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The 5 o' Clock Shadow with Schalk Louw · Strictly Business

0:00
You're listening to Strictly Business Podcast with Lindsay Williams.
0:05
The JSC has closed its doors for another day, so it's time for the 5 o'clock
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shadow.
0:09
And as always on a Wednesday, I speak to Skulk Lowe, Portfolio Manager at PSG
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Wealth Old Oak in Cape Town.
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Now, Skulk, I spoke to you off air and asked you to get a wire coat hanger.
0:20
And
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I asked you to insert one end of the wire coat hanger in your right cheek.
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and the other in your left cheek to see if it would fit.
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And I'm betting there was room to spare with the smile on your face.
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I know exactly what you're talking about.
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I mean, that smile is as good as gold.
0:44
Good as gold.
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Isn't it fantastic news?
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I mean, it just doesn't stop.
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I mean, on the one hand, it is fantastic.
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On the other hand, you're beset with worries because it is so fantastic and it
0:56
just doesn't look real to me.
0:58
I mean, I looked at...
1:00
it my screen, it was 42.20 a little while ago.
1:01
Obviously, it's churning around that 4,200 level.
1:05
But these are levels you could never have predicted or hoped for, Skulk.
1:10
No, I mean, I've been verbally positive on the goal pass for many,
1:17
many years.
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So there's no doubt.
1:19
But I mean, this is just crazy.
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I mean, this is now bordering ludicrous.
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I mean, because, you know, we had...
1:26
this conversation exactly a week ago where we sort of had a similar not a coat hanger
1:33
intro but but a very similar intro where we went
1:35
like can you believe it gold just ran through four thousand dollars i mean now
1:40
we're talking about
1:42
four thousand two hundred dollars i mean that's that's five percent another five
1:47
percent in in one week i mean if you look at the
1:49
the levels that we've seen in in the beginning of september beginning
1:51
of september we were trading three three and a thousand per ounce.
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If we take the clock back to the 1st of January, you'll be talking about $2,500
2:03
per ounce.
2:05
I mean, so yeah, you need to be in it to win it.
2:07
And I think I've looked at a graph earlier today where they plot the current movement
2:14
of the gold price.
2:16
And they look at the previous, I think the previous massive spike that we've seen
2:23
somewhere 30, 40 years ago.
2:25
And the one thing is when gold move,
2:29
don't be in too much of a rush to call tops on this one because
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usually when something like this happens, it can go a hell of a lot higher.
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There's two things I would say to you, Skel.
2:44
The first is that a German friend of mine was watching German TV and she phoned me
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up and she said,
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I've just liquidated my savings and I'm putting it into gold.
2:57
Oh no.
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Big ring of a bell, a huge bell.
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And the other thing is, it hasn't happened yet, but if there is any indication from a
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layman's point of view,
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that's me, I'm not an expert like you, when the shares don't match the actual
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rise in the price of gold,
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so let's say gold goes to 4,500, but the shares stay stable or even go down,
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from the level they were when they were 42.50, when the gold was 42.50 or
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something, that would be the time for me to say, no,
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that's it, thank you very much.
3:31
Is that it?
3:33
It's called a non-confirmation, I think.
3:35
Yeah, that's definitely a non-confirmation.
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Excuse all the secretaries now, but they usually say when the secretaries start
3:44
buying equities,
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that's the closest time to we see a crash in the market.
3:49
Vietnam.
3:50
Yeah, it is.
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There was a lot of good reasons why gold should have moved over $2,000 and into the
3:59
$2,000 levels.
4:01
And on that note, do you remember that day I sent you?
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I think it was March 17, 2022.
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I sent you a screenshot of the trading market, live trading market in gold.
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And it was a bid of $9.98 and a half.
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Offer of $19.98 and a half was the bid.
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1999.3 was the offer or something.
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And we got so excited because it was just about to go through 2000.
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And now look at it.
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We're still talking about this blasted thing.
