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Putting Your Neck Out for Clients with John Llodra | Financial Planner Search · Financial Planner Search

• Gregory Wilnau: John, thank you so much for coming on the podcast today. How are you, sir? John Llodra, CFP(R): Hi Gregory, I'm great. Thank you. And thank you so much for having me on your podcast. I'm really excited to do this with you. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah, my pleasure. I'm looking forward to to it as well. to get started, why don't you tell us a little bit about kind of how you got here and what you do? Maybe you could take a moment to tell us about your practice and and what you specialize in. John Llodra, CFP(R): Okay. Yeah, so my firm is New Harbor Financial Group. We're a nationwide. We have clients nationwide. We're registered investment advisor. And we basically do hands-on money management for for folks, individuals and families. We don't do work primarily with large institutions. Our our work is for real people, folks that have generally worked hard to save assets for their retirement or other purposes, and they don't get a do-over. They look for someone to be a helpful partner and truly stewarding their assets. And you know, it's understandable that many folks have skepticism about financial markets. We bring that healthy skepticism on their behalf. the fact of the matter, there are times where markets are very much risky and and the cliche in in the industry is that it's time in the market that matters. So in other words, just just blindly trust the markets. That's not good enough good enough for us. We think there are times where a more tactical risk managed approach is really important, especially for those folks who already have achieved a level of financial security and their biggest risk is is screwing that up, if I could use that terminology. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. Okay. I love that. I love w the what you specialize in. So maybe you could tell take a moment to just tell us a little bit more about kind of what inspired you to do this. What's your story? How did you get started? John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah, well I'll start by saying you know, as a high schooler or college student, I had I had no idea what I wanted to be when I grew up. I kind of thought I did. I studied in engineering. I went to engineering at C studied in engineering at Cornell, and I jumped around between different disciplines. I started off thinking I wanted to be an electrical engineer, and then I actually thought I wanted to be an orthopedic surgeon. I was unfortunate to have blown out my ACL playing high school football. So I had some experience Gregory Wilnau: Mm. John Llodra, CFP(R): on the operating table with an orthopedic surgeon. So I pivoted it into what I thought was going to be mechanical engineering on the way to medical school. Long story short, I didn't follow that path. And I studied a discipline of engineering called operations research. And really what it is, it's mathematical engineering math models applied to all kinds of business situations. And the math of Wall Street, if you will, is highly rooted in the kind of discipline that I studied. But I when I graduated college, the job market was kind of tough. And during my college years, I I had a summer job at the local electric utility in the in the city I grew up in. So I had some experience in the utility and energy industry, and so happened that that was able to allow me to land a job in the consulting space in the energy industry. So the first decade of my career, I was actually in the energy industry. And it kind of flamed out to to to use a blunt term when the final company I worked for was a company called Enron, which many might know was a company that spectacularly bank went bankrupt, one of the largest bankruptcy incorporated. Yep. And Gregory Wilnau: Never never heard of it. No. John Llodra, CFP(R): it was a a you know, it was a really you see many folks know the story of Enron. What many folks don't know is what it felt like to be an employee there. And I can tell you there were a lot of really good ethical people there, many of whom lost their their life savings because of what happened in the fraud of that company. My group was acquired in bankruptcy by a large investment bank, UBS Investment Bank. I was kept on as a key employee for about a year. And then they kind of scaled that way back. So I was given an opportunity to really take a step back and figure out what I wanted to do to do with the rest of my life. I had built up some stature in that industry and very well could have had a very productive and lucrative career continuing on that path. But something in my soul told me I I needed to do something different. I wanted to do something where I could really do good for people on a human-to-human level. And I took a step back. I had a severance that allowed me to kind of, you know, take some time to be deliberate. And I read a book called Do What You Are. And it's a book that overlays kind of personality assessments with kind of different career types. And among the, you know, list of careers that this book said, hey, I should think about was that of a personal financial advisor. And the lights just kind of went off for me. because I I was al I've always been fascinated by the the technicals and the the the the science and the economics of financial markets. But I always felt that there was this big gap. You know, we never learn about f personal finance in school. Even folks that are highly educated, PhDs never learn about this. And it's such a thing that is we are hardwired as humans to want to do the wrong thing when it comes to money. So I I basically said to my wife, we had two young kids at home at the time. I was the only breadwinner. My my wife was stay-at-home mom running our house, which is more than a full-time