Latest / Chasing Baseball Dreams / Episode #8: Stop The Pressure, Let Them Play | Coach Ballgame
Transcript
- Bobby Minor: All right, welcome to Chasing Baseball Dreams. I am excited. I say that every time, but I am excited today to ⁓ to chat with my guest. He's just I I just think a really cool guy. I've seen him around on social media. I know we know a lot of the same people. This is our first time ever actually connecting, but I'm joined by James Lowe, better known as Coach Ball Game. He is the career hit by pitch leader at Brown University. He was team captain, all Ivy League outfielder. He spent the last 20 years running youth baseball camps, literally all over. all over ⁓ probably all over not just all over the states. I'd imagine you do things even outside of the states. and I know your real your focus is really on on kids, I would say twelve and under, helping them really fall in love with the game, learn solid f solid fundamentals, and doing both of those things I think give them the greatest opportunity to not be one of the seventy five percent that quit by the age of fourteen. You are also the youth ambassador for the MLB ⁓ MLB's play ball program and I know that rule it tell if I'm wrong and this is this is where I'll shut up. Your mission I think is pretty simple. Just kind of replace the winning at all, you know, winning at all cost ⁓ pressure cooker that we see and just help kids like just fall in love with the game and have fun. Coach Ballgame: Yeah, well thanks for having me. Bobby, I appreciate you and ⁓ the message you're putting out there. Yeah, we've gotta educate The ⁓ 25 and olders on this is not life or death. Youth sports doesn't have to be ⁓ what you think it is, win at all costs, keeping up with the Joneses. No. ⁓ make the kid want to come back next year, ⁓ because our anxiety is low. ⁓ make them fall in love with the game ⁓ because we enjoy being there with them. And then when they get to be 15, 16, 17, they love the game. ⁓ They love you, and then we know what we have. We know what kind of athlete we have. Are they a football player, volleyball? Are they a swimmer? Are they a dancer? ⁓ what are they? But until then, play the long game. So I'm just injecting common sense into youth sports. I never would have thought it'd be novel, ⁓ and I'm sure you're finding the same thing as you do this podcast. It's a novelty to inject joy, character development, common sense into youth sports. And it's not just baseball, it's hockey, it's softball, soc it's all over the place. So ⁓ yeah here I am the Pied Piper of of fun, happy baseball, and I I feel like over the 22 years of coaching kids, it has evolved in the past few years to really educating the parents and the coaches. I coach the kids but I'm really talking to the moms and dads and that's probably my favorite part of the whole gig. Bobby Minor: Yeah, no doubt. That's good stuff. So over the past 22 years, like just shoot straight. What do you what's different now compared to when you first started? And what would you say? What's the single biggest thing that parents and coaches are doing today that kids in the nineties, ⁓ you know, kids, yeah, in the nineties, early two thousands, things that they didn't have to deal with. Coach Ballgame: Well, I I remember in the nineties it was ⁓ growing up in North Carolina, it was football from August to November, Thanksgiving. ⁓ then it was basketball. ⁓ till about March and then it was baseball through the end of July with high school ball, Legion ball, things like that. I never did a travel ball. ⁓ I I I'm not bashing it by any means. We'll get to that in a minute. But for me, I was a Great baseball player in college because I played basketball in high school, because I played football. I learned how to track fly balls ⁓ as a an outfielder in Providence, Rhode Island, but by playing free safety in high school. I was able to ⁓ use my quickness and ⁓ seeing the whole court in basketball. I used that in in baseball. So that's how it was. I know it's a lot different now, and there's ⁓ coaches out there that are stressed. to specialize but I've met many major leaguers along the way ⁓ coaches managers players ⁓ and none of them are saying specialize at a young age so ⁓ I I feel like parents didn't have to deal with that so much in the nineties and early two thousands. It really for some reason kicked in. it became a a money game. and you better be on the six U travel ball team now or you're gonna ⁓ be caught ⁓ behind when it gets to middle school and high school. ⁓ I don't believe in that whatsoever. I mean if you are an athlete ⁓ and you can hit a baseball, you can hit a seed to the opposite gap and you can and you can move. Mookie Bet's ⁓ his advice to youth sports parents teach them to move. if if you can move you'll be seen and and there will be a a coach in college or pro ball that says I see something there that's different. I can teach them ⁓ specifics on on that sport but ⁓ yeah that it I I don't bash travel ball whatsoever because I think it's a great space for the elite player, ⁓ but it is coach dependent. It's culture dependent. ⁓ if you've got a coach that is win at all costs and not allowing them to miss some practices because they're swimming or because they have a play. ⁓ i if you notice any red flags, then that's where I say run for the hills. When you're trying out for a travel ball team, ⁓ you're not trying out for them. They're auditioning for you. And if you notice you've got a coach that's got common sense and is mature and and has built a culture of positivity and long game thinking, then you're in good form. I say go get ⁓ but yeah, there is value in doing other things in your youth. ⁓ what are we trying to do? We trying to win ten, eleven, twelve year old trophies, or we trying to set them up for a great high school, college, adult life. So, again, how's that novel? ⁓ but it really is, and I'm here to remind everybody by interviewing a Paul Skeens or a Freddie Freeman with my MLB job, ⁓ Hey, just listen to them. I didn't say that. Mookie Betts did. So ⁓ Shohei's a great baseball player, ⁓ because he was a great swimmer, an elite swimmer growing up in Japan. Mike Trout said he doesn't play outfield in ⁓ the major leagues if he didn't play high school basketball and he was an all state basketball player in high school. So Bobby Minor: Mm-hmm. Coach