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Get Out with Korama Danquah · The Bechdel Cast

0:00
Speaker 1: On the Bechdel Cast.
0:02
Speaker 2: The questions asked if movies have women and them, are
0:05
Speaker 2: all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands, or do they
0:08
Speaker 2: have individualism? It's the patriarchy, zeph and bast start changing
0:13
Speaker 2: it with the Bechdel Cast.
0:16
Speaker 3: Clink clink, Jamie, you're getting very sleepy now.
0:22
Speaker 4: I passed out. It's done.
0:25
Speaker 5: It's done.
0:26
Speaker 3: Oh those so easy.
0:27
Speaker 5: Yeah, I know, I know. I mean, that's that's what
0:30
Speaker 5: the movies are about.
0:34
Speaker 3: Oh goodness. Welcome to the Bechdel Cast. My name is
0:37
Speaker 3: Caitlin Derante.
0:38
Speaker 5: Clink clink, my name is Jamie Loftus, and this is
0:41
Speaker 5: our podcast where we talk about your favorite movies from
0:45
Speaker 5: an intersectional feminist lens using the Bechdel test.
0:49
Speaker 4: Cast test.
0:51
Speaker 5: We've been doing this for eight years as a jumping
0:54
Speaker 5: off point for discussion.
0:55
Speaker 4: But Caitlin, what the hell is that?
0:57
Speaker 3: Oh? Gee whiz. It's a media metric to buy a
1:00
Speaker 3: queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel Wallace Test.
1:03
Speaker 3: It has many versions, and ours is this. Do two
1:08
Speaker 3: characters of a marginalized gender have names? Do they speak
1:11
Speaker 3: to each other? And is the conversation about something other
1:15
Speaker 3: than a man, and we especially like it when it's
1:19
Speaker 3: a narratively meaningful conversation and not just you know, throw
1:23
Speaker 3: away dialogue.
1:24
Speaker 5: Very true. And today we're doing one of our rare
1:29
Speaker 5: do over episodes. We are covering the twenty seventeen movie
1:36
Speaker 5: get Out.
1:37
Speaker 4: If you were a.
1:38
Speaker 5: Matreon subscriber, which you should be, this was I think
1:42
Speaker 5: the first matreard episode we ever did that was a
1:47
Speaker 5: live okay.
1:49
Speaker 4: Okay, listen, listen.
1:50
Speaker 5: It was a moment in time. Listen okay. So what
1:53
Speaker 5: we were the circumstances under which we recorded our first
1:56
Speaker 5: get Out episode was in the basement of a pizza
2:00
Speaker 5: parlor in Brooklyn.
2:02
Speaker 4: Yeah, as a part of a comedy festival.
2:04
Speaker 5: I don't remember which one, but one that was comfortable
2:07
Speaker 5: putting us in the basement of a pizza.
2:08
Speaker 3: Parlor certainly not a venue that was conducive to a
2:14
Speaker 3: live podcast show, to the point where there was not
2:18
Speaker 3: a sound system that allowed it, that allowed us to
2:21
Speaker 3: record audio from the soundboard, which is how we would
2:24
Speaker 3: normally record audio from a live show. And there weren't
2:27
Speaker 3: even enough microphones. Jamie and I had to share a microphone.
2:31
Speaker 5: Yes, and we only had like a half hour. So anyways,
2:35
Speaker 5: and this was also it in to give us some
2:39
Speaker 5: criticism as well. This is before we kind of realized
2:41
Speaker 5: that a movie that requires a lot of discussion is
2:46
Speaker 5: maybe not ideal for a live show.
2:48
Speaker 4: So too a lot like.
2:50
Speaker 5: We didn't have enough time, We didn't know how to
2:53
Speaker 5: do a live podcast.
2:54
Speaker 4: It was twenty seventeen, and.
2:57
Speaker 5: We want to resolve because yes, get Out deserves better.
3:02
Speaker 5: So today we are recovering get Out in the Year
3:07
Speaker 5: of Our Lord twenty twenty four with an incredible guest,
3:10
Speaker 5: a returning guest.
3:12
Speaker 4: Yes, a friend of the pod.
3:13
Speaker 3: Indeed, she's a writer actor. She wrote on I Carly
3:17
Speaker 3: and Raven's Home. You remember her from our episodes on
3:21
Speaker 3: the movies US and Cheetah Girls. It's Carama Donqua, Hello.
3:26
Speaker 1: Hello, bye, thank you so much for having me back.
3:29
Speaker 1: I hope I'm not like a best friend of the
3:32
Speaker 1: pod like you know best friends a tear. I like
3:34
Speaker 1: to think I'm a best friend of the pod. Oh yeah, absolutely,
3:37
Speaker 1: I don't want to like force it or anything.
3:40
Speaker 3: Happening naturally.
3:41
Speaker 5: Three Timers Club, Yeah, three pet I love I also
3:46
Speaker 5: love that. Yeah. I kind of forgot what a wide
3:49
Speaker 5: range of movies we've covered with you.
3:52
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, to Jordan Peele Movies Now and Cheetah Girls.
3:57
Speaker 1: Yes, one cinema classic. And to Jordan Peel Films.
4:02
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, exactly, yes, And of course shout out to
4:06
Speaker 3: our our guest on the original episode, Ray Sonni, and
4:08
Speaker 3: shout out to anyone who was there at the pizza parlor, not.
4:11
Speaker 5: On Ray and not on the pizza parlor attendees. Yes,
4:15
Speaker 5: we take we take full accountability. And plus the comedy
4:18
Speaker 5: Fuzzle Will, which I don't remember the name of. So yeah, whatever.
4:22
Speaker 3: I am because Ray was, you know, like precisely, And yes,
4:26
Speaker 3: we're so excited to have you to talk about this movie, Kroma.
4:30
Speaker 3: What's your relationship with get Out?
4:33
Speaker 1: What is my relationship with get Out? I went to
4:36
Speaker 1: see it. You know, it's so funny because I'm gonna
4:39
Speaker 1: tell a story that's gonna sound almost identical to my
4:42
Speaker 1: story about Us. I went to go see it in
4:45
Speaker 1: theaters with my friend Mike. I went and saw Us
4:49
Speaker 1: with my other friend Mike. I have a lot of
4:51
Speaker 1: white men, different mic friends that are named Mike, don't
4:56
Speaker 1: well and some non white mics Michael's in my life,
5:00
Speaker 1: but most of them are white men named Mike. But
5:03
Speaker 1: I went and saw it in the Cinerama Dome rip
5:07
Speaker 1: and I didn't know a ton before I went and
5:11
Speaker 1: saw it. My friend Mike, this particular mic is kind
5:15
Speaker 1: of always like, come see this movie, and I just go.
5:18
Speaker 1: And that's how I saw Moonlight. Also, we went to
5:21
Speaker 1: an advanced screening of Moonlight together. He doesn't have a
5:25
Speaker 1: lot of black friends, so he tends to see black
5:27
Speaker 1: movies with me, which is fine. I love that for him.
5:31
Speaker 1: I'm not upset about it. But we went to an
5:33
Speaker 1: advanced screening of Moonlight at Lakhma and Janelle Monet was
5:37
Speaker 1: there and my breath gone, Wow, they took it. Yeah.
5:43
Speaker 1: But so I went and saw it at the Cinerama Dome.
5:45
Speaker 1: And I love horror and I love Jordan Peele and
5:48
Speaker 1: I love Danielkluja. I was a Skins person. My ring
5:51
Speaker 1: tone on my phone is the Skins theme song. No
5:54
Speaker 1: one ever hears it because my phone's on silent all
5:56
Speaker 1: the time, but I but, you know, yeah, And I
6:01
Speaker 1: was really struck with get Out, how tight the script
6:07
Speaker 1: was and how well constructed it was. I love a
6:12
Speaker 1: well constructed piece of writing. Like you know, the word
6:17
Speaker 1: play right is spelled weird because a rite is a builder,
6:21
Speaker 1: and writing things is about like building them, and I
6:25
Speaker 1: think that Jordan Peele built a masterpiece. But yeah, that's
6:29
Speaker 1: where I'm at. And then I took my little brother
6:31
Speaker 1: to see it because I was like, this is important
6:33
Speaker 1: for him to see and no one else is going
6:35
Speaker 1: to take him to see it. And he was like
6:38
Speaker 1: seventeen at the time.
6:39
Speaker 5: I was like, oh cool, Yeah.
6:42
Speaker 1: It was not his first rated R movie. I did
6:45
Speaker 1: show him his first rated OUR movie, which was kick Ass.
6:47
Speaker 5: Okay, okay, another solid choice.
6:50
Speaker 1: But I really wanted to like share it with my brother,
6:53
Speaker 1: especially because it has so much to do with the
6:56
Speaker 1: way that black men in particular are perceived in society.
7:00
Speaker 1: And I don't think that my brother had somebody who
7:04
Speaker 1: was going to really talk to him about that and
7:06
Speaker 1: what it meant in the way that I was going
7:08
Speaker 1: to like discuss the film with him, And like, I
7:11
Speaker 1: get to discuss it with you two today.
7:12
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so I'm so excited.
7:15
Speaker 5: Jamie.
7:16
Speaker 3: What's your relationship with the movie.
7:19
Speaker 5: My relationship with the movie is I didn't see it
7:21
Speaker 5: in theaters during its first run, which I really regret.
7:23
Speaker 5: I feel like early twenty seventeen was just before I
7:26
Speaker 5: got a movie pass and before I knew stubs existed,
7:29
Speaker 5: so I just wasn't in the theaters a lot at
7:32
Speaker 5: this time. But I saw it later, I think later
7:35
Speaker 5: that year, in twenty seventeen, and immediately it was like, fuck,
7:41
Speaker 5: I want to see this in a theater so badly.
7:44
Speaker 5: And it took me a couple of years, but I
7:47
Speaker 5: finally did see it. I think I saw it at Vidiots,
7:49
Speaker 5: maybe like a year ago or so. But it's just
7:52
Speaker 5: like you're saying, Karma, it's a masterpiece. It's so good.
7:55
Speaker 5: I feel like this movie at least I don't know.
7:59
Speaker 5: I mean, I'm I'm a horror fan, but I don't
8:01
Speaker 5: know every single thing about horror. But it just seems
8:04
Speaker 5: like get Out really kicked off a whole new generation
8:08
Speaker 5: of horror films, kind of for better.
8:11
Speaker 4: Or for worse.
8:11
Speaker 5: There's a lot of movies you'll see, like a lot
8:13
Speaker 5: of horror movies. Now you're like, Okay, you know, there's
8:16
Speaker 5: a lot of people that want to do what Jordan
8:17
Speaker 5: Peele does, but no one can because he's fucking incredible.
8:20
Speaker 5: And yeah, it was really interesting to go back and
8:24
Speaker 5: revisit this with sort of the knowledge of the better
8:27
Speaker 5: part of ten years of clearly how this was. I
8:30
Speaker 5: feel like get Out was sort of immediately a classic,
8:33
Speaker 5: but now seven years.
8:34
Speaker 4: On, its influence is so.
8:36
Speaker 5: So present, to the point where like Jordan Peele has
8:40
Speaker 5: to work around the influence of this movie. Yeah, Daniel
8:45
Speaker 5: Culia is incredible. I was not a Skins head. I
8:47
Speaker 5: regret it was. I feel like I went the de
8:49
Speaker 5: Grassy way and then I never I never went to
8:53
Speaker 5: England with my teen TV.
8:55
Speaker 1: I'm bisexual. I love both Degrassis and Skins.
9:01
Speaker 4: The two genders. Yes, yes, but yeah I was.
9:06
Speaker 5: I could have been watching Daniel Coluia, but instead I
9:09
Speaker 5: was watching a bunch of.
9:10
Speaker 4: Door Drake I was watching. I know, I was watching Drake.
9:15
Speaker 4: Huge l for me, but yeah, this was.
9:18
Speaker 5: I haven't seen it in about a year or so,
9:22
Speaker 5: but yeah, it's a masterpiece. And also just going back
9:24
Speaker 5: to I've been rewatching a lot of horror classics lately,
9:27
Speaker 5: and I recently rewatched Rosemary's Baby and The Step for
9:31
Speaker 5: Wives and a lot of things that going through this are,
9:34
Speaker 5: you know, very clear influences on Jordan Peel and listening
9:37
Speaker 5: to him talk. I don't know, it's just it's great.
9:40
Speaker 4: Kaitlin Winster history with this movie.
9:42
Speaker 3: This is one of my favorite movies of all time.
9:45
Speaker 3: I agree that it's a masterpiece. I teach it in
9:48
Speaker 3: my screenwriting classes, using it as an example for many
9:53
Speaker 3: examples of what the movie does so well as far
9:56
Speaker 3: as crafting a story and planting payoff and you know,
10:00
Speaker 3: withholding information for later reveal and all this kind of stuff.
10:04
Speaker 3: So I am just astounded by this movie every time
10:08
Speaker 3: I watch it, because it holds up on a rewatch
10:11
Speaker 3: so so well, the way that some horror movies or
10:14
Speaker 3: some movies with like a big twist don't hold up
10:17
Speaker 3: because then the story logic just kind of falls apart
10:20
Speaker 3: when you rewatch it after knowing the twist. But this
10:23
Speaker 3: movie holds up so well. And yeah, I saw it
10:26
Speaker 3: in theaters and it was one of my favorite theater
10:29
Speaker 3: going experiences ever. I would say, especially the very end, Yes,
10:35
Speaker 3: when the cop car pulls up and you're like, fuck
10:39
Speaker 3: the fear you feel for Chris, and then the door
10:42
Speaker 3: swings open and it says airport and Lil Rel steps
10:45
Speaker 3: out and the whole crowd screaming, cheering, just like it
10:51
Speaker 3: was incredible.
10:51
Speaker 1: Nobody has loved TSA as much as they did. I
10:55
Speaker 1: was gonna say in February of twenty seventeen.
10:58
Speaker 4: What a moment for the TSA.
11:00
Speaker 5: Truly, I've never seen them get good press anywhere before
11:04
Speaker 5: or since. But yes, Iconic DSA employee.
11:09
Speaker 3: Oh god, right, right, right, So yeah, I had a
11:14
Speaker 3: great time seeing in theaters and yeah, I've seen this
11:17
Speaker 3: movie probably like twenty times now and.
11:20
Speaker 4: I love it.
11:22
Speaker 3: Let's take a quick break and then come back for
11:25
Speaker 3: the recap, shall we.
11:26
Speaker 5: Let's do it?
11:27
Speaker 6: Sounds great, and we're back.
11:39
Speaker 4: I was gonna say, I forgot to.
11:41
Speaker 5: I think I mentioned this in our first go round
11:43
Speaker 5: of I saw like I saw the wrong Jordan Peele
11:46
Speaker 5: movie in theaters. During this period of time, I did
11:49
Speaker 5: goes to see Keanu in theater. Oh my gosh, why,
11:55
Speaker 5: I mean, that's a fun movie.
11:56
Speaker 1: There's a cat in it.
11:58
Speaker 4: There's a cat.
12:00
Speaker 5: Literally, I got dumped by a prop comedian and I
12:02
Speaker 5: was just like, I gotta go do something, And so
12:05
Speaker 5: I went to see Keanu and I was just like
12:07
Speaker 5: sitting in the back of Keanu crying.
12:10
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, that's so dark. Getting dumped by a prop
12:16
Speaker 1: comedian is. Yeah, I know that you've gone through some shit,
12:21
Speaker 1: but that is probably the darkest thing I've ever heard
12:23
Speaker 1: you go through.
12:24
Speaker 4: That's kind of what it is like.
12:26
Speaker 5: Once you've been not just dumped, but cheated on by
12:29
Speaker 5: a prop comedian. You really it really puts things into perspective.
12:34
Speaker 5: You're like, no one can truly hurt me ever again.
12:37
Speaker 3: Yeah.
12:38
Speaker 5: Wow, Anyways, Keanu was there for.
12:41
Speaker 3: Me when glad to hear. Yeah, oh, we should cover
12:45
Speaker 3: Keanu sometime on the podcast.
12:47
Speaker 5: Yeah. I mean I haven't seen it since I had
12:49
Speaker 5: negative a strong negative association, but it was funny, it
12:53
Speaker 5: was anyways, Yes, and that came out I think less
12:55
Speaker 5: than a year before Get Out, which is wild the range. Yeah,
12:58
Speaker 5: it came out, like, I think in space of six months.
13:01
Speaker 5: I'm pretty sure both if if my breakup timeline is correct,
13:05
Speaker 5: both of these movies came out so close together. And
13:07
Speaker 5: that was the other like really exciting thing was like Jordan,
13:11
Speaker 5: I mean huge Key and Peel fan obviously, like yeah,
13:15
Speaker 5: loved love, loved Key and Peel Forever is like one
13:17
Speaker 5: of the best sketch comedy shows ever. And then just
13:20
Speaker 5: being like and Jordan, Peele can do this, Like it
13:23
Speaker 5: was just so fucking cool. So many comedians have tried
13:27
Speaker 5: to do it since, and no one's pulled it off
13:29
Speaker 5: because he's just different. He's great anyways, Yeah, just wanted
13:34
Speaker 5: to shout out, like we're all comedians here too, and
13:37
Speaker 5: seeing someone who is like at the top of the
13:40
Speaker 5: sketch comedy world immediately also become one of the top
13:44
Speaker 5: tours in the world. It's just like the coolest and
13:46
Speaker 5: get Out is super funny.
13:48
Speaker 4: Like it's just yeah, it's great.
13:49
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah he Also, I mean he Jordan Peele talks
13:52
Speaker 3: about the similarities and parallels between horror and comedy and
13:56
Speaker 3: how they function so similarly as like storytelling devices, and yeah,
14:01
Speaker 3: so it just makes sense. Also, the Gremlins two Key
14:05
Speaker 3: and Peel sketch.
14:06
Speaker 4: Is like where is this going?
14:09
Speaker 1: OK?
14:11
Speaker 3: I watch it like once a month. It's the funniest
14:14
Speaker 3: thing to me. Everyone paused this episode and go watch
14:18
Speaker 3: the Gremlins two Key and Peel sketch.
14:20
Speaker 1: My favorite Key and Peel sketch is the one about
14:24
Speaker 1: the two ethnic restaurants across the street from each other
14:28
Speaker 1: with the chip BOMBI and my mom loves that sketch
14:32
Speaker 1: so so so much because I think it kind of
14:34
Speaker 1: reminds her of like West African Jeeloff Wars. It's like
14:37
Speaker 1: it's all Rice, calm down, and I can say that
14:41
Speaker 1: I'm gonna and we have the best off. Don't fight me.
14:46
Speaker 1: But I worked with Keith and Michael Key a couple
14:49
Speaker 1: of years ago on a show, and my mom was like, Karama,
14:54
Speaker 1: tell him I love the chip Boppy sketch. And I
14:57
Speaker 1: was like, okay, Mom, I'll tell him. And I didn't.
14:59
Speaker 1: He was like that one.
15:03
Speaker 5: Look to each their own. I liked the Continental Breakfast one.
15:07
Speaker 5: Do you remember that one? That was always my favorite classic?
15:10
Speaker 5: But yes, anyways, listeners, also let us know your favorite
15:13
Speaker 5: Key and Peel sketches. It's just like amazing, and then
15:15
Speaker 5: I this is beside the point, but here we are.
15:19
Speaker 4: Do you remember?
15:19
Speaker 5: This was I think the same year that A Quiet
15:22
Speaker 5: Place one came out, and there was this brief moment
15:25
Speaker 5: where they're like two brilliant O tours Jordan Peele and
15:28
Speaker 5: John Krasinsky, And then I think we disabused ourselves of
15:30
Speaker 5: that pretty quickly, were like one great O tour and
15:35
Speaker 5: John Krasinski you.
15:36
Speaker 1: Didn't like if? Are you talking about?
15:40
Speaker 5: Oh?
