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How Cerebral Palsy Works · Stuff You Should Know

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  Speaker 1: This episode of Stuff you Should Know is brought to
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  Speaker 1: get ten percent off your first purchase. Squarespace set your
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  Speaker 1: website apart. Welcome to you Stuff you Should Know from
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  Speaker 1: House Stuff Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.
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  Speaker 1: I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryan over there,
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  Speaker 1: and we've got guest producer Noel in the house. Uh
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  Speaker 1: throwing a sound effect? Noel, wait to go? Yeah? Um,
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  Speaker 1: I'm assuming he'll do that in post right, Uh yeah?
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  Speaker 1: Or maybe the sound effect is silence. Okay, that's a
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  Speaker 1: lack of sound effect. We'll find Know. It's like when
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  Speaker 1: you're a little kid and you'd have just a blank canvas.
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  Speaker 1: You'd be like, look, I did a picture of a
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  Speaker 1: snowman in a snowstorm. I never did that. Smarty smart,
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  Speaker 1: a little smart alec kid gets what's coming to him,
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  Speaker 1: you know, So, Chuck, do you remember we did a
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  Speaker 1: trivia night like years ago on the roof of Five
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  Speaker 1: Seasons Brewery in Atlanta. Yeah, I remember. Hodgman was there,
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  Speaker 1: Buddy Joe Randazzo, Dave Willis was on our All Star team.
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  Speaker 1: David just looking around like, what's going on? Who are
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  Speaker 1: you guys? Why do they care about you? My publicist
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  Speaker 1: said I should come to this. Um that was fun night.
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  Speaker 1: It was. There's a dude there and he had cerebral palsy.
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  Speaker 1: His name was Kyle pas I remember him. You remember
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  Speaker 1: Kyle kps is what he goes by. And and again
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  Speaker 1: this is what maybe like five years ago, four years ago,
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  Speaker 1: maybe six six, Okay, it was a while ago. Um. Well,
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  Speaker 1: Kyle was like, you guys should totally do one on
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  Speaker 1: cerebral policy. We're like, we totally he should, and we didn't. Well,
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  Speaker 1: I ran into Kyle again when you, me and I
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  Speaker 1: were going to visit a Laurel and Braden's baby at
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  Speaker 1: the hospital because he volunteers at Pimont Hospital. Yes, and
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  Speaker 1: I was like, you look really familiar and he's like,
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  Speaker 1: so do you, and I remembered we'd never done one
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  Speaker 1: on cerebral palsy. Even though we totally said we would.
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  Speaker 1: So I was like, he was like, yeah, he didn't
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  Speaker 1: even say anything. He just looked at me his head. Um. No,
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  Speaker 1: he was super cool about it. He's a cool cat.
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  Speaker 1: Actually he's he's he's a cool guy. Kyle Um actually
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  Speaker 1: does iron Man competitions with his brother who like wheels
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  Speaker 1: them along and his wheelchair. They did the New York
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  Speaker 1: Marathon Um and one of the wheels came off of
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  Speaker 1: Kyle's wheelchair and yeah, like the wheel right, So his
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  Speaker 1: brother is like this kind of like helping move along
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  Speaker 1: and think holding up the axle and U some other
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  Speaker 1: people said, you know what, we don't need to make time,
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  Speaker 1: will just help with this. So like a bunch of
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  Speaker 1: like strangers helped get Kyle across the finish line with
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  Speaker 1: his brother. That would have been me. I would have
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  Speaker 1: been like, why am I running with anything? Anyway, I'll
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  Speaker 1: just be a good guy. Uh. That is amazing. And
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  Speaker 1: you see that. You saw it recently in the Olympics
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  Speaker 1: when athletes will forego their own race to help another. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: that stuff just slays me. Or if they're qualifying and
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  Speaker 1: like the first three or the first five across the
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  Speaker 1: finish line, um go on to the next race. Um,
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  Speaker 1: they'll slow up and like finish at the same time
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  Speaker 1: Jerky noses out in front, right, So yeah, yeah, it's
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  Speaker 1: pretty cool to see that that kind of spirit, right yeah. Man.
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  Speaker 1: So anyway, Kyle Peas, it's got his own foundation. I
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  Speaker 1: think it's Kyle Peas dot org or Kyle Peace Foundation.
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  Speaker 1: Probably should looked it up, but this one's for Kyle. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: and you can google that if you want to look
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  Speaker 1: into his foundation more. Yeah. So we're talking cerebral paul
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  Speaker 1: you right, Yes, And it's something that like I've always
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  Speaker 1: known about. I've known people with cerebral palsy like I
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  Speaker 1: I it's just something you know about. But I had
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  Speaker 1: no idea what was going on with the condition, and
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  Speaker 1: as a matter of fact, I just assumed it was
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  Speaker 1: one specific thing. But it turns out that cerebral palsy
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  Speaker 1: is actually UM basically an umbrella term for a bunch
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  Speaker 1: of different conditions that stem from a bunch of different
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  Speaker 1: um origins. I guess, yeah, causes causes, that was the
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  Speaker 1: word I was looking for. It's not a disease, UM,
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  Speaker 1: and the cause is always a brain injury of some
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  Speaker 1: kind that affects your movement. Yeah, but there can be
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  Speaker 1: all kinds of ways, and we're going to get into
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  Speaker 1: all that obviously. And actually you can develop cerebral palsy
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  Speaker 1: from a disease, but like you said, cerebral p itself
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  Speaker 1: is not a disease. H. If you just off the cuff,
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  Speaker 1: not off the cuff, but at the outset cause stats
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  Speaker 1: about eight Well I was I was gonna say off,
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  Speaker 1: you know it, just starting out with some stats instead
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  Speaker 1: of finishing out but off the cuff. Something makes it
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  Speaker 1: sound like I'm making this up right, right, it's not
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  Speaker 1: true about eight thousand children a year or born with
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  Speaker 1: it every year. Yeah, and I got this from a
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  Speaker 1: Canadian sight, so you know that's good. Yeah, there's legit. Uh.
