Latest / Beyond The Horizon / Mega Edition: The Heated Debate Surrounding The Murder Scene In Moscow (8/26/26)

Transcript

Mega Edition: The Heated Debate Surrounding The Murder Scene In Moscow (8/26/26) · Beyond The Horizon

0:01
Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the program. In
0:04
Speaker 1: today's episode, we're going to talk a little bit more
0:07
Speaker 1: about the scheduled demolition of the house at eleven twenty
0:11
Speaker 1: two King Rhoad, and we're also going to talk about
0:14
Speaker 1: the Gonsalvees family and the reaction to the fact that
0:17
Speaker 1: this house is getting torn down before a trial even starts. Now,
0:23
Speaker 1: I've said from the very beginning that this is a
0:26
Speaker 1: bad idea, and I still think it's a bad idea.
0:29
Speaker 1: Why are you tearing down this house before there is
0:32
Speaker 1: any trial. We know that in the past people have
0:36
Speaker 1: went out as far as jury's go to these murder
0:39
Speaker 1: scenes to take a look at what happened for themselves.
0:42
Speaker 1: But all of a sudden, we're in such a rush
0:44
Speaker 1: here to tear this house down, and I just don't
0:47
Speaker 1: get it. Look, I understand the concept behind why they
0:52
Speaker 1: want to tear it down. They don't want a bunch
0:54
Speaker 1: of lookie lose, they don't want a bunch of true
0:57
Speaker 1: crime tourism in Moscow. I understand that completely. But the
1:03
Speaker 1: only thing that should matter at this point is justice
1:06
Speaker 1: and anything or anyone who stands as a roadblock to
1:10
Speaker 1: that occurring, Well, those people or those entities need to
1:14
Speaker 1: get out of the way. And if I was the judge,
1:17
Speaker 1: I didn't post some kind of court injunction here, and
1:20
Speaker 1: I would order them not to destroy this house because
1:24
Speaker 1: I don't want this to come into play later on, right,
1:27
Speaker 1: I don't want this to be a big deal when
1:29
Speaker 1: we're talking about an appeal. If Brian Kolberger gets convicted,
1:34
Speaker 1: what we want to go all the way back to
1:35
Speaker 1: square one and start this all over again. Because look,
1:39
Speaker 1: when that house is gone, it's gone. It's not coming
1:41
Speaker 1: back again, right, So what's the point in tearing it down?
1:46
Speaker 1: Especially given the fact that the gon saw this family
1:48
Speaker 1: at the very least doesn't want that to occur, and
1:52
Speaker 1: considering it's their daughter who was murdered, I would think
1:55
Speaker 1: that the university would be a little bit more compassionate
1:58
Speaker 1: towards what the family might want done with this house,
2:02
Speaker 1: because there's no legal basis, let's remember, for it to
2:05
Speaker 1: be torn down. The whole reason they want to tear
2:07
Speaker 1: it down is because they don't want it to turn
2:10
Speaker 1: into a Torus hotspot for all the knuckleheads that run
2:13
Speaker 1: around going to places like this. So that's their whole
2:17
Speaker 1: entire theory behind why they want to get this house
2:20
Speaker 1: torn down, and again I understand that completely. I just
2:24
Speaker 1: want to reiterate that fact, but not until the child
2:27
Speaker 1: is over. Today we have two articles talking about this topic.
2:31
Speaker 1: The first one is from kr EM two and the
2:35
Speaker 1: headline family of Idaho murder victim expresses frustration with decision
2:40
Speaker 1: to tear down home as the suspects defense team gains
2:43
Speaker 1: access to the home. The family of Klee Gon Solves
2:46
Speaker 1: say they feel their opinion on what to do with
2:49
Speaker 1: the home is not a priority, and I feel that.
2:53
Speaker 1: Can you imagine if it was your daughter who was
2:55
Speaker 1: murdered and then you feel like you have no say
2:58
Speaker 1: so in what's going on. And for the Gonsalves family,
3:02
Speaker 1: that's been pretty much their gripe the whole time. They
3:05
Speaker 1: feel like they've been left out in the cold, and
3:07
Speaker 1: they haven't had the proper lines of communication open with
3:11
Speaker 1: the investigators throughout this whole entire thing. So that has
3:15
Speaker 1: not changed. And remember that's what initiated them going out
3:19
Speaker 1: and getting their own lawyer. They wanted to be represented
3:22
Speaker 1: throughout the process, and unfortunately they still feel that they're
3:27
Speaker 1: not being represented. This article was authored by Selena van heining.
3:34
Speaker 1: The home wherefore University of Idaho students were murdered last year,
3:39
Speaker 1: will be demolished at the end of the month. According
3:41
Speaker 1: to the University, the house on King Road in Moscow
3:45
Speaker 1: will be demolished starting Thursday, December twenty eighth, at seven am. Additionally,
3:50
Speaker 1: the defense team for the suspect, Brian Kolberger, will have
3:53
Speaker 1: access to the house this week, so they're there right
3:56
Speaker 1: now doing whatever it is they're going to do, recreating
4:00
Speaker 1: the crime scene, spatter reports, all of that stuff. And
4:05
Speaker 1: you wouldn't expect Dan Taylor to do anything less, right,
4:08
Speaker 1: But why are we going to tear the house down?
4:11
Speaker 1: What's the point? What if something pops up later on?
4:14
Speaker 1: Sure we'll have the three D model, we'll have the recreation,
4:17
Speaker 1: but the house itself that's gonna be gone. And from
4:20
Speaker 1: where I'm sitting, not that it's worth much, but from
4:23
Speaker 1: where I'm sitting, that doesn't sound like a very good idea.
4:26
Speaker 1: The decision to tear down the house was made to
4:29
Speaker 1: decrease further impact on other students living in the neighborhood.
