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Coaching Chronicles: Shaping Lives on and off the Field · Let's Talk with Carl Lee

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Yeah, you gotta work. You gotta work, bry Sign, it's mine
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gotta show everybody is my time here. You gotta work, cry Shine another
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mind whom taga die day line, don't tell you gotta work. Let the
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conversation begin. This is Let's Talk with your host Carl Lee. Hello,
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ladies and gentlemen. This is Crawley with Let's Talk with Carl Lee and my
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co host, Delegate Hollis Lewis. Is that right is still Delegate? Yes,
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sir, but give and give me a little bit of an update on
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on on what you're doing, where you are and that kind of thing,
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because we haven't we haven't had a discussion about that well before we start the
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show. I got appointed in November twenty twenty three, so I just did
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my first session in uh January, February, the inn March. So currently
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right now I'm just running to basically maintain my seat. So we have primaries.
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I don't have a primary opponent. That'll be in May fourteenth, the
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primary, and then the general election will be November. But you don't have
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it. You don't have anybody that's really at this point running against not not
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in the primary, I will in the general, So get the primary.
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It's like, you know, same party ticket and then the general you run
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against the opposite party. Okay, okay, all right, well good luck.
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And when is that the primaries? May fourteenth? In the general's I
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think November fifth? Okay, so normal, both normal, all right,
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ladies and gentlemen. Today one of the one of the conversations told us that
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that I think I have found to be interesting just because we hear so much
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about coaches and and and all of that, like what is the what is
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the actual role of a coach? You've you've played, and I've played,
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and we both have coached. I coached as a as a head coach.
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You coached as assistant coach. But but give me, give me your expectations
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of what as a player, what you thought at the time the role of
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the head coach would be. And then when you started coaching, what role
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you expected or what role you saw. Not to not to critique the coach
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so much, but you know, just and my point of having this discussion
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is this, I think I think parents don't sometimes don't get it of what
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that role is for the coach. I think sometimes the player, you know
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that good player, you know he's thinking or she's thinking that all that attention
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because he or she's the best player, one of the better players, you're
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supposed to get all that attention. I don't know. I don't know if
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I if anybody gave me that informations as it as it related to a specific
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or specific players. Well, I think when we talk about like the role
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and we're talking specifically head coach, right, yeah, I think when we
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talk about that, I would say, as you you first start and give
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me what you would expect. Again, going back and saying, as you
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if you were a player today, knowing what you know, and maybe even
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if you want to go back to when you were playing, you know,
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and again, I coached, I coached you, So what what was it
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that you were looking for in that coach specifically or what you were looking from
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a coach? I think I would say, first and foremost a great teacher.
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I think that you know the first and again when we're talking specifically head
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coach, when we're talking about specifically like football, again, programmatic programmatically is
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going to depend on kind of the level that you're at right even within college,
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it would depend on D one, D two, D three, It
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would depend in powerfil five verse non power five. But I would say first
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and foremost is that you want a great teacher. Somebody who's able to articulate
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the overarching overview of the game. You know, not necessarily doesn't necessarily have
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to get in the nuances of this or that, but it's able to teach
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you the game, able to increase your IQ to, able to make you
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understand, you know, you know, how we are going to maticulate this
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thing from any of their little quirks and nuances or however they're going to do
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it, whatever perspective they're going to come from, I would look for,
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first and foremost a great teacher. Okay, I'm going to buy into the
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teacher piece of that, because I do think that, you know, if
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you're coaching, coaching is teaching in a sense, because I think you got,
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like, particularly maybe in the area that we grew up in an area
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that we played in, you got a lot of yellers, You got a
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lot of those hard nose quote unquote stereotypical type of coaches. And they may
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have been, uh, you know, been able to motivate you in one
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sense, but they weren't necessarily great teachers to help you teach the game.
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If that makes sense, I see and and and I strongly disagree with you
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in that in that in that statement. And I think that because I was
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in that era. Yes, that yelling and screaming and cussing and grabbing you,
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you know, grab you by the face, masks, grab your shoulder
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pads, all of that was was okay back in the day. The thing
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to me that that I I want to say I liked or I can appreciate
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looking back. What's that that that hard nosed coach that's gonna make you do
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it right? You know what I'm saying, Like, he's not gonna just
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he's not gonna patch you on the butt and say, come on, you
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know, get it going. You gotta do better. He ain't gonna give
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you that you're gonna get you know, come on, or what are you
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doing? You're not here today. You need to get you need to get
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focused in. But I and I know today, I know today that that
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that wouldn't work. No, no, no, that I think to your
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point, I'm not necessarily disputing that. I'm saying a lot of coaches in
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that era got caught up in doing that and they didn't teach you anything,
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and you gotta understand, I'm a quarterback, so all that, that's fine,
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But then you have to come back and you have to teach me the
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nuances of kind of what we're trying to go and even in the nuances of
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just you know, passing the football and the mechanics and different things like that.
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Those are learned skills. So you have to be able to teach those
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skills. Now. If again, if I'm just messing up, or if
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I'm continue to make the same error, then I don't mind a little yelling,
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the screaming, even a little face mask grabbing, but you have to
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teach first and not just being okay, but you yeah, okay, okay,
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And and I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna compare us together. I'm gonna
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put us in the same in the same seat. For a second, Quarterbacks
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a hard position to coach. If you if you don't, if you don't,
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if you hadn't played it, then you had to have studied it,
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or you've got to have somebody on the staff who has been a quarterback to
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do that. I think the same is true for defensive back, especially corner.
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I think corner is a hard thing to Yeah, but it's a different
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thing. Yeah, But I think, but I think it's I think it's
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difficult to teach if you don't know it. Like you can't like you can
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say, okay, cover three, you got deep third and and that's that's
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all that that's all that you got. You know, you teach them.
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And I'm not even gonna say you teach him backpedaling, but you you you
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put them out there having backpedal, and and if it looks wrong, it's
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wrong. If it looks good, then it's good. You know what I'm
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saying. And and so as long as you do that, then you're okay.
