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No Okamoto, so what's next? · Bucco Territory: A Pittsburgh Pirates Podcast

0:09
Speaker 1: What's up, everybody?
0:10
Speaker 2: Welcome back to another episode of Bucco Territory, presented to
0:13
Speaker 2: you by the Foul Territory Network. I'm your host, Doa Hiles,
0:17
Speaker 2: and joining me as always are my wonderful co hosts
0:20
Speaker 2: Josh Harrison aka j Hay and Platinum Key aka Mark Fellas.
0:25
Speaker 2: We got a lot to talk about Okamoto. He's signed,
0:29
Speaker 2: He's not a bucko. That's gonna be the focus of
0:31
Speaker 2: this show in what comes next. But before we get
0:35
Speaker 2: into that, want to remind everyone that this show is
0:38
Speaker 2: sponsored by So Many Angels and we're gonna hear words
0:40
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1:02
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Speaker 2: org to learn more, share the link or find ways
1:07
Speaker 2: to support this incredible Pittsburgh nonprofit that so Many Angels
1:11
Speaker 2: dot org. All right, so as we noted Okamoto signed.
1:16
Speaker 2: I believe it was over the weekend, right, it was?
1:18
Speaker 2: Was it Sunday?
1:19
Speaker 1: Signday?
1:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, Saturday when he signed, all the days blur together,
1:22
Speaker 2: like today is actually the.
1:23
Speaker 1: First day of all.
1:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll be like watching a football game and thinking like, Okay, this.
1:29
Speaker 1: Is Thursday night football. It's like, no, this is Sunday afternoon. Yeah,
1:32
Speaker 1: you know.
1:34
Speaker 2: But yeah, so he signed Saturday with the Toronto Blue
1:36
Speaker 2: Jays four years, sixty million dollars, five million of that
1:40
Speaker 2: on a signing bonus.
1:42
Speaker 1: I'll start here.
1:44
Speaker 2: Was anyone dis or not disappointed? Was anyone surprised by
1:49
Speaker 2: the final destination here? Because it seemed like it was
1:51
Speaker 2: the Pirates, the Angels and the Padres really doing the
1:56
Speaker 2: ball of the bidding here, and then Toronto just kind
1:58
Speaker 2: of swoops in and offers this guy four years of
2:02
Speaker 2: sixty million dollars.
2:03
Speaker 1: It's a pretty good offer for him.
2:05
Speaker 3: Yeah. I wasn't too surprised. Robert Murray had kind of
2:10
Speaker 3: alluded to a few times that there's there was another
2:13
Speaker 3: mystery team kind of lurking out there. And also, I mean,
2:17
Speaker 3: if one of those big teams were to make an offer,
2:20
Speaker 3: maybe he would have just signed earlier, so it makes
2:24
Speaker 3: sense to me. I the Blue Jays are a great
2:27
Speaker 3: fit for him. Yeah, and that's a very reasonable contract
2:32
Speaker 3: for the Toronto Blue Jays. I think he's like the
2:35
Speaker 3: seventh like lowest AAV or seventh highest AAV, so barely
2:41
Speaker 3: a blip on their radar. But yeah, it's uh stinks
2:45
Speaker 3: to see him go.
2:46
Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean I would say a little bit
2:52
Speaker 4: of a surprise scene of go to Toronto seeing him
2:54
Speaker 4: go to Toronto, you know, just from seeing where the
2:59
Speaker 4: traction was with him.
3:00
Speaker 5: I think Toronto was kind of a sleeper team, which
3:04
Speaker 5: in my eyes is not a bad play because.
3:06
Speaker 4: You know, with all the reports out, you know he's
3:08
Speaker 4: got to sign by a certain date, you're already seeing
3:12
Speaker 4: you know, things that he was talking, you know, talking
3:15
Speaker 4: with other teams, so they probably were already getting a
3:17
Speaker 4: feel for what his market was. And then even for him,
3:20
Speaker 4: you know, suppelling they went to the World Series, they were,
3:23
Speaker 4: you know, one game from winning, you know, winning it
3:25
Speaker 4: at all, and you know, sometimes it's it's not about
3:29
Speaker 4: what you can offer us about you know, what's happened lately,
3:33
Speaker 4: and you know, Pirates and other teams very well could
3:36
Speaker 4: have been very aggressive as well. You know, probably could
3:38
Speaker 4: have matched the offer, but you know, they were just
3:41
Speaker 4: in the World Series. The fit of him being able
3:43
Speaker 4: to play with third, but I think the plans for
3:45
Speaker 4: him to play third, right, yeah uh, And not that
3:49
Speaker 4: that might not have been a plan in other places.
