Latest / Outside the Box with Leon Osman and Tony Bellew / Stubbs: Changing Room Stories, Winning the Scottish Cup and Beating Cancer | Outside the Box Ep3

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Stubbs: Changing Room Stories, Winning the Scottish Cup and Beating Cancer | Outside the Box Ep3 · Outside the Box with Leon Osman and Tony Bellew

• 0:00
  Well, Stubzee, welcome to Outside the Box, you're our first ever guest.
• 0:22
  You must like Aussie because he only told us three, four days ago that you were going
• 0:25
  to jump on.
• 0:26
  Well, to be fair, I got a message on, was it Sunday?
• 0:29
  Yeah, could have been, yeah.
• 0:31
  Was that the other Sunday?
• 0:32
  Yeah, chose to message it on the Sunday as well.
• 0:35
  To be fair, I did contemplate saying no.
• 0:40
  Just so I had the ball.
• 0:42
  It was, no, it was privileged to be asked to be fair.
• 0:46
  I'm very last minute, aren't I?
• 0:48
  I'm obviously getting the numbers up highlight.
• 0:50
  That's why you want me.
• 0:51
  Yeah, that's what we wanted.
• 0:53
  Biggest.
• 0:54
  Yeah, and we needed the bigger guys on that side of the table, the little guys on this table.
• 0:59
  Well, it has been on this table.
• 1:01
  We've got like, you know, the little legs over there.
• 1:04
  It's a little bit of focus on the cameras.
• 1:06
  Yeah.
• 1:10
  Alan, I hope you can settle something for us.
• 1:12
  Yeah.
• 1:13
  Aussie likes to tell us how good he is at golf every time on the podcast.
• 1:16
  Is that true?
• 1:17
  He's a decent player.
• 1:19
  He's, I think he'd be played a bit more.
• 1:21
  He would, he would be less than what he is.
• 1:23
  Stop shooting.
• 1:24
  What are you talking to?
• 1:25
  He's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's the gaffer on the golf.
• 1:30
  Yeah, he's, he's, he's hovered around tennis.
• 1:33
  But I've always thought he was better than that.
• 1:35
  So I think he's, I think he's just happy.
• 1:37
  You know what?
• 1:38
  Sometimes he can manage, he can manage your handicap.
• 1:40
  I think Aussie manages his handicap very well.
• 1:42
  No, it's not like that.
• 1:43
  I just, you know, I'm not necessarily good with a card of me.
• 1:45
  And that's all I like to play so much.
• 1:47
  I'm very good socially way enough to be me 10.7.
• 1:50
  I am.
• 1:51
  It's been, it's been a lot for the last seven years.
• 1:53
  I don't know how it has been.
• 1:55
  I've had it a long time because when we go away playing golf,
• 1:58
  I need the, I need the extra coupler shot.
• 2:00
  Because I'm using, no, I'm usually tipsy by the time we play golf.
• 2:03
  You just not hit the course regularly together still or?
• 2:06
  We, we, we have done.
• 2:08
  We probably haven't recently.
• 2:10
  Me too.
• 2:11
  More than so.
• 2:12
  So yeah, we played your place about.
• 2:14
  Yeah, I mean, but before that, you know, we were playing a little bit more.
• 2:18
  But recently, we, we get other catch up.
• 2:21
  Yeah, for me.
• 2:22
  Normally we played.
• 2:24
  So we played each other.
• 2:25
  S and A for me.
• 2:27
  Orbscape.
• 2:28
  Okay.
• 2:29
  You know, so we'll, we'll bounce around.
• 2:30
  Yeah.
• 2:31
  Actually, I didn't do that.
• 2:32
  What's our group at one point?
• 2:33
  The tough, the toughy Thursday club, didn't we?
• 2:35
  Yeah.
• 2:36
  You know, we're just introduced me back into it.
• 2:38
  All right.
• 2:39
  Okay.
• 2:40
  No, we're all right.
• 2:41
  So outside the golf, what are you up to, Alan?
• 2:43
  So I'm doing a bit of coaching.
• 2:45
  So I do, I do.
• 2:46
  I'm the director of football at Skaysby Hall School.
• 2:49
  Oh, nice.
• 2:50
  So I do that there.
• 2:51
  So I'll look after.
• 2:52
  We've got a couple of coaches who were there and we'll, we'll do one-to-ones.
• 2:57
  So some of the, the, the pupils have come out of lessons and do a 30 minute one-to-one with the coaches.
• 3:04
  So there's, there's myself and, and then two.
• 3:07
  And then we, they will do after school clubs as well.
• 3:10
  So yeah, so I'm, and that's what's keeping me busy.
• 3:12
  I do a little bit of media and I do some bits for everything TV.
• 3:17
  And also I do maths commentary for BBC Master as well.
• 3:21
  Have you still got that love for coaching?
• 3:23
  Obviously, I have a lot of strength in, in management.
• 3:25
  Probably my, my love for coaching is probably more with the younger ones.
• 3:29
  You know, I feel as if now I get more enjoyment in terms of seeing the younger players.
• 3:36
  You know, comment, or improve them or comment through, but improve them.
• 3:40
  There's nothing better than seeing it a young player come through.
• 3:44
  Because I think we've all been in that environment where.
• 3:48
  To see someone have that opportunity and basically following similar footsteps to what you, you've wanted to do helps.
• 3:57
  So what ages are you work with now because you have, you have the twenty ones that have been going over the years, which is.
• 4:03
  Obviously, still development and bring them players through which gives you more joy, I suppose, with kind of age development suits you better.
• 4:12
  Well, I think.
• 4:14
  Very young.
• 4:16
  It's hard.
• 4:17
  In terms of because you're doing the very basics with, you know, because you look, it seems to be getting younger and younger.
• 4:23
  If you look, I say for instance, everything, you know, you're looking at six years old, you know, so.
• 4:29
  They're getting them in earlier and earlier.
• 4:32
  I think from, I would say from.
• 4:35
  I think younger players now are far more advanced than when.
• 4:41
  I was at age, I think because of what they're seeing on TV.
• 4:45
  I think all the skills that they're trying to do, I sometimes feel as if skills are more important than the basics.
• 4:52
  Right now, I think sometimes we've, I think we've moved away from maybe even social media when you see ballers and all these, all these, all these people.
• 5:01
  I think you can never get away from control and passing.
• 5:06
  You say, you're saying people act as if the skills are more important than the basics and no one's actually teaching the basics anymore.
• 5:13
  I think I think understandable though.
• 5:16
  Can you explain it like that in terms of social media impact?
• 5:19
  I think young, young children because of social media and, and Premier League and everything else, they think it's more sexy.
• 5:32
  Incessions do a skill than what is to have a better face touch or to be able to pass the ball.
• 5:38
  Because ultimately, the biggest thing that any footballer can have is to be able to control the ball and be able to pass it.
• 5:44
  You know, you look at probably one of the best ones over the recent years in the state of Beckham.
• 5:49
  It wasn't the most skillful player, but he could, he had the touch.
• 5:53
  It was good as anybody and he could put a ball in the six months.
• 5:57
  It was a master at the fundamentals.
• 6:00
  I remember playing with him playing us.
• 6:04
  It was the game where I remember when Beckham put it reversed and took the ball.
• 6:08
  It was a free kick against him.
• 6:09
  I wasn't playing. We lost our game also.
• 6:11
  I was, yeah, I was.
• 6:12
  And I remember Beckham's play, Vanessa always gone to take me long.
• 6:18
  And as I've gone to go with him, he's already coming back and the ball was already on its way from Beckham into his feet.
• 6:25
  And I was like, wow, this is a different level.
• 6:28
  You know, in terms of their understanding of each other's games.
• 6:31
  And that's, that's, you know, what you, what you have to deal with.
• 6:35
  But, you know, so I just think, I think with everything in football, everything goes full circle.
• 6:41
  You know, I think at this moment of time, certainly for younger players,
• 6:45
  it's all about skills and how many step-overs and flicks and tricks can you do.
• 6:50
  Whereas it won't be long before it comes back again.
• 6:53
  I ain't an awful lot of them saying, now, to be an ol' book at what's it called?
• 6:59
  Oh, they're ol' book coached.
• 7:01
  The game and the skill is being coached out of them.
• 7:05
  Yeah.
• 7:06
  And I had an awful lot.
• 7:07
  What do you mean when you say that?
• 7:09
  Well, I mean, the game is being coached out of them.
• 7:12
  I think what they mean is that sometimes I think they're getting that much coaching.
• 7:17
  The individualism gets pushed.
• 7:21
  They can't make themselves.
• 7:22
  They can't make themselves.
• 7:23
  You don't decision making skills.
• 7:24
  You basically, what used to happen, go back years, one of the reasons football was so enjoyable.
• 7:29
  Especially for me as an attacking player, the baller comes here.
• 7:31
  I get told roughly where I needed to be at the right moment in the attacking end.
• 7:35
  And I also used to get told, do all these skills on the edge of the penalty area.
• 7:38
  Don't be doing them in the half way, that basic information.
• 7:40
  But then when the ball came to me, I could decide what I wanted to do, depending on what I saw.
• 7:46
  Whereas now, patterns of play are so distinctive and so defined
• 7:50
  that if you get the ball in this position you've been told to be, they've given you two options.
• 7:54
  You either pass it there or you pass it there.
• 7:56
  There's no room for anything else.
• 7:58
  There's no room for your individual mind to go, I see a gap there.
• 8:01
  And I'm going to run through it because if you lose it, you're now in trouble.
• 8:04
  You've let the team down.
• 8:05
  You've let squad down.
• 8:06
  You've let this system down.
• 8:07
  There've been one working so hard to do.
• 8:09
  So I think that's what it means.
• 8:11
  Anyway, those define a moment of making sense.
• 8:13
  By saying that though, is that, is that mean I work coaching the Mavelics out of the game?
• 8:17
  Because I haven't seen, I see it up to the age of 14s.
• 8:24
  And then after the 14s, I don't see them shining.
• 8:27
  Well, I think we're all blues.
• 8:30
  We've got one at Everton.
• 8:32
  It's Jack Elish.
• 8:33
  And then you look at Jack Elish when he went to Mancetti.
• 8:38
  And for another one minute, would I ever criticize, obviously, Pep Guardiola, because he's the best coach.
• 8:44
  I think we've seen over here in terms of making a change, as long as, along with Arthur Venger, in terms of how he changed the culture and everything.
• 8:52
  But Jack Elish went to city and he had to do what he said and job.
• 8:59
  So Jack Elish, you know, when he's come to Everton, and he's been given a bit of a fleece spirit again.
• 9:05
  A new lease of life.
• 9:06
  Being put an arm around his shoulder, you know, he's been given a bit of love.
• 9:10
  You know, where would you say Jack Elish has been the best?
• 9:14
  And you'd have to say Arthur Venger, because he was allowed to go anywhere he wanted.
• 9:19
  I actually think that Jack Elish, we got, although he got a couple of earlier sets, I think that Jack Elish, we got in the first couple of weeks of the season,
• 9:29
  was a different Jack Elish that we was playing for as roundabout Christmas time, or just before he got injured.
• 9:34
  Because I did think week by week, I felt he was getting rid of the control, or getting rid of this idea that he has to do this.
• 9:41
  Now, I felt he was getting more and more back.
• 9:44
  More freedom.
• 9:45
  I think David Moyers and this Everton squad, this 17 was saying to him, that you can be a bit more yourself.
• 9:49
  You don't have to just lay off. You can go do this.
• 9:51
  And I think it took him a few sort of months to really buy into that.
• 9:55
  That's one of the reasons why he seems to look so nice.
• 9:57
  I think we've got that element.
• 9:59
  I think the only difference with element in that is probably one of the only players I see in the league who wants to work his hard gone backwards as he does going forwards.
• 10:09
  I haven't seen a player like that for a long, long time.