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So I think there are positions like quarterback, to your point, if
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if you you might not get all the information that you need. You know,
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throw this route, throw that route. Here's your steps that you need
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to make again, dB, you got to backpedal this kind of way.
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That's a those positions are harder. It's always you can always find an offensive
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line coach. You can always find a d line coach, somebody who played
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linebacker, you know, some running back receiver. Quarterbacks a little bit more
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of a of a challenge. So I think which again, I think It's
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why we have very few great quarterbacks. Yeah, you know, because you
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know, and again, if you're a quarterback and you're handing the ball off
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all the time, that ain't helping you. But I would even say,
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even in doing that, that is an art, right because even if you're
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running like a wing team and wing tea or some sort of option thing,
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even doing that is an art and you have to be able to teach it
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correctly. I can remember when I was at Staton coach Chevalier and he taught
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me how to run the option. And I had learned in the high school,
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but I didn't learn it to the degree that he taught. You know,
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just getting the ball back, wait till your buck, and make decision,
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keep your eyes. Those in addition to the steps. So even if
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you're just even if you're running one of those type of offenses, you still
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have to have a coach that's going to be able to teach you that.
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Even to your point is a dB. He could tell you deep half,
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or you got third, or you got middle, but he has to say,
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okay, in this situation, if this happens, you got this.
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Now, if this happens, that happens, you know, he has to
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be able to teach all those scenarios within the confines of whatever scheme that we're
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running and seeing. I think back in back in my day, you got
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deep third and and and and and you pretty much go with it, you
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know. You you do your drills, do your back pedaling and stuff like
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that, and you're breaking on the ball and all that kind of stuff.
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And and it's and again we're not at the coach. We're not we're not
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talking about the coaches per se. We're talking about just the reality of what
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it was because nobody went into detail, you know, like when I got
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when I guess that's what I'm saying. You gotta go into detail. If
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you're going to be a coach, or if you're going to be a head
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coach, you have to demand that your assistance go to that level of detail
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so the players are not surprised when these different situations pop up. And that's
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basketball, hockey, baseball, whatever. And and I hate to say this,
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but some times when coaches hire that buddy, it don't work. It
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don't it don't work. Don't work, you know, because you you want
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your buddy wants on the staff, so you put him somewhere, and then
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you where do you put him? You put him as a DV coach,
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You know, you put him somewhere that you think doesn't matter. Where does
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it not matter? Yeah? I don't think there's any space that it doesn't
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matter. Yeah. And and the reason I think you you, in my
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eyes, you you coach as a as a teacher first is because I think
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what it does. It brings up the players who are not as talented that
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they have everything, but it's just not as talented. So you can you're
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able to coach them up and they're able to get in positions or at least
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they'll have the knowledge of kind of what they're doing. And then the players
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who are exceptionally talented, if you can find to know, then they'll they'll
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just be a step or two ahead of everyone else once they have the knowledge
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of what exactly they're doing. Because I think we've you know, it just
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was too much yelling and too much screaming him again. I'm not talking about
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it from like, you know, trying to get you the tough or trying
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to you know, not to get you to be emotional. I get all
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that, that's fine, but I'm just saying when you do that and then
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you forget to teach. That's the problem. Well and and again sometimes I
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think the mistake that could be made as a coach that coaches make, and
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and I'm not naming or saying anyway, but just just overall is if you're
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if you're if you're doing a quarterback, then you have to teach the quarterback
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to make sure he understands defenses. I can hear you, but I think
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I think the most important thing is to make sure that they know defense,
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so that so that they know what the coverage is. So if they recognize
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the coverage, you can say, oh, it's covered three. But if
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you don't know where people are supposed to go, then you're you're you're stuck
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again. Portion of it, not only do you have to know teach me
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what's going on offensively, but you also have to teach me what's going on
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defensively and to the other side of that, in addition to being a great
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teacher, I'm looking for a head coach specifically to be a great administrator.
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And I think as a head coach you have to particularly and I'm saying like,
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if you're coaching at maybe like a state or you're coaching at a smaller
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school, let's say a smaller college. You're not at the Alabamas or the
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Florida with all the resources. You have to be able to go out there
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and fundraise. You have to be able to You gotta be everywhere. You
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got to be a politician. You gotta be, you know what I'm saying,
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making sure that guys are in class, guys getting grades. You have
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to make sure that you understand all the NCAA processes and procedures and different things
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of that nature. So you gotta be great on that side as well.
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Okay, So I had contacted, you know, a few coaches that I
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know, and they gave me bits and pieces of what they what, what
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they're what they thought the role of the head coach should be. And I
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thought this one was really interested. The most important thing we can teach our
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student athletes is how to be a leader with a mind with a with a
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championship mindset. There are two ways that we can do this, Okay,
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Now, discipline and accountability is one, yeah, and then he is and
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this is the one. I think that it's difficult cultivate a championship mindset.
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I don't know exactly necessarily, how you do that unless you're in that unless
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you're in that place of being a champion. You you know, your team
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has won a championship. How do you build the championship? How do you
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get the championship mindset? See? I to me, that's a little bit
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more difficult because I think that you know, I don't know, and I'm
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trying to and I'm sure there's examples of it, but I don't know if
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you've ever like just looking at a professional or collegiate level, right that you've
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ever like cultivated that mindset absence of players who may have had it, you
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know, I think to that degree, you have to have the player.
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You gotta have the talent at some level, right in order to wait to
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coach of that, because you can have like a championship mindset, but if
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you don't have the talent, you're not going to be. We're just talking
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about like the physical actor winning is and we're not saying that the coach is
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wrong. What we're saying is when when when if you're looking to be a
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head coach and you're trying to figure out how to be where to be,
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what how does that all work? I agree with you. I think if
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you, you know, walking into South Charleston at the time that I walked
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into it, I don't know if I if I could if I could find
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a championship mind that, because I don't think any there wasn't a player.
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Now, if I could shift that mindset, I think maybe you could.
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And again when we say championship mindset, like what does that mean? That
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may not mean the physical act of winning that check. It just made me
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maximizing whatever you have to So I mean, it's just to be fair.
