Latest / Elevate The Hustle / How He Built A Referral-Driven Agency In The Hardest Insurance Niche ft. Andrew Nigri

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How He Built A Referral-Driven Agency In The Hardest Insurance Niche ft. Andrew Nigri · Elevate The Hustle

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_04: What I didn't want to do, because I've heard of this happen to him before, I didn't want to take a proposal from one buyer and give it to the other and say, Here, make this, if you do this, I'm yours.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_04: Because that's what happens to us in the insurance business.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_04: But that was like a big sh that was a big strict like rule that I followed for myself.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_04: We ran an honest process.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_04: You have more integrity than I have, Andrew.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_04: That's what I hear everybody does, but no, we didn't do that.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_04: We were specific with that.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: Elevate the hustle.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome to Elevate the Hustle, where we break down what it actually means to build teams, scale companies, and lead with intensity.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm your host, Stan Mayton.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um I'm Dom Picharillo.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_02: And this week we are coming to you with a good friend of mine and special guest, Andrew Nigri.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_02: And Andrew took a leap that most people think about taking, but don't actually do.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: So we're super excited to have him here to tell us about his story and uh his journey through the insurance industry.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the show again.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: Let's go.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_03: Andrew, did you pick up on that?
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_03: That Dom got his name wrong.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_02: I yeah, that sounds about right for me.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_03: Just so you know how this podcast is.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_04: Can you change that in editing, or are we just gonna run it?
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: We're just gonna go.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: We try to be our authentic selves here.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_03: If we F up, it it's okay.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_03: If you F up, maybe we're gonna we're gonna edit it out.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome to the show.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks for having me.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_03: You were a big broker doing big business.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_03: Is that true?
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_03: Try.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: Is that research correct?
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_03: Did we get that research, right?
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_03: And then you decided to start your own business, your own agency.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_04: Well, Dom was a big part of that, actually.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_04: So Dom?
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_03: Dom is let's hear this.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_03: Let's get right into that.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_04: Yes, we're just did write that.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_04: So I got free tickets to the Traveler's Invitational Golf Tournament in Connecticut from our mutual travelers rep.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_02: And um let's give him a shout-out because he hasn't talked to me in about 10 years.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_02: But Dave Liebeck, if you're listening, Dave.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_04: I haven't seen him in probably 12 years.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_04: Let's go, Dave.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_04: And I went, I went to he's like, oh, he's like, meet this guy, Dom, you guys will get along.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_04: So we hung out, watched, watched the golf.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_04: And Dom was already, I think, two years in, and I was contemplating going out and starting my own.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_04: And um, yeah, so it was it kind of gave me a little bit of a comfort level that, like, oh, someone else did this, that's not like you know, a second or third generation.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_04: Like, someone did it as a startup.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_04: There's not, there's frankly not a lot of startup insurance agencies, at least that I knew of at that time.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but yeah, my my thought process was I just think I could do it better than everybody else.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_04: So I had the audacity to think that.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_04: So put put my money with my laptop.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: Better than Dom is what you were thinking, right?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: It's like if the guy that can't get his name right could make this work, like I could definitely do this.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: We said it, not you.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_03: You're good at it.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I mean, so let's back up before that.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, growing up, there was someone that shaped your professional life in a meaningful way.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Do you want to talk a little bit about that?
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_04: Ooh, you're going real, you're going way back.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_04: Definitely my father.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_04: Definitely my father.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: And what were the like what were the lessons you learned?
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: And like, what did he do?
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: Can you elaborate a little bit on this?
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_04: Well, both my parents were in sales.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_04: So I grew up in a sales environment.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_04: But um my father, I work, I had the pleasure of working with my father for several several years.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so I just learned a lot of a lot of techniques early on, and um specifically, specifically the empathetic sales approach where you're really trying to hone in on what the customer needs.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_04: Um and so just a lot of those skills learned early age.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_04: But um, but yeah, that's that would be my number one without a doubt.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: What was he selling?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_04: What were you selling?
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_04: Like what were you guys slinging?
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, can you tell us?
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, slinging cars.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_04: So I was in the furniture business and then I got into um was it the furniture business first?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, furniture business first, cars, uh, because furniture business wasn't a lot of money in it at the time.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_04: I got into the car business.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_04: My father said, come on with us, you know, make a lot of money.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_04: My uncle was in there also, and the he was more in the finance department.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but I I joined the car business, and I'll never forget I was an absolute failure.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_04: In the in the furniture business, I was great.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_04: I was, you know, slinging couches, no problem.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_04: But went over to the finance business.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_04: I was only 20, 21 years old, and um just was not, didn't didn't get it.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_04: And it took a couple months, and then they were gonna fire me.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_04: And my father, who was pretty like high up at the dealership, kind of saved my job and was like, he basically I had to follow his directions and learned I learned a lot about controlling the customer and and basically taking control of the sales process.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_04: And I learned what a sales process was because I had no process, I was just kind of going off my gut, talking, product knowledge.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_04: But in the car business, you need you need to have a process.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_04: So once you follow the process, all of a sudden it works, and you know, it's been done you know for for years, and there is a process to it.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_04: So once I learned that, I got my job saved and then worked there for about three, four years until I went into the mortgage business, which was the worst time in American history to get into the worst possible job, which was 2007, 2007, into 2008.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and yeah, I remember I remember watching the TV in the the sales office, watching Lehman Brothers go down, right?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_04: And thinking this is probably not a great place to be.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_04: So that was and that was 2008, and then I got licensed in I I left the insurance business, got licensed in June, and so it's been um yes, almost 17 years.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_04: So 19 years, 19 years.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_03: Let's back up.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_03: Uh growing up, right?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_03: You said both your parents are in sales.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_03: Did you was that like it?