3:51
Speaker 4: You know, these are personal choices, and you know, it's
3:54
Speaker 4: just one of those things. Like you said, it stinks
3:56
Speaker 4: to see him go, but you know, for the Pirates,
3:58
Speaker 4: you gotta keep the ball moving and you know, pivot,
4:02
Speaker 4: pivot to you know, the next best move.
4:04
Speaker 3: And I was hoping that maybe like Alex Bregman still
4:07
Speaker 3: being out there would have scared off a team like
4:09
Speaker 3: the Blue Jays. They were heavily connected with him, but
4:12
Speaker 3: it makes sense for them just hey, this guy has
4:14
Speaker 3: to sign now. He's pretty darn good, and let's just
4:17
Speaker 3: pivot to either Tucker or Bishett and go that direction.
4:22
Speaker 1: Yeah.
4:23
Speaker 2: I mean, if you look at it now too, I
4:24
Speaker 2: think this is I still think the Pirates are is
4:27
Speaker 2: probably where he could have had the biggest impact, Like
4:30
Speaker 2: they would have been asking him to do the most right,
4:32
Speaker 2: Like he would have been hitting middle third of the lineup,
4:36
Speaker 2: probably playing the most. He would have got the most
4:40
Speaker 2: leeway right where in Toronto, if he doesn't play well,
4:44
Speaker 2: you could just put Barger back at third. You can
4:46
Speaker 2: put Ernie Clement there, like they have so many others, yeah,
4:50
Speaker 2: that they could put it third. And honestly, he might
4:52
Speaker 2: be someone where if the glove, I know the glove
4:54
Speaker 2: was not an issue for him, but like, if it
4:57
Speaker 2: isn't an issue, they have good defensive players that could
5:00
Speaker 2: put there late in the game. They have so many
5:02
Speaker 2: different options there, and he's gonna be a bottom of
5:04
Speaker 2: the third lineup guy. They'll hit seventh or eighth for
5:08
Speaker 2: them until he gets acclimated, and then if he's anything
5:12
Speaker 2: better than that, yeah, they'll move him up. But it's
5:15
Speaker 2: not like if he if he came into Pittsburgh or
5:18
Speaker 2: if he came into Los Angeles for the Angels, Like,
5:21
Speaker 2: this is a guy that would be probably batting fifth
5:23
Speaker 2: and they would be demanding twenty ish home runs for him.
5:27
Speaker 2: Where he has a little bit of grace now and
5:29
Speaker 2: this four year commitment, this four year commitment really allows
5:33
Speaker 2: him to kind of settle into a higher level of baseball. So,
5:37
Speaker 2: I mean, I totally get why he wanted to do it.
5:40
Speaker 2: I totally think, you know, four years sixty. If you
5:44
Speaker 2: would have told me that was the price tag, I
5:45
Speaker 2: would have thought the pirates got him. But I just like,
5:49
Speaker 2: like you, Mark, I didn't think that Toronto was this interested.
5:52
Speaker 1: But yeah, I get it. It makes a lot of sense.
5:55
Speaker 4: But even on the flip side, Josh, yeah, simple, mine's
6:02
Speaker 4: going to be simple.
6:05
Speaker 5: Oh you want to go yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, all right.
6:07
Speaker 4: What I was gonna say on the flip side, as
6:09
Speaker 4: I said, personal choice, personal preference. Another thing that I
6:12
Speaker 4: just thought about as a player, Maybe the dome uh,
6:18
Speaker 4: weather could also play a factor in him coming over soon,
6:21
Speaker 4: you know what? Yeah, you know what I mean that
6:24
Speaker 4: that population and knowing that, hey.
6:26
Speaker 5: I'm playing in kind of climate control.
6:28
Speaker 4: Even though they can open the roof, it's not like
6:30
Speaker 4: if it's cold outside, they're gonna leave a cold So
6:32
Speaker 4: that's also an adjustment of saying, Okay, if I want
6:35
Speaker 4: to make an adjustment, I want to make sure that
6:36
Speaker 4: I'm probably playing somewhere that I can kind of be
6:39
Speaker 4: comfortable with the weather. So that's something else that just
6:42
Speaker 4: popped in my mind, is like, you know what, that
6:43
Speaker 4: could also be a selling point too.
6:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, yeah, at the end of the day,
6:48
Speaker 2: there's a lot to like about the Toronto that they were.
6:51
Speaker 2: They were one runaway from winning the World Series and
6:54
Speaker 2: they have pretty much everyone coming back.
6:56
Speaker 1: So yeah, there's a lot. Any final thing to add
6:59
Speaker 1: on this.
6:59
Speaker 3: Mark before we Yeah, just the one thing that did
7:02
Speaker 3: surprise me about the contract was that there was no
7:04
Speaker 3: opt outs. Yeah, we saw with the other two Japanese signings,
7:10
Speaker 3: and so I was curious if that was something where
7:13
Speaker 3: Toronto didn't have to offer or opt out where maybe
7:17
Speaker 3: that would have been something that, you know, if he's
7:19
Speaker 3: signing with the Pirates, he would want opt outs. So
7:22
Speaker 3: that kind of shocked me for a four year deal.
7:26
Speaker 3: But again, he seems like the high floor, low ceiling
7:28
Speaker 3: is what the the tagline has been with him, So
7:32
Speaker 3: maybe they're just happy with the consistent av and where
7:35
Speaker 3: they're at. So not a bad place to the land.
7:37
Speaker 2: For four years, No, absolutely, all right, so now he's
7:41
Speaker 2: off the board, the Pirates still need to make moves
7:45
Speaker 2: spring training, I think their report and about a month
7:48
Speaker 2: and a week.
7:49
Speaker 1: So what's next? That becomes the question.
7:53
Speaker 2: All open the floor to either of you guys, and
7:55
Speaker 2: I'll start by asking, this is third base still the
7:58
Speaker 2: area of focus here? Is it as simple as they
8:01
Speaker 2: have to go get Gino Suarez now?
8:03
Speaker 1: Or are you are you looking elsewhere?
8:05
Speaker 2: Are you saying, okay, well, you know what, maybe Marcelo Zuna,
8:09
Speaker 2: you sure up that designated hitter spot and you could
8:12
Speaker 2: stomach not a lot of offensive production from third base
8:16
Speaker 2: and behind the plate. Or are you trying to get
8:19
Speaker 2: upgrades at catcher? You know what's the move here? What's
8:23
Speaker 2: what's the next thing on your wish list? If you're
8:25
Speaker 2: the Pirates, we'll start with Josh.
8:29
Speaker 5: I've seen the reports of being interested in Geno.
8:32
Speaker 4: I don't think it would be a bad fit if
8:33
Speaker 4: you're looking to shore up third base and if that's
8:36
Speaker 4: what we're looking for, because still looking for an impact bat,
8:40
Speaker 4: right handed bat, and Gino would definitely fit that mold.
8:44
Speaker 4: But as you just mentioned, sharing up a d H
8:47
Speaker 4: spot like a Marcelo Zuna does give you the option
8:49
Speaker 4: to know that third base is going to be handled defensively,
8:52
Speaker 4: and anything that is handled offensively necessarily I want to say, by.
8:56
Speaker 5: Committee, any that could be a bonus.
8:59
Speaker 4: You gotta find out what's gonna make sense, because granted,
9:03
Speaker 4: if you're really gonna be that serious, we're going after
9:05
Speaker 4: Okamoto and willing to spend that. What's going to make
9:09
Speaker 4: sense to shure up your team, making it better by
9:11
Speaker 4: allocating that. Is it, you know, via trade or is
9:15
Speaker 4: it signing Marcel and you know, using those other resources
9:19
Speaker 4: to you know, maybe do something with the catcher or
9:21
Speaker 4: vice versa.
9:22
Speaker 5: Who knows.
9:23
Speaker 4: But I think it's one of those things that you
9:26
Speaker 4: just have to weigh your options to know that. Okay, defensively,
9:30
Speaker 4: third base is that something you don't want to lose
9:35
Speaker 4: any defense. But if you're gonna give up a little
9:38
Speaker 4: bit of defense, you better be gaining the whole heck
9:40
Speaker 4: of a lot in the bat, you know what I mean.
9:42
Speaker 4: So that's the trade off. And I don't think Geno's
9:46
Speaker 4: a bad fit. He knows the central but at the
9:48
Speaker 4: same time, if that's not gonna happen, you have to
9:51
Speaker 4: find a bat somewhere else.
9:54
Speaker 1: Mark.