4:33
Speaker 1: It is the grim reminder of a heinous act that
4:35
Speaker 1: took place there. University of Idaho President Scott Green said,
4:39
Speaker 1: while we appreciate the emotional connection some family members of
4:43
Speaker 1: the victims may have to this house, it is time
4:46
Speaker 1: for its removal and to allow the collective healing of
4:49
Speaker 1: our community to continue. I would think that that healing
4:52
Speaker 1: would come with justice in this case, right, you know,
4:56
Speaker 1: somebody getting convicted, that's when the healing starts. Tearing down
5:00
Speaker 1: the house well kind of just looks like something that
5:04
Speaker 1: you're doing just to do it. I don't think that
5:06
Speaker 1: there's any good reason that anyone's put forward, at least yet,
5:11
Speaker 1: that would lead me to believe that tearing this house
5:13
Speaker 1: down is a good idea. And when we're talking about
5:16
Speaker 1: the legal process still working its way through the system,
5:20
Speaker 1: I don't think talking about how we're going to heal
5:22
Speaker 1: as a community is even the proper way to go
5:26
Speaker 1: about it, Considering, like I said earlier, the healing should
5:29
Speaker 1: start when the justice is applied. Coburger's defense team will
5:35
Speaker 1: be at the house taking pictures and measurements of the
5:37
Speaker 1: area on Thursday and Friday. Once they are done, the
5:41
Speaker 1: university will start preparing for the demolition. Demolition is scheduled
5:45
Speaker 1: to begin on December twenty eighth and is expected to
5:48
Speaker 1: last several days. This house is a daily reminder, said
5:52
Speaker 1: Jody Walker, the communications director for the university. We'll never forget.
5:58
Speaker 1: We can't forget, but we can, we can come together,
6:01
Speaker 1: and we can begin to move into the next phase.
6:06
Speaker 1: The family of Kailee Gonsalvis, one of the victims, has
6:09
Speaker 1: previously shared their reservations about demolishing the home. On Friday,
6:14
Speaker 1: the Gonsalvist lawyer Shannon Gray released the following statement, let
6:18
Speaker 1: us ask this isn't it better to have the King
6:22
Speaker 1: Road House and not need it than need the house
6:25
Speaker 1: and not have it. That has been our question to
6:28
Speaker 1: the prosecution and the University of Idaho for the entire time.
6:31
Speaker 1: The demo of the King House has been an issue.
6:35
Speaker 1: But why is it even up for discussion. This is
6:37
Speaker 1: one of the most horrific crimes in the history of Idaho,
6:40
Speaker 1: and the University of Idaho wants to destroy one of
6:43
Speaker 1: the most critical pieces of evidence in the case. And
6:47
Speaker 1: it also is important to make note that there is
6:49
Speaker 1: now a demolition date before there is even a child
6:52
Speaker 1: date set. This alone speaks volumes. It is obvious from
6:57
Speaker 1: the two recent visits to the house by both the
7:00
Speaker 1: prosecution and the defense that there is still evidentiary value
7:04
Speaker 1: in having the King Road House still standing. There may
7:08
Speaker 1: be additional discovery by either party that prompts one side
7:12
Speaker 1: or the other to go back to the scene of
7:14
Speaker 1: the crime. There has always been a dialogue about the
7:17
Speaker 1: three d imaging or they are building a model to
7:20
Speaker 1: replicate the home, et cetera. First and foremost, what a
7:23
Speaker 1: waste of state money and resources. And secondly, nothing replaces
7:27
Speaker 1: the real thing. Jurors are notoriously unpredictable, and they tend
7:32
Speaker 1: to make decisions on a variety of facts and circumstances.
7:36
Speaker 1: It would be foolish for us to try and foresee
7:38
Speaker 1: what they will want or need to make a just
7:41
Speaker 1: verdict in this case. The family has stressed tirelessly to
7:45
Speaker 1: the prosecution and to the University of Idaho the importance
7:49
Speaker 1: evidentiary and emotionally that the King Road House carries, but
7:53
Speaker 1: nobody seems to care enough. It's like screaming into a void.
7:57
Speaker 1: Nobody is listening, and everyone tells you how sorry they
8:00
Speaker 1: are for the decision, but the family's opinion isn't a priority.
8:05
Speaker 1: Victims' families have a voice, and they should be heard,
8:08
Speaker 1: and they should be listened to and I agree a
8:11
Speaker 1: bazillion times with everything he said. I think this is
8:14
Speaker 1: the wrong idea from the university's perspective, and not just
8:18
Speaker 1: so much on the you know, the right thing to
8:21
Speaker 1: do angle, but from the whole legal angle, right, why
8:26
Speaker 1: would you want to get rid of the crime scene?
8:28
Speaker 1: I just don't understand that. It really just makes no
8:31
Speaker 1: sense to me, and maybe I'm missing something. So if
8:33
Speaker 1: I am, please feel free to shoot me an email
8:36
Speaker 1: and educate my dumbass. Boise based criminal defense attorney David
8:40
Speaker 1: Leroy said jurys will sometimes want to walk through a space,
8:44
Speaker 1: especially one is large and complex as the house on
8:48
Speaker 1: King Road. In this case, however, Leroy said, both sides
8:51
Speaker 1: have had time and technology to recreate the structure. Because
8:56
Speaker 1: we'll have diagrams and perhaps three dimensional recreationations, lots of
9:00
Speaker 1: photographs and lots of videos. I would not expect the
9:04
Speaker 1: jerry to be lost in the special relations in the
9:06
Speaker 1: home and understanding the crime scene. He explained, Well, okay,
9:11
Speaker 1: but we can't say that that's not going to occur.
9:15
Speaker 1: And if the house is not available, it's not available.
