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What If Doubt Is Part Of Faith? Interview With Lila Willardson · ToddTalks--Spirit By Design: Your Weekly Survival Guide

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Todd Talks, Spirit by Design, where I help you design your spirit life in preparation so that you can be spiritually prepared for the Lord's second coming.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: Today, on today's episode, I have one of my closest friends in the world, Lila Willardson.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: She has grown in an extremely successful family.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: She lives in Anchorage.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: She served a mission, runs an Airbnb, and I tell you what, she is one of the most awesome spiritual people I have ever met in my life.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: And we're gonna have a discussion today and just glean some words of wisdom from things that she's learned, things I've learned.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: And as always, you know, with these interviews, I just talk, we talk, and hopefully you'll get something out of it that will apply to your daily life.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: Before I started the recording, we just started talking about Lila's made the decision to read the entire Old Testament, and it's difficult.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, to say the least.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_04: It is not not a fun one.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: Well, because the uh the Jews constantly had to learn from their mistakes and relearn their mistakes.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Even as you said, Solomon didn't Solomon didn't listen to his own advice.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like so much of it is is reminding us two things.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_04: God works through imperfect people all the time, and most of us are very, very imperfect.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_04: So turn to him.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: I I totally agree.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: I agree with that 100%.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: I just um I just sent a message on a chat that I'm part of.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: And let me let me pull it up because I think it's very apropos.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um it was a gym, first it was a Jim Rohn quote.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: He said that we must all suffer from one of two pains, the pain of discipline or the pain of regret.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: The difference is discipline weighs ounces while regret weighs tons.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so then I added, I've had enough regrets in life, I'll take discipline from now on.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, that's good.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_04: I like that.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we as we read the scriptures, and you know, I we were talking about how I've made it a daily discipline now to start my day with the scriptures.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I haven't always done that.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I've had my ups and downs with the scriptures throughout life.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: And when I've made it the daily practice, like I'm doing now, it is my my days are just better.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm happier.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: Wouldn't you agree that it just makes the days better?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_04: Well, it's for me having something good that I start my bed day with just makes all the difference in the world.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_04: And you might start, and I think you've probably heard of and read the book Make Your Bed.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_04: Can't remember the author, but that's okay, right?
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_04: One that I gave all my kids.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_04: So they they need they need this.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_04: The whole idea is make your bed in the morning, which now my husband does.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_04: So that's great.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_04: I did it for years, now he does.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_04: But um I I didn't want to take all the fun, you know, or all the goodness.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_04: Anyway, um, doing one thing.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_04: And so if that's what you start with, that's great because you're doing one good thing, making your beds pretty simple.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_04: For me, um, and I was telling Todd this before, somehow when I was 18 years old, I just began the practice, actually a little even before that, but the practice of exercising in the morning, every morning.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_04: I actually probably started that when I was 16 or 17.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_04: But beyond the other activities, I played volleyball, I did cheerleading, so you know, I had that as well.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_04: But um anyway, that has been a part of my life.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_04: The exercise has changed.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_04: Walking or running has been a daily part of my life, pretty much since then.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you have always been fit since I've known you.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you've never gotten overweight, obese, not none of that, because that's a part of your daily discipline, part of your life.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_04: You that meeting healthy, yeah, and the scriptures have I'm like you.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_04: It's taken me a lot, I think a lot of years.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_04: I always wanted it to be, but I did have seven children.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_04: We did live not always the most traditional wives, but um uh so so that has I I have always had this desire to be a daily scripture reader.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I would say that I have I have for the most part disciplined myself into doing that in an uh over the you know, for the last definitely 15 years.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_04: It is in one form or another, whether those scriptures are from modern scriptures, in other words, conference talks or whatever, or the ancient being the Book of Mormon, the um Bible, the Doctrine and Covenants as well.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_04: So, yeah, that has made a difference too.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_04: And to make it at the beginning is so much better for me than trying to make it at the end, at the end of the day.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I agree.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: So we were talking about how the fact that I I started uh almost two months ago, a daily discipline, morning, a morning routine, a daily discipline, and I start my day scriptures and um a conference talk.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: When I'm on the road, I do it before I even get on out of bed.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: Because I I spend half the month in hotel rooms as you know, just part of the life of an airline pilot, right?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: But when I am at home, I've started doing it where I roll out of bed, go throw on my gym clothes, put in my headphones, and I listen to it as I go out the door and just made a discipline of walking, jogging, running, and I listen to it for the first 30 minutes of my walk jog.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it literally strengthens me, it empowers me and I'm able to hear the spirit better throughout the day.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: The I don't know about you, but the focus of this podcast, the focus of my life, actually.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: I made the goal of 2026.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: My focus is on helping others to be able to not just hear the spirit, but act on the promptings that they get.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: And the more you hear and act, the more you'll be able to recognize that you're being prompted, and then you'll act more so that it's a snowball effect.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I do have a question for you.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: This is this is this is the fun part about doing these.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: I I love doing these because I get to ask probing questions of my friends.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so my first probing question for you, Lila, and I've known you for over 20 years now, going on 25 years now.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_04: At least, yes.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um what does it mean to you to put God first in your life?
