you can find me on Twitter where I am talking
• 1:51:58
  about a whole slew of other things, other than World of
• 1:52:01
  Warcraft, you can follow me over there at Adventure live.
• 1:52:05
  And you can also find me on the Discord, like all these
• 1:52:08
  wonderful people that give us questions every week by heading
• 1:52:10
  to bit.ly slash Fez. Discord has lots of wonderful
• 1:52:13
  conversations happening all the time.
• 1:52:16
  We would love for you all to jump in.
• 1:52:18
  But Manny aside from the Discord, where can people find
• 1:52:22
  you? So I had a nice little sit-down
• 1:52:27
  with Pro Jolly, where we went over the Druid talent trees and
• 1:52:32
  that was really great that was over on my twitch stream so you
• 1:52:36
  can find me on Twitch in Twitter.
• 1:52:37
  That is True Villain. Manny true without the e and for
• 1:52:41
  Azeroth of course is part of Warcraft.
• 1:52:43
  Radio you can check out Warcraft radio.com for other, fantastic
• 1:52:48
  shows and links to all their socials until next time.
• 1:52:51
  Guys, may all your hits be crits.