Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Overland Testing Mashup: Raptor R, TRX, Grenadier, 4Xe Trailhawk, Defender 130 and more!

Transcript

Overland Testing Mashup: Raptor R, TRX, Grenadier, 4Xe Trailhawk, Defender 130 and more! · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the over One Drill podcast. I'm
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: your host Scott Brady, and for this week, my co
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: host Matt Scott and I talk about our recent vehicle mashup.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: So this is all of the vehicles that we've been
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: testing and using in the field over the last six months.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: That includes some really interesting time in the Ford Raptor
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: R and in the TRX. We also spent quite a
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: bit of time in the Hummer EV SUV, the Rivian
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: R one S SUV, and then we had some really
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: amazing surprises with the Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk four y E,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: which we'll talk about in great detail. And then we
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: also were able to drive the Gmcat four X Sierra,
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: which is their fifteen hundred or their half ton variant
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: that even has rear and front lockers along with multimaddic
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: suspension and a bunch of other things. We talk about
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: some other cars as well, but this is really our
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: overview of some of the newest Overland vehicles on the market,
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: So please enjoy our conversation about trucks. This content is
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: brought to you by Overland Journal, our premium quality print publication.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: The magazine was founded in two thousand and six, with
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: the goal of providing independent equipment and vehicle reviews along
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: with the most stunning adventures and photography. We care deeply
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: about the countries and cultures we visit and share our
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: experiences freely with our readers. We also have zero averatorial
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: policy and do not accept any advertiser compensation for our reviews.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: By subscribing to Overland Journal, you're helping to support our
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: employee owned and veteran owned publication. Your support also provides
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  Speaker 1: resources and funding for content like you are watching or
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: listening to right now. You can subscribe directly on our
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: website at Overland journal dot com. So, Matt, we have
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: had a lot of cars, all of them. I think
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: that this is the first time ever that we've actually
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: had more test vehicles come through this parking lot than
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: the vehicles that you have personally purchased.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a terrible person.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: It has been. I mean, if we were to do
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: the whiteboard list, there are many times that Matt is
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: buying cars personally faster than we're getting in test vehicles. Yeah,
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: but you got it. It's a fun hobby for you,
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: and you do have somehow may managed to make it
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: work and many times make money.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or lose a only a small amount, I guess.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: Exactly, Yeah, which is pretty amazing. I mean, we've got
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: a list of vehicles that we're going to talk about.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: So we're going to talk about the Raptor R. We're
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: going to talk about the TRX, We're going to talk
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: about the Grand Cherokee Trailhawk four by E, We're going
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: to talk about the Wrangler for by E, the Rivian
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: R one S, the Hummer SUV, the Defender one thirty,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: the Maverick tremor, the eighty four X, and also a
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: big update on the Grenadier because I spent some more
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: time in that incredible vehicle. So we were going to
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: talk about some grand touring stuff, but you're gonna have
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: to wait till another proadcast. We're just not going to
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: make it work too much on those on the dog
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: too much on the docket, but we are going to
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: start covering a little bit more grand touring because it
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: is such a fun way to travel and Matt and
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: I enjoy it. So that's what this has always been about,
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: is doing the things that, yeah, that bring us joy.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: Grand touring happens to now be one of those things. So, yeah,
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: if we promised to not have too many sailboat or
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: grand touring podcast people like it. They do, and I
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: like talking about it. The numbers have been good. Well,
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: I think it'd be fun to start off with these
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: super trucks. So the Raptor R and the TRX, it
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: very much seems like the Raptor R was Ford's somewhat
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: expedient response to the TRX. What do you think?
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I had a TRX. When I first
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: came out, it was you had You had a Raptor too,
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: I had a Raptor. I think people thought that the
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: Raptor are was going to be a like TRX killer,
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: and I don't think it turned out to be a
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: TRX killer.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: And I've driven them now back to back and it's like,
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: this is something worth talking about. We have always avoided
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: testing these long travel, desert oriented trucks. Many people actually
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: use Raptors for overlanding, and there are certain configurations where
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: they actually make a lot of sense. In fact, when
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: I rolled into USHWAYA on Expedition seven, the only other
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: Overlander at the place we were staying was a Raptor
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: with a four wheel camper in the back of it.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: They have been driven clearly.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean they're not one fifty on this surfactory suspension.
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: They're a little wider. The downside is they have always
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: been neutered on payload, so you end up with a
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: payload less than a Honda Cord, a full sized truck,
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: and that means that you really can't put a camper
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: in it, you really, I mean, if you have three
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: full size adults, you can't even put a five hundred
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: pound tongue weight of towing something behind it. So, but
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: that is starting to improve. So the Raptor R seven
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: hundred horsepower, five point two meters supercharged V eight like
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: fifteen inches of suspension travel thirty seven inch tires from
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: the factory. It's big, and it has a sixteen hundred
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: pound payload, so you can actually start to carry some stuff.
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: Put a lightning rack on the bag, as my prospector was, yeah, so.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: There you go. So and that's after all the cool stuff.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: So it's got already got all the cool stuff on it,
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: and it's got a sixteen hundred pound payload. So this
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: was my I've driven your TRX before very short distances,
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: but actually on a fairly technical piece of trail, and
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: that shocked me how well, how much articulation it had
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: and how it performed.
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: It works with what it has, pretty good.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: Rear locker and everything else. But the Raptor R was
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: really the first time I've had a long test period
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: with one of these super trucks and a lot of
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: pause of impressions on the Raptor. It feels like cheap
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: the plastic well, and that's what we'll talk about because
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: that's the real difference with the TRX, But the Raptor
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: feels like a very well executed performance package. So when
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: it comes to driving at high speed on the dirt,
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: when it comes to how the transmission works, how it
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: actually drives in a performance setting, I was extremely impressed.
