Latest / 2nd City Gridiron / Bears Banter Ep. 252: Brendan Sugrue joins to discuss the Packers debacle, looking ahead, Mike Ditka

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Bears Banter Ep. 252: Brendan Sugrue joins to discuss the Packers debacle, looking ahead, Mike Ditka · 2nd City Gridiron

• 0:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: That's right, bear it out, bear it's way it's time for another edition of.
• 0:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: agabair's podcast bears banter powered by second city gridiron bill Zimmerman with you and we are back ladies and gentlemen I kind of felt like maybe crawling under a rock and skipping this week
• 0:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: The podcast is actually a couple of days late this week.
• 0:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: We were planning on doing a guest who is only available later in the week.
• 0:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then that actually fell through last, last minute.
• 0:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we had to adjust something.
• 0:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why this podcast is out a little later than usual, which is unfortunate coming off this Packers game.
• 0:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: There was plenty to talk about.
• 0:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's still plenty to talk about, though, no shortage of topics.
• 0:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to get
• 0:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: to a lot of those topics with Brendan Shigrew of Bears Why Are You Know Him?
• 1:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, USA Today, he's going to be by here in just a little bit.
• 1:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to be talking about everything facing this Chicago Bears team sitting at three and two.
• 1:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: But before we do, you get me for the next little bit here.
• 1:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't want to talk like specifics.
• 1:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'll get into a couple of the Packers game because we are later in the week.
• 1:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: So no need to rewind the clock all the way to Sunday.
• 1:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I do want to say a couple general things here about this Bears Packers game.
• 1:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And mostly, it's the fact that,
• 1:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is what Ben wanted, and this is what Ben got.
• 1:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't mean Ben wanted a 31-7 blowout.
• 1:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson wanted this rivalry to be a rivalry.
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: He did not want to be a dormant to the packers.
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted this game to matter.
• 1:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted this game to be important.
• 1:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: he wanted his guys up for this and that his guys understood what this rivalry was.
• 2:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when you elevate it in the media, when you elevate it to your guys, when you stress the importance of the bear's packers rivalry, which Ben Johnson has done.
• 2:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Again, the Packers fans like to make it out, like Ben Johnson is berating the Packers and every press conference and talking about how much he hates them and this and that.
• 2:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: What they're doing is they're blowing things out of proportion.
• 2:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson is made sure that this is a rivalry again and I'll tell you, you know who appreciates that the most, the NFL.
• 2:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: The NFL appreciates it because the NFL wants to highlight this every season.
• 2:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's why the game is on Christmas day on the Netflix package.
• 2:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is important to the NFL.
• 2:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: They want this to be the NFL's oldest and biggest rivalry.
• 2:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Ben Johnson made sure of it.
• 2:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when he elevates it on his side, when he makes a joke, I like beat Matt LaFlor twice a year, when he knows his
• 3:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: locker room is being recorded until you put on social media and he yells after the packers when he has, you know, curtain shakes with Matt LaFlor, it's going to get blown up and be like, this is a rivalry, this is heated and that's what Ben Johnson wants and I appreciate that.
• 3:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is not a complaint that he's done it.
• 3:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate that.
• 3:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: But
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you make sure you elevate it on your side, you know, it's going to happen.
• 3:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to get the other side elevated as well.
• 3:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Matt LaFlorga, we have gone, this is about the players, this isn't about coaches, and he can try and downplay, but I guarantee you he wasn't downplaying it in the locker.
• 3:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: and the packers came out.
• 3:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bears, when they do this, they ask for the packers' best shot.
• 3:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the bears got the packers' best shot, and they got punched in the face.
• 3:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we as bears fans need to take it on the chin.
• 3:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was chirping before this game, and I was kind of poking fun at the packers, because,
• 3:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's fun to poke fun at the packers.
• 4:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: The packers aren't down very often.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when they're down, you know, you want to take that stick and you want to poke them a little bit.
• 4:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you want to make sure that they know that you know.
• 4:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And here's what's interesting.
• 4:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, like, you know, the game got moved to the early window.
• 4:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I said, oh, the NFL's hiding the packers because they're so bad.
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And, and, you know, take a couple of jabs of Peter Pukowski, because you
• 4:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: need to take jabs at Peter Bukowski.
• 4:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was having fun before this game because I was confident.
• 4:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I truly bought in to Ben Johnson's wizardry and I still have bought in to Ben Johnson's wizardry, but wizards can't fix everything and they couldn't fix Tyson Beijing.
• 4:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll get into a little bit later here.
• 4:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the bottom line here for me is that I thought the bears were going to
• 4:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was wrong.
• 4:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, the Packers kicked this snot out of the bears, but here's where I think it's interesting is usually when that happens.
• 5:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have so many Packers fans in my mentions and a couple of my things even got retweeted by fairly large Packer accounts where you're mentioned should be inundated with Packers fans, but I think it didn't happen because
• 5:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, Packers fans are celebrating that they beat the snout out of the bears.
• 5:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Again, little brother all been summoned and look, they get it.
• 5:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: They get this round.
• 5:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: We we we understand that.
• 5:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: But.
• 5:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Packers fans agreed with where I and many others thought their team was heading into this game.
• 5:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they're not going to go back and just be like, oh, no, we were awesome.
• 5:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: We knew we were awesome.
• 5:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: They knew they were just in a bad spot, but credit to Jordan love, credit to Matt LaFloran, credit to the rest of the team.
• 5:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: They rallied.
• 5:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: They had a really solid game plan and they won that game running away, especially in the
• 6:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, yes, I thought they were going to get their ass kicked.
• 6:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought the bears were going to kick the packers ass and I was wrong.
• 6:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I did not get inundated with the mentions, like I thought I would, which I got a few, obviously, which I think goes to show you that packers fans even understood how poorly the packers were playing.
• 6:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, I get it.
• 6:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: But here's where it feels different.
• 6:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like usually, these type of losses, you feel helpless as a bear's fan, right?
• 6:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: They you feel like, well, this is it.
• 6:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: We are the dormant to the Green Bay Packers.
• 6:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: We get the crap kicked out of us year in and year out.
• 6:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it happened again.
• 6:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't feel that way.
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel like resigned about the Christmas day game to you.
• 6:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like the Packers got
• 6:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: well got the best of the bears here, easily got the best of the bears here.
• 6:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm still confident the bears can win on Christmas Day.
• 7:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't mean they are definitely going to win on Christmas Day.
• 7:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: We need to know what kind of situation the teams are in.
• 7:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are they both going to play off on?
• 7:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do are they healthy?
• 7:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean there's plenty of factors that are going to go into it that we can't predict over two months in advance right now.
• 7:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we can say confidently, as Barris fans, at least we should be able to, that with Ben Johnson and with Caleb Williams, there is a confidence about this team that we have not had in a very long time, maybe ever because of the head coach quarterback combo.
• 7:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: makes you have a completely different level of confidence and I still have that confidence despite the brutal beating the bears took on Sunday and that's where this isn't as bad for me because usually
• 7:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: You get your ass kicked by the Packers.
• 7:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: You feel helpless because you know the Packers are a superior team, superior franchise, superior everything, Packers fans in and date your mentions, and you try and punch air for a little bit, but you know you're just getting your ass kicked in the mentions in real life on the football field, and it's frustrating.
• 8:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't feel that way.
• 8:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think most Packers fans, they don't want a lot of them don't want to admit it.
• 8:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: But they don't feel that way either.
• 8:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: They understand the bears are not a door man anymore.
• 8:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they understand that they can easily lose to the bears on Christmas day.
• 8:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it feels different.
• 8:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't feel helpless.
• 8:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: It feels like, OK, all right, you got that round.
• 8:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to get this next round.
• 8:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to punch back and forth.
• 8:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this isn't.
• 8:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it doesn't look like we were hoping like maybe the Bears Packers rivalry was going to shift and be completely dominated by the Bears and look.
• 8:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's still good over the next few years.
• 8:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Who knows what's going to happen?
• 8:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: But here's what we know right now.
• 8:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: 2024 split.
• 8:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Caleb Williams arrives.
• 8:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: 2024 they split.
• 8:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: 2025 bears take two out of three.
• 8:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: What is that?
• 8:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: What does that have you right now?
• 8:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: That has you three and three.
• 9:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ted Heat since Caleb Williams arrival.
• 9:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And look, Packers fans are still going to want to go back pre Caleb Williams and they can and they get to because they had Aaron Rogers and Brent Farve and the bear's had what the bear's had.
• 9:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But what the bear's fans can rebut with is, you just have to agree with them.
• 9:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, you had that era.
• 9:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: We had the 80s.
• 9:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: You had the 90s and the 2000s and the 2010s.
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: You had 30 years of congratulations to you, but it's 2024, 2025, 2026.
• 9:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is a different pair of steam.
• 9:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Caleb Williams arrives, Ben Johnson arrives, now it's a dead heat.
• 9:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's still a small sample size, but in the NFL, six games isn't bad.
• 9:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: and six games tells you that this is a dead heat and a dead heat is fun.
• 9:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it hurts when you lose, but it is fun.
• 9:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what the bearer's packer's rivalry has become.
• 9:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson wanted it.
• 9:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson wants the packer's best shot.
• 9:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: He got the packer's best shot.
• 9:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wasn't ready this time.
• 10:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that to me was
• 10:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to talk about the defense.
• 10:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to talk about Beijing.
• 10:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And again, what this all looks like moving forward, but the bears weren't prepared to play this one.
• 10:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what was rough.
• 10:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is something, even when the bears have gotten their butts kicked a couple times in previous games at Ben Johnson's coach,
• 10:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: They didn't feel unprepared.
• 10:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: They felt outmatched at times, but they didn't feel unprepared.
