Latest / Beat The Odds with Dre, Rodney, & Brylan / Pooh Shiesty, Civilization Tweets & The AI Robot Tax

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Pooh Shiesty, Civilization Tweets & The AI Robot Tax · Beat The Odds with Dre, Rodney, & Brylan

• Rodney: happened or what transpired when he went there but essentially they robbed some people they robbed Gucci they robbed some of those guys I think one of the guys maybe even got choked out I don't remember the exact details of what happened but there was some violence that was involved as well there was different guns ultimately they tried to get Gucci or I believe they did get Gucci to sign a new contract, which if we had to guess, it must have been a better contract. I don't know the details. Dre: Well, I think he wanted to get out. I think he wanted to get out of his, his deal. So he was trying to get Gucci to like, basically, I guess, terminate the contract. Right. So basically get out of the deal, whatever the deal is, whatever deal he was in, I think you said in 2020, he signed to the label, whatever deal he was in from then he was trying to get out of it. And I guess Gucci was like, no, that's not how I mean, we know how contracts, that's not how contracts work. Right. You can't just exit out of it when you want to. Uh, and I guess he thought he was in the nineties. Rodney: Okay. Dre: He like, you're like, don't have cameras around. We can get out of this. And, uh, he thought he can get out of that in that way. Obviously he obviously don't know the law because you can't coerce someone into signing a contract that that immediately is going to void that. So as far as I know, I don't even, I think he probably still signed a Gucci. So his music probably going crazy right now. So Gucci, Gucci is monetizing essentially probably his music while he's sitting behind bars waiting for this, uh, for this case to play out. Brylan: you Rodney: Look, let's just jump out there and say this is an idiot. I mean, this has got to be one of the dumbest guys that we have seen in decades. He does not care ⁓ himself. He does not care about his family. He does not care about Gucci or the label. This guy just does not care. He is probably a little slow. I'll just be honest. He's probably just a little slow. It's not even like we got to be honest about this, right? You are they let like you had you already were under. Here's the thing, right? This whole thing about. I'm breaking the law, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. get all that. I get all that. I understand it. We understand that we know different people. We ⁓ all ⁓ we understand this, right? But the once you've got the federal first federal charge. That's when you sober up, right? Like you gotta sober up after that first federal charge. it's not the state, correct me guys if I'm wrong, it wasn't the state, it was federal. Dre: For For sure. But you got to look, examine this through the eye of a criminal. do it. No, no, no, no, no, because, no, because, ⁓ no, perspective, I think perspective is everything. You know what I'm saying? I think perspective is everything from where he from. And again, I'm not for what he did. Obviously what he did is extremely stupid, but this is just, this is my rationale for how he see it. Where he from, he from the streets. And so- Rodney: No, no, no, Go go ahead, go ahead, go ahead, go ahead. ⁓ Brylan: Go ahead say it. Go ahead say it. Rodney: Okay, okay, sure. Dre: You know, it could have been agreements that were made, that were broken between him and Gucci. It could have been disagreements. It could have been agreements in the contract. They weren't fulfilled correctly. We know that happens all the time with artists. You know what I'm saying? Where they have disagreements with their label, things that they want to do that aren't done because he didn't properly read it or examine it. I mean, that's the, that's the narrative in the music industry. We know that to be true. So, I mean, from his perspective, and plus the time he did in the fans, he probably like, bro, that's a slap on the wrist for all the... Think about all the crime he's done that he ain't never been held accountable to. It's probably a lot, right? So the time he did do an offense is probably like nothing to him. Even in fact, the time he probably thinking about sitting out for doing this, it's probably nothing to him relative to the reward, which is I don't want to be signed to this nigga no more. I'm hotter than ever right now. My name bigger than ever right now. I can move units. Nigga, his first day out song on YouTube did like over 50 million views just for the video. So like he hot right now. Rodney: ⁓ yeah, for sure, for sure. Without a doubt. He's done a lot. He's fearless. Brylan: Yeah. Dre: He the pipe is hot. You know what saying? There's money on the table He got to feed his family and this all he know how to do other than the street shit Which he probably really trying to get out of to really really take this to the next level, but Gucci holding them back Brylan: Well, hold up. Because one of the things I heard here too, yeah, one of the things I heard here too was like he actually had a better deal. So another record label came to him offering him a better deal. But given he was in, you know, this contract, he couldn't he couldn't take advantage of it. And I think the number that was reported was like, there's like a $10 million like sign on bonus or something, you know, if he was to take that deal. So Dre: So it might be worth it. Of course. Rodney: Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay, okay, so look. Brylan: Mentality matters here. Dre: A couple years for 10 million. I mean, who's to say that the net present value of that money is going to be the same then, right? But he did come out hotter than he was before he went in there. That's for sure. Rodney: Okay, okay. So I can't argue with a different perspective. Different perspective exists, right? can't argue with a different perspective. There's a way that he saw it, which created the action that we all are observing and discussing, correct? So I understand that. And. assuming I'm not the only one. So I not born and raised in the streets. I was born in Detroit, Michigan. I was raised in Farmington Hills. I grew up primarily in the suburbs. Now, when comes to ⁓ my family, have family who have been killed in the streets and I have family that have been in prison. Now, From my observations, from cousins or uncles, now that I think about it, no woman that I can think of. I don't know what that says, but from my observations, it ⁓ make sense. Now, is there a perspective? And they've served different times, and for some people, ⁓ the thing, ⁓ the conclusion I've always came to is that Ultimately, it's a perspective that doesn't value your own life. Right? So because thing about it is this, okay, you're from the streets. So you believe that if somebody does this, you got to do this. Somebody does that, you got to do this. my like, there's all these different codes, right? And I see that. I see that. But the thing that I always think about is, that when I go work at a corporate job, The people I work with don't operate under the same code that I grew up with. And I didn't come from, I don't gotta be from the streets. But ultimately, if I chose to play a certain game, then I gotta play by those rules. Otherwise, I will lose my livelihood. In his case, Dre, he's come out of prison, federal prison, and he's hot. In this case, to me, it sounds a little bit more like greed. than it does about like principle standing. You're hot, you're doing well, Gucci is making a lot off of it. You do not like that. As Brian Lynn mentioned, now there's somebody else coming with the deal and now you want to get out of it because you want the money. But here's the thing. You chose to sign to a record label. So then now you have chose to play a different game. additionally, that greed of, ⁓ I want to handle this. And clearly it backfired. It clearly backfired. Cause I guess maybe he thought nobody was going to tell. I guess he thought that, ⁓ maybe we could talk about that, but I guess he thought nobody was going to tell. I guess he thought he could get away with this, et cetera. I don't know really, because he's on house arrest. So guess I still don't even understand how if you're on house arrest, did you think they weren't going to track it or... And then also these days, what I've been seeing is that the federal government has not been playing recently when it comes to rappers and entertainers, these people who have not been held accountable. They actually try to give people chances. They try to give people chances. I've been seeing that. You see people like Gunna who... who's portraying street. I don't know if he's from the streets. I don't know what he does in the streets or if he has done things in the streets. If I had to guess, he probably has dibbled and dabbled, but maybe not fully embraced it. Gunna got caught up with YSL. He got caught up with Young Thug. And when it came down to it, said, look, I'm not choosing the streets. I choose me. I choose me. I choose my family. I choose my friends. I choose my health. And now he's He's doing all ⁓ things, et cetera. He's showing a different way. Now, mind you, Gunna is not Pooch Ice. You know, he's not, those are not the, ⁓ still, I that's what he portrayed. Not, no, no, not at all. Not at all. Not at all. ⁓ I'm saying that. I'm not saying that, but we gotta say this. Okay, so one thing that Bradley did say though, is the snitch, right? The Gucci snitch. Brylan: He used to be. Dre: Nah, but see Gunnar not from the streets though. He not from the streets. He not from the same streets that Pooch I see from. Rodney: And look, I think Gucci did snitch. I think he had no choice. I think Gucci's in a position where do people want him to do? Now, mind you, I don't think he said that much, ⁓ there's really not much to say. You get robbed, people are getting, you know, people are, he a huge situation where I can't see how he can't say anything when the police show up. He's going to have to say something. Now, I don't know what he said. But it seems like based