Latest / Simply Bitcoin / Paolo Ardoino | Simply Bitcoin IRL

Transcript

Paolo Ardoino | Simply Bitcoin IRL · Simply Bitcoin

• 0:00
  So Paulo, you're a very humble guy, but you've basically
• 0:03
  created the most profitable company on the face of the
• 0:06
  planet. How the hell did you do that?
• 0:08
  By pure luck. I said you're humble.
• 0:10
  The USDT is just a representation of the US dollar
• 0:12
  and gives the ability to move it with less friction and all that.
• 0:16
  But the ultimate best form of currency that we will have in 50
• 0:19
  years is is Bitcoin. And I fail to understand how
• 0:25
  Bitcoin will not be the most used currency in the world and
• 0:27
  will be the check and balances of the world as a currency.
• 0:34
  Yeah, welcome to another episode of Simply Bitcoin IRL.
• 0:38
  It's an absolute honor today to have Paulo Arduino join me.
• 0:42
  Thank you, Paulo, for joining me.
• 0:43
  Thank you, CEO of Tether. So I recently saw that you came
• 0:47
  to the United States. You're welcome to the White
• 0:49
  House. You got a standing ovation.
• 0:51
  How did that feel? Very weird and crazy because I
• 0:54
  came to the United States, I'm 41 now.
• 0:56
  I came into the United States for the first time in my life
• 0:59
  when this year the the 2nd of March 2025 and after four
• 1:04
  months, I think it was the 18th of July 2025, I got to meet the
• 1:08
  president. A stable condo was signed.
• 1:10
  So it's like, I think it was a very, very compressed arc of
• 1:14
  time where a lot of things happened.
• 1:16
  I had to spend a lot of time in the United States to explain
• 1:19
  Tether, to explain Bitcoin. I stayed two months in DC to
• 1:23
  meet with regulators, lawmakers to to explain what Bitcoin is
• 1:27
  about, but also what the Tether is doing in the world.
• 1:29
  Why Tether is one of the best allies to United States for for
• 1:34
  the US dollar Germany, but as well as making sure that the US
• 1:37
  can become and will become the the digital asset in Bitcoin
• 1:40
  capital of the world. Being Italian, I was born in the
• 1:44
  80s looking at all the and watching all the movies from
• 1:47
  from the US with where the US was leading everything and felt
• 1:52
  like in the last four years something changed because the US
• 1:55
  was for the first time in history not leading the
• 1:57
  technology and not So now he's getting back on track.
• 2:00
  Yeah, when I saw the video of, you know, President Trump naming
• 2:06
  you by name and you standing up in the front row, I was like, Oh
• 2:08
  my God, this is crazy. How what was the significance of
• 2:12
  the genius act that was passed that specifically the stable
• 2:15
  coin regulation bill? What how did that change?
• 2:18
  What was the significance of it? The Genius Act is a is a very
• 2:22
  important piece of law because it creates a template for
• 2:25
  stablecoins. I'm a Bitcoiner and I love
• 2:28
  Bitcoin. I think it's the most perfect
• 2:29
  form of money. We saw in 2014 the opportunity
• 2:32
  to use the same technology that Bitcoin uses to transport Fiat
• 2:36
  currencies and and the dollar. We started that in 2014.
• 2:39
  Until 2024, no one care about stable coins, no one thought was
• 2:45
  a good idea, at least in the western world.
• 2:48
  In the rich world, people were skeptics.
• 2:50
  This year seems like everyone and their sisters want to do a
• 2:53
  stable coin also because of the genius act.
• 2:54
  That is my opinion is a great thing.
• 2:56
  Competition is always good, so how technology improves.
• 2:59
  But as a Bitcoin lover, I think that is important to put
• 3:03
  everything in context. And I think that I'm not big fan
• 3:06
  of all the other alcoins and and blockchains, but I think that
• 3:10
  stable coins have a reason to exist because not everyone out
• 3:13
  there understands Bitcoin yet and everything is relative.
• 3:16
  You have people that live in in emerging markets like Bolivia or
• 3:21
  Argentina where we do become education there.