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: In fact, it has an incredible amount of reserve capacity
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: and performance. The challenge is finding a place to actually
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: test that safely. So the only time I was able
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: to do that was in a wash where it's not
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: a public road. You're able to drive, you have plenty
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: of it after it, yeah, you have plenty of visibility,
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: but everything else you kind of have to be careful.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: And that's the downside of these trucks is that they
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: can be driven at speeds that are not legal on
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: forest roads or BLM roads, which most of those have AITAB.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: They can be driven at speeds that just aren't safe
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: even in closed courses. I mean, you're you're talking about
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: vehicles now that are approaching Like they're not race cars,
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: That's what I'm trying to get at, but they're approaching
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: the same speeds and you know, they have pretty decent
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: wheel travel now, yeah, and you can really get yourself
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: into some trouble.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: And thirty sevens too, So the tire size has gotten
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: so big it's incredible. The Raptor just kept getting better
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: and better and better as the speed went up. Yeah,
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: it has. I mean, this is another thing. It has
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: seven hundred horse power. If you think you're going to
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: hop in that thing and like stick it in tool
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: drive and lock the rear diff and like kind of
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: have some fun with this thing, you're you're crazy, Like
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: this is literally what I do for a living. And
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I did that for a bit and it was extremely fun.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: You can put it in to wheel drive still, you can. Yeah,
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: and tier X it's all wheel drive or nothing. That's right.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: So yeah, you can have the Raptor and tool drive
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: seven hundred horsepower going to thirty seven in the rear.
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: And if you think about accelerating the car sideways, I
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: mean you haven't even touched the accelerator yet. Your your
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: brain has thought, I'm going to accelerate in this corner
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: to get a little bit of rotation, and the car
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: is already sideways. And yeah they are, They're incredible. But
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: what I found myself doing is just going into Baja mode.
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: All will drive, and then the thing was much safer,
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: much more enjoyable. Like over the top. Absolutely over the top,
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: but because it has a sixteen hundred pound payload. You
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: can put a lightner rack in the back. You put
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: a rooften on the thing that hopefully would hold together.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: I don't know what rooften would be the right choice,
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: but something that would hold together. Maybe some deck drawers
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: you can have trouble to.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: Be practical that has a warranty, that has it'll have
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: a great resale value.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: I mean there's probably people that bought I think.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: I think when the Raptors launched, if I if I
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: recall correctly, they started at just under forty thousand dollars.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: Those chucks now have a hundred and fifty thousand miles
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: on them and they're still thirty thousand dollars. Yeah like that.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, we're talking about a car that is a really,
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: really great residual value. It's an F one fifty. It
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: has all the practicalities of an F one fifty. My
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: problem with them is there's the sticker price of a
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: Raptor R. You're not going to get one at sticker price.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: Maybe in a couple of years you'll be able to
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: get one. They sell for one hundred and fifty thousand dollars.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It was incredible though, and it's just it's so
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: inspiring to see the kinds of performance on the full spectrum.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: So let's look at a Rubicon, a twentieth anniversary Rubicon, Yeah,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: and then let's look at a Raptor R. So the
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: as slow as you can go with a Rubicon, and
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: it's like nothing that's ever been made before. Yeah. And
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: then you have as fast as you can go like
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: a tarx or as a Raptor and there's nothing like
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: that that's ever been made before. Seven hundred horsepower supercharged
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: engines with over a foot of t yeah, thirty seven.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: They're just unbelievable on both sides of the spectrum.
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: Itssel and it'll be crazy to see where these things
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: go because obviously they have these very profitable models. Now
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: Raptor is big business not only for Ford but for
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: dealers because rather than selling an F one fifty, I
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: mean historically it was five ten, fifteen thousand understicker, you're
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: starting to create something that's desirable enough that people are
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: paying not only buying a more premium F one fifty,
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: but then they're paying over sticker.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, everybody's making more money on it. Yeah, and same way.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: I can't even imagine what some of these people's car
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: payments are because.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: It used to be the nine to ten percent.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: It used to be that premium vehicles like that they
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: were really for the affluent and they would people come
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: in and write a check for it. But people do.
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of people that are rich. There's not
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: a lot of people anymore that are wealthy. And the
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: distinction that I put is someone that's rich makes a
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: lot of money, but they have no cash. And it
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: used to be that wealthy people would go and buy
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: a Rolls Royce or whatever, and they would pay cash
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: for it because they had so much money. Yeah, and
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: now you have these rich people, people that are have
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: good income and they can afford a two thousand dollars pay.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: There's so many Raptors and there's so many TRX's in
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: the town that we live in.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're everywhere.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're not going to be in most towns in
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: the West, and I'm sure the East you're not going
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: to be. Your goal is to be the unique guy
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: on the block. You're probably not going to do it
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: with a Raptor or a t Rex anymore. But there's
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: a reason for that. We know that these trucks are
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: fantastic on the road. Like I am shocked, I think
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: shocked my Raptor was at twenty eighteen. They have upgraded
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: them from them. They went from having leaf springs in
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: the rear its coil springs and a five link in
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: the rear, kind of this trailing arm design that's really
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: cool that I don't did they get a little bit
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: more power, but it's similar drive train, a little bit
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: more wheel travel, a little bit more refinement in the cab.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: And then you have the TRX, which is just this.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so let's shift to the TRX and then maybe
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I'll give a little bit of my insights around comparison.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: But I drove your TRX, but I was I was
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: very much. I had a job to do with it
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: that day with a rack that we had on there
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: that we were getting some photography for, and I it
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: was amazing, But I didn't I didn't drive it for
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: that reason. And plus, I'm driving my buddy's truckhun so
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to be testing jump it. I'm not
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: going to be testing your car. The thing that I
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: noticed I just came out of the Raptor. Yeah, and
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: you had that last week here. Yeah, and I'm now
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: in the TRX. The TRX is across the board. It
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: feels more premium, it feels more super truck, it feels
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: more powerful, It is much more comfortable on the road.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: It's quieter than the Raptor. The TRX, in my mind,
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: feels like this premium, expensive super truck. Yeah, whereas the
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: Raptor felt like a very well engineered off road high
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: performance truck.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, I think that the Raptor is a better Yeah,
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: I'll say it. I think that the Raptor is a
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: better off road truck. I think that they're a little
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: bit less precious. I think they're more wheel travel, more
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: of an after market more aftermarket availability. Like the problem
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: with the TRX if you like to, you know, fiddle
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: with things, is you're kind of looking at what you're
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: going to get out of that platform. You're not going
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: to get much more wheel travel. You're not really going
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: to fit much more of a tire on there. Ford
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: has has this thirty seven package, which is like.
