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Losing My Religion · Everyone Has An Ex

• 0:10
  Speaker 1: You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. Muma Me acknowledges
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: the traditional owners of the land and waters. This podcast
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: is recorded on This episode contains discussion of domestic violence
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: and suicide, which may be distressing for some listeners. If
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  Speaker 1: you or someone you know is affected, support resources are
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  Speaker 1: listed in the show notes. Belief systems run deep within us,
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  Speaker 1: etched into our nature and reinforce through our upbringing. We're
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  Speaker 1: molded by the adults who surround us, people who often
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  Speaker 1: were the best of intentions, shape our understanding of the
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: world and pass down the lessons of life.
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  Speaker 2: We went to the pastor, and the same thing that
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  Speaker 2: my mum said was what this pastors said to me.
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  Speaker 2: So his advice to me was to not provoke. As
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  Speaker 2: a woman, what we were taught about was being submissive,
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: and that men get angry and you need to just
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  Speaker 2: kind of really try to simmoth down. I just learned
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  Speaker 2: to be quiet. I learned to not pipe up. I
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  Speaker 2: learned to not try to defend myself, to argue.
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  Speaker 1: That sometimes the very truths you were raised on hard
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  Speaker 1: and inter lies, and you left with no choice but
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  Speaker 1: to unlearn them because your sense of self, even your
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  Speaker 1: survival depends on it.
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  Speaker 2: And in that moment, I made a decision that I
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  Speaker 2: had two options, that I actually physically couldn't live in
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: that environment anymore, and that I either end my life
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  Speaker 2: or I get out. And I knew how to get out,
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  Speaker 2: and that was to sleep with someone else.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: I'm Georgia Love and this is everyone has an ex
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  Speaker 1: Come with me as we dive into a collection of
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: unconventional stories about relationships past through the eyes and the
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: hearts of the very people who lived them. To begin
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  Speaker 1: this story, dear listener, I've got to take you back
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: to when Bella was born. She was one of three kids,
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  Speaker 1: lived with both parents. But what was unique about Bella's
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: upbringing was her community, or more specifically, her church.
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  Speaker 2: The church that we attended was pretty full on. It
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  Speaker 2: wasn't probably your standard Christian church. For example, we weren't
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  Speaker 2: allowed to mix with any other churches. We had very
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  Speaker 2: strict rules around what we were allowed and not allowed
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  Speaker 2: to do, so probably the obvious no drinking, no dancing.
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  Speaker 2: I never attended a party. Your life was very much
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: the church, and we attended three to four times a week,
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  Speaker 2: and your community was a church. So you won't encourage
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  Speaker 2: really to make friendships outside of the church. It was
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  Speaker 2: quite insular, but in saying that, growing up in it
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  Speaker 2: it was really fun. I've got really good memories, I
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  Speaker 2: think because we had such a sense of community and
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  Speaker 2: it was always something on and there was kids everywhere
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  Speaker 2: all the time. When I was younger, it was really nice.
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  Speaker 2: I never felt alone if we would cool sort of
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: adults in our lives that attended the church, our aunties
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: and our uncles, and so it sort of had like
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  Speaker 2: this family feel to it. So when I was younger,
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  Speaker 2: I kind of had a really positive experience growing up
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  Speaker 2: in that environment. But I think as I got older
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: and as we get into our teenage years, I suppose
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  Speaker 2: that's where some of the rules you kind of under
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  Speaker 2: your parents' guidance when you're young, and then as you
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  Speaker 2: become a teenager. Where I attended, this particular church had
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  Speaker 2: some pretty strict rules, and so I grew up very
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  Speaker 2: much a people pleaser, didn't want to upset my parents,
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: wanted to do the right thing, and growing up as
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: a girl in that church, there was no sex before marriage.
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: There was a real sense of your goal in life
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  Speaker 2: is to get married and to have children, and that's
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  Speaker 2: kind of the way that it all worked, and it
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  Speaker 2: was very common for the majority of young people to
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  Speaker 2: get married between the ages, sort of like eighteen nineteen twenty.
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  Speaker 2: That was kind of expected in the standard.
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  Speaker 1: At the tender age of sixteen, when Bella and her
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  Speaker 1: family moved across the country, her teenage heart started to
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  Speaker 1: feel teenage things and her interest in boys began.
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  Speaker 2: This church is all over Australia, so we attended the
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  Speaker 2: one in Perth, and then when we attended the one
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  Speaker 2: in Sydney, we weren't allowed to date until girls were
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  Speaker 2: seventeen and boys were eighteen, and it was called going official,
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  Speaker 2: and what that meant was that you sat down with
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  Speaker 2: the pastors and they ran through some rules with you
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  Speaker 2: and then they kind of officiated your relationship. So I
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  Speaker 2: was getting to that age, or I was sixteen, and
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  Speaker 2: I was kind of like close to being allowed to
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  Speaker 2: having a boyfriend. And for me growing up, because it
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  Speaker 2: was sort of tortoise, kind of the pinnacle to get
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  Speaker 2: married and to have children, that was on the forefront
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  Speaker 2: of my mind. So we arrived into Sydney and I
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  Speaker 2: remember sort of like the first we had like a
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  Speaker 2: youth night. I had come like youth groups and I
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  Speaker 2: met all the girls and they were like, Oh, is
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  Speaker 2: there any boys here that you like? And I remember
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  Speaker 2: this one guy who stood out as soon as I
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  Speaker 2: walked in the room, and he was gorgeous. He had
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  Speaker 2: tanned skin, he had green eyes, and he had this
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  Speaker 2: presence about him, almost an arrogance. But I was so
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  Speaker 2: attracted to it, and I said what about him? And
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  Speaker 2: all the girls looked at me and they said, no,
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  Speaker 2: anyone but Luke. Stay away from Luke. And I think
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  Speaker 2: they called him a player, whatever that meant. When we
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: were sixteen, and I was like, I'm a pretty stubborn person.
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  Speaker 2: I was like, no, I got my eye on him.
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  Speaker 2: And the next time I met him was at a
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  Speaker 2: youth camp. So a part of this church, we would
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: have youth camps and we met for the first time,
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  Speaker 2: and I don't know whether it was love at first sight,
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  Speaker 2: but it kind of felt that way when we met.