4:31
It's three years ago, Lindsay.
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And I think more important, I can still remember that day as well.
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Because I'm not going to look for it now.
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But I remember I still published a tweet, tongue in the cheek,
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just stating.
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Do you remember when gold was still trading below $2,000?
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Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.
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And now it's just crazy to think.
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I mean, it was a joke that day.
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But I mean, here we're sitting three years ago, and I want to ask you.
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Can you still remember when gold was still trading below $2,000?
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I can remember when gold was trading at $250 an ounce, but that's another story.
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I've got another story for you now, and you probably know it, but it's very
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interesting.
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You're more of an accountant-leaning person than I am.
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How much gold does the U.S.
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have in its reserves?
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Have you any idea?
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Give us a rough figure.
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No, don't give me a rough figure because you're going to be way out.
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I'll tell you it's got 261.5 million ounces.
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I mean you've seen the film
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Goldfinger, the James Bond film where he was trying to knock off Fort Knox which is
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where a lot of the
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gold is kept underground and it's encircled by troops 24 hours a day.
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But the important thing here is that the book entry for gold is from 1973 and it
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hasn't been changed in all
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these decades.
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$42.
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And 22 cents per ounce.
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So if Trump ever finds this out, I mean, he's too stupid to know it.
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But if he works out that gold at 4,000 is very different,
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it's 100 times different to what the gold is valued at, he could probably say, I'm
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going to value it at 4,000.
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Therefore, I'll be the president that made gold go up from, I don't know how many
6:22
billion it is,
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to just about a trillion dollars worth they've got.
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And you go from there.
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But the book entry is obviously important to the Treasury.
6:32
What would happen if they actually valued it at real prices?
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What would it mean for the United States and indeed the world?
6:40
I think there's quite a lot to digest, what you just mentioned.
6:47
But I think one thing that I think is important to note is that the U.S.,
6:53
they haven't increased their gold in...
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Decades.
6:58
Yeah.
6:58
We know the Bank of England.
7:00
They look really bad.
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I think they must be one of the only central banks that's actually reduced
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their gold
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reserves over the past, let's quote, 25 years.
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And man, oh man, can you still remember what levels they actually sold?
7:16
The last couple of tons or the last
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200,000 ounces or so were sold by a Scottish fellow.
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He goes by the name of Gordon Brown.
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He was the Chancellor of the Exchequer at the time and then went on to become Prime
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Minister.
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I think it was $252.20.
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And everyone waited for that last bit.
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They flagged it.
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They said, we're selling all our gold, we've got X amount left.
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And all the traders were licking their lips and rubbing their hands together and
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saying, right, Gordon Brown's out.
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And they just bought it from then on in.
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That was the signal for the turn in the gold price.
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Gordon Brown, bless him.
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Anyway, just to go on, you're still long and are you still bullish?
8:02
Yeah.
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So, I mean, when you look at the United Kingdom, they had just shy of 500 tons.
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So, about 300, let's go, 480 tons back then.
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They're currently sitting with reserves, you know, 310 tons.
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That is shameful.
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That is crazy.
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That is crazy.
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But to your point again, United States is exactly the same.
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When we look at the current reserves for, what's the second?
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Second largest is Russia.
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No, I'm lying.
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There's going to be France.
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But I mean, if you look at something like
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China, they're currently sitting with 2,279 tons gold.
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In 2000...
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China was sitting with 395.
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Look at that.
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They've just been accumulating all the time.
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They're very clever.
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Exactly.
9:00
Russia has probably been drawing down in order to pay for the war in Ukraine.
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That's what I think.
9:04
I know they've been doing that with platinum group metals.
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But anyway, central banks have been buying.
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And normally, in normal geopolitical circumstances,
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unless there's something disastrous going on with an economy, they're normally quite
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strong holders.
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So in other words, if they buy it at 4,000, they're not going to be selling it
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at 4,500.
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They'll hold on.