Ballgame: Yeah, don't fall into the trap, parents. ⁓ But we're here to inject some common sense and I'm happy you're doing the same. Bobby Minor: No, I appreciate it. That's that's I mean, great insight, great wisdom there. And I I think, look, parents, if you're feeling pressured That your son has to play fall baseball or he's not guaranteed a spot in the spring. A, I would say it's just that's not a good place to be. But you have to understand if you don't play fall baseball, there are financial implications to the person that's trying to pressure you to play. Your son will not fall behind if you're doing other things, if you're swimming, you're playing football, playing basketball, just just being a kid and being athletic, he's not gonna fall behind. So, coach, you just mentioned some some pretty big names there. What's a what's one other kind of consistent theme? ⁓ ⁓ in in in the answers that you've gotten from from all these these current major league players, what's one other kind of consistent theme that you think is really important for parents to know? Coach Ballgame: I went to ⁓ Philadelphia for the All-Star game and I interviewed all the coaches and players and the the main theme there was ⁓ what's your advice to travel ball coaches? Because most of these coaches are parents and ⁓ the advice was to ⁓ Get over yourself and duh you know, the the your own ego of how many wins ⁓ and how many great players you have on your team, ⁓ get past that real quick because the amount of wins you have on that twelve year old travel ball team equates to absolutely nothing ⁓ down the road. So the ⁓ big fan of Paul Skeens and I asked him that question and he said, ⁓ well you know what When I got to college, I noticed something. All these kids that had played travel ball for the last eight years, they didn't know baseball. They didn't know how to ⁓ bunt. They didn't know how to take a secondary. ⁓ so find that coach that is prioritizing ⁓ knowledge of the game, scholar salutes of the game, as opposed to just ⁓ dropping the back shoulder, hitting bombs, throwing ninety-four, and winning a lot of games at that younger age. How about player development? ⁓ Another theme was building connection. ⁓ Find the coach who ⁓ prioritizes like a Dusty Baker. He was a savant of people. He I'm reading his book right now, and he was all about connecting with humans and hearts and the person. So find the coach who asks questions and really asks you, mom and dad, what is your plan? plan for for this kid this year? What are your ⁓ outlooks? I I'll I'll I'll try to accommodate as best I can. ⁓ and then that coach that's willing to communicate effectively and maturely ⁓ with parents you you've got a ⁓ if if you've got to call things out i if need be. You can't be talking behind people's back. You need a coach that's like hey I'm gonna make mistakes if you're upset let's have a cup of coffee and we'll talk about it. But we've got to model ⁓ maturity To these kiddos as best we can. So those were some of the themes that I heard. ⁓ and then Freddie Freeman, his kid, when he's watching him play, his kid always looks for a reaction from dad. And so he tries to ⁓ not react. Good, bad. ⁓ he's just there ⁓ and it is a model of of peace. W as he watches his kid do well, he watches his kid ⁓ fail. ⁓ he really tries to make his joy detached from the kids' results. So if I had to put it all in a nutshell, parents detach your joy, your your insecurities, your own ⁓ stuff, detach it from your kid. Let let them play. This is their journey. ⁓ ours was in the nineties. Bobby Minor: Yeah. That's good. That's good stuff there. And you made me think of something several years ago in a former life I was interviewing the men's golf coach at TCU and I know you're a golfer so you can appreciate this. And I'd asked him, ⁓ Coach Monegal, I said, Coach, when you're watching a high school golfer, what are you looking for? And he said, When I see him walk off the green, I don't want to be able to tell whether he just made birdie or bogey. And so you made me think of that because parents, when you're s when your son l or daughter looks at you, they shouldn't be able and nobody should be able to tell whether your son just struck out. Now, if he hits a bomb, be happy. Of of course, like be happy. But you know you know the point, like yeah, like it's you shouldn't it's not It doesn't have to be the roller coaster that you make it. ⁓ Coach Ballgame: That made me think of ⁓ college baseball coaches that I've talked to at I mean top ten schools and when they go recruit players, they're not looking for the three for four with two bombs. They're w watching to see how they react after failure. ⁓ how do they hustle their position after a strikeout? How do they respond after that wild pitch or ⁓ walking two guys in a row? ⁓ there you go. So yes, ⁓ a secondary thing that hit my brain if if somebody came, if you're a coach and somebody came from two states over and watched Bobby Minor: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Coach Ballgame: you run a practice ⁓ and didn't know you from Moses and couldn't tell who your kid was as as you coached that two hour practice, ⁓ you you're probably doing your job. So ⁓ that's another ⁓ form of just kinda taking all the anxiety off in the parking lot and and just being supportive. Bobby Minor: Yeah. Yeah, that's good stuff. So coach, I'm gonna go back to something you said, you said earlier, when you're when you're talking about when your kid's at a tryout, he's not you're not trying out for the coaches. The coaches are auditioning for you. So with with that in mind, what do you what are three questions ⁓ that you think parents should ask when when they're considering joining a program before they ever sign anything, before they ever swipe their card? Coach Ballgame: Yeah. And and to clarify, ⁓ I mean this is th we're talking club ball, travel ball where it's pay to play. Not not rec ball. Rec ball is a different ball game where, you know, engineer Bob and I mean I'm I'm I've been voluntoled to coach my ⁓ daughter's ⁓ ten year soccer team this fall. So I'm ⁓ I can relate to all of you like who it's been thirty five years since I played that game. ⁓ but I'm doing my best. ⁓ when it's Bobby Minor: Yeah. Right, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. Not literally this travel ball, travel ball. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Coach Ballgame: ⁓ travel ball you are you're I think you're looking for for just a quiet confidence in the coach, you know, as you watch them, just an ease, right? I mean what kind of Coaches ⁓ did you love growing up? Think about that. I loved a guy named Jimbo McDaniels where ⁓ there was never a consequence or a negative tone or a passive aggressive tone or a yell or a lap on the other side of a ⁓ mistake. ⁓ all I remember was his smile and his laugh, especially in the high leverage moments, the big moments. So you're looking for a coach that can command with a balance of ease. ⁓ if they have to use intimidation to get their point across to a kid, red flag. ⁓ so I would I I would look at that ⁓ big time. Look for the coach that praises loudly and constructively criticizes quietly and privately. If you're noticing any public shaming ⁓ out of the gates, I mean that is that that's all ⁓ based and stemming from insecurity ⁓ of that coach and look out for that. And then how ⁓ how are they able to kind of manage the different personalities and different skill levels, right? The Benny the Jet Rodriguez? ⁓ are they just all about that guy and paying no attention to smalls? ⁓ or are they able to meet each kid on their own playing field? The kid ⁓ with ADHD, how is he coaching them differently? ⁓ the kid that's super bashful and shy, the kid that's neurodivergent, ⁓ are they able to meet meet them on all of those specific playing fields. ⁓ that's huge. I'll add one more. When they're running a practice, is it does it move? Is it effective? Are they splitting the kids up into small groups and creating movement? Because ⁓ that's how kids learn by moving. no lectures, no lines, no laps, get them moving. ⁓ and then I I'm a big fan of the 2020 rule. ⁓ teach for 20 seconds and let them move for twenty minutes. So ⁓ those are some things to look out for. Bobby Minor: That's good stuff. You referenced a couple of players from the sandlot. I'm actually interviewing Squints ⁓ here in the next couple of weeks. So ⁓ all right, so yeah. So okay, so you you definitely mentioned some things that parents should look for. What are what are a couple of questions that parents should ask, you know, of that coach or organization director before they commit? Coach Ballgame: And a boy. Yeah. ⁓ what are your priorities? Are your priorities in winning trophies? ⁓ or is it long term development and come on. I I think we all know that every coach, especially the one that's all about the trophy, they're gonna say, ⁓ yeah, I'm I'm all about ⁓ creating a long form ⁓ development skills, the human. I wanna know what kind of adult they're gonna be. What kind of teacher are they gonna be down the road. ⁓ I mean th i i i y you gotta make sure you're ⁓ you're able to weave through the the B S if you know what I mean, and and and and have them prove it with their actions. But questions you can ⁓ kind of get to the bottom of and it might take time because actions speak louder than words, but you know, ⁓ my kid he he loves chess. And he's got a chess club on Wednesdays. Is he gonna have to sit out in games because he can't make that Wednesday batting practice? ⁓ he's got swim meets from time to time. In in the event that we miss ⁓ a practice or a game, ⁓ how do you approach that? And I do understand the value in if a kid shows up, then they get in the starting lineup. I understand that, and there can be some sort of pecking order with hey They're devoted, they're showing up early, they're staying late, they're here at every practice. Yes. But big picture I need a coach that is not Going to throw shade or think down upon this kid, my kid, if we do have other things in ⁓ in mind. Because again, that's got a lot of value. ⁓ we're trying to create great athletes and well-rounded people. ⁓ so ⁓ finding out if ⁓ if homework, schoolwork, other sports, does that have value in this coach's brain, or is it just ⁓ just a hard line? ⁓ right there. And then I think y you have to you have to try to find out what the schedule's going to be. I think you can sniff out pretty quickly, geez, we're gonna be in Utah ⁓ the first week of September, then Texas the second, and I think that's like three tournaments in a month. ⁓ y that's too much. Right? You also wanna sniff out how many practices ⁓ are being scheduled, right? ⁓ two sports at a time is really good. ⁓ I think of Christopher Walken. He always likes to be reading two different scripts at the same time. ⁓ you gotta diversify the portfolio. You gotta ⁓ be able to Bobby Minor: Mm. Coach Ballgame: Keep baseball fresh by playing a little bit of soccer, if you know what I mean. So ⁓ I think the schedule is very important. You can get a lot done in a pre-game practice or a little workout where you're doing some BP, some fielding. That's one of the practices before the game, and then one other practice a week, you're in good form right there. I think one tournament a month is more than enough ⁓ to give them ⁓ the experience they need. ⁓ but yeah, just chasing three. Bobby Minor: Yeah. Coach Ballgame: Four tournaments a month, four or five practices, which I hear a lot of per week. ⁓ red flags all the way. Just think. If you've got four practices and two games in a week, what's left? Well, there's no dinner at the dinner table. ⁓ you're not ⁓ meeting that math teacher for extra training on that math grade that's that's C minus at best. ⁓ you're not able to hang out with friends and you're not able to play a different sport. So ⁓ you gotta check the schedule ⁓ for sure and then as as much as you can what are those priorities that that coach ⁓ has Bobby Minor: That's good stuff. I I was hoping I thought you were gonna do a walk in impr ⁓ impersonation. Coach Ballgame: ⁓ d you know, I I didn't I I w I I didn't wanna come in too fast, ⁓ but that that guy, he ⁓ he would make a great coach, you know, because he he's he's just he's just interesting and he's musical. And I f I find if you're musical then ⁓ you make a great a great coach, especially for kids. That's that's my B minus walking. Bobby Minor: ⁓ That's all no, that's good. That's good. That's good. So ⁓ let's okay, one I'm gonna go back again to something else we were just talking about. Well, I know there are some parents out there that think that coaches that yell and scream that it's just