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: That's what ours was.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: Super Yeah, I think the raps are ours. All comes
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: standard with them super super super cool. It's almost i'll
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: call it a three way race. There's the Raptor R
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: and there's a t Rex. The best choice out of
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: all of them is probably the standard Raptor. I don't
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: think that you necessarily need the power of these vehicles
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: when you're in low range. You're not using it when
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: you're on idle and you.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: You cannot use seven hundred.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: If you want to see what the back of your
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: truck looks like while you're still sitting in the front seat,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: use all seven hundred horsepower on these trucks. The TRX,
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: it does not have the wheel travel to take advantage
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: of seven hundred horse.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: Power, and it's softer sprung, so that means everything up
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: until a big event, TRX felt better, very comfortable off road,
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: the cycling through washes and over bombeds.
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: It's a lot more active suspension I've found, whereas the
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: big hits the Raptor was like, it shocked me how
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: good it was. Yeahs, more suspension travel is going to
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: do that and the aftermarket that the chassis on the
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: Raptor has more capability in it, you know, like there
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: are things that you can then go and do to
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: a Raptor to make it I mean a stock Raptor
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: off road. There there are there are race cars that
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: have less horsepower and less wheel travel that have role cages.
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: Sure, that's That's always been an interesting thing for me
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: with these super trucks. Yeah, is now guys can have
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: a I think how how people build trucks has changed
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: with with the availability of all of these factory packages.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: It just makes more sense to have the car payment.
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: We live in a society and.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: The warranty line on credit and the warranty and all
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: the engineering that goes behind like you could you yes,
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: Like I remember when the Raptor, Camment oh Lot could
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: build that.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, cool and now and now it's just
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: easier to finance or write the check at the dealer
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: or whatever your final position is, like, I don't I
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: don't really care about that. But a lot of people
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: just go and like you said, they they they want
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: to have the payment to get the truck, and it
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: actually makes a lot of sense, that's frankly. I mean,
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: that's what I do now, is you can go out
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: and just get one of these things. You do a
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: few little modifications like That's why I want to know
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: how many Raptor Baja design fog pocket kits they've sold
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: kind of thing, because that's really all that people are
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: doing to them. You'll get some guys that do more,
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: but I think that's like the Raptor crowd. I think
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: the TRX is this grand touring pickup truck that's really
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: capable off road, but is so so comfortable.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: It was shocking, I mean, for those that are interested
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: in the difference between the two. When I was driving
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: the t Rex, I felt like I was in one
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: of the finest luxury sedan's that I mean, I drive
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: a lot of those too, and it was absolutely yeah, quiet, plush, powerful.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: I just did an hour and a half each way
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: drive yesterday and it was seamless.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean effortless. My power current daily is a
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: E sixty three s AMG Wagon. It's really comfortable. I mean,
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: if you're talking about an autobond Cruiser or whatever that
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: may be, that is the definitive car in that segment.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: The TRX is quieter inside. It is more comfortable inside
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: because you just have more space. You know, it is
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: a pickup check at the end of the day, so
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: putting your feet up on the dash or this or
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: that or whatever. It's just very comfortable. It has all
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: the power you need.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: I mean, oh my gosh.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, the wagon's faster.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: By how much though, Like a t Rex is four.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Seconds four seconds and then this one's under three. But
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: none of that matters. It's like a blink, it doesn't.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: It don't feel incredibly powerful. The TRX feels like a Mercedes. Yeah,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: the the Raptor feels like a Volkswagen or well it
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: just a Ford feels like one fifty you get. I
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: mean there's things that drive me crazy on Fords, and
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: you still you still get that with the Raptor.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: It's the little.
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: I mean, I complain it all the time, but like
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: the Mold seam lines everywhere on an F one fifty.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: The the like texture plastic with the leather grain in it.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: You know, it's it's very The buttons feel cheap. Everything
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: kind of feels like there's engineering behind it. And then
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: like an accountant came in and just you know, fort
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: great engineers, even better accountants. That's that's just how I
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: feel with the Raptor.
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: But and it doesn't feel even though the numbers are
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: very similar, it does not feel as powerful as the TRX.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: It's not as comfortable as a TRX, but it does
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: it is a better performing vehicle at the limits in
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: my experience, and now that I've driven both, I guess
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: this is kind of my summary, more of as a
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: validation of are these great overland vehicles? I think for
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: some people they are, But for me, no. I would
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: not consider either one of these things for a personal
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: vehicle because I don't need something with seven hundred horsepower.
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: I want something with fuel economy and range. I want
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: something preferably diesel, and it just and so for me personally,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: even though they have they are incredible tools, they are
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: incredible performing machines. The TRX I liked a little bit better,
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: but Yeah, it wouldn't be wouldn't be a truck for me?