job. And I said, Gregory Wilnau: Absolutely. John Llodra, CFP(R): I'm gonna jump over to the financial services side of UBS and start over basically. And literally I had a very modest stipend for about six months. And then after that, it was feast or famine, zero or you find clients. And I Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. Yeah. John Llodra, CFP(R): must have been very sleep deprived because I took the leap and and the rest is history. We I I Started building a business there, met who became my my future founding business partner, Mike Preston. We've we left UBS and founded our firm, New Harbor Financial Group, in two thousand and five. So we're beyond twenty years as an independent firm where we answer only to our clients. We're not serving shareholders, we're not serving management. Our clients are our bosses and we we don't forget that any any given day. Gregory Wilnau: Love it. So before we I want to talk more about your clients and who you serve. but first I I wanna ask I wanna ask ask you a quick question. So I know a lot of ad advisors that obviously that we we interview, and a a common story is that you know everybody starts out, most people don't know what they want to do. And a lot of people go do go into engineering. A lot of advisors have said, I wasn't I went to for mechanical engineering or electrical engineering, and I decided I didn't like it. What is it about engineering that adva you think advisors don't like? Because this is a very common story where they'll go to college, they take engineering, realize they don't like it, and then they're drawn to to finance and typically say they say it's because there's they want more of a human element. But I'm curious John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: is do you have any personal insights as to why you think that might be? John Llodra, CFP(R): Geez, it's tough. I mean, I I can only speak in terms of what I think draws drew me to this type of career after self self-reflection. And it's the real, it's the human part of it. you know, classically engineering is a numbers and math and analytical thing. It's not about the human connection, it's not about Empathy, it's not about understanding and psychology. as technical as we are here at my firm in terms of the the business of what we do and managing assets, and we're very hands-on asset managers, very hands-on financial planners, a huge part of our job is almost as that of a counselor. And I I do not want to put us on the same level as folks who are mental health counselors or other very important medical practitioners, but a huge part of our job is is really being able to connect with people, understand. Understand where they're coming from, their psychology. Empathy is a huge part of what we do and of meeting our clients where they are. You know, not telling them what they want to hear. Our job is to be a source of sound and objective judgment for our clients, but there's a way to speak and interact doing that, but in a very compassionate and and emp empathetic way. Gregory Wilnau: I love it. All right, let's talk a little bit more about your clients. So maybe you could take a moment to describe the the kind of person who comes to you. What's a typical situation that they need you to lead them through? John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah, that's a great question. So I'll start by just saying that we're based in Massachusetts. We're in in the city of Worcester, Massachusetts, about forty-five minutes west of Boston. But our clients come from all over the country. in fact we're just as likely to get an inquiry from someone from Texas or California or or Illinois as we are, you know, anywhere in Massachusetts or New England. And the reason for that is we we're different and we're proudly different, not just for the sake of being different, but we Bring that healthy skepticism. Myself and my my business partner actually, founding business partner is studied engineering as well. He was a chemical engineer. So we both bring an analytical, data, evidence-based approach to how we view financial markets. Not just blind faith belief in financial markets, you know, but skepticism, healthy skepticism. Show Gregory Wilnau: Sure, sure. John Llodra, CFP(R): me the data. Let's look at the data, let's look at you know, where things are and in the cycle of things and we studied market history well before we've we've lived personally through some very dramatic episodes in in financial markets. Many advisors today haven't even seen a bear market. We've lived through some of them and navigated our clients through them, but we also have gone back and studied the data going back to the Great Depression and major bear markets, the 1970s inflationary period, which some may say is very similar to to the f kind of phase we're in right now with markets. Gregory Wilnau: Mm-hmm. John Llodra, CFP(R): but you know so our clients come to us they they they Oftentimes have worked with another advisor, and they're just nervous. They they feel in their bones that things just quite aren't right. Some of them are much well studied in their own right, understanding valuations. And you know, we can say objectively that right now the US stock market is more highly overvalued than it has been in any time in history. more rich than the tech bubble, more rich than the housing bubble, even, you know, frankly, more more rich and more overvalued than 1929 leading into the Great Depression. Now, valuations aren't very good timing indicators for the short term, but they do paint a very reliable, historically speaking, anyways, picture of what the likely returns are likely going to be, say, over the following decade. And the simple takeaway is not good. to to expect The kinds of returns we saw over the last decade to continue into the coming decade would be grossly at odds with history. And for someone who has, and usually