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_03: Were you like, I want to be a sales guy, this is what I'm gonna be?
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_03: No, not at all.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um baseball player?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_03: Tell us.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_03: I want I want to know.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_04: No, I didn't really have um I didn't really have uh an idea.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_04: I knew I knew business, definitely, but I don't think I knew what that was when I was in high school.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um I uh but I was an English major.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_04: It was more of the writing and the history side of the brain than the math.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_04: Definitely, I'm definitely like not a finance guy.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_04: I wasn't wasn't great in math in high school, but went went to college as an English major and business.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_04: And um, so you know, maybe creative writing, journalism.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't know where I was gonna go.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_04: And then um I think I I realized sales once I kind of got out of college.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: So you you followed the money?
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_04: Pretty much, yeah.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_04: I dropped I dropped out uh after the second semester, and the the easiest, quickest money is sales, right?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_04: For for someone without a degree.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_04: So um so yeah, so kind of just grinding ever since basically.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_03: What do you what do you think it takes to be a successful salesperson?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_04: Uh perseverance.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_04: And and you gotta um you have to understand failure.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_04: Like you have to really just you know you're gonna fail.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_04: You know that you know 99 of the hundred uh opportunities are is gonna be a door slammed in your face.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_04: And if you can persevere through that, um you'll be successful.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_04: I think that's really all it is.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, assuming you get better and don't make the same mistakes, I think it really just comes down to sticking with it, you know.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: And any any any good failure sales stories?
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: Any good door slams you want to share?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_04: Well, yeah, I mean I mean so many.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, so many.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_04: The biggest thing now is a lot of my business comes in through word of mouth.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_04: Um so you know, qualifying a prospect is the biggest thing, right?
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_04: Most of the deals that I work on I close.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_04: So when a deal comes through and it's a referral, I kind of your guard kind of gets put down to the point where you know what, I don't really need to qualify this prospect because you know they're coming to me and the whole thing.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_04: Your guard goes down, you don't ask those questions, and you find out like, you know, a month into the process that like the broker is like their brother.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_04: And it's like there's no chance of winning that policy.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_04: So, so the the humbling experience of the the the failure nowadays when I've been doing it for so long and see so many is is always entertaining.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_04: But I mean, no one failure stands out, but there's just a lot over the years, so but more success.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_03: More success.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_03: So you were in a state before starting your agency.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, Dom helped you because you went to Dom and you're like, hey, this guy can do it, I can do it.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: You said you were thinking about you know starting it starting your own agency.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_03: What was the vibe?
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_04: Because I got the itch because I was reading a lot of entrepreneur books at the at the time, and it was kind of like, you know, it seemed like there was a ceiling of where I could go, which I was doing well at the time um financially.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_04: But um, you know, I saw the account executives on Facebook all day, and then there was a couple of accounts that there were some failures on some accounts where it was just it was like basic stuff, and we lost the account, and then um I went to my boss, like you know, pissed off about the way something was handled, and I'll never forget they said, Um, when it's Andrew Negri's insurance brokerage, you could do whatever you want.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_04: And then it was like that was like the like the idea, like the inception in my mind.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_04: And then it was kind of, and then everything after that, and then I started kind of like looking at different processes in the agency and saying to myself, you know, I think that this is not right.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_04: I think I could do this better, but not not really knowing if I was right, right?
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_04: And then it was kind of the idea of, well, I want to find out.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and then when you find out that there's a big incentive to making 100% of the commission and a huge tax incentive of being, you know, in business for yourself, it kind of gets less scary.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_04: And um I also had I also had a large network already that I've been cultivating for, you know, seven, eight years prior.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_04: And and I was in, I was placing risk.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_04: So I already kind of knew I knew everything about the business.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_04: So I knew I knew everything from placing the risk with the insurance carrier as well as the front end, I call it, the sale to the insured.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_04: So I had the whole deal flow from the beginning to the end.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_04: So the account management was easy and pretty much um you know, we managed our accounts uh ourselves in the beginning.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_04: I actually did have a partner who ended up going, who ended up buying out at a later date.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_04: But we didn't, you know, I didn't hire an account executive for years later.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_04: So there's always a story about a partner.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: So so when you started, like did you have any hesitations?