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I sold my TRX to get a
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: prospector prospectors, you know, in that same financial realm as
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: some of those trucks. Prospectors a better choice if I
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: was heading down to Baja or wanted to have a
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: truck that well. I mean I've used these trucks. I've
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: taken Raptors everywhere. I've taken trx Is everywhere. They're really
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: fun for me. Is it an overland truck? Yeah, for sure,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: because you can just throw a tent in the back
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: and you have this factory engineered long travel whatever. You
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: keep it within its realm, and it's pretty good for
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: an off road vehicle. I would still rather have the
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: Raptor for a luxury vehicle, I would rather have the TRX.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's a great way just to sum it up.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: But they're very cool and for those that have them.
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: In fact, if anybody is listening and they use one
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: of those vehicles for their travels, I'd love to hear
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: more about that. I'd love to see some photos. I'd
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: love to see how you're using it.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: People use them and use them, and they do they
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: they put up with it all right.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: So now we're going to move into the plug in
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: hybrid and EV territory. We're going to talk about Grand
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: Cherokee trail Hawk four by E, Wrangler four by E,
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: Rivan R one s, and Hummer Suv. I think I'm
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: gonna start with this trail Hawk four by E because
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: probably for the first time in many years, did I
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: have a vehicle that completely took me by surprise where
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: I came in with a like a like a fixed
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: impression or a bias, let's even call it. Like I've
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: been doing this for a long time.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: YEA. Grand Cherokees have always been there, but they're they've
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: always like.
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're good cars. Like my it seems like my
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: family owns eighty seven of them. Yeah, and it's a
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: practical choice. Yeah, they they are amazing vehicles. I just
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: they've just completely gone off my radar as an off
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: road or an.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: Overland They've always the Grand Cherokee has always been that
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: like weird, like, yeah, some wrangular parts and some Cherokee
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: parts will bolt onto it, but like, but the Grand
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: Cherokee platform has just continued to get better and better
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: and better and better and it's particularly the Trailhawk four
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: by E is like most people listening to this podcast probably.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: Should drive one. I would buy one. It is absolutely
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: a vehicle that I would buy. I mean, let's just
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: run down real quick through the specs. This thing does
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: four hundred and thirty five horsepower zero to sixty and
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: five and a half seconds. It gets a combined they
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: call it like a MPGe between the engine and the
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: electric in the forty mile per gallon range. It has
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: thirty miles of electric only, which means you do all
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: of your little local like where we live in Prescott,
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: I could use electric only at one quarter of the
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: price of filling up the fuel tank. It has thirty
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: one inch diameter tires all terrains.
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: That used to be big. That doesn't sound like much now,
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: but that used to be. It's plenty big. It's plenty big.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: It's plenty big.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: It has skid plates throughout, airbag suspension with two off
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: road hype modes, which to be clear off road two
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: is used to clear over something you do not drive
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: in off road two. It is so brutal there's no
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: down travel left. But if you need to get over
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: a ledge, put it in off road two, go over
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: the obstacle and then put it back down into off
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: road one center locking differential, rear locking, differential low range.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: And this new one has a front swaybartist connect.
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: That's that was the crazy thing that surprised me with it.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: I didn't know it until I got into the car,
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, what is this magic ye like on
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: a jeep rubicon where you can push the button and
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: you gain all this articulation and you reduce head toss.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: This Grand Cherokee in off road one mode. I mean
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: it flexes way more than I've seen any independent vehicle
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: flex and the head toss is way down. You don't
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: get that really busy ride. You're not getting kind of
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: tossed around the cabin. It still tows six pounds, so
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: you're going to tow any kind off road tracks like
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: the Overland.
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: It's like the best over daily driver on Overland or
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: could ever hope for it.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: It's like the one car to the Morton or whatever.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: It's like the one car if you need to drive
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: back and forth to work and your commutes ten miles,
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: you're never gonna use any fuel. Yeah, you can go
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: plug into your electricity. Hey for Electricia that you do
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: you get to plug in anywhere you want, Matt, my
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: electricity is or electrics.
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: Thanks, thanks buddy.
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: I think that this is an amazing car. I am.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: I'm literally blown away by how good it is. And
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: it looks good.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: The interior quality, which is something like it's a mystery
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: car interiors and it's good if i'm you know, cars
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: are expensive these days, and.
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: Okay, and that's the that's the coupdi gra, so the
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: coudi gra of these trail Hawk for by ease. And
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: I did not. Again, I didn't know this because the
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: way that we got the car was a little bit
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: out of order, and I didn't. It just showed up,
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: so I wasn't I didn't do a lot of research.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: Brian McVicar's drove it back from Moab and like here,
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden, we have this car. So I
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: didn't know what it was. I didn't know anything about it.
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: I thought we just had another Grand Cherokee. This vehicle
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: with all of those features. It costs sixty eight thousand dollars,
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: which it still seems like a lot of money. But
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: if you look at any car today, like we were
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: just talking about about Ford, Mavericks that are being sold
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: over sticker for sixty eight thousand dollars forty eight.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean crazy crazy, so yeah, so the deal
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: you you actually figure that when the world gets back
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: to normal, the automotive world, the dealership world, you know,
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: that means that sixty eight thousand dollars MSRP. That means
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: you're paying low sixties, high fifties for that in the
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: real world. Because the Grand Cherokee doesn't have that, Like
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: most of these capable off road vehicles, you're paying still
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: ten to fifteen thousand dollars over a sticker for them.
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: That's where it becomes reasonable.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: It does. And I'm not saying it's better than any
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: of the other great subs out there. I'm not saying
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: it's better than a it's on par with a two hundred,
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: it's on par with a four runner. If you're considering
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: some other vehicle like that, just go check this. Yeah,
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: I think it's worth looking. Just go check it out.