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_04: Oh probably prayer, you know.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_04: I would think putting God first because God has to come before everything else, and that's hard, you know, that that can be hard for our for our finite little minds that uh I think it's just continuing to do those things that that can bring the spirit in your life, even if you're not feeling it.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, how many times do I get those scriptures out?
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_04: Do I get on my knees to pray?
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_04: Do I do those things?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_04: I'm I'm not really feeling it, but I made a covenant to do it despite despite that when as a mom.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: I want to interrupt real quick, just because I love that word you used.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: You made a covenant to do that, right?
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because the episode I released this morning is about covenants.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and what is a covenant and and how do we keep making keep covenants?
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_04: So right.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_04: So I've made a covenant, which is more a covenant comes with blessings.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so a covenant is more than just a promise.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, it's it's it means that if I uphold my end, God has to uphold his end.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so I'm I know I've made this covenant.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_04: I uh don't always feel like keeping that that promise, but I know it it is stronger.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_04: And what a covenant does is it ties us literally, it ties us to Father in Heaven.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_04: That means that He is in pursuit of us as much as we are in pursuit of him.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: So what you're saying is you mean you're human and you're not perfect, yeah, yeah.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, hate it when that happens, but I can keep trying.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_04: And there are times what we've learned, what I learned from my study so far of Psalms, what I love, is that you know, there are times things are not going good, and I am not happy, and I am not happy with my heavenly father, and I'm kind of upset with the way things are turning out in my life, and he can take my railings that I have towards him, you know, and there are those what they call the the psalms of, I don't know if they call them the psalms of rage or railings or whatever, where where David is just like, what in the heck is happening, you know, and and Jesus even quotes those psalms, my God, my God, why have you why hast thou forsaken me?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_04: You know, so God's big enough to take that.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_04: And I love that we've got families to help us understand that, that we've been able to be parents, right?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_04: So we've had that blessing in our lives, and so much of me being a wife and a parent helps me to understand God a lot more because I can take it when I when I've had to discipline my children or they're unhappy with me, I I can take it, you know, or when they're unhappy with life, it's like it's gonna get better.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_04: It's okay.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_04: Just oh yeah, keep the faith, you'll be okay.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but I think in putting God first in your original question is is you just keep that faith.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_04: You keep the covenants, you you keep your promises to God, and He eventually is gonna keep them up to you.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: I love what you said because when you think about it, most people when they think about praying to God or talking to God, they think of it as a one-way, one-way communication.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: But you use the words raging to God.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: And the only way you're doing that is if you have a relationship, and it it's it's a two-way communication the last few days, especially the last few weeks, uh, as I've really delved into my relationship with God.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: I've had 30-minute-long conversations with him where he spoke back.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: I could hear it, yes, it was my voice in my head, but I knew that the words were coming from him.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he it he tells me, and we have a conversation now.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because I'm I'm I've developed that relationship.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm open to it, I'm open to hearing.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes when our life is not going great, when things are not the way that we would love them to be.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I know kind of some of your situation, um it's hard.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's hard, and and we can be frustrated.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when when we uh we start raging at him, and then he goes, It's all it'll be all right.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes descended below everything, it'll be all right.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: I know how you feel.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_04: And it's it's it's one of those things where it's like um he can handle the raging.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_04: He's the best one to vent to, you know.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_04: When you got a vent, go to God and vent, you know, say, I don't think this is very fair and I don't like it.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_04: And I realize, you know, I'm not doing woe with me.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_04: I just need to let it out.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, you know, let me let it out.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_04: And uh he can take it.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_04: And it doesn't mean I don't love him.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's where the world gets it wrong, is they vent and there's like, how can you do this to me?