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But look at the effect that it had, for instance, on the South African market.
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I had an interesting conversation today, and I'll do some name-dropping.
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We had a conversation with Cornelius Ziermann. He's one of the fund managers,
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the fund manager of the Fairtree Global Emerging Market Fund.
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Yeah.
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And.
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We were talking about losing alpha, gaining alpha, and I said, well,
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you guys were pretty overweight in gold.
9:57
But interesting, so two years ago, I said two could be...
10:02
It could be a little bit longer.
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It could be that quarter 2022.
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The weight within the oil share, gold shares.
10:12
Remember, at that stage, Sabania still watered, I mean, not even 10%
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of the profits were made out of gold mining.
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Today, it's just 50%.
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I think 47%, 48% of the profits is made out of gold.
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So we didn't count...
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So, Banya Stillwater has a gold counter back then.
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So, there was only five gold counters.
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So, it's Anglia Gold, Goldfields, Harmony, Durban Rediputi, Pan African Resources.
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They didn't make up 4% of the JSE.
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And now?
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Total weight.
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Today, as we sit here, it's over 16%.
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That's just the gold counters.
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And that's the market capitalization of the stocks?
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That's the market capitalization.
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within the JSE All Show.
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by the JSE All Share in some form of ETF, like, for instance, Satrix, Satrix Alls.
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16% of your holding, of your investment,
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will be invested in five gold mines.
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16%.
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If you, exactly a year ago, if you invested in PGMs,
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now that's the likes of the Volterras, Anglo-American Platinum, Impala Platinum,
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and Northern Platinum.
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That didn't make up, it was just over 2%.
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Today, as we sit here, the total weight of those three counters is now 8%.
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So, if you combine the likes of your
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PGM counters and your gold counters, it's now getting very,
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very close to a quarter of the total JSE.
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That's just precious metals.
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And that's just pretty...
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pretty much coming out of seven counters.
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No, sorry, it's eight counters.
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It's exciting in many ways, isn't it?
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Because it's like the old days.
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But on the other hand, it leaves the market a little bit vulnerable should
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there be a bit of a knockoff.
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Yeah.
12:14
Yeah, no, it's definitely worrying because, I mean,
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the words that I heard the most over today's conversation were that words.
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called concentration risk.
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Suddenly we're sitting with a bit of concentration risk in the JSE as well.
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Here's a very interesting one.
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And we've often had this conversation, Lindsay, where we discuss the different
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indices.
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Back then we talked about what's the difference between the JSE cap SWIX or cap
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all share
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compared to the JSE normal all share.
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And that's just usually...
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That's just that they cap certain companies.
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You don't have a scenario like, for instance, what's it, five years ago, six
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years ago,
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where a NASPAS suddenly makes up more than 20% of your total index.
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And that's why they created this.
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But if you look at the return profile of both these indices,
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you would note that it's really been very, very close, close in terms of
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um performances so in dollar terms if you look at it year to date year to date uh
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the dollar return for for
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the jse is now way over 36 closer to
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40 40 then you get something called the the um you could get something called the
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msci south african index now this is why by the way scalco
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I couldn't manage to carry on a career in financial services.
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It just became too complicated.
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But go on.
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Yeah.
14:00
So you had your, what we call the JSE, or the MSCI
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South Africa.
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Now, whenever you get an interview, a lot of people will be very well known, you
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know,
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on what is the MSCI world or MSCI all country world.
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Here's a little bit of a lesson.
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When somebody says they follow the MSCI world, You know that you've got no,
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no exposure to any emerging markets.
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It's literally, you just invested in developed markets.
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When it's got that all-country world in front of it,
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then it's the developed markets or the MSCI world with emerging markets.
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And that accounts for about, let's call it 15% of the total
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MSCI all-country world is the emerging markets and the remaining 80%.
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85% will be developed markets.
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So then how do you get classified to become part of the MSCI?