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So and again, but I think it's difficult though. You know, the
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first part of that was developed and and or the future of the future of
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a player. So to me, I like that. I think if you
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can get in and you can make every player better, you know, and
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and and set them up for the future, and that future may not be
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football, that that future and again on on down below it's about the discipline
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and accountability and being a student athlete. You know, one of one of
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the one of the coaches had talked about part of this is about being a
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student athlete because your success doesn't necessarily on the field, doesn't necessarily guarantee you
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that next level whatever that next level is. But if if you understand the
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discipline and you apply that the accountability, you apply that all to the academic
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side of it, then no matter what football is, or basketball or baseball
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or whatever it is to you, you're gonna take care of that because you're
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gonna take care of that in the academic side. I mean, I understand
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that. But again, even academic and that's why I say, like to
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me, even academics, right, not every player you have is going to
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be a student or not not They're not going to academic is not going to
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be their strong suit, right, So I think your I don't know that,
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what do you mean by that? Because I don't know if that's true.
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I know I don't. For me, players is not going to be
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academically inclined. That's not going to be They're not going to have that acumen
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where they're going to be able to go sit in the classroom. Because then
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we know players, right who's to play four years of stay and they drive
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trucks, they cut hair, they do other things outside. But if you
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if you put in if you as that coach, you put in that that
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that concern about this, this ain't this ain't forever. This You ain't guaranteed
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to play Sunday. So it's more it's it's more important for you to make
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sure that you get yourself academically sound, get that degree so that you can
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become something. See, I disagree with that. It's more important that you
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have the capacity, capacity, and the willingness to learn. Now, whatever
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that learning is for you, it may not be in that classroom. It
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may be here on this field. And if you can get taught a skill
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on this field, then you may go be a coach. Or your capacity
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to learn on the field may translate to doing entrepreneurial things, or may cut
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hair or drive trucks, are doing something else outside of what the university can
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offer you. So again, some players are going to be academically inclined.
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They're gonna have that. But I think as a football because we can't put
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all that on us, right, you know what I'm saying. But if
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I can teach you, and I can get you to learn at here at
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a game, at something that's your game, something that you just love.
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But now I gotta teach you to learn the nuances to your point. You
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know, when you're with Pete Carroll and you're doing to punch that puss that
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puss up you did at a million gazillion times, right, But it taught
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you to do things to You know, you're not perfect, but it taught
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you to do something perfectly. It taught you to do something instinctually that now
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when you go up, you line up against the guy you know the coverage
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about that that's automatic. So it increased your capacity to learn, even though
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it's just football. Okay, you see what I'm saying, I do,
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I do. And what's funny is you being the academic and me being the
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athlete. I'm over here trying to say that you know, there's some focus
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that needs to be on the or there's a carryover from what I have on
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the field that I got to put into my end of the classroom. And
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on the other side of it, you're saying, no, this is that's
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a that's a single focus on the field. That's a single focus, and
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you're not necessarily What I'm saying is that, you know, we want to
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encourage. If I'm a football coach, I'm definitely gonna encourage my guys to
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find other interests. I want to encourage them to do their best academically the
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same way they do here. But as a football coach, I can't put
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all that on me. I'm gonna have my study halls. I'm gonna make
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sure that you try to do your best in the classroom. But if I'm
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the football coach, my job. I'm going to teach you the game of
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football. And I'm not going gonna go ahead, roll out the ball and
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have you. We're just not gonna play. We're gonna learn. We're gonna
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study the nuance of it, and we're gonna get out here and the experts
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in this thing. And I'm saying that expertise can carry over to different lane.
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Well, and I'll say this because me as a coach, me,
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as a coach at West Virginia State, you were accountable. I wanted to
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make sure that you knew you were accountable for the academic side. I mean
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that's a given you no play, yes, And I wanted to make sure
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that we stayed on top of that no matter who it was. If you
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were the number one player, number fifty player, I don't care. You
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need to be in class, So we're checking classes. If you're not in
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class, you're running and all of those kind of things because there wasn't no
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certainty that there was going to be a scout come this way. Yeah,
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and and and so your best opportunity is to get that degree. And I
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think for me to have as much as I harped on on perfection at the
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game, I'm going to make the case and you can. You can challenge
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this if you want to see where where you thought it was. My main
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focus was the academic side. But see when I came, when I when
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I get to the grass, though, once I'm at the grass, it's
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all grass. Yeah. But again I just think looks it's to this point.
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If you're taking a psychology and you're taking English, the psychology professor ain't
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worried about what the English professor doing. The English professor can't worry about what
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the psychology professor department. Doug, I understand. I'm saying athletics. You
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got to take care of athletics and if you do it right, and if
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you because the thing about being in the athletic program, particularly football, which
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is generally the standout, we're going to get the most tension on any college
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campus in the nation that has a football program. It's so many our opportunities
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to learn. It's so much to do because not only are we teaching you
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the nuances of your position this game, your side of the ball. We're
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teaching you, you know, Coach Evers used to say, you're living in
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a glass house. We're teaching you media training. We're teaching you if you
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study, if you're up under Rick, if you're in an athletic we're teaching
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you. You getting some knowledge of athletic training. We're teaching you how to
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lift weights. We teach you how to condition, we teach you how to
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each eat. We're teaching you how to study, not just your academics with
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your playbook. So I'm saying is, if I'm the football coach, I
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have to worry about football things. If I'm the basketball coach, I got
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to worry about foot basketball things. And I'm saying, it's enough opportunity and
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enough time to fit a bunch of stuff in there within the confines of what
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I'm doing. I buy that one hundred percent. I really do. But
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I don't. I don't, I don't think, and I don't see anywhere
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where any one of the coaches that I reached out to lock down just their
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role was the athletic part of it, it's it's there's some social pieces to
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it. You know. Again, that fits all within athletics. So you're
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saying if you're so, you're saying that if you, if you, if
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you're the athlete under that coach, under those by those rules that you you,
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you're gonna spend your time playing ball and learning those lessons. But when
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you walk off that field, those lessons are going with you. What you're
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saying basically yes, okay, okay, because no matter what you talk about,
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if I'm talking about how to engage yourself socially, I'm saying, again,
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you're living in the glasshouse. If you were the big man football on
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campus, then it's certain things you can't do online. I'm saying we gotta
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be media trained. I'm saying we gotta be gentlemen. I'm saying we gotta
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know how to write and articulate ourselves so that when we go comment on the
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game or coming on our teammates, we don't look foolishly. So I I'm
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saying within the confoct, particularly football, because it's such a grueling, such
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a long, such a strenuous game, that it's so much that you can
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only play one time a week. I'm saying, you fit all those lessons
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within the field of play and all those things. It's like, look that
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you build it up, build it up, brick by brick, and it
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just goes with you. And I'm saying, when we start to try to
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add too much stuff or try to think too much outside of the game,
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that's what we feel, all right. So I have my hat on,
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and I usually have my hat on, and at the wreck and all that
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kind of stuff. One of the things that Sonny Randall used to make NS
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do is take her hat off when you enter a building, whether it's the
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gym or whatever. And you and you know me, and then there's a
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whole host of other guys that are hat guys. You just wear it every
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day, you know, and and you know you you would first try to
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sneak, You try to sneak. You know, you gotta keep it on
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because you're not thinking anybody's gonna see you. And then all of a sudden,
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somebody lets the coach know that they saw you would have had on in
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the building. And then you got to get up early in the morning.