on what I'm seeing online is that he said a little bit, but other people that he was with, the bodyguards, et cetera, said a lot more. That's what I'm seeing. if that stands for something, then people should look at that. But from what I can see, if you're not supposed to say anything at all, then yes, Gucci did snitch. But if it's just a matter of, Brylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Rodney: He had to say what we could all see with our own eyes. Then, I don't know. Brylan: So let me ask this question, right? Because dealing with two different Gucci's now. Like we all remember ice cream man Gucci, you know, ⁓ from the early days. But now we have clone Gucci. For the folks that don't understand that, go do your research. And this got a lot more money. It's so... ⁓ Rodney: You're right. Brylan: When does snitching yeah, when does snitching become okay? That's the question. Rodney: does it on the streets that based on what I see and I'm not this is what I see people saying I'm not in the streets. I'm in how I'm in corporate. I'm in tech. I'm in business I Clean Clean based on what I say. What I saw when I see it. There's no such thing as if you want to be associated with the streets. Now, if he's saying that I am away from that, I think it is okay. Dre: But I see I think Gucci still industries. Look at who his artists are. Rodney: You think he's in there? Brylan: It has to be. Dre: How do you source how do you source that type of talent? on on come on on there's some organic there's some organic something happening there where he gone out and sourcing these artists go look at his record label a lot of people on his record label either dead They're in jail very few people have survived Gucci's record label and attract the track record ⁓ Rodney: Cause it counts too! It counts too! You see his catalog? You see his catalog? Brylan: you Hey, hey, Dre, go. Rodney: So you think he's really, so you think he's in the streets? Dre: He got it, bro. You got to be to manage that type of talent, to manage those type of artists, to even work with that type of talent. You got to be. I'm not saying, let me clarify. Let me clarify what I mean by in the streets. I'm not saying Gucci's standing on the corner slinging rocks and selling dope. I'm not saying that. But what I'm saying is he has relationships with people who are in the streets. He is around people who are in the streets. are who you around. I mean, you can't be around people in the streets and say you're not in the streets. Rodney: Okay, okay. Dre: Like, I mean, either you in or you out. know, again, he may not be, he may be distant from somewhat of criminal behavior, but that doesn't mean that he not still tapped into the streets. I find it hard to believe that you can sign these type of artists, produce this type of music, and then say, oh yeah, I'm not in the streets. How do you make such a good product? Like, I mean, I just find that hard to believe. Now, if he was signing like Justin Bieber, you know what saying? If he was working with... Ariana Grande, you know, those are all type of artists he was signing. Then I'm like, okay, then okay, cool. That makes sense. But bro, you got Poo Shicey signed to your record label. mean, come on. Like it's hard to be around that to me. Maybe like you're not part of the street. That's just my take on it. But nevertheless, ⁓ doesn't mean Gucci shouldn't snitch whatever the case may be. I mean, the man almost lost his life potentially. He got a family. He got kids. He got to get back home too. I mean, at the end of the day, that's really what we're dealing with here. So. Brylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dre: In my mind, it's not even about the street code, but my thing is he is part of the streets. And I think the way Poushaisi see it is like, nigga, you speak the same code. So unlike what you say, Ronnie, which is like, you know, I work in corporate, we don't speak the same code. Poushaisi is like, nigga, no, we speak the same code. We speak the same language. And then on top of that, you got me in a fucking predatory contract. not right either. We know that's how the music business is. That doesn't make it right. That doesn't make these contracts right. You know what I'm saying? Just because that's just the way it is. And these contracts are predatory. And if you start looking at the numbers, who should I see like, nigga, I'm out here busting my ass on the road doing this X, Y, and Z, and you just raking in this and that, and you're not even willing to renegotiate? When I'm at the height of my career, which usually artists are in a position to renegotiate deals when they are at the height of their career. And it's like, you strong arming me? You know what saying? You're from the same place I'm from. So it's like, no, we got to handle this a different way now. Rodney: It sounds like Dre supports what he did. Dre, Dre, Dre. Dre: I don't support it. understand it. I understand it. That's it. I don't support it. just understand where the mentality comes from. And I just understand the core principles of like, nigga, we're from the same place. I'm trying to get bread to feed my family just like you are. And you fucking raping me hand over fist. We got to change that. And either we're going to change it constructively or we're going have to change it a different way. resonate with that. Rodney: Okay, okay, okay. Where you came from? Yeah. Okay. It just seems like though that to me, you have gotten into the music business, you are now in the music business. And me, that is corporate. To me, is corporate. You can't run into a corporate office. So for example, I know he may not look at it like that, but ⁓ if that's studio that Gucci is renting through... business funds, 10, 17, whatever it is, and you run up in there, that's business. Like that's business, that's corporate. Now he may not look at it like that, because maybe the environment doesn't look like that. Who knows how the studio is being run. So maybe it doesn't, maybe he's not professional. So I don't really, but I don't know how Gucci operates anymore because he seems very clean these days. So I don't know how he really operates. He seemed like he drank water. Brylan: Yeah. Rodney: He eat fruit. You know, he seemed like he worked out like he seems like he's he cleaned up his act. He is not this does he not as dysfunctional as he was before. He's not the guy who's, you know, getting tattooed randomly. The guy with the severe mental health issues that get the guy who is doing Mali every other day drinking every other day. He's not that anymore. So now he does still profit off that because his whole catalog. So from my perspective, I'm like, OK. He's an official where he's not trying to go back to where he was at. He's cleaned up his act, et cetera. At the same time, he has a co-catalog of street shit, basically. to me, I do see what you're saying that he might actually still be involved in some of that stuff. Not from like a criminal standpoint, but just, but I also think that it's possible that he's really not. Like, I think that if you have that much of a catalog and you're that much of a street legend and you're that much of a hip hop legend, That stuff could just come to you and you may not be going over to, you know, you may not be going to certain areas. You may not be like, now you might be inviting that a little bit into your space because those people are bringing some of that. But I guess, that is a risk to him though, you know, ⁓ by deal, like, ⁓ don't, don't get it twisted. Gucci is playing a dumb game because he knows the type of people he is dealing with. So. Dre: Yeah Rodney: So he's not necessarily all hands clean, like he's some victim. He knows the type of people he was dealing with. And also, like you said, he put them in a predatory contract and basically Gucci is saying, ⁓ this is business. This is business. And then what Poo was saying is, that business to the side. Put to the side. And I understand that. It's just that when I start to think about the music business, I think about corporate, I think about whatever it is. ⁓ Once you get into start, start dealing with that system that we deal with. That's that, that, that, that system. started to feel that game that you play, the that you start playing at that part becomes more. So if you care about your freedom, then you might want to try to find a different way. Cause at the end of the day, you go to prison. And now no matter how hot he was, he's messed that up. And he is looking at a lot of time because when you get let out early and then you prove to the judge and you prove to everybody that lets you out, that you don't give a fuck about anything that they were talking about, they get, they could have kept you in there that entire time. They could have done all that stuff and they let you out because you're a young man and they want to give you an opportunity to come out. and clean up your act fix your life. That's what they're trying to do. he's so gone that he doesn't care about his life. ⁓ clearly care about it. ⁓ And understand where he's coming from, but at the same time, I'm like, okay, we can understand something, but I can't that. I just can't stamp it, that's all. I understand it. just can't stamp it because we need young people who are talented. Dre: Thank Rodney: who are hot and do all these things and say, know what? Keep that self-control. Keep that self-control. Okay, Gucci fucking you over. Okay, cool. Hold that tight. Hold that tight. Don't say one day you'll get back. But just don't get back like that. don't get back like that. Like just hold tight. Hold tight. Brylan: you Dre: Mm. Brylan: So hold on, there's this lyric, cause I don't know ⁓ after this situation, y'all went back and listened to the first day out lyrics. this one stands out to me where he was like, he said, unfortunately I'm CEO and a top shooter for my gang. My grandma told me keep my grass low the whole time I'm the snake. Smelled his plot from like three miles away. He can't out snake a snake. Dre: Of course, multiple times. Brylan: I choose the streets. They chose me stepping on shit my lane. I ain't choose rapid chose me. My name held