it doesn't happen just that markets go flat, they they go flat by way of very nasty declines, bear markets, recessions, and things like that. So if ever the data was aligned to to paint a picture of that likely scenario, now is the time. Doesn't mean it happens overnight, but for someone that's passively sitting on a nest egg they work so hard to build. Now is a real important time to check and not try to chase returns, but really tighten up your risk controls and be defensive, be conservative. Your biggest risk is screwing things up, as I said earlier, not and missing out on late stage gains. So clients find us because we're willing to say that, first of all. not only say that, but we have the data and the tools to to back that up. We You know, consider ourselves first and foremost risk managers. I'm a certified financial planner. So we do, and and we have other CFPs here at the firm. So we do all the financial planning stuff you might want to do with, you know, looking at things like tax strategies like Roth conversions and things like that, you know, retirement planning. But we think the very most important thing to in a financial plan is first not just blindly throwing your money in markets without any, you know, active tactical plan to manage those assets. So that's what clients are coming to us for generally. They Oftentimes we'll have an advisor, but they're just being told to just don't worry, you know, set it and forget it. Everything will be good. If markets decline, don't worry. They always come back. And they don't want to sit through another 50% decline like we saw in the wake of the tech bubble and the housing bubble. they're just they don't they don't want to do that. Gregory Wilnau: it sounds like your clients come to you because they they are proactive and they feel there's a gap between their own instant instincts and their desire to be proactive and their current advisor is not being proactive enough. So it's a gut kind of a gut thing and they're looking for more. And that's one of the things that drives them to to come to you. what are some of the questions that they typically ask you when they meet with you for the first time? They're not clients yet. They're just exploring possibly working with you. Chasing this feeling. John Llodra, CFP(R): Well, the often Yeah. Yeah, and we spend a lot of time talking to folks. you know, one of the great things about having a established business like ours is I don't feel like I have to make money every hour of the day, so to speak. I I can spend and the team here can spend time with folks that are inquiring about our services and we don't feel any pressure to s to say, Hey, you know, how about you become a client? You know, our Our our wish and hope for those kinds of conversations are just to add some value, to to add some object objectivity, add some perspective. many times folks do choose to become clients, but it's because they have felt in their bones that we're a good fit for them. It's not a high pressure thing. but yeah, our the folks that reach out to us are looking for something more proactive. not they're they're not. you know, doomers or anything like that, but they just they just know in their bones. And some of them are very well studied. They understand financial markets. And sometimes we, you know, we have very in depth conversations. Other times folks are they've they've been other things in their career. They really have never focused on investing. They're they're kind of new to it, if you will, or don't really under and that's where it really gets to be fun because, you know Whatever the level of the client, we can be educators, if you will. I always wanted to be a teacher. My dad was a teacher, and but the the math never worked out. I'm Gregory Wilnau: Well you kind of are a teacher. Wouldn't you say you're you're you're a teacher in some aspects? You guys have a YouTube channel, right? John Llodra, CFP(R): absolutely. And that's one of the things that I think drew me to to this this work and and why that book I told you I read that said this might be. I I love the aspect, and we here love the aspect of taking abstract or confusing concepts and and you you bet you the financial industry goes out of its way to make things unnecessarily confusing because it makes you feel like you need them. but to to c simplify and bring down to everyday relatable understanding things is is what I really enjoy about my job. You know, certainly we're we're in deep on the technicals of things. You know, we we understand options math for those that are are familiar with how options can be used to hedge risk. But Gregory Wilnau: Mm-hmm. John Llodra, CFP(R): you don't have to be an expert in options math to to to s still understand how they can be useful in in managing risk and hedging risk and reducing volatility in in an investment portfolio. Gregory Wilnau: Where you typically find your clients? How do they how do they find you? John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah, so early on in my career, again, we we've never been about high sales. I I would we would find clients just in our life. You know, I I I enjoy riding bicycles and I can tell you I I met several clients just out riding bikes and we're chatting about, hey, what do you do for work? And you know, the rest became history. But we've been fortunate enough to to grow a presence. We actually have a YouTube channel. call it's YouTube is I think if you just go New Harbor Financial Group on YouTube, you'll find our channel. We're closing in on 10,000 subscribers, and and that channel is really meant to just be Gregory Wilnau: Congrats. That's awesome. John Llodra, CFP(R): it's meant to be an educational outlet. Again, we want to educate. And so we have we don't have 10,000 clients. So clearly folks follow our channel that are just looking for education, objective education. That's really and and many of our