• 10:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bear has actually felt unprepared in this one.
• 10:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that was rough.
• 10:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think Ben Johnson also, and like we said, Ben Johnson is learning as a coach.
• 10:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's developing.
• 10:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's getting better.
• 10:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson is going to have to look himself in the mirror.
• 10:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he is going to have to
• 10:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Figure out where he went wrong in the preparations this week, and he is going to have to figure something out.
• 10:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: He, something happened.
• 10:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what happened in that locker room, but this was not the same bare steam that we have seen in terms of preparation and ready to play.
• 11:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the bottom line here is, is that Ben Johnson and Dennis Allen, and I don't think it's gonna happen again.
• 11:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're gonna learn from this.
• 11:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're gonna get better from this, and the Chicago Bears will be in a better place for this, but it's still sucked when the final score reads 31 to 7.
• 11:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about the defense a little bit because I think again when we're starting to spin this forward and look at the big picture.
• 11:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're looking at this Chicago Bears five games in and a defense that yes, the Vikings game was Slop Aided, but a defense that has looked good for three games and has looked really bad for two games and the question now becomes
• 11:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Who are the 2026 Chicago Bears Defense?
• 11:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: What is the Chicago Bears Defense in 2026?
• 11:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is it what we saw in those middle free games?
• 11:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or is it what we saw on the bookends?
• 12:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, there's gray area.
• 12:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, the gray area is the answer here.
• 12:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the answer is that most likely, the bears are not as bad as they looked in the most recent game in the first game of the season.
• 12:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: But they are not as good as they looked in those middle games of the season.
• 12:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And look, you have to look at the middle games in the season and go was a Vikings offense that was struggling.
• 12:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was a Viking offense with Carson Wentz, was a Vikings offense in the slot.
• 12:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: That all plays into it.
• 12:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a bad jet steam and you also have to look at an eagles and go, well, the eagles are good and yes, the eagles are good and they get credit for winning that and I'm not going to downplay it.
• 12:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the eagles' offense has been broken for a couple years.
• 12:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: it really has.
• 12:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we do have to look at it and say when the bears played pretty good offense is in the Carolina Panthers are a pretty good offense.
• 12:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: The way Bryce Young's playing right now and Jordan love in the backers.
• 12:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: The defense couldn't handle it.
• 12:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think if we're being objective, we have to look at this and say the bears defense is a lot closer in my opinion to
• 13:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: the book ends, the bad version, then the really good version.
• 13:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the really good version, Kudos the Dennis Allen for being able to really create a lot of positivity out of a lot of crap.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that he gets a ton of credit for that.
• 13:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he worked some magic in those games.
• 13:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the bottom line here is, is there just outmatch.
• 13:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now they've got some injuries to deal with.
• 13:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But more so than the injuries,
• 13:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: This secondary is alarmingly bad.
• 13:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is alarmingly bad to the point that where you have to question, how can it possibly get better?
• 13:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, Kyler Gordon is an answer.
• 13:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Kyler Gordon assuming he comes back this week, next week, in the very near future.
• 13:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because if he doesn't come back, he's got, the bears have about a week to get him back on the 53 and playing, because if he doesn't, that's it, he's out for the year.
• 13:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the deadlines coming up here on Kyler Gordon.
• 14:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: If Kyler Gordon comes back and plays like Kyler Gordon can he will elevate that defense because Dennis Allen will have a weapon that type of player that he likes to utilize and he can blitz move around put up up on the line of scrimmage move back like Kyler Gordon is versatile and Dennis Allen loves that that's part of the reason why Kyler Gordon got that extension Dennis Allen knew what he could do with Kyler Gordon so that would be a big help if he comes back but that aside
• 14:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: You still have too many holes in the defense.
• 14:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: They do not have, they have not solidified the safety position next to Dylan Thineman.
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dylan Thineman has an off game against the Packers and then it gets extra bad at that point.
• 14:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: can would stabilize it and be that guy?
• 14:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do they just have to wait for Kobe Bryant if he can come back in December?
• 14:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll have to see.
• 14:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: But more so than the safety problem, the outside corners are such a problem on this team.
• 14:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Tyreek Stevenson, we have highlighted since last year about how poorly he's playing.
• 15:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we talked about it heading into this year that Tyreek Stevenson really should never have been put in a position.
• 15:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: to be a starting corner back on this team.
• 15:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: He should have been the team's primary backup corner back.
• 15:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: They should have had in another corner here.
• 15:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: But as we know, they didn't address things on the defense this off season.
• 15:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they went with Tyrex Stevenson as a starting corner, he is bad.
• 15:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: He yes, he'll make an occasional play because he's aggressive and that's great.
• 15:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he gets burnt constantly.
• 15:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: We see it all the time now, he's banged up.
• 15:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see if he's able to play.
• 15:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the bigger problem,
• 15:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: is the other outside corner.
• 15:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know Barris fans don't want to hear this.
• 15:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And look, I falade him after the half time debacle in the playoffs against the Packers before the Barris had the great comeback.
• 15:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because Jalen Johnson had looked bad, and he looked awful in that first half against the Packers in January.
• 15:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: and I fried him on social media and even after the game when we did the podcast I talked about Jalen Johnson and he's just not looking like he's the same guy.
• 16:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I every bear's fan came to Jalen Johnson's defense and I get it.
• 16:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's been a very good bear for a few years.
• 16:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: gets a long time but he's been a very good bear for a few years and that he's likable and bears fans want to defend guys that they like and guys that they think can be an impact player and I just said I just I don't know about Jalen anymore.
• 16:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
• 16:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: that was part of the reason that he felt he was the first round talent when he was drafted.
• 16:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: He fell to the second round because people were concerned about his injuries.
• 16:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now it was shoulders and things like that.
• 16:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: But again, when players start falling and drafts due to injury concerns, it builds up.
• 16:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we're seeing Jalen having some injury issues.
• 16:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: missed a lot of time last year.
• 16:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we're seeing Jalen Johnson who's still young.
• 16:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: This guy is not 30 31 years old.
• 16:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: He came.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was young coming out of college and he is 27.
• 16:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: He should not be breaking down at this point.
• 17:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he does not have the same
• 17:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: athleticism that he used to show.
• 17:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jalen Johnson looks like he's running in mud, while everyone else is, while the receivers here is covering are on track and field surface, right?
• 17:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like they have the nice surface and Jalen's in mud.
• 17:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what it looks like.
• 17:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: He does not have the speed and the quickness to keep up with these guys.
• 17:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he is just getting torched.
• 17:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is statistically one of the worst cornerbacks in the league.
• 17:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tiring Stevenson is right down there with him.
• 17:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: The quarterback rating against is obscene with these two.
• 17:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now you've got Jordan Love.
• 17:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: and that was clearly, this was not an accident where they had a couple deep shots.
• 17:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: This was clearly the plan for the Green Bay Packers is this secondary can't keep up with our speed.
• 17:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: We are gonna have Jordan love going yellow and throwing a deep and he did and he torched the bears deep.
• 17:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: The blueprint is getting out there on how to beat this defense and there's only gonna be so much that Dennis Allen is able to do to cover the war to this defense.
• 18:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this was the problem we said coming into the year is that this defense had too many holes and was too weak.
• 18:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the bear's offense was going to have to carry them weak in and weak out.
• 18:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when Caleb Williams goes down, the offense becomes a pretty good offense, right?
• 18:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bears weren't pretty good offense without Caleb Williams.
• 18:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: They weren't phenomenal.
• 18:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I know seven points and the Viking game wasn't great either.
• 18:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, they scored some points against Jets, they scored some points against the Eagles.
• 18:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, again, running game was a big reason why, but that is the bottom line.
• 18:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: For the Chicago Bears is without Caleb Williams, it's a pretty good offense.
• 18:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And a pretty good offense can't offset this defense.
• 18:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And maybe Dennis Allen is gonna figure some more things out and get some more personnel in places and this defense will be better than I think it can be.
• 19:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: But when you're sitting in a situation now where you have a defense without a lot of talent and then they start losing some of that talent, Montez sweats suspension, diodangbo's injury, TJ Edwards injury, and obviously we already know Kobe Bryant's injury, Kyler Gordon hasn't played,
• 19:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it was thin when you didn't have to deal with the depth, now that you're dealing with the lack of depth, it's in a really bad place.
• 19:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's not a good time with the Atlanta Falcons coming up to be in a bad place because the John Robinson and Drake London are not easy people to stop and the bears really right now do not have the personnel to stop those two.
• 19:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Dennis Allen has his hands full to see what he's going to be able to do with this
• 19:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Atlanta Falcons team.
• 19:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, it does look like Caleb Williams is coming back.
• 19:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're not going to know officially, probably until Saturday or Sunday, but all signs are pointing to that.
• 19:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is a really, really positive, obviously, for the Chicago Bears, because they desperately need it.
• 20:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now.
• 20:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know some bear's fans.
• 20:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm seeing her all.
• 20:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, can't bring them guns against Atlanta because it's a short week.
• 20:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he's going to be tougher as hamstring.
• 20:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Come on, and I get that.
• 20:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: That may be the case where they go from Sunday to Thursday.
• 20:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the bottom line is here.
• 20:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can't worry about that.
• 20:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I understand you don't want to put him in harm's way.
• 20:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: But if Caleb is healthy enough to play, you play him on Sunday.
• 20:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: You make sure you get that victory.
• 20:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then you see how things are going for Thursday.
• 20:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: and hopefully he doesn't need to rest, but, you know, again, you deal with things the way they come and right now, the Bears can't deal with another Keen of Beijing game.
• 20:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: You go Keenum or Beijing against Atlanta, the way that offense is playing right now, the way your defensive person now is most likely the Bears are going to lose that game.