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: And then they get mad at him and they push him away.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_03: Right, right.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas what you're talking about is you vent to him and then you embrace him.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_04: And I think he can even take my times, and I've had that this lately.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_04: Who knows why I'm doing this right now?
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um, hang on, I got to tell Barry I am not going to take his call.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_04: He's shopping at Costco, so there you go.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, nice.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_04: He probably wants he had probably has a question.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: It is my favorite place to shop.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_04: Well, I was happy that he wanted to go do something all on his lone self.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, he's calling me again.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: No, now he's not.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_04: Well, he has he has been struggling lately, so yeah, but I'm glad he's he's he's going and um doing that.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_04: So, but what was I saying?
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_04: Um now I've lost my train of thought, but um he lets us struggle and then yeah, okay.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, I know what it was lately.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_04: There I don't know why I'm like, well, what if God isn't real, right?
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_04: What if he really isn't?
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_04: What if Christ, you know, because I I have um a couple of family members who, well, one, uh, you know, an in-law member who who I'm not sure exactly where her belief is right now.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_04: Um I know that a few years ago she she had kind of decided Christ wasn't really, maybe he was not the son of God.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_04: And you know, maybe I she still believes in a supreme being, but she wasn't really sure where that was.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_04: And and and I love her.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_04: She is such a thoughtful person and and such a good mom and wife.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, just fantastic person.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_04: But uh, you know, and and it's caused me to go, well, yeah, what if, you know, and I find things in the scriptures, I'm going, huh, what about that?
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_04: But I'm old enough, or maybe my mind goes, There's there's an answer for this.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_04: And I go to, yeah, what if I am praying and there isn't?
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_04: And sometimes I say, Tell God, I'm not even sure.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not positive 100%.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_04: I wish I were, I wish I were this person.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_04: I do have, I think, the gift of belief, but I do not have the gift of surety.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that's okay too.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's absolutely okay.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: One of the one of the best things I've learned is God asks us to question.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: He asks us to, he wants us to ask those questions because the only way we can learn is by asking questions.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: When we have doubts, we take them to him.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: And and the only time that we get pulled away, that we lose our faith and all that, is when we rather than taking our doubts, our questions to him, like you said, you even ask him, Are you really there?
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um the only time we pull ourselves away is when we make a decision that, well, nobody's listening, and then we stop listening.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_04: And and I am of the I'm in the camp that it is much better to believe than not than the alternative.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_04: It just it makes people I I feel like people who believe in God have a happier life.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_04: They have happier day-to-day.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_04: And and it is, it's like either, in fact, I was just listening to a a book this morning and that was brought up again, and it was basically um, and it wasn't, it's not at all a religious book, but it that that little theme came in, and it was, you know, for people who believe in God, if there isn't a God, their lives are usually better.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_04: And they're happier than any different.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: So it's I mean, believing period in anything makes you a happier person.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: Believing in God makes your life even better.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: And if there were if there were no God, the the after like if we all just go to nothingness when at the end of this world, which I don't believe that, I believe in the afterlife, um, we still live a happier life.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: So what's yeah, so why not?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: Why not?
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_04: Why not?
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that I think that's how I feel.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_04: And as long as our putting God first is helping us to become a better person and not judgmental and not, you know, yay, I think that's fantastic.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: So so on this line of discussion, that's been it's definitely interesting.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: What brings you joy?
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: And what do you use to help create joy in your daily life?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: I know your mom brought you joy.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: And your mom brought joy to everybody around her.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_04: Service service brings me joy.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_04: When I am able to do something for somebody else that makes their day easier or better in any way, that brings me the most joy.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I've done a lot of thinking about this because I'm like, what?
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_04: I don't, I have no passion in life.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I don't know if you've seen the movie um soul.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_04: That one spoke to me because I felt like that little soul who couldn't find her passion.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_04: And when she realized, when they realized your life is your passion, that to me, I was like, oh, oh, okay, yay, that's me.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_04: I don't have, you know, when people go, oh, you gotta find your passion.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_04: I'm like, I can't find my passion, you know, and and it really is.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_04: And service, truly, to me, I was thinking one of my things I've thought a lot about this year is being a better friend.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_04: Because I have lots of friends that I never see, don't talk to, don't do things.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_04: And I thought I've got to reconnect.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_04: And reconnecting to me is important, but I am not a very good let's go to lunch person.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I'm just not good at that.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_04: And I was talking with one of my dear friends, Kathy Hillis, and I said, Kathy, we live three miles away from each other.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_04: We don't see each other.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_04: So I went up and I said, What?