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like what was your biggest fear?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like what was your thought process prior to actually launching the the business?
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I launched I didn't really have a big fear, but I launched the business um with one of my largest clients was building a brand new construction project out east on Long Island.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_04: And they were it was a it was a big enough construction project to kind of fund half the year of commissions.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_04: So I knew that if I could get this one account, I was all right.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_04: So prior to me actually taking the leap of faith, I I knew I had this account uh ahead of time.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_04: But then if anyone knows Long Island, New York, there's a lot of construction delays and everything everything takes so long.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_04: So that account that I um that I was counting on didn't come in till six, seven months later.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_04: So I was just you know scraping away, eat what you kill, right?
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_04: And so there was kind of like there wasn't really time for fear.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_04: Like in the beginning, I was like, all right, this is I had you know, you you have this amazing business plan, right?
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_04: And then reality punches you in the face.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_04: Everything takes so much longer than you think it will.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_04: And so, but no, I didn't really have a lot of time for that.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_04: I was just kind of let's you know, let's go, let's get it.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, walk us through that feeling, right?
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_03: There's a lot of people that watch this show and listen to us.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_03: Shout out to you guys, make sure you subscribe, comment.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, sorry, I had to fill that in.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_03: Shameless plug.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_03: Shameless plug.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_03: But they're, you know, like some people are trying to start their own business, whether it's an insurance agency or other business, and you know, they're scared, right?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_03: They're like, like it seems like some of your motivation is like, well, I have this account, right?
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: Then you realize probably this account's not gonna come right away.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: What's walk us through your mindset?
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what do you are you just like, I can't fail, I will not fail?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: Are you talking to yourself in the mirror?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_04: Well, no, I mean you just kind of I've always been eat what you kill, right?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_04: I I pretty much never had a salary being in sales prior.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_04: So I wasn't saying I was afraid of that.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_04: It was more about it's just extra motivation.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_04: It's just you know, nights, weekends, networking, breakfast, lunch, dinner, just like you know, knowing that if you put the work in, you will get rewarded is there is satisfaction in that.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_04: So I kind of knew that already.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_04: But um, but yeah, man, there's some dark times, those dark tough days, and and you know was there any cup of noodle in in the basic ramen, no, well, dollar slices, no, absolutely all of that, all of the above.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, coffee machine, like didn't want to spend money on coffee like that much.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_04: Um, vehicles, like just but um but go what was I gonna say?
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_04: Go going back, um just you have like it.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's smart to have a business plan, right?
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_04: Before you go into it, and you have your business plan, just but just know that everything that you think is gonna happen is not gonna, you're gonna be hit like with all these, you know, haymakers from out of nowhere.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_04: And you have to have the ability to kind of deal with that.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_04: Goes back to the perseverance, right?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_04: You have to just um keep on trucking.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_04: And there's dark times, there's you lose accounts, you get cancellations, you don't know how you're gonna, you know, make make ends meet, you don't know how you're gonna pay bills, credit card debt.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_04: I leveraged myself substantially on credit card debt.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_04: I was like 50, 60 grand in a hole.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_04: No, that that's how I knew to do it at the time, which isn't obviously the smartest move in hindsight, but but you gotta do what you gotta do.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_04: And then um and then you have a little a glimmer of light, and then it gets a little easier, and then you fail again, and then and then it gets a little easier.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_04: And then there's a lot of other people who told me that after a few years, like a few years, it's it takes time just to kind of start rolling, and then it gets easier and easier.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_04: So um I did have a c you included Dom.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, a couple people that said you gotta kind of get through those those dark phases of not wanting to wake up and leave bed to go to work to face the day, right?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_04: Sure, you know about that.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: I I know I know it far too well.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: Probably was two years in.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I it's funny because I remember a couple devastating losses.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_04: Like, need to hit this deal.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_04: If we don't hit this deal, Armageddon, right?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_04: And then like you think you have it locked up, and then you don't hit the deal, and it's Armageddon.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_04: But you get through it, right?
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_04: You figure out something comes up, some some way to kind of get around it, and then you onto the next one.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_04: You put you put it back.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_03: You get another credit card, you make it last another couple of months, and then like but I I think that's you know, I think what you're describing is evolution of an entrepreneur, right?
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_03: You haven't been there before, you're not sure, you know.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: Am I gonna make it?
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_03: Am I not gonna make it?
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_03: You're relying on one deal, just me listening to it.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: And I've been there by the way, so I'm I'm I'm not sure.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_03: I've been there a lot, but but you're like, I need this one deal, right?
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like if you look at it now, you're like, uh, how can I even think about one deal as a business?
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_03: I have hundreds, thousands of clients, one deal doesn't make or break me.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's it's yeah, exactly.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_03: So, question Roman god Sancus, name of your agency, named after a Roman god.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_03: Was that like an F you to your old boss who told you to go?