• 20:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: In my opinion, you need Caleb Williams out there to offset what this defense is.
• 20:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, maybe he's rusty, maybe he has other issues, but you need to try and get him on the field if he can do it and try and elevate this offense to what we saw in week one because bottom line here is we have seen Caleb Williams play one full game in good conditions and the offense was unstoppable.
• 21:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the offense that when I'm 59 points is 59 points.
• 21:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: The that's the offense we need to come see come back.
• 21:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: The barricade to score in the 30s, maybe the 40s.
• 21:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is what the offense needs to be with this defense.
• 21:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I firmly, firmly believe that.
• 21:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: So let's wrap up this conversation with the Tyson Bayesian conversation.
• 21:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And again, I'm not gonna litigate and re-litigate everything that happened on Sunday.
• 21:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Bears fans saw it.
• 21:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: and bears media saw it and it was alarming and it exposed a lot of things that a lot of people have been saying about Tyson Bayesian for a lot of years.
• 21:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I get it that bears fans love Tyson Bayesian.
• 21:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And here's the thing.
• 21:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't want to put unrealistic expectations on players because it only leads to disappointment.
• 21:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Tyson Bajan, the West Virginia kid, out of division to Shepherd College, undrafted free agent, not only making the bears, but getting the QB to not the QB three spot, getting the QB to spot.
• 22:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great story.
• 22:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: and Tyson Vagent becoming the bear's backup quarterback can be a great story and that can be the penultimate moment that Tyson Vagent became the bear's backup quarterback.
• 22:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't have to be Kurt Warner.
• 22:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't have to eventually become the starter and win the Super Bowl and have a movie made after him.
• 22:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: That isn't the point.
• 22:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's already a good story.
• 22:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Bears fans trying to push that Beijing is something more than he is just leads to games like this.
• 22:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: because let's be honest about Tyson Bayesian.
• 22:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is a QB2.
• 22:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I, even after that game, I can confidently say that I think Tyson Bayesian is one of the top 64 quarterbacks in the NFL.
• 23:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I could also confidently say that he is not one of the top 32 quarterbacks in the NFL.
• 23:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think he's one of the top 40 quarterbacks in the NFL.
• 23:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Top 50, he's probably clinging right around the top 50.
• 23:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if he is, that puts some right around in the QB2 rankings, probably somewhere between 15 and 20.
• 23:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Which means he is an average backup quarterback.
• 23:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's fine, and that's still a good story.
• 23:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But let's not make Tyson out to be something he isn't.
• 23:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is very limited with his athletic traits, very limited.
• 23:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when you're that limited, it's going to, you're just not going to have the ceiling that guys like Caleb Williams are even some of the other lesser guys, the micropanics is in bone mixes.
• 23:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to have the same ceiling, and that's fine.
• 23:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: But let's remember that Tyson Bajan does not have great arm strength.
• 23:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tyson Bajan needs to operate efficiently to make the sure things go.
• 24:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's exactly what a backup quarterback is.
• 24:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Tyson Bajan has started games over the course of his career in who as he beaten.
• 24:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: his rookie season, he beat the Raiders.
• 24:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: That was a Raiders team where Josh McDaniels was coaching.
• 24:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: He got fired in season like two weeks later because the Raiders were spiraling.
• 24:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: They were a total disaster.
• 24:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tyson Bayesian wins a game against an opponent that's a total disaster.
• 24:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: He won one other game that year, the Carolina Panthers.
• 24:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Carolina Panthers went 2115, this is 2023.
• 24:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Carolina Panthers were literally the worst team in the NFL and gifted the Bears the number one pick and best Caleb Williams.
• 24:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is his second win.
• 24:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: His third win came against the New York Jets, a perennially bad football team.
• 24:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: They lose more than they win every year.
• 24:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Aaron Glenn, in my opinion, is the worst Sunday coach.
• 24:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know about Monday to Saturday.
• 25:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know enough about the Jets, but I can watch games on Sunday and tell you.
• 25:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like when Maddie Reflus was coaching the bears, he was the worst Sunday coach in the NFL.
• 25:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is no longer a head coach, and that mantle has been passed to Aaron Glenn.
• 25:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is the worst Sunday coach in the NFL.
• 25:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those are Tyson Bajan's three wins.
• 25:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: When Tyson Bajan isn't playing a disastrous team,
• 25:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tyson Bayesian loses football games.
• 25:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got three touchdowns and nine receptions in his career.
• 25:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's not good.
• 25:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's a QB2.
• 25:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's a capable QB2.
• 25:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's nothing more than that.
• 25:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: The hope that Tyson Bayesian was going to get traded for a second run pick in the off season.
• 25:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's dead.
• 25:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tyson Bayesian is what he is.
• 25:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: If the bears want to move on from him, they might be able maybe they can get a five.
• 25:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're probably going to get a six seventh run pick.
• 25:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's all he's going to be
• 25:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: because you can find quarterbacks like Tyson page and usually on the free agent wire in March, April, May, probably even June.
• 26:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the Tyson Bayesian story is dead.
• 26:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Chicago media that wanted to turn them into some darling that all needs to end.
• 26:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is the bear's backup quarterback.
• 26:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: He might be now the bear's third string quarterback.
• 26:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's very possible that case, Keenam is elevated to QB2 moving forward.
• 26:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what Ben Johnson's gonna do.
• 26:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, he's gonna do what he thinks is best for the team.
• 26:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: But right now, right now, the bottom line is Tyson Bayesian.
• 26:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: you don't want them on the field.
• 26:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if Caleb Williams has another issue, we're gonna see if it's case key and we're Tyson Bayesian.
• 26:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it might even be a opponent, it might even be related to the opponent.
• 26:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: It might be who depends on who they're playing, which is never a good sign.
• 26:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So,
• 26:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's stop with the Tyson-Bagent narratives.
• 26:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: They are not true.
• 26:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: We now have enough evidence to know they are not true.
• 26:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't need to rip the guy.
• 27:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know that was pretty critical of him there.
• 27:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't need to turn him into something.
• 27:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: He isn't.
• 27:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's scalable, he was back up.
• 27:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: He might be the best third string quarterback.
• 27:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nothing more, nothing less.
• 27:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about all this with Brendan Shigrew of Bearswire.
• 27:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: He joins me next.
• 27:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is Bill Zimmerman, Bears Banner.
• 27:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll be right back.
• 27:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back into the podcast excited to do this.
• 27:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if we would call this a first-time guest because he's definitely been on a couple times on the draft streams that we've done.
• 27:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't think we've done them specifically one-on-one here.
• 27:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: So excited to do this.
• 27:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is the assistant editor of the Bears Wire part of USA.
• 27:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Today he is Brendan Shigrew.
• 27:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can follow him at Brendan's Sogrew on Twitter.
• 27:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's SUG-R-U-E. Brendan, join, joins me now.
• 27:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Brendan, Bill Zimmerman, how you doing?
• 27:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: Great to be here, Bill.
• 27:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: Well done on the name, first of all.
• 27:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then, pronouncing it like phonetically to make sure people can actually follow.
• 28:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because I don't do that.
• 28:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: I just say she grew and I'm sure people are like, well, there's no age in there.
• 28:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: But no, good to be with you, appreciate the invite.
• 28:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, right in the thick of bare stuff.
• 28:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: So this is a fun time.
• 28:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, look, we are definitely in the thick of bare stuff.
• 28:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of news to get to here potentially Kayla Williams coming back.
• 28:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've got a lot to get to, but we got to talk a little bit about this Packers game.
• 28:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to try and spin this forward being this podcast is coming out a day or two later than it usually does.
• 28:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Not going to have as much direct reaction to the Packers game I gave my thoughts on that before you came on.
• 28:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's at least just start with question one here about this Packers game and specifically how this went down.
• 28:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are there anything?
• 28:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's like, look, Tyson Bayjut was bad, but we know Caleb Williams is coming back hopefully this week.
• 28:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Was there anything you saw specifically in this game that has you significantly concerned moving forward about this team?
• 28:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, mainly in the defense, just speaking about the offense quickly, you're right, Tyson Beijing, we know he's not going to be the starter for hopefully, again, this season, as long as Caleb's healthy.
• 29:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: And we know just when you're back of quarterback struggles, you're trying to play from behind, you can only do so much defensively, though.
• 29:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: The packers just unloaded the clip in terms of like what you can do against this defense to actually, you know, get points, chew up yards.
• 29:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: It was a mix of essentially just great play calling.
• 29:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: I thought they got the bears in some really disadvantant disadvantages situations when it came to personnel and then just also executing them.
• 29:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, we've seen this now with the Panthers and the Packers.
• 29:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: If you have some big body wide receiver, wide receivers that can stretch the field, um, these guys cannot keep up with them.
• 29:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: You saw it with technique milling, saw it with Christian Watson.
• 29:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: So that to me tells me there's a blueprint now on how to beat this defense.
• 29:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: Explosive plays stretching the field.
• 29:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because these cornerbacks cannot keep up with, uh, these, these bigger receivers.
• 30:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: And Dylan Thineman for as good as he's shown, he's still a rookie, he's still trying to figure things out, he doesn't have the help, like we thought he was going to get with Kobe Bryant.
• 30:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: So kind of looking ahead to some of these upcoming opponents, I get nervous about the Atlanta Falcons and Drake London, the New England Patriots and AJ Brown, some of these guys that can really give these guys fits and start to chew up yards and get these explosive plays.
• 30:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: the inability of the secondary to kind of keep up with these guys and also the injuries too.
• 30:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we're going to talk about the injury report.