too much weight. Type of influence I got where I'm from. Yo Gotti got Yo Gotti carrying a Drake. I'm telling you bro like cause it, and the reason why I bring up those lyrics is like there was a, there was a, there was a live video recently of Pooch Iced Tea. Cause mind you this happened, this, this, this robbery stuff happened in January. We're just finding out about it four months. Four months has passed now that we found out about it. And so he made a live and he was talking about it was ⁓ to it. was like, was the snake that I was talking about, like all this stuff. And he was ⁓ your point around know, Gucci being in the streets. Poosh Icee has said multiple times that ⁓ he wanted to be a rapper. Like he was really a street dude. Dre: Mm-hmm. Rodney: Okay. Brylan: And he got put in the position. He got put in the position. And so I do think, I mean, I think where I would kind of push back and then we probably can move on is like, I do think environment plays a huge part. And while yes, it's the music business, the artist does not usually operate in the corporate music business. most of the time, like those environments that they're in, like that's their office. Rodney: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the studio environments are, they're not necessarily the most professional. Yeah, we get that. We get that. Dre: I think environment is everything, bro. That's why I'm like, I understand where he coming from. You know what I'm saying? It's not about it being right or not. I just, get that. He thinking about like his freedom. He not thinking about that. He thinking about his respect. Honestly, he really is. He thinking about his respect. He thinking about the bread that he can secure from his family. Cause he probably seeing real money right now that he probably never seen before. Brylan: Yeah. Dre: Especially legally, you know what saying? Because I think he going on tours. He getting booked. mean, the niggas going crazy right now. So he's seeing real money that he never seen before. ⁓ So I get that. I mean, again, I don't know how this is going to play out. We're going to let it play out the way it is. I mean, there's been other federal cases that I thought was slam dunks. I thought all the evidence was aligned and somehow these rappers been able to wiggle their way out. So I don't know if this is slam dunk. It is what it is. I'm just saying. Rodney: ⁓ you know what? What? No, have you based the case? Dre: He makes good music. Hopefully he has some fire. Rodney: If he beats the case, then I guess maybe it was worth the shot. If he beats the case. ⁓ sometimes these cases are kind of, like you said, they're not as strong as they seem on the surface. ⁓ maybe he might be able to beat the case. But I do got ⁓ question though. Do you guys think though that he will ⁓ this five years, 10 years on the line? Yeah, so yeah, we can all understand it. Brylan: Well, all he needs... Rodney: It doesn't take, it's not hard to, maybe for some people that might be listening and I mean, just it really depends on the demographic of who's listening, but. It's clear to understand, but I'm wondering though, is this the type of thing that you regret if they hit you at 10 years? And if that's the case, then it's like, okay, we understand it. it's like, for example, if somebody finds out that somebody their daughter, she's 10 years old and it's a grown man and he ⁓ up, he kills. ⁓ kills the guy. yeah, we understand that. Yeah, we understand that. ⁓ understand, you know, somebody, you know, hurt that person's daughter. So that's why he snapped and maybe he hit him too hard, killed him. We understand what happened. We understand what happened. But you asked that guy five years down the line, 10 years down the line when he's no longer, like you asked that guy, I wonder what you, I wonder what they think. Do they think that the response Because it's not a matter of whether or not something should have been done. There clearly a disrespect and there's clearly was something bad that, there's clearly, ⁓ he challenged as a man. He felt like he was disrespected as a man. Yeah. Brylan: Well, hold on, I'm looking at the Complex article. They said Complex is reporting that Gucci made $24 million off of Poosh Ice D while he was in jail. Dre: Yeah. Like, yeah. What were we talking about, bro? Like, look, I get the logical brain side of it. Will he regret it? Maybe he will, but is it worth it for him? Bro, have you ever talked to somebody who is institutionalized, bro, who have been in and out of, been in and out prison, bro? What? Okay. That some individuals, bro, who are like that are not thinking about that team near about thinking about the, I'm not, I'm not educating you. I'm educating those who are listening. Rodney: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I don't need to be educated in all that though. I get that. Dre: I'm talking to the people who listening, which is because some people might not know that. Okay. So you're different. You got people in your family who've been in prison. So do I. So some people might not have ever been around people who are like that, who think like fucking criminals, who are criminally minded, who are sick in the mind, who operate like criminals. And so for some of those people, they might look at this and be like, fucking 10 years, I do that shit. I'll do it. No problem. Rodney: That's fair. That's fair. That's That's fair. Brylan: Yeah, yeah. Rodney: That's very good. Yeah, yeah. I know. They might they might they might they might Dre: No problem. Because in my prison, they got a whole ecosystem of people. They got a whole comfort. They got protection, all of that shit like that. And so it's a whole different level. So for us, for us who not institutionalized, who are not criminalized mentally, hell no. Of course not. Of course. But also I didn't grow up like Poosh I see in the streets with his parents. His dad was in prison. Fucking his granddad was probably in prison. All his uncles probably was in prison. His cousins probably was in prison or shot and killed. And so to him. Rodney: Y-yes. You're right. Yeah, you're right. Yeah, yeah. Dre: That's literally what he knows. And so I'm not trying to examine this from like my perspective, because my perspective is a whole different view. I'm looking at it like, if I'm him and I'm in the streets and I know something and making 24 million off of me and I haven't made nothing off of that shit, something got to be done about that. What it is, what it is is different. But I'm just saying, I think everybody could, could rationalize that, but okay, something got to be done. And then also too, I'll just say this, we haven't talked about it. We don't know what Gucci's response was. Rodney: Yeah, no, I understand that. Yeah, I understand that. Dre: It could have been the corporate response like, you know what? Let me go see what I could do. Or it could have been, nigga, fuck you. You signed this shit. We about to run it up on you. I ain't changing shit, nigga. You locked into this shit forever. We don't know what the response could have been. We don't know. You know what I'm saying? And again, I'm not saying that makes anything right. I've already said I don't stand by what Poochai she said, but again, this is street level code. I think it's mentally, you have to walk through that differently. That's just how I. Rodney: could have been. Yeah, that's the point. Brylan: Did y'all see the recent Big Meach podcast? Did y'all see what he said on the podcast? I don't know if y'all seen it. Yeah, yeah, so he recently did a podcast with Veeze, another rapper out of Detroit. But I his perspective was very interesting on how people in those type of situations making that kind of money think about these moments. And what he said was, ⁓ he really caught out the point that like, ⁓ Rodney: No, I didn't even know Big Meat had a podcast. Dre: I highlights. I start highlights, about it. Brylan: when him and BMF was really like running things, know, he was really like the black Pablo Escobar, like, homie was doing, you know, close to billions of dollars in revenue. he was like, he was like, you know, the feds never had anything on me. And I had to go look it up. I'm like, how'd you go to jail then if they didn't have anything on mind you, they really never, ⁓ the never had any like, you know, evidence of him actually being the one that said so so drugs. was just like, tell but What he ended up saying was he was like, it was a blessing in disguise because he was like, the thought that he had in prison was that the time that he was doing was for everything he didn't get caught. And he was like, didn't get caught for it. And I feel like a lot of, ⁓ like we've all done bad shit. And so it's like one of those things where like, going back to your question 10 years from now, will Poo Poo feel some type of way? I don't think so because the amount of shit this nigga probably has gotten away with. prepared to like what we know. Chalk that and guess what? Guess what? They can't freeze any of my assets or money. So that bitch is going to continue to grow. I'm coming out on top. No nigga, unless it's attached to the crime. So yes, like they'll probably like any anything that would probably come after this force sign to end the contract maybe, but even that is going to legally be false. Dre: the bodies. Rodney: Yeah, there's a reason why he's fearless. There's a reason why he's fearless. They can't, they can't, they can't, they can't freeze in here. Brylan: But to Dre's point around, Homie is doing numbers right now. I had to look this up. Homie is doing 10 million streams a day. Rodney: That's crazy. so. Brylan: That's all money going to him. The feds can't freeze that bro, cause that's not involved in the crime. Dre: And it's a street nigga from Memphis. I don't know if y'all been to Memphis. I've been to Memphis a lot. That shit is rough. I grew up in the street. I grew up in Detroit, I would consider Detroit a rough place to grow up. Memphis is rough, a rough ass place. So for that nigga to make it out of Memphis and to be making millions of dollars, I mean, not everybody gets that opportunity. And unfortunately he might've