15:40
Speaker 4: Did direct that if? Or a quieplace?
15:44
Speaker 1: I think he uh wrote if or like developed.
15:47
Speaker 3: If if being like imaginary friend right that wait was
15:51
Speaker 3: that the horror movie that came out about Imaginary Friends.
15:56
Speaker 5: Comedy.
15:56
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, it's the one that felt very Foster's Home
16:00
Speaker 1: Imaginary Friends, but like wasn't Yeah I.
16:03
Speaker 3: Saw Imaginary I think is what it was called a
16:06
Speaker 3: horror movie. Yeah, it was not good, except the third
16:10
Speaker 3: act just goes off the rails in the most hilarious way.
16:14
Speaker 3: Highly recommend watching the third act of that movie. Anyway,
16:18
Speaker 3: we're here to talk about it.
16:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think what makes it out so good is
16:21
Speaker 1: that a lot of horror movies really fall apart in
16:23
Speaker 1: the third act for sure, and this one is like, no, no,
16:27
Speaker 1: we're just getting better, like a fine wine over time.
16:30
Speaker 1: Just wow to.
16:31
Speaker 5: The last wine, like the the TSA line. It's just.
16:37
Speaker 1: Incredible.
16:38
Speaker 5: All right, Yeah, let's get into it. Sorry, I just
16:40
Speaker 5: needed to do a quick key and peel.
16:42
Speaker 3: Diverse check in. Yes, no important. So for the recap
16:46
Speaker 3: forget Out, I'll place the content warning for anti black
16:50
Speaker 3: racism and violence. So we open on a young black
16:55
Speaker 3: man played by Lakeith Stanfield who is walking in a
16:59
Speaker 3: suburb at night. He's trying to get somewhere, but he's
17:02
Speaker 3: kind of lost, and then a car approaches and starts
17:06
Speaker 3: creepily following him. The driver gets out, wearing a medieval
17:11
Speaker 3: helmet and attacks and abducts the man. We then meet
17:17
Speaker 3: Chris Washington played by Daniel Caluya, a photographer living in
17:22
Speaker 3: I think New York City is where it's meant to be.
17:26
Speaker 3: He's dating Rose Armitage played by Alison Williams, and they're
17:32
Speaker 3: about to leave on a weekend trip to visit her parents,
17:35
Speaker 3: who Chris will be meeting for the first time, and
17:38
Speaker 3: he asks Rose, who is white, if her parents know
17:43
Speaker 3: that he's black, and she's like, no, but it's not
17:47
Speaker 3: a big deal. My parents aren't racist, and he's like okay.
17:54
Speaker 3: Chris's friend Rod, played by little Ral Howry, is similarly skeptical.
17:59
Speaker 3: He works for the TSA.
18:01
Speaker 5: This is defining characteristic. That's kind of all we know
18:04
Speaker 5: about him. Loves the TSA outside of the fact that
18:08
Speaker 5: he's Chris's best friend.
18:09
Speaker 4: He works for the TSA, and that is what we know.
18:11
Speaker 1: And he's a dog sitter on occasion.
18:13
Speaker 4: Yes, he's a dog lover.
18:15
Speaker 3: He's dog sitting Chris's dog, Sid while Chris is gone,
18:20
Speaker 3: and he jokes to Chris about how he needs to
18:23
Speaker 3: be careful around these white people. He's like, don't go
18:26
Speaker 3: into their house. But despite Little World's warnings, Chris and
18:32
Speaker 3: Rose head out on the road to her parents' house.
18:36
Speaker 3: They hit a deer that suddenly runs out on the road,
18:40
Speaker 3: and Chris can't really do anything about it, but you know,
18:44
Speaker 3: watch it slowly die.
18:46
Speaker 5: I know, we just watched Triangle of Sadness and I
18:48
Speaker 5: was like, wait, they don't do a Triangle of sadness
18:50
Speaker 5: animal sacrifice?
18:51
Speaker 1: Do they?
18:52
Speaker 5: Then they don't. I was just thinking, what.
18:55
Speaker 4: Do they killing Triangle of Sadness?
18:56
Speaker 5: It's like a donkey a donkey. Yeah, I don't know.
18:59
Speaker 5: I just had a flash back to that. Anyways, we're
19:03
Speaker 5: spared that.
19:04
Speaker 3: Yes, So a cop shows up to this, you know,
19:09
Speaker 3: like accident, wanting to see Chris's ID even though he
19:12
Speaker 3: wasn't driving, and Rose implies that the cop is being racist,
19:18
Speaker 3: and so the cop concedes and leaves. They arrive at
19:22
Speaker 3: the Armitage house, this like you know, large rich people home.
19:28
Speaker 3: We meet Rose's dad, Dean played by Bradley Whitford, and
19:33
Speaker 3: her mom, Missy, played by Catherine Keener, and they seem
19:38
Speaker 3: warm and inviting to Chris. We also meet a grounds
19:44
Speaker 3: keeper and a housekeeper who work for the Armitage family,
19:48
Speaker 3: Walter and Georgina played by Marcus Henderson and Betty Gabriel.
19:53
Speaker 3: Both of them are black, and Chris can't help but
19:56
Speaker 3: notice that they seem kind of weird. Then Chris and
20:01
Speaker 3: the family get to know each other a bit more.
20:04
Speaker 3: We find out that Chris's mom died in a car
20:06
Speaker 3: accident when he was a kid. Also, Dean suggests that
20:11
Speaker 3: Missy hypnotized Chris to help him quit smoking. She's a
20:15
Speaker 3: psychiatrist and she's like developed this method of hypnosis. But
20:20
Speaker 3: Chris is like, no thanks, I'm good. Then Rose's brother
20:25
Speaker 3: Jeremy played by Caleb Landry Jones shows up to the house.
20:30
Speaker 3: He's there for a party that Rose's grandfather used to
20:34
Speaker 3: throw every year while he was alive, and the family
20:38
Speaker 3: just like kept this tradition going of throwing this annual party.
20:42
Speaker 3: Jeremy is generally an asshole. He says some weird things
20:46
Speaker 3: to Chris about his physique and genetic makeup, and he
20:51
Speaker 3: tries to play fight with Chris, and so there's you know,
20:54
Speaker 3: weird vibes from him as well.
20:57
Speaker 5: And I know this isn't true, but this is always
20:58
Speaker 5: the point in the movie where I'm like.
21:00
Speaker 4: Is this supposed to be Jonah Piretti because.
21:03
Speaker 5: Oh, because of Chelsea was famously a piece of shit. Anyways,
21:09
Speaker 5: maybe Jordan Peele says, no.
21:12
Speaker 1: Well, I think he'd have to.
21:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can't be like, yes, it's my brother in
21:17
Speaker 3: law who I hate.
21:18
Speaker 5: Yeah, mister BuzzFeed him son.
21:21
Speaker 3: Oh gosh. So Rose is like, oh, sorry about my family,
21:27
Speaker 3: maybe they are racist, and Chris is like, yeah, no shit,
21:31
Speaker 3: I told you so.
21:33
Speaker 1: Uh.
21:33
Speaker 3: Later that night, Chris can't sleep, so he goes outside
21:37
Speaker 3: for a cigarette. He sees more of Walter and Georgina
21:40
Speaker 3: being weird, and when Chris goes back in, Missy reprimands
21:44
Speaker 3: him for smoking and that she kind of coaxes him
21:47
Speaker 3: into being hypnotized. She's swirling a spoon around a teacup,
21:53
Speaker 3: and she weaponizes the guilt that he feels about his
21:56
Speaker 3: mother's death.
21:57
Speaker 5: Catherine Keener is terrifying.
22:00
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, she's very, very scary. The performances all
22:03
Speaker 3: around in this movie are just like next level.
22:06
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, but Daniel Kleia obviously is like the
22:10
Speaker 5: reaction shots of him are like iconic at this point.
22:14
Speaker 5: But yeah, that like every single performance it's so well cast.
22:17
Speaker 5: It's yeah, it's great.
22:19
Speaker 1: He really shows that acting is reacting because he doesn't
22:22
Speaker 1: talk a lot. Yeah, he's a man of few words.
22:26
Speaker 1: He's very observant. Yeah, and not he doesn't he holds
22:30
Speaker 1: his cards a little close to the best.
22:32
Speaker 5: Yeah, for sure. And I also, I mean, just I
22:35
Speaker 5: didn't really think about it before, but like Jordan Peel's
22:39
Speaker 5: casting process, he's like chosen these white actors that are
22:42
Speaker 5: associated with these famous white liberal shows like Alison Williams
22:46
Speaker 5: Is and Girls. Bradley Whitfer was in the West Wing,
22:48
Speaker 5: so it's like there's already this sort of subconscious association
22:51
Speaker 5: with white liberalism with the casting too, and then the
22:55
Speaker 5: performances are just unbelievable. It's yeah, he's playing five D chess.
23:00
Speaker 1: Very much reminds me of Emerald Fennel's casting process for
23:03
Speaker 1: promising young women, where she was like, I want all
23:06
Speaker 1: of the men to be like these lovable white boys
23:09
Speaker 1: that everybody is like, oh my god, he's the best,
23:12
Speaker 1: and then they're horrible sexual assaulters.
23:16
Speaker 5: Right and or complicit Adam Brodie bo burn up, Yeah.
23:19
Speaker 1: Max Greenfield my husband right, right.
23:25
Speaker 5: Yeah. I guess that never like really fully clicked for
23:27
Speaker 5: me on previous viewings, but I was like, wow, he's
23:29
Speaker 5: really playing a game of five DCHSS for the viewers.
23:35
Speaker 3: So we're in the middle of this hypnosis scene. Chris
23:38
Speaker 3: is crying, he's scratching at the armchair, and then Missy
23:44
Speaker 3: puts him in the sunken place where he's basically trapped
23:49
Speaker 3: in his own mind. He can see what's happening in
23:52
Speaker 3: the world around him from a distance, but he can't
23:55
Speaker 3: move and he no longer has control over his own body.
24:00
Speaker 3: Cut to him waking up in bed. Things seem back
24:03
Speaker 3: to normal. He thinks it was probably a dream. And
24:07
Speaker 3: shortly after this, guests start arriving for this party. They
24:12
Speaker 3: are almost entirely older, wealthy white people. They direct several
24:17
Speaker 3: racist microaggressions at Chris and macro.
24:20
Speaker 5: Aggressions, yeah, just to also aggression.
24:24
Speaker 3: A lot of everything.
24:25
Speaker 1: My favorite of the aggressions is when when that woman
24:29
Speaker 1: looks at Rose and says, is it better? Yeah?
24:32
Speaker 4: Ohh god, lady yeah.
24:36
Speaker 3: And then Chris notices the one other black guest at
24:39
Speaker 3: the party and approaches him. We recognize him as the
24:44
Speaker 3: Lakeith Stanfield character we saw at the very beginning of
24:46
Speaker 3: the movie, although now he's acting and speaking and dressing
24:50
Speaker 3: very differently, and he seems to be like romantically with
24:54
Speaker 3: a much older white woman, so the vibes are very
24:58
Speaker 3: weird there. The inter action he has with Chris is
25:01
Speaker 3: very weird. And then Chris Cross's path Chris Cross Chris
25:07
Speaker 3: Cross's paths with a guy named Jim Hudson played by
25:11
Speaker 3: Stephen Root, who Chris had heard of because he's an
25:15
Speaker 3: art dealer. Jim knows of Chris as well because he's
25:19
Speaker 3: an admirer of Chris's photography, although he hasn't been able
25:23
Speaker 3: to see it because due to a genetic disease, Jim
25:27
Speaker 3: Hudson went blind, and he explains that he has his
25:31
Speaker 3: assistant describe artists work to him in detail, so he
25:36
Speaker 3: knows if he wants to, you know, buy and deal
25:38
Speaker 3: it or not. Then Chris goes inside and we see
25:43
Speaker 3: that all the guests are hyper fixated on Chris being there.
25:47
Speaker 4: It's very eerie.
25:49
Speaker 5: The moment where he walks upstairs and everyone pauses is
25:52
Speaker 5: just like everyone's worst fear.
25:56
Speaker 3: I remember that being in the trailer. You know, watching
25:59
Speaker 3: the trailer, you don't really know the context, so.
26:02
Speaker 4: You're just like, what's going on?
26:04
Speaker 3: And then you see the movie and you're like, oh
26:06
Speaker 3: my god. But anyway, Chris calls Rod, who is convinced
26:11
Speaker 3: that the family is trying to hypnotize him and turn
26:15
Speaker 3: him into a sex slave. Chris is like, a haha,
26:18
Speaker 3: I don't know. And then Chris has a bizarre interaction
26:22
Speaker 3: with Georgina. We also have seen him have a similarly
26:27
Speaker 3: bizarre interaction with Walter. Those performances are also incredible from
26:33
Speaker 3: the actors playing Georgina and Walter. And then Chris returns
26:36
Speaker 3: to the party. He observes more of the Lakeith Stanfield
26:40
Speaker 3: character being weird, so Chris tries to take a picture
26:43
Speaker 3: of him on his phone in secret, but the flash
26:47
Speaker 3: goes off and this seems to perhaps unhypnotize Lakeith's character,
26:54
Speaker 3: and he screams at Chris to get out, Hey, that's
26:58
Speaker 3: the name of the movie.
26:58
Speaker 4: You're like, whoa, oh asah.
27:02
Speaker 3: And the family explains this character's behavior away as being
27:08
Speaker 3: an epileptic seizure. And when we see the la Keith
27:12
Speaker 3: character again, he's back to being this like bizarro hypnotized
27:17
Speaker 3: version of himself. So Chris and Rose go off by
27:21
Speaker 3: themselves and Chris is like, that was no seizure. This
27:24
Speaker 3: whole thing is very uncomfortable and I want to go home,
27:27
Speaker 3: and eventually she's like, yeah, this sucks, let's get out
27:31
Speaker 3: of here.
27:31
Speaker 5: So yeah, the way that she soft nags him throughout
27:35
Speaker 5: the movie is so effective.
27:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, she's the master. She is. Give credit where credits
27:43
Speaker 1: due that woman, the character Rose Oscar.
27:47
Speaker 5: I mean it's like, I will, truly I will. It
27:50
Speaker 5: took me, probably on my first viewing too long to
27:53
Speaker 5: catch on that she's almost certainly in on it.
27:55
Speaker 7: But I didn't get it till the keys right right, same,
27:59
Speaker 7: And you're like, fuck, yeah, of course right, because the
28:02
Speaker 7: movie kind of implies that maybe she's also hypnotized.
28:06
Speaker 3: And if she's doing this, it's against her will. But
28:10
Speaker 3: just kidding, No, she's in on it.
28:12
Speaker 5: Yeah.
28:12
Speaker 3: But before we get that reveal, we see what appears
28:16
Speaker 3: to be an auction. It's like disguised as a bingo game,
28:19
Speaker 3: but it's an auction that Dean Armitage is conducting, and
28:23
Speaker 3: it's revealed that what is being sold is Chris and
28:28
Speaker 3: the highest bidder is that art dealer, Jim Hudson, and
28:32
Speaker 3: all of this is of course unbeknownst to Chris. So
28:36
Speaker 3: Chris and Rose go back inside and they get ready
28:38
Speaker 3: to leave, and he sends the picture he took of
28:41
Speaker 3: Lekeith to his friend Rod, and Rod is like, wait
28:44
Speaker 3: a minute, I know that guy. His name is Dre
28:47
Speaker 3: and Chris is like, yeah, I thought I recognized him.
28:50
Speaker 3: And he's explaining how different Drey is now and then
28:54
Speaker 3: and this is the only part of the movie that like,
28:57
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, this is a perfect movie, except for
28:59
Speaker 3: this where Chris just kind of randomly finds this statue
29:04
Speaker 3: of photos in Rose's room, and each one is of
29:09
Speaker 3: Rose and a black person, and the last two photos
29:12
Speaker 3: are of her and Walter and Georgina. And so Chris
29:18
Speaker 3: is now very much panicking. He's trying to get out
29:23
Speaker 3: right now. But Rose's family descends on him, including Rose,
29:28
Speaker 3: who surprise is in on the whole thing, and Missy
29:32
Speaker 3: hypnotizes Chris via the teacup and spoon and puts him
29:36
Speaker 3: in the sunken place. He wakes up in the basement
29:41
Speaker 3: of the house, strapped to a chair. There's a TV
29:44
Speaker 3: in front of him, and it starts playing a video
29:46
Speaker 3: about the coagula procedure, a surgery where part of a
29:52
Speaker 3: person's brain will be transplanted into Chris's body in this case,
29:57
Speaker 3: Jim Hudson, who will have control roll over Chris's body
30:02
Speaker 3: and Chris's consciousness will live in the sunken place.
30:06
Speaker 5: This is one of my favorite, like horror movie tropes,
30:09
Speaker 5: is all of a sudden when the instructional video comes
30:12
Speaker 5: on and it's like, Hi, you might be wondering what
30:15
Speaker 5: the scary thing is. Well, I'm a scary guy, and
30:19
Speaker 5: here's what the scary thing is. I love it.
30:21
Speaker 1: I will say Jordan Pield does a good job of
30:24
Speaker 1: giving an in world reason because he has Jim Hudson
30:29
Speaker 1: say you know, they say that our mutual understanding of
30:32
Speaker 1: the procedure helps it take root.
30:35
Speaker 4: And you're like, yeah, I believe that.
30:36
Speaker 1: I was like, why is this an evil monologue situation?
30:41
Speaker 1: Like they don't need to tell him? And then I
30:43
Speaker 1: was like, oh, okay, that makes sense.
30:44
Speaker 5: He has to understand for it to work.
30:46
Speaker 4: But it's justified, right. Yeah.
30:48
Speaker 3: The reason I don't like Chris just like randomly finding
30:50
Speaker 3: all those photos is because one, like it feels a
30:54
Speaker 3: little too much like a coincidence that he just randomly
30:56
Speaker 3: finds them to me at least, and two like, why
30:59
Speaker 3: would they have that evidence? Like very out in the
31:02
Speaker 3: open and available for him to see. I don't know
31:05
Speaker 3: it just it felt a little silly to me, but
31:08
Speaker 3: otherwise perfect movie anyway. So we understand that this coigular
31:12
Speaker 3: procedure is what must have happened to Drey and Walter
31:17
Speaker 3: and Georgina. And then Chris is hypnotized again via the
31:21
Speaker 3: teacup and spoon coming on the TV screen. Meanwhile, back
31:25
Speaker 3: in the city, Rod starts investigating this whole ordeal and
31:31
Speaker 3: discovers that Drey has been missing for six months. So
31:36
Speaker 3: Rod goes to the police and tries to explain that
31:38
Speaker 3: he thinks the Armitage family is abducting black people, brainwashing them,
31:43
Speaker 3: and turning them to sex slaves, but the cops all
31:46
Speaker 3: laugh him off. Back at the Armitage house, Dean and
31:51
Speaker 3: Jeremy prepare for the surgery. Jeremy goes to collect Chris,
31:55
Speaker 3: thinking he's hypnotized, but just kidding he's not because Chris
32:01
Speaker 3: had stuffed cotton in his ears from the armchair that
32:04
Speaker 3: he was anxiously scratching, so he didn't hear the teacup
32:09
Speaker 3: thing that triggers the hypnosis, which means he's able to
32:12
Speaker 3: fight back against Jeremy. He bashes him over the head
32:15
Speaker 3: with I think a bochi ball feels appropriate, right, And
32:20
Speaker 3: then Chris impales Dean with the antlers of a taxidermied buck.