• 10:12
  I'm not since Pina and Baz and stuff like, you know, when they were working for each other and fighting for each other.
• 10:18
  I haven't seen that in a player who raises back and he looks like he's given it out of 100% just to get that ball back.
• 10:26
  It's very rare you see it.
• 10:28
  Like when you see Dock who, there's no way Dock who's chasing back as fast as fast he's gone forward.
• 10:32
  Same on the other side.
• 10:34
  Some annual maybe does a little bit more.
• 10:36
  I don't see any of them with the intensity that element in Daedus.
• 10:39
  I've gone back to your point where you said about the Mavericks.
• 10:41
  He didn't really come up through the ranks in a normal way.
• 10:44
  So maybe that's why.
• 10:45
  Three footballer.
• 10:46
  Do you think that the last is a street footballer?
• 10:50
  Possibly but then is he going to...
• 10:53
  You see I think he's the last ever one of them.
• 10:56
  What is will as a easy pair for the example?
• 10:59
  Will you see that taken from as a?
• 11:02
  Will you be allowed?
• 11:03
  Will Michele allow as a to still be?
• 11:05
  Because I don't think as he looks the same player that he was.
• 11:08
  I think I lost them.
• 11:10
  I know where you're getting.
• 11:12
  And I do think he will change his game slightly.
• 11:16
  Is that a good thing?
• 11:17
  What Michele will be best served to do?
• 11:22
  You bring in a player and you want to make sure he understands the environment
• 11:25
  and buys into what you're doing.
• 11:27
  But at the same time you can't take away from him what he's what's made him.
• 11:30
  Why'd you buy him?
• 11:31
  You want to sign him in the first place.
• 11:33
  So it's a fine line about how they keep trying to encourage him to go and try and do it.
• 11:38
  But looking at it in the game against Arsenal, he had the post.
• 11:42
  Whereas he probably had better options to hit the ball.
• 11:45
  But you never stop making the decision on the edge of the penalty area to try and win you the game
• 11:49
  and go and do a bit of magic.
• 11:50
  Didn't work out on that.
• 11:51
  I think you see that's the difference between them two players.
• 11:54
  Semenio.
• 11:55
  And as a Semenio is working and flying to get back.
• 11:58
  And I don't think that that's as a stand where it is.
• 12:01
  It is Semenio's.
• 12:02
  And I think that's possibly why Pep went all over Semenio.
• 12:06
  Probably didn't go for that.
• 12:08
  I think the fact that when you look at Semenio and all of that,
• 12:10
  I think Pep obviously realized the type of player that he was getting.
• 12:15
  And he was going to be a straight fit into the team.
• 12:17
  Because you look at quite a few players that go to City.
• 12:20
  You don't necessarily go straight into the team.
• 12:22
  Get the ground running.
• 12:23
  You know, take time.
• 12:24
  They take time to get used to the demands of what Pep wants from you as a, as in that role.
• 12:29
  Did I start about cushion off?
• 12:31
  Yeah.
• 12:32
  Talk time.
• 12:33
  Yeah.
• 12:34
  Cushion up, talk time.
• 12:35
  He looks at completely different player now.
• 12:36
  It looks on the top side of the line.
• 12:37
  I said, it's stable.
• 12:38
  And I think you have tried to do it in his debut.
• 12:40
  He said to us, I think he should have been team of the season.
• 12:42
  The season, but I said he hasn't seen a turn around in a player like that.
• 12:45
  Unbelievable.
• 12:46
  But I think Pep got to just touch it on both of what you just said there.
• 12:50
  Pep got to about, well, to January when the window opens.
• 12:54
  I thought, I'm this transition season.
• 12:57
  It's actually going way ahead as scheduled.
• 12:59
  If I get a couple of players to complement what I've got, we might win the league.
• 13:03
  And he bought in gay, stolen.
• 13:05
  What a brilliant.
• 13:06
  Great.
• 13:07
  Really.
• 13:08
  I put also some in you.
• 13:09
  And the reason why.
• 13:10
  So many of us working.
• 13:11
  I don't think.
• 13:13
  If you look at some annual.
• 13:15
  He's technically at the same level as half, not half as a couple of those city players.
• 13:20
  But he balances them off because.
• 13:22
  As what he can give you is he's basically the anti binard or silver.
• 13:27
  In terms of, you know, he can run away.
• 13:29
  There'd be no match between running and physicality.
• 13:31
  But some annual never match binard or silver.
• 13:34
  It.
• 13:35
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  It's going to be a good match.
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  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:41
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:42
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:43
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:44
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:45
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:46
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:47
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:48
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:49
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:50
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:51
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:52
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:53
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:54
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:55
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:56
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:57
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:58
  It's going to be a good match.
• 15:59
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:00
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:01
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:02
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:03
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:04
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:05
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:06
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:07
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:08
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:09
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:10
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:11
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:12
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:13
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:14
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:15
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:16
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:17
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:18
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:19
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:20
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:21
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:22
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:23
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:24
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:25
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:26
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:27
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:28
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:29
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:30
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:31
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:32
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:33
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:34
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:35
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:36
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:37
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:38
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:39
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:40
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:41
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:42
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:43
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:44
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:45
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:46
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:47
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:48
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:49
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:50
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:51
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:52
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:53
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:54
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:55
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:56
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:57
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:58
  It's going to be a good match.
• 16:59
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:00
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:01
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:02
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:03
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:04
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:05
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:06
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:07
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:08
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:09
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:10
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:11
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:12
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:13
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:14
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:15
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:16
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:17
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:18
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:19
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:20
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:21
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:22
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:23
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:24
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:25
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:26
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:27
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:28
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:29
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:30
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:31
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:32
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:33
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:34
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:35
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:36
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:37
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:38
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:39
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:40
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:41
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:42
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:43
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:44
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:45
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:46
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:47
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:48
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:49
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:50
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:51
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:52
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:53
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:54
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:55
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:56
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:57
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:58
  It's going to be a good match.
• 17:59
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:00
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:01
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:02
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:03
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:04
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:05
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:06
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:07
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:08
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:09
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:10
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:11
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:12
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:13
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:14
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:15
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:16
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:17
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:18
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:19
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:20
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:21
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:22
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:23
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:24
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:25
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:26
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:27
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:28
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:29
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:30
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:31
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:32
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:33
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:34
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:35
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:36
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:37
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:38
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:39
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:40
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:41
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:42
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:43
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:44
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:45
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:46
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:47
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:48
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:49
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:50
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:51
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:52
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:53
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:54
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:55
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:56
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:57
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:58
  It's going to be a good match.
• 18:59
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:00
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:01
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:02
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:03
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:04
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:05
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:06
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:07
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:08
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:09
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:10
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:11
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:12
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:13
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:14
  It's going to be a good match.
• 19:15
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:16
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:17
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:18
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:19
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:20
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:21
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:22
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:23
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:24
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:25
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:26
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:27
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:28
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:29
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:30
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:31
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:32
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:33
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:34
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:35
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:36
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:37
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:38
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:39
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:40
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:41
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:42
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:43
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:44
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:45
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:46
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:47
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:48
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:49
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:50
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:51
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:52
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:53
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:54
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:55
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:56
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:57
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:58
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 19:59
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:00
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:01
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:02
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:03
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:04
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:05
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:06
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:07
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:08
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:09
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:10
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:11
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:12
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:13
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:14
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:15
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:16
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:17
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:18
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:19
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:20
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:21
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:22
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:23
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:24
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:25
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:26
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:27
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:28
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:29
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:30
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:31
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:32
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:33
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:34
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:35
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:36
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:37
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:38
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:39
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:40
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:41
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:42
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:43
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:44
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:45
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:46
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:47
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:48
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:49
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:50
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:51
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:52
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:53
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:54
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:55
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:56
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:57
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:58
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 20:59
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:00
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:01
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:02
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:03
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:04
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:05
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:06
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:07
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:08
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:09
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:10
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:11
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:12
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:13
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:14
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:15
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:16
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:17
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:18
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:19
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:20
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:21
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:22
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:23
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:24
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:25
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:26
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:27
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:28
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:29
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:30
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:31
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:32
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:33
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:34
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:35
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:36
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:37
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:38
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:39
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:40
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:41
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:42
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:43
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:44
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:45
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:46
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:47
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:48
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:49
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:50
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:51
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:52
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:53
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:54
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:55
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:56
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:57
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:58
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 21:59
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:00
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:01
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:02
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:03
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:04
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:05
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:06
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:07
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:08
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:09
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:10
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:11
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:12
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:13
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:14
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:15
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:16
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:17
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:18
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:19
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:20
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:21
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:22
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:23
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:24
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:25
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:26
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:27
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:28
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:29
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:30
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:31
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:32
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:33
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:34
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:35
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:36
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:37
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:38
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:39
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:40
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:41
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:42
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:43
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:44
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:45
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:46
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:47
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:48
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:49
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:50
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:51
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:52
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:53
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:54
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:55
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:56
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:57
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:58
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 22:59
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:00
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:01
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:02
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:03
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:04
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:05
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:06
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:07
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:08
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:09
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:10
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:11
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:12
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:13
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:14
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:15
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:16
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:17
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:18
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:19
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:20
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:21
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:22
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:23
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:24
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:25
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:26
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:27
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:28
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:29
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:30
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:31
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:32
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:33
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:34
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:35
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:36
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:37
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:38
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:39
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:40
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:41
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:42
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:43
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:44
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:45
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:46
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:47
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:48
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:49
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:50
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:51
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:52
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:53
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:54
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:55
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:56
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:57
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:58
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 23:59
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 24:00
  I'm not playing at the weekend.
• 24:01
  I don't even know
• 24:31
  players like to come and train really hard and push themselves to the limit?
• 24:34
  I would say that I don't know where Alan sits on this, but when the foreign players first
• 24:40
  started coming over there, I started playing with they improved training and training methods
• 24:45
  and training ideas, no end. So it doesn't surprise me on the whole, but I just, I was thinking
• 24:52
  Paolo de Canoe was one of these ones that doesn't want to wear that hard, doesn't do too
• 24:57
  much because Alan performs on the pitch, but if he's bought into all of it and they want,
• 25:02
  it turns out like Martetta when he first came over, we'd go on Nights Outer, we'd be on
• 25:06
  preseason, I won't be and we don't have an opportunity to go and have a drink, then I would
• 25:10
  be like, we're here and then the next morning, people like Michele would have stayed in and would
• 25:14
  completely outrun years and embarrass you, talk to speak and then you start thinking.
• 25:19
  I'm a felly. Yeah, we were all in it together drinking thing and we'll all be rubbish the next day,
• 25:23
  it's fine and you turn up the next day or two or three and then we'll be blitzed in the
• 25:27
  run and we'll be thinking, no, it's him, it's him, someone go, someone go kick him, will he?