hard coaching and they want their kid to be coached hard. There's too many soft coaches out there, soft players. What would you say to that parent that that equates screaming and yelling to that's just that's just hard coaching, that's good coaching. Coach Ballgame: Right. Well, I ⁓ started out as a rookie coach ⁓ that way. ⁓ I've I thought, ⁓ the only way I'm gonna get this kid to do what I want is if I raise my voice, if I yell. but I've found because of great mentors a much better path ⁓ is to do it quietly and privately. ⁓ the parent that thinks you need to publicly shame and yell to otherwise you're soft, ⁓ it's just not common sense. There is this world that people live in of either-or. Either you yell, you push ⁓ and you win a lot of hardware, or your soft participation trophy, beta beta, all that good stuff. ⁓ incorrect. What's either or? Nothing. It's all both and. It's both and it's and. I am very competitive. James Lowe love competes hard on the golf course. ⁓ and I enjoy winning and teaching the value of hard work and being a good teammate equates to wins. I like teaching that to kids. But not at the cost of ⁓ The the kid in right field who's ⁓ not getting any attention because he's not skilled, ⁓ not at the cost of our best pitcher, wearing out his shoulder because I'm throwing him out there for a hundred and fifty pitches a weekend because he's the best and he's gonna help us win. ⁓ the cons outweigh the pros when you do it that way. I asked Dave Roberts, manager of the Dodgers, how do you deal with ⁓ players that just aren't up to par with their attitude, ⁓ with ⁓ with the way they're treating other teammates. Then he says, Well, one, I'll never ⁓ I'll never berate publicly. ⁓ anytime I do something like that, that is just me showing off my insecurity. ⁓ I'm gonna do that privately. I'm gonna do that quietly. I've found the same thing to happen. ⁓ I remember being a rookie coach. I'm hitting ground balls to an eight year old. I'm twenty two, fresh out of college. The kid was not doing anything I asked didn't want to be there, ⁓ and I felt like a failure as a coach. So here comes the insecurities and here comes me yelling and screaming. ⁓ After the practice, my mentor, my mister Miyagi, his name's Sean Flicky, he put his arm around me and he said, Hey, ball game, you've got the energy of fifty camels, and s and you're like six men all in one. But that kid hates baseball now because of the way you spoke to him, because of your tone, because of your body language. ⁓ I said, Well he's he didn't want to be here, so maybe I did him a a a favor. And he's like What if that kid has no father at home? What if that kid is being bullied at school? ⁓ what life lessons is that kid gonna learn, ⁓ when you've just shoved them away from The place they need to be. That's the kid that needs to be here the most. so when he opened my eyes to ⁓ being a fisherman and going fishing and and not just awarding all the Benny the Jets and weeding out everybody else, no, find the smalls, find the squints, find the hambinos, bring them in as well, ⁓ because ultimately you are trying to set them up for life. ⁓ point point point point zero zero zero one. percent of anybody I've ever coached or anybody anybody ever will coach makes it to professional sports. But they all become fathers, mothers, servers of their community, teachers, firemen, nurses, ⁓ all of them. So what am we doing here? Are we are we doing the ⁓ let's just make a show He Otani, or are we gonna serve the entire world? And that made sense to me. That was a light bulb moment for me. and then talking to Dusty Baker, talking to Joe Madden, Dave Roberts, Tony LaRussa, all these great World Series winning managers and having Hearing them say the same thing, ⁓ that the louder I get, the less they hear me, ⁓ that made a lot of sense. So that's what I do. I whisper if I read. I'm gonna whisper. And that's when they hear me the loudest. I'm gonna praise loud because ⁓ that kid that's disrespectful or or not not showing up early, ⁓ they're they're crying for attention. ⁓ but praise loudly to feed that. But when you do need to talk to ⁓ it's gotta be quietly, privately. that that's a a much better path. So Yeah, don't be the either or parent. Be the both and where you notice a calm ⁓ when a kid strikes out three times. You notice unconditional positive regard when a kid walks four guys straight. ⁓ and and a coach that doesn't throw fits when these eight, nine, ten year olds make mistakes. You're gonna be able to notice right away if a coach sees the value in mistakes. Because it's not winning and losing, it's winning and learning. Every time there's a mistake, that's that's when we learn the most. So really look for that in a coach. hopefully that helps you out there, moms and dads. Bobby Minor: ⁓ absolutely, absolutely. Hey, quick golf question. So you mentioned being really competitive on the golf course. ⁓ do you have a do you have a war stick by UST shaft in your driver? Coach Ballgame: Ooh. I don't, but I've played many a round with Ian Kinsler, ⁓ and boy can he play the game of golf and he does and he he gave me one of those Warstick ⁓ clubs and I never missed a green with it, let me tell ya. It was pure Bobby Minor: Okay. All right. All right. so I know like I know on social media you talked a lot about toxic parenting in Little League. So we'll we'll shift gears back to Little League for a second. So what's the pattern that you're seeing? And then walk me through, you know, the dad who's actually hurting his son without knowing it. Coach Ballgame: Well, you know that helicopter parent, you you see them ⁓ at every ball field, at every sporting event, and that dad and it is mom's as well, they're just an eight year old ⁓ kid inside, just that was traumatized by something. ⁓ has a lot of anxiety fueled in everything they do and they're just the crying for help. So I've learned to treat that dad that is wringing their fingers against the fence and micromanaging every moment, and you know the car rides are miserable, you know the dinner table at home, all they're doing is talking about what the kid did wrong. You know that parent. I've learned to tread with empathy first and understand, okay, so there's a a ⁓ insecure, traumatized eight year old ⁓ just in a 35 year old man's body. secondly, y you've got to build trust with that parent. There's