32:27
Speaker 3: He breaks Missy's teacup and stabs her and kills her,
32:33
Speaker 3: and then Chris takes Jeremy's keys and starts to drive off,
32:36
Speaker 3: but then Georgina, who is actually Rose's grandmother, tries to
32:42
Speaker 3: stop him and Rose, who's eating cereal inside here's the
32:48
Speaker 3: commotion and goes outside with a rifle. Walter, who is
32:54
Speaker 3: Rose's grandfather, chases after Chris, but Chris is able to
33:00
Speaker 3: use the flash on his phone to unhypnotize Walter, so
33:04
Speaker 3: Walter shoots Rose and then himself. Though Rose is still
33:08
Speaker 3: alive and Chris starts strangling her, but then a cop
33:12
Speaker 3: car shows up and Rose is like, help me, and
33:16
Speaker 3: again we think, oh no, but the door swings open
33:20
Speaker 3: on the car and it says airport because it's Rod
33:23
Speaker 3: in a TSA car there to save his friend, and we.
33:26
Speaker 4: Can't stop cheering, and we're like, I didn't know.
33:30
Speaker 5: That there were alternative endings to this movie until I
33:32
Speaker 5: was researching for this.
33:35
Speaker 1: People did not like the alternate ending, and I don't
33:38
Speaker 1: think I would have liked it either.
33:39
Speaker 3: No, yeah, no. So this ending that we see, you know,
33:42
Speaker 3: the theatrical ending is that Chris gets in the car
33:45
Speaker 3: and they drive off to safety. The end, the alternate ending,
33:49
Speaker 3: at least one of them.
33:50
Speaker 5: It seems like there's a couple.
33:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, there was one that was actually shot. So Chris
33:55
Speaker 3: strangles Rose and kills her, so she dies, and the
34:00
Speaker 3: cops still show up in that moment, and it's actually
34:03
Speaker 3: the police, not Rod in his TSACR. The cops arrest
34:07
Speaker 3: Chris and he goes to jail. We cut to six
34:10
Speaker 3: months later. Rod visits him in prison. He's trying to
34:14
Speaker 3: help Chris clear his name, but Chris, realizing that the
34:20
Speaker 3: racist system won't work in his favor, he's just like,
34:23
Speaker 3: it's okay, like I stopped this from happening again. And
34:26
Speaker 3: then Chris walks away and that's the end of the movie.
34:29
Speaker 3: And Jordan Peele spoke about this as far as when
34:33
Speaker 3: he was writing the movie, that was the ending that
34:35
Speaker 3: he had envisioned. He wanted this sort of gut punch
34:39
Speaker 3: realistic ending.
34:41
Speaker 5: Which does feel like more in step with what he
34:44
Speaker 5: says his influences are, because like the step for wives,
34:46
Speaker 5: Anne Rosemary's Baby both end with like a pretty severe
34:50
Speaker 5: defeat of the protagonist for.
34:52
Speaker 3: Sure, right, But by the time he was shooting the movie,
34:55
Speaker 3: he realized that he wanted an ending that would be
34:59
Speaker 3: like cathartic and uplifting and empowering. And that's why we
35:04
Speaker 3: get the ending that we get where Chris triumphs and
35:07
Speaker 3: Rod saves him.
35:08
Speaker 4: So, yeah, that is that.
35:11
Speaker 3: Let's take another quick break and then we'll come back
35:13
Speaker 3: to discuss.
35:24
Speaker 4: And where we're back.
35:26
Speaker 1: I missed you guys during the breaks.
35:28
Speaker 3: I miss you too.
35:30
Speaker 5: I feel so safe now I'm back with my friends. Yeah,
35:34
Speaker 5: where do we want to start?
35:36
Speaker 1: I guess I want to start talking about like the influences.
35:40
Speaker 1: We talked a little bit about Rosemary's Baby and Stepford
35:43
Speaker 1: Wives being influences, which both of those are written by
35:47
Speaker 1: the same person. The original text I relevent Or eleven.
35:51
Speaker 1: And the first time I ever heard it compared to
35:55
Speaker 1: Stepford Wives, I was at work and one of my
35:59
Speaker 1: coworkers who I didn't like, said, you know, get Out
36:03
Speaker 1: is just like a ripoff, like a bad ripoff of
36:05
Speaker 1: Stepford Wives. Oh, And I was like, I knew I
36:08
Speaker 1: didn't like you, and I was kind of resentful of
36:13
Speaker 1: the comparison at all, not knowing that Peel himself had said, yeah, no,
36:17
Speaker 1: I drew from Stepford Wives. And I think what's really
36:22
Speaker 1: specific about Stepford Wives in particular this did not happen
36:26
Speaker 1: in the two thousand and four remake because it's bad,
36:30
Speaker 1: But in the nineteen seventy five original film and the
36:34
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy two book, the end is that Joanne or Joanna,
36:41
Speaker 1: I don't remember which one is her name, but she is.
36:43
Speaker 1: She becomes a Stepford wife, and at the grocery store
36:47
Speaker 1: she sees this like black family moving into the neighborhood,
36:51
Speaker 1: integrating the neighborhood, and it's very heavily implied that they
36:54
Speaker 1: will be next. So I feel like it was sort of,
36:57
Speaker 1: in a way a symbolic passing of the tour of
37:01
Speaker 1: the baton to tell this story about blackness, because Stepford
37:07
Speaker 1: Wives is very specifically kind of like in the way
37:10
Speaker 1: the feminine mystique exists by Betty for Dan is foreign
37:14
Speaker 1: about white women. And I think that it is very
37:18
Speaker 1: dynamic and it is very of its time, but it
37:21
Speaker 1: is definitely foreign about white women. And this movie is
37:26
Speaker 1: for and about black men in a way that draws
37:30
Speaker 1: from Stepford Wives, but is not a cheap ripoff of it.
37:35
Speaker 1: Man from work whose name I don't remember.
37:38
Speaker 5: Good God, I love men in writers' rooms.
37:43
Speaker 1: They never this was not a writer's room. I will
37:47
Speaker 1: give credit where credits do. I don't want anybody to
37:49
Speaker 1: think that anybody like I Carly or Raven's Home was
37:51
Speaker 1: saying that stuff. I was working as a telemarketer at
37:54
Speaker 1: the time. Very different vibe right around when Sorry to
37:59
Speaker 1: Bother You came out, which, uh was you know interesting
38:03
Speaker 1: that Lakeith Stanfield has taken on many roles embodying like
38:07
Speaker 1: whiteness and blackness at the same time.
38:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I mean I didn't really connect what Peel's
38:15
Speaker 5: influences were before. I just like happened to rewatch these
38:18
Speaker 5: and then yeah, he does cite that. But you're totally right, Crum.
38:22
Speaker 5: I mean, any anyone saying that Get Out is derivative
38:27
Speaker 5: is a fucking liar who just like and and just
38:31
Speaker 5: with like the specificity of who this movie is for,
38:35
Speaker 5: because absolutely like the Rosemary's Baby and steph For Wives
38:39
Speaker 5: have this like whiff of second wave feminism about them,
38:44
Speaker 5: where you know, points are made, and also it's so
38:47
Speaker 5: clearly focused on middle to upper class white women and
38:52
Speaker 5: what their struggles were, ignoring everybody else and get out.
38:57
Speaker 5: I mean, it's just like it's clear what Jordan Peel's folks,
39:00
Speaker 5: and it's like you can reference and be inspired by
39:03
Speaker 5: other works.
39:05
Speaker 4: But this is so different.
39:07
Speaker 5: And the fact that in this movie, like white women
39:11
Speaker 5: of this same class as Stepford wives are taken to task.
39:14
Speaker 5: They are the active aggressors in this situation, and he's
39:18
Speaker 5: not shying away from that. So it almost feels like
39:20
Speaker 5: it's in conversation with stephyr Wise. But to say it's
39:23
Speaker 5: a ripoff is just like a lot.
39:25
Speaker 1: It was. It was deeply appalling, Like it has stuck
39:29
Speaker 1: with me that this man said that and I didn't
39:32
Speaker 1: I flames flames on the side of my face.
39:36
Speaker 3: Okay, clue reference you love to see it? Yeah, I mean,
39:44
Speaker 3: you know, this movie is obviously one that has a
39:46
Speaker 3: very clear agenda as far as examining anti black racism
39:51
Speaker 3: in the US. It's a movie that forced a lot
39:54
Speaker 3: of people, especially white people, to interrogate their history with
39:58
Speaker 3: anti black racism, to interrogate their allyship if they consider
40:04
Speaker 3: themselves to be anti racist allies or non racist allies,
40:09
Speaker 3: and how they approach allyship and whether or not it's
40:12
Speaker 3: actually helpful or if it's performative and false. It's a
40:18
Speaker 3: movie that examines racial and cultural appropriation of black people
40:24
Speaker 3: and examines the exploitation of black bodies throughout history into
40:29
Speaker 3: present day. Like it's doing all these things, and also
40:31
Speaker 3: like all these metaphors that you can apply as far
40:35
Speaker 3: as the prison industrial complex, slavery, that the bingo scene,
40:41
Speaker 3: you know, being an allegory for a slave auction, like
40:45
Speaker 3: all these things.
40:46
Speaker 1: I have to say something about the bingo scene and
40:48
Speaker 1: just something that always is bone chilling for me when
40:51
Speaker 1: I watch a movie where somebody sinister does like crafts
40:55
Speaker 1: to prepare for their sinister activities. I'm just like, you
40:59
Speaker 1: weren't to FedEx copy and print and got those bingo
41:03
Speaker 1: cards made and had like a big ass picture of
41:06
Speaker 1: Chris printed and framed it and put it on an easel.
41:10
Speaker 1: That's not that's not nothing. I co hosted a bridal
41:13
Speaker 1: shower for my friend. There were a lot of little
41:14
Speaker 1: things that I had to do and it was exhausting,
41:17
Speaker 1: and I'm.
41:17
Speaker 5: Just like, you're so evil you had to go to
41:20
Speaker 5: CVS about that.
41:21
Speaker 3: Yes, someone put stickers on the Bengo cards and very
41:26
Speaker 3: specific places and like color coded them and everything like yeah, effort, No.
41:31
Speaker 1: It's nefarious.
41:32
Speaker 5: And I don't think Bradley Whitford is doing that either,
41:35
Speaker 5: like he's outsourcing that labor.
41:37
Speaker 1: I don't think that Georgina's doing it either, because she
41:39
Speaker 1: is secretly the grandma, right. But like I'm wondering if
41:43
Speaker 1: they do have sort of a what Rod's thinking of,
41:47
Speaker 1: like separate like actual slave people doing it, or if
41:50
Speaker 1: they just have like an assistant. I don't know, someone
41:54
Speaker 1: might tell it's like it's a turn.
41:59
Speaker 4: Even the house.
42:00
Speaker 5: The house is very like plantation coded I know is
42:03
Speaker 5: shot in the South. Like there's just so many signifiers
42:07
Speaker 5: of this slavery era in the US and then to
42:10
Speaker 5: have I don't know, I mean, like speaking to your point, Caitlin,
42:13
Speaker 5: of how a lot of people, not all of them,
42:16
Speaker 5: because there are people who are just outwardly racist they're
42:20
Speaker 5: not even pretending to not be. But for you know,
42:23
Speaker 5: I guess with the exception of Jeremy, for like Rose
42:26
Speaker 5: and her parents, it's like they're saying the right thing,
42:29
Speaker 5: but they're not doing I mean, they're actively inflicting harm
42:32
Speaker 5: with their actions, and it's like it's just I don't know.
42:36
Speaker 5: It's like the best possible use of the horror genre
42:39
Speaker 5: to make that point for me.
42:41
Speaker 1: With the outwardly racist people at the party, it's really
42:46
Speaker 1: interesting because they're never outwardly racist in the way that
42:50
Speaker 1: is like bad that you're like, oh, this is a
42:53
Speaker 1: bad person because they're being racist. But like to bring
42:56
Speaker 1: up that lady again who is man handling Chris, and
43:01
Speaker 1: then is like asking Rose like is it true that
43:04
Speaker 1: sex with black men is better? That is obviously very racist,
43:08
Speaker 1: But then you know, you always have those people who
43:10
Speaker 1: are like, but it's a compliment to say that sex
43:14
Speaker 1: with black people is better, Like we're saying a good thing,
43:17
Speaker 1: and it's sort of like the positive stereotypes that are
43:22
Speaker 1: just as harmful as the negative stereotypes, but sort of
43:25
Speaker 1: like passed over. So it's like, oh, I love Tiger Woods.
43:28
Speaker 5: And I'm just like, oh my god, buddy for Obama
43:31
Speaker 5: the third time, Like right, it's.
43:34
Speaker 1: Very Northeast racism.
43:36
Speaker 3: I feel, yeah, well that's the thing, Like even though
43:38
Speaker 3: the movie was shot in the South, Jordan Peele deliberately
43:43
Speaker 3: was like, I want to communicate that these are like
43:46
Speaker 3: New York upstate like neoliberal white rich people, because he's like,
43:51
Speaker 3: it would have been too easy to like do a
43:54
Speaker 3: very like, you know, southern plantation racist kind of thing.
43:58
Speaker 5: Right, people, We've all men like it's right. There's people
44:02
Speaker 5: in my family that it's just like there's uncomfortable echoes
44:06
Speaker 5: of cringe inducing, embarrassing, gross shit that they would say
44:11
Speaker 5: and be like, but what you're just like, you're awful,
44:14
Speaker 5: you're awful, And I think that you know, we don't
44:17
Speaker 5: know what we don't know.
44:18
Speaker 1: And for some people, the first time that they say
44:21
Speaker 1: something like that and somebody's like, hey, that's not cool,
44:23
Speaker 1: they're like, oh my god, I totally didn't know that,
44:25
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. But I think it's the well,
44:29
Speaker 1: I'm not a racist and not being willing to confront
44:33
Speaker 1: like you can be racist accidentally and that's okay as
44:38
Speaker 1: long as you are like, oh, racism is not great,
44:42
Speaker 1: let me not do that again. Like nobody is saying like, oh,
44:45
Speaker 1: once you do a racism, you are automatically hitler, Like
44:48
Speaker 1: that's not how it works. And I feel like a
44:50
Speaker 1: lot of people feel like that, and there's like a
44:54
Speaker 1: discomfort that they're not willing to sit with for sure.
44:57
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, And I feel like that is the idea
45:00
Speaker 5: that if you are racist in any contact at any point,
45:05
Speaker 5: that you are forever horrible is used as like a
45:09
Speaker 5: defense mechanism by people to refuse to learn and just
45:14
Speaker 5: like double down and make people calling them out seem
45:19
Speaker 5: like inherently unreasonable, where it's like, well, no, you're like
45:22
Speaker 5: being asked to listen and adjust your behavior and think.
45:27
Speaker 5: And I feel like that is just so antithetical too.
45:32
Speaker 3: That's what I find so interesting and like effective about
45:37
Speaker 3: the way most of the members of the Armitage family
45:40
Speaker 3: behave as like fake allies basically, where for example, with Rose,
45:46
Speaker 3: we are seeing her anytime that Chris brings up something
45:52
Speaker 3: about oh someone said something that made me uncomfortable or
45:55
Speaker 3: I told you they were probably racist, you see her
45:58
Speaker 3: like downplaying his concerns but like joking around about them.
46:02
Speaker 3: And on the surface, initially that could be interpreted as like, oh,
46:06
Speaker 3: she's trying to put him at ease, she's like, you know,
46:10
Speaker 3: bringing levity to the situation, but really she's gaslighting him
46:15
Speaker 3: and luring him into a false sense of security so
46:18
Speaker 3: that her family can entrap him and steal his body.
46:20
Speaker 3: And even the part where she you know, calls out
46:23
Speaker 3: the cop for wanting to see his ID in a
46:27
Speaker 3: way that feels racist. Her defending Chris wasn't her being
46:31
Speaker 3: anti racist, That was her like avoiding a paper trail.
46:35
Speaker 3: So there's like all these things that could be you know,
46:39
Speaker 3: interpreted through different lenses depending on what you already know
46:42
Speaker 3: about these characters. And then like Dean when he first
46:47
Speaker 3: meets Chris and he's like giving him the tour of
46:49
Speaker 3: the house, he's saying some like cringey things the way
46:54
Speaker 3: a like rich white boomer man would try to be
46:57
Speaker 3: an ally and they're cringey, But it seems like he
47:00
Speaker 3: means well, like he acknowledges the optics of being a
47:04
Speaker 3: wealthy white family having black servants. He's saying the you know,
47:08
Speaker 3: I would have voted for Obama a third term. He
47:12
Speaker 3: you know, makes a comment about Jesse Owens winning gold
47:15
Speaker 3: at the Olympics in front of Hitler and like all
47:17
Speaker 3: this stuff. Again, it seems like he's trying, but it's
47:22
Speaker 3: all a facade and it's all right.
47:24
Speaker 5: But because it's like everything he's doing is like self defensive,
47:28
Speaker 5: which we later learned is because he has a lot
47:31
Speaker 5: of reasons to be like, oh, don't nothing to see here,
47:36
Speaker 5: But on like subsequent viewings, you're like, he's not trying
47:39
Speaker 5: to get to know Chris at all because he doesn't care,
47:41
Speaker 5: Like he's just pointing out all of the ways in
47:43
Speaker 5: which he is not racist towards black people and doesn't
47:48
Speaker 5: ask Chris a single question about himself right at any point,
47:52
Speaker 5: Like never gets to try to know the guy at all.
47:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the different ways that different generations and
47:58
Speaker 1: genders of people in the Armitage family are sort of
48:02
Speaker 1: representative of a class of racism is very interesting. Sort
48:08
Speaker 1: of like the one that stands out the most is
48:10
Speaker 1: Jeremy the brother, and he sort of gives off this
48:15
Speaker 1: like angry alt right internet.
48:19
Speaker 5: Boy down to the haircut down down like sort.
48:23
Speaker 1: Of racism where he is like trying to scrap with
48:27
Speaker 1: him and talks about physical superiority, which is very reminiscent
48:32
Speaker 1: of the way that like in Cells talk and gives
48:35
Speaker 1: me like Elliott Roger vibes. I think about Elliott Rodger
48:39
Speaker 1: all the time. He's so scary to me, Like I
48:43
Speaker 1: never got past that. That was like really freaky for me.
48:47
Speaker 1: But I think that then when you also look at
48:50
Speaker 1: you know, his dad, this older boomer who is a doctor,
48:54
Speaker 1: not for nothing. The medical system is very, very racist.
49:00
Speaker 1: They're trying, some people are trying within the system, but
49:03
Speaker 1: you know, it's still bad.
49:05
Speaker 5: Same with psychiatry too, yeah, yeah, mm hmm.
49:08
Speaker 1: And he is sort of this more one microaggressive racism
49:13
Speaker 1: when he's like, oh yo, how long has this thang
49:17
Speaker 1: been happening? Which I'm not joking. My family friend has
49:24
Speaker 1: this husband who is an older white man who's been
49:26
Speaker 1: rich for most of his life. And I would go
49:29
Speaker 1: to the family friend's house and I stopped going there
49:32
Speaker 1: because I felt so microaggressed because when I would go
49:36
Speaker 1: over there, the husband would be like, Oh, what's up, dog,
49:39
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I don't talk like that. You don't
49:42
Speaker 1: talk like that. Why are we doing this? And it
49:46
Speaker 1: was just exhausting to deal with every time I was there,
49:49
Speaker 1: and it was very real and these different classes, and
49:52
Speaker 1: then we can talk more about like Rose and Missy
49:56
Speaker 1: and the ways in which it's like one of them
49:59
Speaker 1: is like, well, I deep black men, so like I'm
50:01
Speaker 1: not racist, and the other one is sort of like
50:06
Speaker 1: bringing up this trauma that he has and weaponizing it
50:09
Speaker 1: against him in the way that like, you know, a
50:12
Speaker 1: Karen would sort of weaponize her whiteness, white womanness. It's interesting,
50:17
Speaker 1: it's very it's all very deliberate, like we said at
50:20
Speaker 1: the beginning, it's all very well crafted.
50:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then the I don't know if like compromises
50:26
Speaker 3: is the right word, but like what Chris does in
50:29
Speaker 3: response to these constant aggressions from the family or like
50:33
Speaker 3: the guests at the party, and like it's a sort
50:37
Speaker 3: of like choosing his battle sort of thing, but he
50:39
Speaker 3: isn't able to actually like he just has to say, well,
50:45
Speaker 3: there was another one. Okay, I'm gonna go over here
50:47
Speaker 3: now and pretend to take pictures so I don't have
50:49
Speaker 3: to talk to these people. And then he's interrupted from
50:52
Speaker 3: that and more, you know, macro and microaggressions are hurled
50:56
Speaker 3: at him and.
50:58
Speaker 5: As well as like with with Rose occasionally, and this
51:02
Speaker 5: caused me to reflect, I'm like, fuck do I do that?
51:05
Speaker 5: I don't know. I mean, you have one must consider,
51:08
Speaker 5: but how you know, Rose will occasionally sort of monologue
51:12
Speaker 5: about like, wasn't it fucked up when they did this?
51:15
Speaker 4: Wasn't it fucked up when they did this?
51:16
Speaker 5: And you can see that Chris is like kind of
51:18
Speaker 5: exhausted by it and is like can we just not
51:21
Speaker 5: because she's not really doing anything about it, which we
51:25
Speaker 5: realize is very deliberately she's not doing anything about it,
51:28
Speaker 5: but just like seeing this be yet another sort of
51:32
Speaker 5: like drain and burden upon Chris to like have to
51:36
Speaker 5: listen to his girlfriend recap the ways in which people
51:40
Speaker 5: were racist to him throughout the day and then being like, well,
51:43
Speaker 5: I'm not okay with it, and he's like, all right, great, can.
51:46
Speaker 3: You say something about it to your family?
51:48
Speaker 5: Right?
51:48
Speaker 1: Yeah?
51:49
Speaker 3: She's like nah, yeah.
51:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, she's She's just again, she's a master. She needs
51:54
Speaker 1: a she needs an oscar and a copy of the
51:57
Speaker 1: DSMM that wamon.
52:00
Speaker 5: And they cut to her drinking milk with headphones on.
52:02
Speaker 5: I'm like, that is very funny when like listening to
52:06
Speaker 5: I've had the time of my life drinking milk like and.
52:09
Speaker 3: Outing other people to try to abduct. Yeah.
52:13
Speaker 1: I do wonder about and this is I hadn't thought
52:16
Speaker 1: about this before on previous watches, so it's like not
52:18
Speaker 1: a big deal, But I wonder at the logistics because
52:22
Speaker 1: if you look at say like Jim, he is a
52:27
Speaker 1: major art dealer, to the point where you know Chris
52:30
Speaker 1: knows who he is separate from Rose like, where does
52:34
Speaker 1: he go because he's his physical body is gone? And
52:39
Speaker 1: then like does Chris just kind of step into that role?
52:43
Speaker 1: Like I don't understand the logistics.
52:45
Speaker 5: Is he just like kept on like life support?
52:47
Speaker 7: ID?
52:47
Speaker 5: Yeah?
52:48
Speaker 4: Unclear?
52:49
Speaker 3: Yeah, not sure either. But that brings to mind a
52:55
Speaker 3: piece I wanted to quote from by Damon Young in
52:58
Speaker 3: a Slate piece entitled The Disturbing Truth that makes Get
53:02
Speaker 3: Out depressingly plausible, where he compares and contrasts get Out
53:09
Speaker 3: and Gone Girl, just saying the latter, of course, being
53:13
Speaker 3: a movie about a pretty white woman who goes missing
53:16
Speaker 3: and how that captivates and paralyzes the nation, which is
53:22
Speaker 3: what tends to happen when white women are missing, and
53:26
Speaker 3: then he goes on to say, quote and get Out,
53:29
Speaker 3: the Armitage family and their dozens of co conspirators are
53:33
Speaker 3: able to do what they do and are able to
53:36
Speaker 3: continue to do it for what seems to be at
53:38
Speaker 3: least a decade, because well, no one gives a damn
53:42
Speaker 3: about missing black people. The writer goes on to say,
53:45
Speaker 3: the actual facts on the disparities in regard and attention
53:49
Speaker 3: between missing white people and missing black people are predictably disheartening.
53:54
Speaker 3: Although black people only comprise thirteen percent of America's population,
53:59
Speaker 3: we are thirty four percent of America's missing, a reality
54:03
Speaker 3: that exists as the result of a millange of racial
54:07
Speaker 3: and socioeconomic factors, rendering black lives demonstratively less valuable than
54:13
Speaker 3: the lives of our white counterparts unquote. And then he
54:16
Speaker 3: goes on to discuss, you know, the lack of media
54:18
Speaker 3: attention paid to missing black people versus the disproportionate amount
54:23
Speaker 3: of attention paid to missing white woman syndrome. So as
54:27
Speaker 3: far as like the logistics of like, yeah, would Chris
54:30
Speaker 3: just be the art dealer at Hudson Galleries now, or like,
54:33
Speaker 3: you know, Chris's body piloted by Jim Hudson, or how
54:39
Speaker 3: does that work? It seems like they do keep a
54:41
Speaker 3: very like close knit community for this to work. But also,
54:47
Speaker 3: as this piece points out, like this is plausible because
54:51
Speaker 3: of how law enforcement and media and all this stuff
54:56
Speaker 3: doesn't pay much attention to missing black pa.
55:00
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, we get the scene in the police
55:02
Speaker 1: station where three black officers laugh in Rod's face when
55:08
Speaker 1: he's like, hey, my friend was supposed to come back.
55:12
Speaker 1: He didn't. He also found this man who has been
55:16
Speaker 1: missing for six months and even just a statement like,
55:18
Speaker 1: well it doesn't look missing because we found him.
55:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, effective commentary on you know, policing and cops not
55:29
Speaker 3: believing people absolutely.
55:31
Speaker 5: Right and to just have police force like I mean,
55:33
Speaker 5: just do answer to white supremacy at the end of
55:37
Speaker 5: the day. And like I mean, I thought the way
55:39
Speaker 5: that even it's reference, I mean, it's it is like
55:42
Speaker 5: to get the plot moving forward. But even how like
55:45
Speaker 5: if Andre was missing for six months and he was
55:48
Speaker 5: a white man, everyone at the Armitage House would know
55:52
Speaker 5: about him because of how the media is different. And
55:55
Speaker 5: so the fact that the reveal that he's been missing
55:58
Speaker 5: for six months is just presented very passively, and it's
56:01
Speaker 5: like there are these old news articles, but it's clear
56:04
Speaker 5: that there was no you know, like media blitz the
56:07
Speaker 5: way that there would be if if he'd been white.
56:11
Speaker 5: You know, it's like that's how they get away with it,
56:13
Speaker 5: is that armitages are very knowingly taking advantage of how
56:18
Speaker 5: they know the world works, and that they're like, you know, sure,
56:22
Speaker 5: maybe Chris has people in his life who will miss him,
56:25
Speaker 5: but you know, no one's going to actually pay attention
56:28
Speaker 5: outside of maybe a few people. That's what they're betting
56:30
Speaker 5: on not knowing that the TSA is on it.
56:35
Speaker 1: Well, and also he is notably an orphan and exactly
56:38
Speaker 1: no family, no actual like blood family. That's gonna be like, no,
56:43
Speaker 1: we are going to keep looking in the same way.
56:45
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, just like the way that his vulnerabilities
56:49
Speaker 5: are targeted is so disgusting on like on subsequent viewings,
56:54
Speaker 5: because at first I didn't even really fully take in.
56:57
Speaker 5: I was like, oh, you know, part of the reason
56:59
Speaker 5: Rose target him specifically is because he has suffered so
57:03
Speaker 5: many losses in his life. Yeah, and then the way
57:07
Speaker 5: I mean the scene with Missy where he's she's just
57:09
Speaker 5: digging in and in and in on the worst thing
57:13
Speaker 5: that's ever happened to him, Like it's just.
57:17
Speaker 1: I also want to talk about the selection process of
57:21
Speaker 1: picking who these people are. What's interesting to me is
57:26
Speaker 1: sort of the reactions, Like we talked about Chris's reactions
57:30
Speaker 1: like oh, it's probably fine, and sort of picking his battles,
57:33
Speaker 1: and you see Rod's reactions which are much bigger to
57:38
Speaker 1: these things. And part of it is Rod is supposed
57:40
Speaker 1: to be a comedic character. But part of it, also,
57:42
Speaker 1: I think, is the reason that they choose a Chris
57:45
Speaker 1: over a Rod and this idea of sort of palatable
57:49
Speaker 1: blackness and being black but in the right way. He
57:52
Speaker 1: works as a photographer, he's involved in the arts, and
57:55
Speaker 1: then you find out that Andre Dre was a jazz musician,
58:00
Speaker 1: and they're sort of like, you know, pretty chill. When
58:03
Speaker 1: we see Dre walking through the suburbs, you know, he's like,
58:08
Speaker 1: I don't feel comfortable here, But when he sees that car,
58:11
Speaker 1: he kind of turns and walks the other way. He
58:13
Speaker 1: doesn't want to get into a confrontation. And I think
58:17
Speaker 1: that there is a reliance on choosing palatable black people,
58:23
Speaker 1: people that are not going to call people out in
58:26
Speaker 1: their face the way that a Rod would like, nah,
58:29
Speaker 1: I'm out of here.
58:30
Speaker 3: Because Chris had so many opportunities to be like, yeah,
58:33
Speaker 3: that's a very fucked up thing to say. And to
58:36
Speaker 3: be clear, I am not you know, passing judgment against
58:38
Speaker 3: him for not calling out people in those situations. I
58:42
Speaker 3: just mean that it happened very frequently that he was
58:46
Speaker 3: put into those situations.
58:48
Speaker 5: Which almost feels like it's getting into I mean, just
58:51
Speaker 5: speaking to like the like working artists, it's like that
58:53
Speaker 5: becomes a class thing too, where I feel like, you know,
58:57
Speaker 5: Rod working for the TSA and having a working class
58:59
Speaker 5: job versus Chris being a working artist. Like yeah, like
59:03
Speaker 5: you're saying, GRAMA is like a very intentional choice from
59:07
Speaker 5: I mean by the armitages, but also you know, by Chris.
59:11
Speaker 5: I thought there was a There was an interesting quote
59:13
Speaker 5: from Jordan Peele. He said, Chris feels like an everyman.
59:17
Speaker 5: He's kind of like J Cole. Chris is that guy
59:20
Speaker 5: everyone knows who has been in everyone's class at school,
59:23
Speaker 5: that good guy from around the area, which is just
59:26
Speaker 5: I feel like a really like speaks to what you
59:28
Speaker 5: were both just saying. And also that the j. Cole
59:31
Speaker 5: comparison is funny to me.
59:33
Speaker 1: That's very funny. I wanted to talk about black women
59:37
Speaker 1: because there are three black women I would say in
59:41
Speaker 1: this movie, two you see when you don't, and the
59:43
Speaker 1: two you see are Georgina and the police officer, and
59:47
Speaker 1: then the one you don't is Chris's mother. I think
59:50
Speaker 1: that it's really interesting the sort of and not to
59:53
Speaker 1: rag on Jordan Peel, he made a masterpiece, like I said,
59:56
Speaker 1: but the erasure of black women in this conversation and
1:00:00
Speaker 1: sort of the only time that anyone explicitly mentions black
1:00:05
Speaker 1: women and Black womanhood is to talk about the purported
1:00:09
Speaker 1: jealousy that black women express when they see black men
1:00:14
Speaker 1: with white women, which like, you can have him, Like
1:00:18
Speaker 1: it's fine, I'm not mad at you. Calm down, and
1:00:25
Speaker 1: you know how he says, like it's a thing, and
1:00:27
Speaker 1: then Rose tries to downplay it by saying, Oh, you're
1:00:31
Speaker 1: just so sexy that people are unplugging your phone, like
1:00:33
Speaker 1: that's what's happening.
1:00:35
Speaker 5: She responds by gaslighting her mem.
1:00:38
Speaker 1: And you know, at the end of the day, he
1:00:42
Speaker 1: is able to, in a way, heal the trauma of
1:00:45
Speaker 1: not doing what he was supposed to do for his
1:00:48
Speaker 1: mother by going back for Georgina, because even though she
1:00:51
Speaker 1: is inhabited by evil Grandma Armitage, he knows that there
1:00:56
Speaker 1: is a black woman in there. But she's also sacrificed
1:01:00
Speaker 1: in his attempts to escape, and she doesn't kill herself,
1:01:05
Speaker 1: Walter kills himself. So I really am intentionally using the
1:01:09
Speaker 1: word sacrificed. And it's interesting the way that the film
1:01:13
Speaker 1: shies away from showing violence against white women in the
1:01:17
Speaker 1: same way that it shows the violence that Georgina faces
1:01:20
Speaker 1: when she gets hit by the car and later when
1:01:22
Speaker 1: she's in the car because we don't see Missy die
1:01:27
Speaker 1: on screen the camera pans away, and.
1:01:29
Speaker 5: We also don't see Rose technically die. I mean, we
1:01:32
Speaker 5: see her get almost off.
1:01:34
Speaker 1: We see her get shot, but then he stops after everything,
1:01:38
Speaker 1: and I just stop. He just violently violently killed her father,
1:01:44
Speaker 1: her brother, and her mother, but something about her is
1:01:48
Speaker 1: still like he still loves her a little bit, I
1:01:51
Speaker 1: think despite all of that, and watching him wrap his
1:01:54
Speaker 1: hands around her throat, it made me think of Othello
1:01:58
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, yeah, you know, because he
1:02:00
Speaker 1: jokes does Theemona.
1:02:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've definitely read that. I am so educated, and
1:02:06
Speaker 3: I've read so much Shakespeare.
1:02:09
Speaker 1: Yes, people, for people who aren't as educated in Shakespeare
1:02:11
Speaker 1: as Caitlin.
1:02:13
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, please explain it for them.
1:02:15
Speaker 1: Othello is a Shakespearean tragedy that features at its center
1:02:21
Speaker 1: a black man named Othello. Fun fact, my college did
1:02:25
Speaker 1: a production of Othello with zero black people.
1:02:27
Speaker 5: Oh oh my god.
1:02:32
Speaker 1: So we can talk about that on a whole other episode.
1:02:35
Speaker 1: But Othello is this sort of like military, like decorated
1:02:40
Speaker 1: military man, and he has this white wife named Desdemona,
1:02:44
Speaker 1: and this other man, this white man who's jealous of Othello,
1:02:48
Speaker 1: And I might be glossing over a lot. But basically,
1:02:50
Speaker 1: this Maniago, who's jealous of Othello, convinces him that Desdemona
1:02:55
Speaker 1: is cheating on him, and then he murders Desdemona by
1:02:59
Speaker 1: strangling her. And there's a really good you know, I
1:03:02
Speaker 1: love a Shakespeare adaptation, as does any person who was
1:03:05
Speaker 1: a teen in the two thousands, but there's a good
1:03:07
Speaker 1: adaptation with Julia Styles as Destimona called oh and.
1:03:14
Speaker 3: Yes, I've never seen it, but yeah, I remember it.
1:03:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, but like the visual definitely reminded me of that,
1:03:19
Speaker 1: And when he stopped, I was like, oh, that's interesting.
1:03:23
Speaker 1: And the tragedy of Othello is that he kills this
1:03:26
Speaker 1: woman and then he ends up suffering for it. And
1:03:29
Speaker 1: I wonder if, in this sort of remade version of
1:03:34
Speaker 1: not of Othello but like the do over ending, the
1:03:38
Speaker 1: alternate ending that became the theatrical cut, if it was
1:03:41
Speaker 1: supposed to be a softer ending than him actually killing her,
1:03:45
Speaker 1: because if it is the police, and we think it's
1:03:47
Speaker 1: the police, it's like, okay, well they can save her
1:03:49
Speaker 1: and question her or whatever and she'll lie, but they
1:03:52
Speaker 1: can get rid too.
1:03:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, unfortunately, like they needed to kill her,
1:03:57
Speaker 5: like they had to.
1:03:59
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean she had to go.
1:04:00
Speaker 5: I mean not even unfortunately, like, yeah, she she had
1:04:04
Speaker 5: to go. But I honestly, like I hadn't really I
1:04:08
Speaker 5: noticed the absence of black women in roles that. I mean,
1:04:14
Speaker 5: so much of Chris's characterization is defined by his mother's absence,
1:04:18
Speaker 5: her violent absence. And yeah, we don't really get to
1:04:23
Speaker 5: spend any time with anyone other than Georgina, who, as
1:04:27
Speaker 5: you were saying, Croma, it's very complicated, like where is
1:04:30
Speaker 5: Georgina within Georgina? But I hadn't really connected the Yeah,
1:04:35
Speaker 5: the the sort of avoidance of violence towards white women.
1:04:41
Speaker 5: I kind of wonder, like seven years on, if that
1:04:43
Speaker 5: would not be as much of an avoidance if this
1:04:47
Speaker 5: was made right now. I'm not really sure.
1:04:49
Speaker 1: I think I think it probably would be, and I
1:04:52
Speaker 1: do think that also, Jordan Peel is married to a
1:04:56
Speaker 1: white woman, and I think it's very interesting the I
1:05:01
Speaker 1: mean sort of the mention of, you know, black women
1:05:03
Speaker 1: look at East sideways when you're with white women, when
1:05:05
Speaker 1: you're with white women, and maybe that is his experience.
1:05:10
Speaker 1: I love Chelsea Peretti, I'm not looking at anybody sideways.
1:05:13
Speaker 1: They're a great duo, but I do think that, you know,
1:05:17
Speaker 1: the life experiences that we have color the way that
1:05:20
Speaker 1: we see the world. And also, again, he is biracial,
1:05:24
Speaker 1: and I believe that his mother is white, if I'm
1:05:27
Speaker 1: not saying, okay, So I think that his connection to
1:05:30
Speaker 1: white women is interesting. And I don't know if it
1:05:32
Speaker 1: was not to say it wasn't intentional, like he doesn't
1:05:35
Speaker 1: do things intentionally, but I wonder if there was a
1:05:37
Speaker 1: subconscious sort of wanting to protect white women in there.
1:05:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's very possible. And he had also spoken about
1:05:46
Speaker 3: when he was making this movie that he was concerned
1:05:49
Speaker 3: that it wouldn't do well or that no one would
1:05:52
Speaker 3: come to see it because he was concerned that black
1:05:55
Speaker 3: people wouldn't want to watch black people be victimized, and
1:06:00
Speaker 3: he was worried that white people wouldn't want to go
1:06:03
Speaker 3: see it because white people are the villains. So I
1:06:05
Speaker 3: wonder if that kind of informed some of those choices.
1:06:10
Speaker 3: Hard to say, but I do know that he had
1:06:14
Speaker 3: those concerns when he was making the movie.
1:06:16
Speaker 5: I remember a yeah, because I mean, it's I didn't
1:06:21
Speaker 5: really connect to the fact that I was like, oh,
1:06:23
Speaker 5: I guess this could be an awkward night at the
1:06:26
Speaker 5: Parrettes for Jordan Peel after Get Out comes out. But
1:06:30
Speaker 5: I did remember this tweet from Chelsea Pretti I think
1:06:33
Speaker 5: a couple weeks after Getout came out, where I think
1:06:36
Speaker 5: everyone was, you know, like tweeting at her, being.
1:06:38
Speaker 4: Like, is this about you?
1:06:41
Speaker 5: And Chelsea Pretti replied in a very Chelsea Pretti way,
1:06:44
Speaker 5: she said, we all cried for weeks. We were so
1:06:46
Speaker 5: hurt to see our family secrets exposed in this documentary.
1:06:52
Speaker 5: I almost forgot about that, right, which is the only
1:06:55
Speaker 5: rational response to it, because you're just like.