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_04: I said, the best times I've ever had is when we've done something together, when we've made something, or we've, you know, you've taught me how to do something, or I, or you've come and helped me clean, or I've come to your place and we've done whatever, or we go on a walk or a hike or whatever.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_04: I said, I guess I have to move.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_04: But so I went up, picked raspberries with her.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_04: We had a lovely visit.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and it was good for me.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_04: I took home raspberries, I helped her get her patch picked.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um, we had a chat, right?
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_04: So it was a lot of things rolled into one.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_04: But I do find, you know, when I I ask my kids, what can I do for you today?
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_04: You know, what what any little thing that I can be of help.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_04: That is my joy.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_04: That is something I love.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_04: And I noticed that about my mom.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: Your mom is amazing.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_04: She she didn't have these friends she got together with, but she definitely had a lot of friends or a lot of people who considered her their mom or granny.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: She served everybody.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_04: And here's a cool thing is when they would go, you know, they'd take their yearly trip down to the rest of the United States of America.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_04: They would go visit not just family, they made it a point to go and visit friends, you know, people who had lived here, who had been in their lives, um, distant cousins sometimes, you know, in their family.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_04: I just found that, I'm finding that very cool, you know, just a really neat thing.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm thinking, you know, they would touch bases with nieces and nephews, and I thought, I need to do that too.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_04: And so this last year when we took our trip down in March, um, we were taking care of a couple of grandkids.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_04: And at that time I thought, hey, my sister Bonnie's boys are right close here, you know, and their families, and I love them.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_04: So I called them and we met up.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I went, we went to their homes and got to see where they are now.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_04: And that was such a blessing, you know.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_04: And I thought, I have got to do that more often.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: That's cool.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you were always welcome in Alabama.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, we'll just head down there next.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_04: It is an A state, it's just the wrong A state.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_04: Sorry.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if my life weren't so crazy, I'd have been up there already.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_04: It's a okay.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_04: It's all right.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_04: But yeah, I would say definitely, I think serving makes me the happiest.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_04: That is my joy.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_04: That is what brings me joy.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I really enjoy what you said because I think this will really hit home for a lot of people, especially a lot of stay-at-home moms.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like Tiffany would probably echo exactly almost word for word what you just said.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: That she doesn't she she for years has been saying, All the kids are gone.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: I everyone tells me I need to find out what to do with my life, but I have no passion other than serving people.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_04: There you go.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean, word for word uh of what you said, she probably has echoed to me.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it will help her realize that, oh, she's not alone in this.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_04: Ah, yeah.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and that's exactly how that's how I feel.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_04: It's it's the it's the service, you know.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and service is is so good for the person serving as well as the person being served.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: It provides joy to everybody.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: And that echoes what Christ did.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, when he asked, who wants to be the greatest among you, let him be a servant.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: He that wants to be the greatest teacher, let him be a student.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: And then he knelt down and washed all his disciples' feet.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: What what most people think about, most people don't realize when they think, oh, he washed their feet, big deal, right?
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: No, they didn't have paved roads back then.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: They all wore homemade sandals, and it was muddy and nasty, and their feet would would get covered and caked in mud.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I doubt that they bathed as often as we do daily.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, so the their feet had to have been nasty, stinky, gross things.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_04: Well, and the fact that that particular service, that particular act, was always like the lowest of the low servants.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, because it's so gross.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_04: Did that, you know, and that was why, you know, Peter objected.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_04: He's like, no, no, that's the lowest of the low servants' job.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_04: You can't do that.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like Christ is like, yeah, let the servant be the greatest among you.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_04: And and to realize that.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_04: And how cool is it?
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I maybe that's the thing, is so yesterday, Todd, I was like, okay, what a it was a beautiful sunny day.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_04: We have had the craziest weather here in Alaska and we won't go into it.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_04: But anyway, it was a beautiful, it was like the perfect fall day.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_04: It was sunny, but only like 61, 62 degrees.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_04: You know, feels incredible.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: Sounds freezing.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's so so I do remember how it was though on those days.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, it's just my favorite, right?