no way that insecure eight year old inside that adult body is gonna listen to you just fight fire with fire. Can't do that. there needs to be a discussion with the kid as well and let ⁓ know, hey, I l you know love everything I see from you. I've got a project ⁓ that I'm working on ⁓ and and just just bear bear with me on that one as far as your your dad goes. Go to coffee, ⁓ you know, have a glass of milk with that dad and just listen to them talk. ⁓ hear out their story. Maybe maybe you want to invite them in as an assistant coach, say, hey, you're always here, you're always energetic. We need that energy. at my wiffle ball batting station. Can you flip wiffle balls to these kids? That is a great way to channel that energy ⁓ of that helicopter parent. They're gonna notice how difficult it is to coach kids, one. And then their focus is much more on ⁓ the team as opposed to just watching their own kid, ⁓ that they might soften up a l soften up a little bit. ⁓ and then comes the truth bomb. Once the trust has been built, ⁓ and you know, bread has been broken and you've listened to their story, then you can say, Hey, I noticed something. And I only notice this because I used to do the same thing as a dad. I ⁓ I micromanaged, ⁓ I I lived through my kid. I wanted them to do everything right, ⁓ and I thought I was doing everything right. Meanwhile my kid hated baseball and started to ⁓ hate me, didn't want to hang out with me. The fishing trips, they didn't happen anymore, the camping trips, they weren't happening anymore. ⁓ he was much more solitude and by himself. I don't want that for you. and I'm gonna let you know that he performs, she performs way better when you're not here. And I don't want that. I want you here, but there is an ang anxiety within this kid when you're around. ⁓ are you willing to do something about it? And I'll give you three, four, five steps to help you. Now, ⁓ you as a volunteer coach, did you sign up for all that? Did you du you know spend twenty years Coaching, ⁓ are you a therapist? No. But if you're asking the question, that's my answer. And ⁓ I think you'll find a lot of gratitude. ⁓ you'll you'll you'll kind of thrive on the job, coaches, if you're ⁓ able to get somewhere with that situation. It's my favorite moment. ⁓ you know, I'm headed to the state of Washington this weekend. I'll go to the northeast, I'll go to the southeast, I'm going to the UK next year. Every city I go to there is that dad that comes up to me and says, Hey, I used to be that dad. but then I I came across your content. I apologize to my kid. he loves baseball a lot more, and our relationship is thriving. And then there are inevitable tears ⁓ from that dad in every city. It hits hard and it's so relatable and No parent is raising their hand to try and sabotage their own kid's sporting career. They're not doing that on purpose. I know that. So we as coaches, assistant coaches, other parents that notice it, ⁓ it's a bit of a slow burn. And ⁓ fighting fire with fire never works, but maybe over the course of a whole season, that ⁓ that's that's how I approach that. Bobby Minor: Yeah. No, that's good stuff. W what would you say? What do you think? Because this is I'm not saying every every parent everywhere dreams of their son playing baseball, at least in college. ⁓ but I I do think at some point that kind of becomes the goal for I mean, for a lot of parents out there. I mean, I've been around a long time, I've seen it, I've coached. So I mean, that's the goal. What's what's something that you would say to that parent of an eleven or twelve year old that they think actually matters that does not matter at all? That something that contributes to this, you know, kind of anxiety and things like that. Coach Ballgame: Yeah, I think the amount of hits and wins and playing time that that kid gets at eleven and twelve is gonna equate to their college ⁓ and pro life. I think that's a lie. I I think a lo that kid ha a lot of them haven't hit puberty yet. ⁓ and there's no there's no armpit hair yet. ⁓ and you don't know what you have until a kid's got a little bit ⁓ I'm talking for boys, a little bit of ⁓ mustache on the face, ⁓ a until they've matured into their teenage years. So, That is a lie. I would also say that ⁓ character doesn't matter. is an absolute lie. Character is maybe the only thing that matters. i is the the work ethic that they have, what kind of a teammate, how they can respond to failure. those are the things that only matter. at that moment. So ⁓ any t any any world or lens of talent greater than choices, ⁓ that is again BS. It's not true. It is a lie. So I think we all have the common sense gene and it's in our heart and we know when something is a little off. And any culture where a win is greater than the the life that that kid is gonna have as an adult, is is just wrong and so watch out for that. Bobby Minor: That's good stuff. What okay, so like obviously you have a baseball background, I have a baseball background. It's different for our kids. You know what I mean? Like my son, every you know, every day he wanted to do something. We're in the backyard playing catch, hitting the you know, heavy balls, whatever. What are a couple of things that a parent, mom or dad can do with their kid at home to help him get, you know, fun, extra work in for how what what are a couple of things that those parents can do that don't have a baseball background? Coach Ballgame: Yep. So ⁓ get get some form of a wiffle ball and a wiffle bat, and maybe that's a foam ball, ⁓ or a tennis ball. ⁓ what I use a lot of are these ⁓ quick ball bats. ⁓ that are are are a little bit firmer than a wiffle ball bat but ⁓ there's they're not a real bat and then a phone ball and I say hey knock on some neighbors doors and let's get a little sandlot game going. That is a great way to do it. It's how I did it as a kid ⁓ where you you don't have to worry about safety. It's not a real bat, it's not a real ball, ⁓ but they're still playing the game. They're hanging out with each other, learning a lot of social skills and they're off their devices. ⁓ outdoors, ⁓ it's it's all all good stuff. And then ⁓ as far as around the house, like with a tennis ball, you can do so much. ⁓ you can throw a ball up against a wall and practice your catching. Throw a ball up against a wall and work on your fielding. ⁓ there