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  Speaker 2: That was it. We were just absolutely infatuated with each other,
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  Speaker 2: but obviously, not being seventeen and him not being eighteen,
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  Speaker 2: we weren't allowed to date, and so we kept that
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  Speaker 2: on the down low. When I say that, there was
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: still no kissing, there was still no hand holding. But
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  Speaker 2: we knew that we liked each other. Once I hit seventeen,
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  Speaker 2: we got official, which meant that we were then officially
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  Speaker 2: a couple. And I remember just being so besotted and
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  Speaker 2: in love. And you know, I think the beautiful thing
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  Speaker 2: about your first love is you've got no past experiences
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  Speaker 2: of heartbreak, and so it is this beautiful time where
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  Speaker 2: you love so wholeheartedly with every ounce of your being.
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  Speaker 2: And that's what I did. I just my heart. I
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  Speaker 2: just remember looking at him and being just mesmerized to
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: a degree, and I feel like he felt the same
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  Speaker 2: about me. We were just absolutely obsessed with each other.
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  Speaker 2: I really admired Luke's ability to go after what he wanted.
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  Speaker 2: He was very driven in certain ways in that there
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  Speaker 2: was an element of he had a huge amount of
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  Speaker 2: arrogance and confidence, which I was super attracted to. And
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  Speaker 2: he seemed very sure of himself, more sure than me.
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  Speaker 2: Being a people pleaser, I would always over explain would
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  Speaker 2: I would want to appease those around me, where he
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  Speaker 2: just did what he wanted and didn't really care about
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  Speaker 2: ramifications to a degree, And maybe because he was more
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  Speaker 2: experienced in certain areas, I also found that quite attractive.
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  Speaker 2: He would give me so much attention. He at that
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  Speaker 2: time had a sense of like kindness about him. I
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: liked that he got on with my family quite a lot.
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  Speaker 2: And the funny thing is is like when you're that age,
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  Speaker 2: those things are kind of status is like what matters.
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  Speaker 2: And I think it was his status that really drew
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  Speaker 2: me to him, and feeling chosen that made me feel good,
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  Speaker 2: and that was probably the thing that I loved the most.
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  Speaker 2: But I also had this romanticized idea of him as well,
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  Speaker 2: where I just thought he was so capable, he was
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  Speaker 2: so talented, he was so good at sport, he held
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  Speaker 2: himself well, he was popular. He was like this image
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  Speaker 2: of like this incredibly capable man that I just found
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  Speaker 2: myself so attracted to.
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  Speaker 1: And where there's attraction, we all know what happens next.
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  Speaker 1: But for Bella, there were several complexities around this next step.
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  Speaker 2: There was always a massive sense of shame around I
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: guess sexuality for females. So like growing up, I was
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  Speaker 2: taught the basics around what sex was, but I actually
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  Speaker 2: didn't even know how it worked. And I know that
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  Speaker 2: sounds really silly, but I didn't know about female pleasure
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  Speaker 2: and I was never taught about anything like that. Sex
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  Speaker 2: was for the man and so, and if you had
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  Speaker 2: slept with someone outside of marriage, you were sort of
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  Speaker 2: really encouraged to get married, even at a very young age,
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  Speaker 2: because that was such a no no. So to prevent
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  Speaker 2: that from happening and to be looking like I'm say
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  Speaker 2: it tat you know, you didn't date around and you
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  Speaker 2: did the right thing and then you got married quite quickly,
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  Speaker 2: which is kind of what happened. So once I hit
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  Speaker 2: about eighteen, we got engaged. I remember we were at
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  Speaker 2: the Botanical gardens and he got down on one knee
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  Speaker 2: and proposed to me. And I sort of knew it
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  Speaker 2: was coming because that was just the process of what
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  Speaker 2: it was like for us growing up. And I was
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  Speaker 2: so excited. I organized the wedding all on my own.
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  Speaker 2: We had a huge wedding. I think we had over
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  Speaker 2: three hundred people, and yeah, it was massive. I was
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  Speaker 2: so young, and I didn't probably quite understand this severity
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  Speaker 2: or the seriousness of getting married. But all I did
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  Speaker 2: know is that I was absolutely in love with Luke,
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  Speaker 2: and there was not one other person I saw. He
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  Speaker 2: was my heart. He was the love of my life,
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  Speaker 2: and I felt like he was my soulmate. Before getting married,
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  Speaker 2: neither one of us had lived out of home. I
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  Speaker 2: had just finished school before getting married, so very naive.
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  Speaker 2: I'd just got my first job. He, on the other hands,
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  Speaker 2: that have had probably a pretty typical being like a
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: little bit rebellious sort of fifteen sixteen, where he'd go
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  Speaker 2: out and sneak out to parties and drink alcohol, so
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: he kind of had a little bit more knowledge and
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  Speaker 2: experience he had had girlfriends prior. I was just wide
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  Speaker 2: eyed and bushy tailed and had no idea about anything.
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  Speaker 2: I was incredibly naive, But in saying that, I'd say
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  Speaker 2: he was still fairly naive. We were both so young,
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: so getting married it was a massive shift in what
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  Speaker 2: our life looked like and responsibilities. Were both going from
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  Speaker 2: living at home never knowing even how to rely look
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  Speaker 2: after ourselves, and we were thrown into this adult relationship
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  Speaker 2: with a real lack of skills on how to do that,
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  Speaker 2: you know, like how to communicate effectively, how to be
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  Speaker 2: respectful of each other, and how to just live. After
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: getting married, we moved into our first little rental, which
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: was a grunny flat at the back of Luke's Auntie's house,
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: and we rented that out. We had gone on our honeymoon.
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  Speaker 2: It was all like a massive learning curve. As you
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  Speaker 2: can understand. It was also like it was the first
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: time having sex as well, my mum telling me, like,
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: when your husband wants to have sex, you have sex.
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: That's your duty. And so I was like, okay, you know,
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: that's what I do. And it was very much tried
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: wife here. You know, I cooked, cleaned, I also worked.
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  Speaker 2: That was the idea of what a good wife was
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: really under this type of Christianity.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: While Bella's life we're shifting in a whole host of
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: different directions. So was Luke's behavior.