1:06:57
Speaker 4: Shut up, just go see the movie.
1:07:00
Speaker 5: But yeah, I mean I think that that is interesting,
1:07:01
Speaker 5: and I guess it's not. Yeah, it's not even like
1:07:04
Speaker 5: necessarily a criticism of Jordan Peele, but just that's that's
1:07:07
Speaker 5: O tour shit where it's like, it's not unreasonable to
1:07:11
Speaker 5: think that some of his own personal stuff is gonna
1:07:13
Speaker 5: get tangled up in it because of how it was made.
1:07:16
Speaker 1: And it's not bad stuff. It's just interesting stuff to
1:07:19
Speaker 1: note and stuff that you know, my personal experience is
1:07:22
Speaker 1: also going to make me notice because I am a
1:07:25
Speaker 1: black woman, and I also I don't know if Rose
1:07:31
Speaker 1: is queer or not, but I also do think it's
1:07:34
Speaker 1: interesting that Georgina is queer and one of the only
1:07:38
Speaker 1: Black women that we, you know, learn the name of
1:07:41
Speaker 1: Get to See is a queer Black woman, and they
1:07:45
Speaker 1: sort of double oppressed her.
1:07:48
Speaker 3: Right we only see a version of her that's inhabited
1:07:52
Speaker 3: by thiss like grandmother, so we don't even get to know. Yeah,
1:07:56
Speaker 3: to your point, Grama, it is. I found it disappointing
1:08:00
Speaker 3: that this movie about anti black racism and black liberation
1:08:05
Speaker 3: because of how the movie ends, mostly leaves out black women.
1:08:10
Speaker 3: And I don't know if this would have been narratively possible,
1:08:14
Speaker 3: but I wish the movie had found a way to
1:08:18
Speaker 3: save Georgina where he unhypnotizes her and there's enough of
1:08:24
Speaker 3: her left in there that she can, you know, be
1:08:29
Speaker 3: liberated from this situation. But it's tricky because, like, you know,
1:08:33
Speaker 3: you see Walter kill himself, and you can imagine that
1:08:38
Speaker 3: it's because he wouldn't want to go on living after
1:08:42
Speaker 3: having experienced these horrors of Welle.
1:08:44
Speaker 1: Also, the other guy is in there and it's mostly him,
1:08:48
Speaker 1: so I think that he's like, no, I'd rather die.
1:08:51
Speaker 5: Yeah, I just feel like there is room for there
1:08:54
Speaker 5: is room for black women in this narrative without meaningfully
1:08:59
Speaker 5: changing it.
1:09:00
Speaker 1: I will say. I will say one thing that I
1:09:02
Speaker 1: did think was interesting is we see three coagulate black
1:09:07
Speaker 1: people throughout the film, and two of them are men,
1:09:11
Speaker 1: one is a woman, and the two men get released
1:09:15
Speaker 1: through the camera flash at some point and we see
1:09:20
Speaker 1: a peeking through of the real Georgina. Yeah, without that,
1:09:25
Speaker 1: and the black woman is the only one who is
1:09:27
Speaker 1: strong enough to keep continually fighting to get out to
1:09:31
Speaker 1: the point where she is in tears. And we know
1:09:33
Speaker 1: that your physical nervous system is what is connected to you,
1:09:37
Speaker 1: so those tears are coming from her. It's yeah.
1:09:39
Speaker 3: And the scene when she's pouring tea and like almost
1:09:42
Speaker 3: spills it, it's like she's trying to break free from this.
1:09:47
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's really really really good performance from Betty Gabriel, Like, yeah, who,
1:09:53
Speaker 5: I didn't realize she's like a scream queen. She's a
1:09:57
Speaker 5: Bluemhouse girly in the Purge election year. She is an
1:10:02
Speaker 5: unfriended dark web, which I have seen and I was like, oh,
1:10:05
Speaker 5: she's she's an unfriended dark web. She's in upgrade, she's
1:10:09
Speaker 5: in it, lives inside. I mean, she is a but
1:10:13
Speaker 5: just like a really really great performance from her, especially
1:10:17
Speaker 5: because it's like she's not given that much screen time.
1:10:21
Speaker 4: But Yeah, makes a meal of it. I agree.
1:10:24
Speaker 5: I don't know, like narratively, how to get around all
1:10:28
Speaker 5: of this sort of lore, but I do. It's just
1:10:31
Speaker 5: like there there was room for black women within this
1:10:35
Speaker 5: plot and it feels intentional, feels like too, but like it,
1:10:41
Speaker 5: I don't know.
1:10:41
Speaker 1: I think. I also think that black men are allowed
1:10:44
Speaker 1: to have their own stories, their struggles an entirely different thing.
1:10:48
Speaker 1: I just am pointing out what I see. And I
1:10:51
Speaker 1: think that a lot of people talk about Get Out
1:10:53
Speaker 1: as being black generally, and I think that there are
1:10:57
Speaker 1: a lot of women who are black, a lot of
1:10:59
Speaker 1: women of all races who do love get Out, but
1:11:02
Speaker 1: it is definitely specifically a story about and for black men.
1:11:08
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I mean something that I think Jordan Peel
1:11:11
Speaker 5: does really well. Conversely is like knoweeling how white women
1:11:17
Speaker 5: can weaponize their white womanhood in all.
1:11:21
Speaker 4: Of these different ways.
1:11:22
Speaker 5: Where I mean, by the end, you see that Rose
1:11:26
Speaker 5: has spent whatever the better part of a decade weaponizing
1:11:30
Speaker 5: her white womanhood to bring people to her family's creepy estate.
1:11:36
Speaker 5: And the way that Missy acts, I want to talk
1:11:39
Speaker 5: about Missy a little bit, because it's like that character
1:11:41
Speaker 5: is so ah.
1:11:45
Speaker 1: Yeah, I do want to just stay on Rose for
1:11:47
Speaker 1: a second and talk about the weaponization of her white woman.
1:11:50
Speaker 1: This and one that I don't think I've ever heard
1:11:53
Speaker 1: anybody talk about, and that doesn't mean people aren't talking
1:11:57
Speaker 1: about it. That stuck out to me on this rewatch
1:12:00
Speaker 1: was when Rod calls to check in on Chris and
1:12:03
Speaker 1: he finally gets through to Chris's number and she does
1:12:07
Speaker 1: this again, absolutely alarming performance. Yeah, just blank blank face,
1:12:17
Speaker 1: and she's like, Chris, where are you? Is this Chris?
1:12:22
Speaker 1: And then Rod's like, he's not with you. He left
1:12:24
Speaker 1: two days ago. And then when Rod is like, you
1:12:28
Speaker 1: know what, this bitch talks too much. I'm gonna I'm
1:12:30
Speaker 1: gonna catch her and starts recording, she switches tactics and
1:12:36
Speaker 1: makes it seem like he is sexually predatory towards her,
1:12:40
Speaker 1: which is very for me, reminiscent of like Emmett Till
1:12:45
Speaker 1: and this idea of protecting white women's virtue. And he knows.
1:12:50
Speaker 1: He's like, I'm fucked, Like this is this is not
1:12:52
Speaker 1: helping Chris. This is only going to hurt me. I
1:12:55
Speaker 1: need to shut this down. This recording is of no use,
1:12:58
Speaker 1: and she knows to do that. She's like, no, he's
1:13:00
Speaker 1: gonna start recording. I've been doing this for ten years.
1:13:03
Speaker 1: I know what to do. And it's very insidious and
1:13:06
Speaker 1: it is very calculated. And I'm also very angry that
1:13:11
Speaker 1: that woman who lied about Emmitt til never went to
1:13:13
Speaker 1: jail and she said she lied. She said she lied, yeah,
1:13:17
Speaker 1: and they were like, well, she's an old lady. What
1:13:20
Speaker 1: are we gonna do. Now.
1:13:22
Speaker 5: That's part of the reason where it's like we should
1:13:23
Speaker 5: be We should have just seen Rose die on screen
1:13:28
Speaker 5: like she has a coming, because you see her, I mean,
1:13:31
Speaker 5: and in the movies last moments, you see her preparing
1:13:34
Speaker 5: to do the exact same thing to Chris. She says, I.
1:13:38
Speaker 3: Love you, she yes, which is tactic.
1:13:41
Speaker 5: Well, I mean, like when she thinks that a white
1:13:45
Speaker 5: police officer has arrived, she's preparing to be like he
1:13:49
Speaker 5: attacked me, I don't blah blah blah, and just playing
1:13:52
Speaker 5: into all of these white supremacist narratives that police, you know,
1:13:57
Speaker 5: don't blink at. But thankfully it's the TSA right.
1:14:02
Speaker 3: But even before that, like she's trying to save herself.
1:14:05
Speaker 3: She knows that he wants to strangle her to death.
1:14:09
Speaker 3: So she's like, I love you even though she's just
1:14:12
Speaker 3: tried to kill him with a gun. But she's like
1:14:15
Speaker 3: she to the very very end, she's doing these manipulating tactics.
1:14:20
Speaker 3: Whatever she thinks, will you know, save her, get her
1:14:24
Speaker 3: out of this situation. And he doesn't buy it. But
1:14:27
Speaker 3: then I'm like, just kill her, just strangle her to death,
1:14:31
Speaker 3: finish the job.
1:14:32
Speaker 1: Chris the gun is my favorite plant in Payoff when
1:14:36
Speaker 1: he says at the very beginning, like I just don't
1:14:38
Speaker 1: want to get chased off the lawn with a shotgun,
1:14:40
Speaker 1: and then that is the very thing that happens to him.
1:14:43
Speaker 3: But she, yes, should we get into Missy.
1:14:50
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's talk about Missy.
1:14:52
Speaker 5: I feel like she is i mean speaking to like
1:14:55
Speaker 5: the generational stuff we've been talking about, Like she is
1:14:58
Speaker 5: a different kind of white woman doing a different kind
1:15:00
Speaker 5: of white woman thing where she's clearly playing off of
1:15:04
Speaker 5: her husband, which you know, later revealed to be this
1:15:06
Speaker 5: very insidious performance. This family like the worst piece of
1:15:10
Speaker 5: community theater ever to take place, but that she's playing
1:15:14
Speaker 5: off of like, oh my husband, please ignore him, Like
1:15:18
Speaker 5: I'm I'm the nice parent, I'm the normal parent, and
1:15:21
Speaker 5: the second she gets Chris alone still tries to sort
1:15:25
Speaker 5: of maintain that for as long as possible, while pushing
1:15:29
Speaker 5: past every single boundary that he sets, until he's plot
1:15:35
Speaker 5: wise completely paralyzed. Yeah, I just noticed you're wearing a
1:15:41
Speaker 5: Shrek shirt.
1:15:42
Speaker 3: Sorry, yes, well, I mean I wasn't sure when or
1:15:48
Speaker 3: if I would bring this up, but I did at
1:15:51
Speaker 3: some point want to draw some parallels between Get Out
1:15:55
Speaker 3: and Shrek two.
1:15:57
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, okay, listening the parents.
1:16:00
Speaker 3: So, a man who is marginalized by society goes to
1:16:05
Speaker 3: meet the family of his partner, who is far more
1:16:07
Speaker 3: privileged than he is. It's very uncomfortable. The family, you know,
1:16:12
Speaker 3: makes a bunch of aggressive comments towards him. The family
1:16:17
Speaker 3: of both has a secret that deals with inhabiting a
1:16:21
Speaker 3: different body because in Shrek two, the king is actually
1:16:26
Speaker 3: a frog. Okay, not the same secret, but but there's
1:16:32
Speaker 3: divergences right. Similarly, you know, the protagonists of both movies,
1:16:38
Speaker 3: they either exchange bodies or almost has their body taken
1:16:42
Speaker 3: over by someone else because in Shrek Too, Shrek becomes
1:16:47
Speaker 3: a human, a white human man. So a body swapping
1:16:54
Speaker 3: element in both movies, and both protagonists have a comic
1:17:00
Speaker 3: relief sidekick friend played by a black comedian.
1:17:04
Speaker 1: Wow, it's crazy how get Out is a cheap knockoff
1:17:08
Speaker 1: of Shrek Too.
1:17:10
Speaker 5: Don't tell that to the guy worked with, so he'll
1:17:14
Speaker 5: be taking that theory all around town.
1:17:18
Speaker 3: I feel well, I read was this true that Shrek
1:17:21
Speaker 3: Too takes inspiration from guess who's coming to dinner?
1:17:25
Speaker 1: I would believe that. I one believe that having seen
1:17:31
Speaker 1: both movies.
1:17:32
Speaker 5: I vaguely, I vaguely remember us talking about that in
1:17:35
Speaker 5: our Shrek two episode.
1:17:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Jordan Peele, you know, cites that is somewhat
1:17:40
Speaker 3: of an inspiration for get Out as well.
1:17:42
Speaker 5: So by way of by way of Shrek Too.
1:17:49
Speaker 3: And then the get Out and Titanic parallels are that
1:17:52
Speaker 3: both movies have a character named Roseye come from a
1:17:55
Speaker 3: rich white family.
1:17:57
Speaker 4: Wow, the end.
1:17:58
Speaker 3: That's the end of.
1:17:59
Speaker 5: Those the similarities. Hopefully we don't know. Our family is
1:18:03
Speaker 5: pretty pretty fucked. Yeah do we have?
1:18:07
Speaker 4: Is there anything else we wanted to talk about with
1:18:09
Speaker 4: with Missy?
1:18:11
Speaker 3: Just that Again, everyone in this family is such a
1:18:15
Speaker 3: master manipulator, and they're doing things to either put on
1:18:20
Speaker 3: the facade of allyship to try to manipulate Chris into
1:18:24
Speaker 3: feeling more of a sense of ease, or they are
1:18:28
Speaker 3: weaponizing things about him against him, like you know, Missy
1:18:31
Speaker 3: with the almost like using therapy speech as a weapon
1:18:35
Speaker 3: in the way that some people do.
1:18:37
Speaker 1: Know what I was gonna say, is, you know, by
1:18:41
Speaker 1: leaps and bounds therapy and psychiatry and psychology, is it
1:18:46
Speaker 1: feel dominated by white women? Definitely more psychology than psychiatry,
1:18:50
Speaker 1: just because you know, medicine. But I think it's interesting
1:18:53
Speaker 1: that we have created a sort of system where the
1:18:57
Speaker 1: people that you're supposed to turn to in trying to
1:19:01
Speaker 1: figure out how to navigate, you know, what you're struggling with,
1:19:04
Speaker 1: for the most part, are white women, And like, what
1:19:07
Speaker 1: if white women are the problem? And which is true
1:19:14
Speaker 1: in this case. And she's let me help you, let
1:19:17
Speaker 1: me help you stop smoking. He's like, no, that's fine,
1:19:20
Speaker 1: I'm good. And it's not that he doesn't want to quit.
1:19:24
Speaker 1: He just doesn't want to get hypnotized with good reason, right,
1:19:28
Speaker 1: And she's like, no, trust me, bro, And that's sort
1:19:32
Speaker 1: of like the thing you I mean, I have never
1:19:35
Speaker 1: had a black therapist. I have primarily had white women therapists.
1:19:39
Speaker 1: And I've had some great therapists but there are times
1:19:43
Speaker 1: in therapy where I have to like stop and explain
1:19:46
Speaker 1: something in a way that I wouldn't have to if
1:19:49
Speaker 1: I had somebody who was from a similar background to me.
1:19:52
Speaker 1: And there are times where it's like, you look like
1:19:54
Speaker 1: the problem. And now I'm at a point in my
1:19:58
Speaker 1: therapy where I'm comfortable enough, but it's hard at first
1:20:01
Speaker 1: to be like, you look like the problem, and I
1:20:04
Speaker 1: need to tell you about the problem, and I need
1:20:07
Speaker 1: you to not take this personally, and I don't know
1:20:09
Speaker 1: if you can do that.
1:20:10
Speaker 5: Yeah, which theoretically a therapist should, but boy, are there
1:20:14
Speaker 5: are a lot of therapists out there who take shit so personally.
1:20:18
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:20:19
Speaker 5: Yeah, it felt very again just like intentional of in
1:20:23
Speaker 5: a gendered way, like you're saying, like, because therapy in
1:20:27
Speaker 5: the US is so dominated by white women, and the
1:20:30
Speaker 5: fact that like it's almost sort of implied with like, well,
1:20:33
Speaker 5: the man is the doctor the surgeon, and the woman
1:20:38
Speaker 5: handles emotions, and it's like it's prescriptive in a gendered
1:20:42
Speaker 5: sense too, but they are very much working in tandem
1:20:45
Speaker 5: with each other towards a common goal.
1:20:49
Speaker 4: And just like Catherine.
1:20:50
Speaker 5: Keener is so scary and I feel like also is
1:20:53
Speaker 5: just very well cast in like, you know this lady,
1:20:57
Speaker 5: she wouldn't hurt you, right, Like it's.
1:21:00
Speaker 1: And I think it's interesting that when they're talking about
1:21:02
Speaker 1: Jeremy being in medical school, Dean says, oh, he wants
1:21:06
Speaker 1: to follow in his old man's footsteps, and it's like,
1:21:08
Speaker 1: you're both doctors. I hope you know that.
1:21:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, rightst psychiatrist go to medical school.
1:21:15
Speaker 1: Right.
1:21:15
Speaker 5: So there are these little like I do appreciate, I
1:21:19
Speaker 5: guess in movies where it's like gender discrimination is acknowledged,
1:21:23
Speaker 5: but not as something that would get you off the
1:21:25
Speaker 5: hook for being actively aggressive in the way that Missy is,
1:21:30
Speaker 5: where like the harm is like this is not the
1:21:33
Speaker 5: same amount of aggression that's being experienced, and she is
1:21:36
Speaker 5: the perpetrator of so much of it. And yeah, I
1:21:40
Speaker 5: guess we should have seen her die on screen a
1:21:42
Speaker 5: little more brutally. It's weird that we didn't.
1:21:44
Speaker 1: It could be a contract thing. I don't know.
1:21:47
Speaker 4: Katherine Keener will not screen.
1:21:50
Speaker 5: I know that the Julia and Moore thing, Julia Moore
1:21:53
Speaker 5: will not die on screen. That's her. That's her rule,
1:21:57
Speaker 5: So I guess don't look for her in a slasher movie.
1:22:00
Speaker 1: My favorite rule is that Denzel Washington will not kiss
1:22:03
Speaker 1: white women on screen. Really yea good for him, and
1:22:07
Speaker 1: not because he's got anything against them, but because he
1:22:11
Speaker 1: thinks that it would be alienating to his target demographic,
1:22:15
Speaker 1: which is primarily black women. And I think that that
1:22:18
Speaker 1: is absolutely true, particularly black women of a certain age.
1:22:22
Speaker 1: And I think that it's really interesting and kind of
1:22:27
Speaker 1: wonderful that he has put that much thought into it.
1:22:30
Speaker 1: And he's like, no, I know who I know who
1:22:34
Speaker 1: supports me, and I want to support them back.
1:22:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, Yeah, that's beautiful. My favorite rule of an
1:22:41
Speaker 3: actor is that Leonardo DiCaprio has to be fully clothed
1:22:44
Speaker 3: in water in all of his movies. This is not
1:22:47
Speaker 3: actually substantiated. This is not kram I see your face.
1:22:50
Speaker 5: It's it's just something that happens mysteriously in every Leonardo
1:22:54
Speaker 5: DiCaprio movie. I think he might have a no topless
1:22:57
Speaker 5: rule or something. I feel like you rarely see him
1:22:59
Speaker 5: shirt yeah, most hunks you see short lists more. I
1:23:03
Speaker 5: feel like maybe he's just not comfortable with it.
1:23:04
Speaker 3: There's like ten movies where he's fully clothed in water.
1:23:08
Speaker 5: We've been working on this theory for years.