clients watch it because it helps them understand. They always I think our clients would generally say they have a very good idea how we see and view things at any given point in time because we have That channel we do monthly live QA's that both clients and out, you know, friends or followers can tune into our live QA's where clients can put us on the spot literally on a on a live podcast like this, where they can throw questions at us and we're happy to answer them. No scripting, it's it's right right from the hip, you know, a day in Gregory Wilnau: Love that. John Llodra, CFP(R): the life, if you will. we also have a relationship. We're an endorsed advisor of a of a widely followed financial media channel. There's a Closing in 200,000 subscribers. So we we are are an endorsed advisor of that channel. And we will oftentimes be introduced to folks who have seen us on that channel. And so we're fortunate that we get a lot of incoming inquiries. and we we love to have those conversations, whether it's a half hour, hour, whatever, there's no pressure. if we can do some good and in kind of adding some value in that time, karmic income is a is a wonderful thing. Gregory Wilnau: So John, what are some of the questions that you get on your YouTube channel or when you do those live Q and A's? You have like a top one to two that come to mind that are that are the most common questions you typically get or t types of questions? John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah, so by and large, the because folks are coming to us because they're concerned about markets. I mean, there's great there's a number of great financial advisors, financial planners out there that know tax, and we're we're very good at that too. But I think the reason people reach out to us has to do with the markets and our take on the markets and their concerns about the markets. They're being told by their advisor that, hey, you're you're age X, so you should be in this mix of stocks and bonds. Don't even try to question it. The You know, academic theory says this is your pie chart, right? And and we're gonna keep you in that pie chart no matter what. And it just doesn't pass a sniff test for a lot of people, and understandably so. so oftentimes they're asking us questions about, you know, hey, I th I'm worried about this. What do you think? And so oftentimes we validate concerns that they have, not just to placate them, but because there's real data to validate that. other times we'll tell them things that they don't necessarily want believe or want to hear, but it's objective. Gregory Wilnau: so you're doing a favor when you do that for sure. That's important. John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah, we just try to be we s we say it like it is. We're we're we we don't BS. We we we we get right to the point and and and and that's one of the peeves I had about that when I first started off in this line of work with that large firm, you know, literally almost almost verbatim, but certainly subtly, advisors in those firms are are told that your job is not to manage money, your job is to go out there and gather assets and farm the money management off to some Third party money manager or whatever. And that's there's nothing necessarily wrong with that. But what it does, it it absolves that advisor, either consciously or subconsciously, from feeling like it's their job to put their neck out there for their clients. our job is to put our neck out there for our clients. We're not always going to be right. We have learned the great lesson of humility. Markets are constantly teaching even the best investors the need to be humble. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. The market is in charge for sure. Yeah. Yeah. John Llodra, CFP(R): Absolutely. But it doesn't mean you're defenseless. You you ax there are absolutely tools and approaches to tilt things in your favor to accomplish what you're really trying to accomplish. Gregory Wilnau: So let's talk about your practice a little bit more and the future and your vision. obviously things are always changing. They're not static, they're dynamic, and neither is your practice. when it comes to your practice, where do you see it in the next one to three years? What what's your vision? What goals are you working on? Where do you want to take John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: it? John Llodra, CFP(R): Well, so when I and my partner entered this business, we never had dreams about, you know, we never even thought about like what what kind of money we could make. I already told you I walked away from several hundred thousand dollars a year of of guaranteed income to start essentially close to zero. and in fact zero after six months. So it's never got the money. Yeah. I Gregory Wilnau: By the way, can con congrats on doing that. That's a leap that a lot of people don't take 'cause they're they're afraid, but you took the leap, so John Llodra, CFP(R): I was fortunate as I had a little bit of a financial buffer to be able to do that as I s as I joked. I think I was sleep deprived and not thinking clearly. but and I t doing that same risk today, I'm like, wow, I I can't believe I did that, but I'm so glad I did because it it so we we do are fortunate that we have a a s a a a sizable business and it's truly a business. practice is one word, but but our my our practice is really a business. We we have a team here, we have a team approach every Client of ours is served by our whole team. They know that they're well, well served and attended to, whether it's an operational issue or an investment strategy issue. We've got that covered as a team. Okay. And we never set out to be big. In fact, we could have been a lot bigger if we were better marketers or whatever, but we've been fortunate in that we have seen enough inquiry that our our business is growing quite steadily. We are growing fast. And