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  Speaker 1: They say it's the most common childhood physical disability, affecting
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  Speaker 1: about two point five of every one thousand live term
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  Speaker 1: births in twenty two out of every one thousand live
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  Speaker 1: premature births, and it affects more boys than girls. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: I saw premature births in particular um have a higher
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  Speaker 1: incidence of cerebral palsy. And I didn't know if it
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  Speaker 1: was the cerebral palsy caused premature birth, but then I
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  Speaker 1: read it a little more in depth and saw that
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  Speaker 1: actually premature birth is a risk factor for developing cerebral policy. Yes, exactly. Uh,
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  Speaker 1: but with that broadly defined, let's you want to jump
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  Speaker 1: back into a little bit of history. Let's go back
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  Speaker 1: way back in yeah, way back to eighteen fifty three
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  Speaker 1: in fact, with Dr John Little Ums it's hard at work. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: in the same country as Dr Little Doctor Little This
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  Speaker 1: guy was a good dude. He was as a kid,
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  Speaker 1: he was afflicted with a lot of illnesses and he
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  Speaker 1: basically grew up to say, like, you know what, that
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  Speaker 1: was no fun, and so what I'm gonna do is
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  Speaker 1: dedicate my life to to discovering the causes of some
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  Speaker 1: of these things. Although he didn't have some reberal palsy. Um.
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  Speaker 1: He started working in the eighteen thirties, uh, in his
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  Speaker 1: first kind of UM. I guess the first way that
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  Speaker 1: he was actually on the really the right track was
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  Speaker 1: he started doing lectures on birth injuries, which will find out,
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  Speaker 1: as you know, birth injury can be a way that
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  Speaker 1: you can get cerebral palsy. So that's where he was
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  Speaker 1: on the right track at first. But to him, birth
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  Speaker 1: injury was the only way to get cerebral palsy. And
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  Speaker 1: the only way that you could get cerebral palsy from
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  Speaker 1: a birth injury was if you were asphyxiated while you
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  Speaker 1: were being born, correct, which happened and happens right, So
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  Speaker 1: he was right, right. But it turns that the um
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  Speaker 1: that was too narrow of an umbrella that he came
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  Speaker 1: up with. Yeah, and he did these lectures, these really
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  Speaker 1: influential lectures that he later published called on the Nature
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  Speaker 1: and Treatment of the Deformities of the Human Frame, and
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  Speaker 1: um it wasn't called cerebral palsy at the time though,
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  Speaker 1: in fact, they called it Little's disease. He was like, oh, yeah, okay.
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  Speaker 1: A lot of the diseases originally had the doctor's name,
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  Speaker 1: and some of them kept those yeah, you know, like
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  Speaker 1: cop Cross syndrome, remember that one? Yeah, was that named
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  Speaker 1: after Arnold Copcross? Did you just make that up? I
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  Speaker 1: made up the first name, but it was the name.
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  Speaker 1: And morgellons more Gelan's which way do you say it?
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  Speaker 1: You just confused to say you can't even remember now,
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  Speaker 1: Morglon sounds right, but you were saying it because you
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  Speaker 1: were poking fun at me. I think perhaps you don't
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  Speaker 1: even remember now I think I do. I'll just have
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  Speaker 1: to go back and listen the episode because it's documented.
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  Speaker 1: Uh seven is when the term was actually coined by
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  Speaker 1: Sir William Ostler, who wrote Cerebral Policies of the Children.
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  Speaker 1: It was a book and he used a lot of
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  Speaker 1: Little's work UM or built upon Little's work and finally
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  Speaker 1: gave it you know, that lasting name. Yeah, but he
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  Speaker 1: was the only one that was very famous Austrian. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: doctor Freud, Yeah, Freud got it right. Freud had some
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  Speaker 1: theories that UM, that cerebral palsy could be developed or
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  Speaker 1: it could be the result of something that happened during
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  Speaker 1: UM before birth in the mood. Yeah, during development, that's
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  Speaker 1: what I was looking for. UM. And everyone's like, Freud,
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  Speaker 1: go back to your cigars and your mother fixation and
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  Speaker 1: all that. Just leave this to us, including Little. Like
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  Speaker 1: they got a little contentious at times. Yeah, a lot
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  Speaker 1: of contentious for two doctors, that is. Yeah, UM and
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  Speaker 1: uh Freud said, do you take the cigar and you
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  Speaker 1: stick it where the sun don't shine? Maybe so. Uh
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  Speaker 1: So it turns out Freud was right the UM, but
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  Speaker 1: everyone just kind of ignored him until like the first
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  Speaker 1: study that really looked at cerebral palsy and the development
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  Speaker 1: of cerebral palsy from a birth injury, an injury that
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  Speaker 1: occurred during birth. So would that be perinatal. Isn't that
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  Speaker 1: during birth? Neo natal's right after birth, perinatals during right,
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  Speaker 1: So a perinatal injury developing cerebral palsy. Everyone thought it
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  Speaker 1: was a of the cause. It's turns out it's like
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  Speaker 1: ten percent or less, something like five to of births
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  Speaker 1: or of cases of cerebral palsy come from being injured
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  Speaker 1: while you're you're being born. And there's all sorts of
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  Speaker 1: ways you can be injured. Some can happen naturally, like
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  Speaker 1: if you come out breached, UM, if you get stuck
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  Speaker 1: in the birth canal too long, if the doctor is
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  Speaker 1: a little too heavy handed with the four steps, which
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  Speaker 1: is like a horrific thing that can happen. UM. You
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  Speaker 1: can also have a prolapsed umbilical cord where it comes
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  Speaker 1: out before the baby. UM. You can have the umbilical
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  Speaker 1: cord wrap around your neck, and any one of these
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  Speaker 1: things can cut off the blood supply to your brain
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  Speaker 1: or the oxygens supply to your brain, which are effectively
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  Speaker 1: one and the same and either way, your little tiny
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  Speaker 1: brain is like, oh, well, this region's going down because
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: I was just as fixiated for a little while. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: So his work was later, you know, verified, um after
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  Speaker 1: his death. When did Freud die? Uh? Yeah, it was
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: that'd be pretty cool c Freud and a member's only jacket. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: I could see him really living it up in the
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: Disco area, so he would have been at Studio fifty four. Yeah. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: and like yeah, uh. A couple of other folks who
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  Speaker 1: have made a name for themselves by doing a lot
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  Speaker 1: of great work. Leonard and Isabel Goldenson. Their daughter had
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  Speaker 1: cerebral palsy and uh she uh they basically dedicated their
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  Speaker 1: life to it for that reason, to learn more about it,
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  Speaker 1: and um, sadly she passed away at the age of
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  Speaker 1: twenty nine. And they founded co founded the United uh
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  Speaker 1: Cerebral Palsy Association in ninety and they are a really
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  Speaker 1: big organization now s this year the fifth largest health
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  Speaker 1: agency in the United States. Uh. And then in the jeez,
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  Speaker 1: I don't remember the year, but there were some very
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  Speaker 1: famous books written by a woman named Marie uh Khalilia.
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  Speaker 1: So how we're going to say it. I would have said, Kilalia,
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: but Killala if you want to go Hawaiian, gotcha? Uh.