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: And the four by ee drive train, like I've known,
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: I've known quite a few people that have had these.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Now I've never heard them complain about reliability or having
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: any issues.
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: Check out the Grand Cherokee trail Hawk four by E.
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: It's one of the vehicles that has surprised me more
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: than anything that I've driven in many years. And also
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: check out the Wrangler four by E. There's a lot
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: of resistance to evs within the over land space for
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: a good reason and for I think misunderstandings. But one
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: of the best selling plug in hybrids in America is
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: the Wrangler.
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: It's the best selling electrified vehicle in America in twenty
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: twenty two.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: I think because it's kind of how people use Wranglers.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: They don't tend to do long commutes in them. So
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: it has about a twenty five mile electric range. They
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: they're quick. It has four hundred and thirty five horsepower.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: And then you can get it in a rubicon, So
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: you can have an electric vehicle, a hybrid vehicle, a
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: gasoline only vehicle, something with front and rear lockers and
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: swuitward disconnect on thirty.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: Fives the roof comes off.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: Come on, you can. You can see why they sell
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: eight billion of these things. They work. I see them
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: all over all over Prescott. Again, such a win the
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: EV thing.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: If you live in a city, EV's probably ready for you. Now. Yeah,
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: where we live kind of rural northern Arizona. You know,
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: EV's are fine for around town, but I don't.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: Know, it's a little bit of a challenge. It's a
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: little challenge. It's an infrastructure issue. Although Prescott just got
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: its first supercharger Yaba Pike College, Yaba Pike College. Okay, Okay, cool.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: So we were up from one charger with two cables
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: at the Hilton Garden.
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: And we should talk about the Rivian R one S
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: because there's actually I don't there's not a lot that
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: I kind of want to riff on with this car,
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: other than it's not only the best electric suv I've
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: ever tested, it's one of the best SUVs I've ever tested.
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: And this is for me personally. One of my most
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: favorite cars that I've ever owned was a two thousand
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: and seven rainerow We Mark three. Yeah, and I loved
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: everything about that car while I owned it. It was
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: very reliable, it was one of the most beautiful, capable,
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: the broadest spectrum of attributes that I have ever had
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: in a vehicle that I owned. The R one S
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: most closely matches like that exper size es like.
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: It's that Tundra first Gen Tundra size and the pickup
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: truck and Mark three range rover and the suv.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: It's incredibly fast three point two seconds zero to sixty
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: eight hundred and something horsepower, three hundred and something mile range,
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: airbag suspension thirty four inch, all terrains from the factory.
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: It's huge.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: And the ground clearance Like when we had that one,
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: I sat underneath it fifteen inches. I'm like nearly sitting.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: It's not like I'm like trying to get underneath it.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, I'm underneath it, like oh, I can
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: kind of sit up here like you drive behind a
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: Rivian and it just the architecture of the suspension looks
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: purpose built.
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: It's really good. It's really good off road. All evs
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: have the same issue, which is this kind of low
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: speed climbing over big rocks and ledges. We've talked about
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: that in the past, but and the Rivian's not exempt
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: from that. But it is an incredibly fine automobile. It's
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: beautifully designed. It's so minimalist, which is just like makes
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: me in such a happy place.
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: We disagree a little bit on that line. I know
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: I really like it, but.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: I love them.
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: I want some buttons.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I love that. It's just so minimalist and like
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: reduct reducted reductionist.
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so some of it, some of the interior feels
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: a little cheap to me because I'm thinking startup didn't
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: mean to design the buttons. Put it in the screen.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: It's a simple solution.
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: I get it.
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: But Rivians also are not They're an expensive vehicle, but
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: they're not as expensive as you'd actually crazy, Like, they're
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: not crazy. You know, I sold, I sold my av
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: prospect Or Excel, and I'm one feeling dumb about it
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: because I've now realized how expensive trucks have become. Even
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: though it was only one year. The cost of a
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: pickup truck has gone off about twenty percent from my
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: actual somebody who buys on vehicles, it feels twenty percent
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: more expensive. But the Rivians just aren't. You know, you
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: can get a Rivian R one tier R one s
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: effectively new. So if you go to the website and
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: you buy one, I think there's somewhere between six to
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: twelve months on a delay afforable that, yeah, probably, but
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: there's so many people that have basically just bought allocations
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: to flip them that an R one T you're looking
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: in the eighty to ninety range, and the R one
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: s being a little bit more, a little newer and
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: fewer of them on the market. You're looking right around
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: one hundred. You can't get an F two fifty for that.
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: You can't get a Raptor for that is faster than
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: a Raptor. Yeah, you can barely get a standard. You're
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: basically competing with regular pickup trucks. Yeah, regular pickup trucks
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: might be more expensive at this point. If you're comparing
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: speed and power and torque and all that kind of stuff,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: it's it's it's an interesting it's it's very interesting right now.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And the Rivians are amazing. And one of the
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: things that I love about the company is that it
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: is it is a startup filled with incredibly passionate people
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: that truly believe in their product. They really do. I mean,
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: they've worked with Bill Burke, they really care about the
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: off road performance. And then they're going to have they're
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: going to come out with this dual motor model and
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: they're going to come out with some things that I
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: think will be even make them even more appealing. But
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: if you're looking at an electric suv and you're looking
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: at the Yeah, it's kind of amazing. I think, I
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: do think.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: You know, we keep getting little little teaser tidbits of
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: the all electric g Wagon, which really really excites me.
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: But gee, what's the markup.
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: Going to be on those? Yeah? Incredible? I mean G
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: sixty three's you have to have your own like nuclear
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: power plant next to the house.
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, unless it's unless it's some kind of you know,
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: it's Mercedes.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: Their first car was electric.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like I mean the first car Mercedes made electric.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: They're now going back into electric. We had the eq
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: E EQST EQS And this isn't really a this isn't
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: an Overlander, this isn't really a Grand Tour. But it's
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: important to get these new vehicles in to just compare
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: to what they are to others.