are plenty of YouTube videos out there, mine included. I I've done thousands of videos on things you can do around the house on my social media, YouTube and my coaching courses, ⁓ where you don't have to know a thing about baseball. Have the kid watch those, watch them w ⁓ with them. ⁓ maybe you can learn a thing or two from those videos and then say, Hey, go try that in the backyard. But yeah, I I I had two older brothers, but they were much older, so I had to be creative in the backyard and don't just do baseball. I had a basketball goal, I had a horseshoe pit, my dad built a swing set and a big green wall where I could hit tennis balls with a tennis racket. Like have them play all the different sports, it all helps. ⁓ I promise you that. So ⁓ yeah, ⁓ you don't need a real glove, you don't need a real ball, you don't need a real bat, you can still really learn a lot. Bobby Minor: That's good stuff. That's good. So I know you do like you do character clinics, you have the Sandlot Tour, but I mean everything's designed to rebuild the love for the game. What are what are some common themes that you might see in in elite travel ball players that have been playing you know since the age of six that show up to your your clinics and camps? What are some common themes that you that you see that where you say like man like if something doesn't change fast, this kid's not gonna be playing in a couple of years? Coach Ballgame: Well, I mean I I think the one that I look forward to the most is the too cool for school. And I see a lot of that with eleven and twelve year olds and I'll ask ⁓ you know, you you're my oldest kids at at this clinic. ⁓ every town I go to I notice a pattern. The oldest kids, they don't try their best. They think trying hard is is not cool. ⁓ w anybody got an answer for that? Why is that? And you'll get a couple eleven or twelve year olds say, ⁓ they they think they're above that. ⁓ and I say, Yes. But you know who's not above that? Do you know who tries their best? Mookie Betts. Bryce Harper, Shohei Otani. They try their best. Not only on the field, but in the dugout, cheering for their teammates before the games, off days. They're working hard to become a better teammate to help their team. So the too cool for school is the one thing I notice. And yeah, a lot of times those are the kids that have the two. $500 bats in their bag. They've got the swag, you know, they've they they've met every Savannah Banana player. and those are the ones that that might think, ⁓ I'm above all this trying their hardest. I look forward to them because they actually do have a shot. They can make a high school team. And beyond that, who knows? ⁓ but I tell them there comes a point you're gonna show up on a baseball field. And you're not going to be the best player. You're not going to be the second best player. You're going to be the seventh best talented player on that field. But the way you move, your body language, the way you hustle, the kind of teammate you are, the respect you had for your coaches, that matters so much. And look around. Look in those bleachers. Look ahead. Look at me. Your future high school coach, your future college coach might be right here, right now. taking mental notes. And those types of people never forget a kid that mails it in. They also never forget a kid that tries their best. So I'm passionate about that population. So ⁓ the too cool for school i is a biggie. I also get the the kid in blue jeans and flannel shirt that's never played baseball. ⁓ and I'm a big fan of inviting them in and letting them know, hey, you're 12 years old, you've never played Bobby Minor: Mm. Coach Ballgame: This kid's played their whole life. How can we get Benny the Jet and Smalls together? How can Benny the Jet teach Smalls how to play? How can Smalls teach Benny the Jet to be a little more humble and hard working? those are beautiful moments. So as coaches, I I didn't used to look forward to the disruptive, the disrespectful player. I always thought they were ⁓ a nuisance and it bothered me. I've learned to Embrace it, enjoy it. ⁓ and and that took a lot of time but I a and patience, but I'm there and I look forward to the challenge. So yeah, that that's what I got about that. Bobby Minor: No, good stuff. So what would you say to the parents out there of ⁓ even an eight year old that they're spending money every week sending their eight year old to hitting lessons, pitching lessons? When do you when do you think lessons where do you think lessons fit into the equation and actually provide real value? When is it overkill? When is it too much? Coach Ballgame: Yeah, I I ⁓ paid the bills and put food on the table with private lessons for f twelve years. A lot of lessons were behind a McDonald's using a floodlight. there is I and I think there's value in the private lesson. I would much rather have a kid ⁓ play one game a week. and have a private instructor teaching them ⁓ personalized skills that they need to become better. Once a week lesson, one practice or game a week. I'd much rather have that. ⁓ where they also have the option to play different sports in that moment. They can do different things around school as opposed to four games every week, three practices every week, ⁓ where they're just slogging. No. I think there's a lot more productivity in a half hour or hour lesson where somebody who's knowledgeable sees why they're not hitting the ball, sees why they're not throwing it to a target and can really work that. My daughter has ⁓ has improved so much in her singing by just meeting thirty minutes once a week with a pro. ⁓ so if it's more than once a week, hmm, you kinda wanna ⁓ check in because then that coach might be more about making a few bucks than the productivity and keeping the light alive, keeping the fire alive for that kid. But a once a week lesson ⁓ I think has a lot of value. I'd much rather I I I think th the kid's gonna get way more out of that than just playing a bunch of games. Bobby Minor: Yeah. Okay. That's good stuff. So you've built pretty much built your whole movement around fun and connection instead of things like rankings and winnings. But most kids still quit. So what does the parent of a 13-year-old do right now if he wants his son to actually make it past fourteen? Coach Ballgame: Yeah, you you ⁓ create a two way street and you have a