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  Speaker 1: They she wrote a book, a couple of very famous
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  Speaker 1: books on the bestseller list, one called Karen and one
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  Speaker 1: called With Love from Karen that really captured the attention
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  Speaker 1: of uh, the United States at large. And they were
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  Speaker 1: about her daughter's struggle with cerebral palsy. Yeah, and um,
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  Speaker 1: she Karen is still alive today. Oh yeah, She's in
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  Speaker 1: her seventies and is very private and I think works
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: as as a secretary at a monastery or something that
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: is extremely private, something like that you want to you
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: want to keep to yourself. I'd have to put up
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: with any chitch at work. That is where you can
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: get a job probably, so um secluded existence. Right, So
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  Speaker 1: the those I guess you'd call him civilians, non doctors,
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  Speaker 1: UM helped to really kind of expand public awareness of
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  Speaker 1: cerebral policy. Is the impression I have, right, Yeah, and
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  Speaker 1: those books especially, Um, should we take a break. Let's
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: take a break, man, all right, We'll take a break
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  Speaker 1: and we'll get into some of the causes right after this.
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  Speaker 1: All right, before we broke, you said we were talking
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  Speaker 1: about Freud and his um while we were talking about
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  Speaker 1: childbirth injuries being actually accounting for a fairly small amount.
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  Speaker 1: But they used to think because of Dr John Little,
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  Speaker 1: that it was like that was the cause of ceret
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: uh secent at the time. Freud was right, yeah. And
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  Speaker 1: you would think also that doctors, especially um pediatric doctors,
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  Speaker 1: the ones who are doing the deliveries, would be like, yeah, yeah,
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  Speaker 1: Freud's right, it's definitely not birth injury, like the obstitrician right.
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  Speaker 1: They'd like, it's something else that's happening during pregny. It's
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  Speaker 1: not us. But they didn't. They took it. You never know, well,
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  Speaker 1: at the very least it didn't. It didn't happen. And
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  Speaker 1: if you look up, if you look up cerebral palsy
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  Speaker 1: caused by doctor error, like the first eight pages of
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  Speaker 1: Google are nothing but articles on law firm sites, like
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  Speaker 1: every single one. Some of them seem like pretty like
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: well researched articles, well written, but all of them are
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: law firm sites. So like and and by the way,
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: give us a call. Well it's funny later we'll talk
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: about this later. But with uh stem cell therapy, I
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: looked into that some more because it's hard to get
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: accurate information on that, because the first five pages of
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: Google are all about companies that offer trying to get
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: money to do stem cell therapy. You kind of had
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: to wade through that to get to actual facts. So
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: I just I have so many questions that well, we'll
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: get to that later on. Um. And then the remaining
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: what do we say is during pregnancy, five, during child
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: birth injury wise, and then the remaining cases, as we'll
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: see are after birth up to the age of two
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: or three. Well, we'll get to the reasons why. So
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: during pregnancy, there's a lot of stuff that can happen,
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: but typically, um, you're you. You are either the baby
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: comes down with a disease or an injury, or um,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: the mother has a disease that affects the baby's development. Right. Yeah,
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: it could be a condition and infection and disease. We've
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: talked about toxoplasmosis. Yeah, why you shouldn't change out the
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: cat litter if you're pregnant, right. Uh, toxoplasmosis can lead
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: to your baby being born with three bow policy. Uh
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: and uh. Rubella used to be a big problem and
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: a huge cause of um cerebral palsy until they developed
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: the vaccine for it, that's right? What is it? Musle
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: momps rubella MMR. Wasn't there a good band like that
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: called m m R? No, you would know. I think
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: there was. As a matter of fact, I know there was.
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: I'm just not that familiar with His eyes darted at
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: you as if to say, did he just say my name? Uh?
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: He still hasn't acknowledged us. That's all right? Um? What else? Epilepsy? Um,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: diabetes and epilepsy. If your mother has that, they have
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: higher chance, higher risk of having a baby with the
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: CP right, and all of these things have um a
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: couple of different effects like or there's different different effects
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: that these diseases or injuries can have on the baby's development.
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: For for starters, when you are building your tiny little
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: brain in the womb, it starts out as you start out,
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: is just a single cell, right, that starts dividing fertilized
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: cell that starts going haywire, but not haywire, haywire in
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: a very structured manner. Okay, Um, Well, eventually it gets
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: to the neural tube. And the neural tube is this
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: little uh roly poly cluster of cells that on one
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: end develops into the brain. And then the other end
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: develops into the spinal cord. And then as it's developing,
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: the cells divide more and more and they actually become specialized,
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: and they migrate to the root, to these different areas
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: of the brain and make up different parts of the brain,
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: different reasons of the brain. Right if at any point
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: any of that gets messed up, where there's like a
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: problem with the migration or some of the cells don't
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: develop correctly, they there seems to be a pattern that
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: they can follow where parts of the brain that direct
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: movement in the muscles have they they tend to cluster
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  Speaker 1: in a um in a in a way that that
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: gets affected with another place more than other ways. And
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: that's and they don't know when policy, No, they don't,
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  Speaker 1: which is a pretty big mystery. You'd think would be
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  Speaker 1: like just a random roll of the dice, what you know,
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: what was affected by these different conditions and diseases and injuries.
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  Speaker 1: But it does seem to kind of fall on the
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: spectrum toward um the conditions that make up cerebral palsy.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: It's really interesting, it is, it's it's odd and and
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: again they have no idea why. Hopefully they will one
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: day well, I wonder if it you know, there would
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: just be a different condition if it was in a
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: different area to bring though, you know, you know that mean,
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: does that make any sense? Yeah, no, it does. But
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: and then maybe there are conditions out there there we
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: just aren't aware of, but everybody else knows about that.
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: It is like, oh, if you're if you're um, your
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: neurons don't migrate in this way, you have this condition.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: If they don't migrate in this way, you have cerebral palsy.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: I see what you're saying. Uh, So there are some
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: pre that see specific conditions that can cause cp UM
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: once called uh preclampsia, and that's when you it's a
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: disorder that causes high blood pressure and the mother that's
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: going to affect the blood flow to the umbilical cord.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: And again all this goes it all goes back to
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  Speaker 1: the same problem, which is the baby are developing fetus
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: not getting enough blood and oxygen. Yeah, or the neurons
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: didn't migrate to the right way there was either a
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: problem with development or the developed cells were starved of oxygen.