fucked it up for himself, but you know what saying? Not everybody at least hits that position. Rodney: Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Brylan: But if he's a millionaire in jail, he's living differently. He's living. That's what the audience needs to understand. Dre: for sure. For sure. Rodney: Yeah, he's living differently. ⁓ yeah, but the audience also needs to understand that people get stabbed in prison, people get raped in prison, people get killed in prison. And unfortunately, prison is someplace where nobody, there's nobody's going to protect you, there's no safety. And so the... Dre: 100%. It's vicious. Brylan: Sure, sure, sure, sure, sure. But if you go look at the people who that happens to, nine times out of 10, it ain't the niggas with money. have, Tory Lanez, ⁓ out of what? Millions of people that have been in jail. Like, if you... Rodney: Tory Lanez. No, I'm like, I'm not talking about the, like, I'm just saying like you said people want money, so yeah. Brylan: Yeah, yeah, I'm talking even so Tory Lanez is one but I'm sure there have been other people with money in jail like because what I equate having money in jail to is if you can get someone to put money on your commons area If you can get money get get someone to put money on your books are better than 99 percent of niggas in there and you ⁓ the leverage that you have is different Rodney: Mm-hmm. Yes, yeah, for sure. One thing that I've thought about as you guys were kind of talking a bit is like this, as Dre was saying, like this the mind of somebody who's been institutionalized. And unfortunately, that for me, definitely, I have an older brother that has been in and out of prison almost his entire life. Most of you don't know of him, but. And since he was young, he had always been in these situations. And for me, that was a very challenging thing. for me, it's challenging, right? ⁓ in my life, I've tried to, my but then also me personally, I've tried to do a lot to try to. ⁓ turn that around in some way, whether it's financially or businesses or helping with businesses or whatever it is. And it's something I don't really talk about that often, but it's something that when I hear the of somebody who's institutionalized, et cetera, you know, I really get it and I really understand it. it's really, it's one of those things where I don't really know how to react to a lot of this stuff because on one hand I'm saying, I'm saying I get it. you know, unfortunately, actually, it's one of those things that I know a little bit too, you know, too personally. But then I also think like, you know, because I didn't grow up that way. you know, my brother was somebody who I mean, I just can't even get it. the stuff like just to put it lightly, one thing was, that in, you know, he got expelled from the schools in Michigan. just from when he was a teenager bringing guns to school. And that's the thing like that's like, and that's just like one of many things across 30 years that I've been, ⁓ I, ⁓ I just. think me personally, I start to look at that and I say, okay, it's hard because I understand that we grew up differently. But then I'm also like at some point though, like, you you have a wife, you have kids, et cetera. And the way that you're living, just not It's just not right. And I understand there's something going on and I don't really know what to do about that. And it's not like we got to go into a whole thing about know, what to do about that. Maybe that's the podcast that is important to talk about is, you know, the prison reform and rehabilitation and how people can go back out after, you know, having felonies and having, you know, mistakes that they've made in their life and how they can go back out without this mentality of a criminal, this mentality of violence, this mentality of, you know, scheming and doing all, like, you know, doing crimes, et cetera. This mentality of It's just, it's a horrible mentality. And I really just like, I don't know. It's just something that's kind of like, it's when I hear something like this, I'm like, it's so dumb. But I also, get it too. So I always get conflicted about it. I get conflicted about it. And honestly, I that we can find something that can help people. Because all I see is somebody who, yeah, I understand the situation. All I see is just like, dang, okay, I get it. But it's just like, man, I wish that that He could have, yeah, I think that Gucci would have took that money. And I think that if with a different mindset, although I understand he doesn't have it, that he could have probably ate that loss and he could have found a different way. And I also think he's extremely talented. And I think that, you know, that 24 million is a small bucket out of the 240, maybe 300 million he might be able to make in his life. And I just think that... It's kind of just, it doesn't feel good to kind of see that, yeah, mean, since that kind of took a kind of ⁓ a downturn though, I would say, I guess this is good news either. We talked about this a little bit before we joined, started the podcast, but there's been a series of events with Iran, right? And. It started off earlier today, I think sometime in the morning or afternoon, I think maybe the afternoon, went ⁓ Truth Social. He started off the paragraph with, a whole civilization will die tonight. Do need to say anything? Do I need to say anything else? I mean, there's more, but like, we react off that? Dre: Well, actually, guess there is good news though, because according to Trump, mean, he was going to wipe away the civilization, I think 8 PM Eastern time, which would be in what, next four minutes. And right before the pie, came out, or he didn't come out. ⁓ saw the reports. I don't know if it's been confirmed, but he have extended the deadline by two weeks per recommendation the Pakistanian prime minister. So my understanding is the Pakistanian prime minister. Rodney: Yes. Dre: was basically trying to negotiate with Trump and Trump deputies for the last couple of days and propose a ⁓ list things for a ceasefire. I don't know if the ceasefire is actually going to happen. But effectively, he was trying to just say, hey, let's just give him another two weeks to get the straight open before we go to the plan of destruction. So it seemed like he's just kind of a blage that request, so to say. So I would say that is good news, ⁓ because The way he was talking, I think the whole world was on pins and needles thinking like, we getting ready to go into different escalation in the war. again, based on that news that came out breaking right before we started the pot, it looks like that is not going to happen, at least within the next two weeks, if Trump decides to keep his word. But at least it looks like tonight things have been kind of put on pause. So I would say that's incredible news because I was deeply disturbed by that tweet. Brylan: you Dre: I thought it was just completely unprecedented. I, you know, it was crazy. I don't even have a problem with him feeling that way or even saying it scenes. Cause I imagine there's a lot of conversation that happens behind the scenes, you know, just like you have in a boardroom, right? There's negotiating, there's people say stuff, people get angry, you know what I'm saying? You say something personal. I ⁓ that debate and conversation and just take place behind the scenes. No problem. No foul. Say whatever you want. But I think to say that publicly, the president of the United States, I actually think that is a disgust on America. And don't think it represents the American sentiment at all. And I think America as a country, while we ⁓ support the wars and support having a strong military, clearly I think all of us are cool with us having a strong military. I don't think any of us will support us just indiscriminately bombing civilians and killing a bunch of innocent people for the sake of nothing. I don't think anybody would be okay with that. I don't know. was just sick and about a whole thing, but I'm thankful that he at least gave another two weeks. What will come from that? Obviously it's hard to determine, but hopefully we can sleep tonight. At least that was kind of scary. I'm not even gonna lie. I didn't want to see that. like, hope the news, I hope the news organization, if he were going to do that, I was like, I hope the news does not report on that. I'm like, that's just going to send the world into chaos. mean, can you imagine seeing just millions of people dying on the, on the world news like that? Brylan: I think, I'm going be honest, this is where my skeptical hat comes on. Right. And part of the reason why my skeptical hat is on in this moment is we've this ⁓ before. Right. this isn't the first time that Trump has kind of like, you know, made these types of threats and then kind like set these deadlines only to like backtrack. Right? The first one actually started in March. So March 21st was the first time he set the deadline. He said the deadline was March 23rd. Nothing The straight was not opened. Then March 26th, he set deadline number two, either open it up or we're going to bomb your infrastructure. They did bomb the infrastructure, but the straight was not open. And then you get March 30th, you know, that ⁓ comes in. Dre: Mm-hmm. Hmm. Brylan: Um, actually April 1st. So he comes in April 1st and he says, we're willing to, this was the first time he came out and said, we're willing to consider a ceasefire, but only after the straight of Hormuz has opened. set a date 48 hours. If you remember that true social or all hell will be faced. That deadline hit nothing happened. And then you got Easter, you got Easter. So April 5th. that's where the first tweet came where he said Tuesday, 8 PM, this, this shit needs to be open. Yesterday, he doubled down. Today was the day. And that's when he kind of gave the civil civilization, but he's had four opera. He's essentially set four deadlines. That not been respected. And I think the reason why this timeline is extremely important is because when you think about the context ⁓ or frame at which this whole situation. exist. It's a Bahamuth versus someone who is weak. It's David versus Goliath. The US is essentially, I