• 25:34
  I wonder if Canoe was like that because he was loved, wasn't he? I'm every one I've spoke to
• 25:41
  and the other things I've known, he was treated definitely by said Alex, but it sounds like
• 25:45
  the canoe on Canton, now the canoe. Yeah, I would know what Canton are. Did you ever treat
• 25:53
  people differently, you were managing, in terms of when you're looking at these players and you say
• 25:58
  they might need something different, did you treat your own like the players different? I did,
• 26:01
  when I was at Hibbs, we had a like called Anthony Stokes, we had a loan from Celtic and he was
• 26:09
  by far on most towns of play, but we had issues off the pitch, loved the drink and it wasn't just
• 26:19
  the fact they loved the drink, he loved the drink for a couple of days and I'd be part of the game
• 26:24
  in that. No, just in terms of going, he couldn't start. No, so like if he'd give them a Monday off,
• 26:30
  he wouldn't turn into the Wednesday, so if he was having a drink it was a bender or he'd go back to
• 26:35
  Ireland and stuff like that, so. And he's like the main player, he was the game changer,
• 26:42
  and so like I had to manage it and basically I asked I brought a couple of the players in
• 26:49
  and I just said to him said listen this is where we are with this and I want you to buy into it
• 26:55
  because he's going to make a difference, looking up for me is that they realized that he was
• 27:02
  the difference as well, so they, unless if you've got players that will accept it to a certain degree,
• 27:10
  you've got half a chance, but if players, you've got no chance, as long as he's delivering,
• 27:16
  yeah, and I had to have a conversation then, and I said listen, I'm happy to give you a little
• 27:21
  bit of leeway, but don't take the piss because you're taking the piss out of your fellow teammates,
• 27:26
  not me, you're taking the piss out and you can't do that. You had some other good players in that
• 27:30
  club. Yeah, we did, you know, we had, we were obviously, we had John begin, John was just
• 27:39
  a bit of a fresh year, John, you know, you knew he was, I actually tried to get everything to
• 27:43
  sign him, and it just didn't, it didn't happen for whatever reason. I remember you'd tell them
• 27:48
  speaking to us back then straight away talking to us when you were down about maybe on a night,
• 27:52
  I would call for whatever we'd met up about this player that was, and I didn't really see much
• 27:57
  of a band then, and I didn't see the potential, I'm not saying I didn't knock and try and identify it,
• 28:02
  but a couple of years later, I was thinking, I'm sure that's it, and that's what he was talking about,
• 28:06
  when he moved, he was like, how am I after how many games, or what? Well, we signed them from,
• 28:12
  from St Merrim for, I think it was a hundred grand in the end. I'm old to see that. He would have been
• 28:19
  twenty, twenty-one. Just shows you, don't it? They do. It doesn't have to be at the, it can be spotted.
• 28:29
  If you're paying off attention, you can't find the right partner. I think that out there,
• 28:33
  I think sometimes and all is that it seems to be getting harder. Yeah, of course. It just seems
• 28:38
  to be getting harder. Certainly at the top end because other than the Premier clubs can wait.
• 28:45
  What was your criteria then, when you signed them, was use, why not sell the algorithm and the stats,
• 28:50
  and the numbers is running, numbers is tackling, numbers is passing, numbers. Was you looking at that,
• 28:54
  then, or was you just like, I'll look at them with my eye and go, ease for me? Yeah, no, my
• 29:01
  head of recruitment, which was a lot like all Grand Matty was very good at the time, and he said,
• 29:09
  come to me and said, we've got this player that we've been looking at. I said, okay, he said,
• 29:15
  put me together a dossier of him, get me all the clips, or go and watch him, and then I'll look at the
• 29:20
  clips. And I'm not just saying it now, which make myself look something that I'm not, but as soon as
• 29:27
  you're seeing him playing, he was doing things that I thought, okay, he didn't exactly have 100%
• 29:35
  success in us all, but the fact that he's seen it is the most important thing for me.
• 29:40
  Because if you can't see it, you've got a problem, the fact that you can see it, you can always,
• 29:44
  you'll always get that past, correct at some point, and then, and then knew he had potential,
• 29:51
  and we were, we were still a championship team there. So I knew he could come in and make a big
• 29:57
  difference for us, and literally as soon as you come into the door, the level just went, or even all
• 30:06
  the players just realized that we had to play in our hands. And it was just a matter of time. It's
• 30:10
  one of them sometimes when you know you've got someone good, enjoy them while you can. It's just
• 30:15
  going to go at some point. Probably Wayne is another example of that as well. What was the highlight
• 30:20
  of your manager career? It was, well, it's hard not to say the Scottish Coffin,
• 30:30
  and that was just off the charts. Good. I think when you win something, and I think you see it with
• 30:40
  all the managers now, when they won something, I was lucky as a player, because I was fortunate to win
• 30:48
  when a few things. It was the look on my staff, some of the players' faces,
• 30:55
  when, once they've achieved something, which gives you such an immense pride to think that you've
• 31:02
  given them probably something that they will cherish for the rest of the lives. It wasn't the
• 31:08
  medal. It wasn't the case. It was the fact that they were there on that day. You know,
• 31:17
  as I actually speak about it yesterday or day before, I remember one of the first press conferences
• 31:22
  I've gone in, and there was a bit of a smart-ass reporter there, journalist, and it was like,
• 31:30
  and it was the start of the Scottish Cup campaign, so we would obviously come in in the first round,
• 31:34
  and it'd go, yeah, it's just going to be the year-round, so obviously they haven't won it for a
• 31:39
  hundred, but it was a hundred and thirteen years when he first had. So I said, well, someone's going
• 31:44
  to do it. I said, you know, I'd love it to be me, but if not, it'll be someone at some time.
• 31:50
  Anyway, so anyway, we've got knocked out, and I think it could have been the fourth round,
• 31:55
  fifth round, the second year, and they're saving the reporter. Oh, is this going to be the year?
• 32:02
  You know, like when you're looking inside the ball, and seven millionths is going to be the same.
• 32:06
  I said, someone's going to do it, and I'm hoping it's me. I think we've got a strong squad this year,
• 32:11
  so let's see where it takes us. Anyway, we obviously get to the final, let me win it. Same reporter's
• 32:17
  in the press conference after the game. And I just said, I said, I told you not bad.
• 32:27
  So, and he took it in the right way, he took it, you know, and it was, it was obviously, it was a great
• 32:33
  feel, you know, to win any game, or to win it. The odds on you, but the start of that cup campaign.
• 32:42
  Oh, we were, we were, we were a, we realistically, we, we were a championship team,
• 32:52
  but with a championship squad, okay, because we were, we were, we were a strong team in that
• 32:58
  division. We'd, we'd, in the second year, we were a much better. The problem we had was that,
• 33:04
  we still had arrangers in the league, because arrangers obviously were being demoted, they were
• 33:08
  coming back up, and we had them and we were on a significantly bigger budget than us, but we were,
• 33:13
  there wasn't much between us, you know, if you look at our overall record that season, I think we
• 33:17
  might have played each other five times, and we'd, or six times, and I think we'd won three and
• 33:25
  lost thing. So there was nothing between the two teams. Another co-final you had was playing for
• 33:31
  Bolton. It was, yeah, it was, unfortunately, against that other team across the, yeah, it was the
• 33:38
  dark side, yeah. So that was, we lost two on that game. I think Mac Manoran, yeah, Mac Manoran
• 33:45
  scored. And the same, we had a good team, we had a, we had a very good team, actually, you know,
• 33:51
  there was, that would have been the likes of myself, Jason McAteer, Alan Thompson, John McGinley,
• 33:57
  Thompson Lassort, yeah, you know, so we had a, we had a decent team on the day, we just
• 34:03
  weren't good enough, you know, we'd done great to get there, but Liverpool just had too much
• 34:09
  quality for us on the day. But Bolton was where your, your career took off? It was, well, I was,
• 34:14
  I was at Everton as a young kid, and unfortunately, I got released when I was, I think 13,
• 34:21
  and then did you think you should be saying, was that like, you were at the time in your
• 34:28
  developments? I probably didn't, I didn't think that way. I didn't think, they've got it wrong.
• 34:36
  I just, I just probably thought, did you just made a decision? Did you leave that training? I
• 34:43
  think I'm going to prove you're wrong. At the time, no, because I felt I was devastated.
• 34:48
  So I was on the way home with me, with me, with me dad, and we used to get the bus into West
• 34:53
  Arby. So I was, it was more about him saying, this isn't the end of the world, everything, we'll,
• 34:58
  we'll, we'll, we'll do it somewhere else. But at the time, you think can, but it's Everton,
• 35:04
  you know, yeah, and you never want to leave, but it was probably the best thing that,
• 35:10
  that happened to me now, looking back because I go to Bolton, and I've got to be honest,
• 35:15
  I didn't know where Bolton was when I had a knock on the door for Max, he believed it or not.
• 35:20
  He was Neil Houston, he was a scoffer, Bolton. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he knocked on the door,
• 35:26
  knocked on the door and said, I'll listen, I know you've been, William Smith, and we'd love you to come
• 35:30
  to Bolton, we know all about you, type of thing. And I was like, Mr. Juxtap. Yeah,
• 35:35
  Bolton? Juxtap has been in the game, yeah. And I went, well, I said,
• 35:40
  that doesn't drive. I says, I says, I was going to get there. He said, no problem. He said,
• 35:44
  we've got a, we have a mini bus going from Highton, we've got a few lights, we live in Highton,
• 35:49
  and they travel. And there was a guy there called Ronnie, and he used to do the drive, and he was
• 35:54
  like a little bit of a local scout there. So anyway, got to Highton, got on the bus, I'm used to
• 36:00
  go every, every Tuesday and Thursday. And then it all seemed to take off from there then.
• 36:05
  And then I was playing midfield for, like, literally, my, my, my, my path was
• 36:15
  on the nine's striker. And I was just got fair at the back. Yeah. Thanks to the striker,
• 36:21
  the only thing she's a striker. Then left wing, believe it or not, left wing.
• 36:27
  Yeah, left wing. I'm in the day when you used to get outside and cross it, or thinking you
• 36:31
  could not stand on with it. I was never driven past someone. Yeah. Then into midfield.
• 36:37
  Yeah, midfield. And then by just by chance, a couple of injuries, when I was at Bolton,
• 36:46
  and I think it was 16, and the manager at the time was filming, and we had a reserve team manager,
• 36:55
  Steve, and he, he comes to me, said, oh, listen, the, the graphic one was asked if you, if you
• 37:00
  will, play center back, got a few injuries, wouldn't mind seeing you there. And played there,
• 37:06
  done all right. And never look back. Did you love it straight away? Or did you think I enjoyed
• 37:10
  it a midfield? No, I enjoyed it because it, playing in impositions gave me a real idea of
• 37:18
  everything in front of me. And I, and I, I think probably one of my strengths was that I,
• 37:23
  I, I, I, I light, I read the game. And I, and I think playing in impositions just helped me
• 37:31
  understand of where to be and time, you know, put yourself in the right place at the right time.
• 37:38
  And I think with that, with any footballers that you, you have to understand what you stand
• 37:44
  and weaknesses are. So I, I wasn't quick, but in terms of me, I, I then started to read the game
• 37:52
  and be cleverer. And time put myself in positions where I wasn't pouring it in a foot race.
• 37:59
  So I'd, I'd be thinking of, oh, if this goes over my head, I need to be in the right position
• 38:04
  to time give myself a head start. And, and I think that, that helped me massively.
• 38:09
  That never changed. No, no, it didn't. And, you know, you're not slow, though. No, I wasn't,
• 38:15
  I wasn't quick. I felt if I was, I was quick there, but not there. We, we used to,
• 38:23
  we used to have a race, we used to have a race, we used to have a race, me and him to see who was
• 38:27
  the slowest player I've ever, and it changed weekly.
• 38:34
  You ever dipped the most on a Friday afternoon or on me a few?
• 38:39
  You ever dipped the most on a big, don't could beat us, everyone could beat me.
• 38:43
  And I'll accept, really, yeah, you're never at the front where we,
• 38:46
  all in the finals. Just a quickish, you came up against,
• 38:51
  but probably the most natural was probably, um, jokes of, I think, Joe, Joe, your boat.
• 38:56
  Joe, your boat was rapid. Yeah, but a completely opposite of you in terms of you would read
• 39:03
  the game, you would get in position early, you would defend it in the right way. And Joe would
• 39:08
  literally say, you said, no, Joe, Joe would stand on the spot with his eyes and like mouth open,
• 39:16
  watch the game and then go, oh, that's my job, but he was so quick. He would get, he
• 39:22
  caused them to see more problems than he solves after time. It wasn't me, it would be, it would be
• 39:27
  Davy, you know, and, and more often, when I played my, my best partnership to play with his,
• 39:34
  his, his piece. Yeah, he was, he was so good in terms of understanding each other's games.