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, learn the new technology important to us.
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: The reason I bring it up is I I think
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: the Raban's really cool. I do not like how it drives.
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: It drives like a golf cart to me. Once you
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: get past the the you know, the kind of what
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: feels like a one trick pony of the instant power
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: and the launch and that kind of stuff. The one
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: pedal thing drives me crazy. Yeah, it would be nice
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: because it's it would did any kind of motion sickness
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: as a person, which however this works out, I do.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: You're always kind of like any change in throttle and
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: you're you kind of get this, like feels like a
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: car at sixty milli an hour in third gear.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: It would be nice if they had a way to
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: reduce that.
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I don't think that it's that exciting to well,
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: it's exciting to drive because it's fat. I don't think
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: that it's a good experience. But with the Mercedes, I
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: loved how that car drove. It drives like a car
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: that happens to be electric.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: It is not. You would never know that it was.
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: You would you would never know. It has the option
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: of the one pedal thing, but if you're not crazy
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: on that, which which I mean, I get why they're
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: kind of doing it, but it.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: Just I like it. I just know how to drive
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: like with one pedal.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: You know, it's all this weird, this weird thing, and
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: I don't like it, but maybe I'll get used to it.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: But I do like it.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so there you go. I think the eq
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: for it. Actually it just felt like a more of
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: a traditional car totally. But it was the only thing
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: I didn't And we'll talk about the EQUS in another
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: episode a little bit.
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: It was not so ugly. From the front it was handsome,
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: but from any other angle it was not. And then like,
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: what is the one thing about an electric vehicle that
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: makes it totally unique? The fronk? Yeah, and that car
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: did not have a fronk. I didn't open that. It
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: was so sad like it's like design wise, it was
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: just yeah, it was bulbous, it was very eggy. It
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: was it was a Masda c X nine. Again, from
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: the front, I thought it was handsome, yeah, but any
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: other angle it was pretty egg shaped, which is also
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: what made it incredibly quiet and dynamic.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: And so serene to drive, serene to drive absolutely those
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: little pillows for your head. I know it's crazy, but
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: i'sportant to drive that stuff just to see, yeah, how
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: it positions.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: And learn these new technologies because it's important to us,
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: because we know it's changing. Things are changing, people are
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: going to be buying them. So the other electric suv
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: that we drove was the Hummer Suv, which the Hummer
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: Suv is it's it's like driving any other like a
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: TRX or any other kind of a vehicle, in the
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: sense that it has a regular shifter you can turn
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: off the one pedal drive and drives very, very normal.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, it drives like a normal vehicle, and because
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: it has the rear steel, it drives more compact than
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: it actually is. It's incredibly fast three point five seconds
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: zero to sixty for that one under the launch conditions,
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: and it looks a lot better than the truck. The
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: biggest complaint I had with the Hummer truck is I
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: just don't care for that kind of vestigial bed with
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: the weird angle to it. I just don't think it
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: made the truck very handsome, whereas the suv, in my mind,
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: is a lot more attractive looking vehicle.
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: I'm so impressed with so much that GM is doing
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: right now, and then this Hummer thing comes out and
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: it's like, oh God, it's bad.
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: But you know what's let it die. You know what's
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: gonna happen though, is that we're going to end up
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: with a Yukon eighty four electric and it's gonna it'll
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: be and it'll look it'll be great, and it'll be great.
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: So it is a very comfortable vehicle. Yeah, it's it's
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: incredibly spacious on the inside. So the actual driving experience,
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: the actual like being. Because Paula, our producer, was with
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: me when we went to Califor for you to test
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: the vehicles. She shot all the video. She drove it, some,
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: I drove it some I got to be the passenger.
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: It was just a very comfortable vehicle to be in
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: a lot of space, very open and roomy, and it
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: has tons of power, thirty five inch diameter tires with
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: long travel, four corner independent airbag suspension. It ends up
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: being like a really nice car. Drive this and there's
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: a lot of.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: Impressive engineering that has gone into that car.
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but there's a couple things that are a problem.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: The ground clearance is much less than the Rivian. It
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: has this deceptively low sided, low quarter panel that you'd
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: because of the way they did the rock sliders. It
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: kind of obscures the fact that the chassis is much
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: lower than the sliders, and that's because that's where all
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: the batteries are. So in the highest suspension modes, the
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: breakover is fine, but in a lot of other cases
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: it's low In the center and that also makes it
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: incredibly flat steering. It's very low center gravity. But that's
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: one of the things that I noticed is it's fairly
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: low compared to like the Rivian for example. And then
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: I think it's also just that overall size. It's a
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: very very big vehicle. Thank goodness. It has four wheel steering.
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: So the four wheel steering is a game chain. It is,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: and I think that we're going to start seeing that
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: on more off road vehicles. You don't always just have
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: to crawl over something. You can also drive around it. Yeah,
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: and that works great for that. But the crab mode's fun. Yeah,
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of yeah, very interesting engineering with that.
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: WATS to Freedom is fun. There's just there's lots of things.
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: It's a fun vehicle. It's definitely supercar super trucky. Yeah,
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: on the eating side. And I think it's what what
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: it allowed for GM to do is to fund the
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: development of all of these systems we're going to see
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: in vehicles that are a little more practical.
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: The idea of a of a Yukon at four X
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: that has all of that technology sounds amazing. That sounds great.
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: My qualms are purely of a styling and reputational.
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty tough to unwind the H two legacy.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: It's pretty tough to unwind that well.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but they have also this amazing legacy with H one,
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: and the H three was a.