would say, winning this war militarily. No Everybody knows this. You can see the video, see the pic. We are destroying them. I say strategically, I would also say I would also say we're on the verge economically, but more importantly, from a credibility standpoint, I think the US credibility is at the heart of all of this right now. if our credibility goes, our goes, if our goes, I'm telling you now, it's going to accelerate the whole China bricks. don't have to kind of get into that. But I think right now, You have Trump looking like a fool because like we were talking about this on the pod before, Iran's strategy is to outlast. It's a strategy of endurance. And their strategy is to push the U S to escalate because it takes away resources from other areas for their allies. But furthermore, it hits the credibility because as you can tell from when he went to NATO, he went to all our quote unquote allies and none of them showed up because they don't want to. They don't want to. And so, yeah, even seeing this type of tweet go out, right, this morning, alarming, right? Because I think I dropped this in a group chat. When you say you're going to wipe a civilization off the planet, I think there's probably only two ways you can do that, either with a bio weapon or nuclear weapon. Right? So I think that's why you have people taking it serious. ⁓ Taking it serious. Dre: Yeah, think his tone was just different this time. I think the message, based on what, to your point, I think was always consistent along the way, right? We're going to do this and if you don't do this, we're going to do this if you don't do this. I think what made this one a little bit different, at least what resonated differently for me was just a tone of that message. Like to your point, when you say you're going to wipe out a civilization. And then not only did he say that, I mean, he was like using curse words. We've never heard a president really talk like that before. Again, publicly, privately, they probably all said they probably all talk like this, but out publicly, you know what I'm saying? Like just the stuff he said, I mean, it was just like the tone and it was just just it was just a little bit different. mean, can his tone escalate even more than what it already has? Maybe he's already reached that max capacity now. So anything he says going forward would just be taken with a grain of salt your point. But I think his tone, so I mean, I don't know, maybe, and maybe he, I think the scary part about that is maybe he feels that sentiment. Cause we know how, how tapped in Trump is to his public image. Right. And so to say face, will he do something extreme? Right. Or he say, you know what? All right. They think I'm bluffing. Fucking do it. He could. And, and, there's no, there is no question that militarily we can do what we want. mean, I think every, every public analyst I've seen out there has agreed. Rodney: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, so... Brylan: Yeah. Dre: The US has the capabilities to do exactly what he said he wanted to do. Bomb every bridge, bomb every power facility. could do it. It is no question, can we do it? It could be done. So it's just a matter of if he feels like, you know what, y'all think I'm bluffing? Y'all think I'm not going to do it? OK. I'm going do it, but I'm going do it on my time. I'm going do it on my terms. I'm going do it under the covers of darkness when it's unanticipated. Nobody's going to know. Rodney: ⁓ Dre: So I don't know, I still think about that. don't know, I mean, we know Trump is a little bit deranged, so it's kind of hard to tell what he's thinking. I mean, we know what he's thinking because of what he says, but we don't necessarily know when he's going to carry out some specific action, right? Rodney: Yeah, that's interesting guys. I first saw the tweet from, ⁓ I guess it was a post on Truth Social. ⁓ I definitely have this detachment on social media to where... a lot of things and probably just over time, just because social media can have so many different things that come up and make you feel some type of way. I really didn't feel anything. But what I, but in my mind was in a very, very logical standpoint. And was concerned about the last part that Dre said about the saving face part. I did think he was bluffing, but I also thought that potentially that there was potentially a risk. on him feeling like, okay, y'all don't take me serious. I thought that was an ego risk basically. So I thought that was a risk. But I didn't feel, honestly, I'm not gonna lie. I felt very cold. I very cold, very calculating. I didn't really feel much when I saw this. I could tell though that a lot of people did. And just by the way that people were popping out and et cetera. And I understand because It was very, it's very strong. I think that the way my mind rationalized that was just that. At the end of the day, he's the president at the end of the day. So whether I thought he was bluffing or not, and whether Brian was right that he's constantly moving the goalpost, he's the president. So people do take him serious. And I know people from Iran that were not taking those things lightly either. So I understand that. And because at the end of the day, he could do it, may not do it. Is he serious? Is he not serious? At the end of the day, when somebody's crazy, I don't think they should play that credit. So Marlon, if they're trying to reduce Trump's credibility, I just don't think they should do it because... Brylan: No, I don't think it's not it's not Trump's credibility. It's the US credibility. Rodney: I don't think, well isn't it connected to what Trump is saying? Brylan: It is, but it's because he represents. representing the US. Rodney: Okay. Well, this case, the way that what I'm speaking about is, I'm much saying that, which is that if they're trying to lower the US's credibility, ⁓ you through Trump, I don't think that they should do that because Trump may not, when somebody's crazy, don't try them. Like when somebody's crazy, just don't try them. You don't like, don't mess with them. Don't mess with them. You might be trying to do this and do this. If he's just crazy, may not go with you. You're reducing credibility for this aspect and for this reason. Just stay still. This crazy. Nobody move. It's all just like... Dre: I think they have a tolerance for suffering that's different than how we think about suffering in the US. You know what I'm saying? We have a different standard of how we think about living. We have a different philosophy and ideology on life. You know what I'm saying? We have a different stance on religion. And America is made up of many different religions. it's not a... Brylan: Yeah. Rodney: That's clear. Dre: Homogenous in that sense, but it is is a difference in just how we you know Think about suffering a little bit different. And so I think from their standpoint Yeah, that's true. That's true. That's true. I think in their standpoint I think they they they're willing to like like Brian said they're willing to wait this thing out and I do think the destabilization ⁓ of US credibility Is an lever point why because the whole world? Rodney: Not Pooch Icy, not Pooch Icy, not him. Dre: is based on global security is based on allies. Right. The whole idea of the whole principle of security. And again, the US is strike a little bit different because of literally our location. Right. That's one of the things that saved us in World War Two and every war that has been the fact that you haven't seen bombings of American factories. Yeah, that plays a huge role. But for a lot of the rest of the world, that Brylan: facts. You got water on both sides. Dre: Peace and mind of security, you you go to a place like uk. It's a small ass island You go to france france is small spain small italy small these small nations Where you can literally have somebody like germany come in and take I mean we know the history But my point is the whole idea of global security to me relies Based on credibility and you doing what you say you're going to do right and I trust that you're going to do what you say you're going to do when the time come, even if it's 70 years from now, 80 years from now, a hundred years from now, 200 years from now, I expect you to do what you say you're going to do. And if at any point that starts to become questionable, then it's only right for me to then decide, then how do I realign myself with another ally where that security is a little bit more safe, sort of say. So it could be like, okay, well then do we go to China? You know, do we go to Russia? You know, we, got to, maybe we need to talk to some other global superpower. You know, we already, Brian kind of already alluded to that with the BRICS organization in terms of like payment flow. There's already been some actions by other countries to try to get some of the Saudi Arabian, some of the Gulf countries to not take U.S. dollar for oil. That's one of the biggest reasons why U.S. has this dominance is because right now it is required for the most part, if you want to buy oil, you have to buy it in U.S. Well, if that changes, then that completely changes how we fund our military. That completely changes how we fund overseas bases. That completely changes a lot of things. A lot of Americans don't realize that. so, but a lot of that whole agreement structure is based on the principle of alliances and you doing what you say. And so the moment you start to away at that, that does start to have some of those allies start to, again, go have other conversations behind closed doors where maybe the U.S. isn't involved in it, right? Or go look at other strategic partners where the U.S. isn't involved in it. Brylan: out. Dre: And right now what Iran is trying to do from a principal standpoint, it's really trying to get all of those Gulf countries, including Saudi Arabia, to say, why are you all letting the US interfere in your politics? Why are you all letting the US dictate how y'all do investments, how your security or energy, all of that stuff is controlled by the US? Why would y'all want that? Which is a very fair question because I think we will be asking the same