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_04: So I um Sadie, our our sixth child, uh, fourth, fourth daughter, she's living and renting the old, the top of the old house.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_04: She rents it from uh Carol's daughter, Amy, who owns she and her husband own it.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_04: So the house I grew up in, my mom's house, my mom and pop's house.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_04: So you know, mom and her flowers.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_04: She's a crazy, right?
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_04: Crazy woman with flowers and all.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_04: And that is not Sadie, you know.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_04: Sadie's been, she was single until she was, you know, 29 and a half and never planted anything, you know, lived in apartments and whatnot.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_04: So, so there, and and she didn't move into that house until June.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_04: So there's no flowers.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_04: And in June, we did go over because it hadn't been taken care of, mainly because my niece has her own huge house and grounds to take care of and all the stuff.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_04: But um, there was this, there's this flower garden in the front of my mom's house, a little horseshoe shape around a stone inset that my that Papa did.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_04: And I am determined that next year that's going to get planted.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_04: We didn't get it done this year, but it had a lot of weeds in it.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_04: And I I went over there.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_04: I thought, oh, Sadie's new little dog.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_04: They have a little five, six-month-old puppy.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_04: I said he could use some outside time.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_04: It's so beautiful.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_04: So I went over, not really planning on doing this, but just to get the dog, but I let it out and I thought, you know, there is, there's that, the hoe that I like.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_04: And I thought I should just weed this, get all these weeds out because I got them out at the beginning of the summer.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_04: If I get them out now, they won't be so bad next year.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_04: We can plant.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_04: And just doing that, which I stayed there for a couple of hours, um brought me so much closer to my mom and made me think of my mom, you know, and how that is exactly what she would do.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you remind me a lot of your mom.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, I hope so.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_04: You do I have I have her crooked, you know, arthritic fingers now.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_04: I put them together like that.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_04: They're making a Y.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_04: Look at that, they're all knobby.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_04: I have I had her varicose veins.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_04: I'll probably get her dementia, you know.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_04: So, so stick with me, Todd.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_04: Stick with me in the years.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_04: But if I can have her service, I'll take all the I'll I'll take all the hard things too, you know.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, I'll I'll if I can if I can have her heart, I'll take all the rest of it.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_04: Same with my papa, you know.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_04: They were such, they were, they were definitely knit together.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_04: They're even though they they fusted each other and got after that's just old age.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_04: They taught, well, they they taught you how to love through it all, right?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_04: They're an example.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_04: That that it's okay, you can be frustrated with each other and still love quite deeply.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's a there's a lesson I teach or tell anyone I find out's newlywed or recently married or whatever.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, look, every couple is gonna go through hard times.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_00: Every couple doesn't matter, doesn't matter how strong your love is, every couple is gonna go through hard times.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: They're gonna go through something or multiple somethings that the world will say, they're not making me happy anymore.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: Go find somebody else that'll make you happy.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then you keep repeating the cycle over and over.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's the world's way.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas you get through the hard times together on the other side of the hard times, especially if you get through it with God, you're stronger, you're closer, your friendship is greater, and your love is deeper.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: And they are definitely the person you want to grow old with.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_04: You know, my my papa's last words to my mom the morning he passed away, he he'd slept quite restlessly.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_04: And he slept in a in his big easy chair.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_04: And my mom was sleeping on the couch at that time, you know, to look after him.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_04: And we would take turns.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_04: We'd we'd uh, you know, she'd do a couple nights, and one of us would do a couple nights.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_04: And actually at that time, at that particular time, my niece had come to live with him, so she'd switch off with my niece.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_04: And uh he'd been very restless, kept throwing the covers off, but he was always cold, you know.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_04: So she'd get up and put the covers back on.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_04: It was probably about three or four, you know, middle of the night.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_04: And she was putting the covers back on, and she, you know, said, Is that okay?
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_04: Are you good?
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_04: And he said, Oh, oh, yes, and I just love you so much, my eternal companion.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_04: That's the last words he spoke.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_04: Is that the most?