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: And then apparently when that happens, they form holes in
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: the brain holes fill with water. And then get covered
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: over and they become cysts. Yeah that's allegion, man. Yeah,
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: so sad. We talked about our h factor and compatibility
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: in our blood podcasts, which is one of our good ones. Yeah,
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: the blood one. Yeah, oh yeah, I love that one.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: But um, if that happens when the mother's blood type
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: is uh not compatible with the with the babies, uh,
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: that can result in jaundice. Jaundice can lead if it's
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: severe enough and they don't get the good treatment, that
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: can lead to a certain kind of brain damage that
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: we're called uh cause CP, it's called cronic terrorists. I'm
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: gonna go with a silent C on that one. I'm
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: gonna make it a hard see cronic. I know we
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: we sometimes look these things up. I don't want to, no,
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying, uh, I've tried to get better about
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: looking at pronunciations. Um. And we've had offers from people
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: in the medical field. Ye like give me an email,
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: I'll let you know. But it's become part of our show.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: No disrespect intended. Uh. And we already talked about birth injury,
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: which is one of the in the five percent range. Yeah,
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: five five to ten percent, right, Yeah, what I say.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: I mean, you're in there part about fifty of all
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: kids was born with ribal palsy were born prematurely. Right,
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: there's that premature birth being a risk factor for cerebral policy. Yeah, exactly,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: it's so. Yeah, it's not the other way around, right,
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: But the article on the site makes it. It seems
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: like it's it is the other way around the way
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: the sentence is structured. Yeah, I agree. Um, but you can,
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: like we mentioned, um and and it's all very sad,
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: but you can have a great birth, completely healthy baby,
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: and then you can get cerebral palsy due to an
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: injury at the age of like two, or if you
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: almost drowned, or if you choke on something that that
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: oxygen is interrupted, you can acquire I guess it's a quire. Yeah,
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: it would that would be a choir uh CP, you know,
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: as late as three years old. And the reason why
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: it doesn't you can't acquire cerebral palsy at age twenty
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: or something like that because your brain's developed by that. Yeah.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: I think your brain is fully developed by three to
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: five years after you're born, so you wouldn't. You would
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: just have I guess a certain level of brain damage,
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: it wouldn't qualify as cerebral palsy. And the reason why
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: it wouldn't qualify cerebral policies because cerebral palsy describes the
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: symptoms basically of a specific type of brain damage that
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: occurs during the brain's development, and again it affects the
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: muscles in their movement and control of it. Yeah. The
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: other couple of ways, um that you can get it
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: through injury after birth or meningitis. And then the satising
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: on earth shaking baby syndrome, which we need to do
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: a whole episode on that. That's a very controversial, UM thing.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: Controversial how there's there's a lot of people out there
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: say it's not a real thing, that people are being
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: put in prison for something based on junk science. Interesting, Yeah,
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: there's a um some somebody, some group of people made
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: a documentary about it, and they offered to send us
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: a link to it to watch it privately. What I mean,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: obviously they're not saying shaking her baby is fine. They're
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: just saying it doesn't lead to brain damage. No. I
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: think they're saying like there isn't a there isn't so, yeah,
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: there isn't such a thing. As this shaking baby syndrome.
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: I don't know what the documentarians are saying because I
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: haven't seen the documentary, but I have read other articles
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: about it. Um Man, I wish I could remember the
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: name of it. I'll tweet it or something like that.
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: But there there's this um really great long form article
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: about this couple I think in Dallas who's baby like
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: injured himself and the dad just the E M. T.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: S came in and thought that the house the scene
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: looked kind of weird and didn't like the way the
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: dad was acting, and all of a sudden, the guys
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: in prison now for years because he was convicted of right.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: I thought you were saying that people contend to contend
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: that shaking your baby like that can't lead to uh,
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: these kinds of injuries and brain damage. I think some
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: people do. I think some people are saying, like, like, weird,
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: shaking baby syndrome is not an actual thing. Interesting. Yeah,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: well that's what I'm saying. We need to do a
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: whole episode. I have to look in at that. My
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: gut reaction is it's child abuse. Affecting the baby's head
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: not have an impact if it's severe enough. I think yes,
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: you could shake your baby until it gets until your
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: baby has a concussion or has some sort of brain
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: damage or injury. Right. I think what what the critics
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: of shaking baby syndrome are saying is that the current understanding,
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: the current scientific understanding, where if you see this, this
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: and this and a baby, especially a child who's just
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: died under mysterious circumstances, it was the parent who shook
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: it touch and so send the parent to jail. And
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: they're saying, no, that's junk science. You can't send people
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: to jail based on the criteria that we're currently using
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: and sending people to jail with. Not Yeah, shake a
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: baby as hard as you can, you'll never give it
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: a concussion or kill it like That's that's not what
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: they're saying now. They're saying, like the science, the scientific
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: understand people being wrongly convicted when there was no abuse
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: going on. Right that, So there's a witch hunt and
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: it's based on junk science. Man, we gotta do one now.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: I mean, we definitely just teased it enough. Theing. Uh
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: so here's a we we have this little sidebar in
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: the article that I had to look into a little
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: more about magnesium sulfate UH. In the New England Journal
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: of Medicine in two thousand and eight, they did UM.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: They published an article about a study about if you
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: have a high risk of preterm delivery and you know
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: this and you're given magnesium sulfate, the mother is UH.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: It cut the rate of CP and half UM and
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: I looked up in studies. Basically what I came down
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: to is this is and this was from that same
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: Canadian website. It said that if you do know, there
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: are two things to treatments to minimize it in newborns
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: UM and one is magnesium sulfate if you know ahead
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: of time that you're at risk and you like, get
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: on it, it's amazing. And then therapeutic hypothermia, which we've
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: thought about before. Yeah, that's stuffs magic minimize the damage
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: due to lack of oxygen or blood supply, which well
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: that one makes sense, Yeah, because it's it's UM like
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: they they will freeze you or bring you pretty close
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: to freezing to keep you from going from suffering brain
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: damage because it lowers your metabolism, so you need less oxygen.
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: And if your oxygen deprived and they lower or your
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: metabolism it's interesting. Yeah, that is that was a great episode.
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: Two that was therapeutic hypothermia. So the magnesium sulfate does
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: check out. That's really astounding. But again it has to
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: be given with the you know, well in advance. So
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: is it like a course of treatments or is it like, here,
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: take the shot of magnesium sulfate and you'll be fine
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: for the rest of the pregnancy. You know, I'm not sure.
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: My inclination from reading it was that it was a
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: course of treatments, like you're on it during the pregnancy.
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: But I might be wrong, but I think that's I
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: think that's a deal. You want to take a break, Yeah,
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: and then we'll talk a little bit about what's going
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: on with the muscles, all right, Chuck, So we talk muscles.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: Let's talk muscles. So we talked about all the ways
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: you can get cerebral palsy acquired or develop it. I
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: guess get works right, sure, um. But the actual way
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: that cerebral palsy is categorized is by the types of
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: symptoms you have, and they're generally um carved into three
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: types of cerebral palsy. They're spastic, there is um a
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: taxic right, Yeah, and then um, the third type is
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: ethnoid dyskinetic and spastic is by far the largest group
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: of cerebral palsy. Should we talk about SPECIs space spasticity? Nice?