• 39:40
  But the amount of times where I'd run across, if I was playing on the left, I would be potentially
• 39:46
  then, more than that was for Stony, or Gazne Smith or, or whoever they, and you'd go across the time
• 39:52
  cover then. And if you turned over your shoulder and expect Joe to be coming across, you got
• 39:58
  fucking no chance. Joe was standing in the spot going, I'll do this, but I'll, I'll do this
• 40:06
  in my spot. But like he was that quick, he would just get out of his own problems that he caused.
• 40:13
  I honestly think it is how modern defenders defend not everyone, not not old defenders,
• 40:20
  but they're so conservative in their job. They sometimes don't defend across as a unit and
• 40:25
  there's so much such big gaps in the middle. You look at the way they defend now, they'll grab
• 40:29
  older percent of forward for crosses or a ball comes in the box, they'll grab a cent of forward,
• 40:33
  and if it does, that cent forward doesn't score. They'll say, job done. But if someone runs in by
• 40:38
  year and scores, you know, that was the area you should be defending, but they'll say, but
• 40:43
  yeah, but it's not mindful. Someone lost their run in midfield, you're like, but just defending.
• 40:47
  Yeah, you and some other stuff. I like the responsibility. We were talking about this before.
• 40:54
  So if I would, I would, I would prefer it if I was a player or even a manager, I would
• 41:01
  prefer, I'm sorry, I prefer. He did play. Yeah, I did play. I loved it. I would draw
• 41:06
  this. A manager said to me, he said to me, right, you're Mark and Tony, but you, I know that he won't
• 41:12
  win from me. He's always like we stubs. So that, and then therefore I know my job. Yeah,
• 41:21
  you know, because I think what you did have, especially on the David Moise, he would have
• 41:25
  myself, we'd have David here, and we would pick up their bigger players. And then he would have,
• 41:31
  Ozzy was probably sometimes more of not being in the front post, you know, because he was good in
• 41:36
  the air. I thought you said because I was going to mark in a post. No, you were, well, you were
• 41:40
  marking a post on the map and the area. But Ozzy was good in the air, believe it on off for the
• 41:46
  size he had, he had a real, and I think what, what, what, think of Ozzy was that he had, he had
• 41:52
  good timing. Same with it probably likes of a Tim Kyle. Yeah. You know, Tim, Tim was in the biggest,
• 41:59
  but he had good hang time. And then he had, he'd have that prolonged analysis, Ozzy has, Ozzy's got
• 42:04
  that reach neck, that last little minute, we'd reach out a little bit more and let the flickers.
• 42:09
  You know, so he was important in that in terms of that area, but then David would have some
• 42:15
  zone, but he would give the responsibility more often not to two or three of us off probably four
• 42:21
  to pick up what he would see as their danger. And if the ball is coming in the front area,
• 42:26
  we knew as you would be able to deal with that. Tim, more often not, if he was one of the pick up,
• 42:31
  would probably be in the sense of the goal. Because I was a fan. I was two hundred and now,
• 42:35
  but I always just thought why aren't players just going man for man? And one of the players told me,
• 42:39
  he said to me, he said to me, he said to me, he said, that's what happened. That's when I changed
• 42:44
  me opinion a bit then. Wow, wow, that kind of makes sense because if you're marking me and then he,
• 42:49
  and then he blocks you, stop me. I'm a fan of the man. There's just no getting around it.
• 42:53
  Yeah, but you've got to, you've got to old school defenders would work hard to make sure they didn't
• 42:57
  get blocked. Yeah. If you did, I'd find a way of stopping that. Or there might be a bit of communication
• 43:02
  between him and big David to say, we've got these two, if the blockers, you might have to go in it.
• 43:08
  I just think go. If you go Sunday and the smart thing is there, there means that and every single
• 43:14
  step he's in court, it's gone towards Van Dyke's way. If you put two, two markers on Van Dyke,
• 43:20
  only one can be blocked. But essentially, they'll say no to two blockers on them. But if you just
• 43:25
  put two men on Van Dyke, I just don't see how it goes wrong, but then you use no more than
• 43:31
  I think if you, if you're into Sunday's game and that goal, they, they will be disappointed
• 43:39
  they never dealt with that. As defenders, you'll be disappointed that you never dealt with that,
• 43:44
  because does he blame one man? Does he blame two men? No, I think it's easy to point the finger at
• 43:51
  who you think should have done better. But, but, you know, I've got to, I've got to be honest,
• 43:57
  I think now the balls are much lighter, they're coming in much faster as well. So, to a fan,
• 44:03
  it looks like, well, he should have been picking up or he's lost them or he's in that. But,
• 44:08
  literally, you know, as I'm looking, I'm looking at that clock there and you've got that to make a
• 44:13
  decision. That's how quick it is. You've got that. And, and that's why you've got a trust
• 44:22
  that you're in the right area, because if you know, you can't recover. And that's how,
• 44:27
  that's how quick it is. That's how quick you're going to make a second. It's like, it's like,
• 44:31
  it's like you in terms of, in the ring, you've got that to get out of the way of a punch.
• 44:37
  100 of a certain, you know, and that's instinct then. Well, that's just thing for football.
• 44:42
  You know, he's the only threat. You don't have another man who wants to win Edders or
• 44:46
  challenge for the ball like him. But, I like to say, I don't know. I'm just thinking from a
• 44:51
  fan's record. From my point of view, I'm scream going, wow, two years, just stand on his foot.
• 44:59
  I think he's out, I think he's out muscled as well, because he hasn't jumped.
• 45:03
  And the ball was quality. The ball was a great ball because the ball was so good. He just basically
• 45:07
  put his arms out, made his tiny little bit of space and the ball was that good that he just
• 45:12
  needed. There's the keeper's got no chance on it. Just think. He's the only threat I've got.
• 45:17
  And I just think everybody seems always got that one foul, haven't he? To be fair, it's
• 45:20
  acceptable. They dealt with it well for the majority of the game. Yeah, he was, yeah,
• 45:27
  I'm jealous. You think about it. You think about it. You're two of the biggest players I've
• 45:30
  gone on. And they both gone off. And that, that, that is a mid, mid to game. I think he knows
• 45:34
  good in them areas. He gets the throws himself about. Yeah, he throws himself about, but it just
• 45:38
  can't stand by. You know what? There's some labs in the last minute here. Just two of us
• 45:43
  take on in because no one else is going to want to win it like he does because he was just doing
• 45:47
  him. You look at, I think, Alien, Alien in the game. Better always cleared the first two corners,
• 45:51
  open the name post. You know, and then when you look at that goal again, and I've, if I've
• 45:57
  looked at it once, I've looked at it. Twenty. The ball comes in and I'm not blaming anybody,
• 46:02
  but the ball slightly goes over, buddy. It's a beat to the first man. Yeah, beat to the
• 46:05
  first one. And then you've got obviously Taukowski who's slightly underneath it. But you talk on
• 46:12
  fractions. Yeah. You talk on fractions. Yeah. But if, if Barry stands in front of Andaich and Tauk,
• 46:18
  he stands behind. You're not losing. I think Barry's in the front post area area ish. So that's it.
• 46:23
  So to be fair, it is a good ball. It is a good ball. It's a good ball. It's a good ball in all games.
• 46:28
  He's all about to live in it. He's all about. He's just, he's doing it all the time. He's
• 46:32
  what a player. Yeah. A lot of ball, a lot of ball. Yeah. You were in Evan's side that you captain
• 46:36
  that was very good defensively. What, what was good about that season? Um, I think we had a,
• 46:41
  our biggest thing was probably, I think, our team spirit. I think we, I think a lot of people
• 46:47
  had written off before. We were in the early years on the David Moise. I think we were a little
• 46:53
  bit of a yo-yo. We'd have a good season. And for no pattern reason, we'd have a, we'd have a
• 46:57
  bit of a dip and we'd have a down season. And then we, and it wasn't until I think 2000 and
• 47:03
  four, five where we started to get consistent and we started to really be a six,
• 47:10
  fifth, seventh, eighth position team. Was that your break through season? Four, five, yeah. I played
• 47:17
  the last couple of games of the season before. We'd lost all three of them, lost the city.
• 47:22
  And all the talk was the day of Moise. We were going to get sad, wasn't it? Yeah.
• 47:25
  That season. And in modern day football management, he probably would have, because good season,
• 47:31
  as soon as you have a bad season, that you've done, but yeah, just sticking with you,
• 47:35
  shows the opportunity for things to come back up. But we'd had a tough summer. We'd had,
• 47:41
  we'd been absolutely shouted out in that dressing room at City. Yeah. Like he'd never seen him so
• 47:46
  angry. David Moise went absolute tore into us and then go off every summer, this, this, this,
• 47:52
  and then we did. We came back for the preseason and he was a bit more relaxed. We had a good work
• 47:57
  in Austria. We went to Houston where we landed and he gave us two and a half days to basically just
• 48:02
  socialise and play golf and have nights out, drinking with each other and we were, I went ice skating
• 48:08
  at two o'clock. I went ice skating at midnight in Houston and then a Kev Kilban fell over, cut his
• 48:15
  elbow, everything. It was like, never done it, but it was the camaraderie and the stories that we
• 48:20
  then took from that first two and a half days into the rest of the trip where I've done thing I've
• 48:25
  ever worked as hard. Do you know what I mean? We talked about it all season long and we
• 48:29
  went back to that preseason. He won't say it because obviously he was the captain, but you will,
• 48:34
  because you've had various captains and different. How important, how important of a role does the
• 48:39
  captain play in that camaraderie? Is he, is he the gel or is he the main contributor? Is he the
• 48:45
  biggest factor? He's played in teams that that that's been influential as well, but within that
• 48:52
  team, we didn't need anybody rain on us in. So I've played in different teams where a captain
• 48:58
  wants to rain you in, but also a captain won't ever let you go too far. If you know what I mean,
• 49:03
  so it's fine and that balance of, of a don't want to rain them in and stop them having,
• 49:07
  keeping this bubbly attitude and keeping the fire bare and and keeping stuff going, but I also
• 49:12
  need to make sure that one or two don't lose in the way that one or two with the don't,
• 49:16
  yeah, don't go too far. And we had credit to Alan, but we also had, as he's just mentioned,
• 49:22
  we had Alan, we had Davey, we had big dongle, we had Kev Campbell, it's super Kev,
• 49:28
  God bless him. We had a lot of captains. We had a lot of captains. All within the one team,
• 49:32
  we had a lot of captains. But you were the band. So does the book stop with you or does it,
• 49:37
  how does it work? Well, I don't mean the book stops with me, but I think from what happens if
• 49:42
  something goes wrong, you're the one that leads that conversation. Okay, you know, so the manager
• 49:46
  comes to see you, yeah, or if the manager wants to something to get to the players, he would have
• 49:54
  a conversation more often than with me and maybe one or two other senior players say this is not
• 50:00
  acceptable or listen, this is what I want going forward. That's what I believe football misses,
• 50:07
  now, senior leadership. All the, all the figures around them, I just think it misses it so much.
• 50:12
  It's got, you look across, Premier League clubs now. Kids run and kids. There's a lot of teams
• 50:17
  that lack leaderships. Maybe these teams don't think that the senior players are good enough
• 50:24
  to, because look at Chelsea buying so many kids up to kids up to kids because they could have
• 50:28
  the potential of selling on and having an, but if you've not got some leaders to actually direct
• 50:34
  them and help them, yeah, just, just help them along the journey. And there's a lot of teams
• 50:38
  that really struggle with that. I think there's, there's some good teams out there as well.