• 3:24
  But people there have bigger problems.
• 3:26
  And their their main worry in this moment is that the fact
• 3:30
  that the Argentinian peso lost 98% of its value against the US
• 3:33
  dollar. So the only thing that they see
• 3:36
  in with their eyes is the dollar.
• 3:37
  So they want the dollar that their mind is focused to get the
• 3:40
  dollar because they can beat already their national currency
• 3:44
  by X 100%. That's why stablecoins mine
• 3:47
  while in the United States, for example, you don't have much
• 3:51
  need of a stablecoin in my opinion elsewhere, and that's
• 3:55
  why I say all is relative, you have a strong need of stablecoin
• 3:58
  because the current options are very bad.
• 4:00
  That's why we, we focused on building a dollar, a digital
• 4:03
  dollar that could serve 500 million users.
• 4:06
  We just a few days ago we crossed the mark of 500 million
• 4:09
  users and we have around 183 billion of dollars under
• 4:13
  management for, for USDT. And when the genus arc pass we
• 4:18
  we actually were able to explain, you know all these what
• 4:21
  we're doing in Africa, in Central South America in, in, in
• 4:24
  Asia in terms of dollar Germany buy back the US Treasuries.
• 4:28
  We are probably the 17th largest holder U.S.
• 4:31
  Treasuries in the world. And at the same time, I I think
• 4:35
  that it allowed, the Genus Act, allowed us also to look at the
• 4:38
  United States as an opportunity, as a new market, because with
• 4:41
  the previous administration there was Operation 2.0.
• 4:45
  The OCC was trying to kill banks that were supporting crypto and
• 4:49
  and that was not good. So now that at least there is
• 4:52
  clarity in the the Genius Act is a statement of clarity of the
• 4:56
  will of the government to support this technology.
• 4:59
  Then we felt confident that we could enter United States
• 5:02
  because then there was going to be a rule of law and there was a
• 5:05
  framework to for us to operate in United States.
• 5:08
  And so we are entering the United States.
• 5:09
  We believe that we we have invested in Rumble.
• 5:13
  We are working with Rumble to build a Rumble wallet that will
• 5:16
  have Bitcoin, UST and USAT and that are gold inside so that we
• 5:21
  with a 51 million user base that is the active user base of
• 5:24
  Rumble and so all that is possible through the genus act
• 5:27
  I'm a. Huge, huge fan of Rumble as a
• 5:29
  content creator, free speech platform and the fact that
• 5:32
  they're integrating a non custodial wallet I think is a
• 5:35
  huge, it's, it's a game changer. Now Paulo, I have a question for
• 5:38
  you. Do you believe that stable coins
• 5:40
  are an on ramp to Bitcoin eventually?
• 5:42
  I think is that is the ultimate case.
• 5:44
  I was, I was a little bit kind of criticized.
• 5:47
  I mean, I used to speak up my mind and I tried to do it in a
• 5:51
  way that you know, I want to be objective and logical in
• 5:55
  everything. At least I tried in everything I
• 5:57
  say at once. I said maybe in 50 years there
• 6:00
  is only will need no need of USD T So the point I don't like
• 6:04
  companies that try to protect one product for the sake of
• 6:07
  protecting it just because it makes money today to me.
• 6:10
  And the ultimate goal is that, you know, the USDT is just
• 6:13
  represent representation of the US dollar and gives the ability
• 6:17
  to move it with less friction and all that.
• 6:19
  But the ultimate best form of currency that we we will have in
• 6:24
  50 years is is Bitcoin. There will be, I think the need
• 6:28
  of few things like a generational change.
• 6:30
  I mean, older people, for example, they, you know, don't
• 6:33
  trust Bitcoin and yet because they don't understand Bitcoin.
• 6:36
  My grandmother was always telling me, I trust three
• 6:39
  people, my doctor, my priest and my banker, right.
• 6:43
  So Asia was coming and was born in a very small village in
• 6:46
  Italy. But that is kind of the not
• 6:48
  everyone, of course, but the majority of the older generation
• 6:51
  is rooted in this concept, and that's fine.