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: The tooth is coming? Are you psyched? I am psyched?
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Ready for my s is to be a little more contained,
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying? Uh, Spasticity is the word. Uh,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: And you send off that you sent over this little addendum.
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: I think it really kind of helps understand how it
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: all works. Uh. Spasticity is basically the the tension in
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: your muscle, and you always have this going on. Otherwise
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: we would just be laying down the floor at all times.
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: Like you might not feel like your muscles are tens
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: or doing anything, but your muscles are tensed if you're
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: sitting upright and you're or you're walking around or you're
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: doing anything. Yeah, there's there's like a real um conversation
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: going on between your spinal cord and the muscles themselves,
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: the nerve fibers and the muscles themselves saying, hey, we're
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: getting a little too contracted here. Why don't you send
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: us a little hit of relaxation. And so your muscles
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: are just constantly alternating to keep you sitting upright, to
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: let you talk, to do anything you use your muscles for.
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: There's this interplay between tension and relaxation of the muscles
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: and all that's called tone. Yeah. And the really interesting
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: thing is that when you're the actual message for increasing
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: that tone comes from the muscle. Yeah. I was fascinated
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: by that. To the message to decrease, it comes from
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: the brain, which is weird. Yeah, because the muscles saying, hey,
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: tell me to to to tighten. Yeah. Well it's like
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: just do yourself. Pal Is there no brain involved there
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: at all? I'm always having to hold your hand. Here
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: is said, it goes directly from the muscle to the
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: spinal cord. Yeah, it's crazy. I would think the brain
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: would be involved. I think the brain gives the spinal
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: cord a lot of leeway and stuff like that, like
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: you take you got this right, you got you got this,
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: you know what you're doing. But like, uh, like I
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: said that, the brain is what tells the muscle to relax.
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: And when you have the damaged in cerebral palicy, when
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: you have the damage to the brain, it's not sitting
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: the right message. Then you have an overworked uh not overworked,
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: but the muscle is is doing the message sending only
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: because the muscles um, neurons or sensory fibers are fine.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: So they're getting their message across loud and clear. But
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: the other message that's part of that interplay, that conversation
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: to relax, is not coming through. So in um, in
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: spastic cerebral palsy, you have muscles that are basically constantly rigid,
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: and it may or may not be accompanied with by
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: tremors right um, and the the outcome, the result of
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: a constantly tensed to muscle um is is ultimately a deformity,
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: like the the limb might shrink, UM, the bone itself
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: can become twisted. Uh, there's a lot of things that
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: can happen from just I mean just flex your forearm
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: for for thirty seconds, like imagine that all the time,
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: like un relenting lee. That's what spastic cerebral palsy is.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: So it's it's not like a child who was born
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: with spastic cerebral palsy comes out with limbs that are
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: um that are malformed or deformed. Um. The that that
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: actually is the result of years, even just a few
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: years of that constantly contracted muscle. Well, yeah, but we
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: should point out though it's not a degenerative disease, it
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: doesn't get worse over time, No, it doesn't. But the
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: these because it happens as your body is developing. If
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: your muscles developed like that, um like the the that
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: will that will get worse until it develops into I
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: think a certain equilibrium about of people get the spastic kind.
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: And there are three uh sub groups within that. One
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: is quadra uh sorry, quadra plegia. And that's when all
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: four limbs or effect did. You might have seizures and tremors. Uh,
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: you might not be able to talk, You might not
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: be able to walk right, might be wheelchair bound. And
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: that's the most severe. Uh yeah, because again like I'm
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: using a bunch of different muscles right now to talk
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: and uh swallow, eat, bring food to my mouth, Uh,
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: do anything anything you need to use your your muscles
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: for if you are a quadriplegic cerebral palsy, So for
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: you are you it's all up for grabs. Yeah you
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: you there there. You might not you might be able
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: to do very little, that's true. Uh. Himoplegia, which is
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: one side of the body, and as we've talked about
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: the brain, it's usually affects the opposite side from where
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: the injury is. You might have to have braces on
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: your legs. Um, your limbs might grow at different rates,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: but you probably can walk. Um. And then the final
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: subgroup of the spastic kind of uh daplegia, and that's
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: the lower part of the body only. Um, you might
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: be a toe walker if you've ever heard of that.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: That doesn't necessarily mean if you're a tell walker that
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: U f c P because there are other causes of
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: toe walking. Oh really, yeah, that's unusual. Yeah. I had
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: a friend actually whose daughter was a toe walker, and um,
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: I don't know that I've ever seen that. Like, in
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: researching this, I was trying to bring it to mine.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever seen anybody to walking. Yeah,
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: she's exactly what it sounds like. Yeah, walking on your
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: tippy toes. But it's it's no good for balance, Like, um,
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: it's not just like oh that's a that's charming. Yeah,
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: I mean it actually affects their their balance like big time.
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: Because I can imagine um and and like there you know,
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: she's constantly moot in motion basically like she could never
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: just stand still because you know, get on your tippy toes.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: That's what it would be like. And um, she eventually
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: had a surgery. Um, hers wasn't CP and she had
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: I guess something elongated to allow her attendant or something.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: I'm not exactly her, but then you know, it fixed
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: it and she could like stand still for the first
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: time in her life. So like her ten was too short,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: which made which brought her up on her tips. So
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: I don't remember exactly, but I think that's the way
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: he described it. But um, scissoring too is another thing.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: If your your legs cross. Um, Yeah, like when you
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: when you pick a baby up and they cross their
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: legs immediately, that could be an early sign number two
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: DISCONNECTICU at thetoid and those aren't. You can call it
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: either one. I think right, this is a banner moment.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: We just agreed on pronunciation. Pronunciation. Everybody do a shot. Uh.