conversation and you ask them questions. Hey, how we doing kid? Do you love this game? Do you still love it? What do you love about it? What do you not like about it? And here's a really good one. What kind of sports dad, what kind of sports mom am I? How am I doing? ⁓ do you feel good in in those big moments ⁓ with me around? I I've never done this before. ⁓ how am I doing? That is a great conversation to have. ⁓ if you're the coach in the third base box, ⁓ how am I doing there? If you're the parent in the bleachers, ⁓ create a two-way street where they ⁓ are empowered to ⁓ start the conversation, so to speak, and and and talk ⁓ about what they love and and don't love. But ⁓ if I feel like if we want it. ⁓ they're gonna sniff it out and they're gonna kinda wanna do the opposite. So whether you gotta be a great actor, ⁓ or you've gotta ⁓ meet with a therapist to figure out your own deal, you gotta let them walk. You gotta let them walk their journey and you gotta let them ⁓ hit some speed bumps along the way and and figure it out on their own. So just just be curious, ⁓ have conversations that are two-way streets. I think that's a great way to approach it. And if they love it, it will be very clear. ⁓ they are gonna be asking you to go play catch in the backyard daily. ⁓ They're gonna be asking you to go kick that soccer ball with them all the time. So ⁓ ⁓ they'll let you know. Bobby Minor: That's good stuff. ⁓ at what age, by what age? Let's let's say, you know, a kid says that's his he wants to play baseball in college, he wants to play in the MLB or whatever. By what age does a parent need to see their son being the primary driver of of this dream versus them? Because I see a lot of parents, they don't want, they don't want, they don't want to They don't want to acknowledge it, but the reality is they want it more for their son than he wants it for themselves. So what age would you say, like look, if your son's not I'm not saying you don't ever have to encourage him or anything, but ⁓ by what age would you say if your kid's not the one like initiating most of the activity, you know, it it's it it's probably not a good situation. Coach Ballgame: Yeah, I I'm I'm I'm late in the game, ⁓ but ⁓ obviously high school and I I would I would think when they start driving a car at the age of sixteen, that's kinda when they can start driving the the future of their life. That's how I look at it. ⁓ again, you're you're waiting to see what What size of an athlete do we have? What kind of an athlete do we have? There's some late bloomers out there. ⁓ but if you notice a sixteen-year-old driving to school and they never show any interest in that early AM workout, that pre-practice batting practice, they don't have conversations or or discuss the game. Then there there's a discussion that you have with them. Do you love this? If not, what do you love? Let's find something that you do love. ⁓ we're not just gonna sit on our phone and and scroll all day long as a sixteen-year-old. We're gonna get out and do some things. ⁓ but yeah, I I I think sixteen's a pretty good age. That is about the time I had to narrow it down from three sports to two, just because I I it was tough overlapping basketball with football and baseball. And basketball is my first love and that did take a sacrifice. But I knew by sophomore year high school, ⁓ I'm not gonna make that varsity team if I'm three weeks late. So ⁓ that was a moment that that I said, okay, I think baseball's gonna get me to college. So I'm gonna still play basketball, but not on the high school team. Loved football And that didn't interfere, so I went from a three sport to a two sport athlete. ⁓ but yeah, ⁓ by sixteen you kinda have an idea of what might get you ⁓ to a college, ⁓ w whether that's D one, D two, D three, and then we can start to have some serious conversations. Bobby Minor: All right, good stuff. All right. So I want to do something. I try to do this with everybody. It is what I call in and out. Four rapid fire questions, coach. Just fifteen to twenty second answers, nuggets of wisdom for the parents out there. So I want to jump into that. So it's time for some in and out with Coach Ball Game. All right, first question, Coach. Your nine-year-old gets cut from an elite travel team. What does that actually mean about his future? Coach Ballgame: ⁓ man, that means ⁓ it it that is a that's not a step back. That's not a stepping stone, that is a launching pad. ⁓ and and this is where you can talk about Michael Jordan not making that varsity team. This is where you tell him the story of Daniel Nava. If you don't know the story, look it up. but ⁓ those are the Those are the moments, the big moments in a kid's life when they wanted something very bad, they did not get their way, and then they grieve, and then they see that batting tea in the backyard, and that badding tea is just waiting for them. ⁓ encourage them to ⁓ hey, if you love this thing, Then that batting tea is waiting for you. And it's gonna sit there all day. ⁓ but ⁓ those those are opportunities. I never look at them as backslides, they are launching pads forward if the kid loves it. If they don't love it and they got cut ⁓ and it feels like ⁓ like a good thing, well, let's find something that they do love. But I've always looked at a ⁓ a sh a door shutting as an opportunity. Ooh, how about the the side door. Hmm, how about the window? Let's crawl through that. And if the kid loves it, right, if they've got that ⁓ that that vigor for that sport, then they'll find that that back window. Bobby Minor: Alright, good stuff. So, what would you say to the parent out there that's always hopping from team to team, thinking the grass is greener on the other side? Coach Ballgame: Huh, I would just say take a deep breath and ⁓ and check in i am I making this about me? Is this my journey or is it the kids' journey? and maybe you're ⁓ for eight on the the coaches auditions and it it's just been toxic, toxic, toxic. ⁓ but check in with yourself and say, Hey, what what coach? is gonna make my kid a really awesome father one day. Ask that question, go there. Bobby Minor: Good stuff. All right, third question. ⁓ if you could tell parents one thing that would stop them from running their kids' love for baseball, what is it? Coach Ballgame: ⁓ stress. ⁓ Parent anxiety is the killer of youth sports. ⁓ the