• 30:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure, but when you're not getting much help up front and you have issues with guys getting suspended, guys getting hurt only puts way more pressure on the back seven and now with these upcoming offenses, I'm very concerned that
• 30:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: This defense is going to we're going to see more of these 30 point games versus what we saw in the previous three weeks at home against the Vikings eagles and jets.
• 31:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and let me ask you this specifically, there's some more stuff with the defense I want to get into with you, but specifically here, with with this defense is like the defensive line coming into this, I knew the defensive line was going to be bad the secondary and we'll get into some specifics with the secondary that's where I had my most concerns popping up from this Packers game, but
• 31:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know it's not extreme right like this defense is not as bad as it showed in Carolina and the packers game, but it's probably not as good as it showed in those other three games.
• 31:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm going to ask you which way on the scale do you lean?
• 31:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think this defense has a better chance to look more like it did in the three games where it looked outstanding or do you think that's more likely headed towards the defense that we saw in the most recent game and opening week?
• 31:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: I would probably lean towards the Panthers and Packers a little bit just because of, look, the offenses that they played at home against the, the Jets, I know Gina Smith came in, having a great season, but he wasn't able to do much, they're offensive play calling, didn't inspire much confidence.
• 32:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: Let's go to the Eagles as well.
• 32:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: The Eagles actually had a pretty good game plan to stop the bears.
• 32:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: And they were rolling it for some reason.
• 32:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: Nick Seriani is Sean Manion.
• 32:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: They decided to move away from Sake Juan Parkley and put Jalen hurts in positions where he had to win the game.
• 32:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: So they kind of had a lot of that taken away from them, which is nice.
• 32:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then the Minnesota Vikings game, that's just the mud bull game.
• 32:36
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not that good.
• 32:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't take much of it.
• 32:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, so that one's kind of a wash.
• 32:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: So you're really looking at two games versus having them have a good defense versus two games not having a good defense and I just think depending on the offensive coordinator, the offensive system, the personnel and just how much they stick with their game plan.
• 32:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: I really think this defense is beatable as they are constructed right now.
• 32:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, Kyla Gordon comes back.
• 33:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's a whole new element that makes things a little bit more interesting.
• 33:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's going to help in run support and also take a little pressure off of everybody else in the secondary when he comes back at nickel.
• 33:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see what moves they make potentially up from Kobe Bryant.
• 33:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: later down on the season, hopefully he comes back and then you're finally getting your full complimentary players in the secondary, but I would say for the next.
• 33:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: uh, let's say, month or so, month and a half.
• 33:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, I think we are, it's very possible that we see, you know, more like 21 to 28 point games and the offense really has to carry this team to make sure they get victories.
• 33:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, 100%.
• 33:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: And like what we're talking about the secondary.
• 33:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: So let me say, the thing that was most concerning to me, yes, it was the secondary, but it was specifically Jalen Johnson.
• 33:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: It
• 33:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the reason for that, obviously, we see how poorly he's not just this packer's game, he has not played well during the regular season.
• 33:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when I was talking about this team heading into training camp, it's like this secondary, as long as it stays healthy, is a strength because I didn't see a lot of depth in this secondary, but you like the safety tandem, you know, Kyler and Jaylin, and you're like, I didn't like Tyrex Stevenson, but I'm like, all right, one spot where it might be questionable, Dennis Allen can kind of cover that.
• 34:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: This was all kind of on the idea of all the reports about how good Jalen Johnson looked in camp and that he was the old Jalen Johnson.
• 34:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I said that like that has to be the case because of Jalen Johnson is to 2025 Jalen Johnson, who ever said he's not that guy he's only playing hurt.
• 34:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a problem.
• 34:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And right now, we're seeing the same thing.
• 34:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a 2025 Jalen Johnson.
• 34:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: He has linebacker speed now, trying to cover these wide receivers.
• 34:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's not working.
• 34:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is where I have significant concerns.
• 34:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's not like, oh, you're like, oh, Jalen bid on that.
• 34:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got to pay more attention.
• 34:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It seems like it's straight athleticism right now, thing for him, Brendan.
• 34:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if he's going to be able to build up and get the speed and the quickness back.
• 35:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, what do you think with Jalen Johnson here?
• 35:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
• 35:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think you make a great point.
• 35:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: It really isn't biting on those dumb moves, which he, I'm being an excuse of after Sunday's game, which I thought was really interesting.
• 35:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: He was just straight beat, and it's not even just lacking speed in the passing game, it's the physicality getting run over by guys like Marshall Lloyd.
• 35:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, true.
• 35:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: It has very few reps.
• 35:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: So when you can't get it run,
• 35:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: can't get it done in run defense and you can't get it done in past defense, like, what good are you?
• 35:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: I also think it's interesting that, you know, we see two sides of this, Ben Johnson, he decides to bench Tyson Bayesian at the start of the fourth quarter and really because the packers had two long scoring drives, I mean, maybe he benched some earlier, but, you know, people want to point out, like, he always should have benched him earlier or should have benched
• 35:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: For a guy that Johnson believed in, look on the other side with Dennis Allen, do you see Dennis Allen actually benching somebody like Jalen Johnson and trying something different because I'm not sure I do.
• 36:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: We saw multiple times early in the game that Johnson wasn't having it, whether it was just a match-up situation or just being straight-cooked.
• 36:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: and he didn't try anything else.
• 36:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: He didn't put in Clark Phillips.
• 36:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: He didn't move around Malik Muhammad.
• 36:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe some of that was by necessity because of the fact Stevenson got hurt midway through the game, but I am concerned that Jalen Johnson is cooked.
• 36:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's only weeks six.
• 36:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't understand people are beat up, but you kind of shouldn't be this much reliability yet.
• 36:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see if something changes after the minibye following the New England game, but I have seen nothing this
• 36:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: Jalen Johnson is going to rebound and become even an adequate cornerback, which is very concerning.
• 36:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's the thing is, like, Dennis Allen's here in a big part because he's aggressive, right?
• 36:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what Ben Johnson wants.
• 36:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson can be aggressive on offense.
• 37:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wants aggressive on defense.
• 37:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wants a defense that's going to try and make plays, negative plays, turnovers, all of stuff, which Dennis Allen does a great job scheming up.
• 37:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, you said there would be like, well, how can you fix this without, like, making a big trade, which I don't think they're going to
• 37:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you sit there and go, well, Kyler Gordon can come back and then you can move my home and outside, but you know, you still have Tyreq Steven's also a liability, so like I look at this and go, can he switch to more zoneless man and kind of give Jalen some help there, but at the same time, to me, when you're switching from zone schemes to man schemes, your your aggression level, especially in the secondary is going to get dropped a couple of picks.
• 37:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, definitely.
• 37:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: And also, we've got to keep in mind too, you know, they don't have their full compliments of safety, either.
• 37:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, whatever coverage you want to play and thinking back to, you know, relying just on Dylan Thineman and the fact Kim Lewis has been in and out of the lineup, Elijah Hicks is getting run.
• 38:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: You just can't do as much without Kobe Bryant.
• 38:03
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, it just hurts everything else when you try to be aggressive.
• 38:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: And when you
• 38:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: when you miss on that and you're relying on, you know, somebody like the and a mint to clean up the mess, it's it's really not going to work out well, especially early in the season.
• 38:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let's let's talk about the front seven a little, but then we can get to the agent and Caleb and some of the stuff on the offense as well here.
• 38:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: The the situation with the defensive line here and line back in group.
• 38:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've got.
• 38:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: TJ Edwards is dealing with something.
• 38:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Looks like he's going to miss time.
• 38:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dio, Dengbo, they already said is going to miss time.
• 38:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not, look, I know TJ Edwards was having a good season.
• 38:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not as worried there because I see a reliable person in Demarco Jackson who I think can fill in and do a pretty good job.
• 38:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I sit here and look at the defensive line and I can't believe August's Bill Zimmerman can't believe October Bill Zimmerman is saying this, they really need Dio Dengbo.
• 38:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was playing well, he was making impact plays where he was affecting the offense.
• 39:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they don't have the depth here, well, maybe Schermar Turner or something, but based on the small sample size we've seen, that's not something they can rely on.
• 39:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: situation at the fence of wine and the injuries here that the front seven is facing.
• 39:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I sit here and with with Bajan Robinson coming up here in Atlanta and some of these other games coming up.
• 39:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is definitely where Dennis Allen is going to have to get in his bag because he is going to have to skim up these players, not just in the secondary, but in the front seven as well.
• 39:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
• 39:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we haven't even talked about Montess what in his suspension.
• 39:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the question come up.
• 39:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: You want to lump it in.
• 39:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, we can talk about that as well.
• 39:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: No, but, but still like, you're right.
• 39:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you're you're starting defensive lineman.
• 39:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, defensive ends alone.
• 39:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Austin Booker, Schmar Turner, who is not played a down since late October.
• 39:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's almost been a full year.
• 39:55
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not fair to actually expect much of him.
• 39:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, in game one anyway.
• 40:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you want to like sort of ease and back in action.
• 40:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: And now you have to really rely on him to play probably the majority of snaps.
• 40:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, hey, for those who love John Rikroma in the preseason boy is this going to be the game for you because he this is probably going to be his first.
• 40:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: action this season, and maybe he can show something that he showed back in the preseason.
• 40:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: And then Daniel Hardy, just a core special team, or that's your guy.
• 40:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: And you're right, it with Dio Dango, especially the fact that you can, they were able to move him inside, and he was able to make such an impact next to Grady Jarrett along with Neville Gallimore.
• 40:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: You don't have that sort of mismatch player there, because he had the size and speed to really get through some of those guards.
• 40:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: And now you're just going to be relying on Grady Jarrett,
• 40:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: Gallamore, George Vanneberg, it really doesn't inspire much confidence at all.