• 6:56
  I think freedom also means that we should give the freedom of
• 6:59
  people to, to choose what they use.
• 7:01
  But with the new generations, I think there is more people are
• 7:04
  more prone to, to use Bitcoin as their main source of stability
• 7:09
  for, for their wealth. Also on the other side, in order
• 7:12
  to gap, to fill the gap between USDT and Bitcoin.
• 7:17
  So UST is a dollar in Bitcoin. I think we created something in
• 7:20
  the middle. It's called tender gold.
• 7:22
  If you are in Argentina, you have the Argentina peso.
• 7:26
  So you're here then having a step towards USDT is a huge,
• 7:30
  huge step. And then eventually you will
• 7:32
  move on the staircase. If you're United States, you
• 7:34
  have USDT. You say, well, I have already
• 7:36
  the dollar. I have two bank accounts, two
• 7:38
  credit cards and debit cards. But maybe you don't understand
• 7:41
  yet. Bitcoin.
• 7:42
  You need though a step towards Bitcoin.
• 7:44
  So we created that are gold. Many Bitcoiners hate gold.
• 7:48
  They they feel like gold is competing with Bitcoin and I
• 7:50
  think that is the wrongest assumption.
• 7:53
  Gold is competing with the dollar is not competing with
• 7:56
  Bitcoin. So we created that our gold as a
• 7:59
  way to make the step towards become even easier in the
• 8:03
  Western world where if you're in the United States and you look,
• 8:06
  you don't understand Bitcoin, but you know very well gold,
• 8:09
  because it would have it has been our friend throughout the
• 8:11
  last 505 dozen years. You buy gold and you use, you
• 8:15
  can use gold tokens as a way to hedge against the fact that the
• 8:20
  US is printing $3 trillion per year.
• 8:22
  And the way the one trillion goes in interest rates, 1
• 8:24
  trillion goes into weaponry and defence and the third one is
• 8:30
  healthcare and all that. And that is the best currency in
• 8:33
  the world. the US has the best currency in Fiat currency in the
• 8:35
  world. So if that is the best currency
• 8:37
  in the world, imagine all the others, right?
• 8:39
  So even for United States, since everything is relative, they
• 8:42
  need to move towards something. The lucky ones, the ones that
• 8:45
  have the time and the opportunity to understand
• 8:49
  Bitcoin sooner, they will move to Bitcoin already.
• 8:51
  But the others need to need something because we need to
• 8:54
  help people, right? To me, it's almost like a 3D
• 8:57
  chess game with the with the future and with, you know, there
• 8:59
  is Gov what could happen in the future in terms of instability.
• 9:02
  And so that's why we have that, our goal.
• 9:03
  You know, what you said is is inspirational because, again,
• 9:06
  you know, if you come from the West, you don't realize how
• 9:08
  financially privileged you are. But I'm originally from
• 9:11
  Venezuela, and, you know, you hear stories of people using
• 9:15
  Tether as their bank account essentially because if they put
• 9:19
  their money in the bank, it could be seized, right?
• 9:23
  And they use Tether as, as you know, that mechanism.
• 9:26
  And you're seeing that across the Global South now.
• 9:29
  When you guys started Tether back in 2014, did you have any
• 9:34
  idea that all of this was going to happen?
• 9:36
  No. I mean, in 2014, let's discuss
• 9:40
  with John Carlo that is the, the person that created UST, we
• 9:44
  thought the biggest market gap that USDT could have was meeting
• 9:48
  $100 million and if we were very, very lucky 1 billion.
• 9:51
  But 1 billion seem seemed like, you know, very, very crazy, very
• 9:55
  like, you know, 40 years seeing the future, we could get to one
• 9:59
  1 billion and even the market size, the the user base, 500
• 10:03
  million users that you can find on the line, you can find on our
• 10:06
  website. Yeah.
• 10:07
  There is also this website called USDT dot network.
• 10:11
  You go there, you spoke about Venezuela.
• 10:13
  You see the exact moment when USDT became USDT that is March
• 10:18
  2020. Everyone knows or remembers, I
• 10:21
  think what happened in March 2020 was the pandemic.