• 50:41
  He's just talking to a John McGinnon, yeah, Aston Villa, who looks like he's a huge influence on
• 50:47
  the team. I've got a lot like they've got a couple within the squad, but I think the probably
• 50:51
  the one that sticks out to me right now is probably Jacques. That's something. Yeah,
• 50:57
  I think he's, I think he's, I think he's a, I think he's a very humble person. I think it's,
• 51:03
  I've seen an interview that he did not so long ago, maybe in the last month, and it was a brilliant
• 51:09
  interview. The, the, I don't know who was it that was on, whether it was Sky or whether it was BBC,
• 51:15
  but they have seen Nailed it. And he got emotional when I was talking about his upbringing,
• 51:19
  saying about how, how, how difficult his upbringing was, his parents haven't going out and
• 51:25
  having two and three jobs and trying to do everything they could, and they went very straight,
• 51:29
  they were quite poor, and to where he is now. And, and I, and I think that type of thing builds
• 51:37
  a leader. Yeah. I think sometimes now, unfortunately, I think when you're young, the leaders are the
• 51:46
  parents. I think parents are playing a more pivotal role now in, in children coming through
• 51:52
  than what we've ever seen before. And, and, and I think so. I thought you were going to say,
• 51:59
  Grana, Jack was crying because they made him play for Sundayland. I thought that's where you go.
• 52:03
  I was going to say that harsh, because Sundayland is something we know, we love you, we love you,
• 52:08
  we love you. So, after all, Sundayland battles, it was just a joke.
• 52:13
  Were you also when you were two Sundayland?
• 52:16
  It's neither, it was, it shouldn't have happened. The club itself was when you left us for a few
• 52:22
  months. Yeah, that was, it was just one of them situations where we just qualified for the
• 52:30
  Champions League. I wanted the two-year contact. It wasn't about money, the, the, the finances of it
• 52:39
  was what it was. And I just wanted the two-year, two-year deal. And David, I think, and I think,
• 52:45
  as he was, as I had this before, as well as that, I think David leaned on the fact that I was
• 52:50
  inevitably fine and I was a local lad. And thought, are you ill-signed? And at home, I stood
• 52:57
  me grand. And I remember getting a phone call and I actually believe we're not far away from
• 53:02
  here, the view in Southport. And I was, I was literally, the film was about to start and got a
• 53:08
  phone call, and I'm not even going to take it. And then, like, in the Gaffo and I stopped, you
• 53:13
  come on, are we signing it then? Come on. And I went, no, I said, unless you tell me it's two years
• 53:17
  I'm not signing. You know, we can't, we can't do this. And I said, okay, no problem. I said,
• 53:21
  thanks for everything. It says, but I can't. I said, I feel as if I've warranted being a really
• 53:28
  important part of what we've achieved this season. And he didn't budge. And I didn't budge.
• 53:35
  So there was no winner in the end. And I think when we look back, you know, they were regretted,
• 53:41
  100% regretted, because I didn't want to leave in the first place. But sometimes, whether it's
• 53:46
  stubbornness or whether it's morals or whatever, you stick to your guns. And unfortunately, you know,
• 53:55
  the club went budging. Did you feel like you had something to prove when you went back?
• 54:02
  I didn't actually know. I was just relieved that I was back. And that's not a slant on
• 54:10
  Sunday fans, because, you know, they went, they went great when I went there. They had a team
• 54:17
  that was struggling. I was up there by myself. It wasn't great when being there without the
• 54:25
  family. And then when I got a phone call from from Jimmy Lumsden in the November time, I know
• 54:30
  they had a conversation with Mick McCartick. And he said, listen, we need you off the
• 54:33
  way. Which is really, we really stick to what we're going to do. So that was straight after
• 54:38
  the Champions League. We'd called for the Champions League. And then Jimmy Langley and said, right,
• 54:44
  come on. Let's have a conversation. The gaffer wants to speak to you. And I was like, I was
• 54:49
  thinking, we're playing to play hard to get here. Or do I like to say it? And I was like, yeah,
• 54:54
  okay, yeah, where do you want to be? And I'm talking about tickle cells in the hotel there.
• 55:00
  And we just had a conversation and we said, right, listen, let's forget what's going on.
• 55:04
  Clean slate. Let's just, we need your back. We definitely needed them back. We were
• 55:09
  really struggled at that time of the year. You said you're relieved to be back. I think I was
• 55:14
  the most relieved because I've been losing races. And the first game back was Arsenal.
• 55:27
  And I think Davey came off injured after about 20 minutes. And I came on. He won one
• 55:33
  nil. Yeah, there are places. Yeah. I think that was not the way you go. No, no, no, that was,
• 55:39
  that was me. I think me know you're me and James Beats. I don't want to know. Day, I think.
• 55:44
  I remember the scores. It's a beat. I think it was round about.
• 55:52
  I really was round about that. I think it was. We won one nil. Yeah, because I spent the,
• 55:56
  I had some sort of belly issue that day. And I was, did you eat too much? No, I felt like an
• 56:01
  essence of the big practice. Yeah, I needed a way. And there's playing on the pitch. That's
• 56:06
  stupid story. That shouldn't even talk about this. And I was going, Beats, I need to go out and
• 56:10
  he was going, no, we're playing great. So he gave me a big cookie. No, come on. We're going to win
• 56:13
  this game for like 35 minutes. He was going, we're having a great time out when I was going,
• 56:18
  no, I'm in pain. Come on. Come on. Come on. We're going to win. Don't worry. And I was like, oh,
• 56:23
  yeah. When you look back, though, it doesn't frustrate me. I think football, well,
• 56:29
  I know our club, we treat our own Western, we treat the others. And it doesn't have frustrate me.
• 56:34
  Don't worry me. Look after your own. That's scousers. You're closer. Look after your own. And that,
• 56:41
  that doesn't, it's just, you know, I'm not making about fordness or other, but I'm just saying
• 56:47
  understand and value what you have and understand he gets the football club, he knows the city,
• 56:54
  he knows the fans, he knows the people. That's a strength. It's not a weakness. I think,
• 57:00
  I think as fans, we all love one of our own. Yeah, it's brilliant. What we take it for granted as
• 57:05
  well. Yeah. You know, when it comes to that. And I think as an ever to fan, you know, I don't
• 57:12
  think there's anything better than seeing the likes of a Harrison Armstrong coming through.
• 57:16
  It's brilliant. You know, it's like, it's, it's a, first of all, it's a, it's a massive
• 57:22
  feather in the cap for the club itself. Because the academy is not being where it has been over
• 57:29
  recent years. It's had a real tough time, you know, whether that's cutbacks because of
• 57:36
  previous regimes, whether that's affected in terms of our recruitment, in terms of
• 57:46
  people on the grounds, looking at our players, whether it's had to be rained in.
• 57:50
  Hopefully now with the new owners, they've all identified the academy as one of the areas that
• 57:54
  they want to invest in, which I think is fantastic because you can't underestimate how important
• 58:01
  academy is. And it goes hand in hand with the football club. You know, we've had an amazing
• 58:07
  history of bringing some through some brilliant players who've contributed huge amounts to the,
• 58:14
  to the football club. And I think the new ownership understand that because I don't think anyone
• 58:22
  wants to be spending 150 million, 200 million every year. It's not sustainable. And I think
• 58:28
  that's why the academy has to, as the time help offset that burden of having to spend big money.
• 58:35
  And I think that is a, is a real plus. And we have to time build them. We're the only one in a
• 58:40
  long time. And we need more. We, we, we definitely know we aren't. No, maybe not necessarily. But
• 58:45
  these are a brilliant outfit that took over the football club, but they're also amazing businessmen
• 58:50
  and amazing businessmen. Don't waste money. You don't blow money for the sake of money. That's
• 58:55
  why the local lads and the fans don't pay because businessmen. And that's not just football. This
• 59:01
  is everything. You get something as, for as cheap as you can. You don't overpay. No one wants to
• 59:06
  overpay for anything like that. I know you want to stay at the football club. And you're,
• 59:11
  I could probably get you to stay for this, but he lives over in Spain. And so probably going to have
• 59:16
  to pay him a bit more. Unfortunately, that's, I get it. That's kind of how it works. I get it way
• 59:20
  up where you're up with. I'm important to see the scene and with it, but you know, but and you're
• 59:26
  also bringing a little bit more because you know what it feels like to be the fans. You know what
• 59:32
  they're going to feel like on Diabria. You're not something for the 10 of us just another game.
• 59:35
  Because it means something to us as fans when a sculpture walks on a picture is like I'm up for
• 59:40
  this. And I'm going to let all these and just do normal for it as well. Not like the game. That's
• 59:45
  a big club. No, we're telling up here. And it means just as much as it was. There's
• 59:51
  something good about being in the dressing room where everybody knows the significance of the club
• 59:56
  you're playing for. There is something. There is something really good about it. Because you've
• 1:00:00
  played a big time. And I'm not saying that a lot of foreigners get it as well. So it's not about
• 1:00:06
  local. It's not about foreign. It's just about having an understanding of where you are,
• 1:00:11
  the club you're playing for. And I've got to be honest, the best squads I've been in have had
• 1:00:17
  a huge majority of people pulling in the same direction like that. Oh, four or five to here.
• 1:00:24
  You've got three rungs and hippo hippo hippo all the time as well.
• 1:00:27
  That's here with you. There's how many local lads there.
• 1:00:31
  You've got jagged jaggs was in the academy. Yeah. And then legged. Myself was in the academy.
• 1:00:38
  You know, so it's it's there. Yeah. You know, and sometimes we don't mind. We keep getting them in
• 1:00:43
  and letting them get used to showing them. I've used that. And it's a great indicator to the young kids
• 1:00:49
  out there who will listen to some watches. It's not all because they say it's over. No, definitely.
• 1:00:54
  It's over when you say it's over. I've got a huge problem with the way academies in general work,
• 1:00:59
  not ever to let them in. I mean, a kid could come in at six and be told, you know, they come in for
• 1:01:05
  six week trials across clubs at the moment. So a kid goes within one season, he could have had
• 1:01:10
  trials at five different clubs. Six years of age, six weeks is like a huge chunk of
• 1:01:15
  age at that point. And so by the time he's seven, he's been told by five different clubs that
• 1:01:20
  they don't want him to come back. The effect that that has, think about when you're 10-11-12. And
• 1:01:25
  even if you get to 16, you spend your whole time in the academy at the moment because of the
• 1:01:30
  demands of an academy to do four or five training sessions a week, the games at the weekend,
• 1:01:36
  what the parents say, you don't end up having a social life. You don't get to know the kids in
• 1:01:39
  your local area. You just get to know the academy kids. And then if you step away from that,
• 1:01:44
  it doesn't work out. You lost kind of friends. You've got a social life. You're more rejection.
• 1:01:48
  It's something I think that needs to be solved. I think the Premier League and especially
• 1:01:53
  Premier League clubs, I think they need to do more for when players get released, especially at 16 or
• 1:02:00
  18. I think they should, I think they should be an obligation that they help them for the
• 1:02:06
  same amount of time. The time create whatever pathway they want to go along because I think we
• 1:02:13
  could have, we could have a player in the system for, it's basically from year six to 16. So we
• 1:02:20
  take 10 years of, it was like, and he walks away and we just discard them. And it's nothing.
• 1:02:24
  I'm the time to give you the time. That's not just what that is across the board. I do think there
• 1:02:29
  is, there is work to try and do something like that. I think I think the Premier League should be
• 1:02:33
  put in a position because that's all be honest, they're making more than enough money to play
• 1:02:37
  nearly it. So why can't they go right? Okay, this kid, let's just say this kid's put in the
• 1:02:42
  $10,000 we're going to give him $5,000 of, of, of opportunity and work to help him after football
• 1:02:49
  because he didn't make it and it wasn't right. So he gave us $10,000 to try and make it and it was
• 1:02:54
  to benefit him as well, make no mistake, but we're now going to give him $5,000 worth of, like
• 1:02:58
  said, opportunity, work, education, something else that doesn't necessarily have to, it could be
• 1:03:04
  in football, it could be in the college, it could be, but they're all making it enough. Pull it back
• 1:03:08
  into the grassroots because grassroots is now so for them more than ever. Less than less kids.