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  Speaker 2: There was a shift in Luke from who I knew
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  Speaker 2: him to be almost instantly once we got married, and
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: it started off very subtle. Our honeymoon, I believe, was
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: for two weeks and we got home and we were
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: bickering a lot. We were fighting a lot, We weren't
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: communicating properly, and this was just over really basic things.
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: It could have been about the way that we unpacked
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: the dishwasher, the way that you stack the plates, super
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: basic things, just like really learning how to live together.
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  Speaker 2: Were we compatible and knowing how to communicate effectively, but
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: we didn't know how to do that, so it was
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: I remember feeling very high strung and feeling like I
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: was very out of control and maybe I had made
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: the worst mistake of my life. And I remember, just
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: after getting married, having this gut feeling, like this sinking
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: feeling in my gut that what have I done. I
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: remember him putting me down, making certain comments about me,
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  Speaker 2: even sexually, which was quite spiteful and hurtful, about my body.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: He would say, like, you know, I prefer you with
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: makeup on. You're not really very pretty without makeup on.
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: It was the first time we had seen each other
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: without clothes and he had made comments about my body.
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: And I was only nineteen. I got married at nineteen,
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: so I was already very insecure. I guess you are
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: when you're younger. And I was also in this position
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: where all of a sudden I had gone from being
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: in the safety of my home, and that being quite
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: consistent too, with this man who I didn't feel a
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: lot of love, that I was getting love from him,
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: or that maybe he didn't even like me at this point,
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: and it was very confusing because I would talk to
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: him and I'd be like that's just how I do things,
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: to the point where I would talk and I would
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: talk too loud. You're so loud, Like, shut up all
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: the time. Okay, I'm really annoying. I'm so irritating. I
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: felt like the most irritating human and it was like
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: he just couldn't stand me. I irritated him. But in
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: the same instance, he was so obsessed and so possessive
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: of me. Luke would say to me all the time
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: that no one will love you like I love you.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: That was what he would say to me. He would
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: say to me that I was selfish, that I was
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: self centered, and that it was almost implied that he
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: was doing a service to everyone else that he is
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: putting up with me as his wife. I felt incredibly
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: grateful for him, so grateful that he had chosen, almost
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: selfishly to love someone that was unlovable, and so I
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: just felt like I owed him and I wasn't my
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: own I felt like he owned me because if I
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: was to leave, no one would want me, and I
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: guess that's why I felt like a possession. But it
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: was a possession that he didn't even like. It started
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: to really unravel once we got back from our honeymoon
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: and we were having an argument and it wasn't even
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: about anything in particular. It was something so trivial, and
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: he pushed me, and he pushed me into the wall
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: quite hard, and as a reaction, I had never had
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: someone physically do that to me, and I pushed him back,
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: and it just kept happening. Were pushing each other back
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: and forth until he pinned me down, and I realized
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: in that moment, I was like, Okay, well, I can't
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: fight back, but I was so angry at him for
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: doing that to me. I wasn't actually quite fearful at
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: that point. I was just angry, like how dare you
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: push me? That really progressed throughout our marriage. Quite early on.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: It escalated and it would start with pushing and shoving,
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: and then it would start with getting me down on
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: all fours and he would just be kneeing me and
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: hurting me quite a lot. And till one day we
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: were having another argument. And I can't even tell you
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: what the argument was about. There were never anything big,
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: about anything big. It was just really standard stuff. And
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: he grabbed a knife out of the knife block and
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: he just started running at me, and I remember like
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: at that point opening the door. This was still maybe
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: like six weeks after getting married at sclated very quickly
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: and I just ran and I was trying to get
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: into my car, and I was shaking so much. I
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: couldn't unlock my car door. It took me so long
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: to just try to steady my hand, and I couldn't
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: even put it in the ignition to drive away. I
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: just locked it and I was screaming. At that moment,
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: I thought I was going to die. And as soon
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: as I got out the front of the house, he
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: walked back inside. Because something that drove Luke was his
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: perception how people perceived him, and he did not want
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: anyone to see what he was doing to me. I
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: drove to my parents' house. I told my mum and
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: my dad. My dad sat me down and he said
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: to me, Bella, you need to put a stop to
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: this now, because if you don't nip this in the butt,
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: he's going to think that this behavior is okay. This
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: is an intimidation and he's trying to bully you. My mum,
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: on the other hand, had a different opinion. Her response
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: to me was, well, what did you do? And then
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: she said to me, well, look, your dad's done things
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: to me in the past. You just need to not provoke.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: I didn't know what to do. I didn't go to
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: the police. I internalized it. I felt so sorry for him.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: It was always my fault. Whatever he did, it was
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: my fault. And after having that conversation with my parents
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: and went back to where we were living, and I said,
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: this can't keep happening. I told him that we need
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: to go to our pastor and we need to talk
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: about what's going on, because he needed some kind of
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: counseling to deal with his anger, because he would just
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: lose it. So he agreed to go to the pastor.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: We went to the pastor, and the same thing that
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: my mom said was what this pastor said to me.
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: Luke was looked at by this particular pastor as like
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: the up and coming. He was certainly quote unquote special
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: in his eyes, and he thought the world of him.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: And so his advice to me was that to not provoke.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: As a woman, what we were taught about was being
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: submissive and that men get angry and you need to
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: just kind of really try to simmer things down. When
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: we got back, it didn't take long. Four things to
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: continue to escalate, and things escalated for a really long time.
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: It stated a lot of pushing, a lot of shoving.