9:18
Speaker 1: There's no going back and putting those pieces together. Once
9:21
Speaker 1: that house is demolished. What Bob the Builder's showing up
9:23
Speaker 1: in his little overall outfit with his little toolbox negative
9:27
Speaker 1: not gonna happen. So the idea behind knocking this house
9:31
Speaker 1: down in the first place is ridiculous. And speaking on
9:35
Speaker 1: that point was Jennifer Kofendaffer in a new interview that
9:39
Speaker 1: she gave. So let's bounce over to this next article
9:43
Speaker 1: from The Messenger and let's see what's going on over here.
9:47
Speaker 1: Headline Brian Kohberger may benefit from demolishing of Idaho murder house.
9:53
Speaker 1: Former FBI agent says, don't want the jurors in there
9:57
Speaker 1: one hundred percent. I know if I was on the defense,
10:00
Speaker 1: I'd be doing backflips. I'd be so happy that if
10:03
Speaker 1: I had a tail, I'd be wagging it at this news.
10:07
Speaker 1: The fact that the house is going to be destroyed
10:09
Speaker 1: and the jurors might not get a shot to go
10:11
Speaker 1: in there and take a look. Oh yeah, I'd be
10:13
Speaker 1: happy if I was the defense. This article was authored
10:17
Speaker 1: by Jenna Sundel, a former FBI agent, warned that Brian
10:22
Speaker 1: Cooberger may benefit from the upcoming demolition of the house
10:26
Speaker 1: where he allegedly murdered for University of Idaho students in
10:30
Speaker 1: November of twenty twenty two. The university plans to demolish
10:35
Speaker 1: the residence on December twenty eighth, and former FBI special
10:39
Speaker 1: agent Jennifer Kofendaffer said that an important piece of evidence
10:43
Speaker 1: may be lost if the plans move forward. In a
10:46
Speaker 1: Saturday interview with News Nation and Look, you don't have
10:49
Speaker 1: to be an ex FBI agent to figure all this out, right,
10:53
Speaker 1: just somebody with a little bit of common sense. There's
10:56
Speaker 1: a lot to be obtained by going into the house
10:59
Speaker 1: for jurors. Evly, Kofendaffer said, Listen, nothing is going to
11:03
Speaker 1: change in terms of how long it would take to
11:06
Speaker 1: get from the second floor to the third floor, what
11:08
Speaker 1: it would sound like between the rooms of Dylan Mortenson
11:11
Speaker 1: and where Xana and Ethan were killed. Also angles, what
11:16
Speaker 1: angle did Mortenson have of Brian Kolberger when he walked out.
11:20
Speaker 1: All of that is going to be lost with the
11:22
Speaker 1: loss of this house, and all of that is valid.
11:25
Speaker 1: All of that stuff goes away the second this house
11:27
Speaker 1: is gone, and I really hope that it doesn't come
11:29
Speaker 1: back to bite the prosecution when all's said and done.
11:33
Speaker 1: Coberger is accused of murdering Kaylee Gonsalves, Madison Mogan, Ethan Chapin,
11:38
Speaker 1: and Xana Kernodle. On November thirteenth, twenty twenty two. The
11:42
Speaker 1: four were killed in their off campus home, and two roommates,
11:45
Speaker 1: Dylan Mortenson and Bethany Funk, survived the attack. Kofen Daffer
11:50
Speaker 1: explained how the demolition of the house could benefit the defense.
11:54
Speaker 1: I think the defense isn't objecting because they don't want
11:57
Speaker 1: the jurors in there to see the scene, even oh,
12:00
Speaker 1: it's cleaned up to the degree it could be, Kofendaffer said.
12:04
Speaker 1: She added that in some other high profile cases, including
12:08
Speaker 1: the trial of Alex Murda, viewing the scene helped the
12:10
Speaker 1: jurors reach a verdict. Criminal defense attorney Dante Mills disagreed
12:15
Speaker 1: with Kofendaffer and saw no issue with the demolition. Generally,
12:19
Speaker 1: and most times in trials, jurors do not visit the
12:22
Speaker 1: scene of the crime. Mills said, Also, though in most
12:26
Speaker 1: crimes the scene isn't destroyed either, is it two sides
12:29
Speaker 1: to every coin. No trial date has been set for Coburger,
12:33
Speaker 1: more than a year after he allegedly committed the murders.
12:36
Speaker 1: He was charged with four counts of murder and one
12:39
Speaker 1: count of burglary. A not guilty plea was entered on
12:43
Speaker 1: Colberger's behalf after he declined to enter a plea in May.
12:46
Speaker 1: He faces the death penalty if convicted. He's being held
12:50
Speaker 1: without bail in the Leata County Jail. So things are moving, folks.
12:55
Speaker 1: They might be moving slow, but things are certainly moving.
12:58
Speaker 1: And like usual, whenever we have some new information, we'll
13:02
Speaker 1: definitely share it because there has been a bit of
13:06
Speaker 1: a pause, if you will, an information coming out of
13:09
Speaker 1: the case over the last week or so. But as
13:11
Speaker 1: this new information comes out, we'll definitely get it added
13:14
Speaker 1: and we'll keep it moving right along, all right, folks.
