Latest / Full Credit to the Noise / NEWS: How TRC talks will shape Supercars’ future
Transcript
- Speedcafe Team: Hello and welcome to Full Credit to the News, brought to you by Authentic Collectibles. I'm Andrew Van Loon and I'm joined by Speed Cafe's managing editor, Stefan Bartholomew. Stefan, how's your week been, mate? It's been good, although I haven't heard from you too much, which always means you've got a car race coming up. Are you all set to jet in the formula forward this weekend? Yeah, I'm having to jump in ⁓ tomorrow on Saturday for a skid. I ⁓ I would like to say that ⁓ I've spent the week ⁓ diligently preparing. ⁓ probably should be up the track right now having a run, but I'm not. I'm talking to you instead. So going in a little bit underdone and to be honest, still a little exhausted from our ⁓ far north Queensland adventures just last weekend. But anyway, we'll ⁓ we'll see how we go. ⁓ You've you've got the race car driver's excuse book out straight away, so I think you'll be just fine. They're quite legitimate this time. But anyway, whatever. I don't think ⁓ I don't think it's gonna make a great difference to my ⁓ to my career either way, however it goes. ⁓ tomorrow up at Wannoroo. But ⁓ let's kick things off with the biggest story of the week, and that is the teams racing charter negotiations between Supercars and the TRC holders, which of course is the teams. ⁓ now the basis of these negotiations is the funding for additional events beyond the 12 required by the TRC and the broadcast deal. As it stands, the payments to teams for additional events stipulated stipulated by the TRC is. simply too expensive for supercars and we've seen one-off bargaining effectively to get to the current number of fourteen events that we have. The hope is that a more permanent solution can be put in place that is fair to both the series and the teams to initially hold the calendar at 14 rounds and then expand beyond that as early as 2028. ⁓ the negotiations properly kicked off in Townsville, Barclay Nettelfold addressed a four person four person team owners committee Consisting of Brett Rauf, Ryan Walkenshaw, Brad Jones, and Matt Stone last Thursday. And those four then fronted a meeting for representatives from all teams on Friday. Stefan, let's actually start with why this four man committee exists and why it's those four people on it. Well, it ⁓ actually came about last year when ⁓ these negotiations were going on just for how it was going to look in twenty twenty six, and it's just a natural ⁓ case of Supercars not wanting to have to negotiate with a room full of team owners and it really streamlines the process if you've got just some representatives. So they've ⁓ ended up with two guys in Brett Ralph and Ryan Walkenshaw who sort of operate large business empires of which the supercar's teams are are a small part. ⁓ and obviously in Brett's case he has a lot of interest in in different sports, including rugby league and baseball and and things like this. So He's got quite a knowledge of revenue streams and and how the competitors are looked after in in different codes, which has been a talking point of this whole discussion. And then you've got the Brad Jones and Matt Stone, who are guys who rely on their race teams to actually be sustainable in order to ⁓ survive. So ⁓ they've they've tried to curate this ⁓ group of people with ⁓ with differing views ⁓ in order to represent everybody in the in the paddock. Now, from what we can tell, Stefan, there wasn't actually a lot of detail presented to the wider team owner group on Friday. We don't know exactly what was presented to that four man committee on the Thursday in the first place, but there certainly wasn't a lot of detail around what will be on offer to the teams ⁓ kicking about after that Friday meeting. So I guess it kind of feels like we're still a fair way off knowing how this is all going to play out. This was definitely one of the curious elements of that. Townsville weekend because the team owners did seemingly go into that meeting on the Friday evening expecting to be told a lot more than they were. So there were some mixed reactions out of that. We don't really know why. I don't know whether it was a requirement from Barclay that that information that he'd shared with the four stayed in that room. ⁓ but of course, these meetings they weren't the start of this whole topic. It does go back ⁓ even James Warburton presented race's financial figures to ⁓ to that team owner group in just before New Zealand. And I think James was meant to go back to the group with with a presentation in the week that he actually left the building there. So it was a bit of a point of contention between Warburton and Barclay about how much was to be shared and what the plan was. So ⁓ yeah, this was then months later. Barclay has finally gone back to them with a plan, even though we don't know exactly what it is on the financial side. Leeds I I think we we need to touch on the fact that these are critical negotiations, right? Because if an agreement can't be met, then the reality is that we go back to twelve rounds next year and potentially for the foreseeable future, which would be a huge blow for the sport itself and the teams. Like this is really important. Yeah, the TRC as it's written at the moment is just a massive handbrake on the sport. The supercars is twelve rounds for the rest of its life, unless they can get a deal done here and really compromise on it. Because the calculation of what race has to pay each of these TRC holders resets every five years. So this is the end of the the first five year block, which is why this negotiation is far bigger than it was. last year and we