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You gotta run, you gotta do, you gotta run after practice and all
26:11
that kind of stuff. So you're like, Okay, this ain't even worth
26:15
this, ain't this is not even worth trying to beat this. Just go
26:18
with the system. I think. I think those kinds of structures are there,
26:29
they're they're not They're not out there anymore. Like I don't. I
26:32
don't know if coaching the head coach, whether he's supposed to not supposed to.
26:37
I don't. I'm not saying he's supposed to or not supposed to,
26:40
but I'm just saying in the difference of head coaches and and how how you
26:47
develop a kid, Like every one of my every one of the guys that
26:52
I played with in college, bru it's taking their hat off as soon as
26:56
they hit the door in the meet for the meeting room. See to me,
27:00
I find that like nonsensical. Well I don't. I don't. I
27:03
don't see how that's going to be applicable to I don't see how that's going
27:07
to be applicable to anything. But what I will say is applicas coach Lee
27:11
time. That's one that you had. We set our clocks ten five minutes,
27:15
uh was it late or early early? Early? So that way you
27:18
always five to ten minutes early. Now, when I find it in my
27:22
political life and in my professional life, it's always better to get to a
27:27
place early than late, you know, even even for like uh, you
27:32
know, even for not so even for just the basic of reasons, right,
27:36
you want to get to an event early so you could take pictures because
27:37
generally the big word the big wigs is getting there early and they leaving early.
27:41
Right, So that's applicable. So something like they have one under I
27:47
don't. I don't find it applicable to anything. Well, because there used
27:49
to be the rule. There used to be the rule of you couldn't wear
27:52
a hat in the building, like even in school, like you couldn't wear
27:56
a hat, like you couldn't wear it, like you couldn't you couldn't go
28:00
into us into a into the classroom with a hat. Okay, you know,
28:06
so it was to me. And again, I wear my hat everywhere.
28:11
Yeah I've seen yeah so, And but I did learn that lesson,
28:21
and so if if it was ever needed, like that would be something that
28:25
I would be able to easily adjust adjust to. And I say that only
28:30
because I never forgot it, you know, And and and those kinds of
28:36
things are are are I think I think they're missed. I think and to
28:41
to your point of time on time, that's a huge one, like huge
28:48
one. And and and I didn't come up with that. That was again
28:52
that was Sonny. That was Sonny Randall. That would have been Bud Grant.
28:53
That would have been like anywhere. And and you know today, like
28:57
you in your profession now you can ain't don't be late. No, it's
29:02
just it's just or I would even say even if you it's just better to
29:04
be early. I'll just put it like that, just to put it a
29:07
positive. It's always better to be early. And I think that when you
29:10
just get back to the point when we're talking about these rules and we're talking
29:14
about these sort of coaching philosophies and strategies that that are gonna have effects outside
29:19
the game, they have to be number one, they have to be applicable.
29:22
And I think it has to be with it. If we can make
29:26
it where it's in the confines of the game, I just think it it
29:30
plays better. All Right, We're gonna take a quick break and we'll jump
29:33
back in it as soon as we come back. Follow us on Facebook at
29:37
let's talk Carl Lee. Visit w c hsnetwork dot com slash Let's Talk for
29:41
more sponsorship opportunities are available. Contact Carl Lee at Let's Talk at pro message
29:48
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29:52
call free zero four three four two eight one three one ask Carl a question
29:56
or comment on current or previous episode. To visit Let's Talk Carl Lee on
30:02
Facebook, Like, rate and subscribe from your podcast service to help more people
30:07
find Let's Talk with Carl Lee. Now back to the conversation. All right,
30:11
ladies and gentlemen, we're back from the break, and Hollis and I
30:15
are are beating back and forth the role of the head coach and his his
30:23
responsibilities, I guess in a sense, and how that has an impact on
30:33
I think the future of of a of an athlete, Like I think everything
30:38
about me is I think I got from from from the coaches that I had
30:45
from uh, Homer Crittal, who was who was military type guy, Sonny
30:52
Randall, military type guy, Bud Grant, military type guy, those kinds
30:59
of and even even even junior high. You know, my junior high.