• 1:03:13
  Just remember that have you gone out recently and go past the park? I went past the park in an
• 1:03:18
  Astro Tef in the recent half-term, it would just be none. I couldn't, no more playing football. Yeah,
• 1:03:24
  kids weren't like, the kids just weren't on. No one you'd try to pass the one I was in. Every
• 1:03:28
  Astro Tef was, there were kids on it. You'd see an 11 as a game going on and then you'd see
• 1:03:33
  kids playing in between the pitches. There was times years ago that there was one pitch and
• 1:03:39
  there'd be two games going on across each other. Yeah, at the same time. You haven't played
• 1:03:43
  one of those. That was very credible. And now the more teams play them all different
• 1:03:47
  directions. Now just to just get on in parks. No, no. And I just think an academy is now
• 1:03:53
  I've swallowed up anyone who can say that the football leases because everyone's just
• 1:03:59
  had an academy and you're just like, I just think it's so difficult for the kids to have
• 1:04:04
  some kind of social everything. I mean, I talk about one man, he's 13. He's 13. He played
• 1:04:10
  out for the first time last week. His whole life. He played out. Because of his mother though,
• 1:04:15
  yeah. Yeah, it's more than I mean. So, I'll drop him off and he, believe it or not, he's
• 1:04:21
  with his evident team mates and he's at there. And I've dropped him off and you don't leave
• 1:04:25
  there. Just just pretend that you've drove off and just watch them. And I might listen
• 1:04:29
  love. I said, don't start me off. He's 13. Bigger than you. He's five foot 11. I'm not. I'm
• 1:04:35
  just leaving him. I'm just our lad's one and already a couple of years back for the first
• 1:04:39
  time. And he was even Rachel. I was a fold in us saying, we're going to have to get flights
• 1:04:43
  out there. We're going to have to go. We're going to have to go. We're going to have to go
• 1:04:46
  in the same hotel just down the road. We're going to have to watch them. We're like 19 years
• 1:04:50
  of age. Just leave them. They're all ugly. I'm like, no, we've got to go. Tony. He was like,
• 1:04:54
  nearly getting me in the ad lock. Tell me I had to go. I had to go to Benadol. I was really upset.
• 1:04:59
  That's where the cheers are. Yeah. That's like when we were at age, you just allowed to go
• 1:05:04
  onto the street. We're going to have to wait for two weeks. Yeah. Two weeks. But suddenly fast
• 1:05:09
  forward 20 years. It's like we're going back. That's a pen though as well. Yeah. That's
• 1:05:15
  not being a pen on the dangers. Yeah. I'm so weird. Exactly. You've witnessed them and seen
• 1:05:21
  them. So you just have to ask the kids plan. Stop them. It's just it's not these kids in the
• 1:05:27
  academy. It's five days a week. Yeah. No. It's a lot of parents as well. Yeah. It takes
• 1:05:33
  over your life. But as I said, five days a week in football. I do, I genuinely believe we are
• 1:05:38
  the most the richest, the most powerful and the best league in the world. Take care of the
• 1:05:44
  kids you can eat. Same subjects like change. Yeah. Your life was in the academy for many years.
• 1:05:50
  Some stops. It was now a professional footballer himself. How's that as a parent?
• 1:05:55
  Oh, listen, it's to see, to see any any size, whether whoever it is, go on and
• 1:06:02
  it. He don't just do it. Brilliant work. Yeah. So yeah, I'm just as proud as as
• 1:06:07
  here as what I have my son, you know, even though obviously he's tried to follow in the same
• 1:06:13
  footsteps and, you know, and even though he's not played at the same level as what I've played
• 1:06:18
  at, for me, he's achieved something just as good, you know, to be a professional footballer.
• 1:06:26
  It's not easy, you know, to try and follow in the footsteps of an elf, an elf, an elf,
• 1:06:31
  a far too. You know, but yeah, but you know, obviously, but then you flip side with Midorta,
• 1:06:39
  you know, she's working in the Walton Centre, which is an incredible unit in Liverpool.
• 1:06:44
  She's in in in in your own and she's doing really well. So I'm, you know, I'm lucky,
• 1:06:49
  more so in respect of what they do, is that I've got you brilliant young, new,
• 1:06:56
  managed to stay on the right path and not being led the wrong way. You know, when it's easy,
• 1:07:03
  I think in this day and age now there's there's a there's a big shift in all of that,
• 1:07:08
  great stuff. 100%. When you look at it, you know, it's doing drugs and things like that,
• 1:07:13
  it's scary. It's not a great job. The jobbies have done it. That's pleased me more than anything.
• 1:07:19
  No, I'm more than proud of them, you know, first and foremost and obviously, you know,
• 1:07:27
  Midorta's just give me the best thing now. You know, you're a grandad. I didn't really want to say
• 1:07:33
  that. You said I'm not going to be a card of grandad for 20 years. I've been playing with my race.
• 1:07:42
  So no, so it's been great. I've been, I've been very fortunate, you know, I've had brilliant parents
• 1:07:48
  who did everything for me and you take it for granted, you know, and it's not until you
• 1:07:54
  everything's finished that you look back and you go, wow, it goes really, you know, and you know,
• 1:08:00
  it's they've got their life now and we're there to try and help them achieve and go for whatever
• 1:08:06
  they want to want to be and you know, we're just supportive, you know, of them, very proud of them.
• 1:08:12
  Probably don't tell them enough how proud they are with them. Well, send them the podcast.
• 1:08:17
  Yeah, yeah, but I'm sure they'll still see on this. I'm sure they will. So, you know,
• 1:08:22
  had a song I'm very proud of you. You make me proud every day. Well, it feels like a good
• 1:08:27
  notice sort of end our chat on. What we want to do with Gess and you're the first ever one,
• 1:08:32
  is play a new game. Okay, there's OTB deck of cards outside the box. Whoa, it's a bit red.
• 1:08:39
  And now it is a bit red. So we need to get like some new ones, some sort of stuff that can't
• 1:08:45
  be on the ground in the shot. Yeah, well, I actually wizzed my seat on the way.
• 1:08:49
  All the mod cottons are in there, right? So you can have the cards. So basically,
• 1:08:53
  you need to shuffle them. I tried me best in the car, but you might want to give them a second
• 1:08:57
  shuffle. I can't shuffle for sure. So every... Do you come up with this game, aren't you?
• 1:09:04
  No, I actually did. But Aussie did, that's for you. I just said let's have a bit of fun.
• 1:09:09
  So every number in that deck has got a random football question associated to it. So whatever
• 1:09:15
  number you play, I'll read you the question. Okay, that's good. That's good for you.
• 1:09:19
  All right, now it is nice. So what are we doing this? And he's picking on it?
• 1:09:21
  Yeah, he's picking a card yet and then there's a random question and it's too much.
• 1:09:24
  Can you see an old film? I like that question. That's why I wanted to get that.
• 1:09:28
  Eight of hearts. Eight of hearts. I have one. Oh, it's a bit of a D1. The toughest period in your career.
• 1:09:36
  Oh, that's a L. It would have been cancer. So it would have been... I did after the Scottish
• 1:09:45
  Coffire, Scottish Coffire, Games Ranges, just lost 1-0, get called in for the routine
• 1:09:51
  drug test and one of the names and then think nothing of it. I passed the oil line,
• 1:09:59
  go away, get back on the bus, back with the players and then which they were off for the summer then.
• 1:10:06
  And I get a phone call about three weeks later from the doctor, Jack Mulhan. And he said,
• 1:10:12
  he said, all right. He said, yeah, all right. Jack, he said, just ring Europe about your results
• 1:10:17
  on your drug test, expecting to say everything's fine. Oh, clear. He said, it's come back positive
• 1:10:23
  and I'm like, Jack, it's impossible. I said, I don't do drugs. I don't take drugs. He said,
• 1:10:26
  I know that. I only said, he said, how are you feeling? And I suddenly the alarm bells
• 1:10:31
  started to ring. I said, what do you mean? He said, how are you feeling in general,
• 1:10:34
  yourself? I said, I feel great. And I did. I felt really good. He went, anything going towards,
• 1:10:40
  anything like that. And then suddenly stayed away. Well, to be honest, I've been having this,
• 1:10:45
  sometimes it's odd pain and one of my testicles, but it's common gone. I could have a pain and
• 1:10:52
  then I wouldn't feel nothing for a few months. You and it's okay. I said, why do I ask? He said,
• 1:10:58
  he said, well, your drug test, whether it be in positive said, you're producing a hormone,
• 1:11:02
  and that's normally only found in pregnant women. But when it's found in men, it's linked to cancer.
• 1:11:08
  So then stayed away. I thought, shit, I'm okay. So what's what's the plan then? He said,
• 1:11:13
  right, we need to bring it up and do some tests, said ultrasound and we'll take it from there.
• 1:11:18
  He said, I'm sure it's nothing. And he just started, you know, calm it and started, like,
• 1:11:22
  a laid my fears type of thing. And I went, okay, I said, when do you want us to come up? And he went,
• 1:11:27
  he said, well, can we get you up tomorrow? So I said, yeah, so in any way,
• 1:11:31
  seldom we're amazing. Really, really amazing. He sent a car down for us, picked up me and Mandi.
• 1:11:36
  Don't always back up. And then I went into the hospital. Added ultrasound and you could see it was
• 1:11:42
  night and day. Clear as anything. One testicle was white. And the other one was white. And then
• 1:11:48
  at the bottom of it and like a little moon shape was black, he went, that's the cancer. He said,
• 1:11:53
  we need to do a biopsy. And make sure that it hasn't spread. So anyway, he did the biopsy, took
• 1:12:00
  some swaps from the lymph nodes all around. And then he said, in the meantime, said, we're going to
• 1:12:06
  remove the testicle. He says and then and then take it from there. So said, okay. And then he
• 1:12:11
  were like, and I have no problem with this. And he said, well, the one was to put like a false one
• 1:12:14
  in. I started laughing. Of course, I says, no, you know what? I said, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not
• 1:12:20
  vain. I said, you know, I'm quite happy. He said as long as I don't lean to one side,
• 1:12:23
  has it assaulted him? I said, sorry. And then he was laughing about it. So anyway,
• 1:12:31
  I had the results come back from the, from the biopsy and it was all clear. So I said,
• 1:12:37
  he said, listen, I'm happy for you to carry on playing. So literally, I had a hearing operation
• 1:12:42
  and then he moved it up through there and took it out. I was back playing with him within
• 1:12:46
  five weeks. And then thought nothing of it kept going for regular scans, then every three months
• 1:12:53
  and checks. And I've about 16 months later, I went for the scan, not starting to get over the,
• 1:13:00
  like, the fear of, oh, shit, I've got a scan today. Is it, I hope everything's okay,
• 1:13:05
  type of thing in that mindset. And I was, I was getting over that and I think, and all good,
• 1:13:09
  all clear. I'll be fine. And I had the scan. And then I got a phone call at night from the,
• 1:13:14
  from the, the guy that was reading the scans and the radiologist. And he said, I said, I'll listen.
• 1:13:19
  He said, really sorry, but he said something showed up on the scan. He said, we need to get
• 1:13:25
  checked. He said, I said, what is it? He said, it looks like you've got a tumor, the size of a
• 1:13:31
  p at the base of your spine. He says, and he said, I want to be really honest with you. I said,
• 1:13:36
  it's not a great place to have it. So we said that I want to be speaking to a couple of specialists
• 1:13:41
  tomorrow. He said, and then we'll take it from there. So anyway, spoke to them. And then he come up
• 1:13:47
  with it with it with a plan. He brought me back up. He said, listen, sat me down with Mandy.