• 10:23
  The pandemic was a very, you know, sad event, of course, but
• 10:26
  very interesting event for multiple from multiple point of
• 10:30
  views because it accelerated the downfall of many economies
• 10:34
  around the world. Of course, also the western
• 10:36
  economies, but even more so the economies in emerging markets
• 10:41
  from 2017. That was the the first alcoine
• 10:45
  bubble and a lot of young generation kids went into crypto
• 10:50
  2020. All these young kids like in
• 10:52
  emerging markets in developing countries, there are more kids.
• 10:55
  So the average age is lower. So there is more younger
• 10:57
  population that is more prone to do new things.
• 11:02
  And so from 2017, two 1020, these kids learn crypto, 2020
• 11:07
  arrived, March arrives and suddenly there is the pandemic.
• 11:11
  And in all the emerging markets and other common denominator is
• 11:14
  that people go in the black markets and buy cash bills,
• 11:18
  dollars, right. So they go in the street and
• 11:20
  they buy some dollars and they, they give, for example, back the
• 11:22
  Argentina pesos. So they buy the dollars with
• 11:25
  Argentina and pesos. But, and that event was
• 11:27
  significant because for the first time in history, the
• 11:30
  parents could not get in the streets because there was
• 11:33
  curfew. You could not in many countries.
• 11:34
  You could not go and get in the series.
• 11:36
  You were banned to go out. And also, if you were going out,
• 11:40
  the television was, was would tell you you were going to die
• 11:42
  if you catch the virus. So people were not going out.
• 11:45
  But still we're sitting around the the kitchen table thinking
• 11:48
  what I'm doing and what, what I can do, how I can help my family
• 11:52
  for the first time. It's the kids that talk to their
• 11:55
  parents. I can hold the US dollar on my
• 11:58
  smartphone and it's more secure to keep it under the the
• 12:01
  mattress. And you see the curve at the
• 12:03
  beginning of 2020, wow, USD T was 5 billion dollars, $4
• 12:08
  billion of market cap, but the end was more than four, so.
• 12:11
  And you think it was the cat, the pandemic that was the
• 12:13
  catalyst? Yes.
• 12:14
  And it just it just snapped. People realized I can use this
• 12:17
  as a bank account essentially if you.
• 12:19
  See, the chart is like this, growing slowly, slowly until
• 12:23
  March 2020 and then. How did you feel when that
• 12:26
  happened? Well, actually, I wish I could
• 12:28
  tell you we understood it when it happened.
• 12:31
  I I understood this one year ago.
• 12:32
  Did you get chills? Where you like, you're like, Oh
• 12:34
  my God, it's. Very humbling because last year
• 12:36
  we were like OK now we have to study this thing why it
• 12:39
  happened. Sometimes you create products
• 12:40
  that work in the in from 2022 thousand 24 we spent less $10
• 12:46
  million in marketing in the entire like in in four years
• 12:49
  yeah and we have 500 million users.
• 12:51
  I wish I could tell you that it all happened because we were
• 12:53
  really good, but the reality and kind of is a set the reality,
• 12:57
  the success of USD T is directly proportional to the success of
• 13:02
  many economies. But thank God there is USD T
• 13:05
  because it's offering like a lifeline.
• 13:07
  Yeah. And so, yes, it's chilling and
• 13:09
  it's very humbling to me because I mean, at least we created
• 13:12
  something that people use. And, and, and so I'm very proud
• 13:16
  of what the team did. And, and, and and you know, the,
• 13:19
  the, the, you know, the outcome that is this happening.
• 13:21
  So we are, that's why we feel so lucky to be in this position
• 13:25
  that, you know, we spend all our time to build new technologies
• 13:29
  that empower freedom of speech. We invest in Ramble, we invest
• 13:32
  in all these products that will continue and carry forward
• 13:34
  Bitcoin, the Bitcoin ethos. Yeah, the Bitcoin ethos and the
• 13:38
  freedom virus spreading across the world.
• 13:40
  So, Balo, you're a very humble guy, but you've basically
• 13:44
  created the most profitable company on the face of the
• 13:47
  planet, per employee. How the hell did you do that?