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_03: No, no, no, no, not at all, not at all.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um, although an FU to my old boss, no, I'm kidding.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_04: Um, um the I don't know how I found it, but if it found me, I joke around.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_04: But um I was looking for some I didn't want to use my last name.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um I wanted to use something that was that that had some meaning behind it, some kind of metaphor or some kind of something symbolic.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_04: And I came across this, and it was the it was um Roman God protector of contracts and marriage oaths and all these different like basically documents, right?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_04: And at the time, a big thing, and and I still believe this, a lot of insurance brokers, all of our competition, they they don't write the right policies.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, so many of them.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_04: In fact, if I only worked on policies that were written incorrectly, I could still be rich.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I could I could be rich beyond belief because it just so many problems out there.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_04: Pretty much all I do is solve problems to the point where if there's no problem, I'm kind of like, look, you're good with where you are, you know, but you don't, you know, there's no reason to fire your broker, they're doing a good job.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_04: But there's so many issues.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_04: So when you write uh an insurance policy, um, what you're doing is you're telling the client that we're gonna take this risk from you, we're gonna transfer it to the insurance company, right?
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_04: That's what insurance is, it's a risk transfer vehicle.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_04: So now, in the event that the policy is written wrong, you're not you're not holding up your end of the bargain, right?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_04: So that's kind of the thought process of at the end of the day, if you're insured with me and my agency, you know you your coverage is gonna trigger.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_04: So if you get sued by a third party, there's not gonna be an exclusion that that should have been covered.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_04: There are things that are not covered, right?
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_04: That are standard, but nothing that should be covered is not gonna be covered.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_04: And the same thing with property.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, property values a little more, a little more easy, right?
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_04: Because basically, you know, what's what should it be valued at?
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_04: What isn't valued at?
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, and the coverages that go along with that.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_04: So at the end of the day, like when there's a fire, you know, my the the promise that we make is we were we're there for you.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_04: We're there.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_04: You you you sign a contract to transfer the risk, we're there to honor that contract.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_04: So that's that's the spirit of of the mission of the company.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: I remember once you told me that uh this is gonna be like kind of insurance nerd shit, but like there was uh a contractor that had uh a bunch of rap projects, like project-specific projects, that the underlying policy was like picking up at audit, and you were able to get those like excluded and and win the business.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember that?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so that was that was from a reputable firm, and it was like a seasoned insurance professional.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_04: And just very basically the the general liability policy is rated on sales.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_04: The sales were, I think it was five million dollars in sales, and half of that was wrap-up work, meaning the insurance was placed elsewhere, so you're supposed to deduct those sales.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_04: And I was gonna leave the meeting because the insurance was a with a good carrier, there was no reason for me, there's nothing I could do.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_04: And it was like the last question on the app.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_04: I was already like negative.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_04: I was like, I'm not gonna write this one.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_04: And it was like, oh, you guys do wrap-ups?
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_04: And they're like, Yeah, half of our work is wrap-ups.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_04: I'm like, half of your work?
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_04: So your your sales are really 10 million?
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_04: Like, no, no, no, the five million is a total, so it's really two and a half million.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_04: So they were their exposure was double, they were being charged double.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_04: So I saved them half, right?
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_04: Half their premium, which was like a few hundred thousand dollars, and then we and then we went back because it was an admitted company, we were able to go back and get prior audits back.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_04: So it was like hundreds of thousands of dollars just because the broker didn't ask them what kind of business, what kind of work they were doing.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_04: And that's the kind of thing that I'm talking about.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_04: It's it's amazing.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_04: You'd be surprised, you know, how much of that is out there.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_04: I just saw one today.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_04: Come across my desk.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_04: The umbrella um doesn't have labor law.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_04: Like the the the Arthur line does, but the umbrella doesn't.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_04: It's like, what are you guys doing?
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_04: You know?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: So do you do you think that that's like obviously you're a seasoned vet, obviously you understand the policy.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think that's you know a smaller company and you worked at a big agency versus a big agency, maybe they're not giving.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: People the right training, maybe that's a different department, maybe that gets lost in the shuffle.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_03: Whereas you know, you're you're you're kind of running your business and you're in the business and you're able to solve something so in fairness to the brokers, New York construction is very difficult.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_04: It's one of the reasons why I like it is it's the hardest.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_04: Again, it goes back to my my English reading comprehension, writing background.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_04: I love the hard, nuanced insurance policies.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_04: But a lot of brokerages, they're not professionals in construction and they really shouldn't be working on the construction.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_04: But at the end of the day, if they get a construction opportunity across their desk, they're gonna work on it.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_04: So I think a lot of it is that where they they don't they don't have an expertise in construction.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_04: See, real estate's easy, you know, for the most part.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_04: There's a lot of the other a lot of the other um market sectors are are easier, you know, insurance is difficult.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_04: But um I just think that most of the mistakes that we see are due to non-expertise in that field.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_04: I do a lot of condo associations also.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um if there's a broker that doesn't know how to do a condo association or they've never done it before, everything's wrong.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_04: Like everything is just there's like the directors and officers' liabilities wrong, the crime policy is wrong, but there's just a lot of different things.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_04: The coverage forms are incorrect.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_04: So I think that uh it's sector, you know, mark, you know, different brokers are good at different market sectors.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_04: But that is one of the reasons why I focus on real estate construction and hospitality.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_04: It's it's kind of like I'm those are my lanes, you know.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, we do write everything, but um, but like I don't, I don't like I don't pretend to be an expert on nonprofits or manufacturing.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_04: I I have a couple manufacturers, but I think that's what it is.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's more about the you know, the niches.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: And how did you develop your niche in those like areas?