1:23:10
Speaker 1: I feel like the woman in that meme where there's
1:23:13
Speaker 1: like math in front of her. I'm like, what, like,
1:23:19
Speaker 1: it's like a beautiful mind. I'm like putting things together.
1:23:22
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't think I've ever seen that man
1:23:24
Speaker 1: with his shirt off in water.
1:23:25
Speaker 3: You're right, it's a Titanic, Romeo, Plust, Juliet inception, the
1:23:31
Speaker 3: Shutter Island. The list goes on.
1:23:34
Speaker 5: There's a few exceptions, but it's way, yeah, vastly. He's
1:23:38
Speaker 5: he's always wearing a clingy shirt underwater.
1:23:41
Speaker 4: The beach anyway, the Beach one.
1:23:44
Speaker 5: Of our famous, our most famous underwater actors and later
1:23:47
Speaker 5: add to Dicapria.
1:23:50
Speaker 1: One thing I.
1:23:50
Speaker 4: Wanted to just get everyone's feeling on.
1:23:54
Speaker 5: I mean, this is like a again trope of the
1:23:56
Speaker 5: horror genre, but the Stephen Root character, which I was
1:23:59
Speaker 5: also like, how do I know this guy? How do
1:24:01
Speaker 5: I know this guy? Milton got Space, Milton off Space
1:24:05
Speaker 5: Office Space. Yeah, did not connect that until this viewing.
1:24:08
Speaker 5: Good for Milton, but the incorporation of his blindness as
1:24:16
Speaker 5: a you know, I don't know, it's just I'm curious
1:24:18
Speaker 5: what you guys think from a disability perspective of how
1:24:22
Speaker 5: that is used, because I know that's something that is
1:24:24
Speaker 5: used in the horror Disability is weaponized in the horror
1:24:27
Speaker 5: genre very frequently.
1:24:29
Speaker 4: I think it is.
1:24:30
Speaker 5: Easy to understand what you know, Jordan Peel is going
1:24:34
Speaker 5: for metaphorically with sight and the sort of horrific quality
1:24:39
Speaker 5: of a white man wanting to literally steal and take
1:24:45
Speaker 5: a black man's perspective from him, which I feel like
1:24:48
Speaker 5: is very much what he's saying, because Chris as a photographer,
1:24:52
Speaker 5: his perspective is very you know, crucial to who he is,
1:24:56
Speaker 5: and you know, Jim Hudson knows he's very town and
1:25:00
Speaker 5: he wants to take that from him and claim it
1:25:03
Speaker 5: as his own. So I think as a metaphor it works, but.
1:25:06
Speaker 1: It feels absolutely like nonsensical to think that now that
1:25:11
Speaker 1: you're in his body and you have his physical eyes,
1:25:13
Speaker 1: that you will gain his perspective because his talent being
1:25:17
Speaker 1: a photographer is not about having literal good eyes. Yeah,
1:25:23
Speaker 1: it's about noticing things, and the ways that we notice
1:25:26
Speaker 1: things are influenced by the things that we go through.
1:25:29
Speaker 1: And we can see these sunken place people and how
1:25:34
Speaker 1: they're not black, like they look black, They're not black.
1:25:38
Speaker 1: There's nothing about them that feels black. And it was
1:25:42
Speaker 1: interesting that and I'll get back to Stephen Root's character
1:25:44
Speaker 1: in just a second. It was interesting that Chris said
1:25:48
Speaker 1: that when he saw Dre he felt like he knew him,
1:25:53
Speaker 1: and it sort of felt like kind of a positive
1:25:56
Speaker 1: inversion of the idea that all black people know each
1:25:59
Speaker 1: other and like knowing your people when you see your people.
1:26:03
Speaker 1: And he was very clear that like, I didn't know
1:26:06
Speaker 1: that first guy, I knew the second guy.
1:26:08
Speaker 4: Yeah, the guy who came at me.
1:26:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, which I think was interesting with Stephen Root
1:26:13
Speaker 1: and the blindness. I think one he gets to Nazee
1:26:17
Speaker 1: color and very explicitly says like I could give a
1:26:20
Speaker 1: damn about what color you are. I half wanted him
1:26:23
Speaker 1: to say, like he could be black, white, green.
1:26:26
Speaker 5: Purple, that old boomer boom chestnut.
1:26:34
Speaker 1: I love it when they say that. It's so funny.
1:26:36
Speaker 1: To me, it's so funny because like, show me the
1:26:38
Speaker 1: purple people, show.
1:26:40
Speaker 4: Me the purple, well, show me the green people. It's Shrek.
1:26:43
Speaker 1: But anyway, but the thing about obviously like he gets
1:26:48
Speaker 1: to be colorblind, and that's a statement on that, and
1:26:50
Speaker 1: it's like even if you're not seeing race, you're still
1:26:52
Speaker 1: being racist. But also talking about disability in horror, I
1:26:57
Speaker 1: think a lot of times disability makes the people evil.
1:27:01
Speaker 1: It's like they're disfigured and we're seeing they're evil on
1:27:04
Speaker 1: the outside. This for me feels more like the problematic
1:27:10
Speaker 1: aspect of disabled people always wanting a cure for their disability,
1:27:15
Speaker 1: and he's willing to go to these evil lengths to
1:27:19
Speaker 1: get a cure for his blindness, which is yes, comes
1:27:23
Speaker 1: from a genetic disorder and it's not something that he
1:27:25
Speaker 1: was born with. But it's like when you have a disability,
1:27:29
Speaker 1: it is a change in perspective and it is a
1:27:32
Speaker 1: change in the way you live your life. But not
1:27:33
Speaker 1: everybody wants a cure for their disability. They want accessibility,
1:27:37
Speaker 1: but they don't want a cure, right, Yeah.
1:27:40
Speaker 3: That and it's just another example of a disabled character
1:27:44
Speaker 3: being played by enable bodied miltoner by Milton. So yeah,
1:27:51
Speaker 3: I think that could have been handled very differently and
1:27:55
Speaker 3: better than it is.
1:27:57
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not. I mean, it's not the most egregious
1:28:00
Speaker 5: example we've seen of it by a long shot in
1:28:02
Speaker 5: the horror genre, but it did feel worth mentioning, And
1:28:06
Speaker 5: I honestly, I mean, like even hearing you say, like,
1:28:08
Speaker 5: how like ridiculous is it that Jim Hudson would expect
1:28:12
Speaker 5: to like gain Chris's artistic perspective by having his body
1:28:16
Speaker 5: is like just another way that he's reducing every black
1:28:20
Speaker 5: person he encounters to a body versus a person or
1:28:25
Speaker 5: a consciousness or like you know, he's like eyeballs equal perspective,
1:28:29
Speaker 5: which is pretty fucking rich coming from an art dealer.
1:28:32
Speaker 5: I'm like, Okay, so you just don't understand your own job,
1:28:38
Speaker 5: which is a lot of people in high places, so.
1:28:42
Speaker 1: You can just say you want to see Jim like
1:28:44
Speaker 1: it's okay, Yeah, yeah, you can say that, right, and
1:28:48
Speaker 1: that's okay, you can want that. Yeah, don't lie to
1:28:51
Speaker 1: yourself and don't lie to me that you're like, I
1:28:53
Speaker 1: want to be able to take real good pictures. That's
1:28:57
Speaker 1: the goal.
1:28:58
Speaker 5: That's why I'm doing the eugenicist experimented Bradley went for
1:29:02
Speaker 5: his house. It's just fucking horrible, Like I yeah, I mean,
1:29:07
Speaker 5: and I do think that it's like a valid point
1:29:09
Speaker 5: that yeah, I mean, the fact that you know, Jim
1:29:12
Speaker 5: Hudson sort of uses his disability to explain why he
1:29:17
Speaker 5: isn't racist, where that's not how racism works. It's not
1:29:21
Speaker 5: connected to your ability to see it's connected to how
1:29:24
Speaker 5: you've been societally conditioned. And Jim Hudson is fifty sixty
1:29:29
Speaker 5: whatever years old. Yes, he does have internalized and externalized racism.
1:29:34
Speaker 5: So I get I mean, I don't know, I get
1:29:36
Speaker 5: why from like a writing perspective, Jordan Peele did that.
1:29:39
Speaker 5: But yeah, there's a few things that I mean, starting
1:29:42
Speaker 5: with by actually casting a disabled actor would have you.
1:29:46
Speaker 1: Know, yeah, because there's no reason not to. Yeah, there's
1:29:49
Speaker 1: literally there's no reason you don't have to draw.
1:29:53
Speaker 5: Right. It took me almost ten years to figure out, Oh,
1:29:56
Speaker 5: that's Milton.
1:29:57
Speaker 1: And you know, he's a great actor, but I'm sure
1:30:00
Speaker 1: that there was a great blind actor who could have
1:30:03
Speaker 1: then been the draw for the next big movie if
1:30:06
Speaker 1: we knew who he was for sure.
1:30:08
Speaker 3: Yes, I also wanted to chat about the character of
1:30:13
Speaker 3: Hiroki Tanaka. Yes, so this is one of the party
1:30:17
Speaker 3: goers at the Armitage family party. He is the lone
1:30:24
Speaker 3: Asian man, the only person of color who hasn't been
1:30:29
Speaker 3: you know, coagula procedured, and he's one of the people like,
1:30:34
Speaker 3: you know, bidding in this auction, and a lot of
1:30:37
Speaker 3: people were like, wait a minute, why is an Asian
1:30:40
Speaker 3: person at this racist party hanging out with all these
1:30:42
Speaker 3: racist white people, and a lot of people have written
1:30:46
Speaker 3: about it, and the response was mixed, where some of
1:30:50
Speaker 3: what I saw were op eds from Asian writers that
1:30:55
Speaker 3: interpreted the inclusion of the Hiroki Tanaka character in this
1:30:59
Speaker 3: particulgular context as commentary on the existence of anti black
1:31:04
Speaker 3: racism and complicitness in white supremacy in the Asian community.
1:31:10
Speaker 3: I'll share a quote from a piece by Rainier Miningding
1:31:17
Speaker 3: in Next Shark entitled why Get Out? A movie about
1:31:21
Speaker 3: anti black racism, had an Asian character says, quote to
1:31:26
Speaker 3: understand why the Asian man asked this being the question
1:31:30
Speaker 3: that he poses, which is something like, do you find
1:31:33
Speaker 3: that being African American has more advantages or disadvantages in
1:31:38
Speaker 3: the modern world? So that's the question the character asks.
1:31:41
Speaker 3: So to understand why the Asian man asked this, you
1:31:44
Speaker 3: have to consider Claire gene Kim's theory of racial triangulation.
1:31:48
Speaker 3: Racial triangulation posits that Asians exist on a spectrum where
1:31:52
Speaker 3: they are one perceived as better than blacks but not
1:31:55
Speaker 3: as good as whites, and two categorized as perpetual foreigners
1:32:00
Speaker 3: who will never be accepted as quote unquote full Americans.
1:32:04
Speaker 3: According to racial triangulation, Asians are in racial limbo, trying
1:32:09
Speaker 3: desperately to achieve whiteness and status as quote unquote real
1:32:13
Speaker 3: Americans by stepping on the heads of black folks. So
1:32:17
Speaker 3: when the Asian man asks Chris, is the African American
1:32:20
Speaker 3: experience an advantage or disadvantage, he wasn't just making small talk.
1:32:24
Speaker 3: He was wrestling with the decision of whether or not
1:32:26
Speaker 3: it would be better to trade bodies with Chris and
1:32:29
Speaker 3: experience anti blackness, or stay the same and live life
1:32:33
Speaker 3: as an Asian man in America and experience xenophobia unquote.
1:32:39
Speaker 3: And that piece goes on to describe other ways in
1:32:42
Speaker 3: which Asian people have been complicit in white supremacy, not
1:32:45
Speaker 3: saying that that's a universal thing or anything like that,
1:32:48
Speaker 3: but that there is a history of that happening. And
1:32:52
Speaker 3: then other writers felt the portrayal of this character plays
1:32:56
Speaker 3: into stereotypes about Asian people and perpetuates the idea of
1:33:01
Speaker 3: Asians as foreigners and perpetuates the myth of Asian people
1:33:06
Speaker 3: being the quote unquote model minority. Where friend of the
1:33:11
Speaker 3: show Olivia Truffau Wong wrote in a piece on Bustle
1:33:16
Speaker 3: entitled why the Asian character in Get Out matters. She says,
1:33:20
Speaker 3: quote the inclusion of such an individual in this particular
1:33:25
Speaker 3: context trivializes the Asian experience. The discussion of race relations
1:33:29
Speaker 3: between Asians and African Americans is an important one and
1:33:33
Speaker 3: it deserves more than a throwaway line and a few
1:33:36
Speaker 3: short scenes unquote. So again, mixed interpretations of it, but
1:33:43
Speaker 3: I just wanted to.
1:33:44
Speaker 1: I think everyone's right. I think that it is a
1:33:48
Speaker 1: very nuanced conversation. A couple of things that I'll say.
1:33:52
Speaker 1: I want to first talk about the Supreme Court, which
1:33:56
Speaker 1: I could talk about the Supreme Court for a long time,
1:33:58
Speaker 1: but I specific want to talk about I don't know
1:34:01
Speaker 1: if you guys remember Becky with the bad grades, that
1:34:04
Speaker 1: girl who didn't get into University of Texas at Austin.
1:34:09
Speaker 1: And she was like, it is because I am being
1:34:11
Speaker 1: discriminated against because I am white. And she wanted to
1:34:16
Speaker 1: get rid of which has successfully happened. Wanted to get
1:34:20
Speaker 1: rid of affirmative action, which white women are the primary
1:34:24
Speaker 1: beneficiaries of. She wanted to get rid of affirmative action
1:34:28
Speaker 1: in college admissions because she didn't get into the school.
1:34:31
Speaker 1: And she's like, I saw people who were less qualified
1:34:34
Speaker 1: than me, who were black and brown who got in,
1:34:38
Speaker 1: and they just got in because of that, which what's
1:34:40
Speaker 1: funny to me is, first of all, Becky with the
1:34:42
Speaker 1: bad grade, you t Austin has an admissions policy where
1:34:46
Speaker 1: if you were in the top ten percent of your
1:34:48
Speaker 1: high school class, you automatically get in. You can go
1:34:51
Speaker 1: to Utube. I didn't know that. Yeah, no, that's what
1:34:54
Speaker 1: makes it so much funnier to me. And she was like,
1:34:56
Speaker 1: well I didn't get in, and I'm like, okay.
1:35:00
Speaker 5: You weren't good enough at school.
1:35:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like you should have invested more time
1:35:04
Speaker 1: in working on your grades, ma'am. But I do think
1:35:07
Speaker 1: that it is very interesting that that Supreme Court case
1:35:10
Speaker 1: failed when the white woman was the person behind it,
1:35:14
Speaker 1: but succeeded when it was spearheaded by Asian people. And
1:35:19
Speaker 1: Asian people were saying that they were hurt by these
1:35:21
Speaker 1: quotas because people can like, we're like, oh, there's too
1:35:24
Speaker 1: many Asian people who are excelling and who are qualified,
1:35:29
Speaker 1: and we have to have a certain number of them.
1:35:32
Speaker 1: And now that we've had this policy in place for
1:35:34
Speaker 1: a few years, the numbers of Asian people who are
1:35:37
Speaker 1: getting into elite colleges has in fact decreased who defunk it.
1:35:41
Speaker 1: But and with the idea of Asians being seen as
1:35:46
Speaker 1: the perpetual foreigner, which I think is very true. And
1:35:49
Speaker 1: it's interesting because my parents are actually immigrants, and people
1:35:54
Speaker 1: never assume that about me. Because people, when they see
1:35:58
Speaker 1: black people in America make a sound about the Atlantic
1:36:01
Speaker 1: slave trade, and the majority of black people in America
1:36:04
Speaker 1: did end up here because of that. But Asian people
1:36:07
Speaker 1: who have been here for just as long and who
1:36:10
Speaker 1: you know, came and were building railroads and also helped
1:36:13
Speaker 1: build this country are seen as foreigners, which is bad.
1:36:17
Speaker 1: It's bad, end of story. But when you're applying to college,
1:36:22
Speaker 1: they don't see a picture of you, but they see
1:36:23
Speaker 1: your name, and if you have a name that sounds
1:36:27
Speaker 1: explicitly Asian, even if they don't see you, they make
1:36:31
Speaker 1: their judgments. And I think that it's really interesting that
1:36:34
Speaker 1: Asians were spearheading this because of that particular detail that
1:36:39
Speaker 1: there are more Asian people who have names that specifically
1:36:42
Speaker 1: out them as Asian than there are black people who
1:36:44
Speaker 1: have names that specifically out them as black, especially because
1:36:47
Speaker 1: black people in America for a very long time have
1:36:50
Speaker 1: and I think the tide is turning on this more now,
1:36:53
Speaker 1: but have specifically named their children so that they would
1:36:56
Speaker 1: be able to later in life, be able to get
1:36:58
Speaker 1: jobs and be able to have like a resume name
1:37:02
Speaker 1: that wouldn't get their resume thrown out. And then the
1:37:05
Speaker 1: other thing I wanted to say about I forgot his name,
1:37:09
Speaker 1: Hiroki Tanaka, that's his name? Is that Jordan Peele explicitly
1:37:13
Speaker 1: said that he was paying homage to again Rosemary's Baby
1:37:16
Speaker 1: because at the end of Rosemary's Baby there is one
1:37:19
Speaker 1: Japanese man there. And he said that it's about the
1:37:22
Speaker 1: double worship being a global thing. It's not just these
1:37:26
Speaker 1: people in this place. It is global. And I think
1:37:29
Speaker 1: that if we look at it from that perspective, it
1:37:33
Speaker 1: could be a nod to the idea that anti blackness
1:37:36
Speaker 1: is global. And we think of anti blackness, and we
1:37:40
Speaker 1: think of black and white a lot in this country,
1:37:42
Speaker 1: but there are more layers and more nuance to it.
1:37:46
Speaker 3: It is far reaching. Jordan Peele lists two other reasons.
1:37:50
Speaker 3: He was a guest on the Tiger Belly podcast hosted
1:37:54
Speaker 3: by Bobby Lee and Klaia kuhn Yep and they ask
1:37:59
Speaker 3: him about this about this character being included in the movie.
1:38:02
Speaker 3: And I'll paraphrase here, but Jordan Peel in addition to
1:38:07
Speaker 3: the homage to Rosemary's Baby and you know, wanting to
1:38:12
Speaker 3: kind of showcase how far reaching an underground society like
1:38:17
Speaker 3: this could be. He also said that, and you know,
1:38:22
Speaker 3: we can discuss this if we want, but he wanted
1:38:26
Speaker 3: the fact that because the character's first language is not English,
1:38:31
Speaker 3: and he's posing the question in a kind of more
1:38:33
Speaker 3: direct way than perhaps a native English speaker might ask
1:38:38
Speaker 3: a question like that, he wanted to like use that
1:38:42
Speaker 3: to heighten the awkwardness of the situation. So there's that.
1:38:47
Speaker 3: And then he also says, and also, like, what doesn't
1:38:51
Speaker 3: make sense an old Japanese billionaire comes and wants to
1:38:54
Speaker 3: buy a black body, I think is what he says.
1:38:57
Speaker 3: He's interrupted by the host, so it's kind of hard
1:39:00
Speaker 3: to tell what the last few words were, but I mean,
1:39:03
Speaker 3: that is why all those people are there for the party.
1:39:06
Speaker 3: So but anyway, the hosts jump in and they agree
1:39:09
Speaker 3: and they're like, yeah, it makes sense to me, honestly.
1:39:12
Speaker 3: So those are the least the reasons he cites.
1:39:16
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, you know, I.