• 13:51
  By pure luck, so I told you I. I glad you were humble.
• 13:55
  Yeah, but think about this. The reason why I'm saying, and
• 13:57
  it's not, it's not kind of fake humbling, being fake, being
• 14:02
  humble, is that until 2022, Tedder did not make that much
• 14:05
  money. The interest rates on the US
• 14:07
  Treasuries were low. So how I could predict that we
• 14:10
  created a product? It's so simple.
• 14:12
  I think that the genial idea that Giancarlo had and we
• 14:16
  carried forward and we carried forward for also all these years
• 14:19
  is that the product so is so simple.
• 14:21
  When we designed it, we could put the transaction fee on it
• 14:25
  like these. And MasterCard, there is no
• 14:27
  transaction. So we discussed how if we should
• 14:31
  take one basis .10 basis points from every single transaction.
• 14:35
  And here we said why we shouldn't do that.
• 14:37
  Let's make, we don't care about making money.
• 14:39
  In 2014, the interest rates were really worth 0.
• 14:42
  Let's create a product that people will use in the future.
• 14:44
  We'll see. I don't care.
• 14:45
  And basically we put zero as transaction fee.
• 14:48
  And it happened that the way we make money is because the US,
• 14:52
  even the US now the inflation is so high that the, the interest
• 14:56
  rates spiked up. That's why we have the most
• 14:58
  profitable company in the world by employee is because simply
• 15:02
  you, we, we are not created at the beginning.
• 15:04
  If you create technology that is the most open technology.
• 15:07
  And that is the observer thing. I think I call tatter the once
• 15:11
  in a century company because I remember that it's functioning
• 15:14
  the opposite way from other companies.
• 15:16
  Most of the companies in order to make more money, they need to
• 15:20
  create more walled gardens. For us, it's the opposite.
• 15:23
  In order to make actually more profits, we need to spread our
• 15:27
  technology and open technology as much as possible.
• 15:30
  So create the most, the most, the biggest freedom tech
• 15:33
  movement. Hence we're going to make more
• 15:35
  money. So it's crazy how there is this
• 15:37
  difference of incentives from most of the companies in the
• 15:39
  world and us. What makes me really happy,
• 15:42
  Paolo, is that you guys are Bitcoiners at the end of the
• 15:45
  day. So this this giant, you know,
• 15:47
  the digital dollar that the world is using right now, the
• 15:50
  the people yourself behind that are Bitcoiners.
• 15:54
  Yeah. And the Bitcoin ethos is behind
• 15:56
  that. And I think that plays a little
• 15:59
  bit of a part. But you guys recently launched
• 16:02
  the USAT, and you guys recently brought on board Bo Hines, who
• 16:06
  worked with the Trump administration or under the
• 16:09
  Trump administration. So what's your strategy with the
• 16:12
  USAT? If you ask me what is the single
• 16:15
  most important thing that made the success of Tedder is hiring.
• 16:18
  Tedder is not accompanied by PhDs is not a company made by
• 16:24
  people that that you know, come from insane backgrounds, is
• 16:29
  built by people that come from 70 different countries.
• 16:33
  And we designed our product suite based on the needs of the
• 16:36
  families of those people. Bo is, is a very smart guy, very
• 16:40
  intelligent and was is, is able to carry forward the the same
• 16:43
  message and he's very humble and he's a bitcoiner and he's the
• 16:49
  one that understand the best what are the needs of the people
• 16:52
  in the United States, right. So this year was the first time
• 16:55
  for me to come in the United States.
• 16:56
  How I could pretend to come to the United States and make a
• 16:59
  strategy for United States just myself, right.
• 17:02
  It's it's like there there is some there would be some
• 17:05
  arrogance to that. It's like saying, OK, I've never
• 17:07
  been to well, I've been to Argentina, but you know how we
• 17:10
  could design A strategy in Argentina.
• 17:13
  So we are not conquistadors, right.
• 17:14
  So it's not like we go there and we impose our way of ways is we
• 17:19
  go there, listen and we never partner with the institutions.