the correct remedy for that is not to, we don't believe, employ a bunch of AI bots, but to get great quality people to join our team. So we are actively hiring. We are are talking to several candidates and so I next one to three years. Right now we manage about $830 million of of assets for households, households and individuals. couples. and it's it's highly likely we could be, you know, one and a half, two billion under management within that three year period. Not because we Gregory Wilnau: Awesome. John Llodra, CFP(R): set out to do, but if we, you know, I just feel like if you do the right things and the right kind of work, it it manifests itself in people wanting to work with you. So we're very fortunate, very grateful that so many clients entrust to us this important work. But so I think we'll be larger in terms of the AOM that we manage, assets under management, which means more people we can help. That's the way we think about it. Yes, it means more financial income to our firm, but it means we can help people. We feel like we're on a platform. We're we feel like there's that markets are challenging enough that we're in the cyc grand cycle of things where we want to be screaming out on a podium, you know, listen, this is not. This is not like 1982, the beginning of a brand new bull market. We are in late stages of a very, very I'll use the word treacherous type of environment that that if history's any guide, will be very damaging to a lot of people. And our job is to share that as with objectively, not in a in a pessimistic but a realistic kind of way with as many people as we can. And to do that, we'll be adding more highly qualified people to our team as well. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. And, you know, ultimately too, we don't know what the market's going to do. So this it that is, you know, speculation of what's going to happen. But I think as you say, you know, you want somebody who in your corner who thinks about these things deeply. And it sounds like that's one of the and can make proactive recommendations, sh strategic recommendations with somebody. And that it sounds like that's why one of the main reasons why your clients come to you. They're very proactive in the way that you are. John Llodra, CFP(R): That's exactly right. Gregory Wilnau: So what I wanna do now is I wanna learn more about what it looks like to work with you. So maybe you could take a moment to walk us through your actual process. So when somebody becomes a client today, what happens the first few weeks? What does onboarding look like? And then what does it look like to work with you during the course of a calendar year? Maybe we could start John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Cool. Gregory Wilnau: with the first couple of weeks in onboarding. John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Well of course the first thing is is that no pressure consultation where you know folks learn through conversation whether they are they think we're a good fit for them. And they choose to work with us, not us twisting their arm, to be very clear. But yeah, so mechanically it's it's so we're SEC registered investment advisor. We are fiduciary, not only in theory and in in our conscience, but by the law, and that's important. Doesn't mean there's plenty of fiduciaries out there that are are not not good people. I mean Bernie Madoff was a fiduciary, right? He was but fiduciaries can do bad things. But it's a legal standard and a conscious standard that we hold ourselves to. we custody presently all of our clients' assets at Charles Schwab. We have an independent custodian, so clients know that the money that they entrust us to help them manage is kept separately. It's not in any of our personal or bank accounts. Unlike Bernie Madoff, he was also the custodian. He could literally fabricate you know statements and performance That could never happen with us because Charles Schwab is an independent custodian that that holds the assets. You can log in 24-7. So the f you know, after we had that initial one or several intake conversations to learn about you and your goals and whether we're a mutual fit, the actual process of opening accounts is quite simple. Our service team makes it very simple. Most folks prefer to do things via electronic digital signature. Via DocuSign. And many folks are familiar with that if they've done like real estate transactions. Very seamless, very easy, but it's all spelled out. And the mountain of forms that you have to sign when you engage with a firm like ours or any firm in our industry, at least is made that much simpler because it's electronic and it's all flagged for where you need to complete. typically takes anywhere from five to 10 business days for a client's existing assets to transfer over to our management. We generally take the approach of transferring those assets over in kind, meaning w we won't make any changes until the assets are here, but only only after we've had a very in-depth conversation and plan for how those assets may or may not be repositioned. We're very sensitive to things like capital gains, unrealized capital gains and the impact of repositioning. So we don't just go in there like a bowl in a China shop and and force fit it into a a model portfolio, if you will. We're very thoughtful about how we do that. And this is an environment where that's important because many folks have large gains in in in say tech stocks, maybe you know, folks invested in you know some of the big tech companies like Nvidia or Apple or that they have huge gains, but they're concerned about how large those positions have become in their portfolio. We can work with them to have a strategy to hedge those positions to make them less risky in their portfolio, but spread the tax impact over you know a set period of time to smooth out the tax impacts. but we we give clients the ability to