• 40:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: And that's why just getting Heather Gordon back is so imperative because he plays the mind of scrimmage so well.
• 40:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like his run defense, we talk about just his versatility overall, but I'd love the way that he plays the run defense.
• 41:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: He can get those tackles for losses and really kind of clog up those running lanes on the outside.
• 41:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: And again, this is just, I've said it three times now, but this is where you miss Kobe Bryan as well.
• 41:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because the combination of those two, this is really where things could have been a lot different.
• 41:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: And you could sort of get by with some of these injuries.
• 41:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: Really, I am so interested to see what Dennis Allen is going to do, because frankly, I,
• 41:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't really know, like if I'm, you know, Kevin Stephansky and the Falcons offense, I am licking my chops and just saying, Bajan and Brian Robinson, you guys are going to get 250 yards on this team and we are just going to pound the rock because I don't see how this defensive line is going to stop them.
• 41:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because here's the thing.
• 41:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: We all had concerns about this defensive line coming into the year, right?
• 41:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: September 1st, we're sitting here going, defensive line is probably the worst unit on this team.
• 41:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And at that point, three of the four starters
• 42:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: are now gone.
• 42:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: That being Montess Sweat Javan Dexter and Dio Dingo and I know Dingo is having more of an impact inside.
• 42:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: But again, those three in Grady Jared, like that was the expected starting for up on the defensive line, three of those guys are gone.
• 42:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're not going to be playing the next couple of games.
• 42:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's next man up.
• 42:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And again, Austin Booker seems capable of being next man up, but you know, like you talked about there's some questions on what those defensive tackles can do and talking about sweat specifically and you had a great tweet for about Montes sweat with the zero TFL zero sag zero pressure zero tackles one suspension like that was it was a great tweet, but here here's what I will say about sweat is.
• 42:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He at least garners attention.
• 42:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: You can't ignore him as an offense.
• 42:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the other guys, you don't really have to game plan too as much at this point with sweat gone.
• 42:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, bookers almost become the focal point or maybe gritty Jared, I don't know, but the focal point of what offenses need to do.
• 42:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's not something that's not a role you want Austin Booker to be put in at this point.
• 43:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, without Montez sweat and without some of these other guys, I question the Dexter mode trade in the moment and it's I'm certainly questioning it now because I don't know if Clark Phillips is ever going to play.
• 43:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: But like I sit here and go, this defensive line was bad.
• 43:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Seem that Dennis Allen was getting a lot out of it.
• 43:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now.
• 43:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't even have a question here, Brendan, because I really just don't know what is going to happen here without sweat.
• 43:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: You just want to say help.
• 43:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, like we did have fun with the stats, because everybody was climbing on sweat for his game against the packers.
• 43:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: And rightfully so it wasn't a good game at all.
• 43:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: But you're right, he does go into the most attention.
• 43:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's their best well-rounded edge player.
• 43:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: He plays the run well, he plays the pass well.
• 43:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: You at least know you can depend on him and you know what you're getting out of him.
• 43:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Austin Booker is flashed, but I have questions about him in the run defense.
• 43:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes he can overshare Sue, and that could really open up some holes for this balcony's run game.
• 43:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, we can all have our fun, but, you know, come Sunday, we are all going to be missing mantis wet.
• 44:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I will, I also saw an interesting poll from
• 44:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: Sylvie of while on Sylvie, I mean he's been 1,000.
• 44:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: He asked the question, will the bears miss Montes wet on Sunday?
• 44:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you saw this.
• 44:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: Do you know what the...
• 44:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: I did not see the total results of this now.
• 44:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, as when I saw it at the time, 60% of bears fans said no.
• 44:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just thinking you guys are crazy.
• 44:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: The the short memory that everybody has is insane.
• 44:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: This team absolutely is going to miss sweat.
• 44:31
  [SPEAKER_00]: It makes things so much harder and like I said, yeah, I think to your point.
• 44:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not even a question.
• 44:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's just.
• 44:39
  [SPEAKER_00]: how much is this going to hurt on Sunday?
• 44:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe that's the question when it comes to that.
• 44:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it really is.
• 44:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: So obviously both of us here significant concerns about the defense.
• 44:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's move over to the offensive side of the ball.
• 44:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about Tyson Beijing a little bit.
• 44:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't need to pile on exactly what happened on Sunday.
• 44:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: We know he was horrendous.
• 44:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: He got Bench.
• 44:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: My question for you is, what are your thoughts on Tyson pageant the player, overall player, not specifically what we saw, because again, he has one 3 NFL games, but I will say this, and I said this at the beginning of the podcast.
• 45:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those three wins he had was against the Raiders, which at the time were in a spiral with Josh McDaniels who got fired two weeks later.
• 45:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: be Caroline a Panthers that went to in 15 and because of that gifted the bears Kayla Williams and a jet's team where I'm you know I'm of the opinion that Aaron Glenn is the worst Sunday coach in the NFL.
• 45:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: those are Tyson Bajans three wins.
• 45:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is not exactly beaten world leaders and that's okay as a backup quarterback.
• 45:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's not going to look, and I said this, I, you know, full basic apology.
• 45:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I bought into the Ben Johnson wizardry that he was going to be able to just
• 45:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: do whatever he needed to with Tyson Bayesian and get a win against what I thought was a bad packer steam.
• 45:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Definitely overreact to all that and I fully admit that.
• 46:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Tyson Bayesian the player is he, we know he's not a QB1.
• 46:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's a QB2.
• 46:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Is he an acceptable QB2 in your eyes or is this a concern if Caleb has more time where he misses another gamer too?
• 46:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: I would say he's an average back of quarterback at very best.
• 46:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: And when I say very best, like the conditions are right, he's playing at home.
• 46:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has a good ground game.
• 46:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: He can play within his system.
• 46:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: And you kind of have to check all those boxes to say, yes, we're going to get the most out of Tyson Bajan.
• 46:34
  [SPEAKER_00]: And when we kind of saw that in some aspects with the jets, he had some rough throws, but he was able to lean on the ground game and do enough to move the ball down the field to keep the bear's strives rolling.
• 46:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: I just I think back to the 2023 game against the Saints where he threw three three interceptions and he actually really cost the bears that game because they were in position to actually score and win if I remember correctly and then same thing with the packers like he doesn't do well with hostile environments and I also think too Bill
• 47:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think he can work well and kind of elevate his game and have been Johnson offense.
• 47:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: But the thing I'm kind of going back to is it really feels like that he was kind of auditioning for something on Sunday.
• 47:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: He was taking some of these, he was trying to make some of these big throws and that taken the easy check-downs or, you know, the answer right in front of them.
• 47:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: And it almost felt like to me, he's trying to show, yes, I can be a starter and I want to show that some teams should go get me because
• 47:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is, this maybe his one in last shot to actually do that before Caleb Williams gets back.
• 47:38
  [SPEAKER_00]: All he's ever had for the last three years was a pre-season game.
• 47:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: He hasn't played since, I mean, we all want to talk about like the mystery and myth of Tyson Bayjant that he could be this hidden gem and truly that just completely went out the window.
• 47:54
  [SPEAKER_00]: We have this weird situation where if back or quarterbacks don't play, their value increases for some reason.
• 48:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: show that he was worthy of becoming like a bridge starter somewhere else and that he had he was afforded the opportunity and he's just isn't he doesn't have the arms strength he doesn't have the poise but if he kind of plays within that system and just take the easy dink and dunks lean on your run game and hopefully you're playing with a favorable crowd yes you could be
• 48:26
  [SPEAKER_00]: an average quarterback and a 500 quarterback is fine in a pinch, but we cannot be making him out to be more than what he actually is.
• 48:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let me ask you this, and not like who should be the QB2 if Caleb goes down.
• 48:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we could talk about that if you want, but if Caleb Williams, you know, knock on wood, you know, he doesn't miss any more time, but if he is going to miss full games, another game or two this season,
• 48:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know the answer can be, I'll trust whatever Ben Johnson thinks is best for the team, but I want to know Brendan Shagru's opinion should case kingdom be the starting quarterback if Caleb Williams is missing or should they go back to Tyson Bayesian or does it depend on the opponent?
• 49:12
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it depends on the opponent.
• 49:13
  [SPEAKER_00]: I will say I think it depends on the location.
• 49:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: If we're talking about the Falcon's game, a hostile environment, a rogue game, I'm starting case kingdom.
• 49:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has experience there.
• 49:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: I know he's not going to get as rabble to his page and he may not have as good of a game, but I just don't think he's going to melt down nearly as much as what pageant would.
• 49:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: If it's a home game at soldier field and you have your full compliment of Kalmanungai and DeAndrey Swift, I'm more than fine trusting Tyson Bajin.
• 49:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not in the mood or business to develop back up quarterbacks or anything.
• 49:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: So maybe that's sort of like a supplementary reason to say, hey, he can kind of get his confidence back.
• 49:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: But I think he's somebody you can win with in that situation.
• 49:55
  [SPEAKER_00]: And the other thing too is
• 49:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: If for some reason, it's a game at Soldier Field.
• 49:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: He has his full complimentary of running backs and he can lean on that, but he's still having a bad game.
• 50:05
  [SPEAKER_00]: You can still go back to case kingdom in that situation.
• 50:08
  [SPEAKER_00]: If case kingdom kind of struggles there, I don't feel good about going to Tyson Bayesian right off the bench.
• 50:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'd feel better about it the other way around.
• 50:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense.
• 50:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And not that this last point on Beijing, not that this is really important in October, but I do think it's worth a conversation.
• 50:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it definitely will be a conversation come February, going into March is, I think like you said, the mystery of the backup quarterback can help teams out significantly in terms of trade value and that kind of thing.