• 17:22
  We always go from the ground up because what if you crack that?
• 17:25
  Then you get and you can't get sticky success.
• 17:29
  And so Bo, he's able to carry forward our, our philosophy in
• 17:35
  the United States. We work together daily on the
• 17:36
  strategy. The way I try to describe is
• 17:38
  like if you are in Nigeria, the OR or in Kenya, you have the
• 17:43
  financial yields are between 10 and 30% efficient.
• 17:46
  Hey 14 Kenya has this thing for example called mobile money and
• 17:50
  PESA. So they use SMS and like the GSM
• 17:53
  technology to send money. But it has a limitation because
• 17:56
  it does not allow people in Kenya to participate to the
• 17:58
  global economy that is full digital and now is on chain.
• 18:03
  So Nigeria, Kenya might have 5010 and 40% efficiency of
• 18:07
  financial rails. United States have 90%
• 18:10
  efficiency of the financial rails.
• 18:11
  No one ever complained about the slowness of a wire or like a
• 18:14
  payment of a credit card. Of course there are parts of the
• 18:17
  US that are underserved, that's fine.
• 18:19
  But it's very limited part of the population compared to other
• 18:22
  countries like maybe Vietnam or or else of the world that where
• 18:26
  we are, we have our headquarters.
• 18:29
  We cannot take the same product we use and emerging markets in,
• 18:32
  in the United States with the same value proposition because
• 18:34
  it doesn't make any sense. So we started thinking what we
• 18:37
  do have in the United States, what what is the thing that's
• 18:39
  most valuable to Tether is our distribution network and that is
• 18:43
  500 million users out there outside the United States.
• 18:45
  What we do I have in the United States that is very valuable.
• 18:49
  Well, we have platforms like Crumble we are making, we almost
• 18:52
  reinvested $5 billion in United States.
• 18:55
  So we have we do Bitcoin mining. I think we're going to be the
• 18:58
  biggest miner in the world by the end of this year.
• 19:00
  But we invested in in Ramble and a few other digital platforms.
• 19:04
  So we have 506070 million active users per month through the all
• 19:08
  our investments. What is the first thing to do is
• 19:10
  to have all these guys move to a self consoled wallet with USAT
• 19:14
  and USAT and Bitcoin inside. And that are called that in my
• 19:17
  opinion is the biggest gift we could do because the first time
• 19:21
  we can actually have access to one of the most used social
• 19:25
  networks in the world. Actually, we, we prove we are
• 19:28
  using that opportunity as an, as a template to prove that it's a
• 19:33
  great idea will be a huge success with creating a creator,
• 19:37
  creator's economy, with tipping and with potentially even
• 19:41
  remittances. You know, many of the creators
• 19:43
  might have families abroad as well.
• 19:45
  So they might get Bitcoin or USD and they can send it from the
• 19:48
  wallet to to their parents or their kids at home.
• 19:51
  So we wanted to showcase how easy that is going to be, and
• 19:56
  there is, and we want to explain that there is no reason about
• 19:59
  greediness for not doing it. I'm so excited as a creator, you
• 20:02
  know, with the with the Rumble platform, free speech focus, you
• 20:06
  know, one day your channel could exist and the other day it's
• 20:09
  off, right? Yeah.
• 20:11
  So I'm super hot. When I heard that, you know, you
• 20:14
  guys took a stake in in Rumble, I was so happy to hear that.
• 20:17
  Now, Paulo, do you sleep? I have a problem.
• 20:22
  So even tonight I was like waked up four or five times because I
• 20:27
  still run bit Fenix and the centralized exchange that
• 20:30
  process like, you know, 1,000,000 orders per minute.
• 20:33
  The more time it takes for you to sleep and get in front of
• 20:37
  your computer to wake up and get in front of your computer.
• 20:40
  And then, you know, the, the, if there are issues, they will
• 20:42
  compound by 1,000,000 orders per minute.
• 20:45
  And so I've been trained and that is not a good thing.
• 20:49
  I've been trained to, to, to sleep in basically one hour
• 20:52
  chunks. But you know, I, I would want to
• 20:56
  change that. It's not like really heroic.