31:03
I know it's middle school now, but you had somebody who was so disciplined
31:11
and holds you accountable for any and everything. That's whether it's being in class,
31:18
whether it's being late for class, whether it's being late for practice,
31:22
whether it's like anything that you were any rule late for curfew, late we
31:30
it was you couldn't even be You couldn't even be late for dinner, you
31:34
know. Uh, you know, for your meal. You had to be
31:37
on time, you know. And so I think I think where I think
31:44
we're coaching has dropped off. To me, it is that we don't want
31:49
to put that accountability and and and I think the accountability comes with the parents
31:55
now because some of these parents have to drive, they have to drive their
31:57
kids. Sometimes they're not off, you know, they're not off, so
32:00
they can't get there in time. But that should be something that's discussed so
32:04
that you know. But if you just if you just randomly late, are
32:08
you're bringing your child late that, I don't know if that helps him understand
32:14
being on time. Yeah, I mean I agree with you on that when
32:17
I think just the dynamic has changed, because I mean back in the day,
32:22
you know you you know, you live in you live in close proximity
32:25
to where he played so you riding your bike, you walk and it wasn't
32:30
like afar Off. You didn't have to travel on an interstate to get to
32:35
you know, practice. One of the things I would like to see,
32:37
in addition to like the time attire like I know that, you know when
32:43
I was at GW, even at state, like, you couldn't come out
32:45
in the practice field with random colors. You couldn't, you know, you
32:50
had to be dressed appropriately for practice. Yes, And I think everybody looked
32:55
like everybody looked alike. Everybody at least everybody had the same color, same
33:00
you know, you we're going to have this on this day, this on
33:02
that day, et cetera, et cetera. And I think stuff like that
33:07
that carries over to a person presenting themselves neatly and within you know, within
33:13
the standard or whatever industry they work in. And I'm interested to see whatever
33:16
what was some more of the comics, Well, here was one which kind
33:21
of plays into that. I think the biggest role is getting them to buy
33:25
into the process and the culture which should be designed to get help help them
33:30
grow in all areas of their life, getting them to develop the habits of
33:36
consistency and accountability, helping push them beyond what they can see and challenging them
33:43
in the areas of uncomfortability to to to them to be great and see.
33:50
And that's what it is for me. We're going to whatever the process and
33:53
procedure that you set forth as a coach, whatever we're doing, I need
33:58
you to buy into that because if I can get you to understand and I
34:01
can get you to maximize yourself within that process and procedure, you'll be able
34:06
to do it in other areas of your life. And I think that's what
34:09
he articulated what I was trying to say. Perfect, Okay, So let
34:13
me ask this. Okay, So does it really matter what the coach?
34:21
How the coach does this per se if you follow it, if you're if
34:27
you are willing to follow it, you're going to learn some of these lessons.
34:30
Like I think it matters, it matters how they do it well,
34:35
because I'm not gonna say how they do what I shouldn't say how they do
34:37
it, but what they do as long as they're doing something that that that's
34:43
holding you accountable. Because I think the biggest thing that I keep seeing is
34:46
accountability. That that's that that word discipline, accountability, self discipline. I
35:01
think those type those types of those types of words are are are are queuing
35:07
into that individual to learn what is happening, learn what is going on in
35:15
this in this structure. Like you you you get to the capitol, you
35:20
understand how that structure and culture works. And you know, not necessarily,
35:23
but I understand it. I'm gonna let it play out and learning. I'm
35:28
gonna learn. I understand that there's a process in a procedure. That's what
35:30
I understand. So so you know that you gotta you have to kind of
35:35
work into that process and the procedure to understand it as quick as you can,
35:39
because if you don't, somebody's gonna keep calling you on it. And
35:44
I think and I and my question becomes to the coach, to you do
35:52
our kids today? Are they worried about that? Like are? And I
35:55
would say no, because obviously we see that with the movement the far and
36:00
I don't want to travel down that rabbit hole. But you see with the
36:02
move when the transfers and stuff like that, if it doesn't work out,
36:06
I'm just going to the next school. And I would put it in the
36:08
context of like offensively maybe you have this this guy where who's running a spread
36:14
offense, or you have this guy running an option offense. Right, if
36:17
I'm able as like to say, the quarterback, if I'm able to say,
36:22
Okay, I know that my skill set is more of a passer,
36:25
but I'm gonna get into this wing team where I may pass ten times a
36:30
game, and I'm gonna master this, you know what I mean. I'm
36:32
gonna challenge myself to master it, even though i know I'm better suited maybe
36:37
for something else. And I think stuff like that, It can't help you,
36:39
right, it can't help you. And I think that I think parents
36:49
don't understand how you know. And let me just say it out now,
36:57
I'll fix it. How well scouts look at an athlete. They're not looking
37:05
at that athlete at quarterback, at corner, at dB, you know what
37:09
I'm saying. Like that, they're looking at where they specifically think that player
37:15
can play, and he may not or she may not have played that position
37:20
at all. Yeah, but it ends up getting in that position at whatever
37:24
that next level is, let's say to college, and all of a sudden
37:29
that they can play it. Yeah, it's the same thing like big men
37:32
now, right, if you're a big man, every big man wants to
37:36
go out into the wing and shoot threes and dribble drive. Right. But
37:38
if I'm a big man and I can go up under the post, and
37:40
I can post up, and by the time I get to the next level,
37:44
not only do I have that skill, but I also have the skill
37:45
playing in the wings, So I can do a little bit of both.
37:47
So I think that far as like on that end, when you're talking about
37:52
parents, you have to be able to think holistically about development and skill set
37:59
and this pathology. Like, for example, I think the case for travel
38:02
sports is perfect in this instance where for example, if I have a big
38:07
man, what he's playing for his school, maybe he plays under the post,
38:10
but when we go to a you you're gonna play on the wing to
38:13
develop that skill, right, you see what I'm saying. I think those
38:15
how those things can sort of compliment one another because because again, unlike unlike
38:22
football football, you you once you're something, you're that for a while until
38:30
something somebody else tweaks it and sees that you're something that they think that you're
38:37
something different, Like it took me I was I played in two different games
38:42
I played corner at Marshall and everything else was safety. So I'm thinking I'm
38:47
a safety, but every scout that looked at me looked at me as a
38:52
corner. I was long, long arms, big hands, all that kind
38:58
of crazy stuff, and I wasn't. I wasn't even really, I wasn't
39:01
even sure you know that I was okay with that, you know. And
39:06
again I even moved back to safety my second year just because, like you
39:15
know, I just and I felt good. I was like, okay,
39:17
this is it. But all of a sudden I realized size and the physicality
39:22
of that safety position was even above my head, you know, And I'm
39:25
think, I'm thinking, you know, hey, I'm physical. I don't
39:28
mind running into anybody. But that was like that happened too frequently. So
39:34
I ended up going back to the corner. And from that moment it was
39:39
it was crazy to me how well they knew me better than I knew me.