• 50:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the pack
• 50:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: you used to do it brilliantly with guys like Matt Flynn and Matt Hasselback and all these guys at home run a develop and then pawn off on other teams and or even if they were free agents they get huge contracts they never deserve.
• 50:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chase Daniel made tens of millions of dollars and barely took a snap in the out of felids.
• 50:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty magnificent what can happen if you're if you're that type of QB2.
• 50:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: But
• 50:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: no one knows if this is specifically true, but there were a lot of rumors that a team and that team was rumored to be the Arizona Cardinals offered the bears a four for Tyson page.
• 51:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the bears asked for it too.
• 51:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: The Cardinals said no, the question was if the Cardinals bumped it up to a three with the bears have had said yes, who who knows if this is accurate or not.
• 51:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: But if that is the case, the one thing I think Brendan here going into next season is
• 51:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think Tyson Bayesian will have any trade value.
• 51:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe a team will offer up a six or a seven because they, you know, like a decent quarterback at a decent price, but I think any thoughts of the bears being able to get a two or a three or anything like that to send Tyson Bayesian off and have a different backup quarterback.
• 51:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's dead.
• 51:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Again, not as important in October, but I do think that performance against the pack or significantly dented any hopes of that happening in the future.
• 51:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he would have to have another, like he would have to have a rebound game, and I remember those rumors and conversations, I had a tweet that said, if somebody's offering a fourth or a fifth for Tyson Bage and maybe you can make it a conditional pick depending on playing time, I'm absolutely making that trade.
• 52:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: And the amount of bear's fans that came after me, I came after me, but just said no, he's way too valuable for that.
• 52:14
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not, I'm not dealing him for anything less than a second.
• 52:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: I was surprised that the bears had that same thought, it's just interesting that they had that same value for a guy who they really hadn't had like serious tape on in 2023.
• 52:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'd love alone like the same system either, since a few offensive coordinators have come and gone since then, but
• 52:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: Look, we know that quarterbacks are still a valuable currency in this league, guys who have struggled and struggled again and struggled a third time.
• 52:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: They keep finding jobs.
• 52:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: So I still do think that there is some trade value for Tyson Bayesian when the year is, you know, when it's all said none, he's on an affordable contract, but you can definitely kiss like that mid-round pick goodbye.
• 52:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: It would have to be like a late-round pick at best.
• 52:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, let's talk about the running game a little bit here because without Kyle Menongai, this does get a little interesting because, you know, Menongai, he has the ability to carry the ball to 25, 30 times like we saw him do previously out he's dealing with the turf toe.
• 53:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know exactly what this is going to impact him for the next couple weeks.
• 53:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And honestly, for the whole season, we know how nasty turf toe can be for certain players.
• 53:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: DeAndre Swift didn't get that huge work load that Manangai got when Swift was Bench.
• 53:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe that was by design, maybe it was because the game got away, where we're not sure, but a Swift also doesn't feel like a workhorse back.
• 53:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: The reason I bring all this up is that while I am a big defender of Rochon, Johnson,
• 53:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's an RB4 and I honestly thought that they were going to keep Rochon on the 53 and essence as the RB3 but he was never going to see the offense.
• 53:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was going to be the special teams player and if one of those two guys got hurt, we would see Ahmed or them do something else and bring up an RB3 and keep Rochon in his RB4 role.
• 54:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was wrong.
• 54:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Rochon got it carries.
• 54:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Rochon shouldn't get carries.
• 54:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't work with him.
• 54:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: So for Ben Johnson, who likes to have a two running back situation on his offense, without Manangai, how much do you think this impacts what they're going to be able to do in a run game that we know when the bear's running game is going, this offense is virtually unstoppable.
• 54:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: it's huge and we saw the glimpses of that on Sunday where they were just trying to get something going with end-of-rounds and quick screens and you know working in the wide receivers like Luther Burden and saving on Thomas and for the most part it didn't really work so you could
• 54:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: just grasping for straws to get something to work there while they try to figure out something with Swift and Swift did eventually get going.
• 54:52
  [SPEAKER_00]: I thought I was kind of expecting to see them on the injury report this week to start.
• 54:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: So it was good to see that Swift is not injured for one reason or another.
• 55:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: They just decided to not utilize them in the second half to your point.
• 55:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it was just the fact that things were getting away from them and Ben Johnson wanted to
• 55:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, they do rely on just like the, hey, we're going to get you with one guy and then, you know, once, you know, he gets a little tired.
• 55:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to switch it up and just keep that a two-back rotation going.
• 55:21
  [SPEAKER_00]: I would be interested to see what Ahmed can do.
• 55:24
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's kind of like a change of pace guy with a speed.
• 55:27
  [SPEAKER_00]: So he's not really the bruising type of back that monunga is.
• 55:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe they continue to work somebody like Thomas in it running back.
• 55:33
  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe even Khalif Raymond, I feel like he might be able to be somebody who could give you snaps from the running back position, not that I would love that because I think he's so valuable as a receiver.
• 55:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know where he's at right now.
• 55:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he's on the practice squad, and I don't think he's been picked up by anybody.
• 55:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: If, if the bears are concerned about monunga being out again, I'm given Britain Brown a call.
• 55:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: Britain Brown is somebody who came in when Swift was out last year against the bangles and he gave them some pretty solid areas.
• 56:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: He knows the offense.
• 56:03
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'd say he's a much better runner than Rochon Johnson.
• 56:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: You're obviously not replacing monunga, but somebody like him, I feel like you feel more comfortable relying on a two-back system and you feel like you could get by at least for a week or two.
• 56:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, let's talk about the big fish that being Caleb Williams.
• 56:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: We were recording this Wednesday night.
• 56:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know 100% of Caleb's going to play, but I will say he's a full participant on the first injury report.
• 56:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it's a walkthrough, but again, it's projected.
• 56:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the one thing I always trust me.
• 56:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, all right, it's a walkthrough.
• 56:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but it's...
• 56:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: it's still a projection as if it was a full practice what the bears think he would have done and he think he would have been a full participant.
• 56:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Caleb's looking good, Ian Rapp for Adam Shaft or everyone's doing the all signs point in the Caleb plan against Atlanta.
• 56:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: So let's go in with the expectation that Caleb is a full go for the Falcons.
• 56:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: But again, coming off a hamstring injury, that could that could limit his his mobility and that that combines with coming back
• 57:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Where are you with Caleb Williams?
• 57:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are you comfortable if he just lets it rip and is running?
• 57:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Would you like to see him kind of try and stay in the pocket more?
• 57:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Do you want to see Caleb be Caleb?
• 57:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: How concerned are you with him coming off a grade two hamstring injury?
• 57:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a little concerned, I do, I think if you are bringing it back, you don't really want to put the clamps on them, you want him to be Caleb, because that's what makes him so special and knowing the running game could be suffering.
• 57:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't really want to shy away from that.
• 57:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: And maybe this is a dangerous situation, dangerous statement to make just because
• 57:37
  [SPEAKER_00]: we've seen so many issues this year, but if he's healthy, I trust the staff that they're making the right decision put them in them out there.
• 57:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: But one thing I'm kind of interested to see and I don't know if I'm concerned, but I'm curious because I go back to Caleb's 2024 season.
• 57:57
  [SPEAKER_00]: when he comes in as a rookie and he talked about being a creature of habit and loving the consistency the weekend and we got, you know, having the same sort of routine every day.
• 58:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: He seems to really thrive in that.
• 58:11
  [SPEAKER_00]: He is not played in the three games.
• 58:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, being out for three weeks, having his routine disrupted,
• 58:19
  [SPEAKER_00]: Are we going to see some rust if he plays?
• 58:22
  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, is he really going to be dialed in for those like first few series?
• 58:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: Is it going to take some time for him to kind of like recapture that?
• 58:28
  [SPEAKER_00]: And if that's the case,
• 58:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: What does the offense look like?
• 58:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: Do they fall behind from the Falcons before he sort of clicks?
• 58:35
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just wondering, if he does play, just what kind of player we're gonna see from the start because there's definitely a rust factor.
• 58:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: He's a guy that had really missed a game.
• 58:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: And missed a game at all since coming in as a pro.
• 58:49
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I remember the first game that he played with real bullets against the Titans in 2024.
• 58:55
  [SPEAKER_00]: That was the first game since,
• 58:58
  [SPEAKER_00]: What was at the conference championship for the Pact 12 at the time?
• 59:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: Because I don't think USC was at the with the big 10.
• 59:04
  [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, that was a long time ago when he struggled in that game.
• 59:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: I know it's not exactly apples to apples, but I just want to see does he come out struggling rusty or is he really in a rhythm and can start off fast?
• 59:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's a fair point, and I'll just finish with this.
• 59:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Based on how much time Kyler Gordon is missed, based on how Jalen Johnson looks with the lack of speed.
• 59:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Kayla Williams, if you're listening, I know he's not.
• 59:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: I have one request for him.
• 59:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Stay away from Dr. Mo.
• 59:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: There he is, Brendan Shigru from Bear's Wire course part of the USA today.
• 59:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Network Brendan.
• 59:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for the interview.
• 59:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoyed it.
• 59:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully the bears have a better outcome on Sunday when they face the Atlanta Falcons.
• 59:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
• 59:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: There's a pleasure.
• 59:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for having me on and hopefully we don't have to witness another embarrassing loss like that after the next couple weeks.
• 59:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Let's hope.
• 1:00:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
• 1:00:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: There he is.
• 1:00:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Brendan Shigru, everybody.
• 1:00:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hope you enjoyed that conversation.
• 1:00:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: First time I've really had a chance to dive into an extended conversation with Brendan.
• 1:00:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought he did a heck of a job.
• 1:00:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of good insight there.