9:54
Speaker 3: Yeah, Pirates are in a pretty awkward spot kind of,
9:58
Speaker 3: I think right now because just the way that this
10:01
Speaker 3: offseason shaping up, not a lot of teams are interested
10:05
Speaker 3: in prospects, and that's really all that the Pirates have
10:09
Speaker 3: to offer right now. I mean, I don't know how
10:11
Speaker 3: much MLB talent the Pirates can trade at this point.
10:15
Speaker 3: To acquire other MOLB talent, But I think so if
10:20
Speaker 3: I still think third base needs to be the priority focus.
10:24
Speaker 3: But you I like Jared Triolla there, but I think
10:27
Speaker 3: he's just brings so much value as a utility player,
10:29
Speaker 3: allowing him to shift elsewhere. Let him do that name, yes, exactly,
10:35
Speaker 3: And the depth right now does not look great on
10:38
Speaker 3: the Pirates bench. So one guy that Ari was brought
10:42
Speaker 3: up today was as In Barger from the Blue Jays.
10:47
Speaker 3: He played third base and right field. Obviously, they just
10:51
Speaker 3: signed Okamoto. They're in on Kyle Tucker. You know, he's
10:55
Speaker 3: already kind of been bumped out of the infield, so
10:59
Speaker 3: why not go after him. He's got some power. I mean,
11:03
Speaker 3: his defense is not great, it's a little below league average,
11:08
Speaker 3: but he has a canon of an arm so he
11:11
Speaker 3: can play right field. He's about like twenty home run
11:15
Speaker 3: power potential kind of guy. He had twenty one homers
11:17
Speaker 3: last year for the Blue Jays, and he's team control.
11:22
Speaker 3: He's cheap, so you still can go out and spend
11:25
Speaker 3: on a Marcello Suna or fill out like your outfield
11:28
Speaker 3: more with like a Mike Takman, a guy I think, Noah,
11:31
Speaker 3: you brought him up earlier this year world who you know,
11:34
Speaker 3: not the sexiest name out there, but a guy who's
11:37
Speaker 3: really underrated would be cheap and is still available in
11:40
Speaker 3: free agency. So with the limited pool of free agents,
11:43
Speaker 3: there's obviously that top tier of the Bashet, the Tuckers,
11:47
Speaker 3: all those guys, the Bregmans. None of those guys are
11:50
Speaker 3: going to be Pittsburgh pirates. And so outside of Juhenno Suarez,
11:54
Speaker 3: which I mean Suarez is projected gig like a three year,
11:58
Speaker 3: sixty million dollars deal out same money. I mean, that's
12:01
Speaker 3: what fangraft says like as is like crowdsourced deal. I
12:04
Speaker 3: don't know how accurate that would be, but I think
12:09
Speaker 3: the market could be pretty robust for him, especially with
12:12
Speaker 3: all the other teams that struck out on No Komodo.
12:14
Speaker 3: I mean, we're going to be right back there, I
12:15
Speaker 3: think with the Angels and Padres. So we'll see. But
12:21
Speaker 3: it's it's an awkward position to be in when you
12:23
Speaker 3: still need to make trades, but there's just not too
12:27
Speaker 3: many trade partners out there that are willing to look
12:30
Speaker 3: at those younger players. Maybe like a White Sox Luis
12:34
Speaker 3: Robert deal could finally happen. No no, it doesn't like it. No, Yeah,
12:41
Speaker 3: I think there.
12:41
Speaker 2: Are actions out there, but yeah, I don't I don't
12:44
Speaker 2: know what exactly they do. But like I'm in a
12:47
Speaker 2: firm believer that their biggest move has to still be
12:51
Speaker 2: on the way. Like if if ohearne or Lao are
12:55
Speaker 2: your biggest move, I mean those are big moves in
12:58
Speaker 2: comparison to the ones that you may over the last
13:01
Speaker 2: five six But yeah, but that's that's not enough to
13:06
Speaker 2: beget your tea.
13:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it made them better, no doubt.
13:10
Speaker 2: But if if they're in my eyes, they really still
13:13
Speaker 2: haven't backed their rhetoric, I think they've better reallocated money
13:19
Speaker 2: that they cleared up, like this was this was a
13:23
Speaker 2: better use of funds than paying David Bednar nine to
13:28
Speaker 2: ten million to be your closer to Brian Hayes, like
13:31
Speaker 2: eight million to your third basement. I think you're better
13:33
Speaker 2: off giving the money to Ryan O'Hearn and Brandon Lao.
13:38
Speaker 2: So like, yes, and I'll give credit, like when you
13:40
Speaker 2: look at what they were able to get for what
13:43
Speaker 2: they were able to give up in these trades, it's
13:45
Speaker 2: gone well, but we haven't seen a significant financial commitment.