13:17
Speaker 1: That's going to do it for this one. All of
13:19
Speaker 1: the information that goes with this episode can be found
13:23
Speaker 1: in the description box. S's up, everyone, and welcome back
13:26
Speaker 1: to the program. The conversation about the house at eleven
13:32
Speaker 1: twenty two King Road still rages on. Now. There are
13:37
Speaker 1: obviously some forces at work who want this house to
13:41
Speaker 1: be torn down as quickly as possible, and they want
13:45
Speaker 1: it torn down because they don't want it to become
13:48
Speaker 1: a hotspot for true crime tourists. So what they want
13:52
Speaker 1: to do is get rid of this house and begin
13:56
Speaker 1: all over again, whether it's putting up a garden or
13:59
Speaker 1: a memore of some sort. They feel, meaning the university,
14:03
Speaker 1: that they're better served by knocking this house down and
14:07
Speaker 1: just moving on. However, there are some things to consider, like,
14:11
Speaker 1: you know, a murder trial that's on the way, and
14:15
Speaker 1: I don't know about you, but I don't trust the
14:17
Speaker 1: government or the defense enough to think that they have
14:21
Speaker 1: done a thorough of enough job yet as far as
14:23
Speaker 1: the crime scene goes, when it comes to a jury
14:27
Speaker 1: and what they want to see. We just saw recently
14:30
Speaker 1: in the Murdaw trial the jury go back out to
14:33
Speaker 1: Mozelle to take a look for themselves at the crime scene.
14:36
Speaker 1: Who's to say that the jury in this case wouldn't
14:39
Speaker 1: want to do the same thing. So I think that
14:42
Speaker 1: the house being torn down is a bit of a
14:44
Speaker 1: knee jerk reaction right now. And I think that the
14:47
Speaker 1: judge should file some sort of injunction, some sort of
14:51
Speaker 1: order that puts a stop to this and lets the
14:54
Speaker 1: house stay as it is until this trial is over,
14:58
Speaker 1: because if there is something that pops up later on
15:02
Speaker 1: down the road as far as this house and evidence, well,
15:07
Speaker 1: once the house is gone. There's no going back, right.
15:10
Speaker 1: I mean, there'll be like some three de reconstructions and
15:12
Speaker 1: some renderings and stuff like that, but physically going back
15:15
Speaker 1: to that house will obviously be impossible if the house
15:19
Speaker 1: is torn down. So I think that they should hold
15:22
Speaker 1: off on tearing this house down, and I think that
15:25
Speaker 1: they should wait a little while until this trial is over.
15:28
Speaker 1: That way, in case something pops up. This bit of evidence,
15:31
Speaker 1: this place where these murders occurred, is available to the investigators,
15:36
Speaker 1: the defense, and everybody else involved in this case. And
15:41
Speaker 1: I think there are a few things that have to
15:43
Speaker 1: be considered when we're talking about tearing down this house,
15:46
Speaker 1: like the preservation of evidence. If the house is a
15:50
Speaker 1: crime scene and contains critical evidence related to the murder investigation,
15:54
Speaker 1: it may be necessary to preserve the property until the
15:57
Speaker 1: trial is concluded. The evidence elected from the crime scene
16:01
Speaker 1: can be crucial in determining the truth and achieving justice.
16:05
Speaker 1: In such cases, tearing down the house before the trial
16:08
Speaker 1: could potentially compromise the investigation. Point Number two. Property rights
16:14
Speaker 1: and legal considerations. Property owners generally have the right to
16:19
Speaker 1: decide the fate of their property, but there may be
16:21
Speaker 1: legal restrictions in certain jurisdictions. It is essential to consult
16:26
Speaker 1: local laws and regulations to understand any limitations on altering
16:31
Speaker 1: or demolishing a property involved in an ongoing criminal investigation.
16:37
Speaker 1: Number three, Public perception and impact. Tearing down a house
16:41
Speaker 1: where a murder occurred can have a significant impact on
16:44
Speaker 1: the community and the perception of justice. Some people believe
16:48
Speaker 1: that preserving the property until the trial concludes respects the
16:52
Speaker 1: memory of the victim and upholds the integrity of the
16:56
Speaker 1: legal process. Others may argue that the presence of such
16:59
Speaker 1: proper could negatively affect property values or cause emotional distress
17:05
Speaker 1: to neighbors. Four practical considerations. The condition of the property,
17:10
Speaker 1: the cost of maintaining it, and the duration of the
17:13
Speaker 1: legal proceedings are practical factors to consider. If the house
17:17
Speaker 1: is in disrepair or opposed as a safety hazard, it
17:21
Speaker 1: might be more reasonable to demolish it, ensuring the safety
17:25
Speaker 1: and well being of the community. Ultimately, the decision on
17:29
Speaker 1: whether to tear down a house where a murder occurred
17:32
Speaker 1: before the trial should be made based on careful assessment
17:35
Speaker 1: of all of these factors, and it may involve input
17:38
Speaker 1: from legal authorities, law enforcement, and relevant stakeholders and of course,
17:43
Speaker 1: there are more reasons to support or not support this
17:47
Speaker 1: house being torn down, but I think that those four
17:49
Speaker 1: questions are some of the biggest questions when we're talking
17:52
Speaker 1: about this house being demolished or not. And for me,
17:56
Speaker 1: I think that it's prudent to wait a little while
17:59
Speaker 1: until this ends and then from there do whatever it
18:02
Speaker 1: is you want to do. But if there comes a
18:04
Speaker 1: point where one side or the other wants to go
18:07
Speaker 1: back to this house and it's gone demolished, then what
18:10
Speaker 1: Today we have an article from the Idaho Statesman and
18:13
Speaker 1: the headline should University of Idaho demolish the house where
18:17
Speaker 1: four students were killed? The author of this article is
18:21
Speaker 1: the editorial board. University of Idaho officials have several very
18:27
Speaker 1: good reasons to demolish the house where four students were killed,
18:31
Speaker 1: and I think that's definitely correct. When all is said
18:34
Speaker 1: and done, this house should be torn down. Who the
18:36
Speaker 1: hell would want to live here? Right? But I think
18:38
Speaker 1: just waiting a little while is a good idea. Brian
18:41
Speaker 1: Coberger is accused of stabbing to death for University of
18:45
Speaker 1: Idaho students seniors Kaylee Gonsalvez and Madison Mogan, and junior
18:51
Speaker 1: Xana Kernodle and freshman Ethan Chapin Coberger twenty eight, a
18:56
Speaker 1: former graduate student at Washington State University, is charged with
19:00
Speaker 1: four counts of first degree murder and one count of
19:03
Speaker 1: felony burglary. The state intends to seek the death penalty
19:07
Speaker 1: if he is convicted. His trial is scheduled to begin
19:10
Speaker 1: October second, and with it being a death penalty case,
19:13
Speaker 1: I think that knocks it into another level of importance
19:17
Speaker 1: to have all of the evidence available, including the crime scene.