log into a client portal where they can right from day one look at their investment performance relative to benchmarks. We don't want there to be any opaqueness. We want full transparency, not only with the fees that our clients are paying us, but in how they're doing. We want to empower them to continually ask the question and am I getting value for what I've hired this team to do? and you know, we big part of our motto is is is communication and accessibility. My founding partner and I, Mike Preston, we even though we've got a great team and we work as a team, we are highly accessible, especially when it comes to investment nuances. You know, we you know most most firms you call call up the the firm and there's some third party money manager across the country that you're not gonna get a direct conversation with that money manager. The buck stops with us. We're we're available Gregory Wilnau: Mm-hmm. John Llodra, CFP(R): to have those calls with clients. But we've very proactively through many mechanisms communicate. We have, I I think I already mentioned every month we do a live QA where clients can either well we w confidentiality and discrete discretion is very important to us. So when we host these things, we'll answer questions, but we'll never talk about clients' names or anything like that or personal situations. Gregory Wilnau: Sure, sure. John Llodra, CFP(R): but they can fire questions at us and they're not scripted. We're on our toes answering them as we would in any so through those and we do We try to do weekly or every couple of weeks videos on our YouTube channel to educate our clients and and followers. So by the time we do review meetings, which you know, we we have reviews with our clients at different frequencies depending on their needs and their their situation with us. but we have proactive reviews that we schedule. And these reviews are meant to be very meaningful reviews. They're not meant to be just, hey, how are the wife and kids? So Gregory Wilnau: How often do you do the reviews? I'm s John Llodra, CFP(R): Our our best Gregory Wilnau: Go ahead. John Llodra, CFP(R): clients, our best clients have, you know, come to us with a a million dollars or more. our our minimum account size is 500. For households a million or more, we have at least four scheduled annual reviews a year. Okay. Gregory Wilnau: Wow, so every quarter? John Llodra, CFP(R): Every quarter. Now, the rat the fact of the matter is we talk to clients typically much more than that because what we want to know better than us scheduling, hey, we're gonna reach out to you on the the the 31st of every third month. We want you to know that we're always accessible. Reach out to us. There's no question that we don't want to make urgent for you, and no matter how simple that question is. So we'd much rather be open open doored, open phone, whatever whatever you wanna, open video, so that our clients feel like they now there's there's there's a level of contact that's too much for you know to run a business, but also it's it's overkill. Like we don't need to be talking every week with any c any given client. There's nothing in markets that that demands or deserves a weekly call. If if one is tuned in that closely, it's it's more about their psychology than than a true need or or prudence of having that frequence of of of contact. Gregory Wilnau: I love it. I love that you give them the space but also the structure. So they can reach out to you anytime proactively, but there's also a set structure where they know that we're gonna meet four times this year, catch up, talk about things. But you also give them a an avenue and the expectation is there that you can reach us any you reach out to us anytime. So I I love that. I also love that you put yourself out there to answer questions. Like you never know what could happen, those things, right? Somebody might ask a a question that you're not prepared to answer. I would give me an anxiety attack, but I'm just kidding. But I love that you put yourself out. John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Well it's it's it's funny when when when all you know how to do is speak the truth and speak it humbly without, you know, it's it's it's actually a rather natural position for us to be in. Gregory Wilnau: Also probably freeing, you know, too, because John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: I love that. I love that, John. well thank you so much for coming on. Before we jump off here, I want to for someone listening who is interested in getting in touch with you or possibly learning about how they might work with you, what should they do next? Where should they go? John Llodra, CFP(R): Yeah. Well we have a very simple form on our website that folks can fill out. It it doesn't ask for anything sensitive or anything like that, just your name and just if you'd like you could put a little brief but if you go to our website, it's New Harbor. It's H A R B O R. No no U in no British spelling in in Harbor for us. New Harbor Financial dot com. And if you go to the contact button on there, there's a simple web form. You can put your name and how you'd like to to to to contact us or us contact you more more correctly. You can certainly call our office. there's we almost always a human here answering the phone during regular business hours. that's 978-537-7701. and from that we would we will we'll proactively reach out to you to offer some time to schedule a conversation. Again, no obligation, no stress, no pressure conversation with one of our team members. And you know, it just goes from there. It's quite that simple. Gregory Wilnau: All right, John. Well thank you so much for coming on. We appreciate you taking the time. John Llodra, CFP(R): Thank you, Gregory. I really appreciate it. It was fun. And thank you for your your viewers' attention. I hope that there's some value here. Gregory Wilnau: Absolutely.