39:47
Hmm. They knew what I could do better than I did. Yeah,
39:52
But again, though you trusted those are experts. Though I would say
39:57
those NFL scouts were experts, and I don't thing parents down to them.
40:00
I don't know if they have the same trust far as at the lower levels
40:04
high school and stuff like that. But but but my my point to this
40:07
is it doesn't matter where you play that. I mean, I agree with
40:14
you on one end. I agree, I think it's always good to challenge
40:16
yourself. But I also think that sometimes you know, you know, you
40:23
know, you know, but you don't know what the you don't know,
40:27
like you okay, okay, because because like again, I'm going to make
40:30
the case that there were a thousand black quarterbacks that never got a chance to
40:36
play quarterback that could have played. There's no questions, not even could it,
40:40
should have played, should have played brother who's throwing Jerry Rice the moment
40:47
lead? So what so changing them to a receiver and dbs and stuff like
40:53
that back in the day that that was a horrible situation because because but that
40:59
was a that was a issue around leadership. You know, you couldn't be
41:02
a black quarterback and be a leaguer or issue of the times of the issues
41:06
at the time. Yes, now you see it, and you and and
41:12
and some of your best quarterbacks you know in college they're not even thinking about
41:19
playing another position. Ain't nobody thinking about them playing another position? Because you
41:22
got my homes. You got these guys out there that could prove that they
41:27
could think and do all the audibles and do all that kind of stuff.
41:30
They and I'm saying, and to me, that's the case. I mean
41:35
again, we're not there in that time anymore, but that's the case sometimes,
41:37
you know, you know, like if I sometimes some kids know,
41:40
and I'm sure some of those guys truly knew they were quarterbacks. And I
41:45
think some kids know. Some parents know, like my kid is gonna be
41:47
doing this, what's some other ones believe in them talking about your players and
41:55
hold them to a higher to a high standard of discipline and account the building.
42:00
I like that one too. Yes, I like that one too.
42:02
I think that's that's important. That's could be one of the most important one
42:08
because that's that's everybody that's not the star or the guy that's sitting on the
42:15
bench or the girl that's sitting on the bench. This is this is the
42:19
team. And I see I like that because that that pitch it squarely within
42:23
the confines of the game. And I'm saying, look, you're a part
42:28
of this yellowjacket or cougars or whatever, You're gonna be on time you're gonna
42:31
be dressed appropriately, gonna walk with your head up high. You're gonna this
42:36
is the grades that we get and it pits it in the confines of the
42:39
game where we're not trying to be your parent, your mom, your dad,
42:43
your teacher, d D D D. We're just we're your coach.
42:45
And this is the standard that we're gonna have for you to be a part
42:49
of this thing of art. And to that point, I one hundred percent
42:52
agree with you that that takes mom, that takes dad, that takes uncle,
42:58
that takes all them out of it, that you're out of it if
43:00
you want to be part of this is what we do. And and you
43:05
can and you don't, and you're because this conversation, this conversation is trying
43:12
to assist you in understanding that at some that's gonna be a point in time
43:17
you have no control over the system. The system is bigger than you and
43:23
and you're gonna be You're gonna be the one who's gonna keep coming to the
43:27
school trying to tell the coach that your kid is something else. When they
43:30
have moved him to another position. You're gonna try to convince them that he
43:35
needs to play somewhere. So if if well, here's what if he if
43:38
he ain't the quarterback, I'm moving him to such and such. I'm not
43:45
telling you what not to do, Okay. What I'm telling you is sometimes
43:52
you have to trust that coach and until your point, and I like what
43:57
you said, you're going to run into a point where the system is bigger
44:00
than you. Yes, right, And I think you know me like like
44:05
in my past, I was a judge, I was on the parole board,
44:07
and what I often found was that when you talk to those guys,
44:10
particularly those guys are and women who are incarcerated, some of those individuals just
44:16
can't get their head wrapped around that you're a part of this society. You're
44:22
part of this system, and if you keep going outside of the confines of
44:25
what we deem allowable or unlawful, you're gonna find yourself exactly where you currently
44:32
are. And I think to your point, regardless of the ancillary conversations,
44:37
it's gonna get to a point where you have to work within the confines of
44:42
the system. Now now you can you can work within it to be a
44:45
part of it, or you can master it. And I think that's where
44:49
you have those greats. Do you have those Tom Brady's where or Bill Belichick
44:52
where they were able to master the system? Yes, you see what I'm
44:58
saying, Michael Geordane, Kobe Bryant able to master the system. Because even
45:04
those athletes, when you talk about Kobe, Bryan and Michael Jordan, they
45:07
work within a triangle office that the coach said, and and and and I
45:13
saw I saw this clip on Facebook with Kobe talking about you know, he
45:22
didn't he didn't like to lose, but losing wasn't an issue for him.
45:27
He said, like winning and losing wasn't the issue. What the issue was
45:31
him being ready to play, him being the being the best player he could
45:37
be on the on the court. And if he did everything he could do
45:43
to be the best player, winning and losing will take care of itself.
45:45
And hunt and that's in and that's what we have to that is that is
45:52
that is the basis of what the coaches is in line thinking Okay, he's
45:57
in the line of thinking, Okay, I got this kid, he's he's
46:01
really pretty good. I got this kid. He's okay, this kid he's
46:05
really really good. This kid's okay, And he's trying to merge them,
46:07
put them together into a place to where they can be the best team.
46:15
They the best team they can be, not the best individual they can be.
46:19
You can be the best individual wherever he puts you, and you can
46:23
say, well, I don't like it. He ain't getting the ball no
46:27
more. Yeah, okay, what are you saying? But and you know,
46:30
and that was and that was my problem with kind of with the first
46:32
whoever the coach was the first comment that we read, because developing a championship
46:37
mentality, Like I said, I think as a coach, you can recognize
46:40
all those I can recognize that I have these pieces and you can assemble them
46:45
perfectly, and you've done your job as a coach. But I think on
46:49
the other end, if you if those players don't have that mentality, then
46:52
it's not really it's not going to manifest itself into a championship level. And
46:58
I would say to that point, my only my only regret as a player
47:02
is that I don't like looking back is like I don't know if I reached
47:06
that maximum. I don't I don't know if I reached that pinnacle where I've
47:08
exhausted all the potential that I have and this is the result. And I
47:14
think as a player, just talking about just on the players in currently,
47:16
that's where you want to be at the end of your career, whether it's
47:20
high school, college, pros, whatever, you want to maximize yourself.