1:39:18
Speaker 5: Don't feel like I can make any intelligent comment on this,
1:39:22
Speaker 5: I think get Out is not a movie that is
1:39:25
Speaker 5: I think trying to deconstruct this particular dynamic, and it's
1:39:32
Speaker 5: I feel like it is always a slippery slope between
1:39:34
Speaker 5: expecting everything of one movie. But I agree with the
1:39:38
Speaker 5: Krama that all, like every perspective we've talked about makes
1:39:42
Speaker 5: total sense, and there's no like perspective on that character
1:39:46
Speaker 5: that I don't know. I'd be comfortable being like, no,
1:39:49
Speaker 5: you're wrong, because I think you can also go into
1:39:51
Speaker 5: like histories of colonialism between different countries. I mean, there's
1:39:55
Speaker 5: like a lot of different ways to approach that conversation.
1:40:00
Speaker 1: Of like also co opting blackness for like cool aesthetics.
1:40:04
Speaker 1: That is something that is very prevalent in many different
1:40:08
Speaker 1: Asian countries. I would say most prevalent in the way
1:40:11
Speaker 1: that we see K pop borrowing from arguably stealing from
1:40:16
Speaker 1: black R and B music from the nineties and sort
1:40:20
Speaker 1: of recreating these sort of like voice to men situations,
1:40:24
Speaker 1: and they even have like similar dance aesthetics and things
1:40:30
Speaker 1: like that. It's very much steeped in black culture. And
1:40:34
Speaker 1: like I saw Black Pink in concert with my mom
1:40:37
Speaker 1: because I'm cool and also parent.
1:40:41
Speaker 4: I love that you and your mom went together.
1:40:44
Speaker 1: It was we went to Coachella together and Black Pink
1:40:46
Speaker 1: was headlining, so it's even cooler than you thought. But
1:40:52
Speaker 1: my mom was kind of like checked out during Black Pink,
1:40:54
Speaker 1: which I expected that that's fine, that's not her her vibe.
1:40:58
Speaker 1: She listens to Joni Mitchell, so I but I was like, oh,
1:41:03
Speaker 1: aren't they cool? And my mom was like, I just
1:41:06
Speaker 1: I'm really sick of people who are not black taking
1:41:09
Speaker 1: black things and becoming more popular than black people. And
1:41:13
Speaker 1: so I don't think that the prospect of this Japanese
1:41:17
Speaker 1: billionaire coming to this party and wanting to co opt
1:41:21
Speaker 1: blackness in a way is that far reaching. And I think,
1:41:26
Speaker 1: you know, we can have the conversation about wrestling with
1:41:28
Speaker 1: is it better to be experiencing xenophobia or is it
1:41:32
Speaker 1: better to be experiencing what it is to be a
1:41:34
Speaker 1: black American, which they're all, it's it's not good either way,
1:41:40
Speaker 1: I think personally. But I also think that there is
1:41:44
Speaker 1: the idea that you know, Jim talks about. I keep
1:41:48
Speaker 1: wanting to say Jim Henson instead of Jim Hudson.
1:41:52
Speaker 3: Because it's like Jim Hudson Galleries, and you've got like
1:41:55
Speaker 3: Jim Henson Studio.
1:42:00
Speaker 5: Would never Oh, I thought we were talking about Jim Henson, I.
1:42:03
Speaker 1: Know, But Jim Hudson talks about like because Chris asks
1:42:10
Speaker 1: the very valid question why black people, which also makes
1:42:13
Speaker 1: me think of Zulander, Why male models?
1:42:17
Speaker 3: Oh my god, oh Zuland.
1:42:20
Speaker 1: But he asks why black people, and Jim says, some
1:42:24
Speaker 1: people want to be faster, some people want to be stronger,
1:42:27
Speaker 1: some people want to be cooler. And I don't think
1:42:30
Speaker 1: it's out of the realm of possibility that a wealthy
1:42:35
Speaker 1: Asian businessman would want to be cooler. I just think that, oh,
1:42:39
Speaker 1: taking a black man's body is the way to do that, right,
1:42:42
Speaker 1: I think that there is precedent for them.
1:42:45
Speaker 5: Yeah, I guess I like assumed that the intention of
1:42:48
Speaker 5: including that character was to say that anti blackness is
1:42:53
Speaker 5: a global problem and not a problem that is siphoned
1:42:57
Speaker 5: to white liberal Americans, even though they're obviously a disproportionate
1:43:02
Speaker 5: perpetrator of anti blackness. But I also like totally understand
1:43:06
Speaker 5: the perspective that, like, having such a complicated dynamic siphoned
1:43:10
Speaker 5: into like one character is not gonna sit well.
1:43:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that the movie did not benefit enough
1:43:18
Speaker 1: from that addition to be like, no, it's necessary. Yeah,
1:43:23
Speaker 1: I think that it's fine with it. I think it
1:43:25
Speaker 1: would have been just as fine without it. But I'm
1:43:28
Speaker 1: glad that that man got a job that is not
1:43:32
Speaker 1: an actor.
1:43:33
Speaker 3: He's Ken Marino's father in law.
1:43:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, and a karate master.
1:43:40
Speaker 3: What wait, Yeah, he's not really an actor, although there
1:43:44
Speaker 3: is an actor named Hiroki Tanaka.
1:43:48
Speaker 1: Oh that's fine, you know, different guy.
1:43:50
Speaker 3: Well, because a lot of the op eds I read
1:43:52
Speaker 3: about this, it's like it's a character named yeah, so
1:43:55
Speaker 3: he go a Yoma played by actor Hiroki Tanaka, but
1:44:00
Speaker 3: it's flipped. Yeah, the guy's real.
1:44:02
Speaker 5: Name is.
1:44:05
Speaker 3: Yeah, so he go a Yoma. But they, I think
1:44:08
Speaker 3: were just like looking up what the actor's name was,
1:44:12
Speaker 3: and because there was an actor named Hiroki Tanaka, they
1:44:14
Speaker 3: thought that that anyway.
1:44:16
Speaker 5: So that's so it's it's so funny, like how in
1:44:20
Speaker 5: Jordan Peel's work you occasionally just get like a weird
1:44:24
Speaker 5: gen X comedy connection. We were like, oh, yeah, of course
1:44:29
Speaker 5: Jordan Peel and Ken Marino are pals, and this would
1:44:32
Speaker 5: be some weird thing that would happen in the same
1:44:34
Speaker 5: way that in US when you're like, wait, why is
1:44:37
Speaker 5: Tim Heidecker here and you're like, oh, because him and
1:44:40
Speaker 5: Jordan Peele have probably known each other for five thousand years.
1:44:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know the reason that he hired this
1:44:46
Speaker 1: man who was not an actors because they were doing
1:44:48
Speaker 1: all of the casting for the secondary characters in Mississippi.
1:44:52
Speaker 1: And shockingly, there are not a lot of Japanese actors
1:44:57
Speaker 1: in Mississippi.
1:44:58
Speaker 3: Well I thought it was Alabama.
1:44:59
Speaker 1: Oh, maybe it was Alabama.
1:45:01
Speaker 3: I could be either way, but yeah, I mean not
1:45:04
Speaker 3: not a lot of Japanese actors in either place. Something
1:45:08
Speaker 3: I remember learning a while back, or maybe it was
1:45:11
Speaker 3: even kind of recently that sort of show. Oh, yeah,
1:45:13
Speaker 3: it was recently, because this was revealed on Graham Norton's show.
1:45:18
Speaker 1: I Love Graham Norton. My goal in life is to
1:45:21
Speaker 1: be famous enough to be a guest on Graham Norton.
1:45:24
Speaker 4: I wish you all the best that's gonna happen.
1:45:27
Speaker 3: Daniel Klulia was on the show and revealed that he
1:45:31
Speaker 3: was not invited to the world premiere of Get Out
1:45:35
Speaker 3: at the twenty seventeen Sun Dance Film Festival. He said
1:45:39
Speaker 3: he cleared his schedule knowing when it would happen, thinking
1:45:43
Speaker 3: he would be invited and then he was just never
1:45:45
Speaker 3: invited and blames it on the industry.
1:45:50
Speaker 4: I don't.
1:45:51
Speaker 3: I'm sure people advocated for him to be invited, but yeah, he.
1:45:54
Speaker 4: Just was nominated for an Oscar what.
1:45:56
Speaker 3: No, he was not invited and so he did not
1:46:01
Speaker 3: go to the premiere. Yeah, I don't think I had
1:46:04
Speaker 3: anything to do with any like bad Blood or anything
1:46:07
Speaker 3: between like him and Jordan Peele they go on to
1:46:10
Speaker 3: make Nope together and everything. But yeah, he just wasn't
1:46:14
Speaker 3: invited and someone fucked up.
1:46:17
Speaker 1: Basically, I'm curious if like Catherine Keener was invited and
1:46:23
Speaker 1: Alison Williams was invited. Maybe they weren't either, But I'm curious.
1:46:28
Speaker 3: Hard to say, we don't.
1:46:29
Speaker 4: We don't know.
1:46:30
Speaker 3: I haven't looked it up.
1:46:31
Speaker 5: But he's I just am like he is the star
1:46:34
Speaker 5: of the movie.
1:46:36
Speaker 1: Like it makes me so sad.
1:46:38
Speaker 4: That, Yeah, that's ridiculous. Well that's a bomber.
1:46:43
Speaker 5: I did not know that. However, this movie was obviously
1:46:49
Speaker 5: don't need me to tell you.
1:46:50
Speaker 4: Tremendously successful.
1:46:52
Speaker 5: It was made for less than five million dollars and
1:46:55
Speaker 5: made a quarter of a billion dollars.
1:46:58
Speaker 1: Geez, Louise, Yeah, I.
1:47:01
Speaker 5: Didn't even I didn't realize it was like making its
1:47:04
Speaker 5: budget back eighty times successful, but it absolutely was obviously
1:47:08
Speaker 5: launched an incredible directing career for Jordan Peel, and Jordan
1:47:12
Speaker 5: Peele also produces a lot of a lot of director's
1:47:16
Speaker 5: works as well. It seems like, I mean, whatever, we
1:47:18
Speaker 5: love Jordan Peele. We don't need to belabor that point,
1:47:21
Speaker 5: but that this movie got It also won Jordan Peele
1:47:25
Speaker 5: his first Oscar. He won for Best Original Screenplay, also
1:47:29
Speaker 5: a nomination he got a nomination for Director. I don't
1:47:33
Speaker 5: know who he lost to that year, but the movie
1:47:35
Speaker 5: was nominated for Best Picture, Best Director, Best Actor for
1:47:38
Speaker 5: Daniel Caluia, and Best Original Screenplay, and it won Best
1:47:42
Speaker 5: Original Screenplay.
1:47:44
Speaker 1: And Jordan Peele is the first and only black person
1:47:48
Speaker 1: to win for Best Original Screenplay. I will say there
1:47:52
Speaker 1: are like, I think seven or eight black people who
1:47:55
Speaker 1: have won for Best Adapted Screenplay, So that's got a
1:47:59
Speaker 1: little bit more a little bit more weight behind it.
1:48:02
Speaker 1: I yeah, And I think it's interesting that there's such
1:48:08
Speaker 1: a disparity between original and adapted, and it kind of
1:48:12
Speaker 1: speaks to sort of the fun thing that's happening in
1:48:15
Speaker 1: the industry right now where they want a sure thing,
1:48:19
Speaker 1: and they're like, this thing that was already commercially successful,
1:48:23
Speaker 1: that we can adapt this ip. We will. We will
1:48:26
Speaker 1: take a chance on you to do that because we
1:48:30
Speaker 1: are pretty sure that you can't fuck it up.
1:48:34
Speaker 3: And that's why we don't have enough original stories from
1:48:38
Speaker 3: marginalized filmmakers in general.
1:48:42
Speaker 1: Because it's like Precious. I think the guy who wrote
1:48:45
Speaker 1: Precious based on the novel Push by.
1:48:46
Speaker 4: Sapphire famously based on.
1:48:49
Speaker 1: It's right there on the poster, which I think Sapphire
1:48:52
Speaker 1: like made them include that legally good for her, which
1:48:56
Speaker 1: you know, because the book has a different title and
1:48:58
Speaker 1: it's gonna be forgotten and overshadowed by the movie. And
1:49:02
Speaker 1: I you know what, I more power to her. Yeah,
1:49:05
Speaker 1: But Precious based on novel Push by Sapphire. The guy
1:49:08
Speaker 1: who wrote that was the first black person to win
1:49:10
Speaker 1: Best Adapted Screenplay, and I know that the guy who
1:49:14
Speaker 1: wrote Twelve Years of Slave also won. I think that
1:49:19
Speaker 1: American fiction most recently won. And then two of the
1:49:23
Speaker 1: four writers for Black Clansmen were black as well, and they.
1:49:28
Speaker 4: Won, which is a Jordan Peel produced movie.
1:49:31
Speaker 1: He's everywhere, It's all connected, everywhere, his influence.
1:49:36
Speaker 5: I'm just I'm looking back at the Academy Award page
1:49:39
Speaker 5: from this year, it's always funny. I mean, and I
1:49:41
Speaker 5: like the Shape of Water a lot, but the Shape
1:49:43
Speaker 5: of Water sort of became the Oscar Movie of the
1:49:46
Speaker 5: Year this particular year, where right with all love to
1:49:51
Speaker 5: Giamo del Toro and the Shape of Water a movie
1:49:54
Speaker 5: I very much like, you know, get Out and Ladybird
1:49:59
Speaker 5: and Phantom.
1:49:59
Speaker 3: I mean, come on, I was gunning hard for get
1:50:04
Speaker 3: Out to win Best Picture, and I will admit being
1:50:07
Speaker 3: furious that Shape of Water one instead.
1:50:10
Speaker 5: I mean, yeah, I mean it's not only I mean,
1:50:13
Speaker 5: there's so much like horror movies are so I mean,
1:50:17
Speaker 5: I think get Out kind of changed this narrative. But
1:50:21
Speaker 5: not only is you know, Jordan Peel marginalized director, he's
1:50:25
Speaker 5: also directing a genre film. And I feel like the
1:50:27
Speaker 5: Oscars love to dismiss genre films up until very recently,
1:50:32
Speaker 5: because get Out was so fucking good.
1:50:36
Speaker 1: I think only six horror films have been nominated for
1:50:40
Speaker 1: Best Picture, and Silence of the Lambs is the only
1:50:43
Speaker 1: one that's ever won.
1:50:44
Speaker 3: Yeah, Exorcist too, because we just covered that on the
1:50:46
Speaker 3: The Exorcis the Matreon, But it didn't win.
1:50:49
Speaker 4: It just was nominated.
1:50:50
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I don't think the Issis won anything.
1:50:52
Speaker 4: Yeah, they took away like one our hearts.
1:50:57
Speaker 3: It was nominated for like ten things and won only two.
1:51:00
Speaker 5: I want to say I was kind of surprised I
1:51:01
Speaker 5: was nominated for that much in any case. I mean,
1:51:04
Speaker 5: I like, get Out broke all of these barriers, and
1:51:07
Speaker 5: I feel like it's not very often discussed what a
1:51:10
Speaker 5: huge thing it was for the horror genre as well
1:51:14
Speaker 5: of just like getting all of these I mean, because
1:51:17
Speaker 5: it is a masterpiece and it is better than the
1:51:21
Speaker 5: Shape of Water. Not to pit them against each other,
1:51:23
Speaker 5: but that's what the oscars is.
1:51:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's true.
1:51:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, first movie or no, not for it was his
1:51:28
Speaker 1: first movie. It was his directorial debut.
1:51:30
Speaker 4: It was Yeah, he wrote Keanu, he did not direct Kian.
1:51:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we don't know what Keanu could have
1:51:36
Speaker 1: been had they let Jordan direct.
1:51:38
Speaker 5: His vision would have changed the game. I also thought
1:51:41
Speaker 5: it was this was just nice. I don't I mean,
1:51:44
Speaker 5: I don't know what the deal is with Key and Peele.
1:51:47
Speaker 5: I feel like there's all these theories as to why
1:51:49
Speaker 5: they don't work together anymore. However, get Out was made
1:51:54
Speaker 5: possible by Keeth and Michael Key, and he introduced Jordan
1:51:58
Speaker 5: Peel to a producer director he knew the producer of
1:52:03
Speaker 5: like Donnie Darko, and that was like, how this conversation
1:52:07
Speaker 5: around get Out got started was by his friend and
1:52:10
Speaker 5: collaborator being like, Jordan is obsessed with horror movies. He
1:52:14
Speaker 5: has a lot of great ideas. You should talk to him,
1:52:16
Speaker 5: And that was how get Out sort of came to be.
1:52:19
Speaker 3: So yeah, they had a lunch and Jordan Peel pitched
1:52:22
Speaker 3: get Out to this producer and he like bought the
1:52:25
Speaker 3: pitch at that very moment, and.
1:52:27
Speaker 5: Thank god different times truth, I know, I was like,
1:52:31
Speaker 5: this was ten years ago.
1:52:34
Speaker 1: I actually can very confidently say that the reason that
1:52:36
Speaker 1: Key and Peel don't work together anymore is a disagreement
1:52:40
Speaker 1: over a recipe for chibapyous.
1:52:45
Speaker 5: It was a documentary the whole time.
1:52:48
Speaker 1: What if I had the tea? What if I actually
1:52:50
Speaker 1: had the tea? You know, I think their careers are
1:52:53
Speaker 1: just going in different directions and different people have different priorities.
1:52:56
Speaker 5: And I know the Twitter algorithm is design to torture
1:53:01
Speaker 5: me with speculation as to why they don't work together.
1:53:03
Speaker 5: So maybe it's just always on my mind because the
1:53:05
Speaker 5: algorithm decided that.
1:53:07
Speaker 4: But if anyone knows, let me know.
1:53:09
Speaker 3: Yeah. I love when a movie and I feel like
1:53:14
Speaker 3: this happens, maybe most often with horror thriller type movies,
1:53:20
Speaker 3: but when the audience is so affected by it that
1:53:25
Speaker 3: they become like for example, Fatal Attraction, everyone like being
1:53:31
Speaker 3: so scared of Glenn close and like being afraid that
1:53:35
Speaker 3: that would happen to them, Or the way that like
1:53:38
Speaker 3: Misery made everyone be so afraid of Kathy Baits and
1:53:42
Speaker 3: I the.
1:53:43
Speaker 1: First time I ever saw Kathy Baits on film was
1:53:46
Speaker 1: in the movie Misery when I was twelve.
1:53:48
Speaker 4: Yeah, oh it was now too.
1:53:50
Speaker 1: I was too young and she was too scary, And
1:53:54
Speaker 1: I can't watch Matt Locke.
1:53:55
Speaker 5: Now you watch Titanic, though, But that sentence was a journey.
1:54:02
Speaker 4: This is a journey.
1:54:04
Speaker 3: But just the way that like certain movies will have
1:54:07
Speaker 3: such a cultural impact and like incite fear in so
1:54:11
Speaker 3: many people. I feel like get Out is another one
1:54:14
Speaker 3: of those movies where on like dating apps, for a
1:54:17
Speaker 3: few years after this movie came out, I saw a
1:54:20
Speaker 3: lot of people's profiles be like, if you're a white woman,
1:54:23
Speaker 3: please don't get out me, Like that was a thing,
1:54:27
Speaker 3: so so interesting.
1:54:29
Speaker 1: I don't remember seeing that, which doesn't mean it wasn't there.
1:54:33
Speaker 1: I think I've blocked out a lot of the trauma
1:54:35
Speaker 1: of dating apps.
1:54:37
Speaker 3: They're so traumatic.
1:54:39
Speaker 1: My favorite dating app copy pasta for a while was
1:54:42
Speaker 1: when Game of Thrones was still in the air. It
1:54:44
Speaker 1: was like, oh, I'm just a bastard looking for my
1:54:46
Speaker 1: wild lang and I'm like, okay more, Oh dude, awesome,
1:54:55
Speaker 1: I'm so happy for you. The first time I saw it,
1:54:58
Speaker 1: I chuckled, and then I realized that guy and come
1:55:00
Speaker 1: up with it, and.