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_04: And mama remembered that for a long time until she forgot who Papa was.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_00: But well, you know, that happens.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_04: That happens, that happens, and that's okay too, you know.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_04: It was it was sweet seeing mom go through her dementia.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it was awful, but it was all there were also very sweet little things that came in, you know, where we would be reminded of her true nature that she had nurtured through her life.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_04: She, I don't think any of us are naturally one way or another.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_04: If I I think we have to develop good qualities.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_04: And and I think that comes from putting God first.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that we're always either growing or regressing.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you can't just stay, you can't just stay um, you know, stagnant.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_04: It was like my sister Carol and I were talking about mom and how all of the good qualities and the things that she would do, and you know, how other people have said, like you, how wow, she just, you know, was just so naturally, you know, in tuned to people's needs and doing things, just and and it was like, no, she developed that.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, she developed it, you know.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_04: She had to so and I think we all can be that way.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_04: We can we can develop the things that we put, like you said, what is your joy?
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_04: What brings you joy?
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_04: And hopefully it's something not very selfish, you know, and and uh that it's not things, right?
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_04: I would say being with family brings me great joy.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_04: I I love, you know, being with my my kids, my sisters, uh, even my my nieces and nephews, any family members as well.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: I want I I I feel the need to point something out to you.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_00: And that is about 20, 30 minutes ago, you were talking about how you can't say that you're gifted with with knowledge, surety, but you are but you are gifted with belief.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_00: I would like to counter that a little bit with throughout our discussion, you have more than belief.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: You have surety in the way you speak, in the way you talk about um your mom and her relationship with God, in the in the joy that you get from serving others, and the examples that you've learned from Christ.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think you have a surety and you just need to be a reminded of it sometimes.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_04: And that's quite possible.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_04: You know, when my mom was probably around 70-ish, maybe a little, maybe a little older.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_04: I really can't remember, not much older though.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_04: I remember asking her if she was afraid of dying.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_04: And she said, Yeah, I kind of am.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_04: And I said, Well, why?
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_04: And she said, Well, because I'm not sure that what I believe is really real and true, you know, about where we're gonna know.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_04: When she was still in her right mind, you know, mostly, when she was probably about, well, after my dad had died, after Papa died, so she was probably around uh 87 or so, 88, probably 87, when I asked her, Are you afraid of dying?
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_04: And she said, No, not at all, because I know where we're going.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um different phases of life.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_04: I think, yeah.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_04: And there again, I think even in people's dementia, God gives us special things, special gifts.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_04: Annie told me about a time about, oh, it's while we we were on our mission, so it was probably in October or so, and she was in the um, she was in a home, you know, in a wing for dementia patients.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_04: And and Annie faithfully went and visited her at least once a week.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_04: And she said she got there one day and they were having lunch, and mom was just finishing lunch up, and then they were gonna go for a walk.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_04: And Granny said, No, Granny, mom, all one person.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, and granny looked over at this one lady at a table by herself whose eyes were really weepy and teary, and she said, Oh, wait a minute, I need to go, I need to go see her.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_04: And she went over to this lady and asked if she was okay and if there was anything she could do for her.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_04: And the lady said, Oh no, I'm just having a problem with my eyes.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_04: I'm okay.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_04: And she said, Okay, I just wanted to make sure.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_04: And then, and now now at this time, mom's not remembering who we are.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, she rarely you have to tell her who you are, and then she may not remember.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_04: But her sweetness, that spirit stayed with her, and we, you know, we know that doesn't happen for everybody that sometimes people get dementia and they get mean and they get you know hard and difficult.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_04: And we were so blessed that she stayed just as sweet and as nice and as yeah, I I mean, in all the hardness, there was some real blessings that happened, you know, through that.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_04: And so when people go, oh, that would be terrible, you know, I'm like, I'm probably gonna get dementia.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_04: It's it's highly likely, you know, that is likely.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_04: Let's be real.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm hoping my prayer is that people will remember that who I am, and that they can be blessed even when they, you know, when I'm not who I was, you know, in their eyes.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I love you regardless of what happens.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_00: You you you are just a special spirit to me, special friend.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, right, that got you.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_04: So ever since I walked into your house, and poor little Savannah had the croup.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_04: That's how long we've known each other since Savannah was before one year old, and she was a baby.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_04: So, whatever that was, however old she is, that's our friendship.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_00: We we moved there in uh December of 22.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean December of 02.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: December of 02.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_04: Yep.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_04: So I had Annie who was two, and Savannah was newborn, right?