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: This can result in involuntary movements that are usually slower,
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: usually in the arms, and they're repetitive, so it looks
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: like a tick almost but the right let me suck
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: your blood. Um. The big difference with this one, though,
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: is that your tone is usually um, decreased, You're you're
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: not contract well, it can be either they can be
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: rigid or or they describe it and here is loosen floppy. Okay,
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: so let me ask you this then, chuck, is that
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: loosen floppy and then rigid in the same patient Like
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: it's going from alternating from one to the other or
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: to somebody could have loosen floppy tone or rigid tone
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: and they could both still have athtoid dyskinetic. Uh, this
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: is a good question. I don't know. I mean, if
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: you read the literal sentence, sometimes are muscles are STIFFI rigid,
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: other times they're loosen floppy. Makes it sound like one
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: person can have these. It can come and go. Maybe, Uh,
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: who knows. Yeah, I guess we'll never know. Someone let
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: us know. You'd think we would know. Uh, you may
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: actually have difficulty walking, talking, eating, basic motor skills might
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: be affected if you have this kind And then finally,
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: a taxi a taxic CP. It's the least common five um.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: And this is like when you have trouble with your
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: fine motor skills, like you might not be able to
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: write well or you know, you might have trouble walking. Uh,
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: you can walk, but you might have trouble with your balance.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: M hm. And uh. This one has another interesting side
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: effect called an intention tremor. And that's when it's it's
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: very specific to like you have an intention like I
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: want to go pick up that cup of coffee, Like
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: your hand might be fine and not have a tremor,
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: but when you go to do something with it specifically,
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: it will start a tremor, right, which has to be
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: really frustrated. Oh yeah, I can't imagine, but it makes
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: sense if if if a taxi um affects the fine
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: motor skill, I mean it takes increasingly more UM fast
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: twitch muscles too. When you finally do go to grasp
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: and pick something up, then it does just move your
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: arm toward it, you know. And you can have a
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: mix of these as well. And these are not this
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: isn't like you as spastic as the worst, and atotoid
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: is the second worst, and then a taxic is the lightest.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: You can have UM, mild or severe versions in each
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: of these. It just describes what what the symptoms are,
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: what areas are affected, and how they're affected. Yeah, and
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: I get the feeling. It all comes down to the
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: severity of that initial brain injury. It does. I read
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: somewhere that cerebral palsy. There's no two cerebral palsy cases alike,
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: because the region of the brain that's affected is a
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: factor when it's affected in the development of the brain.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: And then how how how the whether it was safe
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: from a disease that the mother had or an injury
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: that occurred a couple of years after birth. Um, So
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: every person with cerebral palsy is a special little snowflake.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: That's true. Um. In terms of diagnosis, when you're a baby,
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: doctors will look at things like weak muscles or very
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: tight muscles. When your baby crawls, if one leg kind
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: of drags behind, that could be an early sign. Talked
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: about the scissoring already in the in the toe walking,
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: or any kind of really bad posture, difficulty balancing, um,
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: which is can be tricky because you know, babies don't
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: have great balance to begin with, so you know, diagnosing
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: it is uh. Eventually they're gonna get you in a
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: in a brain scan if they really think that, you know,
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: your symptoms might be leading down that road, right, and
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: there's like a there's a fine line to walk as
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: a parent between freaking out over nothing or unnecessarily and
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: getting it early because basically every course of treatment for
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: dealing with cerebral palsy and managing it because again it's
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: it's incurable that literally the damage is done, but you
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: can treat and manage the symptoms. The earlier you catch
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: it that the better the outcome you can possibly have
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: from that treatment. Things like UM, working on muscle muscle
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: muscle development, UM massages are really big. Yeah, teaching a
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: little kid yoga and even like if you can, if
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: you can um uh diagnose cerebral palsy as an infant,
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: you'll want to start like working out, pumping those legs.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: Just UM, we're just really working on the muscle development
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: has a big impact on the child's life later on. Uh.
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: Some of the things UM with the other kinds of
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: the uh attoid diskinetic CP, which like I said, could
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: result in trouble breathing and speaking and eating, they're gonna
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: be doing a lot of therapy with a speech language
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: pathologists UM, different modes of communication, occupational therapy. UH, so
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: they can learn how to feed themselves. UM. And again
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: the two are alike. So it's really going to depend
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: on the severity. That's what kind of therapies are gonna need. Right.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: And one other thing too about catching this early chuck
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: is that the brain again is still developing, which means
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: it's highly plastic, so you can actually find novel ways
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: to do stuff without using say your arm for your leg.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: Like there was a very famous guy named Christy Brown.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: Oh is that my left foot? Yeah? Yeah, yeah. He
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: had severe cerebral palsy and his left foot would follow
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: the commands from his brain, so he didn't he created
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: art with his left foot. Man, what a movie that was.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: I never saw it. It's pretty good. Yeah, he's an
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: Irish poet and artists, I believe. I think it just
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: any Daniel day Lewis movie, it's just a must. He's
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: one of those. He's like the brando like you, you
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: just have to see it. Sure, you know, what are
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: you about to say? What do you think of my
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: left fock? Dentil They Louise as Lincoln. He's so good though,
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: it's just ridiculous. That was That was the line that
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: clinched the oscar that year. What do you think of
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: my left foot? You know, he's the one that goes
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: so far and deep into the method that like, you know,
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: I think when he was on what movie was it
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: where he basically worked as a like a nineteen century carpenter.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: Don't know he like jumped Was he in the Crucible? No?
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: I think it has Gary Oldman, Well, they might have
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: both been in there. No, he's in the Scarlet Letter
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: one of the know it sounds like Dan day Lewis.
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: He basically jumped in with the set carpenters, and I
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: was like, I'm gonna help build these sets with my
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: old school Like great, Yeah, that's great, Mr day Lewis,
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: we'd love to have you. Yeah, now bring in the
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: real one. Right after builds it, he just falls over
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: as he's walking away. Job well done. What accent would
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: you like me to try? Now? Uh? Drugs, Yes, they
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: use drugs sometimes. Muscle relaxers can help with the spasticity.
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: Benzo diazepines like valium. Yeah, I thinks annex is one
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: of those. The problem is is you're giving those two
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: two or three year old Yeah, and they're on like
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: volume all the time. There's there's undesirable side effects of it,
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: but they do work. Apparently. Botox is like killing it. Yeah,
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: and it's a it's FDA approved now is an off
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: label use. So um botox is it's the botulin toxin, right,
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: but it paralyzes muscles. So if you and if you
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: inject botox into a spastic muscle, UM, it relaxes it
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: and it lasts apparently for months UM for treatments, and
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: it might not just be like okay, everything's all all good,
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: but it's gonna definitely reduce the effects of the spasticity
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: UM enough that it's a it's a pretty good treatment UM.
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: And they apparently are not finding many harmful side effects
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: at all with it. That's great. Yeah, we should do
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: one on botox, Okay, I know with it. We had
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: a listener right in and say, I started keeping count
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: how many times you said that? And I'm up to
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: like seventy or eighty and if we could remember him?
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: And I was like, well, what's the list? He said, Oh,
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: I'm not writing them down. I've just been making notches
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: on my cave wall. And I was like, well, what
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: good are you? We need a list we can't keep.