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: There was a few more other knife incidences which were
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: similar getting thrown out of cars, and I just remember
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: feeling so overwhelmed and perplexed at the situation that I
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: was in, and that feeling of being stuck started to
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: hit me hard, and I realized at that point that
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: this was my life moving forward, and I I couldn't
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: believe that this man that I loved wholeheartedly with every
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: fiber of my being, would want to hurt me. And
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: the only way I could compartmentalize it at that point
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: was that if I blame me, Luke would use suicide
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: quite a lot after every time he would physically abuse
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: me that if I was to go anywhere, if I
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: was to tell anyone, that he would kill himself, and
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: so that weighed very heavily on me. We would have
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: good days, and we would have days where we would
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: get on, we would laugh. There was always a sense
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: that he was better than me. Always. He would always
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: subtly put me down, and it was almost like being
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: with someone that kind of had to put up with you,
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: but hated you. That's what it felt like. Honestly, every
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: day of our marriage, I just remember feeling so annoying,
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: like the most irritating person I think on the planet,
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: Like why am I so annoying? And the one thing
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: that would really set him off quite a lot would
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: be when I would raise my voice. And I would
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: raise my voice. At the beginning of our marriage, when
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: the physical abuse started, I had a few traumatic events,
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: especially the knife incident. My first reaction was to scream
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: for help, genuinely scream for help. He was so conscious
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: of his image that that was the thing that would
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: set him off to be more abusive and would get
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: more angry. And when I say angry, I mean I
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: would know when it was coming, when he would snap.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: His whole demeanor and his whole face would change, and
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: I would look at his eyes and he was not
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: thinking rationally, and I have this vivid memory in my
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: brain of going okay. I learned how to get through
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: those situations, and that was I couldn't yell anymore. I
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: would put my head down, I would roll my shoulders down,
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: and I would look at the ground and I would
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: just I would just want it to be over. And
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: I knew the smaller I would make myself maybe the
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: less angry he would be at me, until the behavior
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: with that would it started to get a little bit scarier.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: And that was he would whenever he would do anything,
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: he would smother me with a pillow and that would
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: go over my face, so he knew I couldn't yell
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: for help. Or he would stand by the front door
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: and he would always snatch my phone from me, and
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: he would break my things in front of me, so
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: he knew I couldn't contact. He would smash my laptops.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: I mean I went through that many phones, that many laptops.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: Despite the abuse, Bella still loved Luke and felt compelled
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: to protect him. After all, he was her husband. To her,
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: this behavior seemed normal, especially since the person she loved
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: and trusted most reinforced that belief.
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: My mother was a very important person in my life.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: We were very close, and I went to her for everything,
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: and her reinforcement of his behavior was sort of what
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: solidified it for me. I think I went back to
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: her for that reassurance to be like, is this isn't okay?
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: Is it?
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: And I didn't get that. I got this is okay.
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: And I think once again, like the idea of my
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: mom being you know, this idea of like the solid
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: foundation in your love for life, for love, for safety,
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: for consistency. She was backing up that behavior. And so
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: the influences in my life that was most important to
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: me were all saying the same thing, and so how
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: could I think any different. I never spoke to anyone
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: else besides the pastor and my mum, And the reason
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: for that is I felt this huge amount of loyalty
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: and protection for him. I wanted to protect him. I
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: didn't want anyone to think of him badly. I totally
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: and wholeheartedly believed I was causing him to act that way,
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: that I was deserving of that behavior, and I felt
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: sorry for him. I felt sorry that he had to
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: put up with me, that he had to do those
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: things to me, and that he might feel upset that
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: he did those things to me, And I was so
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: terrified of him ending his own life that I just
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: wanted to protect him. I loved him, I loved him
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: with every ounce of my being. I just loved him,
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: and I wanted to make him happy. But I knew
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: I couldn't make him happy, and I just felt like
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: I was I was making him so miserable and not
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: even aware of how any of this was affecting me. Yeah,
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: I had no idea where I was being abused, and
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: no clue I thought I was deserving of all of it.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: I just learned to be quiet. I learned to not
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: pipe up, I learned to not try to defend myself
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: to argue. I was pretty defeated, and as time went on,
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: I started to get more and more depressed, more anxious.
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: I started to feel quite disconnected from the world. I
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: felt like I was existing, but I was not living.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: And I was also incredibly lonely, incredibly lonely, and trying
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: to grapple with the idea that this is the decision
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: that I've made and this is going to be my
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: life now moving forward. We decided that we wanted to
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: have a child. I always wanted to be a mum,
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: and we had to go through the IVF process. As
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: anyone knows, the whole IVF process can be like quite
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: taxing and very emotional, and we were so blessed to
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: have fallen pregnant and it be successful, and I was
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: over the moon. I finally had something beautiful and knew
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: in my life that I could shift my focus to.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: But unfortunately that time is when the abuse probably was
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: at its worst. He began to start strangling me. So
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: he would smother me with pillows and then he would
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: strangle me. And I remember I was about eight months pregnant,
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: so I was very pregnant, and I remember him being
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: on top of me on the bed and he had
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: his hands around my neck and I would usually just
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: wait for the anger to pass them, for the situation
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: to pass, but I remember feeling this innate of like
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: just absolute fear, and I remember looking at him just
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: begging him, please, I've got your baby, Like, just for
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: your baby.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: I don't care about me, for your baby, because I thought,
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: in that moment, if he doesn't care about me, but
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: I'm holding his child, I'm growing his child.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: To the point that it's I'm close to giving birth.
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: This is a full baby. That scared me because I thought,
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: I don't know what's going to stop him from maybe
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: one day taking this too far. I throughout my pregnancy
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: was very very anxious, so I was very depressed. There
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: was a lot of abuse. I mean, I gave birth
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: to a beautiful, healthy baby boy, and the joy I
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: felt on the day that I had him was like
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: nothing I've ever felt in my life. And I remember
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: feeling so full of adrenaline that I was like, I
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: think I could run a marathon. And I felt like
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: the only woman ever in the world that had ever
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: given birth to a baby. And I remember just walking
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: around my ward with my baby and just looking at people, going,
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: have you seen my baby? I just had a baby.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: I was so proud and I was so happy. It
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: was just the best time, and my child just brought
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: a purpose for me. At that point, all of a sudden,
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: I had this greater purpose and this light it felt
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: to be able to love something and maybe for this
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: little human to love me back, and for me to
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: have something to focus on that would bring me some joy.
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: Luke was over the moon and was just obsessed with
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: our sun from day dot. He was super emotional on
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: the day that I had him, and he was very
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: active in his life, and you know, it was really
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: beautiful to see that bond between them. And we got
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: home from the hospital and unfortunately things started to just
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: go really bad again. I began to really struggle. I was,
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: as I mentioned, not great during my pregnancy. I was
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: very low and post baby blues, I think hit me
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: and he started to then really criticize me as a mother.