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: Much better car, just came too late. The Hummer Suv
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: is very interesting, very expensive, very obscure, unique styling. Yeah. Yeah,
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: so let's move on from the Hummer Suv to the
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: Defender one thirty. I have such incredible respect for the
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: land Rover brand, and it all started for me from
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: land Rover. None of this, for me, would have happened
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: if it wasn't for that cover of a FORL Drive
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: magazine with the Camel trophy on it. And I've owned
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: a lot of classic land Rovers. I've driven land Rovers
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: around the world, and I have such just love I
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: wouldn't even say for the brand. Love for the brand.
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: I mean there's really not I wouldn't say, and there's
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: bassist people, yeah, just in a yeah, love for the brand.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: I just have just true affection for it. In recent years,
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: I have not found that any of the modern land
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: They're all great cars, that's to be clear, but none
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: of them have elicited that same passion for me or
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: even the consideration of buying one until the Defender one thirty.
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: So the Defender of a.
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: Car that nobody really asked for.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's also the one that they needed to sell.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: The one ten. It is fairly space constrained on the inside,
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: and it has more of a departure angle than you
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: need for a vehicle of that kind, like how you
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: would use a really nice Defender is not doesn't require
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: a like a forty five degree departureing. Yeah. I like
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: the fact that the one thirty has more space in
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: the rear. I also like how it balances out the
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: appearance of the vehicle. Some people don't care for that
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: as much as I do, but it actually reminds me
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: like if we look at the Defender one ten behind us,
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: it actually has sheet metal behind the rear tire. There's
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: actually some material there, which is not the case for
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: the one ten, the modern or the current model one ten.
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: It's just very abbreviated. It looks more like a Defender
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: ninety did, a classic Defender ninety did, whereas the one
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: ten always had some space behind it. So now the
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: one thirty looks reminiscent to me. Of the amount of
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: space behind after the rear axle in a classic one ten,
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: it actually drives a little bit more balanced on the trail.
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: The rear of the one ten is prone to popping
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: up kind of unexpectedly or even a little bit more aggressively,
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: like we experienced that even a little bit on Benzel's pass.
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like the rear would, but always the on that
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: it was the left rear.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: H that's right, Yeah, the one thirty because as a
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: little bit more weight over the back, it very much
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: a little bit more and it settles that movement. Just
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: because there's a little bit more weight aft of the
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: rear axle, it has a lot more space. You can
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: buy it as a five passenger model next year, so
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: you end up with this totally load flat load floor.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: You can sleep inside the v vehicle. I've gone on
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: to the builder and I'm like, what does it take
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: to build out one of these things?
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: I always I always look at building a Defender, same
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: with you, Like I have a huge admiration for the brand.
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: The Defender is a lovely vehicle, right, I think it
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: is one of like as far as interiors go, it's
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: one of my favorite interiors ever. Put into a vehicle
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: and it's it's because they have that that Defender dash
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: where you get in your pocket, knife, your wallet, your
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: phone or whatever. You just like throw it in front
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: of you and then you go on with your day
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: and it's it's it's really great. But there's always a
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: butt with land Rover. And do I personally trust one
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: knowing that I live an hour and a half, two
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: hours from the closest land one hundred miles from the
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: closest land river dealer that's yeah.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: And how much of that do you feel is reputation
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: of let's call it a two thousand and one discovery
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: two or how much of that you feel is actually
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: an issue with the current vehicle. It's probably all of
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: the above.
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: Like I know that there have been quality problems with
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: the new Defender.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: They are made in a new Yeah faction.
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: There was also a lot going on at that time.
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: I mean, you know, maybe they were ramping up as
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: COVID was starting. You know, not to use COVID as
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: an excuse necessarily, but the automotive world got turned on
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: its head with supply chains. So I always look at them.
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: But anybody listens to the podcast know that I don't
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: really keep things for that long, So I'm really interested
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: in a year at like a certified pre owned Defender
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: one ten. There you go, and then perfect because they'll
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: be instead of them being ninety grand or one hundred
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: grand and really hard to get, they're going to be
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: forty five grand or fifty fifty. Yeah, like they're not,
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: and you're still have the same potential for issue.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: I think that they're really cool. I think that they're
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: really capable. I think they have a lot of features
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: that are in them that are really nice.
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I like the one thirty. And my only disappointment,
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: in fact, this is the only disappointment that I have
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: in the car, is that you can't put an eighteen
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: on it because it comes only with the six cylinder,
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: or by the time that we this goes live, it'll
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: also be available with a V eight, which is.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: A variant, and that gets the bigger brakes, which means
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: you're there's no off road nineteen inch tires, so that
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: means you're at a twenty.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: You're at a twenty, and that it's a mistake. It's
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: like every manufacturer. If you're listening to this podcast, it
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: is a mistake. Yeah, the Hummer at ten thousand pounds,
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to give a compliment to the Hummer.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: The Hummer is ten thousand pounds. Is the truck almost
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: It has an eighteen inch wheel. If you can stop
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: a ten thousand pound electric truck, you can stop a
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: defender with an eighteen inch wheel. You can put the
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: brake package on there that allows you to fit the
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: wheel diameter that is appropriate for the vehicle's intention. The
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: one ten is designed to be an adventure vehicle. It's
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: designed to be an off road vehicle, even if it's
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: not used in extreme terrain. If you take them in
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: the sand, you can't air down low enough. If you
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: get into snow, you cannot air down low enough.
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: There's not enough of those decisions they end up being
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: They never end up being in the consideration set for
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: what the defender was supposed to be.
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: But they did everything else. They give it a rear locker,
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: they give it crossed axle air suspension with good articulation.
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: I just drove one in the Arabian Desert, big dunes, trails,
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: long distances, driving around the country. Yeah, and I liked
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: the car a lot. My big disappointment is the twenty
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: inch wheel. It is not appropriate for the kind of.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll deal with it on a range rover, but
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: if you're going to throw that Defender name plate on it, like.