19:21
Speaker 1: If the jurors want to go and visit and see
19:24
Speaker 1: what the crime scene looks like for themselves, why would
19:27
Speaker 1: we take that away from the jury. Don't we want
19:30
Speaker 1: to have a fair look at what's going on here,
19:32
Speaker 1: a real fair assessment, and make sure that Brian Kolberger
19:36
Speaker 1: gets a real fair trial. Isn't that the whole point here,
19:39
Speaker 1: to make sure that everything's on the up and up
19:42
Speaker 1: and all of the evidence is explored to do that.
19:46
Speaker 1: Don't you think having the crime scene accessible to investigators
19:50
Speaker 1: and the jury would be a good idea. The owner
19:53
Speaker 1: of the house where it happened donated the house to
19:56
Speaker 1: the University of Idaho, which plans to demolish the house
20:00
Speaker 1: and turn the site into a memorial. University of Idaho
20:04
Speaker 1: officials understandably want to demolish the house this summer before
20:08
Speaker 1: students returned to campus on August twenty first. That's a
20:11
Speaker 1: good reason alone. It certainly would help the communities healing
20:15
Speaker 1: to remove such a stark reminder of this horrible event. Further,
20:20
Speaker 1: the University of Idaho carries the burden of keeping the
20:23
Speaker 1: house secure twenty four hours a day, seven days a week,
20:27
Speaker 1: protecting it from ghastly murder scene. Lookie Lose, I mean, really,
20:33
Speaker 1: you're like going on a vacation to go and look
20:34
Speaker 1: at a scene of a crime. What is wrong with you?
20:37
Speaker 1: This shit is horrendous. This isn't what you sit around and,
20:40
Speaker 1: you know, sip your wine to and eat some Danish
20:43
Speaker 1: and joke about this shit is horrendous that we're talking
20:46
Speaker 1: about here. These are real people who were murdered. And
20:49
Speaker 1: if you're going to one of these sites as some
20:51
Speaker 1: kind of like tourism, you need to check yourself. Now.
20:54
Speaker 1: If you're going there as an investigator or something like that,
20:57
Speaker 1: all right, I get it, but going there to have
20:59
Speaker 1: a look, I mean, what's wrong with you? Both the
21:02
Speaker 1: prosecution and the defense in Coburger's case agree that the
21:06
Speaker 1: house can be torn down. Still, it seems unreasonable to
21:10
Speaker 1: destroy the crime scene before the trial. What if there's
21:14
Speaker 1: still evidence that could be collected. What if either the
21:16
Speaker 1: defense or the prosecution lawyers in Coburger's trial decide it
21:20
Speaker 1: would be beneficial to have the jury visit the crime scene.
21:24
Speaker 1: And that's what I was saying earlier. It's important to
21:26
Speaker 1: have that available in case the jury wants to go
21:29
Speaker 1: and check it out. Terms and conditions applying SEA website
21:32
Speaker 1: for details. Jurors last year visited the crime scene in
21:36
Speaker 1: the infamous Alec murda, a double murder trial in South Carolina.
21:41
Speaker 1: Jury visits are rare, according to an article in The
21:44
Speaker 1: New York Times, but they have been known to happen
21:47
Speaker 1: in several high profile cases, such as the sentencing trial
21:51
Speaker 1: of the school shooter in Parkland, Florida, the trial of
21:54
Speaker 1: a Louisville, Kentucky, police officer who was charged over the
21:58
Speaker 1: fatal Briona Taylor, and the oj Simpson murder trial in
22:02
Speaker 1: Los Angeles. And considering the stakes in this case and
22:06
Speaker 1: the publicity, I would think that it falls right in
22:09
Speaker 1: the same kind of realm you don't want to get
22:11
Speaker 1: rid of any evidence here and shoot yourself in the
22:14
Speaker 1: foot for either side. So I don't know why the
22:17
Speaker 1: defense or the prosecution would be okay with this. If
22:20
Speaker 1: I was Brian Kolberger and I thought I was innocent,
22:23
Speaker 1: I would demand that my lawyer does everything in his
22:26
Speaker 1: or her power to make sure that this house doesn't
22:28
Speaker 1: get demolished. I want to make sure that I have
22:31
Speaker 1: all the evidence possible if I'm an innocent man that
22:34
Speaker 1: could help free me. So if I'm innocent, I want
22:37
Speaker 1: that house to stand direct and I want investigators, the jury,
22:41
Speaker 1: and everybody else to have access to it. Demolishing the
22:46
Speaker 1: house where the University of Idaho students were killed takes
22:49
Speaker 1: away that option. There's no going back once the house
22:52
Speaker 1: is destroyed. It would be better to be safe now
22:55
Speaker 1: than sorry later on. Most compelling for us is the
22:59
Speaker 1: desire of the victims' families to keep the house standing.
23:03
Speaker 1: According to an article by Idaho Statesman reporter Kevin Fixler,
23:07
Speaker 1: some of the victim's families opposed tearing down the house
23:10
Speaker 1: before Coberger's trial. The home itself has enormous evidentiary value,
23:16
Speaker 1: as well as being the largest and one of the
23:18
Speaker 1: most important pieces of evidence in the case, Shannon Gray,
23:22
Speaker 1: attorney for the Gonsales family, wrote in an email to
23:25
Speaker 1: The Statesman. Gray said members of the Mogan and Kernodle
23:29
Speaker 1: families also opposed the destruction of the home. After the trial,
23:34
Speaker 1: Gray also said, the university is disregarding family's requests. Look,
23:39
Speaker 1: that's not good. These kids were just killed. Do the
23:42
Speaker 1: right thing here and let this place stand until the
23:46
Speaker 1: trial ends, and then bring the reckon ball to it.