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: Six months old, yep.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_04: Six months old, had the crew, poor Tiffany.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_04: You guys hadn't unpacked everything sitting there.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_04: I think the power might have been out because it was dark, but maybe it was just she was trying to get Savannah to sleep.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_04: I don't know.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_04: And I realized so I went and got a humidifier.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_04: So anyway, I don't know what there was a spirit.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_04: Poor Tiffany was crying.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_04: I felt so bad for her, you know.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_04: And uh I was at the stage where I was at the beginning and ending of my family.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I'm and my other dog, my oldest, was off at school and probably engaged by then.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_04: I don't know, but yeah.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um anyway, you guys have been a special, special family in my life.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_04: How long did you live here in Alaska?
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_00: Three years.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's all.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: That's all man, isn't that crazy?
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: But it's it's and I I've mentioned this on like on the podcast before, but I've I've always believed that there are certain people that come into your life that your spirits recognize each other, that you were friends in the premordal existence.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_00: And when you when your spirits meet, you go, I know you, and you become best friends for life.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_00: And it doesn't matter how much time passes, whatever, as soon as you see each other again, it's like no time has ever passed.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, it's so true.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_04: Or talk to each other or whatever.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_04: You can just chat, chat, chat, chat, chat.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_04: And there are those people in our lives definitely like that for sure.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well I'm gonna let's let's finish up the uh the podcast and I'll stop the recording.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um let's finish it with this.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_00: If if there were one thing that you learned while serving the people of Mexico that strengthened your faith, what would it be?
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_01: I would say strengthened my faith.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_01: Man, that that's that's hard to articulate.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um loading question.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_04: Trying to be able to put this That it does not matter.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_04: It doesn't matter when when those okay, let's let's say this.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_04: Let me put it in this way watching the missionaries, those young missionaries teach and bring people and baptize and they're excited, right?
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_04: Do you know how many of these people we saw for just a little bit in church and then didn't see again?
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_04: And then we tried to find them, and then we'd be like, where did they go?
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_04: Or or or people who who we contacted with the missionaries, and then nothing ever came of it.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_04: I still have the faith that every life that was touched, no matter how great or how small, will make a difference in those people's lives and eternity.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_04: That's what I felt probably the most.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_04: Whether or not they keep the faith, okay, or astray.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_04: They were touched, they were touched by the spirit, and that's what matters most.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_00: I absolutely agree.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason I agree is because we as a faith, the Church of Jesus Christ, the Larry Day Saints, we teach that yes, we we have this life to learn, but everything that we learn in this life or are uh touched by somebody else in this life will help us in the eternities because we have eternity to become like God.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not it's not a hey, you you lived 20, 50, 70, 90, 100 years, um, or even a day, right?
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_00: And and that's it.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_00: You're the decisions made on what's gonna happen to you for the rest of eternity.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um I'm glad I'm not the judge, but I do know and I have faith that, you know, to become like God, because we teach that God wants us to become like him.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_00: Heavenly Father, we're all his children, he wants us to become like him.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: So the more we learn in this life helps us when we die and we get to the other side.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, you know what, I didn't really learn or understand math and some sciences very well.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I get to the other side and I'm gonna be, hey, um Galileo and some of you Asimov and some of you other really smart guys, can you teach me that in a way I'll understand?
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um Captain Moroni, how you know the faith that the very jaws of hell would close if I had your kind of faith.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: Teach me that.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your student, teach me.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: We'll have eternity to learn.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_04: To grow to learn and to grow.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_04: And that is where my finite mind goes, my my infinite mind goes, yay, and my finite mind comes in and goes, yeah, but really, you know, but I'll take the yay because that's way more fun.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I can't say that I don't I don't doubt.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_04: I definitely doubt sometimes.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_04: I'm like, what?
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_00: But I don't know, nobody knows.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and that's the that's the mysteries of God.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_00: We've only been given this much.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we have very little.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_04: We don't we don't know much.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_04: We really don't, you know.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_04: People think, oh, we launch rockets and we're learning.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we're learning all the time.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_04: That's awesome, that's great, you know.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_04: But there's still so much we don't understand.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_04: We still can't figure out how in the heck those pyramids were built.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_00: Aliens.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_04: Aliens.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_00: All right, I'm going to stop the the recording here.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to hop off yet, but thank you so much for participating and sharing your thoughts, your testimony, your beliefs, and your doubts with others because I think it will really reach out to a lot of people.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: That was fun.