Latest / Mic Drop Comedy / Senator Raphael Warnock - Faith_ Politics_ and _The Crooked Places Made Straight_ _ The Daily Show

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Senator Raphael Warnock - Faith_ Politics_ and _The Crooked Places Made Straight_ _ The Daily Show · Mic Drop Comedy

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Thank you for being here. Great to be here.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: And I know New York City very special to you.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: You worked in New York City for many years.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: I was here about 10 years serving at the Abyssinian
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Baptist Church in Harlem and making my way through seminary.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: So it's always great to be back in New York.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: Especially right now.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Oh, it's always this celebratory. We can never go wrong.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: You mentioned that. So working your way through seminary, what
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: is the process of becoming, you are, is it called
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: a licensed reverend?
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: I'm an ordained minister.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: Ordained minister. What is that process like? What is the
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: schooling like for.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: Something like that? Well, after college, I went to seminary
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: and spent three years working on a Master of Divinity degree.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: And that qualifies you?
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: That's the academic qualifications, but there's some other things, you know.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Do you have to pass a passage? It depends on
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: the denomination.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: I see.
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: But early on, I knew that I was going into ministry.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: My father and my mother, who's still with us, are
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: both Pentecostal preachers. So I grew up in a house
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: with two pastors and they spoke to me in King
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: James English, like Thou shalt wash the dishes.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: I get that. That's a hard house to sneak out of,
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: I would think. And then the process of seminary, because
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: you also have your doctorate now.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: That's right. Politicians don't usually admit that. I do have
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: a PhD.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: No, sir, you should admit. It's a long process. I
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: bring it up by way of this, and I say
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: this as respectfully as I can. Friends of mine wanted
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: me to marry them. And I couldn't do it unless
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: I was ordained officially. So I paid $ 10 to the
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: Universal Church of Light. And I guess what I'm saying is,
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: you and I are colleagues.
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: Moment of silence.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: Slight differential, perhaps, in the depth of our knowledge?
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: I was listening to you before coming out. That was
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: quite a sermon.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: Let me tell you something. All kings English. Depending on
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: the king. That's the English. So, you have this, then
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: you go down and you work in Atlanta. In maybe
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: the most, one of the most legendary places churches, historic
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: churches in all of America. And how long were you
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: down there for? How did you end up there?
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: So I was born and raised in Georgia.
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: And so I returned to my home state. Right. And,
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: you know, Baptist, it's the congregation that elects you.
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: Okay. To serve.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: There's no bishop. So I was elected by the congregation. And, yeah,
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: it's quite an honor to serve as pastor of the
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: church where Martin Luther King Jr. was born and where
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: he preached from 1960 to 1968. And it's a church
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: that's always had, at the helm of its leadership, pastors
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: who believe that you take your faith out into the
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: world and you make it come alive. Everybody knows the
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: story of Dr. King, but not as many people know
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: that every pastor of that church, his grandfather, Daddy King,
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: led a voting rights campaign in Atlanta in 1935, 30
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: years before the voting rights law. And that his maternal grandfather, A.D. Williams,
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: who was the second pastor of the church, led a
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: bond referendum that created the first public high school for
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: black children in Atlanta. And so it's a long legacy
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: of faith and justice. Faith come alive in the public square.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: And I've tried to live that out in my own way.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: And I'm blessed that the people of Georgia saw fit
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: to send me to the United States Senate.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: It's amazing. How do you... In the church hierarchy, how
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: do you stand for election as their pastor?
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: They elect you once.
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: Do you have to put your name as, is there
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: a nominating process?
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: Oh, they did a national search. Oh, really? Yeah.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: They looked all over the world and found you to
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: lead that church. That's amazing. And they voted on you.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: It's quite an honor.
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: And then you were there for a couple of years
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: and they went, you should really.
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: Run for Senate.
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: What was it like when you announced you were leaving?
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: I didn't leave. I'm still the pastor of Ebenezer Baptist Church.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: I return to my pulpit most Sundays, almost every Sunday,
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: because I don't want to spend all my time talking
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: to politicians. I'm afraid I might accidentally become one. No,
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  Speaker 1: but seriously, I really do think it's important for you
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: to walk with the people, even as you work for them.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: Sure.
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  Speaker 1: And to stay connected to them. So I still lead
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: my church. I still preach every Sunday. And this book
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: began as a sermon, literally, that I preached one Sunday
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: morning at Ebenezer Baptist Church.
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  Speaker 2: Well, you write in it that there were people that
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: came up to you when you announced that you were leaving,
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: and some were upset, and some were really congratulatory. They
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: were nervous.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: They were nervous about what was going to happen. Understandably.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: Politics is a messy business.
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  Speaker 2: Right.
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  Speaker 1: And what would it be like to bring your church
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: into the fray? And there were people... My adversaries are
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: political opponents who did come after the church and tried to,
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: you know, and they come after us all the time. But,
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: you know, Ebenezer's used to being in a fight.
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: Sure.