thing as America if we saw Russia come into our backyard. You know what saying? Doing the same thing in the Caribbean. I think we probably would be like, would y'all let them do this? You know what saying? We'd be having that same conversation. So ⁓ do think there's something to that. Again, whether they outlast Trump, I don't know. It's always hard to predict. But I do think it's very fascinating how these global politics kind of play out. And I think it shows just how fragile everything is. literally, of this stuff is really baked on a fucking handshake. And when starts to get, again, when that starts to go backtrack, When that starts to backtrack, mean, you kind of get some of the things you have now. so I don't know. I find it very interesting. Brylan: Yeah, I think one thing I want to really add to this because to the point of most people really do not understand. Yeah, I would say this whole idea of like the US dollar dominance, right? And everything is hinging on that, right? And so like even today or like over the last few days, I don't know if you all saw the headline, but France removed all their gold from US banks. Dre: Yep. Brylan: That is a big deal. That is not small. Just because, you know, essentially gold, especially in times of war, is seen as a store of value, right? ⁓ think the other thing people really have to call into ⁓ call question as well, is the why credibility is also important. And we saw this a year ago when the tariffs happened, right? When countries do not find another country credible, they are less likely to want to buy your debt, so your bonds. As much as we talk about equity America, America runs off of debt. America runs off of debt. And so literally what you have seen over the last year is countries like Japan, et cetera, who used to be huge buyers, of US bonds or US treasuries have slowly started to sell more and more, right? One, because they don't know if they're gonna get paid back, et cetera, et cetera. And this has trickled down effects that we don't have to unpack now, this has serious trickle down effects on not the economy, but eventually the American people. And so I think you kind of have both these parallels and they're one of the same. They're one of the same, where if the US... Whoever like it, and I think it's just part of history, but whoever controls the currency that the world trades in usually has military dominance. And right now that is what is being tested. Right. I think going back to Dre's point around like just even causing a slight hesitancy, hesitancy, right. That's why there's an op, like there is a serious opportunity for what China, Russia, India, South Africa, what they're trying to do. Right. And it's all, and like, all you gotta do is go pay attention to the markets. I'm sure some listeners on here have been paying attention to like gold markets. Yes, they've recently dropped, but over the last year they went crazy. And if you go over the last two years, they went crazy. If you go look underneath why is because these governments have been buying gold so they can literally store the value or use that as the store of value for the brick system that China is trying to create. Right. And I think it is all trying to break away and have a little bit more independence when it comes to these decisions that the U S are ⁓ And I, and I, I know if y'all saw the, ⁓ this came out like maybe like an hour before we hopped on the pod too, but Ray Dalio, you know, who's kind of been, you know, a large voice in the space, kind of speaking of this, you know, changing world order. He wrote a really good post and his whole thing was that he feels like markets right now aren't really pricing in the truth. He feels what markets are really seeing is this going to be like a short term conflict where he's like, everything is pointing to this potentially being the breakout. We can drop but the things that he pointed out that I thought were interesting, he was like, Right now we have four active wars going on. So everybody knows about Russia, Ukraine. And then you also have Israel and Lebanon. And then you also have Yemen and Sudan, and then the US, Iran, Israel. But his whole thing was, he was like, if you look at the environment of the world right now, it looks like the environment prior to World War I and World War II. So like that 1913 period and that late 1930s period. ⁓ and so he, he's like, this is a very fragile time, not only for America, but for the world. But I think that's to my point of like, if I'm, if I'm just going to be honest with you. do think Trump was bluffing. You can't take it as a bluff, but I do think he was bluffing because the ⁓ ⁓ the world, if he was to do Iran, I'm telling you right now, America would feel it very And it's not because we don't need the oil or whatever we talked about earlier, but it's because of everything else that's interconnected to it. Dre: You Rodney: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yeah. I agree with that point about that. You can't take it as the as a bluff because he's the president. I thought it was a bluff. I was under the belief that it was a bluff. But if you're Iran or anybody else, it is totally fair that you don't take it as a bluff. It's completely fair. It's so, so, you know, people were scrambling, tweeting, impeachment. Brylan: Yeah. Rodney: Amendment, you know, 24, whatever, whatever number that was, people were popping out. And I understood, I understood, even though I didn't feel the same way. But look, look, we got one more topic for these last, for this last segment. And it is around Anthrophic. So we're going to go back to AI. And essentially, Anthrophic is claiming that Brylan: You see how to the topic of conversation every week? It's for a reason. Rodney: Yeah, yeah. So look, so look, so enthralpy may be the topic of conversation, but at the end of the day, who's in everybody's hands? Who's in everybody's hands? And if you can answer that honestly, then, you know, we can continue forward. But, ⁓ use everyone. I use everyone. That's a good question though. Okay, yeah. Dre: Yeah. Brylan: Who do you use? That's a very diplomatic answer. Rodney: Yeah, yeah, I use everyone. It's not diplomatic. It's the facts. It's the evidence. I use grock. use, I use... For what context? See, I'm an advanced AI user. Okay. I'm an advanced AI user. I'm not basic. You know what saying? Yeah. ⁓ not, I'm ⁓ ⁓ advanced. Like, well, for what use case? Like, you I use every AI every day for different use cases. Every single AI is every day. Brylan: Let's add one word, most. You would be a good witness on the stand, alluding to questions. Rodney: I use Gemini every day, I Grok every day, I use Cloud every day, I use ChatGPT every day. But I use them all for different purposes. All for every, all of them every day. But I would say that my home would be ChatGPT. That's the home AI. But I don't use it a ton though. I would say I probably use Grok more because I tend to want a more unrestricted model. So, so Grok fits that for me more. But anyways, this segment is not about me guys. Claude came out with this new model or they haven't come out with this model yet. It's called Mythos and it's preview and it was announced today. And essentially they're saying that this is their most powerful AI model. Now I just have say this because I'm not hating. I just had, but it is just so people know saying that it's your most powerful model. And also additionally, they said it's their most dangerous model. That is one way to drive hype towards a model. If you say a model is extremely dangerous, it comes off like the model is very powerful. Those two are hand in hand, very powerful, very dangerous. So anyways, This model takes huge leaps in cybersecurity. So what I mean by that is that it can help hackers and attackers by a large margin, but it can also do the opposite. So one of the things, like a couple of the things that it discovered just in its findings were one, like thousands of like different bugs across all different types of software online. One of the bugs was a 27 year old but in a very widely available version of Linux that, and Linux is open source. So it has been reviewed and everything almost multiple times a year and it was never caught. So essentially these models are finding bugs and vulnerabilities, which they call zero-date vulnerabilities. And essentially a zero-date vulnerability is a vulnerability that the developers or the creators do not know about. It's like having a back door in your house and you don't know about it. So it's very serious. they found other basically bugs in widely popular software. For example, there's another video software called FFMPEG or MPEG. it's a free tool that handles video and audio. Some people might know of it. Either way, It has all these different vulnerabilities essentially Anthropik is coming out and saying, Hey, look, we have some very ⁓ concerns because this model is very useful, very powerful, but we could also see, and we're worried about attackers using this and able to ⁓ do large scale AI attacks that businesses and individuals. may not be able to protect themselves from. Now, to combat that, they're doing a deliberate slower release. this slower release is meant to go to like the larger partners like JP Morgan, Google Apple, et cetera, to kind of. give them this kind of infrastructure for our software first, but that's the meat of it. Dre: think it's going to end up being great for them. I heard they are on what, like a $30 billion revenue run rate right now, is incredible. They've added, I mean, just, it's just amazing to see a company scale of this size. think on the last spot, we looked up publicly how many software companies ⁓ are that are over 20 billion. ⁓ wasn't that many of them. It was only a handful. So even get to that level is crazy in and of itself. I don't know. I'm hopeful that this product will be useful. But I mean, as I've learned from you, Rodney, there is no way to stop the hackers, the attacks. There is no 100-proof way to do it. So all you're really doing is doing mitigation work, which, I mean, there could be some value to that. I won't say that's value-less. But no 100-proof way to do it. But