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: Give us an eighteen inch wheel. It's that simple, which
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: you can get on the one ten, right, you can,
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: that's right, you just have to get the four cylinder
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: drive train. We're going to do rapid fire. So eighty
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: four X. We had the eight four X Sierra for
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: a while. Incredible that a newer generation than one you have. Yeah, yes, exactly.
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: So it is newer generation, brand new interior, very luxurious,
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: rear locker, front locker, gets rid of that terrible G
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: eighty mechanical locker out of the rear, thirty three inch
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: diameter tires, multi matic suspension, rock sliders, and now they
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: have an AV addition in the eight four X which
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: gives you AV bumpers front rear, and a bunch of
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: other cool things and a larger diameter tire. So there,
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: these are very cool trucks. I would have never imagined
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: five years ago that GM would have the most capable
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: half ton pickup.
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: I would never if somebody was like in the year
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: two thousand. I don't know when you got that one
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: twenty one In the year twenty twenty one, Scott Brady
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: is going to buy a GM product.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: That would be like I would have never thought it. Yeah,
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: I would have thought it, but it was. I mean,
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: my truck has been fantastic. I love the Sucoul and
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: now you can get the eighty four x AV Sierra
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: with all of the off road goodies, and you can
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: now get the three lead diesel again. So it's just
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: like like you can hear the cherubs singing. It's a
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: really amazing truck. The only downside again is payload. You
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: can load those things up to the point where you
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: get pretty low on the payload number, so you get
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: really limited around truck campers. And the fifteen hundred is
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: not warrantied for a truck camper, so you're kind of
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: making a personal decision, like if you do some damage
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: to the bed or whatever, you're out of warranty on that.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: But amazing trucks. It's incredible to see what what they're
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: doing with that real quick. The Maverick Tremor.
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: I love the Maverick.
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: I'm a huge fanboy of the Maverick. They you can
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: buy a four cylinder hybrid front will drive model for
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: about twenty four thousand bucks if you could find one.
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: They get forty miles to the gallon. You have a
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: mini truck. We don't have mini trucks anymore. It's a
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: perfectly sized truck to put in your mulch and your
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: or your mountain bike or your bike or whatever, or
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: even a motorcycle in the back. The Maverick is just
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: super cool. And the Tremor gives it the drive train
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: of the Broncos Sports. So you've got this kind of
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: hookie kind of a locker in the They call it
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: a locker. You actually have a locker button, but it
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: isn't It doesn't give you a mechanical locker. Yes, that's right.
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: And then it has a center differential lock. It's got
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: a larger diameter tire and about a one inch lift.
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: Super fun to drive. I love driving them. I just
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: I'm a huge fanboy of the Maverick. Yeah, I love
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: the fact that we can buy a mini truck again.
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: Go Fast did a cool one where they bought the
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: truck and put the camper on there for less than
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: thirty grand for a brand new vehicle. We're cool with
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: a go Fast camper. That's just to me, that's super fun.
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: Sound like a thirty inch yep Hire, thirty inch tire,
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: little all terrain, little Falcon, Yeah, wild Peak Alterrain.
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: It's such an interesting that that whole set up with
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: the Go Fast is such an interesting thing because it's
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: you're doing that for subar room money. Yeah, and I
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: will tell you the quality of the interior the Maverick
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: at low twenties is the same interior quality as a
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: Raptor in the eighties to nineties, So it presents this
• 46:59
  Speaker 2: very good val you for money.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: I totally.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: I think it's the best product in for its range.
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: And I knew that.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: It took cannot make enough of them. Yeah, it took
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: Cahonis to put that in there because you're like, oh,
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: people want bigger, bigger, more power whatever, or we actually
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: want this.
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: But that's what they did. They released a mini trug
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: for Yeah, totally. Do I say bravo for it? Well,
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: it's an awesome, awesome vehicle. And then the last thing
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: is a little quick update on the Grenadier. I've had
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: a chance to now spend another week in the Grenadier
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: in North American spec Unit rock crawling much higher speeds
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: in the sand hill climbs. I kind of had the
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: vehicle to do whatever I wanted with It just keeps
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: getting more and more impressive to me. It's important to
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: note that the drivetrain is well balanced to the intention
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: of the vehicle, but it's not overly powerful like we've
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: been having so many powerful vehicles in the marketplace. Now,
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: in my mind, it feels very well balanced to the vehicle.
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: I like the seating position, the lockers engage and disengage well,
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: the traction control system works well. The tire size and
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: the suspension dynamics are all really well balanced to the vehicle.
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: So now that I've had some time to kind of
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: have it in the wild, ye I like it even
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: more than the first time I drove it. So the
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: Grenadier keeps getting better and better, and it's getting closer
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: and closer to being available. So by the time this
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: goes live, there's a chance that we're going to have
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: some or see some important announcements. I'm excited.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: I think I think it's it's a return to purpose
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: for like you said, there's a lot of seven hundred
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: horse power pickup trucks out there. Yeah, and I guess
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: there's only two, but you know the point.
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but this this is built for overlanding. And in fact,
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: there's a little plaque on the front of the truck
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: and it's one of my favorite things about it because
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: it shows the intention. It's the mission statement of the business.
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: Built on purpose. Yeah, it is built on purpose to
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: go around the world. It's built on person purpose to
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: go down to Panama. It's built to do those things
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: I'm so excited for. And we get to buy one
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: before we know it. It's just awesome cool. So well,
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: thanks Matt. That's our mashup. Wow. Thanks, we'll have to
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: do another episode just on the vehicles that you've bought
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: and sold.
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: So yeah, it's in a few hours.
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: Thanks Matt. All right, we'll talk to you all next time.