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: From the day we got home. I wasn't doing anything right.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: I wasn't holding him right, and I wasn't coping. I
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: was overwhelmed with becoming a new mum that in itself
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: is a lot, and then just being critiqued. And then
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: he would call my mom and my mom would come
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: over and they would talk, and then she would be
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: there critiquing me as well, and it was almost like
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: they were tagged teaming it and I felt I remember
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: feeling like I'm also a shit mum. I'm a shit person,
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: and now I'm a really shit mum. And I had
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: this instinct of just wanting to run away, like I
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: thought this was my out, this was the thing that
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: I wanted so badly, and I've got it, and now
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: these people have come in and they're going to take
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: that from me as well. It was probably three days
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: after I had my son. We'd just gotten home from
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: the hospital and was standing in the hallway and he
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: was yelling at me over something and he was holding
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: our son. And this was the only time he had
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: slapped me with an open palm across the face before,
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: but he took his hands up and he just punched
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: me straight in the face and essentially knocked me over
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: and broke my nose. And I couldn't believe that he
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: had just so openly just done that in front of
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: a newborn baby. Here's me. I had had a cesarean,
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: I was very weak, I had just given birth. I'm
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: feeling overwhelmed as a new mum, I'm being critiqued, and
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: then that and that did it for me. I just
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: I switched off. After that, I completely disconnected. I was
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: completely dissociated, and I struggled to bond with my son
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: from that point moving forward, I didn't even feel like
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: I was on planet Earth. That was a really weird situation.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: I didn't even know what it was, and I ended
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: up seeing a psychologist because it began to really scare me.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: And that's disassociation. Yeah, I guess that sort of started
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: my journey of figuring out, maybe this situation that I'm
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: in isn't right. Why am I feeling this way? Maybe
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: this isn't normal, Maybe he doesn't love me, maybe I'm
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: not a terrible person. But it was also very difficult
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: because I felt like I didn't have anyone in my
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: corner helping me. I felt incredibly manipulated, and I was
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: quite manipulated, really brainwashed from a child growing up in
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: this church, and I had never thought for myself. I'd
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: never even researched about abuse or even what I want.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: I was taught the religion that we have is that
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: you die to yourself, meaning this life, you die to
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: what is good. You sacrifice if you live a hard
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: life here, if you bear those burdens of the choices
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: that you've made and the repercussions of those, your reward
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: is in heaven. But I remember thinking, I'm not going
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: to survive much longer. I can't keep living like this.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: So what do I do is just the ultimate sacrifice
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: to God, that I am completely sacrificing my well being,
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: my happiness life for him. Does he actually want that
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: from me? I don't understand why he would want me
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: to suffer.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: Bella and Luke had been married for almost twelve years,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: and in a last diage effort to find some answers
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: and reassurance, Bella went to speak with her pastor, the
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: same one she and Luke had sat down with when
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: the abuse had originally started.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: I wanted to let him know that due to like
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: his negligence, that things had escalated so bad, and how
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: much that had impacted my life and really ruined a
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: lot of my life and my sense of self and
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: my quality of life and so much. And I mighted
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: him and I was like, look, you know, I remember
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: coming to you all these years ago when I was
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: so young, and you didn't nip it in the bar.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: You didn't sit him down and say, hey, if you're
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: feeling angry, you need to learn how to manage your emotions.
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: You need to figure out you can't do that. Doesn't
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: matter how angry you get, you can't do that. And
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: I went in detail into all the abuse and what
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: I had gone through, and he sat there and he
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: smiled at me, and then he said, after telling him everything,
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: he said, I just want to thank you for being
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: so loyal to your husband and for protecting him for
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: all of these years, And my jaw almost hit the floor.
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: I just looked at him and I was like, you're
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: never going to get it. Like at that moment, I
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: realized these people, there is no getting through to these people,
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: like there's no getting through to it. And what if
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: I wasn't here anymore? What would you say? Would you
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: be proud? Would you be happy? And that's exactly the
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: narrative that I had in my own mind, and that
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: backed up exactly why I felt like I didn't have
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: an option was because you endure that that's a part
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: of life, that's what you should put up with. And
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: just something inside of me didn't feel right. I just
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: was like, this can't be okay, this can't be. I
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: remember calling around different churches. I was so terrified of
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: going to hell, like so terrified of this idea of
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: like eternal torture, which is what we were taught, that
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: I started calling churches and I said, hey, like, what
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: would you say if you were an abusive marriage and
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: someone left, or someone committed adultery and had an affair.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: Do you think that's still burn in hell? And I
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: remember the past is going well, well, no, I mean
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: that's not I don't think where in the Bible does
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: it say that I need to know in the Bible.
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: There were very much a took the Bible literally in
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: what they preached, and there was nothing in there about that.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: And I didn't feel sure that what they were telling
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: me was right, because we were also taught in my
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: church that we were the chosen ones that all the
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: other churches we weren't allowed to mix with because they
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: would call it their doctrine or their teaching was incorrect,
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: and they made it suit the current times where it shouldn't.
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: You need to stay faithful to what the Bible says,
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: and so I didn't even believe that. So at that
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: point I decided I knew. I was like, well, look,
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: I think that my fate is hell, and I think
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: I'm going to be cursed.
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: Fate asighed Bella was sure of one thing she needed
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: to get out.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: After that punch, I stopped loving my husband. I just
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: I hated him. I hated him. I was so angry
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: at him. I felt numbness towards him. I felt numbness
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: towards most things in life, but I felt this sense
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: of just disgust, and I used to ask him. I
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: asked him every day. I think, for like two years,
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: I want to go. I want to leave. I want
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: to leave. I want to leave. And the thing to
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: understand the context here is that in the church that
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: I was in is that if you leave a marriage,
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: you don't just lose your marriage, you lose your whole community.
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: No one is allowed to talk to you ever again. Ever,
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Every lifelong friend I had, every support person I had,
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: would go, and so I was like, I didn't feel
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: like I had the strength to do it on my own.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: I don't know why he wanted me to stay so bad.