23:49
Speaker 1: The university asked for the family's opinions on the demolition
23:53
Speaker 1: and then proceeded to ignore those opinions and pursue their
23:57
Speaker 1: own self interests, Gray wrote. According to Gray, a University
24:01
Speaker 1: of Idaho lawyer gave family members one day to provide
24:05
Speaker 1: a legal argument for preserving the house. We sympathize with
24:09
Speaker 1: the University of Idaho officials desire to level the house
24:13
Speaker 1: and put this as far behind them as they can
24:16
Speaker 1: as the new semester begins, and we believe they're genuine
24:20
Speaker 1: in feeling that leaving the house standing impedes the community's healing. However,
24:25
Speaker 1: there's something terribly callous about demanding a legal rationale from
24:30
Speaker 1: the families forestalling the demolition. That kind of response impedes
24:34
Speaker 1: the family's healing. In this case, the families needs outweigh
24:38
Speaker 1: the university's desire to move on and to RaSE the reminders,
24:43
Speaker 1: and that's where I fall. I think that that's a
24:46
Speaker 1: pretty good article that gets right to the point of it,
24:48
Speaker 1: and I think that the house obviously should continue to
24:52
Speaker 1: stand until after the trial. All right, folks, that's going
24:56
Speaker 1: to do it for this one. All of the information
24:58
Speaker 1: that goes with the episode can be found in the
25:01
Speaker 1: description box, which what's up, everyone, and welcome back to
25:05
Speaker 1: the program. Over the past few days, we've heard that
25:09
Speaker 1: the University of Idaho is planning on demolishing the house
25:14
Speaker 1: on December twenty eighth, and as you can imagine, that
25:18
Speaker 1: news isn't sitting very well with some of the family
25:21
Speaker 1: members of the murdered victims. So today we're going to
25:25
Speaker 1: talk a little bit more about the demolition of the
25:27
Speaker 1: house and how the family members feel about that house
25:31
Speaker 1: being demolished. And to do that, we have two articles.
25:35
Speaker 1: The first one is from The Independent and the headline
25:38
Speaker 1: Idaho murder victims family slam's decision to demolish home. This
25:43
Speaker 1: article was authored by Amelia Neath the family of one
25:49
Speaker 1: of the slain University of Idaho students has condemned the
25:52
Speaker 1: decision to demolish the house where the murders took place
25:55
Speaker 1: before suspect Brian Kohberger goes on trial. Kelly Gansaw, Madison Mogan,
26:01
Speaker 1: Xana Kernodle, and two other female students lived in the
26:05
Speaker 1: property at eleven twenty two King Road, just a few
26:08
Speaker 1: minutes walk from the college campus in Moscow. Just to
26:12
Speaker 1: be clear, at the time, Kaylee wasn't living there, but
26:15
Speaker 1: she had lived there previously. But on November thirteenth, twenty
26:19
Speaker 1: twenty two, the home turned into a horrific crime scene
26:22
Speaker 1: when Gonsalves, Mogan, Kernodle, and Kernodle's boyfriend Ethan Chapin were
26:27
Speaker 1: brutally stabbed to death inside. Last week, the University of Idaho,
26:32
Speaker 1: which owns the property, announced that the property will now
26:35
Speaker 1: be torn down, with a scheduled demolition date of December
26:39
Speaker 1: twenty eighth. And again, just to reiterate, I think it's
26:43
Speaker 1: a terrible idea to tear this house down. There's just
26:46
Speaker 1: no need for it at this point. Later on down
26:49
Speaker 1: the road, of course, go ahead, tear it down. Do
26:51
Speaker 1: whatever you want to do, but why even take the chance.
26:54
Speaker 1: Imagine if this house comes back to haunt the prosecution
26:59
Speaker 1: later on down the road. Code you want to talk
27:01
Speaker 1: about bad press, You want to talk about optics? Boy,
27:04
Speaker 1: oh boy, that'll be it. In a statement, the university
27:07
Speaker 1: said that the house only stands as a grim reminder
27:10
Speaker 1: of the quadruple homicide, but some of the victims' families
27:14
Speaker 1: have slammed the decision, questioning why the university wants to
27:17
Speaker 1: destroy one of the most critical pieces of evidence in
27:21
Speaker 1: the case. Gonsolves family and said in a statement to
27:24
Speaker 1: News Nation that they believe the house could carry a
27:28
Speaker 1: lot of evidentiary importance to the case, but feel that
27:31
Speaker 1: they're pleased for it to stay standing until the murder
27:35
Speaker 1: trial are being ignored. I totally understand how the Gonsalbass
27:39
Speaker 1: are feeling. I know that if it was my kid,
27:42
Speaker 1: I'd be freaking out. I'd want every bit of evidence
27:46
Speaker 1: that's possibly available to be available come time for trial.
27:50
Speaker 1: What we've never seen a prosecution flup things up before.
27:54
Speaker 1: We've never seen a prosecution not know what they're doing.
27:57
Speaker 1: Of course we have. And then you add to that
28:00
Speaker 1: the fact that the Gonsavas family hasn't really had the
28:03
Speaker 1: strongest relationship with the prosecutors and the investigators in Moscow,
28:08
Speaker 1: And yeah, I'm sure that they're not very confident or
28:11
Speaker 1: comfortable with what's going down. And obviously I wouldn't even
28:16
Speaker 1: begin to try and put myself in their shoes, but
28:19
Speaker 1: I would think that in a similar situation, i'd be
28:22
Speaker 1: demanding the same things that the Gonsalvast family are demanding.