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So if that specific company is listed in South
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Africa, because remember, if you invest in the likes of British American tobacco
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company,
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although we got a secondary listing in South Africa, the primary listing is in
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the UK.
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So that company will form part of the MSCR UK, not South Africa.
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Okay, so because of its London listing, that takes precedent over the...
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Johannesburg listing.
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That's it.
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Exactly.
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So if you invest, for instance, in Richemont, Richemont,
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although it's again got its listing in South Africa, its primary listing is in
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Switzerland.
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So that will form part of the MSCI
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Switzerland. So when somebody invests in the MSCI South Africa,
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that will be your pure South African companies.
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That will be your NASPAS.
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because it's still got its primary listing in South Africa.
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That will be your South African banks.
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So just to get and a lot of people will usually say that's more reflective of your
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SA Inc.
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type of stocks, although it's a little bit difficult to say that,
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but that is sort of your SA Inc.
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stocks.
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Do you want to take a guess, year-to-date,
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what the MSCI South Africa is currently what it's done year-to-date?
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in dollar terms.
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Yes, it's $18 in dollar terms.
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Gosh, I don't know.
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Scalp, 27%.
16:36
There's that laugh again.
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There's that coat hanger coming in.
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You should try harder.
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It's currently 65%. Not bad.
16:49
In dollar terms, year to date.
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Dollars terms, crikey.
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But then again, in round terms, it'll be less than that because the round's been
16:57
stronger against the dollar.
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Slightly, slightly.
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Slightly less, but I mean, it just shows you what our pure South African countess
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has done this year.
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And yes, it is.
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Remember, your Impala Platinum has got its main listing in South Africa.
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Your Durban-Rudipur Deep, your Northern Platinum, those all companies.
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This is all hindsight, Scott.
17:18
This is all hindsight.
17:20
This is where you're going to earn your money.
17:21
I was talking to a fund manager yesterday, very, very good fund manager as well.
17:27
A woman who talks her mind and I said, what differentiates your fund from the
17:33
rest?
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Because she outstrips everybody.
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And she said, I'm a good seller.
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And that was the only thing she said about being differentiated from the
17:45
herd, selling properly.
17:49
She said, we're very good buyers, anyone can buy.
17:51
You buy gold because it's doing so well.
17:53
I'm a buyer, You don't get many people saying, gosh, he or she's a good seller.
17:59
That's my lesson of the day.
18:00
So tell us, where is it going?
18:01
When are you selling?
18:04
When am I selling gold?
18:05
Yeah, when are you selling gold?
18:06
Come on now.
18:07
It's not very well being a buyer.
18:09
So currently, I don't want to sound like a typical economist.
18:14
They always say you need to find yourself a one-handed economist.
18:18
Economists always remember, they always say, on the one hand, we see interest
18:24
rates going up.
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It's called political correctness.
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It's called corporate governance.
18:30
But anyway, go on.
18:32
But I mean, if I'm going to be a one-handed portfolio manager,
18:35
I do think that that gold is currently overvalued.
18:38
I do think it's done a little bit too much too quickly.
18:43
Because, I mean, we've seen a massive, massive retracement.
18:47
There's a lot of people that say, well, if we currently look at all the gold
18:53
reserves,
18:55
available in the world and still need to attach some sort of valuation
19:01
of all the money that's been printed and a gold can pretty much go to a hundred
19:08
thousand over a hundred thousand dollars per ounce
19:10
I'm not in that court we've gone beyond that but gold has done a lot
19:14
I'm always worried when the likes of of the Goldman Sachs is like for instance
19:21
last week came out and say well they now increase
19:23
their forecast for gold.
19:25
um you're so brave of them i mean they said it would be 4 000 in the first
19:28
quarter of 2026 it goes to 4
19:30
000 two days later and then they say oh it's going to go here next i'd love to get
19:36
a seven figure figure just to talk to state
19:38
the obvious which is what these people do a lot of the time and i'm of course being
19:43
jealous and generalist generalistic about it
19:45
anyway scout go on sorry goldman sachs So they're calling it $4,009,
19:49
and then I always get a bit worried.