• 20:58
  It's something that we should, I should change in my life because
• 21:01
  I think sleep is very important. It's been proven that is one of
• 21:04
  the most important things for longevity.
• 21:05
  I don't want that young but it's still like I wake up, check my
• 21:10
  messages and if nothing goes is wrong I go back to sleep like
• 21:14
  this. I didn't know all of that, but I
• 21:17
  wanted to ask you because I see how busy you are.
• 21:20
  And I was like, does he get time to sleep?
• 21:22
  And now I know you sleep in one hour intervals now.
• 21:25
  Paulo, how bullish are you on Bitcoin?
• 21:27
  And we're sitting at a, you know, roughly $100,000.
• 21:30
  You know, do you believe we're still early?
• 21:32
  Do you still think, you know, this is the early innings?
• 21:35
  Because that's one of the things I always hear.
• 21:38
  How do you feel as the CEO of the most profitable company on
• 21:42
  planet earth? How do you feel about Bitcoin?
• 21:44
  Are we still early? Are you feeling bullish?
• 21:47
  Every time we get an interest from well, we we get to
• 21:51
  interest. We make money on the interest on
• 21:53
  the US centuries. We buy Bitcoin and gold.
• 21:56
  We own all together with the with the tether owns more than
• 22:01
  110,120 thousand Bitcoin. Just last quarter we bought 8888
• 22:08
  Bitcoin. And I'm very bullish on Bitcoin
• 22:10
  simply because I I like to think about the future in, in logical
• 22:14
  steps and most probable outcomes.
• 22:16
  And I fail to understand, you know, given enough amount of
• 22:21
  time, it's hard to predict if it's like 10 years or 50.
• 22:24
  But I fail to, to, to understand how Bitcoin will not be the most
• 22:28
  used currency in the world and will be the, the check and
• 22:31
  balances of the world as a currency today is still, I think
• 22:35
  we are early because it's, it's a cultural thing, right?
• 22:38
  If you put, you take a person, you put in front of that person
• 22:43
  2 currencies, one that is made by a human and now one that is
• 22:48
  made by math. So by, you know, the physics of
• 22:52
  the universe, still, most of the people prefer the one made by
• 22:56
  humans. To me, it's very crazy because
• 22:59
  you should trust the universe. You should trust us math, right?
• 23:01
  So you know, you've been totally in school that math is this
• 23:04
  amazing thing that is, can, can create proofs that can be can
• 23:09
  never, cannot be destroyed even by God.
• 23:12
  And, and, and on the other side, you have a human that change
• 23:15
  every four years and might wake up one day and change the
• 23:18
  monetary policy. But still people still prefer
• 23:21
  and, and many people prefer like the, the, the, the human money.
• 23:25
  And to me means that we are very early.
• 23:28
  But that's one of these things that could happen in the future.
• 23:31
  And it's, it happened a few times in the past, is the fact
• 23:34
  that could be an event in the world that will be so
• 23:37
  catastrophic that will force everyone to be on to Bitcoin
• 23:41
  very quickly. And I'm not hoping for that.
• 23:43
  Of course, that would be very bad.
• 23:45
  But I think that we need to think about the fact and what we
• 23:47
  should be doing in order to prepare for even an event like
• 23:51
  that. Hopefully there will be gradual
• 23:53
  adoption, but I think we are actually not ready for a surge
• 23:58
  in Bitcoin. So I think the price we got
• 24:00
  today is the right price for today.
• 24:03
  Markets are always right, but independent from that is the
• 24:06
  right price for today because we are not ready and the society is
• 24:08
  not ready. I agree with that.
• 24:10
  I agree with that. Follow up, final question, how
• 24:13
  do you want to be remembered? What do you want your legacy to
• 24:15
  be? 2000 years from now?
• 24:17
  100 years from now? 200 years from now?
• 24:22
  As a guy that was ready to die on the heel of freedom.
• 24:26
  I love that follow. It's a pleasure.
• 24:29
  Thank you so much for joining me.
• 24:30
  Thank you.