it does work effectively, then this could be an interesting product line for them. Rodney: Yeah, it can be. Yeah. Dre: tens of billions of dollars just in and of itself. I think open AI is probably gonna come fast following and start releasing stuff similar. can see them kind of starting the same product track, which I'm not saying is a bad thing because I think not to go back into the war theme, but one of the things I was looking at is that Iran is really strong at cyber capabilities. And one of the things that they've been doing is launching an enormous amount of cyber attacks on American infrastructure, whether it be power plants, Rodney: Yeah. Wow. Dre: rather it be water treatment facilities, all of these systems, all of this infrastructure runs off computers. I mean, at this point, we know that, right? A lot of these data centers are running off of computers. And so... ⁓ Rodney: I'm more worried now. I'm more worried now. They're smart. Dre: Yeah, no, for sure. And so I think anything that gives American companies, you know, more tools to help fight, you know, these type of adversaries, I'm a huge fan for. And unfortunately, we're in a world right now where we got nation states that are coming at our American infrastructure and companies. So, you know, I'm for whatever, whatever works, you know, for a product standpoint. Rodney: Okay, so go ahead. Brylan: Yeah, I would say, I'm actually really curious ⁓ they do release these models. Yeah, I'm curious to dive just kind of into some of the technical breakthroughs, right? Is this just the result of ⁓ models getting That's one of the things I'm gonna be curious about as well. I think the other thing too that I'll be curious about too is to see if they speak about any of the ⁓ data mix. ⁓ Right. ⁓ just because it does seem compared to like Opus, of those benchmarks, there's like a plus, you know, 20, like improvement percentage improvement. Right. and there's that. And then the other thing that I'm also going to be curious about too is like, I feel like last year was like the year of like reinforcement learning. Right. and so the of the reason why I'm going to be curious about these three things is because I do think it gives us. just as folks who are kind of curious about this space, some predictive power of like, much further could this continue to go, right? I the other thing that I'm gonna be curious about too is, yeah, it seems like ⁓ the roles have almost flipped a bit, right? Because if we remember like just even last year or even just like the previous few years, you have never seen Anthropic. like come out here and hype up a model release. they just drop the model like, you know, day of, it's like, there's this new model. Maybe there's like some Twitter leak of like, ⁓ Anthropic is, but it's not to the point of like, would say like how OpenAI that was part of their like marketing and kind of like growth strategy. felt like even to the point of, you know, like if Anthropic dropped a model the same day, OpenAI had, you know, a tweet. you know, in a blog post ready to drop it kind of like the next day. And so curious to see if this is like anthropic trying to be on like the offense ⁓ than, you know, just being the conservative kind of like player in the space that they, that they have been given. I will say their brand credibility. Yes. Be on offense. Yes. Rodney: Did you just say offense? Did you just say offense? Okay. That's... Okay. Okay. Dre: You Brylan: What you trying to get at? What you trying to get at? What are you... Which, Which, what are you, hey, we got, like I said this a few weeks ago, Anthropoc got to get to 100 Bill. ⁓ Rodney: I think that's fine. A hundred billion is fine. It's just not what Open AI is going to do. think Anthropa is going to be a long lasting big company. that's that goes without saying. mean, what are they going to do fail? Like it's like, they ain't failing. Like they're too big. I actually do think they're too big to fail. I do believe that actually. But I when you say like, they're trying to on offense. Brylan: Mm-hmm. Rodney: I mean, do you see, I see Dario in every move they make. Conservative, know, slow steps. So got this ⁓ dangerous that they're gonna slowly roll out, but they're only gonna roll it out to the most, to the largest corporations who can figure out all this stuff if anything were to go wrong. So everybody else that actually would not be able to, like, ⁓ Brylan: Yeah. Dre: you Rodney: They're performative, bro. just can we just look past this image that they are portraying? They are playing the same game that opening eyes playing. They are performative. They're giving, they're saying they're worried about safety and how bad it could be. But then they proceed to give it to multi-billion dollar, some of them trillion dollar companies before like, and what's that going to do exactly? What exactly is that going to do as far as reducing the danger to basically the rest of the economy and the rest of the businesses and also the rest of the individuals. What exactly is that gonna do? Give them an opportunity to maybe fix things and then everybody else is free for all? What exactly is the, I don't get it, but it looks good. If you don't think about it, if you just read that and you just don't think about it, it sounds great, but just think about it. They don't really. So now don't think they're on offense. I think they're trying to play it safe. think they're being conservative and they're rolling it out slow. And they don't want to be the one. And I think also too, I might even give Darrio some strategic credit because to Dre's point, I think that this will make OpenAI jump out. maybe that's strategic. Maybe they're coming out saying they have a powerful model and they're going to roll it out responsibly and slowly. And that's going to make OpenAI jump out and they're just going to drop it and dump it. And it's going to be... Because we all know that this model is not going to be 10 times better than something that OpenAI already has. Everybody's neck and neck at this point. ⁓ can see OpenAI falling into that. I can see them responding and coming out and being a little bit more reckless. I can see them doing that. I can see them doing that. So maybe I'll give some credit on that aspect. Brylan: Well, think OpenAI when it comes to strategy right now is, yeah, I do think it's flipped. And what I mean by that is I think from 2023 to probably most of 2025, what you had was OpenAI capitalizing on the fact that they won the hearts and minds of the world, right, with Chad GPT. I think you had... Rodney: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, they did. Brylan: Dario and Anthropic come out being more so the Doomer, which has been in their position the whole time, but their strategy, I think at first was one where they were potentially trying to lock themselves into a competitive, competitive position on regu based off of regulation, like trying to get the government to force certain things. ⁓ you know, to protect their kind of business. I think that has flipped. I think that has flipped, not to say that Rodney: Yeah. Brylan: Chat GPT is still not top of mind for most consumers, but I think given the sourness of the relationship with Anthropic and the current administration and the government, that has created an opportunity where now they have the hearts and minds, especially in this environment that we've been discussing on the pod. So I think they're doubling down on that. But even the fact that I think OpenAI, that has switched too because people were sour about them taking a night deal with the Pentagon. But Rodney: Right, yeah, yeah. They were. They were, yeah. Brylan: Now you have them doubling down and releasing this policy statement or whatever, which is really just lobbying for what they want. Like if we're going to be honest, so think you're seeing this kind of crossover, this switch that might be happening. Rodney: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I guess if we have a few more minutes, we could talk about this proposal. we have a little bit longer here, we have an hour, but basically OpenAI came out this proposal and essentially, in short, it's basically something to help mitigate. or help reduce all the damage that's gonna come to AI. They believe that AI is gonna replace a lot of jobs, it's gonna do a lot of displacement. There may even be new jobs, but they think that that transition could be bumpy. what they're proposing is, one, they're proposing a change to taxes, right? So one of those changes is like a quote unquote robot tax. Easy way to think about it is if you were to buy a physical robot or if a business was to buy a fleet of physical robots and essentially replace humans for that particular job or task, then each robot would be taxed on the revenue or income that it generates, like a human would. ⁓ that can go to something the government, taxes, et cetera. And essentially, you can imagine a digital form of that too, but it's just easier to think about from a standpoint. And then the second thing that they came up with was this idea of a public wealth fund. So if you think about the Trump accounts, which are a really good idea, and I'm not going to lie, that's one of the long term things that people are going to be thinking Trump for. Trump may get like a lot of backlash now, but people who have those Trump accounts, those kids that in 18 years, they get access to those accounts, they're going to be feeling Dre: Mm-hmm. Rodney: pretty good. And it's going to suck for if your parents didn't get you one of those, you're to feel like you're not to be happy about that because everybody had an opportunity. ⁓ essentially, the fund was essentially where you could start off a little. I forgot how much ⁓ I forgot exactly it works, but you start off with a certain amount of money and the government either matches it or they automatically give every kid a certain amount of money. And it's in safe account. It's invested, it grows over time, and you can start it off with, I think, kids under years old or something along lines of that. they're openly, a public wealth fund, which is similar to that concept, but for every citizen, so