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: Was it intentional or like what made you get into those areas?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: And how did you find yeah, I know you get most of your business from referrals, so like how did you find your referral sources and your centers of influence in those areas?
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_04: Great question, Dom.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_04: Uh so um I worked for a real, I was really real estate is where I started.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, real estate, I was working in the city doing placement for accounts nationwide.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_04: So someone's buying assets, and you know, you name the state.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_04: It was my job to figure out what the property consisted of and placing that insurance.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_04: So I always had the kind of real estate background.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but with regard to construction, I was doing a real estate deal um on Long Island.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_04: And is it on Long Island or in Long Island?
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_04: In Long Island, and the developer was building was building the uh the property, and I was representing the board when it transferred from the developer to the homeowners association board when the controls.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_04: So that's kind of how I got started with the first developer, and then he saw how I handled some issues with the real estate.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um, because there's there's a little bit of a it's a little bit tough when an account is going from uh a construction site to a permanent real estate.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_04: It's a lot of there's a lot of nuance with regard to vacancy and and you know certificate of occupancies and things like that.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_04: So he saw how how I handled that.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_04: So he gave me a shot on the construction account.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_04: So that's how I got my feet wet in construction, plus I was already doing it in the city.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_04: And then once I wrote the developer, we actually do risk management for the developer, which not other a lot of brokers do.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_04: We vet the subcontractors, we review their policies, and then after a while, a lot of times we'll find that some of the contractors are insured with a broker that isn't savvy in construction, and they come to us for the policies.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_04: So by providing an extra service to the developer, we inherited, right, a huge book of business of contractors.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_04: That's really how we got into contractors.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_04: And so now we just provide at a scale risk management services for all of our developers, and then it's just a matter of time before the subcontractors come our way.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_03: I've heard is that a common practice?
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: And in like are people, are other people doing such things?
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_03: Because teams are pretty much none of them.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_03: None of them.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_04: Nobody reviews sub policies, not like we do.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_04: They're starting to catch on a little now, but we actually order the certs.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_04: We have a team of uh these great virtual assistants.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_04: That's what I'd say I was going with it.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_04: Elevate teams.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_04: All they do all day long is review subcontractor policies.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_04: And both of them are great, they're amazing.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_04: And we developed a website to kind of streamline the process.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_04: We were using Excel spreadsheets for years, and so they, you know, I think there's also, you know, they uh they speak Spanish, which is a you know a big part of our position is we want to try to help the subcontractor get the job.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_04: A lot of times there's a language barrier, so they're very helpful in that respect.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_04: And basically just tell them what they need to kind of you know to get the job.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_04: And if if the broker is not like helping them, then that's kind of where we step in.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_04: We we don't want to try to say, hey, we're we're shutting the door, you're not approved for the job, and then say, hey, you know, come with us, write the business.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_04: We try to we try to maintain like there's no conflict of interest.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_04: It's we ask them, look, if you're we'll tell your broker how to do it, if they don't, if they they're not responding or for whatever reason, you can come with us.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_04: Most of the time they do come with us.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_04: Um but yeah, no one else does it.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_04: And and the and the reasons why they don't do it from like the large brokerages is because they don't have the bandwidth, they think it's too expensive to service.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_04: But what they their blind side is that the the other business that they would have gotten had they done this for their clients the whole time.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_04: And these developers are paying so much in New York construction because of the scaffold law, which I'm sure we'll get to.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_04: They're paying so much money in New York construction.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_04: My position, my pitch to them is don't you think it should be included?
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_04: You know?
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_04: So usually we're pretty successful in that respect.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: So what you're saying is everyone should hire a bunch of VAs and start their thing.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_03: Don't tell nobody, Andrew.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's smart though.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, the fact that you're able to figure that out, right?
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: And the fact that you're able to kind of capitalize on what you're really great at and build that into a business.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_03: Kudos to you.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's hard to do.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_03: And most people, you know, if you look at once again, the evolution of business, there's those, right?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_03: We talk about niche on the show all the time.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, we're super niche business, and a lot of other people that we meet would either have their niche or figure something out that's different than than the competition.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_03: But it's it's process, right?