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: When he I felt like he hated me so much,
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: and I would ask him, let me go, let me go,
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: We're gonna go. Who's gonna love you. No one's gonna
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: love you like I love you. That was his line,
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: and that stuck in my brain so much. I didn't
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: think I was worthy of love. I didn't think I
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: didn't think I was worthy of anything. But all I
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: knew was that I couldn't keep going. I would get
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: boils that would come up on my skin ever since
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: I got married, these big boils, and I've got scars
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: all over my hands and my feet from them because
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: of the toxicity in that environment. My body was just
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: it was just dying on the inside, and I felt
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: dead on the inside. And it got to a point.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: My son was four, and at this point I had
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: lived for at least two years just completely having no
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: feeling about anything. Not even about my son. I looked
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: after my son. I always made sure I'd fake it.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: I would fake the love. I'd fake hug him, i'd
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: fake kiss him. I loved him with every ounce of
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: my being my son, like I can't even put into words,
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: but I couldn't feel like I couldn't And it was
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: the most horrible experience that I was like, I can't
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: actually do another day of this. And in that moment,
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: I made a decision that I had two options, that
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: I actually physically couldn't live in that environment anymore, and
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: that I either end my life or I get out,
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: and I knew how to get out, and that was
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: to sleep with someone else. And the only thing that
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: made me choose that second option was my son, because
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: I had this glimmer of hope in me that maybe
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: one day I would feel maybe one day I would
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: feel happy again and I could love again, and I
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: just had to take the chance of that could be
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: a possibility. So sleeping with someone outside of marriage in
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: the church that I was in is called committing adultery,
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: and committing adultery that and death is the only ways
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: that you get divorced and don't burn in hell. But
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: if you are the one that has an affair, you
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: can be forgiven. You can never remarry, you can never
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: have a relationship with someone else, because if you do,
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: or you're sitting every time. And I was taught to
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: believe that when that happens, your fate is hell, and
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: hell is burning eternally. I wholeheartedly feared that because that's
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: what I had been told my whole life. But then
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: also suicide. I believed was a sinner as well. So
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: I wasn't gonna win either way. And I knew that
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: by having an affair, I would need to live with
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: the shame of that as well. That didn't align with
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: who I was as a person, but I felt like
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: I didn't have any other option. And so there was
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: a guy that sent me a DM on Instagram that
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: I had bumped into at the gym, and I hadn't
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: entertained it, And then I entertained it. I messaged back
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: or messaging back and forth. I had never had sex
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: with anyone else. I'd never kissed anyone else. I've never
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: held anyone else's hand. I'd never done anything ever with
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: anybody else but my husband. So to go and actually
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: have sex with another man was a huge deal, and
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: at this point I was completely disassociated. I went over.
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: It wasn't something that was, you know, like hot and
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: heavy or lustful on my end. It was genuinely to
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: go there, do what I needed to do. And I
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: went back and I told him, and I said, let
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: me go. Can I go now? And his response was
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: exactly what I thought. He just looked at me in
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: absolute disgust and called me every horrible name under the sun,
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: and looked at my son and said, Mommy's leaving you
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: because she wants other boyfriends. And I left. Leaving meant
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: I knew the narrative in my community would be that
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: I cheated and that I had an affair, and I
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: knew that he would gain sympathy from that as being
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: the faithful husband. At that point, a few people knew
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: about the abuse, but it still wasn't. I actually remember
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: one of his friends saying, I don't care about what
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: you did, like she's a hoe, and that's what I was.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: You know. I knew that was going to be in
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: the narrative, and that was something I had to carry
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: with me, that I was a cheater, that I wanted
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: to sleep around. But at that point I didn't care,
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: because I didn't care. I just had to get out,
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: and I knew that that was kind of the choice
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: that I needed to make if I wanted this potential
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: of another life and I lost everything. I told my parents.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: My mom was obviously very disappointed in me, and I
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: knew that my mom wouldn't support me. She wanted me
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: to get back with him. There was no way I
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: was doing that. I lived in my car for a
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: few months. I lived with that guy from the gym
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: that I met, and he actually took me in. He
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: was very kind, I'm very thankful. Wasn't exactly ideal situation,
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: but he knew I had nowhere else to go. I
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: was just I was just surviving. I didn't see my
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: child for a while because he wouldn't allow me to.
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: I had nowhere to live. I ended up living in
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: eight homes within a space of two years. I jumped
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: from place to place, living in people's lunge rooms, living
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: in people's homes while they were away. I just was surviving.
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: I was just surviving. That's it all, is it? Big blur?
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: I've lost a lot of memory of that time. I
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: was able to eventually I reckon about six months. It
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: took me to get a rental and I started to
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: sort of start to rebuild. I didn't have any furniture
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: or anything like. I didn't even own a fork. I
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: had nothing. So I started from scratch and started to
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: like have a sense of building my own life. It
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: was very hard. It was very lonely, and I realized
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: at that point, like I need to try to make
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: some friends here, which is difficult when at this point
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: I'm thirty one, so I'm a grown woman. I've never
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: lived life. I've never stepped foot into a bar. I'd
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: only had my first drink of alcohol. I think at
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: twenty nine, I had no idea about the world, never
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: done anything. I was like a fresh sixteen year old
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: stepping out into the world, very naive and so as
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: you could imagine, had to learn some hard lessons that
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: you probably learn when you're you're a teenager. But I'm
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: in my thirties, and it's not as cute when you're
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: in your thirties and you try and explain to people,
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: never up bringing, you know, like I didn't pick up
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: that red flag, you know. I took people for their word.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: I just thought the best in people, because why else
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: would I not, you know, And I started to rebuild.
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: Bella wasn't the only member of her family forced to
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: leave the church in hopes of rebuilding a life free
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: from the abuse they'd suffered.
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: My youngest brother I was quite close with, and he
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: had left the church and he had experienced some quite
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: severe bullying from some older people. When I say older,
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: he was started I believe when he was eleven and
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: they were maybe sixteen seventeen, these boys people in the church. Yeah.
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: So I remember being at a youth camp and I
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: had beaten him up and they broke his collar bone
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: and taking him into hospital. And this went on four years,
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: and he eventually came out and spoke about how he
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: was actually being sexually abused by this boy. I remember
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: him telling my mom, and my mom telling me, oh,
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: I don't know if that's true. And I remember thinking, like, no,
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: what are you talking about? Why would he make that
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: up as a grown man. He was twenty seven, and
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: it's humiliating. He was struggling a lot with depression and
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: there was obviously something that was affecting him. Why would
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: you think he's making it up? And it was about
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: six months later that he ended his own life. He
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: was getting married that weekend. He had a little boy,
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: and my brother was just the most beautiful, empathetic human.