13:49
Speaker 1: We just we just haven't, and.
13:53
Speaker 2: That needs to happen, and it doesn't need to happen
13:55
Speaker 2: necessarily through a free agent signing. I mean, if if
13:59
Speaker 2: you want to try to go in and out big
14:02
Speaker 2: teams for Gino Soarez, then do it. I know that
14:05
Speaker 2: the Post Gazette reported that the Pirates are interested in Soarez,
14:09
Speaker 2: but like, I don't.
14:11
Speaker 1: They should be, Yeah, yeah, they should be, Like is
14:14
Speaker 1: he interested in them?
14:17
Speaker 2: So I don't know, And I think that you can
14:22
Speaker 2: make an equally big move through trade. And Mark you
14:26
Speaker 2: mentioned how it seems like some certain teams aren't interested
14:29
Speaker 2: in prospects.
14:30
Speaker 1: I mean, the Rays acquired two of the.
14:32
Speaker 2: Astros top prospects and they also acquired a whole bunch
14:36
Speaker 2: of prospects from the Shanez. Yeah, the Rays are still
14:40
Speaker 2: going to raise and I know the Pirates have already
14:43
Speaker 2: done business with the Rays, but there are other guys
14:46
Speaker 2: out there, and and you know, to me, you know,
14:50
Speaker 2: no one wants prospects until a certain prospects on the table,
14:54
Speaker 2: And this is the time to be bold, this is
14:57
Speaker 2: the time to make.
14:58
Speaker 1: Your big move. And I think that that's that's what
15:01
Speaker 1: needs to happen.
15:02
Speaker 2: And if they really don't have the money, to spend,
15:05
Speaker 2: which if they don't, that's nonsense, because they do.
15:09
Speaker 1: They need to spend more money still.
15:12
Speaker 2: But if they don't, yeah, they said they were going to.
15:17
Speaker 2: And if you're gonna, if you're gonna show up and
15:19
Speaker 2: pound your chest about your payroll being like one hundred
15:21
Speaker 2: and five million dollars, that's still not good enough. It's
15:24
Speaker 2: it's better again, it's better in comparison. It technically went up.
15:28
Speaker 2: But and I'll give credit north Shore nine, our friends
15:31
Speaker 2: over there. I think it was Jim Rozzotti who said it,
15:35
Speaker 2: this year should be the year the Pirates have the
15:37
Speaker 2: highest payroll in franchise history. Why wouldn't it be. It's
15:40
Speaker 2: it's a win now mode. It's your last year of
15:42
Speaker 2: Paul Skiing's pre ORB and you're going into a CBA.
15:46
Speaker 1: It's a good look for your CBA negotiations.
15:49
Speaker 2: And also like you might not have to pay some
15:52
Speaker 2: of these guys next year if there's a lack out.
15:54
Speaker 2: There's just so many reasons as to why this is
15:58
Speaker 2: the year where it should be one hundred and fifteen
16:01
Speaker 2: or one hundred and twenty whatever. The record was, however
16:04
Speaker 2: high it was back when Josh was playing here in
16:07
Speaker 2: twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, those were the highest payrolls they've
16:10
Speaker 2: ever had, and even back then it still wasn't high enough.
16:13
Speaker 1: They've got to get it to at.
16:15
Speaker 2: Least that when your payroll, when you're talking about spending
16:18
Speaker 2: money and you can't match the payroll you were dishing
16:20
Speaker 2: out a decade prior, that's a problem.
16:24
Speaker 1: So it's you got to find a way.
16:26
Speaker 2: And I'm not just saying to go out and spend
16:29
Speaker 2: dumb money here, right, don't just give somebody money just
16:32
Speaker 2: to say you spent it. But when I say like
16:35
Speaker 2: that payroll needs to go up, that comes with the
16:37
Speaker 2: implication that you're adding value because typically good baseball players
16:42
Speaker 2: they make a lot of money. So go acquire one.
16:44
Speaker 2: And if that means trading your prospects, then do it.
16:48
Speaker 2: Traded Edward Florentino. As I've said on this show before,
16:51
Speaker 2: if you look at your roster forty man and the
16:55
Speaker 2: farm system and you see players who are good but
16:59
Speaker 2: will not be to help the team win. While Paul
17:01
Speaker 2: Skeins is still a Pittsburgh pirate, they should absolutely be
17:05
Speaker 2: on the table for a deal.