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: He might start writing, well, I keep the list of
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: my own blood. I can't write the titles some children
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: you might have a pump permanently, well maybe not permanently,
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: but a pump implanted in your abdomen permanently once you
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: get old enough to deliver a constant stream of a
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: drug called backloaf in. It's an anti spasmodic. Apparently it
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: works really well, really, but you can overdose from it,
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: which is not good. So what does that mean, Like
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: the pump better work? Right? Yeah, it's automatic. Wow, that's scary.
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: Probably shouldn't connected. Let it be connectible the Bluetooth or
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: anything hackable too, I would agree with that. And then
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: surgeries you talked earlier about your bones becoming twisted. They
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: can untwist them surgically. Yeah, they will, um, I guess,
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: probably cut them in two and then just twist them
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: around so that they're aligned in a in a straight line. Again. Yeah,
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: if you think about it, like the fact that that
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: works is astounding. Yeah, that's a pretty primitive operation if
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: you think about it, like, can you really think about
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: the nuts and bolts of it. It's, well, the bone
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: twisted this way, so we're gonna cut it in two
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: and then reset it so that it's back to the
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: way it's supposed to be. It sounds like something of
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: Barber would have thought exactly, That's exactly what I was
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: thinking of Barber. Surgeon. Have you heard about the head
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: transplant that's happening. Oh no, yeah, dude. Is it Rosie Greer? No,
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: I'm not even sure what that means. Uh, the thing
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: with two heads? It was Ray Milan and Rosie Greer.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: I think the Man with Two Heads, the Steve Martin
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: movie Man with Two Brains. This is this is the
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: thing with two heads Ray Milan, and I think it's
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: and it might not be Rosy Grey, could be Jim Brown.
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: Is it a movie, Oh dude, Yeah, it's like a
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: Saturday shocker. No, this is a but real surgery. I need.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's happening very soon if it hasn't already.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: And I read about it on one of our UK flights.
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: There's a surgeon that is I think he's Italian. That is,
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: he's found a body donor, which is a body on
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: life support with no chance of coming off life support,
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: and he is taking the head off of the man
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: who needs help putting it on this body. Supposedly there
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: are he is roundly being called a quack and a
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: lot of circles. But the doctor said, yeah, those same
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: people are calling me quack, are also calling me up
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: and saying like, how are you doing this? Like tell me, like,
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: is it possible? They'll I'll be licking my boots when
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: this is over. Maybe. I mean it's I couldn't believe
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: what I was reading. When I was reading this, Um,
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: they freeze, I think, the body and the head, and
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: there's like an hour that they have to get this
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: thing reattached and the blood flowing and the nerves connected.
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: And to make it worse, they play the Jeopardy theme
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: exactly that. Uh So this guy, I can't remember what
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: affliction he has, but it's um, it's well, no, it's
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: something sort of like this in it he has no
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: uh but I think it's degenerative where he has no
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: control over his own body. Oh is it a l S.
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: Leuke Garrick's disease. Don't think it's a l S. I wonder.
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: And the guy was volunteering, saying, you know, I might
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: very well die, but he's like, somebody's got to go first. Man,
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: I'm willing to. Yeah. The number of like nerves and
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: blood vessels and everything that you would have to connect
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: the spinal column to the brain, Like, how would you
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: even do that? I don't know, man, I mean it does.
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: It seemed like botox crazy science when I was reading it,
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: and while means it might be. I gotta check that out. Yeah,
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: that's amazing. I mean we're gonna do it sooner or later. Yeah,
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: it's just insane that it's happening now. Well, I thought
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: for sure in the twenties at the earliest. Yeah, he
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: called it head transplant, but once I read it, it's
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: feels more like a body transplant. I guess. Yeah, tomato
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: tomato head transplant sounds awesomer. That's probably why I picked it. Um,
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: where were we? Oh, surgeries, they're also surge reas if
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: you have severe spasticity. UM where they actually identify nerve
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: fibers and cut those is called selective dorsal uh rise
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: rise toemy. Yeah, and um that's a last resort surgery though. Yeah,
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: it's not like that's something that would go to right away. Yeah,
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: because I would imagine once you cut a nerve to
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: your muscle, like you can't use that muscle anymore. But
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: if it's been spastic your whole life, you're probably like, fine, fine,
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: just cut it. I'm sick of it. And then the
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: cord blood therapy, which we talked about earlier. What I
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: found was this, currently there are no approves them self
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: therapies for treating scruble palsy, so I think they're all
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: in clinical trials. Um. And it's interesting this Canadian website
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: said if you research this uh across the website, you
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: will come across companies that say otherwise and offer fee
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: based treatment, which is what I found, which is super
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: sad and the worst thing to prey on people that
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: are willing to pay whatever on something that may or
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: may not work. So these aren't approved. They are in
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: trials though, and they're seeing uh if either your own
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: cord blood. And one of the problems is people are
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: starting to bank their cord blood more now, but it
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: wasn't a very common thing, so people like, oh, I
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: don't have any chord blood, so they think that sibling
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: cord blood could um or sibling stem cells. What do
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: they call those, like savior babies or something like that. Yeah,
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: something like that, but um, it's not quite there, but
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: it could be at some point. It's fascinating. Yeah, although
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: it's a tough act to follow. The head transplant well, sure,
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: you know, I have a feeling that this guy won't
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: ever you know, he probably won't do a lot of
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: medicinal practicing if if it doesn't go well, No, who knows,
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: he'll go back to like merging pigs and orange and tanks.
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: It's sort of what it sounded like. Uh, your life
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: expectancy is normal if you have CP, um, but like
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: you indicated, you could have worshening mobility over the years. Right.
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: And we should also say I think a lot of
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: people assume that people with cerebral palsy have um intellectual disabilities.
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: They very well may. If the brain or if the
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: blood supply or oxygen supplies cut off to your brain. Uh,
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: that can lead to intellectual disabilities. That's almost co morbid though,
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: right or co occurring co occurring? Did you see somebody
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: write that in They were like, Chuck, don't worry. There's
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: another term for it, like occurring because it's not necessarily
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: because the CP, it's because of the brain injury. Right. Um,
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: so it would be co occurring. Right. Um, So some
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: people who have CP also have an intellectual disability. You
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: would be very much mistaken to assume that all people
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: who have CP have an ellect disability. And I think
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: you could probably bet that most people who have CP,
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: who you talk to like they have an intellectual disability,
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: would resent that tremendously because they are typically of average
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: intelligence or even above average intelligence. Yeah. Imagine that's a
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: big struggle. Yeah, especially if you have this condition called
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: dis arthria where you can't speak because you can't control
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: those muscles. So people just assume that, um, since you
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: can't speak, you have an intellectual disability. Or do you
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: remember Jerry Jewel? Jerry from Facts of Life and she
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: was also in dead Wood too. Oh yeah, she played Jewel,
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: who I think was like an innkeeper or tavern lady
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: or something like that. She didn't have intellectual disabilities, but
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: people assumed she did because she had a certain amount
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: of disarthria. Uh. Same with Josh Blue another comedian. By
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: the way, Jerry started out doing stand up in the seventies.