there's no age limit. And I ⁓ that is to also allow people to benefit off all the wealth that's going to be generated from AI. Another thing that they're suggesting is this idea of a four hour work week. think everybody can agree that would be really nice. think theory about how that would be implemented would be basically a hour limit on And then after that, it's overtime pay. That's the only that I personally can see that being put into place. ⁓ And then another would be increased Dre: Yeah. Rodney: on social benefits, so unemployment, healthcare, etc. That one's a little, it's it sounds nice. But when I think about the current, well, he's talking about from AI, he's talking about AI is going to bring so much wealth that we should be able to take the ⁓ taxes from robots ⁓ and the Yeah, taxes. Yeah. Yeah, but from the AI and the robots. Yeah, not Brylan: Where the money going to come from? Dre: Well, taxes, yeah, taxes. Brylan: Yeah, taxes, but let's be honest. Do people want to be taxed or do companies want to be taxed? Rodney: not tax, no, they're not trying to tax people though. nobody wants to be taxed, but he's suggesting that companies that are using AI and physical AI, every agent and every robot should be taxed just like a human. So if those things are going to replace jobs, he's basically saying tax it like a human, use those taxes to pay for our lives. Dre: Yeah. I mean, makes sense. It makes sense to me, right? Because I mean, the whole premise of these robots is that, at least from a business standpoint, is that you have a better cost structure, right? You can replace a robot with a human. The whole thing is they can be more productive. They can work 24 hours a day. I went to a wedding in the middle of Ohio a couple of weeks ago, corn fields all around. And it was at like a... Rodney: Now whether or not that actually works, I don't know, but. Right. Dre: Like a farm kind of, it was at a farm, right? It was just kind of crazy, right? In the middle of nowhere. And I come outside, I'm getting ready to leave and I see a robot lawnmower. There was just been, it had been out there all day. Automatic, bro. Automatic, cutting grass. It had been out there all day. Mind you, I had got to the venue around 11 o'clock in the morning because I was dropping off food to the bride and groom, just running errands and I saw it. And I was like, okay, that's interesting. Rodney: That's great. here Automatic? Yeah. Yeah. Dre: And it was just going around doing a little pattern kind of like ⁓ a, robot vacuum. If you ever seen a robot vacuum in a house, it was very similar to that, but it was cutting the grass, bro. By 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock that night, the robot vacuum was mean the lawnmower was still working. was still cutting the grass at 11 o'clock at night. and so it makes sense to me that if you're going to have these robots and thinking, that's just one small of some rural farmer in the middle of Ohio, just ⁓ choosing use a robot to cut his grass versus. Rodney: Mm. Dre: having some employee sit out there for several hours and cut in. That's just a very small example. But it makes sense to me that if you're going to use these robots to replace human, which that is a human job that otherwise a human would be doing, that you do kind of have to tax them a little bit differently. So that logically does make sense. How you do it mechanically, I mean, that's what IRS to figure out, right? But that does make sense to me. mean, because I mean, we're starting to see it. And again, just as simple as a lawnmower, right? ⁓ what does that start to look like? Rodney: Yes. Tax that. Yeah. Dre: in other areas of the economy. Rodney: Right? Yeah. Autonomous cars and truck drivers and all these different things. And people think that there's going to get these fleets and they're just going to replace everybody. ⁓ then everybody else is just going to be on the sidelines. Like, ⁓ I do think that, yeah. Brylan: Well, think there's going to be a tough argument, right? Because the president is going to be that this isn't, ⁓ least in terms of physical AI, these are just an of machines. So when we talk about the humanoids, the robots or whatever that we envision, some here but are coming, the autonomous vehicles, Those are just evolution of machines. And I think people are going to probably point to, for example, in agriculture, You have, I what ⁓ the it's not like a bulldozer or whatever, but what they use to lay the grain and the seeds, ⁓ or the tools that they use to water. When they introduced that, these farms extremely more productive because It was replacing human beings who had to do that by hand before. That machine was not taxed. Rodney: It did, yeah. Right. The thing that I think might be different, might, and I see your point, I do see your point, and don't get it twisted, I don't think that companies are gonna lay it out and not say anything. probably gonna say something along the lines of that. I think the key piece might be the intelligence factor. And I don't if that matters, but the intelligence factor. it's just a machine that you have to, that's just repeating the same thing over and over again, it's a little bit different than something that's autonomous and requires some level of intelligence to operate. Meaning most machines, if they're not perfectly placed or they're not perfectly set up or something happens, they'll thrown off in some type of way. But when you add intelligence, that is the evolution of a machine. But at that point, is, I don't know what the, I guess I don't know. It a good point that machines got better in those different place jobs at one point, but we were able to adapt because one, we were still able to do certain jobs that machines couldn't do, especially if they required thinking. And I think what this might be focused on is jobs that require intelligence and or thinking. ⁓ could be different than, because I guess I don't know what we have past that. If we don't have intelligence and thinking to offer to the system, then don't know what else we have. If, what else do we have as far as agency? Something that we can use to take control of our lives. And, you know, but. ⁓ Dre: We need some solution. I've always been clear about my doomsday feeling about AI the fact that I thought it was going to decimate a bunch of jobs. ⁓ still bullish on that. ⁓ just don't see how it doesn't. And ⁓ get the comparison to your point, Brightlin, about the machine and the farmer. But the reality is technology has always killed jobs. That's never been a secret. has always done that, right? I mean, think about it. When the elevator first came out, was somebody who was on there who was responsible for pushing the button. And then you have better sensor, better technology to prevent the elevator from dropping to the bottom floor. And now you don't need that person. So technology has always been about eroding jobs. I think what makes this technology different, to me at least, is that it is both horizontal and vertically deep, meaning that farm machine affected the farm. We're talking about a piece of technology that can affect the farm. They can affect the office. They can affect the doctor office. They can affect the pharmacist. They can affect the taxi driver. You know what I'm saying? Like you're seeing this kind of a multi-pronged, I don't want to say attack, but multi-pronged approach where you have this technology horizontally and vertically rolling out to all these different industries. And again, if America does what it does best, which is we innovate, we iterate. Rodney: Yeah, the spread. Dre: constantly, constantly, till we can't do it no more. If we are successful at that, then I think the end result would be to replace these jobs. I don't see how we take this technology all the way without it. To me, that would be a failure in technology. To me, the whole purpose of these robots is to build an automated factory that needs as least amount of humans as possible. Otherwise, we're just marginally improving stuff. I don't even think that's the... culture of America. I think our objective is to be as innovative as we possibly can. So again, I'm hopeful that we are successful in that attempt, but to me the side effect of that is what we should be having, continuously having a conversation about, because I think that's real. And I think we've seen it even now, early college grads, and maybe it's more than just AI, right? It is more than just that, right? But they're struggling to find jobs. That's a real fact. Rodney: Yeah, I hear that. Dre: Subjective that's really what's happening right now. There's something about why that is Rodney: Wow, yeah. Yeah. Well, I hope wherever this is all going, we can, in my ideal world or my ideal future, we could all have more time to focus on our health. We could all have more time to do, activities or play sports. all have more time with our family and friends and we could choose to do other, you know, random hobbies just for the sake of enjoyment. It would be kind of tricky. It does seem kind of tricky to determine. Because on one hand, I'm like, ⁓ if we with this automation, people should be able to have more. Everybody should be able to have more because houses and everything should be able to be built way quicker. Buildings like all types of stuff should be able to be built way, way faster and way cheaper. Items houses and just more than you could imagine. At the time, this is going to be a question of, how much does this person get and how much does this person get and how much does this person get? And then that's kind of like, I feel like that's that's always the the part where it's like, even if we have more and everybody has more, people are gonna be wondering, well, how come my slice, like my slice is this, but his slice is that, or her slice is this. And I think that's gonna be the tricky part is, that's gonna be tricky. yeah, guys, it's been a crazy podcast, I feel like. I mean. Dre: Yeah, we cover everything, all the current events. There's a lot going on, Rodney: I mean, yeah, we covered everything, culture, war, and then technology. Dre: Yep. Yep. All right. We'll wrap it up. Brylan: Thank