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's niche, it's being an expert in the field uh and being self-aware enough to understand that hey, there's something here, and now I can productize it and capitalize on it.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you gotta execute.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_04: Gotta execute.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_04: I remember when I was building the website, you were like, you gotta execute.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_04: A little bit of a you know, a kick.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_04: So but it's great.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_04: We're adding AI to it now.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_04: We're in the process of doing that, which is the coolest thing ever.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_04: We're just um basically taking my risk management insurance brain and I'm giving it to programmers to build this thing, to, to, you know, customize it for us for what we need to um you know to review their insurance policies.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_04: So um, I'm really pumped for that.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_04: I'm trying to launch that, trying to get it done by the end of June, but we'll see.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's exciting.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: Do you find that like building this second thing has been a lot easier for you since you've been through like the ringer with the insurance business?
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I have capital now, so that's a big difference.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_04: So, well, I mean, in all seriousness, I mean, in the beginning, you're bootstrapping, right?
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_04: And you yeah, I was broke at the time.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it was but um, but yeah, having a little capital makes it a little bit easier, and also um I'm starting with a team, you know, that's big.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_04: So um I'm able to kind of just I'm I'm able to in I'm able to use capital to make it a little bit easier, but there's still like it's funny because I have that startup mentality where I like I have this idea, it's a great idea.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_04: I I could see the path, I know I have to execute, but I'm waiting for the thing that I don't see, the failure that you don't like, it comes out of left field, and you gotta just jump over that hurdle.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_04: And I like I just I haven't seen it yet, but like I know it's coming.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_04: You know, that that train's never late, you know.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_04: It's just it's just a matter of when um when that happens.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_04: So so far, so good.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but we'll see.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_04: We'll see how it goes.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_03: What would you tell your you know, your younger self, like fast rewind to back when you're starting out, and obviously what you know now.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_03: What would you tell yourself?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_03: Let's say if you want, like you you have the knowledge, right?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_03: You made the mistakes, you got the battle scars.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_04: Everything takes longer than you expect.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_04: So, like, you you're starting your business, you have this great idea, you're running, you know, you're hustling, there's there's no patience, which is all great things, but then you get frustrated because it doesn't happen fast enough.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_04: But what you gotta realize is that it is happening.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_04: It's just you're not seeing it in real time.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_04: Once you, once you look back and see how far you've come in in six months, you're like, oh wow, things are a little bit different.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_04: And maybe I'm not, I didn't hit my goal yet, but I'm a little closer.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_04: So that's the biggest thing for me.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_04: It just everything just takes so much longer than I and even today, you know, like it's just it's everything.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_04: It's really an everything.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_04: So I would I would that's without a doubt the number one thing I would tell myself.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_04: Just keep doing it, be patient.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: So you you mentioned that you have some capital now, and uh rumor has it that you sold your insurance business.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_02: You want to tell us what what that process was like?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_04: No, I don't actually.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_04: It was I'll just say it was interesting dipping my toe into the private equity world a little bit.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_04: Um, we ran a process with um a good, a close personal friend of mine who I trust completely was uh he's an ex-Goldman Sachs guy, you know, just an MA guy through and through.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_04: And if I didn't have him through the process, I don't know what I would have done.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_04: Um and I elected to go that route instead of going with uh an insurance MA guy.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_04: But, you know, it was it was grueling, man.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, in the beginning, um we we we we we started doing this for the year end uh the uh quarter two of 2025.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm gonna wrap up my Q2 numbers and then you know figure this out and go out to market.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_04: And then it was like, well, your numbers are all screwed up because you should be, you should change over your accounting from cash to accrual.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_04: So then, you know, going back to everything takes longer, right?
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_04: I want to close by Labor Day, right?
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_04: Which was ridiculous in hindsight.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_04: So then we redid the numbers.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_04: All right, great.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_04: And then it's like there were still problems with the numbers and problems with the way the bookkeepers were logging the numbers, which was okay for me running the business, but not for presenting to a potential buyer.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_04: So just going through that, then going through the process of meeting all these buyers, and you see some of like the most basic sales techniques.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_04: Again, I've been around sales for years, I've seen it all.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_04: I know the pitch when you when you open your mouth, I know what your, I know your the type of tactic.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_04: You don't even know what it is, I know the name.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_04: So they're like, oh man, and like some of them, some of the M and some of the buyers wouldn't provide any information, but they wanted to get you on the the Zoom and try to feel you out for what number you wanted to be at before they offered provided an LOI.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, guys, we're running a process here.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_04: You guys got to submit a bid, you know?
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_04: No tickie, no laundry, right?
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_04: It's like we went out, we got 10 uh LOIs, and then narrowed it down, and narrowed it down to three.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_04: And and then once we got to that second round, um, all the buyers are like, where do I need to be?