expect the base payment will go up a bit because it's based on basically the media rights revenue. So that was locked in at 650 as the base for the first five years. And again we don't know the exact numbers but it's been suggested it might go up to say 750 per car, which is okay. But it's those extra round payments that's the key. And the TRC in there it states that That payment has to be the greater of either 9.2% of the base or a revenue growth share. And again, 9.2%, even if it's 750, 70k, that's not a drama, but it's that revenue growth share that kicks in and apparently kicks the payment up to about 200 grand per TRC per extra event. So you'd end up with race paying 750 for 12 rounds and another 400 for two more. So obviously no board would sign that off. They wouldn't be paying out more than a hundred percent of the revenues to do these extra rounds. So yeah, again, that the teams feel like they have the power here because the TRC is written in that way and race has got to put something to them that ⁓ incentivizes them to make a compromise. You would hope that just the sheer common sense of of, you know, growth across the sport will will be of some assistance in in getting this across the line. And we have seen some movement, you know, from the team side in terms of the fact that we are we do have 14 rounds this year. So ⁓ we have seen the the those kind of shorter term negotiations come off. ⁓ and teams do it this is always one of those funny things because both sides fully agree that we need to be racing more. That, you know, we're probably at our minimum that we should be doing now and we should be looking to grow beyond that. It's not there's not a fundamental Misunderstanding about that, it's just about where the money comes from. And you know, is it up to the teams to go and sell themselves in the commercial market better and say, well, we're racing more, so this is what it now costs to sponsor one of our cars? Or is it up to supercars to stump up whatever the TRC ⁓ says it should, as you've pointed out, that's pretty much impossible. So there just needs to be a bit of a middle ground. found here and hopefully common sense is going to be a a a key a key part of all this. Yeah, exactly. So race's pitch to the teams is that we need money to be able to invest in the sport and grow the whole thing. And therefore the capital value of each TRC, basically the value of the teams grow over time. But again, the teams would have to give up something to to get something in that case. Let's be optimistic and ⁓ and hope a solution is found. ⁓ and if it is, how do you see the calendar actually playing out over the next couple of seasons? Well, what we do know is that ⁓ Barclay's plan is for fourteen rounds next year and then for fifteen in twenty twenty eight. The TRC does actually cap it at fifteen as well. It's a minimum of twelve and a maximum of fifteen as it's written at the moment. So we've got fourteen rounds now. But ⁓ if they do get the deal done for extra events, it does sound like Philip Island would come in and replace most likely Queensland Raceway. And then in twenty eight, obviously you've got that Perth street round is meant to come in. ⁓ but I would say whether that directly replaces Wanneroo, whether they get the New South Wales street race up, whether Ipswich is in the mix for a return, it sort of would depend on ⁓ which government is willing to pay the most to to have the 15th round. Very interesting. Let's move on to premier racing. And what is currently one of the major silly season talking points, and that is the future of Declan Fraser at that team. Stefan, three 21st place finishes in Townsville at a time when his teammate Jaden O'Jader is really starting to hit his straps and look like a regular top ten contender. It's no longer really a surprise to see Juice qualify for a for a shootout and that sort of stuff. We know that Decker has enjoyed great support from Roland Dane. Roland was key to giving him this second chance in supercars. There's obviously some history there from Triple Eight when when Declan was involved in the Super Two program and the wildcard program. But based on Roland's comments coming out of Townsville, like he didn't hold back, you know, like it's very clear that Declan is under pressure to to keep to keep his seat, whether it's through to the end of this season or into next season. Well, I'm not sure if Roland was holding back or not. It depends Probably what the truth inside those four walls actually is, because there was a lot of talk going into Townsville, and there has been a little bit for a while about ⁓ Declan maybe even being replaced mid-season, which Rowland was pretty strong on the fact is not the plan, and that they ⁓ want to at least see out the season. ⁓ he did admit that they're looking at their options for next year, but ⁓ Yeah, in the meantime, obviously it was a particularly tough Townsville for Declan. He had steering issues slash steering feel complaints through the weekend. They changed a rack and it didn't seem to fix anything. Struggled in quality and he really struggled with the tire management in the longer races too. So they did that test day on Wednesday out at QR, which was a rookie day that was pre-planned for some time. So that wasn't a reaction to what happened on the weekend. But ⁓ it at least gave them a chance to go and try to figure out what had what had gone wrong on the weekend. Yeah, I mean for for Declan's part, obviously he has done that test. He was he actually ⁓ he came to Western Australia ⁓ the weekend before no after Darwin ⁓ to race a radical at Wanneroo just to try and get some some laps there, you know, ahead of the supercars round ⁓ that's ⁓ that's coming up in a in a couple of weeks. So he is clearly doing what he can to try and turn this around. But yeah, I mean you you sort of I don't know, you look at like a Ryland Gray, for example, who's also having, you know, a tough rookie season, but there's those little green shoots of promise, you know, whether it's putting it in the shootout in towns or whatever. You just need to see those kind of those those something to give you optimism that, you know, the the underlying speed is there. And I guess ⁓ I mean 11th in qualifying in Townsville for for Declan, a career best, that was that was something, but ⁓ on the Friday that was. But you know, i I guess he just needs over the next half of the season to just to have those little flashpoints that signal that the underlying speed is there. I guess in terms of how it plays out from here, I mean if the current trend in results does continue, you you have to think that the team will look at other options. But we're also in one of those years where a lot of talent is actually tied up contractually. The market isn't necessarily flooded with front running drivers that are looking for a seat somewhere. So I guess, you know, if he can turn things around enough in the second half of the season, perhaps it will just be the market that gives him a glimmer of hope of of having a another crack and a a third season in supercars and a second with premiere. Well, yeah, I'm sure the best outcome for both parties is if the results improve and they can go on together. Obviously there'll be a point of comparison there with Nash Morris co-driving that car in the endurows, which aren't very far away. But certainly what happens with that second premier seat for next year is going to be really interesting as Roland Dane builds this team up and and ⁓ yeah, what he wants to do with it. I I feel like with Jaden O'Jada, if you flick it back to Roland's triple eight time, like Roland's sort of already got his his Jamie Wink up there. Yeah. ⁓ that he's building. But ⁓ yeah, does he need an established driver alongside or or will they, if they do look to move on Decker, would they try to go with another young gun? Hmm. Interesting. All right, now for some news from Authentic Collectibles. One of the most anticipated supercars model releases of the year has arrived with Authentic Collectibles unveiling the 118th scale replica of the 2025 Repco Bathers 1000 winning. Penwright Racing number 100 Ford Mustang, driven by Matt Payne and Gar Tanda. Celebrating an unforgettable victory at Mount Panorama, this highly detailed die-cast model with opening parts recreates the Mustang that charged from 18th on the grid to secure one of Bathurst's most memorable wins, delivering Payne his maiden Great Race victory, and Tanda a sixth Bathurst crown. This model is limited edition of 2,700 pieces and is available via the Authentic Collectibles website or run over to your nearest stockist and buy one. Authentic Collectibles driven by passion. Made for collectors. Now speaking of testing this week, Stefan, team 18 was in action at QR as well doing some fuel economy work for supercars, which comes off the back of a Townsville weekend where fuel saving and the fuel churns were ⁓ were quite the talking point. What's your take on this whole fuel economy slash fuel save racing kind of thing? Well, I guess there's a couple of ⁓ different things going on. One is the the parity discussion. And the reason that they've been doing some tweaking of the map on the GM engine and went out and did that test day was because supercars now has the has the data. They've been putting ⁓ new fuel flow meters in in the cars and and making teams report on the exact weight of fuel going in. So they they realize that the GM is at a slight disadvantage there and they've been trying to tweak it to to help it out. The reasons why that's happened. is not entirely clear. Obviously there's a different fuel blend this year and a pushrod engine could react differently to that than than the quadcams. But ⁓ there had also been some suggestions that the GMs were behind here ⁓ going back to last year. So whether this has just been the result of of the Ford ha having more of a focus on it and and more mapping changes across the across the journey that meant the the Chevy fell behind a bit. We're not sure, but the the overall fuel racing topic that is also quite an interesting one. And I find it amusing that there's calls for ⁓ the the fuel drop to come back in based on the fact that teams decide not to put enough fuel in the cars. Yeah. And make the drivers save fuel. So you've got to actually regulate how much fuel they have to put in them. Like it everything is just so over regulated and controlled. It feels fun actually that this is a variable and some teams are forcing the drivers to save so that they gain or maintain track position in the pits and others can fill her up and and make the driver go for it. I think it's great. Yeah, look, I'm not entirely sold on it. I hate the idea of, you know, particularly i if it becomes a bit more widespread. I think we did talk about it ⁓ in I think the Sunday daily pod from the Townsville five hundred after Cam Waters had pretty much ⁓ unloaded on the whole scenario and said it was a shit way to go racing. ⁓ I kind of do agree with that to some extent if everyone's kind of doing it and it's not a sort of one off ploy. I guess the the biggest issue that we have in in supercars or, you know, with Australian circuits is like the pit lane speed limit. It it like it does you can have all as many strategic options as you like, but you kind of don't as well because, you know, like it just takes so long to execute a stop. And