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: He felt he was too I always think of him
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: as an angel, like he was too kind for this
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: yucky world. And I really dug my heels in off
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: to that, and I got angry and I was like
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: fuck it, you know, like this is not on. And
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: something that I really struggle with and I'm working through
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: is my relationship with my mum. I hold a lot
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: of hurt from her, as I don't quite understand being
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: a parent myself, like why you would do that to
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: your child? But I think we're all very complex and
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: we're multifaceted as humans, and sometimes putting our head in
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: the sand means that we don't need to take accountability
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: and maybe we don't want to feel that guilt. I
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: don't think that my mother doesn't love me or didn't
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: love my brother. I think she didn't know how to
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: deal with the heaviness of the reality. But I wanted
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: to fight for my brother and find she did. I
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: just that I wanted to report a lot of the abuse.
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: So after leaving the marriage, my son still has his
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: father in his life, and his father still, although there's
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: that proximity of distance, doesn't treat me kindly. He won't
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: look at me in the eye. He looks at the
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: ground because he doesn't think I'm deserving of respect of
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: his eye contact, and always critiqued still, and I just
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: got fed up with it one day and I thought,
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: you know, I've just I've allowed you to steal so
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: much of my life, like you have destroyed my life
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: in ways, not now you know I'm rebuilding, but like
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: you have destroyed so much of me. I can see
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: it for what it is with the distance, with a
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: lot of therapy, I can see what you're trying to do.
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: And I decided to report the abuse. And I did
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: it as an exercise for me to feel like I
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: was taking back my power from him, and I really
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: didn't expect it to go anywhere. And the report got
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: given to the investigators and it was about two hours
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: later and they arrested him and he's been charged. He's
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: got several charges. I've aggravated assault and strangulation. So his
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: court dates coming up. And when I got a call
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: from the investigator, almost fainted and I thought, my goodness,
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: what have I done? Like this wasn't my intention. I
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: didn't want this to happen to him. And it's been
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: an interesting exercise where I've protected him for so many years,
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: and instinctively I still feel this need to protect him,
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: and I remind myself that he's never protected me and
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: he doesn't care about me. Why do I feel such
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: loyalty to someone that has done that? And I think
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: that's the nature of an abusive relationship, is that there
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: is that power dynamic there and the only way that
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: I can overcome that is to begin to have the
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: self love and respect to put my foot down and go, no,
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: you don't treat me this way, and there's repercussions for
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: your actions which he now needs to face. I'm not
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: responsible for what happens moving forward now that's due to
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: his own choices, and it's been uncomfortable, but it's also
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: been incredibly empowering to feel like I've finally got that
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: support that I never got, where I was asking people, hey,
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: like this isn't on. I don't think this is right,
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: and just constantly getting told like no, no, no, it's
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: fine to now by law, you know you can't do
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: that to someone. And the church also currently have a
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: parliamentary inquiry happening at the moment as well. There's a
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: lot of cases of abuse that have been hidden, Lots,
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: lots and lots lots of terrible, terrible stories in particular,
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: mostly unfortunately targeting women, mothers in very violent, abusive relationships
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: and all types of abuse.
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: In honor of her brother and the many women and
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: children who had suffered at the hand of the community
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: she'd once called home, Bella dared to cast light into
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: a place shrouded in darkness. Yet even as she exposed
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: its shadows, her heart remained tangled in conflicting emotions.
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: I didn't feel any guilt about what I had done,
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: but I felt a lot of shame, and I actually
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: felt a lot of anger towards Luke at the fact
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: that I almost felt like he wouldn't do it because
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: his image was everything to him, that I was forced
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: to do it, and that I had to bear the
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: brunt of that, not only bear the brunt of that,
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: but bear the brunt of the trauma of the whole marriage,
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: and then to walk away being looked at as someone
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: that was a low character, person that wasn't loyal to
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: her marriage, which wasn't who I was, and I knew
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: I had to carry that, and I did hold shame
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: over that. That's something I've worked on. It's still not
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: something I'm proud of. But until you're in that position,
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: until you feel like you have no other option, it's
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: very hard to describe how difficult it is to make
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: a decision like that, when you feel like you're forced
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: into a corner with no other option. I've done a
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: lot of therapy. I still struggle with it a lot.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: I still struggle with setting boundaries. It's very uncomfortable for me.
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: I've never been told how to do that, so I
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: let bad behaviors slide because I think as women growing up,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: and even those women that have experienced that abuse as well,
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: you are taught that you don't make anyone else feel uncomfortable,
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: so you put up with a lot of bad behavior,
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: and that runs into different areas and aspects of your life.
• 51:58
  Speaker 2: This is like thirty years of conditioning for me that
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: I need to undo and I'm only really like three
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: years into it, which seems like a while, but it's
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: really not in the scheme of things, And I think
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: what has been the most beneficial thing is actually distance
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: is distance from the church and is distanced from Luke.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: With the bail conditions. Now he's unable to communicate with me.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: And it has been amazing because every time the relationship
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: between us still isn't great and I would revert back,
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: I just did because I haven't had the time and
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: the space to be able to heal from him. I
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: go back to who I was with him, which was
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: someone that is very meek, who doesn't stand up for herself,
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: who will put him before me and his needs before
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: me instantly. And the only way I think you can
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: break out of that is to have good people around you.
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: I have like a reference grip of a few friends
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: that I'll go to and I go, hey, I got
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: this text message. Am I in the wrong here? Because
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: I'm confused because I live a lot confused with what
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: is right, what's not right? Am I being selfish? Am
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: I just standing up for myself? I'm not sure. I
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: don't know, and I think that's only going to be
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: a matter of time to heal that. But also that
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: space and distance as well. I look at the behavior
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: of all of these men and it's very clear to
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: me they're just very misogynistic and it was all self serving.
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: So it's not even biblical, Like if you look in
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: the if you actually understand the Bible, none of it's biblical.
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: It's been news to controls. Then I go, all right, well,
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: then this idea of like having a woman and she's
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: not allowed to do this thing, that's for their own benefit.
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: And I think a great way to scare people is
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: to say you do this and then this is what happens.