• 1:13:52
  Like Mandy was like, these stores and I'm like, I'm there. And to be fair, I can compose myself
• 1:13:57
  quite well to things like that. So they split me with the doctors and he said, he said,
• 1:14:02
  he said, this is what we're going to do. We're going to give you four courses of the chemotherapy.
• 1:14:06
  He says, after that, he said, we'll, we'll, we'll scan you as we're giving you the courses of
• 1:14:12
  the chemotherapy. And then we'll, we'll, we'll make decisions as we go along. He says,
• 1:14:16
  ultimately, they're going to obliterate it. He said, it'll reduce the size or it'll do nothing.
• 1:14:22
  He said, so obviously we're hoping it's going to obliterate it or reduce the size. He said,
• 1:14:26
  if it does reduce the size, we'll go in straightaway and then start and do the operate. So anyway,
• 1:14:31
  add me first course of the chemotherapy and find no problem. And I actually did. I felt fine.
• 1:14:37
  No problems whatsoever. They told me that all the implications of the chemotherapy,
• 1:14:42
  what I could do. So for that, and I had none of them. He said, probably because you're so fit,
• 1:14:47
  he says, you're just flying through it. He said, obviously, as you can imagine, we don't have
• 1:14:52
  anyone really as fit as a professional footballer doing this. So I had that. And then
• 1:14:57
  literally finished the finished the first course, went back and Celtic Rangers were on and I went
• 1:15:04
  down to the local health club with with Tommy Johnson. And the game had kicked off. And
• 1:15:09
  literally within about five minutes, I was shivering, freezing cold. I said, Tommy, is it cold?
• 1:15:15
  And he went, no, it's absolutely roasting. So I said, he needs to take me home, I feel like shit.
• 1:15:20
  So when we've gone home and man, these realised days, they've hanged the hospital. And I'd
• 1:15:24
  must have caught the tannies to bug, but because me immune system now was starting to get low,
• 1:15:29
  it looked like it was like four-born flu. So they'd rush me back into hospital, put me on a drip.
• 1:15:34
  I was in for a couple of days, just finally flushed it out to me and I was back out. So then
• 1:15:38
  went in for the second one, about three weeks later. And then he said, listen, we're not going
• 1:15:44
  to be as aggressive over this one. We'll give you it over three or four days,
• 1:15:47
  was the first one was over over two days, done it. He was a lad in there for the first time,
• 1:15:53
  Celtic fan, kept going past the window all the time. And he was struggling. So I know he coming
• 1:15:58
  and the nearest going to me, how do you mind having a chat with them? Really struggling. He said,
• 1:16:03
  he could probably do with a chat. He said, I'm really sorry. He said, yeah, no problem to us,
• 1:16:06
  we came in sat down, chat away to him and said, I said, how are you? He said, he said, not good.
• 1:16:11
  He said, you can't get me out of round it. He said, I just think we want to die.
• 1:16:15
  So I said, yeah, it is, it is this book. I said, I've read the Lans Armstrong book. I said,
• 1:16:19
  really good. Might help you. Little did I know that was only, well, a couple of years later,
• 1:16:27
  I found out that Lans Armstrong was a fucking liar. So that was always the time. So anyway,
• 1:16:37
  I'd gone in and I was used to go back coming the next time. And as I was in a set of the
• 1:16:44
  nest, I said, there was Michael that was in the last time. He said, I'm really sorry, passed away
• 1:16:49
  last night. And it was like then we're a dawn on your thoughts. Shit. This is serious, because I
• 1:16:54
  didn't really, I don't know what it was, whether it was, I was cause of us naive. I just, as a
• 1:17:00
  professional football, you always think you're evinks, rosy ball of proof. And that was where I think
• 1:17:07
  I suddenly became a bit vulnerable, because I didn't know what to expect. So then I had the
• 1:17:14
  second course and then I had a scam. And they saw the specialist said, I'll listen, really happy.
• 1:17:19
  He said, it's reduced in size. We're going to go in and operate. So anyway, so they got me ready.
• 1:17:25
  They literally cut me open from my breastbone, all of it down to below me, belly button, pulled
• 1:17:31
  on the side. He moved all my organs to get to the back, because it was at the very back of me
• 1:17:36
  spine. I was operating here. It was a lot smaller. I've seen it, I've seen it, it was, it was a lot
• 1:17:45
  smaller. It was even more for me. The most serious. I'm sorry. I was, I was in the operating theatre.
• 1:18:03
  Oh, sorry, before that, this gets even worse. So I'm in the theatre ready to go in.
• 1:18:09
  So the little room before you actually go into the theatre, get impressed. And then the nurse or
• 1:18:15
  the doctors trying to give me an epidural in me spine. It's obviously helped with the pain relief.
• 1:18:20
  So I'm bent over this table to try and stretch my spine out. And the doctors saying, I don't
• 1:18:25
  can't get in. He said, you must also do tight. He said in terms of this, I'm really struggling
• 1:18:30
  to get in. He said, I'm looking at conscious at the time we need to get you into the theatre. So
• 1:18:36
  anyway, so he's gone. So from getting in lower, he's ended up getting in higher. So from near
• 1:18:42
  upwards, I had pain relief, but it wasn't where the operation was. It was there down. So I had no
• 1:18:47
  pain relief when you don't open me because you were too tight, because it was too tight. He couldn't
• 1:18:53
  get in. I was in the theatre nine hours in there, come out in the emergency waiting room.
• 1:19:21
  And I already remember just coming around and I had, you know, one of them silver foils that all of you in terms of the heat design helped with knock a cold and the pain was the worst pain of I could ever ever explain someone it was just horrendous.
• 1:19:37
  So they were trying to isolate the nurse obviously knew what happened and they were trying to put morphine get me all set up for the morphine trip to go in.
• 1:19:48
  They were giving me tablets and not much work and I'm on the morphine you press a you press the button and it gives you a little dose.
• 1:19:57
  And I'm pressing it every bloody five seconds thinking but he only gives you every 50 minutes just because I wanted it not quick so I need to give me tablets anyway.
• 1:20:07
  After about a couple of hours it all starts to kick in and my body shuts down I go no because they give me that much to sign help me body just shut down so I couldn't feel a thing so I literally I was a corpse on the table and the only thing that could move was my eyes.
• 1:20:25
  Side to side so literally nothing I shit myself. I thought I was going to be parlance.
• 1:20:31
  I could literally mumble.
• 1:20:34
  And so the nurse has come in and she's like she's sad to be showing me it's fine and this is quite normal believe it or not.
• 1:20:41
  It will come back.
• 1:20:43
  But obviously someone telling you that we'll come back to actually think knowing it is too completely different things and it wasn't until the following day or the following morning I woke up and I had pins and needles and one of me one of me toes and it all suddenly start to come back and it was the best feeling.
• 1:20:59
  Sorry, sorry, sorry, Mandy.
• 1:21:02
  It was the best feeling ever and I was literally there for in the hospital for I think four days.
• 1:21:14
  The doctor thought I was going to be over three months. I just wanted to get out. I couldn't.
• 1:21:19
  I was still like stay but as long as I could touch my toes they were happy for me to go out and I was just desperate to do it.
• 1:21:26
  Done it and then they said listen, you can go.
• 1:21:29
  Just we're happy to pass it over to the to the physio now and just take it from there.
• 1:21:34
  And I was and I was back playing probably three months later.
• 1:21:38
  Yeah.
• 1:21:40
  Sorry.
• 1:21:41
  Let's hope the next card.
• 1:21:43
  Come on.
• 1:21:50
  I was just thinking I checked your poll.
• 1:21:57
  You talk about that.
• 1:22:00
  Check your poll.
• 1:22:02
  I'll be few to pick a card for a million.
• 1:22:05
  Okay, here we go.
• 1:22:09
  Green of diamonds.
• 1:22:11
  Who was always late?
• 1:22:14
  So the teams you played for, who was the late comer?
• 1:22:16
  Well, popping up as a player.
• 1:22:18
  But when I was a culture Everton.
• 1:22:20
  The one that was always late was it was two.
• 1:22:24
  Andy van der Meyder.
• 1:22:26
  And Drenter.
• 1:22:30
  What would they like with it?
• 1:22:32
  Party boys.
• 1:22:34
  It's funny.
• 1:22:36
  How long will we go?
• 1:22:37
  It's just funny.
• 1:22:39
  Just unbelievable.
• 1:22:40
  Yeah.
• 1:22:41
  Well, they lived in their own places.
• 1:22:44
  We spoke about it in the last week about when Bellos killed us.
• 1:22:47
  Yeah.
• 1:22:48
  Yeah.
• 1:22:49
  Yeah.
• 1:22:50
  Yeah.
• 1:22:51
  Yeah.
• 1:22:52
  I think he was happy that they didn't eat.
• 1:22:54
  Yeah.
• 1:22:55
  Yeah.
• 1:22:56
  Yeah.
• 1:22:57
  So the first one that came across Winger.
• 1:23:00
  German.
• 1:23:01
  Living in his own sort of.
• 1:23:03
  Desires like a drink.
• 1:23:06
  Like the drinks, like the night out.
• 1:23:09
  Like the story on the show.
• 1:23:11
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:23:12
  But didn't really like their stories on the time.
• 1:23:14
  But I never ever met him.
• 1:23:15
  So.
• 1:23:16
  Yeah.
• 1:23:17
  You know what he was actually decent player as well.
• 1:23:19
  Yeah.
• 1:23:20
  Talented.
• 1:23:21
  Talented, but shame that in it.
• 1:23:23
  You know what?
• 1:23:24
  I've got a question for you.
• 1:23:25
  It was the mo because I've always got to say that it's the same answer in boxing.
• 1:23:29
  in boxing, who's the most talentable, who's the most talented player you've played with
• 1:23:35
  or coached or was around and never made it. Oh, never made it.
• 1:23:41
  I've got one. And you go, like, you're looking and you go, I've been around fighting
• 1:23:46
  and you go, and he was just well better than I mean, it's just lifestyle, but who's the
• 1:23:49
  one who use it? Everyone must have one. My was, my was not in professional football, my
• 1:23:54
  was before grown up as a young lad. Really? Yeah, man, so we, so I was along the ages
• 1:23:59
  of Steve McMahon and playing against them when they were all younger in terms of, and our
• 1:24:04
  team was decent team. And we were probably one of the, one of the better teams throughout
• 1:24:09
  the Liverpool area. And there was a lads called Danny Vaughn and he was, he was that Liverpool
• 1:24:18
  and he was a brilliant player. Real, good midfiel player. You could play passes, skillful.
• 1:24:29
  And he just, he didn't, he didn't make it. For, for a lot of different reasons, you know,
• 1:24:38
  he was the best player that I played with Gournal. Wow. And he was, he was the one that everybody
• 1:24:44
  would have said in, in, in Liverpool watching that time, he's nailed on to make it. And he
• 1:24:50
  never was. It's not quite a match. It is. My brother was good. He should have done better
• 1:24:55
  than he did. Just sort of didn't quite. He was better than you, won he? It's what everyone
• 1:25:02
  says. Yeah. Just, you know, a car better than you. He was a good player. He was a winged
• 1:25:06
  headmog speed. He'd beat me and you're in a race. That's why I never made it. Spees
• 1:25:12
  and everything. And then there was a guy when we, we played for England school boys. It's
• 1:25:18
  from, from Schemeco, the in Armstrong. He was, um, at Liverpool at the time, expected
• 1:25:24
  to be. So he, he had a, he shared a room with Joe Cole at Lillershaw. He was at Lillershaw.
• 1:25:28
  Oh, he's at Lillershaw as well. Yeah. Was there anyone who went to Lillershaw? Usually
• 1:25:32
  Yes. That's what I mean. You just felt that he was on the path. He was at Liverpool.