• 1:00:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hope you learned something.
• 1:00:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know I did.
• 1:00:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, decided to skip the mail bag this week.
• 1:00:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: because I wanted to make sure I had some time to talk a little bit about Duck Coach and talk a little bit about Mike Dica and didn't feel like it was going to work doing it at the top of the show.
• 1:00:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was the plan.
• 1:00:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was planning on, you know, Bears victory, Bears, Packers, Mike Dica was all going to come together and then the Bears late and I got on Sunday.
• 1:00:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So said, you know what, let's separate it.
• 1:00:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll talk about the Bears Packers disaster and where this
• 1:00:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about Mike Dicka after the interview.
• 1:00:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's what we want to do here is talk a little bit about Mike Dicka from the Old Man Perspective, from the guy pushing 50 in his late 40s.
• 1:01:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is old enough to remember when Mike Dicka coached the bears.
• 1:01:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, not old enough to remember Mike Dicka is a player, but I am a man of NFL history.
• 1:01:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love NFL history and joy NFL history and Mike Dicka.
• 1:01:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about the player for a second first because, look, when you hear greatest tight ends of all time, right?
• 1:01:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Someone goes, who are the greatest tight ends in NFL history?
• 1:01:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Travis Kelsey's name gets mentioned.
• 1:01:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Rob Grinkowski, you know, Kellyn Winslow, senior, not junior.
• 1:01:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, you get that group.
• 1:01:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe someone wants to throw Shannon Sharpen, Tony O' Gates in the mix.
• 1:01:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Tony Gonzalez, if I didn't mention Tony Gonzalez, like you know the name is Yihir.
• 1:01:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And for the most part, other than Kellyn Winslow, pretty much every name is 2000 in the present.
• 1:01:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: But there are other names that should be mentioned.
• 1:02:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if you made a top 10 list, they would be included in the top 10 list.
• 1:02:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Names, like Winslow, like Ozzy Newsom, like John Mackey, and like Mike Dica.
• 1:02:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Mike Dica is kind of the Godfather of NFL Titans because he is the guy.
• 1:02:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we talk about how players revolutionized aspects
• 1:02:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And like NBA is the easiest one.
• 1:02:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wilk Chamberlain comes in.
• 1:02:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: They literally changed the rules.
• 1:02:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: They widen the lane.
• 1:02:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: They start the three seconds, it's three second rule violation in the lane because Wilk Chamberlain was so dominant.
• 1:02:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: They literally like, we have to change the rules.
• 1:02:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: This guy, we can't beat this guy.
• 1:02:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Steph Curry, the way he could shoot three pointers.
• 1:02:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Revolutionized, revolutionized, the way NBA is played with three pointers.
• 1:02:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: These are the type of players that come in and change the way things are done.
• 1:03:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicka changed the tight end position.
• 1:03:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: The tight end position was merely before Mike Dicka, it was a blocking position.
• 1:03:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And occasionally, you might catch a passer too.
• 1:03:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like it was almost like a trick play.
• 1:03:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you used your tight end as a receiver, it was almost a trick play.
• 1:03:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was simply that NFL rules said if they were at the end of the line of
• 1:03:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: That was it, but they were a blocker.
• 1:03:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: You had six blockers, sometimes seven blockers across the front, whether you had one tight end or two, depending on if it was the 30s, 40s, 50s or 60s.
• 1:03:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dick could come in and says, I can be your hard-nosed blocker.
• 1:03:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can get down and dirty with the defensive linemen and throw down with them and block them and do what needs to be done.
• 1:03:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I can also go out and be a weapon in the past game and Mike Dicca in his rookie season has a thousand yards as a Titan.
• 1:04:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Never had been done before.
• 1:04:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: He does it as a rookie, revolutionized as revolutionized as the position.
• 1:04:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that is Mike Dicca's legacy as a player.
• 1:04:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: He changed the position.
• 1:04:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicca opened the door for John Mackie.
• 1:04:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: John Mackey opened the door for Kellan Winslow and Kellan Winslow is the blueprint of the modern day Titan, the receiving weapon Titan, Kellan Winslow of the chargers of the 1980s is the guy that is now every Titan since I mean, grunk and guys are like a throwback, but every Titan since that receiving weapon Titan that everybody wants
• 1:04:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Colston, Lovelin, Dalton, Kincaid, even if they don't work out, the guys that everyone wants that the model is Kellyn Winslow.
• 1:04:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that is the path of the NFL Titan.
• 1:04:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dica, Tamaki, to Winslow, to all these new Titans, and this new era of football with what the Titan can be.
• 1:05:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is thanks to Mike Dica.
• 1:05:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he changed a position because he possessed a skill set that nobody in the first 50 years of the NFL had, but Mike Diff got had it.
• 1:05:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that you give credit for as a player and that is why he is a Hall of Famer and the first ever NFL tight end to be put in the Hall of Fame.
• 1:05:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is his legacy as a player.
• 1:05:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But what's unique about Diff is he has three legacies.
• 1:05:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: He has the legacy of player, he has the legacy of coach, and he has the legacy of an NFL analyst.
• 1:05:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: His media time in the league, whether it be with CBS or ESPN, people love Dica.
• 1:05:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, he had very at times, especially towards the end, and equated ways of thinking about the NFL, because he was still in the 70s and 80s and 90s.
• 1:05:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: He still wanted to play football that way, and it wasn't being played in football that way,
• 1:06:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: kind of like Mark Schleriff does now.
• 1:06:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to run the football.
• 1:06:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to just block.
• 1:06:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want three, three yards in a cloud, a dash.
• 1:06:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Schleriff loves yelling at the clouds.
• 1:06:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Mike Dicca was the same way.
• 1:06:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he did it in a charming way.
• 1:06:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it was fun for people to listen to and watch.
• 1:06:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that was his third legacy.
• 1:06:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the second legacy was that of a coach.
• 1:06:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know, over the years,
• 1:06:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dickas' coach aspect has been diminished by fans.
• 1:06:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's been diminished by fans pretty significantly because they got a lot of fans don't like him for a variety of reasons, which we can talk about in a second.
• 1:06:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it was Mike Dicka ran the offense, buddy Ryan ran the defense.
• 1:06:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: The defense was the reason the bears were good.
• 1:06:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicka doesn't deserve the credit, buddy Ryan deserves the credit.
• 1:06:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, Buddy Ryan was in charge of the defense and Buddy Ryan was a masterful defensive coordinator and his defensive players loved him.
• 1:07:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: But.
• 1:07:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: There was still a head coach that had to corral these players.
• 1:07:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the 85 bears, the mid-80s bears.
• 1:07:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: This was not a normal football team.
• 1:07:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: These guys were insane.
• 1:07:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean that in a positive way.
• 1:07:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the 85 bears, these personalities were insane.
• 1:07:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Steemit Michael was insane.
• 1:07:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right, Wilbur Marshall and Otis Wilson were off the walls, like the offensive line was a bunch of just, you know, get in the dirt and want to just pound your kind of guys, these players had personalities on steroids, they were nuts.
• 1:07:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: and you needed a coach who was able to curl them.
• 1:07:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, think about a basketball team that had, you know, 10 Dennis Rodmans.
• 1:07:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's the 85 Bears, 86 Bears.
• 1:07:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what this team was.
• 1:07:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: They went out drinking all night.
• 1:08:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: They went out partying.
• 1:08:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they were...
• 1:08:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: hammered five nights in a row on Burman Street Super Bowl week.
• 1:08:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just party their ass off.
• 1:08:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Had they lost to the Patriots?
• 1:08:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I understand they beat the snye out of them.
• 1:08:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Had they lost that would have become an epic story about the bears on Burman Street and they blew history by losing to the Patriots.
• 1:08:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: That was going to be the story.
• 1:08:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it didn't happen because Dick could let them have their fun.
• 1:08:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: New when to rain them in, new when to drop the fist and be a hard ass.
• 1:08:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dick can new how to pull those strings and that is getting lost in history about how good Mike Dick was at being the head coach of that football team to understand what bears football was to
• 1:08:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: understand what these players needed to understand that they just needed the right level of animosity towards each other, but love towards each other and working towards the same goal.
• 1:09:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like Dick have figured all that out and he figured it out with the defensive coordinator that did not like him.
• 1:09:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: that was there before Mike Dicca arrived.
• 1:09:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it was an arranged marriage.
• 1:09:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicca showed up that we know the story, the players gave the letter to George Hallis.
• 1:09:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're working with something, you can't let buddy Ryan go, George Hallis, said, all right, we're keeping buddy Ryan.
• 1:09:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: He hires Mike Dicca, even though the GM Jim thinks doesn't want him.
• 1:09:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Think about the dysfunction that this guy goes into.
• 1:09:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: We love George Alice, but George Alice hires the coach, who wrote him a letter and said, I want to be the coach of the bears.
• 1:09:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: George Alice hires this coach, ignores what his general manager wants to do, the owner hires the coach.
• 1:09:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: The GM is so pissed about it, he leaves a year later.
• 1:09:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: The defense of coordinator stays, but he doesn't get the head coaching job.
• 1:09:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: He stays as the defensive coordinator.
• 1:09:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there's an arrange marriage between two coaches.
• 1:10:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is what did Kawaks into.
• 1:10:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Crazy personalities, GM that doesn't want them.
• 1:10:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're a defensive coordinator that doesn't want them.
• 1:10:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're an owner who wants them.
• 1:10:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're hood who passed away.
• 1:10:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what happened.
• 1:10:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And did good comes into that.
• 1:10:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And wins a Super Bowl.
• 1:10:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's not forget what he accomplished as the bear's head coach.
• 1:10:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I understand you couldn't figure out the quarterback.