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  Speaker 1: And it's a fight that changed America, brought us closer
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: to our ideals, and that's the work that I'm trying
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: to do right now. I'm really concerned about our country
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: as we approach this 250th anniversary.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: So what is, when you're reflecting on this idea of
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: the moral meaning of America, what do you derive it
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: from and And how do you see it fitting into
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: the political hierarchy?
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I just think that we've got some really big
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: challenges in front of us. And the language of partisan
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: politics in a real sense is too puny a vocabulary
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: for the issues.
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: It's a very puny vocabulary.
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  Speaker 1: It's very predictable that that's confronting us. And this is
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: a call to remind us of who we are at
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: our best. We the people. The first three words of
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: the Constitution are not just the opening lines of a sentence.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: It's really a creed. And they're those who are trying
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: to divide us in this moment. Because folks who have
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: no vision traffic in division. And we're seeing growing wealth inequality.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: We're seeing poor people who are really just being crushed
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: by the system. And I'm honored to fight for them
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: every day in the United States.
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: Do you look at this book as a way of
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: making a political argument? Or is this book really an
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: argument about Christianity and which Christianity, which path of Christianity
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: you believe people should go down?
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: Well, I engage with politics. You know, I'm serving as
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: a Democratic senator from Georgia. But I really do, honestly,
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: believe that the issues that confront us are bigger than
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: this Partisan language and most Americans feel that they don't
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: wake up thinking of themselves as a Democrat or Republican
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: Folks want to be able to go to the grocery
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: store and afford their groceries sure they want health care
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: and And part of what I do is in the
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: book is I call us to faith those of us
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: who are people of faith I do ask about the
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: character of that faith But I also honor people who
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: don't claim any particular faith tradition but are people of
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: moral courage and And that's the covenant we have with
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: one another. So ultimately, I'm calling us to renew our
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: faith in one another and in the American covenant. And yeah,
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: I do take on those of my particular faith tradition.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: And I ask us, do our deeds match our creeds?
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  Speaker 1: And so I was taken by the fact that when
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: they passed the one big ugly bill, I call it,
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: I don't find it beautiful at all.
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  Speaker 2: Watch your language, Reverend.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: Don't.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: That's as close to custom. This is not that kind
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  Speaker 2: of show.
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: This act. Well played. Thank you, sir.
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: Here's what I want to ask you. The reason why
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: I bring it up is there is certainly a tradition
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: within the Republican Party to claim faith as the foundation
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: for all that.
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: That governance should occur, that they would like to see
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: more of that in there. And it feels like the
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: argument you are making is with maybe some of your
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: fellow politicians. I know you've sat down with Mike Johnson,
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: who is obviously And forgive me for not having the
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: language of this, because I don't come from a faith
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: tradition other than.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: He's a fellow Christian. Yes. You can believe him. Yes.
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  Speaker 2: So you're basically working off of the same book.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, we... That's right. We're people of the book.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: And let me be really clear, because I don't want
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: people to misunderstand this as a pastor who serves in
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: the Senate. Let me be really clear. I'm a Christian.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: I don't want to live in anybody's theocracy. Christian, Muslim, Jewish...
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  Speaker 1: that we are a country, the covenant that we have
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: with one another is a covenant for freedom. Freedom of religion,
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: freedom to choose your religion, freedom from religion. And the covenant,
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  Speaker 1: I mean, and we agree that we're gonna have each
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: other's back and we're gonna support that. But I was
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: struck by the fact that when they passed the one
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: big ugly bill, They got together, the Speaker of the
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: House held hands with other legislators, prayed a prayer, and
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: then they went and cut a trillion dollars out of Medicaid.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: A trillion dollars. They kicked 15 million people off of
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: their health care. They kicked veterans and seniors and children
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: off of SNAP. And I don't understand how you read
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: the book that I read. I'm a Matthew 25 Christian.
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  Speaker 2: Oh.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: In as much as you've done it. Why wouldn't you.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Be? Matthew 24, you're like, no. I remember when that
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: was coming up.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: And you were always like, keep going. You know that one, John. No.
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  Speaker 1: I was hungry and you fed me. I was thirsty
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: and you gave me something to drink. I was sick
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: and you came to visit me. And they asked the Lord,
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: when were you hungry? You're the Lord. When were you sick?
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: When were you in prison? When were you an immigrant?
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: And he said, inasmuch as you've done it unto the
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: least of these, you've done it also unto me. And
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  Speaker 1: so for me, the acid test of the authenticity of
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: your faith is the depth of your commitment to the
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: most marginalized members of the human family. You can't pray
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  Speaker 1: and then crush the poor. Isaiah, upon which this book
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: is written, said that God says, I can't endure solemn
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: assemblies with iniquity. Your hands are full of blood. And
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: so I raised that question, and the speaker wanted to
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: meet with me, and I was happy to meet with
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: him and and talked to him, we had a very
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: candid conversation. I hope we keep that going.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Can I ask you, so in that moment, because here's
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: the difficulty for me. The idea that we need to
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: find this book, like poor people are being kicked off
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: of food benefits, old people being kicked off, people being
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: kicked off their health insurance. It strikes me as a
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: very difficult slope to go down to say we shouldn't
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: do that. Why? Hold on. Matthew 25. Why is that
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: moral covenant self-evident? And does that open the door to
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: other Christians going, well, let me show you this other
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: quote that gives me a justification. Let's say it's the
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: story of Ham to keep people enslaved. Doesn't it allow
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: people an ability to weaponize their faith for whatever policy
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: they think is right?