• 1:25:36
  Joe Cole's best mate. Um, and circumstances happened that he lost his way and, um, didn't
• 1:25:44
  make it. It was a surprise. Hmm. Yes. His dad died at a wrong, uh, he's never
• 1:25:50
  at a right time with that kind of thing. And a young guy who's just lost his, um, when
• 1:25:56
  he called, he'd have to ask him, but he was a surprise. I thought he was going to, he
• 1:26:00
  nailed it. I thought he was going to make it. I really did. I thought we were going
• 1:26:02
  to be competing against each other. Two lads from Schemeco. For our whole lives. And
• 1:26:07
  he, uh, didn't quite get over the line, which was, which was, what did I say, my, who
• 1:26:12
  shocked us? And say, when fear that, when fear that you're expected. You.
• 1:26:17
  Piss off.
• 1:26:21
  What's one I do, like, just took me time. That's all years. I've been getting this
• 1:26:35
  out of this little shit.
• 1:26:39
  I've never seen that coming. Do you know what months plays now? There was a group. So
• 1:26:45
  because I've been going to Finch Farm that many years, there's one player who sticks
• 1:26:49
  with me. And he's had a career in the Premier League. Well, I don't know. I don't
• 1:26:53
  force you. Yeah. Yeah. The group he was around, and the players he was around, I go,
• 1:27:01
  I knew he was going to play when you play, but when you look at the people around him
• 1:27:06
  and you go, he's not seeing them all. I tell you, one of probably shocked me in terms
• 1:27:10
  of the level that he played with played that. And I probably Adam and Adam, I had Adam in
• 1:27:16
  that group. Adam was with the 21s and that's how probably Shane Duffy. Don't better than
• 1:27:25
  Shane was in terms of, I hope he's a no Shane dead well and he's a great lad, but he
• 1:27:31
  was daft as a brush. But like as brave as a line, throw his body on the line with anything.
• 1:27:41
  He was a proper, it was a throwback. Technically, it wasn't great. And I say that in the best
• 1:27:51
  possible way. But he made the most of what he had. Yeah. He did really well, but I was there
• 1:28:01
  the day his career ended at Everton. We were on a preseason and another one you see enough.
• 1:28:09
  Yeah, no, Roberto just joined us. And it was a tough time. We'd had this trip that David Moise
• 1:28:16
  had set up. Roberto wasn't into taking us to a few different places. So we were like,
• 1:28:20
  San Francisco, Miami and somewhere else. And we just had the game and we all snuck to this
• 1:28:26
  better said, right, we're training at eight o'clock in the morning. We make sure on the bus,
• 1:28:30
  really, we're all sneaking out to this pub. We'd found that on the road. And obviously Shane
• 1:28:36
  was there with us, had too many far too many. Shane, he's still just a young lad. We're
• 1:28:41
  you to say far too. He was still just a young lad as well. And we stumbled out of the late time
• 1:28:46
  and we were like, Shane, what are you doing? We're going to walk back the hotel and we went,
• 1:28:49
  no, no, I'm going to tax you and Shane. That's just going to think about the hotel. He said, no,
• 1:28:53
  so you flagged this taxi down. We've set up walk and he flagged the taxi down. Go ahead and
• 1:28:57
  taxi and said, take to this hotel, the driver drove 50 yards and popped him outside the hotel.
• 1:29:02
  We were waiting for him stood with our arms full to think he was going to get it. So with that
• 1:29:07
  drop, we get just about gets on the bus on the way to train and the next day. And those that have
• 1:29:11
  played, one of them was Shane were able to just do runs up and down the side of the pitch. I had to
• 1:29:16
  one V ones in the middle of the pitch. It wasn't great down in Gibson dropped out two minutes into
• 1:29:21
  the bloody session, who takes his place in my one. Roberto Martinez. So me and Roberto are doing
• 1:29:27
  one V ones. I'm stinking a veil. So that didn't go well. But Shane Duffy was on the pitch. Sorry,
• 1:29:31
  at the side. We were doing it. The width of the penalty area from the edge of the penalty area
• 1:29:36
  up to the halfway line. That was our box. And Shane and the other center halves were running
• 1:29:41
  down the side of the penalty area just from the halfway line to the touch line. And they were
• 1:29:46
  just doing it at half pace. Shane kept falling on the pitch. He was just trying to literally run
• 1:29:52
  in a straight line from the goal line. And he just kept veering to the right. And he just kept
• 1:29:59
  ending up on our pitch. And I was telling him to get off the pitch. And he just got lean onto
• 1:30:03
  the pitch. And that was basically the end of his career. That's ever to the other great career.
• 1:30:09
  It's funny to say that. Remember when we were away. I know you remember this. Which time?
• 1:30:16
  When we were away, we were in Marbella. And we were on the beach. And it was me and David
• 1:30:23
  here. And remember, I wasn't. He told me and David, he was going to take our places.
• 1:30:30
  Oh, sure no. I was there. That was brilliant. We've got to go out.
• 1:30:37
  That was our first trip. We were one of the young guys. So we told you so like we were there.
• 1:30:43
  And we were on the we were on the the A.O. all day. We played with football. We played a reserve
• 1:30:48
  team game. So you went out there on like Friday. We thought whatever day we played a reserve team
• 1:30:52
  game and joined them the next day. So we're drinking all day gets there. I think you might have
• 1:30:56
  even played. Oh, you're on the beach all day. No, we'd play golf. You'd play golf and we'd
• 1:31:01
  be on the beach all day. Because we got there late. And there was George Pilkinson and
• 1:31:07
  Sean O'Hanlon and Charlie. Yeah, Charlie was there and me and you came back and you came
• 1:31:12
  around and sat next to us all. And you went, right, Lads, well, I've game for you. Tell us
• 1:31:17
  what you want to be. What kind of play you want to be when you're all get to the senior level
• 1:31:21
  George Pilkinson said like I'd love to I'd love to to play like like you Alan the way you take
• 1:31:26
  the ball and you do this and said to someone else, what would you want to do to and
• 1:31:31
  yeah, I'd love to copy you Steve Watson. It was it was it was it was you though he said it to you
• 1:31:37
  with it and you're and you're building going away. I'd love to have I'd love to Alan. I'd
• 1:31:43
  actually said Alan. I'd love to have played the ball like you the way you hold the ball David
• 1:31:47
  We're love to defend like you kevkel bannered love your pace Steve Watson. Don't want anything from you
• 1:32:01
  it is yeah and then he did say at the end of he said then and I'm going to take your two
• 1:32:04
  places as well and want to take one of your places to me and David. Do you say anything?
• 1:32:09
  No it was like it was it was it was like one of them and like we were laughing at it it's
• 1:32:16
  off at a the following day would be the store saying it was like he didn't want to
• 1:32:21
  sit in mincella obviously I got loads of respect for you and all that right so like you
• 1:32:25
  know so it was yeah it was it's what it was but it was like so funny because we all
• 1:32:30
  zinc and and as I'm when you're there it gets funny you're on funnier but for the young
• 1:32:34
  guy to stand up takes a bit of balls yeah yeah yeah you know and he respect himself
• 1:32:38
  you respect that yeah you know I thought it was crazy to read yeah come on son so yeah so that
• 1:32:46
  was it yeah it's good we didn't even get to touch on our J-lows get together did we our our
• 1:32:52
  weight gang that we had for 12 4 or 5 years we had the krachans hand in me with the you the
• 1:32:57
  heavyweight the lighter you know the weight champion in the world and the Bulgarian weight
• 1:33:02
  lifted up with the next boys stubs he the Bulgarian weight lifter we call
• 1:33:07
  stubs he can just squat absolutely anything lift anything he just carries on shucking us all
• 1:33:12
  every single time and as he likes to do pull-ups for fun not anymore I've told you're a
• 1:33:16
  me weight distortion is a bit different now regardless of strength strength be weight is a
• 1:33:22
  little bit different than it used to be Tony we don't like to talk about that it's okay it will
• 1:33:25
  come back at some point don't worry you will get it back best by the way as well before we finish
• 1:33:30
  best trainer from a non-football point of view is this guy well don't know about that it was
• 1:33:38
  what he put himself through in terms of the lead up to some of the fights where we were in the gym
• 1:33:42
  he said the same it was just ridiculous he said see me I know when I no one to stop no I could
• 1:33:49
  run no one to stop as you can run no one to stop as he stopped before you know what to actually
• 1:33:55
  run and go through that that end line and keep going and to a limit it was just incredible to watch
• 1:34:05
  in terms of stop money yeah in terms of just that self-minded focus to push yourself beyond where
• 1:34:15
  probably no one goes we're just incredible to watch just call being possessed and obsessed
• 1:34:21
  it was it was a possessed it was a possessed but it was like I'd not see none of that in terms of
• 1:34:26
  the sport that we've been because normally we get we get stopped but like it was he was he was he was
• 1:34:33
  pushing himself through the line that I'd never seen before and it was it was it was impressive
• 1:34:38
  to see I must mean great for users players to see that and did that impact the way you trained
• 1:34:43
  we we made me know what I maybe realize what I wasn't to it yeah yeah we we finished playing
• 1:34:50
  then you know so we were like we it was just a gym that where it was like myself Aussie it helped
• 1:34:57
  us move on it did it it was a brilliant thing for us to do as we entered retirement to get us through
• 1:35:03
  first steps and stages and stuff to be trained and next to a guy who's trying to win titles belts
• 1:35:09
  across the one of the most the kind of spots in the in the world yeah just for our camaraderie and
• 1:35:15
  for us to actually because you've getting to know me you put me in a gym just was forward nothing
• 1:35:21
  was with nothing really to do yeah I'll come a point where I ruin it because I'm messing around
• 1:35:26
  yeah I'm not doing it properly and there's no real full goal but because he had the goal
• 1:35:30
  yeah because he had the goal because he had the goal it kind of kept it kind of kept us focused
• 1:35:38
  and it kept me focused and it was great for us Aussies was a token gesture or I'll do 10
• 1:35:43
  I get I get more biscuits afterwards than I did riffs yeah it's good because I wasn't all my whole
• 1:35:50
  career I've trained and I'm on me on I'm not part of a team yeah so when I first went to
• 1:35:56
  Finch Farm Stubs he was managing with tough that's our first met Stubs he and you get to know
• 1:36:01
  everyone in and around the building but going in and seeing them and being in the dressing room
• 1:36:06
  and seeing lads it just it was brilliant it was away from boxing it was really cool for me
• 1:36:11
  and then when we started doing it from Bill O's house and doing it in the gym which was brilliant
• 1:36:16
  because you're with the lads and you're together at the same phase each day and everyone's
• 1:36:19
  crafting everyone's doing a bit of work it just works so while I was very fortunate to have these
• 1:36:24
  around me at the time it was brilliant and then as I said we've had a we've had our nights we've
• 1:36:29
  had our chips away it's it's it's the jailhouse the jailhouse whites can you translate the gym gang
• 1:36:34
  but it's good for another podcast those though yeah definitely yeah but I've had a great time
• 1:36:39
  and it's been it's been brilliant because I just can imagine just being in a normal event and from
• 1:36:43
  being around these it's like it's it's it's surreal at times and then you have to tell you
• 1:36:50
  something go you know what the exact same with me it's just really going to kick in the ball I'm really
• 1:36:53
  going to punch people in the face it's also a years for that to sink in and you still go in at
• 1:36:58
  first matter but I don't even think wow they're like these are the the gym the gym they're
• 1:37:03
  always doing what you assume you're like the same with the storm yeah you're normal fellas
• 1:37:09
  down the bend and we figured it out yeah it's great to see the impact you've had on each of
• 1:37:14
  our friends stops you I think we could talk to you all day you definitely have to come back on
• 1:37:18
  we didn't even like touch on your time it's Celtic yeah properly but yeah no thank you so much
• 1:37:23
  for coming on base ever guess outside the box