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: And so just remembering that, and then also to me,
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: my husband broke my marriage vows very early on in
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: the marriage. To them, they don't perceive it that way,
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: but to me, he has. He's broken his marriage vows
• 53:56
  Speaker 2: to me. So it probably took a good couple of years,
• 54:00
  Speaker 2: like I'd say, only like really last year, I reckon.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: I felt kind of okay about it.
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: And as for her relationship with her son.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: I didn't have my son for I saw a couple
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: of times, but really was about a two to three
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: month period. Yeah, it was terrible, and that was mostly
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: because I was just living in people's lounge dreams. It
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: took a lot of rebuilding with my son. He felt
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: comfort with his dad because his dad was in his home.
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: He was the consistent one. He didn't understand what was
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: going on. He also had said some not so nice
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: things about me. But what has been the greatest, the
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: most beautiful thing to come out of all of this,
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: my son is I can't even put into words like
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: the joy that he is everything good in the world
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: to me. He has saved me selfishly. But more than anything,
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: he is my opportunity to almost I don't want to
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: say lived through him, because it's not that. But I
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: can give him the life that I wanted, and that
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: is such a healing gift. I can love him unconditionally.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: He doesn't need to perform for my love. He doesn't
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: need to embey certain rules for my love. He can
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: mess up and make a mistake and I will be
• 55:26
  Speaker 2: there and I'll say, hey, I'll kick him up the
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: bum when he needs it, and I'll tell him, you
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: know that's not on. But I'll also tell him that
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: I think he is the most incredible, wonderful human being,
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: and I will always love him regardless of what he does.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: He will always have that from me, and that being
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: able to give him that love has been so healing
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: and it is such a gift that I am so
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: grateful for and I know that through the stress of
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: the past couple of years, I've really struggled with my
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: mental health, and I know that he's kept me here.
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: I just love him. I think going back to having
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: that initial love with someone, when you fall in love,
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: you love without limits, and I think it's such a
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: beautiful thing. And I since getting out of my marriage,
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: I really struggled with romantic relationships. But I can give
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: that unconditional love with no limits to my son. And
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: there is nothing purer, there is nothing more beautiful, and
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: there is nothing more fulfilling.
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: But Bella has continued to suffer one unbearable wound that's
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: been the silence from her own family.
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: We don't have a relationship anymore. That's been probably actually
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: the hardest thing out of all of this is losing
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: my family. Has been very challenging, but there's not much
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: I can do about it. I hope to one day
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: get to a place where I think I heal enough
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: to be able to accept it for what it is.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: But at the moment, it's just it's too hurtful for
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: me to see it as a rejection. It's just hurts.
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: She's had the same response from the church.
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: I haven't heard a peep from anyone, from the pastors,
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: from no one. I've not heard a word from anyone
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: they Luke. I believe they helped him with a lawyer.
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: He kept the house, he's kept everything, and has felt
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: very entitled to all of that. I think by hearing
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: these other stories of what women have gone through, there's
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: a sense of real anger within me. I feel absolutely
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: infuriated at the idea that women are looked at as
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: almost second class citizens, that we are deserving or need
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: to put up with behavior like that, and the men
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: have been protected. It is a boys club. Men are protected.
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: It just so much. And hearing the harrowing stories of
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: what women have gone through even longer. Being in marriage
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: is over twenty years, and that's a massive chunk of
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: their life that has been taken now, and it's angers
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: me a lot, like it's not okay. Everything as well
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: came from fear. So that's how they could control where.
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: I think, like, if you give people options to make
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: a decision for themselves, they can go, oh, they can
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: go either way. But with this, it was like, you
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: won't do that, Well, we're gonna shame you and you'll
• 58:18
  Speaker 2: see you're gonna burn in hell? So what do you
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: want to do.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: Above all else? Through every trial and every loss, and
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: despite everything, the one thing that has endured is Bella's faith.
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: I feel pretty like traumatized by religion. I still believe
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: in God one hundred percent. I believe in God. I
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: think unfortunately, what a lot of us humans do is
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: we come in and we ruin things that are beautiful,
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: and I think religion, some religions, are used to control
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: people and that's not what I believe God wants for us.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: So I still have a faith to a degree what
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: that looks like. I'm still working out. I can't step
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: for in a church. I don't really want to, and
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: I don't feel ready to do anything like that. I
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: also don't feel like I need to at this point.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: But I've been able to separate God from religion, and
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: I think that's been really important because I think I
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: merged the two where what I see that particular church
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: that I went to as a very controlling place that
• 59:18
  Speaker 2: does wanted to control, and I don't believe God wants
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: that for us. I think that He's made us all
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: for a purpose to live at our own purpose, to
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: make a positive impact. And to live our lives and
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: to enjoy our lives, which is we are allowed to
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: be happy and make our own decisions and not have
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: other people make decisions for us and feel like we
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: need to live within this very small box in order
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: to quote unquote please him. My hope for my future
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: is to get to a place where I'm not as
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: fearful of love, that I can accept love more freely.
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: I am very good at giving love and very hesitant
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: and hyper vigilant of a lot of people and why
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: they would want to love me, because I actually don't think.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: I think I've definitely been loved by my parents, but
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: I don't think I've ever been unconditionally loved, and I
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: want that. I hope that one day I can welcome
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: that into my life. My goal at the moment is
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: to just love my son and to just give him
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: as much as I possibly can, and for us to
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: make memories. I mean, I've actually had the best time
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: over the past couple of years. I've done a little living,
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: I've made up for lost time. I've actually had a
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: ball and it's been great. I've lived so much life
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: in the past couple of years, and I've it has
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: been a real struggle, Like it's been the worst time
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: of my life, but the best time of my life,
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 2: and it's exciting. I try to look at life as
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: a bit of an adventure. I feel like I've lived
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: a few different lives and I am excited for the
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: future and I just hope to get to the point
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: where I'm accepting of love. That's what I would love
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: to be able to receive and to also like, I
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: would still love a family and to have a family unit,
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: but more than anything, just that self love and having
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: a really strong relationship with my son as well. Yeah,
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: I'm free, That's what it feels like.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 4: I'm finally free.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: Everyone Has an Ex is a Minti Media production and
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: proudly part of the Mum and mea Network. This episode
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: is written and produced by Linda Scott. Interview conducted and
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: episode narrated by me Georgia Love. If you have a
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: story you'd like to share, email us at podcast at
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• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: a five star review. We'll see you for the next episode.