1:55:01
Speaker 4: I was like, oh, isn't that.
1:55:02
Speaker 5: It's such as Yeah, every time you're like, oh, that
1:55:05
Speaker 5: man was clever, and you're like, wait a second, that's a.
1:55:08
Speaker 4: Thirty year old movie. I haven't seen.
1:55:10
Speaker 5: Fuck you.
1:55:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, he loves the office, Oh my god, oh.
1:55:15
Speaker 4: Wow, so original?
1:55:17
Speaker 1: Wow?
1:55:18
Speaker 3: Or another Game of Thrones thing is I'm still not
1:55:20
Speaker 3: over the last season of.
1:55:22
Speaker 4: Game of Thrones.
1:55:23
Speaker 3: Oh you and eight million other people shut up say
1:55:28
Speaker 3: yeah that too. Anyway, does anyone have any other thoughts
1:55:33
Speaker 3: about Get Out?
1:55:35
Speaker 1: I want to talk about the music for a second. Yeah,
1:55:37
Speaker 1: because the guy who did the music was the same
1:55:41
Speaker 1: guy who did the music for us, and I talked
1:55:42
Speaker 1: a little bit about him and not. And his name
1:55:45
Speaker 1: is Michael Abels, and I love him. This was his
1:55:48
Speaker 1: first film score ever, nailed it ever in the world.
1:55:54
Speaker 5: He was like a professional composer, but he's just never
1:55:56
Speaker 5: done a film.
1:55:57
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah he and he went to like
1:55:59
Speaker 1: the Thornton School of me at USC so he yeah,
1:56:03
Speaker 1: he has the pedigree, he has the talent, and now
1:56:06
Speaker 1: he's a Pulitzer Prize winner. Fun fact, he won the
1:56:10
Speaker 1: Pulitzer Prize for Music in twenty twenty three for an
1:56:13
Speaker 1: opera that he wrote called what is it called? I
1:56:18
Speaker 1: don't think down? What it was called Omar Yes, yeah,
1:56:20
Speaker 1: and it was about Omar ibn said, who was an
1:56:24
Speaker 1: enslaved Muslim man, and he wrote a he wrote an
1:56:28
Speaker 1: autobiography that was primarily an Arabic and it's, I think,
1:56:31
Speaker 1: if not the only, one of the only autobiographies by
1:56:35
Speaker 1: an enslaved person written primarily in Arabic.
1:56:38
Speaker 5: Wow.
1:56:39
Speaker 1: And I think what's interesting about Michael Abels is that,
1:56:43
Speaker 1: you know, he sort of cut his teeth on this
1:56:45
Speaker 1: very successful film. And he is a black composer. And
1:56:49
Speaker 1: if you look at his work on IMDb, he has
1:56:53
Speaker 1: by and large worked on films that tell black stories
1:56:57
Speaker 1: like he worked on See You Yesterday, also worked on
1:57:00
Speaker 1: us and films that have primarily black casts, which I
1:57:04
Speaker 1: think is a really interesting calling card and you know,
1:57:07
Speaker 1: a gift to be able to do not exclusively those.
1:57:11
Speaker 1: He worked on Bad Education, which.
1:57:14
Speaker 4: By that weird HBO movie. I was like, huh is
1:57:16
Speaker 4: that what my friend.
1:57:17
Speaker 1: Wrote that movie? Oh? Really, my friend Mike, who I
1:57:21
Speaker 1: saw it out with. Yeah, my god, white Mike.
1:57:26
Speaker 4: That's so that's wild.
1:57:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, I watched that movie.
1:57:31
Speaker 5: I think that movie came out during the pandemic, right.
1:57:33
Speaker 1: It came out during Lockdown.
1:57:34
Speaker 5: Yeah, I need to rewatch it because I feel like
1:57:36
Speaker 5: I saw it, liked it, memory hold it because Lockdown.
1:57:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, highly recommend am fully biased. But my mom also
1:57:48
Speaker 1: liked it, and she was like, oh my god, tell Mike,
1:57:50
Speaker 1: I'm so proud of him. Hugh jack Finn, I'm telling
1:57:52
Speaker 1: the truth.
1:57:53
Speaker 5: And Jenny Okay, yeah.
1:57:55
Speaker 3: I have no memory of this movie. I'll have to
1:57:57
Speaker 3: check it out.
1:57:58
Speaker 1: We'll talk about That Education well, because it was so
1:58:00
Speaker 1: theatrically released. If you want to talk about it, I
1:58:03
Speaker 1: have an end with Mike.
1:58:06
Speaker 5: Mike, come on the pod. That's fascinating. I didn't realize
1:58:12
Speaker 5: that Michael Abels had gone on to win a Pulitzer
1:58:14
Speaker 5: since we last talked about him.
1:58:15
Speaker 4: That's fucking incredible, and.
1:58:17
Speaker 1: Not the first black opera to win a pullet Serprize,
1:58:21
Speaker 1: which I thought was really interesting. There was one that
1:58:24
Speaker 1: I actually saw, and I'm gonna be really honest, I
1:58:25
Speaker 1: did not like that was about the I think the
1:58:29
Speaker 1: Exonerated five is what they're called now, but the people
1:58:32
Speaker 1: who were accused of that horrible sexual assault in Central
1:58:36
Speaker 1: Park all those years ago and were eventually exonerated because
1:58:41
Speaker 1: they were in fact innocent. But there was an opera
1:58:45
Speaker 1: about that as well that won a Pulitzerprize. So I
1:58:48
Speaker 1: think that it's interesting that there is this sort of
1:58:51
Speaker 1: growing world of black opera telling black stories, and that
1:58:54
Speaker 1: Michael Abels is, you know, out there repin yeah, oh yeah, yeah.
1:58:59
Speaker 5: There's also like I just now that we have three
1:59:02
Speaker 5: Jordan Peel movies too to pull from, Like you can
1:59:05
Speaker 5: see sort of how he has like this repeated motif
1:59:07
Speaker 5: of rabbits in his movies and then like the opening
1:59:11
Speaker 5: song and like the repeated song, yeah.
1:59:16
Speaker 1: Where's the rabbit in No, I don't remember the rabbit.
1:59:20
Speaker 5: I don't know there was a rabbit refer it was not.
1:59:22
Speaker 5: I mean, I feel like US is still the movie
1:59:25
Speaker 5: that obviously references rabbits most heavily. Yeah, because that opening
1:59:30
Speaker 5: shot lives in my mind rent Free all the time.
1:59:35
Speaker 1: But I've said it before and I'll say it again,
1:59:38
Speaker 1: the most upsetting and scary part of the movie US
1:59:41
Speaker 1: was the part at the beginning where they talked about
1:59:43
Speaker 1: all the tunnels creepy. I'm not okay, I don't like it.
1:59:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's unsettling. Yeah, as far as the Bechdel test goes,
1:59:58
Speaker 3: I mean, I think the movie Probab passes. I wasn't
2:00:01
Speaker 3: really paying much and Rose and Missy.
2:00:03
Speaker 1: It like lightly passes. Yeah, I think that there's the
2:00:07
Speaker 1: conversation that Missy and Georgina have about how it's like
2:00:10
Speaker 1: you should lie down that passes. But I do think
2:00:15
Speaker 1: the majority of the conversations are about Chris, So I
2:00:18
Speaker 1: don't think Missy and Rose have any one on one conversations.
2:00:24
Speaker 1: I don't think Georgina and Rose have any one on
2:00:26
Speaker 1: one conversations. There just aren't a lot of women also, right,
2:00:30
Speaker 1: there aren't a lot of people.
2:00:31
Speaker 3: To be fair, this is true, but it does feel
2:00:34
Speaker 3: especially glaring knowing that black women were mostly left out
2:00:39
Speaker 3: of this narrative, right, and it just speaks to the
2:00:42
Speaker 3: need of more stories featuring black women and black people
2:00:47
Speaker 3: of marginalized genders.
2:00:48
Speaker 1: And I will say black women are much much more
2:00:53
Speaker 1: at the center of the stories that are in us
2:00:56
Speaker 1: And Nope, yes, for sure.
2:00:59
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's definitely an you know, continued glaring thing throughout
2:01:04
Speaker 5: his filmography. Yeah, so I yeah, And I also, I mean,
2:01:07
Speaker 5: just going back to your original point at the beginning
2:01:09
Speaker 5: of the episode, Krama, it's like, this is a movie
2:01:12
Speaker 5: made by a black men about black men and for everyone,
2:01:16
Speaker 5: but it's like particularly made with that audience in mind.
2:01:19
Speaker 5: And that's you know, we don't have a lot of
2:01:21
Speaker 5: movies like that.
2:01:22
Speaker 1: And yeah, and I think that he gets to tell
2:01:25
Speaker 1: that story, and I'm so glad that he told that story. Yeah,
2:01:28
Speaker 1: and I'm so glad that it resonated on this massive
2:01:32
Speaker 1: global scale where people enjoyed it, people were moved by it,
2:01:37
Speaker 1: people were provoked to think by it regardless of their
2:01:41
Speaker 1: own personal experience.
2:01:43
Speaker 5: Yeah.
2:01:44
Speaker 3: Absolutely. As far as our nipple scale zero to five
2:01:49
Speaker 3: nipples based on examining the movie through an intersectional feminist lens,
2:01:54
Speaker 3: I mean, and maybe this is just how much I
2:01:57
Speaker 3: love this movie coming into play here, but I want
2:02:01
Speaker 3: to give it like four four and a half nipples.
2:02:03
Speaker 3: I do feel like there could have been and should
2:02:08
Speaker 3: have been more inclusion of black women.
2:02:11
Speaker 4: In this narrative.
2:02:12
Speaker 3: Make Little Rall's character, you know, cast a woman in
2:02:14
Speaker 3: that role that's an active participant in the story, who's
2:02:18
Speaker 3: you know, helping and who saves Chris at the end.
2:02:22
Speaker 3: You know, that could have been something or just found
2:02:26
Speaker 3: other ways to include black women more significantly. So with
2:02:30
Speaker 3: that in mind, I think I'll give it four out
2:02:32
Speaker 3: of five. But I just I love this movie so
2:02:35
Speaker 3: much and I think it has so many interesting, important
2:02:40
Speaker 3: things to say, And yeah, four nipples. I'll give one
2:02:46
Speaker 3: to Jordan Peel, I'll give one to Betty Gabriel who
2:02:52
Speaker 3: plays Georgina. I'll give one to Sid the Dog, and
2:02:58
Speaker 3: I'll give my final nipple to the Gremlins. Two sketch
2:03:01
Speaker 3: of k and people.
2:03:05
Speaker 5: I'm going to meet you at four.
2:03:06
Speaker 4: I agree.
2:03:07
Speaker 5: I mean, it's like, because this is a podcast about
2:03:09
Speaker 5: intersectional feminism, it cannot get the full five unfortunately, But
2:03:13
Speaker 5: you know, I think that this is I'm I'm glad
2:03:16
Speaker 5: and encouraged to see that Jordan Peele has centered and
2:03:21
Speaker 5: prioritized black women in the movies that he's made since.
2:03:25
Speaker 5: So I would maybe granted a little more harshly if
2:03:29
Speaker 5: we didn't have the sort of benefit of future knowledge.
2:03:31
Speaker 5: This is not a continued issue in his filmography and
2:03:34
Speaker 5: get Out is just a fucking masterpiece.
2:03:36
Speaker 4: We didn't get into it.
2:03:37
Speaker 5: But I also think it was I'm trying to remember.
2:03:40
Speaker 5: I think it was maybe on the press cycle for Us,
2:03:43
Speaker 5: where there was this expectation that all of Jordan Peele's
2:03:47
Speaker 5: movies were going to be about race, and then US
2:03:51
Speaker 5: wasn't explicitly about race, and it like broke a lot
2:03:55
Speaker 5: of moviegoers' brains where they're like, wait, why are you
2:03:59
Speaker 5: trying to make a move about something else? And he's like,
2:04:01
Speaker 5: because I'm a filmmaker.
2:04:02
Speaker 4: And I have other things I want to talk about.
2:04:05
Speaker 1: And like people were like, but there's black people.
2:04:07
Speaker 5: In it, but it's not explicitly about race, and he's like, yeah,
2:04:12
Speaker 5: Like I yeah, he's he's had to be at the
2:04:16
Speaker 5: center of all of these like obnoxious media press cycles,
2:04:19
Speaker 5: and I just like, also.
2:04:22
Speaker 1: The movie was not about like blackness, but it was
2:04:24
Speaker 1: very explicitly about the idea of stealing land and the
2:04:28
Speaker 1: idea of taking land from Native people, indigenous people in
2:04:32
Speaker 1: this country. Yeah, and how we're living on top of
2:04:35
Speaker 1: them and their second class citizens. Like that was not subtle,
2:04:40
Speaker 1: Absolutely not.
2:04:41
Speaker 5: I mean, and I think that that just like goes
2:04:43
Speaker 5: back to something we've talked about on the show a
2:04:44
Speaker 5: lot of just like when you are a marginalized filmmaker,
2:04:49
Speaker 5: that you are expected to only make stories that reflect
2:04:52
Speaker 5: your specific experience, and that like original stories outside of
2:04:56
Speaker 5: your own experience that references your own experience in the
2:05:00
Speaker 5: way that like an executive would expect is.
2:05:02
Speaker 4: Not permissible or is like this.
2:05:06
Speaker 5: Radical act when it's like, no, that's just what filmmakers do,
2:05:11
Speaker 5: and it's not an opportunity that's given to enough marginalized filmmakers.
2:05:18
Speaker 5: So anyways, just Jordan Peel fucking rocks. I like, his
2:05:23
Speaker 5: movies are so distinct, and get Out is probably one
2:05:27
Speaker 5: of the old timer like directorial debuts. It's it's ridiculous,
2:05:33
Speaker 5: it's it's unfair, it's fucked up. He's so good. So
2:05:37
Speaker 5: I'm gonna give it four nipples. I'm gonna give two
2:05:41
Speaker 5: to Jordan Peel, one to Daniel Cleia because it's just
2:05:46
Speaker 5: like the wildest performance, and I'll I'll also give one
2:05:51
Speaker 5: to Betty Gabriel.
2:05:53
Speaker 1: Nice I am. I'm gonna come in a little lower
2:05:56
Speaker 1: than you guys on the nipple scale. I'm gonna give
2:05:59
Speaker 1: it three nips. I was going to start with one,
2:06:02
Speaker 1: but then I heard you guys out and I was like, okay,
2:06:04
Speaker 1: they have points, they have points. Let me, let me,
2:06:07
Speaker 1: let me readjust so I'm going to do three nipples.
2:06:10
Speaker 1: I think that through the lens of intersectional feminism, the
2:06:15
Speaker 1: best thing that this film does is lambast the weaponization
2:06:20
Speaker 1: of white womanhood, and that is like that was always
2:06:25
Speaker 1: going to get one of the nipples. I think it
2:06:26
Speaker 1: does a great job at that, and it is very
2:06:31
Speaker 1: unflinching in its ability to do that. I'm going to
2:06:35
Speaker 1: give a nipple to Daniel Kluya because I've loved him
2:06:39
Speaker 1: since his days is Posh Kenneth on Skins, which fun fact,
2:06:43
Speaker 1: he also wrote an episode of Skins.
2:06:45
Speaker 4: Really not kidding, God, he's so fucking cool. I forgot.
2:06:48
Speaker 5: I was like, where did I think I had I
2:06:50
Speaker 5: had first seen him in Black Mirror.
2:06:52
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, And then I will give my final nipple
2:06:57
Speaker 1: to Georgina's no no, no, no no scene.
2:07:02
Speaker 3: It's so good.
2:07:03
Speaker 1: I love a scene that just really stands out, and
2:07:07
Speaker 1: it's kind of up there for me with Viola Davis
2:07:10
Speaker 1: in Doubt, which interesting that they both involve a black
2:07:13
Speaker 1: woman crying but stand out performances.
2:07:16
Speaker 5: Yeah.
2:07:17
Speaker 3: Absolutely, Well, we haven't brought up doubt in a while
2:07:20
Speaker 3: on the show.
2:07:21
Speaker 1: I love about times what I'm here for now.
2:07:24
Speaker 5: We found it. We found it in the eleventh hour.
2:07:27
Speaker 5: We brought it back to doubt.
2:07:30
Speaker 3: All roads on the podcast lead back to Titanic, Shrek
2:07:33
Speaker 3: or doubt.
2:07:34
Speaker 4: And occasionally a doubt.
2:07:37
Speaker 5: Just word saying Alfred Molina could have been in this movie,
2:07:40
Speaker 5: but I'm just assuming he was busy.
2:07:42
Speaker 1: I feel like he also could have been not Jim Henson,
2:07:45
Speaker 1: but Jim Hudson.
2:07:46
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah.
2:07:49
Speaker 1: Again, we want a disabled actor to play a disabled character.
2:07:51
Speaker 1: But if they were gonna cast a draw non disabled actor,
2:07:55
Speaker 1: Alfred Molina, Yeah, there you go.
2:07:57
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I you know, let's let's speak it
2:08:00
Speaker 5: into an existence, a Jordan Peel al Ford Molina collaboration.
2:08:03
Speaker 5: It's not a question of if, it's a question of when.
2:08:06
Speaker 5: And I personally can't wait for when.
2:08:11
Speaker 3: Yes, well, Karama, thank you so much for joining us
2:08:13
Speaker 3: once again. Come back anytime.
2:08:15
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me again.
2:08:17
Speaker 3: Oh we love having you. Tell us where people can
2:08:20
Speaker 3: follow you online and check out your work.
2:08:23
Speaker 1: I am at Karama Drama on all platforms including Yes,
2:08:28
Speaker 1: I'm back on Twitter. I came crawling back.
2:08:32
Speaker 4: I there with you.
2:08:33
Speaker 1: I had a thought about yogurt and I had no
2:08:35
Speaker 1: one to tell it too, so I wish I were joking,
2:08:39
Speaker 1: but that's what brought me back. I was like, strawberry
2:08:42
Speaker 1: yogurt is that bitch, and no one can tell me otherwise.
2:08:45
Speaker 5: You're like, Okay, I'm reactivating. I'm reactivating.
2:08:50
Speaker 1: So Karama Drama on Twitter, Instagram occasionally TikTok, but really
2:08:54
Speaker 1: not really it's too much, man.
2:08:57
Speaker 5: I'm too I'm too fucking old. I'm not doing it.
2:09:00
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm a watcher. I'm just not a creator.
2:09:03
Speaker 1: I don't have it in me. That's I am like
2:09:06
Speaker 1: a plus commenter though, I feel like my comment game
2:09:09
Speaker 1: on point. So if you follow me, I'll comment on
2:09:13
Speaker 1: your stuff. Where can they find you, guys?
2:09:17
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.
2:09:18
Speaker 1: Thanks.
2:09:18
Speaker 3: You can follow me at Caitlin Durante on Instagram and
2:09:23
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2:09:27
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2:09:35
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2:09:37
Speaker 1: Yes, that's less than a latte, honestly, a.
2:09:40
Speaker 5: Steal, exactly exactly. And you get our back catalog of
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Speaker 5: over one hundred and fifty episodes.
2:09:46
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2:09:47
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2:09:51
Speaker 5: up horror movies. We just covered The Exorcist, which is
2:09:54
Speaker 5: why exercise the Exorcises top of mind. We did the
2:09:56
Speaker 5: exercise and Pearl Over in the Matreon this month. If
2:09:59
Speaker 5: you to check it out, it's a blast over there.
2:10:02
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Speaker 5: Bechdel Cast, which is the name of the podcast. I
2:10:08
Speaker 5: just almost said it wrong, and uh with that, all
2:10:14
Speaker 5: hail the TSA.
2:10:16
Speaker 1: Yes, Wow, yes, bye bye.
2:10:23
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