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_04: Like, and and what I really what I didn't want to do, because I've heard of this happen to them before, I didn't want to take a proposal from one buyer and give it to the other and say, here, make this if you do this, I'm yours.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_04: Because that's what happens to us in the insurance business.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_04: So that was like a big sh that was a big strict like rule that I followed for myself.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_04: We ran an honest process.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_04: You have more integrity than I have, Andrew.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_04: I that's what I hear everybody does, but no, we didn't do that.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_04: We were specific with that.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_04: Um I always kind of thought it was gonna be choice, and we ran through the process, and then because again, you were you went to choice, so I was comfortable with that.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_04: So we ran the process, but I kind of was feeling more comfortable with choice the whole time.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, there was a couple other offers that were very appealing, um, but then it was right around um I want to say October when I when I signed the LOI and then due diligence starts.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_04: And due diligence wasn't that bad, but legal was a nightmare.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_04: I thought due diligence was the headache, and if I got through due diligence, um I'll get through the legal.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_04: My attorneys will do that.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_04: But what happened, the bit the other big thing was um we were running the numbers up until um July 1st, second quarter, and then I had a ridiculous third quarter.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_04: So I was like, all right, well, we gotta do this, you know, we gotta the business is bigger, it's a it's a different business than it was three months ago.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_04: So then I delayed the process, and then in December, I wrote I wrote two million in new business premium in December.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_04: It was my my best month.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_04: That's what I usually write in a year.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_04: This is my best month by far.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_04: So then I'm like, well, we gotta include December, you know.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_04: So then so then by the time January came, you know, we just closed up, we did due diligence already.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_04: I made him extend another two months, and then it's like, okay, get legal together and close by the first of February.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_04: And then, you know, I'm laying out retainer, retainer after retainer, and we're going through this hell of a legal process.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_04: My attorney is fighting with their attorney.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_04: You know, they're saying, like, my attorney's nitpicking, you know, attorneys are meant to split hairs, right?
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, they're well, they're paid by the hour, so my attorney's nitpicking an issue.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_04: Their attorney's like, I've never seen anyone nitpick this issue.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_04: You know, this is the I have to 40 deals, this is the first time I've ever seen that.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_04: And then my attorney's like, I've been doing MA since 1990.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_04: This isn't my first rodeo.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_04: And there's like an email fight, and I'm paying for it, right?
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_04: And then, and then we get legal together, and everything's great, and everything's done.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_04: And like, we're working.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_04: I remember we were working on Sundays during like the NFL playoffs, and we're all we're all working, and then boom, two one, they delayed the closing two weeks.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, again, I'm I'm on the ropes with retainers, you know, and I'm like, guys, what are we doing here?
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_04: I'm like, did they run out of money?
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I'm like, oh, I I just ran this process.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_04: Are we gonna close?
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_04: Is this a serious company?
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_04: All these things are going through my head, and you know, and then and then they throw in last minute things in legal, and then I bluff that I'm gonna walk away if they don't change that, but I'm not walking away, but I'm bluffing, and then you know, just it was just intense.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_03: Did you close though?
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_03: Congratulations.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_02: Closed.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: Did the money, did they have the money?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_02: The wire hit.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_04: So the what the best the best is the wire, right?
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_04: So, you know, it's 9 a.m.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_04: It's supposed to go through 9 a.m.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_04: So so that it's like, do you accept the terms?
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, so I'm waiting for my attorney to respond, 9 a.m., 9 15, 9 30.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm getting a text from Ian, like, you gotta love these attorneys, right?
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_04: Like, what are you doing right now?
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_04: Like, you should be just saying, Yes, I accept the wire.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_04: I accept, I accept.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, release the signatures.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_04: What are we doing right now?
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_04: I was waiting, so it didn't come until like uh that evening.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but uh, but yeah, then when it comes, it's surreal.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_04: It's surreal.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_04: You're you're rich overnight.
• 39:04
  unknown: Yeah.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_04: But the you know, the interesting thing about it is it's a it's a weird feeling because I don't know, I as soon as it came, it was like I I uh my ambition actually increased.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_04: It was like a little taste of of more.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_04: Like I said, it was like you couldn't afford and now you're like it was like it you would think that it was like, all right, I'm good, you know, I'm set up, I could kind of you know get put some in put some money away and invest, and I'm I'm gonna be comfortable.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_04: But that it was the opposite feeling.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_04: It was like, well, first of all, it was like don't blow it, right?
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_04: Right, like and then the second is like, all right, well, what's the next step?
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_04: And now I'm I'm in that next step, and I'm I'm busier than I've ever been.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_04: Short of the due diligence, which was like a second career.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, I'm busier now than I've ever been, and and and I'm enjoying it, you know.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_03: So it's funny you say that.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_03: I I had a few buddies of mine sell their companies, and they both said the same thing, like that, like you know, during their due diligence, it was like the busiest months they ever had.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_03: And they're like, Do I really want to go sell them, doesn't it?