it's the same, you know, it's something that, you know, we've spoken to to to To Kev Fitzsimmons from Dunlop about this before. Like it's, you know, if you had if you went to an F1 style eighty kilometer an hour speed limit, suddenly teens might think, okay, well, it's, you know, faster to execute a stop. We might have an option of doing an additional stop or whatever. But yeah, I I don't know. It's a ⁓ I I I think what we spoke about on Sunday was that it's not a problem yet. Obviously, Cam Waters was very outspoken about it because that team did decide to really shortfill that car for the run home. probably miscalculated a little bit and gave him a little bit too much to do. But I do get a little bit concerned at the thought of, you know, like the that becoming an a significant kind of part of a the last stint of a race. Yeah, I mean this when you look at Townsville, this discussion is about whether you spend a second or two extra in the lane, ⁓ in order to be able to go flat out ⁓ on the track. Like it's sort of the pit lane speed limit discussion about whether you do two stops or three. We're not even sort of in that area. But no, no, but what I mean is that like that is the that's always going to be the limiting factor if we try and just go open slather on on strategy. But I also totally agree with what you're saying is that, you know, you and I spent ages pondering why we still had a fuel drop when we didn't have the the differences in economy like there was back in the the Car of the Future days. ⁓ but it's your classic case of unintended consequences of getting rid of something. It seems like a really obvious thing to do, but it has kind of created this other sort of thing. But yeah, I I also I also agree with what you're saying is that, you know, we need as little regulation as possible. So it's kind of it feels it feels it would feel like a backward step to go to go back to a fuel drop. So I guess what I'm saying is I have no idea what the answer actually is. Well, yeah, I I just felt this was a classic example of blaming supercars for everything because Tickford actually admitted they made a mistake. They miscalculated, put less fuel in there than they intended to, and Cam Waters said that's a shit way to go racing. Well, yeah, I guess I guess it is. Yeah. Right? That's true. But it is fun as well that ⁓ is a shit way to go racing, you're right. These ⁓ some of these teams are just doing fuel to tires. So no matter what ⁓ amount of time the tire stop takes, you you send it as soon as that's done. And that's something that like team eighteen at back at Rapuna, they ⁓ they caught themselves out by doing that because the guys doing the tire change did the quickest stop they've ever done in their lives and they ended up massively underfilling it. ⁓ so that's ⁓ again it's just like the the balancing act of going racing when when you've got a control car and and so much is the same. It just highlights these small variables that we have left. Yeah. No, no, I do I think I do agree with you. I think and and again, like we did discuss, it's kind of it's probably been a bit I don't just it felt like a talking point in Townsville even before Cam Waters kind of really blew it up with his comments in the Sunday press conference. But ⁓ it's obviously been something that's sort of been bubbling below the surface a a bit and it'll be interesting to see kind of ⁓ kind of where it goes from here. But yeah, you're right, I shouldn't be campaigning for more regulation in the sport. We have Far too much of it already. ⁓ let's finish up with a look ahead to the Belgian Grand Prix this weekend. Stefan, track action is just a few hours away as we are recording on Friday afternoon. Now Spa is one of the world's great circuits, but it's hard not to be a little concerned about how energy hungry it might be and whether we're actually gonna get the spectacle that Spa or F one cars on Spa deserves. Well, it's hard to know what the spectacles gonna be because it is this like big track that ⁓ you think the cars will be quite energy starved on. So again, the yo-yo racing like we've seen at places like Silverston ⁓ at the last round. But then there were some interesting comments from George Russell ⁓ on the Thursday during his media session where he was sort of explaining that because there's only two key areas to actually deploy the gear energy at spa rather than four like there was at Silverston. you won't have that much variability in ⁓ in where people are deploying and therefore not as much yo-yo racing going on. So ⁓ yeah, we'll ⁓ have to actually wait and see how how it looks. Yep. It's ⁓ well, yeah, it's interesting, if nothing else, to see ⁓ to see how these things play out. Hopefully, you know, I just want to see I just want to see F1 cars going flat out on this spectacular circuit. Like it's a shame that we should be amped to go into this round and say, how good is it? That this incredible track with these incredible cars and we get to watch the best drivers in the world racing on it. Instead, we're talking about what battery deployment's going to be like and how how soon they'll be ⁓ they'll be running out of juice on the on the Camel Strait. But anyway, let's wait and see how the weekend does play out. You will be able to follow all the action at speakfa.com. We will have live updates from each and every session. We'll have all of the session reports, race reports, news, reaction, everything to come out of Spa. Across the weekend, there is a high-tech oil super series. action on as well. So it will be a busy weekend at specafe.com. Stay tuned for all of that and full credit to the noise will be back in this podcast feed next Tuesday morning.