19:51
And it's like you mentioned, if I look at media, if I look at social media, and if I
19:57
look at I get very similar vibes.
19:59
that I actually got a year or so ago when people, when
20:03
Bitcoin just went through the $100,000 mark and people were saying, well, this is
20:09
only the beginning.
20:11
It's now going to go to a million dollars.
20:14
That's where I get a little bit worried.
20:16
But remember, and we've had this conversation, I'm still invested in the
20:23
gold mines.
20:25
And when you've got a mine, like for instance, the likes of a gold fields, gold
20:29
fields,
20:31
they're all in cost.
20:33
That is what it costs them to go down those mines, to mine these gold.
20:36
Dig it out of the ground, in other words.
20:38
Yes, that's all in cost.
20:41
They're mining this for anything between $1,700 and they haven't reached $2,000.
20:47
So let's call it $2,000 per ounce.
20:51
The longer that the gold prices stay at these current levels, these mines are
20:58
printing money.
21:00
They've got 120% margins.
21:01
It's extraordinary what's going on.
21:04
So suddenly the gold mines, that's usually been something you trade, not invest in,
21:09
is suddenly a great company to be invested in because they extremely, well, the cash
21:15
flow positive,
21:17
they don't have any debt on their balance sheets.
21:19
Yes, as long as the gold price stay at these levels, I'm happy.
21:24
I'm happy to hold my investment in gold because gold, they're actually still doing
21:31
really,
21:33
really well.
21:35
Well, I hope you're just ready for something that happens in the future,
21:37
which will happen, of course.
21:39
It is going to happen.
21:41
It never goes up in a straight line.
21:42
Nothing as parabolic as this anyway.
21:44
So just be ready.
21:46
I know you always are.
21:47
And you'll be the first or second one to press the sell button as soon as that gold
21:53
price tips over,
21:55
which it will one day.
21:57
Not yet, though.
21:59
OK, Scott, we've talked about the exciting stuff.
22:01
Let's get the boring stuff out the way now.
22:03
Karoo's numbers came out from the JSC today.
22:05
Share price down around about 10%.
22:07
There was some sort of corporate activity at AECI,
22:10
and that share price down 8.5%.
22:12
Do you want to talk about either of those briefly?
22:15
AECI, where we can chat about Kuru, I always struggle because that's not the way
22:21
you spell the Kuru.
22:23
Exactly, it's got five O's, hasn't it?
22:24
I struggle to read any trading statements or financial statements when they spell
22:31
Kuru
22:31
with five O's.
22:33
I agree, so they can go and stop being stupid and spell it properly and then
22:39
we'll have a look at it.
22:41
AECI now, bang bang.
22:43
Now all the listeners will remember Karu is the one with the five O's. Yeah, ACI,
22:48
the CEO now resigned.
22:51
He stepped down as CEO.
22:53
He's been CEO for, and he stated that it's for personal and family reasons.
23:00
And people know this is a company that I do like.
23:03
But this is one of those that's just been such a frustration for me
23:10
because Although it's definitely a value stock,
23:14
it's a company that's been well managed over the years.
23:19
And it's a company that's looking financially healthy.
23:22
They've been selling off some of these offshore companies that they had.
23:27
So the company is looking, I would say, financially very, very sound.
23:32
But when a CEO surprised the market by stepping down or noting
23:39
that he's going to step down, And people usually ask the questions, why?
23:42
Why?
23:43
Personal reasons.
23:44
Why not?
23:45
Sometimes you feel like stepping down, don't you?
23:47
And going and sitting with a cool something in your hand and looking out and
23:52
saying, goodness me,
23:54
I'll miss gold.
23:54
But, God, goodness me, it's served me well.
23:57
You'd like to do that, surely, one day.
24:00
Correct.