28:26
Speaker 1: It's not like they're saying that this house should never
28:28
Speaker 1: be torn down. They're just saying, why don't we pump
28:31
Speaker 1: the brakes a little bit here, and why don't we
28:33
Speaker 1: wait until after the trial? And I think that is
28:37
Speaker 1: a very legitimate request for the families to make, considering
28:41
Speaker 1: they're hoping that there's a conviction at the end of
28:43
Speaker 1: all of this. The Gonsalvest family said, it's like screaming
28:47
Speaker 1: into a void. Nobody is listening, and everyone tells you
28:51
Speaker 1: how sorry they are for the decision, but the family's
28:54
Speaker 1: opinion isn't a priority. Mister Coburger, who has been in
28:58
Speaker 1: custody since December thirtieth of twenty twenty two, was originally
29:02
Speaker 1: slated to go on trial this October, but the trial
29:05
Speaker 1: was postponed indefinitely. The prosecution and the defense have both
29:10
Speaker 1: visited the murder scene ahead of its demolition, and there
29:13
Speaker 1: is the possibility that three D imaging could be used
29:16
Speaker 1: to recreate the crime scene at trial. Now, look, I
29:19
Speaker 1: get it. If there was a situation where the crime
29:22
Speaker 1: scene had to go away, yeah, three D it up
29:26
Speaker 1: and let's get all of the information that we possibly
29:28
Speaker 1: can have. And it's good that they did that here
29:31
Speaker 1: as well. But why get rid of the house? I
29:34
Speaker 1: think that is a bit counterproductive. No, if you're going
29:37
Speaker 1: to make a three D model of the place, why
29:39
Speaker 1: not just leave the place standing at the same time,
29:42
Speaker 1: make your three D model and then go from there.
29:45
Speaker 1: But Gonsava's loved ones say they can reconcile. Why authorities
29:49
Speaker 1: wouldn't leave the real thing standing until the trial? Yet,
29:52
Speaker 1: not all of the victims' families are against the demolition.
29:56
Speaker 1: Chapin's mother, Stacy Chapin, told News Nation that the family
30:00
Speaker 1: supports the decision to tear the house down. We're supportive
30:04
Speaker 1: of the decision to take the King Street house for
30:06
Speaker 1: the good of the university, it's students, including our own kids,
30:10
Speaker 1: and the community of Moscow, she said. And this is
30:14
Speaker 1: exactly what you should expect from this kind of situation.
30:17
Speaker 1: Not everybody's gonna feel the same. And the shape and
30:20
Speaker 1: family they've moved differently this whole entire time. They've spent
30:25
Speaker 1: their time not focusing so much on the trial or
30:28
Speaker 1: on Brian Coberger, but they've spent their time focusing on
30:32
Speaker 1: Ethan's memory, and for them, that's how they're healing. But
30:35
Speaker 1: for the Gonsalvas family, they're healing a different way, and
30:39
Speaker 1: their path towards getting better or healing or dealing with
30:43
Speaker 1: their new normal, whatever you want to call it, leads
30:45
Speaker 1: directly to Brian Coberger getting convicted. So it's not one
30:50
Speaker 1: is right and the other is wrong. But I think
30:52
Speaker 1: it's more of an example that shows us how people
30:55
Speaker 1: grieve differently. The demolition is currently scheduled for just three
30:59
Speaker 1: days after Christmas and two days before the one year
31:02
Speaker 1: anniversary of the Coburger arrest. It's a grim reminder of
31:07
Speaker 1: the heinous act that took place there, University of Idaho
31:10
Speaker 1: President Scott Green said in a statement announcing the demolition.
31:14
Speaker 1: While we appreciate the emotional connection some family members of
31:18
Speaker 1: the victims may have to the house it's time for
31:21
Speaker 1: its removal and to allow the collective healing of our
31:24
Speaker 1: community to continue. Well, I don't know if it's so
31:27
Speaker 1: much an emotional connection. I think it's more so fear
31:30
Speaker 1: that evidence might be destroyed. And in situations like this,
31:35
Speaker 1: if it's your loved one, your daughter, I bet you
31:38
Speaker 1: think a little bit different, mister Scott Green. Mister Green
31:41
Speaker 1: added that the FBI had created a visual aid by
31:44
Speaker 1: scanning the house, which could be used as evidence in
31:47
Speaker 1: the trial. Okay, that's fine, but I think that's kind
31:51
Speaker 1: of redundant. No, if the house is still standing, why
31:54
Speaker 1: do we need all this other stuff? And then you're
31:56
Speaker 1: going to rely on the other evidence that you collected,
31:59
Speaker 1: as far as as the three D renderings and models
32:02
Speaker 1: that you built, why not just have the real McCoy,
32:05
Speaker 1: Why do you want a model? Why do you want,
32:07
Speaker 1: you know, something that's not really the place where these
32:11
Speaker 1: crimes took place, especially considering you have the actual crime
32:15
Speaker 1: scene right there at your fingertips. The property, which was
32:19
Speaker 1: donated to the school by the owner following the murders,
32:23
Speaker 1: was previously planned to be demolished, but the move was
32:26
Speaker 1: blocked in July. Demolition plans were then moved until at
32:30
Speaker 1: least October. Mister Koberger, a criminal Justice PhD student at
32:35
Speaker 1: Washington State University, was charged with the four murders after
32:39
Speaker 1: his DNA was found on a knife sheath that the
32:42
Speaker 1: killer left behind at the scene. According to the Affidavid,
32:45
Speaker 1: at his arraignment, he refused ender a plea, meaning a
32:49
Speaker 1: not guilty plea was entered on his behalf. He also
32:52
Speaker 1: waived his right to a speedy trial, meaning that his
32:55
Speaker 1: original trial date was scrapped and no new date has
32:58
Speaker 1: yet been set. And moving on to our next article.