17:07
Speaker 1: And that's that that needs to be the focus.
17:08
Speaker 2: And I don't know if that addition comes at third base,
17:11
Speaker 2: I don't know if it comes in the outfield designated hitter,
17:15
Speaker 2: and I don't I honestly do not think it matters.
17:17
Speaker 2: Like the guys you acquired, especially O'Hearn, he's so versatile,
17:22
Speaker 2: you can find a spot for him. And and Low, yeah,
17:25
Speaker 2: you'll find a spot for that bad as well, exactly,
17:28
Speaker 2: And for guys like Nick Gonzalez and Jared Triolo and
17:32
Speaker 2: Spencer Horowitz, even in mangum and and Garcia and all
17:37
Speaker 2: these other guys, it's like there will be there will
17:40
Speaker 2: be opportunities for you to play, but they need to
17:44
Speaker 2: get better. If the offseason were to end now and
17:47
Speaker 2: they just made a couple more you know, one year
17:49
Speaker 2: three to five million dollar signings, they are a better team,
17:53
Speaker 2: they have better odds to compete. But you're still entering
17:56
Speaker 2: a season hoping that if everyone can stay healthy and
17:59
Speaker 2: no regresses, you might have a shot of reaching the playoffs.
18:03
Speaker 2: That's not serious. It's not serious contention, Josh. You played
18:09
Speaker 2: on teams that were built that way, and sometimes it works,
18:12
Speaker 2: and sometimes it doesn't, and more frequently the lot of
18:14
Speaker 2: times it doesn't, it does not exactly.
18:17
Speaker 4: The inevitability of injuries. Like, yes, you are literally hoping
18:22
Speaker 4: everything goes right. And that's any team no matter how
18:27
Speaker 4: you're constructed.
18:28
Speaker 5: You know, you want everybody to be healthy. You don't
18:30
Speaker 5: want any injuries.
18:31
Speaker 4: You want everybody to have, you know, the success that
18:34
Speaker 4: they've had in the past. That's like, oh, yeah, this
18:36
Speaker 4: is the player. But truth be told, that's not how
18:38
Speaker 4: it is. Baseball doesn't work that way. But if you're
18:41
Speaker 4: continually operating that way, it's going to hurt you more
18:45
Speaker 4: than it's going to help you. You have to be
18:48
Speaker 4: I don't want to say I mean you got to
18:50
Speaker 4: be aggressive, but like as you put it in terms smart,
18:53
Speaker 4: smartly aggressive. You're not just saying I'm going to spend
18:56
Speaker 4: money just to spend money, but you have to add
18:58
Speaker 4: value smartly. But can't sit here and not add value
19:01
Speaker 4: and think that holding on to something in the minors
19:04
Speaker 4: is going to turn into this big value when no,
19:07
Speaker 4: that there are people.
19:08
Speaker 5: That can help a team win now. And you got
19:11
Speaker 5: a picture in pall skins.
19:12
Speaker 4: Not only that the pieces that you've added, as you said,
19:15
Speaker 4: you should be in win now mode. That doesn't mean
19:17
Speaker 4: you're gonna go empty to pocket and empty the tank
19:20
Speaker 4: but you have to put forth an effort to do
19:23
Speaker 4: something different from what you have in the past.
19:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the clock's ticking.
19:29
Speaker 2: I mean, I think they've avoided the doomsday Pirates first scenario.
19:33
Speaker 2: I will say that, like, yeah, they're not going to
19:35
Speaker 2: get booed off the stage at.
19:37
Speaker 1: This point, but they need more to be reporting at
19:43
Speaker 1: spring training.
19:44
Speaker 2: Then you know, if you have this group plus like
19:47
Speaker 2: a Joan Mancata or you know something, if they just
19:52
Speaker 2: add a couple of replacement level players who are coming
19:55
Speaker 2: off of down years, the same crop of guys that
19:59
Speaker 2: they've and bringing in every year, it's like, do I
20:02
Speaker 2: think that those guys there's a place for them. Absolutely,
20:06
Speaker 2: you need depth, Like I'm not against Joann Mincatta being
20:10
Speaker 2: signed a platoon at third base, But if you do that,
20:13
Speaker 2: then you need to go out and get someone better
20:15
Speaker 2: to play left field or play catcher or be your
20:18
Speaker 2: everyday dag to make up for it. Right there, there
20:22
Speaker 2: needs to be another eight figure addition eight figure of talent.