24:01
And it's been in that position or on the leadership position for over 18 years.
24:07
So, I mean, it's… Somewhere along the line, you just know it is time.
24:13
But the market did not like that at all.
24:17
And the share price, that was down 8.8% today on the news.
24:22
Okay.
24:22
I know it's time to get on with the markets because we've been… jabbering on
24:26
for far too long.
24:28
Dollar-Rand is 1732, a little bit of risk off, got the Rand a little bit weaker.
24:33
The dollar though is 0.4% down against the Rand, so overnight the Rand was weaker
24:39
than it is.
24:41
British Pound against the Rand 2320, Euro-Rand back above 20, 2015.
24:45
Euro-Dollar is 116.35, that's a Euro that's about a quarter of a percent higher
24:52
against the greenback and
24:54
British pound against US dollar.
24:56
is 133.95 over to gold 4200 on the noggin it's 59 up or
25:00
1.4 platinum up 22 to 16.99 16.99 is
25:06
1700 a big number i'll look on my graph later on the palladium price is
25:12
not slipping but slipping relative to platinum it's only up ten dollars an ounce
25:19
to 15.99 dollars per ounce
25:21
okay let's move to other commodities now the oil price is all over the place in the
25:25
last couple of months.
25:27
And I think it was on Monday, it was on Friday, it was down about 5%.
25:31
Today, it's down 0.4%.
25:33
That's Brent crude $62.02 a barrel.
25:36
West Texas crude $58.42, which is down 0.3%.
25:40
And the copper price has, it got very, very close to a year high the other day,
25:47
a real high anyway, because it had a couple of spikes, which were to be taken
25:53
off the graph But anyway, it's
25:55
$4.97 a pound at the moment, was $5.20 a pound a couple of days ago.
25:59
That's commodities.
26:01
S&P 500.
26:03
After some good bank results, 67.42, up 0.8%.
26:09
The U.S.
26:11
10-year bond price, 4.01%, just about to break its big figure from 4 to 3.
26:17
The South African 10-year bond.
26:19
is maybe going to go from 9 to 8.
26:22
It's 9.04 at the moment.
26:25
Really good performances in bonds.
26:27
You could have bought gold.
26:28
You could have bought bonds.
26:30
You could have bought Bitcoin.
26:32
I mean, you could have bought the stock market.
26:34
Four things all going up together.
26:36
I've never seen that skulk.
26:38
Bitcoin, $111,180 per coin.
26:43
That's down 1.5%, underperforming.
26:46
I'm exhausted after all that.
26:48
Do you hear what I just said, Scalp?
26:51
Four asset classes that don't always go in the same direction, going in the same
26:56
direction.
26:58
Bonds, stocks, gold, and let's leave out Bitcoin because it wasn't there during the
27:02
good old days.
27:04
Three in a row.
27:06
That's ridiculous.
27:08
There we go.
27:10
You could have written all those asset classes on a piece of paper, put it in a
27:12
dartboard, throw the dart,
27:14
and you would have made money.
27:16
It doesn't matter which and where it landed.
27:18
Yeah, there's definitely some optimism today from a US point of view.
27:20
I mean, you and I have been talking about it Friday.
27:23
It was just as if all hell broke loose.
27:26
I mean, Trump went like, I'm going to be really tough on China.
27:33
I'm going to increase their tariffs and it's going to be beautiful.
27:38
I love it when he says, I don't want to hurt China.
27:41
I want China to do well.
27:43
I've got a great relationship with President Xi.
27:46
And then he says, by the way, 100% on everything.
27:50
He's such a nitwit, that man.
27:55
And then I think 24 hours, because then Friday, all hell broke loose.
28:00
We had markets and I was sort of going like, yes, at last,
28:04
because I have some cash that I need to deploy.
28:07
And it's just tough to deploy it in a market environment that's just, as you
28:12
mentioned, where everything just goes up.