• 1:10:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted Doug Flutey.
• 1:10:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Doug Flutey was a disaster in 86.
• 1:10:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: 87's a strike.
• 1:10:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Gary Fensick talked about it.
• 1:10:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: The defense lost their edge after that.
• 1:10:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: 88, it's Mike Tom's act.
• 1:10:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jim McMan's gone.
• 1:10:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dipket can't win with Harbaugh and Tom's act.
• 1:10:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wins a couple divisions, whatever.
• 1:10:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then you know, has the bad season 92 sealator.
• 1:10:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dipket never figured out the quarterback because Jim McMan couldn't stay healthy.
• 1:10:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: But you ever know what Mike did because record was with Jim McLean.
• 1:10:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to talk about that for one second here before we wrap up conversation about did come out to things people didn't like about him.
• 1:10:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't like those things as well.
• 1:11:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Jim McMahon and Mike Dicca, right, together, three and four and 1982 in the seven games, McMahon starts.
• 1:11:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: 7 and 6 and 1983.
• 1:11:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Then here's where the defense gets figured out, the offense gets homing.
• 1:11:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: 7 and 2 in 84, 11 and 0 in 85, 6 and 0 in 86.
• 1:11:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: five and one in 87, seven and two in 1988 and then McMahon's gone in 89 and he goes to the charges.
• 1:11:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, from 84 to 88, that is 41 games where Mike Dickah had a capable quarterback.
• 1:11:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what we're gonna call Jim McMahon, a capable quarterback.
• 1:11:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: He had 41 games.
• 1:11:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: with Jim McMan, Mike Dicca in those 41 games lost a total of five times.
• 1:12:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicca with a great defense, but again, not always buddy Ryan.
• 1:12:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's not there in 86 and 87, so you can't just say it was buddy Ryan, 41 games, five losses when he had a capable quarterback.
• 1:12:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's Mike Dicca as the head coach of the Chicago Bears.
• 1:12:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: We get Mike Dick is older years.
• 1:12:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's some things that happen.
• 1:12:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicka never said no to an endorsement.
• 1:12:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: That bothered a lot of people.
• 1:12:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: That Mike Dicka was just had his billboard all over Chicago, was on every commercial break, basically people thought he would do anything for money.
• 1:12:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: That annoyed them.
• 1:12:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dicka had very firm political beliefs.
• 1:12:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: that bothered people.
• 1:12:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dick and I, our political beliefs, we're not see eye to eye.
• 1:12:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: He supported political candidates that I wish never ever step foot in Washington DC.
• 1:13:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dick had talked about how he wished he would have run for Senate against Barack Obama because he thinks he would have won.
• 1:13:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he might have.
• 1:13:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then Barack Obama became president.
• 1:13:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't like the Barack Obama was president.
• 1:13:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But you know what Mike did could did do when Barack Obama invited the 85 bears to the White House, because if you don't know the story, I'm sure you probably do the 85 bears were supposed to come to the White House after they won the Super Bowl in 1986, but the challenger shuttle disaster was a few days later bears visit got canceled, never got rescheduled, and they never went.
• 1:13:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: So Barack Obama being a Chicago guy says, I'm gonna give the 85 bears their day.
• 1:13:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Invite the 85 bears to the White House.
• 1:13:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dittka shows up and gives Barack Obama an 85 Obama jersey.
• 1:13:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And was cordial and they had fun banter and Mike Dittka respected the office of the president showed up and Obama's a good man.
• 1:13:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Whether you like him or not, I'm not trying to get into politics with Obama.
• 1:13:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I think even people who hate Obama's politics,
• 1:14:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure there's some that are extreme, but for the most part, you know, when sat there and said Barack Obama disrespected the office, when you say he had to wear a tan suit was disrespectful, that's when you know, you cross in lines and look at your drawn, you know, your, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh
• 1:14:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're grasping in straws.
• 1:14:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the word I'm looking for, the term I'm looking for.
• 1:14:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Grasping in straws.
• 1:14:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, did good, despite the fact that he did not like Obama's politics, still showed up in the White House and still took that honor.
• 1:14:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, yes, Mike Dicka probably peddled too much crap.
• 1:14:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, Mike Dicka had politics that bothered liberals.
• 1:14:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Mike Dicka,
• 1:14:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: In the end, still was a great player, a great coach, a fun commentator, and when you hear stories from Jim Harbaugh and Jim Nance and some of the guys that got to know him behind the scenes, where Mike Dicca did not advertise that he did this stuff.
• 1:14:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Mike Dicca always carried a
• 1:15:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And what you do, you got your co-check five dollars, here's a hundred keep the change.
• 1:15:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Free Budweiser's please eight dollars, here's a hundred keep the change.
• 1:15:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what Mike Dick did, sees a homeless guy, hundred dollar bill, peels it off, drops it in his cup.
• 1:15:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's what Mike Dick did, he was generous.
• 1:15:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jim Harbaugh told a story that he went in the Dick's office when he was the quarterback of the bears and kids was just writing, check after check after check all for five hundred dollars and stuff in him and envelopes.
• 1:15:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Our blast, what are that for?
• 1:15:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's people who reached out who were hurting.
• 1:15:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: needed some help.
• 1:15:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm helping him.
• 1:15:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: That was Mike Dittka.
• 1:15:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dittka cared whether you like this politics, whether you dislike this politics, whether you hated that he was an endorser, whether you thought it was funny that he was an endorser.
• 1:15:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dittka was a generous man.
• 1:15:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dittka was a great coach.
• 1:15:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mike Dittka is an all-time bear.
• 1:15:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: He is on the Mount Rushmore.
• 1:15:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: George Hallis, Mike Dittka, Walter Payton, argue about your fourth guy, mine is Dick
• 1:16:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the Mount Rushmore.
• 1:16:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did cause probably never coming off that.
• 1:16:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Never coming off that.
• 1:16:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson and Caleb Williams.
• 1:16:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, if they both get a spot on Mount Rushmore eventually, because they go, you do huge things.
• 1:16:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: George Alice obviously is always going to be on Mount Rushmore.
• 1:16:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to argue, Mike Dicker, Walter Payne, because that's when you're talking about the Chicago Bears.
• 1:16:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're talking about how important Mike Dick is to this franchise.
• 1:16:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to be missed and I know he wasn't in the public eye the last few years because his health wasn't great, but he's going to be missed because he was Chicago.
• 1:16:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know he was a Pittsburgh guy, but he embraced Chicago.
• 1:16:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was Chicago.
• 1:16:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Chicago loved him.
• 1:16:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
• 1:16:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let's wrap this up.
• 1:16:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: with the prediction.
• 1:16:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Atlanta Falcons, this is an important game.
• 1:16:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is not a must-win critical game.
• 1:16:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bears can lose this game and be fine.
• 1:16:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: They are three and two, three and three is not the end of the world, especially the way the NFC's very bottled up right now.
• 1:16:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, there's not a lot of dominant teams.
• 1:17:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: We can look at this right now in the playoff picture and say the East, good chance that East is only getting one team, good chance the South is only getting one team.
• 1:17:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you're talking about,
• 1:17:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: the three teams in the west and you're talking about the four teams in the north, you're going to have those seven teams probably buy in for five spots.
• 1:17:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's probably what how this is going to shake out.
• 1:17:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know for sure, teams can get hot, teams can get cold, but that's most likely how this is going to play out.
• 1:17:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the Chicago Bears are sitting at three and three, it is certainly not panic mode.
• 1:17:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they're going to have their hands full, Michael Panics is going to play.
• 1:17:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: If Michael Panics didn't play Tua and Strand and Rush, they're also bad, the bears were going to be in a really good shape to win this game, even if Bayesian or Akina played.
• 1:17:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: But bottom line is, Panics is going to play.
• 1:17:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: This offense looks a lot better with Michael Panics.
• 1:17:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It just does.
• 1:17:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: But John Robinson, I don't know how the bears are going to stop him.
• 1:17:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Drake London, I don't know how the bears are going to stop him.
• 1:17:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Dennis Allen, you got your hands full.
• 1:18:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: but the return of Caleb Williams is huge.
• 1:18:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think Caleb Williams might have a little rust, but I do think this bear's offense is gonna look significantly better than it did.
• 1:18:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna see what they can do at the running game here because Rochon Johnson isn't it?
• 1:18:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: bottom line there.
• 1:18:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: He just should not play in the offense.
• 1:18:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bears need a different RB3.
• 1:18:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Rochang to be your RB4.
• 1:18:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: He can play special teams.
• 1:18:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: He can come in for a couple of plays in a pinch and pass walk and do what you need to do.
• 1:18:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: He can't be relied on as your RB2 when Kalmanon guys out.
• 1:18:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we have to see what they can do in the run game.
• 1:18:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ben's going to have to get creative.
• 1:18:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to see how much Caleb Williams impacts this game and see how much rust he might have, how much trust he has in his leg.
• 1:18:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: There's the whole lot of things that Caleb's going to have to work through mentally that he hasn't had to do yet at the NFL level.
• 1:18:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this is going to be a tall order for the bears.
• 1:18:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this defense is going to struggle.
• 1:18:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think this offense is going to look better.
• 1:19:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the bottom line here is the Chicago Bears.
• 1:19:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think they're going to lose this one.
• 1:19:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to be much more high scoring.
• 1:19:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'll say 31, 27 in Atlanta.
• 1:19:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think Caleb is going to have a little russ, but he's going to look pretty good overall.
• 1:19:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And hopefully I'm wrong, and the Chicago Bears do win this one, heading into that short week with the New England Patriots.
• 1:19:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's going to do it for Bears, Manter.
• 1:19:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: We will talk to you next week, fair now, and everybody got his suit, adios.