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_04: I have to sell.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_04: And then, like, and then nitpicking you on like EBITDA, and you're like, guy, if you wait another month, my EBITDA is gonna be more.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_04: Like, you pay like lock because insurance, you know, it does go up every year.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_04: Like, you you have Lyft and you get new accounts, so it's it's you know, you're always worth more in six months than you are today, for the most part, unless you lose a lot of accounts.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, but for the so there was that too.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_04: How does it fail to have a boss?
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_03: Well, that's another story.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_04: I mean we're gonna talk about there's a lot, there's a lot that I didn't realize about this company.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um, just some some assumptions that I had that I didn't realize, but um but it's been good.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_04: I can't complain.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: Good.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_03: Let's get into let's get into the fun stuff.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_03: We're gonna go get into rapid fire.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_03: One word a sentence um that comes to mind.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_04: We're gonna ask you some so is that your way of telling me I'm too long-winded?
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_04: No, not at all.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_04: Not at all.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_04: I think you're agreeing.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_03: Uh but the rapid fire has got to be rapid.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_03: All right, quick.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_03: Let's go.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh favorite restaurant on Long Island.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_03: Let's start there.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_02: These are Suffolk County guys.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_02: Rapkeys?
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: Rapkeys.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_02: The Bryant Melville.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_03: Say that again.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_03: I missed it.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_04: The Bryant in Melville.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_04: It's like my second office on there once once a week, once every other week.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_04: Shout out to JP Marangolo.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_04: There's nicer ones, but like that's my favorite.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_03: Shout out to isn't that the Cipellini guys?
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_03: Isn't that the same, the same owners?
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_04: The Bryant Cooper.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, same same guy.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_04: Is that also that?
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um what's your Starbucks order?
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_04: Uh I drink espresso.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, bro.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: He's a real Guido.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_02: He only drinks espresso.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_02: A little bit in the morning, a little bit after lunch.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_03: Uh something in the industry that people don't question enough.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_04: In the industry, people don't question enough.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_04: Um, which I don't know.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_04: Probably no one looks every all the insurance companies complain about capacity and they complain about um the the reasons why they're hardening up and they have all these excuses, and then there's reinsurance treaties and all this stuff.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_04: But if you look at the stock prices of these insurance companies, and it's going up.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_04: So so like there's it doesn't it doesn't add up.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_04: What what they're telling us to tell our clients doesn't add up.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_04: And I happen to ask that question, but I don't think enough people did.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_04: What's uh we haven't had a hurricane and uh like a formidable hurricane on Long Island since 2012.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_04: But the the property rates aren't reflective of that.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_04: Why?
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: Why is that right?
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_04: There's not a lot of fire, unless there's a lot of fires that I don't know about, but I don't know.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um what's one thing you do now that your younger self wouldn't understand?
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_02: One thing I do now.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I dress I dress for work every day.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_04: I know that you two are very casual.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um We're gonna call us out on our own show.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_04: But but um my father always used to say if you want to be treated like a professional, you dress like a professional.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_04: So every single day, I'm not I don't wear a suit every day, but I'm Always wearing business attire.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_04: I don't show up in the office in jeans or anything else.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_04: Now, if you would have told me that when I was younger, I would have been like, you're crazy, you know.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_04: But um, but no, that that's probably my biggest thing.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_04: And it kind of makes me stand out a little bit, I think.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_03: So well, this is my next question.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_03: Are you wearing suede or leather shoes?
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_03: Suede.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_02: He's got the suede Ferragamas on.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_02: No, just kidding.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_04: Johnson and Murphy.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_04: Only Johnson and Murphy.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: You're upstairs.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_03: Something you believed early on that you were completely wrong about.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_04: Something I believed early on in I guess insurance, right?
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_04: Um or not insurance business.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_04: Man, I guess I'll go back to the speed, the speed of how long everything takes.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I think I'll stick with that one.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_03: Alright.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Andrew, it was a pleasure to have you on the show.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_03: Congratulations on all your success.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_03: If people want to reach out to you and talk about contractors insurance or pick your brain, where where where can they find you?
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_04: Email me or or call me on my cell.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_04: Should I leave my cell on this?
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_04: Or is this uh it's not a function, right?
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_04: Andrew at thesankusgroup.com.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_04: That's me.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_03: And to close it off, if you could go back to your 17-year-old self, what would you tell them about the path ahead?
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_04: I would just say slow down, take your time.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_04: Everything takes longer than you expect.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_04: Enjoy the moment.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_04: Enjoy the moment, relax.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_04: Don't be so when I was younger, I was really more so ambitious and so like I'm you know, what am I gonna do to make it?
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_04: It it works out.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_04: It all works out.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_03: It all works out.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_03: Well, we're sitting here for those of you that are running really fast, slow down, take it in, and you will eventually get there.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_03: We appreciate you, Andrew, and looking forward to seeing you some more companies.
• 46:11
  unknown: All right.
• 46:12
  unknown: Thank you.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_04: See you as always.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_04: Thanks for having me.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_01: See you around.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_01: Bye.