20:29
Speaker 2: And if it comes through trade, that's great. If it
20:33
Speaker 2: comes through free agency, that's great too, But there's still
20:37
Speaker 2: their biggest.
20:38
Speaker 1: Move still needs to be made in my opinion.
20:41
Speaker 2: Otherwise this was a good offseason for their standards, but
20:45
Speaker 2: their standards haven't been up the snuff for a very
20:48
Speaker 2: long time.
20:49
Speaker 3: I agreed this off season so far like a C minus.
20:52
Speaker 2: I get it higher than that you think. I guess
20:57
Speaker 2: the trades have been good. The trades have been good,
20:59
Speaker 2: and they sign they signed o'hearne. I like the Sodo signing.
21:03
Speaker 2: It's just like for right now, I give it like
21:07
Speaker 2: a B for right now, I give it a bet now.
21:09
Speaker 3: If it's the yeah.
21:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a C minus. But as of right now
21:15
Speaker 2: it's a B now. You still have the final portion
21:18
Speaker 2: of the test. And this next month, this first month
21:21
Speaker 2: of twenty twenty six, is a very big one for
21:23
Speaker 2: the Pittsburgh Pirates because if they do not get it
21:25
Speaker 2: right and they stay put and they don't make another move,
21:30
Speaker 2: I think there it's going to cost them because this
21:33
Speaker 2: team opportunity is good enough to be interesting, I think.
21:37
Speaker 2: But if they don't make any other moves, I think
21:40
Speaker 2: there's a very good chance we're going to get to
21:42
Speaker 2: September and say, man, if they just made one more move,
21:44
Speaker 2: this could have been different, and that would be a shame,
21:47
Speaker 2: because after this year, the finances get a lot more complicated.
21:52
Speaker 4: So you don't want to be that close, and you
21:58
Speaker 4: trust me, it happens fee that close a well.
22:02
Speaker 5: I mean, as I said, it's not our money to
22:04
Speaker 5: sit here.
22:05
Speaker 4: But at the end of the day, you know, as
22:07
Speaker 4: you say, add and value, good baseball players are going
22:09
Speaker 4: to cost a little.
22:10
Speaker 5: Bit more, and if you want to win, you have
22:14
Speaker 5: you have to spend. And as you said, we've got
22:17
Speaker 5: to spend smartly. Don't be afraid.
22:19
Speaker 3: And I do think that the Pirates make no way.
22:22
Speaker 3: You're probably more connected into this than I am. But
22:24
Speaker 3: I feel like the Pirates front office has to feel
22:26
Speaker 3: the pressure too. You know, we talked about this, like
22:29
Speaker 3: Ben Cherrington, if he doesn't make the playoffs this year,
22:32
Speaker 3: is he gonna.
22:33
Speaker 5: Have a job?
22:35
Speaker 2: Yeah?
22:35
Speaker 3: I mean who knows, right, yeah, right, But you have
22:38
Speaker 3: to be thinking that, like in the front office having
22:41
Speaker 3: that like question, like if I don't go all in
22:43
Speaker 3: this year, well I ever get another shot to do that.
22:47
Speaker 2: I'll just say this right now, I don't think anyone
22:50
Speaker 2: can blame Ben Charrington if another move is it made
22:54
Speaker 2: this offseason?
22:55
Speaker 5: True?
22:55
Speaker 2: Because Ben Charrington's made good moves. Yeah, I think I
22:59
Speaker 2: think if they go and just you know, get replacement
23:05
Speaker 2: level players on one year deals. For the remainder of
23:07
Speaker 2: this offseason, we're gonna say we're gonna be able to
23:11
Speaker 2: determine who the.
23:12
Speaker 1: Real problem was all along.
23:13
Speaker 2: And I mean, I think we all kind of knew,
23:15
Speaker 2: but I mean, Charrington has had his flaws, right. The
23:18
Speaker 2: trade returns haven't been good, like there have been failures
23:21
Speaker 2: and development like, they have not got a lot of
23:23
Speaker 2: these things right. But on paper, he's had some really
23:26
Speaker 2: good trade returns and these free agent signings make a
23:29
Speaker 2: lot of sense for what he has to work with, right,
23:32
Speaker 2: Like I believe I reported like the payroll would be
23:35
Speaker 2: around ninety million, it's in ninety five million now.
23:38
Speaker 1: So with the with the reallocated money, with the.
23:41
Speaker 2: Resources that already existed, he has made this team better.