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: There is no question.
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: That people have often weaponized faith or faith language in
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: service to slavery, human oppression. The favorite one during the
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: Christian slaveocracy, what an oxymoron, but that's what we were,
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: was slaves obey your masters. But I come from a
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: tradition where folks stumbled into Exodus where God told Moses
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: to tell Pharaoh to let my people go.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: I do know that story. For me it's... We have
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: a whole dinner. You have no idea. By the way,
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: some of the weirdest foods you've ever eaten in your life.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I don't think it's about a verse.
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: When you have those conversations with someone like the Speaker
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: of the House, do they battle you in verse? Is
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: that how that goes? Or do they just say, I
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: hear what you're saying, not don't believe it?
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: We had a candid conversation. Christians have differences of opinion.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: By the way, I think this idea of mercy and compassion,
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: love of neighbor, there are iterations of what we call
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: the golden rule in all of the great faith traditions. Right.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: There's some version of that in all of the great
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: faith traditions. And I just pointed out to the speaker
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: that there are 2,000 verses in scripture that tell you
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: how to treat the poor. And so I'm not just talking,
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: when I say that justice making, truth telling, centering the
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: concerns of poor and ordinary people is a requirement of
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: the faith, I'm saying it's central to the meaning of
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: the faith itself.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: Right, you can't be one or the other. Would you
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: rather convert somebody to Christianity or being a Democrat? And
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: what verse would that be like? Luke 19, 10. Look,
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: you have got to vote.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: Buy mail.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: But... Are you able to separate it in your mind?
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely. Look, Democrats have got some issues, too.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: Boy, oh, boy.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: For sure. Yes, sir. And, you know, I'm honored that
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: I get to work in that arena, but for me,
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: I put up with politics. Right. I'm not in love
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: with politics. Why do you?
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: What is it about politics? Is politics the vessel by
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: which you can execute the plan that you believe that
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: is more godly?
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: I'm in love with change, and every now and then,
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: You get to do something amazing in this job. What
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: else could I be doing where I could literally write
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: the legislation that capped insulin for seniors to no more
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: than $ 35 of out-of-pocket costs per month? Incredible.
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: So you're saying it allows you the levers by which
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: you can manifest.
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Public policy is a matter of life and death. Faith
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: and politics is about life and death. And, you know,
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: I put up with politics because every now and then
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: I get to do something amazing like that. For me,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: as much as I love this office, I don't need
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: this office. I think leadership is about an orientation, not
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: about an office. And I'm always going to find some
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: way to serve because that's what gives me fulfillment and joy.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: That's what I think we're put here for. Now, your
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: book is coming out. At the same time, I believe J.D.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: Vance has a book coming out. Same day, about his
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: faith journey.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: It's called I'm a Fraud. No, it's called.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: I'll find it. I'll find it. Communion. Finding my way
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: back to faith. And I believe his is about Catholicism.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Whose book will win?
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: I haven't read the Vice President's book.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: I don't think he has either.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: I will say this. Yes. You know, he's been talking
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: about his faith and his conversion and who am I
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: to question anybody's conversion. But I did find it interesting
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: that he was so quick to say to the Pope
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: after the Pope called for peace, that he said the
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: Pope needs to be careful when he's talking about theology.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: By the way, judging, coming off of what happened when
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: he met the last Pope, like, that's no idle crap.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: When he said the Pope needs to be careful, I'm
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: sure the Pope was like, what's this guy trying to imply?
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: And, you know, yeah, I'm sorry.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: I'm just... I love the fact that you can't come
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: with me on these journeys. And I go down these
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: rabbit holes of terrible things to say, and you just
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: have to go like, getting back to the good book,
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: let me just....
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: It's better this way. It's better this way.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: Keeps you clean.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: I like this.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: But you thought it was interesting that he would say that.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: Is he someone that you could pull aside and have
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: a conversation about theology with?
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: Well, we did serve for a little while together in
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: the Senate. Oh, okay. And, you know, I have conversations
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: with Republicans all the time. And every now and then,
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: you know, I actually do legislation with Republicans. I'm listed
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: as one of the most bipartisan senators in the Senate.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: So I find a way to hold on to my
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: values and where I can work with people to get
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: some good done. I'm always willing to do that.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: Is your faith more tested in a theological setting or
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: in a senatorial setting? Is it difficult for you more
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: so to maintain your faith in your church setting or
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: in your legislative setting?
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: I can tell you that working in Congress has given
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: me plenty of material for my sermons.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: LAUGHTER That's all I needed to hear, sir.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: LAUGHTER Cookie Place is made safe. Available right now.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: Senator Raphael Warnock.