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: Oh no, I remember that. Um, Josh Blue one last
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: comic standing I think. Really he's a very famous stand
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: up comedian who has cerebral palsy. Uh what about r J. Middy? Yeah,
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: we both wrote him down. If you look at the note,
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: are J. Middy is at the top. He's at the top.
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: If you have seen Breaking Bad and you know, uh
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: and love Flynn or Walter White Jr. People loved him
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: or they hated him. I thought he was great. Yeah,
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: he was like I mean what you know, he's a
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: handsome kid, he's a good actor, and why not put
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: someone in there? Like I think people are like, well,
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: why why did they? Why does he have cerebral palsy? Like,
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: why not? Because people have it? And as soon as
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: we normalize this by just saying I'm sure put him
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: in that role, why not exactly like it? It had
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: no impact on the show. It might have. I mean
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: maybe there was an extra vulnerability that the family felt
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: as a protectors, But I think that humanized them even
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: more rather than it added certainly in an extra amount
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: of depth to their characters. Yeah. Have you heard of
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: Abby Nicole Curran? She was missing, she represented I was
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: She was Miss Iowa for the Miss USA two thousand
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: eight pageant um already mentioned Christy Brown, my left foot guy. Uh,
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: there's a dude named Jerry Trailer who jogged across the
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: United States on his crutches. Jogged across the US on
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: his crutches, um and then Stephen Hopkins had cerebral palsy
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: and he signed the Declaration of Independence and he had
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: this awesome quote, my hand trembles, my heart does not.
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: I love that guy. And then lastly, if you want
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: to um, just kind of see what it's like to
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: live with cerebral palsy. There are a lot of um
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: online journals Facebook pages of people who are more than
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: happy to tell you about it. I came across one
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: called CP Daily Living UM and it it's the written
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: by the mom of a nine year old girl named
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: Maya who has cerebral palsy. And like it's it's extremely
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: uplifting and inspiring and then heart wrenching and just neat
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: to just kind of peek in on this girl's life.
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: She's the new Karen. That's why those books captured America's attention,
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: because it's it's really just about the ins and outs
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: of your life. Yeah, this is this is exactly what
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: it's like. UM. Yeah, it's a it's a neat blog
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: for sure. So cerebral Palsy get off our backs, Kyle, Okay,
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: and uh. Cerebral Palsy Awareness Month I believe is March.
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: We're coming out in September. Were either late or we're early.
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: We're both. Yes. If you want to know more about
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: cerebral palsy, go online. You can also type those words
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: in the search bar. How stuff, we're dot com. And
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: since I said search bar, it's time for listener mail.
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this clearing up a couple of things
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: about ice. Is this about ice? No, but we should
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: go ahead an issue that. Um, there was a gaff
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: about ice being more dense than water, the one liquid
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: that's that's not And first of all, we want to
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: thank Actually, let me take that back because that's probably wrong,
• 56:26
  Speaker 1: and we'll get listen to mail about that. First of all,
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: we want to thank the forty two people who sent
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: us messages and nineteen and counting what one just came in,
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: we should have a counter d um. But if you
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: listen to our Icebergs podcast, Josh very eloquently explains the
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: correct thing. Oh I just forgot in depth in the
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: Icebergs podcast. So thanks man. How did you know that
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: you remembered it well? Now, someone said, Josh, you you
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: did a great job explaining it correctly in the Icebergs podcast,
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: and yeah, it's just well goof. But like at this
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: point a marionette of knowledge. It just lurched from one fact, well,
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: proof that things get jumbled up. There after eight and
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: fifty something shows. You know, I gotta go back and
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: listen to Icebergs again. Remember that one, Just like when
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: you go to bed and I put it on under
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: your pillow and just curl up. A single tear rolls
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: down my cheek and freezes. Um. All right, hey, guys,
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: just want to see your podcast has been an absolute
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: revelation for me. I've avoided podcasts for the last decade somehow,
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: but I started a new job with an hourly commute.
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: We're the commuter's best friend, uh, and picked up you
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: guys is my first one? Anyway, you're pretty much you
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: were pretty full of info. I thought I posed a
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: question that I came up with in the shower. Is
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: it better to hear good news first or bad news?
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: I could see good news being better first, so bad
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: news would be softened, but the opposite could make sense,
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: helped take your mind off the bad news once you've
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: heard the good news. Any thoughts, Uh, definitely, it's a
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: personal preference bad news first. Yeah, I'm a bad news
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: first guy too. Yeah, let's get it out of the way.
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: I want to know the bad first and then yeah,
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: there's a treat coming afterward. Yeah, you know, you get
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: this sugar with the medicine. Yeah, like Mary Poppins. All right,
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: I agree. Um. Mostly I want to tell you, guys
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: how much you've enriched my life, um, by not only
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: making my commute better, but teaching me about topics that
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: had no idea. We're so fascinating. Like so you get
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: a lot of emails like this, but from the bottom
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: of my heart, I want to say thank you for
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: what you do. And that is Jacob Beasley. And there's
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: another question. Okay, well this is a ps. What's the
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: difference between a fact and a factoid? I always thought
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: a factoid in a statement of the pierced true, that
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: isn't you guys use a lot. I'm sure you. I'm
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: sure I'm incorrect, Jacob, You're not. We are factoid Now,
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: factoids one of those words because language evolves as a
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: living thing that now has officially two meanings. Norman Mailer
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: invented the term factoid in the seventies like truthiness, yeah,
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: sort of, but his original definition was a piece of
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: information becomes accepted as fact even though it's not true. Um,
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: that sounds like Norman Mailer all over totally. But since
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: then it is evolved, it can mean just a insignificant
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: little fact, right, like a nugget. Yeah, it's it's evolved
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: into what it sounds like. Finally. Yeah, so language evolves, people,
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: it does, man, octopi, octopusses, octopods, take your take your pick,
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: and stop being weirdos about it. Yeah, pedantry is no
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: fun for anyone. It's not. If you want to hang
• 59:49
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• 59:52
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• 59:54
  Speaker 1: K podcast. You can hang out with me at Josh
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: Underscore UM Underscore Clark. You can hang out on face
• 1:00:00
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• 1:00:02
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• 1:00:07
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• 1:00:10
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• 1:00:21
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