47:23
I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna critique
47:27
you on that, on that particular point, and I'm going to unfortunately agree
47:31
with you. I'm gonna agree with you. But I think at the time
47:37
that I got there and you were there, you were already beyond football.
47:45
You you you you, you were you know you. You didn't have Sunday.
47:49
You didn't have Sunday thinking. You weren't thinking Sunday, at least it
47:52
didn't come across to me. I wasn't. So you were already looking for
47:55
this this this this, this life maybe even the life that you got now,
48:00
you were looking for that. And because you were looking for that,
48:04
you were doing everything that you needed to do to get that. To your
48:08
point earlier about putting all that focus into the football, your focus was in
48:15
that career and in football was the after was the after glow. But I'll
48:20
say this, I think if if if the focus would have if I had
48:24
to put more into the football than this could have been accelerated. Because I
48:30
think that's what happens. You know, again, we all know that everybody
48:32
ain't gonna play on Sunday, but I think even at a small college,
48:37
if you're all American, all conference, those things accelerate that career. Yes,
48:42
and that's and that's my point. And I'm not saying put all your
48:45
eggs in one basket. I'm not obviously saying that, But what I am
48:47
saying is that if you're going to do it, you need to do it
48:52
well. I'll make the case that football has opened doors for me to do
48:58
things that I would have never never done because of that accelerated career, being
49:05
able to find Sunday, be able to get to lose the lasts any last
49:08
week. Yes, yeah, that's what I'm saying. You gotta understand that
49:12
opportunity doesn't happen. Doesn't happen to everybody, you see what I'm saying.
49:16
Yeah, and that just don't happen. And and and the work that you
49:22
if you are willing to put that kind of work in on the field,
49:27
on the court, whatever it is you put that you put that there.
49:31
You don't know any other way to do another job. When you get a
49:37
job, you're gonna put you You're gonna put it. You're gonna put the
49:40
work in and and you're gonna want to accelerate. And you don't know who's
49:45
watching exactly. You never know who's watching, because I'm telling you it's some
49:49
guys out here who were great high school players, and no people remember,
49:52
like, man, you were awesome, you were my hero, and come
49:55
over here with us, and you know, let me see what you got
49:59
going on. Now. People remember that, you know, Levi Phillips,
50:02
People remember that name forever, and they still do remember that name just like
50:08
it was, just like it was yesterday. And I never seen any play.
50:12
But all that carry, all that, all that talent and all that
50:15
carries over into your life, whether it's whether you're playing on a professional lever,
50:21
coaching, or you're just or you're working in the white collar job.
50:23
So I'm saying, why you got the chance to do this thing, why
50:28
you got the chance to be a part of this man, go hard,
50:31
be the best you can be. And okay, so there's a there's another
50:36
there's another line here. But we can use football to teach leadership and positive
50:44
perspective one hundred percent, one hundred percent Can we now? Can we today?
50:51
I think, I think what you that's a great question, and I
50:54
think you can teach. And it's a it's different. It's more difficult,
50:59
I say, because if you got different guys coming in and out, it's
51:01
difficult to mess your team together. But I think what you can teach,
51:06
you could teach, you know, a leadership amongst oneself, because I think
51:10
if you're a guy who's going to stay among the chaos, then you got
51:15
to make sure that you're ready to go. You gotta make sure you're ready
51:17
physically, mentally, emotionally, academically. You have to be ready to go
51:22
because to your point, you don't know who's coming in and out. So
51:25
I might be playing quarterback the villa Tommy kid, right, he was a
51:29
quarterback, a good high school quarterback. He comes in the next year,
51:34
he's playing running back, a good all state running back. Now back to
51:37
quarterback. So you don't know what you're going to be doing because you don't
51:40
know who's coming in and out of the door. So has a You got
51:43
to make sure that your leadership and you're ready to go. So I think
51:46
it kind of switched. Unfortunately, I don't know if that's a good thing.
51:49
Well, yeah, that's true too. So the coach has to believe
51:54
in them, but again hold them, to hold them accountable and hold them
52:00
to a standard. A standard of discipline I've never heard, I've never seen
52:06
it that way, standard of discipline like that. But I do like that
52:08
because I think that is the standard somewhere in wherever, the wherever discipline starts.
52:17
That's that standard you have to you have to hold them. Maybe youth
52:22
football is different than middle school, middle schools, different than high school high
52:27
schools, different in college. College is different. Pro whether or not you
52:30
know it or not, you can't you can't be late for practicing on Sunday.
52:35
And I just think the standard itself, what I'm saying is like,
52:38
this is the standard we set for us in order for us to maintain these
52:43
standards. These are the things that we have to do, and if we're
52:45
not willing to do that, then we're not going to maintain this standard and
52:49
we're not gonna go. So I like the standard part of it because I
52:52
think just in society there's this different conversation. But decidy in general, we're
52:57
not holding standards now. No, I think we think that, oh that's
53:00
okay, that ain't that bad everything. Yeah, it's good. It's you
53:06
know, he's okay, he didn't do no, because if it's if who's
53:10
who's creating the boundary, where's the boundary actually at? So like so,
53:15
oh it's okay, Hollis. Hollis just said something like that. That's okay,
53:20
you know, And then I'm gonna go I'm gonna push that. I'm
53:22
gonna push that limit and go a little bit further. And the thing is,
53:25
there is a boundary, and then we're saying it ain't no boundaries with
53:29
when you're getting this get over here or get over there. There's gonna be
53:34
some boundaries actually, you see what I'm saying. So you learned to work
53:37
within those, it's gonna benefit you moving around. You know, you know
53:42
this person as well as I know this person. Okay, that person who
53:45
can't even have a normal conversation with you without some kind of some kind of
53:52
word coming in there, just in a normal conversation. Where are you working
53:55
at exactly? Because because you can't, you you have not no one has
54:02
told you not to say these words you don't know where not to say them.