kids are so intuitive and they feel and smell all of our ⁓ stress. So ⁓ allow them to fail. Breathe. ⁓ I would say that. Yes, yes, yes. Bobby Minor: All right, good stuff. All right, last question. Here's a slow roller. And I know you're an outfielder, so you don't really get slow rollers, but I pulled you in on I'm giving you some reps at second today. So here's a slow roller. All right, so you've got nicknames for every kid that you coach. ⁓ why is that important? Like parents don't have nicknames for their kids. Why is it important for you to ⁓ to give kids nicknames? Coach Ballgame: Well, everybody thinks I give the kid the nickname. No. I ask them questions and I say, Hey, what do you love? ⁓ what do you love to eat? What do you love to do? And based off of that, they come up with their own nickname. I just memorize it. So, ⁓ nicknames are fun, it creates a fun culture. ⁓ but there's a lot of trust built when you as an adult are curious. about a kid and their life. What do they like to eat for breakfast? What do they like to do in their off time? ⁓ what are some hobbies you have? Ooh, you like going to Disneyland? Let's call ya Disneyland. There's your nickname. ⁓ they laugh. They feel confident and comfortable around you ⁓ because you care about them as a human. ⁓ so it and then memorizing those nicknames it really puffs up their chest. ⁓ man, I'm important. ⁓ so I I prioritize that. ⁓ it is number one. You gotta have a nickname at at any gig that I have. ⁓ but super valuable as far as building that trust. Bobby Minor: ⁓ best nickname that you've ever you've ever seen out there. Coach Ballgame: Eternal Desert Boy. And this kid, ⁓ the first day I met him, he wanted to be Dodger Boy. He loved the Dodgers, wanted to be Dodger Boy. But he comes up to me at the second practice. He said, I want to change my nickname, Coach Ball Game. I said, Okay, what do you got? Eternal Desert Boy. And it's always stuck with me as the best of all time. ⁓ second and third place might go Llama Shades. And Lloyd Christmas. ⁓ big fan whatever parent was allowing them to watch Dumb and Dumber, I gotta give it to ⁓ Well done. ⁓ so the top three there. Bobby Minor: Yeah. I think it's funny my my twenty one year old who would just got dropped off at school this weekend, getting ready to begin his fourth year playing baseball in college. I want to say when he was like two years old, he would get his oldest older sister's VHS tape of Dumb and Dumber, pop it in the VCR and sit there and watch it. So bad parenting. Yeah, I don't Yeah. Coach Ballgame: Teach ⁓ young. Teach ⁓ young. Bobby Minor: So Els in and out w with Coach Ballgame. All right, Coach, I have one more question for you and then I'll I'll let you kind of ⁓ just leave us with some parting wisdom. But so I be how was Coach Ballgame born? Coach Ballgame: Well, I That's a great question. And I was Jimmy Ballgame in college 'cause I used to run through walls and do things like that. ⁓ and then when I started coaching here in Southern California, it was with a teammate from Brown, so we just called me coach ball game. ⁓ but I learned in my twenties what my voice was, my tone, the culture I wanted to create. And then in my thirties and forties I've built this coach ball game, ⁓ and it was all ⁓ it stemmed from my wife who was like, You love all of these different things. You love art, you love music, you love acting, you love entertaining, you love baseball. Why don't you put it all together into this coach ballgame sandwich ⁓ and tour the country with it? So that's how the culture and the idea of ball game was really born. And then the national tour, ⁓ that was all born from a family giving us a grant, ⁓ giving us a a sponsorship basically saying, hey, we love what you do and we want you to do this thing all across the world. ⁓ that opened the door for us ⁓ to to go to different states and and do this thing. So yeah. And it's never ⁓ not learning and evolving. We're always evolving, but ⁓ we're in a good spot right now. Bobby Minor: That's awesome. That's funny. ⁓ you know, my wife for five years had been telling me to launch Chasing Baseball Dreams, and I finally listened last November. So maybe our wives see something that we don't that we don't necessarily see. So Coach Ballgame: And you know, it wasn't an ultimatum, but it was kind of an ultimatum like, Hey, you know, you're substitute teaching, you're waiting tables, you got nine odd jobs. I think you can put everything into this thing. What do you say? And ⁓ I needed that shove. Bobby Minor: Yeah, that's good stuff. So so coach, okay, for the parent out there that wants to follow you on social media that's not already following you, ⁓ or they want to learn more about your your camps and your clinics and everything, where's the best way to connect with you? Coach Ballgame: Yeah, I guess the main hub is is my website, Coach Ballgame dot com. It's got everything. My in-person ⁓ camps and sandlots that I do, and it's got my online course for coaching, Coach Ball Game University, ⁓ where I talk about the psychology of coaching all sports. I've got a whole ⁓ curriculum on baseball and softball skills for the eight and unders, how to teach those skills. We've got ⁓ spotlight courses on kids that are afraid of getting hit by a pitch. ⁓ the kid that has ADHD or autism and we're always bringing out new curriculum on that platform as well. And then my social medias are at Coach Ball Game. most of my followers are on Instagram, ⁓ then Facebook and then TikTok and YouTube. But you can find it all coachballgame.com Bobby Minor: Good stuff. So coach, that kid that's afraid of getting hit, you put him in the cage and you just start beaning him with with with p with pitches? Coach Ballgame: Right, watermelons. Throw watermelons at ⁓ and laugh at ⁓ when they ⁓ w you know, when they cry or squeal. Yeah, no. Do the opposite of that. it ⁓ and me, you know, I'm the career hit by pitch owner. Brown University. I get it. I understand. But yeah, the ⁓ the faster you try to fix that, mom and dad, the longer it's gonna take. So, ⁓ yeah. Bobby Minor: Okay. Yeah. Coach Ballgame: That that that's the most common email I get and and I just say, you know, let they have to be the one to make that decision. Bobby Minor: All right, good stuff. All right, coach, I appreciate you. Coach Ballgame: Hey, appreciate you. Thanks, Bobby.