23:45
Speaker 2: But an additional investment was required, and they talked about
23:51
Speaker 2: how they're.
23:51
Speaker 1: Gonna spend money. All they've really done right now is
23:54
Speaker 1: reallocate money.
23:55
Speaker 2: So now it's time to give him more money to
23:59
Speaker 2: work with. I'm not saying you have to double the payroll.
24:03
Speaker 2: You should, but you know that might be a bit aggressive.
24:07
Speaker 2: But if you don't have another twenty million to give
24:09
Speaker 2: this guide to at how bad.
24:12
Speaker 1: Do you really want it?
24:13
Speaker 5: Right?
24:14
Speaker 2: And if you can't afford to give another twenty million,
24:16
Speaker 2: should you really be owning a major League Baseball team?
24:19
Speaker 3: Might be a good time to get rid of that
24:20
Speaker 3: one billion dollar asset or whatever the value.
24:23
Speaker 1: Whatever it is.
24:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Pittsburgh teams they're selling. The Penguin's just sold.
24:28
Speaker 2: Who knows. But hey, like I said, we still have
24:31
Speaker 2: a month to see how it plays out. I don't
24:33
Speaker 2: anticipate any big signings happening once the calendar hits February.
24:37
Speaker 2: That's typically where guys are just like, all right, I
24:39
Speaker 2: need a team before spring training, yep.
24:40
Speaker 1: Mode.
24:41
Speaker 2: So there's still some big dominoes to fall. I'm sure
24:45
Speaker 2: there's gonna be a big trader too, still.
24:47
Speaker 1: Trade market, but the trader.
24:49
Speaker 2: The trade market needs to get going here in these
24:52
Speaker 2: next couple of weeks, because the closer we get to February,
24:55
Speaker 2: I think, the less likely there is to be a
24:58
Speaker 2: trade of significance. So well as any final thoughts before
25:01
Speaker 2: we head out here, n.
25:05
Speaker 5: Uh, just gotta state of course, And.
25:10
Speaker 4: As I said, you still got to find a way
25:11
Speaker 4: to make something happen, and you just got to be
25:14
Speaker 4: vigilant and and sometimes you, you know, like just tell kids,
25:20
Speaker 4: don't take no for an answer, you know, and that
25:21
Speaker 4: doesn't mean you know, no from this person doesn't mean
25:25
Speaker 4: it wasn't won't work somewhere else. And that's not saying
25:28
Speaker 4: if mom says no, go ass dad. We know kids
25:31
Speaker 4: do that. But you know, in this, in this process
25:33
Speaker 4: of trying to make your team better, you know you
25:35
Speaker 4: got people that you align with that you think are
25:37
Speaker 4: gonna make you better. Don't let one person's no keep
25:40
Speaker 4: you from you know, trying these other people, because the
25:43
Speaker 4: right person will find a fit if you're really vigilant
25:45
Speaker 4: of trying to make your team better.
25:49
Speaker 3: And I'll just send on. I'd love to see the
25:52
Speaker 3: Pirates prove some people wrong, like no, it's saying, and
25:54
Speaker 3: go out there and spend that money. It's so close.
25:57
Speaker 3: It feels like one more move being that tantalizingly close
26:02
Speaker 3: of having a really, really good off season. It's exciting,
26:05
Speaker 3: but also you gotta be nervous if you're a Pirates fan,
26:10
Speaker 3: because it feels kind of all too familiar to and
26:14
Speaker 3: seeing how the story played out before. But if there
26:17
Speaker 3: was one year to do it, this has to be
26:19
Speaker 3: the year.
26:20
Speaker 5: So and on that.
26:23
Speaker 2: I want to end by reminding everyone to hit that
26:25
Speaker 2: subscribe button if they haven't already. Our mission to one
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Speaker 2: thousand weeky climbing. We're getting really close. We're over nine
26:32
Speaker 2: hundred now. I believe we're like close to nine p
26:34
Speaker 2: fifty if not over that, so big thanks to everyone
26:38
Speaker 2: who subscribes.
26:39
Speaker 1: And if you don't subscribe, it's not too late. You
26:41
Speaker 1: can do it. Fellas another show in the books. We'll
26:45
Speaker 1: be back on.
26:47
Speaker 2: When of these posts Tuesday and Thursday, So yeah, we'll
26:49
Speaker 2: be back on Thursday. You can check it out on
26:53
Speaker 2: our channel Buco Territory presented by the Foul Territory Network.
26:57
Speaker 1: We'll see you then
27:00
Speaker 5: At the