54:09
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you have no de korum. You know,
54:13
you don't know what I don't know that big words. But but yeah,
54:17
but I think the reality of that is is is we have not we
54:22
have not We've we've got so relaxed on on the culture. Not only one
54:30
of you use the standards. I think the standard of what what we are
54:36
as whether what you're going to be as an athlete, and and and the
54:39
benefits of what it is. And the coaches want to and again some of
54:44
these coaches they want to win so bad they they have that culture, but
54:47
they gotta they gotta give it up. They gotta they gotta be flexible with
54:52
it so that you know, you don't leave. And I understand that it's
54:55
got to be a little bit of flex but I just think it's an let
55:00
I see. And that was I guess that was my point, is that
55:02
we gotta maintain a standard here. They can tell you out there over there,
55:07
in there whatever, there ain't no standards. Everybody can just as really
55:10
needed to do what they want. But in here, we gotta maintain some
55:15
standards, and we gotta maintain some decorum, and we gotta maintain a high
55:21
level of discipline, whatever you want, accountability, all that in order for
55:24
us to move forward, because if we don't do this, then we can't
55:29
move unlike maybe out there when it's all just a free for all. And
55:32
I think that's that's the beauty of what athletics is, and that's what we
55:37
gotta get back to. And and I'm gonna, I'm gonna say this,
55:39
and this is gonna I don't know how this is actually gonna sound, but
55:44
I'm gonna say it anyway. And I'm looking at football football as a as
55:51
a as a with the ratio of seventy five eight black athletes. Right,
56:00
So you got that group of players, that that number of players, and
56:07
you're and you're allowing some flexibility. I'm gonna I'm gonna give Hollis a little
56:15
bit of room he can kind of say and do because you know, he's
56:16
my guy. You know, he's my player, So I'm gonna give him
56:19
some some room. Well, somebody else is gonna try to take a little
56:23
bit of that space too. Somebody else is gonna take a little bit of
56:28
his space. So before you know what, you've got a team built around
56:31
you as the star me as the coach saying all these crazy things, saying
56:37
all this and then knowing that that ain't gonna work. I'm gonna let it
56:43
work. Yeah, it's gonna work with me. But as soon as you
56:47
started to start talking about trying to go to college or just getting the job,
56:52
getting the job, yeah, just trying to get a job, you
56:55
you don't know how to to man, He's that because you're at because you've
57:01
been free to be able to say that. So I'm saying to I'm saying
57:07
the coaches, I know that if you can't go back to old school,
57:10
old schools, old schools, old school and it's gone. But you to
57:16
me, to me, look at my record, And I'm still saying to
57:22
me, I think we have to be better in making making our kids better,
57:30
holding them accountable if they leave, they leave, you know. See,
57:37
I just think it's the standard, I think to me, because we
57:40
can tell discipline center and all that, and I think those are buzzwords,
57:45
but I just think, like just the standard. This is the standard that
57:49
we have. If you fail to ithere to this standard, then maybe you
57:53
just can't be here. Because I can I can guarantee you. I can
57:57
guarantee you that there are some of these coaches hold hold a standard where they
58:05
are yeah, okay, and and then on the other side of it,
58:10
there are coaches who are just okay, just I got my team and we
58:15
get that. That's not really even the to me, that's not even like
58:19
the contest. That's not even it to me. It's saying like, for
58:22
example, if you had a small community where kids don't have no choices,
58:25
then that's one thing. But when you're at a at a GW capitol hurricane,
58:30
when these guys are just kind of moving back and forth, are you
58:32
still able to and I'm just using those schools an example, this ain't about
58:36
them. Are you still able to maintain or hold the line knowing that I
58:40
can lose this kid and I can lose that kid if you see them.
58:45
I think that's the contest. That that's the head coach issue. That's the
58:49
head coach issue is because what you have to figure out as the head coach.
58:54
And yeah, I'm giving I'm giving this as asked some advice. If
58:59
you're going to be head coach, My thing to you is do the best
59:02
that you can do for your kids. Don't don't don't make it easy for
59:07
them, don't stand put the standard in place. Make make sure that your
59:15
school, your team has a standard that they must meet. Yeah. Not,
59:20
it's not an option regardless of whether or not they're gonna transfer if you
59:24
transfer, So be it. This thing, this school, this team,
59:30
We're gonna have a standard. We're gonna work this hard, and we're gonna
59:35
go out and we're gonna play this hard and the results will be what they
59:37
want to be. But at the end of the at the end of your
59:39
three years, four years, whatever level you're at, you're gonna be successful.
59:45
Yeah. Yeah, I can appreciate that, and I can respect that,
59:50
you know what I mean. And I think that you if you put
59:52
that on top of a coach who has the ability the acumen to teach that
59:55
standard, to teach those things, I think that's where you win at you
1:00:00
know what I mean. But you got it. I think in today's time,
1:00:02
you gotta maintain it because I just can't. I'm just I've seen it
1:00:07
on both ends and it's going and it's going downhill. I've seen it on
1:00:10
both ends, and I just seen like it just doesn't work if you don't
1:00:14
have that standard. Now, again, you're gonna get lucky. You're gonna
1:00:16
maybe have runs. We're gonna get a run of players that's just too good
1:00:20
to be beat, right, But you gotta maintain that standard that have that
1:00:23
long term success. All right, ladies and gentlemen, that's that's the show.
1:00:29
And coaches, Hopefully you heard us. Maybe you're you're doing it.
1:00:35
Hopefully you know you you got something positive out of it. We weren't trying
1:00:38
to be negative. We were trying to be as positive as we can.
1:00:43
And we're out, so we'll get back to you again soon. The opinions
1:00:46
expressed on this program do not necessarily reflect the opinions of w VRC Media,
1:00:52
it's management, employees, or sponsors. Follow us on Facebook at Let's Talk
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