33:01
Speaker 1: This is from Fox News and the headline Brian Coberger trial.
33:06
Speaker 1: Mother of Idaho murder victim fights to keep King Road
33:09
Speaker 1: house intact. This article was authored by Michael Ruiz. As
33:15
Speaker 1: the University of Idaho prepares to knock down the rental
33:18
Speaker 1: home where four students were murdered last year, one of
33:21
Speaker 1: the victim's mothers is fighting to keep it standing until
33:25
Speaker 1: the suspect goes to trial. Experts have told Fox News
33:28
Speaker 1: Digital that the university's bid to demolish the building is
33:32
Speaker 1: a decision that prioritizes the school's aim to move on
33:36
Speaker 1: above the potential impact. A firsthand look at the crime
33:39
Speaker 1: scene could have on jurors in the case against suspect
33:43
Speaker 1: Brian Coberger. And I think that that's a spot on
33:46
Speaker 1: analysis of what's going on here. And it certainly seems
33:50
Speaker 1: like the university is trying to move at this rapid
33:53
Speaker 1: pace because they just want to put this whole thing
33:56
Speaker 1: behind them. And I completely understand that, and I am
34:00
Speaker 1: eyes with that. Who wouldn't want to put this behind them? Right?
34:03
Speaker 1: This is a terrible, terrible situation, But I think that
34:07
Speaker 1: justice trumps everything else, and if destroying this crime scene
34:11
Speaker 1: might get in the way of justice being served, I
34:14
Speaker 1: just can't, for the life of me, understand why they'd
34:17
Speaker 1: push for this to happen so quickly. Karen Northington, whose
34:21
Speaker 1: twenty year old daughter Xana Kernodle, was stabbed to death
34:24
Speaker 1: alongside three friends in the early morning hours of November thirteenth,
34:28
Speaker 1: twenty twenty two, shared a change dot org petition on Sunday.
34:33
Speaker 1: The demolition is set to begin on December twenty eighth,
34:36
Speaker 1: less than a year after Coburger's arrest. Tearing down the
34:40
Speaker 1: house before jurors have had a chance to walk through
34:42
Speaker 1: it could potentially hinder a fair path to justice. According
34:46
Speaker 1: to the petition's organizer, it's critical that all evidence remains
34:50
Speaker 1: intact until after this trial continues, he wrote. Police arrested
34:55
Speaker 1: Coburger on December thirtieth, weeks after the murders, after he
35:00
Speaker 1: took a cross country trip with his dad back to
35:02
Speaker 1: his family home in Pennsylvania. At the time of the slayings,
35:06
Speaker 1: he was studying for a pH d in criminology at
35:09
Speaker 1: Washington State University, about a ten mile drive from the
35:12
Speaker 1: King Road house. Coburger allegedly entered the three story house
35:16
Speaker 1: around four a m. On the upper level, he is
35:19
Speaker 1: accused of stabbing Kaylee gonsalvis in Madison Mogan, twenty one
35:23
Speaker 1: year old best friends, who were both found in the
35:25
Speaker 1: latter's bedroom, along with a k bar knife sheath. The
35:28
Speaker 1: prosecutors alleged had Coburger's DNA on the snap. On the
35:33
Speaker 1: second level, he is accused of killing Kernodle and her
35:35
Speaker 1: boyfriend Ethan Chapin, also twenty A surviving housemate overheard the
35:40
Speaker 1: sounds of the struggle from her second floor bedroom and
35:43
Speaker 1: told police that chief rozen shock as she saw a
35:46
Speaker 1: mass man with bushy eyebrows who left through the rear
35:49
Speaker 1: sliding door. Another survivor was in the building's lowest level.
35:54
Speaker 1: The landlord donated the property to the University of Idaho
35:57
Speaker 1: earlier this year, and the school announced plan to raise
36:00
Speaker 1: it and build a memorial garden, which, according to the Chapins,
36:05
Speaker 1: is being designed by UI architecture students. Well that's good, right,
36:10
Speaker 1: keep it in house. Let the architecture students do their
36:12
Speaker 1: thing and memorialize their former classmates. I don't see why
36:18
Speaker 1: the house needs to be demolished before the trial, said
36:20
Speaker 1: Joseph ga Cologne, a retired NYPD sargeant and adjunct professor
36:25
Speaker 1: at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice. I understand
36:29
Speaker 1: the school wants to move on, but walking the jury
36:32
Speaker 1: through the crime scene when you have it is important
36:34
Speaker 1: to give them a perspective that photos just can't. The
36:38
Speaker 1: FBI and the defense investigators have returned to the house
36:41
Speaker 1: multiple times to take pictures and map the layout, but
36:45
Speaker 1: experts say pictures and videos may not have the same
36:48
Speaker 1: effect on the jurors. And I think because of that
36:52
Speaker 1: fact that they should really think about not demolishing this house.
36:56
Speaker 1: But it looks like that ship is selled, and it
36:58
Speaker 1: looks like the university is going to go forward with
37:00
Speaker 1: these plans to demolish the house on December twenty eighth.
37:04
Speaker 1: So all I could say is I hope that that
37:07
Speaker 1: decision doesn't come back to bite them, the family members,
37:11
Speaker 1: and society as a whole, right in the rear end,
37:14
Speaker 1: because if it does, it is going to be a
37:17
Speaker 1: hellstorm like you have never seen. All Right, folks, that's
37:21
Speaker 1: gonna do it for this one. All of the information
37:23
Speaker 1: that goes with this episode can be found in the
37:27
Speaker 1: description box.