28:14
There's no specific asset class that's standing out as a, oh, this is a great
28:18
opportunity.
28:20
And markets retraced.
28:21
And 24 hours later, he tweeted.
28:24
He didn't even come out with some statement.
28:27
He tweeted.
28:28
He says, no, don't worry.
28:29
China will be OK.
28:31
China will be fine.
28:32
The taco's back.
28:34
People forgot about the taco factor.
28:37
Trump always chickens out, in other words.
28:40
But he's checking it out again, but this time it only took him 12 hours to check it
28:43
out.
28:44
Literally 12 hours.
28:45
And how the markets reacted.
28:48
So the model, the story again, reiterated to me,
28:52
was currently the political decision, specifically in the U.S.,
28:59
is now being dictated by market movements.
29:02
I'm 100%.
29:04
Because we've seen it.
29:05
We've seen it in April, Liberation Day speech.
29:09
We've done that and it was just like it was tough.
29:13
Man, are we going to take you to town on tariffs?
29:17
And then markets.
29:19
got very, very close to really correcting.
29:21
I think it did in some senses.
29:24
S&P was down 17%, I think, in three days.
29:27
There we go.
29:28
So there was a proper, proper, proper correction.
29:30
And then he backed down.
29:32
So clearly markets are dictating the political decisions.
29:37
But I think today it's more, I think, the Powell show.
29:41
I mean, Powell did come out.
29:43
And it's funny how the market actually took what he said as What has he said,
29:49
please?
29:50
Tell us what he said.
29:52
He actually came out and he said that there's no real indication that things
30:00
are changing in terms of the US economy.
30:04
But he just said, but cautioned that a notably softer labor market is emerging.
30:11
And we've seen it in some of these.
30:13
these data releases recently.
30:15
Yeah, we haven't got the data anymore because the government's shut down.
30:18
But as soon as the government comes out, we might get the non-farm payrolls and we
30:24
might get the ADP numbers as well.
30:26
And we also might be able to go to Yosemite National Park to have a look at
30:32
the animals.
30:34
Everything's closed down in America.
30:36
No, exactly.
30:38
It's still government shutdown.
30:40
But I mean, what I want to get to is The market took his...
30:41
let's call it his caution towards a notably softer labor market
30:49
as dovish.
30:50
And the CME FedWatch tool suddenly went from, ah, it was positive.
30:57
But now, as we said here, 97%
31:00
probability that we'll see a rate cut again on the 10th of December.
31:05
Okay.
31:05
So there we go.
31:07
Don't be best against that one.
31:09
It's the second one after that.
31:11
that is the important one.
31:13
What have we got?
31:14
September and December.
31:14
But anyway, Skulk, I'm getting thirsty.
31:17
So let's get on to the moves up and down on the JSC.
31:21
MTN, the big winner today, up 8%.
31:24
Rishwan up 5.5%.
31:25
Harmony, 4.5%.
31:27
Advertech, a 3.6% gainer.
31:29
And Capitech up 3.2%.
31:31
Downside, ACI is not on my screen, but I'm going to say 8.8% down for that one.
31:37
Karoo, though.
31:38
Down 9.8%.
31:39
That was a nervous laugh, by the way.
31:41
Carew with Five O's shareholders.
31:44
Growth Point down nearly 6%.
31:46
AVI down 4.5%.
31:48
Fortress B down 4.4%.
31:49
And Nepi Rock Castle down 2.3%.
31:52
Property stocks in there, Skunk.
31:53
Any ex-divs you should tell me about?
31:56
Yeah, yeah.
31:57
Fortress and Growth Point, both ex-divs stories for today.
32:01
Okay, good.
32:02
Because that would have sort of soured your gold euphoria.
32:07
A little bit.
32:08
Any other stocks that you've got that I didn't mention?
32:11
No, I think you've mentioned all.
32:13
We talked about the winners.
32:15
We talked about the losers.
32:16
Good.
32:17
So give us the closing JSC indices, if you would.
32:20
So the JSC today closed at 111,635 points.
32:27
I mean, it takes me longer to read the market.
32:31
I think they should have a 10 for 1 split or something like that.
32:34
And that's up 69 basis points for today.
32:38
Most of the gainers came from the industrial side.
32:40
That was up 1.2%, while resources were up again
32:44
0.63%. Financials were slightly in the green, 0.2%.
32:48
But as mentioned, the property stocks did retrace a little bit today, down 2.1%. We
32:55
look at the value trade,
32:57
not a bad day at all.
32:58
We've surpassed $30 billion today.
33:00
$32 billion traded on the JSC today.
33:03
I mean, it's been solid, Lindsay.
33:04
I mean, you know, often...
33:06
had these conversations on the value traded on the market.
33:09
I mean, this is now the second time this week alone where we've surpassed the $32
33:15
billion trade.
33:17
And I think most of, when I look back, past, let's go to five trading days,
33:22
the average for the past five trading days was just shy of $29 billion.
33:26
Okay, just finally, because we're running over time, JSE Limited, what's it done?
33:33
today and what has it done over the last month or so, if you would?
33:38
Because these numbers you're talking about, 32 billion,
33:41
must be filtering through to the numbers for the JSE itself.
33:46
Yeah, that's a really interesting question that you're having there because, I mean,
33:53
we know that Dr.
33:53
Leila Farid,
33:55
she's now announced that she's going to step down as the CEO of the JSE.
34:01
And.
34:02
And immediately I went and said, well,
34:05
she started at Tenor as a CEO on the 1st of October
34:11
2019.
34:13
And over that period, just for interest sake,
34:16
the JSE All Share has improved or has grown.
34:22
By 153%.
34:26
So, yeah, that will be good.
34:27
She can't take credit for that.
34:29
But where's the JSE limited?
34:30
That's the one.
34:32
JSE, however, over that same period has only grown 57%.
34:37
So it's an 8% growth per annum versus the JSE's growth by 17%.
34:43
And we know why.
34:44
We know that we've only seen volumes pick up.
34:50
over the past few months.
34:52
And yeah, hopefully that will turn.
34:54
I do think that there might be some opportunity.
34:56
That might be something to look at, definitely.
34:58
Okay, great.
34:59
We'll keep an eye on that for the remainder of this quarter.
35:03
Meanwhile, Skulk, we'll reconvene this time next week.
35:07
And where will the gold price be?
35:09
Should we have a guess?
35:10
No, no, no.
35:10
Let's not spoil it.
35:11
Let's not get into that guessing game and who got it right, who got it wrong.
35:14
Because we're both going to get it wrong.
35:16
We know that.
35:16
Skulk, thank you very much for your time.
35:18
When we were young, I just want to say, when we were young, we're getting old,
35:21
Lindsay.
35:22
When we were young,
35:23
there would have been a black label bet on this every day of
35:30
the week, for sure.
35:31
Now we're getting old.
35:32
Now we don't want to even guess.
35:35
Do you know what?
35:37
I don't need to guess what the alcohol, the ABV of a black label is.
35:41
It's 5.5%.
35:43
And it's delicious as well.
35:45
And it's relatively cheap.
35:46
And it's the beer of the people in South Africa.
35:48
And that was my beer of choice, of course.
35:50
You know what my beer of choice is now?
35:52
Well, you wouldn't know.
35:53
It's called Warsteiner.
35:54
It's a fine beer, but it's a non-alcoholic beer.
35:58
But I've sort of beat the system, because if you look at the back, it says less than
36:05
0.5%.
36:07
So I've worked out if I drink 632 of them, I can get pissed, which is great.
36:10
LAUGHTER
36:14
I found a loophole.
36:17
Skullclaw is a portfolio manager at PSG Wealth Old Oak in Cape Town, and that was
36:23
the five o'clock shadow.
36:25
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36:31
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36:33
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